Mohamed Nasheed - Former President of the Maldives HARDtalk

to some tenants, including the disabled and foster carers. That is

a summary of the headlines. Now it is time for HARDtalk. A dangerous

political storm is blowing through the melodies. The island nation's

young democracy is under threat. -- the mother dies. Former president

Mohamed Nasheed is at the centre of these. He claims there was a coup

against him. Amid furious protests and violent clashes, it is the

ousted President pushing his country to the brink of chaos? --

Maldives. Mohamed Nasheed in the capital. Welcome to HARDtalk. I

will begin with a simple first question. On February 7th you

resigned. Shortly Leyte you announced you had been the victim

of a coup. Tommy what really happened? On February 6th at 5:00

am I went to the National Security Centre because there were police

outside. I wanted the military to arrest them. I asked the military

to arrest them. I worked on it until 11am the next day. But the

military refused. Later on they joined with the police and together

they gave me an ultimatum that I should resign within one hour. In

front of that kind of hostility and the threats that they were very

clearly demonstrating to everyone, I resigned, because I did not want

the military would the police to use arms and start shooting at the

people. Nor did I want the police to storm the National Security

headquarters. In the interests of the people and pistes, I decided

the best thing at that time I could do was to resign. -- and peace. I

resigned under duress. I want to be clear about this. Some have

suggested that when you made that public declaration of resignation,

he had guns pointed at your head - literally. Is that your claim or

not? No, literally, there were no guns and at my head at that point.

But I had resigned by the time I gave the state him. They had taken

a letter from me by the time I get the statement. The statement was

after the resignation. We have statements from several people - if

I may give you an example - from the current President, Mohammad

Wahid, who was vice-president at that time. He said he saw you will

then terribly writing out the letter of resignation, putting on

your best suit, going to make you stay put. He said it is entirely

false to say it was a coup. He was not there. He could not have seen

the writing the letter. There were three military personnel in front

of me and 18 others a few stairs behind me. The vice-president was

not there. How do you explain the fact that the Indian High

Commission is quoted by Indian media sources as saying you had

spoken to them hours before the resignation and had explained that

because of the unrest in your country and the potential for great

bloodshed you had decided to quit the presidential offers? That

sounds to me like a resignation, not a coup. I had to quit because

there was a beaten us police force outside and the national security

forces had joined the police if the knee and had given me an ultimatum

that if I did not reside within one hour they would use arms on me and

on the people. Isn't the truth that you resign because he failed? You

failed to maintain the security of your nation, the most fundamental

duty of any President, and you had lost control of many of the people

in your country including those within your armed forces. It had

failed! Our country is a very tender it democracy. After 30 years

of dictatorship we have a new constitution. Unlike in the past,

we did not purged the police or the military. Need it did we arrest

anybody from the Opposition or the previous dictatorship. We wanted to

see how we could work with people. We wanted to see how we could do

things more pleasantly. I did not remove in the body from the

military or the police. The idea was that we will be able to work it

out so that democracy can be consolidated over the period of

time. While we were doing it, all of long, the old dictatorship has

been trying to come back and with the help of the police and the

military they forced me to resign. They are back. It is not an Dr

Wahid. It is the old order it in a new facade. He is the vice-

president. He knew about the queue. He knew what was going on. -- the

coup. We have to get the mum dies back on track. We need democracy

here. -- Maldives. The people want to see the constitution and

democracy implemented. You must look at what is happening in this

country. Hundreds of people, thousands of people are out on the

streets. They are all going to continue with the democracy

establishment work and we are doing. They were going to. That is why

people are out on the streets calling for an election. I have

been forcibly removed from office and now we cannot make the

illegitimate government run. We need fresh elections as quickly as

possible. Your problem is that of you describe it as an illegitimate

government put in place by a rebellion within the security

forces, that is not the way it is being seen by influential outside

powers. Why is it that the United States, the UK, India, all appear

to recognise the legitimacy of President Wahid? The Indian

government and the US and the United Nations a baby to

investigate into the events and how the transfer of power happen. They

say whoever is in power, they will have to work with the status quo.

It is not necessarily recognising the Government. William Hague said

it would be difficult for them to recognise the Government and to

what they are clear on what happened in transfer of power. We

have a Commonwealth Legal Action Group coming to our country on the

17th. They will ascertain the facts and find out what happened during

the six and the 7th, which is during the transfer of power. --

6th. I am not hiding. Usually when people are forced to resign, the

whole country is in euphoria with the new government. That is not

what we pass the here. Bang on. Everybody is out on the streets

supporting me. - may hang on. Many turn your logic around. If it was a

force for Cook, it seems odd that you are sitting happily in a TV

studio in Mali talking to me telling me what a terrible thing

has befallen you. The current presidents aides or your rights and

privileges will be respected and he wants you to work with him to

ensure calm and stability in the country. That is a very odd coot.

Usually somebody like you would end up in a dungeon. Yes, usually that

happens. But as soon as this happened I was able to step out of

the military headquarters. I said I would only write the letter in the

presidential office. Then I was able to come to my people, with the

farce majority realised what is happening, and they came out in

support of me. I can talk to you today because there are thousands

of people outside supporting us. I have an arrest warrant on leave.

The police are trying to get to me. I am only able to speak to you

because the vast majority of the people of this country support me.

Do you believe you are going to be arrested? I have a court order out

on May. The police want to arrest me. But the people will not let

that happen. They are surrounding me all the time. Even the TV

station I am talking to now, they will be her rest soon after ride

the fear. Everybody is working in high risk. -- they will be harassed

soon after I leave here. But they want democracy so they are all out

there and defending us. You are playing a dangerous game. Voters

have turned to violence in the last few days, not just in Mali. Also in

your stronghold. Your supporters stand accused of burning down more

than a dozen police stations. If you do not do what the Americans

ask - co-operate with the new president - you could turn the

country into chaos. If I did co- operate, this country would go down

the drain immediately. The people elected a leader - me. I have been

forcibly removed and they want me back. I am saying, OK, it's that

new elections. We can then see what the people want. If I step aside

and joined the rebel gunmen, the people will lose faith. The

international community must understand that to serve the

interests, you first have to serve the interest of the people of this

country. It is only through fat that you will be able to serve your

own interest. He cannot ignore the people. They want democracy here.

They want an election. They elected a leader and their elected leader

has been removed by force. Let's be clear about one thing. Are you

categorically say that you and your party will not co-operate with the

new President and will not join a national unity government? Sub beat

many international bodies want to see. It is called national unity.

It would unified the old order. He would not unified the people. We

cannot take part in this government. We cannot be a unifying force for

the old order. The people rejected that through the ballot and free

elections. Our first free and fair election. When people take over

power through any means, it does not mean stability can come by

joining with the rebels. That cannot happen. It can't happen? OK,

but is clear enough. We have you state that. It cannot happen that

you will join a national unity government. So we can expect more

confrontation on the streets? is not a national unity government.

It is only the unification of the old order. It has nothing to do

You think the President is in some way operating with Association of

the former president. Let me ask you this. Many people do not

understand one thing about your recent record. Why did you order

the arrest of a senior judge in the criminal court, without a warrant

or due process, simply because he released one of your political

opponents? He was not a political opponent. In November the

commission, the constitutional commission looking at the judges,

they took the action against that charge. They said that he was not

fit to sit on the bench. That was their decision. Nothing happened.

He was still sitting. In December, nothing happened, he was still

sitting. In January, nothing happened. I had to act. It was in

the interest, and the justice system people lost confidence in

the judiciary system. He was a judge, where the Commission had

said he was not fit to be a judge. He was still sitting. He was still

doing judgments. I had to defend the constitution. I had to create

confidence in the judiciary. I will do it again. I will interrupt you.

It seems this is the crux of the story of your demise as President

of the male leads. We remember you as a human-rights campaigner. We

will remember you as a prisoner of conscience. Just one month ago, you

order the arrest of one of the most senior judges. Too many people in

your country, that flew in the face of your own record of principle.

Exactly, this is true. The old order, many things were happening.

They were hiding behind the judiciary. We have not been able to

an act the judiciary according to the new constitution. All of the

judges are hand-picked by the former president. They were still

there. They were dishing out sentences according to the old

order. They were hiding behind the judiciary. That was one thing. The

other thing was powerful businessmen, as before,

continuously hit influence in the judiciary through corruption and

through favours. We had to have an independent judiciary. This is one

of the reasons why the people and the Mail Beaves wanted a new

constitution. They wanted fairness and justice. This was done

according to be due course. That was done with the Commission taking

the steps and said he was not fit to be a judge and he was removed.

It took three months and I finally had to do it. I against, it had to

be done. I don't want to arrest anyone. He was removed and taken to

an installation. He was given access to a lawyer. He was given

rights and everyone had access and nothing happened him. I cut not let

him sit on the bench when the judiciary Commission. The fact is,

all this trouble with the rebellion and the police all began after his

arrest of that judge. The court said it was unconstitutional. The

human rights Commission said he should be charged or released

immediately. The vice-president said it was shameful. The police

now want to ask you some very serious questions about why you did

that. Are you prepared to claw operate with police? The police

want to frame me, to discredit me. There will be new elections, that's

what they want. They know the old leadership as been embroiled in a

coup and they need to answer police. To counter that, now they want me

to be discredited. That what the police run after me and want to

arrest me. The court order you mention, that was actually released

before I was supposed all forced to resign. This was not true. What

happened here is we were not able to suppress the old walled a

because we did not want to sound heavy-handed. We ran the process.

When we started the reforms and the judiciary they knew they could not

hide behind that anymore. We had six opposition MPs with criminal

cases in the same court. They did not want the court to be reformed.

He was corruption cases, human rights abuses. They don't want that

looked into. That's why they were so concerned when we employed his

judiciary. There was no popular demonstration here. There was

always demonstrations. You have made your point. They want to be

out of power. We do not have much time. Some quick questions here.

The first question is this. You spent time in exile war. You

believe you will have to go back to political exile again, given these

current predicaments? No, we will have elections here. The people

here want an election and we will have an election. We are holding on

to the people. The sentiments are boiling over. We can hold on.

Peaceful activity is going on here until the elections. We is your

family? My family is here in the Maldives. We your family stay?

will all stay. Whatever happens we will stay and we will win the

election. We will have an early collection. The international

community cannot be served by Brazil - back preserving this

status quo and we cannot let that happen. You cannot do that. We need

to serve the interests of the people here. The position you

outline his suggests that the Maldives may be heading for serious

internal conflict over the next few weeks. Would you agree? I hope the

international community understands. I hope the rebel government

understands that they do not have a chance to continue. They cannot run

the Government. Mohamed Waheed does not have one single seat. We have a

working majority. One of her Cabinet he has must come through

the parliament. Unless they arrest the Mall. It will be impossible. We

need to have a fresh election. disappointed are you with the

reaction I out my milieu of the international community. They have

on. Some of them have not. The British

Government has. Most European have. The Commonwealth has. The Indian

government and the US do not. Blair understand it security adviser from

India will visit the Maldives and I think they will come round to see

what has happened. Both India and the US cannot ascertain what has

happened here. We may come here they will see what has happened. At

this time the governments have made a statement. They find it difficult

to turn around. Once the Act is clearly understood, they will all

support an early election and I hope the Indian government and the

US government will come round to that position in the next few days.

A final thought, you spend years in prison in Burma bids over the last

20 years because it your fight for political freedom. You now prepared

to go back to prison? If need be, I'm ready to go back to prison.

Fortunately, the people, the vast majority, are with us and I do not

see any reason why I should go to prison. I think the rebels should

go to prison, the new juniors should go to prison. Those who used

force to remove the Government should go to prison. I'm sure they