Thomas Hampson - Opera Singer HARDtalk

time for some HARDtalk. Welcome to HARDtalk. I am Sarah

Montague. Pariah is one of the least watched artforms in the world and

possibly one of the most expensive. -- paparazzo. My guest today is an

opera superstar, Thomas Hampson. He says that the way to get people to

love it is too will get them to watch it and then it has the power

to transform. I guest today is an opera superstar, Thomas Hampson. He

says that the way to get people to love it is too will get them to

watch it and then it has the power to transform. Is he right? Can one

of the most elite and extensive artforms have worldwide appeal? --

Thomas Hampson, welcome to HARDtalk. Hello. It is hard to see opera as

anything but elite. He said that it should appeal to all walks of life?

Would you say that now? Without question or reservation. I am

talking about, talk about opera is where it comes from, the stories? .

There is no pariah. We cannot talk about opera. Are different

generations, languages, countries. The opera always has in common that

they come from historical perspectives and they come from a

deep desire to tell a story about how people interacted with

themselves. Some of the confusion about pariah the art form comes from

that we have way too much emphasis on plot, too much of a comparison to

theatre or television or sitcoms. Opera gets misunderstood because it

is at the laboratory of dilemmas, of people. That can only be relevant

always. At the moment, the only people really watching opera are the

richest, most well educated in the world. It is a tiny percentage of

the world which sees opera and perhaps understand it. Think this is

HARDtalk, get to push back. I am not sure that is entirely true. The

demographic -- demographics of an Opera audience are extraordinary. We

have a wide audience across the world. We are sitting in England, I

am an American, it is a European artforms and so on. We have to talk

a global perspective. There is a very large and very wide demographic

of the opera audience. There are more opera performances to date and

there were 25 years ago in sheer numbers. That is an expensive art

form is no question. Productions have gotten more expensive. The

institutions of opera houses especially European opera houses

where there are fixed social costs of running an institution that that

is a real problem and we have to get to it, no question. That it is only

prices are so expensive? I have been impressed with a lot of major houses

including the Metropolitan who had very innovative ticket restriction

programmes. We know a few years ago in the US that you may argue that

the West has it wrong that China and other countries have it right dash

of the National endowment of the arts had a survey that 2% went to

the opera in the year with the lowest level of all in arts

activities. Just under 0.5% had their

their family going to watch them perform. Similar figures in the UK

arts Council. Of those who go to arts presents -- events, 72% had not

gone to an operator that. That is astounding to me. -- opera event.

Even the casual entrant events are so limited. I am not saying that it

is a ubiquitous art form. That would be ubiquitous -- ridiculous to

maintain. An saying that the numbers who are still interested and

supportive are very lively. It is not just relegated to people with

more money than others. There is a demographic that I think we can

celebrate and focus upon. (CROSSTALK). How do you get beyond

that? You say that it made the more than people realise that it is still

tiny and redundantly older people. 2% of 300 million is not too bad.

They will see the relevance. How do you reach out? How do you get beyond

that? You say that it is relevant and has the power to transform their

lives are so how do you reach them? That is the question I would like to

focus on. That is what we would love to talk to people about, to enthuse

them to this magnificent art form which is as strange as it is

wondrous. It is his Doric lead based. There is cut -- some concept

that has to do with how we are as people. -- context. The late 19th

century is much a dialogue of morality and puritanism as we have

today. -- historically based. (CROSSTALK). You were talking about

something that was written, 1857 was the first premiere of its? That is

around the corner. 1357 was the character. He was a course out. The

reason it is important because the historical context does not mean

that it is just a precise lifting from history -- corsair. The

character is a mixture of his brother as well as in himself. The

character of this first anointed, democratic, elected, feudal ruler

whose passion is to find at least a not an actual friendship with

enemies. It is very powerful. not accept that it is hard to get

to? You say that it is a great story but then you add layers of classical

music, in another language, and it seems so remote. Those who

understand it would say that it is the most amazing thing. The rest of

the world looks on and thinks dash it is meaningless to me. That is

wonderful. Is that not the power of this artform? Your perspective and

part of our preoccupation today is about globalisation and knowing how

different we are across the globe. What seems to be happening is that

with all the benefits of these widening perspective to the world,

varies in fact a kind of tribal that is coming in. -- there is. There is

a fear or reticence to understand something else or someone else's

perspective. You mention an art form or another timeframe, another

language... There are hundreds of thousands of different languages.

The arts and humanities and performing arts are at precisely the

place to ameliorate this sense of other. This sense of not knowing

what -- not wanting to know about that. If we are not curious about

one another and if we do not want to understand other cultures and

of the human story that literally becomes so -- showed it through

different presence of history... People are scared of globalisation,

scared of what they see, the Other from the other side of the world?

People are being scared of being grouped into something they are not.

They are also being scared of - human nature says not to tell me of

believe. There needs to be avenues so people can accept what they then

no. That is a larger perspective. The arts and humanities are the

cause towards the realisation of that narrative which is the

performing arts, in my opinion. It is that wonderful laboratory, that

place where you can learn to appreciate things which you have not

known before. Classical music does not hurt. In fact, the only thing

which seems to get caught up in this stigma of classical music is that

there is something going on which we do not know. I will not go there

because I d?I ? because I derstan have talked about informed

performances. By both the performer and the audience. Take it from the

audience's perspective - this is the idea that they have to do some

homework before seeing this? That is what you mean? It is a better

understanding? To better understand, to better appreciate - more

familiarity. If I go to a museum or an exhibition of Renison 's

paintings, I can be wondering at the close and wondering at the time

and, that seems to be very interesting in terms of use of light

and I wonder what that means - but I still love it. I have gone through

this wonderful exhibition. I may get an audio guide or have somebody

explain the iconography of what is going on there, what that will means

or the use of architecture that it meant something very specific in a

sociological sense. All the parts of the hidden language which then

become the narrative. That is no different than in classical music.

Classical music at a hard rap just because it is a more formalised or

structured use of tone and harmony and melody does not make it any less

relevant to our emotional impact of what we are hearing or why we are

hearing it. Very often, in every opera did you go to, there will be

an emotional journey in a musical language which you do not

understand. That is good. You would not say to somebody to not go unless

and what it is about. And yet you have said that Mozart should not

be... I am not sure that any music should be in elevator is. My point

is not to attack elevator music. Mozart has a place and it is not in

irrelevance. We are bombarded with music all the time and we become in

Europe to the language. Music has a language. You not being a little

precious it? A making a simple point with Mozart and the elevator at this

idea that music is best understood when you know from where it is

coming or when you understand the iconography of what is going on?

When you understand the context and the history? When you do that, it

becomes precious. Surely good music is good music? I agree with you. I

am not saying that classical music is better by any means. I do not

like the word precious. I think that those adjectives are unnecessary.

There is a context to classical music that implies form, imply a

structure, implies an intent to express something with a specific

musical language. That is not precious. That is a specific

context. It can be very developed. I maintain that the impetus of a

magnificent song, whether it is the Beatles or Mozart, comes from the

same place of the heart. It comes from the same place of the heart and

mind. This living thing said that I want to express what I feel, what I

remember about being alive at this moment. The context of different

kinds of music and historical perspectives are prisons. It is one

river and many many globes. From a performance point of view, the

performer also has to have been a cultural historian do have to

understand guymac they cannot just be a good actor and a thing?

shouldn't be enough. It can suffice but I think that informed

performance both from the performer and the -- and invigorating the

curiosity of the audience is a positive and wonderful thing.

think that you should know from where the plot comes. It is not

extraordinary to think in a language you do not speak nor is it

particularly a natural. You did not like me using the word precious but

is that one of the things they found with these surveys that people do

not go to all listen to operate is that there a psychological barrier.

The psychological barrier is that it is not for people like me. That is

interesting. I would say that clearly we have a mandate in the

classical community that fewer people next year should say that

next year than this year. We cannot change the world and nor do I

believe that all of different arts are going to be equally accessible

or be massively accessible to everyone. I do not think that that

is the point. I think that the democratic process is that they

should be available to those who are curious. If you want to go to opera,

issue should not be prohibited from going to go whether it is because a

social group from which you do not want to be a part or a ticket price

you cannot afford. One possible way to do that is via the Internet?

have - the foundation says the two had an website and your own at which

you can download and see masterclasses? You were involved in

the first live video streaming of classical music events on an Apple,

a masterclass. It was all about distant learning. I wonder - it is

so much of opera and you will be on stage tonight - it is about live

performance. What you can get a buyer a small computer screen - does

it really...? With all my fascination of the technological

world and all these wonderful programmes with which I had been

involved in my career and the Internet and regulate all of that -

it is wonderful but it is all about the live art form. There is nothing

more exhilarating than being in the public, either in the opera or a

concert hall - being there and adjusting acoustically and

emotionally investing yourself or opening yourself or whatever it is.

For me, there is nothing that replaces that. Everything that I

think in the technological world that we can do to either capture a

certain moment for some souvenir of that - that is one aspect. What I

find more exciting about technological development and its

link to distance learning is that we have the ability to turn these

paradigms around. Rather than asked having something in the classical

community - going to two people and saying look at this, we can build

inroads that say - if you are curious, build your own access

points and come and find more about the opera will put your big toe into

the deep water parts to see if you like it. I think that programmes

like spot a fight... The idea that you can go onto the Internet and the

music that you did not know yesterday, or in preparation for a

concert you may or may not want to go to. It is an extremely positive

development. And it is not a problem if people are downloading stuff for

free? Not in the least. We need to make money in a different way. There

is no question in my mind that more music should be free. You have

accessibility to listen to it. Nobody should have to pay to listen

music. To own it, that is a different question. Those poor

people that are dead, most of them have no rights. The Beatles have all

the rights. These are different questions. I am not qualified to get

into that. I am determined to participate in the new dialogue of

accessibility and informing people what this artform is. And it is an

ability to transform, by which you mean what? People underestimate how

powerful the emotional and electoral involvement in an art form is. If

you do not know musical language, you take this journey. Music

invigorates a certain liveliness in your emotional reaction. If that is

accompanied with a -- knowingly participating, so that you are

engaging the brain and your heart in the same time, that is an exciting

and transforming experience. The other thing is that the magic of an

opera, just staying with an opera, when that happens in the theatre,

and I have been fortunate to be part of that a couple of times, it is

infinitely greater in its effect on the summation of its parts. There is

not one thing you can control that says, that is going to give it.

us look at what has changed. Is this because audiences just do not like

the former model? Certainly as far as women are concerned. We know that

the likes of some reform is were told that they were too fat. --

performers. There is no question that our artform is under a great

deal of physical pressure. -- visual. Producers are far more of

fixated on the visual representation of the Opera that they are

passionate about, against the musical necessity and singing. It

can be beautifully given in bodies that are not as beautiful as others.

I know I am being dodgy here, but I am not sure that the believability

factor of an opera because one tenor is thinner than the other can or,

but one understands it more, I do not think we need to put that as a

focus. I do not think we need to concentrate on that. And yet the

Opera movement thinks that. We are under a lot of pressure. It goes

back to what I have said. We are under immense visual pressure, but

also in the believability way. Believability is the dilemma.

Whether it is a Treo or an ensemble or a solo, it is always an

exploration of the human experience. Our opera singers under what

pressure? We are under a new kind of pressure. Every generation is under

some kind of pressure. One person you are working with at the Opera

house, the music director, he said that the singers are weaker in their

bodies or do not care. He is saying that this generation are cancelling

(and centre. It was not a difficult production. -- left, right and

centre. I understand what he was speaking about. There are is a valid

reason for that. Any young singer is not another singer. The richer you

have to go through to be treated as an established artist, that process

is changing. It is under a lot of pressure from many different

reasons. But the singers are under more pressure. There is an

expectation from them and they possibility of them falling off the

ladder. A bad patch. Six months of bad singing, you are a bad patch.

Six months of bad singing, you are done dime. There could be reasons

for it. Some. We stuck to -- need to get more refocused. I belong more to

the previous forum of things. I would rather be dead than cancelled.

That is a stupid thing to say, but cancelling, I could not think of it.

That is something else. Does that mean I would sing when I am not up

to my standard? There are two standards. There is a level that you

cannot go under. But you have to trust that there is some give and

take. It's very seldom reaches your own ideal, but it maintains a

standard that you can respect. You have to, as a singer, trust that

even if you feel like you have not given a good performance, you know

that somebody in the audience has made a great deal of effort to come

and see you. But at this stage in your life, does anyone come and

say, you need to do better. Indirectly, sure. Do you get told

off? Hold off? Not necessarily. It is much more subtle. It is a lively

debate. Plenty of people do not want to hire me for some things that I

think I am very good at. There are other people that I'm willing to

give me risk and want to see me challenge myself. And for someone in

your position that has been in Professor Long -- opera for so long,

what I am wondering is that they are of when they will slip. Good for

you. Now I am on the couch. There must be some ways to go up than they

are down. One man gave a fantastic interview. He was the guy. He gave

the interview and said that he had this fear that somebody is going to

call. It is just not working out. I think all of us, anyone who spends

her life in the public late, but certainly a performer, must carry