Browse content similar to 03/04/2012. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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This man created the biggest upset in electoral politics for years. | :00:09. | :00:12. | |
What does George Galloway's bulldozing of the Labour Party tell | :00:12. | :00:17. | |
us about what's gone wrong with British politics. Why are we so | :00:17. | :00:20. | |
disillusioned with mainstream parties? And the way that power is | :00:20. | :00:25. | |
exercised here? And the spin doctor, Tim Bell is | :00:25. | :00:28. | |
with us, has his profession done the most to poison relations | :00:28. | :00:34. | |
between politics and the public. And then we travel to northern | :00:34. | :00:38. | |
Burma, where foren observers are banned, as war rages between ethnic | :00:38. | :00:42. | |
rebels, and Government soldiers. TRANSLATION: Everyone was running, | :00:42. | :00:47. | |
but my mother didn't, and they shot her, I went back and found her body. | :00:47. | :00:53. | |
They had thrown it in a deep hole that had been dug as as pit, and | :00:53. | :01:01. | |
then I buried her. People are understandably sceptical | :01:01. | :01:05. | |
about politics, said the Labour leader, Ed Milliband today, one of | :01:05. | :01:10. | |
those remarks that you some how indicitively know will never make | :01:10. | :01:14. | |
it to the Oxford Dictionary book of quotations. Trying not to look like | :01:14. | :01:20. | |
a man who had been hit on the head by a large halibut, he said his | :01:20. | :01:23. | |
party would recover because it could make a difference. George | :01:23. | :01:27. | |
Galloway demolished the hold on what was a safe seat in Bradford. | :01:27. | :01:33. | |
But all the parties sense a growing public disillusion. Perhaps they | :01:33. | :01:41. | |
noticed it today, the eighth day of their Easter holiday | :01:41. | :01:44. | |
There was a certain predictability in British politics, don't like the | :01:44. | :01:49. | |
colour of the Government, wait a bit, it will change, as surely as a | :01:49. | :01:53. | |
traffic light. What's more, every now and then there is a Lib Dem | :01:53. | :01:58. | |
protest vote at a by-election to look forward to. But, as the old | :01:58. | :02:02. | |
three-party machine, has it broken down, putting in play lots and lots | :02:02. | :02:05. | |
of minor parties? Last week's victory by George | :02:06. | :02:09. | |
Galloway, in the Bradford West by- election, was hailed as nothing | :02:09. | :02:16. | |
short of a revolution. Most notably, of course, by the man | :02:16. | :02:22. | |
himself. The most sensational result in British by-election | :02:22. | :02:27. | |
history, bar none, represents the Bradford spring. | :02:27. | :02:31. | |
Recent pol polling makes grim reading for the established parties. | :02:31. | :02:37. | |
17% of voters said they would vote for another party. That is the | :02:37. | :02:41. | |
highest since 2009 and the European elections. | :02:41. | :02:46. | |
68% of voters think British politics is either "very" or | :02:46. | :02:51. | |
"fairly" corrupt. And when it comes to the performance of the party | :02:51. | :02:58. | |
leaders, David Cameron is assessed as "doing badly", by 53% of voters. | :02:58. | :03:03. | |
For Ed Milliband it is worse, 62%, and Nick Clegg, worse still, 69%. | :03:03. | :03:10. | |
And the public, it seems, don't trust the parties over their donors. | :03:10. | :03:15. | |
7% don't trust David Cameron over his donors, 64% don't trust Ed | :03:15. | :03:20. | |
Milliband over his party's donors. We have had the expenses row, that | :03:20. | :03:25. | |
has certain low put a lot of voters off politicians. Then -- certainly | :03:25. | :03:29. | |
put a lot of voters off politicians. Then the complaint in the 1990s and | :03:29. | :03:35. | |
the Nolan commit year, and the aspect of transparency, and | :03:35. | :03:38. | |
transparency, rather than increasing trust in politician, has | :03:38. | :03:41. | |
led to a whole bunch of stories about politicians doing wrong. | :03:41. | :03:44. | |
There is a real public cynicism about politicians. | :03:44. | :03:49. | |
But, hang on a minute, Bradford West was actually the seventh by- | :03:49. | :03:53. | |
election of this parliament. In all six previous by-elections, the | :03:53. | :03:56. | |
party that went into the by- election having the seat, came out | :03:56. | :04:02. | |
of the by-election having the seat. Five of those times, the Labour | :04:02. | :04:09. | |
Party. At Feltham and Heston, there was an increase in the margin of | :04:10. | :04:13. | |
the victory over the predecessor, although on a reduced turnout. That | :04:13. | :04:17. | |
doesn't, on the surface of it, sound like the death of the three- | :04:17. | :04:21. | |
party system. I do think there is something very strong about parties | :04:21. | :04:24. | |
that really are rooted where they are. They are not just structure, | :04:24. | :04:29. | |
they are not just national entities, but they are part of the community. | :04:29. | :04:33. | |
If you have parties that maybe haven't managed to keep those links | :04:33. | :04:36. | |
really strong, then it is very easy for them to be displaced, no matter | :04:36. | :04:40. | |
whether or not they have got the right policy solutions for an area. | :04:40. | :04:43. | |
Is part of the problem here that one of the tendencies in modern | :04:43. | :04:48. | |
politics is the national parties control more and more from the | :04:48. | :04:53. | |
centre, in a sense, leaving less space for local parties to feel | :04:53. | :04:57. | |
ownership? We see people going back to wanting to be connected to | :04:57. | :05:02. | |
something local, and be local, and have the parties responded to that | :05:02. | :05:05. | |
message and bridging a national message with a local message and a | :05:05. | :05:09. | |
skens of being local too I don't know if -- a sense of being local | :05:09. | :05:13. | |
too I don't know if we have done that to a point of reconnecting | :05:13. | :05:17. | |
people with politics. In the past, if voters were angry with the | :05:17. | :05:20. | |
Government, yet not quite ready to trust the opposition again, they | :05:20. | :05:24. | |
tended to vote for the Liberal Democrats, or their predecessor | :05:24. | :05:29. | |
parties. They were the natural home for disillusioned voters. Now, of | :05:29. | :05:31. | |
course, well, they are in Government. | :05:31. | :05:35. | |
And just look what's happened to their share of the vote as a result. | :05:35. | :05:41. | |
From just under a quarter, to bumping along between 8-10%. | :05:41. | :05:47. | |
We have also seen voters learning to vote differently in different | :05:47. | :05:52. | |
elections. UKIP doing very well in the European Parliamentry elections, | :05:52. | :05:56. | |
the SNP going from a minor party to the majority party of Government, | :05:56. | :06:00. | |
in the Scottish Parliamentry elections. All of that loosens the | :06:01. | :06:05. | |
habit of voting for a particular party all the time. But, is another | :06:05. | :06:10. | |
explanation that people are finding new ways of doing politics that | :06:10. | :06:13. | |
don't involve the political parties. For example, the campaigning | :06:13. | :06:19. | |
organisation, 38 Degrees, is, well, let them explain. What we are | :06:19. | :06:24. | |
really about is people power, it is about over a million ordinary | :06:24. | :06:27. | |
citizens of the United Kingdom, coming together to decide on the | :06:27. | :06:31. | |
campaigns they want to run together, and then working together to make | :06:31. | :06:35. | |
change happen. We don't run for election, we don't cosy up to any | :06:35. | :06:39. | |
of the political parties, we are very much about staying independent, | :06:39. | :06:43. | |
listening to ordinary people, and using our pooled resources, as lots | :06:43. | :06:46. | |
of ordinary people all coming together, to influence politicians | :06:46. | :06:50. | |
of all stripes and persuasions. Since the Second World War, there | :06:50. | :06:54. | |
has been a decline in tribunal politics, to be replaced -- tribal | :06:54. | :06:59. | |
politics, to be replaced by consumer politics. Every now and | :06:59. | :07:02. | |
again the consumers stop shopping in the big brand name stores, and | :07:03. | :07:07. | |
go boutiques instead. George Galloway MP is here, | :07:07. | :07:11. | |
congratulations. Thank you. Are you going to be any more conscientious | :07:11. | :07:16. | |
representing the people of Bradford, than the people of Bethnal Green? | :07:16. | :07:21. | |
Don't start by insulting me, don't let's get off on a bad start. | :07:21. | :07:25. | |
true, you only attended 8% of votes during your time there. As I have | :07:25. | :07:27. | |
explained to you and others many times before, in the Commons you | :07:27. | :07:33. | |
can only vote for the Government's motion, or the leader of the | :07:33. | :07:36. | |
opposition's amendment, and I seldom wished to vote for either in | :07:36. | :07:41. | |
that five years. My attendance in parliament was daily. My attendance | :07:41. | :07:46. | |
in votes depended on what the issue under discussion was. Do you know | :07:46. | :07:50. | |
what Jeremy, I won, you have to get used today that, I won a great | :07:51. | :07:55. | |
victory. I have already congratulated you? Not sincerely, | :07:55. | :07:59. | |
evidently. Quite sincerely, I have said it was one of the most epic | :07:59. | :08:03. | |
victories in recent electoral business? Evidently the people of | :08:04. | :08:09. | |
Bradford West think so, they voted for me in an overwhelming number. | :08:09. | :08:14. | |
I'm quite struck by the phrase you used there, the "Bradford Spring", | :08:14. | :08:21. | |
it is an odd choice of word by a man who described President Assad | :08:21. | :08:26. | |
as the last stand in Syria. Please don't judge me. I think it is an | :08:26. | :08:29. | |
odd form of words? Evidently the people of Bradford West, who matter | :08:29. | :08:34. | |
to me far more than you do, are the judge of what I say and what I do. | :08:34. | :08:40. | |
And they judged in a democratic election, 18,000 of them, to put | :08:40. | :08:45. | |
their X next to my name. They evidently were not put off by your | :08:45. | :08:48. | |
misrepresentations about my views about Syria. I have seen the e-mail, | :08:48. | :08:54. | |
you did describe Assad's Syria as the last castle of Arab dignity? | :08:54. | :09:00. | |
did in 2005. 2010, in fact. wasn't. The 14th of August, 2010. | :09:00. | :09:06. | |
My speech in Syria was in 2005. are talking about an e-mail, not | :09:06. | :09:10. | |
your speech when you talked about what a good chap Assad was. That | :09:10. | :09:15. | |
was at the time he was sleeping in Buckingham Palace, in the Queen's | :09:15. | :09:19. | |
stair bedroom. He wasn't sleeping in Buckingham Palace in August | :09:19. | :09:24. | |
2010? The Syrian people are the last castle of Arab dignity, they | :09:24. | :09:29. | |
are the last stand to Israeli occupation, and imperialist | :09:29. | :09:33. | |
intrigue in the area. I don't think that was an issue in the Bradford | :09:33. | :09:37. | |
West by-election, or great importance to the people watching. | :09:37. | :09:43. | |
Why did you call it the Bradford Spring? A big uprising of people, | :09:43. | :09:48. | |
democratic uprising, unin theed by you, you didn't send -- unnoticed | :09:48. | :09:52. | |
by you, you didn't send anybody there, the London media didn't send | :09:52. | :09:56. | |
anybody there, and yet it happened, has to be characterised as | :09:56. | :09:58. | |
something new in British politics. They were not voting on my views | :09:58. | :10:03. | |
about Syria, neither on my views about how to vote in the House of | :10:03. | :10:06. | |
Commons divisions, which are largely meaningless to most of them. | :10:06. | :10:09. | |
Which is what this discussion should really be about. We will get | :10:09. | :10:13. | |
on to, that I want to get one other point with you, why did you say | :10:13. | :10:19. | |
"God knows who is a Muslim, and he knows who is not, I George Galloway | :10:19. | :10:24. | |
don't drink alcohol, and I have fought for Muslims at home and | :10:24. | :10:28. | |
abroad all my life". Why did you find it necessary? Because the | :10:28. | :10:31. | |
Labour candidate was going around campaigning on the twin basis that | :10:31. | :10:38. | |
he was a Pakistani and a Muslim. So I believed that playing, shameless | :10:38. | :10:41. | |
playing of ethnicity as an electoral card was something that | :10:41. | :10:45. | |
needed to be answered. And orderly, of course, if it weren't me that | :10:45. | :10:50. | |
were being accused of t you would be the sternest critic. I have | :10:50. | :10:54. | |
never had anyone ask for my vote by telling me how much I drink, I was | :10:54. | :11:02. | |
curious? I don't drink, and he does. Let's talk a little bit about what | :11:02. | :11:06. | |
this victory for George Galloway, it is a sensational result. Let's | :11:06. | :11:10. | |
talk about what it represents, Ed Milliband was talking today about | :11:10. | :11:14. | |
how your party needs to listen, why didn't he realise that before? | :11:14. | :11:17. | |
has always spoken about that. It was a sensational result, to be | :11:17. | :11:22. | |
honest, Jeremy, you do a disservice to the people of Bradford West, by | :11:22. | :11:25. | |
focusing on George, does he drink, what he said about this. I'm just | :11:25. | :11:29. | |
interested in what he chose to say? In a democracy, you have to listen | :11:29. | :11:35. | |
when people vote in those numbers. And clearly the people of Bradford | :11:35. | :11:39. | |
West, they were trying to get a message through to the political | :11:39. | :11:43. | |
establishment. I think the underlying message, it is not just | :11:43. | :11:47. | |
issues about Afghanistan, although whether you live in Bradford Orton | :11:47. | :11:52. | |
bridge wells, you wonder what on earth we are -- Bradford or | :11:52. | :11:56. | |
Tunbridge Wells, you wonder what on earth we are doing in Afghanistan. | :11:56. | :11:59. | |
It is a mistake to write off Bradford West, we need to listen to | :11:59. | :12:04. | |
the message. What is going on, do you think, in people's attitudes to | :12:04. | :12:08. | |
the mainstream parties? They are fall ago I way from them, we have | :12:08. | :12:11. | |
consistently lower attendances, the attempts of both the Tories and | :12:11. | :12:15. | |
Labour to launch themselves, in some sense, as mass membership | :12:15. | :12:20. | |
parties, has largely been a failure. I think the kind of tit for tat | :12:20. | :12:23. | |
business of politics, the liberals came into the last election, on the | :12:23. | :12:28. | |
face of it, with an honest desire to try to change that, and to try | :12:28. | :12:35. | |
introduce a more. They fooled us all. Yes, it fooled me, and in a | :12:35. | :12:39. | |
sense I didn't think they would be so feeble when it got to the | :12:39. | :12:42. | |
negotiating procedure. I thought it was a party that understood how | :12:42. | :12:46. | |
proportional Government worked, they might have been prepared to | :12:46. | :12:53. | |
sit down longer. It is over for the Lib Dems, every time there is a | :12:53. | :12:55. | |
sensational by-election, going back to Orpington, people say this is | :12:55. | :13:00. | |
the end of politic, as we know, funnily enough, the two parties are | :13:00. | :13:03. | |
still reinstating themselves. you notice it in the Conservative | :13:03. | :13:07. | |
Party as well? I think so, this has been a wake-up call for all the | :13:07. | :13:11. | |
political parties T may well be that a future by-election, even in | :13:11. | :13:14. | |
this parliament, that the Conservatives may have big problems. | :13:14. | :13:18. | |
Part of the issue was the way we do politics, everything is focused on | :13:18. | :13:21. | |
the marginal seats. What happened in Bradford, and what was | :13:21. | :13:24. | |
interesting, I don't think Labour had any idea about any data about | :13:24. | :13:27. | |
where the voting preferences where, come the close of polls, they have | :13:27. | :13:32. | |
thought we have won again like the last 40 years, that was why it was | :13:32. | :13:35. | |
such a shock. Did Tory polling predict George Galloway would win? | :13:35. | :13:42. | |
No it didn't. You were all caught out? I'm not making an anti-Labour | :13:42. | :13:46. | |
point, the whole focus of politics is on the 80-100 marginal seats, | :13:46. | :13:50. | |
where everything matters, and all the resource goes in. The small | :13:50. | :13:54. | |
armies of members that all the parties have are working. What is | :13:54. | :13:57. | |
your solution? There are not easy solutions to it, the reality is, | :13:57. | :14:00. | |
this is one of the difficulties, there was great excitement when the | :14:00. | :14:05. | |
coalition came in two weeks ago, about fresh politics. No there | :14:05. | :14:14. | |
wasn't. From some people there was. I detected none of that, I must say. | :14:14. | :14:19. | |
Any policies. You need to get out more. Part of the problem now is | :14:19. | :14:22. | |
essentially we have got diminished living standards in this country | :14:22. | :14:25. | |
for the next decade, it is going to be incredibly difficult. No | :14:25. | :14:28. | |
Government of whatever stripe is going to be popular, and no | :14:28. | :14:32. | |
opposition is going to be trusted, not least because we may well be in | :14:32. | :14:36. | |
a situation like the 1960s and 1970s, where we are chopping and | :14:36. | :14:41. | |
changing at each election going forward. It may be. Isn't the point | :14:41. | :14:44. | |
about Bradford, George was campaigning, when you were | :14:44. | :14:49. | |
campaigning you were saying there is this system among certain Urdu | :14:49. | :14:53. | |
people in the Labour Party, in Bradford, there is a system | :14:53. | :14:58. | |
essentially of patronage, it is good old style politic, there is | :14:58. | :15:04. | |
that kind of system operating at a national level as well. The | :15:04. | :15:11. | |
political class offers cynakures. George Galloway? It is a parallel | :15:11. | :15:16. | |
universe, Mark is a gentleman and expensively educated one. Free, I | :15:16. | :15:21. | |
was a grammar schoolboy, you would be pleased to know. He might be | :15:21. | :15:25. | |
from Mars to the streets of Manningham, there, youth | :15:25. | :15:30. | |
unemployment has risen 40% in 12 weeks and tripled in a year. The | :15:30. | :15:33. | |
mass of people are in poverty in British terms, not relative to | :15:33. | :15:38. | |
other countries in the world, but in British terms, mass poverty. And | :15:38. | :15:42. | |
these politicians, not Diane, but the political leaders, speak in a | :15:42. | :15:45. | |
different language to them, and about different things to them. | :15:45. | :15:50. | |
is a rather beautiful inverted world, isn't it, Bradford, George, | :15:50. | :15:54. | |
you have an enormous hole in the middle of your city, where there is | :15:54. | :15:59. | |
a westfield was meant to be, unlike the westfield on Stratford Marshes. | :15:59. | :16:04. | |
These are parts of the country that never recovered from the | :16:04. | :16:07. | |
deindustrialisation of the Thatcher years, and now the coalition is | :16:07. | :16:10. | |
slashing public sector spending, no wonder there is no hope. | :16:10. | :16:13. | |
interesting thing about George Galloway, even his critics will | :16:13. | :16:16. | |
acknowledge, that George Galloway gave people, who voted for him, | :16:16. | :16:25. | |
something to hope for. Let's hope? I think rather misguidedly. | :16:25. | :16:29. | |
George's problem and Respect's problem, they are in a coalition | :16:29. | :16:32. | |
with rather unlikely fellow travellers, who don't necessarily | :16:32. | :16:35. | |
want to travel with George. sounds like the Lib Dems and the | :16:35. | :16:40. | |
Tories. Namely the SWP, all of these groups, to some extent, | :16:40. | :16:44. | |
demand representation, and represent a part of the vote, we | :16:44. | :16:48. | |
don't have an electoral system capable of reflecting that level of | :16:48. | :16:52. | |
diversity. All due respect, no pun intended to George, what he had in | :16:52. | :17:00. | |
Bradford was a Cinergy between the conditions he -- synerg y between | :17:00. | :17:05. | |
conditions in Bradford, and the two issues that matter, British foreign | :17:05. | :17:12. | |
policy, and disafegs with the local Labour Party. It is not just | :17:12. | :17:22. | |
:17:22. | :17:24. | ||
Muslims who were very disillusioned by the Iraq war. Professor Self | :17:24. | :17:32. | |
will want to hear this. The Bradford West is asset nick as it | :17:32. | :17:41. | |
can be, I won 8 -- as ethnically as it can be, I won 85% of the votes, | :17:41. | :17:43. | |
because your parties absolutely betrayed the university community, | :17:43. | :17:49. | |
who from this September will be paying �9,000 in tuition fees, that | :17:49. | :17:51. | |
was not a Muslim issue, that was a young people issues. How are you | :17:51. | :17:56. | |
going to reverse that. I'm not going to reverse it, but I will | :17:56. | :18:01. | |
speak out for them. As has happened already, I am heard when I speak. | :18:01. | :18:05. | |
People are paying attention to what I'm saying, because of this result. | :18:06. | :18:09. | |
But essentially you will be sideswipeing actual parliamentary | :18:09. | :18:19. | |
parties, you are a lone MP in this. That question George Galloway | :18:19. | :18:22. | |
raises, how the Liberal Democrats behaved on a very public pledge, in | :18:22. | :18:26. | |
the first sniff of power for decades, they immediately renege | :18:26. | :18:32. | |
upon, that has destroyed a tremendous amount of trust? It is a | :18:32. | :18:39. | |
political supooku. You backed them? I voted for them, I wouldn't say I | :18:39. | :18:44. | |
backed them. Gullible Professor Self. Who else would I vote for! | :18:44. | :18:49. | |
They are heading for the knackers yard. It is over. I wonder if this | :18:49. | :18:52. | |
sort of behaviour is the consequence of coalition, what | :18:52. | :18:55. | |
happens when you have coalition Governments? There is an element of | :18:55. | :19:01. | |
it, we are not used to them. After an election a coalition agreement | :19:01. | :19:02. | |
is reached, a tablet of stone, rather than manifestos put to the | :19:03. | :19:09. | |
public at large. That is a problem and will cause a sense of | :19:09. | :19:11. | |
disillusionment. There is no legitimate mandate for quite a lot | :19:11. | :19:16. | |
of what is going on. A lot of that is driven by the economic situation, | :19:16. | :19:21. | |
by which, again, none of the political parties, Labour, | :19:22. | :19:27. | |
Conservatives, Liberal Democrats, levelled with the public about how | :19:27. | :19:31. | |
it was. There was all this �6 million being the difference | :19:31. | :19:35. | |
between Armageddon. There were some of us who said at the time it was | :19:35. | :19:39. | |
not the way we go about it. disillusion, perhaps not | :19:39. | :19:45. | |
disillusion, but the fact that the voter has become more promiscuous, | :19:45. | :19:49. | |
more volatile, more changable, it is something that has been going on | :19:49. | :19:56. | |
for 40-50 years. Why is that? Coming up in the next election, | :19:56. | :20:01. | |
with the diminish of vote for the two main parties. Will probably go | :20:01. | :20:07. | |
up to the next election because of the collapse of the Liberal | :20:07. | :20:10. | |
Democrat vote. But I don't disagree with what you are saying. The clip | :20:10. | :20:15. | |
earlier on was very interesting, actually what you have is a lot of | :20:15. | :20:19. | |
small, single-issue protest groups, who basically are very targeted, | :20:19. | :20:23. | |
and they deliver. The feeling is the political class make as lot of | :20:23. | :20:27. | |
promises every time, and partly because of global factors, and the | :20:27. | :20:30. | |
power of international business is not able to deliver. You can take | :20:30. | :20:36. | |
your concerns elsewhere, to a charity, you can tweet, join a | :20:36. | :20:40. | |
pressure group? Talking about 38 Degrees, if they have a million | :20:40. | :20:43. | |
members, that is hundreds of thousands more than any of the | :20:43. | :20:48. | |
political parties have, the Stop The War coalition moved millions in | :20:48. | :20:53. | |
the run up to the Iraq war. People are in CND and all sorts of things, | :20:53. | :20:57. | |
they no longer trust parties. not one or the other, sing-issue | :20:57. | :21:00. | |
pressure groups or political parties, they work together. None | :21:00. | :21:04. | |
of this feeds into legislation, you can be as mean as you like about | :21:04. | :21:09. | |
the Lib Dems, and the reality of it is, if you are a Lib Dem party | :21:09. | :21:13. | |
member, in theory you have a say in what goes into the manifesto, that | :21:13. | :21:18. | |
is why the Lib Dem betrayal looks so bad F you are a member of the | :21:18. | :21:23. | |
Tory Party, you wake up to find you are introducing legislation about | :21:23. | :21:26. | |
the reorganisation of the National Health Service, which you had no | :21:26. | :21:30. | |
part in and you didn't vote for. They also cut the top rate of tax, | :21:30. | :21:35. | |
and they are happy about that. disconnect of being part of the | :21:35. | :21:39. | |
Tory Party and the Government. are a less democratic party in that | :21:39. | :21:43. | |
sense, in the sense we have always taken the view to get on, and we | :21:43. | :21:47. | |
want to get on into Government and the team get on and do it. Unless | :21:47. | :21:57. | |
you want everyone to disappear in thisg loop of civic mindedness and | :21:57. | :22:01. | |
internet voting, people want to feel they have a stake in | :22:01. | :22:07. | |
legislation. Tory voters haven't been delivered to, of course they | :22:07. | :22:12. | |
delivered for key story voters, cutting the price of tax and | :22:12. | :22:16. | |
pasties. This is a Tory Government, Tory-led Government. Kept in power | :22:16. | :22:20. | |
by the Liberal Democrats. There is a long-term issue whether we have | :22:21. | :22:24. | |
distinction between executive on the one signed and legislatures, | :22:24. | :22:28. | |
the Members of Parliament are legislatures to vote on, not being | :22:28. | :22:33. | |
whipped through as quickly as there is. Let's let George Galloway have | :22:33. | :22:39. | |
the last word? Will is on to the point, there is a pardigm shift, | :22:39. | :22:44. | |
the system has failed, the Tweedledy and Tweedle dumb, if a | :22:44. | :22:48. | |
back side could have three cheeks, they are sitting in the House of | :22:48. | :22:56. | |
Commons, and shake opposition, they all stand for the same things, neo- | :22:56. | :23:02. | |
liberal economics, expenditure, and war abroad, that has to be smashed | :23:02. | :23:04. | |
into. It always used to be said that | :23:04. | :23:07. | |
whatever you thought of individual politician, by and large British | :23:07. | :23:12. | |
politics as a whole were pretty clean, and by comparison with | :23:12. | :23:16. | |
somewhere like Italy and Nigeria they are, but they are tarnished, | :23:16. | :23:20. | |
"cash for questions", cash for honours, cash for dinner with the | :23:20. | :23:23. | |
Prime Minister. At the heart of many scandals are the lobbyist, | :23:23. | :23:26. | |
retained by companies to promote their interests in parliament. A | :23:26. | :23:30. | |
bad smell, or essential element in a modern democracy, as they call | :23:30. | :23:33. | |
themselves. We will talk about that with Lord Bell shortly. First we | :23:33. | :23:40. | |
report. Accusations of cosy dinners, party | :23:40. | :23:44. | |
cash and a voice at the top table. Peter Cruddas resigned as | :23:44. | :23:50. | |
Conservative treasurer ten days ago now, after the Sunday Times caught | :23:50. | :23:54. | |
him apparently peddling Premier League access to senior politicians. | :23:54. | :24:00. | |
Marked a dams is the lobbyist who tipped off the paper, the claim in | :24:00. | :24:04. | |
this case was influenced for party donations. Few things shock me in | :24:04. | :24:08. | |
politics these days. It is not the way I believe politics or lobbying | :24:08. | :24:11. | |
should be done. I was certainly surprised by it, and thought it | :24:11. | :24:15. | |
merited further investigation. When the Tory treasurer quit, it | :24:15. | :24:21. | |
was the latest in a long line of lobbying scandals, involving party | :24:21. | :24:23. | |
big wigs, the public seems to believe that politicians are | :24:23. | :24:27. | |
willing to do favours in return to cash. Whether that is into the | :24:27. | :24:32. | |
party's coffers, or straight into their own bank accounts. | :24:32. | :24:38. | |
And, is politicians are both sides -- it is politicians from both | :24:38. | :24:43. | |
sides of the cabinet that have been caught out. Three Labour members | :24:43. | :24:47. | |
were suspended in 2010 for a scandal, Stephen Byers was filmed | :24:47. | :24:52. | |
as saying he could be a cab for hire. Before coming to power, David | :24:52. | :24:57. | |
Cameron promised to shine a light on the business and the scandal. | :24:57. | :25:02. | |
is the next big thing waiting to happen. It is an issue that exposes | :25:02. | :25:08. | |
the far too cosy relationship between politics, business and | :25:08. | :25:11. | |
money. That was before Defence Secretary Liam Fox was forced to | :25:11. | :25:15. | |
step down, not over cash, but because of his cosy relationship | :25:15. | :25:25. | |
with lobbyist Adam Werrity. The wider question hanging over all | :25:25. | :25:31. | |
this, is just how much power big- name lobbyists really have, and how | :25:31. | :25:36. | |
much is just sales bluster. Calls for stronger regulation intensified | :25:36. | :25:40. | |
last year, when undercover reporters taped executives from a | :25:41. | :25:50. | |
:25:51. | :25:59. | ||
public affairs company, boasting of What concerned me is the way they | :25:59. | :26:03. | |
were decribing that they could have a quiet word with people inside | :26:03. | :26:06. | |
Number Ten, and inside Government, who would sort the problem out. | :26:06. | :26:10. | |
That again is not the way that lobbying, in my view, should be | :26:10. | :26:15. | |
done. Newsnight understands the body that | :26:15. | :26:18. | |
represents the PR industry, will tomorrow clear the company of | :26:18. | :26:23. | |
breaking its own voluntary Code of Conduct. Even so, calls for Britain | :26:23. | :26:26. | |
to put in place statutory regulation are now getting louder. | :26:26. | :26:30. | |
I think we have seen that it is the next big scandal, that keeps on | :26:30. | :26:36. | |
coming out of Government. We see it with the donor scandal, we saw it | :26:36. | :26:43. | |
with the claims that Bell Potting er made, the MPs saying they are | :26:43. | :26:48. | |
like cabs for hire, and Lords that will accept cash. The solution to | :26:48. | :26:53. | |
it is to open up lobbying, to public scrutiny, to allow people to | :26:53. | :26:57. | |
see what influence people are having over what policies, and | :26:57. | :27:00. | |
crucially how much money they are spending in the process. While | :27:00. | :27:03. | |
there is still the suspicion and not knowing who is influencing who, | :27:03. | :27:07. | |
then we will continue to get scandals. The Government is now | :27:07. | :27:13. | |
planning to make some lobbyist reveal exactly who they represent. | :27:13. | :27:16. | |
Critics, though, claim the new rules lack any teeth, and won't | :27:16. | :27:23. | |
stop the scandals. Here to discuss this is Lord Bell, chairman of | :27:23. | :27:31. | |
Chime Communications, and the parent company of Bell Potting er. | :27:31. | :27:34. | |
When you talk on President Assad's wife and others, do you think here | :27:34. | :27:39. | |
is a misunderstood person, or here is money? I never worked for | :27:39. | :27:47. | |
General Pinochet. I worked for the Pinochet Foundation, which is not | :27:47. | :27:52. | |
the General. In terms of Mrs Assad, we were asked to set up a | :27:52. | :27:57. | |
communications office. In terms of the Pinochet Foundation, we were | :27:57. | :28:02. | |
asked to stop him being wrongly extradited to Madrid. And your | :28:02. | :28:06. | |
motivation is? I work for clients. Business? Yes. Is there anyone you | :28:06. | :28:13. | |
wouldn't accept? I wouldn't work for anybody I couldn't do a good | :28:13. | :28:18. | |
job for, and anybody that wouldn't be prepared to do what is necessary. | :28:18. | :28:22. | |
You wouldn't object on moral grounds? I'm not a priest, I have | :28:22. | :28:25. | |
my own personal morality, which is mean, I know the difference between | :28:25. | :28:30. | |
right and wrong. What is your job when you are representing them? | :28:30. | :28:34. | |
are effectively messengers. We devise strategy, and the | :28:34. | :28:37. | |
methodology, and the way things work, we talk about the opportunity | :28:37. | :28:41. | |
people have to change things, if they don't like the way they are | :28:41. | :28:44. | |
going. We advise them on who they should talk to. We very rarely talk | :28:44. | :28:48. | |
to ministers themselves, we nearly always ask the clients to do it. | :28:48. | :28:54. | |
You saw on the piece of tape, one of your colleagues both boasting | :28:54. | :29:02. | |
about having a conversation at 2.30? You haven't seen all the tape, | :29:02. | :29:05. | |
it is 3.5 minutes, out of an hour- and-a-half's tape, if you think | :29:05. | :29:10. | |
that is a fair representation you are deluded. The reality is, what | :29:10. | :29:14. | |
he said was, he was asked if he could get a message to Downing | :29:14. | :29:18. | |
Street, by 2.30 in the afternoon, because James Dyson was going with | :29:18. | :29:21. | |
the Prime Minister to China, and they wanted to bring up the issue | :29:21. | :29:25. | |
of copyright, he said he was able to deliver that message within an | :29:25. | :29:31. | |
hour. He boasted he delivered it, and that the Prime Minister then | :29:31. | :29:34. | |
raised it with the Chinese Prime Minister? It rather shraoints the | :29:34. | :29:40. | |
way you discuss the thing, both -- slants, the way you discuss the | :29:40. | :29:45. | |
things. Boasting and discussing it is not the same thing. How come you | :29:45. | :29:49. | |
don't say to me, why did the business of investigative | :29:49. | :29:53. | |
journalism pretend they were a group, give us credentials and | :29:53. | :29:58. | |
create a website. Probably the only way to get inside your | :29:58. | :30:04. | |
organisation? Last week a member of the BIJ asked me a series of | :30:04. | :30:08. | |
questions about lobbying, I answered him, he didn't like what | :30:08. | :30:13. | |
he said and asked me could he exaggerate him, I have a copy of | :30:13. | :30:18. | |
the interview. You can talk to me about that, or this, which is | :30:18. | :30:27. | |
rubbish, and in the mid-of a PCC complaint, and upheld by the PRCA. | :30:27. | :30:34. | |
The public relations association. You can dismiss it, and belittle | :30:34. | :30:38. | |
anything you want to. But if you want to have a fair argument, don't | :30:38. | :30:42. | |
discuss what people on there, like Marked a dams, who had nothing to | :30:42. | :30:46. | |
do with us whatsoever. He makes a complaint. Why not a register of | :30:46. | :30:51. | |
lobbyist, so we know who you are and who you represent? By all means. | :30:51. | :30:55. | |
They exist all over the country, we work in Washington, we sign up to | :30:55. | :30:59. | |
it and declare all the relations. Can we know all your clients? | :30:59. | :31:03. | |
can know all of them, except the British and American Government, | :31:03. | :31:06. | |
with whom we have had contracts, over which there is a requirement | :31:06. | :31:11. | |
of confidentiality. A mandatory register would ensure transparency, | :31:11. | :31:16. | |
wouldn't it? Not of what you want. It would tell you who works with | :31:16. | :31:19. | |
what chiend client t would never be up-to-date. It would be impossible | :31:19. | :31:23. | |
to manage. It has been tried before. It doesn't work in America. You | :31:23. | :31:27. | |
should know this, the BIJ claimed what they were doing to us was | :31:27. | :31:31. | |
based on an investigation done in America, where they have had a | :31:31. | :31:34. | |
statutory register of lobbyists for 45 years, that investigation was | :31:34. | :31:37. | |
done five years ago. Where on earth is the logic of that. When David | :31:37. | :31:43. | |
Cameron says, as you heard him say, a bit of his speech there, a PR man | :31:43. | :31:47. | |
himself, indeed. They don't know who is meeting whom, and they don't | :31:47. | :31:52. | |
know if any favours are being exchanged o which outside | :31:52. | :31:55. | |
influences are wielding an unhealthy interest? You should ask | :31:55. | :32:01. | |
him. He's a former PR man? That is not a lobbyist. You don't have the | :32:01. | :32:06. | |
faintest idea what a lobbyist is or not, nor does the consultation | :32:06. | :32:10. | |
paper. Was it a sensible thing for him to say? I don't think it was a | :32:10. | :32:14. | |
senseable thing for him to say, I'm sure he regrets it. So it wasn't? | :32:15. | :32:18. | |
No, because he given a hook for everyone who wants a statutory | :32:18. | :32:23. | |
register of lobbyist, that is what everyone wants, it is what Marked a | :32:23. | :32:27. | |
dams is fighting against, and what the Independent numbers wants. They | :32:27. | :32:31. | |
are lobbying for a statutory register of lobbyists and they are | :32:31. | :32:36. | |
paid for it. Aren't they entitled to know who is getting the ears of | :32:36. | :32:38. | |
ministers in a Government they elect? Absolutely. You wouldn't | :32:38. | :32:42. | |
have a problem? We have no secrecy about our client list, it is | :32:42. | :32:45. | |
published on the website. It is available to everybody. We have | :32:45. | :32:49. | |
never, ever said we won't publish our clients, nor have we ever been | :32:49. | :32:53. | |
untransparent, if there is such a word, about the things we. Do we | :32:53. | :32:57. | |
ask questions about lunches we hold with politicians, dinners we hold | :32:57. | :33:00. | |
with politicians wrecks openly declare them, the politicians | :33:00. | :33:02. | |
declare them, we tell people what they are about, and tell people | :33:02. | :33:06. | |
what the rules are. We even have sessions with politicians and | :33:06. | :33:09. | |
journalists present. We sit there and let the journalists write about | :33:09. | :33:14. | |
it. All this rubbish about the lack of transparency is just that, | :33:14. | :33:18. | |
rubbish and claptrap, put up by people who want to prove that | :33:18. | :33:21. | |
something unpleasant is going on, or you so charmingly put, that we | :33:22. | :33:27. | |
smell. Actually I don't smell! I said, some people say rb there is | :33:27. | :33:33. | |
a bad smell. OK, yes. We don't see you very often. No you | :33:33. | :33:38. | |
doint. But I love seeing you. beginning to see why. | :33:38. | :33:43. | |
I'm beginning to rather regret inviting you. Don't be like that. | :33:43. | :33:46. | |
I'm serious, when you lock at the state of the Conservative Party now, | :33:46. | :33:50. | |
from your long experience, what do you think, what advice would you | :33:50. | :33:53. | |
give them if you were doing your old job? I think the problem was | :33:53. | :33:58. | |
summed up in that discussion you had with George Galloway et al, it | :33:58. | :34:02. | |
is the problem of the coalition Government, there is not a majority | :34:02. | :34:05. | |
Government in place, the majority of people are not satisfied. You | :34:05. | :34:09. | |
have lot of people voting Liberal Democrats who don't like what is | :34:09. | :34:11. | |
going on, and people who voted Conservatives don't like what is | :34:11. | :34:14. | |
going on, a lot of people who voted Labour didn't like Labour and what | :34:14. | :34:18. | |
they Z you have lot of dissatisfied people, plus you have a terrible | :34:18. | :34:22. | |
period of austerity, where people are having a bad time, everybody, | :34:22. | :34:25. | |
were the top to the bottom is having a bad time, compared to five | :34:25. | :34:33. | |
years ago. The fact that where they were on five years ago was based on | :34:33. | :34:36. | |
borrowed money they have forgotten, as we all. Do it is a troublesome | :34:36. | :34:40. | |
world, you have a hell of a lot of strange things going on, the risk | :34:40. | :34:44. | |
of nuclear war in Iran, problems all over the world, protest | :34:44. | :34:47. | |
movements everywhere. Which the Internet causes and creates, there | :34:47. | :34:50. | |
is a great big gutter of protest in the Internet. People can publish | :34:50. | :34:56. | |
all sorts of claptrap on it, and frequently do, about you and me, | :34:56. | :35:00. | |
your Wikipedia entry isn't so great either, any more than mine is. This | :35:00. | :35:05. | |
goes on, it is a phenomenon, and we have to cope with it, it makes | :35:05. | :35:08. | |
communications very difficult to deal with. As far as the party is | :35:08. | :35:11. | |
concerned, they should have a proper chairman, like in the good | :35:11. | :35:14. | |
old days, somebody who is active. They should try to separate the | :35:14. | :35:18. | |
positions of the Conservative Party as a political entity from the | :35:18. | :35:20. | |
Government, which is not a Conservative Government, it is a | :35:20. | :35:23. | |
coalition Government. If they could achieve that separation, and | :35:23. | :35:25. | |
actually bring some people into communication work in the | :35:25. | :35:28. | |
Government who know what they are doing, then we might actually end | :35:28. | :35:31. | |
up with a different situation. Thank you very much. | :35:31. | :35:35. | |
Tomorrow night here in the studio, the Mayor of London mud wrestles | :35:35. | :35:40. | |
with people trying to take his job from him. Aung San Suu Kyi's | :35:40. | :35:44. | |
victory in the Burmese by-election set off more celebrations, more | :35:44. | :35:49. | |
predictions of a prop transition to democracy. But in the state of | :35:49. | :35:53. | |
Kachin, the elections didn't happen, cancelled because of fears about | :35:53. | :35:58. | |
security, and the war between Kachin rebels and the Government | :35:58. | :36:04. | |
forces. Neither aid agencies or journalists are allowed into Kachin, | :36:04. | :36:13. | |
but our Sue Lloyd Roberts managed to get there for Newsnight. | :36:13. | :36:18. | |
"We can defeat the enemy" sing the new recruits to the army, at their | :36:18. | :36:22. | |
training ground on the slim area of land they still control. | :36:22. | :36:25. | |
While freedom and democracy are being celebrated elsewhere in the | :36:25. | :36:30. | |
country, their's is one of several ethnic armies, who have been | :36:30. | :36:36. | |
fighting the Burmese army, off and on, for the last half century. | :36:36. | :36:40. | |
For the Kachin, the fighting is very much on going. Training has | :36:40. | :36:44. | |
been cut from three to two months, to get these men and women to the | :36:44. | :36:53. | |
front, with real guns, in a hurry. TRANSLATION: Burmese army soldiers | :36:53. | :36:57. | |
came into our village, they werefying their guns, shooting at | :36:57. | :37:03. | |
the old people who couldn't -- were firing their guns, shooting the old | :37:03. | :37:07. | |
people who couldn't win, they raped our women and set fire to our homes. | :37:07. | :37:12. | |
I'm old, I'm 42, but that's why I signed up. | :37:12. | :37:15. | |
The landscape is now littered with burned out villages, from where | :37:15. | :37:24. | |
people fled their homes, with their lives, and little else. | :37:24. | :37:28. | |
TRANSLATION: We don't have enough food. We left with nothing. And so | :37:28. | :37:32. | |
my husband crept back to the village to get some rice. When he | :37:32. | :37:37. | |
didn't return, I went back, and found his body. | :37:37. | :37:45. | |
They had shot him in the chest, and stabbed him in the face. When they | :37:45. | :37:49. | |
hear the Burmese army is on its way, they run. This man's wife had given | :37:49. | :37:57. | |
birth just days earlier, and couldn't keep up. | :37:57. | :38:00. | |
TRANSLATION: The next day I went back to look for her, and found | :38:00. | :38:05. | |
they had killed her with the spear. Entering through her rib cage on | :38:05. | :38:10. | |
the left, and all the way through to her arm on the right. I found | :38:10. | :38:14. | |
our baby, barely alive, lying next to her mother. I just grabbed her | :38:14. | :38:22. | |
and ran. TRANSLATION: Everyone was running, | :38:22. | :38:30. | |
but my mother didn't, and they shot her. I went back and found her body, | :38:30. | :38:37. | |
they had thrown it in the deep hole that had been dug as a cesspit. It | :38:37. | :38:47. | |
took ten of us to get the body out. And then I buried her. | :38:47. | :38:51. | |
survivors, tens of thousands of them, are now crowded into | :38:51. | :38:56. | |
makeshift camps, where there aren't enough basics like food and water, | :38:56. | :38:59. | |
let alone any hope of counselling for the trauma they have endured. | :38:59. | :39:04. | |
We have grown accustomed to hearing report of brutality, about the | :39:04. | :39:08. | |
military dictatorship that has ruled Burma for 50 years, but all | :39:08. | :39:12. | |
these recent stories of atrocities, have taken place within the last | :39:12. | :39:16. | |
few months, even though the allegedly reforming Government held | :39:16. | :39:20. | |
elections over a year ago, and promised change. The people of | :39:20. | :39:24. | |
Kachin, and others, can be forgiven for being confused. | :39:24. | :39:29. | |
The Burmese Government don't want the outside world to see these | :39:29. | :39:33. | |
people, because their might contradicts the new, caring, image | :39:33. | :39:38. | |
they want to present. They are restricting aid getting in from the | :39:38. | :39:42. | |
international community, although it is desperately needed. | :39:42. | :39:46. | |
The administrator says there is more than 1800 people in this camp, | :39:46. | :39:52. | |
and there is not enough food, medicine or shelter. | :39:52. | :39:56. | |
The children might find it all a game now, he says, but when the | :39:56. | :40:01. | |
rainy season starts, it will be a nightmare. | :40:01. | :40:11. | |
:40:11. | :40:13. | ||
TB has broken out in the camps, and malnutrition is prevalent. | :40:13. | :40:17. | |
My son isn't recovering from his illness and isn't growing, she says, | :40:17. | :40:20. | |
because she has nothing to feed him with. | :40:20. | :40:27. | |
Another mother, with four children, fears for her unborn child. | :40:27. | :40:30. | |
TRANSLATION: The children say they are hungry all the time, and I'm | :40:30. | :40:33. | |
not getting the nutrition a pregnant woman needs, we long to | :40:33. | :40:39. | |
return to our villages, but how can we. The Burmese hate the Kachin | :40:39. | :40:45. | |
people, and their army will only attack us again. | :40:45. | :40:49. | |
Both sides blame the other for starting the fighting in June last | :40:49. | :40:53. | |
year. With the Burmese army using artillery and mortars, against the | :40:53. | :41:00. | |
Kachin, who are armed with AK-47s and home made weapons. | :41:00. | :41:03. | |
The fighting intensified in December, at about the time the | :41:03. | :41:07. | |
American a second, Hillary Clinton, arrived in Burma, to encourage the | :41:07. | :41:13. | |
Government with its reform programme. Land mines cause them | :41:13. | :41:16. | |
most casualties, among the Kachin army of some 20,000, who are now | :41:16. | :41:22. | |
struggling to hold out against the Burmese army's half million. | :41:22. | :41:26. | |
Over 100 soldiers have died, hundreds more have been injured, | :41:26. | :41:35. | |
and no-one knows the number of civilian dead. This 31-year-old | :41:35. | :41:40. | |
lost his leg in December, and says he wants to get back to fighting. | :41:40. | :41:44. | |
The doctor in charge of the military hospital says that | :41:44. | :41:47. | |
soldiers get the best treatment available, but that's not up to | :41:47. | :41:53. | |
much. TRANSLATION: We lack medicines, | :41:53. | :41:56. | |
prosthetics, everything really. They want me to get these men back | :41:56. | :42:00. | |
to the front, but considering the facilities we have here, that's | :42:00. | :42:04. | |
just not realistic. The frontlines are just a few | :42:04. | :42:07. | |
hundred metres away from the hospital, and from where people are | :42:07. | :42:12. | |
living. We can see the Burmese position on the hill opposite, and | :42:12. | :42:16. | |
no-one's too sure when they might attack next. | :42:16. | :42:19. | |
TRANSLATION: We could attack their position and probably overrun it, | :42:19. | :42:23. | |
but we don't want to go on the offensive. We wait for them to | :42:23. | :42:30. | |
attack us. It's quiet here today, the captain explains, because the | :42:30. | :42:35. | |
fighting has moved further north, where the Burmese army is attacking | :42:35. | :42:38. | |
daily. Shortly after Hillary Clinton's visit, and under pressure | :42:38. | :42:42. | |
from the international community, Burma's new President ordered the | :42:42. | :42:50. | |
Burmese army to stop fighting. Why haven't they? TRANSLATION: I think | :42:50. | :42:54. | |
there are two reasons, the first is that, under the new constitution, | :42:54. | :42:58. | |
the President doesn't have that much power over the army. And | :42:58. | :43:01. | |
secondly, the President doesn't have the support of the army | :43:01. | :43:08. | |
generals because he wants to reform the country and they don't. | :43:08. | :43:12. | |
Burmese generals have, for a long time, enjoyed the wealth of these | :43:12. | :43:18. | |
border areas, which are rich in timber, gold and Jade. If they are | :43:18. | :43:23. | |
at odds with Burma's President, this could slow down both reform | :43:23. | :43:31. | |
and a solution to Burma's long- running ethnic conflict. | :43:31. | :43:35. | |
The mainly Christian Kachin say they don't want independence from | :43:35. | :43:39. | |
Burma, they want equal treatment within a federal Burma. Their | :43:39. | :43:44. | |
political party was excluded from the elections in 2010, and the | :43:44. | :43:47. | |
Burmese Government have postponed by-elections in Kachin state, | :43:47. | :43:54. | |
blaming security problems. TRANSLATION: What the Kachin want | :43:54. | :43:59. | |
is equal rights. If they were to offer genuine democratic union, | :43:59. | :44:03. | |
then this conflict could be solved. On going peace talks between the | :44:03. | :44:08. | |
Kachin and the Burmese Government are taking place in China. The | :44:08. | :44:14. | |
border between Kachin and China runs through the main town year, | :44:14. | :44:19. | |
and China is weary of the on going war on its doorstep. With the | :44:19. | :44:22. | |
delegates returning back through the border post, after the latest | :44:22. | :44:28. | |
round, say they have failed to get agreement, why? TRANSLATION: To get | :44:28. | :44:31. | |
agreement, the Burmese Government is being asked to withdraw their | :44:31. | :44:34. | |
troops. Politically the Government is making advances towards | :44:34. | :44:38. | |
democracy. They have included the Burmese opposition, under Aung San | :44:38. | :44:41. | |
Suu Kyi, released political prisoner, and they say they want to | :44:41. | :44:45. | |
reach an agreement with the ethnic groups, but there will be no | :44:45. | :44:55. | |
:44:55. | :44:57. | ||
progress with the ethnic peoples, if their troops keep advancing. | :44:57. | :45:00. | |
Until the conflict is solved, the situation here in the camps will | :45:00. | :45:07. | |
get worse. Those who have been here since June, | :45:07. | :45:11. | |
say they are praying to go home, but more immediate low, they are | :45:11. | :45:14. | |
praying the food doesn't run -- immediately, they are playing the | :45:14. | :45:22. | |
food doesn't run out before they. In this camp of 5,000, the ration | :45:22. | :45:29. | |
is down to one cup of rice per day per child, and two cups for an | :45:29. | :45:33. | |
adult. Aid agencies who want to get in to help say they are struggling | :45:33. | :45:38. | |
to get here. The British Government has pledged | :45:38. | :45:43. | |
�2 million in aid to help these people supplement their diet, and | :45:43. | :45:46. | |
when the British Foreign Secretary, William Hague, was in Burma Earl | :45:46. | :45:51. | |
yes this year, he said -- Burma earlier this year, he said | :45:51. | :45:54. | |
sanctions shouldn't be lifted until the Burmese Government allowed the | :45:54. | :46:01. | |
aid to get here. There is huge pressure from business interests in | :46:01. | :46:05. | |
the UK and America for sanctions to be lifted. People here hungry and | :46:05. | :46:08. | |
home lesson the edges of the country, fear they will be | :46:08. | :46:11. | |
forgotten amid calls for trade to be resumed, with a country that is | :46:11. | :46:17. | |
so rich in natural resources. As the Kachin army took us on | :46:17. | :46:20. | |
patrol, along a frontline that stretches hundreds of miles through | :46:20. | :46:25. | |
the jungle, the commander told me that they are grateful to the | :46:25. | :46:28. | |
British, whose army they fought alongside during the Second World | :46:28. | :46:34. | |
War, for giving them the model on which to build. | :46:34. | :46:39. | |
But, over the intimacy of a campfire at night, there is | :46:39. | :46:45. | |
bitterness about their former military ally. TRANSLATION: | :46:45. | :46:49. | |
British shouldn't forget us in our time of need. When they needed us | :46:49. | :46:54. | |
we fought for them against the Japanese. We are now suffering | :46:54. | :47:04. | |
:47:04. | :47:07. | ||
horribly. Surely this is the time For now, they sing of defending | :47:07. | :47:14. | |
their land from exploitation by Burma. | :47:14. | :47:17. | |
Knowing full well that they are running short of weapons, man power, | :47:17. | :47:26. | |
and support. That's all from Newsnight tonight, | :47:26. | :47:36. | |
:47:36. | :47:40. | ||
more tomorrow with that mayoral What a day it's been, the day that | :47:40. | :47:44. | |
winter bit back. The worst of the wintry conditions now heading | :47:44. | :47:48. | |
southwards across northern England, and North Wales. Snow over the high | :47:48. | :47:51. | |
ground causing problems. Gale force winds blowing it around. No great | :47:51. | :47:54. | |
improvements across the heart of England and Wales through the day. | :47:54. | :47:59. | |
Further rain and snow, most of the snow in the high ground, a bleak, | :47:59. | :48:03. | |
raw-feeling day with a strong north-eastly wind. Southern most | :48:03. | :48:06. | |
counties, relatively mild, but slow-moving sharp showers, don't | :48:06. | :48:10. | |
get caught out. It is not going plain sailing by any means here. We | :48:10. | :48:14. | |
run back into that cold and wintry weather across the heart of Wales. | :48:14. | :48:18. | |
Most of the snow up over the highest ground where it could cause | :48:18. | :48:20. | |
problems locally. For Northern Ireland brighter prospects through | :48:20. | :48:23. | |
the afternoon, there will be sunshine. Don't expect a heatwave, | :48:23. | :48:27. | |
it will be a chilly-feeling day. In the sunshine out of the breeze it | :48:27. | :48:30. | |
shouldn't feel too bad. For Scotland a much better day. Apart | :48:30. | :48:35. | |
from the odd shower from the north. It should be dry and bright with a | :48:35. | :48:45. | |
:48:45. | :48:52. | ||
steady thank you. Looking ahead to After a frosty start this is the | :48:52. | :48:54. | |
picture, rain clearing away from the south. More rain heading into | :48:54. | :48:58. |