30/09/2012 Sunday Politics South East

In the South East: Why the people of Dartford could

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2119 seconds

signal victory or defeat for Ed Hello, I'm Natalie Graham, and this

is the Sunday Politics in the South East. Coming up:

Whether it is mansions, council tax or free TV licences, will targeting

the region's wealthiest voters backfire on the politicians?

Joining me in the studio today is Amber Rudd, who is the Conservative

MP for Hastings and Rye and Parliamentary Private Secretary to

the Chancellor George Osborne. Also joining us is Lord Bassam, former

leader of Brighton Council, and Labour's chief whip in the House of

Lords. First, the new road scheme linking

Bexhill and Hastings moved a step closer this week when the

government approved orders for buying up the necessary land. The

project will cost more than �90 million. The council says it will

bring development and jobs to the area. But opponents are strongly

against the scheme because of its effect on the landscape and widlife.

They are continuing to fight it in the courts and say it is the wrong

way to solve local traffic problems. Gummer, you will be familiar with

the arguments. -- Amber. It is not worth the damage? This is a debate

that has been going on for over 20 years. People are already suffering

from fatigue. Most of us who live in the area and love it up excited

at the prospect of the road. It is not just about trying to sort out

the roads, it is about economic regeneration. It is about the

opportunity it gives for new businesses and jobs. He you say

that but a report by the council says the opposite. They say they

are small benefits. I do not think that is true. East Sussex County

Council has been the biggest promoter of this road. It will

bring it 3,000 jobs. We must point out huge amounts of effort has gone

into environmental mitigation. There will be special measures for

the badgers and dormice. For Lord Bassam, what do you think? For the

road has been a long argued for. We were going to approve it when we

were in government. But you did not manage it. We had put a lot of

money into other projects in Hastings to try to regenerate the

economy. It is important the thing does not stop there and we make

sure it links up properly with the a 21. I agree with Amber. We need

to protect the local environment. It is right the Council listens to

those. We will leave it there. Are there will be a judicial review.

That will be heard in October. judicial review was turned down.

They have asked to leave for appeal. We hope that will be turned down.

To the Labour Party now. It is holding its conference in

Manchester this weekend, surfing a wave of favourable opinion polls.

But there is evidence that its recovery is weaker in the South

East than other parts of the country. So can Labour win back the

seats in Sussex and Kent that it lost in 2010? One that will be

watched particularly closely is Dartford because the party that

wins the seat normally forms the next government.

Dulford in north Kent is only 16 miles from London. It is a popular

commuter and since 1964 it has been the country's most reliable seat

for elections. The party that wins here get into power. It is a key

battleground and local issues will be important. This is Bluewater

shopping centre which is in the Dartford constituency. In spite of

money changing hands, unemployment is higher than the national average.

It is just over 10%. They have an on-site learning shop which runs

sessions for people out of work, like these young people. It is

disheartening because you apply and applied and you fill in application

forms and hand in your CV and some people just don't reply. I have

handed out over 200 CVs to shopping centres in my area. I have applied

for about 20 jobs every two weeks and I have had one interview.

must be very frustrating. Yes, it is. I was turned down. Other

residents who have jobs, many commute to London. For those who

drive, the toll will increase next month from one pound 52 for �2.

Rail fares are likely to go up by around 6%. Lyndon Jones is what

politicians referred to as the squeezed middle. His season ticket

has gone up four years. On top of the other increases, the gas

electricity, and the price of going across the Dartford crossing, it is

all adding up and reducing my monthly take-home available income.

It is not good news. I am not happy. Voters faced with this price

increase will take this thing into account. Despite national opinion

polls, Labour's recovery in the South East has been weaker than in

the north. In Dartford, the party lost seats at the local council

election. In the last General Election, problems with the Labour

Party were greater in this part of the country. We do have a bigger

majority to fight against in the next election. It will not be an

easy task. We are confident we can make a good inroad into that.

some commentators say aspiration is important in the region. This is

the place where the aspiring classes live. They one the Labour

party to represent their values. -- we want. They are not convinced Ed

Miliband shares their values. Can they make the South East as popular

as it was under Tony Blair? For the electorate, Ed Miliband looks like

a left-wing Labour than in 1997. Labour needs to convince crucial

swing voters in Dartford it can improve their fortunes in economic

difficulty. It needs to come up with a vision that matches the

aspirations of people of all ages. Steve Bassam, we heard from Lyndon

Jones and the squeezed middle. There is a long way for your party

to go to convince people like him to vote for you? I do not think

voters in the south are that different. We have made a lot of

progress there. Last year's elections in Hastings, we took six

seats off the Tories. One was for the Lib Dems. But we have

consolidated their. It means seats like those, it means those will be

up for grabs. I think we can recover the lost ground from 2010.

I think Ed Miliband will take as in that decision -- in that direction.

I am more vulnerable than Dartford. They have a majority of 11,000. I

try not to look at that too much. I tried to deliver on the ground for

Hastings. I am trying to help people get the jobs they want and

make sure the cost of living does not, as in the example, go down.

But that is the trouble. The utilities, the train fares, the

Dartford crossing, those are going up. We have always said these are

difficult times. It is a difficult time to build the economy. I

hesitate to say this but there are signs of improvement. I was as a

jobs fair in Hastings yesterday. 350 jobs on offer. The economists

who are saying this week the tide is turning. I have looked at the

statistics for young unemployment and they are horrific in Brighton

and Hove and they are not good in Hastings. You might think there are

signs of improvement but that is not how young people feel.

mentioned the victories in Hastings. Crawley, you hardly made any gains.

You are not -- you did not gain control, which you expected to do.

You are not making as much as a recovery as you would like to see.

We took control of Southampton. We made a lot of progress in Crawley,

actually. We will get control in the next set of district elections.

Mind that recovery is strong in the south. We are making of the lost

ground. In Hastings, unemployment has increased by 14%. -- has

decreased. Thank you. Now we will hear from Ed Miliband. He has been

talking to our political editor. She began by asking him what Labour

would do about the need for greater airport capacity in the South East.

We have said what needs to happen is there needs to be a proper look

at the environmental issues we face around aviation, a proper look at

the business case around aviation and any decision is made. It is not

good the Government has kicked this into the long grass. We would like

a quicker decision. We will look at the way the commission works.

People want a bit of certainty and that is what we will have to do in

our own policy review. environment and climate change

Secretary, you were against a third runway at Heathrow. What is your

position now? I remain sceptical about Heathrow. The key thing about

this is you have got to start with... We have got big

environmental commitments as a country. We want to cut our

emissions by 80%. Aviation has got to fit within that. I wanted to

start with that and then look at the business case and make

decisions. I do not think it means no extra capacity anywhere but I do

not think we can carry on as we are. We have got to strike the right

balance. On education, Labour have been clear they do not support

grammar schools. In Kent, they have that grammar school system. But

they are expanding it for the first time in half a century. People in

Kent will have that concern that if Labour get in, you do not support

the education system they cherish? It is supposed to be a cross-party

consensus that we do not want new grammar schools and that is not the

way forward. But I want to drive up standards of education. One issue

is the education of people who are not academic and need vocational

skills. Michael Gove is announcing changes to GCSEs. But that is not

the biggest issue. What about the kids that are not academic but do

not want to go to university? That is that 15% we do not talk about.

We need to help them. That will be one of the things we will talk

about in the coming months. You are doing well nationally in the polls.

But that is not translating in the South East. You made some gains

that were not enough. Is it just that you do not risen at their in

the way that Tony Blair did? think we are in party be building,

particularly in the south. We have some distance to go. -- rebuilding.

We need to talk about how we will rebuild Britain. Prices and living

standards, energy bills, we need to talk about how we will make a

difference in terms of jobs and make the bank's work for them. It

is about rebuilding the economy and Britain. That will speak to people

in the South East. Are you confident you can win in the South

East? You have no MPs there at the moment. Are you confident Labour

has the right message? I am. Talking about the economy and how

we will build it up, people voted for change two years ago. They

thought David Cameron would bring change. But he made it worse, not

better. People are losing the benefit of the doubt for the

Government. They want to know how we will change the country. Thank

you. Is he sounding too left wing? That is the accusation we heard

earlier. I do not think that is true. I think he does understand

the aspirations of people in the South. He talked about schools,

jobs, banking. All of those things are really important in the South

East. They are the 7th largest regional economy in the UK. Ed

Miliband I understand that. He will address those issues. You mentioned

education. We touched on grammar schools. But he is not talking to

the middle classes in the way Tony Blair did? He was talking against

Michael Gove. But a lot of Michael Gove's policies who are playing

well with aspirational parents in this part of the world. Fighting I

think the reaction to Michael Gove's attack on grade inflation

has been mixed. My daughter has just done her GCSEs and her

friends' parents did not take too kindly to Michael Gove's

interventions. We need to focus on training and education and make

sure people are well qualified. That is exactly where Labour is.

That is where voters are. A I am sure you will see that is where the

Conservatives are. If -- you will say. In that conversation, he

touched on a lot of things that mattered. But he did not have any

answers. He is very good at framing the question but something like his

aviation policy, he has no view at all. I think it is quite reasonable

to say we have to look at this carefully and say we need to decide

on the best thing for everyone. But just to attack us without no

answer... I am looking forward to the Labour Party Conference and

hearing what they will actually do rather than just attacking the

Government. I do not think Boris Ireland is such a good idea. But we

need extra capacity somewhere. -- Boris Ireland. We cannot afford to

kill off Heathrow. Would it not be refreshing for a politician to say,

an estuary would boost jobs and the economy? I am not sure about it. We

need to look more carefully at Heathrow as well. There are too

many options out there. Everyone has so many options. We need to

look at them all. Next, the policies that could hit

you where it hurts - the wallet. The Liberal Democrats talked about

wealth taxes again this week, and Labour and the Tories are also

known to be looking at them. Whether it is raising council tax

on expensive houses, a mansion tax, or taking away universal benefits

for affluent pensioners, squeezing the rich is a subject that will not

go away. And the South East would be affected more than many other

parts of the country because of relatively high property values.

Amber, you are Parliamentary Private Secretary to the Chancellor

of the Exchequer. What is his thinking? He has not share that

with me. My view, if you were to ask me, we are not a country that

is overtaxed and we should not be looking at wealth taxes in the same

way the Lib Dems are. They claim they are making progress.

Commentators are saying George Osborne has approved some kind of

tax on property. A I am behind the curve on that one. The one that

matters is we have had a 7% stamp duty tax which is now on very

expensive houses. So I would say we have already done that. We have

made sure the wealthier do pay their share by withdrawing child

benefit from a high paid. We are all in it together. A wealth tax

would not play well with your constituents? We are not overtaxed

in this country. We need to look for efficiency and better

government. So you think we should have more taxes? No, we are not

under taxed. You are right. A I am glad you have clarified that. We

need to look at taxation. The Government got it wrong in the last

Budget, giving millions back to millionaires for and squeezing

people on lower incomes. They did not get the balance right. A Ed

Balls is thinking about a wealth tax as well? All Chancellors have

to do that. If we are to ensure there is money to invest, you have

got to do that. He has been saved a lot of interesting things. That

will emerge as being one of them, perhaps. You live somewhere where

property prices just continue to rise? Brain is a property bubble. -

- Brighton. I am not opposed to taxes which are fair. But I worry

about the Government's policy because it is giving a lot of money

back to will the house sold its -- to wealthy households. Whether

you're raising revenue efficiently or whether it's there, there are

two issues here. -- it is fair. had a property tax in the sense we

had rates. Property does not move and it is easier to tax and track

down. A once you start recalculating, you are opening up...

Some people will say if you have a wealth tax on property, you are

just getting an advance against the inheritance tax so there is no more

any money. So you cannot just say, let us tax a big houses. There is

clearly a debate going on amongst the three parties and we will be

looking at the possibility of a... Were due like to see a wealth tax?

I'll would like to see us tax bigger properties. -- would you

like to see. Now the round-up of the political week.

The Lib Dems have seen a few storms recently but as we gathered for

their conference in Brighton it was another problem troubling the party

president. We love everything about Brighton with the exception of the

prices of the hotel bar. A sober Nick Clegg promised there will be

brighter days ahead but warned of tough decisions. One of the first

decisions they made was to renew their opposition to airport

exemption -- expansion in the South East. John Terry's conviction by

the FA for racially abusing another player was backed by MPs. They are

unacceptable, that type of language. The pancake champion it flipped

when her researcher told a bad joke. She tweeted she punished the