:00:10. > :00:19.On The Review Show tonight. Angry Boys, troubled men and a talking
:00:19. > :00:26.beaver! Mel Gibson attempt as comeback with
:00:26. > :00:33.help from a fluffy friend. Can a beaver rehabilitate Mad Max.
:00:33. > :00:39.are you? I'm the beaver. Huge excitement in a Russian small town
:00:39. > :00:44.when the Government inspector arrives. How do stars of TV comedy
:00:44. > :00:49.fare in Gogol's classic play. Get him to send over his next
:00:49. > :00:54.Bordeaux or I will break his fingers. The dead unburied in
:00:54. > :01:00.Andrew Miller's novel, set in prerevolutionary France. Does the
:01:00. > :01:05.stench of 18th century Paris leap off the page?
:01:05. > :01:14.Chris Lilley plays delinquent teen, racist grans, and even blacks up in
:01:14. > :01:23.his new mock can youmentry, Angry Boys - mockumentary, Angry Boys,
:01:23. > :01:32.funny or just over the top. Balls, ball, I have big blackballs. Live
:01:32. > :01:37.music from Jonathan Jeremiah. Joining me tonight are the
:01:37. > :01:42.independent columnist, Johann Hari, the novelist and President of
:01:42. > :01:46.English Pen, Gillian Slovo, the policy editor of the economist,
:01:46. > :01:50.Anne McElvoy, and broadcaster and academic, Susan Hitch. It is quite
:01:50. > :01:55.hard to imagine the pitch for this one, for a start the film will be
:01:55. > :02:01.starring Mel Gibson, never mind the drunken racist rants or claims of
:02:01. > :02:06.domestic abuse. The role itself, not an action hero, or comic part,
:02:06. > :02:12.but man suffering from depression. Get this, he decides the only way
:02:12. > :02:19.to talk to his family is via a hand puppet of a beaver. Do you want to
:02:19. > :02:23.get better. Who are you? I'm The Beaver Walter. Gibson plays Walter
:02:23. > :02:30.Black a chronically depressed toy executive who stands to lose his
:02:30. > :02:35.family if he doesn't make dramatic changes, he decides to communicate
:02:35. > :02:40.with the world through a beaver hand puppet. The Beaver is Jodie
:02:40. > :02:44.Foster's third directoral outing, she co-stars as Walter's long-
:02:44. > :02:48.suffering wife. It is painfully emotional film. That is the biggest
:02:48. > :02:52.surprise, that a movie can start out with such a high concept, and
:02:52. > :02:58.by mid-way through the film you are so invested in the characters and
:02:58. > :03:03.moved by them, you see your own small details and tapestrys of your
:03:03. > :03:07.life with your family through them. You completely forget that he has a
:03:07. > :03:14.puppet on his hand. The other troubled relationship is between
:03:14. > :03:19.Walter and his son Porter, a teenager worried he's turning into
:03:19. > :03:24.his father. This is a joke, right. No, son. It is a fresh start.
:03:24. > :03:28.you completely lost your mind. know it seems. I'm not talking to
:03:28. > :03:32.you nut job, I'm talking to mom. Could the role of Walter Black be a
:03:32. > :03:36.case of art imitating life. An acknowledgement of one of
:03:36. > :03:41.Hollywood's biggest stars of his dramatic fall from grace. Has
:03:41. > :03:47.Gibson now come to terms with his inner demons. It is one of the
:03:47. > :03:51.deepest performances Mel has ever again, and the most - given, and
:03:51. > :03:56.one of the most true he has given. That is lucky, it is an incredibly
:03:56. > :04:02.lucky skill to have the ability to look demons in the face, and say,
:04:02. > :04:05.you know, I'm going to do whatever it takes to kick you in the ass.
:04:05. > :04:09.Putting his personal controversy aside, is this the right vehicle to
:04:09. > :04:14.turn Gibson's career around. person who handed you this card is
:04:14. > :04:17.under the care of a prescription puppet. Designed to help create a
:04:17. > :04:21.psychological distance between himself and the negative aspects of
:04:21. > :04:29.his personality. Please treat him as you normally would, but address
:04:29. > :04:33.yourself to the puppet, thank you. One of the questions I would never
:04:33. > :04:37.have thought I would have asked on television, what do you think the
:04:37. > :04:41.point of The Beaver is? Goodness no, I think Jodie Foster thinks she
:04:41. > :04:44.does but doesn't really. On one level we are supposed to believe it
:04:44. > :04:48.is a prescription puppet, that turns out to be a lie. Afterall it
:04:48. > :04:52.is not a prescription puppet, is it a useful psychological tool
:04:52. > :04:56.nonetheless in which he's able to voice his inner thoughts in way he
:04:56. > :04:59.can't do directly? Or is it something that is actually taking
:04:59. > :05:04.him over, that is psychotic. I don't think the film has made up
:05:04. > :05:09.its mind, and I think there is a problem there. Did you think it was
:05:09. > :05:13.credible, Jodie Foster was saying after a few minutes you are
:05:13. > :05:16.completely absorbed and overtaken? The whole film work ones whether
:05:17. > :05:21.you believe in the existence of The Beaver. Five minutes of thinking I
:05:21. > :05:25.can't believe in it, five minutes of thinking maybe I can. The rest
:05:25. > :05:29.of the film thinking I would like to kill this beaver. I found it
:05:29. > :05:33.difficult to talk about, I almost cannot believe this film actually
:05:33. > :05:38.exists. You are sitting there watching it and you keep getting
:05:38. > :05:43.hit by waves of incredulity and that anyone has ever made this film.
:05:43. > :05:50.It is the plot of American Beauty, through the imagination of Fred
:05:50. > :05:56.West. You have a middle-aged man having a breakdown and unsufferably
:05:56. > :05:59.twee teenagers. The tone is so odd. At times it thinks it is a commondy
:05:59. > :06:03.or horror film or profound psychological drama. It is none of
:06:03. > :06:10.them. The animal he speaks through should be a turkey, this is such a
:06:10. > :06:14.disaster. Could it be that the idea of the beaver is man, male
:06:14. > :06:24.menopause, this is his masculinity, the only way to communicate is
:06:24. > :06:29.through the beaver which has a strong macho accent? A good try. It
:06:29. > :06:33.is the accent is Michael Cain meets something else, they are trying to
:06:33. > :06:37.externalise the depression and say all of this, the idea that the
:06:37. > :06:42.depression is internal or chemical it can be dealt with pro-Zach or
:06:42. > :06:46.getting a grip, you can't do that, I needs that is outside himself
:06:46. > :06:54.that will articulate what he feels. Therefore, it is not going to be
:06:54. > :06:59.him but everyone is going to have to accept it. The incredulity point
:06:59. > :07:03.is important, the reaction of the family is unbelievable, we have a
:07:03. > :07:07.Muppet boy who loves the beaver, have you ever tried to do anything
:07:07. > :07:11.weird around a child, they are the most conservative on the plan the.
:07:11. > :07:14.Then you have the cookie teenage thing, it is straight out of
:07:14. > :07:18.American Beauty, a real waste of Jennifer Lawrence and a good cast.
:07:18. > :07:23.There was one scene in the film that I really did think it was very
:07:23. > :07:28.good, it is when Mel Gibson and The Beaver are on television, he, The
:07:28. > :07:34.Beaver articulates in his mockney the philosophy behind it, it is a
:07:34. > :07:39.complete story of a man who is having a mid-life crisis and the
:07:39. > :07:45.justification of a middle-aged men everywhere for throwing his life
:07:45. > :07:48.away, I thought it had a lot of power, why did you need The Beaver?
:07:48. > :07:52.That is uncomfortably true, I don't believe in the premise, or Mel
:07:52. > :07:56.Gibson as the depressed man, he has the tense face, he doesn't have the
:07:56. > :08:01.slackness of somebody who is depressed. Yet I do believe in Mel
:08:01. > :08:06.Gibson as the angry middle-aged man, I didn't need to know the events
:08:06. > :08:11.going on in his events to believe that. I was queasy about this being
:08:11. > :08:15.a rescue vehicle, it is a rescue vehicle by Mel Gibson by taking on
:08:15. > :08:19.mental illness, they hope in some way to get him out of the career
:08:19. > :08:24.crisis he has worked himself into. It is not to do with mental illness
:08:24. > :08:29.but him. Was the performance a career rehabilitating one?
:08:29. > :08:36.because the film isn't. His performance is. I find the things
:08:36. > :08:40.Mel Gibson has done abhorrent, he's a great actor and film maker. If
:08:40. > :08:45.you look at The Passion Of The Christ, it is a disgusting film and
:08:45. > :08:50.extraordinary, and I think he's one of the most profound film makers of
:08:50. > :08:54.our time. I think he has something incredible. I was torn, part of me
:08:54. > :08:58.wants him to be rehabilitated, because I want to see his next film.
:08:58. > :09:02.This is not the vehicle to do it. It does show his acting talents.
:09:02. > :09:05.is an interesting question, how far can you distance an actor or artist
:09:05. > :09:08.from his politics and private life? Yes, but I don't think that the
:09:08. > :09:12.problem with this film is Mel Gibson's private life. I don't
:09:12. > :09:17.think that's what's get anything the way there. I think the problem
:09:17. > :09:20.with the film is, as Susan said, it just doesn't know what it is doing.
:09:20. > :09:25.It has some really worthy things and some really whacky things, they
:09:25. > :09:31.do not measure together. It is a very ambitious film, it is high
:09:31. > :09:38.concept, it has been Anne tell gent Jodie Foster, whose own performance
:09:38. > :09:42.was rather good It always it, there ising - it always is, there is a
:09:42. > :09:46.kind of intelligence, even when she's not on the screen, we can see
:09:46. > :09:52.her taking in stuff intelligently. It is the reaction shot that I like
:09:52. > :09:57.of her's. I do think the film is a mess. It hasn't made up its mind
:09:57. > :10:00.what it is. It drops into terrible sentimentality, the little boy and
:10:00. > :10:04.the older child who suddenly comes back together with his father.
:10:04. > :10:09.older son was interesting, isn't he a parallel to what's happening with
:10:09. > :10:13.his father, he's also acting like a ventriloquist in his life, because
:10:13. > :10:17.he's writing other people's essays and getting into their heads for a
:10:17. > :10:21.speech? They may as well have flashing on the bottom of the
:10:21. > :10:25.screen, "subtext", the recurring image of the son is him banging his
:10:25. > :10:30.head against the wall, which is how the audience feels by the time you
:10:30. > :10:36.get to that. The film doesn't let you get away from reminding you of
:10:36. > :10:39.Mel Gibson and has narrative. The beaver said a great obituary you
:10:39. > :10:44.have written for yourself. It is constantly drawing you back to
:10:44. > :10:49.Gibson the man. Isn't it interesting that the psychotic
:10:50. > :10:54.voice is Cockney! Let's be honest it was sometimes Cockney and
:10:54. > :10:59.sometimes Australian. Sort of English? It is interesting.
:10:59. > :11:03.The Beaver w its strange accent, opens across the UK next Friday.
:11:03. > :11:08.There may never have been a better time to see funny faces off the
:11:08. > :11:11.tele, treading the stages of London theatre, Catherine Tate is helping
:11:11. > :11:16.David Tennant, making Much Ado About Nothing, while James Corden
:11:16. > :11:20.is starring in The National in One Man, Two Guvnors. Meanwhile at the
:11:20. > :11:27.Young Vic, half of The Mighty Boosh, Jean-Baptiste Baratte, meets one
:11:27. > :11:31.third of - Julian Barratt, meets one third of Smack the Pony, in The
:11:31. > :11:35.Government Inspector which opened last night. With news of an
:11:35. > :11:42.imminent visit of a Government inspector to a small provincial
:11:42. > :11:51.Russian town, the local mayor and inhabitants are sent into a frenzy
:11:51. > :11:55.of social thought. Is he from there. Has he got a moustache. Is he very
:11:56. > :12:00.distinguished. Is he privvy or state councillor, or a cleejic
:12:00. > :12:07.councillor, is he a general? He's not a general.
:12:07. > :12:12.He has to be higher than a general. Written by Ukrainian-born novelist,
:12:12. > :12:17.Nikolai Gogol, in 1836, when Russia was struggling to compete
:12:17. > :12:21.economically with the rest of the world. The play uses the device of
:12:21. > :12:27.mistaken identity to expose the towns people's greed and corruption.
:12:27. > :12:32.News of the incognito visitor spreads fast. How young a boy?
:12:32. > :12:36.or so, young, very beyond his years, very travelled and worldly.
:12:36. > :12:41.Cultured, he loves to read books and scribble down his thoughts
:12:41. > :12:51.about the Stone Age, but his cave was too dark and Baltic, he seeks
:12:51. > :12:57.out prolonged exposure to the arts. Brown hair, black hair, long,
:12:57. > :13:03.feathered. When a fopish civil servant turns up and is Makin for
:13:03. > :13:12.the inspector he's enjoying the attentions of the towns people.
:13:12. > :13:20.lost my money on the road, could you lend me $300. Absolutely.
:13:20. > :13:23.don't like to deny myself, why should I. I won't trouble your
:13:23. > :13:33.excellencey any further. Do you have any thoughts about the postal
:13:33. > :13:34.
:13:34. > :13:44.service? I will write to you. Taking her talent from the TV to
:13:44. > :13:47.
:13:47. > :13:51.the stage are many stars. Adapted by the Scottish playwright David
:13:51. > :13:58.Harrower. This new version is as lively on stage as it is on the
:13:58. > :14:03.page. But has it managed to stay true to the original play.
:14:03. > :14:06.We have a real sense of the vivacity of the production there.
:14:07. > :14:13.How do you think it captures the spirit of the original Gogol?
:14:13. > :14:17.don't think it does, it rollicks along, very amusingly, you saw from
:14:17. > :14:22.the clip, it is a fantastic feat of getting people on and off the stage,
:14:22. > :14:26.the language is very cleverly adapted to modern English in the
:14:26. > :14:31.venacular. The problem is this is an angry play, written by Gogol as
:14:31. > :14:33.a young man, angry about the conditions in the provinces and the
:14:33. > :14:39.random nature of power from St Petersburg. This could be anywhere,
:14:39. > :14:44.it could be a bad day for David Brent at the Office, when
:14:44. > :14:49.management is checking up on his paper clip quota. This moral anger
:14:49. > :14:53.is central to Russian comedy, they have lost it here. Did they
:14:53. > :14:56.trivialise it? There is a sense of absurdity central to Russian comedy.
:14:56. > :15:04.With The Government Inspector you can produce two different plays out
:15:04. > :15:07.of it, one is that naturalistic, serious, funny, maybe, but deeply
:15:08. > :15:11.satirical and dark version. But you can also make out of it something
:15:11. > :15:15.that is farcical and really, really absurd. The moment you choose to go
:15:15. > :15:20.for Richard Jones as director you have gone for the absurd, he won't
:15:20. > :15:24.do anything else with it. What I liked about it, is it really
:15:24. > :15:28.reconsidered it properly and turned it all the way into a farce. It is
:15:29. > :15:32.a beautifuly constructed play, dramatic mechanism it has a perfect
:15:32. > :15:40.lock on it. So actually it is quite difficult to re-think it, even as
:15:40. > :15:45.farce. I thought they did it well. I'm a surprised you think that
:15:46. > :15:51.goes back to the stream of Gogol f you go back to the short story The
:15:51. > :15:54.Nose, about a bureaucrat whose nose runs away from him. This is like
:15:54. > :15:59.The Mighty Boosh t loses some of the political edge, I don't think
:15:59. > :16:04.that is something that Gogol disliked, he didn't like it when
:16:04. > :16:07.was done in a socially realist way, when he saw productions like that.
:16:07. > :16:12.My problem is with the basic production. It is really annoying
:16:12. > :16:16.that theatre producers keep putting TV actors without theatre
:16:16. > :16:23.experience and aren't that good at theatre, in the big roles where
:16:23. > :16:26.they have to carry a big vow. Julian Barratt cannot do t and it
:16:26. > :16:32.leaves a hole at the centre of the play.
:16:32. > :16:36.Did you feel the performances were as bad as that? I think there were
:16:37. > :16:41.wonderful performance, some of it was Amanda Lawrence Lawrence, she
:16:41. > :16:46.used her body in the most amazing way. I thought Julian Barratt felt
:16:46. > :16:50.uncomfortable on the stage, it improved as it went on. As long as
:16:50. > :16:53.he was talking it was all right. When I was listening he didn't know
:16:53. > :16:56.how to hold himself, that was the problem. Something about the play I
:16:56. > :17:00.found interesting, I have always thought of as the mayor as the one
:17:00. > :17:05.person in the town who has a kind of moral conscience, who does
:17:05. > :17:10.understand what's happening, and this production made him into a
:17:10. > :17:16.torturer, by the way it came to the end. I thought that took away a
:17:16. > :17:19.kind of a feel to Julian Barratt's performance, who has gone on record
:17:19. > :17:23.as saying we can't be too sympathetic to the mayor because
:17:23. > :17:28.then we won't laugh at him. I don't think so, I think we could have
:17:28. > :17:32.laughed at him and been sympathetic. I saw it the night after you,
:17:32. > :17:36.perhaps he improved enormously in the 24 hours. I found him awkward
:17:36. > :17:41.and uncomfortable in his skin. In way that when I saw it, contributed
:17:41. > :17:45.to the character. That this was a mayor who is uneasy any way with
:17:45. > :17:48.what he's doing so, when he has the stress dream, if it is a dream,
:17:48. > :17:53.when the terrible thing happens to him it is bringing out the fears he
:17:53. > :18:00.has any way. He's not very comfortable with himself. I know
:18:00. > :18:05.you like this bit better than I did, of course there is absurdity galore
:18:05. > :18:10.in Gogol, if you run it like that for the whole duration for the play,
:18:10. > :18:14.you make it hard for the mayor and the imposter, they have to keep
:18:14. > :18:18.going at the same pace and delivery for a long time. It is wearing, if
:18:18. > :18:22.you lose the seriousness, you lose that kind of variety. This is a
:18:22. > :18:26.play, which is so badly received, and is seen as so critical that
:18:26. > :18:29.Gogol is forced into exile. So, yes, there is the absurdity, yes it is
:18:29. > :18:34.meant to be farcical, and funny. But the seriousness of purpose, and
:18:34. > :18:40.everything that it says it part and parcel of the work. It is a play
:18:40. > :18:45.constantly revived, it speaks to something of our age at a time of
:18:45. > :18:52.MPs' expenses and corruption. Nabakov thought it was the worst
:18:52. > :18:56.play ever written t harsh on Chekov, it is a good translation by David
:18:56. > :18:59.Harrower. There are beautiful moments of pathos, I think it works
:18:59. > :19:03.best with them. When one of the people in the town just begs the
:19:03. > :19:09.person he thinks is the Government inspector, when he goes back to St
:19:09. > :19:15.Petersburg, to say in a town out in the stick there is a man called Bob
:19:15. > :19:18.Chinsky, he wants the officials to know he exists. Where it is
:19:18. > :19:23.prefiguring the Russian history to come worked well. They weren't too
:19:23. > :19:26.loaded. I thought the hints of it, it reminded me of the Dostoevksy
:19:26. > :19:30.novel The Devil, which anticipates so clearly the nightmare that is on
:19:30. > :19:34.its way. Before leaving it, we should talk about the way it is
:19:34. > :19:39.staged. Extraordinary design, and a joy to watch? It is gorgeous.
:19:39. > :19:45.Everything works, the sound, and the sight and the colours in it. I
:19:45. > :19:50.think, I also think we have to mention, Khlestakov, Kyle Soller,
:19:50. > :19:54.who was like a maniac imp, with more bounce than I have ever seen
:19:54. > :20:04.anybody on a stage. He was literally jumping on the ground, on
:20:04. > :20:05.
:20:05. > :20:12.the sofas 0 - and on to bookshelves. And also from Do you know McKeekin?
:20:12. > :20:17.But it was also like thank Kyle Soller was like the death of
:20:17. > :20:22.Chaterton, he was the boy with red hair and instead of dying
:20:22. > :20:32.consumptionively, he was bouncing on sofas. Didn't he remind you of
:20:32. > :20:36.
:20:36. > :20:41.Ange, doing these movements. It has been four years since the
:20:42. > :20:45.Australian comedian, Chris Lilley last appeared on screen in the
:20:45. > :20:52.critically acclaimed mockumentary, height height. This year he
:20:52. > :20:56.returned - Summer Heights High. This year he returned playing a
:20:56. > :21:00.eclectic collection of characters in Angry Boys. Comedy from the
:21:00. > :21:10.southern Hemisphere, has given us some much-loved characters, from
:21:10. > :21:13.Barry Humphreys Dame Edna, to Kath & Kim. Look and me Kim. Chris
:21:13. > :21:18.Lilley, stand-up comedian, added to this collection, with Summer
:21:18. > :21:22.Heights High, which ran on BBC Three in 2008. Lilley played a
:21:22. > :21:28.remarkable range of characters in an Australian High School.
:21:28. > :21:35.Including spoilt schoolgirl Jamie. Oh my God. And self-deillusional
:21:35. > :21:41.drama theatre Mr G. I just perform for the kids for a whole lesson, to
:21:41. > :21:44.give them a benchmark of how things are done. So they can see someone
:21:44. > :21:49.at a professional industry level, and how they handle the performance
:21:49. > :21:54.side of things. However, his latest series, Angry Boys, gives the
:21:54. > :21:59.mockumentary a more cutting edge. Featuring controversial characters
:21:59. > :22:04.like Gran, the less than PC prison guard. You are a light skin, I know
:22:04. > :22:09.you're an Aborigine, but a light skin. And twin delinquent, Danal
:22:09. > :22:13.and Nathan Sims, who first made an appearance in Lilley's debut series,
:22:13. > :22:20.We Can Be Heroes. He never wants to talk, he reckons if he does he
:22:20. > :22:29.sounds like a full Plastic, and he reckons we always laugh at him, and
:22:29. > :22:35.we do. Hey Nae, say "my name is Nathan and I'm a big deaf spas".
:22:35. > :22:40.Danal is a big deaf spas. This premiered in Australia last
:22:40. > :22:46.month to rave reviews and high ratings. Viewing figures for later
:22:46. > :22:52.episodes have declined. As Lilley's humour takes ever darker turns, has
:22:52. > :22:56.he pushed the boundaries of the mockumentary. # Balls, balls
:22:56. > :23:03.# I got big Blackballs
:23:03. > :23:07.# Let me show you Very much Chris Lilley's work,
:23:07. > :23:11.playing all these characters, writing, producing, co-directing,
:23:11. > :23:16.it shows great versatility in this, I suppose. There are really three
:23:16. > :23:20.masters of this mockumentary style, or this new form of sitcom, Ricky
:23:20. > :23:24.Gervais, Larry David and Chris Lilley. It is a strange thing where
:23:24. > :23:28.it is both comedy of extreme social awkwardness, tinged with real
:23:28. > :23:32.sadness. It take as while to set those things up. If you watch the
:23:32. > :23:37.first episodes of any of their shows it take as while to get going.
:23:37. > :23:41.For those new to it, it would seem odd. Summer Heights High is one of
:23:41. > :23:46.the best comedies of the past ten years. He hasn't done what Ricky
:23:46. > :23:50.Gervais did after The Office, he's gone for more of the same thing. It
:23:50. > :23:54.feels odd, but will grow into something great. Did you admire the
:23:54. > :23:59.technical skill in this I admire the technical skill but I hated it.
:23:59. > :24:03.Maybe I'm not the person for mockumentary. I didn't enjoy it at
:24:03. > :24:09.all. There is a very basic problem of imitation here. If you imitate
:24:10. > :24:17.people who are bored, most of the time, boring, racist, offensive,
:24:17. > :24:22.the problem in the end is not that they are racist and offensive, that
:24:22. > :24:26.is contextualised, you can read that sat teirically, sometimes I
:24:26. > :24:30.wonder - satirically, sometimes I wonder why, I'm bored. I would go
:24:30. > :24:34.between the two, I thought it did get better. The second episode felt
:24:34. > :24:39.much more alive to me than the first episode. Did it make me laugh.
:24:39. > :24:43.It is not exactly my thing. I laughed actually, the less PC it
:24:43. > :24:50.was, the funnier I found it, but I didn't even find it that funny. I
:24:50. > :24:56.like the character of Gran, in way. Gran is the racist prison guard, we
:24:56. > :25:02.saw there dividing the young boys into dark and light skined? And who
:25:02. > :25:09.keeps guinea pigs and has a game with the boy goch cha, where she
:25:09. > :25:18.tells one of them he's about to be released and then says gotcha. That
:25:18. > :25:24.turned dark for me and I liked S Mouse. He said, I'm really radical
:25:24. > :25:30.because I have puct situation, in the middle of - puct situation in
:25:30. > :25:40.the middle of my name. In the second episode with S. Mousse, I
:25:40. > :25:42.
:25:42. > :25:46.thought was funny. It worked - S Mouse.
:25:46. > :25:50.It was very, very funny, and it also took that apart. I thought
:25:50. > :25:56.that worked very well. You saw then the effect that it had back on the
:25:56. > :26:00.hopeless crowd back in Oz. On the anti-PC point, I think one should
:26:00. > :26:03.say it is fairly broad stuff. very BBC Three, you have to have
:26:03. > :26:07.just come in from the pub to watch it. That is probably what most of
:26:07. > :26:11.the audience will have done. I thought it got less funny when they
:26:11. > :26:14.repeated these very anti-PC joke, whether they were about race or
:26:14. > :26:18.masturbation, or body parts. Because the first time you go, oh,
:26:18. > :26:24.they said, that the second time it is like they said that before. Why
:26:24. > :26:27.do I have to be amused another time. Is there a risk with some of the
:26:27. > :26:33.anti-PC jokes, whether they are racist or joke about the deaf twin,
:26:33. > :26:37.that so. Audience will be thinking that is fatastically ironic, others
:26:37. > :26:41.will think that is very funny because he said the word "spas".
:26:41. > :26:45.The crucial question is who is the joke on, it is never on the deaf
:26:45. > :26:49.brother, it is the idiot brother laughing at him. That is the strain
:26:49. > :26:54.going through comdee. You can't judge comedy by the reaction of the
:26:54. > :26:58.stupidist members of the audience, if you think about Alf Garnett
:26:58. > :27:02.people always misunderstood the characters. If you compare it to
:27:02. > :27:06.Jim Davidson, blacking up, or little Britain, where the joke is
:27:06. > :27:12.on the weaker character, that is not the case here. You would have
:27:12. > :27:16.to be really quite dumb to misread this as laughing at the deaf person,
:27:16. > :27:20.that never happens. Part of my objection to it is the sense of
:27:20. > :27:25.waste. When you see Chris Lilley acting, really acting as Gran, for
:27:25. > :27:32.example, you Israel yois that Chris Lilley is, I think, possibly -
:27:32. > :27:39.realise that Chris Lilley is, I think, possibly the best actor we
:27:39. > :27:43.have seen tonight. Better than the puppet! Better than Mel Gibson and
:27:43. > :27:46.Jodie Foster, he's a real shape shifter actor and needs better
:27:46. > :27:50.material. What about the Australian working-class, here we have had a
:27:50. > :27:56.big debate about chavs the demonisation of the working-class a
:27:56. > :27:59.new book out what do you make that have? If you were watching this in
:27:59. > :28:09.Australia, there might be an why theity with the cull tue, and you
:28:09. > :28:14.may join in - Identifying with the culture, we may join in watching it.
:28:14. > :28:17.We're watching it from here, but here from here the joke is on the
:28:17. > :28:20.working-class Australians. That is profoundly wrong f you look all the
:28:20. > :28:26.way through Chris Lilley, the joke in Summer Heights High, there is a
:28:26. > :28:30.rich girl the joke is on, and an incredibly sympathetically
:28:30. > :28:34.portrayed poor kid. It would be patronising to exempt one
:28:34. > :28:42.particular group of people from his school of mockery. I think it is
:28:42. > :28:46.true, if you look at S. Mouse, is he's a rapper who is pretending to
:28:46. > :28:50.be street, smack your elbow, and his father is on there saying, look
:28:50. > :28:54.at our house, we are rich. He comes from the middle-classes. I thought
:28:54. > :28:59.that worked wonderfully well. I thought that the working-class
:28:59. > :29:02.characters were less successful for me, because I really felt too
:29:02. > :29:06.uncomfortable with those twins. I felt it was quite repetitive. It
:29:06. > :29:10.didn't seem to move on. In that way, I don't think it worked for them.
:29:10. > :29:16.What do you think about the grenre of mockumentary, we have seen so
:29:16. > :29:21.many now over the years, is it reaching the end of its time?
:29:21. > :29:31.wonder, if we still made the time capsules, if they did one now it
:29:31. > :29:35.would be full of mockumentary. They would thinking S. Mouse we have to
:29:35. > :29:39.look him up. Chris Lilley is new to me. Lots said, lots of flaws and
:29:39. > :29:44.icky bits, but it is really good. Even if it is the last one on the
:29:44. > :29:47.planet, I'm sticking with it. is another chance to see the first
:29:47. > :29:51.two episodes of Angry Boys on BBC Three, later tonight in fact. And
:29:51. > :29:56.the next two episodes premier on Tuesday.
:29:56. > :29:59.Andrew Miller is one of those authors who seemed to relish an
:29:59. > :30:04.historical challenge, his first two novel, Ingenious Pain and Casanova,
:30:04. > :30:08.are both set in the 18th century. The most recent money, Morning
:30:08. > :30:13.Glory, takes place in Japan on the - One Morning Like A Bird, takes
:30:13. > :30:20.place in Japan. For book number six, Pure, he returns to the 18th
:30:20. > :30:25.century to set a story in prerevolutionary Paris.
:30:25. > :30:30."my Lord, I have made an initial examination of both the church and
:30:30. > :30:36.the cemetery, and see no reason to delay the work your Lordship has
:30:36. > :30:42.entrusted to me. It will be necessary to recruit at least 30
:30:42. > :30:48.able bodied men for the cemetery. It is a book set in Paris a few
:30:48. > :30:53.years before the revolution. It concerns a cemetery in the centre
:30:53. > :30:57.of par bri, the mid-18th century was poisoning the entire
:30:57. > :31:01.neighbourhood, and indeed that side of the city.
:31:01. > :31:05.So my novel, my story is about a young engineer, who comes from the
:31:05. > :31:15.provinces, sets about the destruction of the cemetery, and
:31:15. > :31:25.
:31:25. > :31:30.the church. He is, in a sense, The revolution is very much present
:31:30. > :31:37.in the wings of the book. This is a city before the storm. In its last
:31:37. > :31:43.moments of a way of life that was coming soon to an end. Black
:31:43. > :31:48.letters on the cemetery wall, tall, ragged, unignoreable letters
:31:48. > :31:56.extending from the cemetery door. Fat kings, slut Queen, beware,
:31:56. > :32:02.Beche is digging a hole big enough to bury all Versailles. Set in mid-
:32:02. > :32:07.18th century, and I say there is much that a reader can connect with.
:32:07. > :32:13.It is a time of, I don't know, banks and tourism and police, and
:32:13. > :32:19.police force, and hotels and postal services and whatever. It is the
:32:19. > :32:29.beginnings of a polite society, beginnings of new ideas about how
:32:29. > :32:40.
:32:40. > :32:48.we might be, what a society should "a year of rape, suicide, sudden
:32:48. > :32:53.death, of friendship too, of love. So Gillian, starting point for this
:32:53. > :32:57.is an extraordinary real life event, the excavation of a cemetery. The
:32:57. > :33:00.whole book is infused, in way, with decay? It is, and it is also
:33:01. > :33:05.infused with the period where it is. Andrew Miller is very good at
:33:05. > :33:09.evoking the period, and making you feel that you are inhabiting it,
:33:09. > :33:12.and the stink of it. And the world of it. But I did, I have to say, I
:33:12. > :33:16.thought there was something slightly odd about this book, in
:33:16. > :33:21.the sense that, at the same time as I thought it was extremely well
:33:21. > :33:26.written, and there are wonderful scenes in it, I also thought,
:33:26. > :33:30.reading it in the weak way, talking about women's writing has a
:33:30. > :33:33.sentimental sense of society, I actually thought this book had a
:33:33. > :33:41.sentimental sense of society. And part of the reason I thought that
:33:41. > :33:45.was the women characters. That, you know, apart from the crazy ziinggit,
:33:45. > :33:49.who was my favourite character, the daughter of the landlord that this
:33:49. > :33:53.engineer is staying with, and who acts in way that nobody understands.
:33:53. > :33:57.There was theer who with the heart of gold, there was the - the whore
:33:57. > :34:03.with the heart of gold, there was the young girl who looks after her
:34:03. > :34:08.grandfather and everybody else. And the landitey who looks after the -
:34:08. > :34:11.landlady who looks after the artist. Did you think the women characters
:34:11. > :34:15.were stereotypical? Some where, but actually I had more time for them
:34:15. > :34:19.than you did. Partly because I think a lot of this book is about
:34:19. > :34:24.what you can do with rationality and what you can't do with
:34:24. > :34:29.rationality. And yes, it's gender divided, but we have the engineer
:34:29. > :34:32.as the very spokesperson of the active person of an 18th century
:34:32. > :34:35.rationality that works. It is one of the interesting things about
:34:35. > :34:40.this novel, it is one of those rare novels which is about work and
:34:40. > :34:45.about effective work, all these things happen, rape, murder mayhem,
:34:45. > :34:49.you name it, but the cemetery gets cleared. The women don't speak, but
:34:49. > :34:53.they have a presence that is very important to the balance. This idea
:34:53. > :34:57.runs right through the book, the contrast between rationality, the
:34:57. > :35:03.ideas of the enlightenment, and religion, the church, mad priests
:35:03. > :35:08.lurking in the background? It is murder, mayhem and metaphysics, one
:35:08. > :35:12.thing I really liked about the book, is he takes the novel of ideas
:35:12. > :35:15.seriously. You never feel that someone is acting or speaking in
:35:15. > :35:20.way only to be there for rationalism. What is so great about
:35:20. > :35:23.the story is he starts out as the engineer, the rational man, as he
:35:24. > :35:28.digs down into the bones, and there is the past and religiosity comes
:35:28. > :35:33.back at him, and comes back at his whole ideals. In the end his
:35:33. > :35:37.identity is unwound, he cannot really relate his rationalism to
:35:37. > :35:41.what he has been doing, he's hyperrational thinking it doesn't
:35:41. > :35:46.matter. Digging up a few bones at the beginning of the story, what
:35:46. > :35:51.could go so wrong, it all goes so wrong, it is incredibly cleverly
:35:51. > :35:56.controlled, very touching. This whole idea of being pure,
:35:56. > :36:03.maintaining a moral position in the mid of this decay shows to be
:36:03. > :36:09.impossible? He has done something startling impressive, he has taken
:36:09. > :36:14.a historical event, and made it intellectually and emotionally
:36:14. > :36:20.alive, by using this metaphor that prefigures the revolution. We
:36:20. > :36:23.talked about the revolution talking about the democracy of the dead.
:36:23. > :36:28.Clearing out a graveyard is brilliant metaphor for that. He
:36:28. > :36:32.take it is and makes it so vivid, he doesn't patronise the past or
:36:32. > :36:36.make you feel a moment when he's displaying his research, you never
:36:36. > :36:42.feel a moment when the characters become sieveers for the ytdz, even
:36:42. > :36:45.- siefers for the ideas, and it is a brilliant novel. You have a sense
:36:45. > :36:49.of the impending French Revolution and there are various moments in
:36:49. > :36:54.the book, the action of the miners and you get a sense of the tumult
:36:54. > :37:00.going to be unleashed? You get it from the graffiti coming up around
:37:00. > :37:04.the city, and through the strangeness of the miners who don't
:37:04. > :37:09.even speak the same language, stuck in the graveyard doggedly digging
:37:09. > :37:14.up bones. You have the feeling that something is about to blow. I was
:37:14. > :37:19.sorry that something didn't blow a little more and sooner in the book
:37:19. > :37:24.for me. I sometimes felt that it had quite a lilting rhythm, which I
:37:24. > :37:29.admired, I wanted a bit more disruption at some point. I liked
:37:29. > :37:34.the excavation, that we worked our way through it. Pure by Andrew
:37:34. > :37:38.Miller was published this week. Once again, our own angry boy, Will
:37:38. > :37:44.Gompertz, has about out and about on our behalf. After Venice last
:37:44. > :37:47.week, he stayed closer to home for a look at what to expect from the
:37:47. > :37:54.London 2012, Cultural Olympiad, which you haven't noticed has been
:37:54. > :37:58.running for three years already. So, just 413 days until the 2012
:37:58. > :38:02.Olympics, which, of course, is jolly exciting. But perhaps not as
:38:02. > :38:08.exciting as the last three years of the British Cultural Olympiad, we
:38:08. > :38:13.have been really enjoying that, haven't we? Haven't we?
:38:13. > :38:18.Cultural Olympiad? I don't know. Ifrpblgt I don't know what is the
:38:18. > :38:22.Cultural Olympiad. What does this man think of the Cultural Olympiad?
:38:22. > :38:24.The Cultural Olympiad. What is that? I don't think I have heard of
:38:25. > :38:29.the Cultural Olympiad. What do you mean?
:38:29. > :38:37.OK, so awareness of the Cultural Olympiad is clearly pretty low. The
:38:37. > :38:42.arts have always been part of the modern Olympics, up until the early
:38:42. > :38:48.19th century there were medals handed out for painting. We had an
:38:48. > :38:53.arts competition' V & A. This time we thought we would go large, and
:38:53. > :38:57.spent �18 million on a four-year cultural Olympiad. It is fair to
:38:57. > :39:01.say we have established the first three years of the four-year
:39:01. > :39:06.Cultural Olympiad, and it has failed to capture the public
:39:06. > :39:12.imagination. The organisers have a new plan to do a new festival on
:39:12. > :39:14.June 21st, which they say will be the UK's biggest-ever festival. To
:39:14. > :39:19.celebrate the finale of the Cultural Olympiad. I think we are
:39:19. > :39:26.talking about the Festival of Britain here. It means there will
:39:26. > :39:29.be a royal Shakespeare festival, and a Pinobaust season, fantastic.
:39:29. > :39:35.It looks good, what about my new found friends at the national
:39:35. > :39:41.gallery what do they want? Justin Bieber, marry me!
:39:41. > :39:47.Fish and chips, I like fish and chips. A few famous faces.
:39:47. > :39:53.Different bands, classical music as well as pop and rock. Tribunal
:39:53. > :40:03.music, or just mud tribal music, not just mainstream. Clint Eastwood
:40:03. > :40:07.or John Wayne. I definitely fancy Robbie Williams. Robbie Williams.
:40:07. > :40:14.As an American I don't know about British writers. Shakespeare.
:40:14. > :40:24.Modern art or anything like that. That painter, the guy he painted
:40:24. > :40:30.
:40:30. > :40:35.the ceiling. A space simulator. Michael anglo-. He's dead!
:40:35. > :40:40.Who do you pick for the Olympiad? At a time when arts organisations
:40:40. > :40:44.are being cut, they should have put it in the pot so organisations
:40:44. > :40:48.doing great work didn't close. idea is to get things out of London
:40:48. > :40:53.and around the country, it is great idea. London theatre is in
:40:54. > :40:56.fantastic phase, lots of good writing, fantastic writers, I hope
:40:56. > :41:01.they get some on the road and get them out.
:41:01. > :41:04.Well, that's almost all for tonight. Remember you can catch up with all
:41:04. > :41:11.things review on the website. And the team here are primed and ready
:41:11. > :41:17.for The Tweets. My thanks to Gillian and Susan, and Anne and
:41:17. > :41:23.Johann, and the latest addition to our film, The Beaver. Most obedient
:41:23. > :41:25.of our panel. Suzy Klein will be here with highlights of the
:41:25. > :41:29.Edinburgh International Film Festival. We end with music from
:41:29. > :41:36.Jonathan Jeremiah, his new single, Heart of Stone.
:41:36. > :41:44.# I've been feeling # Like you messed me around
:41:44. > :41:50.# I've been hurting # But there's no way out
:41:50. > :41:54.# I've been hurting # But there's no way out
:41:54. > :41:56.# If' been reeling # I've been reeling since the day
:41:56. > :42:02.you left # Now I'm wandering
:42:02. > :42:06.# I'm wandering # I say I'm wondering how
:42:06. > :42:15.# You've no regrets # I've been wondering how
:42:15. > :42:18.# You've no regrets # You got a heart of stone
:42:18. > :42:25.# You got a heart that feels so cold
:42:25. > :42:35.# But I'm not letting go # I'm just letting you know
:42:35. > :42:37.
:42:37. > :42:43.# You got a heart of stone # I've been thinking
:42:43. > :42:46.# I've been thinking since you put me down
:42:46. > :42:50.# I've been better # I'll be better
:42:50. > :42:53.# I'll be so much better # Off without
:42:53. > :42:57.# I'll be better # Better
:42:57. > :42:59.# Off without # I'll be better better
:42:59. > :43:06.# Off without # Oh yeah
:43:06. > :43:10.# You got a heart of stone # You got a heart that feels so
:43:10. > :43:20.cold # I'm not letting go
:43:20. > :43:37.
:43:37. > :43:40.# I'm just letting you know # You got a heart of stone
:43:40. > :43:48.# You got a heart that feels so cold
:43:48. > :43:57.# I'm not letting go # I'm just letting you know
:43:57. > :43:59.# You got a heart of stone # You got a heart that feels so
:43:59. > :44:04.cold # I'm not letting go