0:00:02 > 0:00:04It's hard to believe that, just a few months ago,
0:00:04 > 0:00:06streets like this went up in flames.
0:00:08 > 0:00:12Homes and businesses were burned to the ground.
0:00:14 > 0:00:16Britain went into lockdown.
0:00:20 > 0:00:23It seemed like some people felt that looting was just a way
0:00:23 > 0:00:26of getting their hands on the material possessions
0:00:26 > 0:00:27that they were entitled to.
0:00:29 > 0:00:32The finger was pointed at teenage gangs
0:00:32 > 0:00:36and more than half the people charged with offences were under 21.
0:00:41 > 0:00:45I'm Reggie Yates and tonight I'm trying to find out what makes
0:00:45 > 0:00:47gang life the chosen path for thousands of teenagers
0:00:47 > 0:00:49in Britain's inner cities.
0:00:52 > 0:00:54But I'm starting off with some pretty firm views.
0:00:57 > 0:01:00I've long believed that everybody has choices in life
0:01:00 > 0:01:03and that no-one is forced to become a criminal
0:01:03 > 0:01:06just because they grow up poor.
0:01:06 > 0:01:08I grew up on a council estate, in a house that,
0:01:08 > 0:01:11for a long period of time, was essentially living off benefits
0:01:11 > 0:01:14and I believe that your surroundings don't define who you are.
0:01:14 > 0:01:16I think it's you as an individual,
0:01:16 > 0:01:20how much work you are willing to put in. That determines how well you do.
0:01:21 > 0:01:25But I'm going to test my beliefs on a journey that will take me
0:01:25 > 0:01:27to some pretty dangerous places.
0:01:28 > 0:01:32Over the last three months, I've spent time with four young people
0:01:32 > 0:01:35who've all been right at the heart of gang life in Britain.
0:01:35 > 0:01:36It's not been easy for them,
0:01:36 > 0:01:40but they have allowed me an insight into their world.
0:01:40 > 0:01:43Aaron was a member of one of the most feared teen gangs
0:01:43 > 0:01:46in South London and served time in prison.
0:01:46 > 0:01:49'I've done a few things, you know, like robbery,'
0:01:49 > 0:01:50but paid the price for it.
0:01:50 > 0:01:54Talisa's been involved in selling drugs for another London gang
0:01:54 > 0:01:56and was the victim of a vicious assault.
0:01:56 > 0:01:58How many times were you stabbed?
0:01:58 > 0:02:01- I was stabbed about 14.- 14 times?
0:02:01 > 0:02:06Shakeel lost a friend to a vicious gangland war.
0:02:06 > 0:02:09People do get killed out here. I can't lie about it.
0:02:09 > 0:02:10And Darren was a member
0:02:10 > 0:02:12of one of the most ruthless gangs in Manchester.
0:02:12 > 0:02:15Basically, you wouldn't look at us lot wrong,
0:02:15 > 0:02:18cos if you did, you'd be the next one in the back of the ambulance.
0:02:18 > 0:02:21So where does the responsibility lie?
0:02:21 > 0:02:23Am I right that it is down to the individual
0:02:23 > 0:02:27and the choices that person makes, or is it about their environment,
0:02:27 > 0:02:29things that are often outside of their control?
0:02:29 > 0:02:32I'm going to try and find out.
0:02:32 > 0:02:34POLICE SIRENS WAIL
0:02:49 > 0:02:53For four years, Aaron Rhoden was a member of one of the toughest gangs
0:02:53 > 0:02:55in Stockwell, South London.
0:02:55 > 0:02:59Now he's trying to put his energy to more constructive use.
0:02:59 > 0:03:01Five days a week, he packs his sports kit
0:03:01 > 0:03:03and heads down to the local gym.
0:03:04 > 0:03:08But he misses the status and fast money that came with gang life.
0:03:08 > 0:03:11You can never get used to having no money,
0:03:11 > 0:03:14but it's just something what has to be done sometimes.
0:03:14 > 0:03:17Obviously, it's depressing, but I've got to accept it.
0:03:19 > 0:03:22Aaron served nine months of a 2.5 year sentence for ABH,
0:03:22 > 0:03:26and, since April, he's been out on licence, but is finding it tough.
0:03:26 > 0:03:31I might not have the strong enough willpower to stay off the streets,
0:03:31 > 0:03:35and the influences come in from elsewhere, and they will just come
0:03:35 > 0:03:37and overpower your willpower, you know.
0:03:37 > 0:03:41You got have the mind and strength to want to do it for yourself.
0:03:48 > 0:03:52So what was life like for Aaron inside a gang and has he really
0:03:52 > 0:03:55been able to put the fast money and prestige behind him?
0:03:58 > 0:04:03- Hi, how are you doing? - Good, thanks. Upstairs.
0:04:04 > 0:04:08- This is the penthouse.- Yeah, this is where it all goes down!
0:04:08 > 0:04:10You've got loads of things.
0:04:10 > 0:04:12All your hats on your wall. Are they like your prized possessions?
0:04:12 > 0:04:17Yes, my hats are memories. Look at this one here.
0:04:17 > 0:04:19- "031", what's that?- It was just my current gang at the time.
0:04:19 > 0:04:21And what did you guys do?
0:04:21 > 0:04:26Get into beefs, altercations, drugs, whatever it is.
0:04:26 > 0:04:28You say drugs like it's a small thing.
0:04:28 > 0:04:30But for most people, it really isn't. Were you dealing, selling?
0:04:30 > 0:04:31It's, like, selling, innit?
0:04:31 > 0:04:34You gotta go and get money, however you can get it.
0:04:34 > 0:04:36That's the mentality of the young people.
0:04:36 > 0:04:38There must have been a moment
0:04:38 > 0:04:40when you decided to go down the wrong path that led to
0:04:40 > 0:04:42actually being involved in an organised gang.
0:04:42 > 0:04:44What was that moment everything changed?
0:04:44 > 0:04:50I was about 14 years old and someone had just basically come up to me,
0:04:50 > 0:04:51and he said to me, "I just stabbed someone.
0:04:51 > 0:04:55"Quick. I got the blood on my knife and everything."
0:04:55 > 0:04:57He brought out the knife.
0:04:57 > 0:05:00He asked me to just to follow him to the bus stop.
0:05:00 > 0:05:04It got to the point where I ended up following him about the whole day.
0:05:04 > 0:05:07He, kind of, like, in a way, he kidnapped me.
0:05:07 > 0:05:12He took my phone, he took my chain, he took my big diamond ring.
0:05:12 > 0:05:16After that day, my trust for people, in general, just went down.
0:05:16 > 0:05:20I didn't want to be so exposed like that again.
0:05:20 > 0:05:23So after all of that, you started carrying a knife yourself, right?
0:05:23 > 0:05:24Would you have used it?
0:05:24 > 0:05:28I would have had to. Had to. There's no point in carrying it.
0:05:28 > 0:05:30You can go to jail for just having a knife,
0:05:30 > 0:05:32so I might as well use it, if I'm going to have it on me.
0:05:34 > 0:05:37'Aaron's been upfront about his time with the 031 Bloods gang,
0:05:37 > 0:05:40'but I wanted to know why he'd been sent to prison.'
0:05:40 > 0:05:46It was a robbery, you know, kind of thing. Drug dealers and stuff.
0:05:46 > 0:05:49Why don't you want to talk about what actually happened?
0:05:49 > 0:05:53Because, really and truly, the people who were the victims of it,
0:05:53 > 0:05:57could be watching right now and they might think justice wasn't served.
0:05:57 > 0:06:00They might think, "Oh, I saw so-and-so there.
0:06:00 > 0:06:03"He was on the TV there. Don't I remember him
0:06:03 > 0:06:07"from the court case, there?" you know, kind of thing.
0:06:07 > 0:06:09"Let's go after him, still."
0:06:09 > 0:06:13They might be like that. You don't know how people are.
0:06:16 > 0:06:20Aaron still has to look over his shoulder whenever he goes out.
0:06:21 > 0:06:24He took me to the estate in South London where he grew up,
0:06:24 > 0:06:28'and he seemed uneasy about being on the streets with the cameras.'
0:06:29 > 0:06:31There's beef, real shoot-outs.
0:06:31 > 0:06:34People have shoot-outs all the time. This is Stockwell. This is real.
0:06:34 > 0:06:37When was the last time you saw a shoot-out round here?
0:06:37 > 0:06:41'08. 2008 was the last vivid one I can remember.
0:06:43 > 0:06:48Little party in a pub and someone came and shot it up.
0:06:48 > 0:06:51Two bouncers outside the pub, both of them got hit up.
0:06:51 > 0:06:55One got shot in his head. Everyone in the club had to walk over
0:06:55 > 0:06:57his dead body to get out of the club.
0:06:57 > 0:07:00- That was the last real one I can remember.- How old were you then?
0:07:00 > 0:07:03I was...17 or 18.
0:07:03 > 0:07:07So at 17, you're stepping over a dead body to get out of a pub.
0:07:07 > 0:07:09Did that not affect you in any way?
0:07:09 > 0:07:13The shooting and stuff got so regular that things used to happen
0:07:13 > 0:07:15and we got to look and laugh about it.
0:07:15 > 0:07:19We, literally, came away and if no-one got hurt, you're laughing.
0:07:19 > 0:07:23There's no doubt Aaron wants to turn his life around.
0:07:23 > 0:07:26But how long will his resolve last?
0:07:27 > 0:07:29Because he spent so much time before he went in
0:07:29 > 0:07:33being used to the trappings of his former lifestyle,
0:07:33 > 0:07:36'I'm not entirely sure he's going to be OK and be able to stick it out.'
0:07:36 > 0:07:39I think that the temptation is massive and I really hope
0:07:39 > 0:07:41that he doesn't fall to it.
0:07:44 > 0:07:46One thing I want to get across is that
0:07:46 > 0:07:48gangs are not just a black issue.
0:07:48 > 0:07:52In most of Britain's big cities there are all sorts of gangs -
0:07:52 > 0:07:54Asian, white and black.
0:07:54 > 0:07:57So I'm heading to the North West, once again to find out whether
0:07:57 > 0:08:02people there choose to join gangs or are they forced into it?
0:08:02 > 0:08:03Here in St Helens,
0:08:03 > 0:08:06these young people are part of a rehabilitation scheme.
0:08:06 > 0:08:10They've all committed serious offences,
0:08:10 > 0:08:12most involving gang violence.
0:08:12 > 0:08:17Darren Burns was a member of one of THE toughest gangs in Manchester.
0:08:17 > 0:08:19Now he gets a kick out of helping out at this old gym.
0:08:19 > 0:08:21How much are you enjoying this?
0:08:21 > 0:08:25Erm, it is actually quite fun. You do get a few laughs.
0:08:25 > 0:08:28- OK. - It's what you make of it yourself.
0:08:30 > 0:08:33Boxing lessons are the most popular part of the course.
0:08:33 > 0:08:38After watching these young people land some pretty fearsome blows,
0:08:38 > 0:08:43I took the chance to find out what drove them into gangs.
0:08:43 > 0:08:44Basically, you wouldn't look at us lot wrong,
0:08:44 > 0:08:47because if you did, you'd be the next one in the ambulance.
0:08:47 > 0:08:49That's how it was.
0:08:49 > 0:08:51What were you known for?
0:08:51 > 0:08:55Drug dealing, weapons, fighting. Everything.
0:08:55 > 0:09:01Darren lived in 42 different care homes, from the age of five.
0:09:01 > 0:09:04At 14, he joined up with Manchester's notorious Gooch gang.
0:09:04 > 0:09:07Other gang members served time for murder
0:09:07 > 0:09:10as they fought rivals for control of the drugs trade.
0:09:11 > 0:09:14You don't look like the sort of person that would have
0:09:14 > 0:09:17a gun in his pocket. What was it that attracted you to it
0:09:17 > 0:09:21and did you not think, "This might not be for me"?
0:09:21 > 0:09:26At the time, I'd gone through a stage of being bullied at school,
0:09:26 > 0:09:29so it was my way of saying, "Listen, I'm not a muppet.
0:09:29 > 0:09:32"I'm not going to let you trample all over me."
0:09:32 > 0:09:36I wanted the reputation that came with it, the reputation whereas
0:09:36 > 0:09:39if you did something, it wouldn't just be me coming to get you,
0:09:39 > 0:09:44- it would be someone else.- You were bullied as a teenager?- Yeah.
0:09:44 > 0:09:45What was the one moment you said,
0:09:45 > 0:09:47"They won't mess with me again"?
0:09:47 > 0:09:49I went up to the biggest guy in school
0:09:49 > 0:09:54and just trampled him all down the stairs, because he was the main one.
0:09:54 > 0:09:58I was only in year nine and he was year 11.
0:09:58 > 0:10:00So, one of the oldest kids in school and you beat him up?
0:10:00 > 0:10:02Yeah, I threw him down the stairs.
0:10:04 > 0:10:08After that, did things change? Did people look at you differently?
0:10:08 > 0:10:12- Yeah.- Did you enjoy that? - I loved it at the time.
0:10:12 > 0:10:14I was thinking I was untouchable.
0:10:14 > 0:10:18You get this, sort of, invincibility cloak over you,
0:10:18 > 0:10:19like, no-one can touch you.
0:10:19 > 0:10:22- Now that you're out the gang, do you see it differently?- Yeah.
0:10:22 > 0:10:28Boys will be boys, but it's a completely different perspective now.
0:10:28 > 0:10:32Do you not think it's a bit stronger than "boys will be boys"?
0:10:32 > 0:10:36I know what you're saying, but when you're there, it's like a family.
0:10:36 > 0:10:37You protect each other.
0:10:37 > 0:10:40So, Darren believes he had to be in a gang,
0:10:40 > 0:10:44as a way of finding security - almost a surrogate family.
0:10:44 > 0:10:48His environment gave him no alternative.
0:10:48 > 0:10:52But is he just an exception to my belief that it's all about
0:10:52 > 0:10:54individual choices? I'm heading back to London,
0:10:54 > 0:10:58for a meeting with someone else who's agreed to tell me her story
0:10:58 > 0:11:01about life inside a teenage gang.
0:11:06 > 0:11:09Talisa Kyei was in a gang from her early teens.
0:11:09 > 0:11:11She was often involved in fights,
0:11:11 > 0:11:13and earned money as a lookout for drug dealers.
0:11:15 > 0:11:17She's moved out of her parents' house
0:11:17 > 0:11:21and now lives on this estate in Morden, Surrey.
0:11:21 > 0:11:24For Talisa, it's a key part of breaking away from the gang.
0:11:26 > 0:11:28Her flat represents independence,
0:11:28 > 0:11:31but it also shows the choices she now has to make.
0:11:31 > 0:11:34- Hello.- Hey!- Welcome. - Are you all right?
0:11:34 > 0:11:39She has to find £120 a month towards her rent
0:11:39 > 0:11:42and that's the sort of money she doesn't have.
0:11:42 > 0:11:45- This your place, yeah? - This is my room.
0:11:45 > 0:11:48Not the messiest, but it's not the neatest, either.
0:11:48 > 0:11:50Don't worry. I ain't getting the Hoover out.
0:11:50 > 0:11:53This is the living room, right here.
0:11:53 > 0:11:55'Talisa insists she's now out of the gang.
0:11:55 > 0:11:59'The turning point came five years ago.'
0:11:59 > 0:12:03One day, I got a phone call from my friend and then I came out
0:12:03 > 0:12:05my house to meet them, but they wasn't there,
0:12:05 > 0:12:07so I was thinking, "What's going on?"
0:12:07 > 0:12:12So I saw this dude that I thought I was cool with and I went up to him
0:12:12 > 0:12:15and all I remember was I saw a knife and he just went for me.
0:12:17 > 0:12:19I didn't really thought anything.
0:12:19 > 0:12:24All my emotions went. I was thinking, "How am I going to survive this?
0:12:24 > 0:12:27"How am I going to get out? Am I going to see my mum again?"
0:12:27 > 0:12:32- And how many times were you stabbed? - 14 times.- Do you have scars?
0:12:32 > 0:12:33I don't really want to show them.
0:12:33 > 0:12:37- You don't have to show me, but do you have scars?- Yeah!
0:12:37 > 0:12:40So what do you think when you see the scars from the stabbing?
0:12:40 > 0:12:45When it's a bad day, I think, "Why didn't I just die with the scars?"
0:12:45 > 0:12:49And then, when it's a good day I think, "I'll overcome this.
0:12:49 > 0:12:53"This is what makes me today, and this is why I'm living today."
0:12:53 > 0:12:54Since leaving the gang...
0:12:54 > 0:12:56MOBILE RINGS
0:12:56 > 0:12:58- Don't worry about it. It's OK.- Are you sure?- Yeah.
0:12:58 > 0:13:01'Talisa's phone rings throughout our interview.
0:13:01 > 0:13:03'Something is going on.'
0:13:03 > 0:13:06- TEXT MESSAGE BUZZ I'll switch it off.- Popular girl.
0:13:06 > 0:13:10- Who was texting you? - Is this on camera?- Mm-hmm.
0:13:10 > 0:13:13He's actually one of my friends still, but I just...
0:13:13 > 0:13:15- leave it a little. - Why are they texting you so much?
0:13:15 > 0:13:18- Oh, I don't know.- No? OK.
0:13:18 > 0:13:21'I've only known Talisa a few hours,
0:13:21 > 0:13:23'but I can tell she knows more than she's letting on.'
0:13:23 > 0:13:25- PHONE BUZZES - What's going on?
0:13:25 > 0:13:29Nothing, it's just, one of my friends, like. They just, like...
0:13:29 > 0:13:33They are, sort of, on a grind, innit? They still do what they want to do.
0:13:33 > 0:13:35I understand what you mean, but for the people that don't,
0:13:35 > 0:13:37can you explain what you mean by "on the grind"?
0:13:37 > 0:13:40They're still hustling, basically, to live, like, a nice life,
0:13:40 > 0:13:43to live a decent life. Everyone deserves things...
0:13:43 > 0:13:45What are they...? Hustling how?
0:13:45 > 0:13:48- Like, just showing and stuff. - Selling drugs?- Yeah.
0:13:48 > 0:13:50And why are they calling you?
0:13:50 > 0:13:53Because they want me to get one of my friends to get it off them,
0:13:53 > 0:13:55but I don't want to do that.
0:13:55 > 0:13:58'She says she doesn't want to be involved,
0:13:58 > 0:13:59'but explains some people believe
0:13:59 > 0:14:01'they're entitled to a better lifestyle,
0:14:01 > 0:14:05'even if it is funded by selling drugs.
0:14:05 > 0:14:09'Talisa switches her phone off, but when she turns it back on
0:14:09 > 0:14:10'it starts up again.'
0:14:10 > 0:14:12I actually... PHONE BUZZES
0:14:12 > 0:14:15- Oh, my God.- You just turned it back on again?- Yeah.- OK.
0:14:15 > 0:14:17I don't want to answer and then he tries coming here.
0:14:17 > 0:14:20Come on, answer your phone. You sure?
0:14:20 > 0:14:24- 'Now there's a knock on the door.' Who's that?- The boy.
0:14:26 > 0:14:29Stay here. Shall I answer it? Yeah.
0:14:52 > 0:14:54'It felt obvious that Talisa's friend
0:14:54 > 0:14:56'would be coming back once we'd gone,
0:14:56 > 0:14:59'but that wasn't quite what she told us.'
0:14:59 > 0:15:01- SHE SIGHS - What happened?
0:15:01 > 0:15:05- I just told him to go. - What did he come here for?
0:15:05 > 0:15:07Just to talk to me, but I told him to go.
0:15:07 > 0:15:09Is there a temptation, there, to get involved?
0:15:10 > 0:15:12Not even a little one?
0:15:13 > 0:15:15- Why are you so sure? - Why am I so sure?
0:15:15 > 0:15:18- Cos I know where it can lead me to again.- And what can it lead you to?
0:15:18 > 0:15:21Probably prison or death. This time, death for true, this time.
0:15:26 > 0:15:30'You see, I like Talisa, but despite her good intentions,
0:15:30 > 0:15:32'I'm worried that she might be letting her environment
0:15:32 > 0:15:34'get on top of her.'
0:15:35 > 0:15:39I want to say that she's being a better person and moving on,
0:15:39 > 0:15:42but the fact that her phone continuously rings
0:15:42 > 0:15:44and randomly you've got a guy turning up out of the blue,
0:15:44 > 0:15:48knocking on front door, trying to get her to sell drugs for him,
0:15:48 > 0:15:52says to me in her mind, she wants to move on and thinks that she is,
0:15:52 > 0:15:54but I'm not sure if that's actually what's really going on.
0:16:02 > 0:16:04'The next day, I met up with Aaron.'
0:16:08 > 0:16:11'He'd agreed to take me to another estate close by
0:16:11 > 0:16:14'that was territory of the All Bout Money gang.
0:16:14 > 0:16:18'They'd had a serious beef with the 031 Bloods that Aaron belonged to.
0:16:18 > 0:16:22'It's part of a turf war that has cost up to ten lives
0:16:22 > 0:16:23'in the last decade.
0:16:24 > 0:16:28'Aaron seemed nervous here, and sort of on the alert.'
0:16:28 > 0:16:29A couple of years ago, you know,
0:16:29 > 0:16:31we used to come and meet around here for football,
0:16:31 > 0:16:35just chill around here at the little park at one stage.
0:16:35 > 0:16:38Do you know what? I've heard about a place called the Hotspot.
0:16:38 > 0:16:41- Is that anywhere near here? - Oh, that's right there, yeah.
0:16:41 > 0:16:43- Just there? - Yeah, right across the road.
0:16:43 > 0:16:44what's that, then?
0:16:44 > 0:16:48Um, also called Stockwell Gardens Estate, also known as Hotspot.
0:16:48 > 0:16:50Why is it called that, then?
0:16:50 > 0:16:54- Um, I think because police always used to be round there a lot.- Yeah?
0:16:54 > 0:16:56Yeah, it's just like a big strip, you know?
0:16:56 > 0:16:58'It's hard to believe that this little parade of shops
0:16:58 > 0:17:00'with a small courtyard
0:17:00 > 0:17:03'could be such a prized piece of gang territory,
0:17:03 > 0:17:05'but this can be a dangerous place.'
0:17:05 > 0:17:08So, if we were to go there now with the cameras, myself and you,
0:17:08 > 0:17:10would that be a problem for you?
0:17:10 > 0:17:13- Um, yeah, I'm not really trying to condone any of that.- Why's that?
0:17:13 > 0:17:16It's not my job to really do that, you know?
0:17:16 > 0:17:20I'm not a reporter. However, you know... Yeah, it's just not me.
0:17:20 > 0:17:23- It's not me. - You look really uncomfortable.
0:17:23 > 0:17:26You look really uncomfortable about going over there.
0:17:26 > 0:17:27What is it about this area in particular?
0:17:27 > 0:17:31It's not even that, but it's like, because of my affiliates, you know?
0:17:31 > 0:17:35- They had problems with these lot. - So, in a situation like this,
0:17:35 > 0:17:37where someone who was once in a gang
0:17:37 > 0:17:39got into an area that they shouldn't be seen,
0:17:39 > 0:17:42even though they're out, is it still dangerous?
0:17:42 > 0:17:45It shouldn't be. It shouldn't be, but it can be.
0:17:46 > 0:17:50'I finally realise why Aaron's so nervous here.
0:17:50 > 0:17:54'This area's at the heart of a postcode war between rival gangs.'
0:17:57 > 0:18:00'To try and turn their lives around, Aaron and Talisa
0:18:00 > 0:18:04'have signed up for a course of intensive personal coaching.
0:18:04 > 0:18:08'I've come to see what they do and how they get on.
0:18:09 > 0:18:12'It's not in the sort of place I'd expected -
0:18:12 > 0:18:15'right in the heart of London's affluent West End, Covent Garden.
0:18:19 > 0:18:22'It's called RAP Mentors, a private company which offers coaching
0:18:22 > 0:18:26'to young people at risk of getting involved in gangs
0:18:26 > 0:18:29'and to others who want to become mentors themselves.'
0:18:29 > 0:18:33- Is it OK to take your mentee home with you?- No!
0:18:34 > 0:18:37'The project manager is 41-year-old David Williams.
0:18:37 > 0:18:40'He spent time in prison 20 years ago,
0:18:40 > 0:18:43'but now wants to help other young people avoid a life of crime.'
0:18:43 > 0:18:47- Is it OK to share a spliff with your mentee?- No!
0:18:47 > 0:18:51'He knows it'll be a hard road for Aaron and Talisa.'
0:18:51 > 0:18:53There will always be struggles
0:18:53 > 0:18:56because they're living in the same environment,
0:18:56 > 0:18:58they're in the same community,
0:18:58 > 0:19:02they know the same friends and the peer pressure is very, very great.
0:19:02 > 0:19:06'David believes that outside forces can be strong.'
0:19:06 > 0:19:08Did anyone do any of that homework?
0:19:08 > 0:19:10'At the group discussion, Aaron explains
0:19:10 > 0:19:15'why he resisted the temptation to take part in the London riots.'
0:19:15 > 0:19:18Even though I felt like I was missing out on an opportunity,
0:19:18 > 0:19:20I wanted to be a part of history.
0:19:20 > 0:19:22'His decision not to join in the looting
0:19:22 > 0:19:25'suggests he's already moving forward.'
0:19:25 > 0:19:28And, obviously, I'm on licence as well, so I don't want to go out there
0:19:28 > 0:19:30and get remanded straight away
0:19:30 > 0:19:32and have to do my licence plus extra charges.
0:19:32 > 0:19:35'But Talisa still has problems.'
0:19:35 > 0:19:37Sometimes it's not the person, you know, that messes up -
0:19:37 > 0:19:40it's their friends around you, cos they're jealous of you
0:19:40 > 0:19:42for doing better than them, or whatever.
0:19:42 > 0:19:43So sometimes it's people as well.
0:19:43 > 0:19:46'Only a few days ago, she was involved in a row on the street
0:19:46 > 0:19:49'with another girl in which a mobile phone and money went missing.
0:19:51 > 0:19:53'She's still angry,
0:19:53 > 0:19:56'and it quickly becomes clear that things haven't been resolved.'
0:19:56 > 0:19:59Come in, come in, come in, come in. We're going to put you in the group.
0:19:59 > 0:20:02'Julie, the girl from the phone row, walks into the class,
0:20:02 > 0:20:05'face-to-face with Talisa.
0:20:06 > 0:20:09'Try as she might, it seems Talisa can't escape trouble.'
0:20:32 > 0:20:35'Everyone else tries to act as peacekeeper.'
0:20:35 > 0:20:37I need to find out if Talisa's all right
0:20:37 > 0:20:41and what's being going on. It seems like what's going on outside
0:20:41 > 0:20:46of trying to better herself has come back and bit her.
0:20:46 > 0:20:48How mad is that?
0:20:48 > 0:20:52'I talk to both Talisa and Julie to get to the bottom of what happened.'
0:20:52 > 0:20:56Basically, me and my brothers were standing by the station, yeah?
0:20:56 > 0:20:58All these others, they came up to us,
0:20:58 > 0:21:01sprayed me in my eye with a JuJu spray, yeah?
0:21:01 > 0:21:04I wasn't there. She was giving her sister the money.
0:21:04 > 0:21:06They was telling me what happened.
0:21:06 > 0:21:09'It's a complicated story, to say the least of it,
0:21:09 > 0:21:12'and even when I've heard both sides, I'm not much the wiser.'
0:21:12 > 0:21:15I don't want to seem like a snitch, but she can't do this to me.
0:21:15 > 0:21:17'This may seem petty and juvenile,
0:21:17 > 0:21:19'but it's clear passions are running high.
0:21:19 > 0:21:23'If they'd run into each other on the street,
0:21:23 > 0:21:26'it could have blown up into something much more serious.
0:21:29 > 0:21:32'Eventually they make up...for now.'
0:21:32 > 0:21:35Thank you very much, all right?
0:21:35 > 0:21:37'The afternoon has been an eye-opener.
0:21:37 > 0:21:40'I've learned that however much you want to change,
0:21:40 > 0:21:44'things from the world outside can come and trip you up.
0:21:44 > 0:21:48'I've also learned how different Aaron and Talisa are.'
0:21:48 > 0:21:52They're both trying to turn over a new leaf. Aaron is well on his way,
0:21:52 > 0:21:56whereas Talisa was distracted right in front of us
0:21:56 > 0:22:00and the old Talisa was brought back out to play.
0:22:00 > 0:22:03So how well they do and how much they progress,
0:22:03 > 0:22:07hopefully we'll find out and hopefully it will be positive.
0:22:07 > 0:22:08We shall see, I guess.
0:22:11 > 0:22:14So far, it's been an education.
0:22:14 > 0:22:17The more I see, the more I understand that that the reasons
0:22:17 > 0:22:22people are drawn into gang life are complex and often very different.
0:22:22 > 0:22:24I'm heading back to the Hotspot,
0:22:24 > 0:22:28the home of the All Bout Money gang, where I'd been with Aaron.
0:22:28 > 0:22:32'David Williams from the Covent Garden project is taking me there.'
0:22:32 > 0:22:34I'm going to take this right here.
0:22:34 > 0:22:38'He's trying to find gang members willing to talk to me.
0:22:38 > 0:22:41'The Hotspot is dangerous, even when it isn't dark.
0:22:41 > 0:22:43'The police always keep an eye on it
0:22:43 > 0:22:46'and tonight, it looks like things may have kicked off already.'
0:22:46 > 0:22:50- Are they on their way down there now?- Mate, I'm not even joking.
0:22:50 > 0:22:52I'm serious. That's not even a joke, I'm telling you.
0:22:52 > 0:22:57- They're most likely going there now, you know?- What are the issues there?
0:22:57 > 0:23:00Street robberies. Gang culture.
0:23:00 > 0:23:04- OK, yeah. - A bit of hostility, rivalry.
0:23:04 > 0:23:06Postcode wars and so forth.
0:23:06 > 0:23:09What should I be expecting?
0:23:09 > 0:23:12You might meet a few angry people, to be honest.
0:23:12 > 0:23:16- When you say angry, what do you mean?- The riots, for instance.
0:23:16 > 0:23:20People are still angry. Young people are angry. They want to be heard.
0:23:34 > 0:23:36'They might want to be heard,
0:23:36 > 0:23:39'but tonight they don't seem to want to talk to me.'
0:23:39 > 0:23:43You want to talk to us, brother? No?
0:23:46 > 0:23:50I don't think many people really want to talk to us right now.
0:23:50 > 0:23:53I mean, the bright light probably isn't helping.
0:23:53 > 0:23:55But hopefully David will find us
0:23:55 > 0:23:57someone who's willing to talk to us soonish.
0:24:01 > 0:24:03'It looked like it was going to be a frustrating visit,
0:24:03 > 0:24:08'But I was beginning to understand why people wouldn't talk.'
0:24:08 > 0:24:11I've just spoken to some guys here in Stockwell,
0:24:11 > 0:24:14they keep using the same phrase, "dry snitching".
0:24:14 > 0:24:18They believe talking to us on camera is basically a gentle version
0:24:18 > 0:24:20of going to the police and snitching.
0:24:20 > 0:24:23The incredibly frustrating thing about that
0:24:23 > 0:24:26is that the things they are saying are so valid
0:24:26 > 0:24:29and so bang on to what we're trying to talk about
0:24:29 > 0:24:32and discuss in this programme, that I can't...
0:24:32 > 0:24:35I think frustrating is an understatement.
0:24:35 > 0:24:39Off camera, people told me they felt poverty and police harassment
0:24:39 > 0:24:41drove them to seek security in gangs.
0:24:41 > 0:24:44But they wouldn't tell me on camera.
0:24:44 > 0:24:47I want them to say to you guys what they've said to me,
0:24:47 > 0:24:50but they're never going to do it, on camera at least.
0:24:50 > 0:24:55Oh, it makes me angry. It makes me so angry.
0:24:55 > 0:24:58'Finally, one man does come forward.'
0:24:58 > 0:25:03- You up for talking?- Yeah. What's up? - Hello, man. You all right?
0:25:03 > 0:25:06'He's Shakeel Nascimento, aged 22 and a refugee from the Congo.
0:25:06 > 0:25:08'He's lived in London since he was 14
0:25:08 > 0:25:12'and he seems to know about gang life from the inside.'
0:25:12 > 0:25:15Would you say that you were involved in any gangs?
0:25:25 > 0:25:29'He clearly knows a lot about tensions in the area.'
0:25:29 > 0:25:32So how dangerous does it get around here?
0:25:36 > 0:25:39- Do you know what it was over? - No, I don't know.
0:25:41 > 0:25:44How easy is it to escalate from being just a normal kid
0:25:44 > 0:25:47who's getting in trouble at school?
0:25:59 > 0:26:02Shakeel wants to tell me more,
0:26:02 > 0:26:04but thinks he's said enough in front of his mates.
0:26:04 > 0:26:08We arrange to meet a few days later.
0:26:17 > 0:26:21London is just one of many places where teenage gangs
0:26:21 > 0:26:23have caused big problems.
0:26:24 > 0:26:27Two days after last summer's riots began in the capital,
0:26:27 > 0:26:29violence broke out on Merseyside too.
0:26:33 > 0:26:37A different city, different people, but many of the same problems,
0:26:37 > 0:26:41and teen gangs taking a large part of the blame.
0:26:42 > 0:26:45Gang turf wars here have reached as far as cyberspace.
0:26:47 > 0:26:51But they're also an alarming part of the real world too.
0:26:51 > 0:26:54I'm heading for the place that became the focus of the battle
0:26:54 > 0:26:58between the rival Nogga Dogz gang from Norris Green
0:26:58 > 0:27:01and the Crocky Crew from neighbouring Croxteth.
0:27:04 > 0:27:06In 2007, this pub car park
0:27:06 > 0:27:11was the scene of one of the most notorious teen gang shootings
0:27:11 > 0:27:12of recent times.
0:27:12 > 0:27:14- RADIO REPORT:- 'Breaking news this evening.
0:27:14 > 0:27:17'An 11-year-old boy has died after being shot in the head.'
0:27:17 > 0:27:19It was part of a turf war,
0:27:19 > 0:27:23but the victim was a boy who had nothing to do with gangs.
0:27:23 > 0:27:26He was just on his way home from football practice.
0:27:26 > 0:27:29- RADIO REPORT:- 'The 11-year-old boy had been playing football
0:27:29 > 0:27:30'in the Croxteth area of Liverpool.'
0:27:30 > 0:27:33Rhys Jones was killed by a bullet
0:27:33 > 0:27:37which had ricocheted off a wall and hit him in the back.
0:27:37 > 0:27:41The gun was fired by 16-year-old Sean Mercer.
0:27:41 > 0:27:44He'd intended to shoot a rival from Norris Green
0:27:44 > 0:27:47to earn his spurs.
0:27:47 > 0:27:49The boys who played football
0:27:49 > 0:27:52with Rhys Jones are now aged 15.
0:27:52 > 0:27:56This is their team, Fir Tree FC.
0:27:56 > 0:28:00I went to watch one of their weekly practice sessions,
0:28:00 > 0:28:03supervised by coach Steve Geoghegan.
0:28:03 > 0:28:07Although the dreadful night of Rhys' murder was over four years ago,
0:28:07 > 0:28:10it still has very painful memories.
0:28:10 > 0:28:12I remember it like it was yesterday actually.
0:28:12 > 0:28:15I never heard nothing, I never heard any gunshots.
0:28:15 > 0:28:17I don't know why, everyone else in the area did.
0:28:18 > 0:28:20I shouted to me dad
0:28:20 > 0:28:24that Rhys was on the floor over there, what's happened?
0:28:24 > 0:28:27Just before I got there,
0:28:27 > 0:28:31a girl got there, and she was screaming, "He's been shot."
0:28:31 > 0:28:33And nothing registered.
0:28:33 > 0:28:36He was bleeding quite a lot
0:28:36 > 0:28:39and I just remember I started crying, really.
0:28:39 > 0:28:42It was just numbness.
0:28:42 > 0:28:45I felt my whole body shaking
0:28:45 > 0:28:46and I didn't know what to do.
0:28:46 > 0:28:51I knew, you know...
0:28:51 > 0:28:53I knew Rhys had no chance.
0:28:58 > 0:29:01Fir Tree FC hosts an annual tournament in honour of Rhys.
0:29:01 > 0:29:05Teams from all over the country come to compete for the Rhys Jones Cup.
0:29:05 > 0:29:09That's a great ball. Well played!
0:29:09 > 0:29:12But, even on the football pitch, there are reminders
0:29:12 > 0:29:15that gang violence is only just below the surface.
0:29:15 > 0:29:19Some teams were causing us some problems. One team actually said
0:29:19 > 0:29:22they were going to come back and shoot us.
0:29:22 > 0:29:24And by what's happened to our team,
0:29:24 > 0:29:27we don't take threats like that lightly.
0:29:27 > 0:29:29Why did they want to shoot you guys?
0:29:29 > 0:29:31A bad tackle went in,
0:29:31 > 0:29:34and their team got quite aggressive.
0:29:34 > 0:29:37So what goes through your head
0:29:37 > 0:29:40when you think something as small as a tackle could cause a shooting?
0:29:40 > 0:29:44Like a bad tackle, they're obviously going to go in football.
0:29:44 > 0:29:46Just the heat of the moment and the game and stuff.
0:29:46 > 0:29:50But to say you're going to shoot someone because of a bad tackle,
0:29:50 > 0:29:52I find that quite disturbing.
0:29:52 > 0:29:55So a decent bunch of lads who want nothing more
0:29:55 > 0:30:00than to enjoy their football can be threatened so casually.
0:30:02 > 0:30:04I was learning that you can get drawn into street violence,
0:30:04 > 0:30:06whether you want to be or not.
0:30:09 > 0:30:11It seems like sometimes, you don't even have a choice.
0:30:17 > 0:30:19It may be easy to get caught up in that world,
0:30:19 > 0:30:22but what about getting out?
0:30:22 > 0:30:26Is it possible for young people to break free of their environment
0:30:26 > 0:30:27and leave the gang life?
0:30:27 > 0:30:30I've got an appointment with a guy in East London
0:30:30 > 0:30:32who I hope can give me some answers.
0:30:37 > 0:30:40Sheldon Thomas runs a project in Stratford
0:30:40 > 0:30:43to counsel and rehabilitate gang members.
0:30:43 > 0:30:46It's called TAG - Target Against Gangs.
0:30:46 > 0:30:48They use their strong Christian beliefs
0:30:48 > 0:30:51to try and convince young people that there is a way out.
0:30:51 > 0:30:55What we've done is to get the main players
0:30:55 > 0:30:59in these particular gangs
0:30:59 > 0:31:01and get them to change the guys in the gangs.
0:31:01 > 0:31:05So we've got a philosophy of each one, teach one, reach one.
0:31:06 > 0:31:09Today they are reaching out to a mother on this estate.
0:31:09 > 0:31:13Her 15-year-old son has become heavily involved in crime,
0:31:13 > 0:31:14and she's worried.
0:31:14 > 0:31:18Both Sheldon and his assistant Gavin McKenna
0:31:18 > 0:31:22are ex-gang members themselves, so they know the score.
0:31:22 > 0:31:24But they're not the only visitors today.
0:31:24 > 0:31:25Probably come to nick one of them.
0:31:25 > 0:31:28This happens all the time, you know what I mean?
0:31:28 > 0:31:31The 15-year-old has disappeared.
0:31:43 > 0:31:47But I discover there's more to the case.
0:31:47 > 0:31:50Last night, this house was visited by a gang
0:31:50 > 0:31:53who shot up the windows and front door. It's a message
0:31:53 > 0:31:56for the 15-year-old, and his family is living with the fall-out.
0:31:56 > 0:31:58People think, "Oh, this don't happen every day."
0:31:58 > 0:32:01- It happens every day. - No-one's doing nothing.
0:32:01 > 0:32:03I was just sitting talking to the mother and father.
0:32:03 > 0:32:06Look how distraught the mum was. "I have to live here."
0:32:06 > 0:32:08The son that's caused the trouble's never here.
0:32:08 > 0:32:13Sheldon's one of the people the government speaks to about gangs.
0:32:13 > 0:32:16He's even had a meeting with David Cameron.
0:32:16 > 0:32:20Today I'm watching him in action.
0:32:20 > 0:32:24What's Sheldon's take on personal responsibility versus environment?
0:32:24 > 0:32:27Does he think it's down to the individual,
0:32:27 > 0:32:31or is it about forces beyond their control?
0:32:31 > 0:32:35But before we get round to any of that, he receives an urgent call.
0:32:35 > 0:32:38You don't need to worry so much about the six-year-olds.
0:32:38 > 0:32:41It's more the 8, 9, and 10-year-olds.
0:32:41 > 0:32:43A teacher in East London is worried about a gang problem at her school.
0:32:43 > 0:32:4510-year-olds are very sneaky
0:32:45 > 0:32:49because they are getting drafted in at that young age.
0:32:49 > 0:32:51You are hearing it right.
0:32:51 > 0:32:55Sheldon is talking about primary school kids.
0:32:55 > 0:32:58In this particular school, they're already showing signs
0:32:58 > 0:33:01that something's not quite right with some of the older guys
0:33:01 > 0:33:04who are about to go to secondary school. They're ten years old.
0:33:04 > 0:33:06How would you draw in someone that young?
0:33:06 > 0:33:09Very rarely do you hear of a policeman stopping a 10-year-old.
0:33:09 > 0:33:12They know that, so they give them young guys a little £10.
0:33:12 > 0:33:15£10 to a 10-year-old is lots of money.
0:33:15 > 0:33:18Before you know it, that's how they get trapped.
0:33:18 > 0:33:21£10, another £10, now he's got money.
0:33:21 > 0:33:23He ain't getting much money at home
0:33:23 > 0:33:25because obviously Mum's maybe struggling or whatever.
0:33:25 > 0:33:28So that's how these guys are getting caught up in it.
0:33:28 > 0:33:30Wow. OK.
0:33:30 > 0:33:33No wonder Sheldon thinks prayer is the answer.
0:33:33 > 0:33:35HE PRAYS
0:33:37 > 0:33:39Christianity is at the heart of his project.
0:33:39 > 0:33:43Keep our mind focused on the young men that we have
0:33:43 > 0:33:45to go out and sow a seed to.
0:33:45 > 0:33:47Father, let us have our goals fixed on them
0:33:47 > 0:33:49to bring them into the Kingdom.
0:33:49 > 0:33:52Today, we're talking about, "Who am I?"
0:33:52 > 0:33:55Because everything we do has to relate to what
0:33:55 > 0:33:56the man on the road's doing.
0:33:56 > 0:33:59Sheldon's style is like a street preacher.
0:33:59 > 0:34:01They step, one step, they're pulled right back...
0:34:01 > 0:34:04He starts by getting his team of former gang members
0:34:04 > 0:34:07to think about the things we can't control which upset us.
0:34:07 > 0:34:09Just touch on it. What exactly are you angry about?
0:34:09 > 0:34:12- A father figure. - What are you angry about?
0:34:12 > 0:34:14- Things that happened in the past. - Exactly.
0:34:14 > 0:34:18I've come to observe, but I'm being asked to offer my own thoughts too.
0:34:20 > 0:34:24I guess, frustrations, various frustrations.
0:34:24 > 0:34:28'Sheldon demonstrates how these outside issues can weigh us down.'
0:34:28 > 0:34:32This is what they're carrying. This is them.
0:34:32 > 0:34:36He believes we have to accept the hand we've been dealt and move on,
0:34:36 > 0:34:38rather than letting outside frustrations hold us back.
0:34:38 > 0:34:40I don't have to get up in the morning
0:34:40 > 0:34:44and be angry at something I can't do nothing about.
0:34:44 > 0:34:47What we can do something about, watch this, is about us.
0:34:47 > 0:34:49'It's a persuasive message.'
0:34:49 > 0:34:53The thing that came across for me was some of the stuff that he said
0:34:53 > 0:34:55actually really applied to me, you know.
0:34:55 > 0:34:59My start out isn't that different to some of the people in room.
0:34:59 > 0:35:03Hearing what Sheldon had to say rung true with me in some places.
0:35:03 > 0:35:07Although I'd experienced some of the frustrations
0:35:07 > 0:35:09I'd heard here tonight,
0:35:09 > 0:35:12I didn't join a street gang, whereas they did.
0:35:12 > 0:35:16Should I take credit for that? Or had I just been lucky?
0:35:16 > 0:35:18I left with more questions than answers.
0:35:28 > 0:35:32It's been a week since my visit to the Hotspot in South London.
0:35:32 > 0:35:36Remember I'd arranged to meet with Shakeel, the guy from the Congo?
0:35:36 > 0:35:38The only one who would talk?
0:35:38 > 0:35:41He's been in touch and agreed where to meet.
0:35:41 > 0:35:44'Not at the Hotspot, but at a cafe in West London
0:35:44 > 0:35:48'where no-one will recognise him.'
0:35:48 > 0:35:50I'm hoping that away from the Hotspot
0:35:50 > 0:35:54he'll open up further about whether or not he'd had a proper choice
0:35:54 > 0:35:56about getting involved in gang life.
0:36:00 > 0:36:06After an hour, I was wondering whether he would come at all.
0:36:06 > 0:36:09When he finally turns up, there's an explanation.
0:36:09 > 0:36:10The arrival of his new baby.
0:36:12 > 0:36:14Shakeel. Hello, man. How you doing?
0:36:14 > 0:36:18- You all right?- Yeah.- Good to see you, bruv. You OK?- Fine, thanks.
0:36:18 > 0:36:20- You look tired.- Yeah.
0:36:28 > 0:36:32Were you in the room when the baby was born?
0:36:37 > 0:36:39Social Services were involved?
0:36:49 > 0:36:52Do you think it may have come from
0:36:52 > 0:36:55your reputation and what you do?
0:37:09 > 0:37:12Shakeel's begun to open up, but I want to push him further.
0:37:12 > 0:37:14He may live near the Hotspot in Stockwell,
0:37:14 > 0:37:17but don't he and his friends have a choice
0:37:17 > 0:37:19about getting involved in gangs?
0:37:19 > 0:37:21Tell me about that t-shirt.
0:37:27 > 0:37:29What happened?
0:37:34 > 0:37:35Not far from the Hotspot?
0:37:39 > 0:37:41He was a good kid? Do you think it was mistaken identity?
0:37:51 > 0:37:55But Shakeel's gang hadn't just been victims of violence,
0:37:55 > 0:37:57they were behind some of it too.
0:37:57 > 0:37:59What sort of stuff did you do then?
0:38:01 > 0:38:02Like what?
0:38:04 > 0:38:06Are these violent things?
0:38:17 > 0:38:18Are you proud of it?
0:38:20 > 0:38:21Are you proud of what you did?
0:38:24 > 0:38:25What's your view on gangs?
0:38:25 > 0:38:28Why do you think there's so many in the city right now?
0:38:35 > 0:38:36What's the right reason?
0:38:49 > 0:38:50Shakeel had to leave.
0:38:50 > 0:38:53I appreciated how honest he'd been with me,
0:38:53 > 0:38:59but I was left wondering how he would manage away from his estate.
0:38:59 > 0:39:03Could someone who'd been so deeply involved in gangs
0:39:03 > 0:39:04ever really find a way out?
0:39:05 > 0:39:09Having a daughter means that he's got a reason to turn a corner,
0:39:09 > 0:39:10and I hope that he'll do it.
0:39:10 > 0:39:13But with the level that he was in before,
0:39:13 > 0:39:16and the fact that he's been through so much, the question is,
0:39:16 > 0:39:17can he actually do that?
0:39:21 > 0:39:25I'm heading back to the other side of London to see Talisa.
0:39:25 > 0:39:30She's another one who's found it hard to escape the world of gangs.
0:39:30 > 0:39:32She's trying, but is she succeeding?
0:39:34 > 0:39:37Tonight I'm invited for dinner with Talisa and her mum, Juliet.
0:39:37 > 0:39:40The family has had its fair share of problems.
0:39:40 > 0:39:42As I was about to find out.
0:39:44 > 0:39:46How you doing?
0:39:46 > 0:39:48Yeah, good, thank you. I can smell dinner.
0:39:48 > 0:39:53First I wanted to try and talk to Talisa's mum on her own.
0:39:53 > 0:39:55On the menu was a Ghanian speciality.
0:39:55 > 0:39:58- Hey, Juliet. Can I pop in? - Come in, Reggie.- How's it going?
0:39:58 > 0:39:59- Lovely.- Nice.
0:39:59 > 0:40:02- Can you smell the food? - It does smell good. Jollof, yeah?
0:40:02 > 0:40:05- Yes, jollof.- Wonderful.
0:40:05 > 0:40:06Jollof is...
0:40:06 > 0:40:09The bombshell for Juliet was discovering
0:40:09 > 0:40:11that Talisa was taking drugs.
0:40:11 > 0:40:13I had no idea she was even smoking cannabis
0:40:13 > 0:40:16until she came back from school one day
0:40:16 > 0:40:19and I happened to be searching through her bags, just by chance.
0:40:19 > 0:40:22And there was a card in there that said, "Girl, lay off the weed."
0:40:22 > 0:40:26You know, it never occurred to me, none of my family ever smokes dope.
0:40:26 > 0:40:29I didn't even know what was meant by "weed."
0:40:29 > 0:40:32She described one of her lowest points as when she was stabbed.
0:40:32 > 0:40:35After that happened, did you fear for your daughter's life?
0:40:35 > 0:40:38I was... I went into a state of shock.
0:40:38 > 0:40:41I allowed my daughter to go away from me so far, as to get into gangs,
0:40:41 > 0:40:43and to be stabbed, as well.
0:40:43 > 0:40:46Just showed me where everything was going,
0:40:46 > 0:40:49and I had to take a deep breath and stop.
0:40:49 > 0:40:53Do you feel that she's 100 percent away from the person she was?
0:40:53 > 0:40:55I'd say 78 percent!
0:40:55 > 0:40:58So, what about the remaining percent?
0:40:58 > 0:41:00What is it that's still... what's keeping her?
0:41:00 > 0:41:03She's not completely open to me,
0:41:03 > 0:41:05but I've developed a sixth sense about her,
0:41:05 > 0:41:07and I can tell when she's telling the truth,
0:41:07 > 0:41:09and I tell when she's not telling the truth.
0:41:09 > 0:41:13Juliet was clearly doing her best,
0:41:13 > 0:41:16but I wanted to know how family life had affected Talisa.
0:41:18 > 0:41:19Her mum and dad were divorced,
0:41:19 > 0:41:22but now live separate lives under the same roof.
0:41:22 > 0:41:27Over dinner, it didn't take long for the issue
0:41:27 > 0:41:29of her parents' relationship to emerge.
0:41:29 > 0:41:34I mean, knowing that you're close, and that you've got a relationship,
0:41:34 > 0:41:39how do you feel about knowing that what you did in the past
0:41:39 > 0:41:43hurt your mother so much and damaged your relationship with her?
0:41:43 > 0:41:48Well, it's more complicated to say, but, I didn't intentionally
0:41:48 > 0:41:51mean to hurt her, but through my child life, my mum and dad
0:41:51 > 0:41:55never got along, and my brother's more close to my mum,
0:41:55 > 0:41:56and I was more close to my dad,
0:41:56 > 0:41:59it's like I didn't have to fight for attention.
0:41:59 > 0:42:02But I know my mum cares about me,
0:42:02 > 0:42:05but because my mum and dad always used to argue, it confused me about
0:42:05 > 0:42:08who to like and who not to trust, and who to love and who to not.
0:42:08 > 0:42:11So, when my dad left, I thought my rock left,
0:42:11 > 0:42:14because my dad was like the person I loved the most in the world.
0:42:14 > 0:42:18So, when he left it just broke my heart, my world just went to an end.
0:42:20 > 0:42:22For the first time,
0:42:22 > 0:42:24I feel we are getting to the heart of Talisa's problem.
0:42:24 > 0:42:27In her eyes, everything came down to her mum and dad's separation.
0:42:28 > 0:42:31How did you feel about your mother at the time?
0:42:31 > 0:42:32I didn't hate her,
0:42:32 > 0:42:35but I just didn't understand why it couldn't work out.
0:42:35 > 0:42:38I was ten when my dad left. I was still at that age.
0:42:38 > 0:42:41It was just really about me trying to find myself,
0:42:41 > 0:42:43and trying to scream out for attention.
0:42:43 > 0:42:46She knew she had to get away from me,
0:42:46 > 0:42:48because I was perpetrator of her unhappiness,
0:42:48 > 0:42:50because her father had to leave.
0:42:50 > 0:42:52But she was too young to understand the ins and outs,
0:42:52 > 0:42:55she'd seen the police being called to this house before
0:42:55 > 0:42:57and she knew what was happening.
0:42:57 > 0:43:00But when the break finally came she wasn't ready for it,
0:43:00 > 0:43:02and so she thought, "My mum's deprived me of my father,
0:43:02 > 0:43:04"I'm going to be bad."
0:43:04 > 0:43:07- You thought I didn't care about you?- Yes, 60 percent. Yeah.
0:43:07 > 0:43:10At that time how important were your friends to you?
0:43:10 > 0:43:12That was the only thing that didn't give me problems.
0:43:12 > 0:43:14You saw your mum as a problem...
0:43:14 > 0:43:18We were arguing a lot at those times and she kicked me out before,
0:43:18 > 0:43:20so there was a lot of arguments,
0:43:20 > 0:43:22and I didn't feel wanted here, and I felt like a dog.
0:43:22 > 0:43:25It wasn't because I didn't want to be with her,
0:43:25 > 0:43:29it was because I felt that this wasn't my house any more.
0:43:29 > 0:43:32It must have taken a lot of courage for Talisa
0:43:32 > 0:43:34and her mother to speak openly.
0:43:34 > 0:43:37I've had a chance to meet a mum who understands
0:43:37 > 0:43:39the importance of a stable family.
0:43:39 > 0:43:42And how disruptive it can prove
0:43:42 > 0:43:44if the influence of a parent is taken away.
0:43:44 > 0:43:48So what does that mean for Talisa's future?
0:43:48 > 0:43:50I think the fact that her mother has embraced her
0:43:50 > 0:43:51in the way that she has
0:43:51 > 0:43:53is a key part on keeping her on the straight and narrow,
0:43:53 > 0:43:55and moving forward as she wants.
0:43:55 > 0:43:59If Talisa is able to become the person she wants to be,
0:43:59 > 0:44:02her mother is a key part in making that happen.
0:44:07 > 0:44:11Back in the North West, there's someone else I want to see.
0:44:11 > 0:44:14He lives on this estate in Skelmersdale,
0:44:14 > 0:44:1615 miles outside of Liverpool.
0:44:18 > 0:44:21He's the writer and lead rapper on this video.
0:44:24 > 0:44:28The song warns about the dangers of carrying knives.
0:44:31 > 0:44:34- JJ.- How are you? Nice to see you. - Nice to meet you.
0:44:34 > 0:44:35- You all right?- Yeah, good.
0:44:35 > 0:44:39JJ Hunter was once a member of a gang that terrorized this estate.
0:44:39 > 0:44:41Now he's going straight.
0:44:41 > 0:44:46He's got strong views on what drives young people into gang crime.
0:44:46 > 0:44:47One word - money.
0:44:47 > 0:44:51The people who are driving cars that are worth fifty grand,
0:44:51 > 0:44:53and moving away into big houses,
0:44:53 > 0:44:55so they start seeing what they're earning
0:44:55 > 0:44:56and what they're doing,
0:44:56 > 0:44:58and they want to progress with that, don't they?
0:44:58 > 0:45:01I think that's where it starts, to be honest with you.
0:45:01 > 0:45:04Seeing people with a lot of money and lot of respect,
0:45:04 > 0:45:06and then you want to aim for that, as a child,
0:45:06 > 0:45:08like you don't know any different really.
0:45:08 > 0:45:11So, when you were younger you saw the gang lifestyle as glamorous?
0:45:11 > 0:45:13Yeah, to be honest with you,
0:45:13 > 0:45:16it's stupid to say at this age now, but at the time, definitely, yeah.
0:45:16 > 0:45:19I've been bouncing from one side to the other,
0:45:19 > 0:45:22in terms of how I look at how young people get involved in gangs,
0:45:22 > 0:45:26some people say it's environment, some people say it's attitudes,
0:45:26 > 0:45:29and I came into this believing it's just about the person,
0:45:29 > 0:45:30it's the individual.
0:45:30 > 0:45:33What do you believe is the real reason for young people
0:45:33 > 0:45:35getting involved?
0:45:35 > 0:45:37I wouldn't say the person, that's just my perspective,
0:45:37 > 0:45:41I'd say the environment and the family members.
0:45:41 > 0:45:43Like I said, if you're living in an environment
0:45:43 > 0:45:45where there's not much going on,
0:45:45 > 0:45:47and you see people doing more than what you are,
0:45:47 > 0:45:51and making a lot more money, I think, that entices you, doesn't it?
0:45:51 > 0:45:54And that's part of your environment, not yourself, isn't?
0:45:59 > 0:46:03It's a simple idea, but thinking back, the temptation of easy money
0:46:03 > 0:46:07was something I'd heard from Sheldon and Aaron in London.
0:46:07 > 0:46:10'You got to go and get money however you can get it.
0:46:10 > 0:46:12'That's the mentality of the young people.
0:46:12 > 0:46:16'Ten pounds, another ten pounds. Now he's got money.'
0:46:16 > 0:46:20Then there was the gang in Stockwell, the All Bout Money gang.
0:46:20 > 0:46:22Maybe money is really what it's all about
0:46:22 > 0:46:26for many kids in teenage gangs. And what did Talisa say to me?
0:46:26 > 0:46:30'Need to sell drugs. I didn't really care, as long as I got the money.'
0:46:31 > 0:46:35As a teenager, I too was faced with the temptation
0:46:35 > 0:46:37of earning fast money.
0:46:37 > 0:46:40But I was also lucky to be given opportunities in the TV world.
0:46:40 > 0:46:45So, personal responsibility versus environment.
0:46:45 > 0:46:48What do I think now?
0:46:49 > 0:46:53I came into this journey believing that it's all about the individual
0:46:53 > 0:46:57and about a person believing that they can essentially take
0:46:57 > 0:47:00their environment, ignore it, and move forward,
0:47:00 > 0:47:03regardless of what's happening in their own lives,
0:47:03 > 0:47:06but, off the back of spending some time out here in the North West,
0:47:06 > 0:47:08my mind's starting to change a little bit.
0:47:08 > 0:47:10I'm a very proud and stubborn person,
0:47:10 > 0:47:14and I don't like to be proved wrong, but I definitely believe
0:47:14 > 0:47:17environment is a massive part of how well a young person can do,
0:47:17 > 0:47:19and whether a person gets pulled into drugs, gangs,
0:47:19 > 0:47:21criminality or not.
0:47:32 > 0:47:36I'm reaching the end of my journey, and it is time to say my goodbyes.
0:47:39 > 0:47:43Back in London, Shakeel had told us he was on a decorating course
0:47:43 > 0:47:46at this college in Greenwich, but he's gone off the radar again.
0:47:46 > 0:47:50I was hoping this would be the best place to pay him a last visit.
0:47:50 > 0:47:54I think Shakeel seems to be a guy who understands
0:47:54 > 0:47:57what this opportunity actually represents,
0:47:57 > 0:48:00and hopefully today, we'll see him embrace that.
0:48:00 > 0:48:02- Hello, Benita?- Hello, Reg.- Reg...
0:48:02 > 0:48:06Benita Ager runs the college and she was happy to show me around.
0:48:06 > 0:48:10They're here from nine in the morning till about 3:30.
0:48:10 > 0:48:13They specialise in offering opportunities
0:48:13 > 0:48:16to young people from deprived backgrounds.
0:48:16 > 0:48:19Just right for Shakeel - it was a place that could give him
0:48:19 > 0:48:23hope and an honest future. So where was he?
0:48:24 > 0:48:26He was excited about the course, we brought him on.
0:48:26 > 0:48:28He only attended for a couple of days.
0:48:28 > 0:48:29He did his induction.
0:48:29 > 0:48:32Hang on a second, he only attended for a couple of days?
0:48:32 > 0:48:34- Yeah.- So, is he not here today?
0:48:34 > 0:48:36He's not here any more, he's off the course now.
0:48:36 > 0:48:38Why is he off the course?
0:48:38 > 0:48:39Because he just didn't attend.
0:48:39 > 0:48:42We've rang him, he said he was ill one day,
0:48:42 > 0:48:44then he said he'd definitely be in the next day,
0:48:44 > 0:48:47and the third time we've rang, he switched his phone off.
0:48:47 > 0:48:51- We rang him an extra four times, we just couldn't get hold of him.- Right.
0:48:54 > 0:48:59That was a bit disappointing, wasn't it?
0:48:59 > 0:49:03The idea was to see Shakeel at work, as it were,
0:49:03 > 0:49:06and see him actively going out of his way to try
0:49:06 > 0:49:10and do something with himself, and he's not here,
0:49:10 > 0:49:12and he's not been here for a while,
0:49:12 > 0:49:16and I'm a little bit disappointed, if I'm honest.
0:49:20 > 0:49:25Hello, is that Shakeel? How you doing, mate? It's Reggie.
0:49:25 > 0:49:28How you doing? Have you just woken up?
0:49:28 > 0:49:31Why have you just woken up?
0:49:31 > 0:49:33Why are you stressed out?
0:49:33 > 0:49:36He agrees to meet by the river an hour later.
0:49:36 > 0:49:39But I'm worried this might be another no-show.
0:49:46 > 0:49:47When he turns up,
0:49:47 > 0:49:50he looks like a man who really doesn't want to be here.
0:49:52 > 0:49:54How you doing? You all right?
0:49:56 > 0:49:58You sure? You don't look it.
0:50:00 > 0:50:03Talk to me, man, what's up? What happened?
0:50:03 > 0:50:06How come you haven't been going to your classes?
0:50:15 > 0:50:18What is it that's so hard about putting yourself out there?
0:50:23 > 0:50:25Do you know what, Shakeel?
0:50:25 > 0:50:27There's people watching this right now that don't know you,
0:50:27 > 0:50:30don't understand the choices that you're having to make right now,
0:50:30 > 0:50:32they're going to be thinking,
0:50:32 > 0:50:33"If he just grinds it out,
0:50:33 > 0:50:35"gets himself a job, does what he has to do
0:50:35 > 0:50:38"and just swallows his pride, everything will work itself out."
0:50:56 > 0:50:57Well, you say you're being real,
0:50:57 > 0:50:59have you stepped back into that world...?
0:51:06 > 0:51:08The last thing I want to see you do is go down
0:51:08 > 0:51:10a road that you don't want to go down
0:51:10 > 0:51:13but it feels like everything is pushing you in that direction.
0:51:13 > 0:51:15Where you going to end up in two years, bruv?
0:51:19 > 0:51:21I don't want you to go the wrong way, brother,
0:51:21 > 0:51:24but this might actually be the last time I speak to you,
0:51:24 > 0:51:26and I don't want to walk away thinking
0:51:26 > 0:51:28that you're going to go in the wrong direction.
0:51:28 > 0:51:29What do you think is going to happen to you?
0:51:37 > 0:51:39What do you really want for yourself?
0:51:44 > 0:51:47And how do you think you're going to achieve that right now?
0:52:03 > 0:52:06'I really want Shakeel to keep the promise he's just made to me
0:52:06 > 0:52:07'to give it a go,
0:52:07 > 0:52:10'but sometimes wanting isn't enough.'
0:52:11 > 0:52:13Look after yourself.
0:52:13 > 0:52:16'I'm sad to be saying goodbye,
0:52:16 > 0:52:18'I feel that Shakeel needs long-term help,
0:52:18 > 0:52:21'but he's also got to learn to help himself.
0:52:23 > 0:52:25'Let's hope he makes it.
0:52:28 > 0:52:30'Back at the project in Covent Garden,
0:52:30 > 0:52:34'one person at least is trying to make the best of his opportunities.
0:52:34 > 0:52:38'Not only is Aaron becoming a success as a mentor,
0:52:38 > 0:52:40'but they've also given him a job.
0:52:40 > 0:52:43'Three days a week he earns eight pounds an hour doing admin,
0:52:43 > 0:52:47'but it's less than what he would earn in a street gang.'
0:52:47 > 0:52:50It tempts me every day. I see it every day.
0:52:50 > 0:52:53It's part of my environment, that's all I see,
0:52:53 > 0:52:55but, erm...it's a conscious decision
0:52:55 > 0:52:58I've got to make as to, you know, where I see myself,
0:52:58 > 0:53:01my family, my friends,
0:53:01 > 0:53:03the people what's gave me opportunities now.
0:53:03 > 0:53:06I can't let everyone down like that.
0:53:06 > 0:53:08And what about Talisa?
0:53:08 > 0:53:11How is she coping with life away from her gang?
0:53:11 > 0:53:13Is she strong enough to do the right thing
0:53:13 > 0:53:17and resist the lure of easy money through drugs?
0:53:17 > 0:53:20I want to help but I know it's up to her.
0:53:20 > 0:53:22I said we'd go shopping
0:53:22 > 0:53:25to see if she's managing to budget for herself,
0:53:25 > 0:53:26but when we meet,
0:53:26 > 0:53:30she says she's just had to pay £200 in rent arrears...
0:53:31 > 0:53:32..so I lend her 20 quid.
0:53:35 > 0:53:38I've got to ask you, if we hadn't have helped you out today,
0:53:38 > 0:53:41erm, how would you have paid for your shopping,
0:53:41 > 0:53:44or would there even have been any shopping today?
0:53:44 > 0:53:47- There would have been no shopping. I'm not going to lie to you.- No?- No.
0:53:47 > 0:53:49What do you do in situations like that?
0:53:49 > 0:53:51You just depend on your friends.
0:53:51 > 0:53:53That is actually expensive.
0:53:55 > 0:53:57So with the money that you're living off now from benefits,
0:53:57 > 0:53:59where is all that money going?
0:53:59 > 0:54:03- Be honest with me here.- Yeah. - Are you smoking any of that money?
0:54:03 > 0:54:05Not as much as before.
0:54:05 > 0:54:07A little bit, yeah, but not as much as before.
0:54:07 > 0:54:11So what would happen if you stopped smoking?
0:54:11 > 0:54:13- Do you not think...- Save money. Save the money.
0:54:13 > 0:54:16Even though I haven't smoked for three or four days, I feel fine.
0:54:16 > 0:54:19It's just that when I get the money it's a bit tempting, but...
0:54:19 > 0:54:23I hate to sound like an annoying art teacher or something,
0:54:23 > 0:54:27but in the next 12 months, you're going to need to focus and not be drawn back in,
0:54:27 > 0:54:28but, from what you're saying,
0:54:28 > 0:54:31- there's a good chance you will be drawn back in.- I won't, I promise.
0:54:31 > 0:54:33Well, tell me something that will make me believe
0:54:33 > 0:54:35that you won't be drawn back in.
0:54:35 > 0:54:37If I went back, I'd be a bigger fool than I am now,
0:54:37 > 0:54:40and feeling like a fool I don't like that feeling.
0:54:40 > 0:54:42I'm not saying, "Never say never,"
0:54:42 > 0:54:44but I know this is not going to happen.
0:54:44 > 0:54:48You've just got to trust me on this one, Reg.
0:54:48 > 0:54:49Trust me.
0:54:58 > 0:55:00When I started this journey,
0:55:00 > 0:55:02I thought that you make your own choices in life,
0:55:02 > 0:55:06and that you just have to live with the consequences.
0:55:06 > 0:55:07I'd always had to accept that,
0:55:07 > 0:55:10and I believed that everyone else should do the same,
0:55:10 > 0:55:12but what I've seen these last few months
0:55:12 > 0:55:14has changed the way I feel.
0:55:16 > 0:55:17I came into this process
0:55:17 > 0:55:20believing that a person is in charge of their own destiny,
0:55:20 > 0:55:24but since meeting people like Shakeel and Talisa,
0:55:24 > 0:55:27I think environment has a huge say on how far someone can go.
0:55:29 > 0:55:31I think, more than anything,
0:55:31 > 0:55:34I've got a new-found respect for how fortunate I have been.
0:55:34 > 0:55:37I found myself at a crossroads when I was younger,
0:55:37 > 0:55:40and I had to make a very clear decision
0:55:40 > 0:55:42not to go down a certain path.
0:55:42 > 0:55:45I've looked at anybody who's made a bad decision
0:55:45 > 0:55:49that's had a tough start as weak and as stupid
0:55:49 > 0:55:52to a certain extent and...
0:55:54 > 0:55:57..I think I've learned that there's much more to somebody
0:55:57 > 0:55:58who's finding it tough,
0:55:58 > 0:56:01especially somebody in a teenage gang.
0:56:02 > 0:56:04This process has taught me
0:56:04 > 0:56:08a hell of a lot about how hard it is to make a positive decision
0:56:08 > 0:56:10when a negative decision can benefit you massively,
0:56:10 > 0:56:12in the short term at least,
0:56:12 > 0:56:15and when you're living hand-to-mouth,
0:56:15 > 0:56:18the short term is so much more important.
0:56:20 > 0:56:22Perhaps what the young people I've met really need
0:56:22 > 0:56:24is a long-term future
0:56:24 > 0:56:26that they believe is worth keeping out of trouble for.
0:56:42 > 0:56:46Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd