Browse content similar to 08/11/2012. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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Afternoon, folks. Welcome to the Daily Politics. Radical changes | :00:45. | :00:49. | |
afoot to our armed forces. The government wants to double the size | :00:49. | :00:52. | |
of the part-time Territorial Army. Army reservists will also get a new | :00:52. | :00:56. | |
name. The Defence Secretary says it is a fresh start. We will be asking | :00:56. | :01:00. | |
him if it's defence on the cheap. Out with the old and in with the | :01:00. | :01:03. | |
new. China gets a new President. John Simpson will be live from | :01:03. | :01:09. | |
Beijing. Should we regulate the press or not? One Fleet Street hack | :01:09. | :01:15. | |
tells us why it should be left alone. And would you eat pickled | :01:15. | :01:20. | |
kangaroo? No? We're not talking about I'm a Celebrity. We'll be | :01:20. | :01:30. | |
:01:30. | :01:34. | ||
discussing the art of ambassadorial You have got a thing about | :01:34. | :01:40. | |
kangaroos! You're on about them yesterday. It stops today. No need | :01:40. | :01:50. | |
:01:50. | :01:50. | ||
to go there. On behalf of the BBC, Irish like to apologise. All that | :01:50. | :01:54. | |
in the next hour. And with us for the duration we've bagged Sir Socks. | :01:54. | :01:56. | |
Yes, the former Ambassador to Washington Christopher Meyer is | :01:56. | :02:02. | |
with us. Welcome to the Daily Politics. Great pleasure. Now, | :02:02. | :02:05. | |
first today, let's talk about the day after the night before, if you | :02:05. | :02:08. | |
get my drift - the US elections. Because President Obama has rather | :02:08. | :02:12. | |
a lot in his in-tray, not least the small matter of a fiscal cliff | :02:12. | :02:22. | |
:02:22. | :02:22. | ||
hanging over him. Scary! The liberal left in America are | :02:22. | :02:28. | |
claiming this was a watershed election. There is a new democratic | :02:28. | :02:33. | |
majority that is likely to be there for a long time and it is the | :02:33. | :02:42. | |
triumph of social liberalism. True? Up to a point. It does show that | :02:42. | :02:45. | |
the Republicans need to do something about the way in which | :02:45. | :02:50. | |
they garner votes if they will ever win another presidential election. | :02:50. | :02:57. | |
For the moments, the Democrats have a coalition of minorities. That has | :02:57. | :03:01. | |
enabled them to prevail this time around for a bar rubble President, | :03:01. | :03:07. | |
who was weakened by what has happened over the last four years. | :03:07. | :03:11. | |
-- a far honourable president. Whether they will draw the right | :03:11. | :03:15. | |
conclusions remains to be seen. A lot of them will take down and make | :03:15. | :03:21. | |
it worse. Is there not the possibility of a continuing civil | :03:21. | :03:26. | |
war with the TEA Party and the establishment? I have seen some | :03:26. | :03:30. | |
Republicans - reminiscent of Labour in the 1980s - saying they have | :03:30. | :03:38. | |
lost because they did not have a conservative enough candidate. That | :03:38. | :03:43. | |
was until they had Michael Foot. Then they said, we lost because we | :03:43. | :03:49. | |
were not left-wing enough. Mitt Romney was not Conservative. He was | :03:49. | :03:55. | |
a moderate, they thought. Something may concentrate their minds and let | :03:55. | :03:59. | |
commonsense break through. A President does not have to be re- | :03:59. | :04:05. | |
elected Again. He is liberated. The mid-term elections are coming in | :04:05. | :04:10. | |
2014. If he can pin it on these hardline republicans but it is they | :04:10. | :04:13. | |
who are blocking legislation and tax of, and getting the deficit | :04:13. | :04:23. | |
:04:23. | :04:25. | ||
down, then they will suffer in the mid- terms. -- and tax reform. | :04:25. | :04:30. | |
understand it, if they cannot come to an agreement on tax and spend, | :04:30. | :04:35. | |
taxes go up automatically and spending is cut automatically. It | :04:36. | :04:45. | |
:04:46. | :04:47. | ||
could take about 5% at of the American GDP. -- out off. In | :04:47. | :04:52. | |
Washington, they often go to these fiscal cliffs. Do they ever jump | :04:52. | :05:00. | |
over a? A cannot remember a time when they have gone over. -- I | :05:00. | :05:04. | |
cannot. My guess is that if they get to the end of the Year and have | :05:04. | :05:09. | |
not done the deal, somehow or other they will shut down time until they | :05:09. | :05:15. | |
do the deal. I would be really surprised if they went over the | :05:15. | :05:19. | |
edge. It would be catastrophic and ruin what is left of the reputation | :05:19. | :05:29. | |
of Congress. They are down in their approval ratings. Either they do it | :05:29. | :05:35. | |
by 1st January or they will suspend it until late thrash it out. | :05:35. | :05:39. | |
Whether they will want to do a compromise or not. Let me bring you | :05:39. | :05:45. | |
on to something... We will discuss China later in the programme. Yet | :05:45. | :05:51. | |
we suggest, we could already be seeing the beginnings of Mr Obama | :05:51. | :05:58. | |
becoming a Pacific President in the first term and even more of that in | :05:58. | :06:05. | |
the second term. He has no ethnic ties to Europe. His home state is | :06:05. | :06:10. | |
Hawaii. He was brought up part of the time in Indonesia. He is trying | :06:10. | :06:16. | |
to do a deal with Australia. We know he has no love for Europe or | :06:16. | :06:21. | |
the United Kingdom and maybe even regards us as a backwater. I am not | :06:21. | :06:27. | |
sure he has a love for any foreign country. I have never seen a burst | :06:27. | :06:34. | |
of enthusiasm when he has met anyone from anywhere in the world. | :06:34. | :06:38. | |
Gordon Brown had to meet him in the kitchen. What about the idea that | :06:38. | :06:44. | |
America is being drawn inexorably to the Pacific? They have had | :06:44. | :06:48. | |
fleets out there for years. As China becomes more powerful, they | :06:48. | :06:53. | |
will pay more attention to that. It does not mean they are banned in | :06:53. | :06:57. | |
Europe as they embrace the Pacific. Other than trade come up what do | :06:57. | :07:07. | |
:07:07. | :07:07. | ||
they want from Europe? -- other than trade, what do they want? | :07:07. | :07:16. | |
are very scared. The eurozone crisis really concentrates people's | :07:16. | :07:20. | |
minds in Washington. The anaemic recovery in the United States could | :07:20. | :07:25. | |
be thrown off course by anything, including Europeans who do not get | :07:25. | :07:29. | |
that acts together. Europe has not disappeared from out of sight and | :07:29. | :07:37. | |
out of mind. If we're talking 25 years ago, not as important. NATO | :07:37. | :07:44. | |
is still in Afghanistan and we are still quite important in the United | :07:44. | :07:52. | |
States. -- have to the United States. Now you've probably seen | :07:52. | :07:55. | |
lots in the news recently about ash trees and the disease that's | :07:55. | :07:59. | |
spreading through them. The Government is due to publish an | :07:59. | :08:03. | |
action plan tomorrow on how best to deal with the spread of so called | :08:03. | :08:06. | |
ash dieback disease. However, ministers admit we could lose a | :08:06. | :08:10. | |
significant number of trees. But why should we care about ash trees? | :08:10. | :08:13. | |
And what will be the environmental and commercial impact of the | :08:13. | :08:18. | |
disease? There are approximately 80 million ash trees across the UK and | :08:18. | :08:22. | |
they are very important for wildlife. Ash trees support insects | :08:22. | :08:24. | |
like the lesser stag beetle, hole- nesting birds including owls and | :08:24. | :08:30. | |
woodpeckers. And they are an important habitat for flora such as | :08:30. | :08:34. | |
bluebells and ramsoms. Dieback has been confirmed at 115 sites - woods | :08:34. | :08:42. | |
in Norfolk, Kent, Suffolk and Essex are among the worst affected. | :08:42. | :08:44. | |
Nearly 100,000 saplings have been destroyed in recent weeks, while | :08:44. | :08:47. | |
the import and movement of trees has been banned leaving nursery | :08:47. | :08:53. | |
stock virtually worthless. Joining me now from Nottingham is Austin | :08:53. | :09:02. | |
Brady from the Woodland Trust. Isn't this the end of the ash tree | :09:02. | :09:07. | |
in the UK? It could be. That is why we have been working really hard | :09:07. | :09:10. | |
with the Forestry Commission and others to get a handle on how far | :09:10. | :09:18. | |
the disease has spread and how much of a foothold it has got. If we are | :09:18. | :09:23. | |
saying 115 sides, it is it possible to stop the spread? It is very | :09:23. | :09:27. | |
unlikely we can stop it spreading. We need to focus on a clear action | :09:27. | :09:34. | |
plan as to how we will respond, not just to this disease but other | :09:34. | :09:40. | |
threats which are lurking on the borders. The ash tree is part of | :09:40. | :09:44. | |
the very fabric of the British countryside. It makes our country | :09:44. | :09:50. | |
what it is. We are passionate about protecting ancient woods and trees. | :09:50. | :09:54. | |
The ash tree is really important to that. We're trying to do what we | :09:54. | :10:00. | |
can to tackle the problem. What is the commercial impact of this | :10:00. | :10:06. | |
disease? There is a commercial impact on people who manage | :10:06. | :10:12. | |
woodland. Also an impact on people who supplied trees to the trade. It | :10:12. | :10:20. | |
is about getting the supply chain smartened up. Do you think | :10:20. | :10:24. | |
politicians are giving adequate protection to the countryside? | :10:24. | :10:29. | |
There has maybe being a reliance on systems which are not fit for | :10:29. | :10:35. | |
purpose. We need to move forward with solid actions. We have a | :10:35. | :10:38. | |
project on the side -- on the starting blocks. We need the | :10:38. | :10:42. | |
Government to close the funding back to put their money alongside | :10:42. | :10:47. | |
ours to get the project running next week and not next year. With | :10:47. | :10:50. | |
me now is Mary Creagh, who is the Shadow Environment Secretary, and | :10:50. | :10:52. | |
the Conservative MP, George Freeman, whose mid-Norfolk constituency is | :10:52. | :11:00. | |
one the worst affected areas. Has the Government done a good job in | :11:00. | :11:03. | |
responding to the crisis? Secretary of State has taken a very | :11:04. | :11:10. | |
strong grip. COBRA has been meeting. Yesterday there was a major | :11:10. | :11:14. | |
national and international summit of leaders. There has been a | :11:14. | :11:20. | |
nationwide survey of the disease. The truth is, this has been brewing | :11:20. | :11:24. | |
for some time. There are questions to be asked about how we did not | :11:24. | :11:30. | |
spot it coming earlier. It is about looking for it and making Britain | :11:30. | :11:34. | |
secured. When you say the Government is on top of it, they | :11:34. | :11:38. | |
did not respond to the crisis early enough to stop the first confirmed | :11:38. | :11:43. | |
case in Buckinghamshire was back in March. This has been happening over | :11:43. | :11:47. | |
the last decade. There are questions for all parties in | :11:47. | :11:53. | |
government about how we make sure that biosecurity in Britain, in the | :11:53. | :11:57. | |
context of global trade, is looked after. We still have trees coming | :11:57. | :12:02. | |
in from China with soil on the routes. We need to take it as a | :12:02. | :12:09. | |
wake-up call. Is it fair to say the Government was asleep on the job in | :12:09. | :12:14. | |
response to this crisis? disease was found in March. | :12:14. | :12:18. | |
Ministers were informed in April. Why did they not tell the public | :12:18. | :12:23. | |
and would growers over the summer? We know this fungus fruits between | :12:23. | :12:29. | |
June and October. The biggest fruiting time has happened. It | :12:30. | :12:34. | |
likes wet conditions. The Government is doing a four des | :12:34. | :12:40. | |
survey it over the last four days, desperately trying to survey an | :12:40. | :12:45. | |
area the size of Wales. They're totally on the back foot. If the | :12:45. | :12:49. | |
public had known earlier, we could have been out and about and the | :12:49. | :12:52. | |
much further forward with the disease. What has happened in the | :12:53. | :12:58. | |
last seven months? A lot has happened. The best option is not to | :12:58. | :13:05. | |
spread panic. The best advice is to leave the trees standing. We have | :13:05. | :13:09. | |
carried out a nationwide survey of this disease across the whole of | :13:09. | :13:13. | |
the United Kingdom. This government has not been sitting on its hands. | :13:14. | :13:18. | |
It is about making sure that this country becomes again the safe | :13:18. | :13:23. | |
haven in terms of biosecurity. In Australia, they spray you before | :13:23. | :13:28. | |
you get out of a plane. We need to make sure this country is once | :13:28. | :13:34. | |
again a fortress in Europe. Nothing has been done on that scale. It was | :13:34. | :13:41. | |
not done under Labour. The Labour government was told of the threat | :13:41. | :13:47. | |
of the disease from ash trees and it was ignored. The letter went to | :13:47. | :13:50. | |
Forestry Commission officials. The best advice was that the fungus was | :13:50. | :13:56. | |
already widespread in the UK and could not be banned under the EU or | :13:56. | :14:02. | |
World Trade Association rules. It was only discovered in February, | :14:02. | :14:08. | |
2010. The issue is that the Forestry Commission budget has been | :14:08. | :14:14. | |
capped to 36 million and 500 staff have already gone. Do we have the | :14:14. | :14:19. | |
boots on the ground to tackle this? How many people in the department | :14:19. | :14:24. | |
are experts in dealing with this? am not in DEFRA so I could not tell | :14:24. | :14:30. | |
you. Just one person is left in DEFRA, who is a plant specialist | :14:30. | :14:36. | |
and expert, who is able to do this sort of thing. You have seen from | :14:36. | :14:39. | |
the speed and significant of response Houses see the Government | :14:39. | :14:47. | |
has taken it and scientists have taken it. -- how seriously the | :14:47. | :14:53. | |
Government. Will many go into them compensate people question we need | :14:53. | :14:57. | |
to take the very best scientific advice. Should there be | :14:57. | :15:07. | |
:15:07. | :15:07. | ||
compensation. That are worthless? This is not the time for that. -- | :15:07. | :15:14. | |
this disease has spread at 30 kilometres an hour. How do we | :15:14. | :15:20. | |
protect the British trees, British growers and the British forestry | :15:20. | :15:23. | |
industry and take this opportunity to reinforce British biosecurity? | :15:23. | :15:30. | |
We do not want this to happen with other species? Should there be | :15:30. | :15:36. | |
compensation? That is further down the line. We are back to the | :15:36. | :15:40. | |
arguments about the science. Should the Government have told people. | :15:40. | :15:44. | |
People planted stuff over the spring and summer and have been | :15:44. | :15:50. | |
planting seeds. Those seeds are worthless. That would have reduced | :15:50. | :15:54. | |
the number of saplings that were planted and, actually, I would have | :15:54. | :15:58. | |
meant that nurseries would not have been ruined from a business | :15:58. | :16:04. | |
perspective. This is not the time at which people are importing trees. | :16:04. | :16:09. | |
The best advice is to keep the mature trees there. When the | :16:09. | :16:14. | |
industry flat this with the last government, it carried on importing. | :16:14. | :16:18. | |
There are issues about how we handle these diseases and make sure | :16:18. | :16:28. | |
:16:28. | :16:30. | ||
that Britain is a strong global Congratulations to endured a | :16:30. | :16:34. | |
crewman on his November moustache. Now, the Chinese President has | :16:34. | :16:36. | |
opened the Communist Party congress that begins a once-in-a-decade | :16:36. | :16:39. | |
power transfer in the country. I'm joined from Beijing by the BBC's | :16:39. | :16:45. | |
World Affairs Editor John Simpson. There is always a periodic changing | :16:45. | :16:51. | |
of the Guardian Beijing. Tell us the significance of this one. | :16:51. | :17:01. | |
:17:01. | :17:02. | ||
Andrew, the way it works, each time a new leadership comes clanking in, | :17:02. | :17:10. | |
they have all got the Grecian 2000, they all look identical, but each | :17:10. | :17:16. | |
time there is a new leadership, it seems to be that much more, I hate | :17:16. | :17:20. | |
to use the word liberal, because they are not very liberal, but a | :17:20. | :17:26. | |
little less controlling, a little less kind of delving into the | :17:26. | :17:32. | |
details of people's private lives. That's the way that China has been. | :17:32. | :17:36. | |
As it has grown richer, it has become more difficult really, to | :17:36. | :17:42. | |
keep the lid on people. The lid is still there but it's not quite a | :17:42. | :17:48. | |
jammed on as much as it used to be. And I'm assuming the new leadership | :17:48. | :17:52. | |
will just be part of that process. They won't be terribly exciting | :17:52. | :17:59. | |
people although, as it happens, Xi Jinping, the new leader, who will | :17:59. | :18:04. | |
be President early next year, is quite interesting. His wife is a | :18:04. | :18:11. | |
folk singer, a crossover folks go, -- Stokes singer, and that gives it | :18:11. | :18:21. | |
:18:21. | :18:21. | ||
a certain interest. -- folk singer. He himself is probably a little bit | :18:21. | :18:24. | |
less appetite than his predecessor have been. But not much more than | :18:24. | :18:31. | |
that. The Chinese economy has been slowing down. Still growing hugely | :18:31. | :18:35. | |
compared to western levels of growth, but slowing down by its own | :18:35. | :18:40. | |
standards. Is that causing fear in the ruling elite? They have a pact | :18:41. | :18:44. | |
with the public in China that we will give you the growth but you | :18:44. | :18:49. | |
let us run the place. If they don't give them the growth, what happens? | :18:49. | :18:55. | |
Absolutely, absolutely. The starkest thing I have heard since I | :18:55. | :19:05. | |
have been here, I was talking to somebody pretty well plugged in, a | :19:05. | :19:12. | |
Chinese figure, and he told me that he had been talking to a couple of | :19:12. | :19:19. | |
senior party people who said the other day to him they wondered | :19:19. | :19:24. | |
whether the Chinese Communist Party would still be around to celebrate | :19:24. | :19:29. | |
its centenary. The centenary comes in only nine years' time, before | :19:29. | :19:36. | |
the term of this ten-year regime. So you can see, within the system, | :19:36. | :19:42. | |
there is a lot of anxieties and they can see it clearly more than | :19:42. | :19:47. | |
anybody else can, and they know there are so much anger about | :19:47. | :19:53. | |
corruption in society, generally, so much anger about the way some | :19:53. | :19:59. | |
parts of the economy are run and the only way out of that is simply | :19:59. | :20:03. | |
to dole out banknotes and say to people, look, you are three times | :20:03. | :20:08. | |
richer than 10 years ago, what is the fuss about? Whether that will | :20:08. | :20:11. | |
continue in the next 10 years is very doubtful and that's why they | :20:11. | :20:18. | |
are nervous. A re-elected President in the United States. Now a new | :20:18. | :20:23. | |
President in China. Are we getting to the stage in the 21st century | :20:23. | :20:27. | |
with the new President in China is as important as the President in | :20:27. | :20:36. | |
Washington? Well, I think if you had to kind of sum up the likely | :20:36. | :20:41. | |
influences on the lives of ordinary people in Britain, say, of the two | :20:41. | :20:45. | |
things, I don't think you would find their lives were much affected | :20:45. | :20:52. | |
as to whether it was Mitt Romney or Barack Obama. The difference | :20:52. | :20:56. | |
between them is fairly, fairly slight, but here, if things go | :20:56. | :21:00. | |
wrong in China, it will affect everybody in Britain. In one way or | :21:00. | :21:09. | |
another, it's going to damage us. And, of course, conversely, if they | :21:09. | :21:14. | |
can pull a rabbit out of the hat, sorted out, I find it impossible to | :21:14. | :21:19. | |
think they can, but if they did, indeed, our lives would be made | :21:19. | :21:25. | |
easier. I'm not talking about political power or influence, but | :21:25. | :21:30. | |
just in terms of the actual effect on your pocket and my pocket. I | :21:30. | :21:35. | |
think China gets the vote. Very interesting. Thank you for | :21:36. | :21:41. | |
interesting live from Beijing. So has Chinese Presidential handover | :21:41. | :21:48. | |
gripped the streets of London? Here's our Adam. | :21:48. | :21:54. | |
Welcome to Chinatown in London. There are millions of people who | :21:54. | :21:59. | |
know their Xi Jinpings from their Hu Jintaos. Let's find out. Have | :21:59. | :22:05. | |
you been following the leadership challenge in China? No. To think we | :22:05. | :22:11. | |
should be following it? The as much as the Americans, sure. You know | :22:11. | :22:16. | |
who won the American election, don't you? Yes. I don't know the | :22:16. | :22:21. | |
Chinese one, and that's deplorable, isn't it? They want to bring | :22:21. | :22:27. | |
Chinese into St -- industry into Europe through Ireland. I think | :22:27. | :22:33. | |
they're quite powerful. Do you know how big the Chinese economy is? | :22:33. | :22:42. | |
Pretty big. I was after a number. don't know. 3.5 trillion pounds. | :22:42. | :22:47. | |
That is pretty big. Can you tell us anything about who is going to be | :22:47. | :22:57. | |
the new President? Barack Obama. China! Your home country. | :22:57. | :23:03. | |
Jinping. They may be changing the number on the committee from nine | :23:03. | :23:09. | |
to seven. Good knowledge. I excite about the new Chinese President? | :23:09. | :23:19. | |
:23:19. | :23:20. | ||
Yes. Xi Jinping. What kind of guy is he? A normal Chinese guy. | :23:20. | :23:29. | |
pronunciation is not very good. you pronounced it very good. | :23:29. | :23:34. | |
was our new Chinese Correspondent. We have now sent Adam on a very | :23:34. | :23:38. | |
slow boat to China! Let's speak to somebody who knows what they're | :23:38. | :23:42. | |
talking about on this matter. And joining us now is the Australian MP | :23:42. | :23:45. | |
Michael Danby, who is the chairman of his country's Foreign Affairs, | :23:45. | :23:47. | |
Defence and Trade Committee. China is looming ever larger in | :23:47. | :23:54. | |
Australia's foreign policy. Thank you for joining us. Will we notice | :23:54. | :23:58. | |
consequences as a result of this change of leadership? | :23:58. | :24:04. | |
immediately but Xi Jinping is the representative of the princeling | :24:04. | :24:09. | |
inspection, a bit more confident with power than the previous | :24:09. | :24:16. | |
bureaucrats previously. Explain what you mean by princelings? | :24:16. | :24:23. | |
sons and daughters of the Communist aristocracy. They were originally | :24:23. | :24:29. | |
taken over China in 1949. The do We have any idea what this new leader | :24:29. | :24:35. | |
wants to do? Do we have a sense of where he wants to take the country? | :24:35. | :24:40. | |
Become more repressive? I think the Chinese leadership are very wise. | :24:41. | :24:45. | |
Whatever form they come in. They know China is a trading country. | :24:45. | :24:49. | |
They had taken 300 million people out of poverty by doing a lot of | :24:49. | :24:56. | |
international trade and no one can afford to get involved in the | :24:56. | :24:59. | |
conflict in a very profound sense. You must never do to them what | :24:59. | :25:06. | |
happened to Japan in the late 1930s, keeping energy back from them etc. | :25:06. | :25:12. | |
Provoking them. But they are very aware that they need trade with the | :25:12. | :25:18. | |
West. They are aware they need to work with the Americans. The | :25:18. | :25:22. | |
Americans owe them a lot of money, but the Chinese don't want to press | :25:22. | :25:26. | |
it too hard because they still want to sell things. If you own the Bank | :25:26. | :25:31. | |
of pound, they've got you but if you owe the bank a million pounds, | :25:31. | :25:37. | |
then they owe you. China are looming ever-larger in Australian | :25:37. | :25:41. | |
foreign policy and pushing you closer to the Americans. Ironic, | :25:41. | :25:46. | |
isn't it? The South East Asian countries feel that, too. The | :25:46. | :25:50. | |
Chinese have been unsubtle in their aggressive rhetoric, haven't done | :25:50. | :25:56. | |
so much about it recently with the South China Seas, so, ironically, | :25:56. | :25:59. | |
that Philippines kicked out the Americans 10 years ago and are now | :25:59. | :26:05. | |
asking them to come back and re- establish naval facilities there. | :26:05. | :26:08. | |
It's a part of the world which, although historically for colonial | :26:08. | :26:13. | |
reasons, we have the knowledge. But it's a part of the world where | :26:13. | :26:19. | |
neither Britain nor continental Europe brings any assets or | :26:19. | :26:23. | |
advantages to the Americans or the Australians. You bring assets of | :26:23. | :26:28. | |
advantage to the Chinese. Germans in particular, the UK less | :26:28. | :26:32. | |
so, are very big trading partners with the People's Republic of China. | :26:32. | :26:38. | |
We actually have quite a significant role collectively and | :26:38. | :26:43. | |
individually to play with a Chinese and, given that, there is a | :26:43. | :26:50. | |
significance to us from the point of view of the Americans and | :26:50. | :26:55. | |
neighbours to China. The thing I find interesting about China, it's | :26:55. | :26:59. | |
in a classic situation you always find in Russia, economic | :26:59. | :27:02. | |
development has gone way ahead of political development so how do you | :27:02. | :27:07. | |
bring the two things into Cink without the top blowing off too | :27:07. | :27:16. | |
. They don't have an answer to that any more than we do. Let me go back | :27:16. | :27:21. | |
to Australia. In northern Australia at the moment, there are US forces | :27:21. | :27:28. | |
training. It's not an official base, I don't think. It's not like | :27:28. | :27:35. | |
American bases in the UK, or Britain has bases in Cyprus but, it | :27:35. | :27:40. | |
is training nonetheless. Is there a consensus in Australia over this or | :27:40. | :27:46. | |
is it a matter of argument that an alliance with America is the best | :27:46. | :27:52. | |
safety from an aggressive China? Barack Obama made the announcement | :27:52. | :27:57. | |
in Canberra. It has bipartisan support and actually it was like | :27:57. | :28:02. | |
witnessing the Munro document being and unseat for the first time. I | :28:02. | :28:04. | |
think the Americans are pretty ensconced in the world. | :28:04. | :28:07. | |
Particularly in our area of the world and we should be happy with | :28:07. | :28:13. | |
that. The real danger not just for Europe, Australia, his American | :28:13. | :28:19. | |
withdrawal. After their experiences in Iraq and Afghanistan, an | :28:19. | :28:23. | |
American withdrawal from the world would be the worst thing. Is there | :28:23. | :28:29. | |
a fear of China in Australia? lots of people at business | :28:29. | :28:33. | |
relationships. We can do both democracy at the same time, | :28:33. | :28:37. | |
maintain friendships with all of the advanced countries of east Asia, | :28:37. | :28:42. | |
Europe, USA, democratic countries but still have a good commercial | :28:42. | :28:48. | |
relationships. They want our steel, iron ore, energy, Cole. It's a | :28:48. | :28:53. | |
third cheaper than it perhaps be transported from Brazil. But also | :28:53. | :28:56. | |
makes you are rich target as well. Australian defence spending is | :28:56. | :29:00. | |
still pretty robust and like in Europe and I assume you're not | :29:00. | :29:05. | |
spending all this money to defend yourself from New Zealand? Probably | :29:05. | :29:13. | |
true but wise caution into the future would mean, according to an | :29:13. | :29:17. | |
hour passed Defence white paper, we will have links with British crews | :29:17. | :29:21. | |
by the way or not being employed here at the moment, and we will be | :29:21. | :29:25. | |
buying quite a few of those American Joint Strike fighters like | :29:25. | :29:31. | |
Britain will be. Was Australia happy with the Chinese and Japanese | :29:31. | :29:41. | |
:29:41. | :29:42. | ||
war games in the South China Seas? No, we are pretty unhappy with it. | :29:42. | :29:49. | |
Japan and America had war games? The Japanese American war games in | :29:49. | :29:54. | |
the eerie with these two little bits of rock are in dispute. | :29:54. | :29:59. | |
underneath those lie very rich oil resources. China is energy | :29:59. | :30:02. | |
dependent and that's why they are very sensitive, along with a long | :30:02. | :30:08. | |
history of, remembering 55 Days at Peking, the famous film. Charlton | :30:08. | :30:14. | |
Heston. Western colonialism us. We have to be careful we don't do that. | :30:14. | :30:18. | |
How long before American and Australian forces are involved in | :30:18. | :30:23. | |
war games? We played together all the time. We are serving with you | :30:23. | :30:28. | |
in Afghanistan, we lost 40 people. I meant Australian and American war | :30:28. | :30:32. | |
games in the Pacific region. They happen all the time. Northern | :30:32. | :30:36. | |
Australia, East and Australia. Thank you for being here. Good to | :30:36. | :30:46. | |
:30:46. | :30:53. | ||
Last week we got Charlotte Harris has dug she discussed her fell with | :30:53. | :30:58. | |
Neil Wallace. He is deputy editor of the News of the World and it got | :30:58. | :31:06. | |
a bit heated. Are you planning to actually screen as partial and | :31:06. | :31:09. | |
distorted a piece like that about the case against statutory | :31:10. | :31:18. | |
regulation? Are you going to broadcast a distorted partisan | :31:18. | :31:25. | |
piece like we have just seen? did not think he had got the | :31:25. | :31:30. | |
concept of that. To help him understand, he is his take on how | :31:30. | :31:36. | |
he thinks the pressured operate. Britain has enjoyed press freedom | :31:36. | :31:43. | |
for 317 years. It was finally won from that lot in 6095. Many have | :31:44. | :31:50. | |
literally died to protect it ever since. Why are so many people | :31:50. | :31:55. | |
wanting to give it away? What is press freedom? Not the right to | :31:55. | :32:03. | |
hack phones, a black medical records and wrongly rep -- wreck | :32:03. | :32:09. | |
reputations. The UK already has laws against bad - a libel laws, | :32:09. | :32:16. | |
privacy laws and criminal laws. -- against that. Press freedom it is | :32:16. | :32:20. | |
the right to publicly demand answers to inconvenient questions | :32:20. | :32:27. | |
that those in power do not want aired. That is why an unsavoury | :32:27. | :32:29. | |
alliance of celebrities, politicians and lawyers are trying | :32:29. | :32:34. | |
to con you into giving it up. They call for legally controlled | :32:34. | :32:39. | |
statutory regulation of the media while claiming that some have the | :32:39. | :32:46. | |
press can still remain independent. -- somehow. It is simply a life. | :32:46. | :32:53. | |
The word state control and free press cannot live in the same | :32:53. | :32:55. | |
sentence. If it happened, politicians would get depressed | :32:55. | :33:00. | |
they want and not the press they deserved. Oppress they can control. | :33:00. | :33:07. | |
In Greece, the journalist was arrested. -- a press they can | :33:07. | :33:11. | |
control. In France, successive presidents were able to use tax | :33:11. | :33:16. | |
pair managed to pay for mistresses and secret children pulled up here | :33:16. | :33:24. | |
we have ongoing for NP expenses scandals. -- secret children. | :33:24. | :33:30. | |
Statutory regulation is the thin end of the wedge. When in place, | :33:30. | :33:36. | |
politicians will be freed to amend, change, tweak, clarify, fix the | :33:36. | :33:41. | |
press laws to silence the questions they do not want to answer. A free | :33:42. | :33:47. | |
press does make mistakes. It gets things wrong, including behaviour. | :33:47. | :33:53. | |
That can hurt. The alternative is worse. To paraphrase, democracy is | :33:53. | :33:58. | |
the worst form of government, until you consider the others. It is the | :33:58. | :34:06. | |
same as self-regulation and press freedom. Let them steal it at your | :34:06. | :34:16. | |
:34:16. | :34:17. | ||
peril. We're also joined by Sir Christopher Meyer. And so has | :34:17. | :34:23. | |
Charlotte Harris. How do you answer the complaint that if we go to | :34:23. | :34:29. | |
statutory regulation, which or newspapers will be enforced to | :34:29. | :34:34. | |
subscribe to by law, you have state licensing of publishing? Quite | :34:34. | :34:39. | |
easily. The way the argument has been framed has been very | :34:39. | :34:43. | |
convenient. That is not simply a situation where you have a free | :34:43. | :34:49. | |
press versus state regulation. That is not state regulation. It is an | :34:49. | :34:53. | |
independent regulator. The only part of government control in | :34:53. | :34:58. | |
theirs is that the Government comes in and recognises the authority of | :34:58. | :35:05. | |
the body. On one hand, you have a self-serving job for boys - self | :35:05. | :35:10. | |
regulation - which is the same as it was before off. You will need a | :35:10. | :35:14. | |
state licence to publish. All you need is the Government having the | :35:14. | :35:22. | |
same enabling factor as it has Ofcom, the ASA and the judiciary. | :35:22. | :35:27. | |
If I am a newspaper publisher and I say, I do not want to be part of | :35:27. | :35:32. | |
this operation but it is the law of the land, I cannot publish that | :35:32. | :35:37. | |
newspaper, correct? Not necessarily. It means you are in a position | :35:37. | :35:44. | |
where you have to sign up to this. If you do not want to sign up to it, | :35:44. | :35:48. | |
then you are in a position where you are not covered. If you look at | :35:48. | :35:53. | |
the different models... Of the different incentives. Am I still | :35:53. | :35:59. | |
allowed to publish? Everyone is allowed to publish. Whether or not | :35:59. | :36:04. | |
you are in a position... Wine with newspapers signed up if they do not | :36:04. | :36:09. | |
have to? They would have to sign up. If they do not sign up, you cannot | :36:09. | :36:16. | |
publish was up it depends on the model. We do not know. -- you | :36:16. | :36:22. | |
cannot publish. You are making it overly simplistic. No one is | :36:22. | :36:30. | |
suggesting that. I want to start a newspaper tomorrow. I would be | :36:30. | :36:34. | |
economically mad to do so but supposing I am. I do not want | :36:35. | :36:41. | |
anything to do with your state regulation. I am an anarchist | :36:41. | :36:43. | |
publisher. Am I still allowed to publish the newspaper if I do not | :36:43. | :36:49. | |
join? There is no suggestion you would not be allowed to publish. | :36:49. | :36:53. | |
You would also have to be accountable. The Irish model is a | :36:53. | :36:59. | |
model where I understand a lot of people are looking at. The air is a | :36:59. | :37:06. | |
lot of thinking to be done on this. There are lots of models. -- ed | :37:06. | :37:13. | |
there is a lot of thinking. We in the publishing media has had | :37:13. | :37:18. | |
decades to put our houses in order. We have had decades to put it right | :37:18. | :37:24. | |
and decades of abuse. It has culminated in the hacking business | :37:24. | :37:29. | |
at News International. There is no escape for us. We should have put | :37:29. | :37:36. | |
our own house in order years ago. You even had the editor of the | :37:36. | :37:41. | |
daily Melk in charge of standards. I am actually quite happy for | :37:41. | :37:48. | |
Charlotte to continue talking. -- the Daily Mail. The answer is, you | :37:48. | :37:54. | |
are right, you were a journalist. Journalists get things wrong. | :37:54. | :37:59. | |
Getting things wrong is simply part of what happens in life. The | :37:59. | :38:04. | |
hacking was covered by the criminal law. We have a libel laws and | :38:04. | :38:11. | |
privacy laws. We have something like 40 odd statutes that can | :38:11. | :38:17. | |
impinge upon newspapers. I will help you with that frog in your | :38:17. | :38:23. | |
throat by interrupting you. You cannot say that we, as an industry, | :38:23. | :38:33. | |
:38:33. | :38:33. | ||
have put our house in order. Sorry, I'm just trying to clear my throat. | :38:33. | :38:38. | |
No one is suggesting the status quo. You look at what the industry has | :38:38. | :38:42. | |
done. They have recognised a problem and come up with a series | :38:43. | :38:51. | |
of proposals that, actually, if the statutory regulation lobby would | :38:51. | :38:55. | |
actually part that their obsession with getting the Government to | :38:55. | :39:01. | |
control this, they would find a lot of this applies to what we are | :39:01. | :39:09. | |
talking about. Black and Hunt in that proposal, it really is the | :39:09. | :39:17. | |
problem and not the solution. are referring to Lord Black... | :39:18. | :39:27. | |
black and Lord Hunt. It is a non statutory regulation. The answer to | :39:27. | :39:31. | |
that is you cannot have industry figures deciding who their chairmen | :39:31. | :39:34. | |
will be from a self regulatory point of view because you will not | :39:34. | :39:40. | |
have independence. Your figures do not suggest that the stop if you | :39:40. | :39:45. | |
read the proposals, they do not suggest that at all. -- suggest | :39:45. | :39:52. | |
that. It is very clear there are no Sevinc editors. There are former | :39:52. | :39:59. | |
industry figures. -- serving editors. The majority are late | :40:00. | :40:04. | |
editors. The main editor is a non industry figure. He is chosen in | :40:04. | :40:10. | |
the same way as a senior NGO figure is chosen - independently. All of | :40:10. | :40:15. | |
these things are answered. You have an obsession with getting the state | :40:15. | :40:25. | |
:40:25. | :40:29. | ||
to regulate. To end 317 years of press freedom and it is madness. It | :40:29. | :40:34. | |
is your proposal. If you really cared about free press, or what I | :40:34. | :40:39. | |
would like to note is, at what point would you say there should be | :40:39. | :40:44. | |
some cap on media ownership? Why are you not talking about | :40:44. | :40:52. | |
plurality? That is a different issue. I'm not sure it is. It is | :40:52. | :40:55. | |
interesting that you want to broaden it into that. You seem to | :40:55. | :41:04. | |
be on a campaign against the media. Why was the PCC useless? Can I | :41:04. | :41:09. | |
bring the wisdom of Solomon into this. It was not useless and that | :41:09. | :41:13. | |
that it was not was be tested by the thousands of people who came | :41:13. | :41:18. | |
every year to get remedies. It did not stop his colleagues in the | :41:18. | :41:23. | |
tabloids to -- behaving disgracefully. I'm talking bag | :41:23. | :41:29. | |
relentless intrusion into people's lives that went unregulated by the | :41:29. | :41:35. | |
PP -- the PCC. What did you do about it? A hell of a lot about it. | :41:35. | :41:39. | |
All you have to do is read the witness statements, put him by | :41:39. | :41:46. | |
their former director of the PCC, Stephen Abel. -- put in by the | :41:46. | :41:53. | |
former director. My point is very brief. If I was chairman, there is | :41:53. | :41:57. | |
a bunch of stuff I would do to strengthen it. A new statute is not | :41:57. | :42:03. | |
the answer. All the statues have been spelled out already. A statute | :42:03. | :42:08. | |
would not have dealt with phone hacking. Above all, what it will | :42:08. | :42:14. | |
not do is, it is all very well in bringing in the traditional media | :42:14. | :42:17. | |
into the system that you have for the internet publishers and fair. | :42:17. | :42:24. | |
That is what it does not deal with. I need to come to you for equal | :42:24. | :42:29. | |
time. It is not statutory regulation will start I am trying | :42:29. | :42:34. | |
to give you time to get your case across. -- statutory regulation. | :42:34. | :42:39. | |
What is the answer about the rules to want to be followed are not | :42:39. | :42:45. | |
covered by the new media? It is important that we worked towards | :42:45. | :42:50. | |
global understanding. You asked me to answer at it and this is what I | :42:50. | :43:00. | |
:43:00. | :43:00. | ||
am saying. Of course there will be a problem in terms off what we have | :43:00. | :43:02. | |
in eight global communication environment. It does not mean what | :43:02. | :43:08. | |
you say is right. We will just continue to let people's lives be | :43:08. | :43:15. | |
intruded. The people who are the winners here, with the PCC plus, | :43:15. | :43:19. | |
are the industry. Actually not all journalists, who I think would like | :43:19. | :43:26. | |
to be free from the proprietors. It is not statutory regulations. You | :43:26. | :43:33. | |
have already said to me and accuse me of having an attack on the media | :43:33. | :43:38. | |
industry. -- accused me. It is not what we are looking for in terms of | :43:38. | :43:42. | |
a statutory underpinning. It is about freedom and transparency so | :43:42. | :43:46. | |
we can live in a democracy and not be in a position where you framed | :43:46. | :43:55. | |
the argument as statute against Free Press. No one is saying that. | :43:55. | :44:05. | |
:44:05. | :44:08. | ||
We should have a third round. Spinach and mushroom tart, followed | :44:08. | :44:11. | |
by English venison, and then a traditional German cake for pudding. | :44:11. | :44:13. | |
That was the menu for David Cameron's little supper with | :44:13. | :44:16. | |
Chancellor Angela Merkel last night. The State Dinner is often a vital | :44:16. | :44:18. | |
opportunity to negotiate seemingly unpalatable matters, from one | :44:18. | :44:21. | |
nation to another. In this case, ultimatums over just who exactly is | :44:21. | :44:25. | |
going to pick up the EU tab. As we can see, from last night's Downing | :44:25. | :44:27. | |
Street shindig, it wasn't guaranteed to cure Mrs Merkel's | :44:27. | :44:33. | |
indigestion. Experience tells me that if someone confronts you with | :44:33. | :44:39. | |
an ultimatum, he may be confronted with another one. If you have 27th | :44:39. | :44:42. | |
interests in the European Union that we want to reconcile, it is | :44:42. | :44:50. | |
not a great idea to start with an adulteration. -- ultimatum. The | :44:50. | :44:55. | |
need to find a common foundation. The more we have the less able we | :44:55. | :45:02. | |
will be to find agreement. There were not share in this discussion. | :45:02. | :45:07. | |
-- I will not share. Oh, to be a fly on the wall at that dinner | :45:07. | :45:10. | |
party! Christopher Meyer has had a ringside seat at many of these | :45:10. | :45:13. | |
events. And, in researching his new book on the subject, Matthew Parris | :45:13. | :45:16. | |
has heard more anecdotes about them than you've had. Well, small, round, | :45:16. | :45:18. | |
ambassadorial chocolates. Anyway, before we discuss the matter, we've | :45:18. | :45:28. | |
:45:28. | :45:30. | ||
Which UK delicacy, served at the British embassy in Paris, failed to | :45:30. | :45:34. | |
win over the French? Spotted dick. Toad in the hole. Jelly. Bubble and | :45:34. | :45:42. | |
squeek. Do have a guess. Which would fail to win over the French? | :45:42. | :45:50. | |
I would say all of them up. Spotted dick. No, you are both wrong. It | :45:50. | :45:58. | |
actually jelly. The lady ambassador could never get the consistency | :45:58. | :46:07. | |
right. Not that she made it, anyway. OK, number two. According to Chris | :46:07. | :46:10. | |
Patten, what did the Chinese serve at a dinner for the World Wildlife | :46:10. | :46:19. | |
Fund? Oh dear. Grilled marmoset. Bears' paws. Stewed dolphin. Puffin. | :46:19. | :46:29. | |
:46:29. | :46:30. | ||
I can't imagine any of those went down well at literally. I will go | :46:30. | :46:38. | |
for bear's paws. Well done, it is that. Can you imagine the reaction? | :46:38. | :46:43. | |
Maybe they didn't recognise them. Maybe this one will suit you more. | :46:43. | :46:45. | |
How many bottles are kept in the Government's special wine cellar | :46:45. | :46:52. | |
near Whitehall? 10,000. 40,000. 400,000. Not known. 400,000. 40,000 | :46:52. | :47:01. | |
for that not as many as you would think. A-night! Concentrate, please. | :47:01. | :47:03. | |
What present did John Major receive from the President of Turkmenistan? | :47:04. | :47:06. | |
200 large yellow water melons. A pregnant camel. A race-horse. A | :47:06. | :47:12. | |
dancing bear. A racehorse. watermelons were there to pay the | :47:12. | :47:17. | |
railway guards who had brought the racecourse -- racecourse to Moscow. | :47:17. | :47:24. | |
Yes, they had to use that to get their fair back. -- race course. | :47:24. | :47:30. | |
The sad thing is there were armed bandits who stole many of the | :47:30. | :47:35. | |
watermelons. They tried to steal the horse, so they stole the | :47:35. | :47:40. | |
watermelons instead. What was John Major's reaction? Absolutely | :47:40. | :47:47. | |
furious. What can you do in these situations? His reaction to getting | :47:47. | :47:51. | |
the horse? He was delighted. Astonished. The President gave him | :47:51. | :48:00. | |
a carpet with his own face embroidered on to it. So John Major | :48:00. | :48:04. | |
told me you knew where to wipe your feet and then he was presented with | :48:04. | :48:09. | |
a picture of a horse and realised he was going to get an actual horse. | :48:09. | :48:16. | |
It sounds like Harry Potter. lives in north Wales. As David | :48:16. | :48:23. | |
Cameron been riding? What about your favoured ambassadorial dinner? | :48:23. | :48:31. | |
My favourite was one I went to Paris with Geoffrey Howe and he was | :48:31. | :48:35. | |
entertained by the French minister, who was a gourmet of the most | :48:35. | :48:41. | |
exquisite kind, wonderful food was supplied and superb wine. We would | :48:41. | :48:46. | |
eat in a chateau outside Barrett -- Paris and then fly back to London. | :48:47. | :48:51. | |
And then Geoffrey would say, what did we discuss? And none of us | :48:51. | :48:59. | |
could remember. What happens if you're a fussy eater? If you had to | :48:59. | :49:06. | |
deal with these situations? I once had an ambassador whose wife, she | :49:06. | :49:11. | |
didn't like what she was drinking and eating, and would put it on my | :49:11. | :49:18. | |
plate and switch glasses. The food? Yes. What is your favourite | :49:18. | :49:23. | |
anecdote? Ambassador wides will conduct proxy wars on behalf of | :49:23. | :49:28. | |
their husbands and was almost wives until recently, very few female | :49:28. | :49:35. | |
ambassadors, and there was a dinner by the French ambassador and there | :49:35. | :49:38. | |
was a diplomatic war going on but in Britain and France and the | :49:38. | :49:42. | |
British ambassador said to her French hostess, marvellous dinner, | :49:42. | :49:47. | |
my dear, such a shame about the souffle. And the two women never | :49:47. | :49:51. | |
spoke after that and neither did the husbands. In terms of the | :49:51. | :49:55. | |
business done at these dinners, Angela Merkel and David Cameron may | :49:55. | :49:59. | |
or may not have taught at great depth about the Budget but they are | :50:00. | :50:06. | |
important, aren't they? Yes, you can do serious business if you have | :50:06. | :50:09. | |
an interpreter. You can quickly stuff through down your throat so | :50:09. | :50:15. | |
you don't have to speak to the opposite number, spitting on them | :50:15. | :50:21. | |
up. That's the problem you have in the USA way you speak the same | :50:21. | :50:25. | |
language and have to read and speak at the same time. With the Germans, | :50:25. | :50:29. | |
there is a respectable time to eat and get your point over. In terms | :50:30. | :50:34. | |
of leaders you have dealt with and entertained, who is good around the | :50:34. | :50:39. | |
dinner table in terms of talking politics? You have really floored | :50:39. | :50:46. | |
me with that one. Does it make a difference, Christopher, if a | :50:46. | :50:52. | |
minister is particularly good, sociable, hospitable? Does it alter | :50:52. | :50:57. | |
the flow of international relations or not? It is the icing on the cake. | :50:57. | :51:02. | |
The only thing which makes it float is that you have a convergence of | :51:02. | :51:07. | |
hard interests. Soft sentiment and soft food won't do it but it's a | :51:07. | :51:17. | |
:51:17. | :51:17. | ||
kind of lubricant. You obviously enjoyed quite a few. He would give | :51:17. | :51:22. | |
us beautiful wine. I dunno how many points we gave away to the French | :51:22. | :51:26. | |
in the politics as a result of the excellent support. Thank you very | :51:26. | :51:31. | |
much indeed. Now how do you keep an effective military force at a time | :51:31. | :51:34. | |
when the Army is having its strength cut by 20,000 to just | :51:34. | :51:36. | |
82,000 regulars? Well, the Defence Secretary Philip Hammond has this | :51:36. | :51:39. | |
morning set out plans to boost the role of reservists in future | :51:39. | :51:42. | |
deployments. He wants to double the size of the Territorial Army from | :51:42. | :51:46. | |
15,000 to 30,000. And he says the changes would mark a radical shift | :51:46. | :51:51. | |
in the way the TA helps deliver the nation's security. Here's what he | :51:51. | :52:01. | |
:52:01. | :52:01. | ||
had to say earlier. Under our proposals with a balanced defence | :52:01. | :52:06. | |
budget and an additional �1.8 billion of investment, about | :52:06. | :52:10. | |
reserve forces of the future will be better trained, better-equipped, | :52:10. | :52:15. | |
and better resourced than ever before. Collectively, they will | :52:15. | :52:19. | |
take on greater responsibility and benefit from greater reward and | :52:19. | :52:24. | |
greater respect. In the years to come, we will have Army, Navy and | :52:24. | :52:29. | |
Royal Marines and the Royal Box Hilary if force sitting at the very | :52:29. | :52:33. | |
heart of the defence of our nation. Reserve forces of which we can be | :52:34. | :52:39. | |
proud, supported by employers to whom it we will owe a deep debt a | :52:39. | :52:43. | |
national gratitude. And from the commons to our studio. The Defence | :52:43. | :52:45. | |
Secretary, Phillip Hammond is with us now. And John Cridland, the | :52:46. | :52:47. | |
Director General of the Confederation of British Industry | :52:48. | :52:54. | |
is also here. Welcome to both of you. You're having to boost the | :52:54. | :52:59. | |
role of army reservists as a result of cuts to the armed forces. | :52:59. | :53:02. | |
have to reduce the size of the regular army as part of the process | :53:02. | :53:07. | |
of dealing with this fitted billion pounds black hole that we inherited | :53:07. | :53:11. | |
in the defence budget. We've had to go up some capabilities we would | :53:11. | :53:15. | |
have preferred to have kept, accept smaller armed forces to protect the | :53:15. | :53:22. | |
equipment budget, so those armed forces will be properly equipped, | :53:22. | :53:25. | |
protected for the job that we want them to do. And by increasing the | :53:25. | :53:30. | |
reserves, that's the way we buy back capability we otherwise might | :53:30. | :53:35. | |
have lost from having smaller numbers of forces. You do need that | :53:35. | :53:38. | |
capability clearly and will fuel the accusation you're doing it on | :53:38. | :53:43. | |
the cheap. It's an assertion, state and, at the heart of what we're | :53:43. | :53:47. | |
doing. The reserves will no longer be something peripheral, but at the | :53:47. | :53:53. | |
very heart of the armed forces, essential to its functioning and | :53:53. | :53:59. | |
integrated with it in a way that emphasises that essential role. | :53:59. | :54:01. | |
will fuel the accusation you're doing it on the tube, they are not | :54:01. | :54:04. | |
going to be there in the same capacity in terms of the amount of | :54:04. | :54:08. | |
time they can commit, so how much training will be available to these | :54:08. | :54:13. | |
people when they are sent off to Afghanistan for example? First of | :54:13. | :54:16. | |
all they will do basic training and once they had done that in the army | :54:16. | :54:20. | |
reserves, they will need to do 40 days a year of continuing training | :54:20. | :54:25. | |
but anybody who will be deployed into an operation will be called up | :54:25. | :54:29. | |
months in advance of their deployment and given mission | :54:29. | :54:31. | |
specific training. I want to correct something else, an | :54:31. | :54:37. | |
impression that this is somehow doing the army on the cheap. All of | :54:37. | :54:41. | |
our English-speaking allies, the Americans, Australians, Canadians, | :54:41. | :54:45. | |
have a much larger proportion of reserve forces in their total force | :54:45. | :54:49. | |
mix than we do. The Americans in Afghanistan have a larger | :54:49. | :54:53. | |
percentage of national guardsmen in the deployed force than we do | :54:53. | :54:56. | |
Territorial Army soldiers, so we are moving back to something more | :54:56. | :55:00. | |
like the norm across our major allies and something more like our | :55:00. | :55:06. | |
historic position where, if you go back to 20 years, we had 72,000 | :55:06. | :55:10. | |
Territorial Army soldiers. There will be a knock-on effect for | :55:10. | :55:13. | |
employers if you're asking people to increase the time they're going | :55:13. | :55:17. | |
to have to give to be called up, it will have a knock-on effect on | :55:17. | :55:21. | |
employers. Are you happy about the fact the Government would increase | :55:21. | :55:26. | |
the number of days for reservists? I think this is the right thing for | :55:26. | :55:32. | |
the Government to do. Is it good for business? It's a huge change | :55:32. | :55:35. | |
which will require a change in partnership between the MoD and the | :55:35. | :55:39. | |
business community. We shouldn't think this is tweaking the numbers | :55:39. | :55:41. | |
on the existing relationship which exists between some employers and | :55:41. | :55:47. | |
the MoD. This will then be many more employers begin to release | :55:47. | :55:51. | |
people more regularly for longer periods. But that's a huge pressure. | :55:51. | :55:56. | |
How is it double? It used to working years gone by and it works | :55:56. | :56:02. | |
in America and other countries. For small employers, it will be the | :56:02. | :56:05. | |
equivalent of managing maternity leave, sufficient notice, adequate | :56:05. | :56:10. | |
cover, consequences when people come back. We know how challenging | :56:10. | :56:15. | |
employers find covering maternity cover, although they fully support | :56:15. | :56:20. | |
women having a year off. Can you see a small empire faced with a | :56:20. | :56:24. | |
reserve has come in for a job saying, I'm going daft hat and you | :56:24. | :56:29. | |
will lead and 40 days of, and then not being taken on on that basis. | :56:29. | :56:33. | |
If we get it wrong, that's where we will end up. What do we need to do | :56:33. | :56:39. | |
to get it right? Compensation for employers? I'm suggesting a public | :56:39. | :56:45. | |
and private agreement, to model this with employers are equal | :56:45. | :56:50. | |
partners at the table. If they are listened to and can help to design | :56:50. | :56:54. | |
a model, it will require a relationship with government. | :56:54. | :56:57. | |
you have come out with these proposals but how much consultation | :56:57. | :57:02. | |
have you done with business? already have consultation, a | :57:02. | :57:06. | |
partnership or talent, with a number of significant employers | :57:06. | :57:10. | |
working with us around support for the reserves, but I published today | :57:10. | :57:16. | |
are consultation, the beginning of a process, not the end. The number | :57:16. | :57:20. | |
of days that employers would be expected to release reservists for | :57:20. | :57:26. | |
training is 16 days in the year. Two full weeks and the rest of it | :57:26. | :57:31. | |
is done at weekends and evenings. The Federation of Small businesses | :57:31. | :57:35. | |
said compensation would be imperative. We haven't ruled out | :57:35. | :57:40. | |
the possibility of financial support for small employers. There | :57:41. | :57:45. | |
is a model the Australians used which gives financial incentives to | :57:45. | :57:48. | |
small employers. The current situation already provides | :57:48. | :57:52. | |
financial support for employers when reservists are called up and | :57:52. | :57:56. | |
an important part of the package we have announced today is about | :57:56. | :58:01. | |
giving employers more certainty so they will know. How much notice | :58:01. | :58:05. | |
will they have? We are going to define the period of call-up for | :58:05. | :58:10. | |
army reservists as a six-month period of deployment once in every | :58:10. | :58:14. | |
five years, and it could be up to one year, including pre- deployment | :58:14. | :58:18. | |
training and recuperation. But the employer will know in advance when | :58:18. | :58:23. | |
that period is going to occur. And the focus, again, on the mutual | :58:23. | :58:27. | |
benefits of military training, vocational skills people will | :58:27. | :58:31. | |
acquire and working with employers to make sure we extract the maximum | :58:31. | :58:34. | |
mutual benefit from this arrangement. The thank you both | :58:34. | :58:41. | |
very much. We have to leave it there. The One O'Clock News is | :58:41. | :58:45. | |
starting over on BBC One now. I am back tonight for This Week on BBC | :58:45. | :58:48. | |
One with Piers Morgan, Simon Schama, Denise Welch, Sarah Smith, Michael | :58:48. | :58:52. |