Browse content similar to 07/03/2017. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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I'm Victoria Derbyshire, welcome to the programme | :00:07. | :00:10. | |
This morning, these parents of a seven month old severely ill | :00:11. | :00:13. | |
baby tell us why they're urging the courts not to grant doctors | :00:14. | :00:16. | |
the rights to switch off his life support machine. | :00:17. | :00:21. | |
7 month old Charlie is receiving 24-hour treatment for a genetic | :00:22. | :00:24. | |
condition so rare he's believed to be only the 16th person | :00:25. | :00:26. | |
We'll bring you the full heart-breaking story shortly. | :00:27. | :00:33. | |
Also on the programme, Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn tells | :00:34. | :00:36. | |
this programme Theresa May's government has an issue | :00:37. | :00:37. | |
with disabilities - he's calling on them to scrap plans | :00:38. | :00:40. | |
to limit access to a key disability benefit. | :00:41. | :00:48. | |
They seem to have an issue over disabilities, because last year they | :00:49. | :00:56. | |
did try to remove the personal independence payments by ?4 billion. | :00:57. | :00:59. | |
I just think they need to think about the kind of society we are, | :01:00. | :01:02. | |
the way we support people. We'll bring you that full exclusive | :01:03. | :01:04. | |
interview around 9:30 this morning. And how Facebook called | :01:05. | :01:07. | |
the police on the BBC after we revealed potential flaws | :01:08. | :01:09. | |
in their moderation system. Hello, welcome to the programme, | :01:10. | :01:20. | |
we're live until 11am. Throughout the morning we'll bring | :01:21. | :01:22. | |
you the latest breaking news and developing stories - | :01:23. | :01:25. | |
and a little later in the programme we'll hear from an army widow | :01:26. | :01:28. | |
who says she had 5 miscarriages after her husband unknowingly | :01:29. | :01:30. | |
attacked her in his sleep as a result of his post-traumatic | :01:31. | :01:32. | |
stress disorder. She's now suing the | :01:33. | :01:36. | |
Ministry of Defence. Do get in touch on all the stories | :01:37. | :01:40. | |
we're talking about this morning - If you text, you will be charged | :01:41. | :01:46. | |
at the standard network rate. Our top story today, | :01:47. | :01:50. | |
the Labour Leader Jeremy Corbyn has accused Theresa May's government | :01:51. | :01:52. | |
of having an issue with Corbyn has previously claimed | :01:53. | :01:55. | |
that the Prime Minister is turning the Conservatives back | :01:56. | :01:59. | |
into the nasty party by quietly announcing a change to rules | :02:00. | :02:02. | |
on disability benefits. Let's get more on this from our | :02:03. | :02:08. | |
political guru Norman Smith. What is at issue? I think we learned | :02:09. | :02:20. | |
today from your interview with Jeremy Corbyn that he wants to make | :02:21. | :02:25. | |
disability benefits are key battle ground in the weeks ahead, over this | :02:26. | :02:29. | |
issue of personal independence payments. Two courts ruled recently | :02:30. | :02:35. | |
that many, many more people, around 160,000 more, should be able to get | :02:36. | :02:40. | |
this disability benefit. These are people at the moment is | :02:41. | :02:44. | |
predominantly with mental health issues, people with dementia etc, | :02:45. | :02:49. | |
they would be eligible. The Government has insisted, no way. | :02:50. | :02:58. | |
This is not what the benefit is meant for and it would come with a | :02:59. | :03:01. | |
huge price tag, they say it would cost almost ?4 billion. Interesting, | :03:02. | :03:04. | |
Mr Corbyn insisted today that as a society we have defined that money, | :03:05. | :03:09. | |
but going one step forward and accusing the Tories of having a | :03:10. | :03:12. | |
problem with disabled people. Have a lesson. They seem to have an | :03:13. | :03:18. | |
issue over disabilities, last year they tried to remove the personal | :03:19. | :03:22. | |
independence payments by ?4 billion, they then reverse that Kurt asked | :03:23. | :03:25. | |
Iain Duncan Smith resigned a few days later, then they agreed to | :03:26. | :03:31. | |
carry on paying it. There is a deficit built into the budget | :03:32. | :03:36. | |
already because of that. They see this as a further opportunity to | :03:37. | :03:39. | |
prevent the bill rising further. I think they need to think about the | :03:40. | :03:45. | |
kind of society we are, the way we support people. That was the issue | :03:46. | :03:53. | |
of PIP. We also talked about a snap general election, former | :03:54. | :03:55. | |
Conservative leader William Hague says that Theresa May should | :03:56. | :03:59. | |
effectively call one and change the legislation. Unlikely, I think? Yes | :04:00. | :04:06. | |
and no, Theresa May has made it very clear repeatedly that she does not | :04:07. | :04:10. | |
want to hold an early general election and she thinks that it | :04:11. | :04:14. | |
would be wrong now to change her mind. Whatever the electoral | :04:15. | :04:18. | |
advantages. But an awful lot of Tories would think Mr Hague has a | :04:19. | :04:22. | |
point, here we are going into the Brexit negotiations, possible | :04:23. | :04:27. | |
revolts in the Commons, one way that Mrs May could strengthen her hand | :04:28. | :04:32. | |
would be to go for an early election while Labour are at sixes and | :04:33. | :04:36. | |
sevens. In the interview you did with Jeremy Corbyn he sounded a | :04:37. | :04:39. | |
little knocked, almost riled when you kept pressing him, six times, I | :04:40. | :04:45. | |
think I counted, about would he be in favour of an early general | :04:46. | :04:50. | |
election. Let's have a listen. Are you telling me you are confident you | :04:51. | :04:54. | |
would win a general election? We will take our case to the country. | :04:55. | :05:04. | |
We are very confident of the support we can get in order to win an | :05:05. | :05:07. | |
election, to take our case to the British people. Don't underestimate | :05:08. | :05:10. | |
the support there is for the Labour Party and the anger out there at the | :05:11. | :05:12. | |
levels of inequality and injustice. We will expose all of that, that is | :05:13. | :05:17. | |
why the case is very, very strong. You have asked me the question many, | :05:18. | :05:21. | |
many times. How many times do I have to tell you, we are taking our case | :05:22. | :05:30. | |
to win because I believe we can. Sounding a bit sharp, maybe not | :05:31. | :05:33. | |
surprising in the wake of the Copeland by-election defeat. As for | :05:34. | :05:38. | |
the prospects of a snap general election, some in the Tory party | :05:39. | :05:43. | |
think not just wouldn't strengthen the position of Mrs May here but | :05:44. | :05:46. | |
also strengthen her hand in terms of the Brexit negotiations. I would | :05:47. | :05:52. | |
class it as unlikely but not rule it out. Thank you, Norman. We will have | :05:53. | :05:57. | |
the full interview with Jeremy Corbyn at just after 9:30am and we | :05:58. | :06:02. | |
will hear from the former Work and Pensions Secretary Stephen Crabb on | :06:03. | :06:03. | |
the issue of PIPs. Joanna is in the BBC | :06:04. | :06:05. | |
Newsroom with a summary Facebook's procedures for vetting | :06:06. | :06:07. | |
content on its pages have been strongly criticised after a BBC | :06:08. | :06:11. | |
investigation found it was failing to remove inappropriate | :06:12. | :06:13. | |
and sexualised images of children. The chair of the commons media | :06:14. | :06:15. | |
committee Damian Collins has said it casts grave doubts | :06:16. | :06:18. | |
on the effectiveness Our correspondent | :06:19. | :06:19. | |
Angus Crawford reports. Facebook says it removes nudity | :06:20. | :06:23. | |
or sexually suggestive content. But our investigation last year | :06:24. | :06:28. | |
found paedophiles using secret groups to swap obscene | :06:29. | :06:30. | |
images of children. We informed the police, | :06:31. | :06:37. | |
and this man was sent Facebook told us it had | :06:38. | :06:40. | |
improved its systems, But we still found sexualised | :06:41. | :06:44. | |
pictures of children, We reported 100 posts that we felt | :06:45. | :06:50. | |
broke Facebook's own guidelines. They didn't breach Facebook's | :06:51. | :06:56. | |
community standards. I'm concerned that that's been | :06:57. | :07:10. | |
brought to Facebook's attention, and some of those images have not | :07:11. | :07:18. | |
been dealt with and addressed. And this report, this investigation, | :07:19. | :07:21. | |
it casts grave doubt on the effectiveness of the measures | :07:22. | :07:24. | |
that Facebook has in place. Facebook asked us to send them | :07:25. | :07:29. | |
examples of what we had The company then reported | :07:30. | :07:32. | |
us to the police. Facebook issued | :07:33. | :07:38. | |
a statement saying... But, even now, groups | :07:39. | :07:40. | |
with inappropriate images and comments about children | :07:41. | :07:43. | |
remain on Facebook. But, even now, groups | :07:44. | :07:58. | |
with inappropriate images and comments about children | :07:59. | :08:02. | |
remain on Facebook. Questions about how the company | :08:03. | :08:05. | |
moderates content won't go away. A British woman has been | :08:06. | :08:10. | |
rescued by police officers in Australia after allegedly | :08:11. | :08:18. | |
being held against her will A 22-year-old man from Queensland | :08:19. | :08:20. | |
has been charged with several counts of rape and assault | :08:21. | :08:24. | |
after she was found with injuries Downing Street has rejected | :08:25. | :08:27. | |
a call from the former Conservative leader, | :08:28. | :08:32. | |
Lord Hague, to call Writing in the Daily Telegraph, | :08:33. | :08:34. | |
he says Theresa May needs a decisive Commons majority to head | :08:35. | :08:39. | |
off backbench rebellions. Mrs May has repeatedly ruled out | :08:40. | :08:42. | |
going to the country before The Government is facing | :08:43. | :08:45. | |
the prospect of another defeat in the House of Lords over | :08:46. | :08:52. | |
the process of leaving the EU today. Peers are to vote on an amendment | :08:53. | :08:56. | |
to the Brexit Bill which calls for Parliament to be given | :08:57. | :08:59. | |
a meaningful vote on a final deal. The Prime Minister has said | :09:00. | :09:02. | |
Parliament will have a vote - but only on a take it | :09:03. | :09:05. | |
or leave it basis. Last week, the Upper House voted | :09:06. | :09:07. | |
to guarantee the rights of EU A couple are asking | :09:08. | :09:10. | |
the High Court to let them take their seven-month-old son | :09:11. | :09:16. | |
to the USA for potentially life-saving treatment as they began | :09:17. | :09:18. | |
a battle against Great Ormond Street Chris Gard and Connie Yates | :09:19. | :09:21. | |
want to take their son Charlie Doctors at Great Ormond Street have | :09:22. | :09:25. | |
applied to withdraw life support on the grounds it is not | :09:26. | :09:30. | |
in his best interest. A judge will rule on the case | :09:31. | :09:34. | |
at a hearing next month. And Charlie's parents will be | :09:35. | :09:37. | |
speaking to Victoria here on this programme in just | :09:38. | :09:39. | |
a few minutes' time. Senior members of Donald Trump's | :09:40. | :09:44. | |
administration have defended a new executive order that puts | :09:45. | :09:46. | |
a ban on people from six mainly Muslim countries | :09:47. | :09:49. | |
travelling to the US. The revised travel ban | :09:50. | :09:51. | |
is due to come into effect Iraq has been removed | :09:52. | :09:53. | |
from the previous list. The Secretary of State, | :09:54. | :09:59. | |
Rex Tillerson, said the new order signed by the US President | :10:00. | :10:02. | |
was designed to keep The Malaysian Prime Minister | :10:03. | :10:04. | |
has accused North Korea of holding his citizens hostage | :10:05. | :10:09. | |
after Pyongyang banned Malaysians In a tit-for-tat response, | :10:10. | :10:12. | |
Malaysia has imposed similar restrictions | :10:13. | :10:16. | |
on North Korean visitors. The measures are an escalation | :10:17. | :10:18. | |
in tensions sparked by the murder of the North Korean leader's | :10:19. | :10:21. | |
half-brother in Kuala Lumpur. Wayne Rooney is backing a campaign | :10:22. | :10:30. | |
encouraging boys to open up It comes after new figures | :10:31. | :10:32. | |
from the charity Childline show that boys are six times less likely | :10:33. | :10:36. | |
to seek help for suicidal But national figures show the number | :10:37. | :10:39. | |
of suicides among boys is much That's a summary of the latest BBC | :10:40. | :10:44. | |
News - more at 9:30am. We have Kanye 's and Chris Cloete | :10:45. | :11:07. | |
here, thank you for coming in. -- we have Connie and Chris here. They | :11:08. | :11:13. | |
will talk about their legal battle with Great Ormond Street Hospital. | :11:14. | :11:16. | |
Their seven-month-old baby is being treated on doctors there believe his | :11:17. | :11:19. | |
life-support machine should be switched off, you as parents totally | :11:20. | :11:31. | |
disagree? Why are you speaking out? To try to raise money for treatment | :11:32. | :11:35. | |
in America. Thank you, we will speak to you later. | :11:36. | :11:38. | |
Let's get some sport from Hugh Woozencroft. | :11:39. | :11:40. | |
Hugh, Team Sky have urged their cyclists to praise boss | :11:41. | :11:43. | |
Dave Brailsford according to reports in this morning's papers. | :11:44. | :11:46. | |
Why? There is so much scrutiny on Team Sky, it is not going away in a | :11:47. | :11:55. | |
hurry. Last week we spoke about a mystery package delivered to Sir | :11:56. | :11:58. | |
Bradley Wiggins, a lack of evidence about what it contained, the chair | :11:59. | :12:02. | |
of the select committee Damian Cullen said the credibility of Team | :12:03. | :12:05. | |
Sky and British cycling is in tatters. The team was next to | :12:06. | :12:11. | |
explain excessive quantities of another drug, users of which include | :12:12. | :12:15. | |
prevention of asthma attacks. Dave Brailsford said the team medic gave | :12:16. | :12:22. | |
him it after surgery. An academy coach says he was treated by the | :12:23. | :12:25. | |
same medic with the same drug, the drug that was given to Bradley | :12:26. | :12:29. | |
Wiggins before three major races using his therapeutic -- therapeutic | :12:30. | :12:41. | |
use exemption. Durant Thomas has responded on social media, it | :12:42. | :12:46. | |
shouldn't even need saying but we back Dave 100%. I have known him for | :12:47. | :12:49. | |
a long time and I would not want anyone else leading Team Sky. | :12:50. | :12:54. | |
Peter Kennaugh added I think all the riders on Team Sky would join me in | :12:55. | :13:00. | |
saying they are completely behind Dave Brailsford. One rider is | :13:01. | :13:04. | |
conspicuous by his absence, Chris Froome, the three-time Tour de | :13:05. | :13:07. | |
France winner is yet to respond to the request, which does not look | :13:08. | :13:12. | |
good for Team Sky. This response to something so serious as well. There | :13:13. | :13:16. | |
have been plenty of questions and calling for Brailsford to resign, we | :13:17. | :13:23. | |
will see if he can survive in the coming weeks. | :13:24. | :13:25. | |
And a massive task facing Arsenal in the Champions League tonight. | :13:26. | :13:28. | |
It'll be interesting to gauge the atmosphere between Arsene Wenger and | :13:29. | :13:35. | |
various players? We might see a different side to Arsene Wenger, he | :13:36. | :13:39. | |
has asked for lucid rage from his against Bayern Munich, who are | :13:40. | :13:44. | |
looking to achieve the miraculous results, 5-1 down in the first leg | :13:45. | :13:50. | |
from the Champions League last 16 tie, Wenger has caused for total | :13:51. | :13:55. | |
commitment. The players are ready to fight but it is always a mixture of | :13:56. | :14:00. | |
a little bit of success or a little bit of belief. I think we live in a | :14:01. | :14:09. | |
world of small margins, if you drop off a little bit on the belief side | :14:10. | :14:16. | |
or the confidence fronted looks like you do not want to fight. I won in | :14:17. | :14:21. | |
2% believe these players want to do well and win. | :14:22. | :14:24. | |
He will need them to fight pretty hard, they are 33-1 to make it to | :14:25. | :14:30. | |
the next round. On the BBC sport website you can see what is more | :14:31. | :14:34. | |
less likely to happen than matter. More or less likely that Vladimir | :14:35. | :14:37. | |
Putin will win the next Russian election? That is more likely, just | :14:38. | :14:52. | |
3-1. More less likely that Australia will win Eurovision? That is just | :14:53. | :14:55. | |
10-1. The next James Bond being a female actor? More likely, just | :14:56. | :14:57. | |
16-1. How about the existence of alien life being prudent 2017? Also | :14:58. | :15:04. | |
more likely, just 20-1. Lots of fun to be had on the website, especially | :15:05. | :15:09. | |
if you are a Spurs fan. We will see is a miracle happens. Thank you. | :15:10. | :15:16. | |
The parents of a seven-month-old baby boy who are challenging doctors | :15:17. | :15:19. | |
in court not to switch off his life support machine say they deserve | :15:20. | :15:22. | |
the right to decide the fate of their son. | :15:23. | :15:26. | |
Charlie Gard is receiving 24-hour treatment at | :15:27. | :15:30. | |
London's Great Ormond Street Hospital for a genetic condition | :15:31. | :15:33. | |
so rare he's believed to be only the 16th person | :15:34. | :15:35. | |
With no accepted cure for the disease, doctors now believe | :15:36. | :15:39. | |
Charlie should be allowed to die with dignity. | :15:40. | :15:45. | |
But his parents say pioneering US treatment could save his life. | :15:46. | :15:48. | |
They now have less than a month to prove that to a judge. | :15:49. | :15:51. | |
Connie Yates and Chris Gard are here. | :15:52. | :16:02. | |
When Charlie was born in August, perfectly healthy. Everything seemed | :16:03. | :16:09. | |
normal. We had no worries. At what point did you start to worry? By six | :16:10. | :16:15. | |
weeks he looked weaker and by eight weeks we took him into hospital | :16:16. | :16:18. | |
because he appeared to have lost weight. What did they do? They did a | :16:19. | :16:22. | |
few tests but they didn't know what was wrong at the time. He got | :16:23. | :16:27. | |
transferred to great or Monday Street Hospital on 11th October. He | :16:28. | :16:31. | |
has been there ever And pretty much since. You two as well. Tell us | :16:32. | :16:35. | |
about the condition Charlie is in. It is hondrial depletion syndrome. | :16:36. | :16:55. | |
He is missing an enzyme. So yeah. What does that mean about his | :16:56. | :16:59. | |
condition on a day-to-day basis Chris? What you do and not do? | :17:00. | :17:08. | |
Slight movements. Move his hands, move his fingers and eyes. He can't | :17:09. | :17:13. | |
open them fully, but he can still open his eyes and see us and he | :17:14. | :17:21. | |
responds to us. We don't feel he is in pain at all. We wouldn't say he's | :17:22. | :17:30. | |
suffering. He has not got the same life as normal seven-month-old baby, | :17:31. | :17:33. | |
but what we're asking for is something that can make him better. | :17:34. | :17:38. | |
If we were going to court to either end care or to leave him how he is, | :17:39. | :17:45. | |
we know that's not a life for the long-term, but it is having | :17:46. | :17:48. | |
something out there which can, you know, improve him and give him a | :17:49. | :17:52. | |
better quality of life and hopefully make him better is the reason why | :17:53. | :17:55. | |
we're still sitting here fighting now. I'll ask you more about the | :17:56. | :18:01. | |
treatment in America in a moment. In terms of the months that he has been | :18:02. | :18:07. | |
in the hospital, October to now, do you believe his condition has | :18:08. | :18:10. | |
deteriorated? It has since we got there, but in the last sort of | :18:11. | :18:14. | |
couple of months he hasn't got any worse. He stayed very stable, hasn't | :18:15. | :18:21. | |
he, the last couple of months. Yes. My understanding is the doctors feel | :18:22. | :18:27. | |
he has deteriorated. He has since he got there, but not in recent months. | :18:28. | :18:32. | |
He's stable. He's not on any painkillers. Just a ventilator. He | :18:33. | :18:37. | |
doesn't have any IV lines or anything like that. In terms of what | :18:38. | :18:43. | |
the specialists at great or Monday Street were saying, they could do | :18:44. | :18:47. | |
for him, what sort of things were they looking at? What sort of things | :18:48. | :18:52. | |
were you looking at? At what point did it come clear that they weren't | :18:53. | :18:56. | |
going to be able to treat him? There isn't much they can do for hondrial | :18:57. | :18:59. | |
depletion syndrome. They told us no treatment, no cure. So they have | :19:00. | :19:01. | |
given him vitamins and stuff which can boost the mitochondria he | :19:02. | :19:29. | |
has. You have done research. What did you find. There was another | :19:30. | :19:37. | |
mitochondrial syndrome that had a treatment. There was a research | :19:38. | :19:40. | |
article I read where they said that it should also work for Charlie's | :19:41. | :19:50. | |
gene as well. Even though it is a different gene? It is a similar | :19:51. | :19:55. | |
cell. I went out to try and find this particular doctor. He has been | :19:56. | :20:01. | |
very helpful. He's waiting for Charlie in America. So he has agreed | :20:02. | :20:12. | |
to treat Charlie? Yes. When did you realise that the doctors in the | :20:13. | :20:16. | |
hospital weren't going to support you in this? Thursday. The day | :20:17. | :20:20. | |
before court. They told us we could do Go to America subject to money | :20:21. | :20:25. | |
and things like that, but and then they said that they don't think it | :20:26. | :20:31. | |
is in his best interests. I said but he hasn't deteriorated recently | :20:32. | :20:34. | |
since they said we could go to America. What was that like when you | :20:35. | :20:39. | |
found out there was a really big fundamental difference of opinion, | :20:40. | :20:42. | |
Chris? Well, it's difficult because we feel like we've been fighting for | :20:43. | :20:46. | |
a long time. It seems like we've been fighting since the day we found | :20:47. | :20:54. | |
out Charlie was ill, you know. At the end of the day, we want him to | :20:55. | :20:59. | |
be given the chance, you're never going to find treatments or cures | :21:00. | :21:02. | |
for these things if you never try anything. What we're asking to give | :21:03. | :21:08. | |
him are not poisons, they're naturally occurring compounds that | :21:09. | :21:12. | |
me and you can do produce and unfortunately he is deficient in | :21:13. | :21:15. | |
them and he can't produce them himself. So, you know, there is no | :21:16. | :21:21. | |
real known side-effects to the medications so I kind of think the | :21:22. | :21:28. | |
hole time has been why not try? There is no side-effects. It is just | :21:29. | :21:31. | |
something that his body requires, you know, it's very different, I | :21:32. | :21:37. | |
know, people will say it is very different, insulin for diabetics, if | :21:38. | :21:42. | |
a diabetic doesn't have insulin, they're in trouble and someone said | :21:43. | :21:46. | |
it is very different, insulin is known to be safe in humans. Well, | :21:47. | :21:50. | |
how did you find out who was the first person to try this? Because he | :21:51. | :21:53. | |
has got a rare disease he doesn't have a treatment at the moment, but | :21:54. | :22:00. | |
he's only number 16. We want to do this for Charlie. He always has been | :22:01. | :22:05. | |
and always will be our number one priority, but we know how it feels | :22:06. | :22:08. | |
to have someone born with this disease so if anyone in the future | :22:09. | :22:12. | |
is born with this disease, we want something that can help this and we | :22:13. | :22:18. | |
want to find a treatment and cure for mitochondrial disease. We want | :22:19. | :22:23. | |
parents taken into the side room and told we have got something your | :22:24. | :22:27. | |
child. We don't want the devastating news that there is nothing we can | :22:28. | :22:33. | |
do. You have been taken into a side room many times. What did they say | :22:34. | :22:39. | |
to you? They said they were the worst results they had seen in a | :22:40. | :22:44. | |
living baby. They were amazed he made it to eight weeks. He was 13, | :22:45. | :22:50. | |
or 14 weeks at that point. They said they were amazed he could move his | :22:51. | :22:55. | |
little finger. We were so proud of him. He shouldn't be there at 13, 14 | :22:56. | :23:01. | |
weeks. We thought you're fighting here. As long as you're fighting | :23:02. | :23:03. | |
we're going to keep fighting for you. Halfs he like in the first few | :23:04. | :23:09. | |
weeks then? Perfect. He's still perfect. He's our little man. We | :23:10. | :23:15. | |
didn't have any worries. He had his own little personality and started | :23:16. | :23:20. | |
smiling and all the usual things. Just started getting weaker and | :23:21. | :23:25. | |
yeah. When they said they are the worst results we have ever seen and | :23:26. | :23:29. | |
he shouldn't really be here now. Was that the point at which they said | :23:30. | :23:33. | |
there is no treatment? There is no cure for this? They did say that to | :23:34. | :23:40. | |
us before. We got there on the Tuesday and then on the Friday they | :23:41. | :23:48. | |
said, "We suspect he has got mitochondrial disease." We were told | :23:49. | :23:53. | |
we had days left with him and that was in October/November. We're now | :23:54. | :23:58. | |
March so... What is the atmosphere like at the hospital when there are | :23:59. | :24:03. | |
medical specialists there who want to do the best for your baby. You're | :24:04. | :24:07. | |
there, you want to do the best for your baby, but you have this really | :24:08. | :24:11. | |
big difference of opinion? I don't see how the best is for him just to | :24:12. | :24:16. | |
die. The best is for him to be given a chance. I think they say he's in | :24:17. | :24:23. | |
pain. The people say that he's in pain don't spend all day with him | :24:24. | :24:27. | |
and all night with him. He's not on painkillers. If they thought he was | :24:28. | :24:32. | |
in pain, he would be in painkillers. We are there every day and all day | :24:33. | :24:37. | |
and people who wrote the reports for court spend very little time with | :24:38. | :24:40. | |
Charlie. So if anyone knows him, they're the experts when it comes to | :24:41. | :24:44. | |
the clinical side of things, but if anyone knows him, do you think if we | :24:45. | :24:48. | |
suspected he was in pain, we'd still be fighting this hard? If we were | :24:49. | :24:52. | |
sitting there thinking he is in pain, we would have let him go a | :24:53. | :24:55. | |
long time ago. He is our boy. We love him. We're doing all this for | :24:56. | :25:00. | |
Charlie. He can't hear, is that right? He can't cry? His muscles are | :25:01. | :25:08. | |
very weak. I can tell if he is unhappy and if he's crying, but I | :25:09. | :25:11. | |
can understand how someone else couldn't see it because his muscles | :25:12. | :25:15. | |
are very weak. So what would he do to show that he wasn't happy? You're | :25:16. | :25:21. | |
going to make me pull silly faces on the telly. I didn't know what the | :25:22. | :25:25. | |
answer is? You can see him do something with his mouth. He can get | :25:26. | :25:29. | |
tears in his eyes. Really? It is a facial expression because the | :25:30. | :25:32. | |
muscles are so weak. We do understand why. People can't tell. | :25:33. | :25:36. | |
Are you, you are allowed to touch him and you are allowed to stroke | :25:37. | :25:40. | |
him and are you allowed to hold him? Yeah. You lie alongside him. He has | :25:41. | :25:45. | |
got a big bed now so we can lie alongside him. The scenario that | :25:46. | :25:49. | |
you're in now is that actually the decision has been taken out of your | :25:50. | :25:53. | |
hands? Yes. And out of the hands of the doctors and a decision about | :25:54. | :25:57. | |
your son's life will now be made by a judge. Who has never met him | :25:58. | :26:02. | |
before. What do you think about that? I hate it. I can't bear the | :26:03. | :26:09. | |
thought of it. He's our boy. We've always had his best interests at | :26:10. | :26:13. | |
heart. Those three words I've heard more are in Charlie's best | :26:14. | :26:19. | |
interests. We're his mum and dad, his best interests always will be | :26:20. | :26:22. | |
our main priority. What do you have to do at the next hearing? You have | :26:23. | :26:27. | |
to persuade the judge that the treatment in America is what, I | :26:28. | :26:32. | |
don't know, going to work, is worth it, how do you have to go about | :26:33. | :26:38. | |
persuading this judge? Just... Do you have to give him evidence about | :26:39. | :26:41. | |
the treatment? As much evidence as we can, but there is limited data on | :26:42. | :26:45. | |
it. There is some scientific proof which I'll share with him, but and | :26:46. | :26:51. | |
yeah... It's difficult because it is so rarement people are saying the | :26:52. | :26:54. | |
data is not out there, but he's number 16 in the world to have the | :26:55. | :26:59. | |
infantile version of this. The judge has described this as the most | :27:00. | :27:04. | |
tragic situation. He talked about you as truly devoted parents and he | :27:05. | :27:08. | |
will, "Have to balance on the one hand the risk of pain and suffering | :27:09. | :27:13. | |
to Charlie against the possibility that the treatment in America could | :27:14. | :27:20. | |
prove to be successful." I mean that's an impossible decision in a | :27:21. | :27:22. | |
way, isn't it? I wouldn't like to be that judge. | :27:23. | :27:30. | |
Rather him than me right now. I'm going to read you some messages from | :27:31. | :27:34. | |
people watching you around the country KDB tweets this, "This is so | :27:35. | :27:39. | |
heartbreaking, but the parents should decide." Nicky says, "I | :27:40. | :27:42. | |
support the parents. They should be able to help their baby boy without | :27:43. | :27:48. | |
a court case." You are trying to raise money. Tell our audience the | :27:49. | :27:52. | |
reasons why you need over ?1 million. We need to get a private | :27:53. | :27:58. | |
air ambulance there because he's ventilate sod we require a doctor | :27:59. | :28:02. | |
and nurse just to look after him. And the care in America is very | :28:03. | :28:06. | |
expensive because it's private healthcare. And then the medications | :28:07. | :28:12. | |
that he'd require as well. They are just oral medications. They are not | :28:13. | :28:17. | |
too overly expensive, but it is mostly the care. And where are you | :28:18. | :28:22. | |
up to in that? In terms of raising the money? I didn't check this | :28:23. | :28:31. | |
morning? About ?23,000. Is it? Wow. This is what great or Monday street | :28:32. | :28:36. | |
say, "Charlie has a rare and complex disease which which there is no | :28:37. | :28:40. | |
accepted care. Charlie was very ill when he was admitted to great or | :28:41. | :28:44. | |
Monday Street Hospital and he remained under 24 hour care in our | :28:45. | :28:52. | |
intensive care unit. We feel we have exhausted all available proven | :28:53. | :28:56. | |
treatment options. We can't imagine how hugely distressing this is for | :28:57. | :28:59. | |
the family. We continue to support them every way we can while | :29:00. | :29:05. | |
advocating what we believe is best for Charlie." | :29:06. | :29:10. | |
What do you say to that? I just wish we were trusted to know what was | :29:11. | :29:15. | |
best for our son. I think we've shown the dedication we've got. | :29:16. | :29:20. | |
We're not keeping him here just for our benefit, you know, because we | :29:21. | :29:26. | |
can't bear to lose him. As I said, he has fought to save, to stay here | :29:27. | :29:33. | |
and you know as I say, if we feel he's in pain and suffering which we | :29:34. | :29:38. | |
don't because seriously we would not be doing this. We are not bad | :29:39. | :29:41. | |
parents. We just want him to be given the chance and if he's not in | :29:42. | :29:45. | |
pain and not suffering as we feel he is then you know we will fight to | :29:46. | :29:48. | |
the very end to get him the treatment that we think will work, | :29:49. | :29:52. | |
you know, we're convinced it will work. Jo says, "I feel so sorry for | :29:53. | :29:56. | |
Charlie's parents. Of course, they want to fight for their son, but | :29:57. | :29:59. | |
surely you have to listen to the doctors." | :30:00. | :30:04. | |
You're listening to a doctor in America who has used these | :30:05. | :30:09. | |
medications and in the research behind them, we think it will work | :30:10. | :30:17. | |
-- we are listening to. He is a urologist specialising in | :30:18. | :30:20. | |
mitochondrial disease and neurological conditions. | :30:21. | :30:24. | |
Rowan says my heart goes out to the couple. Sandra says what an awful | :30:25. | :30:29. | |
position. Another view says my heart goes out to them and Charlie. Debra, | :30:30. | :30:34. | |
we need to support that is -- the parents, doctors are not always | :30:35. | :30:39. | |
right. Helen says I would like to offer ?20,000 to help with Charlie's | :30:40. | :30:44. | |
treatment in America. Thank you, Helen. That's amazing. Oh, my word. | :30:45. | :30:51. | |
I know a lot of people say they have to listen to the doctors, but kids | :30:52. | :30:56. | |
are Jura ball. Kids defied the doctors every day. We believe | :30:57. | :31:02. | |
Charlie is a special boy. He is our son, we love him, of course we will | :31:03. | :31:07. | |
be biased, but he is a special boy, a little warrior. Thank you both. We | :31:08. | :31:13. | |
will report back for our audience on what happens in court in a few | :31:14. | :31:17. | |
weeks. In the meantime, thank you for coming on the programme. Thank | :31:18. | :31:21. | |
you for having us. If you want to get in touch about | :31:22. | :31:28. | |
that, please do. You can send us an e-mail, you can message us on | :31:29. | :31:29. | |
Twitter. Still to come, Jeremy Corbyn calls | :31:30. | :31:30. | |
on the government to scrap plans to limit access | :31:31. | :31:33. | |
to a key disability benefit. We'll have his full interview | :31:34. | :31:35. | |
in the next few minutes. A British backpacker | :31:36. | :31:39. | |
is allegedly raped and assaulted during a two-month hostage | :31:40. | :31:41. | |
ordeal in Queensland. We'll have the latest | :31:42. | :31:43. | |
live from Sydney. Joanna is in the BBC Newsroom | :31:44. | :31:53. | |
with a summary of the news. Jeremy Corbyn has told this | :31:54. | :31:56. | |
programme that he believes Theresa May's government has | :31:57. | :31:58. | |
an issue with people Labour has previously criticised | :31:59. | :32:00. | |
the government over moves to reduce the number of people able to claim | :32:01. | :32:05. | |
disability benefits - particularly personal | :32:06. | :32:08. | |
independent payments. The government has insisted that the | :32:09. | :32:20. | |
welfare system is a strong safety net for those in need of it? | :32:21. | :32:26. | |
They seem to have an issue over disabilities, last year they tried | :32:27. | :32:30. | |
to remove the personal independence payments by ?4 billion, they then | :32:31. | :32:33. | |
reversed that cut after Iain Duncan Smith resigned a few days later, and | :32:34. | :32:39. | |
then agreed to carry on paying it. There is a deficit built into the | :32:40. | :32:43. | |
budget already because of that. They see this as a further opportunity to | :32:44. | :32:48. | |
prevent the bill rising further. I think they just need to think about | :32:49. | :32:52. | |
the kind of society we are, the way we support people. | :32:53. | :32:55. | |
And you can listen to Victoria's full interview with Jeremy Corbyn | :32:56. | :32:57. | |
right here in a couple of minutes' time. | :32:58. | :32:59. | |
Facebook's procedures for vetting content on its pages have been | :33:00. | :33:02. | |
strongly criticised after a BBC investigation found it was failing | :33:03. | :33:04. | |
to remove inappropriate and sexualised images of children. | :33:05. | :33:07. | |
The chair of the commons media committee Damian Collins has said | :33:08. | :33:10. | |
it casts grave doubts on the effectiveness | :33:11. | :33:12. | |
Facebook said it had removed all items that were illegal | :33:13. | :33:16. | |
Downing Street has rejected a call from the former | :33:17. | :33:24. | |
Conservative leader, Lord Hague, to call | :33:25. | :33:26. | |
Writing in the Daily Telegraph, he says Theresa May needs a decisive | :33:27. | :33:30. | |
Commons majority to head off backbench rebellions. | :33:31. | :33:31. | |
Mrs May has repeatedly ruled out going to the country before | :33:32. | :33:34. | |
A couple fighting a court battle from preventing Great Ormond Street | :33:35. | :33:49. | |
Hospital from turning off their baby's live support they say they | :33:50. | :33:53. | |
just want to improve his quality of life. Chris Gard and Connie Yates | :33:54. | :33:58. | |
want to take their son Charlie to America for pioneering treatment. | :33:59. | :34:01. | |
Doctors at Great Ormond Street have applied to withdraw life support on | :34:02. | :34:05. | |
the grounds it is not in his best interests. | :34:06. | :34:08. | |
If we were going to court to either end care or to leave him how he is, | :34:09. | :34:14. | |
we know that is not a life for the long term, you know poster not but | :34:15. | :34:18. | |
it is having something out that that will give him a better quality of | :34:19. | :34:22. | |
life and hopefully make him better, that is the reason we are still | :34:23. | :34:35. | |
sitting here fighting. More at 10am. This on personal independence | :34:36. | :34:39. | |
payments, Martin text this, Jeremy Corbyn is 110% right what he says | :34:40. | :34:45. | |
about PIP. I have tried six times to get on PIP payments because of my | :34:46. | :34:49. | |
disabilities, now I am trying for my seventh with Atos. They are the | :34:50. | :34:54. | |
private company which does the assessments. 99% of applicants will | :34:55. | :35:03. | |
fail to qualify for PIP. He must, must come to Swindon and takes his | :35:04. | :35:06. | |
seat from the Conservatives after years and years of neglect. More on | :35:07. | :35:11. | |
that after the sport. Good morning. | :35:12. | :35:12. | |
Well, Chelsea are looking pretty unstoppable in the race | :35:13. | :35:14. | |
They survived the test of a London derby last night, | :35:15. | :35:18. | |
Eden Hazard and Diego Costa goals helping them to | :35:19. | :35:20. | |
The are now 10 points clear with 11 games left. | :35:21. | :35:25. | |
Manchester United talisman Zlatan Ibrahimovic faces | :35:26. | :35:26. | |
missing their FA Cup quarter final against Chelsea after being charged | :35:27. | :35:29. | |
He appeared to try and elbow Tyrone Mings of Bounemouth | :35:30. | :35:34. | |
If given a three match ban he'd also miss league games | :35:35. | :35:38. | |
Five-time world champion Ronnie O'Sullivan beat Liang Wenbo 5 | :35:39. | :35:45. | |
frames to 1 to reach the second round at the Players | :35:46. | :35:48. | |
And day-night cricket will be included in the Women's Ashes | :35:49. | :35:56. | |
England and Australia will meet in Brisbane in October | :35:57. | :35:59. | |
with the first of three one-day internationals, before | :36:00. | :36:01. | |
-- test and Twenty20 matches as well. That is all, we will be back | :36:02. | :36:10. | |
at just after 10am. The Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn has | :36:11. | :36:12. | |
told this programme the Government He's calling on them to scrap plans | :36:13. | :36:15. | |
to limit access to a key disability The Government wants to reverse two | :36:16. | :36:19. | |
recent court rulings that would have made another 160,000 people eligible | :36:20. | :36:23. | |
for the personal independence PIP is a benefit paid to the long | :36:24. | :36:26. | |
term ill or disabled. It is replacing an older payment | :36:27. | :36:34. | |
called Disability Living Allowance. PIP has two parts - | :36:35. | :36:38. | |
one to cover daily living expenses, the other to cover mobility | :36:39. | :36:41. | |
or getting around. Under PIP you are scored | :36:42. | :36:44. | |
based on your needs. More than eight points and you get | :36:45. | :36:47. | |
the lower or standard rate. That is ?55.10 a week for expenses | :36:48. | :36:56. | |
and ?21.10 a week for mobility. More than 12 points | :36:57. | :37:01. | |
and you get an enhanced rate. That is around ?82 for living is and | :37:02. | :37:05. | |
over 50 points for mobility. Last year judges at two tribunals | :37:06. | :37:12. | |
said more points should be given if you suffer overwhelming | :37:13. | :37:14. | |
psychological distress when making a journey or if you need | :37:15. | :37:16. | |
help to take medication. That - says the Government - | :37:17. | :37:19. | |
would make another 160,000 people eligible and would cost the taxpayer | :37:20. | :37:21. | |
?3.7 billion over Whenever we talk about PIP on this | :37:22. | :37:24. | |
programme we get hundreds of texts Last week we were contacted | :37:25. | :37:28. | |
by Brian Rollinson who served with the British Army | :37:29. | :37:31. | |
in Northern Ireland in the 1980s. He was injured back then and later | :37:32. | :37:36. | |
diagnosed with Post Traumatic Our reporter Jim Reed went | :37:37. | :37:39. | |
to meet him yesterday The first tour was very tough, | :37:40. | :37:43. | |
walking the streets of Northern Ireland not knowing, | :37:44. | :37:54. | |
would you be coming back safely? It had a massive effect | :37:55. | :38:00. | |
on me later on in life. My day-to-day life, I have daily | :38:01. | :38:09. | |
flashbacks, traumas, I try and avoid difficult | :38:10. | :38:13. | |
situations like supermarkets, going on public transport and PTSD | :38:14. | :38:23. | |
is an illness that I don't think So, you know, look at | :38:24. | :38:28. | |
the paperwork I have to submit! I was very relieved after the first | :38:29. | :38:45. | |
tribunal that we won our case and, I thought, right, I can | :38:46. | :39:07. | |
get on now living. In 2015, we're looking two years | :39:08. | :39:12. | |
straight after the first tribunal, I had a letter saying we need to do | :39:13. | :39:15. | |
another assessment on your I was thinking to myself, | :39:16. | :39:20. | |
"What's happening now?" I thought, "That's | :39:21. | :39:35. | |
it, it's all done." The claim is being looked at | :39:36. | :39:40. | |
and I've gone back down to standard. I don't want to be too | :39:41. | :39:55. | |
blunt but it's pathetic. I don't think that these people | :39:56. | :40:07. | |
making these decisions And it was a very | :40:08. | :40:23. | |
difficult time yet again. You feel like a criminal | :40:24. | :40:31. | |
because of what I had to go through over the last | :40:32. | :40:38. | |
couple of years. Yes, I didn't want | :40:39. | :40:40. | |
to be here any more. I think that speaks for itself | :40:41. | :40:42. | |
without me saying those words, but, this really got | :40:43. | :40:44. | |
me down, really did. I think ministers, government, | :40:45. | :40:48. | |
need to have a look As we've been hearing, | :40:49. | :40:50. | |
the Labour Leader Jeremy Corbyn has told this programme that | :40:51. | :41:04. | |
Theresa May's government appears to have an issue | :41:05. | :41:06. | |
with people with disabilities. This is the full interview, | :41:07. | :41:08. | |
and Mr Corbyn began by describing what action he's demanding | :41:09. | :41:11. | |
from Ministers over personal The court made a ruling and the | :41:12. | :41:22. | |
Government did not put it to the Social Security advisory committee, | :41:23. | :41:26. | |
which is what they would normally do before introducing legislation. On | :41:27. | :41:30. | |
the 23rd of February they laid a statutory instrument before | :41:31. | :41:33. | |
Parliament to negate the decision of the court and thus 164,000 people | :41:34. | :41:38. | |
did not receive enhanced PIP payments from the beginning of | :41:39. | :41:43. | |
April. I think that is disgraceful, we will obviously oppose it when it | :41:44. | :41:48. | |
comes before Parliament but that is the Government position, they are | :41:49. | :41:54. | |
wrong. The Government say everybody currently on personal independence | :41:55. | :41:56. | |
payments will continue to receive it. | :41:57. | :42:03. | |
The current recipients will continue to receive it, these are new | :42:04. | :42:07. | |
applications for people suffering from severe conditions such as | :42:08. | :42:10. | |
post-traumatic stress and a number of others, who will not get the | :42:11. | :42:15. | |
necessary enhanced payments to live an independent life. They are | :42:16. | :42:19. | |
suffering from quite serious mental health conditions and I think they | :42:20. | :42:23. | |
deserve to be supported. The Government's policy, in law there is | :42:24. | :42:27. | |
a parity between physical and mental health, it seemed to be undermined | :42:28. | :42:32. | |
by the Government's decision. The DWP says 65% of recipients, those | :42:33. | :42:38. | |
getting PIP with the mental health condition, get the highest rate of | :42:39. | :42:42. | |
the daily living expenses, versus 22% under the previous Labour policy | :42:43. | :42:51. | |
of the disability living allowance. The number getting personal | :42:52. | :42:52. | |
independence payments is considerable, they deserve it and | :42:53. | :42:56. | |
are integral to bid. This is about new applicants are people suffering | :42:57. | :42:59. | |
from mental health conditions who will not get the enhanced payments. | :43:00. | :43:03. | |
I think they should, we will challenge this in Parliament and I | :43:04. | :43:08. | |
think it is extremely unfair. Explain why having a mental health | :43:09. | :43:13. | |
condition like anxiety, the condition referred to by Theresa | :43:14. | :43:16. | |
May's head of policy units, is a serious in your view as having a | :43:17. | :43:23. | |
severe disability? He is very derogatory language and sedatives | :43:24. | :43:26. | |
eventually -- essentially people who do not have a serious condition at | :43:27. | :43:33. | |
all. I think he should talk to people who have developed obsessive | :43:34. | :43:36. | |
disorders, those with post-rheumatic stress and a number of others, they | :43:37. | :43:43. | |
need support to live independently and get support to recover from it | :43:44. | :43:46. | |
all together. Denying them the support they need in order to live | :43:47. | :43:51. | |
independently is counter-productive because their condition will | :43:52. | :43:55. | |
probably get worse, they will become a greater cost because they will | :43:56. | :44:00. | |
possibly need care in a residential setting. I wonder if you think there | :44:01. | :44:06. | |
should maybe be one payments that everyone receives regardless of the | :44:07. | :44:10. | |
severity of their disability or mental health condition? The | :44:11. | :44:15. | |
principle behind personal independence payments is the | :44:16. | :44:18. | |
principal of independent living, where those who have conditions or | :44:19. | :44:22. | |
to be able to live independently in their own home, and the costs vary | :44:23. | :44:27. | |
between different parts of the country, different levels of | :44:28. | :44:30. | |
conditions, meaning there has to be an assessment made. If you have a | :44:31. | :44:34. | |
flat rate benefit to the whole country it is not necessarily | :44:35. | :44:38. | |
reflect the costs to some people, and some need more current support | :44:39. | :44:41. | |
than others, they might need some body to help them, others may be | :44:42. | :44:50. | |
able to manage with minimal help -- some need more care and support than | :44:51. | :44:52. | |
others. You cannot legislate simply for every single mental health | :44:53. | :44:55. | |
condition. You will know the disability welfare bill has steadily | :44:56. | :45:00. | |
increased for rent two decades, are you this morning saying you are | :45:01. | :45:05. | |
except that it will keep increasing in the future? -- are you this | :45:06. | :45:09. | |
morning saying that you access to that? I think it will increase for a | :45:10. | :45:15. | |
number of reasons, one is the older population, medical research has | :45:16. | :45:18. | |
moved on a lot and people are able to survive quite bad injuries when | :45:19. | :45:21. | |
they end up with a disability condition which in previous decades | :45:22. | :45:24. | |
maybe they would not have survived from. I think the costs will go up | :45:25. | :45:31. | |
but I think we have to judge ourselves as a society. Do we | :45:32. | :45:35. | |
believe that those with any form of disability can contribute? Yes. Do | :45:36. | :45:39. | |
we believe they should live independently? Yes. Does that mean | :45:40. | :45:43. | |
we have to support them? Obviously, that is part of the price of | :45:44. | :45:47. | |
civilised living. The Government say the changes they want to make would | :45:48. | :45:52. | |
save ?3.7 billion, where would you get that money from? | :45:53. | :45:58. | |
I would continue by not reducing the level of inheritance tax. I would | :45:59. | :46:04. | |
look at it as a cost that we all have to bear as a society for the | :46:05. | :46:09. | |
benefit of all of us. That reversal in corporation tax | :46:10. | :46:13. | |
cut, you've spent it quite a few times now. You've said you'll use it | :46:14. | :46:18. | |
to plug the gap in social care funding and you'll use it to address | :46:19. | :46:24. | |
the pay freeze on public sector workers and you'll abolish tuition | :46:25. | :46:27. | |
fees and bring back grants and that adds up to ?14 billion a year. There | :46:28. | :46:34. | |
would have to be other sources of income as well for central | :46:35. | :46:40. | |
Government. That issue has to be decided upon. Has to be examined | :46:41. | :46:44. | |
carefully, but I just make the point that this Government is moving in a | :46:45. | :46:48. | |
trajectory of lowering the top rate of taxation, lowering the levels of | :46:49. | :46:51. | |
corporate taxation, lowering the levels of inheritance tax, all that | :46:52. | :46:55. | |
has a price to pay and it is all of us who have to pay that price. | :46:56. | :47:02. | |
Reversing the corporation tax cut saves ?7.5 billion over five years, | :47:03. | :47:07. | |
and reintroducing the 50 pence tax rate brings in ?100 million a year. | :47:08. | :47:13. | |
Where else would you pay for this ?3.7 billion for these enhanced | :47:14. | :47:17. | |
payments for more claimants? Let's start from the principle we should | :47:18. | :47:21. | |
pay them. Start from the principle that these people are entitled to | :47:22. | :47:25. | |
that care and support and we have to raise the taxation to deal with it | :47:26. | :47:29. | |
and we're also considering the level which we would raise corporation tax | :47:30. | :47:34. | |
in order to raise more funds for public needs because we do need it | :47:35. | :47:39. | |
as you quite rightly identify to fund education improvements as well | :47:40. | :47:43. | |
as maintain a decent level of funding for those with disabilities | :47:44. | :47:46. | |
and also, of course, properly fund our NHS and social care system. You | :47:47. | :47:51. | |
will know there is a certain level of public support for reducing the | :47:52. | :47:56. | |
welfare bill? There is always a public support for lots of different | :47:57. | :48:01. | |
things, but I think anyone who has talked to somebody, who has gone | :48:02. | :48:06. | |
through a mental health crisis, somebody that's going through | :48:07. | :48:10. | |
post-traumatic stress or somebody that's suffering from physical | :48:11. | :48:12. | |
disability, everybody would recognise they have a right to be | :48:13. | :48:15. | |
able to live their lives as independently as possible and as | :48:16. | :48:19. | |
decently as possible. I think when you put to the public the simple | :48:20. | :48:23. | |
human case for spending all of our resources or helping those people to | :48:24. | :48:27. | |
live fuller lives then I think there is a lot of support for that. Do you | :48:28. | :48:33. | |
think Theresa May and her Government have an I shall ub with people with | :48:34. | :48:39. | |
disabilities? They seem to have an issue over social care and they seem | :48:40. | :48:43. | |
to have an issue over disabilities because last year they did try toe | :48:44. | :48:48. | |
remove the Personal Independence Payments by ?4 billion. They then | :48:49. | :48:52. | |
reversed that cut after Iain Duncan Smith resigned a few days later and | :48:53. | :48:57. | |
then agreed to carry on paying it. So there is a deficit built into the | :48:58. | :49:02. | |
Budget already because of that. They then see this as a further | :49:03. | :49:06. | |
opportunity to prevent the bill rising further. Well, I think they | :49:07. | :49:12. | |
just need to think about the kind of society we are. The way we support | :49:13. | :49:17. | |
people and hope they will change their minds on this. We will | :49:18. | :49:20. | |
certainly oppose the statutory instrument in Parliament. That's the | :49:21. | :49:24. | |
legal jargon for bringing this thing in and hope the Government will | :49:25. | :49:29. | |
change its mind. We certainly have never changed our minds on this. | :49:30. | :49:32. | |
People need support. Why would they have an issue with people with | :49:33. | :49:37. | |
certain disabilities? I think they have an issue about being prepared | :49:38. | :49:41. | |
to argue the case to spend public money in supporting people who need | :49:42. | :49:44. | |
to be able to live as independently as possible. All the time I have | :49:45. | :49:49. | |
been in Parliament there has been debates about disability, we have | :49:50. | :49:53. | |
moved a long, long way. We got equalities legislation and | :49:54. | :49:56. | |
disabilities right and we got parity of he is seem through on physical | :49:57. | :49:59. | |
and mental health and things have changed a great deal. Clearly, there | :50:00. | :50:03. | |
is a cost involved in that. It is how you judge and measure society. | :50:04. | :50:08. | |
Let me ask you one or two other questions if I may. One of your own | :50:09. | :50:13. | |
Labour MPs said the former Conservative Prime Minister John | :50:14. | :50:16. | |
Major is more effective at attacking Theresa May than Labour right now. | :50:17. | :50:21. | |
Is that colleague of yours right? I have no idea who he is or she is or | :50:22. | :50:26. | |
why they say that. We are attacking this Government on issues of health | :50:27. | :50:30. | |
and social care as we have just been discussing. We are attacking this | :50:31. | :50:34. | |
Government on issues of economic development, of unemployment, under | :50:35. | :50:38. | |
employment, zero-hours contracts and insecurity in work, we're attacking | :50:39. | :50:42. | |
this Government on all these fronts. Because John Major is critical of | :50:43. | :50:45. | |
the Government over the European Union, so are we. We have accepted | :50:46. | :50:49. | |
the result of the referendum. But we also want to make sure there is a | :50:50. | :50:53. | |
good, effective tariff-free trading relationship with Europe in the | :50:54. | :50:58. | |
future. Former Conservative leader William Hague says Theresa May | :50:59. | :51:02. | |
should scrap the legislation that would then allow her to call a snap | :51:03. | :51:05. | |
general election. Would you welcome that? Well, the legislation was put | :51:06. | :51:11. | |
in with all party support only in the last Parliament which is known | :51:12. | :51:17. | |
as a fixed term parliaments Act, the fixed Parliament Acts require that | :51:18. | :51:22. | |
Parliament goes for five years unless two-thirds of MPs vote for | :51:23. | :51:26. | |
dissolution of Parliament. We supported that legislation because | :51:27. | :51:29. | |
we wanted to ensure greater stability in politics, but if there | :51:30. | :51:33. | |
is a proposal to get rid of it then I'm sure we'd consider it. Does that | :51:34. | :51:37. | |
mean you would welcome the snap general election or not? I want to | :51:38. | :51:41. | |
see a different Government. I don't want to see this Government in | :51:42. | :51:44. | |
office. So you would welcome the snap general election. | :51:45. | :51:49. | |
Theoretically, are you saying you'd win it then? We would take our case | :51:50. | :51:59. | |
out to the country. The case out for dealing with the housing crisis | :52:00. | :52:03. | |
rather than leaving so many people living in housing stress or homeless | :52:04. | :52:12. | |
or unable to buy because they can't find anywhere to buy. The latest | :52:13. | :52:20. | |
poll puts Labour 18 points behind the Conservative Government. That's | :52:21. | :52:24. | |
the biggest lead since you became leader and it has been like that for | :52:25. | :52:28. | |
a few months which suggests even if voters agree with your message, they | :52:29. | :52:32. | |
like your message, they've stopped listening to you as the messenger? | :52:33. | :52:38. | |
We're getting out there with our case, our case for national Health | :52:39. | :52:41. | |
Service, our case for social care, our case for jobs, our case for | :52:42. | :52:45. | |
housing, our case for decency in society. We will put that out there. | :52:46. | :52:49. | |
We'll put that out there because the levels of inequality in this country | :52:50. | :52:53. | |
are totally unacceptable and the inability of so many young people to | :52:54. | :52:57. | |
make the most of their lives because of the levels of debt they get into | :52:58. | :53:02. | |
in university or the very low levels of pay they get, or the high cost of | :53:03. | :53:06. | |
rent in the private rented sector. If you put that out there, do you | :53:07. | :53:10. | |
think that's enough for you to win a snap general election? We will be | :53:11. | :53:12. | |
out there campaigning. We will be out there taking our message, taking | :53:13. | :53:16. | |
our message of hope to the people of this country. And we're very | :53:17. | :53:19. | |
confident that that message will be well received. Does that mean yes, | :53:20. | :53:22. | |
you could win a snap general election? We will take our case out. | :53:23. | :53:29. | |
We will do our very best to win an election. Nobody knows the result of | :53:30. | :53:33. | |
an election before they go into it, but we do know that we have a | :53:34. | :53:37. | |
strong, moral and just case to put to the people of this country, of | :53:38. | :53:43. | |
the kind of country we could be. You definitely won't say yes, you could | :53:44. | :53:48. | |
win a snap general election. Nobody can say they're going to win an | :53:49. | :53:52. | |
election. All you can say is you go into an election determined to win | :53:53. | :53:55. | |
it so that you can deliver for the people of this country the kind of | :53:56. | :53:58. | |
society they deserve and we believe is possible. | :53:59. | :54:04. | |
I wonder is the soft coup that your shod owe chancellor revealed | :54:05. | :54:07. | |
recently, is that over or still ongoing? I'm asking all Labour MPs | :54:08. | :54:13. | |
to get behind the strategy we're putting forward. Get behind an | :54:14. | :54:17. | |
investment-led economy, get behind our opposition to what this | :54:18. | :54:22. | |
Government is doing in creating greater inequality in our society. | :54:23. | :54:25. | |
We have a large party membership campaigning week in and week out and | :54:26. | :54:29. | |
we have council and mayoral elections coming up. We're going to | :54:30. | :54:32. | |
be together on those doorsteps winning the elections. Do you think | :54:33. | :54:35. | |
privately there are some of your colleagues who are plotting against | :54:36. | :54:40. | |
you still? I think there is a media obsession with the internal workings | :54:41. | :54:43. | |
of the Labour Party. Well, it was John McDonnell, it was your Shadow | :54:44. | :54:46. | |
Chancellor who told us about a soft coup... I know. I know. Listen, | :54:47. | :54:54. | |
let's get out there on the policies, let's get out there united as a | :54:55. | :54:57. | |
party, determined to change the way that people live in our society so | :54:58. | :55:01. | |
they can live better lives, that's what politics is really all about. | :55:02. | :55:04. | |
What do you want to see from the Chancellor in tomorrow's Budget? | :55:05. | :55:10. | |
What I would like to see is sufficient funding for the NHS and | :55:11. | :55:12. | |
social care. I think that's a key. What I would also like to see is | :55:13. | :55:16. | |
addressing the issues of the school funding crisis which means that many | :55:17. | :55:20. | |
schools are now faced with a horrible prospect of laying off | :55:21. | :55:24. | |
teachers or teaching assistants. Classes gotting bigger and | :55:25. | :55:27. | |
children's support in education getting less. I want to see those | :55:28. | :55:31. | |
issues addressed and I also want to see something very positive about | :55:32. | :55:35. | |
housing particularly development of council housing so that people can | :55:36. | :55:38. | |
get somewhere decent to live rather than having to pay often very | :55:39. | :55:42. | |
excessive rents for inadequate quality of private rented | :55:43. | :55:46. | |
accommodation. We are expecting an announcement on an increase in | :55:47. | :55:49. | |
funding for school places in the Budget including for new grammar | :55:50. | :55:52. | |
school places, what do you think of those Conservative plans? I think | :55:53. | :55:58. | |
they're barking up the wrong tree completely on this. The issue of | :55:59. | :56:02. | |
school funding and school places. The issue isn't going around to | :56:03. | :56:07. | |
develop selective education. The issue is supporting the schools that | :56:08. | :56:11. | |
we've got and supporting the principal of local community schools | :56:12. | :56:14. | |
rather than selection. There is no great public support for selection | :56:15. | :56:17. | |
because they realise if you have selection for one group of people, | :56:18. | :56:22. | |
somebody else doesn't get selected. Please forgive me Mr Corbyn, I will | :56:23. | :56:26. | |
come back to my question about whether you think you would win a | :56:27. | :56:29. | |
snap general election. Are you telling me... Are you telling me | :56:30. | :56:35. | |
that you're confident you would win a general election? We're going to | :56:36. | :56:41. | |
take our case out to the countriment we're very confident of the support | :56:42. | :56:44. | |
we can get to win an election to take our case to the British people. | :56:45. | :56:47. | |
Don't under estimate the support there is for the Labour Party. Don't | :56:48. | :56:51. | |
under estimate the anger that there is out there of the levels of | :56:52. | :56:54. | |
inequality and injustice in our society. We'll expose that. That's | :56:55. | :56:59. | |
where our case is very, very strong. Can you answer yes or no, please? | :57:00. | :57:03. | |
You've asked me the question, many, many times, how many times do I have | :57:04. | :57:06. | |
to tell you, we're taking our case out there to win because we believe | :57:07. | :57:10. | |
we can win. Thank you very much for talking to us. Thank you. | :57:11. | :57:14. | |
We will get reaction to that from the former Work and Pensions | :57:15. | :57:23. | |
Secretary, Stephen Crabb. Denise says, "He can't answer a simple | :57:24. | :57:26. | |
question as to how he would pay for it. I fully support the welfare cuts | :57:27. | :57:32. | |
and the Government." Vivy says, "I agree with Jeremy Corbyn. I'm | :57:33. | :57:35. | |
concerned about the Government's attitude to the disabled." Emma | :57:36. | :57:38. | |
says, "It isn't just people with mental health issues that will be | :57:39. | :57:42. | |
affected by PIP changes is this is a huge issue, but not the only issue." | :57:43. | :57:47. | |
Sarah says, "Corbyn is talking rubbish. He's plucking his money | :57:48. | :57:56. | |
tree again." Ness says, "The system is cruel. It is judgemental and it | :57:57. | :58:03. | |
belittles you. ." Another viewer says, "I am a carer. Are there any | :58:04. | :58:08. | |
stats on how many suicides occurred as a result of the forms and the | :58:09. | :58:11. | |
process? If only the Government could see the despair and defeat on | :58:12. | :58:16. | |
the faces of the vulnerable people I go to to look after." Thank you. The | :58:17. | :58:21. | |
latest news and sport in a moment after the weather. Here is Stav. | :58:22. | :58:27. | |
Good morning. What a chilly one it has been. It will be the last of the | :58:28. | :58:37. | |
chilly mornings. Plenty of sunshine to compensate the cold morning. | :58:38. | :58:41. | |
Further west the cloud is continuing to thicken like this picture shows | :58:42. | :58:44. | |
in Somerset. That's because we've got this weather front which is | :58:45. | :58:48. | |
slowly creeping in off the Atlantic to brood deuce stronger winds and | :58:49. | :58:51. | |
thicker cloud and rain to western areas as the day wears on. There is | :58:52. | :58:56. | |
another weather front affecting the north-east corner of Scotland and | :58:57. | :59:00. | |
the Northern Isles. Lots of sunshine around, but the rain will continue | :59:01. | :59:04. | |
to march in slowly across more western areas. For Scotland, not a | :59:05. | :59:07. | |
bad afternoon. There should be good sunshine around on the mainland. | :59:08. | :59:11. | |
Sunshine and showers continuing across the Northern Isles. More | :59:12. | :59:14. | |
prolonged rain at times and feeling cold with the wind there. Some of | :59:15. | :59:17. | |
the rain getting in towards Western Scotland because for Northern | :59:18. | :59:20. | |
Ireland here, for you, it will be turning cloudier and wetter and | :59:21. | :59:23. | |
breezier for this part of the afternoon and the rain gotting in | :59:24. | :59:26. | |
towards parts of Wales and the south-west of England, but the | :59:27. | :59:28. | |
Midlands eastwards will hold on to the drier and the brighter weather. | :59:29. | :59:32. | |
The sunshine becoming hazier at times too, but in the brighter spots | :59:33. | :59:37. | |
we could make ten or 11 Celsius. Elsewhere, staying in single | :59:38. | :59:41. | |
figures. It isn't until this evening and overnight the rain gets its act | :59:42. | :59:45. | |
together and marches across the UK. A bit of snow over the higher ground | :59:46. | :59:49. | |
of Scotland for a while before that mild air pumps in right across the | :59:50. | :59:53. | |
UK. So by the end of tonight, we're looking at temperatures of four to | :59:54. | :59:56. | |
maybe nine Celsius across the south. So it means for Wednesday, we're in | :59:57. | :00:01. | |
the mild air. It is going to be a tale of two halfs. Northern areas | :00:02. | :00:04. | |
will see blustery showers. For Scotland and Northern Ireland and | :00:05. | :00:06. | |
the far north of England Arsunshine. For much of England and Wales the | :00:07. | :00:09. | |
weather front will be stubborn to clear so it will be damp here. | :00:10. | :00:14. | |
Outbreaks of rain. Some hill fog and mist and murk, but very mild | :00:15. | :00:17. | |
across-the-board, but across central and southern parts of Britain with | :00:18. | :00:20. | |
top temperatures of around 14 Celsius. If we pull out to show the | :00:21. | :00:25. | |
big picture into Thursday, you can see the area of low pressure moves | :00:26. | :00:28. | |
away from the north of Scotland and we will have a weather front across | :00:29. | :00:30. | |
the south of the country, but I think it is a ridge of high pressure | :00:31. | :00:34. | |
dominating so for many areas, it should be dry with sunshine, and | :00:35. | :00:37. | |
probably the best of the sunshine across eastern areas. A lot of cloud | :00:38. | :00:40. | |
further south and west. A few showers across the south and very | :00:41. | :00:45. | |
mild again with top temperatures of 14 Celsius or 15 Celsius. The mild | :00:46. | :00:48. | |
air will be with us until the end of the week and into the weekend, but | :00:49. | :00:52. | |
don't expect wall to wall sunshine. There is going to be a lot of cloud | :00:53. | :00:56. | |
around and outbreaks of rain too. It stays mild into the start of next | :00:57. | :00:57. | |
week too. That's your weather. Hello, it's Tuesday, it's 10am, | :00:58. | :01:02. | |
I'm Victoria Derbyshire. In a court battle to keep | :01:03. | :01:05. | |
their seventh month old baby alive, we hear from a couple who tell us | :01:06. | :01:08. | |
exclusively why they are fighting to take their seriously ill | :01:09. | :01:11. | |
son Charlie to the USA for potentially | :01:12. | :01:14. | |
lifesaving treatment. At the end of the day, we just want | :01:15. | :01:25. | |
him to be given a chance because, you know, you will never find | :01:26. | :01:30. | |
treatments or cures for these things if you never try anything. What | :01:31. | :01:36. | |
we're asking to give him are not poisons, they are naturally | :01:37. | :01:41. | |
occurring compounds that me and you can produce, unfortunately he is | :01:42. | :01:46. | |
deficient in them. So many of you getting untouched, Mark says my | :01:47. | :01:50. | |
heart and love go to you two and you... Your boy. -- so many of you | :01:51. | :01:55. | |
getting into edge. You will be able to watch the full | :01:56. | :01:57. | |
interview shortly. We'll also bring you reaction | :01:58. | :01:59. | |
to our exclusive interview with Jeremy Corbyn - | :02:00. | :02:01. | |
he's told us Theresa an issue with people | :02:02. | :02:03. | |
with disabilities. They seem to have an issue of the | :02:04. | :02:10. | |
disabilities, last year they tried to remove the personal independence | :02:11. | :02:17. | |
payments by ?4 billion. I think they have to think about the kind of | :02:18. | :02:20. | |
society we are, the way we support people. In the next few minutes we | :02:21. | :02:27. | |
will bring you an interview with former Work and Pensions Secretary | :02:28. | :02:29. | |
for the Conservatives, Stephen Crabb, he flatly rejects the idea | :02:30. | :02:35. | |
that the Conservative Government has an issue with people with | :02:36. | :02:36. | |
disabilities. And the army widow who says she has | :02:37. | :02:37. | |
suffered five miscarriages after her husband unknowingly | :02:38. | :02:40. | |
attacked her in his sleep. She says post-traumatic | :02:41. | :02:42. | |
stress was involved. She tells us why she is suing the | :02:43. | :02:47. | |
Ministry of Defence. Joanna is in the BBC Newsroom | :02:48. | :02:51. | |
with a summary of today's news. Jeremy Corbyn has told this | :02:52. | :02:54. | |
programme that he believes Theresa May's Government has | :02:55. | :02:56. | |
an issue with people Labour has previously criticised | :02:57. | :02:58. | |
the Government over moves to reduce the number of people able to claim | :02:59. | :03:02. | |
disability benefits - particularly personal | :03:03. | :03:04. | |
independent payments. The Government has insisted | :03:05. | :03:08. | |
that the welfare system is a strong safety net for those who are in need | :03:09. | :03:11. | |
of it. They seem to have an issue over | :03:12. | :03:15. | |
disabilities because last year they did try to remove | :03:16. | :03:18. | |
the Personal Independence They then reversed that cut | :03:19. | :03:20. | |
after Iain Duncan Smith resigned a few days later and then agreed | :03:21. | :03:27. | |
to carry on paying it. So there is a deficit built | :03:28. | :03:32. | |
into the Budget already They then see this as a further | :03:33. | :03:34. | |
opportunity to prevent Well, I think they just need | :03:35. | :03:38. | |
to think about the kind of society we are and the way | :03:39. | :03:43. | |
we support people. The NSPCC has strongly condemned | :03:44. | :03:48. | |
Facebook after it failed to remove some content featuring inappropriate | :03:49. | :03:51. | |
and sexualised images of children. A BBC investigation found | :03:52. | :03:56. | |
a hundred such images, but after reporting them, | :03:57. | :03:58. | |
only 18 were removed. Facebook said it had taken down | :03:59. | :04:03. | |
all items that were illegal A British woman has been rescued | :04:04. | :04:05. | |
by police officers in Australia after allegedly being held | :04:06. | :04:11. | |
against her will for A 22-year-old man from Queensland | :04:12. | :04:13. | |
has been charged with several counts of rape and assault | :04:14. | :04:17. | |
after she was found with injuries A couple who are fighting | :04:18. | :04:20. | |
a court battle to prevent Great Ormond Street from turning | :04:21. | :04:30. | |
off their baby's life support have told this programme they just | :04:31. | :04:33. | |
want to improve their son's Chris Gard and Connie Yates | :04:34. | :04:35. | |
want to take their son Charlie Doctors at Great Ormond Street have | :04:36. | :04:39. | |
applied to withdraw life support on the grounds it is not | :04:40. | :04:42. | |
in his best interest. He has fought to stay here. You | :04:43. | :04:58. | |
know, as I say, if we feel he was in pain and suffering, which we don't, | :04:59. | :05:02. | |
seriously, we would not be doing this. We are not bad parents. We | :05:03. | :05:08. | |
just want him to be given a chance. If he is not in pain or suffering, | :05:09. | :05:12. | |
as we feel he is, we will fight to the very end to get him the | :05:13. | :05:13. | |
treatment. That's a summary of the latest BBC | :05:14. | :05:14. | |
News - more at 10:30am. I want to read you this e-mail from | :05:15. | :05:24. | |
Louise. I have been watching Charlie's parents with tears in my | :05:25. | :05:27. | |
eyes. I want to tell you what happened to my family. The doctors | :05:28. | :05:32. | |
wanted to turn off my dad's life support after he suffered a brain | :05:33. | :05:35. | |
haemorrhage and heart attack in 1990. They told us he would be a | :05:36. | :05:40. | |
vegetable. We defied the doctors and we kept my father alive. It took a | :05:41. | :05:46. | |
long time for my father to recover, to live independently, but I am | :05:47. | :05:49. | |
happy to say that we did the right thing. | :05:50. | :05:52. | |
He was not a vegetable, my father went on to live another 20 years | :05:53. | :05:55. | |
with the family that lived in very much and we are so pleased that we | :05:56. | :05:59. | |
did not give up on him. The doctors are not always right, never give up | :06:00. | :06:02. | |
hope. Obviously you are seeing pictures of | :06:03. | :06:07. | |
Charlie being treated in Great Ormond Street Hospital, he is seven | :06:08. | :06:09. | |
months of age. A text from one viewer, I feel so | :06:10. | :06:14. | |
sad for Charlie and his parents, I say to them, go for it. I have | :06:15. | :06:25. | |
personal experience with some doctors playing God, particularly | :06:26. | :06:27. | |
babies being born with syndromes. Some parents will be told that their | :06:28. | :06:30. | |
babies will be a cabbage only to find later they live a full life. | :06:31. | :06:33. | |
Good luck, I hope it works. David says, come on, if there is a | :06:34. | :06:36. | |
chance for this child to live and thrive they have to try. All life is | :06:37. | :06:41. | |
precious and for doctors to say, let the baby die, it seems ludicrous. | :06:42. | :06:44. | |
Do get in touch with us throughout the morning - | :06:45. | :06:46. | |
If you text, you will be charged at the standard network rate. | :06:47. | :06:50. | |
Arsenal will need to make Champions League history tonight | :06:51. | :06:54. | |
and become the first club to overhaul a four-goal first-leg | :06:55. | :06:57. | |
deficit when they line up against Bayern Munich | :06:58. | :06:59. | |
We may be seeing a different side to Arsene Wenger - | :07:00. | :07:04. | |
he's asked for a lucid rage from his players. | :07:05. | :07:09. | |
The players are ready to fight, but it is always a mixture of a little | :07:10. | :07:18. | |
bit success all a little bit belief, you know? I think we live in the | :07:19. | :07:25. | |
world of small margins and it should drop off a little bit. On the belief | :07:26. | :07:31. | |
site. And on the confidence fronted looks always like you do not want to | :07:32. | :07:36. | |
fight. These players, I wanted to present believe that these players | :07:37. | :07:37. | |
wants to do well and want to win. Chelsea continue their march | :07:38. | :07:40. | |
towards the Premier League title. They're now ten points clear | :07:41. | :07:43. | |
after a 2-1 win at West Ham. They haven't been beaten since | :07:44. | :07:46. | |
losing to Spurs on January 4th. After the break, Diego Costa added | :07:47. | :07:50. | |
a second with his thigh. Manuel Lanzini grabbed | :07:51. | :07:56. | |
a consolation goal in injury time Chelsea are now | :07:57. | :07:58. | |
unbeaten in ten games. We must think that we're able to | :07:59. | :08:18. | |
take 26 points to win this title. But it goes step-by-step. It is | :08:19. | :08:25. | |
important to see it again by game, to dream is good but it is important | :08:26. | :08:28. | |
to keep our feet on the ground. India's cricketers have pulled off | :08:29. | :08:30. | |
a dramatic win over Australia in Bangaluru to level the four match | :08:31. | :08:33. | |
test series at one-all. Australia needed just 188 to win | :08:34. | :08:35. | |
but were skittled out for just 112. They were already in deep | :08:36. | :08:41. | |
trouble when captain Smith was unsure whether to review | :08:42. | :08:43. | |
the decision and seemed to try to communicate | :08:44. | :08:51. | |
with his dressing room - India skipper Virat Kohli was angry | :08:52. | :08:53. | |
at Smith's antics and the umpires Ravi Ashwin took six wickets | :08:54. | :08:58. | |
as India sealed a 75 run victory. The third Test is | :08:59. | :09:05. | |
a week on Thursday. Ronnie O'Sullivan is | :09:06. | :09:10. | |
through to the second round of the Players Championship | :09:11. | :09:12. | |
in Wales after a 5 frames to 1 The Rocket, who's a five | :09:13. | :09:15. | |
time world champion, was rarely troubled as he eased | :09:16. | :09:18. | |
through to a second round clash against either Judd Trump | :09:19. | :09:21. | |
or Mark King in a tournament which sees the world's top | :09:22. | :09:24. | |
16 players take part. That's all the sport for now. | :09:25. | :09:32. | |
Thank you. Welcome to the programme. An army widow who says | :09:33. | :09:38. | |
she had five miscarriages after her husband unknowingly | :09:39. | :09:40. | |
attacked her in his sleep is suing Lindsey Roberts says she lost | :09:41. | :09:43. | |
the babies when her husband, Andrew, mistakenly hit her | :09:44. | :09:48. | |
during his nightmares. She claims the military | :09:49. | :09:50. | |
knew her late husband had a post-traumatic stress disorder yet | :09:51. | :09:53. | |
sent him on nine tours of duty in ten years, | :09:54. | :09:55. | |
including two in Iraq He died following a Taliban | :09:56. | :09:57. | |
mortar attack in 2012. Lindsey Roberts is now | :09:58. | :10:04. | |
pursuing two legal claims against the Ministry of Defence, | :10:05. | :10:07. | |
one for failing its duty of care towards her husband by allowing him | :10:08. | :10:11. | |
to return to Afghanistan in 2012 and the other a personal injury | :10:12. | :10:15. | |
claim for the injuries she suffered It's the first time an Army widow | :10:16. | :10:17. | |
has sued the government Good morning. Thank you for coming | :10:18. | :10:36. | |
on the programme. Tell us about Andrew when you first met him? He | :10:37. | :10:41. | |
was a good guy. I was working in the NAAFI on the army base, one of the | :10:42. | :10:47. | |
barmaids, I was 18, he was 19. We got married two years later and | :10:48. | :10:51. | |
shortly after Andrew went on his first tour of Iraq. As you would | :10:52. | :11:00. | |
expect, he experience and pretty horrendous things. When he came | :11:01. | :11:05. | |
home, did he seem different? Yes, but every soldier keen is different | :11:06. | :11:09. | |
when they are home. Nobody goes to these two zones, the things they see | :11:10. | :11:14. | |
are horrendous. Nobody comes back the same. Nobody comes back the same | :11:15. | :11:19. | |
at all, you expect them to be a bit disjointed and a bit emotional. For | :11:20. | :11:28. | |
us, the real problem is caked in about five weeks after he got back, | :11:29. | :11:33. | |
I fell pregnant, our first pregnancy, five weeks into my | :11:34. | :11:37. | |
pregnancy Andrew had his first serious night terror where he | :11:38. | :11:41. | |
thrashed out in the night. Could you explain what a night to raise? It is | :11:42. | :11:47. | |
a nightmare. Andrew, when he had his, he would be in a sleepwalking | :11:48. | :11:52. | |
state in bed. -- can you explain what a night terror is? He would be | :11:53. | :11:57. | |
moving around or doing things but was not awake, he had no knowledge | :11:58. | :12:01. | |
whatsoever of what he was doing, did not know where he was, did not know | :12:02. | :12:04. | |
he was at home all who was around him. If you see somebody | :12:05. | :12:09. | |
sleepwalking, you cannot control what is going on in their head. It | :12:10. | :12:14. | |
is the same thing, he had no clue. What did he do to you that led to a | :12:15. | :12:19. | |
miscarriage? He was thrashing round the bed trying to fight, he was not | :12:20. | :12:26. | |
aware where he was. On Andrew's first tour, his job was that a | :12:27. | :12:29. | |
prisoner of war camp, I don't know what he saw that caused those | :12:30. | :12:34. | |
nightmares but I know that when he woke up, there were occasions when | :12:35. | :12:38. | |
he said he dreamt he was captured. I don't know what he was fighting | :12:39. | :12:43. | |
against, who he thought he was fighting, he certainly did not know | :12:44. | :12:46. | |
it was me in the bed next to him. But as a result, you say, you lost | :12:47. | :12:55. | |
the baby? We lost five pregnancies in total. One in three women in the | :12:56. | :13:00. | |
UK miscarry, it is hard to prove they are connected to the night | :13:01. | :13:03. | |
terrors. We cannot win any compensation from taking that part | :13:04. | :13:07. | |
to court, that is purely to make people stand up and realise that it | :13:08. | :13:14. | |
is not just... The series of the PTSD and the lads that are | :13:15. | :13:18. | |
suffering, but this affects families, too. Over Christmas, I | :13:19. | :13:22. | |
work at something called The Roberts Project, we were inundated with | :13:23. | :13:28. | |
messages from wives and girlfriends of soldiers suffering PTSD, they are | :13:29. | :13:31. | |
crying out for help because their husbands and boyfriends are having | :13:32. | :13:35. | |
night terrors. I had somebody that ended up in hospital because she was | :13:36. | :13:40. | |
smashed in the face with something. She is awaiting surgery. We had | :13:41. | :13:48. | |
another girl that has just ended up in an absolute state, her husbands | :13:49. | :13:51. | |
can't remember doing a single thing about it. It is unwinnable, the | :13:52. | :13:59. | |
compensation claim. You want to raise awareness. It is purely about | :14:00. | :14:04. | |
awareness. Of former soldiers with PTSD that are not getting the | :14:05. | :14:08. | |
specialist help they need? One of the problems I hear about on a | :14:09. | :14:12. | |
regular basis through our projects is that these soldiers... Soldiers | :14:13. | :14:16. | |
have a lot of banter that goes on in camp, they are conditioned to | :14:17. | :14:20. | |
certain way, they tend to swear a lot, it is all in jest. But when | :14:21. | :14:25. | |
they go into the NHS services, obviously any chess has a zero | :14:26. | :14:31. | |
policy, zero-tolerance on swearing and abuse -- obviously the NHS has. | :14:32. | :14:37. | |
Soldiers swear. They swear. There is no skirting around it. They don't do | :14:38. | :14:43. | |
it in an abusive way, they swear in general conversation. When they | :14:44. | :14:46. | |
swear and they are around somebody that works in the NHS in a mental | :14:47. | :14:50. | |
health capacity, they are told to stop swearing and they will be | :14:51. | :14:55. | |
refused treatment. Tell a soldier suffering from PTSD that he is about | :14:56. | :14:59. | |
to be refused treatment because he swore, he will react. You say you | :15:00. | :15:05. | |
had five miscarriages because of Andrew, in the middle of the night, | :15:06. | :15:09. | |
effectively sleepwalking but kind of attacking you. Why didn't you move | :15:10. | :15:14. | |
out of the bed? Quite frankly, your kids don't have nightmares every | :15:15. | :15:18. | |
night, neither did Andrew. You could not get out of the room? Once we had | :15:19. | :15:27. | |
our children, the first time it happened it was a massive shock. It | :15:28. | :15:32. | |
is like your kids. Your kids will have nightmares once in awhile, they | :15:33. | :15:36. | |
won't have them every single night of the week. Do you know what I | :15:37. | :15:39. | |
mean? You would not lock your child in a room because they might go | :15:40. | :15:43. | |
somewhere, that is not how life works. We a happily married couple | :15:44. | :15:48. | |
at the time and obviously Andrew could not have guessed when the | :15:49. | :15:51. | |
nightmares would happen, I could not have guessed, one thing we have | :15:52. | :15:58. | |
linked now looking into the case, when Andrew was suffering the worst | :15:59. | :16:04. | |
of these nightmares he was on a medication called Larry, an | :16:05. | :16:08. | |
antimalarial drug. We have reported on that and some people who have | :16:09. | :16:11. | |
taken it have been subjected to those nights terrors. | :16:12. | :16:18. | |
We can't know for certain. Andrew isn't here anymore and it is | :16:19. | :16:26. | |
important for people to realise he was an amazing soldier and he was an | :16:27. | :16:31. | |
amazing dad. He would have done anything for anybody. I know for a | :16:32. | :16:35. | |
fact if he could save lives with his story being told now to help these | :16:36. | :16:39. | |
soldiers that are suffering PTSD, that are not getting the help that | :16:40. | :16:46. | |
they need and potentially, are the on the route to committing suicide, | :16:47. | :16:51. | |
the Army only, the MoD only keep stats on suicides that have happened | :16:52. | :16:55. | |
within service. They don't keep stats on suicides that happen after | :16:56. | :16:58. | |
service because they say it is too hard to keep track of these | :16:59. | :17:03. | |
ex-servicemen. Andrew tried to take his own life in 2011? He did, yes. | :17:04. | :17:11. | |
He was killed in a mortar attack in Afghanistan in 2012. Do you have any | :17:12. | :17:16. | |
idea if the MoD were aware of his mental health? In 2009, and we | :17:17. | :17:19. | |
staoully, this is the evidence that has gun to the papers and this is | :17:20. | :17:23. | |
why they printed it and took it seriously. In 2009, it is in his | :17:24. | :17:27. | |
doctor's records and in my doctor's records that a meeting with the MoD, | :17:28. | :17:34. | |
Army welfare, the doctors and the police took place and it actually | :17:35. | :17:38. | |
states on the records the exact words are to discuss with the Army | :17:39. | :17:44. | |
welfare the problems that the husband was having after his return | :17:45. | :17:48. | |
from Afghanistan. Yeah, they knew he was having problems. If he got care. | :17:49. | :17:55. | |
If he got the right care, things might be different? Rchlt He | :17:56. | :18:01. | |
shouldn't have been on that tour. My children might still have their dad. | :18:02. | :18:06. | |
If he hadn't been on that tour, he wouldn't have been gone. | :18:07. | :18:09. | |
Unfortunately you can't go back and change things and we can't change | :18:10. | :18:13. | |
what happened to Andrew. What we're hoping is we can take a stand and | :18:14. | :18:18. | |
stop this happening to anybody else. We have a statement from the | :18:19. | :18:19. | |
Ministry of Defence. "Whilst we wouldn't comment | :18:20. | :18:23. | |
on a specific legal case, the mental health of everyone | :18:24. | :18:25. | |
who serves our country is of the utmost importance | :18:26. | :18:28. | |
and that's why we encourage anyone needing help to come forward and get | :18:29. | :18:30. | |
the assistance they deserve before, Thank you very much for coming on | :18:31. | :18:33. | |
the programme. Thank you. And Lindsay Roberts will be taking | :18:34. | :18:41. | |
part in a Facebook live on the BBC news account shortly - | :18:42. | :18:44. | |
do send her any questions you have. Still to come, we'll have more | :18:45. | :18:47. | |
reaction to comments made by Jeremy Corbyn over planned cuts | :18:48. | :18:49. | |
to a key disability benefit. He told us Theresa May's government | :18:50. | :18:54. | |
has an "issue over disabilities". The Prime Minister is facing another | :18:55. | :19:09. | |
defeat in the House of Commons over Brexit. Peers have voted that | :19:10. | :19:13. | |
European nationals living in Britain can stay once the UK has left. They | :19:14. | :19:16. | |
are expected to call on Theresa May to give a legal commitment that MPs | :19:17. | :19:22. | |
and peers are given a vote before departure in two years time. So what | :19:23. | :19:26. | |
will it mean? Norman Smith is back with us. Hi again, Norman. Hi Vic. | :19:27. | :19:32. | |
No wonder we learned this morning that William Hague was suggesting | :19:33. | :19:38. | |
Mrs May may want to call an early election to bolster her majority | :19:39. | :19:41. | |
because she has been getting a tough time in the House of Lords over | :19:42. | :19:45. | |
Brexit where peers have been coming up with all sorts of changes they | :19:46. | :19:49. | |
want to see in her approach to Brexit. So let's just remind | :19:50. | :19:53. | |
ourselves where we've got to. Mrs May turned up in the Lords the other | :19:54. | :19:58. | |
week to eyeball peers to put pressure on them, not to try and | :19:59. | :20:01. | |
change her Brexit Bill, what did they do? Well, they delivered that | :20:02. | :20:06. | |
clunking great defeat on EU nationals. In effect, telling Mrs | :20:07. | :20:10. | |
May she should guarantee their right to remain in the UK straightaway | :20:11. | :20:14. | |
regardless of what other EU countries do. But tonight, we are | :20:15. | :20:20. | |
expecting more trouble over a so-called meaningful vote. Now, what | :20:21. | :20:25. | |
that would do would give Parliament the final say on any Brexit deal. | :20:26. | :20:31. | |
They would have the power to veto whatever Mrs May finally sorted out. | :20:32. | :20:35. | |
There is pressure for a second vote. A second referendum. This is | :20:36. | :20:38. | |
something the Liberal Democrats are pushing and it seems they have | :20:39. | :20:41. | |
actually been encouraging their peers to buy camp beds so they can | :20:42. | :20:47. | |
stay here late at night to make sure they're here to vote for that second | :20:48. | :20:53. | |
referendum! Lastly, updates. Peers want Mrs May to have to give | :20:54. | :20:58. | |
Parliament regular, three month updates on how the negotiations are | :20:59. | :21:03. | |
going. So, how does the Prime Minister respond? Well, in the | :21:04. | :21:10. | |
Commons Mrs May will seek to overturn all those defeats. She try | :21:11. | :21:16. | |
to use her majority to reverse any defeats inflicted here. Why? Well, | :21:17. | :21:22. | |
because she says don't delay. All these amendments risk slowing down | :21:23. | :21:25. | |
our departure from the EU and she wants to be able to trigger Article | :21:26. | :21:31. | |
50 by the end of March. She will also argue it is the unelected House | :21:32. | :21:37. | |
that is doing all this. When MPs, the elected House, have already | :21:38. | :21:40. | |
voted in favour of Article 50. Why should peers be allowed to hold | :21:41. | :21:45. | |
things up? And lastly she will warn that all these changes risk tying | :21:46. | :21:50. | |
her hands, limiting her ability to negotiate. But Mrs May faces a | :21:51. | :21:55. | |
difficult time because some of her MPs may think, you know what, those | :21:56. | :22:00. | |
peers have got a good point. The real risk for her is that she might | :22:01. | :22:07. | |
even lose in the House of Commons. I think that's perhaps unlikely, but | :22:08. | :22:10. | |
it is a sign of the pressure she is under and why perhaps leading | :22:11. | :22:14. | |
figures like William Hague are saying, you know, what Theresa, you | :22:15. | :22:17. | |
ought to think about a snap election. Cheers, Norman, thank you | :22:18. | :22:25. | |
very much. We have heard quotes from Jeremy | :22:26. | :22:31. | |
Corbyn that he thinks Mrs May's Government has an issue over people | :22:32. | :22:42. | |
with disabilities. They seem to have an issue over | :22:43. | :22:46. | |
disabilities because last year they did try to remove the personal | :22:47. | :22:50. | |
independence payments by ?4 billion. They then reversed that cut after | :22:51. | :22:55. | |
Iain Duncan Smith resigned a few days later and then agreed to carry | :22:56. | :23:00. | |
on paying it. So there is a deficit built into the budget already | :23:01. | :23:05. | |
because of that. They see this as a further opportunity to prevent the | :23:06. | :23:08. | |
bill rising further. Well, I think they just need to think about the | :23:09. | :23:12. | |
kind of society we are, the way we support people. | :23:13. | :23:16. | |
We asked Number Ten and the Department for Work and Pensions to | :23:17. | :23:19. | |
respond to Mr Corbyn's claims and no one was avail yable. We asked | :23:20. | :23:26. | |
Stephen Crabb why the Government hadn't followed the tribunal's | :23:27. | :23:29. | |
rulings in giving higher personal independence payments. Well, what | :23:30. | :23:36. | |
the tribunals have done is broaden the eligibility criteria for | :23:37. | :23:39. | |
personal independence payments. They have gone way beyond what the | :23:40. | :23:42. | |
intention of Government was when they designed the policy. So in the | :23:43. | :23:45. | |
first place, we don't think it's right that the courts make policy, | :23:46. | :23:50. | |
but more importantly, what the courts themselves said is look the | :23:51. | :23:55. | |
regulations aren't clear. We think that the judgements themselves risk | :23:56. | :23:58. | |
creating more confusion and look, when you've got a system that gives | :23:59. | :24:03. | |
out as much cash payment as personal independence payments you do need | :24:04. | :24:07. | |
clear criteria and so in this case the Government is right in saying | :24:08. | :24:12. | |
that they are going to bring forward regulations that restore what the | :24:13. | :24:15. | |
original policy was. Now, there are problems with the way the personal | :24:16. | :24:19. | |
independent payment system works, but in this case, Government | :24:20. | :24:23. | |
ministers have got it right. But they're independent judges. | :24:24. | :24:26. | |
Independent of Government looking at the issues legally. And that's the | :24:27. | :24:29. | |
decision they have reached. Why won't you follow what they say? | :24:30. | :24:33. | |
Well, their job is to interpret what is in the legislation and the | :24:34. | :24:38. | |
criteria and they themselves said it is not clear. Up until the point of | :24:39. | :24:45. | |
the judgement, the criteria sought to draw a distinction in two | :24:46. | :24:50. | |
important areas between the way the symptoms affect people with | :24:51. | :24:53. | |
different kinds of disabilities in the area of being able to move | :24:54. | :24:58. | |
around, and people then taking therapy and medication at home. Now, | :24:59. | :25:03. | |
we think those distinctions are important. The tribunal made a | :25:04. | :25:07. | |
judgement that risks lumping together different kinds of cases in | :25:08. | :25:11. | |
a way that we don't think is clear. We think it will lead to operational | :25:12. | :25:14. | |
confusion and I think it is right for ministers to bring the policy | :25:15. | :25:18. | |
back to what it was originally intended. How much is it do to with | :25:19. | :25:23. | |
not spending another ?3.7 billion? Well, the critics and Labour Party | :25:24. | :25:26. | |
have said this is about cutting benefit. Nobody, absolutely nobody, | :25:27. | :25:31. | |
will see a cut this their Personal Independence Payment as a result of | :25:32. | :25:33. | |
the new regulations that the Government will bring forward. No, | :25:34. | :25:38. | |
but you don't want to spend the ?3.7 billion? Well, costs are important | :25:39. | :25:45. | |
in consideration of any policy, but I think more importantly, it is | :25:46. | :25:47. | |
about operational clarity and actually have you got a clear set of | :25:48. | :25:52. | |
criteria by which a Government department can distribute billions | :25:53. | :25:56. | |
of pounds of cash every year to vulnerable people up and down the | :25:57. | :26:01. | |
country. It is clear, people with anxiety, who suffer psychological | :26:02. | :26:05. | |
distress when travelling alone, deserve the enhanced payment. That's | :26:06. | :26:08. | |
really clear. With the regulations that they're bringing in people who | :26:09. | :26:16. | |
suffer overwhelming psychological distress will still qualify. People | :26:17. | :26:21. | |
who had a stroke won't. People with schizophrenia? The mistake that a | :26:22. | :26:27. | |
lot of people make when they look at that this is thinking it is about | :26:28. | :26:32. | |
what condition you have? It is not. Personal independent payments are | :26:33. | :26:36. | |
about the impact, the simp tolls of your condition, how they affect your | :26:37. | :26:40. | |
daily life to move around and the additional costs that arise from | :26:41. | :26:43. | |
that. It doesn't matter whether it is a mental disability, a | :26:44. | :26:46. | |
psychological illness or a physical disability, we have tried to design | :26:47. | :26:50. | |
a system that takes account of how those different kinds of diverse | :26:51. | :26:56. | |
disabilities affects your ability to live your every day life. What is it | :26:57. | :27:00. | |
about the Conservative Government and some people with disabilities? | :27:01. | :27:05. | |
Well, I'm proud that we have a welfare support system in this | :27:06. | :27:09. | |
country that spends as much money as it does supporting people living | :27:10. | :27:15. | |
with as diverse a range of physical and mental disabilities than we | :27:16. | :27:19. | |
support. Name another country on earth that spends as much cash | :27:20. | :27:22. | |
payment week in and week out as Britain does supporting people with | :27:23. | :27:26. | |
all kinds of illnesses and disabilities. That's not to say... | :27:27. | :27:29. | |
Every year? The system is not perfect. Lever year there is another | :27:30. | :27:35. | |
attempt by the Conservative Government to squeeze the benefits | :27:36. | :27:38. | |
that help people with disyakets live a full life? That's not true. Nobody | :27:39. | :27:43. | |
is trying to squeeze benefits in the regulations that we're talking about | :27:44. | :27:46. | |
this morning. It is about restoring the policy to that which Parliament | :27:47. | :27:50. | |
originally intended and money, the money being spent on personal | :27:51. | :27:54. | |
independence payments will continue to increase and there is no question | :27:55. | :27:58. | |
of trying to reduce it. It is a question of whether we have clear | :27:59. | :28:03. | |
criteria that the system can operate to, that provides clarity for all | :28:04. | :28:06. | |
users of the system, not least the people applying and seeking the cash | :28:07. | :28:10. | |
support that they need. So the Government doesn't have a problem | :28:11. | :28:15. | |
with some people with disyakets? The Government works extremely closely | :28:16. | :28:20. | |
with people with disabilities and their representative organisations | :28:21. | :28:22. | |
and when the personal independence payments system was designed, it was | :28:23. | :28:26. | |
designed in close consultation with disability charities, mental health | :28:27. | :28:31. | |
organisations, medical specialists, so it has tried to create a benefit | :28:32. | :28:36. | |
that captures as wide a possible range of symptoms and conditions as | :28:37. | :28:42. | |
possible. Ricardo says, "It scares me how | :28:43. | :28:45. | |
cavalier Jeremy Corbyn is with our money. Money that doesn't exist. | :28:46. | :28:52. | |
Luckily he is unelectable." Sue says, "Jeremy Corbyn lives in | :28:53. | :28:57. | |
cloud-cuckoo-land. I think he could win a general election. He's | :28:58. | :29:02. | |
delusional." Another viewer says, "It is shocking that people are | :29:03. | :29:06. | |
treated like criminals when thul' need is money to live." A viewer | :29:07. | :29:10. | |
says, "Jeremy Corbyn won me over this morning. It is about the sort | :29:11. | :29:14. | |
of society we want to be a part of and I'm in full agreement with him." | :29:15. | :29:20. | |
Laura says, "People who claim PIP and other benefits are taxpayers | :29:21. | :29:24. | |
too. We all contribute. Stop being divisive." Another viewer says, | :29:25. | :29:28. | |
"They cut my friend's payments by ?300. She has a disability scooter, | :29:29. | :29:33. | |
can't get around. Has several illnesses and is 69 years of age and | :29:34. | :29:38. | |
the can't work. It is disgraceful. She challenged the decision, but it | :29:39. | :29:43. | |
was upheld. It has had a devastating effect on her life." | :29:44. | :29:50. | |
There has been an avalanche in a French ski resort in the south-west | :29:51. | :29:57. | |
of the country, the regional police say that many skiers are stuck. | :29:58. | :30:01. | |
According to witnesses there are many people and to the avalanche in | :30:02. | :30:08. | |
Tignes in south-eastern France, where an avalanche has swamped a ski | :30:09. | :30:13. | |
slope. -- there are many people under the avalanche. | :30:14. | :30:19. | |
Could the vendors from black and minority ethnic backgrounds be given | :30:20. | :30:23. | |
lighter punishments? -- could offenders from? And how | :30:24. | :30:28. | |
Facebooked called the police on the BBC after we revealed potential | :30:29. | :30:33. | |
flaws in their moderation system. That is an astonishing story coming | :30:34. | :30:34. | |
up in the next five minutes. Joanna is in the BBC Newsroom | :30:35. | :30:37. | |
with a summary of the news. Jeremy Corbyn has told this | :30:38. | :30:40. | |
programme that he believes Theresa May's government has | :30:41. | :30:42. | |
an issue with people Labour has previously criticised | :30:43. | :30:44. | |
the government over moves to reduce the number of people able to claim | :30:45. | :30:47. | |
disability benefits - particularly personal | :30:48. | :30:49. | |
independent payments. The government has insisted | :30:50. | :30:54. | |
that the welfare system is a strong They seem to have an issue over | :30:55. | :30:57. | |
disabilities, last year they tried to remove the personal independence | :30:58. | :31:03. | |
payments by ?4 billion, they then reversed that cut | :31:04. | :31:05. | |
after Iain Duncan Smith resigned a few days later, | :31:06. | :31:09. | |
and There is a deficit built into | :31:10. | :31:12. | |
the Budget already because of that. They see this as a | :31:13. | :31:21. | |
further opportunity to I think they just | :31:22. | :31:23. | |
need to think about the kind of society we are, | :31:24. | :31:27. | |
the way we support people. A rescue operation is under way | :31:28. | :31:42. | |
after an avalanche struck a ski resort in the French Alps. Several | :31:43. | :31:45. | |
people are said to be buried under the snow after it had to resort at | :31:46. | :31:49. | |
Tignes. Emergency services are said to be on the scene. | :31:50. | :31:51. | |
Facebook's procedures for vetting content on its pages have been | :31:52. | :31:54. | |
strongly criticised after a BBC investigation found it was failing | :31:55. | :31:56. | |
to remove inappropriate and sexualised images of children. | :31:57. | :31:58. | |
The chair of the commons media committee Damian Collins has said | :31:59. | :32:00. | |
it casts grave doubts on the effectiveness | :32:01. | :32:02. | |
Facebook said it had removed all items that were illegal | :32:03. | :32:06. | |
That's a summary of the latest BBC News. | :32:07. | :32:14. | |
We will, thank you. Many of you getting in touch about the interview | :32:15. | :32:25. | |
with parents Chris Gard and Connie Yates about their little boy | :32:26. | :32:28. | |
Charlie, they are in accord bottle with doctors that's -- in a court | :32:29. | :32:35. | |
battle with doctors at Great Ormond Street who believe Charlie's | :32:36. | :32:37. | |
life-support should be turned off because he is in pain and | :32:38. | :32:41. | |
deteriorating. His parents believe there is the chance for treatment in | :32:42. | :32:46. | |
America, a doctor has agreed to treat him. A judge will make the | :32:47. | :32:50. | |
final decision in this court battle. Jim says these parents are against a | :32:51. | :32:53. | |
system that has already made a decision and there is no longer | :32:54. | :32:57. | |
looking, therefore Charlie needs an advocate prepared to give them every | :32:58. | :33:01. | |
chance. The NHS or anyone else does not have the right to take away the | :33:02. | :33:06. | |
parents' last hope of treating Basson. | :33:07. | :33:08. | |
Audrey says this is heartbreaking, if there is a chance of help from | :33:09. | :33:15. | |
the USA for Charlie it comes down to money, someone must be able to | :33:16. | :33:16. | |
assist. I really, really wish them well. Ron | :33:17. | :33:21. | |
says a very sad case but how long should the NHS, in effect the | :33:22. | :33:26. | |
taxpayer, pay for a baby being kept in hospital? As soon as they go to | :33:27. | :33:30. | |
the USA, they will have to pay for everything. Run, that is why they | :33:31. | :33:33. | |
are crowdfunding. Well, Chelsea are looking pretty | :33:34. | :33:34. | |
unstoppable in the race They survived the test | :33:35. | :33:37. | |
of a London derby last night. Eden Hazard and Diego Costa | :33:38. | :33:40. | |
goals helping them to The are now 10 points clear | :33:41. | :33:42. | |
with 11 games left. Arsenal will need to make | :33:43. | :33:46. | |
Champions League history tonight if they are to overhaul | :33:47. | :33:48. | |
a four-goal first-leg deficit when they line up | :33:49. | :33:50. | |
against Bayern Munich The winners will reach | :33:51. | :33:52. | |
the last eight. India plasma cricketers have | :33:53. | :34:04. | |
labelled the four match Test series at one all against Australia after | :34:05. | :34:08. | |
the tourists collapsed to 112 all out. | :34:09. | :34:09. | |
And five-time world champion Ronnie O'Sullivan beat Liang Wenbo | :34:10. | :34:12. | |
five frames to one to reach the second round at the Players | :34:13. | :34:14. | |
That's all the sport for this morning, I will be back with more | :34:15. | :34:21. | |
after 11am in newsroom live. A British backpacker was allegedly | :34:22. | :34:38. | |
beaten, raped and attacked after a two month-long ordeal in Australia. | :34:39. | :34:41. | |
Queensland police say that she is traumatised. | :34:42. | :34:44. | |
Police say the female person did have injuries consisting | :34:45. | :34:46. | |
of facial fractures, scratches, and abrasions to her neck | :34:47. | :34:48. | |
area, and other bruising consistent with the offences | :34:49. | :34:50. | |
From that, we have subsequently charged that male person | :34:51. | :34:54. | |
They are very serious offences and would have been quite traumatic | :34:55. | :35:01. | |
Hywel Griffith is in Sydney. What is the latest on how this happened? The | :35:02. | :35:20. | |
police are still trying to piece together exactly what this woman | :35:21. | :35:24. | |
went through. We know she met the man right at the start of the deer | :35:25. | :35:28. | |
up in Cairns in northern Queensland and very soon the violence followed. | :35:29. | :35:35. | |
We understand she was subjected to rapes and assaults. The timeline | :35:36. | :35:38. | |
follows that at some point in the next few weeks they went on a road | :35:39. | :35:43. | |
trip, travelling in a way to by four vehicle that was eventually flagged | :35:44. | :35:52. | |
down on Sunday the 5th of March -- in a white 4x4 vehicle. Staff in the | :35:53. | :35:59. | |
petrol station say she was disoriented and visibly bruised, | :36:00. | :36:01. | |
because she left without paying the police than flagged down the | :36:02. | :36:05. | |
vehicle, but when they spoke to her they could tell there was something | :36:06. | :36:08. | |
deeply wrong, that is when she started to tell them that she had | :36:09. | :36:12. | |
been the victim of abuse, held against her will, police say when | :36:13. | :36:19. | |
they looked in the boot of the 4x4 they found the 22-year-old man they | :36:20. | :36:23. | |
have now arrested and charged coming he was hiding. The woman is | :36:24. | :36:29. | |
receiving hospital treatment, severe physical injuries, traumatic | :36:30. | :36:32. | |
emotional injuries. They say she has been very brave so far in giving | :36:33. | :36:36. | |
evidence and has also been able to speak to her family back home. It is | :36:37. | :36:41. | |
understood she will have to stay here maybe for some time yet in | :36:42. | :36:45. | |
order to give more evidence, it is unclear when she made be able to | :36:46. | :36:49. | |
return back to the UK. Thank you, Hywel Griffith. | :36:50. | :36:52. | |
A BBC investigation has found that Facebook's content moderation system | :36:53. | :36:54. | |
is failing to remove pornography and obscene content from its pages. | :36:55. | :36:57. | |
Our reporter Angus Crawford reported 100 images that appeared to breach | :36:58. | :37:00. | |
the company's own rules on nudity and obscenity using it's | :37:01. | :37:02. | |
He's with us now and I should say we will get into some | :37:03. | :37:09. | |
Tell us what you found on Facebook? Before we start you are right, | :37:10. | :37:21. | |
excuses for some of the language and content you are about to hear and | :37:22. | :37:24. | |
see, if you are watching with a young family you might want to turn | :37:25. | :37:28. | |
off the television, turn it down or do something else for the moment, or | :37:29. | :37:32. | |
put them in another room. Last year we were tipped off that there were | :37:33. | :37:35. | |
secret groups on Facebook being used by members of sexual interest in | :37:36. | :37:41. | |
children to swap obscene images. Touch men with a sexual interest in | :37:42. | :37:47. | |
children. We did the report, it created headlines and concerned | :37:48. | :37:52. | |
Facebook. Facebook said it had improved regulations, particularly | :37:53. | :37:56. | |
on the sexualisation of children. We decided to test them against their | :37:57. | :38:00. | |
own standards, not ours or criminal standards, their own standards | :38:01. | :38:04. | |
against nudity and sexualised content. We reported something like | :38:05. | :38:10. | |
100 images and posts, 82 stayed up. I will tell you about some of the | :38:11. | :38:16. | |
groups that we found, the content is unpleasant. One was called Hot Sexy | :38:17. | :38:21. | |
Schoolgirls, containing images you can imagine of real children in | :38:22. | :38:27. | |
school uniform, some stolen. We found pages with pictures of very | :38:28. | :38:32. | |
young, 11 and 12-year-old girls in very, very flimsy clothing saying | :38:33. | :38:36. | |
appalling comments below them by people looking at them. We found a | :38:37. | :38:39. | |
group openly talking about exchanging what they called CP, | :38:40. | :38:47. | |
child pornography. And very unpleasantly, a group that is still | :38:48. | :38:51. | |
up for men that like to mass debate over images and show those results | :38:52. | :39:00. | |
online. That is still up. Many of the images we thought were against | :39:01. | :39:05. | |
Facebook's own standards, they said did not breach community standards. | :39:06. | :39:06. | |
Let's have a look. The BBC exposes the secret groups | :39:07. | :39:32. | |
set up by paedophiles. It was February last year | :39:33. | :39:40. | |
when we broadcast our investigation We found men with a sexual | :39:41. | :39:42. | |
interest in children Many of the pictures in these groups | :39:43. | :39:48. | |
are obscene, indecent. But what's as disturbing is that | :39:49. | :39:54. | |
many other pictures appear to have been stolen and disgusting comments | :39:55. | :39:58. | |
have been written about We told the police about one | :39:59. | :40:00. | |
particular group, a man was arrested A year on, we wanted to find out | :40:01. | :40:10. | |
if the situation had improved. Using Facebook's own system, | :40:11. | :40:21. | |
we reported 100 images or posts we felt breached | :40:22. | :40:28. | |
Facebook's own guidelines. Facebook said those that | :40:29. | :40:36. | |
remained didn't breach I've been very disturbed | :40:37. | :40:43. | |
by what I've seen, very disappointed that one year on we are still seeing | :40:44. | :41:33. | |
images that are very sexualised, totally, in my view, unacceptable, | :41:34. | :41:36. | |
to be online on the Facebook page. The moderation clearly | :41:37. | :41:43. | |
isn't being effective. I would question whether humans | :41:44. | :41:49. | |
are actually moderating this Also, I think it's | :41:50. | :41:51. | |
failing to take account Facebook has a policy that bars sex | :41:52. | :41:56. | |
offenders from having an account. But we found and reported | :41:57. | :42:05. | |
the profiles of five We even reported a group where users | :42:06. | :42:07. | |
were openly swapping what they called child | :42:08. | :42:18. | |
pornography, or CP. If you reported that, | :42:19. | :42:28. | |
if it was looked at correctly, there can only be a decision that | :42:29. | :43:06. | |
that it should be taken down. We wanted to ask Facebook about | :43:07. | :43:11. | |
their content moderation system, At their request, we sent them | :43:12. | :43:14. | |
a copy of the image and asked them That's when Facebook | :43:15. | :43:21. | |
reported us to the police. That's extraordinary | :43:22. | :43:29. | |
because you're helping them, you're trying to help them clean | :43:30. | :43:31. | |
up their network from material When you give them examples | :43:32. | :43:34. | |
that they themselves have asked for to back up your complaint, | :43:35. | :43:39. | |
for them to act by referring you to the police, referring | :43:40. | :43:42. | |
the BBC to the police, rather than acting upon | :43:43. | :43:45. | |
the information they've been given, that is extraordinary and shows | :43:46. | :43:47. | |
a complete lack of understanding of the issues that were presented | :43:48. | :43:49. | |
to the people of Facebook, whoever dealt with this complaint, | :43:50. | :43:52. | |
and it's concerning. Anyone who questions industry | :43:53. | :43:58. | |
members and indeed Facebook comes under attack and you're seen in some | :43:59. | :44:00. | |
way to be questioning modernity The fact that Facebook sent images | :44:01. | :44:03. | |
that have been sent to them and appear on their site | :44:04. | :44:12. | |
for their response about how Facebook deals with inappropriate | :44:13. | :44:15. | |
images on the Facebook site, the fact that they sent those | :44:16. | :44:21. | |
on to the police seemed to me to be extraordinary and one can only | :44:22. | :44:24. | |
assume that the Facebook executives were unwilling or certainly | :44:25. | :44:27. | |
reluctant to engage in an interview or a debate about why these images | :44:28. | :44:29. | |
are available on Facebook's site. And, right now, groups | :44:30. | :44:53. | |
with inappropriate images and comments about children can | :44:54. | :44:55. | |
still be found. There are a number of things really | :44:56. | :45:32. | |
astonishing but, oh, my gosh, they reported you to the police? As you | :45:33. | :45:37. | |
can imagine, we were a little surprised. Understatement of the | :45:38. | :45:41. | |
Iraq formation not you need to understand that this was content on | :45:42. | :45:46. | |
Facebook, first of all, that we reported to Facebook's own | :45:47. | :45:49. | |
moderation system. The moderators said it is fine, it can stay up. | :45:50. | :45:54. | |
Facebooked, for the purposes of being informed before we interviewed | :45:55. | :46:00. | |
them, we were meant to last week, they said you need to send as | :46:01. | :46:03. | |
examples of the kind of content you are talking about, so at their | :46:04. | :46:06. | |
request we sent a material that was on Facebook that had been approved | :46:07. | :46:10. | |
by them moderator is. There was total silence, and then we found out | :46:11. | :46:14. | |
they reported as to the Child Exploitation and Online Protection | :46:15. | :46:18. | |
Centre, the commander in the National Crime Agency. | :46:19. | :46:25. | |
We asked Facebook to speak to us about this. They gave us a | :46:26. | :46:33. | |
statement. He said, "We have reviewed the content referred to us | :46:34. | :46:37. | |
and have removed all items that were illegal or against our standards. | :46:38. | :46:41. | |
This content is no longer on our platform. We take this matter | :46:42. | :46:44. | |
extremely seriously. And we continue to improve our reporting and take | :46:45. | :46:48. | |
down measures. Facebook has been recognised as one of the best | :46:49. | :46:51. | |
platforms on the internet for child safety. It is against the law for | :46:52. | :46:56. | |
anyone to distribute images of child exploitation when the BBC sent us | :46:57. | :47:01. | |
such imablings we followed our industry standard practise and | :47:02. | :47:07. | |
reported them to CEOP. This matter is now in the hands of the | :47:08. | :47:09. | |
authorities." Melissa Price who twice | :47:10. | :47:16. | |
had photos she put up She is recovering from breast | :47:17. | :47:18. | |
cancer and posted photos Vicki Shotbolt is the chief | :47:19. | :47:24. | |
executive of an organisation called Parent Zone that advises parents how | :47:25. | :47:29. | |
to tackle exposure to Dr Linda Papadopoulos | :47:30. | :47:31. | |
is a child psychologist and ambassador for the charity, | :47:32. | :47:35. | |
Internet Matters. Welcome all of you. First of all | :47:36. | :47:42. | |
your reaction to what Facebook did to Angus effectively? I think it is | :47:43. | :47:48. | |
disgusting. I think what you have done was appropriate and I applaud | :47:49. | :47:52. | |
you for doing that, but for Facebook to take that stance and for you to | :47:53. | :47:57. | |
be reported for doing that is ridiculous. Can I just say, people | :47:58. | :48:02. | |
who are watching around the country say, "I am deleting my Facebook | :48:03. | :48:07. | |
account now." I have decided to deactivate my account. Laurie says, | :48:08. | :48:12. | |
"This sickens me. Mike says, "I don't think anything that I have | :48:13. | :48:18. | |
reported has been removed. Cat lover says so it goes on. Another viewer | :48:19. | :48:23. | |
says, "This is disgusting." Linda? It is a sign of the fact that we | :48:24. | :48:28. | |
don't know how to handle these. We don't have the measuresment we know | :48:29. | :48:31. | |
social media has been around a long time. One of the most interesting | :48:32. | :48:37. | |
stats, the majority of online child porn is produced by children | :48:38. | :48:40. | |
themselves through sectioning. I have been involved in cases where | :48:41. | :48:43. | |
boyfriend and girlfriend have done this, where they break up and the | :48:44. | :48:47. | |
boy is then, you know, made, is put on a register because he is a couple | :48:48. | :48:51. | |
of years older. I think we really need to look at the measures. Yours | :48:52. | :48:55. | |
shocks me just as much. I didn't realise what happened to you. It is | :48:56. | :49:00. | |
the fact that we are learning as we go. I think as mental health | :49:01. | :49:03. | |
specialists so I have been, you know, working in this area for | :49:04. | :49:08. | |
years, but we have kids now who are in effect self-harming online, | :49:09. | :49:12. | |
bullying themselves online. There is no textbooks how to deal with this. | :49:13. | :49:17. | |
We are learning as we go and this is another case of that. Vicky, how do | :49:18. | :49:23. | |
you react that some of the images are up because they didn't breach | :49:24. | :49:26. | |
Facebook's standards and the fact they called the police on the BBC? | :49:27. | :49:29. | |
It is extraordinary. I think one of the real difficulties for parents | :49:30. | :49:32. | |
with these services is that we rely on them to do the right thing. We | :49:33. | :49:36. | |
trust that when we report, they're going to respond and they're going | :49:37. | :49:39. | |
to respond appropriately and clearly, they don't and that's one | :49:40. | :49:42. | |
of the really big problems, for not just parents, but for people using | :49:43. | :49:45. | |
the platforms that we have no transparency. We don't know how they | :49:46. | :49:48. | |
respond to reports and we can't test that out. You have tested it and | :49:49. | :49:52. | |
clearly, their response was, I don't know what the word is to use, was it | :49:53. | :49:56. | |
bizarre, is it deliberately confusing the issue to say we've | :49:57. | :50:00. | |
just reported the BBC to the police? It is very hard to know what was | :50:01. | :50:06. | |
going through Facebook's mind. To point out, we weren't judging them | :50:07. | :50:09. | |
by our standards or a criminal standard, we were judging them by | :50:10. | :50:13. | |
their own standards on their own advice pages they say they have | :50:14. | :50:17. | |
effectively a zero tolerance for nudity and sexualised content. So we | :50:18. | :50:21. | |
reported those on the basis that it was sexualised content of children. | :50:22. | :50:24. | |
We have been told by Facebook that they have tightened that up, but our | :50:25. | :50:28. | |
results appear to show that there maybe holes within that system. | :50:29. | :50:33. | |
Melissa what standards did you breach by posting pictures of your | :50:34. | :50:39. | |
breasts post surgery? They said, I believe, it was because there was | :50:40. | :50:44. | |
nipples showing. Right. I don't have any nipples, I have tattoos. Right. | :50:45. | :50:48. | |
Because you had breast cancer. Because I had breast cancer surgery. | :50:49. | :50:53. | |
Yeah, they said I broke those guidelines. Linda, a brief word | :50:54. | :50:59. | |
about, young people in particular, children, in particular, who stumble | :51:00. | :51:03. | |
across the kind of sexualised images online on Facebook? . What impact | :51:04. | :51:10. | |
can it have on them? There is things that you are ready to see when you | :51:11. | :51:15. | |
are emotionally and cognitively developed. We had the watershed on | :51:16. | :51:20. | |
TV. We still have it on games, it is a 12 or a 15 there, doesn't exist | :51:21. | :51:25. | |
online. As a consequence parents need to be aware. So whether it is | :51:26. | :51:30. | |
ensuring that, you know, and they really need to educate they will | :51:31. | :51:32. | |
selves about what kids are doing. So I have got parents that will say, "I | :51:33. | :51:36. | |
think they're on this platform and that, but I'm not sure how it works. | :51:37. | :51:40. | |
Learn how it works. Understand how it works because unless you do, you | :51:41. | :51:44. | |
can't speak to them correctly and we know when a child is confronted with | :51:45. | :51:48. | |
images they don't understand it will affect the way they view their own | :51:49. | :51:55. | |
sexuality and their own boundaries? If this is normalised then is it OK | :51:56. | :52:00. | |
if I do it? The other big thing if they stumble on something in the way | :52:01. | :52:03. | |
that someone who is trying to abuse a child will say, "Don't say | :52:04. | :52:07. | |
anything." They feel guilty so I've stumbled on it. If I feel I can't | :52:08. | :52:11. | |
talk to my mum or dad, if I can't have my parents there, it becomes | :52:12. | :52:14. | |
worsemed be open with your kids and encourage them to speak about it. | :52:15. | :52:18. | |
Ensure that you normalise the idea, you know what, you probably will be | :52:19. | :52:21. | |
confronted with something. It is in the region of 75% of ten to | :52:22. | :52:25. | |
12-year-olds are on social media. By the time they're 13, that's 96%. So | :52:26. | :52:32. | |
the notion that we can somehow police it, it needs to be at a | :52:33. | :52:38. | |
parental level and at an ISP level and a Government level. | :52:39. | :52:42. | |
A number of skiers are feared to be buried under snow following an | :52:43. | :52:59. | |
avalanche at Tignes. Lucy Williamson is in Paris. This | :53:00. | :53:03. | |
avalanche seem to have taken the resort by surprise. You've got | :53:04. | :53:07. | |
pictures from a webcam showing the scene. We're told there is a large | :53:08. | :53:12. | |
rescue operation going with mountain police and even local ski companies | :53:13. | :53:16. | |
getting involved, sending people out with probes to look for those buried | :53:17. | :53:20. | |
under the snow. We are not sure how many people may have been swept away | :53:21. | :53:24. | |
by the avalanche, but some witnesses say they saw a lot of people that | :53:25. | :53:27. | |
they thought might have been caught up in it. So there is a lot of | :53:28. | :53:31. | |
concern to try and dig them out. It is very difficult for helicopters to | :53:32. | :53:35. | |
get there we're told because the visibility is so bad. The conditions | :53:36. | :53:39. | |
have been quite severe. There has been a lot of snow in recent days | :53:40. | :53:43. | |
and in fact one sports journalist, who was at the resort, this morning, | :53:44. | :53:48. | |
is telling French Television that the mountain guides were out in | :53:49. | :53:53. | |
force this morning setting off preventative avalanches to try and | :53:54. | :53:55. | |
reduce that threat. We know that some of the slopes in the area have | :53:56. | :54:00. | |
been closed. This one, apparently was still open. It is seen as an | :54:01. | :54:05. | |
easy slope, a family slope, so obviously they thought the risk was | :54:06. | :54:09. | |
not that great on this slope. Sadly, it seems they were wrong, but we'll | :54:10. | :54:13. | |
try and bring you some more information in the coming hours once | :54:14. | :54:17. | |
things become clearer. More on BBC News throughout the day. | :54:18. | :54:22. | |
Next this morning, could young offenders from black or ethnic | :54:23. | :54:24. | |
minorities be given lighter punishments under new | :54:25. | :54:26. | |
Judges are being told to consider the "discrimination and negative | :54:27. | :54:29. | |
experience of authority" they may have experienced and they should | :54:30. | :54:32. | |
take into account "particular factors which arise" in the case | :54:33. | :54:34. | |
of black and ethnic minority children and young people. | :54:35. | :54:42. | |
With us in the studio is Nathaniel Peat, founder | :54:43. | :54:44. | |
the Safety Box charity which works with young people who're at risk | :54:45. | :54:47. | |
of offending and those who have been in young offender institutions, | :54:48. | :54:49. | |
Ali Wigzell, chair of the Standing Committee for Youth Justice, | :54:50. | :54:52. | |
an alliance of organisations campaigning for a better youth | :54:53. | :54:54. | |
justice system, and Noel Williams, a Youth Justice Consultant | :54:55. | :54:56. | |
Hello all of you. I haven't given you loads of time. But this is a | :54:57. | :55:02. | |
really important issue. Do you think it is right that somebody's | :55:03. | :55:05. | |
background including whether they are from a black and minority ethnic | :55:06. | :55:08. | |
background should be taken into account when a judge is looking at | :55:09. | :55:12. | |
possibly mitigating factors before sentencing? Yeah, absolutely. If you | :55:13. | :55:15. | |
can get the background around a young person it helps to beat a lot | :55:16. | :55:20. | |
of perceptions. Perceptions are held about young black men being in gangs | :55:21. | :55:24. | |
already. Many of them don't, are not involved in gangs and you have got | :55:25. | :55:26. | |
to measure that against the background. When you can get a | :55:27. | :55:30. | |
bigger picture it helps you to have a better understanding of the type | :55:31. | :55:33. | |
of sentence which you can actually give. So definitely, yes. Noel, does | :55:34. | :55:38. | |
that mean someone carrying a knife from a well-to-do family will get a | :55:39. | :55:41. | |
tougher sentence than someone carrying a knife from a black or | :55:42. | :55:47. | |
minority background? Well, I don't know. But what people need to | :55:48. | :55:51. | |
understand there has been a high proportion of discrimination against | :55:52. | :55:54. | |
young black people in that community and it has been known, the Prime | :55:55. | :55:57. | |
Minister has spoke about it, but what I think we shouldn't lose is, | :55:58. | :56:01. | |
of course, if somebody is carrying a knife they deserve to be punished as | :56:02. | :56:05. | |
much as somebody else does. I'm sure the judge can make a good judgement, | :56:06. | :56:09. | |
but it would be fantastic to know that you have got a bit of | :56:10. | :56:12. | |
background before you make that judgement on how to proceed. If | :56:13. | :56:16. | |
somebody is carrying a knife whether you're black or from a middle-class | :56:17. | :56:22. | |
background or an Asian young man, that viable punishment should be | :56:23. | :56:25. | |
fair across-the-board. The guidelines say, you know, there | :56:26. | :56:30. | |
should be the correct punishment regarding the severity of the | :56:31. | :56:37. | |
offence. What's your view, Ali? We would agree with what has been said. | :56:38. | :56:41. | |
It is about the seriousness of the crime. And that dictates what the | :56:42. | :56:48. | |
sentence should be. If we are to prevent teenagers who commit crime | :56:49. | :56:53. | |
from re-offending... Which is what they say this is about? We need to | :56:54. | :57:00. | |
understand what their fwak ground and what and why it happened if we | :57:01. | :57:03. | |
are to put a sentence in place to stop it from happening again. The | :57:04. | :57:06. | |
new guidelines talk about whether that young person has been exposed | :57:07. | :57:11. | |
to pornography or abuse or alcohol abuse or drug abuse? Often at times | :57:12. | :57:18. | |
you're looking at trauma and putting them into an institution is not | :57:19. | :57:22. | |
going to help them. If they're locked up for 23 hours, the young | :57:23. | :57:26. | |
person needs support for the mental state of the mind. It is mindsets | :57:27. | :57:29. | |
and when you can get into the minute of a young person and you can show | :57:30. | :57:33. | |
that that trust is there, many of the issues that are found, you've | :57:34. | :57:39. | |
got 27% which come through arrest, but you've got 50%, the amount that | :57:40. | :57:45. | |
go into prison is more than the amount that are arrested. There is | :57:46. | :57:49. | |
some type of prnlg dissome type of thing that's happening in the | :57:50. | :57:52. | |
courts. I think this step, this is a step in the right direction to help | :57:53. | :57:56. | |
that. Yes, and children in care as well. They want people to look at, | :57:57. | :57:59. | |
they want to take into account the fact that somebody might have been | :58:00. | :58:06. | |
in care. I think we have to take that into account. If you have been | :58:07. | :58:09. | |
in care and you happen to be committing a crime under the age of | :58:10. | :58:14. | |
18, you will be considered as a child, the state are your parents | :58:15. | :58:17. | |
and therefore we need to look at that because that's going to come | :58:18. | :58:21. | |
with its own problems. What we want as a society, rehabilitation would | :58:22. | :58:24. | |
be the best. Thank you. You stopped just in time. Thank you. | :58:25. | :58:27. | |
We're back tomorrow. Have a good day. We're back tomorrow at 9am. | :58:28. | :58:32. | |
The thing that's so clear is that it's 100% honest. | :58:33. | :58:35. | |
We're right in the middle of the action. | :58:36. | :58:39. | |
The remarkable story of British photography. | :58:40. | :58:42. | |
The only cameras that were there that day | :58:43. | :58:45. | |
How pioneering artists and technology | :58:46. | :58:51. |