0:00:06 > 0:00:09You've been coming to our "Flog It!" valuation days for well over
0:00:09 > 0:00:12a decade now, and you haven't disappointed.
0:00:12 > 0:00:15And with around 950 shows under our belt,
0:00:15 > 0:00:19and thousands of your antiques and collectables valued,
0:00:19 > 0:00:22you've certainly put our experts through their paces.
0:00:22 > 0:00:26- What's in there?- I brought it along for someone to tell me what it was.
0:00:26 > 0:00:29I have seen these in books before, but never in real life.
0:00:29 > 0:00:33- Commission bid is £500.- What?!- Oh!
0:00:33 > 0:00:35And now we want to share some of the knowledge we've
0:00:35 > 0:00:38learned from the items you've shown us.
0:00:38 > 0:00:40Welcome to Trade Secrets.
0:01:07 > 0:01:11A report that was published in September 2013 alleges that
0:01:11 > 0:01:15a significant amount of antiques that are bought in the UK are fakes.
0:01:15 > 0:01:19Now, whether that is true or not, it does pay to be on your guard.
0:01:22 > 0:01:24So, on today's programme, we'll be looking at collectables that
0:01:24 > 0:01:27caused controversy.
0:01:27 > 0:01:31Fake or not, that's the question for Anita.
0:01:31 > 0:01:34I just got a feeling that it wasn't right.
0:01:34 > 0:01:36You could turn a £60 replica
0:01:36 > 0:01:40into a £600 antique.
0:01:40 > 0:01:43We find out how to avoid being taken in.
0:01:43 > 0:01:47If you spend £120 on something like this, you've lost your money.
0:01:47 > 0:01:51And we see when reproductions can still be the real deal.
0:01:51 > 0:01:54£550.
0:01:54 > 0:01:56- Thanks, Mum.- "Thanks, Mum."
0:01:56 > 0:01:59You didn't think it was worth that, did you?
0:02:02 > 0:02:05Well, they say imitation is the sincerest form of flattery,
0:02:05 > 0:02:08and that's certainly the case of makers of all fine things.
0:02:08 > 0:02:12They attract copycats, but when is a copy a fake made to deceive,
0:02:12 > 0:02:15and when is it an homage to a master of their art?
0:02:20 > 0:02:23Very often you can use the word "reproduction" or you can use
0:02:23 > 0:02:27the word "fake". The fake is an intention to deceive someone into thinking that it is
0:02:27 > 0:02:29an original.
0:02:29 > 0:02:32If something is particularly rare,
0:02:32 > 0:02:35it could well be a fake.
0:02:35 > 0:02:38If something is in wonderful condition,
0:02:38 > 0:02:39it could be a fake.
0:02:39 > 0:02:43Caution, I think, is important. Don't act with your heart
0:02:43 > 0:02:46if you're going to regret it with your head later, particularly
0:02:46 > 0:02:50if it is involving laying out quite a lot of money initially.
0:02:50 > 0:02:54It is exciting when a reproduction or fake crosses our tables.
0:02:54 > 0:02:56It adds intrigue, sparks debate,
0:02:56 > 0:03:00and let's face it, our experts love a bit of detective work.
0:03:03 > 0:03:05And these skills can be very useful
0:03:05 > 0:03:08when it comes to antique wood furniture.
0:03:08 > 0:03:12You can often find recent pieces purporting to be much older.
0:03:12 > 0:03:14I've seen many, and Philip Serrell
0:03:14 > 0:03:17came across a perfect example in 2005.
0:03:20 > 0:03:23In my eyes, the joint stool was a reproduction
0:03:23 > 0:03:27because it was intended to be a copy of the original.
0:03:27 > 0:03:30- Where did this come from?- It came from my mother-in-law's house.
0:03:30 > 0:03:32They were quite surprised to find it there
0:03:32 > 0:03:36because she wasn't the kind of lady who liked anything that looked old.
0:03:36 > 0:03:38How old do you think this is?
0:03:38 > 0:03:40Well, that's what I was dubious about
0:03:40 > 0:03:42- because...- How old do you think it should be?
0:03:42 > 0:03:45- I think it should be 1600 and something.- 1600 and something.
0:03:45 > 0:03:48So this is a 17th-century stool.
0:03:48 > 0:03:51- Yeah?- Yeah.- And what type of stool do we call it?
0:03:51 > 0:03:54- A joint stool.- A joint stool. And what's it made of?- Oak?
0:03:54 > 0:03:58Oak. Do you want to stand here and have my job? No.
0:03:58 > 0:04:02If this has been around for the thick end of 300 years,
0:04:02 > 0:04:05wouldn't there be some wear here? More wear.
0:04:05 > 0:04:08'You can't fake age.'
0:04:08 > 0:04:11You don't get to look like this if you're only 20.
0:04:11 > 0:04:16And if you look at a stool that's perhaps only 100 years old,
0:04:16 > 0:04:20you can see that it's not 200 or 300 years old,
0:04:20 > 0:04:23because it hasn't been around for long enough.
0:04:23 > 0:04:25People would have sat on this and perhaps put feet on here,
0:04:25 > 0:04:28and there would be more wear here.
0:04:28 > 0:04:32Can you just see that this dark
0:04:32 > 0:04:33- patina here?- Yeah.
0:04:33 > 0:04:37It almost suddenly stops there, like it's been painted on.
0:04:37 > 0:04:41- Yeah.- So this is oak. It is almost a joint stool.
0:04:41 > 0:04:45But I think it is 19th-century rather than 17th-century.
0:04:45 > 0:04:46In terms of value...
0:04:48 > 0:04:50..if this was 17th-century...
0:04:50 > 0:04:53I think it would have been £600-£900.
0:04:53 > 0:04:57So...I'm afraid we're going to have to take a nought off.
0:04:57 > 0:04:59- All right?- Well...
0:04:59 > 0:05:01I think we need to put £60-£90 on this,
0:05:01 > 0:05:04and we'll reserve it for you at £50.
0:05:04 > 0:05:05That will ensure that it will sell.
0:05:05 > 0:05:09And I actually think that represents cracking value for money for someone.
0:05:09 > 0:05:12- So let's keep our fingers crossed. - OK.
0:05:13 > 0:05:15So, Philip confirmed Helen's suspicions.
0:05:15 > 0:05:18But did the bidders agree with our expert's estimate?
0:05:20 > 0:05:2345 with me. And 50, sir.
0:05:23 > 0:05:2550. I'll go five and 60.
0:05:25 > 0:05:2860 and it's there. And it's there at £60.
0:05:28 > 0:05:30And five, anywhere else?
0:05:30 > 0:05:33- Are we all done at £60?- Yeah, the hammer has gone down.
0:05:33 > 0:05:3560 quid, spot on.
0:05:35 > 0:05:38Whoo, that was touch and go, wasn't it, for a second?
0:05:38 > 0:05:39Starting at £30.
0:05:41 > 0:05:42Philip was right on the mark.
0:05:42 > 0:05:45If you're going to go buy from a dealer or an auction room
0:05:45 > 0:05:48a piece of 17th century furniture, the first thing you should do is
0:05:48 > 0:05:52make sure that the receipt you get says, "17th century."
0:05:52 > 0:05:56Not "17th century style" or "17th-century manner,"
0:05:56 > 0:05:58but it says, "17th century."
0:05:58 > 0:06:01And if your catalogue description, or the label in the shop,
0:06:01 > 0:06:05doesn't say, "This is 17th-century, circa 16, whatever,"
0:06:05 > 0:06:07take a step back.
0:06:07 > 0:06:09And don't be afraid to ask.
0:06:09 > 0:06:12Because if you don't, you could come unstuck.
0:06:14 > 0:06:16Now, our experts don't always agree
0:06:16 > 0:06:19when assessing your items at valuation days.
0:06:19 > 0:06:23But there's one particular area of collecting that's had more
0:06:23 > 0:06:25than its fair share of tense standoffs.
0:06:28 > 0:06:32The Colt revolver is the archetypal
0:06:32 > 0:06:34symbol of the American West.
0:06:34 > 0:06:37What are they doing here in the centre of Glasgow?
0:06:38 > 0:06:42Well, I used to collect them many years ago, about 20 years ago,
0:06:42 > 0:06:47but I just decided I've got too many now and want to get rid of some of them.
0:06:47 > 0:06:48I love the Wild West.
0:06:48 > 0:06:51I love Wild Bill Hickok and Wyatt Earp and all that
0:06:51 > 0:06:54so, for me, there was an interesting history there.
0:06:54 > 0:06:56This one is the Colt army pattern.
0:06:56 > 0:06:59This one is the Colt Navy pattern.
0:06:59 > 0:07:02Both of them 1850s, 1870s
0:07:02 > 0:07:06or so in date. Classic six-shot cylinder.
0:07:06 > 0:07:10And both of them have ivory slab-sided grips.
0:07:10 > 0:07:13And here, there's a wonderful verse,
0:07:13 > 0:07:17"Be not afraid of any man no matter what his size.
0:07:17 > 0:07:22"Call on me in your need, and I will equalise."
0:07:22 > 0:07:25The verse that was on that handle...
0:07:25 > 0:07:28is one that is very, very famous,
0:07:28 > 0:07:30The Equaliser...
0:07:30 > 0:07:35for the Colt was the verse that made them almost iconic.
0:07:35 > 0:07:39The wonderful early colour on this one indicates it has never
0:07:39 > 0:07:41been changed. On this one...
0:07:43 > 0:07:45I don't know.
0:07:45 > 0:07:47'When it came to those two pieces,'
0:07:47 > 0:07:51the ivory isn't actually the biggest telltale sign because,
0:07:51 > 0:07:53especially with a weapon,
0:07:53 > 0:07:57you can damage the grips and they can be replaced.
0:07:57 > 0:08:00So the fact that they were
0:08:00 > 0:08:03a paler colour just indicated that they could
0:08:03 > 0:08:07have been replaced, but again, they could quite simply have been
0:08:07 > 0:08:08put away.
0:08:08 > 0:08:12Values, do you have anything in mind for them? Obviously you know a lot about them.
0:08:12 > 0:08:15- Well, I know what they cost me. - That is a good starting place.
0:08:15 > 0:08:20- What did they cost?- Well, I think this one was about 600 and something.
0:08:20 > 0:08:23- OK.- This one, I think, was about 400 and something.- Yeah.
0:08:23 > 0:08:27- Are you happy to put a 600 and a 400 reserve on them?- Yes.
0:08:27 > 0:08:30And put four to five on that and six to eight on that, gives us
0:08:30 > 0:08:33- a fighting chance.- Right.
0:08:33 > 0:08:35But at Anita Manning's saleroom,
0:08:35 > 0:08:38research suggested there might be more
0:08:38 > 0:08:41to one of the guns than first appeared.
0:08:41 > 0:08:44When these two guns came into auction,
0:08:44 > 0:08:47er, we look at them very carefully.
0:08:47 > 0:08:50The first one...everything seemed fine.
0:08:50 > 0:08:53When I looked at the second one...
0:08:55 > 0:08:57I just got a feeling that it wasn't right.
0:08:57 > 0:09:00The handle was too fresh,
0:09:00 > 0:09:02the surface of the barrel just
0:09:02 > 0:09:06wasn't consistent with it being 150 years old.
0:09:06 > 0:09:09Guns can be a difficult area.
0:09:09 > 0:09:13You have firearms laws,
0:09:13 > 0:09:15which you must comply with.
0:09:15 > 0:09:18So we looked at that gun
0:09:18 > 0:09:20more carefully.
0:09:20 > 0:09:24In the 1960s, they started making replicas in Italy.
0:09:24 > 0:09:28- Right, OK.- Now, these weren't meant to be fakes.
0:09:28 > 0:09:33They were meant to be replicas of the item. But the marks,
0:09:33 > 0:09:37the Italian serial marks, could quite easily be taken off...
0:09:37 > 0:09:40- And then re-stamped. - ..and fake marks put on,
0:09:40 > 0:09:43so you could turn a £60 replica
0:09:43 > 0:09:46into a £600 antique.
0:09:46 > 0:09:49So, to be on the safe side,
0:09:49 > 0:09:52the second gun was withdrawn from the sale.
0:09:52 > 0:09:56I'm still not 100% sure that it was as wrong as...
0:09:56 > 0:09:58it was said.
0:09:58 > 0:10:02But, with guns, you have to be so careful.
0:10:02 > 0:10:06And I agree 100% with what Anita did
0:10:06 > 0:10:07by withdrawing it.
0:10:07 > 0:10:10Because if you have an element of doubt,
0:10:10 > 0:10:12then you must withdraw it.
0:10:12 > 0:10:17- We have one in the sale. We're looking at £400-£500.- Right.
0:10:17 > 0:10:19- Are you happy with that? - Yes, reasonably happy.
0:10:19 > 0:10:21OK, hopefully we get the top end.
0:10:21 > 0:10:24That's what we want, we are going to hit the target right now.
0:10:24 > 0:10:27- £300.- Oh, I thought it was going to be more.
0:10:27 > 0:10:29300 with me.
0:10:29 > 0:10:31320. 350.
0:10:33 > 0:10:35380. 400.
0:10:37 > 0:10:39420. 450.
0:10:40 > 0:10:42480. 500.
0:10:45 > 0:10:48The bid is with me, the bid's on the books at £500.
0:10:48 > 0:10:51520, fresh bidder.
0:10:51 > 0:10:53550 on the books.
0:10:53 > 0:10:55580.
0:10:55 > 0:10:57I'm out.
0:10:57 > 0:10:59It's on the floor at
0:10:59 > 0:11:02£580.
0:11:02 > 0:11:05Could have belonged to Wild Bill Hickok.
0:11:05 > 0:11:07LAUGHTER
0:11:09 > 0:11:11- Or Jesse James.- 580.
0:11:11 > 0:11:15Any advance on 580? All done at 580.
0:11:15 > 0:11:17- 580.- Sold.
0:11:17 > 0:11:21- £580. We're happy. You're happy, aren't you?- Yes, of course.
0:11:21 > 0:11:22- Smiles all around.- That's good.
0:11:23 > 0:11:26Do you know, I sell about
0:11:26 > 0:11:282,000 lots a week.
0:11:28 > 0:11:31Between us we try and get most things right.
0:11:32 > 0:11:35But have we ever been fooled by
0:11:35 > 0:11:37a fake? Yeah, of course.
0:11:38 > 0:11:41It happens to the best of us, James.
0:11:42 > 0:11:45High-value items are often copied.
0:11:45 > 0:11:47Most copies aren't done to deceive
0:11:47 > 0:11:50but to fill a legitimate market.
0:11:50 > 0:11:54And these turn up at our valuation days in all shapes and sizes,
0:11:54 > 0:11:57as Mark Stacey discovered.
0:11:57 > 0:11:58It was my first "Flog it!".
0:11:58 > 0:12:01I had no idea what to expect, but I
0:12:01 > 0:12:03wasn't expecting such a large clock.
0:12:03 > 0:12:07This is a very decorative clock that you have brought in with you.
0:12:07 > 0:12:10- You know, of course, it is a reproduction clock.- Yes.
0:12:10 > 0:12:12It is modelled in the style of Louis XVI.
0:12:12 > 0:12:15French, 18th-century.
0:12:15 > 0:12:18- But probably made around the time you bought it.- Oh.
0:12:18 > 0:12:21And I think we'd be looking at an estimate of something like
0:12:21 > 0:12:23- £400-£600.- Yes.
0:12:23 > 0:12:26And let's hope it makes a striking success at the sale.
0:12:26 > 0:12:31If you're a modest collector and you can't afford £200,000
0:12:31 > 0:12:34for a Louis XVI clock, to pick one up for
0:12:34 > 0:12:38300 or 400, 500 or 600 is in your budget.
0:12:38 > 0:12:41And it was a very visual clock, very decorative.
0:12:41 > 0:12:43What should we say to start me? I have two commissions.
0:12:43 > 0:12:46- I start the bidding at 300.- Bid's left.
0:12:46 > 0:12:48- Oh, right.- Straight in.
0:12:48 > 0:12:50At 350. Do we have 360?
0:12:50 > 0:12:53At £350...I order.
0:12:53 > 0:12:56That was so short and sweet, but it was over with very quickly.
0:12:56 > 0:13:00- Yeah, but it's gone.- It's gone.- I'm pleased.
0:13:00 > 0:13:02You cannot fake 200 years of age.
0:13:04 > 0:13:07Now we've all heard of the violin maker Antonio Stradivari,
0:13:07 > 0:13:11whose incredible craftsmanship in Cremona, Italy,
0:13:11 > 0:13:15in the 17th and 18th centuries, brought him wealth and fame.
0:13:16 > 0:13:19And since then, hundreds of violin makers have striven
0:13:19 > 0:13:22to emulate his work.
0:13:22 > 0:13:24Some more successfully than others.
0:13:25 > 0:13:29Fortunately, "Flog It's!" musical expert, Adam Partridge, knows
0:13:29 > 0:13:30the difference.
0:13:30 > 0:13:33Well, it belonged to my mother.
0:13:33 > 0:13:37- Right.- It was bought for her when she was about 11, 12 years old.
0:13:37 > 0:13:42- Did she play then?- I'm not sure. I've never heard her play it.- Really?
0:13:42 > 0:13:44- So you've never heard this violin played.- No.
0:13:44 > 0:13:46Now, I think this is...
0:13:46 > 0:13:49Well, we've got a label inside it first of all.
0:13:49 > 0:13:51And the label reads,
0:13:51 > 0:13:54"Carlo Storioni... registered.
0:13:54 > 0:13:56"Cremonensis Faciebat, 1912,"
0:13:56 > 0:14:01which basically means Carlo Storioni made this in Cremona,
0:14:01 > 0:14:04which is in Italy, of course, in 1912.
0:14:04 > 0:14:07And I'm not sure that's exactly the truth.
0:14:07 > 0:14:10I'm automatically suspicious any time
0:14:10 > 0:14:12I come across any violin with a label,
0:14:12 > 0:14:14until I've had a good look at it and assessed
0:14:14 > 0:14:17whether I think it is actually by the label or not, because there is
0:14:17 > 0:14:20so much jiggery-pokery going on in the...
0:14:20 > 0:14:23in the violin trade over the centuries.
0:14:23 > 0:14:26Storioni was a family of violin makers, dating back from the 18th century,
0:14:26 > 0:14:28and they were Cremonese violin makers.
0:14:28 > 0:14:31And it is generally accepted that the Cremonese,
0:14:31 > 0:14:35or Cremona-based violin makers, is the home of violin making.
0:14:35 > 0:14:36And they were the best violins.
0:14:36 > 0:14:39So lots of violins pretend to be from Cremona.
0:14:39 > 0:14:43And we've sold a few of these Storioni violins that have, in fact,
0:14:43 > 0:14:45been German.
0:14:45 > 0:14:48There was an eminent maker by the name of Lorenzo Storioni,
0:14:48 > 0:14:51who died in 1799.
0:14:51 > 0:14:54So I think what they are trying to imply with this Carlo Storioni that
0:14:54 > 0:14:58we had here was that perhaps he was some connection with the great
0:14:58 > 0:15:02master, one of the great makers of the 18th century,
0:15:02 > 0:15:04where in fact there's no connection at all.
0:15:04 > 0:15:07They are almost good enough to be taken as Italian, and sometimes
0:15:07 > 0:15:11people think they are Italian, and they make quite a good price.
0:15:11 > 0:15:14But I think this is a German example.
0:15:14 > 0:15:17'If my name is Thomas Muller, something typically German,'
0:15:17 > 0:15:19it doesn't sound that glamorous.
0:15:19 > 0:15:21But if it says "Carlo Storioni",
0:15:21 > 0:15:25well, you think your violin is made by one of the Italian masters
0:15:25 > 0:15:28whereas, in reality, it is just a really decent quality German
0:15:28 > 0:15:30workshop violin.
0:15:30 > 0:15:34We've got the table here, the front, which is made from pine.
0:15:34 > 0:15:35Very good condition.
0:15:35 > 0:15:39No cracks, which is vital because that affects the sound quality.
0:15:39 > 0:15:43And on the back there we have a two piece back, down the middle there,
0:15:43 > 0:15:46which is made from maple.
0:15:46 > 0:15:48The date we know because that is correct.
0:15:48 > 0:15:51The date of the label, there's nothing wrong with that.
0:15:51 > 0:15:55Have you got any idea what an instrument like this might be worth?
0:15:56 > 0:16:00- None whatsoever.- None whatsoever? Not even a guess?- Not even a guess.
0:16:00 > 0:16:03Normally we'd expect this sort of violin to
0:16:03 > 0:16:07realise £200-£400 at auction.
0:16:07 > 0:16:10And a reserve of £200, so it doesn't go for less than that.
0:16:10 > 0:16:12Because I'm convinced it's worth that,
0:16:12 > 0:16:14and then it will find its value in the sale.
0:16:14 > 0:16:16- What do you think of that? - SHE EXHALES
0:16:16 > 0:16:18- Well, it's beyond my expectations.- Is it beyond...
0:16:18 > 0:16:22- I thought you were disappointed for a minute.- No, no. No.
0:16:22 > 0:16:26Georgina was a lovely lady, and she was visibly moved, I think,
0:16:26 > 0:16:30by the valuation and the hammer price, and that's a real joy.
0:16:30 > 0:16:32I mean, that's what makes a job worthwhile.
0:16:32 > 0:16:36120. 140. 160.
0:16:37 > 0:16:39180. 200.
0:16:40 > 0:16:42220.
0:16:42 > 0:16:43240.
0:16:44 > 0:16:46260.
0:16:46 > 0:16:48260. 280.
0:16:49 > 0:16:52300. 320.
0:16:52 > 0:16:53Yeah, this is good.
0:16:53 > 0:16:56340. 360.
0:16:57 > 0:16:59380. 400.
0:17:01 > 0:17:03420. 450.
0:17:05 > 0:17:07480. 500.
0:17:08 > 0:17:10550.
0:17:10 > 0:17:12At 550, are we all done?
0:17:12 > 0:17:15On Tom's phone, at £550.
0:17:15 > 0:17:19- Bang! Yes, 550 quid.- Thanks, Mum!
0:17:19 > 0:17:22- "Thanks, Mum."- You didn't think it was worth that, did you?
0:17:22 > 0:17:25No, I didn't think we would get anywhere near that.
0:17:25 > 0:17:27A wonderful result for Georgina.
0:17:27 > 0:17:30So here are a few things to bear in mind.
0:17:31 > 0:17:36If the Wild West appeals, my first suggestion wouldn't be firearms.
0:17:36 > 0:17:39Not only are there strict licensing laws,
0:17:39 > 0:17:43but the fakes on the market can be difficult to spot.
0:17:43 > 0:17:45And as we've seen in the past, there are plenty of other
0:17:45 > 0:17:48fascinating pieces of Americana to collect.
0:17:49 > 0:17:51Reproductions are worth considering.
0:17:51 > 0:17:54They're a good way of owning something in the style
0:17:54 > 0:17:57of a piece that would normally be out of your price bracket.
0:17:59 > 0:18:01And if it's a well-made, quality reproduction,
0:18:01 > 0:18:04it can still make a pretty penny at auction,
0:18:04 > 0:18:06as Georgina discovered.
0:18:12 > 0:18:15100 years ago, Kilburn, in North Yorkshire, was home to a man
0:18:15 > 0:18:19whose work regular "Flog It!" viewers will recognise.
0:18:19 > 0:18:23Original pieces by Robert Thompson, the Mouseman, are very distinctive,
0:18:23 > 0:18:27highly collectable and command huge prices in the saleroom.
0:18:27 > 0:18:30But perhaps less well known is the work of his apprentices,
0:18:30 > 0:18:33the so-called Yorkshire Critters.
0:18:39 > 0:18:42"Flog It!" expert Caroline Hawley had the pleasure of returning
0:18:42 > 0:18:44to her home county to find out more.
0:18:46 > 0:18:51The Yorkshire Critters are a bunch of craftsmen who make solid oak
0:18:51 > 0:18:55pieces of furniture, all with their own individual critters on them.
0:18:55 > 0:18:59There's the "Lizardman", the "Rabbitman", the "Gnomeman",
0:18:59 > 0:19:01the "Wrenman", to name but a few.
0:19:01 > 0:19:04But they all hark back to the originator, which was
0:19:04 > 0:19:07Robert "Mouseman" Thompson, based in Kilburn.
0:19:07 > 0:19:10And I'm here today to see some of his furniture.
0:19:10 > 0:19:14I'm so thrilled to see it as a Yorkshire lass, born and bred.
0:19:14 > 0:19:18There isn't a Yorkshireman worth his salt that hasn't heard of Mouseman.
0:19:21 > 0:19:24Robert "Mouseman" Thompson was born in 1876
0:19:24 > 0:19:29and dedicated his life to the art of making English oak furniture.
0:19:30 > 0:19:32Using traditional tools,
0:19:32 > 0:19:36he made furniture in the style of the 17th century.
0:19:36 > 0:19:40And it's his great-grandson, Ian Thompson Cartwright,
0:19:40 > 0:19:42who is showing Caroline around today.
0:19:43 > 0:19:47- This is where it all starts with the raw material.- Yes, it is, Caroline.
0:19:47 > 0:19:51These are our oak logs that have been purchased in the British Isles.
0:19:51 > 0:19:55- Gosh.- And...- You call that a log? - That is a log, yes.
0:19:55 > 0:19:57And that particular one is about 300 years old.
0:19:57 > 0:19:59I'm going to take you up into the workshop
0:19:59 > 0:20:01so we can see what actually happens next.
0:20:01 > 0:20:05- After, you know, we get our hands on...- Great.- ..the tree. OK.
0:20:05 > 0:20:07- Thank you.- Come along.
0:20:23 > 0:20:27So, Ian, how do you spot a genuine piece of Mouseman?
0:20:27 > 0:20:29- Are there signs that I can look for? - Yes, there are.
0:20:29 > 0:20:32I mean, we've been using certain
0:20:32 > 0:20:35designs for over 100 years.
0:20:35 > 0:20:37One of them is the octagonal leg.
0:20:37 > 0:20:41That shape has been used for literally over 100 years here.
0:20:41 > 0:20:44It was one of Great-grandfather's early designs.
0:20:44 > 0:20:46It is timeless, isn't it, really?
0:20:46 > 0:20:51The methods they use and... It is very Arts and Crafts.
0:21:08 > 0:21:10The most obvious way to tell any of our pieces of furniture
0:21:10 > 0:21:13is by the mouse trademark.
0:21:13 > 0:21:15Great-grandfather was working on a piece of furniture
0:21:15 > 0:21:18with his fellow craftsman, and a fellow craftsman happened to mention
0:21:18 > 0:21:21he thought they were both as poor as church mice.
0:21:21 > 0:21:24He thought how alike he was. You know, the church mouse is working away
0:21:24 > 0:21:27with its chisel-like teeth, and nobody knows what it's up to.
0:21:27 > 0:21:30And here was he working away on the edge of the Hambleton Hills.
0:21:30 > 0:21:33And really not making a song and dance about it.
0:21:33 > 0:21:37So consequently a mouse has appeared on every piece of furniture ever since then.
0:21:37 > 0:21:41Adam is actually creating a mouse in the inside
0:21:41 > 0:21:43of a fruit bowl here
0:21:43 > 0:21:46and he is busy carving the ear at the moment.
0:21:46 > 0:21:49I thought Caroline would maybe like to put the...
0:21:49 > 0:21:52the indentation into the earlobe there.
0:21:52 > 0:21:55Really? Once it has been taken out,
0:21:55 > 0:21:57you can't put it back in, can you?
0:21:57 > 0:22:00Oh, gosh, something is coming off. Oh!
0:22:00 > 0:22:02Oh, no.
0:22:02 > 0:22:04This one's going to have big ears. SHE LAUGHS
0:22:04 > 0:22:06Yes, very big ears.
0:22:06 > 0:22:08- We have an ear, OK.- Oh, wow.
0:22:15 > 0:22:17As you can see, we've got a
0:22:17 > 0:22:19rather nice fireplace which was Great-grandfather's,
0:22:19 > 0:22:23but this particular mantelpiece he carved himself.
0:22:23 > 0:22:25Interesting to note the mice on here,
0:22:25 > 0:22:29which have got front legs with raised heads.
0:22:29 > 0:22:31Very early mice, these are from the early '20s.
0:22:31 > 0:22:35Because they were streamlined, we lost the legs in the later '20s,
0:22:35 > 0:22:38so it's a good way of dating early pieces of furniture.
0:22:38 > 0:22:41And the patination on this oak is just gorgeous.
0:22:41 > 0:22:42Yeah, it's amazing.
0:22:42 > 0:22:44Everybody that wants to come in wants to rub it.
0:22:44 > 0:22:47I've been thinking about the Yorkshire Critters,
0:22:47 > 0:22:50who actually imitate your great-grandfather's work.
0:22:50 > 0:22:54Do you ever have people that deliberately out-and-out try and
0:22:54 > 0:22:56fake or imitate or copy?
0:22:56 > 0:22:58Yes, we have in the past.
0:22:58 > 0:23:00We had a case not too long ago
0:23:00 > 0:23:06where we had 250 of our cow stools that were made in China
0:23:06 > 0:23:10brought back into the UK and then were distributed quite quickly
0:23:10 > 0:23:14and ended up being offered for sale on the internet
0:23:14 > 0:23:18and through auction houses the length and breadth of the UK.
0:23:18 > 0:23:21- Oh, gosh!- We've got an example here that I'd like to show you.
0:23:21 > 0:23:23- This is the genuine item.- Yeah.
0:23:23 > 0:23:26This is a milking stool, our cow stool we sell, with three legs,
0:23:26 > 0:23:30we never make a milking stool with a jointed top, and...
0:23:30 > 0:23:31It's out of one solid piece?
0:23:31 > 0:23:33One solid piece, and obviously,
0:23:33 > 0:23:35- the mouse is carved out of the solid as well.- Mmm.
0:23:35 > 0:23:38But the ones that were coming in from China were made out of
0:23:38 > 0:23:42three and four pieces and the mice weren't carved by hand,
0:23:42 > 0:23:44they were actually carved on a CNC router.
0:23:44 > 0:23:49So without knowing what the original is like, seeing and handling
0:23:49 > 0:23:54the original, I presume the machine-made copy, at first glance,
0:23:54 > 0:23:57to an untrained eye, would have looked roughly all right?
0:23:57 > 0:24:01Well, we're in a fortunate position, because we can verify our own work.
0:24:01 > 0:24:05People can always send images into us, here at Kilburn
0:24:05 > 0:24:08and we'll verify the authenticity of the piece.
0:24:08 > 0:24:10- That's worth doing.- Yeah.
0:24:10 > 0:24:15Ian, thank you SO much for today, I have enjoyed myself enormously
0:24:15 > 0:24:19and I really have learnt an awful lot about Mouseman!
0:24:19 > 0:24:22- I could stop here all night. - HE LAUGHS
0:24:24 > 0:24:28The prices are really fascinating, with it just dependent on
0:24:28 > 0:24:31what type of critter is on your piece of furniture.
0:24:31 > 0:24:37There was a Mouseman dresser that made 3,500, but a dresser in
0:24:37 > 0:24:44a very same style, almost identical, but with a rabbit on, made £1,400.
0:24:44 > 0:24:46I mean, that's a huge difference in price,
0:24:46 > 0:24:50but it all harks back to the originator, Robert "Mousey" Thompson.
0:24:50 > 0:24:53That is the one to look for if you want the best
0:24:53 > 0:24:55and the most expensive.
0:24:55 > 0:24:58But they're all fascinating, a wonderful field to collect.
0:25:03 > 0:25:06A clever forger or faker will always manage to convince
0:25:06 > 0:25:09someone that he's looking at the real McCoy.
0:25:09 > 0:25:13So we asked the "Flog It!" team to offer some sage words
0:25:13 > 0:25:17of advice on how to avoid being taken in.
0:25:17 > 0:25:21I think this is a lovely painting, actually, and it's signed, LS Lowry,
0:25:21 > 0:25:24the signature looks good, the subject looks quite good, too.
0:25:24 > 0:25:28It's very much in his style with thick layers of paint etc,
0:25:28 > 0:25:33but I'm not convinced it's a genuine one, I'm afraid.
0:25:33 > 0:25:35One of the things with Lowry is that you'll never really fully
0:25:35 > 0:25:39know 100% whether it's absolutely genuine
0:25:39 > 0:25:43unless you've got a cast-iron provenance linking it to Lowry himself.
0:25:43 > 0:25:49So, at the moment, it's "Style of LS Lowry", £500-£700,
0:25:49 > 0:25:52but if it was the real thing, and we can prove it to be the real thing,
0:25:52 > 0:25:55I would have thought it would be £30,000-£50,000.
0:25:57 > 0:26:02Is this really a milk jug or might it have been something else?
0:26:02 > 0:26:08It is, in fact, a christening mug that has been converted.
0:26:08 > 0:26:13And it's been converted by the addition of this spout.
0:26:13 > 0:26:18What's particularly worrying is that the spout is not hallmarked,
0:26:18 > 0:26:21which means it's an illegal, conversion.
0:26:21 > 0:26:24And as an illegal conversion, we can't sell it.
0:26:24 > 0:26:28It's as simple as that. So, it's valueless.
0:26:28 > 0:26:31If you spent £120 on something like this, you'd lost your money.
0:26:34 > 0:26:38These two items are both Staffordshire Flatback figures.
0:26:38 > 0:26:41They look fairly similar at first glance.
0:26:41 > 0:26:44One is real and one is a fake.
0:26:44 > 0:26:46But can YOU tell which one?
0:26:48 > 0:26:50This one is the fake.
0:26:50 > 0:26:53It has actually been deliberately made to look old.
0:26:53 > 0:26:59If you look closely at this, you will see it is crazed all over.
0:26:59 > 0:27:02And that's done to make it look old,
0:27:02 > 0:27:06so it's got far more crazing than the original piece.
0:27:06 > 0:27:10This original one could be top hundreds, I would say.
0:27:12 > 0:27:18Whereas this can be bought in the UK now for £10 or less.
0:27:18 > 0:27:22This is ostensibly a little Georgian dessert spoon that dates to
0:27:22 > 0:27:26London, 1790, by the Partnership of George Smith,
0:27:26 > 0:27:28and I bought it at an auction because I felt there was
0:27:28 > 0:27:32something just slightly awry with the hallmark.
0:27:32 > 0:27:35When it came, I was delighted to find out that it's not actually
0:27:35 > 0:27:38a genuine Georgian spoon, but it's a fake.
0:27:38 > 0:27:40But it's not a modern fake.
0:27:40 > 0:27:44It was made by famous forgers at the late Victorian period,
0:27:44 > 0:27:45Lyon and Twinam.
0:27:45 > 0:27:49And consequently, this, as a Victorian forgery of a
0:27:49 > 0:27:54Georgian spoon, is actually rarer than the Georgian spoon itself.
0:27:54 > 0:27:57I wouldn't legally be able to sell this.
0:27:57 > 0:27:59I can own it, that's fine.
0:27:59 > 0:28:02But if I wanted to sell it, I would have to submit it to
0:28:02 > 0:28:05the Goldsmith's Hall, to the Antique Plate Committee.
0:28:05 > 0:28:09They'd consider it, they'd come to the conclusion it's an 1890s
0:28:09 > 0:28:14forgery and they'd erase the marks here and they'd either offer me
0:28:14 > 0:28:16the value of the silver on the day, or return it to me
0:28:16 > 0:28:18hallmarked with modern marks.
0:28:18 > 0:28:22The sad thing then is, you've lost the history of it.
0:28:25 > 0:28:28Some final words of advice from the "Flog It!" team.
0:28:28 > 0:28:32I hope today's show has given you some pointers to help sort
0:28:32 > 0:28:35the real contenders from the great pretenders.
0:28:35 > 0:28:39Join us again soon for more Trade Secrets.