Browse content similar to 05/03/2017. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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It's Sunday Morning and this is the Sunday Politics. | :00:37. | :00:42. | |
The Chancellor says that to embark on a spending spree | :00:43. | :00:44. | |
in Wednesday's Budget would be "reckless". | :00:45. | :00:47. | |
But will there be more money for social care and to ease | :00:48. | :00:50. | |
The UK terror threat is currently severe, | :00:51. | :00:56. | |
but where is that threat coming from? | :00:57. | :00:58. | |
We have the detailed picture from a vast new study of every | :00:59. | :01:01. | |
Islamist related terrorist offence committed over the last two decades. | :01:02. | :01:05. | |
What can we learn from these offences to thwart future attacks? | :01:06. | :01:11. | |
The government was defeated in the Lords on its | :01:12. | :01:13. | |
We'll ask the Leader of the House of Commons what he'll do if peers | :01:14. | :01:18. | |
In the South West, the pensioners hoping this week's budget | :01:19. | :01:21. | |
And the Royal Navy's battle to recruit enough sailors. | :01:22. | :01:37. | |
All that coming up in the next hour and a quarter. | :01:38. | :01:41. | |
Now, some of you might have read that intruders managed | :01:42. | :01:43. | |
to get into the BBC news studios this weekend. | :01:44. | :01:46. | |
Well three of them appear not to have been ejected yet, | :01:47. | :01:49. | |
so we might as well make use of them as our political panel. | :01:50. | :01:52. | |
Tom Newton Dunn, Isabel Oakeshott and Steve Richards. | :01:53. | :01:55. | |
They'll be tweeting throughout the programme. | :01:56. | :02:00. | |
Philip Hammond will deliver his second financial | :02:01. | :02:06. | |
statement as Chancellor and the last Spring Budget | :02:07. | :02:08. | |
for a while at least - they are moving to the Autumn | :02:09. | :02:11. | |
There's been pressure on him to find more money | :02:12. | :02:15. | |
for the Health Service, social care, schools funding, | :02:16. | :02:17. | |
But this morning the Chancellor insisted that he will not be | :02:18. | :02:22. | |
using the proceeds of better than expected tax receipts to embark | :02:23. | :02:24. | |
What is being speculated on is whether we might not have borrowed | :02:25. | :02:36. | |
quite as much as we were forecast to borrow. You will see the numbers on | :02:37. | :02:43. | |
Wednesday. But if your bank increases your credit card limit, I | :02:44. | :02:47. | |
do not think you feel obliged to go out and spent every last penny of it | :02:48. | :02:49. | |
He is moving the budget to the autumn, he told us that in his | :02:50. | :03:01. | |
statement, so maybe on Wednesday it will be like a spring statement | :03:02. | :03:07. | |
rather than a full-blown budget. Tinkering pre-Brexit and in November | :03:08. | :03:11. | |
he will have a more clear idea of the impact of Brexit and I suspect | :03:12. | :03:14. | |
that will be the bigger event than this one. It looks as if there will | :03:15. | :03:20. | |
be a bit of money here and there, small amounts, not enough in my | :03:21. | :03:24. | |
view, for social care and so on, possibly a review of social care | :03:25. | :03:30. | |
policy. A familiar device which rarely get anywhere. I think he has | :03:31. | :03:34. | |
got a bit more space to do more if he wanted to do now because of the | :03:35. | :03:39. | |
politics. They are miles ahead in the polls, so he could do more, but | :03:40. | :03:44. | |
it is not in his character, he is cautious. So he keeps his powder dry | :03:45. | :03:50. | |
on most things, he does some things, but he keeps it dry until November. | :03:51. | :03:57. | |
But also, as Steve says, he will know just how strong the economy has | :03:58. | :04:01. | |
been this year by November and whether he needs to do some pump | :04:02. | :04:04. | |
priming or whether everything is fine. He said it is too early to | :04:05. | :04:11. | |
make those sorts of judgments now. What is striking is the amount of | :04:12. | :04:15. | |
concern there is an Number ten and in the Treasury about the tone of | :04:16. | :04:20. | |
this budget, so less about the actual figures and more about what | :04:21. | :04:23. | |
message this is sending out to the rest of the world. I think some | :04:24. | :04:29. | |
senior MPs are calling it a kind of treading water budget and Phil | :04:30. | :04:33. | |
Hammond has got quite a difficult act to perform because he is | :04:34. | :04:37. | |
instinctively rather cautious, or very cautious, and instinctively | :04:38. | :04:44. | |
slightly gloomy about Brexit. He wanted to remain. But he does not | :04:45. | :04:48. | |
want this budget to sounded downbeat and he will be mauled if he makes it | :04:49. | :04:53. | |
sound downbeat, so he has to inject a little bit of optimism and we may | :04:54. | :04:57. | |
see that in the infrastructure spending plans. He has got some room | :04:58. | :05:03. | |
to manoeuvre. The deficit by the financial year ending in April we | :05:04. | :05:07. | |
now know will not be as big as the OBR told us only three and a half | :05:08. | :05:11. | |
months ago that it would be. They added 12 billion on and they may | :05:12. | :05:16. | |
take most of that off again. He is under pressure from his own side to | :05:17. | :05:19. | |
do something on social care and business rates and I bet some Tory | :05:20. | :05:24. | |
backbenchers would not mind a little bit more money for the NHS as well. | :05:25. | :05:29. | |
He is on a huge pressure to do a whole lot on a whole load, not just | :05:30. | :05:36. | |
social care. There is also how on earth do we pay for so many old | :05:37. | :05:42. | |
people? There is the NHS, defence spending, everything. But his words | :05:43. | :05:48. | |
this morning, which is I am not going to spend potentially an extra | :05:49. | :05:52. | |
30 billion I might have by 2020 because of improved economic growth | :05:53. | :05:57. | |
was interesting. You need to hold something back because Brexit might | :05:58. | :06:03. | |
go back and he was a bit of a remain campaign person. If you think | :06:04. | :06:10. | |
Britain is going to curl up into a corner and hideaway licking its | :06:11. | :06:14. | |
wounds, you have got another think coming. That 30 billion he might | :06:15. | :06:17. | |
have extra in his pocket could be worth deploying on building up | :06:18. | :06:23. | |
Britain with huge tax cuts in case there is no deal, a war chest if you | :06:24. | :06:29. | |
like. He will have more than 27 billion. He may decide 27 billion in | :06:30. | :06:34. | |
the statement, the margin by which he tries to get the structural | :06:35. | :06:39. | |
deficit down, he will still have 27 billion. If the receipts are better | :06:40. | :06:43. | |
than they are forecast, some people are saying he will have a war chest | :06:44. | :06:50. | |
of 60 billion. That money, as Mr Osborne found out, can disappear. He | :06:51. | :06:56. | |
clearly is planning not to go on a spending spree this Wednesday. It is | :06:57. | :07:02. | |
interesting in the FTB and the day, David Laws who was chief Secretary | :07:03. | :07:07. | |
for five minutes, was also enthusiastic about the original | :07:08. | :07:10. | |
George Osborne austerity programme and he said, we have reached the | :07:11. | :07:14. | |
limits to what is socially possible with this and a consensus is | :07:15. | :07:18. | |
beginning to emerge that he will have to spend more money than he | :07:19. | :07:23. | |
plans to this Wednesday. This is not just from Labour MPs, but from a lot | :07:24. | :07:28. | |
of Conservative MPs as well. People will wonder when this austerity will | :07:29. | :07:32. | |
end because it seems to be going on for ever. We will have more on the | :07:33. | :07:34. | |
budget later in the programme. Now, the government was defeated | :07:35. | :07:38. | |
last week in the House of Lords. Peers amended the bill that | :07:39. | :07:41. | |
will allow Theresa May to trigger Brexit to guarantee the rights of EU | :07:42. | :07:43. | |
nationals currently in the UK. The government says it will remove | :07:44. | :07:46. | |
the amendment when the bill returns But today a report from | :07:47. | :07:49. | |
the Common's Brexit committee also calls for the Government to make | :07:50. | :07:55. | |
a unilateral decision to safeguard the rights of EU | :07:56. | :07:58. | |
nationals living here. If the worst happened, | :07:59. | :08:03. | |
are we actually going to say to 3 million Europeans here, | :08:04. | :08:06. | |
who are nurses, doctors, serving us tea and coffee in restaurants, | :08:07. | :08:10. | |
giving lectures at Leeds University, picking and processing vegetables, | :08:11. | :08:14. | |
"Right, off you go"? No, of course we are not | :08:15. | :08:16. | |
going to say that. So, why not end the | :08:17. | :08:19. | |
uncertainty for them now? will help to create the climate | :08:20. | :08:21. | |
which will ensure everyone gets to say because that's | :08:22. | :08:25. | |
what all of us want. That is why we have unanimously | :08:26. | :08:36. | |
agreed this recommendation that the government should make unilateral | :08:37. | :08:42. | |
decision to say to EU citizens here, yes, you can stay, because we think | :08:43. | :08:45. | |
that is the right and fair thing to do. | :08:46. | :08:46. | |
And we're joined now from Buckinghamshire by the leader | :08:47. | :08:49. | |
of the House of Commons, David Lidington. | :08:50. | :08:53. | |
Welcome back to the programme. The House of Lords has amended the | :08:54. | :08:59. | |
Article 50 bill to allow the unilateral acceptance of EU | :09:00. | :09:02. | |
nationals' right to remain in the UK. Is it still the government was | :09:03. | :09:05. | |
my intention to remove that amendment in the comments? We have | :09:06. | :09:13. | |
always been clear that we think this bill is very straightforward, it | :09:14. | :09:16. | |
does nothing else except give the Prime Minister the authority that | :09:17. | :09:21. | |
the courts insist upon to start the Article 50 process of negotiating | :09:22. | :09:25. | |
with the other 27 EU countries. On the particular issue of EU citizens | :09:26. | :09:33. | |
here and British citizens overseas, the PM did suggest that the December | :09:34. | :09:39. | |
European summit last year that we do a pre-negotiation agreement on this. | :09:40. | :09:45. | |
That was not acceptable to all of the other 27 because they took the | :09:46. | :09:49. | |
view that you cannot have any kind of negotiation and to Article 50 has | :09:50. | :09:53. | |
been triggered. That is where we are. I hope with goodwill and | :09:54. | :09:58. | |
national self interest on all sides we can tackle this is right that the | :09:59. | :10:03. | |
start of those negotiations. But it is not just the Lords. We have now | :10:04. | :10:07. | |
got the cross-party Commons Brexit committee saying you should now make | :10:08. | :10:12. | |
the unilateral decision to safeguard the rights of EU nationals in the | :10:13. | :10:20. | |
UK. Even Michael go, Peter Lilley, John Whittington, agree. So why are | :10:21. | :10:26. | |
you so stubborn on this issue? I think this is a complex issue that | :10:27. | :10:30. | |
goes beyond the rise of presidents, but about things like the rights of | :10:31. | :10:36. | |
access to health care, to pension ratings and benefits and so on... | :10:37. | :10:44. | |
But you could settle back. It is also, Andrew, because you have got | :10:45. | :10:48. | |
to look at it from the point of view of the British citizens, well over 1 | :10:49. | :10:52. | |
million living elsewhere in Europe. If we make the unilateral gesture, | :10:53. | :10:57. | |
it might make us feel good for Britain and it would help in the | :10:58. | :11:01. | |
short term those EU citizens who are here, but you have got those British | :11:02. | :11:07. | |
citizens overseas who would then be potential bargaining chips in the | :11:08. | :11:11. | |
hands of any of the 27 other governments. We do not know who will | :11:12. | :11:17. | |
be in office during the negotiations and they may have completely | :11:18. | :11:22. | |
extraneous reasons to hold up the agreement on the rights of British | :11:23. | :11:25. | |
citizens. The sensible way to deal with this is 28 mature democracies | :11:26. | :11:30. | |
getting around the table starting the negotiations and to agree to | :11:31. | :11:33. | |
something that is fair to all sides and is reciprocal. What countries | :11:34. | :11:40. | |
might take on UK nationals living in the EU? What countries are you | :11:41. | :11:47. | |
frightened of? The one thing that I know from my own experience in the | :11:48. | :11:52. | |
past of being involved in European negotiations is that issues come up | :11:53. | :11:57. | |
that maybe have nothing to do with British nationals, but another issue | :11:58. | :12:04. | |
that matters a huge amount to a particular government, it may not be | :12:05. | :12:08. | |
a government yet in office, and they decide we can get something out of | :12:09. | :12:13. | |
this, so let's hold up the agreement on British citizens until the | :12:14. | :12:17. | |
British move in the direction we want on issue X. I hope it does not | :12:18. | :12:23. | |
come to that. I think the messages I have had from EU ambassadors in | :12:24. | :12:27. | |
London and from those it my former Europe colleague ministers is that | :12:28. | :12:32. | |
we want this to be a done deal as quickly as possible. That is the | :12:33. | :12:36. | |
British Government's very clear intention. We hope that we can get a | :12:37. | :12:42. | |
reciprocal deal agreed before the Article 50 process. That was not | :12:43. | :12:46. | |
possible. I understand that, you have said that already. But even if | :12:47. | :12:51. | |
there is no reciprocal deal being done, is it really credible that EU | :12:52. | :12:56. | |
nationals already here would lose their right to live and work and | :12:57. | :13:02. | |
face deportation? You know that is not credible, that will not happen. | :13:03. | :13:10. | |
We have already under our own system law whereby some people who have | :13:11. | :13:15. | |
been lawfully resident and working here for five years can apply for | :13:16. | :13:19. | |
permanent residency, but it is not just about residents. It is about | :13:20. | :13:24. | |
whether residency carries with it certain rights of access to health | :13:25. | :13:27. | |
care. I understand that, but have made this point. But the point is | :13:28. | :13:35. | |
the right to live and work here that worries them at the moment. The Home | :13:36. | :13:40. | |
Secretary has said there can be no change in their status without a | :13:41. | :13:46. | |
vote in parliament. Could you ever imagine the British Parliament | :13:47. | :13:48. | |
voting to remove their right to live and work here? I think the British | :13:49. | :13:55. | |
Parliament will want to be very fair to EU citizens, as Hilary Benn and | :13:56. | :14:03. | |
others rightly say they have been overwhelmingly been here working | :14:04. | :14:06. | |
hard and paying taxes and contributing to our society. They | :14:07. | :14:10. | |
were equally want to make sure there is a fair deal for our own citizens, | :14:11. | :14:15. | |
more than a million, elsewhere in Europe. You cannot disentangle the | :14:16. | :14:18. | |
issue of residence from those things that go with residents. Is the | :14:19. | :14:24. | |
Article 50 timetabled to be triggered before the end of this | :14:25. | :14:28. | |
month, is it threatened by these amendments in the Lords? I sincerely | :14:29. | :14:34. | |
hope not because the House of Lords is a perfectly respectable | :14:35. | :14:39. | |
constitutional role to look again at bills sent up by the House of | :14:40. | :14:42. | |
commons. But they also have understood traditionally that as an | :14:43. | :14:49. | |
unelected house they have to give primacy to the elected Commons at | :14:50. | :14:53. | |
the end of the day. In this case it is not just the elected Commons that | :14:54. | :14:59. | |
sent the bill to be amended, but the referendum that lies behind that. It | :15:00. | :15:07. | |
is not possible? We are confident we can get Article 50 triggered by the | :15:08. | :15:09. | |
end of the month. One of the other Lords amendments | :15:10. | :15:17. | |
will be to have a meaningful vote on the Brexit deal when it is done at | :15:18. | :15:21. | |
the end of the process, what is your view on that? What would you | :15:22. | :15:26. | |
understand by a meaningful vote? The Government has already said there is | :15:27. | :15:31. | |
going to be a meaningful vote at the end of the process. What do you mean | :15:32. | :15:37. | |
by a meaningful vote? The parliament will get the opportunity to vote on | :15:38. | :15:41. | |
the deal before it finishes the EU level process of going to | :15:42. | :15:44. | |
consideration by the European Parliament. Parliament will be given | :15:45. | :15:50. | |
a choice, as I understand, for either a vote for the deal you have | :15:51. | :15:57. | |
negotiated or we leave on WTO rules and crash out anyway, is that what | :15:58. | :16:02. | |
you mean by a meaningful choice? Parliament will get the choice to | :16:03. | :16:06. | |
vote on the deal, but I think you have put your finger on the problem | :16:07. | :16:11. | |
with trying to write something into the bill because any idea that the | :16:12. | :16:18. | |
PM's freedom to negotiate is limited, any idea that if the EU 27 | :16:19. | :16:25. | |
were to play hardball, that somehow that means parliament would take | :16:26. | :16:29. | |
fright, reverse the referendum verdict and set aside the views of | :16:30. | :16:32. | |
the British people, that would almost guarantee that it would be | :16:33. | :16:37. | |
much more difficult to get the sort of ambitious mutually beneficial | :16:38. | :16:43. | |
deal for us and the EU 27. Your idea of a meaningful vote in parliament | :16:44. | :16:47. | |
is the choices either to vote to accept this deal or we leave anyway, | :16:48. | :16:52. | |
that is your idea of a meaningful vote. The Article 50 process is | :16:53. | :16:59. | |
straightforward. There is the position of both parties in the | :17:00. | :17:04. | |
recent Supreme Court case that the Article 50 process once triggered is | :17:05. | :17:13. | |
irrevocable. That is in the EU Treaty already but we are saying | :17:14. | :17:18. | |
very clearly that Parliament will get that right to debate and vote. I | :17:19. | :17:25. | |
think the problem with what some in the House of Lords are proposing, I | :17:26. | :17:29. | |
hope it is not a majority, is that the amendments they would seek to | :17:30. | :17:34. | |
insert would tie the Prime Minister's hands, limit and | :17:35. | :17:37. | |
negotiating freedom and put her in a more difficult position to negotiate | :17:38. | :17:39. | |
on behalf of this country than should be the case. One year ago you | :17:40. | :17:44. | |
said it could take six to eight years to agree a free-trade deal | :17:45. | :17:49. | |
with the EU. Now you think you can do it in two, what's changed your | :17:50. | :17:55. | |
mind? There is a very strong passionate supporter of Remain, as | :17:56. | :18:09. | |
you know. I hope very much we are able to conclude not just the terms | :18:10. | :18:13. | |
of the exit deal but the agreement that we are seeking on the long-term | :18:14. | :18:19. | |
trade relationship... I understand that, but I'm trying to work out, | :18:20. | :18:24. | |
what makes you think you can do it in two years when only a year ago | :18:25. | :18:29. | |
you said it would take up to wait? The referendum clearly makes a big | :18:30. | :18:35. | |
difference, and I think that there is an understanding amongst real the | :18:36. | :18:41. | |
other 27 governments now that it is in everybody's interests to sort | :18:42. | :18:48. | |
this shared challenge out of negotiating a new relationship | :18:49. | :18:53. | |
between the EU 27 and the UK because European countries, those in and | :18:54. | :18:56. | |
those who will be out of the EU, share the need to face up to massive | :18:57. | :19:05. | |
challenges like terrorism and technological change. All of that | :19:06. | :19:08. | |
was pretty obvious one year ago but we will see what happens. Thank you, | :19:09. | :19:11. | |
David Lidington. Now, the Sunday Politics has had | :19:12. | :19:13. | |
sight of a major new report The thousand-page study, | :19:14. | :19:16. | |
which researchers say is the most comprehensive ever produced, | :19:17. | :19:21. | |
analyses all 269 Islamist telated terrorist offences | :19:22. | :19:27. | |
committed between 1998-2015. Most planned attacks were, | :19:28. | :19:30. | |
thankfully, thwarted, but what can we learn | :19:31. | :19:31. | |
from those offences? For the police and the intelligence | :19:32. | :19:33. | |
agencies to fight terror, Researchers at the security think | :19:34. | :19:43. | |
tank The Henry Jackson Society gave us early access to their huge | :19:44. | :19:50. | |
new report which analyses every Islamism related attack | :19:51. | :20:00. | |
and prosecution in the UK since 1998, that's 269 cases | :20:01. | :20:02. | |
involving 253 perpetrators. With issues as sensitive | :20:03. | :20:06. | |
as counterterrorism and counter radicalisation, it is really | :20:07. | :20:09. | |
important to have an evidence base from which you draw | :20:10. | :20:11. | |
policy and policing, This isn't my opinion, | :20:12. | :20:13. | |
this the facts. This chart shows the number | :20:14. | :20:18. | |
of cases each year combined with a small number | :20:19. | :20:20. | |
of successful suicide attacks. Notice the peak in the middle | :20:21. | :20:24. | |
of the last decade around the time of the 7/7 bombings | :20:25. | :20:27. | |
in London in 2005. Offences tailed off, | :20:28. | :20:31. | |
before rising again from 2010, when a three-year period accounted | :20:32. | :20:34. | |
for a third of all the terrorism cases since the researchers | :20:35. | :20:37. | |
started counting. What we are seeing is a combination | :20:38. | :20:42. | |
of both more offending, in terms of the threat increasing, | :20:43. | :20:46. | |
we know that from the security services and police statements, | :20:47. | :20:49. | |
but also I believe we are getting more efficient in terms | :20:50. | :20:51. | |
of our policing and we are actually A third of people were found to have | :20:52. | :20:54. | |
facilitated terrorism, that's providing encouragement, | :20:55. | :21:02. | |
documents, money. About 18% of people | :21:03. | :21:06. | |
were aspirational terrorists, 12% of convictions were related | :21:07. | :21:09. | |
to travel, to training And 37% of people were convicted | :21:10. | :21:15. | |
of planning attacks, although the methods have | :21:16. | :21:23. | |
changed over time. Five or six years ago, | :21:24. | :21:27. | |
we saw lots of people planning or attempting pipe bombs and most | :21:28. | :21:31. | |
of the time they had Inspire magazine in their possession, | :21:32. | :21:34. | |
that's a magazine, an Al-Qaeda English-language online | :21:35. | :21:37. | |
magazine that had specific More recently we have seen | :21:38. | :21:39. | |
Islamic State encouraging people to engage in lower tech knife | :21:40. | :21:44. | |
beheading, stabbings attacks and I think that's why we have | :21:45. | :21:47. | |
seen that more recently. Shasta Khan plotted with her | :21:48. | :21:49. | |
husband to bomb the Jewish In 2012 she received | :21:50. | :21:54. | |
an eight-year prison sentence. She's one of an increasing | :21:55. | :21:59. | |
number of women convicted of an Islamism related offence | :22:00. | :22:04. | |
although it is still overwhelmingly a crime carried out | :22:05. | :22:06. | |
by men in their 20s. Despite fears of foreign terrorists, | :22:07. | :22:09. | |
a report says the vast Most have their home in London, | :22:10. | :22:12. | |
around 43% of them. 18% lived in the West Midlands, | :22:13. | :22:21. | |
particularly in Birmingham, and the north-west is another | :22:22. | :22:24. | |
hotspot with around 10% Richard Dart lived in Weymouth | :22:25. | :22:26. | |
and tried to attend a terrorist He was a convert to Islam, as were | :22:27. | :22:33. | |
60% of the people in this report. He was a convert to Islam, as were | :22:34. | :22:42. | |
16% of the people in this report. Like the majority of cases, | :22:43. | :22:46. | |
he had a family, network. What's particularly interesting | :22:47. | :22:48. | |
is how different each story is in many ways, | :22:49. | :22:51. | |
but then within those differences So your angry young men, | :22:52. | :22:54. | |
in the one sense inspired to travel, seek training and combat experience | :22:55. | :23:02. | |
abroad, and then the older, recruiter father-figure types, | :23:03. | :23:09. | |
the fundraising facilitator types. There are types within | :23:10. | :23:11. | |
this terrorism picture, but the range of backgrounds | :23:12. | :23:14. | |
and experiences is huge. And three quarters of those | :23:15. | :23:20. | |
convicted of Islamist terrorism were on the radar of the authorities | :23:21. | :23:22. | |
because they had a previous criminal record, they had | :23:23. | :23:25. | |
made their extremism public, or because MI5 had them | :23:26. | :23:28. | |
under surveillance. To discuss the findings of this | :23:29. | :23:34. | |
report are the former Security Minister Pauline Neville-Jones, | :23:35. | :23:41. | |
Talha Ahmad from the Muslim Council of Britain, and Adam Deen | :23:42. | :23:44. | |
from the anti-extremist group The report finds the most segregated | :23:45. | :23:59. | |
Muslim community is, the more likely it is to incubate Islamist | :24:00. | :24:05. | |
terrorists, what is the MCB doing to encourage more integrated | :24:06. | :24:09. | |
communities? Its track record on calling for reaching out to the | :24:10. | :24:13. | |
wider society and having a more integrated and cohesive society I | :24:14. | :24:17. | |
think is a pretty strong one, so one thing we are doing for example very | :24:18. | :24:22. | |
recently I've seen we had this visit my mosque initiative, the idea was | :24:23. | :24:27. | |
that mosques become open to inviting people of other faiths and their | :24:28. | :24:29. | |
neighbours to come so we were encouraged to see so many | :24:30. | :24:36. | |
participating. It is one step forward. Is it a good thing or a bad | :24:37. | :24:42. | |
thing that in a number of Muslim communities, the Muslim population | :24:43. | :24:47. | |
is over 60% of the community? I personally and the council would | :24:48. | :24:50. | |
prefer to have more mixed communities but one of the reason | :24:51. | :24:54. | |
they are heavily concentrated is not so much because they prefer to but | :24:55. | :24:59. | |
often because the socio- economic reality forces them to. But you | :25:00. | :25:04. | |
would like to see less segregation? Absolutely, we would prefer more | :25:05. | :25:08. | |
diverse communities around the country. What is your reaction to | :25:09. | :25:13. | |
that? Will need more diverse communities but one of the | :25:14. | :25:17. | |
challenges we have right now with certain organisations is this | :25:18. | :25:21. | |
pushback against the Government, with its attempts to help young | :25:22. | :25:24. | |
Muslims not go down this journey of extremism. One of those things is | :25:25. | :25:30. | |
the Prevent strategy and we often hear organisations like the MCB | :25:31. | :25:33. | |
attacking the strategy which is counter-productive. What do you say | :25:34. | :25:38. | |
to that? Do we support the Government have initiatives to | :25:39. | :25:44. | |
counteract terrorism, of course we do. Do you support the Prevent | :25:45. | :25:49. | |
strategy? We don't because it scapegoats an entire community. The | :25:50. | :25:55. | |
report shows that contrary to a lot of lone wolf theories and people | :25:56. | :25:59. | |
being radicalised in their bedrooms on the Internet that 80% of those | :26:00. | :26:02. | |
convicted had connections with the extremist groups. Indeed 25% willing | :26:03. | :26:23. | |
to Al-Muhajiroun. I think this report, which is a thorough piece of | :26:24. | :26:29. | |
work, charts a long period and it is probably true to say that in the | :26:30. | :26:34. | |
earlier stages these organisations were very important, of course | :26:35. | :26:37. | |
subsequently we have had direct recruiting by IS one to one over the | :26:38. | :26:43. | |
Internet so we have a mixed picture of how people are recruited but | :26:44. | :26:47. | |
there's no doubt these organisations are recruiting sergeants. You were | :26:48. | :26:51. | |
once a member of one of these organisations, are we doing enough | :26:52. | :27:00. | |
to thwart them? If we just focus on these organisations, we will fail. | :27:01. | :27:09. | |
We -- the question is are we doing enough to neutralise them? The | :27:10. | :27:12. | |
Government strategy is in the right place, but where we need to focus on | :27:13. | :27:18. | |
is the Muslim community or communities. The Muslim community | :27:19. | :27:23. | |
must realise that these violent extremists are fringe but they share | :27:24. | :27:28. | |
ideas, a broad spectrum of ideas that penetrate deeply within Muslim | :27:29. | :27:31. | |
communities and we need to tackle those ideas because that is where it | :27:32. | :27:35. | |
all begins. Are you in favour of banning groups like Al-Muhajiroun? | :27:36. | :27:43. | |
Yes, it was the right thing to do and I can tell you the community has | :27:44. | :27:48. | |
moved a long way, Al-Muhajiroun does not have support. Do you agree with | :27:49. | :27:55. | |
that? Yes, but it is very simplistic attacking Al-Muhajiroun. ISIS didn't | :27:56. | :28:03. | |
bring about extremism, extremism brought about ISIS, ISIS is just the | :28:04. | :28:07. | |
brand and if we don't deal with the ideological ideas we will have other | :28:08. | :28:12. | |
organisations popping up. The report suggests that almost a quarter of | :28:13. | :28:19. | |
Islamist the latest offences were committed by individuals previous | :28:20. | :28:24. | |
unknown to the security services. And this is on the rise, these | :28:25. | :28:28. | |
numbers. This would seem to make an already difficult task for our | :28:29. | :28:31. | |
intelligence services almost impossible. Two points. It is over | :28:32. | :28:38. | |
80% I think were known, but it shows the intelligence services and police | :28:39. | :28:46. | |
have got their eyes open. But the trend has been towards more not on | :28:47. | :28:51. | |
the radar. That has been because the nature of the recruitment has also | :28:52. | :28:57. | |
changed and you have much more ISIS inspired go out and do it yourself, | :28:58. | :29:04. | |
get a knife, do something simple, so we have fewer of the big | :29:05. | :29:09. | |
spectaculars that ISIS organised. Now you have got locally organised | :29:10. | :29:18. | |
people, two or three people get together, do something together, | :29:19. | :29:22. | |
very much harder actually to get forewarning of that. That is where | :29:23. | :29:29. | |
intelligence inside the community, the community coming to the police | :29:30. | :29:35. | |
say I'm worried about my friend, this is how you get ahead of that | :29:36. | :29:40. | |
kind of attack. Should people in the Muslim community who are worried | :29:41. | :29:44. | |
about individuals being radicalised, perhaps going down the terrorist | :29:45. | :29:48. | |
route, should they bring in the police? Absolutely and we have been | :29:49. | :29:54. | |
consistent on telling the community that wherever they suspect someone | :29:55. | :29:58. | |
has been involved in terrorism or any kind of criminal activity, they | :29:59. | :30:01. | |
should call the police and cooperate. As the so-called | :30:02. | :30:09. | |
caliphate collapses in the Middle East, how worried should we be about | :30:10. | :30:11. | |
fighters returning here? Extremely worried. They fall into | :30:12. | :30:25. | |
three categories. You have ones who are disillusioned about Islamic | :30:26. | :30:28. | |
State. You have ones who are disturbed, and then you have the | :30:29. | :30:31. | |
dangerous who have not disavowed their ideas and who will have great | :30:32. | :30:37. | |
reasons to perform attacks. What do we do? Anyone who comes back, there | :30:38. | :30:43. | |
should be evidence looked into if they committed any crimes. But all | :30:44. | :30:50. | |
those categories should all be be radicalised. You cannot leave them | :30:51. | :30:54. | |
alone. Will we be sure if we know when they come back? That is | :30:55. | :31:00. | |
difficult to say. They could come in and we might not know. There is a | :31:01. | :31:06. | |
watch list so you have got a better chance. And you can identify them? | :31:07. | :31:14. | |
This is where working with other countries is absolutely crucial and | :31:15. | :31:17. | |
our border controls need to be good as well. I am not saying and the | :31:18. | :31:22. | |
government is not saying that anyone would ever slip through, but it is | :31:23. | :31:26. | |
our ability to know when somebody is coming through and to stop them at | :31:27. | :31:31. | |
the border has improved. An important question. Given your | :31:32. | :31:36. | |
experience, how prepared are away for a Paris style attack in a | :31:37. | :31:43. | |
medium-size, provincial city? The government has exercised this one. | :31:44. | :31:47. | |
It started when I was security minister and it has been taken | :31:48. | :31:51. | |
seriously. The single biggest challenge that the police and the | :31:52. | :31:56. | |
Army says will be one of those mobile, roving attacks. You have to | :31:57. | :31:59. | |
take it seriously and the government does. All right, we will leave it | :32:00. | :32:04. | |
Now, Brexit may have swept austerity from the front pages, | :32:05. | :32:08. | |
but the deficit hasn't gone away and the government is still | :32:09. | :32:10. | |
Just this week Whitehall announced that government departments have | :32:11. | :32:14. | |
been told to find another ?3.5bn worth of savings by 2020. | :32:15. | :32:18. | |
Last November the Independent office for Budget Responsibility | :32:19. | :32:21. | |
said the budget deficit would be ?68 billion in the current | :32:22. | :32:23. | |
It would still be ?17 billion by 2021-22. | :32:24. | :32:29. | |
On Wednesday the Chancellor is expected to announce | :32:30. | :32:32. | |
that the 2016-17 deficit has come in much lower than the OBR forecast. | :32:33. | :32:37. | |
Even so, the government is still aiming for the lowest level | :32:38. | :32:41. | |
of public spending as a percentage of national income since 2003-4, | :32:42. | :32:46. | |
coupled with an increase in the tax burden to its highest | :32:47. | :32:49. | |
So spending cuts will continue with reductions in day-to-day | :32:50. | :32:55. | |
government spending accelerating, producing a real terms cut of over | :32:56. | :32:58. | |
But capital spending, investment on infrastructure | :32:59. | :33:05. | |
like roads, hospitals, housing, is projected to grow, | :33:06. | :33:09. | |
producing a 16 billion real terms increase by 2021-22. | :33:10. | :33:15. | |
The Chancellor's task on Wednesday is to keep these fiscal targets | :33:16. | :33:18. | |
while finding some more money for areas under serious | :33:19. | :33:21. | |
pressure such as the NHS, social care and business rates. | :33:22. | :33:29. | |
We're joined now by Paul Johnson of the Institute for Fiscal Studies. | :33:30. | :33:33. | |
Welcome back to the programme. In last March's budget the OBR | :33:34. | :33:40. | |
predicted just over 2% economic growth for this year. By the Autumn | :33:41. | :33:44. | |
Statement in the wake of the Brexit vote it downgraded back to 1.4%. It | :33:45. | :33:50. | |
is now expected to revise that back around to 2% as the Bank of England | :33:51. | :33:56. | |
has again. It is speculated on the future. It looks like we will get a | :33:57. | :34:00. | |
growth forecast for this year not very different from where it was a | :34:01. | :34:05. | |
year ago. What the bank did was upgrade its forecast for the next | :34:06. | :34:08. | |
year or so, but not change very much. It was thinking about three or | :34:09. | :34:14. | |
four years' time, which is what really matters. It looked like the | :34:15. | :34:19. | |
OBR made a mistake in downgrading the growth in the Autumn Statement | :34:20. | :34:23. | |
three months ago. It was more optimistic than nearly all the other | :34:24. | :34:27. | |
forecasters and the Bank of England. It was wrong, but not as wrong as | :34:28. | :34:35. | |
everybody else. We don't know, but if it significantly upgraded its | :34:36. | :34:38. | |
growth forecast for the next three or four years, I would be surprised. | :34:39. | :34:45. | |
It also added 12 billion to the deficit for the current financial | :34:46. | :34:49. | |
year in the Autumn Statement, compared with March. It looks like | :34:50. | :34:54. | |
that deficit will probably be cut again by about 12 billion compared | :34:55. | :34:59. | |
to the last OBR forecast. It is quite difficult to make economic | :35:00. | :35:03. | |
policy on the basis of changes of that skill every couple of months. | :35:04. | :35:09. | |
That is one of the problems about having these two economic event so | :35:10. | :35:14. | |
close together. My guess is the number will come out somewhere | :35:15. | :35:17. | |
between the budget and the Autumn Statement numbers. There was a nice | :35:18. | :35:21. | |
surprise for the Chancellor last month which looked like tax revenues | :35:22. | :35:26. | |
were coming in a lot more strongly than he expected. But again the real | :35:27. | :35:30. | |
question is how much is this making a difference in the medium run? Is | :35:31. | :35:34. | |
this a one-off thing all good news for the next several years? If | :35:35. | :35:40. | |
growth and revenues are stronger, perhaps not as strong as the good | :35:41. | :35:44. | |
news last month, but if they are stronger than had been forecast in | :35:45. | :35:48. | |
the Autumn Statement, what does that mean for planned spending cuts? It | :35:49. | :35:53. | |
probably does not mean very much. Let's not forget the best possible | :35:54. | :35:57. | |
outcome of this budget will be that for the next couple of years things | :35:58. | :36:02. | |
look no worse than they did a year ago and in four years out they will | :36:03. | :36:06. | |
still look a bit worse, and in addition Philip Hammond did increase | :36:07. | :36:10. | |
his spending plans in November. However good the numbers look in a | :36:11. | :36:15. | |
couple of days' time, we will still be borrowing at least 20 billion | :36:16. | :36:21. | |
more by 2020 than we were forecasting a year ago. Still quite | :36:22. | :36:28. | |
constrained. George Osborne wanted to get us to budget surplus by 2019. | :36:29. | :36:34. | |
That has gone. Philip Hammond is quite happy with a big deficit and | :36:35. | :36:39. | |
is not interested in that. But what he is thinking to a large extent, as | :36:40. | :36:44. | |
you have made clear, there is a lot of uncertainty about the economic | :36:45. | :36:49. | |
reaction over the next three or four years. He says he wants some | :36:50. | :36:53. | |
headroom. If things go wrong, I do not want to announce more spending | :36:54. | :36:58. | |
cuts or more tax rises to keep the deficit down. I want to say things | :36:59. | :37:01. | |
have gone wrong for now and we will borrow. And I have got some money in | :37:02. | :37:07. | |
the kitty. He will not spend a lot of it now. I understand the | :37:08. | :37:12. | |
Chancellor is worried about the erosion of the tax base and it is | :37:13. | :37:18. | |
hard to put VAT up by more than 20%, millions have been taken out of | :37:19. | :37:23. | |
income tax, only 46% of people pay income tax, fuel duty is frozen for | :37:24. | :37:29. | |
ever, corporation tax has been cut, the growth in self-employed has | :37:30. | :37:32. | |
reduced revenues, is that a real concern? These are all worries for | :37:33. | :37:38. | |
him. We have as you said in the introduction to this, got a tax | :37:39. | :37:43. | |
burden which is rising very gradually, but it is rising to its | :37:44. | :37:48. | |
highest level since the mid-19 80s, but is not doing it through | :37:49. | :37:52. | |
straightforward increases to income tax. Lots of bits of pieces of | :37:53. | :37:56. | |
insurance premium tax is here and the apprenticeship levied there, and | :37:57. | :38:02. | |
that is higher personal allowance of income tax and a freeze fuel duty, | :38:03. | :38:07. | |
but at some point we will have to look at the tax system as a whole | :38:08. | :38:11. | |
and ask if we can carry on like this. We will have to start increase | :38:12. | :38:19. | |
fuel duties again, or look to those big but unpopular taxes to really | :38:20. | :38:26. | |
keep that money coming in to keep the challenges we will have over the | :38:27. | :38:31. | |
next 30 years. He is going to set up a commission on social care. He has | :38:32. | :38:37. | |
had quite a few commissions on social care. Thank you for being | :38:38. | :38:38. | |
with us. It's just gone 11.35, | :38:39. | :38:40. | |
you're watching the Sunday Politics. We say goodbye to viewers | :38:41. | :38:42. | |
in Scotland who leave us now I'm Lucy Fisher. | :38:43. | :38:45. | |
minutes, the Week Ahead. Coming up on the Sunday Politics | :38:46. | :38:57. | |
here in the South West. The pensioners hoping the Chancellor | :38:58. | :39:00. | |
will come up with some answers on social care | :39:01. | :39:02. | |
in this week's budget. More money should be made available | :39:03. | :39:05. | |
by central government. Quite frankly I think a lot | :39:06. | :39:08. | |
of people will be prepared to pay another percentage on income tax | :39:09. | :39:12. | |
to fund it. And for the next 20 minutes I'm | :39:13. | :39:16. | |
joined by the Conservative MP for Newton Abbot Anne Marie Morris | :39:17. | :39:19. | |
and the Liberal Democrat peer So the House of Lords have told | :39:20. | :39:23. | |
the government to think again about whether EU citizens living | :39:24. | :39:31. | |
in the UK should have their right to A Lords amendment guaranteeing | :39:32. | :39:35. | |
their right goes back Anne Marie, is this a chance to give | :39:36. | :39:40. | |
some very worried people No, I don't think it is, | :39:41. | :39:45. | |
because I think you have to recognise that if you are a national | :39:46. | :39:50. | |
of one country living in another country, you need to look | :39:51. | :39:53. | |
at how you'll be treated So for the UK to unilaterally say | :39:54. | :39:56. | |
people living in the UK from an EU nationality will have their rights | :39:57. | :40:04. | |
protected because how is that going to impact | :40:05. | :40:09. | |
their rights as EU citizens? You need both parties to agree | :40:10. | :40:13. | |
the rights of both the UK citizens living in Europe and of the EU | :40:14. | :40:17. | |
citizens living here. Judith, what do you make | :40:18. | :40:22. | |
of that argument? It's sort of the way | :40:23. | :40:25. | |
the House of Lords works. Whichever amendment on this | :40:26. | :40:29. | |
particular topic and there were quite a few on this topic | :40:30. | :40:34. | |
in general, gets to the top of the list, that is | :40:35. | :40:37. | |
the one you vote on. That one just happened | :40:38. | :40:40. | |
not to exclude... not to include the issue of UK | :40:41. | :40:42. | |
citizens living in the EU. So what we're really doing | :40:43. | :40:46. | |
is saying to the government, If you were there and listening | :40:47. | :40:50. | |
to the debate, the debate Is it right that the Lords stand | :40:51. | :40:55. | |
in the way of a referendum result and the will of the House of | :40:56. | :41:01. | |
Commons? Our role is to | :41:02. | :41:03. | |
scrutinise legislation. We voted on this and | :41:04. | :41:07. | |
the vote was overwhelming. It then goes down to the Commons | :41:08. | :41:11. | |
and the Commons will look at it and say "Don't like this" or "Yeah, | :41:12. | :41:14. | |
that's all right." They will then come back to us | :41:15. | :41:17. | |
and say either "We like it" And we will say, "All right | :41:18. | :41:23. | |
then" or "Look at it But eventually it's the elected | :41:24. | :41:29. | |
House that gets the final say. So the Prime Minister | :41:30. | :41:36. | |
will get her Bill. When the Chancellor delivers his | :41:37. | :41:39. | |
first spring budget this week, he is under pressure to stump up | :41:40. | :41:42. | |
some more cash Amid signs that stronger | :41:43. | :41:45. | |
than expected tax receipts could give him some room | :41:46. | :41:49. | |
for manoeuvre, in the South West the message is that struggling high | :41:50. | :41:55. | |
streets and care for the elderly and vulnerable should be top | :41:56. | :41:58. | |
of Mr Hammond's list. Hoping for a good hand | :41:59. | :42:00. | |
at Truro Bowls Club's Hopes here too the Chancellor's hand | :42:01. | :42:05. | |
in the spring budget will reveal more cash for the NHS | :42:06. | :42:10. | |
and social care. Margaret is waiting | :42:11. | :42:13. | |
for a hip op with a story I cannot go in there | :42:14. | :42:16. | |
until they clear all the beds so there are people like myself | :42:17. | :42:23. | |
waiting for an operation in a lot Given the go-ahead by ministers, | :42:24. | :42:27. | |
councillors across the South West have put up to 3% extra on council | :42:28. | :42:35. | |
tax bills in recent weeks, They have clubbed together to send | :42:36. | :42:39. | |
a message to Whitehall and it's a message being echoed both | :42:40. | :42:46. | |
here and at Westminster too. More money should be made available | :42:47. | :42:49. | |
by central government. Quite frankly I think a lot | :42:50. | :42:53. | |
of people would be prepared to pay another percentage on income tax | :42:54. | :42:56. | |
to fund it. I think it should be coming | :42:57. | :42:59. | |
centrally, as with the NHS and probably social care and the NHS | :43:00. | :43:03. | |
should be fully integrated. I would ask our Chancellor | :43:04. | :43:07. | |
in his forthcoming budget to address this by urgently giving a lifeline | :43:08. | :43:11. | |
to social care. But the Chancellor is still | :43:12. | :43:17. | |
committed to a diet of austerity. Government departments have been | :43:18. | :43:20. | |
told to find further spending cuts of up to 6% and this week a warning | :43:21. | :43:24. | |
that the economic outlook is uncertain amid reports | :43:25. | :43:27. | |
the squeeze is being felt Your Cornish pasty might be getting | :43:28. | :43:31. | |
more expensive as a weak pound is causing imports of food | :43:32. | :43:37. | |
ingredients and other things like fuel to be more expensive | :43:38. | :43:40. | |
and that cost is beginning to be The bills go up but our | :43:41. | :43:43. | |
wages don't go up. They go up by 3%, 4%, | :43:44. | :43:54. | |
5% but our wages go up I don't know how some | :43:55. | :43:57. | |
of the places actually stay open. The struggling high street behind | :43:58. | :44:06. | |
another issue which has prompted a chorus of disapproval from MPs | :44:07. | :44:09. | |
of all stripes and hopes concessions I'm sorry to hear about all | :44:10. | :44:13. | |
the difficulty with business rates. Gay has owned this shop | :44:14. | :44:21. | |
in Looe for 38 years. She's one of thousands facing higher | :44:22. | :44:26. | |
bills after a nationwide Because the expenses | :44:27. | :44:30. | |
outweigh the income, Signs there might be extra help | :44:31. | :44:41. | |
for the hardest hit have been We are a peninsula | :44:42. | :44:47. | |
of small businesses. If they were a big company | :44:48. | :44:52. | |
and we add them all together, there would be an outcry nationally | :44:53. | :44:55. | |
about how they are being treated so just because they are separate, | :44:56. | :44:58. | |
we need to look at them as a unit and say they are doing good | :44:59. | :45:02. | |
things for our economy. Ministers have said overall | :45:03. | :45:06. | |
the business rate changes make the system fairer and on social care | :45:07. | :45:08. | |
they insist they have already given We'll find out on Wednesday | :45:09. | :45:12. | |
whether there is a trump card up the Chancellor's sleeve as talk | :45:13. | :45:17. | |
of a controversial death tax to help plug the gaps | :45:18. | :45:20. | |
has emerged once again. Anne Marie, people in the piece very | :45:21. | :45:24. | |
worried about social I know that's something you've | :45:25. | :45:30. | |
spoken out about in the Commons. What should Philip Hammond do | :45:31. | :45:35. | |
to try and sort this out? In the short term, what we need | :45:36. | :45:39. | |
is the Better Care fund increased and the spending, | :45:40. | :45:42. | |
which is targeted for further down That's right, but if you | :45:43. | :45:47. | |
from the start move it from where it was to be spent | :45:48. | :45:57. | |
to being spent now, you're right And secondly, if we put | :45:58. | :46:00. | |
in that transition funding for the sustainable transformation | :46:01. | :46:05. | |
plans, that will revolutionise it. And as for your question, | :46:06. | :46:08. | |
where is that money coming from... Small businesses don't | :46:09. | :46:12. | |
like their taxes going up. You can't set one against the other | :46:13. | :46:15. | |
because what people have rightly said is that they are prepared | :46:16. | :46:21. | |
to contribute money to ensure that we have the NHS | :46:22. | :46:25. | |
and the social care we need. Business rates started out as a tax | :46:26. | :46:28. | |
on the properties of businesses and the whole thing is unfair, | :46:29. | :46:32. | |
fundamentally, so I'm not surprised the business community | :46:33. | :46:36. | |
is saying this is wrong. You came into Parliament for small | :46:37. | :46:39. | |
businesses, one of the things. So this is something you disagree | :46:40. | :46:42. | |
with completely, is it? I think the government has had two | :46:43. | :46:47. | |
bites at the cherry, The small businesses, | :46:48. | :46:49. | |
particularly the pubs, are particularly badly served | :46:50. | :46:53. | |
because the way the calculation People voted people | :46:54. | :46:56. | |
like you in to sort this out. At the moment, the government | :46:57. | :47:01. | |
has failed them. I haven't because I'm | :47:02. | :47:05. | |
fighting their corner. Theresa has also said on social care | :47:06. | :47:08. | |
she will look at it in the autumn. While I don't agree with what's | :47:09. | :47:15. | |
happening now, I do believe that the Prime Minister | :47:16. | :47:19. | |
and Mr Hammond do have in mind to look at the business rates | :47:20. | :47:21. | |
and social care in the autumn. Judith, is that something you think | :47:22. | :47:25. | |
Philip Hammond will look at? What do the Lib Dems think | :47:26. | :47:28. | |
the Chancellor should do? He really has no choice | :47:29. | :47:30. | |
but to look at it and to look I think the autumn is | :47:31. | :47:33. | |
leaving it a bit late. I would like to see something coming | :47:34. | :47:38. | |
up with this particular What would be very sensible would be | :47:39. | :47:41. | |
to put it into the Better Care fund, which was a Lib Dem institution | :47:42. | :47:46. | |
from Norman Lamb, and actually say, health and care, sort | :47:47. | :47:49. | |
it all out together, because it is the interface | :47:50. | :47:51. | |
between the two that causes Because people that end up | :47:52. | :47:53. | |
in hospital have nowhere to go. It's a combined effort | :47:54. | :47:58. | |
that needs some work. One of the gentleman said | :47:59. | :48:02. | |
he would be prepared to pay a little bit more and I think we need | :48:03. | :48:05. | |
to have a serious conversation It's getting increasingly | :48:06. | :48:08. | |
more and more expensive. There has been talk in the papers | :48:09. | :48:13. | |
of having a death tax to pay In the past I know the Chancellor | :48:14. | :48:18. | |
before he was Chancellor But I think people might be prepared | :48:19. | :48:23. | |
to pay some sort of hypothecated taxation towards health | :48:24. | :48:31. | |
and social care. It's something people have turned | :48:32. | :48:33. | |
against quite a few times in the past but now is probably | :48:34. | :48:36. | |
the time that it is worth I think that's right | :48:37. | :48:39. | |
because if we get the integration right, people will get | :48:40. | :48:44. | |
the services they want. For me, more important | :48:45. | :48:46. | |
is giving it to the people Right now I'm concerned | :48:47. | :48:54. | |
that the money goes to, if you like, the middleman, | :48:55. | :48:59. | |
by which I mean I would like to see it go | :49:00. | :49:02. | |
direct to the providers. You and Sarah Wollaston abstained | :49:03. | :49:06. | |
on the council funding settlement. Why not do the same sort of thing | :49:07. | :49:09. | |
and vote against the budget, if this isn't what you want | :49:10. | :49:12. | |
and the government isn't delivering? Voting against something very much | :49:13. | :49:16. | |
depends upon the totality of what you are voting | :49:17. | :49:19. | |
for or against. That was about something very | :49:20. | :49:22. | |
specific and I didn't agree with what they had done with regard | :49:23. | :49:24. | |
to social care. The budget is hopefully, | :49:25. | :49:27. | |
if they make some changes that The NHS, social care | :49:28. | :49:30. | |
and small business rates, You could make a stand, | :49:31. | :49:36. | |
couldn't you? Let's see what the rest | :49:37. | :49:40. | |
of the budget says. Nobody apart from the Chancellor | :49:41. | :49:44. | |
knows what's in it. For me to say I'm definitely | :49:45. | :49:46. | |
going to abstain would I really don't know what I will do | :49:47. | :49:49. | |
because I want to see Another way of looking at it | :49:50. | :49:55. | |
would be to say that, historically, this money was given to local | :49:56. | :50:00. | |
authorities because they actually Perhaps it makes more sense to give | :50:01. | :50:03. | |
the money and move the whole social care element within the health | :50:04. | :50:10. | |
ministry and then you can actually At the moment you have to have two | :50:11. | :50:14. | |
ministries having a conversation. They have also got | :50:15. | :50:19. | |
different priorities. So it makes far more sense | :50:20. | :50:21. | |
to look at it in the whole. You make the government | :50:22. | :50:24. | |
solely responsible? You have the Secretary of State | :50:25. | :50:29. | |
for Health and he has a senior minister who has responsibility | :50:30. | :50:32. | |
for social care. And you think the councils | :50:33. | :50:34. | |
would breathe a sigh of relief? They wouldn't like it | :50:35. | :50:37. | |
but you can't have it both ways. Moving on, military experts say cuts | :50:38. | :50:43. | |
to the Royal Navy in the 2010 Strategic Defence Review | :50:44. | :50:50. | |
are to blame for its It follows the cancellation | :50:51. | :50:53. | |
of the Culdrose Air Day after the commander of the Cornish | :50:54. | :50:57. | |
base said operations In the meantime, the senior service | :50:58. | :51:00. | |
is now looking to tempt former sailors to rejoin the Navy as it | :51:01. | :51:04. | |
struggles to find 1,000 crew members Here's our defence | :51:05. | :51:09. | |
reporter Scott Bingham. These helicopters and their air | :51:10. | :51:14. | |
crews are training hard for vital roles on board the new carriers, | :51:15. | :51:19. | |
HMS Queen Elizabeth But like much of the Navy, | :51:20. | :51:23. | |
things here are stretched. With seven squadrons | :51:24. | :51:29. | |
based at the station, the commanding officer has said 80% | :51:30. | :51:32. | |
of his front-line personnel are either on operations or at very | :51:33. | :51:36. | |
high readiness ahead of deployments As a result, this year's public air | :51:37. | :51:42. | |
day, an annual summer event, One former Admiral says | :51:43. | :51:47. | |
that is a mistake. This all relates | :51:48. | :51:53. | |
to alack of manpower. I personally believe | :51:54. | :51:55. | |
there is strength in manpower itself and things like air days and putting | :51:56. | :51:58. | |
people out on parade occasionally I think is rather | :51:59. | :52:01. | |
important for the totality The new carriers nearing completion | :52:02. | :52:05. | |
will go some way to addressing But with a crew of 500 | :52:06. | :52:11. | |
needed for each, it's now This is HMS Raleigh in Cornwall, | :52:12. | :52:17. | |
where the Royal Navy The latest government figures show | :52:18. | :52:23. | |
that the Navy's regular strength has fallen since April 2013, | :52:24. | :52:29. | |
when it was just over 31,400. And there was a surplus | :52:30. | :52:34. | |
of around 750 personnel. In December last year, | :52:35. | :52:39. | |
it had dropped by nearly 2,000 to just under 29,500, | :52:40. | :52:43. | |
leaving a deficit of more At HMS Raleigh, they talk | :52:44. | :52:47. | |
of growing their own. Recruits have to be rained | :52:48. | :52:55. | |
and that takes time. It desperately needs experienced | :52:56. | :52:58. | |
sailors now and is looking to attract those who may have left | :52:59. | :53:04. | |
back to the senior service Codenamed From Street To Fleet, | :53:05. | :53:08. | |
this ad has been reported as being aimed at over 55s - | :53:09. | :53:14. | |
a sort of Dad's Navy if you like. Though the MoD denied this, | :53:15. | :53:19. | |
it admits there is no upper age limit and each application will be | :53:20. | :53:23. | |
judged on a case-by-case basis. What you're seeing here | :53:24. | :53:28. | |
is a government under David Cameron that decided it would cut the Navy | :53:29. | :53:34. | |
right back, ignored probably the siren calls that this would be | :53:35. | :53:38. | |
a mistake because you never know what's coming, and now, | :53:39. | :53:41. | |
seven years later, the Navy finds itself in a fix | :53:42. | :53:45. | |
because of what happened in that The Navy needs to get out | :53:46. | :53:48. | |
of that fix quickly. HMS Queen Elizabeth is expected | :53:49. | :53:53. | |
to be ready for her first The demands on the service's ships, | :53:54. | :53:55. | |
aircraft and personnel are unlikely Judith, you're the defence | :53:56. | :54:02. | |
spokesperson for defence. Do you think there's a problem | :54:03. | :54:11. | |
with the Navy being overstretched? There are not enough people | :54:12. | :54:15. | |
coming in and young men and women are seeing | :54:16. | :54:21. | |
their careers very different. My husband served in | :54:22. | :54:24. | |
the Navy for 30 years. These days, people are thinking | :54:25. | :54:26. | |
four, maybe six years, we've got that on our CV, | :54:27. | :54:29. | |
we've trained as an engineer and we So people are leaving | :54:30. | :54:32. | |
in a way they never used to. Why would they want | :54:33. | :54:37. | |
to do something else? Certainly the SDSR 2010 one wasn't | :54:38. | :54:39. | |
terribly sensible but very often we've had SDSRs in the past that | :54:40. | :54:49. | |
have got rid of the wrong They've looked at numbers and not | :54:50. | :54:53. | |
at skills and this is pretty much So that is something you would | :54:54. | :54:58. | |
disagree with with your party? Hindsight is wonderful | :54:59. | :55:07. | |
if you just look at numbers. There was a big | :55:08. | :55:10. | |
affordability issue in 2010. There's an affordability | :55:11. | :55:12. | |
issue now as well. I know you are concerned | :55:13. | :55:17. | |
about the fall in sterling If you look at the 2015 SDSR, | :55:18. | :55:20. | |
with all sorts of wonderful bits of kit that we are going to come | :55:21. | :55:32. | |
on stream, pretty well all of them are going to be | :55:33. | :55:35. | |
coming from the States The pound currently buys 20% less | :55:36. | :55:39. | |
than it did as a result There are ways of | :55:40. | :55:44. | |
hedging all of that. But it means if we are buying | :55:45. | :55:49. | |
predominately from abroad, then it's So it's expensive to buy these | :55:50. | :55:52. | |
things we are committed to, at the same time Donald Trump | :55:53. | :55:58. | |
is saying we have to up We are relatively comfortable | :55:59. | :56:01. | |
about our 2% so that's fine. Anne Marie, when you campaigned | :56:02. | :56:07. | |
for Brexit, did you think that there might be a fall | :56:08. | :56:11. | |
in sterling and that it would have Was that something | :56:12. | :56:14. | |
you thought through? When you look at the overall | :56:15. | :56:19. | |
Brexit decision, clearly, on either side, could you guarantee | :56:20. | :56:22. | |
what was going to happen afterwards? I'm still for Brexit | :56:23. | :56:27. | |
and I still think economically We have not had this dreadful | :56:28. | :56:33. | |
recession that was forecast. And I think to say that Brexit has | :56:34. | :56:37. | |
caused the currency rate to change Markets are markets and you will see | :56:38. | :56:41. | |
what happened in America... So the fall in sterling has | :56:42. | :56:46. | |
nothing to do with Brexit? It is part of but not | :56:47. | :56:49. | |
the totality of the reason. The fall in sterling | :56:50. | :56:55. | |
and the expense of buying Clearly it matters but that is | :56:56. | :57:00. | |
the commercial reality and in terms of the percentage, | :57:01. | :57:08. | |
while Judith is right, a lot of our equipment | :57:09. | :57:11. | |
is at the moment sourced If you take the defence budget | :57:12. | :57:14. | |
as a whole, it's relatively small, about 10%, and this is also | :57:15. | :57:19. | |
an opportunity for the British companies to start saying, | :57:20. | :57:22. | |
let's make it at home. But that can take 15 years | :57:23. | :57:26. | |
to bring it through. But Harriet Baldwin has signed | :57:27. | :57:28. | |
contracts in the last few months to buy helicopters from Boeing | :57:29. | :57:33. | |
and we have got huge contract But we have to make decisions | :57:34. | :57:37. | |
now about the future. That doesn't mean to say | :57:38. | :57:43. | |
going forward, particularly when we get the Brexit deal done, | :57:44. | :57:46. | |
that we can't then start beginning to work with our own industries | :57:47. | :57:50. | |
to get them to start One of the problems with defence | :57:51. | :57:53. | |
is the long lead time. Those magnificent carriers | :57:54. | :57:58. | |
were ordered by the Labour We are talking about | :57:59. | :58:01. | |
really long time frames. The other thing I would say | :58:02. | :58:07. | |
with regard to the air day, Dawlish had to cancel its air day | :58:08. | :58:11. | |
as well in light of what happened at Shoreham and it was down | :58:12. | :58:17. | |
to health and safety. They are not saying this | :58:18. | :58:20. | |
is health and safety. Air days are great to have | :58:21. | :58:24. | |
but they are not something that But sometimes they can | :58:25. | :58:28. | |
encourage recruitment. A big air day, sometimes that can | :58:29. | :58:32. | |
encourage a drive in recruitment. The funny thing with this is, | :58:33. | :58:36. | |
there is the money for people, How many times in over a 10 year | :58:37. | :58:39. | |
period or 20 year period do We are launching one | :58:40. | :58:46. | |
aircraft carrier. The second will come on quite | :58:47. | :58:54. | |
quickly afterwards but it will go straight into mothballs | :58:55. | :58:57. | |
because we don't have the men There are long lead times | :58:58. | :59:01. | |
for many of these things. It is time for our regular round-up | :59:02. | :59:08. | |
of the political week in 60 seconds. Plymouth Labour councillor | :59:09. | :59:20. | |
Jonny Morris has been suspended It's appalling and I'm ashamed this | :59:21. | :59:24. | |
has happened in Plymouth and when this happens you need | :59:25. | :59:29. | |
strong leadership and people to get out there and actually say | :59:30. | :59:33. | |
this is unacceptable. Cornwall Council is to spend more | :59:34. | :59:36. | |
than ?300,000 bidding for the Duchy Despite protests, the Boundary | :59:37. | :59:39. | |
Commission is pressing on with plans for a Devonwall constituency | :59:40. | :59:47. | |
straddling the Tamar. And Taunton Deane MP Rebecca Powell | :59:48. | :59:51. | |
showered praise on the government Perhaps you, like many | :59:52. | :59:56. | |
other honourable friends and members here today, | :59:57. | :00:00. | |
took a shower this morning. Shower gel products containing them | :00:01. | :00:06. | |
can result in 100,000 micro beads or plastics being washed down | :00:07. | :00:11. | |
the drain every time we use them, into the water system and then | :00:12. | :00:15. | |
into the marine environment. Anna Marie, should Labour's Jonny | :00:16. | :00:23. | |
Morris resign for making He's behaved incredibly foolishly | :00:24. | :00:28. | |
and it's completely unacceptable I would have said the thing | :00:29. | :00:33. | |
that should happen now is his constituents, | :00:34. | :00:38. | |
yes, he should resign, but his constituents, | :00:39. | :00:39. | |
because that's who he's answerable to, should mount a petition | :00:40. | :00:41. | |
to him because that would put on the pressure, | :00:42. | :00:44. | |
but it's not acceptable. The Labour Party acted very quickly, | :00:45. | :00:47. | |
they couldn't do anything else, but it's 2017 and we shouldn't be | :00:48. | :00:54. | |
doing this sort of thing. What about, moving back to something | :00:55. | :00:58. | |
different, Truro's bid to be ?300,000 when we are | :00:59. | :01:02. | |
about to leave Europe? We were chatting about this before | :01:03. | :01:09. | |
we came in and I think even if we aren't selected, | :01:10. | :01:21. | |
even if we don't win the bid, it will be really good for Cornwall | :01:22. | :01:25. | |
because there's an awful lot of stuff we haven't | :01:26. | :01:28. | |
thought about doing. We can think through the plans | :01:29. | :01:31. | |
and strategy and still learn. I am going to have | :01:32. | :01:34. | |
to stop you there. That is the Sunday Politics | :01:35. | :01:37. | |
in the South West. Now back to Andrew | :01:38. | :01:40. | |
with the week ahead. need Crossrail as well. We will be | :01:41. | :01:51. | |
poring over the entrails of the budget next week. Thank you very | :01:52. | :01:53. | |
much indeed. So the Brexit Bill is back in | :01:54. | :01:58. | |
the Lords next week and the Lib Dems They've ordered pizza and camp beds | :01:59. | :02:04. | |
to encourage their peers to keep talking all night, | :02:05. | :02:07. | |
only to be told by the Lord's authorities that their plans fall | :02:08. | :02:10. | |
foul of health and safety laws. Laws that they probably voted for. | :02:11. | :02:22. | |
What did you make of David Liddington's remarks on the Lords | :02:23. | :02:26. | |
amendments, particularly not just the one on EU nationals, but on what | :02:27. | :02:31. | |
is regarded as a meaningful vote at the end of the process? Let's be | :02:32. | :02:38. | |
clear, as ministers like to say, the meaningful vote vote is by far the | :02:39. | :02:41. | |
biggest thing that will happen in Parliament. It puts EU citizens into | :02:42. | :02:48. | |
a tiny corner. It will decide not just who is going to have the final | :02:49. | :02:54. | |
say on this, but who the EU is negotiating with. Is it directly | :02:55. | :02:59. | |
with Theresa May or is it with Parliament? Who will decide the | :03:00. | :03:02. | |
shape of Brexit, Parliament or Theresa May? The Lords amendment is | :03:03. | :03:10. | |
just the first chapter. They have voiced Theresa May to give them a | :03:11. | :03:13. | |
veto on everything she does, and there is a possible chance in the | :03:14. | :03:18. | |
Commons could uphold this amendment. The meaningful vote amendment? The | :03:19. | :03:26. | |
meaningful vote amendment. But is it a meaningful vote if the choice is | :03:27. | :03:30. | |
to either back the deal or crash out of the deal? That is what the remain | :03:31. | :03:37. | |
supporting MPs or hardline people who want to remain fear. What they | :03:38. | :03:42. | |
want is the power to be able to send Theresa May back to the negotiating | :03:43. | :03:48. | |
table. Why is that anathema to many Brexit supporters? They believed it | :03:49. | :03:52. | |
would crucially and critically undermine Theresa May's negotiating | :03:53. | :03:57. | |
hand and also create a long period of uncertainty for business. There | :03:58. | :04:01. | |
is already great uncertainty and this could extend it. The | :04:02. | :04:06. | |
government's position is in there was a proper, meaningful vote which | :04:07. | :04:12. | |
Parliament could reject what was on offer, that would be an incentive to | :04:13. | :04:17. | |
the EU to give us a bad deal? I think that is the fear. If you are | :04:18. | :04:22. | |
saying to the people you are negotiating with that that is | :04:23. | :04:25. | |
another authority and Theresa May will have to go back and have all of | :04:26. | :04:30. | |
this approved, I think it would have a very significant undermining | :04:31. | :04:34. | |
effect on her negotiating hand. Things change from day to day. We | :04:35. | :04:40. | |
are talking about 2019 and 2018 at the earliest, but if the government | :04:41. | :04:46. | |
lost a vote on the Brexit deal, would he not have to call in someone | :04:47. | :04:54. | |
else? That is why the vote will be meaningful even if the amendment on | :04:55. | :04:59. | |
this meaningful vote will be lost. You cannot do a deal on something as | :05:00. | :05:05. | |
historic as Brexit and have Parliament against you. So, whatever | :05:06. | :05:11. | |
form this vote takes, whenever it happens, it will be hugely | :05:12. | :05:18. | |
meaningful. Whatever label that is given and if she lost it she would | :05:19. | :05:23. | |
call a general election. She could not impose it. To call a general | :05:24. | :05:29. | |
election now you need a majority of MPs which she will not have, so | :05:30. | :05:33. | |
maybe she will not get her election after all. It would be very unlike | :05:34. | :05:37. | |
Labour not to vote for an election. It would be very unlike Labour not | :05:38. | :05:40. | |
to vote for an election. The elections to Stormont have given | :05:41. | :05:43. | |
a boost to the republicans and put the long term status | :05:44. | :05:47. | |
of Northern Ireland in some doubt. Sinn Fein's leader Gerry Adams | :05:48. | :05:49. | |
spoke to reporters Yesterday was in many, | :05:50. | :05:51. | |
many ways a watershed election, and we have just started a process | :05:52. | :05:57. | |
of reflecting what it all means, but clearly the union's majority | :05:58. | :06:00. | |
in the Assembly has been ended, and the notion of a permanent | :06:01. | :06:16. | |
or a perpetual unionist majority Is he right? Is this a watershed? | :06:17. | :06:29. | |
The nationalist vote in the assembly will now come to 39 and the | :06:30. | :06:34. | |
Unionists 38. It is only one member, but it is significant. This is a | :06:35. | :06:39. | |
very serious moment and because of everything else going on with Donald | :06:40. | :06:43. | |
Trump and Brexit it is taking a while for people here to realise | :06:44. | :06:47. | |
just how significant this is. Talking to someone who only recently | :06:48. | :06:53. | |
left a significant role in Northern Ireland politics last night, they | :06:54. | :06:56. | |
said they were very worried about what this means. It is likely there | :06:57. | :07:00. | |
will be a call for some kind of international figure to chair the | :07:01. | :07:05. | |
talks to try and see if there is a way of everybody working together. | :07:06. | :07:09. | |
All sides will probably try to extract more money from the | :07:10. | :07:14. | |
Treasury, but it is a very dangerous moment. Should we regard Michelle | :07:15. | :07:19. | |
O'Neill, who has replaced Mr McGuinness as the leader, it is she | :07:20. | :07:23. | |
the First Minister death probably not quite. An interesting thought. | :07:24. | :07:31. | |
Indeed, the daughter of an IRA man, a fascinating concept in itself. But | :07:32. | :07:37. | |
there are are still a large amount of MLAs who will not give Sinn Fein | :07:38. | :07:42. | |
what they need. But what effect does this have on the legacy of the | :07:43. | :07:46. | |
prosecutions and the great witchhunts which the British | :07:47. | :07:51. | |
Government has vowed to end. There is a majority left on the Stormont | :07:52. | :07:57. | |
assembly to end those. But some would keep them going for time | :07:58. | :08:01. | |
continuing, which is a headache for Theresa May. You have now got 27 | :08:02. | :08:10. | |
Sinn Fein members, 28 DUP, then the SDLP bumps up the numbers a little | :08:11. | :08:14. | |
bit. You have got the British Government transfixed with Brexit | :08:15. | :08:19. | |
which has huge implications for the border between North and South in | :08:20. | :08:23. | |
Ireland, and the Irish government is pretty wavering as well and if there | :08:24. | :08:29. | |
is an election there, Sinn Fein could do well in the Dublin | :08:30. | :08:33. | |
parliament as well. There are a lot of moving pieces. There are and | :08:34. | :08:38. | |
there is a danger that we look at everything through the prism of | :08:39. | :08:42. | |
Brexit, but I found Friday and this weekend fascinating. Theresa May and | :08:43. | :08:48. | |
Scotland were Nicola Sturgeon is framing Brexit entirely through an | :08:49. | :08:52. | |
argument to have a second referendum on independence which she wants to | :08:53. | :08:57. | |
hold it she possibly can. And the Irish situation with the prospect of | :08:58. | :09:04. | |
a hard border with Northern Ireland voting majority to remain, quite a | :09:05. | :09:11. | |
substantial majority, again a few of the instability at the moment. That | :09:12. | :09:18. | |
We will be keeping an eye on it for sure. | :09:19. | :09:22. | |
Yesterday, US President Donald Trump tweeted allegations | :09:23. | :09:24. | |
that his predecessor, Barack Obama, had ordered | :09:25. | :09:26. | |
his phones to be tapped during the election campaign. | :09:27. | :09:29. | |
"Terrible!", Trump wrote, "Just found out that Obama | :09:30. | :09:32. | |
had my "wires tapped" in Trump Tower just before the victory. | :09:33. | :09:35. | |
I'm not quite sure what McCarthyism that is. | :09:36. | :09:49. | |
He followed up with a series of tweets comparing it to Watergate. | :09:50. | :09:51. | |
"How low has President Obama gone to tap my phones during the very | :09:52. | :09:58. | |
The sacred election process, I think at one stage he said it was a dodgy | :09:59. | :10:11. | |
election process, but now it is sacred. | :10:12. | :10:12. | |
You are frightened to go to bed at night, you do not know what you are | :10:13. | :10:25. | |
going to wake up to. Completely uncharted territory here. Little | :10:26. | :10:30. | |
more than a month ago at the inauguration they were making the | :10:31. | :10:33. | |
veneer of small talk and politely shaking hands. He saw Barack Obama | :10:34. | :10:40. | |
and Michelle off on the helicopter. You do not know what is coming next. | :10:41. | :10:47. | |
Is there a scintilla of evidence to back up Donald Trump's claims? Yes, | :10:48. | :10:52. | |
there is, although he is very muddled about it all. I will | :10:53. | :10:56. | |
explain. Remember what happened to Mike Flynn, talking to the Russian | :10:57. | :11:09. | |
and Ambassador will stop they were listening. Barack Obama does not | :11:10. | :11:14. | |
sign of warrants, but somebody else did. So why on earth would you not | :11:15. | :11:18. | |
want to listen to the president elect himself in case he might also | :11:19. | :11:26. | |
be breaking the law. Does that sound to you like convincing evidence or | :11:27. | :11:30. | |
just a supposition? I think Tom should go and work for him, that is | :11:31. | :11:34. | |
the most credible interpretation I have heard for a long time. Start | :11:35. | :11:40. | |
tweeting the case for the tweet. What is interesting about this is my | :11:41. | :11:45. | |
theory is he does not really like the idea of being a president. That | :11:46. | :11:49. | |
wild press conference he gave a couple of weeks ago there was one ad | :11:50. | :11:56. | |
lib that did not get repeated which was, I suppose I am a politician | :11:57. | :12:01. | |
now, as if he was humiliated at the idea of being a president. He likes | :12:02. | :12:05. | |
being the businessman with a swagger tweeting around the clock. And | :12:06. | :12:10. | |
campaigning again. He keeps going to what looked like campaign rallies. I | :12:11. | :12:15. | |
disagree with you about him not liking being president. I think he | :12:16. | :12:19. | |
loves the idea of being the president, but the reality is so | :12:20. | :12:24. | |
frustrating on every level, finding he does not have unlimited room for | :12:25. | :12:27. | |
manoeuvre and so many things have been put in place to stop them doing | :12:28. | :12:31. | |
things he would do in the business environment. We have had two more | :12:32. | :12:35. | |
tweets from him this morning, I guess when he woke up. Who was it | :12:36. | :12:40. | |
who secretly said to the Russian president, tell Vladimir that after | :12:41. | :12:43. | |
the election I will have more flexibility? Who was that? Possibly | :12:44. | :12:51. | |
Hillary Clinton. Is it true the Democratic National committee would | :12:52. | :12:56. | |
not allow the FBI access to check server or other equipment after | :12:57. | :13:00. | |
learning it was hacked? Can that be possible? This was all an issue in | :13:01. | :13:05. | |
the campaign. He is now a president. Shall I point out the flaw in Tom's | :13:06. | :13:10. | |
theory. They were not bugging Michael Flynn's phone, it was the | :13:11. | :13:13. | |
Russian Ambassador's telephone they were barking. Mr Neil, I would never | :13:14. | :13:23. | |
contradict you on this programme. But if you suspect there was | :13:24. | :13:27. | |
criminal activity going on, as there was by Michael Flynn, why would you | :13:28. | :13:34. | |
not want to put on a tap? I don't know. That is it for today. | :13:35. | :13:39. | |
I'll be back next week here on BBC One at 11am as usual. | :13:40. | :13:42. | |
The Daily Politics is back tomorrow at midday on BBC Two. | :13:43. | :13:44. | |
But remember - if it's Sunday, it's the Sunday Politics. | :13:45. | :14:34. | |
The thing that's so clear is that it's 100% honest. | :14:35. | :14:37. | |
We're right in the middle of the action. | :14:38. | :14:41. | |
The remarkable story of British photography. | :14:42. | :14:46. |