22/08/2012 Newsnight


22/08/2012

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Tonight in hock up to its neck Greece pleads for just a little bit

:00:08.:00:13.

more time. But after the long hot summer is the promise of September

:00:13.:00:16.

action about to materialise? We'll ask the world biggest bond trader

:00:16.:00:21.

if the printed money's soon going to rain down. Fear of clothing in

:00:21.:00:25.

Las Vegas. He's third in line to the throne, he's naked, but Fleet

:00:25.:00:28.

Street wont touch it with a barge pole. Have they suddenly developed

:00:28.:00:32.

a conscience or have they got the fear of Leveson in them. We have

:00:32.:00:35.

Neil Wallis, a former deputy editor of the News of the World, the

:00:35.:00:39.

publicist Max Clifford and Vanessa Feltz. The airwaves have been alive

:00:39.:00:43.

with male politicians sounding off about rape. In her first interview

:00:43.:00:46.

since resigning Tory MP Louise Mensch says she's fed up with them,

:00:46.:00:49.

and has challenged David Cameron to put women in senior positions in

:00:49.:00:59.
:00:59.:01:01.

the Justice Department. Also its game over for the man who stole

:01:01.:01:03.

multi millions from Polly Peck shareholders. He protested his

:01:03.:01:08.

innocence until the end. A man worth hundreds of millions of

:01:08.:01:14.

pounds, spending dozens of millions of pounds a year on charity, what

:01:14.:01:24.
:01:24.:01:30.

Good evening. Global investors have sitting like hawks on telephone

:01:30.:01:38.

wires watching the drama in Athens as the Prime Minister, Antonis

:01:38.:01:44.

Samaras begs for his colleagues for more time. Since July big stock

:01:44.:01:49.

markets have risen of the expectation in the end the European

:01:49.:01:54.

cl bank will intervene, but with people waiting for the news, to see

:01:54.:01:59.

if they're stepping in to purchase the debt and ease the crisis the

:01:59.:02:09.
:02:09.:02:15.

As our mini-heat wave comes to a end, Continental Europe have been

:02:15.:02:20.

suffering under dangerously high temperatures for weeks. The Euro

:02:20.:02:24.

crisis, which is over a thousands days old, is suffering again. And

:02:24.:02:33.

shock horror, Greece is in the frying pan. It want a two-year

:02:33.:02:39.

extension on the 130 billion Euro loan on troick ker, which was

:02:39.:02:43.

agreed last March. The new Greek Prime Minister, Antonis Samaras

:02:43.:02:47.

hosted the conference, with Jean- Claude Juncker who alongside the

:02:47.:02:57.
:02:57.:03:02.

rest f the troick ker, bailed Today body language expert were

:03:02.:03:07.

deployed to see if there were changes in the mood at least.

:03:07.:03:14.

have to discuss, the lengthening of the period, and other die mentions

:03:14.:03:24.

of the problem, when we are taking the findings of the troika.

:03:24.:03:29.

Any economy in prolonged recession, with soaring unemployment,

:03:29.:03:34.

particularly among young people, cannot stand on its own feet.

:03:34.:03:39.

Afterwards, Mr Samaras invited Mr Juncker to further talks in his car.

:03:39.:03:43.

Can you join me in my car. Tomorrow he flies to France, before jeting

:03:43.:03:48.

to a nipier Berlin, for talks with Merkel measuring, who he will hope

:03:48.:03:56.

is fully refreshed and upbeat after her holiday in Salzburg But

:03:56.:04:03.

creditor nationness the north are cooler on the yfd of a pause in

:04:03.:04:08.

Greek repayments. German MP, hinted today that Germany was already

:04:08.:04:13.

throwing good money after bad by lending money to Greece. "what's

:04:13.:04:20.

the point of the German taxpayer IOUs if the debtor will not pay."

:04:20.:04:26.

Why give Greece more time when it is barely making the structures it

:04:26.:04:31.

agreed to. There is a recognition amongst the troika, there is need

:04:31.:04:35.

to provide relief for the new Government can meet its fiscal

:04:35.:04:40.

targets. But that of course, creates additional financing meeds

:04:40.:04:45.

and that's a difficult conversation amongst the creditor countries.

:04:45.:04:49.

Meanwhile something big is the offing in Frankfurt. Home to the

:04:49.:04:54.

European Central Bank. It looks set to finally use the biggest monetary

:04:54.:05:00.

weapons in the Arsenal, through a programme of unlimit buying, that

:05:00.:05:05.

means the ECB will buy up Government bonds of weaker eurozone

:05:05.:05:09.

countries in the hope of ending the volatility which doged the zone for

:05:09.:05:17.

almost three years. Expect to hear new C words in the coming weeks,

:05:17.:05:22.

conditioningality and convertability. It is the strings

:05:22.:05:27.

if it is to buy bonds on the open ended basis. The Spanish and

:05:27.:05:33.

Italians may formally apply for a bailout from the bailout programmes.

:05:33.:05:35.

As convertability that might account for the softening of the

:05:35.:05:40.

German stance of late. If the future of the currency is called to

:05:40.:05:44.

doubt, that is you cannot convert the currency, the Germans hay allow

:05:44.:05:50.

the ECB whatever, and we mean whatever is necessary, to save the

:05:50.:05:54.

single currency. That talk of major intervention has already stopped

:05:54.:05:59.

the slide in the Euro against most currencies and dramatically lowered

:05:59.:06:06.

Italian and Spanish borrowing costs, down 11 and 17% respectively. If

:06:06.:06:10.

all markets, politicians taxpayers and the weather, were to line up

:06:10.:06:17.

correctly, could we ever arrive at Utopiaville, where coolness lives

:06:17.:06:21.

comfortablely, side by side with southern spending heat. We could

:06:21.:06:26.

see them buy time to slowly and incrementally, and deliberately

:06:26.:06:30.

move towards a banking and political union. Unless we

:06:30.:06:36.

eventually get to debt neutralisation or monetaryisation,

:06:36.:06:43.

or both, we will not see eqib lib reium in the area. It remains a hot

:06:44.:06:47.

issue, but citizens drift towards a banking, fiscal and political union,

:06:48.:06:57.

which few would have forecast, even a year ago. Well watching that from

:06:57.:07:02.

a studio in California, is a man who knows a thing or two about the

:07:02.:07:10.

market, Mohamed El-Erian is CEO of the world's largest bond investors.

:07:10.:07:13.

Hearing German politicians, particularly, saying that it

:07:14.:07:18.

wouldn't really matter, if Greece left the Euro, what's your

:07:18.:07:25.

assessment of that? I think long- term it would be better for the

:07:25.:07:30.

eurozone if Greece were to exit, sixly because Greece has enormous

:07:30.:07:34.

problem generateing economic growth and jobs within the zone and Greece

:07:34.:07:37.

has too much debt so. The solution within the eurozone is difficult.

:07:37.:07:42.

The problem is there is no short- term solution. There is no killer

:07:42.:07:48.

rap to get Greece out without disrupting the rest of the eurozone

:07:48.:07:54.

so no-one makes the decision or go down in history as having that

:07:54.:07:58.

decision made. We have to muddle through again. Are you betting on

:07:58.:08:03.

that? What I'm thinking is going to happen, I want to make a distinct

:08:03.:08:08.

what is likely to happen and what should happen. What is likely to

:08:08.:08:13.

happen is very messy compromise that involves giving some more time

:08:13.:08:18.

to the tkpwreecks but not very much. And - Greeks and involves the

:08:18.:08:21.

creditor giving more money, but not very much, and it will break apart

:08:21.:08:26.

in a few weeks anyway. That's what likely to happen. What should

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happen is people step back, recognise they've been adapting the

:08:30.:08:34.

wrong approach for the last three years, and making the courageous

:08:34.:08:38.

decision. We will end up getting to the difficult decisions but

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unfortunately, they're going to be forced on Greece, rather than taken

:08:43.:08:49.

by Greece. The expectation is, and the ECB will come in and Hoover up

:08:49.:08:52.

Spanish and Italian bonds, Hoover up their debt. Do you think that's

:08:52.:08:58.

the most likely thing to happen? I don't think the E contribution

:08:58.:09:03.

becomes will do that for Greece. I think the ECB will make a distinct

:09:03.:09:08.

tweeng Greece on the one hand and Spain and Italy. And that is a

:09:08.:09:12.

really important distinction that the ECB wants to make and should

:09:12.:09:16.

make, because Spain and Italy are not where Greece is. In terms what

:09:16.:09:22.

they'll do for Spain and Italy, expectations are high, people

:09:22.:09:27.

listen very carefully to the President in London, when he said

:09:27.:09:31.

the ECB is committed to serving the Euro, and do whatever it takes, and

:09:31.:09:35.

believe me it will work, that's what he said. Markets will see

:09:35.:09:41.

words translated into actions, we don't think the translation is that

:09:41.:09:46.

simple. How disappointed will you be if this doesn't happen? I think

:09:46.:09:51.

that the market in general, will be disappointed. All of us should be

:09:51.:09:56.

ready for renewed volatility. We've had a wonderful four weeks of

:09:56.:10:01.

tranquuillity, that tranquuillity was caused by words, not actions.

:10:01.:10:06.

Now we need actions. And I think it will be very hard for the ECB to

:10:06.:10:10.

deliver what both Germany wants which is can't and what Spain and

:10:10.:10:14.

Italy want which is cash. Right, and they're going to have to strike

:10:14.:10:19.

the delicate balance, and it is a very delicate balance to strike.

:10:19.:10:26.

looks like the ECB will do whatever it takes, this will be a open-ended

:10:26.:10:31.

of all debt and printing money, what will that do to the global

:10:31.:10:36.

markets? So F the ECB, does that, and I stress, if, in capital

:10:36.:10:41.

letters, because it is still uncertain, first, that would be

:10:41.:10:46.

tremendous support for Italy and Spain. That would come down. Second

:10:47.:10:50.

it would undermine the long-term credibility of central banks,

:10:50.:10:54.

central banks are not supposed to take on the credit risk. This is

:10:54.:10:58.

for the fiscal agencies, so there's a question about the functioning of

:10:58.:11:02.

institutions, third, it would impose significant political stress

:11:02.:11:06.

within the eurozone for the reasons you heard earlier in your report.

:11:06.:11:09.

Which is the Germans don't think that's the right approach to

:11:09.:11:13.

solveing the problem, they want conditionality, rather than cash.

:11:13.:11:18.

So I think it would solve short- term but come plicate the eurozone

:11:18.:11:24.

long-term. The three things, neutralisation, conditionality and

:11:24.:11:30.

acceptance by citizens in Europe. So far it's been difficult to meet

:11:30.:11:35.

the three criteria. Thank you very much for joining us x. Now, when

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Prince Harry got his kit off in a Las Vagas hotel room, perhaps he

:11:40.:11:45.

had expectation what went on in a private room in Vegas, stayed in

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Vegas, he reckoned without a camera phone, and American chat website,

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has been snapped naked. Like father like son, Prince Charles naked

:11:58.:12:04.

appeared in 1949, but Prince Charles was not a in clairch with a

:12:04.:12:11.

naked woman. Not a single newspaper has done images of Prince Harry,

:12:11.:12:14.

but the Sun which looks nothing like Prince Harry, they were taking

:12:14.:12:20.

no risks. Is it because editors have come on overbarb flee about

:12:20.:12:23.

privacy or fear Lord Justice Leveson is breathing down their

:12:23.:12:32.

necks? Here is Stephen Smith. Keeping a low profile, in cerise

:12:32.:12:36.

bermudas and straw panama, the third in line to the throne has

:12:36.:12:42.

been enjoying down time in Las Vagas, after the duelties of the

:12:42.:12:47.

Olympics. He challenged, Ryan Loche to a race in a nightclub pool. Not

:12:47.:12:51.

sure that was the legacy, everyone was talking about. The Prince

:12:51.:12:57.

invited a whole bunch of people back to his sweert for a few rubers

:12:57.:13:07.
:13:07.:13:11.

Overnight, celebrity web sites in the States ran fuzzy snaps of a

:13:11.:13:16.

naked Prince Harry, in clinchs with women, also wearing very little.

:13:16.:13:21.

Christmas for the tabloids, or so you'd think. It is a fantastic

:13:21.:13:30.

story, he has no clothes on in a bear hug with a lady which appears

:13:30.:13:35.

to be wearing no clothes in a hotel room, literally any journalist

:13:35.:13:39.

worth his salt, whether at one end of the market or the other, would

:13:39.:13:43.

have said, thank you God. It doesn't affect Prince Harry at

:13:43.:13:48.

aufplt because in a way, people would say, he's 28-year-old army

:13:48.:13:52.

officer, he's single and cavorting with ladies who wish to be Kay

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vorted with, so where are the issues. There are none, accept one,

:13:57.:14:06.

Leveson. Air strikes yes, Leveson, with his Lordship's judgment coming

:14:06.:14:09.

soon, British newspaper websites so far declined to run the pictures.

:14:10.:14:14.

Quite right too, say some: We have to remember that although this is

:14:14.:14:20.

Prince Harry, and two girls, this is a 27-year-old, single male who

:14:20.:14:24.

hasn't done anything wrong and who ought to be allowed something of a

:14:24.:14:28.

private life. The palace played this exactly right, saying they

:14:28.:14:32.

won't make any comment whatsoever about it. Now, over and above that,

:14:33.:14:36.

there isn't any scandal that he's done something that is wrong.

:14:36.:14:40.

There's no criminal aspect of it, there's no leadership aspect of it,

:14:40.:14:47.

so he's entitleed to have a private life. So it seems that while the

:14:48.:14:54.

old media will of course be invited to royal photo OPs, such as the

:14:54.:15:01.

work out with Bolt, but less obliging on other stories, like

:15:01.:15:06.

websites which lie out Leveson remit. One well known gossip site,

:15:06.:15:11.

written here, posted the Harry pictures. At the end of the Leveson

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Inquiry, and summation of News International barrister gave to the

:15:14.:15:20.

inquiry, he actually said, it is all right for the Fawkes blowing,

:15:20.:15:25.

they will have a advantage if they clach down on us, so the newspapers

:15:25.:15:30.

are aware this situation cannot exist. And as things get difficult

:15:30.:15:35.

for the old dead tree press, it is to my advantage the Leveson Inquiry

:15:35.:15:45.
:15:45.:15:49.

It had all been going so well for Prince Harry.

:15:49.:15:55.

So, as we countdown to tomorrow morning's papers, what do you do if

:15:55.:16:00.

you're an editor? Risk the wrath of the owner, the lawyers? So I'm the

:16:00.:16:05.

editor of the Sun, I have loads of other issues flying around me, I

:16:05.:16:10.

don't want to embarrass Rupert Murdoch or cost myself my job, in

:16:10.:16:16.

case I get it wrong. The bold move should be to run the damn things. I

:16:16.:16:20.

understand that links later, and Herbert Smith will be all of you,

:16:20.:16:26.

but there's a reason for doing T it is not as though, it is a hole in

:16:26.:16:30.

the wall camera. This is obviously, clearly surrounded by a group of

:16:30.:16:34.

other young people and said that's rather good, we'll have a picture

:16:34.:16:39.

of that. This strip pool party is bad for who exactly? Harry, the

:16:39.:16:46.

palace, the press? It is beginning to look like a cue.

:16:46.:16:51.

Joining me now, we have the evergreen PR tkpwruer rue, Max

:16:51.:16:56.

Clifford, victim of phone hacking, Feltz felt and Neil Wallis who is

:16:56.:17:03.

on police bail as part of the phone hacking investigation, and unable

:17:03.:17:06.

to answer any questions involving that investigation. If you were at

:17:06.:17:12.

the height of your powers, one of the tabloid papers, would you have

:17:12.:17:19.

printed? PreLeveson yes, now no. Because you're afraid, it is either

:17:19.:17:23.

a good photograph or not. situation is fun, it's a good

:17:23.:17:30.

classic newspaper situation. The problem is, in this post-Leveson

:17:30.:17:35.

era, where newspapers are sixly terrified of their own shadow, they

:17:35.:17:38.

daren't do things that most of the country, if they saw it in the

:17:38.:17:43.

paper, would think, that's a bit of a laugh, there there would be no

:17:43.:17:47.

harm done, and they would not think any worse of either the paper, or

:17:48.:17:53.

of Prince Harry. If you thought it was a laugh, what is the public

:17:53.:17:56.

interest defence in these piketures? It is straightforward.

:17:56.:18:01.

He is the third in line to the throne, he has been on the world

:18:01.:18:06.

stage for weeks and weeks. He is supposedly, rounded by police

:18:06.:18:11.

security officers. The truth is, those girls: Clothed or unclothed.

:18:11.:18:17.

Those girls are a group he met at the hotel. That's fine if you are

:18:17.:18:22.

my 27-year-old son, but this is the third in line. For goodness sake F

:18:22.:18:27.

he were in a state or public capacity, if he was suddenly,

:18:27.:18:30.

striping off, at the Olympic Games in full view of the billion viewers,

:18:30.:18:33.

that would be shocking, and that would be a matter of public

:18:33.:18:37.

interest. What he does, in a private hotel room, is what we

:18:37.:18:42.

expect him to be doing, he is a young fellow, he is not married or

:18:42.:18:46.

on state business not representing the Queen, he is having a good

:18:46.:18:51.

laugh. He deserves it, he has been a great ambassador. Any editor who

:18:51.:18:55.

says Prince Harry is doing what he does in private, get naked and cop

:18:55.:19:01.

off, with the opposite sex, that tickles their fancy, and say it is

:19:01.:19:05.

is a private matter S right. If one of the young women, came to you

:19:05.:19:09.

with that photograph, would you take it to a paip sner There's no

:19:09.:19:14.

point because they wouldn't publish it. In a previous life, pre-

:19:14.:19:17.

Leveson? I wouldn't have done, because I have a lot of time for

:19:17.:19:22.

Prince Harry, I like him. Permly, I wouldn't have done, and I think

:19:22.:19:27.

from a PR prers spective, this won't affect his popularity, in

:19:27.:19:31.

terms of what he does with the armed forces, he does a lot in the

:19:31.:19:39.

kids and charities. I have seen him, he has done a lot he and William to

:19:39.:19:46.

make the Monarch as popular as they are today. It is about why the

:19:46.:19:50.

editors make the decision to do that. You see, this is a perfectly

:19:50.:19:56.

reasonable point of view, and if an editor sits and say on journalistic

:19:56.:20:01.

decisions I will decide to or not, that's fine. They're not, that's

:20:01.:20:06.

not the reason, it is not in the Sun tonight. Hang ong, I want to go

:20:06.:20:12.

back, absolutely, Harry is a really decent guy, the Olympics, he's done

:20:12.:20:18.

so and ofpblt but you represent Rebecca Lewis, David Beckham was

:20:18.:20:23.

perfectly decent guy, wasn't he? David Beckham was married.

:20:23.:20:27.

Allegations all the time. I never didn't say it was. But David

:20:28.:20:32.

Beckham was a family man and the whole brand of Beckham was family,

:20:32.:20:38.

family. That's how he was being solid to the world, Rebecca, if the

:20:38.:20:43.

allegations were true, showed that was rubbish and hypocrisy. And the

:20:43.:20:47.

public were being deceived, that's a justification, if there was any

:20:47.:20:52.

in that situation. There's nothing Prince Harry is pretending to be.

:20:52.:20:56.

What is the line now though, I think you would say, that actually,

:20:56.:21:02.

public interest defence may be 20% now? Absolutely right. It is

:21:02.:21:06.

totally changed. As Neil said, basically, before Leveson, and

:21:06.:21:12.

since Leveson, it's totally changed. And my experience, probably, 80%

:21:12.:21:18.

would have made the front page, don't. Why is it a bad thing that's

:21:18.:21:24.

changeed What you're suffering from is knew neutered newspapers. Max is

:21:24.:21:30.

a great example, he mentioned David Beckham's story, do we believe if

:21:30.:21:35.

the story arose now, whether we would get it in a newspaper, I

:21:35.:21:39.

would suspect, that most editors would be embarrassed if you put it

:21:39.:21:42.

to them, because they would be frightened of the consequences,

:21:42.:21:50.

because if you got attacked by Leveson, he would lose your job. If

:21:50.:21:53.

your paper was criticised, the advertisers would flee. You're

:21:53.:22:00.

saying to me, actually the papers are neutered and editors are

:22:00.:22:04.

sitting on legitimate stories? Dels a load of stories, people have

:22:04.:22:11.

come to me, in the last two or three years, were legitimate public

:22:11.:22:14.

stories, exposing paedophiles, editors are frighteneds because

:22:14.:22:19.

this is their private lives, therefore we can't go will.

:22:19.:22:25.

there a bad effect? This is fabulous, awakening of a dormant

:22:25.:22:29.

conscience, if fear is the catalyst for the conscience, who cares. If

:22:29.:22:35.

there's some kind of moral, awakening, then it is about damn

:22:35.:22:41.

time because they're far too many people's lives have been paid fast,

:22:41.:22:46.

if you ask the public, are you suffering a dreadful dirth, is

:22:46.:22:49.

there a famine of fabulous stories you feast, the public will say,

:22:49.:22:54.

what, they wouldn't know what you're talking about. Have you seen

:22:54.:22:59.

this page, it is not, you seen the photographs., It is something else,

:22:59.:23:04.

everyone has seen the internet, that's hilarious. The reason the

:23:04.:23:11.

Sun that is done this, is Leveson. The point of it is, that if you

:23:11.:23:15.

take away the significance of Prince Harry today. What we're

:23:15.:23:20.

talking about is an issue whereby, we have a culture, that means that

:23:20.:23:24.

here in Britain, in Ireland tonight, you stand on the border, one foot

:23:24.:23:30.

on one side, the Irish, herald has the picture ton its front page. You

:23:30.:23:34.

stand on the other side on the border and the British newspapers

:23:34.:23:39.

are too scared to show that picture. Yet you go on the web, and all over

:23:39.:23:43.

the world you can see these piketures. The only people who

:23:43.:23:48.

can't are British newspapers. It is a response face nat, decent.

:23:49.:23:56.

The point is it is the next stage of news, isn't it? As you said,

:23:56.:24:00.

it's on the web. Lots have looked at it, would you have bought a

:24:00.:24:06.

newspaper if it was in it? To have a good look, he looks fantastic, I

:24:06.:24:13.

would buy a centrefold with Prince Harry looking like that. It is he

:24:13.:24:17.

will straight wheen News of the World closed and Sun took over. It

:24:17.:24:20.

is nothing like it the News of the World, because the British public

:24:20.:24:24.

wanted the scandal, the things that are exposed in the News of the

:24:24.:24:30.

World, that doesn't happen any more. Whether it is a good thing or not

:24:30.:24:36.

it another matter. We talked about:. British public miss it.

:24:36.:24:40.

In advance of Leveson, finally on the question of the Royal family.

:24:40.:24:44.

It will be a very, very, interesting paper that would

:24:44.:24:48.

publish anything in the Royal family now, do you think it is off

:24:48.:24:54.

limits, do you think they've successfully managed the PR. They

:24:54.:24:58.

were off limits until 40 years ago, and suddenly, things were appearing

:24:58.:25:02.

that you would never have dreamt off. Now the Royal family, along

:25:02.:25:06.

with everybody else major store is getting massive protection, mainly

:25:06.:25:10.

because of Leveson and everything has changed out there. There's an

:25:10.:25:16.

argument for and against, you must have a free press, and responsible

:25:16.:25:22.

press, but now, the press's hands are tied behind their back. It is

:25:22.:25:29.

the bad guys that get away with it as a result. The Conservative MP,

:25:29.:25:37.

and author, Louise Mensch wrote a piece in today's Daily Telegraph,

:25:37.:25:43.

about MPs attitude to rape. From Henri de Galle to Todd Akin to the

:25:43.:25:50.

mouriesry Senate race. What could be her last salvo, she challenged

:25:50.:25:55.

David Cameron to put a woman in the senior department. She's fed up

:25:55.:25:58.

with male politicians demeaninging the more risk crime of rape. Here

:25:58.:26:05.

are a few of the comments that annoyed her. Not everybody needs to

:26:05.:26:12.

be asked prior to each insertion, some people believe that when you

:26:12.:26:17.

go to bed with somebody, take off your clothe and have sex with them,

:26:17.:26:22.

and then fall asleep, you're already in the sex game with them.

:26:22.:26:26.

It seems to me first of all, from what I understand from doctors,

:26:26.:26:30.

that's really rare, if it's a legitimate rape the female body

:26:30.:26:34.

that's ways to shut that whole thing down. Assume that didn't work

:26:34.:26:39.

or something, I think there should be punishment, but the pun yushment

:26:39.:26:44.

ought to be on the rapeest and not child. The allegations are rape

:26:44.:26:49.

though aren't they? It is well worth people watching us tonight to

:26:49.:26:54.

go go on-line and discover what they can about the allegations how

:26:54.:26:58.

they were made. Who made them, what those people who made them, did

:26:58.:27:04.

afterwards. And, looking at what happened. Serious rape, I don't

:27:04.:27:08.

think many judges give five years for a forcible rape, frankly. The

:27:08.:27:14.

tariff is longer than that. And a serious rape, where violence, and

:27:14.:27:22.

unwilling woman, you attach much longer than that. A few comments

:27:22.:27:27.

from prominent people. Louise, first of all, there's a serious,am

:27:27.:27:31.

Biff lens here amongst male politicians and not just men, about

:27:31.:27:39.

the idea of a violent stranger rape, and coercion in the home? This

:27:40.:27:43.

gradeation, which is recognised in Swedish law in a strange way?

:27:43.:27:47.

That's the point of my piece, all too often male politicians

:27:47.:27:51.

recognise one type of rape, when a stranger holds you off out of the

:27:51.:27:54.

bushes and rapes you. They don't want to look at the areas of

:27:54.:27:58.

consent or believe a wife for example could say no to her husband

:27:58.:28:02.

and be raped within marriage. They aren't interested in shades of grey.

:28:02.:28:05.

A and that's something we have to change. When you look at it, in

:28:05.:28:09.

England and Wales T became illegal to rape within marriage, 21 years

:28:09.:28:17.

ago, is this a kind of relic of old attitudes or new attitudes as well?

:28:17.:28:23.

Unbelieveablely, shocking, so it is an attitude that has gone on for

:28:23.:28:28.

ages, we should have had marital rape for ages as a crime. It is

:28:28.:28:34.

shocking that took us that long. Those attitudes are still there.

:28:34.:28:39.

And people, actually for whatever reason, have sway? Yes., you mean

:28:39.:28:43.

the politicians have sway, these are the people, this is why it is

:28:43.:28:45.

more important than celebrities making stupid comments about rape.

:28:45.:28:50.

These are the law-makers, that will affect how rapists are punished

:28:50.:28:53.

lepbl slated against and recognised in the courts, and also, they set

:28:53.:28:56.

the culture. And sometimes, women, have been driven to feeling that

:28:57.:29:02.

men just don't get it, they fundamentally don't get it. We've

:29:02.:29:08.

seen politicians from the extreme left, like Craig Murray naming an

:29:08.:29:13.

accuser, live on your programme, former Lib Dem. We've seen people

:29:13.:29:18.

from the extreme right. Ken Neath Clarke. Although I do in Ken's case,

:29:18.:29:24.

he really did mis-speak, he was talking about aggravateing factors.

:29:24.:29:29.

Was ust way of putting things. you have things like Whoopi

:29:29.:29:34.

Goldberg, saying it wasn't rape, rape, it is not just men, who are

:29:34.:29:38.

voicing these attitudes? No it isn't just men, and Helen Mirren,

:29:38.:29:43.

made ust remarks as well. But it is far more often men than women.

:29:43.:29:50.

Whilst it is disgraceful that whoopy as activists seekss to

:29:50.:29:55.

justify the film maker. There is only one type of rape, when a

:29:55.:29:59.

victim of rape does not give consent to sex. That's what makes a

:29:59.:30:09.

in rape. How can this be addressed. What you talked about, is ask David

:30:09.:30:14.

Cameron in a senior role. We have a female Home Secretary? It isn't

:30:14.:30:19.

necessary change, I wish to take issue the idea I'm demanding or

:30:19.:30:22.

challenging David Cameron to do anything, I would encourage him to

:30:22.:30:26.

consider it. I think it would be a great idea to do it. This is

:30:26.:30:30.

already his man, I believe. He inherited a parliamentary party

:30:30.:30:35.

with not very women. He did a lot to change that permly and now we

:30:35.:30:39.

have Anna, who will make a fabulous minister. David Cameron made a big

:30:39.:30:42.

effort to change that, and you were one of the people he chose to make

:30:43.:30:46.

that effort with. And you, potentially were a high

:30:46.:30:50.

flyer, you could have been the woman in the Justice Department.

:30:50.:30:54.

I'm not a lawyer. You could be one of the women who, were there to be

:30:54.:30:58.

making changes N the law, changes in attitudes. More than you even

:30:58.:31:06.

have done so far? Well, think, luckily you're not limit speaking

:31:06.:31:12.

out by sitting in a parliamentary seat. The way David handled the

:31:12.:31:18.

difficult resignation, gives him credit. He supported women in

:31:19.:31:23.

Parliament. Do you think you were able to push the envelope, with

:31:23.:31:26.

younger female MPs. I remember when you came on, and it was interesting,

:31:26.:31:30.

because it was unusual to have a young Conservative, we were talking

:31:30.:31:33.

about nextism so openly, did you contribute to the attitude no

:31:34.:31:40.

changes I hope so. I'm not alone. There's Claire Perry, and a whole

:31:40.:31:44.

bunch of Tory women, very many, women, Tory feminists who self-

:31:44.:31:47.

identify as feminists, that's the important thing, to say nextism is

:31:47.:31:51.

not about the right or the left. Femism is about women. And there

:31:51.:31:56.

are people who support the nextist role across the political spectrum.

:31:56.:32:01.

If we debt that across that's a good thing. On your decision, to go,

:32:01.:32:05.

it is come plicate, but is it possible to have a senior role in

:32:05.:32:09.

politics and raise a family? Absolutely, in my case, it wasn't

:32:09.:32:12.

about having it all or children, as I said the Prime Minister supported

:32:12.:32:15.

flexible working and made that happen in my case. My circumstances

:32:15.:32:20.

are unique, it was more about a family that was split across the

:32:20.:32:23.

Atlantic and strains of doing that, more than a working mother. The

:32:23.:32:28.

Prime Minister has backed women and will continue to do so. Will you

:32:28.:32:32.

ever return to front line politics again? Never say never, but I have

:32:32.:32:40.

a lot on my plate right now. As on the Polly Peck tycoon, whose name

:32:40.:32:45.

was synonymous with the get rich fast will be sentenced tomorrow of

:32:45.:32:55.
:32:55.:32:55.

ten charges of theft, between 1987 and 1990, amounting to 61.8 million

:32:55.:33:00.

today. His conviction is the end of a fraud office investigation, which

:33:00.:33:04.

had stalled when Nadir fled the country, two years ago, he returned

:33:04.:33:07.

voluntarily to Britain, promising to clear his name.

:33:07.:33:17.
:33:17.:33:22.

We look back at an extraordinary He was the astonishingly successful

:33:22.:33:26.

millionaire businessman. Whose FTSE 100 company was brought crashing

:33:26.:33:32.

down by an investigation, that's taken over 20 years to complete.

:33:32.:33:40.

Throughout that time, Asil Nadir protested his innocence. There was

:33:40.:33:47.

gross totally, gross conduct of the graveest kind in this whole affair.

:33:47.:33:53.

Now, it's finally ended in his conviction. The Serious Fraud

:33:53.:34:03.
:34:03.:34:03.

Office's long pursuit of Asil Nadir has been vindicated. 19 80s was the

:34:03.:34:08.

get rich quick decade and no-one got richer, quicker than Asil Nadir.

:34:08.:34:13.

Starting in the rag trade in 1980, he made an investment, that was to

:34:13.:34:23.
:34:23.:34:30.

He paid nearly �300,000 for a stake in a small textile company, called

:34:30.:34:33.

Polly Peck. As it expended he devoured more and more companies,

:34:34.:34:43.
:34:44.:34:44.

by the end of the decade, Polly Peck had00 subridries -

:34:44.:34:47.

subsidiaries, and he was a donor to the Conservative Party. By the end

:34:47.:34:53.

of the decade, Polly Peck was one of the leading FTSE 100 companies.

:34:53.:34:59.

But things started to fall spectacularly apart for Asil Nadir

:34:59.:35:05.

when the Serious Fraud Office, raided his offices in Mayfair. They

:35:05.:35:09.

were investigating allegations of insider trading and that triggered

:35:09.:35:17.

the collapse of Polly Peck A very public raid, the newspapers there.

:35:17.:35:22.

With inknew when doe, they create a cloud of you. Rl which is very

:35:23.:35:27.

damaging. Confidence in any company, doesn't matter which company it is,

:35:27.:35:33.

it could be a massive bank or anything else, it can have

:35:33.:35:38.

devastating effect. The September 1990 raid was followed by a

:35:38.:35:43.

shocking series of events x The next day, the Polly Peck share

:35:43.:35:47.

price collapsed. The following month the company went into

:35:47.:35:53.

administration. Then the SFO raided Polly Peck's headquarters, and in

:35:53.:35:57.

December, Asil Nadir was arrested in dramatic circumstances as he

:35:57.:36:05.

arrived back in London on the private jet. There was a massive

:36:05.:36:15.

arrest procedure with dozens of armed surrounding the plane.

:36:15.:36:20.

Ridiculous affair, and I was arrested, taken to holborn place

:36:20.:36:26.

station x It was a catastrophic fall from grace for Asil Nadir who

:36:26.:36:32.

was charged with theft and false accounting on a massive scale.

:36:32.:36:37.

the company collapsed, shareholders, individuals and corporates lost a

:36:37.:36:42.

huge amount of money, various people lost their jobs as well,

:36:42.:36:46.

when PPI collapsed. As far as the reputation of London is concerned

:36:46.:36:52.

as a financial centre, if that sort of thing can occur, it damages our

:36:53.:36:59.

reputation. A mother with five young children, who had used her

:36:59.:37:03.

savings to buy several thousands pounds worth of Polly Peck stock

:37:03.:37:10.

was caught completely by surprise. I had a brilliant annual report

:37:10.:37:15.

from the accountants which gave you no reason to think they would be

:37:15.:37:22.

bad in any way, that it would suddenly go broke. Then a few days

:37:22.:37:27.

later, complete collapse. investigation was run by the

:37:27.:37:32.

Serious Fraud Office which was set up a few years earlier, because of

:37:32.:37:37.

the failure to deal with the wave of financial scannedals. Its

:37:37.:37:42.

reputation was to be severely tested during the pursuit of Nadir.

:37:42.:37:47.

He was accused of zaeling �150 million 348 from Polly Peck's

:37:47.:37:50.

accounts, obviously routeing it vaia the Channel Islands and

:37:50.:37:57.

complex web of companies which the Nadir family controlled. The

:37:57.:38:04.

prosecution said he used 25 million to buy thousands of shares to prop

:38:04.:38:10.

up the price, and 25 million went into family trusts. Then trfs the

:38:10.:38:15.

vanity projects. Stolen money helped buy this 17th century estate

:38:15.:38:19.

in Rutland. He planned to turn in into a gox course. This stately

:38:19.:38:28.

home in Leicestershire, which he bought for himself. After PPI

:38:28.:38:31.

collapsed, the administrators, went to northern Cyprus, to attempt to

:38:31.:38:41.

recover the cash, but found only a black hole. Did you steal that

:38:41.:38:46.

money? Absolutely not. It makes you wonder, a man worth hundreds of

:38:46.:38:53.

millions of pounds, spending dozens of millions of millions of pounds

:38:53.:38:59.

on charity. What motive does he have, for God sake to actually

:38:59.:39:06.

steal money? You steal money from an enterity you created yourself?

:39:06.:39:12.

Absolutely not. In 1993, with his trial date approaching, he decided

:39:12.:39:16.

to flee the UK. Asking a pilot friend to drive him to this remote

:39:16.:39:21.

airfield in Dorset. We came right up to this gate, left the car where

:39:21.:39:28.

it was, walked through, the engines were Turkish r turning the door was

:39:28.:39:34.

open, within 35 seconds we were air borne. The SFO had let the man at

:39:34.:39:38.

the centre of one of the biggest ever fraud trials, slip will you

:39:38.:39:41.

its fingers. And they had no prospect of getting

:39:41.:39:45.

him back. The Turkishish control part of the

:39:45.:39:50.

island has no extradition treaty with the UK for 17 years he lived

:39:50.:39:56.

there, beyond the reach of UK law. With Nadir out of the country,

:39:56.:40:05.

serious questions about the SFO's conduct continued.

:40:05.:40:08.

Tory Government minister, Michael Mates was concerned about the

:40:08.:40:13.

taking and copying of the SFO of legally privileged defence papers,

:40:13.:40:17.

belonging to Asil Nadir. But he was forced to resign, when it was

:40:17.:40:22.

revealed after Nadir's arrest, he'd sent him a watch, engraved with the

:40:22.:40:29.

words "don't let the bugers get you down". In an explosive resignation

:40:29.:40:37.

speech, he lambasted the SFO. God, it is all coming back. Do you

:40:37.:40:43.

remember it. Is it pain snfl This is the moment I was absolutely

:40:43.:40:51.

disturbed, I was in despair. If one cannot come to the House,

:40:51.:40:59.

and tell them what is wrong with the system... If one cannot speak

:40:59.:41:05.

in this place, not about innocence or guilt, not about trial, not

:41:05.:41:11.

about subduediesity, but what has gone wrong with the system, then

:41:11.:41:16.

Madame speaker, what is the point of being here It is after the trial

:41:16.:41:21.

the honourable gentlemen must give this information, that is the point.

:41:21.:41:25.

The SFO's case controller, was disciplined ost cop ig and

:41:25.:41:28.

distribution of the legally privilegeed defence papers, seized

:41:28.:41:35.

in the 1990 raid on Nadir's office. And for failing to fully Brave the

:41:35.:41:41.

then Attorney General. That's enough. But the judge in Nadir's

:41:41.:41:45.

trial, ruled that her conduct, didn't affect the fairness of the

:41:45.:41:53.

trial. The former President of northern Cyprus, who spoke to us

:41:53.:41:57.

shortly before his death last year. He revealed how soon after Nadir

:41:57.:42:00.

arrived back, he was asked by a member of the British Government to

:42:00.:42:06.

have him arrested. I was shocked. I said, under my

:42:06.:42:14.

constitution, he has committed no offence here. We cannot deport a

:42:14.:42:21.

subject. And I cannot arrest a man just because you request it. I'm

:42:21.:42:28.

really shocked. He was shocked. a way I said, well I haven't heard

:42:28.:42:34.

this, forget it. Speculation about why he'd return to Britain remains.

:42:34.:42:40.

But in January, after 20 years of investigations, arrests, claims and

:42:40.:42:47.

counter claims, the trial of Asil Nadir finally got under way.

:42:48.:42:51.

Wearing an electronic tag and bodyguards in tow, he arrived at

:42:51.:42:56.

the Old Bailey. His liberty and reputation of the serious faued

:42:56.:43:05.

office from on the line. A Dad's Army of former board directors,

:43:05.:43:09.

financial expert, police officers, and others, would give evidence of

:43:09.:43:14.

event that happened two decades earlier, leading to the raid on

:43:14.:43:22.

Polly Peck. At his plush officeness Mayfair, Nadir ran things with an

:43:22.:43:26.

autocratic management style. Under a single signatory system he was

:43:26.:43:30.

able to move company money without any other board member having to

:43:30.:43:37.

countersign. Nadir never dispute he moved Polly Peck's money out of

:43:37.:43:42.

accounts in London. His defence to this complex fraud was very simple

:43:42.:43:49.

- it was all about how business was done in Cyprus, back in those days.

:43:49.:43:54.

As Nadir always said that, before he took any money from the company

:43:54.:43:57.

in London, he'd always deposited equivalent amounts of money into

:43:57.:44:00.

company bank accounts here in northern Cyprus. So there could

:44:00.:44:08.

never have been any theft. The justification for that, was that

:44:08.:44:11.

Polly Peck in northern Cyprus needed large amounts of the local

:44:11.:44:16.

currency, Turkishish leera, and his family, and in particular his

:44:16.:44:26.
:44:26.:44:27.

Under cross-examination, Asil Nadir was asked repeatedly if he could

:44:27.:44:34.

provide evidence of the massive deposits of Turkishish lira. He

:44:34.:44:39.

said it was cuss tum to keep vast stores of cash in secure rooms in

:44:39.:44:44.

wealthy houses and not keep records of the deposits. Defence witnesses

:44:44.:44:50.

spoke about ferrying suitcases full of cash to banks. It would have

:44:50.:44:57.

been brought in by her security guards, plural, but, even then, we

:44:57.:45:02.

think inheritly probably you have a nx security guards going down the

:45:03.:45:07.

street with a number of wheeled suitcases containing these vast

:45:07.:45:12.

amount of cash. The jury agreed. Their verdict, finally delivered

:45:12.:45:16.

just fis for the victims of the collapse of Polly Peck.

:45:16.:45:19.

But that's not quite how Asil Nadir sees it.

:45:19.:45:24.

Something in the region of 70 or 80,000 people lost their jobs, as a

:45:24.:45:31.

result of the downfall of Polly Peck. Shareholders lost billions,

:45:31.:45:38.

of pounds, how do you feel about that? Well, all I have to do is

:45:38.:45:42.

remind you, that I was the biggest shareholder, I was the creator of

:45:42.:45:47.

the company. So in a funny way, I've been the biggest loser in this

:45:47.:45:54.

affair. Tomorrow morning's front affair. Tomorrow morning's front

:45:54.:46:04.
:46:04.:46:07.

page now, we begin the w the Sun Harry naked romp was sensation says

:46:07.:46:14.

the Daily Mirror. Telegraph, and picture of Harry, in Los Angeles,

:46:14.:46:20.

hours after the pictures went on- line. The palace moved to ban naked

:46:20.:46:25.

photographs, the Prince confirmed they've spoke ton the complaints

:46:25.:46:31.

commission. On the left hand side hups of schools face axe as GCSE

:46:31.:46:36.

grades stall. The right to die campaigner, finds a victory in

:46:36.:46:43.

death. The Guardian, class divide in

:46:43.:46:48.

health widens, and Tories under pressure. Well that is all from

:46:48.:46:51.

Newsnight tonight. The Russian media reported today that sipgel,

:46:51.:46:56.

Sarah Brightman is in talks to become the eighth space tourist to

:46:56.:46:59.

visit the International Space Station. We find archive of her,

:47:00.:47:03.

that might explain why she's so keen to go.

:47:03.:47:13.
:47:13.:47:26.

# I lost my heart to a star ship trooper

:47:26.:47:36.
:47:36.:47:42.

Prospects for the weekend don't look Rosie. Thursday morning dawns

:47:42.:47:48.

on a bright cheerful note. Cloud will thicken and we'll see rain

:47:48.:47:51.

arriving. Before that happens across the heart of the Midlands

:47:51.:47:55.

the sunshine will hang on in the afternoon. This is 4.00, a bright

:47:55.:48:00.

prospect for most, the London area, certainly. Koofl at 21-22 degrees.

:48:00.:48:04.

Further west, the cloud will be increasing, filling the sky and

:48:04.:48:09.

producing a few showers across the West Country and Wales not a

:48:09.:48:12.

washout, but will be getting cloudier and damper in some places,

:48:12.:48:22.
:48:22.:48:22.

will you the second half of the day. It won't feel that warm out there

:48:22.:48:26.

either. Dampness filling in to south-west Scotland. Further east

:48:26.:48:30.

and north, it will abbrighter prospect.

:48:30.:48:38.

Long last, the heavy rain will fade away. Friday, it looks particularly

:48:38.:48:43.

wet. Not a pleasant toned the week. Gusty winds, particularly down

:48:43.:48:47.

towards English Channel coast. Low pressure, approaching our

:48:47.:48:51.

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