19/01/2014 Sunday Politics East

Morning, folks. Welcome to the Sunday Politics. Nick Clegg says

Chris Rennard must apologise. "What for?", say his friends. We'll ask

senior Lib Dem minister Danny Alexander whose side he's on.

What about the voters? What do they make of the Lib Dems? We hear the

views of a Sunday Politics focus group. A donkey.

Here in the east, David Cameron on tour, but there was no new money for

road or rail. he did not make the announcement? I

don't think that's right. I don t clear every word I say with him I

don't expect him to do the same to me. The Lib Dems have told us before

it was the Treasury that was blocking this from happening. We

were going to ask the low pay commission to advise us on bringing

the minimum wage back up. During the financial crisis, wages have been

lower-than-expected but it's also right, we shouldn't act in a hasty

way, we should listen to what the commission has to say, and if they

don't recommend an increase we have to make sure economic conditions are

there to get it right. Not only are the Tories getting credit for that,

our Scottish voters group showed that people have still not forgiven

you for ratting on tuition fees and that was a broken promise that

didn't even apply to the people in Scotland, where there are no tuition

fees! Nick Clegg has been very clear about the issues that that brought

up. If you look at our manifesto, the University of London said we

delivered about 70% of our policies in the manifesto. They haven't

forgiven you for the big one. The big promise we made was to cut

income tax the millions of people. That is a policy which is putting

money back into the pockets of working people. It is only possible

because we are delivering our economic plan in government with the

Conservatives. Now we have to make sure, through tax cuts, through

looking at issues like the minimum wage and other groups who have made

sacrifices, make sure that benefit is shared. I am not going to agree

to anything which undermines the confidence of businesses to invest

in this country over the next 1 months. Speaking of Scotland, the

Lib Dems, why do they now look largely irrelevant in the battle for

the union? Not one of our focus group even knew who your Scottish

leader is. I don't accept that. I have spent a lot of time with

Alistair Carmichael and others, we are all making the case every day.

If Scotland votes to be independent, it will be in a much worse financial

position within the European Union. Scotland will be contributing to the

rebate for the UK, rather than benefiting from it. It has been a

disaster for your Scottish based to have joined a coalition with the

Tories. It may have been the right thing to do, you say it is in the

national interest, but Scottish Lib Dems did not expect to be in a

coalition with the Tories. By the way I think it is also in the

national interests and the interests of the people for Scotland, cutting

the income tax of Scottish people, stabilising the economy. We are now

seeing good growth. But you are in meltdown. I don't accept that. We

will see what happens in the 20 5 election. I think we have a record

to be proud of, we have played a very important role in clearing up

the mess Labour made in the economy, of making sure the

Coalition government tackles the problems in this country, but does

so in a fair way. I think the biggest risks to the economic

recovery over the next few biggest risks to the economic

either a majority Labour government or a majority Conservative

government. Labour you cannot trust with the finances, the Tories want

us to play chicken with the European Union which would truly be a

disaster to investment in this country. You announced this week

that if Scotland votes to leave the UK, it would be the British Treasury

that would guarantee all British government debt. There wouldn't be a

negotiation, but the backstop would be that even if they didn't take

anything, we would still guarantee the debt. What was happening in the

markets that you needed to calm them down? We were getting quite a few

questions from the people we rely on to lend us money. We are still

borrowing billions of pounds every month as a country. Those people

were asking us to clarify this point. It was becoming a serious

concern? It wasn't reflected in the guilty yields. I follow the bond

market quite carefully and there was no sign this was having an impact.

That's why the right thing to do was to clarify this point now, rather

than the concerns being reflected in what you imply, and I think it is a

bad idea for Scotland to vote for separation but it would be wrong to

allow for the fact that question is on the table to cost taxpayers in

the UK more money and higher interest payments simply because

Alex Salmond has put that question on the table. That's why I think it

was the right thing to do. There were a lot of calls from the focus

group that you need to be different. Nick Clegg has embarked on this

aggressive differentiation. Where you can be different is the

bankers' bonuses. What conceivable reason could there be for anybody at

RBS getting a bonus twice in their salary? We have not been approached

by RBS in terms of those votes. I would be sceptical

by RBS in terms of those votes. I from RBS if it can. It shows

by RBS in terms of those votes. I have presided over

by RBS in terms of those votes. I government, massive reductions. .

I'm not asking you about that, I'm asking what conceivable case there

can be for a bank that has failed to sell its branches even though

ordered by the Government, still has 38 billion of toxic debt on its

balance sheet, I ask again what possible reason should they get

twice salary as a bonus? Your right to say RBS is in a very different

position to other banks, it is mostly owned by the state. RBS

hasn't put a case to us but they might do so I would like to look at

what they would say, but I would be sceptical as to whether a case could

be made given some of the things you said, but also the fact that it is a

bank that has benefited from the taxpayer standing behind it. Now RBS

has to focus more on domestic retail. Let me turn to Chris

Rennard, ten women have accused him of sexual harassment. He denies

every case. Who do you believe? We have been through a process on this

as a party. A report has been issued on this. I agree with Alistair

Webster on this, he has made clear that while he cannot prove what

happened to a criminal standard that there is clear there has been

considerable distress and harm caused. I agree with him about that

and that's why it is necessary for Chris Rennard to apologise as he has

been asked to do. If he refuses to apologise, should he be denied the

Lib Dem whip in the Lords? I don't think he should be readmitted to the

Liberal Democrat group in the House of Lords until such time as the

disciplinary process, including the apology, has been done properly We

are very democratic party, it is a matter for our group in the House of

Lords in due course to make that judgement. Party HQ has had a lot of

complaints from party members about the fact no apology has been made.

The appropriate committee would need to look at that and decide what

action needs to be taken because these are very serious matters. We

as a party have learned a lot, taken a long, hard look at ourselves, to

change the way we work. The apology does need to be made. We are told

that Lord Newby, the Chief Whip of the Liberal Democrats in the House

of Lords, we are told he has shaken hands with Chris Rennard and

welcomed him back. That decision has not been taken yet. I think Lord

Newby would share my view on this. Have you shaken his hand and

welcomed him back? No, I haven't. Does Nick Clegg have the power to

deny Chris Rennard as the whip? I am making it clear that a lack of

apology is totally unacceptable and therefore we have to take steps if

that is not forthcoming. His view and my view is that Lord Rennard

should not be readmitted to the House of Lords if that is not

forthcoming. In our party, our group in the House of Lords has two in the

end take a view for itself. And they can override Nick Clegg's view? I

hope that when they look at this... Do they have the power to override

Nick Clegg? They have the power to decide who should be the whip. The

failure to follow up the simple human demand for an apology for the

stress that has been caused is totally unacceptable. Your party is

totally down lighted on this -- divided on this. Here is what Lord

Carlile had to say. A total nonsense, hyperbole. It is a

ridiculous statement to make and we have seen Alistair Webster, the QC

who did this investigation, comment on that himself this morning. He has

followed the process the party laid down in its rules, which sets the

standard for the investigation which asked him to report on the evidence

he has found, but he also has a duty of confidentiality and

responsibility under the data protection legislation as well. Here

is what your activists have said in a letter to the Guardian. This shows

there are strong opinions, but why should Chris Rennard apologise for

something he denies, unproven allegations, on an unpublished

report that Chris Rennard has not been allowed to read? He should

apologise because he wants to continue to be a member of the

Liberal Democrats and this is the recommendation that has been made by

the internal disciplinary process. Webster himself said this was not an

inquiry, it is an opinion. If Chris Rennard apologises on this basis, he

opens himself to civil lawsuits He says he is not going to do it. As a

Liberal Democrat you join the party because you believe in its values,

you abide by its rules. One of those rules is that we have a process if

there are disciplinary allegations. The committee of the party supported

Webster's recommendations, one of which was that an apology should be

made because he clearly found distress had been caused. Will there

now be a proper inquiry? I don't think any of these legalistic

things, I don't think he can have it both ways. Will there be a proper

inquiry? Alistair Webster did do a proper inquiry. There was a proper

report into what happened at the time and we have learned a lot from

this is a party, and the most important thing now is that Chris

Rennard apologises. You have made that clear. What kind of biscuits

are you? Are you a Tunnocks? Soft on the inside? It is good of you to be

advertising a Scottish product. We just wondered if you weren't tough

enough to take on Ed Balls. Thank you. More than tough enough is the

answer to that. Generally governments are a bit

rubbish at IT projects. They tend to run way over budget and never quite

achieve what they promised. So the revelations of a former spy that the

US and British security agencies were in fact astonishingly efficient

at eavesdropping on the digital communications of their citizens

came as a bit shock. But just how worried should we be about their

clandestine activity? In his latest revelation, former US

by Edward Snowden has claimed that America's National Security Agency

operates a secret database called Dishfire. It collect 200 million

mobile phone messages every day from around the world, accessed, he says,

why British and American spies. This week, the president has outlined a

series of surveillance reforms, including Ning to the storage of the

phone call information of millions of Americans, and no Morse -- and no

more spying on allies like Angela Merkel. Critics say that the British

intelligence agencies have refused to acknowledge

intelligence agencies have refused debate on the issue. The Foreign

Secretary William six says that we have a very strong system of checks

and balances. -- William Hague. ?? new line Nick Pickles is director of

the pressure group Big Brother Watch. The Labour MP Hazel Blears in

on Parliament's Intelligence And Security Committee. They're here to

go head to head. Welcome to both of you. Hazel

Blears, let me come to you first. President Obama has made some major

changes as a result of what we have learned that the NSA in America was

up to. But British politicians seem to, they are not up for this kind of

thing, they are hoping it will go away? It is not going away and that

is why my committee, the Intelligence And Security Committee,

has decided to launch an enquiry into whether the legal framework is

up-to-date. We have had massive technological change. We have had a

call for evidence. Some of the sessions will be open so that people

can see what the evidence is. Obviously some of the information

will have to be classified, but on the committee, there is a real

commitment to say, there is a big debate going on, let's see if the

system is as Rob asked as we can make it. The big question is

oversight and the call for evidence that the committee has issued is not

mention oversight. It is ten years since the Foreign Affairs Committee

said that the committee should be a fully elected committee chosen by

Parliament and not the Prime Minister. It has changed, actually.

The Prime Minister nominates people and the house gets to him -- gets to

approve. In America, they have a separation of power, the president

does not nominate Kennedy. Basically, Hazel Blears, you're an

establishment lackey? I do not think so. Most of the people on the

committee have some experience of intelligence and these issues. In

this country, we have robust scrutiny, compared to some of her

European neighbours. We have Parliamentary scrutiny, the

interception commissioners, and ministers have to sign the warrants.

But there may be room for improvement, which is why we are

having the enquiry. Do not forget, President Obama said that the agency

should not have the ability to collect data, he wanted to put more

safeguards in. That is essential for the work of the agencies. If you

cannot see the data, you cannot take the connections and see the

patterns. Some people never talk about the threat from terrorism it

is all about travesty. There are several thousand people in this

country, as we are talking, who are actively planning to do a country

harm. When this debate started in the US, the NSA head stood up and

said there are 54 plots that have been detected by this capability

that has detected and that in bulk. Now the head of the NSA has admitted

that the number is actually zero. It is not the intelligence committee in

the US that did the work to reduce that number, it was a Judiciary

Committee. The fact that we have two different bodies doing this in this

country, it means that you do not get the correct view. How can people

have confidence in a body when if you go around Europe, for example,

or the world, we are not at the end not requiring judges to not sign

warrants? I do not accept that the committee failed on that range of

issues. You look at the reports on 7/7. Two reports by the committee

get to the heart of it. If you look at that terrorist attack on our

country, people will say, why did you not have them on the radar? The

agencies are between a rock and a hard race. They have got to be

subject to oversight, but beanie capability. Did you know about

Dishfire? We go to GCHQ on a regular basis and I know about the

capabilities that we have got. Some of the names of these programmes, we

would not necessarily know. But did you know that GCHQ had the

capability to use Dishfire, or to get Dishfire material from the NSA?

I knew and my committee knew that we had the capability to collect data,

and these days, people do not write letters, they do not use landline

telephones, they use the Internet and text in, so it is important that

the agencies are able to keep up with that take the logical change.

What should happen? The proper legal framework should include, if a

company is cooperating, as Google and Facebook do, it should be

illegal for GCHQ to hack into them. In the US, Lundberg estimate that

this has driven a 35mm and hole in the US economy because people do not

trust but there are systems are secure. We need to know that GCHQ

are not trying to use a different door into the system, whether by

hacking or foreign intelligence We need judicial oversight with judges

and not politicians signing off The final 30 seconds to you. As a result

of the changes in the Justice and Security act, the committee is

accountable to Parliament and not the Prime Minister. Those changes

are taking place, and I am up for the debate if we need more change or

not. But I want British agencies to have more power to protect the

people in this country. Thank you to both of you. It's coming up to

11:40. You're watching the Sunday Politics. Coming up in just over 20

minutes, we'll get the verdict of the Minister for Portsmouth on that

dive from the Portsmouth MP. Ouch! Welcome to the Sunday politics in

the East. Coming up, David Cameron's road trip to the region,

but no promises of new money. Does that leave the East in the slow

lane? Behind`the`scenes it has not been a great start to the New Year

for the Conservatives. We meet the Romanians and bulky Aryans, but they

are students, not workers. Many more could be on their way. ``

Bulgarians. We have 2 euros MPs, for the Conservatives and Labour. First,

the Prime Minister's trip to the region on Friday. He was singing the

region's praises on road and rail projects. The big question, does the

East get enough bang for its part? Traditionally, the answer has been

that it does not. The East has been seen as a net contributor. People

pay more in taxes than they get back, whether it is in roads or

power stations. David Cameron came to East Anglia armed with new

figures apparently showing the government is spending more here

than anywhere else outside London. He started on Friday at the last

single carriageway stretch of the 11th. It will be dual carriageway by

September. Part of our infrastructure plan is to ensure

that Britain has the roads and railways it needs to drive up growth

and create jobs. This will help not just this part of the country but

the whole economy. He moved on to Lowestoft. The plan is to extend the

road. On the railways he spoke about faster times from London to Norwich.

Classic picture opportunities. No new money. I'm really pleased we are

getting more into infrastructure investment in the east of. I have

campaigned for literally a decade under the last Labour government. ``

east of. `` east of England. DA 14 is going ahead without tolls. His

announcement on Friday contained nothing new. There has been huge

amounts of new investment. The roots have come under the Conservative

government. `` the roots. Was this picture opportunity? It important

that he comes to see. The thing about investment is when you invest

in your low growth. When you allow growth, you get jobs. That is what

we are trying to do, unlock these blocks to get more jobs for people

in the survey on. Labour had 14 years to upgrade this road. I do

agree the Conservative party is in trouble, which sees vivid Cameron

scampering up here to try and consolidate his base. `` David

Cameron. The road was going to happen under Labour, and it was in

the plans. The conservative `led government cancelled it. An alliance

led by Norfolk county council proposed the third crossing. We can

get into the nitty`gritty. Nevertheless, it is important, is it

not, for the Prime Minister to be seen in this region. It gets the

ball rolling, it makes people think that they are being noticed. If you

are a real commuter coming down to Norwich, paying thousands of pounds

in your season ticket, a 20% increase, being told there might be

an improvement in the rail after the general election, that gives you no

help whatsoever. From a Labour point of view, David Cameron showing how

unpopular the Tories are. There is not enough time or money to do

things before the next election and who knows what will happen after?

Let's just remember when we started in 2010, there was no money left.

The economy is coming back, and the top priority of that is

infrastructure investment. If you need the Prime Minister to come and

say that we will get the prime Minister to come and say that

because that is what we are doing. As soon the economy is turning

round, the money is coming for that. We have got lots of that in a

moment. As you can imagine, everything was very tightly

controlled for Mr Cameron's visit. No Conservative is going to rock the

boat publicly when the PM is in town but it does not mean they are all

happy or United. Why was he really here? Could it be because this

region does not feel quite as true blue as usual? It has not been a

great start to the year for the region's Conservatives. In Norfolk

they are fighting amongst themselves over an incinerator. In Suffolk,

they lost to council seats to UKIP. In Cambridgeshire, they cannot even

organise an election properly. No wonder this constant tock about

declining membership and party supporters who have had enough. ``

constant speaking. Party supporters provide the local base and if you

don't have that it is difficult to fight general elections. You do not

have the people to go out and knock on doors. Activists feel they are

used and abused because they are not being listened to. The complaints I

hear are wide`ranging. The Liberal Democrats are too soft, the planning

laws will ruin the Plumtree saved `` countryside. Gay marriage was a bad

idea, and there is UKIP. UKIP should not be stealing our clothes. UKIP

has been the main beneficiary of conservative unhappiness, making

gains on Cambridgeshire, Essex and Norfolk county council is. Here in

great Yarmouth, a recent poll put the party in second place, eight

points behind Labour. There are general election candidate is a

former Conservative. S what a lot of people thought about the Tories is

they would be tough on immigration and work hard for jobs in the

economy, and that is a big issue in great Yarmouth. They don't feel they

are getting that and they feel the cuts that are being made really hit

hard`working normal families. That takes away the attraction from a lot

of ordinary working people. It is showing in the election results.

There have been 17 council by`elections in the east since the

summer. The Conservatives have held onto most of their seats, losing

only three councillors, but in nearly every election therefore has

been down. By 32% in Hever hill. Since the summer, the Tory vote has

been down on average by 8%. This is more than just a story about UKIP. I

am told that private polling by Labour and the Conservatives shows

that not just in great Yarmouth but other key marginals like Ipswich,

Bedford and Northampton, the Labour vote is really firming up. Former

supporters are coming back into the fold and the Lib Dem vote is

collapsing. The Conservatives are losing votes to UKIP but there is

little evidence of them winning any new supporters. That needs to be a

worry for the Conservatives, particularly in a region that has

been so solidly blue. Whilst some MPs believe the solution is to get

tough on Europe, others say the party needs to listen properly to

voters. We have been slow to understand the expectations are

changing, the country is crying out for political reform. Let's not

blame UKIP, let's not blame the voter, let's recognise we need to up

our game and compete. If we do it, we can win. It was no accident that

the Prime Minister went to Lowestoft and Norwich. They are places where

the party has a fight on their hands. It was no accident that he

was talking about roads and trains. Will this be enough to improve his

party's fortunes? You are well connected to the Conservative party.

Are you going to tell me things are not that bad? You can always look

into local election results and see what you want. We had a by`election

that had a swing to the Conservatives from Labour. Labour

majority in a safe Labour ward dropped by 80%. Labour votes went to

UKIP. UKIP are taking votes from both sides. We are looking at 17

by`election results. The week before Christmas, in a seat we had lost to

UKIP, it came back to us in December. On average, Conservative

vote has been down 8%. You have to compare apples with apples and a lot

of these results, UKIP did not put seats up in previous elections.

Whether it is to do with UKIP or not, the Conservative vote is down.

If you compare it to the last European election, where we are

right now... Where are we right now? We're coming up to a European

election, and a lot of us understand why people are voting UKIP, they

want to see change in Europe. I want to see change in Europe, the EU,

renegotiation of the relationship, and a referendum. Labour does not

want that. Lib Dems do not want that. Sadly, you did not have any

chance of getting that if you did not vote any other party. The only

way that you're going to get change in Europe, which is the key UKIP

line, the only way to get that is by voting Conservative. That message, I

have been with local council groups, last week in Suffolk,

Cambridgeshire, Beds, they all get it. All the activists get it.

Whether it is the UKIP phenomenon or not, at this stage, Labour should be

streets ahead. The latest poll puts you at the present. That is not good

news. The report showed that Labour votes are firming up. You should be

doing Miles better. That Paul and great Yarmouth showed a big

increase. Excuse me in trading on this private grief between the

Conservatives and UKIP. Amid Suffolk councillors defecting, others like

the Tory MP in Peterborough attending meetings with UKIP, the

one in Mid Bedfordshire who said it should be a joint ticket. They don't

know what they're doing. I've been with the council groups in three of

the counties last week, Norfolk just before Christmas, there is unity. If

everything was easy, you would not have questions. Is very unity? Look

at Norfolk. We have Conservatives fighting against Conservatives. ``

is there is unity. There is an interesting scenario there because

local people are concerned about the incinerator. It is right to get

value for money, which is what the county has tried to do. There is

absolute unity amongst all groups of Conservatives over the fact that the

numbers on that project have changed. They want to rerun the

numbers. You may laugh but I don't laugh when public money is at stake.

I believe you must get the best value for taxpayers money. However

well you do, whoever you take votes from, this is going to remain a Tory

region. Firstly, the figures have changed on the incinerator because

the government cancelled the money they were going to give, forcing the

hand of Norfolk county council. We will win seats in Norwich,

Lowestoft, where David Cameron went, it is a good thing he did come

because he won't be coming to Tory seats in those places for much

longer. I want to move on to immigration because I know you have

a lot to say on that. As of January the 1st, Romanians and bulky Aryans

`` bulky and `` Bulgarians have come. Many of them are here already

as students rather than workers. That number is set to rise. Here at

the University of Bedfordshire there had 20,000 students. More than 200

of them are Bulgarian and Romanian. This graduate is taking a postgrad

degree in marketing. I hope to get a job here. Hopefully spend a couple

of years here and then go back to Romania. She has been disappointed

by the media storm over the lifting of EU restrictions on her fellow

Romanian workers. I did not meet any British people who told me to go

back home. But I'm really sad about the whole situation. This is the

impressive international department. The University has a

long history of recruiting foreign students and the marketing manager

is Romanian. The Mac although the office is open from Monday to

Friday, I am on the telephone 24 hours a day, with problems,

families, they find the contact person is me. I am the face when I

go abroad. Of the universities in the East, Essex has the most

students from these areas. The total is likely to grow. The limit on the

number of students will be lifted next year and universities like Beds

are going all out to recruit more. With the lifting of the limit, this

will not be displacing UK students, we have further opportunities to

expand numbers. We are looking to elsewhere in Europe, Romania,

Bulgaria, the evidences the students are hard`working, enterprising, and

they are attracted to come to universities like this. Good news

for students like this, who were surprised to find others in their

class. I know from my former life as a member of Parliament that

migration is a very sensitive subject and people have legitimate

concerns, but I don't think some of the press coverage has been

accurate. Here and our other universities expect to increase the

number of students in significant way. The more students we have here,

the more people are going to stay on, that is going to put pressure

on, isn't it? I just completely disagree. I have been with that

university also Anglia University. The current government policy to

restrict foreign students was completely wrong because the

students pay over the odds, subsidise more British students

being able to go, by having international presence in the

lecture halls, it provides a better student experience for British

students, and the vast majority of the students go back, develop

careers themselves in business, politics, having studied in Britain,

become lifelong friends of this country. It shows how wrong the

debate is about immigration that the government wants to stop young

people coming in who are going to help Britain in future years, and

I'm glad that region is helping turnaround. Let's talk about the

tone of the debate. That student said she was quite sad and shocked

by the tone of this debate that has been played out. I don't think there

is any plan to stop students from other parts of the EU, although

there is a review of student loans. The University of Bedfordshire is

doing an amazing job, taking local students, often students who get low

markings in A`levels, nine out of ten go on to get graduate jobs. That

is fantastic. Part of that is because they have this open approach

to business led degrees. That is why people want to come from other

countries. We need to look at people who are coming to the country and

not working. That is why we are doing things like forming benefits

to make sure you cannot just come into the UK sign`on and... This is

really important, UKIP claim they are going to sort out immigration.

There was a vote this Thursday on freedom of movement in the European

Parliament. There was a vote on this key issue that you could say they

are going to sort out. I was there voting, Richard was voting, Nigel

Farage did not turn up. They cannot be trusted to sort out these

problems. Richard, if you earn ten times as much in a rich country in

Europe, there is going to be pressure on the rich countries. But

we are all better off because trade in the European Union, every family

in the Eastern and is ?3000 better off because of that extra trade. The

Conservatives did not transfer your question about the tone of the

immigration debate. I'm afraid, what the Tory Party has done is created

this negative debate about immigration and it is surprised to

find itself losing to UKIP. Very quickly on tone. There needs to be a

very sensitive review to make sure that when people come to this

country they are coming here for work. They are not putting pressure

on services, benefits, and that is what we need to look at very

sensitively across the country. It has been a busy week. Elsewhere in

politics , more problems with hospitals and a reprimand for our

New figures obtained by the Labour seconds.

New figures obtained by the Labour Party should the NHS is spending

much more on temporary doctors in accident and emergency departments.

The worst in the region is Kettering general. We need to see a hospital

tackling this issue seriously and employing more permanent staff

generally. Down the road, Northampton general faces the most

difficult inspection today after concerns were raised about patient

care. Last year, the hospital was singled out for high death rates.

The Labour police and crime Commissioner for Beds was given a

written reprimand after he admitted giving away confidential information

about the death of a man in police custody. The reaction I have had is

people accept that even police commissioners can make mistakes, and

that is it. Finally, first from Ilton key is, the council wants to

spend formally in pounds buying homes to rent. Councillors say it

would reduce the number of homeless people living in bed`and`breakfast.

Richard, the Milton Keynes Dons in solution. Is it good? `` housing

solution. There are many households in the East and with problems, we

see the problems in the health service, these local doctors costing

?1500 per day, it shows that this government has been assessed by the

structure but has stopped minding the delivery of health. This is a

prime example. We were talking about housing. It is a big issue. I am

pleased to see a Conservative council trying to come up with a

creative solution that will allow them to be a bit nimble. Housing for

homeless people can be a big hit on the local council. If this gives

them a bit more control of the situation, Cambridge City Council

looking at doing something similar, to guarantee private landlord rent,

to try to have a small stock of readily available houses for those

who find themselves most in need. It is a lot of money. Look, not only is

homelessness increasing in the region, but the numbers depending on

housing benefit have doubled since the Tory led government came in. The

Councillors are being faced with huge dilemmas but the problem is we

are not building enough homes. Thank you. That is all for now. You can

keep in touch via the website. You will find

keep in touch via the website. You houses being built by the mayor

Andrew, back to you. Welcome back. Now she made quite a splash last

night. I am talking, of course, of the Portsmouth North MP, Penny

Mordaunt. If you missed her first appearance in ITV's celebrity diving

competition show, here she is in action.

APPLAUSE Here is a lady who is more used to

campaigning for votes than diving for them. She created far too much

rotation. Hard work has gone into the start of this dive to try and

control it. That looked painful Now the Portsmouth North MP got voted

off the show last night but what about the verdict that really

matters? The newly appointed Minister for Portsmouth, Michael

Fallon, is here. Welcome to the programme. I would give her ten out

of ten for bravery. I was cheering her on. She was doing this for a

local charity, raising money for the local swimming pool. She was a good

sport. As Minister for Portsmouth, can we expect to see you in your

swimming trunks for the next series? I do not think I have the

spare time at the moment. But there is a big challenge in Portsmouth.

spare time at the moment. But there Penny Mordaunt and

spare time at the moment. But there MPs there have

spare time at the moment. But there asking ministers to help the city.

They are losing jobs. There is a goblin Trinity -- there is a big

opportunity to create jobs. Should she have been on a celebrity

television show of their role these problems in Portsmouth? This was in

her spare time and it is raising money for a good cause. I do not

think we should eat two sniffy about it. Did I not see you dressed up on

Thursday night, doing your programme? This is my job. This is

not her job. It was in her spare time, she was raising money for a

local charity. Your Minister for Portsmouth. Are we going to have a

minister for every town? Are we going to have a minister for

Chipping Sodbury? Chipping Sodbury does not have the issues that

Portsmouth have -- that Portsmouth has. There are jobs at risk in

shipbuilding. The government puts in a lot of money through the regional

growth fund, some ?20 million. There are range of government funding

streams going into Portsmouth. My job is to make sure that is properly

coordinated. I need to make sure that Portsmouth seizes this

opportunity to develop a more broadly -based marine and maritime

economy. To make sure a marginal seat stays Tory at the next

election? There are marginal seats everywhere. There is a Liberal

Democrat marginal the -- seat. Vince Cable and I have been working

together for the issues that Portsmouth is facing. We work on

these things together. But I have the very specific job of making sure

that the effort on the ground is coordinated. So Vince Cable is not

the Minister for Portsmouth? I have been there recently, so has Vince

Cable. So there are two ministers for Portsmouth? Just a minute. I am

making sure that the effort is properly coordinated on the ground.

I am determined to turn this challenging time into a proper

opportunity. Should we be to Paul faced about this? No, good honour.

How much money would be have to pay you to get into a swimming costume?

Bid is not enough money in the BBC covers. Good on her. It took seven

years to get a leg there's an MP. She should be a minister. It is a

pity she has the spare time to do this. She is very talented. It is

interesting about the Minister for Portsmouth, up in the north-east

they must be sad that they do not have any marginal seats. Nick Brown

as David Cameron last July, can we have a minister for the north-east,

and the Prime Minister is said no? Does this mean that Portsmouth is

more deprived economic late than the north-east? No, it means it is a

marginal seat. The Labour Leader Ed Miliband was on

the Andrew Marr programme this morning and he outlined plans under

a Labour government for an annual competition audit. Here is what he

had to say. The next Labour government will have an annual

competition at it, not just done by the regulatory body. Alongside them

will be the citizens advice bureau, setting the agenda for the future,

setting the agenda for how we can ensure that competition will benefit

consumers and businesses. I want to see Labour going into the next

election as the party of competition, the party of the

consumer, the party of hard-pressed working families who are struggling.

They need somebody to deal with those issues and that is what the

next Labour government will do. I thought you were meant to be the

party of competition? We are the party of competition. This is the

party that has given us some of these problems. We have an annual

competition review in the energy sector. We have already tackling

banking. What is interesting about his proposal is it is the smaller

ones who are less sure about this, the smaller banks who think that

this could inhibit the growth. It is the smaller energy companies who

think that through interfering with the market, through his price

freeze, that he will hinder competition. We spoke about this

before. It is a clever pitch that Ed Miliband is making. Under the guise

of token markets and claiming to be the party of competition, he is

creating the reason for state intervention? -- broken markets

Exactly, and it is state intervention that does not work

There is a proud tradition in government of smashing open cartels.

Teddy Roosevelt did it nearly a century ago. The problem is, in

those situations it was clear and obvious that the consumers were

suffering. I am not sure it is entirely obvious in this country. In

the banking sector we have free current accounts in the high street.

That is not true in all Western countries. In the energy sector our

bills are not outlandish they high. It is when we take taxes into

account the become unaffordable He has to make the case that consumers

are suffering as a result of these monopolies. Ed Miliband would say it

is not about state intervention but about making markets work. The piece

that was written by his intellectual Duryea about the significance and

the importance of Teddy Roosevelt. He was the Republican president in

the yearly -- in the early years of the last century. He wanted markets

to work. There is an interesting debate on Twitter this morning. Tim

Montgomerie is saying, why are we, the Conservative Party, not seen as

the party of Teddy Roosevelt? We are seen as the party of business.

There are smaller energy companies competing against the big six. In

banking, we have seen smaller companies coming. It was the Labour

government that created the big six energy companies. I think Teddy

Roosevelt also invaded Cuba and the Philippines. That could give us a

clue as to Ed Miliband's foreign policy. Nigel Farage has promised to

purge the party of its more extreme candidates ahead of the European

Council elections in May. But that may not be going so well. Listen to

this. The latest in this process is these homosexual laws. And Thomas I

shall manage. I believe that the Prime Minister, who was warned that

disasters would follow a three went in this direction, he has persisted,

and I believe that this is largely a repercussion from this godlessness

that he has persisted in. The instructions I have got from now on,

or is just not to answer in, and not to give interviews such as this one.

So you are ignoring them? I am not ignoring them. But you are talking

to me? You are the last one I shall be speaking to. I think it is too

late. Who would have thought it It is not global warming that is

causing the floods, it is gay marriage? That explains it. Last

year David Cameron offered a coded retraction of his statement that

UKIP is full of fruit cakes. I think he will be tempted to retract the

retraction. It is a warning to lots of Tories who think that their best

interests are served by flirting with lace -- with UKIP. Nigel Farage

is a very plausible guy, but several layers down, there are people who

are very different. Nigel Farage is saying that he's going to clear the

party out of what Mr Cameron called the fruitcakes. If he is true to his

word, Mr Sylvester's days in the party should they numbered. If Nigel

Farage falls under the bus, what is left of place -- what is left of

UKIP? People say that they like UKIP because unlike other politicians,

they speak their mind. But as it turns into more of a proper

organisation, people speaking their mind will be less acceptable. The

European elections are always a protest vote. People are not happy

with the elite. You will get people saying utterly ridiculous things

like that man in Henley-on-Thames. But this is a chance to vote against

the entire political establishment. I am not sure that comments like

that will make much of a difference. There are lots of arguments about

climate change. That was certainly a new one! They are the only big

protest party at the moment. Protest party is obviously hoovered up lots

of votes. We have got to be clear in European message that we are the

only party that can reform Europe and give people a proper choice the

first referendum in over 40 years. Mr Sylvester used to be a

conservative. You're probably glad to see the back of him? David

Cameron is right, there are probably a few fruitcakes around there. I

think that mainstream conservatives will understand that this is the

only party that can secure European reform and give people the choice

they have been arguing for. Whatever happens in the European elections,

it is a protest vote. We have almost run out of time. We will see this

week of Chris Rennard gets the party whip act. There is a battle brewing

between Danny Alexander and the common side of the Liberal Democrats

and the House of Lords. If he turns up on Monday and asks to be let in,

I they going to make a big scene at the gate of Parliament? And the

issue will stay in the papers? Yes, they are clearly nervous that Lord

Rennard might be tempted to mount a legal bid. That is all for today.

Rennard might be tempted to mount a Thanks to all my guests.

Rennard might be tempted to mount a Politics is back on

Rennard might be tempted to mount a on BBC Two. And I will be here again

next week. Remember if it is Sunday, it is the Sunday Politics.