0:00:02 > 0:00:04We viewers buy our sets for a variety of reasons,
0:00:04 > 0:00:06but the chief of them is entertainment.
0:00:06 > 0:00:10We want to be entertained, and by entertainment,
0:00:10 > 0:00:13we mean programmes that take our mind of the H-bomb,
0:00:13 > 0:00:15and the fact that we've had a hard day in the office.
0:00:19 > 0:00:20Very good, aren't they?
0:00:20 > 0:00:24It has been found that a method well suited to the television audience
0:00:24 > 0:00:28is the entertainment that operates on more than one level.
0:00:29 > 0:00:30You don't deserve this.
0:00:33 > 0:00:35Aha-ha-ha-ha!
0:00:35 > 0:00:39It begins with an appeal to laughter, excitement, curiosity,
0:00:39 > 0:00:41a warm personality.
0:00:42 > 0:00:44- What do you think so far? - Rubbish!
0:00:48 > 0:00:52Television's job is to leave us more alert than it found us.
0:00:52 > 0:00:58I like coffee, I like tea, I like radio and TV.
0:01:08 > 0:01:12'The new eye of television is roaming here, seeking there...
0:01:12 > 0:01:17'penetrating, revealing, probing,
0:01:17 > 0:01:23'recording - bringing the live world into the homes of the people.'
0:01:23 > 0:01:28In the 1930s, there were over 400 variety theatres in England and Scotland,
0:01:28 > 0:01:31and people would catch a show at least once a week.
0:01:31 > 0:01:36Between 1954 and 1958, over half of them closed.
0:01:36 > 0:01:40It's no coincidence saw the rapid growth
0:01:40 > 0:01:44of a new form of entertainment - television.
0:01:46 > 0:01:51'In 15 years in Britain - of course, TV was blacked out during the war -
0:01:51 > 0:01:55'television sets have grown from 10,000 in 1936
0:01:55 > 0:01:58'to five-and-three-quarter million today.'
0:01:58 > 0:01:59Blame the Queen.
0:01:59 > 0:02:02- HE LAUGHS - Blame the Queen.
0:02:03 > 0:02:08Her coronation was the first big television event.
0:02:10 > 0:02:14Everybody went... If they hadn't got a television set of their own,
0:02:14 > 0:02:17they all crowded into their neighbours'
0:02:17 > 0:02:18on these small small...
0:02:18 > 0:02:21What were they - 10-inch or something like that?
0:02:21 > 0:02:25I remember because my uncle sent me to Carlisle.
0:02:25 > 0:02:28There were some problems at Her Majesty's Carlisle,
0:02:28 > 0:02:32and I went into the theatre and at the first house,
0:02:32 > 0:02:35there were 60 people in,
0:02:35 > 0:02:39and the manager couldn't believe it.
0:02:39 > 0:02:42And it never fully recovered.
0:02:42 > 0:02:44'What does it mean to you?
0:02:44 > 0:02:48'For those who seldom read a book or visit a theatre,
0:02:48 > 0:02:52'it has brought new entertainment - drama, opera, ballet -
0:02:52 > 0:02:55'and above all, sport and variety.'
0:02:55 > 0:02:57In the '50s and '60s, what I call...
0:02:57 > 0:03:02I shouldn't - it's very rude of me. Forgive me, all of you.
0:03:02 > 0:03:05But the '50s, '60s, I call the Halcyon days of television.
0:03:07 > 0:03:09It was coming on so strong,
0:03:09 > 0:03:12and it was wonderful to see this.
0:03:15 > 0:03:18It looked so glamorous-looking, that suddenly,
0:03:18 > 0:03:22the theatre didn't have that magic that it had had.
0:03:22 > 0:03:26And gradually, variety theatres just went.
0:03:26 > 0:03:30- There was more magic on TV?- Yes, there was so much more excitement.
0:03:31 > 0:03:33There were other things, now, to do.
0:03:33 > 0:03:35If you could only go to the theatre,
0:03:35 > 0:03:38you may have drifted back to doing it, but now you can watch TV...
0:03:38 > 0:03:44pubs were beginning to open just a little bit, overseas travel was beginning to become available.
0:03:44 > 0:03:50There were other alternatives than just going to the theatre to see whoever the act was of that week.
0:03:50 > 0:03:54'Television belongs to us all. It has become part of our very lives.
0:03:54 > 0:03:59'And it is in our hands to determine what shall happen to it.
0:03:59 > 0:04:04'We are all involved in its future - whether it be used for good
0:04:04 > 0:04:05'or for ill.'
0:04:05 > 0:04:08My uncle, Jack Taylor...
0:04:08 > 0:04:15who was a very prolific producer of summer shows, tours and whatnot.
0:04:15 > 0:04:19He didn't believe in television.
0:04:19 > 0:04:26And when things were bad, he spent the same amount of money on the shows as he had done in the past.
0:04:26 > 0:04:30And he said, "Oh, it's all a flash in the pan, this television.
0:04:30 > 0:04:34"It won't last. People will come back to the theatres," and whatnot.
0:04:34 > 0:04:37And poor old Jack died bankrupt...
0:04:37 > 0:04:41you know...in 1959,
0:04:41 > 0:04:48not accepting that television had taken over.
0:04:48 > 0:04:53'The immense power of this new medium is vested in the hands of a few.
0:04:53 > 0:04:57'Those few who can influence the minds of millions
0:04:57 > 0:05:02'by what their pictures, words and sounds convey.'
0:05:02 > 0:05:04The great skill of the variety producer
0:05:04 > 0:05:07was getting the running order right.
0:05:07 > 0:05:10The successor to that is the television scheduler.
0:05:10 > 0:05:14And now, tonight, we can all sit back,
0:05:14 > 0:05:17and we're watching a variety show of sorts.
0:05:17 > 0:05:19Instead of four minutes of a dancing troupe
0:05:19 > 0:05:21and seven minutes of a juggler
0:05:21 > 0:05:23and 12 minutes, at the top of the bill, stand-up,
0:05:23 > 0:05:26we're watching a half-hour sit-com,
0:05:26 > 0:05:29followed by a three-quarters-of-an-hour documentary
0:05:29 > 0:05:33followed by a sports programme followed by this, followed by that.
0:05:33 > 0:05:37Not only that, of course, but we can now self-schedule.
0:05:37 > 0:05:42We can hop about and choose our variety bill as we want to.
0:05:42 > 0:05:44While the growing popularity of television
0:05:44 > 0:05:46meant the end of live variety,
0:05:46 > 0:05:50a few performers would rise from the ashes
0:05:50 > 0:05:53to become some of the 20th century's biggest stars.
0:05:53 > 0:05:56But to look at the journey from stage to screen,
0:05:56 > 0:06:00we must start where we began - in the theatre.
0:06:00 > 0:06:01The London Palladium -
0:06:01 > 0:06:05the beating heart of the variety theatre for over 70 years.
0:06:05 > 0:06:09If you could make it here, you could make it anywhere.
0:06:13 > 0:06:16When did you first come as a performer through here?
0:06:16 > 0:06:19As a performer, Sunday Night At The Palladium.
0:06:24 > 0:06:25The actual day I came here,
0:06:25 > 0:06:30I did drive around the block three times because I was so nervous.
0:06:35 > 0:06:38And because I was just a...practically a nobody at the time,
0:06:38 > 0:06:43working at Eastbourne, to an audience of about 200.
0:06:45 > 0:06:47LAUGHTER ECHOES
0:06:51 > 0:06:54CHEERING AND APPLAUSE ECHOES
0:06:58 > 0:07:00BRUCE LAUGHS There you go, we're here.
0:07:00 > 0:07:05- Now take us through to the stage. - You can go past the dressing rooms, or you can go straight through here.
0:07:05 > 0:07:07- Shall we go straight through?- Yes.
0:07:12 > 0:07:13I tell you...
0:07:15 > 0:07:19..this theatre means so much to me. It means everything to me.
0:07:26 > 0:07:31It's got 2,300 seats, but from here, from a performer's point of view,
0:07:31 > 0:07:33- it does feel intimate, doesn't it? - Oh, it does.
0:07:33 > 0:07:38- You can reach everybody. - Yes, exactly. It's got that lovely, lovely feeling.
0:07:38 > 0:07:43Any words you say, any little phrase you say is picked up straight away.
0:07:43 > 0:07:45BRUCE ON ARCHIVE FILM: Thank you very much.
0:07:45 > 0:07:49You feel important. You're here, and you're talking to the people.
0:07:51 > 0:07:53Coming back, it always gives me...
0:07:53 > 0:07:56I always get a bit of a tingle when I walk in here,
0:07:56 > 0:07:58because it means so much to me.
0:07:58 > 0:08:00- Marvellous. How many memories? - I tell you.
0:08:15 > 0:08:17- It was a prestige thing.- No question.
0:08:17 > 0:08:21It was the most famous variety theatre in the world.
0:08:21 > 0:08:23Well, the London Palladium
0:08:23 > 0:08:25is where I first fell in love with show business.
0:08:25 > 0:08:29My dad's office was across the street, and in the school holidays,
0:08:29 > 0:08:32he'd bring me and my sister to opening nights here.
0:08:32 > 0:08:336.15, Monday night.
0:08:33 > 0:08:36I remember seeing the Ink Spots, Guy Mitchell,
0:08:36 > 0:08:39Frankie Laine, Jack Jones, Jack Benny - one of my heroes.
0:08:39 > 0:08:42And we'd always sit in the same seats, here -
0:08:42 > 0:08:47Row C, third row - 13, 14, 15 and 16.
0:08:47 > 0:08:48Magic nights.
0:08:51 > 0:08:52HE SIGHS
0:08:58 > 0:08:59Thank you.
0:08:59 > 0:09:01- Hey.- What?- Who's working you?
0:09:07 > 0:09:09The Palladium is regarded...
0:09:09 > 0:09:12- and I would guess, because of your successes there...- The temple.
0:09:12 > 0:09:16- ..as the temple. - The temple of show business. - The temple of variety.
0:09:16 > 0:09:19Any show at the Palladium, the star, the real star is the Palladium.
0:09:19 > 0:09:22From outside, it's quite unassuming.
0:09:22 > 0:09:24You walk up to it and you think, "OK,"
0:09:24 > 0:09:27and then you walk through the side-of-stage door,
0:09:27 > 0:09:31and all of a sudden, you come into this vast arena.
0:09:33 > 0:09:37People come from North America, people come from Europe.
0:09:37 > 0:09:40People come from everywhere to the Palladium,
0:09:40 > 0:09:42because it is the London Palladium.
0:09:42 > 0:09:45There are certain venues where you can walk out and think, "Hmm..."
0:09:45 > 0:09:49You walk out on that stage, and it's like "Ooh."
0:09:49 > 0:09:53You know that there's so much talent and so much energy
0:09:53 > 0:09:57that's filled that room before you've walked on that stage,
0:09:57 > 0:10:01and it's quite a remarkable place to perform.
0:10:02 > 0:10:05Just to say you've played the Palladium,
0:10:05 > 0:10:08even if you're a bottom-of-the-bill juggler,
0:10:08 > 0:10:10you could still put on your bill matter,
0:10:10 > 0:10:12"Direct from the London Palladium."
0:10:12 > 0:10:15It meant everything. It was a worldwide mark of respect.
0:10:15 > 0:10:18If you did that, you'd made it.
0:10:18 > 0:10:23I've stood on the stage at the Palladium where Danny Kaye entertained.
0:10:23 > 0:10:27I've stood on the stage where all the greatest stars in the world...
0:10:27 > 0:10:32And I've had that honour of standing there, and not only that,
0:10:32 > 0:10:35but Bing Crosby was in the audience on a Saturday night,
0:10:35 > 0:10:38and I sang to Bing Crosby, and he liked it! He liked it.
0:10:38 > 0:10:42And then, one night, because he came over to do the Royal Show,
0:10:42 > 0:10:44I told jokes to Bob Hope.
0:10:44 > 0:10:46Bob Hope's sitting about six or seven rows back.
0:10:46 > 0:10:50Bob Hope! And afterwards, a journalist said to him,
0:10:50 > 0:10:53"Mr Hope, how did you...? What did you think of our Ken Dodd?"
0:10:53 > 0:10:57And he said, "Ah, gee, that Ken Dodd," he said,
0:10:57 > 0:11:00"every laugh was like a sword in my side."
0:11:08 > 0:11:11People were given entertainment sparingly,
0:11:11 > 0:11:14so the only chance they could get to really enjoy themselves
0:11:14 > 0:11:16was to go to the cinema,
0:11:16 > 0:11:19or they could go to the theatre to see variety.
0:11:19 > 0:11:24But when ITV came along, all of a sudden, entertainment was available.
0:11:24 > 0:11:27The BBC always worked on the premise that if you enjoyed it,
0:11:27 > 0:11:29it can't really be good for you.
0:11:29 > 0:11:34There was a marvellous thing published just after the War, which was a sort of green book -
0:11:34 > 0:11:39guidance for variety producers on what they could do. It's my most cherished document.
0:11:39 > 0:11:42"It is impossible to list in detail all potentially dangerous subjects,
0:11:42 > 0:11:44"but a few random samples are given here.
0:11:44 > 0:11:47"There's an absolute ban on the following:
0:11:47 > 0:11:50"Lavatories, effeminacy in men, immorality of any kind,
0:11:50 > 0:11:54"suggestive references to honeymoon couples, chamber maids, fig leaves,
0:11:54 > 0:11:59- "prostitution, ladies' underwear - e.g. 'winter- drawers- on' -
0:11:59 > 0:12:01"animal habits - e.g. rabbits -
0:12:01 > 0:12:04"lodgers, commercial travellers,
0:12:04 > 0:12:10"and extreme care should be taken in dealing with references to or jokes about pre-natal influences -
0:12:10 > 0:12:13"e.g. 'His mother was frightened by a donkey.'"
0:12:15 > 0:12:17ITV was launched in 1955,
0:12:17 > 0:12:23and the jewel in its crown put the variety theatre firmly centre stage.
0:12:23 > 0:12:27I think Sunday Night At The London Palladium is interesting,
0:12:27 > 0:12:30because probably the bulk of the country
0:12:30 > 0:12:32really was unaware of the London Palladium.
0:12:32 > 0:12:34And what it did do,
0:12:34 > 0:12:38it brought great performers, on a theatrical stage,
0:12:38 > 0:12:40to entertain the nation.
0:12:40 > 0:12:43And we'd never really had that before in that way.
0:12:46 > 0:12:49In its early days, it had enormous impact,
0:12:49 > 0:12:52because it was straight, in-your-face variety
0:12:52 > 0:12:55that had never been seen on television in that way before.
0:12:57 > 0:13:02That was the showcase. If you got on there, that was just it.
0:13:02 > 0:13:03Millions of viewers -
0:13:03 > 0:13:06who hadn't seen you in the theatre or even knew about you -
0:13:06 > 0:13:08millions would see you that night.
0:13:11 > 0:13:16I'm pretty certain I never saw Tommy Trinder hosting it.
0:13:16 > 0:13:19Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to Sunday Night At The London Palladium.
0:13:19 > 0:13:22- I might have seen Robert Morley... - Yes!
0:13:22 > 0:13:25..a very unlikely host do it, on one occasion.
0:13:25 > 0:13:31And at a time when they were searching for the new resident host,
0:13:31 > 0:13:34I might have seen Monkhouse - Bob Monkhouse - on it.
0:13:34 > 0:13:37But I really latched onto it
0:13:37 > 0:13:42when Bruce Forsyth came and reinvented himself.
0:13:42 > 0:13:44- # Poor me - Poor me
0:13:44 > 0:13:45- # Poor me - Poor me
0:13:45 > 0:13:46- # Uh-huh - Uh-huh
0:13:46 > 0:13:48- # Poor me - Poor me
0:13:48 > 0:13:50# Poor me-ee-ee
0:13:50 > 0:13:52Bruce, Bruce, quick!
0:13:52 > 0:13:56# ..hold you by me so tight Each night, that's right... #
0:13:56 > 0:14:01It taught me everything. I remember Alan King, the wonderful comic,
0:14:01 > 0:14:02and he said to me,
0:14:02 > 0:14:04"How long have you been in the business, Bruce?
0:14:04 > 0:14:07"I know you've only just started at the Palladium."
0:14:07 > 0:14:10I said, "I've been in the business for 16 years.
0:14:10 > 0:14:14He said, "It's taken you 16 years to be an overnight sensation."
0:14:14 > 0:14:16Good evening!
0:14:16 > 0:14:19# Ladies and gentlemen...
0:14:19 > 0:14:23# Welcome to Sunday Night At The London Palladium
0:14:23 > 0:14:27# Hope your Easter holiday has been very gay
0:14:27 > 0:14:31# Toujours la politesse Hip, hip, hooray... #
0:14:31 > 0:14:33I hope you're having a nice time, I really do.
0:14:33 > 0:14:37- This was where you started working with...- Audience participation.
0:14:37 > 0:14:40- Am I right?- Absolutely correct.
0:14:40 > 0:14:42You've had some good research. LAUGHTER
0:14:42 > 0:14:46- Well...- Or you've read my book. Maybe you've read my book.
0:14:46 > 0:14:48It was at this point... I read the index.
0:14:49 > 0:14:51- Only cos your name was in it. - Exactly.
0:14:51 > 0:14:53- Is this your wife?- No, no.
0:14:53 > 0:14:55Somebody else's - that's why I'm happy!
0:14:55 > 0:14:57LAUGHTER
0:14:57 > 0:14:59Are you with him, dear?
0:14:59 > 0:15:02- Yes.- We've definitely hit on something here.
0:15:02 > 0:15:04LAUGHTER
0:15:04 > 0:15:06Read all about it next Sunday.
0:15:06 > 0:15:11I could always tell the people who liked doing audience participation
0:15:11 > 0:15:13and the comedians who hated it.
0:15:13 > 0:15:16And they have that fear in their eyes of,
0:15:16 > 0:15:20"What happens if it all goes wrong?" I love things to go wrong.
0:15:20 > 0:15:22Good evening... How are you, all right?
0:15:22 > 0:15:24We wondered where you were.
0:15:24 > 0:15:26LAUGHTER
0:15:26 > 0:15:28That's it. Got the sandwiches?
0:15:28 > 0:15:30LAUGHTER
0:15:30 > 0:15:33Yes, you're just in front of the flowers, they're very nice.
0:15:33 > 0:15:36Jolly good. Where are you two from, by the way?
0:15:36 > 0:15:38We've just found out where everybody's from.
0:15:38 > 0:15:39Where are you from?
0:15:39 > 0:15:42Where are you from, sir? It's a party, it's a party.
0:15:42 > 0:15:45Where? London? Why are you late?!
0:15:45 > 0:15:48LAUGHTER
0:15:48 > 0:15:51My frustration has always helped me in comedy.
0:15:51 > 0:15:55The fact that I'm surrounded with people,
0:15:55 > 0:15:59and I show this into camera. I go... I show this frustration.
0:15:59 > 0:16:03It started when I was about 10 years old, 11 years old.
0:16:03 > 0:16:0530 seconds, then, to beat the clock.
0:16:05 > 0:16:08Take your time, because I want a breather. Starting...
0:16:08 > 0:16:10LAUGHTER
0:16:16 > 0:16:19I've got enough trouble tonight without you. Right!
0:16:19 > 0:16:20The theatre was new.
0:16:20 > 0:16:23The American artists that were coming across,
0:16:23 > 0:16:25as well as the domestic artists,
0:16:25 > 0:16:27these were something that the BBC
0:16:27 > 0:16:30never really had tried to create for television.
0:16:30 > 0:16:32You know what we haven't done, yet, Terry?
0:16:32 > 0:16:37We haven't done anything that's really old-fashioned variety, Vaudeville style.
0:16:37 > 0:16:38Let's do one number like that.
0:16:38 > 0:16:41I think I have my Vaudeville prop back here. Yes, here we go.
0:16:41 > 0:16:44AUDIENCE MURMURS
0:16:44 > 0:16:48No man worth his union card would be caught without one of these.
0:16:48 > 0:16:50LAUGHTER
0:16:52 > 0:16:53# Me...
0:16:54 > 0:17:00# ..and my shadow... #
0:17:00 > 0:17:03One of the links between you and that period
0:17:03 > 0:17:05is with the big American stars.
0:17:05 > 0:17:08- Many of them became friends. - Oh, yes.
0:17:08 > 0:17:12Who did you enjoy working with, particularly? Obviously, Sammy Davis.
0:17:12 > 0:17:14Yes, Sammy Davis, of course.
0:17:14 > 0:17:17I always found, the bigger the star, the nicer they were.
0:17:17 > 0:17:19# Because...
0:17:19 > 0:17:23# There ain't gonna be nobody up there
0:17:23 > 0:17:26# But me
0:17:27 > 0:17:31# And my... # I said me and my shadow!
0:17:32 > 0:17:37# All alone and feeling blue. #
0:17:44 > 0:17:48Your job was to look was to look after some of these American stars.
0:17:48 > 0:17:49What did that entail?
0:17:49 > 0:17:51We did everything for them, really.
0:17:51 > 0:17:54Looked after them, got them out of trouble when they got into trouble.
0:17:54 > 0:17:57Who was the most difficult?
0:17:57 > 0:17:59Mario Lanza.
0:17:59 > 0:18:05# Because you're mine... #
0:18:05 > 0:18:10In a year, he knocked me out six times and put me in hospital twice.
0:18:10 > 0:18:12He was quite a violent man.
0:18:14 > 0:18:17# Because you're mine... #
0:18:17 > 0:18:22He was the most beautiful...fellow when he was sober,
0:18:22 > 0:18:26but he was rarely sober, I'm afraid.
0:18:26 > 0:18:32# For as long as I may live... #
0:18:32 > 0:18:38With him, when we travelled, he wouldn't sleep in a room on his own,
0:18:38 > 0:18:41so we had two beds - thank God - in the room
0:18:41 > 0:18:44because he used to wake up in the middle of the night with DTs,
0:18:44 > 0:18:49and say people were coming through the window or trying to get in the door,
0:18:49 > 0:18:53and then I would have to do a whole act about chasing them away.
0:18:53 > 0:18:57- He would...- You would have to...? - Oh, yes.
0:18:57 > 0:19:00"I'm Peter Prichard, I've been in the British Army,
0:19:00 > 0:19:03"I'll kill you fellows if you come through this window."
0:19:03 > 0:19:06He would love that. He'd say, "Oh, great."
0:19:06 > 0:19:09That would relax him, he'd go back to sleep.
0:19:09 > 0:19:13# And it's applause
0:19:13 > 0:19:17# Because...
0:19:17 > 0:19:25# You're mi-i-i-i-i-i-ine. #
0:19:25 > 0:19:30I was told Mario was going to be presented to the Queen.
0:19:30 > 0:19:34This was another worry, because he had a thing of stepping forward and biting girls' necks.
0:19:34 > 0:19:36HE LAUGHS
0:19:36 > 0:19:39So, they were all worried, and in the Palladium,
0:19:39 > 0:19:42in those days, the bigger stars
0:19:42 > 0:19:46stood on a little staircase behind the royal box -
0:19:46 > 0:19:49very tight fit - to meet the Queen.
0:19:49 > 0:19:53For the first time ever, they put me behind Lanza,
0:19:53 > 0:19:56and I had my hands in his trouser belt
0:19:56 > 0:19:59to pull him back if he did anything but bow.
0:19:59 > 0:20:02And of course, like all naughty boys, he was perfect.
0:20:02 > 0:20:05He was so gracious to the Queen.
0:20:05 > 0:20:08And the Duke of Edinburgh was next in line.
0:20:08 > 0:20:10And I'm thinking, "This might be difficult,"
0:20:10 > 0:20:16so I'm holding tight and he shook hands with the Duke, and the Duke said,
0:20:16 > 0:20:20"Mr Lanza, we do enjoy your work, and you were so good tonight,
0:20:20 > 0:20:25"and we understand that you're having a very successful European tour."
0:20:25 > 0:20:27He said, "Well, I am.
0:20:27 > 0:20:34"If you call 10,000 a night successful, I'm successful.
0:20:34 > 0:20:36- "What's your story?" - MICHAEL LAUGHS
0:20:36 > 0:20:42In 1967, the head of ATV network decided to axe Sunday Night At The London Palladium.
0:20:42 > 0:20:47The man who made that decision was no less than Lew Grade.
0:20:47 > 0:20:48Thanks, Uncle.
0:20:48 > 0:20:51Well, by then, most variety theatres had closed,
0:20:51 > 0:20:56and television had taken over as the people's entertainment of choice.
0:20:56 > 0:20:59Variety acts had to learn to adapt,
0:20:59 > 0:21:02and adapt quickly or their careers would be over.
0:21:04 > 0:21:06All right, studio. Settle down.
0:21:08 > 0:21:10Stop the talking.
0:21:10 > 0:21:12Stop the talking!
0:21:12 > 0:21:15I think one of the problems with the early days of variety,
0:21:15 > 0:21:19and variety stars who tried to transfer to television...
0:21:19 > 0:21:22It wasn't easy for them because they had no understanding of it.
0:21:22 > 0:21:25They'd learned to work radio and to make that work,
0:21:25 > 0:21:31so voice became incredibly important, and timing, but to be on screen...
0:21:31 > 0:21:32Some took to it very easily.
0:21:32 > 0:21:38Arthur Askey was almost immediate in his ability to reach through the screen, almost,
0:21:38 > 0:21:41but in the main, they found it very hard to do.
0:21:41 > 0:21:45Very good. Yes, I enjoyed that. He put that in himself.
0:21:45 > 0:21:48Hello. You switched from there to there quick, didn't you?
0:21:48 > 0:21:52I've got to watch you, Tesla. First time I've worked with him, you know?
0:21:52 > 0:21:54LAUGHTER
0:21:54 > 0:21:58I've got all the others lined up. Now watch it.
0:21:58 > 0:22:00This business...
0:22:00 > 0:22:03I've got a brother broke his neck doing that, you know?
0:22:03 > 0:22:08Arthur Askey, the first big star on television to really talk to the camera and ad-lib,
0:22:08 > 0:22:12and turn around and talk to the camera over there. He was brilliant.
0:22:12 > 0:22:14And you never know why he's dropped off the radar,
0:22:14 > 0:22:16but I thought he was wonderful.
0:22:16 > 0:22:19Look, fellas. I'm not going to stand around all day.
0:22:19 > 0:22:21- Let's play something. - What about this?
0:22:21 > 0:22:23Night On The Bare Mountain, by Borodin.
0:22:23 > 0:22:25Nah, we don't play anything like that.
0:22:25 > 0:22:29Well, if we play it, it won't sound anything like that.
0:22:29 > 0:22:32I said to him one night while we were having dinner,
0:22:32 > 0:22:33"Tell me something, Arthur.
0:22:33 > 0:22:35"Do you ever feel any resentment
0:22:35 > 0:22:38"of a little upstart like me suddenly coming along...
0:22:38 > 0:22:43"You've done the lot, you've done 50 seasons at the London Palladium,
0:22:43 > 0:22:48"and I'm coming along, and there's my name all over the top of the bill,
0:22:48 > 0:22:53"and your name along the bottom. Does that offend you?"
0:22:53 > 0:22:57He said, "No, if your name wasn't up the top, I wouldn't be working."
0:22:57 > 0:22:58Very sensible.
0:22:58 > 0:23:03"I wouldn't be here, because I'd come on here and there'd be no people here,
0:23:03 > 0:23:05"so that's all part of our business."
0:23:05 > 0:23:08- That's what I loved about him, I think. He was...- Generous.
0:23:08 > 0:23:13Yeah, he was generous, and tremendously kind of adult about the whole thing.
0:23:13 > 0:23:17I've thought of something more nostalgic. Something old-fashioned.
0:23:17 > 0:23:20No, no, Val! He'll go into that blasted bee song.
0:23:20 > 0:23:22Aha!
0:23:22 > 0:23:23That's very cruel.
0:23:23 > 0:23:24I know, I've heard it.
0:23:24 > 0:23:27Ah! I'm not going to stand here...
0:23:27 > 0:23:29Now look what you've done.
0:23:29 > 0:23:30How dare you?!
0:23:30 > 0:23:34- Listen, listen... - Whatever happened to Norman Wisdom?
0:23:34 > 0:23:39If we just take two performers - both of whom I know you admire -
0:23:39 > 0:23:43one would be Max Miller, and one would be, let's say, Frankie Howerd,
0:23:43 > 0:23:47Frank really made the transition triumphantly...
0:23:47 > 0:23:49Hugely successful.
0:23:49 > 0:23:52Max Miller, he did the odd bit of television...
0:23:52 > 0:23:54He did quite a lot of television,
0:23:54 > 0:23:58but it didn't work because he did need that big audience.
0:23:58 > 0:24:03Not like Frank, who was terrific. He was talking to us - individual people.
0:24:03 > 0:24:06He wasn't addressing a great crowd. Totally different technique.
0:24:06 > 0:24:10It's getting worse. You have to bring your own props on, now.
0:24:10 > 0:24:13Honestly, the standards are going right down you know?
0:24:13 > 0:24:15There's no respect for we artistes at all.
0:24:15 > 0:24:18They take terrible liberties with me, you know?
0:24:18 > 0:24:19Ooh!
0:24:19 > 0:24:22- LAUGHTER FROM AUDIENCE - Thank you! Don't you start taking 'em!
0:24:22 > 0:24:25It was terrific. It was like a woman next door, wasn't it,
0:24:25 > 0:24:30looking over the garden fence and saying, "Well, I'll tell you about her..."
0:24:30 > 0:24:33Look at this week, I'm in my dressing room - ooh, yes, I've got one now.
0:24:33 > 0:24:36Marvellous! And that was just what television needed.
0:24:36 > 0:24:40I told them. I said, "I am not dressing in the corridor any more. I won't do it."
0:24:40 > 0:24:42Look at last week.
0:24:42 > 0:24:45I... Oh, I was embarrassed.
0:24:45 > 0:24:49I could have died, honestly. I did not know where to put my hands.
0:24:49 > 0:24:53Where to put my hands, I did not know.
0:24:53 > 0:24:56His career was a series of comebacks.
0:24:56 > 0:24:59He'd be right up at one point, and then down again.
0:24:59 > 0:25:02He was discovered by every new generation.
0:25:02 > 0:25:04Did he not know?
0:25:04 > 0:25:07Oh no, don't. No, Mrs, no.
0:25:07 > 0:25:10Ooh, don't, Mrs.
0:25:10 > 0:25:12Ooh, don't. Stop it!
0:25:12 > 0:25:15Ooh, don't, Mrs, don't.
0:25:20 > 0:25:26INTERVIEWER: Do you find it strange that generation after generation seem to rediscover you?
0:25:26 > 0:25:29- FRANKIE HOWERD:- Didn't you miss a generation then?
0:25:29 > 0:25:32You meant generation after generation after generation after generation...
0:25:32 > 0:25:37- Do you want me to do it again? - It was me and Noah started together, more or less.
0:25:37 > 0:25:40All those animals from the ark, they used to love me, you know?
0:25:40 > 0:25:42Peter Cook was a big fan of his
0:25:42 > 0:25:46and Peter Cook had him at the Establishment club in Soho in Greek Street.
0:25:46 > 0:25:49And there was sort of a younger audience -
0:25:49 > 0:25:53maybe not that familiar with Frankie Howerd -
0:25:53 > 0:25:57and he was a big hit at this club, and picked up by Ned Sherrin
0:25:57 > 0:26:00and put on television in That Was The Week That Was.
0:26:00 > 0:26:02APPLAUSE
0:26:07 > 0:26:12Er, before we... Oh, this is the one I'm on, yes...
0:26:12 > 0:26:13It's about time.
0:26:13 > 0:26:17I've been waiting a hell of a time, here, to get on. It's 25 to 12.
0:26:17 > 0:26:23And Ned asked him to do about 12 minutes, and after about 17 minutes, Ned said, "No, leave it."
0:26:23 > 0:26:27Live television, Frank was still going, and he was back again.
0:26:27 > 0:26:30I'm usually associated with variety.
0:26:30 > 0:26:33You know, a variety comedian, music hall...
0:26:33 > 0:26:39And I'm not usually associated with these sophisticated... wags and wits.
0:26:39 > 0:26:41You know, these youngsters.
0:26:41 > 0:26:46And, um, you know, I'm more sort of Billy Cotton, me.
0:26:46 > 0:26:50Then he was down again, and then he did Up Pompeii on television,
0:26:50 > 0:26:53and A Funny Thing Happened On The Way To The Forum on the stage,
0:26:53 > 0:26:56and he was back again. Then he was down again. It was fascinating.
0:26:56 > 0:26:59- Why do they come?- Why? - What do they see in me?
0:26:59 > 0:27:02- Why?- You could ask.- Why?
0:27:02 > 0:27:05God only knows. I haven't got a clue.
0:27:05 > 0:27:07I don't...
0:27:07 > 0:27:09I don't query it, don't question it.
0:27:09 > 0:27:14I accept it with gratitude. I don't know why.
0:27:14 > 0:27:17Peter Vincent - a mate of mine, a fellow writer - we went to the Oxford Union.
0:27:17 > 0:27:20I think it was his last TV appearance.
0:27:20 > 0:27:24You know, he was thinking, "Am I a has-been again?"
0:27:24 > 0:27:25- OK?- Mm.
0:27:25 > 0:27:27- Right...- Yeah.- We are on now.
0:27:27 > 0:27:30The house lights are out.
0:27:32 > 0:27:34And the students went berserk when he walked on.
0:27:34 > 0:27:36It was very heart-warming to see.
0:27:36 > 0:27:39CHEERING AND APPLAUSE
0:27:42 > 0:27:45When you're that good, you know, you keep coming back.
0:27:49 > 0:27:52But while television giveth, it also taketh away.
0:27:52 > 0:27:55Peter Brough, anyone?
0:27:55 > 0:27:59Only yesterday I engaged her as your music teacher, and today,
0:27:59 > 0:28:01she's letting my house off as rehearsal rooms.
0:28:01 > 0:28:05It wasn't her fault, it wasn't her idea. It was the tutor.
0:28:05 > 0:28:08What? What did you say, Archie?
0:28:08 > 0:28:11Peter Brough, bless his heart, wasn't technically good.
0:28:11 > 0:28:12His mouth did tend to move somewhat.
0:28:12 > 0:28:16It was the tutor? Did you say the tutor?
0:28:16 > 0:28:18Yes, Brough.
0:28:18 > 0:28:21You see, you didn't hear with all that noise going on.
0:28:21 > 0:28:24He didn't translate to television at all. That was radio.
0:28:24 > 0:28:29Ventriloquists on the radio - the mind boggles.
0:28:29 > 0:28:34He had a great radio show because he introduced some great comedy acts,
0:28:34 > 0:28:38like Tony Hancock and Peter Sellers, Beryl Reid, they all appeared on his show.
0:28:38 > 0:28:42So, his radio show was great, but then you couldn't see him, and you just heard this voice.
0:28:42 > 0:28:47Probably the most successful ventriloquist that we've ever had.
0:28:47 > 0:28:50And yet, one of the worst, technically.
0:28:50 > 0:28:54No, really. I tell you what, I'll phone her up and apologise.
0:28:54 > 0:28:57No, Archie, no, please. You've done enough damage.
0:28:57 > 0:28:59Leave the phone alone, there's a good boy.
0:28:59 > 0:29:02Ooh, I say, look over there.
0:29:02 > 0:29:03- What? - She's left her music.
0:29:03 > 0:29:05Oh yes, so she has.
0:29:05 > 0:29:07- Here, I tell you what. - What?
0:29:07 > 0:29:09I'll phone her up and get her to collect it.
0:29:09 > 0:29:13That's a good idea, Archie. I'll get her some chocolates.
0:29:13 > 0:29:15- Don't overdo it now. - All right.
0:29:17 > 0:29:19We have to talk about Tommy Cooper.
0:29:19 > 0:29:21Oh, la-la-la...
0:29:22 > 0:29:25He was one of those performers who made the transition
0:29:25 > 0:29:28from the theatre to television very easily, didn't he?
0:29:28 > 0:29:31And in fact, he was never that big in the theatre
0:29:31 > 0:29:34before he started to appear regularly on television, was he?
0:29:34 > 0:29:36He was never really top of the bill.
0:29:36 > 0:29:39I think it could be said of Tommy that television made him.
0:29:39 > 0:29:42About five years ago, I was in Manchester.
0:29:42 > 0:29:45I flew from London to Manchester by plane...
0:29:45 > 0:29:48That's the only way to fly.
0:29:48 > 0:29:51Tommy became so funny, so famous.
0:29:51 > 0:29:54He had to end up topping the bill.
0:29:55 > 0:29:57Spoon, jar. Jar, spoon.
0:29:57 > 0:30:00Spoon, jar. Jar, spoon, spoon...
0:30:04 > 0:30:06Diddly ah-da-da-da-da.
0:30:07 > 0:30:09Stop!
0:30:11 > 0:30:12Diddly ah-da-da-da-da.
0:30:12 > 0:30:14Stop!
0:30:15 > 0:30:18Diddly ah-da-da-da-da. ..Pull it, pull it!
0:30:19 > 0:30:25I remember Eric ringing me and saying Tommy's appearing at a nightclub in Dunstable.
0:30:25 > 0:30:28He said, "Why don't we go?" I said, "I'd love to go."
0:30:28 > 0:30:33So we got a table at this nightclub and Tommy comes on and he's in the middle of his act,
0:30:33 > 0:30:38and suddenly, a waiter dropped a tray with a lot of glasses - by accident, you know.
0:30:38 > 0:30:41Horrendous noise, and Eric looked at me, like,
0:30:41 > 0:30:45"What's Tommy going to say?" And there was a long, long wait,
0:30:45 > 0:30:49and the audience was waiting for Tommy to react,
0:30:49 > 0:30:51and it takes him forever,
0:30:51 > 0:30:55and eventually, all he gets out is, "That's nice."
0:30:55 > 0:31:00And the room fell about. After the show, I was talking to Eric, and he said,
0:31:00 > 0:31:02"18 lines went through my head,
0:31:02 > 0:31:05"but what's amazing is he got a bigger laugh than I could have got
0:31:05 > 0:31:09"with some brilliant lines, ad-libbing in that situation."
0:31:09 > 0:31:13But that's Tommy. He was absolutely amazed by it.
0:31:13 > 0:31:16Do you know, my feet are killing me?
0:31:16 > 0:31:21Every night when I'm lying in bed, they get me by the throat like that...
0:31:22 > 0:31:25Tommy Cooper was... Other comedians just...
0:31:27 > 0:31:31The Eric Morecambes and everybody, they just said, "Tom's the man."
0:31:31 > 0:31:35Eric used to say, "That bugger, he walks on and they start laughing."
0:31:35 > 0:31:37He said, "I walk on and I have to start working."
0:31:37 > 0:31:40The glass is going to change places with the bottle.
0:31:40 > 0:31:42The glass... The bottle goes over there.
0:31:42 > 0:31:43So...
0:31:43 > 0:31:49Now the glass is here, and the bottle's there.
0:31:49 > 0:31:50Tommy Cooper, later in life, said,
0:31:50 > 0:31:53"People say I just walk on and they start laughing."
0:31:53 > 0:31:56He said, "They don't know what it takes just to walk on."
0:31:58 > 0:32:00Too many bottles.
0:32:02 > 0:32:03He prepared.
0:32:03 > 0:32:08That shambolic act of his was calculated down to the last degree.
0:32:08 > 0:32:10Everything was just in its place
0:32:10 > 0:32:15and he could create an impression of chaos, but there was no chaos.
0:32:15 > 0:32:16Not at all.
0:32:20 > 0:32:22That's it!
0:32:22 > 0:32:24CHEERING AND APPLAUSE
0:32:24 > 0:32:27As we've seen, adapting to television wasn't always easy,
0:32:27 > 0:32:30but Tommy Cooper and his contemporaries -
0:32:30 > 0:32:32legends such as Harry Secombe, Peter Sellers,
0:32:32 > 0:32:34Des O'Connor and Tony Hancock -
0:32:34 > 0:32:38knew the best place to perfect your act and hopefully be spotted
0:32:38 > 0:32:41by a television talent scout was not in a theatre at all,
0:32:41 > 0:32:43but in a strip club.
0:32:43 > 0:32:46The first job I got was at the Windmill.
0:32:46 > 0:32:47Vivian Van Damm.
0:32:47 > 0:32:51My first audition for him wasn't all that marvellous,
0:32:51 > 0:32:55because I got through all this 10 or 12-minute act that I did,
0:32:55 > 0:32:58which I thought I did pretty well -
0:32:58 > 0:33:01you know, three in the morning in this theatre,
0:33:01 > 0:33:04with people queuing up to do auditions,
0:33:04 > 0:33:06hundreds of people, hundreds.
0:33:06 > 0:33:10So I finished, and he said, "Yes, Bruce. Come down here a minute."
0:33:10 > 0:33:13This was Van Damm, the owner?
0:33:13 > 0:33:15He said, "Yes, Bruce, definitely."
0:33:15 > 0:33:18"Yes, definitely."
0:33:18 > 0:33:23I thought, "Definitely - I'm in!" He said, "You definitely need material."
0:33:24 > 0:33:27I said blonde. Are you a blonde?
0:33:27 > 0:33:28Oh, I'm sorry.
0:33:28 > 0:33:30Can you... Can you do anything?
0:33:30 > 0:33:33- Oh, yes. - We'll look at you afterwards.
0:33:33 > 0:33:36It was a very happy introduction to the business.
0:33:36 > 0:33:39Six shows a day, six days a week, the Windmill.
0:33:39 > 0:33:4136 shows a week. That was quite good schooling.
0:33:47 > 0:33:50The theatre was usually full of guys,
0:33:50 > 0:33:53coming to see the girls,
0:33:53 > 0:33:56and suddenly the comedian comes on - or comics -
0:33:56 > 0:33:59and that's when they get the Evening News out,
0:33:59 > 0:34:01and lean over to get the light from the piano
0:34:01 > 0:34:03so they could see it a bit better.
0:34:03 > 0:34:06And if you could make them laugh at 12 o'clock, lunchtime,
0:34:06 > 0:34:09when they've come in to see a fan dancer,
0:34:09 > 0:34:11you weren't doing too bad at what you did.
0:34:11 > 0:34:12Good evening.
0:34:12 > 0:34:18This is going to be a bit tricky, because, you see, I am a comedian.
0:34:18 > 0:34:21Guys would go in there for a day. They'd go in there at 11 o'clock
0:34:21 > 0:34:24and come out at 11 o'clock - they'd stay in there for 12 hours.
0:34:24 > 0:34:29- They were sick of the sight of us. - Just to see you? - Mind you, I was sick of them!
0:34:29 > 0:34:33On this occasion, it looks as though I will have to walk off
0:34:33 > 0:34:36in complete, utter and sepulchral silence.
0:34:36 > 0:34:41You find, Michael, now, that a lot of really good television performers,
0:34:41 > 0:34:45when you see them in concert at a big place - not effective.
0:34:45 > 0:34:49- Not effective.- Because they've learned their trade on TV?
0:34:49 > 0:34:50Tiny, tiny stuff.
0:34:50 > 0:34:53- Or in small Comedy Store type clubs. - That's right.
0:34:53 > 0:34:56They're tiny, but you need a theatre, you need that
0:34:56 > 0:35:00and it's marvellous when you see someone like Ken Dodd in the theatre.
0:35:00 > 0:35:03- For me, Ken's never been a great television performer.- No.
0:35:03 > 0:35:07- But in a theatre...- Well, in the theatre, it's unbelievable.
0:35:07 > 0:35:09It really is.
0:35:09 > 0:35:11British men, the world's greatest lovers.
0:35:11 > 0:35:12Hooray!
0:35:12 > 0:35:14Thank you, sir.
0:35:16 > 0:35:18Ladies, you wouldn't swap us.
0:35:18 > 0:35:23Look at your old man, sitting along side you, nervously running his fingers through your handbag.
0:35:23 > 0:35:28You wouldn't swap us for one of those continental Romeos, would you?
0:35:28 > 0:35:29YES!
0:35:29 > 0:35:30Really?
0:35:30 > 0:35:34Watching Ken Dodd in full flight, in a variety theatre,
0:35:34 > 0:35:35in his domain, is...
0:35:35 > 0:35:40I tell you, there's as much pleasure watching the audience.
0:35:40 > 0:35:43The thing with the audience, when you've got a really good gag,
0:35:43 > 0:35:48is that 2,000 people all go forwards at the same time.
0:35:48 > 0:35:49It rolls.
0:35:49 > 0:35:52This poor traffic warden, you know, he popped his clogs.
0:35:52 > 0:35:55Stepped off, a traffic warden, and they had him all boxed up,
0:35:55 > 0:36:01and then they were loading him into the hole, and suddenly he came to life. He came to life.
0:36:01 > 0:36:03He knocked on the lid.
0:36:03 > 0:36:05And they brought him up again,
0:36:05 > 0:36:09and they opened the lid. He sat up and said, "I'm alive! I'm alive!"
0:36:09 > 0:36:11The vicar said, "I'm sorry, sir.
0:36:11 > 0:36:13"I've started the paperwork..."
0:36:13 > 0:36:15LAUGHTER AND APPLAUSE
0:36:17 > 0:36:19Thank you.
0:36:20 > 0:36:24He did do a fantastic one not long ago - An Audience With. He did two.
0:36:24 > 0:36:26But that, again, was a big audience in a big place,
0:36:26 > 0:36:29and the camera was way back, picking him up when he felt like it.
0:36:29 > 0:36:32He was playing to that audience there, not the camera.
0:36:32 > 0:36:35I think men's legs have a terrible, lonely life, don't you?
0:36:35 > 0:36:38Men's legs - standing in your trousers, in the dark, all day.
0:36:38 > 0:36:42Just an occasional flash of sunlight.
0:36:48 > 0:36:51Have a look at your legs when you go to bed tonight.
0:36:51 > 0:36:56Try it. When you go to bed tonight, sir, take a torch, take a flashlight up to bed with you, make a tent...
0:36:56 > 0:36:58LAUGHTER Have you ever done that?
0:36:58 > 0:36:59You want locking up.
0:36:59 > 0:37:04When you're doing television, you've got a terrible dilemma...
0:37:04 > 0:37:06Stand on that chalk mark, look over there.
0:37:06 > 0:37:09Do you play to the camera, or do you play to the studio audience?
0:37:09 > 0:37:13- How do you resolve that?- Well, as you can see by this interview,
0:37:13 > 0:37:15I've been playing to the camera all afternoon.
0:37:15 > 0:37:20- I think it's a mixture. You play to the camera, but you have to work the audience.- The studio audience?
0:37:20 > 0:37:23Oh, yeah, you have to work the studio audience.
0:37:23 > 0:37:25It is like an instrument.
0:37:25 > 0:37:29When you're playing an audience, you're playing an instrument.
0:37:29 > 0:37:33They are there to be coaxed,
0:37:33 > 0:37:36cajoled, soothed, lifted...
0:37:36 > 0:37:39You know, you do all that.
0:37:39 > 0:37:41Are you very romantic, Mrs?
0:37:41 > 0:37:45Yes, I can tell, you have very dreamy eyes. I should go on shandies now!
0:37:47 > 0:37:49March 11th 1955 -
0:37:49 > 0:37:52my very first television show.
0:37:52 > 0:37:54For six months, I'd been playing all the theatres,
0:37:54 > 0:38:00and you know, theatres, very nice, and a lovely reaction.
0:38:00 > 0:38:01But you're not prepared for...
0:38:01 > 0:38:04Don't forget, it was only BBC One in those days.
0:38:04 > 0:38:08And the next day, I was playing Hull the following week,
0:38:08 > 0:38:11and I got off the train at Paragon station in Hull and all of a sudden,
0:38:11 > 0:38:14everybody was going, "Look, there he is. That's him."
0:38:14 > 0:38:17People in the streets, you know. That was the power...
0:38:17 > 0:38:19It's me, Mrs!
0:38:19 > 0:38:21Omar Sharif!
0:38:22 > 0:38:25- And when you watch yourself on television...- Oh, hate it!
0:38:25 > 0:38:28- Do you watch yourself on television? - Oh, no. No, no.
0:38:28 > 0:38:31- Really?- No, I don't think any entertainers...
0:38:31 > 0:38:34You always know you could have done better.
0:38:34 > 0:38:38Is there anybody who's seen me on television but has never seen me in the flesh?
0:38:38 > 0:38:41Put up your hands if you've never seen me in the flesh.
0:38:41 > 0:38:44Oh, quite a few. Oh, yes.
0:38:44 > 0:38:48Now would you mind putting up your hands if you're regretting it already?
0:38:49 > 0:38:55Bruce, you are on of the great British television stars,
0:38:55 > 0:38:59who made the transition...
0:38:59 > 0:39:03and found a new home on television, as a new starring vehicle.
0:39:03 > 0:39:06Was it difficult making that transition, for you?
0:39:06 > 0:39:11People were being warned about being over-exposed.
0:39:11 > 0:39:14Not many people did television, but I was doing television every week,
0:39:14 > 0:39:16so I knew what the cameras were.
0:39:16 > 0:39:20But I think the over-exposure thing was about having your eight or ten minutes,
0:39:20 > 0:39:23which had lasted you a lifetime in the variety theatre,
0:39:23 > 0:39:27and you give that away on television, you then can't go back and work in the theatres,
0:39:27 > 0:39:30because that's all you've got - that eight or ten minutes.
0:39:30 > 0:39:36That's it. I mean, some acts used to go around the halls, like Wilson Keppel and Betty.
0:39:36 > 0:39:40They did their act for 25, 30 years.
0:39:40 > 0:39:41Cleopatra's Nightmare.
0:39:41 > 0:39:45Exactly the same act everywhere.
0:39:52 > 0:39:55And often, and this is where people made a mistake,
0:39:55 > 0:39:58they would do a thing on television two or three times,
0:39:58 > 0:40:01and then go and do it in the halls, and people would say,
0:40:01 > 0:40:06"I saw you do that last week. What are you doing? Haven't you got a new act?" And you thought, "Oh, dear!"
0:40:06 > 0:40:09In the old days, you could tour 52 weeks doing the same act
0:40:09 > 0:40:12because if you came back, they'd forgotten, a year later.
0:40:12 > 0:40:15They can go on for two hours, these fellas.
0:40:15 > 0:40:19- Couldn't the old boys?- Oh, the old boys had got ten minutes between them and the work house.
0:40:19 > 0:40:22All the comics I worked with, the great stars in my day,
0:40:22 > 0:40:26they had one song and four jokes, or two songs and two jokes.
0:40:26 > 0:40:28And that's all they had.
0:40:28 > 0:40:32A lot of people said, "It'll eat up all your material."
0:40:32 > 0:40:34Which was silly.
0:40:34 > 0:40:39You know, one appearance and you become a star overnight,
0:40:39 > 0:40:43which is happening with a lot of these people today. I say no more.
0:40:43 > 0:40:46Eric and Ernie, before Eric had his health problems,
0:40:46 > 0:40:48were still touring in their own stage show,
0:40:48 > 0:40:52and Eric said, "We won't do a word of this stage show on television."
0:40:52 > 0:40:59He said, "I don't want anyone walking out saying, 'I saw them do that on Sunday night on telly.'"
0:40:59 > 0:41:02And they got it exactly right.
0:41:02 > 0:41:05They knew, and as I say, a lot of the older performers
0:41:05 > 0:41:08blew all their best jokes and their best routines on television,
0:41:08 > 0:41:11and it was gone. Where did they go from there?
0:41:11 > 0:41:15We're doing the part, he's seated at the table, looking agitated,
0:41:15 > 0:41:18- and "bumming" his fingers, I've got here.- Drumming.
0:41:18 > 0:41:19Oh, drumming.
0:41:19 > 0:41:21DIRECTOR: That's my mother-in-law.
0:41:21 > 0:41:27Can we go back to the line, "That's my mother-in-law," changing roles?
0:41:27 > 0:41:31Some of the top comedians were smart enough to realise
0:41:31 > 0:41:33that they needed writers.
0:41:33 > 0:41:38So, that's the beginning of comedy writing for TV.
0:41:38 > 0:41:42'Studio 1 - recording of a new programme is about to start.'
0:41:42 > 0:41:46- COMPERE:- Mr Eric Morecambe, and Mr Ernie Wise!
0:41:49 > 0:41:54Looking at the great comics that you and I would almost worship -
0:41:54 > 0:41:58Frankie Howerd, Tommy Cooper, Eric and Ernie, and so on -
0:41:58 > 0:42:03they made the transition to television very easily.
0:42:03 > 0:42:07- When you say... Morecambe and Wise didn't find it easy, did they? - Not at the beginning.
0:42:07 > 0:42:09I met them on a variety bill, and they said,
0:42:09 > 0:42:11"We tried our damndest, and we can't get in."
0:42:11 > 0:42:15- Have you ever faced a bull? - I came face-to-face with a ferocious bull once.
0:42:15 > 0:42:18- Did he give you a start?- I didn't need one, I was off like lightning.
0:42:18 > 0:42:21They weren't top of the bill when you were on the bill with them?
0:42:21 > 0:42:25No. That's when they said, you know, we just can't get in there.
0:42:25 > 0:42:27Were they nostalgic about variety?
0:42:27 > 0:42:30Yeah, I think they were. They started with that.
0:42:30 > 0:42:34They started with the Amateur Discoveries.
0:42:34 > 0:42:36And so that's basically all they really knew.
0:42:45 > 0:42:50- You were always on tour with them. That was the way...- Life was.
0:42:50 > 0:42:53Well, he said to me when we were talking about children -
0:42:53 > 0:42:58we decided not to have any - he said he didn't get married to tour on his own.
0:42:58 > 0:43:03- Ah, well that was very supportive. - He never packed a suitcase in his life.- Really?
0:43:03 > 0:43:05So...slave.
0:43:05 > 0:43:06LAUGHTER
0:43:06 > 0:43:08Can you hold it a second. Eddie?
0:43:08 > 0:43:10'Ernie can do another walk.'
0:43:10 > 0:43:14Yes, could you do another walk, there, Ernie?
0:43:14 > 0:43:17You did one across and one back. Could you do two?
0:43:17 > 0:43:19We can spread them out a bit more.
0:43:19 > 0:43:20Go quicker!
0:43:22 > 0:43:27The boys had a first crack at television with the BBC,
0:43:27 > 0:43:31and it didn't go well. It was very badly reviewed, wasn't it?
0:43:31 > 0:43:33Yes, because that was the only thing
0:43:33 > 0:43:36and people were very critical in those days.
0:43:36 > 0:43:40I know that your first television series wasn't a success...
0:43:40 > 0:43:42Who told you that?!
0:43:42 > 0:43:44- It must have been your father. - Blabbermouth!
0:43:44 > 0:43:48One of the critics wrote, this is the famous quotation,
0:43:48 > 0:43:52"Is that a television I see in the corner of my living room?
0:43:52 > 0:43:54BOTH: "No, it's the box they buried Morecambe and Wise in."
0:43:54 > 0:43:58At that time, did you consider having a different job?
0:43:58 > 0:44:01No, no, no, we kept at it. Just because you get a few knocks,
0:44:01 > 0:44:05- it doesn't really...- If you're dedicated to show business, you don't give up.
0:44:05 > 0:44:06It's not all easy.
0:44:06 > 0:44:13You've got... You have this over-riding sort of ego, I suppose, that they all made a mistake.
0:44:13 > 0:44:16Did Ernie ever sort of say, "I really don't think television is for us"?
0:44:16 > 0:44:20- No, no.- He could see it? - He was very ambitious,
0:44:20 > 0:44:23and he always thought they could do so much better.
0:44:23 > 0:44:24So much more.
0:44:26 > 0:44:29It's got me beat, I just can't make it out.
0:44:29 > 0:44:31The market's down four points.
0:44:31 > 0:44:33It's got me beaten as well.
0:44:34 > 0:44:38Desperate Dan's just eaten four cow pies and he's still hungry.
0:44:39 > 0:44:44I think, probably looking back, some people never adapted to television.
0:44:44 > 0:44:47They were too big, they were sort of eating the camera.
0:44:47 > 0:44:50They were behaving as if they were in a theatre.
0:44:50 > 0:44:52Eric and Ernie were made for television,
0:44:52 > 0:44:56and adapted so brilliantly, because they always just chatted.
0:44:56 > 0:44:58It was two heads, talking.
0:44:58 > 0:45:02You've got a nerve, you have, coming on here wearing a wig.
0:45:02 > 0:45:04- You look a sight!- Shut up! - Take it off!
0:45:04 > 0:45:06- I can't.- You can't?- No.- Why not?
0:45:06 > 0:45:08Ah, well. He might be looking in.
0:45:08 > 0:45:10He? Who's he?
0:45:10 > 0:45:11Who's he?
0:45:11 > 0:45:18Well, he's the fella that asked me if I would advertise his wigs on the BBC television show.
0:45:18 > 0:45:20You can't advertise on the B...
0:45:20 > 0:45:22I know, you fool!
0:45:22 > 0:45:25Shut up, see, the camera's coming in closer!
0:45:25 > 0:45:27Good evening...
0:45:27 > 0:45:29Eric said, "The camera's eavesdropping."
0:45:29 > 0:45:33"It's listening and looking at us while we're just talking."
0:45:33 > 0:45:38He used to talk about putting the kettle on. He used to say to directors, "Put the kettle on."
0:45:38 > 0:45:42What he meant was, "Leave the camera there, looking at us."
0:45:42 > 0:45:45There's nobody can advertise on the BBC!
0:45:45 > 0:45:48Even Lord Hill can't say what kind of pipe tobacco he smokes.
0:45:48 > 0:45:50And no wonder, it's mine.
0:45:50 > 0:45:51LAUGHTER
0:45:51 > 0:45:53He's known along the powers of corridor.
0:45:53 > 0:45:55Corridors of power?
0:45:55 > 0:45:56Corridors of power!
0:45:56 > 0:45:58And don't forget, he walks backwards.
0:45:58 > 0:46:00- Yes, he does.- That was quick.
0:46:03 > 0:46:08I wrote a lot for Eric and Ernie with John Junkin and other people,
0:46:08 > 0:46:13but I would say my friend Eddie Braben - the A-team - he changed their image.
0:46:13 > 0:46:16He saw that there was a real warmth and a rapport between them,
0:46:16 > 0:46:20and he made Ernie the pompous little man who wrote plays.
0:46:20 > 0:46:23So, Ernie became funny in his own right, not just the straight man.
0:46:23 > 0:46:28Cleopatra smiles a self-assured smile and says to her hand-maiden,
0:46:28 > 0:46:34"All men are fools, and what makes them so is having beauty like what I have got."
0:46:36 > 0:46:38It's a great line, that.
0:46:38 > 0:46:41I honestly don't know how you think of them, I really don't.
0:46:41 > 0:46:42- Fabulous.- Talent.
0:46:42 > 0:46:45Eric Morecambe analysed it brilliantly.
0:46:45 > 0:46:50He said, "We're both idiots, but I'm a bigger idiot than him because I think I'm smarter than him,"
0:46:50 > 0:46:54which was the best definition I've heard of a good double act.
0:46:54 > 0:46:58- Is that the end of the play, then? - Yes, I'm just checking it now for mistakes.
0:46:58 > 0:47:01- For what?- Mistakes.- Mistakes?!
0:47:01 > 0:47:03- Yes.- Mistakes, in an Ernie Wise play?
0:47:03 > 0:47:05The day that I read a mistake in an Ernie Wise play,
0:47:05 > 0:47:09- that's the day that I shall retire. - PHONE RINGS
0:47:09 > 0:47:12Hello, I can't talk to you now. I've just retired.
0:47:12 > 0:47:16There was obviously a close bond, but they had a great business.
0:47:16 > 0:47:20You know, Morecambe and Wise Ltd, as a business...
0:47:20 > 0:47:22- Yes...- ..was a business.
0:47:22 > 0:47:24Ernie always used to say, "It's business show.
0:47:24 > 0:47:27"Get that right, and everything else comes along."
0:47:27 > 0:47:32I wrote a quick piece for Eric once - two minutes, talking away -
0:47:32 > 0:47:35and in a room full of people, he said to me,
0:47:35 > 0:47:39"This isn't right. You've missed the whole point.
0:47:39 > 0:47:42"This is wrong, so do it again, please."
0:47:42 > 0:47:45So I went out of the room and sulked in the bar. I thought,
0:47:45 > 0:47:48"That's in front of everybody, he did that."
0:47:48 > 0:47:51And he came in the bar, and he said, "What's the long face?"
0:47:51 > 0:47:53I said, "You just...
0:47:53 > 0:47:56"put me down in front of all those people."
0:47:56 > 0:47:59He said, "That was in there. This is here. What are you drinking?"
0:47:59 > 0:48:04When did you first discover that you worked well together, that there was a kind of chemistry?
0:48:04 > 0:48:07When we got married.
0:48:07 > 0:48:08We realised then.
0:48:08 > 0:48:13Er... No, you don't realise that you've got a chemistry, it's just...
0:48:13 > 0:48:17You just want to do this act, this double act, and develop...
0:48:17 > 0:48:21We lean on each other a lot, you know? That's the thing.
0:48:21 > 0:48:24- He's asking some funny questions. - You're not giving any funny answers!
0:48:24 > 0:48:26It's very difficult to answer.
0:48:26 > 0:48:29They worked hard at the relationship.
0:48:29 > 0:48:32- Was it almost like another marriage? - I think it was, yes. It came first.
0:48:38 > 0:48:39My little fat friend.
0:48:46 > 0:48:49Harry Secombe had the greatest expression in the world.
0:48:49 > 0:48:54He used to say, "The only thing that worries me is that I'll wake up one morning, the phone will ring,
0:48:54 > 0:48:59"and a distant voice will say, 'Thank you very much, Mr Secombe. We'd like it all back now.'"
0:48:59 > 0:49:02And that's it, right in a nutshell.
0:49:02 > 0:49:04- Yeah. You don't know. - That's the fear.
0:49:04 > 0:49:07People say, "You've got no need to worry."
0:49:07 > 0:49:10I suppose we haven't, but we do.
0:49:10 > 0:49:12We do worry about it, I worry about it.
0:49:26 > 0:49:31Good morning. Fellow comedians have been paying tribute to the late Tommy Cooper,
0:49:31 > 0:49:35who died last night after appearing on stage at a London theatre.
0:49:35 > 0:49:37The show was being broadcast live on ITV
0:49:37 > 0:49:41and the viewing audience saw the magician collapse during his act.
0:49:41 > 0:49:44He was rushed to hospital, but died soon afterwards.
0:49:44 > 0:49:48And he said two things, Eric, that night. I'll never forget.
0:49:48 > 0:49:52He said, "Tomorrow, people will be saying, 'What a wonderful way to go.'
0:49:52 > 0:49:55"There's no wonderful way to go," he said.
0:49:55 > 0:49:57And he said, "Poor Tom - in front of the audience.
0:49:57 > 0:50:00"Oh, I'd never do that." I'd known Eric long enough to make a joke.
0:50:00 > 0:50:02I said, "Can we have that in writing?"
0:50:02 > 0:50:05"Guarantee you'd never do that." Ha-ha-ha, and all that.
0:50:05 > 0:50:09Six weeks later, a little theatre in Tewkesbury,
0:50:09 > 0:50:14Eric went off the stage, he got off the stage and fell down the stairs.
0:50:14 > 0:50:17And I never forgot him saying, "I'd never do that."
0:50:17 > 0:50:19And he never did.
0:50:29 > 0:50:34To many people, the loss of two of its brightest stars in 1984,
0:50:34 > 0:50:36along with the rise of alternative comedy,
0:50:36 > 0:50:39signalled the end of variety.
0:50:44 > 0:50:48But times do change, and what was once seen as old-fashioned
0:50:48 > 0:50:51can suddenly seem new and exciting.
0:50:51 > 0:50:56MICHAEL MCINTYRE: Our next act captivated the nation when they won Britain's Got Talent.
0:50:56 > 0:51:01Variety has always reinvented itself, because what it has to do
0:51:01 > 0:51:04is to try and please a new generation as it comes along.
0:51:09 > 0:51:12What always was isn't necessarily the way it always will be,
0:51:12 > 0:51:16and people, when they are spoilt for choice for entertainment,
0:51:16 > 0:51:19will look for something that they can't get anywhere else.
0:51:19 > 0:51:21Now that's still variety.
0:51:29 > 0:51:33Point of fact, actually, there's nothing new under the sun. This is so true.
0:51:33 > 0:51:38What Britain's Got Talent - if I may plug the other side's top show - does
0:51:38 > 0:51:42is go to different areas, look at the local talent there,
0:51:42 > 0:51:44sort out the best,
0:51:44 > 0:51:47and then bring it into kind of a central point,
0:51:47 > 0:51:48and then let them fight it out.
0:51:48 > 0:51:50Well, that's how it was then.
0:51:50 > 0:51:52CHEERING AND APPLAUSE
0:51:54 > 0:51:58Before Simon Cowell was even a twinkle in his mother's eye,
0:51:58 > 0:52:01there was a sharp-suited Svengali waiting in the wings.
0:52:01 > 0:52:06Not many people would know his name today. He was Caroll Levis,
0:52:06 > 0:52:09and he brought the talent show to Britain.
0:52:09 > 0:52:11Everywhere there are hundreds of people, I'm sure -
0:52:11 > 0:52:14thousands, perhaps - who do something or other in the way of entertainment.
0:52:14 > 0:52:18People from almost every walk of life, who may be the stars of tomorrow.
0:52:18 > 0:52:25One of the staples of 20th-century British show business has been the talent show.
0:52:25 > 0:52:28Going back to Hughie Green's Opportunity Knocks.
0:52:28 > 0:52:31By the time that was on TV, you were already a big star.
0:52:31 > 0:52:33I'm pretty sure my chronology is right.
0:52:33 > 0:52:35Er, yeah, I think it was after I started.
0:52:35 > 0:52:39- But the fore-runner of that was... - Caroll Levis's Discoveries.
0:52:39 > 0:52:41"We take the unknowns of today
0:52:41 > 0:52:44"and turn them into the stars of tomorrow!"
0:52:44 > 0:52:46- Yeah.- The Canadian voice.- Yes.
0:52:46 > 0:52:49I remember my cousin and I writing to him.
0:52:49 > 0:52:51- My cousin Susan. - You wrote to Carroll Levis?
0:52:51 > 0:52:54Yeah, "Can we please be on your show?" Never heard anything, of course.
0:52:54 > 0:52:59Now outside, we must have two or three hundred people waiting who want an audition.
0:52:59 > 0:53:01So, how about it, boys? Let 'em in!
0:53:01 > 0:53:05OK, gang, come on. Oh...
0:53:05 > 0:53:08One at a time, folks.
0:53:08 > 0:53:12- I never made it with him, with Caroll Levis. - Did you audition for him?
0:53:12 > 0:53:15No, I wanted to, but I was too scared.
0:53:15 > 0:53:18Really, why? You thought you might get turned down?
0:53:18 > 0:53:20- Just scared.- Just scared?
0:53:20 > 0:53:22What's your name, young man?
0:53:22 > 0:53:24Ken Bonner, sir.
0:53:24 > 0:53:26And what do you do for a living, Ken?
0:53:26 > 0:53:28Well, I'm a greengrocer, sir. Does that hurt?
0:53:28 > 0:53:31I don't know, I've never been a greengrocer.
0:53:31 > 0:53:33How about doing your stuff, now, Ken?
0:53:34 > 0:53:40# Oh...I'm Popeye the sailor man Gug-ug-ug!
0:53:40 > 0:53:44# I'm Popeye the sailor man... #
0:53:44 > 0:53:46He'd go to Liverpool.
0:53:46 > 0:53:51He'd go to Edinburgh, or Glasgow or Newcastle,
0:53:51 > 0:53:55and people would line up to get into these talent shows,
0:53:55 > 0:53:59and if they won their heats, they would go into the semi-finals
0:53:59 > 0:54:03and then the finals would come to London. It was then taken on tour.
0:54:03 > 0:54:08Carroll Levis could put out a bill - a full variety bill - but they'd all be amateurs.
0:54:08 > 0:54:15BOY SINGS SOPRANO
0:54:15 > 0:54:18What happens now, you've got Britain's Got Talent,
0:54:18 > 0:54:22which seems like a new form of variety, which of course, it isn't.
0:54:22 > 0:54:27But as long as you're home and being entertained by it, it's terrific.
0:54:27 > 0:54:30It doesn't go away. It just alters itself around.
0:54:30 > 0:54:36Welcome, ladies and gentlemen, to the Royal Variety Performance 2010. I'm hosting!
0:54:46 > 0:54:51I cannot tell you the number of times we've tried to look at the title of the Royal Variety Show
0:54:51 > 0:54:53and think perhaps, "Should it be changed?
0:54:53 > 0:54:57"Does it signify yesteryear? Does it have an old-fashioned feel to it?"
0:54:59 > 0:55:03The modern critics might say, "Oh, variety, it's passe, it's old-fashioned."
0:55:03 > 0:55:05Of course it's old-fashioned!
0:55:05 > 0:55:07Of course it is!
0:55:07 > 0:55:10It's experienced. It's distilled.
0:55:10 > 0:55:12It has been honed.
0:55:12 > 0:55:14- Have you got some new gags up your sleeve?- Me? No!
0:55:14 > 0:55:17I put them in a different order. Always do for royal occasions.
0:55:17 > 0:55:25It's become a very integral part of the fabric of British show business. It's like a comfortable blanket.
0:55:25 > 0:55:30It's always there. You may not like it, but it's there. Let's keep it there.
0:55:30 > 0:55:32It's gone on for years.
0:55:35 > 0:55:39So, is there any future for variety?
0:55:39 > 0:55:45Sadly not. I'm afraid the days of the Twice Brightly on stages like this have gone forever.
0:55:45 > 0:55:48But so long as people have an instinct to perform
0:55:48 > 0:55:52and the talent to do so, they'll find their stage somewhere -
0:55:52 > 0:55:54in television studios, on the web,
0:55:54 > 0:55:57and of course, in those school concerts.
0:55:57 > 0:56:00So, queue the finale!
0:56:05 > 0:56:10The great thing with variety is if you accept the word "variety",
0:56:10 > 0:56:12is that it changes all the time.
0:56:12 > 0:56:17The constituent parts that made variety, they still thrive.
0:56:17 > 0:56:25The great talents are there, and the Eddie Izzards and the Peter Kays and Harry Hills and the Lee Evans.
0:56:25 > 0:56:29They're not schlepping round the country doing 12 minutes a night
0:56:29 > 0:56:32and then bored out of their mind for the rest of the day,
0:56:32 > 0:56:36they're going into the O2 Arena for a couple of nights,
0:56:36 > 0:56:39making a TV deal on the top of it, and earning more in a week
0:56:39 > 0:56:41than Max Miller earned, probably, in 10 years.
0:56:41 > 0:56:42That's still there.
0:56:42 > 0:56:47You've got speciality acts still thriving in different formats.
0:56:47 > 0:56:51Cirque de Soleil is a wonderful example.
0:56:57 > 0:57:00If the people in charge of television - in particular -
0:57:00 > 0:57:04trust the instinct that says people want to be entertained,
0:57:04 > 0:57:06you rarely go wrong with it.
0:57:09 > 0:57:16I think the public, always, if you gave them six great acts in an hour,
0:57:16 > 0:57:19I think it would have always got an audience.
0:57:20 > 0:57:24Someone will always get up and say, "Mummy, I can dance."
0:57:24 > 0:57:27Or, "I can sing," or "I can juggle," or do something like that.
0:57:27 > 0:57:31It's the best kind of show business, the most wonderful kind of show business,
0:57:31 > 0:57:35because you're seeing people do things that... Extraordinary things.
0:57:37 > 0:57:40The most exciting part of show business is tomorrow.
0:57:40 > 0:57:44Not yesterday, and really not today, but tomorrow.
0:57:44 > 0:57:47It will always go on in some form or another.
0:58:07 > 0:58:11Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd
0:58:11 > 0:58:15E-mail subtitling@bbc.co.uk