Freud Museum

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0:00:03 > 0:00:04SHE LAUGHS

0:00:04 > 0:00:07Did you see some of these phallic symbols?

0:00:07 > 0:00:11I don't know what this says about me psychologically, I like that one!

0:00:11 > 0:00:13He's very well endowed.

0:00:13 > 0:00:16This is the former home of Sigmund Freud,

0:00:16 > 0:00:20one of the most influential minds of the 20th century.

0:00:20 > 0:00:23Freud made us aware that we're all driven by the power

0:00:23 > 0:00:25of the subconscious,

0:00:25 > 0:00:29and how our dreams have meanings that can be interpreted.

0:00:29 > 0:00:32Freud's discoveries gave birth to modern day therapy

0:00:32 > 0:00:35and in doing so, have touched the lives

0:00:35 > 0:00:37of countless people around the world.

0:00:40 > 0:00:42Is it OK if he puts his hat on?

0:00:42 > 0:00:44Because his hat is cool.

0:00:44 > 0:00:48- I'll keep my hat on.- Yeah.

0:00:48 > 0:00:50Freud's home is now a museum

0:00:50 > 0:00:54but it's unlike any museum you're likely to visit.

0:00:54 > 0:00:56It's not full of display cabinets or written texts.

0:00:56 > 0:01:00Instead it's a tiny, eccentric piece of the 19th century.

0:01:00 > 0:01:03It's as though Freud never left.

0:01:03 > 0:01:05- Would that have been how it was? - Yes, that's how it was.

0:01:05 > 0:01:09- That's exactly how it was. - Beautiful.

0:01:09 > 0:01:11- You can sense his presence, almost. - Yes, yes, yes.

0:01:11 > 0:01:14- And the presence of the patients. - Yes.- Something ghostly.

0:01:14 > 0:01:16- Smells like what?- Old people.

0:01:16 > 0:01:19- Does it smell like old people?- Yeah. Can't you smell it?

0:01:19 > 0:01:22For years the museum has been a pilgrimage

0:01:22 > 0:01:25for intellectuals, therapists, and students of psychology.

0:01:25 > 0:01:28But now a new director is going to be appointed.

0:01:28 > 0:01:32She needs to make the museum more popular and less elitist.

0:01:32 > 0:01:36All of this could really do with quite a kind of radical rethink.

0:01:36 > 0:01:40One of the ways is to draw on Freud's more shocking theories.

0:01:40 > 0:01:42Anal.

0:01:42 > 0:01:44- Erm, sex. - THEY ALL LAUGH

0:01:44 > 0:01:47And women suffer from penis envy.

0:01:47 > 0:01:49Do they?

0:01:49 > 0:01:52Which I rather doubt as well!

0:01:52 > 0:01:54But might popularising Freud

0:01:54 > 0:01:57run the risk of destroying the museum's unique charm?

0:01:57 > 0:02:00People do not really like simple answers in the end.

0:02:00 > 0:02:05In fact, you're insulting them by offering them simplicities.

0:02:05 > 0:02:09And will making changes create tensions amongst the staff?

0:02:09 > 0:02:11Oh well, everybody else, but when it's something up in here,

0:02:11 > 0:02:13nobody gives me a copy of anything.

0:02:13 > 0:02:16In this series I've set out to examine how struggling museums

0:02:16 > 0:02:19are trying to reconnect with the British public.

0:02:19 > 0:02:24I want to know how they can be preserved for future generations.

0:02:24 > 0:02:26I would actually like, before I die,

0:02:26 > 0:02:28for something to happen!

0:02:38 > 0:02:42Ivan Ward joined the museum in 1987, a year after it opened.

0:02:42 > 0:02:47Nearly every day for the past 23 years, he gives a talk to students

0:02:47 > 0:02:51who are covering Freud as part of their psychology degree at college.

0:02:51 > 0:02:54He tells them about Freud's most important work,

0:02:54 > 0:02:57The Interpretation Of Dreams, which was written in 1900.

0:02:57 > 0:03:02Every single person on the planet dreams every night.

0:03:02 > 0:03:05So it's something that's completely normal

0:03:05 > 0:03:08and it's a bit weird.

0:03:08 > 0:03:11You know? It's that sense, isn't it? Completely normal and a bit...

0:03:11 > 0:03:16Of course Freud was interested, in something that's universal

0:03:16 > 0:03:18and strange.

0:03:18 > 0:03:22Freud had discovered that our dreams were simply realisations of things

0:03:22 > 0:03:26that we wanted to happen in life, "wish fulfilments" he called them.

0:03:26 > 0:03:29Anyone had any good dreams last night?

0:03:29 > 0:03:32SILENCE

0:03:32 > 0:03:34Anybody?

0:03:34 > 0:03:38I had an interesting dream but it's too embarrassing to tell!

0:03:38 > 0:03:40Let's just put it this way,

0:03:40 > 0:03:46there was a programme on TV last night about male gigolos.

0:03:46 > 0:03:49Did anyone see it? No.

0:03:49 > 0:03:50My dream had a lot to do with that.

0:03:50 > 0:03:53Anyway... HE CLEARS HIS THROAT

0:03:53 > 0:03:57For Ivan, working at the museum is more of a calling than a job.

0:03:57 > 0:04:02It does have a quality like somebody might think about the Bible.

0:04:03 > 0:04:07And there's something about that, I think,

0:04:07 > 0:04:12in the way that I relate to Freud.

0:04:12 > 0:04:14In a biblical sense?

0:04:14 > 0:04:18In a sense of the text,

0:04:18 > 0:04:19this book.

0:04:19 > 0:04:22The standard edition of Freud's work.

0:04:22 > 0:04:26I want you to have a new experience that you've never had before

0:04:26 > 0:04:27and give it a name.

0:04:27 > 0:04:34I've been in analysis, not now, but for a long time.

0:04:34 > 0:04:38Would Ivan describe himself as a happy person, generally?

0:04:38 > 0:04:41Me?

0:04:41 > 0:04:44Happy...?

0:04:44 > 0:04:48it's not something, not a term I'd normally use.

0:04:48 > 0:04:50So have an explore and I'll see you in a bit.

0:04:50 > 0:04:53After the talk, Ivan sends the students off around the house.

0:04:53 > 0:04:57There's no particular structure to the visit.

0:04:57 > 0:04:59Instead people are encouraged to wander around

0:04:59 > 0:05:01and soak up the atmosphere.

0:05:01 > 0:05:04Remember what Ivan said right at the start about dreams?

0:05:04 > 0:05:07- What was Freud interested in? - They're linked to your life.- Yeah.

0:05:07 > 0:05:11- There they are, there are the wolves.- Absolutely.

0:05:11 > 0:05:13As I walk around the museum with the students,

0:05:13 > 0:05:16I notice just how worn it looks in places.

0:05:16 > 0:05:19It really feels as if I've been invited into someone's home,

0:05:19 > 0:05:21but that the owners are out.

0:05:24 > 0:05:28Upstairs you can watch the Freud family's old home movies,

0:05:28 > 0:05:30and next door there's a room

0:05:30 > 0:05:33which celebrates the life of his daughter, Anna Freud.

0:05:36 > 0:05:38On the ground floor, just off the hallway,

0:05:38 > 0:05:41is the most important part of the museum.

0:05:41 > 0:05:43It's Freud's study.

0:05:43 > 0:05:46- This is where the magic happened. - Apparently.

0:05:46 > 0:05:48This is where he got inside your head.

0:05:55 > 0:06:00The study has remained almost untouched since Freud was alive.

0:06:00 > 0:06:04The chair at his desk was designed for him specially by a friend

0:06:04 > 0:06:07so that he could sit with his leg dangling over one of the arms.

0:06:07 > 0:06:12On his desk there are many antiquities he collected.

0:06:12 > 0:06:16For Michael Molnar, a former director of the museum,

0:06:16 > 0:06:19there's one very special artefact in the study.

0:06:19 > 0:06:24This is probably the most famous piece of furniture in the world.

0:06:24 > 0:06:28It's the couch on which Sigmund Freud

0:06:28 > 0:06:32discovered, if you want, or invented psychoanalysis.

0:06:32 > 0:06:39Underneath, it's a very undramatic piece of furniture.

0:06:39 > 0:06:43It is, in fact, the carpet that makes it what it is,

0:06:43 > 0:06:48the Qashqai rug which makes it such an exotic piece.

0:06:48 > 0:06:50You could say it's something like...

0:06:50 > 0:06:52the mind.

0:06:52 > 0:06:56When you go below the cultured, textured surface,

0:06:56 > 0:07:00you get something which is quite common.

0:07:00 > 0:07:04These were the drives underneath, or something like that.

0:07:04 > 0:07:05You could go on.

0:07:07 > 0:07:09The people who lay on this couch

0:07:09 > 0:07:12have become some of the most famous test cases

0:07:12 > 0:07:13in the history of medicine.

0:07:13 > 0:07:17The sight of it, for some, is an overwhelming experience.

0:07:17 > 0:07:20He was very important in my life.

0:07:20 > 0:07:26He helped me to understand myself, you know?

0:07:26 > 0:07:28- And then... - He helped you understand yourself?

0:07:28 > 0:07:30Yes.

0:07:42 > 0:07:44In the offices on the top floor,

0:07:44 > 0:07:47Michael now researches the life of Freud.

0:07:47 > 0:07:52There's bits of archive, books here, a photo or two.

0:07:52 > 0:07:59That's the Park Row Building, New York in 1909,

0:07:59 > 0:08:04that was just before he travelled to Worcester, Massachusetts

0:08:04 > 0:08:06to give the lectures on psychoanalysis

0:08:06 > 0:08:10which was the beginning of psychoanalysis in the United States.

0:08:10 > 0:08:15He also went to Blackpool when he was in England, the year before.

0:08:15 > 0:08:19Michael met his partner Rita at a Freud conference in Brazil

0:08:19 > 0:08:22in the 1980s and she now works at the museum.

0:08:22 > 0:08:25Did you fall in love with Michael straight away?

0:08:25 > 0:08:27SHE LAUGHS Straight away!

0:08:27 > 0:08:30No, it doesn't really work like that.

0:08:30 > 0:08:32No, not straight away.

0:08:32 > 0:08:36We started talking straight away, yes.

0:08:37 > 0:08:42I don't really know how it is, it's just a chemistry that happens.

0:08:42 > 0:08:44I just don't know.

0:08:44 > 0:08:48Is that right, Michael? It's a chemistry that happens?

0:08:48 > 0:08:50Chemistry...?

0:08:52 > 0:08:57There's quite a lot about chemistry in early Freud.

0:09:01 > 0:09:03Michael is an expert on Freud the man

0:09:03 > 0:09:06and Ivan is an expert on Freud's work.

0:09:06 > 0:09:08And to me, that might explain why the museum felt

0:09:08 > 0:09:11just a little bit highbrow.

0:09:11 > 0:09:13I'm a medical doctor and psychologist.

0:09:13 > 0:09:18I'm an academic and I use Freud in my teaching and thinking.

0:09:18 > 0:09:21The problem is the museum is aimed at Freudian academics,

0:09:21 > 0:09:24not the general public. And it's very pro-Freud,

0:09:24 > 0:09:27even though in recent years he's fallen out of fashion

0:09:27 > 0:09:29in the psychology world.

0:09:29 > 0:09:31It's quite interesting.

0:09:31 > 0:09:34Confirms all my worst prejudices.

0:09:34 > 0:09:38As a modern practising psychologist, you think of theories like

0:09:38 > 0:09:43a penis envy and Oedipus complex, do you think that's just claptrap?

0:09:43 > 0:09:48Personally, I don't...

0:09:48 > 0:09:50I certainly wouldn't really support them.

0:09:50 > 0:09:54But the idea of free association could be useful as a way

0:09:54 > 0:09:58of getting to the aspects of human cognition

0:09:58 > 0:10:00that aren't easily reportable

0:10:00 > 0:10:02or readily accessible to the individual.

0:10:07 > 0:10:11I'm surprised to learn there are even people working in the museum

0:10:11 > 0:10:15who take Freud's findings with a large pinch of salt.

0:10:15 > 0:10:17It's all very disrespectful, really.

0:10:17 > 0:10:20You can stick your feet inside Freud's head.

0:10:20 > 0:10:22What's the thinking behind that?

0:10:22 > 0:10:24Well, they're very comfortable.

0:10:24 > 0:10:28Paula and Dominique sell various jolly Freudian souvenirs,

0:10:28 > 0:10:31such as a pen with a floating couch.

0:10:31 > 0:10:34And women suffer from penis envy.

0:10:34 > 0:10:36Do they?

0:10:36 > 0:10:38Which I rather doubt as well!

0:10:38 > 0:10:40- Yeah! - SHE LAUGHS

0:10:40 > 0:10:41So...

0:10:43 > 0:10:47That theory doesn't hold much weight with you two, I take it?

0:10:47 > 0:10:49- No, no, not really.- No.

0:10:49 > 0:10:53Although he was interested in the anthropology of his time, I don't

0:10:53 > 0:10:59think he took enough cognisance of the idea that societies form people.

0:10:59 > 0:11:02The shop is one of the key sources of income

0:11:02 > 0:11:05along with visitors paying on the door

0:11:05 > 0:11:08and a grant from an American foundation.

0:11:08 > 0:11:10I have a memento of everywhere I go, as a finger puppet.

0:11:10 > 0:11:13You should see my fridge! It's completely covered.

0:11:13 > 0:11:17It makes me realise that Freud is as commercially viable

0:11:17 > 0:11:19for his oddball controversial ideas

0:11:19 > 0:11:23as he is for his celebrated, groundbreaking ones.

0:11:23 > 0:11:27Someone who can see the commercial potential in all aspects of Freud

0:11:27 > 0:11:30is the development officer, Marion Stone.

0:11:30 > 0:11:32This is like treading grapes.

0:11:36 > 0:11:37- There you are. - SHE LAUGHS

0:11:37 > 0:11:39Something is happening!

0:11:39 > 0:11:42You do have to be a jack-of-all-trades.

0:11:42 > 0:11:46So as much a technician, diplomat, administrator, manager,

0:11:46 > 0:11:51fundraiser, marketeer, whatever else needs doing.

0:11:52 > 0:11:53SHREDDER JAMS

0:11:53 > 0:11:56Oh, God!

0:11:58 > 0:11:59I can't make it work.

0:11:59 > 0:12:03Marion's previous job was at a local history museum in Norfolk.

0:12:03 > 0:12:07- Have you read The Interpretation Of Dreams?- Most of it.

0:12:07 > 0:12:09Not all of it, then?

0:12:09 > 0:12:12No! No, unfortunately I found it slightly dogmatic

0:12:12 > 0:12:15and difficult to swallow, and halfway through it,

0:12:15 > 0:12:19I decided to start reading something else, a book called Against Therapy,

0:12:19 > 0:12:22which was all the arguments against it which I thought

0:12:22 > 0:12:25unfortunately engaged me much more.

0:12:25 > 0:12:28I'm surprised such a key member of staff is not a Freud fan

0:12:28 > 0:12:30but this means Marion can see

0:12:30 > 0:12:34Freud in a different way to Ivan Ward and Michael Molnar.

0:12:38 > 0:12:41She has a lot of energy and ideas.

0:12:41 > 0:12:43For example, she and a researcher called Anna

0:12:43 > 0:12:46have been given permission to hold a dating evening in the museum

0:12:46 > 0:12:48for some of London's many single people.

0:12:48 > 0:12:52We're exploring different ways of people engaging with the museum,

0:12:52 > 0:12:55and reaching different audiences. So, because we're nervous

0:12:55 > 0:12:57about how that'll work, and that we're dealing with things

0:12:57 > 0:13:00like psychosexual development, you know,

0:13:00 > 0:13:02not your usual chit-chat of an evening!

0:13:02 > 0:13:03We just want to test out the ideas.

0:13:03 > 0:13:07Marion gets some friends and staff members together

0:13:07 > 0:13:09to try out a few risque games they'll

0:13:09 > 0:13:12be playing on their dating night later in the summer.

0:13:12 > 0:13:14Anna creates a game based on

0:13:14 > 0:13:18Freud's five stages of psychosexual development in a child,

0:13:18 > 0:13:21and she explains the oral and anal stages to Dominique.

0:13:21 > 0:13:25So the idea is that some people get stuck in the oral stage from

0:13:25 > 0:13:28- drinking the mother's breast milk, the idea of the bottle.- Yeah.

0:13:28 > 0:13:31And then there's the potty-training stage.

0:13:31 > 0:13:34- What does it mean, potty-training? - When you're teaching a child

0:13:34 > 0:13:36how to go to the toilet.

0:13:36 > 0:13:40- OK. - It's the whole thing of what is poo.

0:13:40 > 0:13:42- OK.- The early stages of coming to terms

0:13:42 > 0:13:45with their own excrement and what it is.

0:13:45 > 0:13:49- The idea is they want to nurture it. - Yes.- It belongs to them.

0:13:49 > 0:13:52How many people talk about excrement on a romantic evening?

0:13:52 > 0:13:55This isn't going to be an ordinary dating experience.

0:13:55 > 0:13:58There are two ends in a sense. A goal there and a goal there.

0:13:58 > 0:14:00Four people in a row and...

0:14:00 > 0:14:02Another game they rehearse for the dating night

0:14:02 > 0:14:04is free association football,

0:14:04 > 0:14:08a word association game only with a cheeky, sexual slant.

0:14:08 > 0:14:10Ready? So, penis.

0:14:10 > 0:14:13- Vagina.- Hole.

0:14:13 > 0:14:15Entire. LAUGHTER

0:14:15 > 0:14:18Entire!

0:14:18 > 0:14:19- Anal.- Erm, sex.

0:14:19 > 0:14:21Erm, whatever!

0:14:21 > 0:14:25It's hoped Freud's obsession with human sexuality

0:14:25 > 0:14:26will be the perfect backdrop

0:14:26 > 0:14:29for some midsummer flirtations in a few weeks' time.

0:14:29 > 0:14:31Birth.

0:14:31 > 0:14:34They've only got the half-second as it comes towards them

0:14:34 > 0:14:36- to think of the word. - And that is working.

0:14:40 > 0:14:43It's great to see everything that... made Freud who he was

0:14:43 > 0:14:47in a physical sense as well as reading his work.

0:14:47 > 0:14:49- What do you think? - I think it's fascinating, yes.

0:14:49 > 0:14:50- Do you?- Yes, I do.

0:14:50 > 0:14:53- I think it's amazing. - It's quite cool.

0:14:53 > 0:14:55I was expecting it to be a bit more modern

0:14:55 > 0:14:56because he only died 30 or 40 years ago.

0:14:56 > 0:14:59But it's like a million years old. But it's nice.

0:14:59 > 0:15:01- Does this really seem old to you? - Yes, it's so old.

0:15:01 > 0:15:04- It doesn't seem that old. - But the ceiling's modern.

0:15:04 > 0:15:07- They would have redone that?- Yeah.

0:15:10 > 0:15:14In a few days' time, a new director will be put in charge

0:15:14 > 0:15:15of the Freud museum.

0:15:15 > 0:15:18This new person will need to find a way of balancing

0:15:18 > 0:15:23the different views of Ivan Ward, Marion Stone and Michael Molnar.

0:15:24 > 0:15:26I'd like you to swap with him, if you may?

0:15:26 > 0:15:30These three all want the museum to succeed

0:15:30 > 0:15:33but at times they can seem quite chaotic.

0:15:35 > 0:15:38Like this photo shoot for the museum's website.

0:15:38 > 0:15:39Am I looking studious?

0:15:39 > 0:15:42You're looking studious, you're looking at Ivan.

0:15:42 > 0:15:46He's talking to you, please pay attention to him.

0:15:46 > 0:15:48The staff are supposed to be posing as business people,

0:15:48 > 0:15:52in the hope the museum will get used for corporate hire.

0:15:52 > 0:15:54Are they separate key-words?

0:15:54 > 0:15:58- So people just put "Sigmund" in? - Yes, yes. Those are in order..

0:15:58 > 0:16:01People put "Sigmund" in?

0:16:01 > 0:16:05Each word on a Google search, you do a several word search.

0:16:05 > 0:16:08But they can't get their heads around the idea

0:16:08 > 0:16:10of pretending to have a meeting.

0:16:10 > 0:16:13Can you stop having a meeting, please?

0:16:13 > 0:16:15Concentrate on the photography that we're trying to do.

0:16:15 > 0:16:19Shall I go and get some more paper?

0:16:19 > 0:16:23The new Director will be joining a museum which is charming,

0:16:23 > 0:16:24and a bit eccentric.

0:16:24 > 0:16:28How many museums have their own dog, for example?

0:16:31 > 0:16:33Everyone in the museum is bracing themselves for change,

0:16:33 > 0:16:37and I hope whatever the new director chooses to do,

0:16:37 > 0:16:40they don't destroy the museum's unique character.

0:16:45 > 0:16:49A welcome party is held for the new director, Carol Seigel.

0:16:49 > 0:16:52Many of you know me from a number of different jobs.

0:16:52 > 0:16:56All these people from my past! LAUGHTER

0:16:56 > 0:16:58And I don't like the way they're laughing, either!

0:16:58 > 0:17:02But, for those of you who don't know me, I'm Carol Seigel,

0:17:02 > 0:17:05and I'm pleased to say I'm Director of the Freud Museum.

0:17:05 > 0:17:09I've only been here for a few weeks, but it's lovely to welcome you all.

0:17:09 > 0:17:15Thank you for coming to our summer party. I think, English summer party!

0:17:15 > 0:17:18Carol Seigel has no expertise in Freud,

0:17:18 > 0:17:20but she's got an MA in Museum Studies

0:17:20 > 0:17:23and has run several in the past.

0:17:23 > 0:17:26I think everyone has been incredibly kind here.

0:17:26 > 0:17:31Because I think it's not easy for staff to have some new person arrive.

0:17:31 > 0:17:34And everyone has been so helpful and supportive.

0:17:34 > 0:17:36Once the guests have gone,

0:17:36 > 0:17:40I ask Carol to tell me what she wants to change about the museum.

0:17:40 > 0:17:43Her main concern is the quotations from Freud's

0:17:43 > 0:17:45"Interpretation of Dreams".

0:17:45 > 0:17:48The captions, the way they are at the moment.

0:17:48 > 0:17:51They could do with a bit of physical repair,

0:17:51 > 0:17:52you can see that one is a bit torn.

0:17:52 > 0:17:54But there are quite a lot of captions,

0:17:54 > 0:17:57but without much explanation.

0:17:57 > 0:17:59And a lot of visitors are very interested in

0:17:59 > 0:18:02the whole dream question.

0:18:02 > 0:18:04So we can give them more information, rather than less.

0:18:04 > 0:18:08Upstairs there is one room she is particularly critical of.

0:18:08 > 0:18:12It's a bit of a hotchpotch, without much explanation.

0:18:12 > 0:18:14There's material in here where, again,

0:18:14 > 0:18:17a lot of the captions are quite hard to read.

0:18:17 > 0:18:21All of this could really do with quite a radical rethink.

0:18:21 > 0:18:23Will you be making the decisions dependent on

0:18:23 > 0:18:27whether it's got the support of the people who also work here?

0:18:27 > 0:18:34I'm a consensual decision maker, I think, by instinct.

0:18:34 > 0:18:37So I would hope that we would work through

0:18:37 > 0:18:40and come to some agreed decisions

0:18:40 > 0:18:42about how we want the room to look.

0:18:42 > 0:18:44But that might be naive, I suspect there will be quite

0:18:44 > 0:18:49a lot of arguments to be had along the way, and it will be a compromise.

0:18:54 > 0:18:57The first time the rest of the staff get to hear Carol's vision

0:18:57 > 0:18:59is at a trustees' meeting.

0:19:01 > 0:19:05This is a museum that hasn't changed much since it was first opened.

0:19:05 > 0:19:07With everyone listening intently, I can tell

0:19:07 > 0:19:11Carol feels she needs to be very tactful as she lays out her vision.

0:19:11 > 0:19:13I wouldn't want to be a bull in a china shop,

0:19:13 > 0:19:15and say, "We need to be changing everything,"

0:19:15 > 0:19:21but I do think there's scope for more explanation, more interpretation.

0:19:21 > 0:19:23Particularly for people who've come here

0:19:23 > 0:19:25who don't know a lot about the subject.

0:19:25 > 0:19:29Carol's broad points are aimed at trying to bring more people

0:19:29 > 0:19:31into the museum and, in particular,

0:19:31 > 0:19:33people who aren't familiar with Freud.

0:19:33 > 0:19:36I'm keen to find out where she gets her inspiration for change from,

0:19:36 > 0:19:38and a few days later,

0:19:38 > 0:19:41Carol invites me to the museum she had been in charge of.

0:19:41 > 0:19:44It's about Hampstead's local history.

0:19:44 > 0:19:48She wants to show me some examples of visitor interaction,

0:19:48 > 0:19:51and thinks something similar might benefit the Freud museum.

0:19:51 > 0:19:55It's fairly straightforward, the one that's on at the moment is a game.

0:19:55 > 0:19:56The games that are the most popular.

0:19:56 > 0:19:59So there's a number of different things that you can do.

0:19:59 > 0:20:03They're all related to the displays here, on this touch screen.

0:20:03 > 0:20:07And you can actually read through the history of Hampstead.

0:20:07 > 0:20:08Ah, I see.

0:20:08 > 0:20:15And we've also got some oral histories on this old Bakelite telephone which you can listen to.

0:20:15 > 0:20:18What's quite interesting, when children come round,

0:20:18 > 0:20:21what most amazes them is that this is a telephone at all.

0:20:21 > 0:20:24It's not at all like most telephones that children see these days,

0:20:24 > 0:20:25you actually have to dial!

0:20:25 > 0:20:28- They don't recognise it?- They don't recognise it as a telephone,

0:20:28 > 0:20:31and they're intrigued by the fact that it is.

0:20:31 > 0:20:32And that you do this.

0:20:32 > 0:20:35- WOMAN:- 'And so we had a horse and cart.

0:20:35 > 0:20:37'The little horse as called Snowball,

0:20:37 > 0:20:39'she was a lovely little horse.'

0:20:39 > 0:20:42So, do you think anything like this, or the touch screen,

0:20:42 > 0:20:45- could be used in a Freud setting? - Definitely.

0:20:45 > 0:20:50One of the things that I think will be important to look at

0:20:50 > 0:20:53is how the displays in the house

0:20:53 > 0:20:57can be deepened, how more information can be offered.

0:20:57 > 0:21:02I think all these are going to be very interesting ways

0:21:02 > 0:21:05of actually looking at how to strengthen

0:21:05 > 0:21:08the interpretation in the house.

0:21:08 > 0:21:10The whole museum is very slick and modern,

0:21:10 > 0:21:13but back at Freud a mile or so down the road,

0:21:13 > 0:21:16some people think it's better just the way it is.

0:21:16 > 0:21:19There are certain things I do like about it.

0:21:19 > 0:21:24I like the fact that people have to go down and look closely at things.

0:21:24 > 0:21:27That's a kind of intimacy, going into something.

0:21:27 > 0:21:29- You like that?- Yes, I like that.

0:21:29 > 0:21:32And I think a lot of people appreciate it.

0:21:32 > 0:21:34Would you not change those, then?

0:21:34 > 0:21:38Well, I would obviously make them a bit less tatty.

0:21:38 > 0:21:42But you wouldn't make them less difficult to digest?

0:21:42 > 0:21:43- No.- More accessible?

0:21:45 > 0:21:48Are you saying they are difficult to digest now?

0:21:48 > 0:21:50Well, they're kind of...

0:21:50 > 0:21:55abstract in the sense that they're on their own, aren't they?

0:21:55 > 0:21:57There isn't any explanation that goes with them?

0:21:57 > 0:22:02I don't know if anybody has actually said, "I don't know what these are."

0:22:02 > 0:22:04I don't think we've had many complaints.

0:22:04 > 0:22:09Ivan isn't the only one who thinks making things easy is a mistake.

0:22:09 > 0:22:14People don't really like simple answers in the end.

0:22:14 > 0:22:17In fact, you are insulting them by offering them simplicities.

0:22:17 > 0:22:20People are interested by complexity.

0:22:20 > 0:22:23Why do people love detective fiction, you know?

0:22:23 > 0:22:29You watch any evening television, complexity of plotting,

0:22:29 > 0:22:31who's the killer, you know?

0:22:31 > 0:22:35When you go into those stories, they're multi-layered and complex.

0:22:37 > 0:22:39So we should be doing the same thing. People love it.

0:22:43 > 0:22:47I must admit, after a few weeks even I am helping to explain

0:22:47 > 0:22:49to visitors about the exhibits.

0:22:49 > 0:22:52- Would that have been how it was? - Yes, that's how it was.

0:22:52 > 0:22:54That's exactly how it was?

0:22:54 > 0:22:56It doesn't look very comfortable, to be truthful.

0:22:56 > 0:22:59What he did is, you see the green chair? At the end of the couch?

0:22:59 > 0:23:01- Oh there, yes.- That's where he sat.

0:23:01 > 0:23:05Evidently, he didn't like to have the patients looking at him.

0:23:05 > 0:23:07I think what is also interesting about the room is,

0:23:07 > 0:23:10- it's full of his things, isn't it?- Yes.

0:23:10 > 0:23:12Interestingly, all heads.

0:23:12 > 0:23:15- There are a few phallic ones, too. - Really?

0:23:15 > 0:23:17- Yes, in some of the cabinets. - Oh, right.

0:23:17 > 0:23:20You know about his theory of penis envy?

0:23:20 > 0:23:24- Penis envy? Yes, he did have that. - No, that was his theory.

0:23:24 > 0:23:26That was his theory, yes, when I say he did have that.

0:23:26 > 0:23:29I don't think HE had penis envy per se, it was his theory.

0:23:29 > 0:23:32You have to be a woman to have that, don't you?

0:23:32 > 0:23:34I don't know, I think a lot of men have it as well.

0:23:34 > 0:23:37They're always wondering about the size of their friends

0:23:37 > 0:23:39and colleagues, aren't they?

0:23:39 > 0:23:45I do feel that there are huge topics to address.

0:23:45 > 0:23:48Over the next few weeks, Carol spends time chatting to the staff

0:23:48 > 0:23:51and finding out their opinions about change.

0:23:51 > 0:23:55But with one group of workers, she needs to be particularly sensitive,

0:23:55 > 0:24:00because the museum is not just a place of work, it's a home too.

0:24:02 > 0:24:05The caretaker Alex Bento has lived at the house half his life

0:24:05 > 0:24:07after moving here from Portugal in 1982.

0:24:07 > 0:24:11For the last 24 years he's been the first person

0:24:11 > 0:24:13into Freud's study every morning,

0:24:13 > 0:24:16and the last person to leave at night.

0:24:16 > 0:24:18So this is the plaque that Princess Alexander

0:24:18 > 0:24:22opened 28th July, 1986.

0:24:24 > 0:24:27When the museum opened, a small flat was built for him

0:24:27 > 0:24:31on the ground floor where Freud's kitchen used to be.

0:24:31 > 0:24:35He still lives there today with his son Danny and son-in-law Francisco.

0:24:35 > 0:24:38What are you doing there?

0:24:38 > 0:24:42Straight through, please. And get yourself a ticket in the shop.

0:24:42 > 0:24:45Besides all the work he does getting the museum ready,

0:24:45 > 0:24:49most days he watches the visitors on his two security monitors.

0:24:49 > 0:24:52Many people try and take photographs of the study,

0:24:52 > 0:24:55and some Freud fanatics even try and cross the rope cordon

0:24:55 > 0:24:57and sit on the famous couch.

0:24:57 > 0:25:01I can see from one side to the other side. I can see the full library.

0:25:01 > 0:25:04As soon as you step over the runner, the alarm goes off.

0:25:04 > 0:25:09If anyone steps over the rope, Alex is on to them in a flash.

0:25:11 > 0:25:15Keep on the runner, please. Do not go over the runner. I just told you.

0:25:15 > 0:25:19We see it from the camera there. See? There is a camera down there.

0:25:19 > 0:25:22And when they come up and trip over, and they say, "No, I didn't move."

0:25:22 > 0:25:25I say, "You did move, I saw you go in there."

0:25:27 > 0:25:31In one way it's fun also, you know?

0:25:31 > 0:25:35They are trying to lie to you. They say, "I've never been there."

0:25:35 > 0:25:37I say, "Yes, you did."

0:25:37 > 0:25:41As well as the cameras, there is the other security device,

0:25:41 > 0:25:43but it's old and needs upgrading.

0:25:44 > 0:25:46Bobby the guard dog.

0:25:46 > 0:25:49He's been living with Alex in the flat for 15 years,

0:25:49 > 0:25:51but he's now quite infirm.

0:25:51 > 0:25:53It's not only about understanding or exploring the mind.

0:25:53 > 0:25:57In recent times Bobby has been interfering

0:25:57 > 0:26:01with some of the museum's many artistic and cultural events.

0:26:01 > 0:26:04But onto mad, bad and sad, which is certainly informed by Freud,

0:26:04 > 0:26:06and the history of psychoanalysis,

0:26:06 > 0:26:08but has a far broader historical span.

0:26:08 > 0:26:10- BOBBY BARKS IN BACKGROUND - For me the Freud Museum

0:26:10 > 0:26:12is a very, very special place.

0:26:12 > 0:26:15Not only because of the magical objects -

0:26:15 > 0:26:19the studio, the dog who barks through the talks!

0:26:19 > 0:26:20SHE LAUGHS

0:26:20 > 0:26:24But also because of the things you don't normally see

0:26:24 > 0:26:26when you've just come for a visit.

0:26:29 > 0:26:32Recording the museum's new audio guide

0:26:32 > 0:26:35while Bobby is locked in the garden is not a good idea.

0:26:35 > 0:26:38The dog, arrgh, the dog!

0:26:40 > 0:26:44It's Bobby. He probably wants to come into the museum.

0:26:46 > 0:26:49Can you phone Francisco?

0:26:49 > 0:26:52The caretakers are nowhere to be found.

0:26:52 > 0:26:55We haven't got a key to the garden, which is extraordinary.

0:26:55 > 0:26:58- So I can't actually... - This has to be changed.

0:26:58 > 0:27:02- I think we have to have a key. - This has to be changed.

0:27:02 > 0:27:05There is nothing I can do until Francisco gets back.

0:27:05 > 0:27:08Marion and Rita are annoyed they don't have a key to the garden,

0:27:08 > 0:27:11but this gives me an insight into the relationship

0:27:11 > 0:27:15between the office staff upstairs, and the caretakers downstairs.

0:27:15 > 0:27:19Perhaps it is an uneasy arrangement.

0:27:19 > 0:27:21But one thing is certain -

0:27:21 > 0:27:24the caretakers keep the museum from falling apart.

0:27:24 > 0:27:26They keep it presentable.

0:27:26 > 0:27:29The office staff rely on them totally.

0:27:29 > 0:27:32In fact, anything that needs doing to Maresfield Gardens

0:27:32 > 0:27:36is done by Alex Bento and his family.

0:27:44 > 0:27:48Just like Alex, Sigmund Freud brought his own family

0:27:48 > 0:27:53to the house in 1938, just as the Nazis were moving into Austria.

0:27:53 > 0:27:56His youngest daughter Anna filmed their journey

0:27:56 > 0:27:59as they fled the Gestapo in the June of that year.

0:27:59 > 0:28:02Now this is already Hitler in Vienna.

0:28:02 > 0:28:06That's our house, look, with those swastikas on it.

0:28:06 > 0:28:11Oh, and that is the crowds cheering Hitler.

0:28:11 > 0:28:12Look at the crowd.

0:28:12 > 0:28:17Being an intellectual and a Jew made Freud a real target for the Gestapo,

0:28:17 > 0:28:21and some rich friends of his had to pay a big ransom

0:28:21 > 0:28:22to secure his freedom.

0:28:22 > 0:28:26Amazingly, he managed to get all his personal possessions

0:28:26 > 0:28:28out of the country with him.

0:28:29 > 0:28:33But, as I'm about to find out, not all of them are on display.

0:28:35 > 0:28:37Because of his long time at the house,

0:28:37 > 0:28:40Alex knows more about it than anyone.

0:28:40 > 0:28:43On one occasion he says he wants to show me something

0:28:43 > 0:28:45that belonged to Freud that has rarely been seen.

0:28:45 > 0:28:50It's hidden away upstairs in a cluttered storage room.

0:28:50 > 0:28:52That's Freud's umbrella.

0:28:52 > 0:28:55Right. When was the last time that was exhibited?

0:28:55 > 0:28:58Maybe...10 years, maybe.

0:28:58 > 0:29:02- 10 years ago?!- May be 10, 8.- Right.

0:29:02 > 0:29:04That's the one.

0:29:04 > 0:29:08I'm amazed when he gets out Sigmund's old overcoat.

0:29:12 > 0:29:13Do you think, though,

0:29:13 > 0:29:15that they should put it back on the exhibition?

0:29:15 > 0:29:17It's a nice piece.

0:29:17 > 0:29:19People like to see it.

0:29:19 > 0:29:20Yeah.

0:29:22 > 0:29:25I get the sense Alex feels it isn't his place

0:29:25 > 0:29:28to express opinions about the collection.

0:29:28 > 0:29:30- Thank you for showing us. - No problem.

0:29:30 > 0:29:33But I agree with Alex that a coat might appeal to visitors

0:29:33 > 0:29:36who are not Freud experts, and that is, after all,

0:29:36 > 0:29:38what the museum is hoping to do.

0:29:38 > 0:29:41And why it has recruited a new leader.

0:29:44 > 0:29:48The new director, Carol, wants to get the process of change underway,

0:29:48 > 0:29:50and she's holding a meeting with Ivan and Marion.

0:29:50 > 0:29:52But there's lots of pressing items

0:29:52 > 0:29:55including a new temporary exhibition.

0:29:55 > 0:29:57It makes you want to just shoot yourself!

0:29:57 > 0:30:01Well, I was just going to say, this is almost impossible, isn't it?

0:30:01 > 0:30:05- Looking at this.- It is impossible. - Are we being ridiculous?

0:30:05 > 0:30:09Are we just being overly ambitious in what, as a small museum,

0:30:09 > 0:30:13with a small number of members of staff?

0:30:13 > 0:30:16You've got this application to fill in by the 12th, you know?

0:30:16 > 0:30:18Yes, and grant applications.

0:30:18 > 0:30:23We do have to have some kind of exhibition in four weeks' time.

0:30:23 > 0:30:25That has to happen.

0:30:25 > 0:30:29For this exhibition, Ivan wants to put the items from one of Freud

0:30:29 > 0:30:33cabinets on display, but Marion thinks it should be about myths.

0:30:33 > 0:30:36I think the other one would be simpler.

0:30:36 > 0:30:39Do you? I thought it would be easier to find myths.

0:30:39 > 0:30:43You've got to write it, though.

0:30:43 > 0:30:46Rewrite it. You've got to write your stuff from scratch.

0:30:46 > 0:30:50You could do masses of theoretical work on what you're suggesting.

0:30:50 > 0:30:54- I think both of us have a vision. - I'm suggesting stuffing things in

0:30:54 > 0:30:56and just letting people marvel.

0:30:58 > 0:31:01With the just marvelling, what if they just don't get it?

0:31:01 > 0:31:04You can't fail to get it.

0:31:04 > 0:31:08You really cannot fail to get it, it's, like, extraordinary.

0:31:08 > 0:31:10Is getting it enough, though?

0:31:10 > 0:31:12If it's obvious?

0:31:12 > 0:31:14I'm not arguing.

0:31:16 > 0:31:19I'm just saying that a scattergun, hope for the best...

0:31:19 > 0:31:21But we're not scattergun, that's why we're sitting here now.

0:31:21 > 0:31:25Not scattergun, we're trying to say what we're trying to do,

0:31:25 > 0:31:29- what we need to do.- This is a classic Freud Museum argument,

0:31:29 > 0:31:31which has no end to it.

0:31:31 > 0:31:34We could either continue with the Mad Hatter's tea party,

0:31:34 > 0:31:35or we can move on.

0:31:35 > 0:31:38The meeting ends without a decision being reached.

0:31:38 > 0:31:41I did wonder if the coat and umbrella that Alex showed me

0:31:41 > 0:31:43might have been a good solution.

0:31:43 > 0:31:46But something new is about to happen at the Freud Museum.

0:31:46 > 0:31:49An event aimed at attracting a new, broader audience

0:31:49 > 0:31:50is about to take place.

0:31:50 > 0:31:53It's Marion Stone's dating evening,

0:31:53 > 0:31:54"In your dreams."

0:31:59 > 0:32:01There are going to be two nights.

0:32:01 > 0:32:05The first is for under 40s, and the second for over 40s.

0:32:05 > 0:32:07For just a few hours on a summer evening,

0:32:07 > 0:32:10the guests will be given the keys to Freud's enchanting world.

0:32:10 > 0:32:13They will be the temporary owners of his garden and his study.

0:32:15 > 0:32:18Do you think the people who might be interested in this event

0:32:18 > 0:32:20might be a little repressed?

0:32:20 > 0:32:22I think some of them might be a little hysteric,

0:32:22 > 0:32:25and some might be a little paranoid, they'll probably be mixed.

0:32:27 > 0:32:30- But we don't want to... - Hey, we're not judging!

0:32:30 > 0:32:33I'm saying some of them MIGHT be, it's very tentative.

0:32:33 > 0:32:35It's very Freudian language here.

0:32:35 > 0:32:37Once the museum has closed for the day,

0:32:37 > 0:32:39Marion and Anna have a rush on to get it ready

0:32:39 > 0:32:41for the start of the party.

0:32:41 > 0:32:43- Can you manage all that? - Not really!

0:32:43 > 0:32:47I've got no awareness of where I'm stepping now, actually.

0:32:47 > 0:32:50Guests at the event will be invited to share their dreams with

0:32:50 > 0:32:53one another in a special session held by Ivan in the exhibition room.

0:32:53 > 0:32:55What's the blanket for?

0:32:55 > 0:32:58- Just the idea of a dream sharing room.- They're too close together.

0:32:58 > 0:33:00Do people want to be this close?

0:33:00 > 0:33:03They can sit round in a circle, can't they?

0:33:03 > 0:33:06- But who is that person next to you, there?- People can't just pull in

0:33:06 > 0:33:09and sit how they want.

0:33:09 > 0:33:11Why would you want to be that close to somebody?

0:33:11 > 0:33:13Because it's a dating night!

0:33:13 > 0:33:15Just literally inside here...

0:33:15 > 0:33:18People start to arrive around 8 o'clock.

0:33:20 > 0:33:23Then the games get underway.

0:33:23 > 0:33:26- Winner!- Loser! Oh, God, he's had another one!

0:33:26 > 0:33:28LAUGHTER

0:33:30 > 0:33:33I don't think it'll be good for him to have too much.

0:33:33 > 0:33:35I just keep thinking about my Cocker Spaniels.

0:33:37 > 0:33:40- No, no, no! - He's drinking the beer.- Never mind,

0:33:40 > 0:33:43- let him drink it. - It's not a problem?

0:33:43 > 0:33:45- Eh?- It's not a problem?- No.

0:33:45 > 0:33:47They were worried, you see.

0:33:47 > 0:33:49He's drinking too much at his age.

0:33:49 > 0:33:52No. It's all right, keep him right there.

0:33:54 > 0:33:57As the evening wears on people move inside.

0:33:57 > 0:34:01Upstairs they gather to tell their dreams to Ivan.

0:34:01 > 0:34:02The wine is relaxing people.

0:34:02 > 0:34:04BANGING

0:34:08 > 0:34:10But many feel inhibited from talking,

0:34:10 > 0:34:13so Anna fills the silence by describing a dream

0:34:13 > 0:34:16she had involving all her ex-boyfriends.

0:34:16 > 0:34:19I was looking for a bed, I really needed to sleep. So I knew I had

0:34:19 > 0:34:22to make a decision about which of the beds I was going to fall into.

0:34:22 > 0:34:26- And half the boys were asleep.- Which one did you get into in the end?

0:34:28 > 0:34:31There is one young couple who seem to have found romance.

0:34:31 > 0:34:34One of the games allows them to go into Freud's study

0:34:34 > 0:34:37for an intimate moment, although invite me in too,

0:34:37 > 0:34:40and that makes it strange for all three of us.

0:34:40 > 0:34:42What would Freud have to say about our relationship?

0:34:42 > 0:34:44SHE GIGGLES

0:34:44 > 0:34:46Do I remind you of your dad, for example?

0:34:46 > 0:34:48A little bit.

0:34:48 > 0:34:52Standing here surrounded by all his possessions and books,

0:34:52 > 0:34:56I wonder how Freud would have felt about a dating night in his home?

0:34:56 > 0:34:58I think your time is up.

0:34:58 > 0:35:00Thank you very much indeed. Cheers.

0:35:00 > 0:35:02Take care, goodbye.

0:35:05 > 0:35:08I bet you have been interest in Freud too?

0:35:08 > 0:35:10No, not really.

0:35:10 > 0:35:13I got a Facebook invite and it looked quite entertaining.

0:35:13 > 0:35:20I thought it would be quite a good way to meet interesting women.

0:35:20 > 0:35:22- Have you met any?- Yes.

0:35:23 > 0:35:26I might go and talk to one right now, in fact.

0:35:28 > 0:35:31For a few people maybe romance is on the cards

0:35:31 > 0:35:33in this most unlikely of settings.

0:35:33 > 0:35:37I feel the dating night has shown that Freud does have an appeal

0:35:37 > 0:35:38to ordinary people.

0:35:38 > 0:35:43But this has still only been one fleeting event, a one-night stand.

0:35:43 > 0:35:46How is the museum going to find a way of attracting more people

0:35:46 > 0:35:49like this to the house, but on a long-term basis?

0:35:49 > 0:35:53I think the purpose of this meeting is to think about change

0:35:53 > 0:35:55and how we achieve change.

0:35:55 > 0:35:58The new director, Carol Seigel wants to make the museum more accessible

0:35:58 > 0:36:01but she hasn't yet decided exactly how to do that.

0:36:01 > 0:36:05..The ground we might go over today will be old ground,

0:36:05 > 0:36:08revisiting subjects that have been discussed before.

0:36:08 > 0:36:14At this meeting, is the chair of the museum's trustees, Lisa Appignanesi.

0:36:14 > 0:36:16For people who don't know very much about Freud,

0:36:16 > 0:36:19who have only heard the name in pop-culture,

0:36:19 > 0:36:22it would be nice to give them a sense of the history up front.

0:36:22 > 0:36:27Something of the ideas up front, in a visual way.

0:36:27 > 0:36:31She has been pressing for change and wants to engage with a new audience

0:36:31 > 0:36:33and that's why she appointed Carol.

0:36:33 > 0:36:36In order to bring the people in you have to communicate

0:36:36 > 0:36:37to the outside, something.

0:36:37 > 0:36:41And what you will communicate will be the essentials about Freud,

0:36:41 > 0:36:42and you will say to people, come here.

0:36:42 > 0:36:45So by the time they come here, they will know about Freud.

0:36:45 > 0:36:47I am not sure any more...

0:36:47 > 0:36:49For museum faces a Catch-22 dilemma,

0:36:49 > 0:36:53they want to attract visitors who don't know anything about Freud.

0:36:53 > 0:36:57But if you don't know anything about Freud, why would you want to visit?

0:36:57 > 0:37:02In Marion Stone's eyes this means the need for more audience research.

0:37:02 > 0:37:05We also have a responsibility to talk to the people

0:37:05 > 0:37:06we are actually doing this for.

0:37:06 > 0:37:09- You mean the public? - The public who do and don't come.

0:37:09 > 0:37:12- I am worried about this. - It is a very normal thing.

0:37:13 > 0:37:18It does not mean you take all the views of the non-users

0:37:18 > 0:37:20and that's what you go for.

0:37:20 > 0:37:22It's part of the mix you are looking at.

0:37:22 > 0:37:24ALL TALK AT ONCE

0:37:24 > 0:37:27Let me tell you my worries, my worries are simply

0:37:27 > 0:37:32the we are going to spend another two years in consultation

0:37:32 > 0:37:35and thinking and nothing will happen.

0:37:35 > 0:37:40I would actually like, before I die for something to happen.

0:37:42 > 0:37:46The meeting ends with the decision to carry out more research

0:37:46 > 0:37:48into what the public wants out of the museum.

0:37:48 > 0:37:51I've been at Maresfield Gardens for a few a couple of months,

0:37:51 > 0:37:56but I can already see why so little has changed in the last 25 years.

0:37:56 > 0:38:00Everyone has a strong opinion about who the museum should be aimed at,

0:38:00 > 0:38:02and yet at the same time

0:38:02 > 0:38:05everyone respects everyone else's opinion equally.

0:38:05 > 0:38:06Progress is slow.

0:38:06 > 0:38:09I got a slight sense from you towards the end,

0:38:09 > 0:38:13you feel a bit agitated that things aren't moving fast enough?

0:38:13 > 0:38:18You have to understand, before you arrived on the scene,

0:38:18 > 0:38:22what is it now? Two years ago, three years ago...?

0:38:22 > 0:38:24Two and a half years ago perhaps,

0:38:24 > 0:38:26we put this development plan into motion.

0:38:26 > 0:38:29And I am rather an impatient person

0:38:29 > 0:38:34and I would like to see things moving quickly.

0:38:34 > 0:38:37I sometimes get irritated by...

0:38:37 > 0:38:43this constant need for more focus groups, more asking of questions.

0:38:43 > 0:38:45Because finally, much of what you find

0:38:45 > 0:38:48is going to be something you already know.

0:38:48 > 0:38:52But what you're getting, yes, is a sense of my...

0:38:52 > 0:38:54wanting things to move and change.

0:38:54 > 0:38:56I think they are, I think they've begun,

0:38:56 > 0:38:59it's just that I'd like to move things on a bit.

0:38:59 > 0:39:01- A little bit faster, maybe?- Yes.

0:39:01 > 0:39:02He's not well?

0:39:02 > 0:39:07He hasn't been well for a while, but he looks very glossy today.

0:39:07 > 0:39:09Maybe he's got a sun tan.

0:39:10 > 0:39:13- He likes the sun.- He's very old.

0:39:13 > 0:39:15Don't do that!

0:39:15 > 0:39:17SHE LAUGHS

0:39:18 > 0:39:21Not a very Freudian thing to say, of course.

0:39:23 > 0:39:25Freud had his dogs, too.

0:39:25 > 0:39:28I'm sure they did the same thing.

0:39:35 > 0:39:38Within a short time, a questionnaire is drawn up

0:39:38 > 0:39:41to find out what people think about the museum.

0:39:41 > 0:39:45How interesting did you find this house,

0:39:45 > 0:39:50on a scale of nought to five?

0:39:50 > 0:39:52Four.

0:39:52 > 0:39:55- What sort of brochure did you find us in?- It was the 2-4-1.

0:39:55 > 0:39:57Oh, you came on the 2-4-1?

0:39:57 > 0:39:59Yes.

0:39:59 > 0:40:02There is one person who hasn't been privy

0:40:02 > 0:40:05to the conversations about change or the introduction of a questionnaire.

0:40:05 > 0:40:08It is Alex the caretaker.

0:40:08 > 0:40:11He is not an expert on Freud and he doesn't have a degree

0:40:11 > 0:40:15in museum studies, but as I was to find out

0:40:15 > 0:40:18that doesn't necessarily mean he didn't have strong feelings

0:40:18 > 0:40:19about the museum.

0:40:19 > 0:40:23On one occasion I witness an argument between Alex and Rita

0:40:23 > 0:40:27over what seems like the most trivial of subjects - Bobby the dog.

0:40:27 > 0:40:30He'd escaped and was found on route to Hampstead Heath.

0:40:30 > 0:40:33If we was not here, they could take the telephone call,

0:40:33 > 0:40:36we could call the lady back. But we was not here...

0:40:36 > 0:40:38She said she was going to talk to you...

0:40:38 > 0:40:40Rita had told the woman who found Bobby

0:40:40 > 0:40:43that he is owned by the caretakers and this annoyed Alex.

0:40:43 > 0:40:46But she wanted to speak to you.

0:40:46 > 0:40:51- It's not my dog, and when you say it's my dog...- She brought it back.

0:40:51 > 0:40:55OK, I know that. Thank you.

0:40:58 > 0:41:00Bobby, you go inside now.

0:41:02 > 0:41:04The dog is not mine, that is what...

0:41:04 > 0:41:08You said to me, the dog is mine and I don't like that.

0:41:08 > 0:41:13Listen, this is not the right word to say, "the dog is yours".

0:41:13 > 0:41:16I always thought that the dog was yours. You blamed someone...

0:41:16 > 0:41:18You said, "Who let the dog out?"

0:41:18 > 0:41:21Of course, who let the dog out?

0:41:21 > 0:41:22But I didn't say it was you.

0:41:22 > 0:41:24Who let the dog out?

0:41:24 > 0:41:27Don't laugh at me like that, I don't like it,

0:41:27 > 0:41:31you know? You know very well, I don't like it.

0:41:31 > 0:41:34All the time, she is against me for some reason,

0:41:34 > 0:41:35but I don't care about it.

0:41:35 > 0:41:37No, she's not against you.

0:41:37 > 0:41:40Yes, I know that, because she turned some of the volunteers

0:41:40 > 0:41:42against me and Francisco.

0:41:42 > 0:41:45- I just do my work.- Of course you do.

0:41:45 > 0:41:47I have the...proof.

0:41:47 > 0:41:50And it's bad.

0:41:50 > 0:41:52It's so dangerous for Bobby to be out.

0:41:52 > 0:41:54He lives in their house, they feed it,

0:41:54 > 0:41:56they take it to the vet. You could say it's their dog.

0:41:56 > 0:42:01But since we pay those bills, that's how they read it as being our dog.

0:42:02 > 0:42:04But it's a blurry line.

0:42:04 > 0:42:07I would say it's their dog.

0:42:07 > 0:42:12For the first time since my arrival at the museum, I get a sense

0:42:12 > 0:42:14of real tension in the house.

0:42:14 > 0:42:18The division seems between those upstairs and those downstairs -

0:42:18 > 0:42:21between the thinkers and the doers.

0:42:22 > 0:42:26'I suppose there is a feeling of us and them.'

0:42:26 > 0:42:29You have people working in different places,

0:42:29 > 0:42:33to different effects, so there is a sort of divide in what they do.

0:42:33 > 0:42:37People who are upstairs don't spend so much time

0:42:37 > 0:42:40at the coalface, as it were, with the public.

0:42:40 > 0:42:45So, you get a different perspective on the museum, I suppose.

0:42:49 > 0:42:51How does that manifest itself?

0:42:51 > 0:42:55Presumably, in everything you've just said.

0:42:55 > 0:42:58It's now raining, is your equipment all right?

0:42:58 > 0:43:00If it rains much harder, it won't be.

0:43:00 > 0:43:06I think it might. We should probably...go.

0:43:06 > 0:43:09'Marion wasn't being very forthcoming

0:43:09 > 0:43:12'but I get the impression the argument over Bobby could be evidence

0:43:12 > 0:43:16'of a division that lies at the heart of Maresfield Gardens.'

0:43:18 > 0:43:22It's as if I've touched a nerve and the staff become suddenly

0:43:22 > 0:43:25very alarmed about the direction my documentary is going in.

0:43:25 > 0:43:28I'm concerned about the weight you give.

0:43:28 > 0:43:33It's not that you film or don't film, anything that happens is legitimate,

0:43:33 > 0:43:35as far as I'm concerned.

0:43:35 > 0:43:39It's just the question of, everything happens in the cutting room

0:43:39 > 0:43:42as far as these things are concerned.

0:43:42 > 0:43:44So, it's what weight you give to it,

0:43:44 > 0:43:49what sort of commentary you put on it, your voiceover at this point.

0:43:49 > 0:43:53It's the question of what's important in the end.

0:43:55 > 0:44:00It's just a scale of values and what's going on.

0:44:00 > 0:44:04Not to reduce it to... some sort of trivia.

0:44:04 > 0:44:07We wait to see what the finished product's like.

0:44:07 > 0:44:10We do, we do - all of us, I think!

0:44:13 > 0:44:17If it's bad, we'll set Bobby on to you.

0:44:21 > 0:44:24The caretaker's also become a bit wary of me.

0:44:24 > 0:44:25This is frustrating,

0:44:25 > 0:44:29as I have made an extraordinary discovery about Alex.

0:44:29 > 0:44:32He didn't just arrive here when the house became a museum.

0:44:32 > 0:44:35Alex was working at Maresfield Gardens

0:44:35 > 0:44:37when the Freud family lived here.

0:44:37 > 0:44:40Sigmund Freud died in 1939.

0:44:40 > 0:44:45But his daughter Anna, who fled Nazi Germany alongside him,

0:44:45 > 0:44:46lived on in the house.

0:44:46 > 0:44:51WOMAN'S VOICE: This is already the garden, in Maresfield Gardens.

0:44:51 > 0:44:56We had this couch put up for my father to rest.

0:44:56 > 0:44:59Like her father, she was a psychoanalyst

0:44:59 > 0:45:02and was hugely influential in the science of child psychology.

0:45:02 > 0:45:04You might say she invented it.

0:45:04 > 0:45:07My father goes back to his studio

0:45:07 > 0:45:11to have some peace and quiet

0:45:11 > 0:45:12and the dog follows.

0:45:17 > 0:45:21'It was Anna Freud who hired the young Alex Bento

0:45:21 > 0:45:24'as her housekeeper when she was 87.'

0:45:24 > 0:45:26- Alex?- Yes?

0:45:26 > 0:45:30Sorry to bother you. You remember the time of Anna, yes?

0:45:30 > 0:45:32Yeah, yeah.

0:45:39 > 0:45:42How long did you know her for?

0:45:42 > 0:45:45- Sorry? - How long did you know her for?

0:45:45 > 0:45:48Well, a couple of years.

0:45:48 > 0:45:49Just before she died, was it?

0:45:49 > 0:45:51That's right.

0:45:53 > 0:45:55Cut...

0:45:56 > 0:45:58You have to cut where I say cut.

0:45:59 > 0:46:02'I'm disappointed he doesn't want to talk about Anna Freud,

0:46:02 > 0:46:06'because Alex is the only person I've met at the museum

0:46:06 > 0:46:09'who has a living memory of the Freud family.'

0:46:09 > 0:46:15And that gives him something in common with the few descendents of Sigmund Freud who visit the museum.

0:46:15 > 0:46:17Like the daughter of his grandson Lucien,

0:46:17 > 0:46:19the museum's trustee, Bella Freud.

0:46:19 > 0:46:22Do you remember which relative it was?

0:46:22 > 0:46:24I was really interested in my father,

0:46:24 > 0:46:27much more than my great grandfather.

0:46:29 > 0:46:34So, he occasionally talked about Sigmund, said he was quite funny,

0:46:34 > 0:46:38which made me feel rather pleased about him and proud of him.

0:46:38 > 0:46:41I realised he'd done something kind of amazing

0:46:41 > 0:46:43but I didn't really know what it was.

0:46:43 > 0:46:45Bella wants to try and find a family heirloom

0:46:45 > 0:46:48she's heard about but never seen.

0:46:48 > 0:46:52It's a painting her father Lucien did as a young man.

0:46:52 > 0:46:54I thought he had said there was a painting?

0:46:54 > 0:47:00No, I know what it is. It must be a sketch he did as a young boy

0:47:00 > 0:47:02which he gave to Anna.

0:47:02 > 0:47:04I thought it had been lost?

0:47:04 > 0:47:08Well...Michael said something about...

0:47:08 > 0:47:10He never told me.

0:47:10 > 0:47:14When I was filming Alex showing me the coat the other day,

0:47:14 > 0:47:17I'm sure they mentioned a painting.

0:47:17 > 0:47:19Can we ask him right away?

0:47:19 > 0:47:21I want to go and see it now.

0:47:21 > 0:47:22It's a picture of a palm tree.

0:47:22 > 0:47:25Yes, that's what Michael said.

0:47:25 > 0:47:28Is that by Lucien Freud?

0:47:28 > 0:47:30Yes, yeah, yeah.

0:47:30 > 0:47:32God, how great, how exciting.

0:47:32 > 0:47:35Alex takes Lisa and Bella off in search

0:47:35 > 0:47:38of this priceless painting hidden away in the museum.

0:47:39 > 0:47:42- Thank you so much.- It's OK.

0:47:45 > 0:47:46Oh, it's lovely!

0:47:46 > 0:47:49Oh, my God, it's amazing!

0:47:50 > 0:47:52God, I wish I had that.

0:47:53 > 0:47:56That's really lovely indeed.

0:47:56 > 0:47:58What's the date?

0:47:58 > 0:48:00I haven't got my glasses on.

0:48:00 > 0:48:03Tate Britain,

0:48:03 > 0:48:08- Palm Tree, 1944, when he was 19 or 20.- Gosh!

0:48:08 > 0:48:13- Wow!- Wow!- That is really great. My God, how lovely.

0:48:13 > 0:48:16Alex uses this opportunity to show Bella and Lisa

0:48:16 > 0:48:18some of the other treasures hidden in the room.

0:48:18 > 0:48:20The coat is down there.

0:48:20 > 0:48:25- Show us the coat.- Come on, let's see the coat. That would be great.

0:48:25 > 0:48:27It is the Loden one!

0:48:37 > 0:48:39- Is that his umbrella?- Yeah.

0:48:46 > 0:48:48And the medical case.

0:48:48 > 0:48:49Like a doctor's bag?

0:48:49 > 0:48:52We should have all of them out.

0:48:52 > 0:48:57Both Lisa and Bella are aghast that the priceless artefacts in this room

0:48:57 > 0:48:59are not on display to the public.

0:48:59 > 0:49:03The house was more or less a full house when I came.

0:49:03 > 0:49:04There was no museum.

0:49:04 > 0:49:08So that things are in different places.

0:49:08 > 0:49:13Alex, Bella is Freud's great-granddaughter.

0:49:13 > 0:49:16- I know that. - We have met a few times, yes.

0:49:16 > 0:49:21There is a lot of different stuff but all this stuff is there.

0:49:22 > 0:49:25- It's great you know... - The location of the stuff.

0:49:25 > 0:49:28That really helps.

0:49:28 > 0:49:31In Museums, it's the curators or directors who decide

0:49:31 > 0:49:34what goes on display, not the caretakers,

0:49:34 > 0:49:36but there is no denying Alex has a vast knowledge

0:49:36 > 0:49:38of the house and its contents.

0:49:38 > 0:49:42From here to there was Miss Freud's bathroom.

0:49:44 > 0:49:48So there, what was what we used to call the blue bathroom,

0:49:48 > 0:49:49it was Freud's bathroom.

0:49:49 > 0:49:50Oh, right.

0:49:50 > 0:49:54'Lisa seems genuinely inspired by what Alex has shown her.'

0:49:55 > 0:49:58We are the Caretakers, so we are not...

0:49:59 > 0:50:01Did you tell Carol all this?

0:50:01 > 0:50:06I told her a few things, we try to gradually tell her a few things.

0:50:06 > 0:50:07No, tell her everything

0:50:07 > 0:50:09because I think she will be really hungry to know.

0:50:09 > 0:50:14Change at the museum has been slow to get going, but surely if

0:50:14 > 0:50:18artefacts like the coat and medical bag were put on display,

0:50:18 > 0:50:21it would be a step in the right direction?

0:50:21 > 0:50:24But upstairs, I find Freud scholar Ivan Ward

0:50:24 > 0:50:27quite dismissive of the idea.

0:50:27 > 0:50:30Alex showed Bella and Lisa and they got...

0:50:30 > 0:50:34- And they said, we must have it!- Yes, they got quite excited about that.

0:50:34 > 0:50:36And the doctor's bag.

0:50:36 > 0:50:38The bag that's falling apart.

0:50:38 > 0:50:40And the umbrella.

0:50:40 > 0:50:45And the point is, if you're going to have people coming round

0:50:45 > 0:50:47and having a look at what's in every corner,

0:50:47 > 0:50:51and wanting everything out it's just ridiculous.

0:50:51 > 0:50:52No museum works like that.

0:50:52 > 0:50:56I suppose we could put a hologram of Freud's overcoat

0:50:56 > 0:50:59and the umbrella and the boots,

0:50:59 > 0:51:01- maybe we should go down that- ...

0:51:01 > 0:51:03You're just being cheeky!

0:51:03 > 0:51:06I didn't realise it at the time but the meeting

0:51:06 > 0:51:11with Lisa and Bella Freud has inspired Alex the caretaker.

0:51:11 > 0:51:14It will be a preliminary "OK, this is the initial findings

0:51:14 > 0:51:16"and we've done a bit of audience development work."

0:51:16 > 0:51:21When Carol assembles everyone for an update on modernisation,

0:51:21 > 0:51:23Alex decides to speak his mind.

0:51:23 > 0:51:26Lisa came up and did not know about Freud's coat

0:51:26 > 0:51:29and the palm tree and things like that. They were stuck in a box...

0:51:29 > 0:51:33Alex has never expressed an opinion about the museum's future

0:51:33 > 0:51:36while I am filming, but now he brings up something

0:51:36 > 0:51:37from the museum's past.

0:51:37 > 0:51:42The plans for the renovation of the house in 1983 after Anna Freud died.

0:51:42 > 0:51:45He has a personal copy of the museum's constitution

0:51:45 > 0:51:48which was given to him in the '80s.

0:51:48 > 0:51:53In Freud's room, where the office is and where Marion is and Carol is,

0:51:53 > 0:51:56to be part of Anna Freud's room - part, yeah?

0:51:56 > 0:52:02To be there, the couch to be there, the paint cupboard...

0:52:02 > 0:52:05As a room, you mean?

0:52:05 > 0:52:08Yes, the loom and the cupboard there, quite a few things.

0:52:08 > 0:52:09I have it down there somewhere.

0:52:09 > 0:52:12Then a strange thing happens.

0:52:12 > 0:52:15The meeting ends and Alex leaves.

0:52:15 > 0:52:17Everything seems fine.

0:52:21 > 0:52:25But then a couple of minutes later, he returns with a document.

0:52:25 > 0:52:27You are not going to see it.

0:52:27 > 0:52:29What d'you mean not going to see it?

0:52:31 > 0:52:36- I didn't invent it.- And nobody thinks you did invent it.

0:52:36 > 0:52:381983.

0:52:38 > 0:52:40So it's the joint committee in London.

0:52:40 > 0:52:44It is a vision, presentation...

0:52:44 > 0:52:47'I get the feeling, years of frustration

0:52:47 > 0:52:48'are coming to the surface.'

0:52:48 > 0:52:52You are lucky I give it up.

0:52:52 > 0:52:55You are so personal about it.

0:52:55 > 0:52:58It is personal, yes, because for me, this in 1983...

0:52:58 > 0:53:01It is from the joint committee of the museum.

0:53:01 > 0:53:05The joint committee prepared it but this was given to me.

0:53:05 > 0:53:07I'm not quite sure what...

0:53:07 > 0:53:10We must have this somewhere, you can't have it...?

0:53:10 > 0:53:15- No, this is mine, no-one has this in the house.- No-one?- No, no-one.

0:53:15 > 0:53:18It says, "I enclose a copy of the report of the Freud Museum..."

0:53:18 > 0:53:20Of course, you were given a copy

0:53:20 > 0:53:22and everybody else who worked here should have been given a copy.

0:53:22 > 0:53:25Everybody else but when it is something up in here,

0:53:25 > 0:53:28nobody gives me a copy of anything, yeah.

0:53:33 > 0:53:37Alex is upset because he feels the others are not listening to him.

0:53:37 > 0:53:41And he was, after all, here at the very start of the museum.

0:53:41 > 0:53:45With change happening all around, he feels increasingly sidelined.

0:53:45 > 0:53:50That document, given from the head person in terms of the founder

0:53:50 > 0:53:53of the museum to a caretaker,

0:53:53 > 0:53:57I think it is quite an unusual thing, so the personal connection is there.

0:53:57 > 0:53:59The fact he was given a document

0:53:59 > 0:54:04that was part of the founding documents of the museum.

0:54:04 > 0:54:06Towards the end of the summer,

0:54:06 > 0:54:11the second of Marion's dating evenings is held.

0:54:11 > 0:54:14THEY PLAY "WHAT THE WORLD NEEDS NOW IS LOVE"

0:54:31 > 0:54:32THEY START AGAIN

0:54:36 > 0:54:38The over-40s seem to enjoy

0:54:38 > 0:54:41the cheeky Freudian parlour games a great deal.

0:54:41 > 0:54:43I can't see...latent period.

0:54:43 > 0:54:48- Latent period - sexual drive lies dormant, miss a turn.- Miss a turn!

0:54:52 > 0:54:55One lady I met that evening has just swapped phone numbers

0:54:55 > 0:54:57with a man who had to rush for his train.

0:55:08 > 0:55:11I only do it when I've had a glass of wine.

0:55:15 > 0:55:19At the end of the night, I think the guests had enjoyed themselves

0:55:19 > 0:55:21but I wasn't sure if romance had blossomed.

0:55:42 > 0:55:46Several weeks later, I return to Hampstead for the launch

0:55:46 > 0:55:49of a marketing campaign Marion has organised

0:55:49 > 0:55:52with some other small historic houses.

0:55:52 > 0:55:56The party is addressed by TV historian Dan Cruikshank.

0:55:56 > 0:55:59In a sense, London does tend to live in its small houses,

0:55:59 > 0:56:01therefore an incredible place to visit

0:56:01 > 0:56:03and very, very important.

0:56:04 > 0:56:07An absolutely fantastic project

0:56:07 > 0:56:09and I'm very happy to do anything I can to help.

0:56:11 > 0:56:14APPLAUSE

0:56:14 > 0:56:18'At the Freud museum, things are changing.'

0:56:18 > 0:56:20Has it changed?

0:56:20 > 0:56:22Yes, we've got a new carpet

0:56:22 > 0:56:23and...

0:56:23 > 0:56:28loads of new equipment and a general kind of sprucing up of the museum.

0:56:28 > 0:56:32Finally, the lengthy research period is over and the findings have

0:56:32 > 0:56:37identified a new way of improving the visitors' experience.

0:56:37 > 0:56:39It seems they don't want text panels,

0:56:39 > 0:56:43or touch screens, so not high-tech and not great big chunky things

0:56:43 > 0:56:46that make an intervention into the museum's space.

0:56:46 > 0:56:48But they do want something to help them

0:56:48 > 0:56:51and that something is going to be guided tours,

0:56:51 > 0:56:52just person to person,

0:56:52 > 0:56:56a very kind of low-tech, old-school interpretation.

0:56:56 > 0:56:59I think guided tours are a good idea for the museum,

0:56:59 > 0:57:04although I am disappointed Marion didn't mention Sigmund's overcoat.

0:57:08 > 0:57:10But what I have learnt in my time at the museum,

0:57:10 > 0:57:14is that Freud appeals to many different people

0:57:14 > 0:57:20and this is its greatest asset as well as its biggest challenge.

0:57:20 > 0:57:24Perhaps, most of all, it is simply a place where his memory

0:57:24 > 0:57:26is well looked after.

0:57:28 > 0:57:30This reminds me of a conversation I had with Michael

0:57:30 > 0:57:33while we stood on the balcony one day in the summer.

0:57:33 > 0:57:37- It takes quite a lot of upkeep the garden, doesn't it?- It does.

0:57:37 > 0:57:43The "curator", as far as my very rusty Latin is concerned,

0:57:43 > 0:57:45means to look after.

0:57:45 > 0:57:49You are a custodian, you're looking after,

0:57:49 > 0:57:51taking care of.

0:57:51 > 0:57:56Interestingly enough, in a funny sort of way, the idea of the Latin,

0:57:56 > 0:58:00when you look at the origin of the word, curator,

0:58:00 > 0:58:04- it does actually mean similar to caretaker?- It's a caretaker.

0:58:18 > 0:58:20Bobby!

0:58:20 > 0:58:24THEY TALK IN ITALIAN

0:58:43 > 0:58:45Come on, Bobby, come on!

0:58:46 > 0:58:49Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd

0:58:49 > 0:58:52E-mail subtitling@bbc.co.uk