0:00:02 > 0:00:06Across the country, behind closed doors, we British are building.
0:00:08 > 0:00:12We're building up, down and out to improve our homes.
0:00:13 > 0:00:16- Will we get planning permission? - I've got reservations
0:00:16 > 0:00:19But before we build we need permission.
0:00:19 > 0:00:23Permission from the planners. A bunch of people dedicated to
0:00:23 > 0:00:26protecting our public spaces and neighbourhoods.
0:00:26 > 0:00:29I'm really, really annoyed by planning.
0:00:29 > 0:00:32So, if you've ever wanted a bigger kitchen,
0:00:32 > 0:00:35an extra bedroom or an en suite bathroom, stand by.
0:00:35 > 0:00:39It's time to Plan It, Build It.
0:00:45 > 0:00:48This country has a rich and colourful history,
0:00:48 > 0:00:51and our buildings are a time capsule back to the past.
0:00:51 > 0:00:54From medieval dwellings to quirky modern houses -
0:00:54 > 0:00:55each one tells a story.
0:00:57 > 0:01:01Planners must conserve these historic pieces at all costs
0:01:01 > 0:01:05and to help them, 450,000 of the most important architectural
0:01:05 > 0:01:09and historic structures have been given specially-protected status.
0:01:12 > 0:01:18They are the gems of our historic environment and it's really important
0:01:18 > 0:01:22to protect them because once they're gone, they're gone for ever.
0:01:22 > 0:01:25So, today's show is all about these buildings of importance - what
0:01:25 > 0:01:29is and isn't possible when it comes to extending a listed building.
0:01:29 > 0:01:32And if you buy such a building, will you reap the financial rewards
0:01:32 > 0:01:34or inherit a historic headache?
0:01:38 > 0:01:39The planners will meet
0:01:39 > 0:01:41a couple who have bought one of the most beautiful
0:01:41 > 0:01:44buildings in Hastings.
0:01:44 > 0:01:48Over here by the bar this is going to be the, kind of, dining area,
0:01:48 > 0:01:51this will be the kitchen.
0:01:51 > 0:01:54And one of the most extraordinary cases we've seen...
0:01:54 > 0:01:57We've got a little bit of a problem as to how I'm going to get a
0:01:57 > 0:02:00BMW 5 Series down into a cave.
0:02:00 > 0:02:03I'm just worried we're going round and round in circles.
0:02:03 > 0:02:06But have these applicants bitten off more than they can chew?
0:02:06 > 0:02:09Can they combine conservation with appreciation?
0:02:09 > 0:02:12And, crucially, by respecting the past are they heading
0:02:12 > 0:02:14for financial ruin or financial reward?
0:02:17 > 0:02:21The older a building is the more likely it is to be listed.
0:02:21 > 0:02:24But not all listed buildings are grand stately homes.
0:02:24 > 0:02:26From schools to stations, any structure with special
0:02:26 > 0:02:30architectural significance will be protected for the nation.
0:02:31 > 0:02:34Taking on such a building brings with it responsibility.
0:02:35 > 0:02:39More than half of people do not know what they're getting into
0:02:39 > 0:02:42with a listed building. They just absorb money.
0:02:42 > 0:02:45They cost a lot of money to improve.
0:02:45 > 0:02:48It's very restrictive having a listed building
0:02:48 > 0:02:51but, wow, how lovely to live in one.
0:02:52 > 0:02:56Hastings was host to William the Conqueror's invasion in 1066
0:02:56 > 0:03:00and in the years since this historic event it's collected its fair
0:03:00 > 0:03:04share of historic buildings - over 900 at the last count.
0:03:05 > 0:03:08Hastings town planners work tirelessly to protect these
0:03:08 > 0:03:12structures, from stucco-fronted seaside homes to the historic
0:03:12 > 0:03:14pier - soon to be restored.
0:03:15 > 0:03:20They are part of our history, tell the story of the development
0:03:20 > 0:03:23of the town and they are the character.
0:03:24 > 0:03:29St Leonards-on-Sea boasts many of Hastings' finest buildings.
0:03:29 > 0:03:32These elegant, classically-styled terraces along the waterfront
0:03:32 > 0:03:34were designed and built by James Burton,
0:03:34 > 0:03:38a leading architect of the late 18th and early 19th century.
0:03:38 > 0:03:40Burton was responsible for designing
0:03:40 > 0:03:44and building large parts of Georgian London before turning
0:03:44 > 0:03:48his attention to a spectacular seaside resort in St Leonards.
0:03:48 > 0:03:51Most of these buildings have been converted into flats, but if you can
0:03:51 > 0:03:55get your hands on a five-bed family property you've got yourself a gem.
0:03:55 > 0:03:57Prices are on the up.
0:03:57 > 0:04:01Two-bed flats start at around £250 grand,
0:04:01 > 0:04:05with family homes going for a cool half a million pounds!
0:04:05 > 0:04:08One of the most beautiful buildings in the whole area is
0:04:08 > 0:04:09the Crown House.
0:04:09 > 0:04:12It's a Grade II star listed detached, Georgian villa.
0:04:12 > 0:04:15Up until recently it was being used as a pub.
0:04:17 > 0:04:20It was a rough old pub and we were wondering who owned it
0:04:20 > 0:04:24and the history of it and we started looking into it.
0:04:24 > 0:04:26About six months after coming
0:04:26 > 0:04:31down here I saw it on an obscure, kind of, for sale website in Maidstone.
0:04:31 > 0:04:33Meet Janine Rich.
0:04:33 > 0:04:36She and her husband Pete have taken a massive leap of faith.
0:04:36 > 0:04:39They've bought this incredible building
0:04:39 > 0:04:41and intend to restore it as a family home.
0:04:41 > 0:04:45We investigated it as in previous planning
0:04:45 > 0:04:47and things that had been done to it in the past or
0:04:47 > 0:04:50things that might cause us a lot of complications
0:04:50 > 0:04:52which then we wouldn't have pursued buying it,
0:04:52 > 0:04:56but it all seemed to be kind of OK, it was manageable.
0:04:56 > 0:04:58The Crown House has a grand history.
0:04:58 > 0:05:02A young Princess Victoria stayed here before she became Queen
0:05:02 > 0:05:04and it's a much-loved landmark in the town.
0:05:04 > 0:05:06It's currently a commercial property,
0:05:06 > 0:05:11but the Riches have paid £385 to apply for permission to
0:05:11 > 0:05:14change its use from commercial to residential.
0:05:14 > 0:05:16The problem is, it's listed,
0:05:16 > 0:05:20so any kind of change is right royally complicated.
0:05:20 > 0:05:23You're looking after it on behalf of the country as a whole
0:05:23 > 0:05:27and even though the general public can't just walk in and have a look,
0:05:27 > 0:05:28you know, it's your responsibility
0:05:28 > 0:05:30to protect it for future generations.
0:05:30 > 0:05:33So here's the problem - when it comes to listed buildings,
0:05:33 > 0:05:37it's not just the outside features that require special attention.
0:05:37 > 0:05:41Planners get involved in every change both outside and in.
0:05:41 > 0:05:44They encourage people to restore period homes,
0:05:44 > 0:05:47but what planners require for historical accuracy may not
0:05:47 > 0:05:51fit the needs of a modern family, causing frustration and conflict.
0:05:51 > 0:05:53Having never had a listed building before we didn't realise
0:05:53 > 0:05:56the complications that that would involve, but then you don't until you
0:05:56 > 0:05:59get into it, you buy it - you don't really know.
0:05:59 > 0:06:00But it didn't put us off.
0:06:02 > 0:06:05So, how about the all-important finances?
0:06:05 > 0:06:10The Riches got this house for an apparent snip at £260,000.
0:06:10 > 0:06:14They plan to spend at least £80,000 on the first phase of renovations,
0:06:14 > 0:06:17and will save money by doing much of the work themselves.
0:06:17 > 0:06:19They're not in a rush,
0:06:19 > 0:06:23and they're sitting on a potentially huge investment. When finished
0:06:23 > 0:06:27this property could be worth several times what they paid for it.
0:06:27 > 0:06:30We're not in any hurry. This is like a long term project so...
0:06:31 > 0:06:33..I would say...
0:06:34 > 0:06:38..probably, I don't know, five years, ten years
0:06:38 > 0:06:41till it's looking immaculate and perfect.
0:06:42 > 0:06:45The first phase is to get everything out that's been
0:06:45 > 0:06:48put in in the last 60 years.
0:06:48 > 0:06:51When we actually move in we're going to be living upstairs and
0:06:51 > 0:06:55working on downstairs, so this...
0:06:55 > 0:06:57Our plan is that
0:06:57 > 0:07:02this will be a living area, an open- plan lounge.
0:07:02 > 0:07:04Over here, where the bar is at the moment,
0:07:04 > 0:07:08this is going to be a kind of dining area.
0:07:08 > 0:07:13And up here this will be a kitchen.
0:07:13 > 0:07:17I guess we'll find out as we put in plans what will be OK
0:07:17 > 0:07:19and what won't be OK.
0:07:20 > 0:07:23Janine and Pete's plan for the perfect home depends on them
0:07:23 > 0:07:26getting the crucial first stage of planning permission.
0:07:26 > 0:07:29They must get authority to change the use of this
0:07:29 > 0:07:31property from business to residential.
0:07:31 > 0:07:35Planner Carol Boydell will be paying them a site visit and if she
0:07:35 > 0:07:39decides the change of use isn't in the property's best interests, the
0:07:39 > 0:07:44Riches' expensive gamble will prove a disaster of historic proportions.
0:07:46 > 0:07:50Carol's boss in Hastings Planning Department is Raymond Crawford.
0:07:50 > 0:07:53He heads up Planning Management and takes a keen
0:07:53 > 0:07:56interest in all listed building projects in the town.
0:07:56 > 0:07:59Complex decisions about these buildings require his personal
0:07:59 > 0:08:03attention and his legendary calm approach...
0:08:03 > 0:08:07but even he is surprised by his next application.
0:08:07 > 0:08:11On the face of it it seems like quite an interesting, unusual proposal.
0:08:11 > 0:08:13What they want to do is use some caves
0:08:13 > 0:08:16at the back of one of the properties on the seafront
0:08:16 > 0:08:17for a crime museum.
0:08:19 > 0:08:24Meet Joel Griggs - a man who does, indeed, have a most unusual plan.
0:08:24 > 0:08:27The Palace Court is another of Hastings' fine listed buildings.
0:08:27 > 0:08:30It was once a bustling Victorian hotel
0:08:30 > 0:08:34but behind its fine facade lies a network of empty caves.
0:08:34 > 0:08:38Joel wants to turn these caves into a ghoulish crime museum...
0:08:41 > 0:08:45This is going to be the entrance area and the shop area.
0:08:45 > 0:08:49I'm going to have moveable displays with merchandise on them
0:08:49 > 0:08:51and the till, probably,
0:08:51 > 0:08:55up at that end with a turnstile to let people into the attraction.
0:08:55 > 0:08:59Obviously, it's going to need some work to it.
0:08:59 > 0:09:05This patch that you see here is a blocked doorway to the caves
0:09:05 > 0:09:07so I'm going to open that up
0:09:07 > 0:09:12and that will be the main entrance to the caves and exhibits behind.
0:09:15 > 0:09:19Joel will charge visitors £7 to see four themed rooms containing his
0:09:19 > 0:09:24macabre collection. One of the rooms will be out-of-bounds to children.
0:09:24 > 0:09:27This is a cave I'm going to call The Murder Room,
0:09:27 > 0:09:30this is going to hold some of the more gruesome exhibits.
0:09:30 > 0:09:33Complicated cos it's a listed building. There is
0:09:33 > 0:09:35a history of caves being used in that area.
0:09:35 > 0:09:39The two pieces of planning permission I have applied for are,
0:09:39 > 0:09:41first of all, change of use.
0:09:41 > 0:09:44This isn't actually listed as having a use at the moment,
0:09:44 > 0:09:47but obviously, it's got to go over to being a visitor attraction.
0:09:47 > 0:09:50Alongside the planning permission for it
0:09:50 > 0:09:52being a listed building -
0:09:52 > 0:09:56the actual Palace Court is a listed building and, as you saw as you walked through,
0:09:56 > 0:09:58it's quite splendid and the planners
0:09:58 > 0:10:02want to make sure that whatever I do is in keeping with that.
0:10:02 > 0:10:05Setting up the museum is a bold move.
0:10:05 > 0:10:07Joel was recently made redundant and decided to
0:10:07 > 0:10:11turn his hobby of collecting crime memorabilia into a business.
0:10:11 > 0:10:15The museum will be stocked with over 400 extraordinary items that Joel's
0:10:15 > 0:10:20gathered from police archives, auctions and private collections.
0:10:20 > 0:10:22This is the map of the caves...
0:10:22 > 0:10:26and I'm starting to put on here what is actually going in
0:10:26 > 0:10:27what individual area.
0:10:27 > 0:10:29We've got a car
0:10:29 > 0:10:34which was used in the recent film... Mesrine.
0:10:34 > 0:10:37But we've got a little bit of a problem as to how I'm going to get
0:10:37 > 0:10:42a BMW 5 Series down into a cave through a door about that size!
0:10:42 > 0:10:44This is 207 million -
0:10:44 > 0:10:47the largest drug hall ever, I think it will be very effective
0:10:47 > 0:10:49under a spotlight...
0:10:49 > 0:10:52Joel estimates it'll cost him £85,000 to set up
0:10:52 > 0:10:55the museum, however, if visitor numbers are high enough,
0:10:55 > 0:10:59he hopes to rake in £80,000 a year.
0:10:59 > 0:11:05This is an artwork done by a serial killer called Michele De Lupo,
0:11:05 > 0:11:08who was an Italian hedonist in the '80s.
0:11:08 > 0:11:12I've also got a bullet which was from the gun
0:11:12 > 0:11:14seized by police after
0:11:14 > 0:11:18Reggie Kray shot Jack "The Hat" McVicar
0:11:18 > 0:11:24and the gun jammed thus saving McVicar's life for about 20 seconds.
0:11:24 > 0:11:27Joel's dreams of setting up his crime museum at the back
0:11:27 > 0:11:31of a listed building all hinge on what Raymond thinks of his plans.
0:11:31 > 0:11:33If the chief planner doesn't bite the bullet,
0:11:33 > 0:11:37it'll be a killer blow for Joel's quirky crime collection.
0:11:40 > 0:11:43In St Leonards, it's an important day for Janine Rich
0:11:43 > 0:11:45and her husband Pete.
0:11:45 > 0:11:48Carol and Raymond are en-route to conduct the crucial site visit.
0:11:48 > 0:11:50This will determine
0:11:50 > 0:11:53whether the property can be used as a residential dwelling.
0:11:53 > 0:11:56If the Rich's don't get this all-important approval,
0:11:56 > 0:11:58they'll have bought a total turkey.
0:12:00 > 0:12:02ALL: Hello.
0:12:02 > 0:12:04- Raymond Crawford.- Hi, Janine Baker.
0:12:04 > 0:12:08Have you just started downstairs... there was dance floor here.
0:12:08 > 0:12:12There was. We've started upstairs, we haven't done anything downstairs as such...
0:12:12 > 0:12:16Everything you can see downstairs is just stuff that's come from here,
0:12:16 > 0:12:18- gone down. - And the old bar's been taken out.
0:12:19 > 0:12:21Is this going to be a bathroom?
0:12:21 > 0:12:23It is, yes.
0:12:25 > 0:12:28Our temporary kitchen.
0:12:28 > 0:12:31Cos that's the original doorway through there.
0:12:31 > 0:12:34That's an example of what might have been the original
0:12:34 > 0:12:36layout there.
0:12:36 > 0:12:38- So that's the cupboard? - Yes.
0:12:38 > 0:12:41The planners are keen to see the building returned
0:12:41 > 0:12:43to its former glory,
0:12:43 > 0:12:46but the couple need to adapt the property for 21st-century living.
0:12:46 > 0:12:51Ray and Carol must be convinced that these two aims are compatible.
0:12:51 > 0:12:54You're not having any en suites are you? At this stage?
0:12:54 > 0:12:58We will try to, yes, if we're allowed to.
0:12:58 > 0:13:00That's quite a tricky thing
0:13:00 > 0:13:03when you're breaking up room shapes and things.
0:13:03 > 0:13:06This is our...will be our living area eventually like a big
0:13:06 > 0:13:08open-plan lounge
0:13:08 > 0:13:10that's what we're hoping for. Again,
0:13:10 > 0:13:12take up all the floor, get back to the floorboards.
0:13:12 > 0:13:14Eventually...we're planning...to go
0:13:14 > 0:13:19for our kitchen to be here. Originally, on the old plans, the kitchen was here.
0:13:22 > 0:13:24The consultation period has closed.
0:13:24 > 0:13:26- That's it, really. - Thank you very much.- So...
0:13:26 > 0:13:29Thank you for showing us round, it's been fascinating.
0:13:29 > 0:13:31- Thank you very much.- It's been nice to meet you.
0:13:34 > 0:13:37I think that went really well I was really pleased with
0:13:37 > 0:13:39the building, seeing all the cornices still there,
0:13:39 > 0:13:41that's a good sign.
0:13:41 > 0:13:43Lots of indications of how it's going to look and it
0:13:43 > 0:13:47will work as a single family dwelling house, as well.
0:13:47 > 0:13:53We want people living in it, we want to retain the building and keep
0:13:53 > 0:13:55it structurally safe and it's only going to happen
0:13:55 > 0:13:57if people are living in it or it's being used.
0:13:57 > 0:14:00Because, otherwise it's just going to deteriorate.
0:14:00 > 0:14:01The longer it stays closed.
0:14:01 > 0:14:05- It doesn't take long for an empty building to deteriorate.- Yeah.
0:14:05 > 0:14:09- I think it was quite a positive meeting.- It was. Our first one, though.
0:14:09 > 0:14:12- It's our first one...- Things could be different next time but that was good.
0:14:12 > 0:14:14It's daunting but exciting...
0:14:15 > 0:14:18..and we shall find out in the future.
0:14:18 > 0:14:20Fingers crossed for the Rich's.
0:14:22 > 0:14:26Joel Griggs wants to create a crime museum in caves behind this
0:14:26 > 0:14:28fine listed facade.
0:14:28 > 0:14:31His father John, an architect, is helping him with the plans.
0:14:31 > 0:14:35But, as always with listed buildings, there are problems a-plenty...
0:14:35 > 0:14:38- Hi, I'm Mr Griggs.- Hello, I'm Ray Crawford.
0:14:38 > 0:14:41John and Joel have popped in to the council offices to see
0:14:41 > 0:14:45head planner Raymond and planning officer Calum Rowley.
0:14:45 > 0:14:49They've come to discuss the crucial issue of signage.
0:14:49 > 0:14:51Will they be allowed a sign big enough to
0:14:51 > 0:14:53promote their tourist attraction?
0:14:54 > 0:15:00The signage is a main issue to the change of the street aspect.
0:15:00 > 0:15:02That's what was there originally...
0:15:04 > 0:15:07..that's what we'd like to do...
0:15:08 > 0:15:12..with a sign that scrolls across here.
0:15:12 > 0:15:14Getting rid of that and that.
0:15:14 > 0:15:17I suspect that might be an issue...
0:15:17 > 0:15:19but there might be, um...
0:15:19 > 0:15:22another way of dealing with it.
0:15:22 > 0:15:28- My concern is getting as many customers down there as possible. - Yeah.
0:15:28 > 0:15:32I have this dreaded fear of making this huge investment down there
0:15:32 > 0:15:35and you guys say I can have something
0:15:35 > 0:15:37the size of a postage stamp to...
0:15:37 > 0:15:40CHUCKLING ..pull the punters in.
0:15:41 > 0:15:46- No, well...signage on listed buildings is-is difficult.- Yeah.
0:15:46 > 0:15:48Yeah, but we'll try and be realistic...
0:15:48 > 0:15:51So will we, definitely.
0:15:51 > 0:15:55Although they were suggesting a sign which wouldn't be acceptable to us
0:15:55 > 0:15:58they understand why and we will have a think about that
0:15:58 > 0:16:01and try and come forward with something that will be...
0:16:01 > 0:16:03give them the publicity they need
0:16:03 > 0:16:08and also not impact on the listed building.
0:16:08 > 0:16:11It's a listed building, they're going to have something to say about it...
0:16:11 > 0:16:13they don't want a huge plastic sign
0:16:13 > 0:16:17out the front but, obviously, I need the advertisement
0:16:17 > 0:16:21and the...curb appeal or whatever they call it
0:16:21 > 0:16:23of drawing people in.
0:16:23 > 0:16:26The best way to discuss planning problems is to see them in situ.
0:16:26 > 0:16:28A few weeks later, Raymond
0:16:28 > 0:16:32and Calum head along the seafront to make their all-important site visit.
0:16:32 > 0:16:35They start inside, but which way is it going to go?
0:16:40 > 0:16:42Crikey.
0:16:42 > 0:16:43Right.
0:16:43 > 0:16:48I suppose the main feature of this area is, of course, the roof light.
0:16:48 > 0:16:51- It's just that the glazing needs replacing.- Yeah.
0:16:51 > 0:16:53And it needs redecorating.
0:16:53 > 0:16:56- So, that's all you're going to do up there?- Yes.
0:16:56 > 0:16:58That will be the entrance into the caves.
0:16:58 > 0:17:01You'll see that from the other side.
0:17:01 > 0:17:02It's been bricked-up
0:17:02 > 0:17:06- but the entrance to the caves is behind there.- Right.
0:17:06 > 0:17:09And the last one is...over here.
0:17:09 > 0:17:12Now I've seen the plans, I hadn't appreciated how big it is.
0:17:12 > 0:17:14So...it's er...
0:17:14 > 0:17:17- Have you got enough stuff to fill it up?- Don't ask!
0:17:17 > 0:17:18LAUGHTER
0:17:20 > 0:17:22Time to discuss the major planning issue -
0:17:22 > 0:17:25changes to the listed facade.
0:17:25 > 0:17:28Putting a big sign up on the front of the property may be
0:17:28 > 0:17:29a step too far.
0:17:29 > 0:17:33When we met before you were hoping to persuade the neighbours to
0:17:33 > 0:17:35take off this big fascias and go back to...
0:17:35 > 0:17:37- I think we can.- Yeah.
0:17:37 > 0:17:42But then the latest drawing you've submitted had
0:17:42 > 0:17:45what appeared to be those repainted.
0:17:46 > 0:17:49- No, I didn't say that...- OK.
0:17:49 > 0:17:51I said that's the fall-back position.
0:17:51 > 0:17:53Right, OK.
0:17:53 > 0:17:55I don't like this at all...
0:17:55 > 0:17:59It's not reflective of the building, it doesn't do anything for us.
0:18:00 > 0:18:05Can't you have a more traditional, projecting hanging sign?
0:18:05 > 0:18:07No, no, it's not sufficient...
0:18:07 > 0:18:09I'm all right with that, but what's it going to hang off.
0:18:09 > 0:18:12It's interesting...I don't know.
0:18:12 > 0:18:14I don't know.
0:18:14 > 0:18:16We feel we have given it a lot of consideration
0:18:16 > 0:18:19and been sympathetic to the building - absolutely.
0:18:19 > 0:18:22- OK, good.- Thank you.- Cheers, Ray. - Good to see you again.
0:18:25 > 0:18:31I'm particularly concerned about the external advertising,
0:18:31 > 0:18:33it could become a real issue.
0:18:33 > 0:18:35At the end of the day it's a visitor attraction
0:18:35 > 0:18:39and I've got to be able to let the public know I'm here.
0:18:39 > 0:18:41I want to do that as loudly as possible.
0:18:41 > 0:18:45I can understand from their point of view,
0:18:45 > 0:18:46cos they want to get on and do the work
0:18:46 > 0:18:49and for things to evolve as they go along,
0:18:49 > 0:18:53but we can't work like that, we do need some facts,
0:18:53 > 0:18:56- something we can actually approve, at the end of the day.- Yeah.
0:18:56 > 0:18:58After this visit I think there's more problems than
0:18:58 > 0:19:03- what we thought and what they've told us previously.- Yeah.
0:19:03 > 0:19:06I'm just worried we are going round and round in circles.
0:19:06 > 0:19:07Oh, dear!
0:19:09 > 0:19:13There are nearly half a million listed buildings in the UK,
0:19:13 > 0:19:15but not all are ranked of equal importance.
0:19:15 > 0:19:18There are several categories - at the very top we have
0:19:18 > 0:19:22Scheduled Ancient Monuments and Grade 1 Listed - only a very small
0:19:22 > 0:19:27proportion of exceptional buildings fall into these elevated categories.
0:19:27 > 0:19:29Then there's Grade 2 Star listed -
0:19:29 > 0:19:32and again, this is an exclusive club.
0:19:32 > 0:19:36Finally Grade 2 listed buildings make up by far the largest group.
0:19:36 > 0:19:39The Palace Court falls into this category
0:19:39 > 0:19:42so the structure is protected, but there's some room for manoeuvre.
0:19:42 > 0:19:45That's potentially good news for Joel and John.
0:19:45 > 0:19:49The Crown House, on the other hand, is Grade 2 star listed.
0:19:49 > 0:19:52This puts it amongst the most cherished buildings in the land.
0:19:52 > 0:19:55So, will Pete and Janine be allowed to
0:19:55 > 0:19:58pursue their dream of transforming it into a modern family home?
0:19:58 > 0:19:59Well...
0:19:59 > 0:20:02today's the day they find out whether they can get the all-
0:20:02 > 0:20:06important change of use, from commercial to residential.
0:20:06 > 0:20:10I'm going to phone Janine and tell her what the outcome is.
0:20:10 > 0:20:13PHONE RINGING TONE
0:20:20 > 0:20:23- Hello.- Oh, hello, is that Janine? - Speaking.
0:20:23 > 0:20:25Hello, it's Carol Boydell from Hastings Planning Department.
0:20:25 > 0:20:27- Hi, Carol.- Hello there.
0:20:27 > 0:20:30I'm pleased to tell you both applications have been approved
0:20:30 > 0:20:32- and you've got...- That's fantastic news.
0:20:32 > 0:20:36- You are over your first hurdle, anyway.- Really good...
0:20:36 > 0:20:39That's a yes for Janine and Pete! Phew!
0:20:39 > 0:20:40Phase one out of the way.
0:20:40 > 0:20:42- We're very pleased, aren't we?- Yeah.
0:20:42 > 0:20:44- It was a big worry.- That was the main worry,
0:20:44 > 0:20:47change of use, cos without that there wasn't a lot we could do.
0:20:47 > 0:20:49We couldn't move on, really.
0:20:53 > 0:20:55Back at the council offices, Calum has received amended
0:20:55 > 0:21:00plans for the Crime Museum with more acceptable signage, but now there's
0:21:00 > 0:21:01a new problem.
0:21:01 > 0:21:04There's been three objections and that's why it's
0:21:04 > 0:21:07going to go to Planning Committee now, so, er, yeah.
0:21:07 > 0:21:10I'm going to recommend approval
0:21:10 > 0:21:12for it but, erm...
0:21:12 > 0:21:16again it's down to the Planning Committee to decide, at the end of the day,
0:21:16 > 0:21:18whether they want to go with my recommendation.
0:21:18 > 0:21:21A couple of the objections have been from the same, erm,
0:21:21 > 0:21:24party, but different people.
0:21:24 > 0:21:28It's mainly regarding access. The other objection is...
0:21:28 > 0:21:30that's from the neighbour.
0:21:30 > 0:21:34She wasn't too happy with losing quite a lot of signage.
0:21:36 > 0:21:38This is a crushing blow for Joel.
0:21:38 > 0:21:41With more than two objections, the planners are duty bound to
0:21:41 > 0:21:44refer his application to the Planning Committee,
0:21:44 > 0:21:47putting his whole project in serious jeopardy.
0:21:47 > 0:21:49I wasn't expecting objections,
0:21:49 > 0:21:52but I haven't been through this process before.
0:21:52 > 0:21:55There's a lot more responsibility when you've got a listed building.
0:21:55 > 0:21:57It didn't really occur to me at the time
0:21:57 > 0:22:01I first looked at the premises, I must say, cos it is such a complete
0:22:01 > 0:22:03toilet at the moment...
0:22:03 > 0:22:08Every moment that I'm not open is time I'm not pulling in any money and
0:22:08 > 0:22:11so it's all outgoing cash
0:22:11 > 0:22:14and nothing's coming in at the moment, which makes it tricky,
0:22:14 > 0:22:17so I really do want to get up and running as quickly as possible.
0:22:17 > 0:22:20You know, it's a listed building cos it's got a great pedigree and heritage
0:22:20 > 0:22:25and history and so on, but you wouldn't know it from looking at it at the moment.
0:22:25 > 0:22:28As I say, ever hopeful, ever confident.
0:22:28 > 0:22:29HE CHUCKLES
0:22:32 > 0:22:35Over on St Leonards' promenade, the Rich's are working on the next
0:22:35 > 0:22:37step of their project.
0:22:37 > 0:22:39They've made some important decisions about how
0:22:39 > 0:22:43they want to return the building to its former glory AND make it
0:22:43 > 0:22:44fit for a 21st-century family.
0:22:45 > 0:22:49So, we've got the change of use to residential use, so now we're
0:22:49 > 0:22:55putting in plans for listed-building consent for upstairs and downstairs.
0:22:55 > 0:22:58So originally, this was going to be two rooms as it was originally,
0:22:58 > 0:23:01but now we've changed our minds, we're going to keep it as one room
0:23:01 > 0:23:06as a lounge, it just lends itself with that view to being a lounge.
0:23:08 > 0:23:13Here was the bar from that window to here.
0:23:14 > 0:23:19That back wall was all covered up, we found those two windows.
0:23:19 > 0:23:22Listed building consent will allow Janine
0:23:22 > 0:23:25and Pete to alter the structure of the building, but nothing
0:23:25 > 0:23:29will be easy - planners will want to be satisfied that all changes,
0:23:29 > 0:23:34however minor, reflect the original style and historic importance.
0:23:34 > 0:23:36We're going to block this off with a door.
0:23:36 > 0:23:39Yeah we were originally going to leave it all open-plan,
0:23:39 > 0:23:43but we've decided now that we will section this area off to be a...
0:23:43 > 0:23:46- A bedroom for now. For Lee.- But we will need planning permission
0:23:46 > 0:23:50to reinstate the wall there, originally there was a wall there
0:23:50 > 0:23:52so, hopefully, it won't be a problem.
0:23:52 > 0:23:56And all this is going to be open plan... desk...office over there?
0:23:56 > 0:24:01Office over there. Yeah, it will divide itself up nicely.
0:24:01 > 0:24:05Because of the building itself being...listed...related
0:24:05 > 0:24:09to James Burton and all that...the guy that built the building
0:24:09 > 0:24:11and was involved in St Leonards,
0:24:11 > 0:24:14it's all been a bit intense, hasn't it, really?
0:24:14 > 0:24:16Yeah.
0:24:16 > 0:24:20It's had a lot more attention from people that I thought it would get.
0:24:20 > 0:24:22Yeah, because of its history. It's a good thing,
0:24:22 > 0:24:24because it needs to be kept...
0:24:24 > 0:24:28..nice but it make you think what happened
0:24:28 > 0:24:31in the last 50 years to allow it to be as it is now?
0:24:31 > 0:24:35For virtually all listed buildings, the planning process is not
0:24:35 > 0:24:38quick and easy, but the long-term benefits are huge.
0:24:38 > 0:24:42It will take Janine and Pete many years to get the home they want,
0:24:42 > 0:24:44but, wow, what a home it will be.
0:24:46 > 0:24:50Can Joel Griggs also realise his dream?
0:24:50 > 0:24:53His hopes of setting up a Crime Museum are in the firing line.
0:24:53 > 0:24:56There have been three local objections
0:24:56 > 0:24:59and the decision has been referred to committee.
0:24:59 > 0:25:01I don't anticipate any problems tonight, but you never know
0:25:01 > 0:25:04what might crop up and they might get a bit, kind of,
0:25:04 > 0:25:06concerned about the whole access issue
0:25:06 > 0:25:11because people do have a Right of Way through the corridor.
0:25:11 > 0:25:14And the other thing, they might not be able to get their heads around
0:25:14 > 0:25:18the fact they're caves and where the caves are in relation to the rest of the building.
0:25:18 > 0:25:21Going to put some photographs up, which, hopefully, will help them
0:25:21 > 0:25:24cos what we want to avoid is them deferring the decision for a site visit
0:25:24 > 0:25:27which will then delay the whole thing for another month.
0:25:27 > 0:25:30We really don't want...don't want to see that.
0:25:30 > 0:25:33Hastings' Planning Committee sits once a month to discuss the
0:25:33 > 0:25:37most controversial and strategically important planning decisions.
0:25:37 > 0:25:41The committee is made up of ten locally-elected councillors.
0:25:41 > 0:25:45They hear deputations from all sides before making up their minds.
0:25:45 > 0:25:48Remember, if permission is refused, it will not only destroy
0:25:48 > 0:25:52Joel's dream, it will be a huge blow to his bank balance...
0:25:52 > 0:25:56Well, on the one hand it could go through with no problems
0:25:56 > 0:25:58and we'd be up and running, erm...
0:25:58 > 0:26:02which, fingers crossed, does happen. Obviously, there's no guarantee of that.
0:26:02 > 0:26:06If that doesn't happen then...we're back to square one.
0:26:06 > 0:26:10This is the Palace Avenue arcade and caves.
0:26:13 > 0:26:17Creation of a tourist attraction within caves to the rear of
0:26:17 > 0:26:18Palace Court.
0:26:19 > 0:26:24I would approve, erm, acceptance of this application, erm...
0:26:24 > 0:26:28I think it's rather splendid that we are going to have, touch wood,
0:26:28 > 0:26:32another tourist attraction on the seafront.
0:26:32 > 0:26:36- Erm...which will improve the town. - It does look rather dingy
0:26:36 > 0:26:40and in need of some action. Seeing the photos...
0:26:40 > 0:26:43of what it's like inside, even more so.
0:26:43 > 0:26:44And...
0:26:44 > 0:26:48the idea that... whatever people will think of the specific topic
0:26:48 > 0:26:51of this museum...the fact we're going to have another tourist attraction
0:26:51 > 0:26:56and somebody's keen to come and improve the Hastings' tourist offer
0:26:56 > 0:26:58has got to be to the erm...
0:26:59 > 0:27:01..benefit of the town.
0:27:01 > 0:27:04Absolutely. So, it's been proposed and seconded.
0:27:04 > 0:27:07We approve it's application - all those in favour...
0:27:07 > 0:27:09And that's unanimous.
0:27:10 > 0:27:12That's a yes for Joel!
0:27:15 > 0:27:18- Over the moon.- Yeah.- Really, really happy.
0:27:18 > 0:27:21I thought it was a real positive result, unanimous.
0:27:21 > 0:27:24It was a bit of an unusual application, to be honest,
0:27:24 > 0:27:29erm, a true-crime museum is not to everyone's taste.
0:27:29 > 0:27:32The thing that was in our favour was that Hastings wants it.
0:27:32 > 0:27:36They said they'd be the first through the door so I'll take them up on that!
0:27:36 > 0:27:38- But no free tickets!- No.- Ha-ha.
0:27:39 > 0:27:42Joel has planned it and will soon build it.
0:27:42 > 0:27:45He hopes his attraction will open within months
0:27:45 > 0:27:48and revitalise a once famous Hastings building.
0:27:48 > 0:27:49If things go well,
0:27:49 > 0:27:53he's hoping to make his 85 grand investment back in 3 years.
0:27:53 > 0:27:54A big result.
0:27:56 > 0:27:59The Rich's project will take longer, but they're well on their way
0:27:59 > 0:28:02to restoring one of St Leonard's finest buildings.
0:28:02 > 0:28:05They estimate the house could more than double in value when it's
0:28:05 > 0:28:09restored. But with these unique properties, the sky's the limit.
0:28:09 > 0:28:13It's a priceless investment for both the family and for the nation.
0:28:28 > 0:28:31Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd