On the Road in Honduras (2/3) HARDtalk


On the Road in Honduras (2/3)

Similar Content

Browse content similar to On the Road in Honduras (2/3). Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!

Transcript


LineFromTo

Honduras. In this second of three programmes Stephen Sackur reports

:00:01.:00:04.

from San Pedro Sula, the city with the world's highest murder rate.

:00:04.:00:14.
:00:14.:00:24.

This programme contains disturbing images and flashing lights.

:00:24.:00:29.

HARDtalk is on the road in San Pedro Sula in Honduras. The city

:00:29.:00:39.
:00:39.:00:40.

were the highest murder rate in the world. -- with the. Up here it

:00:40.:00:43.

looks calm, but down there are neighbourhoods in the grip of

:00:43.:00:49.

violent gangs dedicated to drug trafficking and extortion. This

:00:49.:00:53.

place is an example of what happens when the rules of civil society are

:00:53.:00:59.

undermined by criminality and corruption. It is a broken city,

:00:59.:01:09.
:01:09.:01:10.

can it be fixed? In San Pedro Sula the police are fighting a losing

:01:10.:01:17.

battle against violent crime. I joined them on a night patrol in

:01:17.:01:24.

the most lawless city in the world. In Honduras there is a murder every

:01:24.:01:30.

74 minutes. Many of them happen here. This is a city where fear it

:01:30.:01:40.

drives people off the streets after dark. The police, 800 of them in a

:01:40.:01:47.

city of 1.2 million, are completely overwhelmed. The murder count has

:01:47.:01:53.

just gone up by one. Dumped by a House, the body of a young man. His

:01:54.:02:01.

hands and feet bound. His body riddled with bullets. Another gang

:02:01.:02:05.

made out in a neighbourhood where no-one saw anything, heard anything,

:02:05.:02:15.
:02:15.:02:15.

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 58 seconds

:02:15.:03:13.

knows anything. As foreign San Pedro Sula is a sprawling city

:03:14.:03:20.

with 50 routes in and out. Police efforts to slow the traffic of

:03:20.:03:25.

drugs and guns is by their own admission, ineffective. They blamed

:03:25.:03:30.

the lack of resources. Many Honduran say police are part of the

:03:30.:03:40.
:03:40.:04:19.

Do you ever think to yourself that San Pedro Sula is Honduras's

:04:19.:04:23.

business hard, 20 years ago it was one of Central America's more

:04:23.:04:29.

prosperous cities. Then the gangs moved in. Now when you walk through

:04:29.:04:35.

the city centre by day, there is a veneer of normality. Look carefully

:04:35.:04:41.

and you see that almost every business in the city relies on

:04:41.:04:47.

private security. Armed guards massively outnumbered the police.

:04:47.:04:50.

That is little comfort for those who cannot afford a personal

:04:50.:05:00.
:05:00.:05:02.

protection. The city's taxi-drivers have become easy prey for the local

:05:02.:05:08.

mafia. They have threatened every taxi company and every driver.

:05:08.:05:13.

Either they pay a war tax on their weekly income or they can expect a

:05:13.:05:21.

bullet in the head. Not surprisingly, this taxi-driver in

:05:21.:05:26.

his 30s, with a jobless wife and a son to support, would only talk to

:05:26.:05:36.
:05:36.:06:10.

What would happen to you if you told the gangs that you were no

:06:10.:06:20.
:06:20.:06:44.

What about the police? The police are supposed to protect this city

:06:44.:06:54.
:06:54.:07:08.

and your communities. Do They do Month after month, year after

:07:08.:07:14.

blood-soaked Year of the chilling hearer increases. Some of it is

:07:14.:07:23.

turf warfare between the two main gangs. The relentless violence has

:07:23.:07:29.

infected the whole of society. Muggings, sex crimes and domestic

:07:29.:07:39.
:07:39.:07:42.

disputes involve guns and murderous violence. The city's anguish is

:07:42.:07:48.

feasible. Families of murder victims mounted a recent White

:07:48.:07:55.

March Against violence. The taboo against speaking out for fear of

:07:55.:07:59.

reprisals is breaking down. Grieving relatives rarely get the

:07:59.:08:05.

chance to testify in court in the absence of justice, some chose to

:08:05.:08:15.
:08:15.:08:15.

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 58 seconds

:08:15.:10:09.

The people of San Pedro Sula long ago abandoned the hope that their

:10:09.:10:19.
:10:19.:10:21.

government would deliver them from evil. The Church has become a moral

:10:22.:10:29.

liable refuge in this violent city. -- more reliable. The faithful

:10:30.:10:34.

clinging to one of the few institutions not hollowed out by a

:10:34.:10:38.

criminality and corruption. In San Pedro Sula the Catholic Church

:10:38.:10:41.

authorities tried to establish a dialogue with the leaders of the

:10:41.:10:48.

local gangs. But it has not silenced the guns. The sickness in

:10:48.:10:58.
:10:58.:10:58.

this committee runs deep. -- community. Your city, San Pedro

:10:58.:11:05.

Sula, has become the most violent city in Honduras, maybe in the

:11:05.:11:15.
:11:15.:11:15.

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 58 seconds

:11:15.:12:22.

You have become famous throughout this country as a man who has tried

:12:22.:12:28.

to establish a dialogue with some of the gang members. You have

:12:28.:12:34.

reached out to them. You have spoken to them. How do you see

:12:34.:12:44.
:12:44.:13:18.

these people? Do you see them as You have served this community for

:13:18.:13:27.

a long time. I just wonder if you yourself are beginning to doubt the

:13:27.:13:35.

future of this community? Whether you doubt that God is really in

:13:35.:13:45.
:13:45.:13:45.

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 58 seconds

:13:45.:14:35.

Tulsa President is symptomatic of one juror's failing state -- San

:14:35.:14:44.

Pedro Sula. -- Honduras. It has had five different governments in the

:14:45.:14:50.

last six months. The latest escorted me into the prisoner

:14:50.:14:58.

compound for a brief glimpse inside. The feel is chaotic, no-one is

:14:58.:15:06.

visibly in charge. 2,200 men are penned inside these ramshackle jail

:15:06.:15:11.

which was built for 700. Half of the inmates are on remand, not

:15:11.:15:21.
:15:21.:15:25.

convicted of any crimes. The prison has repeatedly made headlines for

:15:25.:15:30.

its violence and corruption. Two riots earlier this year left more

:15:30.:15:37.

than a dozen prisoners dead. Drugs are inescapable inside, as are the

:15:37.:15:46.

gangs. I was allowed to meet one convicted murderer from eight gang,

:15:46.:15:56.
:15:56.:15:56.

he calls himself termite. Termite, I wanted to explain to me why, as a

:15:56.:16:04.

child, you got involved in this game and, why did you join this

:16:05.:16:14.

game? -- gang up. A needed to look after my family. I joined the game

:16:14.:16:20.

for an easy life. It is a cause for which I would give my life. It

:16:20.:16:26.

motivated me to join it. I would be part of it until I die. What was

:16:26.:16:32.

your initiation? What did she do to prove that you were commit Ted to

:16:32.:16:40.

the game? I killed guys from an enemy gang. I do everything from

:16:40.:16:45.

the heart. Even if I give my own life. I was afraid because at the

:16:45.:16:51.

time I was a boy. It had to be done. Otherwise, I would not have shown

:16:51.:16:56.

them what I am made of. Did you have feelings of regret? No, not at

:16:56.:17:03.

all. Had he been in the game make your life different? In the game

:17:03.:17:07.

and you can have everything. You can have everything when you want

:17:07.:17:12.

it. You need to decide you want it and go and get it. Beery strength

:17:12.:17:17.

in numbers, everyone who is with us does better in every way, whether

:17:17.:17:25.

they are boys or man. Gun violence has spread like an infection in San

:17:25.:17:33.

Pedro Sula. The hospital is struggling to cope. While we were

:17:33.:17:38.

there, a young man was brought in with gunshot wounds to the legs.

:17:38.:17:44.

Another game shooting we were told. With every new victim comes a

:17:44.:17:50.

question, why on earth has the Honduran state failed completely in

:17:50.:17:58.

its duty to protect its citizens? Welcome to HARDtalk. I have come

:17:58.:18:04.

back from spending quite a number of days in San Pedro Sula, and what

:18:04.:18:12.

I found is a city that is been torn apart by violence and by crime. How

:18:12.:18:18.

do you explain your Government's failure to deliver any form of

:18:18.:18:28.
:18:28.:18:47.

security to the people of San Pedro I understand that you have set up

:18:47.:18:52.

commissions and investigations, I wonder what your messages to the

:18:52.:18:57.

people we met in the -- to the people in the town of San Pedro

:18:57.:19:01.

Sula, who describes terrible crimes committed to their family. One

:19:01.:19:07.

woman described how her brother was tortured and shot dead because he

:19:07.:19:12.

and said the wrong part of town. Another woman had her husband shot

:19:12.:19:17.

dead by an off-duty policeman. Neither of them denounced the

:19:17.:19:20.

crimes to the police, they were convinced the police would not do

:19:20.:19:25.

anything to help them. What is your message to these women, let alone

:19:25.:19:35.
:19:35.:19:57.

With respect, minister, the evidence is that the police

:19:57.:20:02.

themselves are amongst the worst criminals. To quote one taxi driver

:20:02.:20:07.

in San Pedro Sula, he said, I do not report the fact that they

:20:07.:20:11.

extort money to the police. Otherwise, the police will extort

:20:11.:20:17.

money from me, they are as bad as the gangs. Do you believe that

:20:17.:20:27.
:20:27.:20:44.

there are many criminals in your Human rights groups believe that

:20:44.:20:51.

since the coup of 2009, there have been more than 300 people killed

:20:51.:20:57.

for political reasons, including trade union activists, Land Reform

:20:57.:21:02.

Act of theirs and in the last three years, more than 20 journalists.

:21:02.:21:08.

Are you prepared to say to me now that you accept that agents acting

:21:08.:21:18.
:21:18.:21:23.

for the state are responsible for those killings? -- land reform

:21:23.:21:29.

activists. Do you think that agents acting for the Starr ate were

:21:29.:21:36.

responsible for those killings? -- for the state. How does it help to

:21:36.:21:43.

persuade the public got your seriousness when the government

:21:43.:21:50.

appoints a new police chief, a man who a decade ago is based very

:21:50.:21:58.

serious internal police allegations -- faced. Including allegations of

:21:58.:22:08.
:22:08.:22:34.

murder and being an active member Last year, minister, you said that

:22:34.:22:41.

maybe 1,000 police officers out of a total of 14,500 were corrupt and

:22:41.:22:51.
:22:51.:23:13.

would have to go. Do you accept You're going to give every police

:23:13.:23:23.
:23:23.:23:24.

officer or a lie detector test and a drug test? A final question,

:23:24.:23:32.

minister, a personal question. Would you say that you and your

:23:32.:23:42.
:23:42.:24:11.

Minister, thank you for being on HARDtalk. The end of a rain-soaked

:24:11.:24:16.

police patrol in San Pedro Sula or, they told me it had been a quiet

:24:16.:24:23.

Snipes. Just three murders were added to the city's heavy toll. The

:24:24.:24:27.

Honduran government now promises a purge of the police and a crackdown

:24:27.:24:32.

on crime. It will be a long time before the city emerges from the

:24:32.:24:40.

Download Subtitles

SRT

ASS