0:00:08 > 0:00:10CHIRPS
0:00:24 > 0:00:27Ah, Sunday morning, and a row.
0:00:27 > 0:00:28Um...
0:00:28 > 0:00:32SIGHS It's about the usual thorny subject.
0:00:34 > 0:00:35Sex.
0:00:35 > 0:00:41If you don't have it, you're going to be disappointed. You said that.
0:00:41 > 0:00:45- I don't give a toss. - You said that two seconds ago.
0:00:45 > 0:00:48I don't need you telling me what I do and don't feel.
0:00:48 > 0:00:52Quote, "I'm disappointed that you are not interested in sex.
0:00:52 > 0:00:55"Also, I am concerned that
0:00:55 > 0:01:00"you are trying to push it under the carpet and not taking it seriously."
0:01:00 > 0:01:05The underlying issue isn't that. It's whether you do anything about it.
0:01:05 > 0:01:08What do you want me to do? I'm not a machine.
0:01:08 > 0:01:12I can't just turn things on and turn things off.
0:01:14 > 0:01:19I can't explain why I'm feeling the way I am. How can I explain?
0:01:19 > 0:01:23How can I explain why I'm, quote, "frigid"?
0:01:23 > 0:01:24Christ!
0:01:24 > 0:01:28OK, I don't know. I don't have an answer.
0:01:28 > 0:01:31Maybe I should take some pills, take some drugs.
0:01:31 > 0:01:36- Maybe I should get some sex books. - Maybe. I don't know.
0:01:36 > 0:01:38SIGHS
0:01:38 > 0:01:39I give up.
0:01:39 > 0:01:44If I were to ask each of you to write down the answer
0:01:44 > 0:01:49to a simple sounding, but actually a very difficult question,
0:01:49 > 0:01:51"What does sex mean to you?",
0:01:51 > 0:01:55do you think I would get the same answer?
0:01:55 > 0:01:57- I don't know.- I don't know.
0:01:57 > 0:02:01- OK. Have a go at it. - Have you got loads of paper?
0:02:01 > 0:02:05- I haven't got a spare pen, though. - Spare pens I can do.
0:02:21 > 0:02:24MAN: If I had the choice of anyone at all,
0:02:24 > 0:02:27on this planet, I'd pick her.
0:02:28 > 0:02:30Does that make any sense at all?
0:02:30 > 0:02:33I just feel like Roxanne's the one.
0:02:37 > 0:02:41I started a job about...20 months ago.
0:02:41 > 0:02:45There was this really attractive woman at work
0:02:45 > 0:02:49and I noticed her a couple of times looking at me.
0:02:49 > 0:02:52There was some ridiculous festival.
0:02:52 > 0:02:56They were giving out samosas and she gave me one.
0:02:56 > 0:03:01I thought, "Crikey! She is absolutely gorgeous."
0:03:02 > 0:03:04I feel all uptight,
0:03:04 > 0:03:06butterflies, fidgety,
0:03:06 > 0:03:09dry mouth, all that.
0:03:10 > 0:03:14I suppose I love her. I dunno. Yeah, I think I do.
0:03:14 > 0:03:16I care about her deeply.
0:03:16 > 0:03:21I don't want to just jump into bed with her. I love her.
0:03:21 > 0:03:26- Does she have any idea how you feel? - No. I don't think so.
0:03:29 > 0:03:32The reason I'm trying counselling
0:03:32 > 0:03:35is because I want to understand my feelings.
0:03:35 > 0:03:37Because it's just driving me nuts.
0:03:39 > 0:03:41I would like a relationship.
0:03:42 > 0:03:45A long-term steady relationship.
0:03:58 > 0:04:03Um, I need the euphorbia, basically, clearing out a bit.
0:04:03 > 0:04:05I can do that sitting down(!)
0:04:07 > 0:04:09- Hell!- What?
0:04:09 > 0:04:11I've buggered my back again.
0:04:11 > 0:04:15- So that's my fault, was it? - No, it wasn't your FAULT.
0:04:15 > 0:04:18I'm sure it WAS my fault.
0:04:20 > 0:04:23Our marriage is not in a good state at the moment.
0:04:23 > 0:04:28We've had scenes where there's been a lot of screaming and shouting,
0:04:28 > 0:04:32things being thrown, smashed, all very unhappy.
0:04:32 > 0:04:35And very black and very dark.
0:04:35 > 0:04:38Um... Yes, sort of bad.
0:04:38 > 0:04:41- I'm going to have a cigarette break. - Cigarette break?
0:04:41 > 0:04:43I've got a bad back, haven't I?
0:04:43 > 0:04:47Here speaks Mr Positive again(!)
0:04:48 > 0:04:52We've had 33 years of experience together.
0:04:53 > 0:04:59There are enough good things that we could have an exceptionally good relationship,
0:04:59 > 0:05:02but we don't have a bloody clue how to do it.
0:05:14 > 0:05:18I've been in this situation before, when I was 18.
0:05:18 > 0:05:21- Hm.- It was the first job I ever had.
0:05:21 > 0:05:25- There was this really nice-looking girl in the reception area.- Hm.
0:05:25 > 0:05:29As always, she already had a boyfriend.
0:05:29 > 0:05:32And, um...it was torturous to be at work.
0:05:32 > 0:05:37They got engaged. It was quite traumatic to me.
0:05:37 > 0:05:43Some of us wander through life being attracted to people that are unavailable.
0:05:43 > 0:05:48- Yeah.- Is this a sort of pattern you're noticing in yourself?
0:05:48 > 0:05:54- That's the connection I'm making. - In the meantime, how has that affected you and relationships?
0:05:54 > 0:05:57Well, I mean, I meet lots of girls.
0:05:57 > 0:06:01There's girls I know. I'm very sociable with them.
0:06:01 > 0:06:03I chat them up a bit.
0:06:03 > 0:06:06But getting to the point of asking them out,
0:06:06 > 0:06:09I find a bit difficult, I suppose.
0:06:09 > 0:06:13I'm thinking about people's tolerance for rejection.
0:06:13 > 0:06:18Some people, when they fear something, it stops them, like the fear of flying.
0:06:18 > 0:06:22- Yeah. - It stops them getting on aeroplanes.
0:06:22 > 0:06:28Do you think that your reaction to rejection stops you exposing yourself, asking people?
0:06:28 > 0:06:31OK, let me put it another way. Case in point.
0:06:31 > 0:06:34Peter Andre, Katie Price.
0:06:34 > 0:06:39- Not familiar with that.- She was a topless model called Jordan.
0:06:39 > 0:06:41He was a pop star.
0:06:41 > 0:06:44Are you familiar with I'm A Celebrity Get Me Out Of Here?
0:06:44 > 0:06:47- Yes.- They were both put in this situation.
0:06:47 > 0:06:49He ended up marrying her.
0:06:49 > 0:06:52However, they've split up.
0:06:52 > 0:06:58- Now, all the love can also...turn into hate.- Yes.
0:06:58 > 0:07:03And I'm worried, if I asked this girl out and I get rejected,
0:07:03 > 0:07:05- could I...hate her?- Hm.
0:07:09 > 0:07:11Well, well done for getting here.
0:07:11 > 0:07:15That's something I say to all clients, because coming here
0:07:15 > 0:07:19really is, for most of them, a momentous event.
0:07:19 > 0:07:21And I'm looking forward to working with you.
0:07:21 > 0:07:24- Great. Thank you very much.- OK.
0:07:24 > 0:07:28- We'll get up and go downstairs now. - Right. OK. Thanks.
0:07:33 > 0:07:37- I will say goodbye to you here. We're going to stop.- It's funny.
0:07:37 > 0:07:41- I brought it with me...- We're going to stop counselling talk now.
0:07:41 > 0:07:44- Does that make sense to you?- Yeah.
0:07:44 > 0:07:48We do put a strong boundary on these things.
0:07:48 > 0:07:52- Thanks, Chris. I hope we get on really well.- I'm sure we will.
0:07:52 > 0:07:56- Have you met people like me? - Oh, yes.
0:07:56 > 0:08:00- So there's hope?- Good God, yes! - I'm pleased you said "Good God!"
0:08:00 > 0:08:05And the reason there's hope is you're here.
0:08:05 > 0:08:09- Can I ask you...?- Actually, no. I'm going to stop here.
0:08:09 > 0:08:13- I want it to be proper counselling. Is that OK?- Yeah. OK.
0:08:25 > 0:08:27When's that?
0:08:27 > 0:08:31- That's an ancient one.- That's one you took ages ago in Margate.
0:08:34 > 0:08:38- The house was brilliant. I really liked that house.- Yeah.
0:08:38 > 0:08:40- Did you like it?- I loved it.
0:08:40 > 0:08:44I mean, lots of sort of, like, nice times, really.
0:08:44 > 0:08:47Lots of smiling and laughing and joking.
0:08:49 > 0:08:53How come you're smiling and then you have an awful row?
0:08:53 > 0:08:56We both had a row. Remember? You were there!
0:08:56 > 0:09:01I formed the idea that you've been unhappy most of the time.
0:09:01 > 0:09:08But I don't see how you can have been miserable with a bloody great garden, pool, nice car.
0:09:08 > 0:09:14- You really mean that, don't you? - To an extent.- That's what scares me.
0:09:14 > 0:09:16Don't you get it?
0:09:16 > 0:09:20That doesn't make you happy if you're being foul to me...
0:09:20 > 0:09:25- I clearly wasn't being.- You weren't at the moment the snap was taken.
0:09:25 > 0:09:31- I bloody wasn't.- Five seconds later you could have been.- You say that. - Yes, I do say that.
0:09:32 > 0:09:36I'm actually really concerned about what you've said.
0:09:36 > 0:09:40I can't believe you're making a statement like that.
0:09:40 > 0:09:46If we can't work things out and we feel we've given it our best shot,
0:09:46 > 0:09:51um, then we need, I suppose, freedom to move on.
0:09:51 > 0:09:54And that would probably be divorce.
0:09:54 > 0:09:57Tell me a little bit, if you would, Iain,
0:09:57 > 0:10:01about employment and how that's affecting you currently.
0:10:01 > 0:10:05- OK. To be perfectly honest, I'm not employed at the moment.- Right.
0:10:05 > 0:10:12The reason we've ended up at this point is largely financial, I think.
0:10:12 > 0:10:19A year and a half ago, we were heading for no income, no home, nothing.
0:10:19 > 0:10:24Susan turned round and tried to, or actually did, initiate an affair
0:10:24 > 0:10:30with a chap who happened to be the richest bloke we knew in the area.
0:10:30 > 0:10:33There was me, who ended up with nothing,
0:10:33 > 0:10:38and Susan immediately appearing to try and jump ship.
0:10:38 > 0:10:44- Susan was following the money, is that what you're saying? - I felt there was an element of that.
0:10:44 > 0:10:50- I notice how vigorously you're shaking your head, Susan. - Absolutely. I feel so angry.
0:10:50 > 0:10:54From your perspective, at that point, how was it?
0:10:54 > 0:10:59Well, it started about...2002.
0:10:59 > 0:11:05We started having increasingly separate bedrooms and so on.
0:11:05 > 0:11:10And we got on with our lives, emotionally...poles apart.
0:11:10 > 0:11:15That was the trigger that made me think, "I've got to just go."
0:11:15 > 0:11:20I thought, "OK. I will have some fun." And I hooked up with this guy.
0:11:20 > 0:11:23Which was not particularly serious.
0:11:23 > 0:11:26But it was a brief affair.
0:11:27 > 0:11:31Iain, is that pretty much your recollection of what happened?
0:11:31 > 0:11:38No! I perceived this entirely as, "I want my BMW back. I want my big house back."
0:11:38 > 0:11:41That is SO not true.
0:11:41 > 0:11:45It was in NO way driven by my need for material possessions.
0:11:45 > 0:11:48I'm talking about my interpretation.
0:11:48 > 0:11:53The thing is your interpretation is so far removed from my real feelings
0:11:53 > 0:11:55and what actually happened,
0:11:55 > 0:12:00that if you're going to interpret my behaviour like that then...
0:12:00 > 0:12:02we've got a lot of work to do!
0:12:06 > 0:12:08I'm really glad you said that.
0:12:08 > 0:12:11So much conflict between couples
0:12:11 > 0:12:16usually arises from the differences in interpretation.
0:12:16 > 0:12:20It's at that point that we start negotiating and working.
0:12:20 > 0:12:22You're nodding vigorously, Susan.
0:12:22 > 0:12:26I'm not entirely sure how you're hearing this, Iain.
0:12:26 > 0:12:30- I think you've put your finger on the button to be honest.- OK.
0:12:45 > 0:12:49DAVE: I've been coming here for about ten years now.
0:12:55 > 0:12:58Just completely relax, empty your mind.
0:12:58 > 0:13:04One of those rare places, rare pockets in life you can actually find a place of your own.
0:13:06 > 0:13:08The "refreshingness"
0:13:08 > 0:13:10of diving into the water,
0:13:10 > 0:13:15when you bring your head up and go, "Ah!" You know, that feeling.
0:13:18 > 0:13:20It's a relief.
0:13:27 > 0:13:29Be nice to come here with someone.
0:13:29 > 0:13:34When you see couples here, swimming together, having a laugh,
0:13:34 > 0:13:37they go and have a drink afterwards,
0:13:37 > 0:13:43perhaps a meal, and I go home to my flat on my own, you know?
0:13:43 > 0:13:46I try not to dwell on those things, though.
0:13:51 > 0:13:53Well, make yourself comfortable.
0:13:53 > 0:13:57I'd like to explore the relationship events in your life.
0:13:57 > 0:13:59- That's fine.- OK.
0:13:59 > 0:14:02- But I need to explain something.- Mm.
0:14:02 > 0:14:08Um... In 2003, I ended up living again with my father at home.
0:14:08 > 0:14:12Which was not a happy experience, living at home.
0:14:12 > 0:14:16I was just looking at my life, my past,
0:14:16 > 0:14:20and, um... I actually thought about...
0:14:21 > 0:14:26- ..finishing myself off, actually. - Suicide?- Yeah. I planned it.
0:14:26 > 0:14:28I had all these tablets.
0:14:28 > 0:14:32And I think I went out about six times to do it.
0:14:32 > 0:14:36I remember sitting in a park, crying my eyes out.
0:14:36 > 0:14:40- And people sitting...moving away, you know?- Mm.
0:14:42 > 0:14:45- Have you still got these tablets? - Yeah.
0:14:45 > 0:14:48- Why do think you're keeping them? - Um...
0:14:48 > 0:14:52Because I'm always subconsciously worrying about dark forces,
0:14:52 > 0:14:56or something nasty's going to happen.
0:14:56 > 0:14:59If life's going to treat me like this,
0:14:59 > 0:15:02I've got this bag and I will take them.
0:15:02 > 0:15:08- Does that suggest you're out of control of your life? - I don't know. Perhaps I am.
0:15:08 > 0:15:14- Who was in control when you were on that bench?- I was. I didn't take the tablets.
0:15:14 > 0:15:18- Were the dark forces around? - No. I use that loosely.
0:15:18 > 0:15:22- I know...- I mean, I'm not schizophrenic or nothing.
0:15:22 > 0:15:27But it's kind of a nice term for when things are really awful.
0:15:27 > 0:15:30Part of you thinks, "Go take the tablets."
0:15:30 > 0:15:33- Another part of you is saying, "No." - Yeah.
0:15:33 > 0:15:37If we were to ask the kindly voice, supportive one,
0:15:37 > 0:15:41what would it say now about what to do with the tablets?
0:15:41 > 0:15:45Actually, I'm thinking of throwing them away. Possibly, I will.
0:15:45 > 0:15:49The less useful voice, how do you think it might react?
0:15:49 > 0:15:52- I'm thinking it won't like this. - He won't like that at all.
0:15:52 > 0:15:57He'll be saying, "What you doing? You don't know what's round the corner."
0:15:57 > 0:16:02If you threw the tablets away, would that be showing that voice the door?
0:16:02 > 0:16:05Saying, "You don't belong round here"?
0:16:05 > 0:16:08- Yeah.- OK, right.
0:16:08 > 0:16:14- We'll end at that, and I will look forward to seeing you next week. - Thank you very much.
0:16:23 > 0:16:26Just take a seat.
0:16:26 > 0:16:27Thanks.
0:16:27 > 0:16:33So, how have things been since we met last week?
0:16:33 > 0:16:35Much worse.
0:16:35 > 0:16:39- HE LAUGHS NERVOUSLY - Yeah.- It's been really crap.
0:16:39 > 0:16:42I love Ian a lot. I love him very deeply.
0:16:42 > 0:16:47But sometimes I can't tolerate being in the same room as him.
0:16:47 > 0:16:51Ian will say, "You're the centre of my world."
0:16:54 > 0:16:58I say, "I feel sorry for the poor bastards on the edge of it!
0:16:58 > 0:17:04"If this is what the centre feels like, I wonder what it's like on the edge of your world."
0:17:04 > 0:17:12- Your children, how would they describe your relationship? How old are they?- Nine, five and three.
0:17:12 > 0:17:16My eldest says it's outrageous that we've come out without her.
0:17:16 > 0:17:21- Do you not leave them very often? - No. We don't go out very often.- No.
0:17:21 > 0:17:25It is important that you have family time.
0:17:25 > 0:17:31But it's even more important that you have some quality "couple" time.
0:17:31 > 0:17:34- Does that make sense?- Yeah.- Yeah.
0:17:34 > 0:17:38As a five, I just feel that we're a really strong unit.
0:17:38 > 0:17:40You know.
0:17:40 > 0:17:44We all enjoy being together. A lot.
0:17:44 > 0:17:48It's just when it gets down to me and Ian,
0:17:48 > 0:17:50that's where it's not so good.
0:17:50 > 0:17:54When did the difficult issues start coming along, would you say?
0:17:54 > 0:17:58- We waited so long for children, we never thought it would happen.- Yeah.
0:17:58 > 0:18:03It was a long while we were trying for children. Six, seven years.
0:18:03 > 0:18:07People would come to our house, like my sister-in-law,
0:18:07 > 0:18:09and say she was pregnant.
0:18:09 > 0:18:13We'd have a celebration. She'd go and I'd cry.
0:18:13 > 0:18:15Ian would look at me bewildered.
0:18:15 > 0:18:20- We never really spoke about it all, I don't think.- No.
0:18:20 > 0:18:24Would you say that was the first experience you had
0:18:24 > 0:18:28of Ian not understanding, you hadn't been able to talk about i?
0:18:28 > 0:18:31- Yeah. - This little bit of a wall going up.
0:18:31 > 0:18:33The first major thing, yeah.
0:18:35 > 0:18:39What I'm hearing is that communication's the main issue.
0:18:39 > 0:18:41- Is that what you'd agree with?- Yes.
0:18:41 > 0:18:45That's what a lot of our problems stem from, yeah.
0:18:45 > 0:18:52I'm wondering whether you might like to have a bit of homework this week.
0:18:52 > 0:18:54Um...yeah.
0:18:54 > 0:18:57- Yeah. I think so. Yeah.- OK.
0:18:57 > 0:19:03It's about just talking, uninterrupted, for about five minutes each.
0:19:04 > 0:19:06Listen to what each other's saying.
0:19:06 > 0:19:08Yeah. Yeah.
0:19:08 > 0:19:10- OK.- All right?- OK.
0:19:10 > 0:19:12Thank you.
0:19:13 > 0:19:15- Thanks.- No, that's a pleasure.
0:19:15 > 0:19:18Take care and I'll see you next Monday.
0:19:43 > 0:19:47Always think about her all the time, really. You know.
0:19:47 > 0:19:51She's just everything I'd ever look for in a woman.
0:19:54 > 0:20:00If we went for a walk along the river, I'd wrap up a box of champagne glasses.
0:20:04 > 0:20:10Along the river, I'd have a bottle on a bit of string keeping it chilled.
0:20:10 > 0:20:13I'd ask a fisherman to look after it.
0:20:13 > 0:20:15Give him ten quid.
0:20:15 > 0:20:20"I'm going to be along between 7.30 and eight o'clock."
0:20:22 > 0:20:28I'd get her to open the box and say, "Shame we haven't got any champagne!"
0:20:28 > 0:20:33The guy says, "I've got this bottle. It's got your name on it."
0:20:33 > 0:20:38Do it like that. I think that would be great. Those sort of things.
0:20:38 > 0:20:40Flowers are nice, you know.
0:20:44 > 0:20:48Firstly, if I could check in with how you are.
0:20:48 > 0:20:50- Yeah.- I'm thinking about those tablets.
0:20:50 > 0:20:56- Do you want to do something about this?- Yeah. - What would you like to do?
0:20:56 > 0:21:00Let's get rid of the tablets. We'll throw the bag away.
0:21:00 > 0:21:05- When do you want to do it? - I'll probably do it this Sunday.
0:21:05 > 0:21:07Then can I check in next week?
0:21:07 > 0:21:15- Just to see your success and how you managed to achieve that? - Yeah. OK.- Will that be OK? OK.
0:21:15 > 0:21:20Going back a bit further, I'm interested in your family.
0:21:20 > 0:21:23Your dad and your mum. How did you get on?
0:21:23 > 0:21:27My father didn't show me any affection when I was a kid.
0:21:27 > 0:21:30He never grabbed hold of me or picked me up.
0:21:30 > 0:21:35It was violence. Get a punch or a slap or a pot thrown at you.
0:21:35 > 0:21:38You're going to be bruised afterwards?
0:21:38 > 0:21:41Oh, it was intentional to hurt you, absolutely.
0:21:41 > 0:21:43Yeah.
0:21:44 > 0:21:47And also, he tried killing me once.
0:21:49 > 0:21:50Go on.
0:21:50 > 0:21:55I was upstairs in my bedroom and he came up and had a go at me.
0:21:55 > 0:21:59He put a pillow over my face and he held it there.
0:22:01 > 0:22:04And I thought I was...a gonner.
0:22:07 > 0:22:11He removed the pillow after some time.
0:22:11 > 0:22:16He sat on the bed and opened his arms up to say, "Come to me."
0:22:16 > 0:22:18And I ran downstairs.
0:22:21 > 0:22:26Amongst your peers, people at school and so on, did you swap stories
0:22:26 > 0:22:29about what life was like at home, or...?
0:22:29 > 0:22:33- No.- Hm.- Er... But we had the perfect neighbours.
0:22:33 > 0:22:38They were such an idyllic family.
0:22:38 > 0:22:43The father of the family was very relaxed
0:22:43 > 0:22:46and looked like Kirk Douglas.
0:22:46 > 0:22:51Two good-looking sons who got everything they wanted.
0:22:51 > 0:22:56Sometimes, I'd stay with this family for New Year's Eve.
0:22:56 > 0:23:01I wanted to stay there permanently, to be adopted by them.
0:23:01 > 0:23:06I went back home and asked Mum, "What did you do New Year's Eve?"
0:23:06 > 0:23:09"Oh, watched the TV. Had a cry."
0:23:09 > 0:23:13- All that sort of thing... - Why would she have a cry?
0:23:13 > 0:23:20- She'd probably look at the year that had gone past and nothing had happened.- Sadness?- Yeah.
0:23:20 > 0:23:26Mum always wanted better things in life than Dad can perhaps provide.
0:23:26 > 0:23:30So what do you think you learned as a kid
0:23:30 > 0:23:32about how adults have relationships?
0:23:32 > 0:23:36I don't know. Er... Stress.
0:23:36 > 0:23:40- Stress?- Anger.- What else?
0:23:40 > 0:23:45- Upset.- Upset?- Yeah.- How do you think you've used that in your life?
0:23:47 > 0:23:54I've probably thought, perhaps subconsciously, "You're better off being single."
0:23:54 > 0:23:55Hm.
0:23:59 > 0:24:02THUNDER ROLLS
0:24:09 > 0:24:15- So, shall we make a start on looking at material that you've brought?- OK.
0:24:15 > 0:24:19- What did you get? - Well, I began in '74, when we met.
0:24:19 > 0:24:21So did I.
0:24:21 > 0:24:25So that sounds...pretty reasonable, doesn't it?
0:24:30 > 0:24:34- What happened?- I remember you just walking into the room.
0:24:34 > 0:24:38I remember being struck by you and your personality.
0:24:39 > 0:24:42I told my friends that I fancied you.
0:24:42 > 0:24:45Then, on the school trip,
0:24:45 > 0:24:49my friends literally pushed me into the seat next to you.
0:24:49 > 0:24:54LAUGHS Had that not happened, we never would have got it off the ground!
0:24:54 > 0:24:59I suppose I might have plucked up courage and asked Susan to...
0:24:59 > 0:25:04- LAUGHS: - ..go on the infamous shopping trip! We don't need to go into it.
0:25:04 > 0:25:08He said, "Would you like to come to Leicester to buy football boots?"
0:25:08 > 0:25:10I think that's fairly good!
0:25:10 > 0:25:13That's a killer line, isn't it?
0:25:18 > 0:25:23Part of me has always wanted to, in a sense,
0:25:23 > 0:25:26absolutely adore him and love him
0:25:26 > 0:25:31and be head-over-heels, which I was at the start.
0:25:31 > 0:25:34But there again, maybe, I do
0:25:34 > 0:25:36and don't realise it.
0:25:36 > 0:25:39I don't know.
0:25:39 > 0:25:44It was about September, autumn time, that you first met my parents.
0:25:44 > 0:25:46Yeah.
0:25:46 > 0:25:49There was a sort of evident, sort of...
0:25:49 > 0:25:53- DOOR BELL - They weren't actually hostile.
0:25:53 > 0:25:57It was quite clear that I wasn't what they expected or wanted.
0:26:03 > 0:26:07VOICE BREAKING I remember it very vividly.
0:26:07 > 0:26:11I remember thinking, "I think they might not like him that much."
0:26:11 > 0:26:15But I wasn't quite expecting the reaction I got.
0:26:15 > 0:26:19Which was, "How could you do this to us?
0:26:19 > 0:26:22"What have you brought home?"
0:26:23 > 0:26:25"We are in complete shock, Susan!
0:26:25 > 0:26:31"We cannot believe that you'd do anything like this to us! My God!"
0:26:31 > 0:26:33It was horrendous.
0:26:35 > 0:26:40On one occasion, they tried to convince me that he was albino.
0:26:40 > 0:26:43Because he had pale skin and he had pale eyes.
0:26:43 > 0:26:46"I think he might be albino, Susan."
0:26:46 > 0:26:50It was literally... It was a complete loathing.
0:26:52 > 0:26:54You're a nice man!
0:26:54 > 0:26:58You just didn't have the right accent, you didn't look right...!
0:26:58 > 0:27:00Pah! Unbelievable!
0:27:00 > 0:27:05That did cause me to be anxious a lot of the time.
0:27:05 > 0:27:09There was this kind of risk and threat behind the scenes.
0:27:09 > 0:27:13Her parents might eventually convince her that the chap
0:27:13 > 0:27:19down the road from the better background would be more suitable.
0:27:22 > 0:27:24- OK?- Yeah.
0:27:25 > 0:27:28- Are you all right?- I think so. - THINK so?
0:27:29 > 0:27:33- I'm actually quite upset. - What's the matter?
0:27:33 > 0:27:36- Eh?- I just feel upset.
0:27:36 > 0:27:38I don't know why. I just do.
0:27:38 > 0:27:45When Susan's upset, I'm never too sure whether it's because of me.
0:27:45 > 0:27:48Or whether it's something else.
0:27:48 > 0:27:53I just think a bit of a barrier comes up between us.
0:27:55 > 0:27:57Thank you.
0:27:57 > 0:27:59I'll be fine.
0:27:59 > 0:28:01All right. OK?
0:28:01 > 0:28:03- Yeah.- Oh! Bloody hell!
0:28:03 > 0:28:08I've always thought of myself as not being terribly good at dealing with women's tears.
0:28:08 > 0:28:11It's something that confuses me.
0:28:11 > 0:28:16I don't know. I just feel that I'd like to be better at it.
0:28:16 > 0:28:19- Are you all right? - Yeah. I'm just tired, maybe.
0:28:19 > 0:28:23- I think the sessions stir things up, don't they?- They do.
0:28:24 > 0:28:27- OK.- All right.- Yeah.
0:28:28 > 0:28:30Yeah. OK. All right.
0:28:30 > 0:28:32SNIFFS
0:28:37 > 0:28:39We won't be long.
0:28:39 > 0:28:41Be good.
0:28:42 > 0:28:44CAR UNLOCKS
0:28:45 > 0:28:48Ian's got a tumour
0:28:48 > 0:28:52in his pituitary gland, that he has to take medication for.
0:28:52 > 0:28:55But he doesn't.
0:28:55 > 0:28:59If it grows, it messes up all his hormones.
0:28:59 > 0:29:01After you.
0:29:02 > 0:29:05How do you feel about the sessions?
0:29:05 > 0:29:07Nervous.
0:29:07 > 0:29:11- Why nervous?- I don't think you get how big a deal it is for me.
0:29:13 > 0:29:17The only sign that there was anything awry
0:29:17 > 0:29:20was the fact that we couldn't make love.
0:29:20 > 0:29:25Sometimes he couldn't get an erection. Sometimes he could.
0:29:25 > 0:29:27It was all very erratic.
0:29:27 > 0:29:33During that time, I always thought that it was my fault.
0:29:33 > 0:29:36Ian wasn't attracted to me.
0:29:36 > 0:29:42It's almost like it's become so hard to talk about that we can't talk about it.
0:29:42 > 0:29:46I'm sorry. I don't know what you want me to say.
0:29:46 > 0:29:49- I think you sometimes get aggressive.- Yeah.
0:29:49 > 0:29:53I'm sometimes very angry about it.
0:29:53 > 0:29:57- DING DING - Thank you.- You're welcome
0:29:57 > 0:29:59Thanks. You're welcome.
0:30:00 > 0:30:03I feel like it's put our marriage on the line.
0:30:09 > 0:30:13The medication solved the impotence fairly quickly.
0:30:13 > 0:30:17Within the first year, he appeared to be not taking it.
0:30:17 > 0:30:23Currently, Ian's in the longest period of not taking his medication.
0:30:23 > 0:30:27So in the back of my head, the problem will come back.
0:30:27 > 0:30:32I've tried talking about it. I've shouted about it. I've cried about it.
0:30:32 > 0:30:37Um, and...that's why I don't feel very loved.
0:30:37 > 0:30:41Because I don't feel heard. And that's my issue.
0:30:41 > 0:30:46So what is it that you feel she needs to hear from your perspective
0:30:46 > 0:30:50about the taking or not taking of the medication?
0:30:50 > 0:30:53I don't deliberately not take them.
0:30:53 > 0:30:55I kind of...
0:30:55 > 0:31:00I feel all right so I don't necessarily think about the tablets.
0:31:00 > 0:31:04Then I forget to get them and it just goes on from there.
0:31:04 > 0:31:08I don't understand, if you love somebody,
0:31:08 > 0:31:14when they say, "When you do this it really hurts" you carry on doing it.
0:31:14 > 0:31:18- And you say you said that? - I haven't said it for a long while.
0:31:18 > 0:31:22- How long's a long while? - About 18 months ago.
0:31:22 > 0:31:28I couldn't articulate it it had been so long. I couldn't get it straight in my head.
0:31:28 > 0:31:32- Do you feel like you've said everything tonight?- Yeah.
0:31:32 > 0:31:36- Is that true or are you just nodding?- Yeah.
0:31:36 > 0:31:38That's nice to hear, isn't it?
0:31:38 > 0:31:41Yeah, it just feels incredibly tough.
0:31:41 > 0:31:44Now I understood how bad Mandy feels.
0:31:44 > 0:31:47Right.
0:31:47 > 0:31:50But I'm not quite sure how to rectify it.
0:31:53 > 0:31:58That sounds quite a lot of talking for a couple who...don't talk.
0:32:01 > 0:32:03Yeah. Yeah.
0:32:03 > 0:32:07You've allowed it to get out of control.
0:32:07 > 0:32:12And it's about you, you know, taking back the reins again.
0:32:12 > 0:32:17Like you just said, "I haven't talked about it for 18 months."
0:32:17 > 0:32:19That's to protect yourself,
0:32:19 > 0:32:22the family, to protect the relationship.
0:32:22 > 0:32:27But the trouble is, it's been almost...strangling it.
0:32:27 > 0:32:28- Yeah?- Hm.
0:32:28 > 0:32:33There's no point avoiding it. You're here because you have avoided it.
0:32:33 > 0:32:34All right?
0:32:34 > 0:32:38- Thank you.- Yeah. - THEY CHUCKLE
0:32:38 > 0:32:43- So keep up just listening and hearing.- Thank you.
0:32:43 > 0:32:46- OK. Good.- Have a nice week. - See you next week.
0:32:50 > 0:32:53Take care. Bye bye.
0:33:03 > 0:33:07Can I check in? How are the tablets?
0:33:07 > 0:33:08Um...
0:33:08 > 0:33:12- I...threw the bag away.- Mm-hm.
0:33:12 > 0:33:15The boxes away. But the tablets I kept.
0:33:15 > 0:33:18That...that bad voice was saying,
0:33:18 > 0:33:22"You really don't know what's around the corner."
0:33:22 > 0:33:26- "Just keep them."- Yeah. - "Hide them, but keep them."
0:33:26 > 0:33:30- From who? - Er...from myself, perhaps.
0:33:30 > 0:33:34- Have you still got enough to kill yourself?- Oh, yeah.
0:33:34 > 0:33:40- How many times, do you think? - Um... Twice.- Mm-hm.
0:33:40 > 0:33:43- So it should do the job properly. - Yeah.
0:33:43 > 0:33:47It makes me think that this other voice is quite powerful.
0:33:47 > 0:33:52- Yeah. Well, it almost killed me.- Yeah.
0:33:52 > 0:33:56- Do you think your father might have a voice like this?- Yes, I do.
0:33:56 > 0:34:00I'm just thinking, someone trying to suffocate their son.
0:34:00 > 0:34:04- Yeah.- Actually, the idea of trying to kill you.
0:34:04 > 0:34:08Actually, when he tries not to kill you, he didn't.
0:34:08 > 0:34:12I'm thinking about your experience on that park bench.
0:34:12 > 0:34:14- Yeah.- Two ways you could go.
0:34:14 > 0:34:17Two directions, two sets of thoughts.
0:34:17 > 0:34:21- Then stopping, obviously, in time. - Yeah.
0:34:21 > 0:34:28That now makes me think of how useful it would be to feel you don't have to blame your father as much.
0:34:29 > 0:34:31Oh, crikey! I don't know.
0:34:31 > 0:34:33Er...
0:34:33 > 0:34:37Well, if we think about this other positive voice.
0:34:37 > 0:34:42I sometimes talk about the negatives ones as the uninvited guest
0:34:42 > 0:34:46- who you just can't show the door. - Y-yeah. Yeah.
0:34:46 > 0:34:50While you're trying to deal with them, the other guest,
0:34:50 > 0:34:54quietly sitting in the corner, gets forgotten.
0:34:54 > 0:34:57And yet, is very present.
0:34:57 > 0:35:01I'm wondering whether this week, would it be possible for you
0:35:01 > 0:35:05to get to know more of this other side of you?
0:35:05 > 0:35:07- The dark side?- The light side.
0:35:07 > 0:35:13- The light side. Yeah. - Actually, it's the one we probably should be paying more attention to.
0:35:13 > 0:35:17- It needs watering. - That's an interesting way.
0:35:17 > 0:35:21- It needs watering. It's stuck there waiting to sprout.- Quite loyal.
0:35:21 > 0:35:29It's there, waiting for the sunlight to put its rays on that bulb for it to sprout, for it to grow.
0:35:33 > 0:35:35DOG BARKS
0:35:42 > 0:35:45CLOCK TICKS
0:35:50 > 0:35:54We've been spending quite a lot of time together, recently.
0:35:57 > 0:35:59We're more tolerant.
0:35:59 > 0:36:04More considerate of each other's...feelings.
0:36:04 > 0:36:08It feels comfortable. It feels pleasant. And nice.
0:36:08 > 0:36:12We are both trying, a bit more consciously,
0:36:12 > 0:36:16to explore what's going on rather than just have a row.
0:36:16 > 0:36:20So what we do now is try and rationalise a little bit more
0:36:20 > 0:36:25- what's going on and what the real issues are.- Yeah.
0:36:26 > 0:36:28And...I was lonely.
0:36:32 > 0:36:37I don't like confessing this, but I fell in love with two other people.
0:36:37 > 0:36:40One was shortly after we were married.
0:36:41 > 0:36:46And the next was about a year or two after we were married.
0:36:46 > 0:36:51It's bizarre. I approached this guy shortly after we were married.
0:36:51 > 0:36:54He basically said, "I'm sorry but no can do."
0:36:54 > 0:36:59- I was absolutely devastated and I called you up and told you.- Yeah.
0:36:59 > 0:37:03What is all that about? Attention seeking?
0:37:03 > 0:37:07A cry for you to pay me attention? I don't know.
0:37:10 > 0:37:15We were married, but we weren't close. At all.
0:37:15 > 0:37:18We were. I mean, I think we were.
0:37:18 > 0:37:24We were joined at the hip, doing stuff together, but never intimate
0:37:24 > 0:37:27and close in an emotional sense.
0:37:27 > 0:37:32If you boil it all down, that's probably what it comes down to.
0:37:34 > 0:37:39Susan wanted more emotion in the relationship, right from the start.
0:37:39 > 0:37:43And didn't get it. I should have done more about it.
0:37:43 > 0:37:49But it's only really recently that I've twigged that that's important.
0:37:51 > 0:37:55- OK. Thank you very much again. - Thanks.
0:38:00 > 0:38:06OK, well...how have things gone this week for you?
0:38:06 > 0:38:10- It's been a good week. - A good week?- Yeah.
0:38:10 > 0:38:14I think we knew we'd kind of drifted apart.
0:38:14 > 0:38:18One of the things I've learned is how far we'd drifted.
0:38:18 > 0:38:23Yeah, and valuing time more. We just weren't doing it.
0:38:23 > 0:38:24Yeah.
0:38:24 > 0:38:30- None of this has been rocket science. It's basic stuff.- Yeah.
0:38:30 > 0:38:32But as you say,
0:38:32 > 0:38:35it can have huge benefits, you know.
0:38:35 > 0:38:40We were talking last night about my medication.
0:38:40 > 0:38:45Mandy said, "I don't think I'll ever understand what you did,
0:38:45 > 0:38:49- "but I can move on from it now." - Wow.- Yeah.
0:38:49 > 0:38:54I think I came in thinking I have to understand why he's done it.
0:38:54 > 0:38:58I guess, in the week, I thought maybe I never will understand.
0:38:58 > 0:39:03I get a sense that he's beginning to understand the emotional fall-out
0:39:03 > 0:39:06and that feels enough to move it forward.
0:39:06 > 0:39:08Brilliant.
0:39:09 > 0:39:13The thing that's changed for us is being able to talk to each other.
0:39:13 > 0:39:16We just chat now whenever we get the opportunity.
0:39:16 > 0:39:19We're talking all the time.
0:39:26 > 0:39:28We've having champagne cocktails.
0:39:28 > 0:39:32We used to do that before the children came along.
0:39:34 > 0:39:40I'm almost embarrassed about by how much I'm looking forward to spending time with Ian.
0:39:40 > 0:39:43It feels like a long time since I felt like this.
0:39:43 > 0:39:46We are both so excited.
0:39:50 > 0:39:54I was going to do champagne cocktails. You beat me to it.
0:39:54 > 0:39:56Yeah!
0:39:56 > 0:39:58SHE LAUGHS
0:40:00 > 0:40:04The night just went even better than we had hoped for.
0:40:04 > 0:40:07Had our bath together. Got drunk together.
0:40:08 > 0:40:13It was like going on the first date after 18 years.
0:40:15 > 0:40:19She said, "What you doing?" I said, "Having a date night"
0:40:19 > 0:40:22"Is that what the counsellor told you to do?"
0:40:22 > 0:40:26"No. We figured that bit out all for ourselves."
0:40:29 > 0:40:33- Is this going to become a regular Friday night?- Oh, lovely.
0:40:35 > 0:40:37- Love you.- I love you.
0:40:39 > 0:40:42A bit more so than I'd realised.
0:40:49 > 0:40:54Hiya. Can I have a bacon sandwich and a very strong coffee, please?
0:40:54 > 0:40:56Great. Thank you.
0:40:56 > 0:41:00- It's nice coffee.- Yeah?- Yeah.
0:41:00 > 0:41:03Yesterday was a difficult day.
0:41:03 > 0:41:07Because I knew Roxanne would be working most of the morning.
0:41:07 > 0:41:11Obviously, my emotions are racing, my heart's racing.
0:41:11 > 0:41:16She sat down and she was talking about...marriage.
0:41:16 > 0:41:20She said, "I want to get married in a church."
0:41:20 > 0:41:25And I thought, "I want to get married to YOU in a church."
0:41:25 > 0:41:27So, work finished.
0:41:27 > 0:41:30I felt quite down when I got in.
0:41:30 > 0:41:34I bought a couple of bottles of wine and I was going to get drunk.
0:41:34 > 0:41:37I had all my music I was going to play.
0:41:37 > 0:41:39I'd poured myself a glass of wine
0:41:39 > 0:41:43and was all set for a session of drinking.
0:41:43 > 0:41:47But I didn't want to go down that road again so...
0:41:49 > 0:41:53Well, I sat on my bed and I was talking to myself,
0:41:53 > 0:41:58that I need to be realistic.
0:41:58 > 0:42:03I've got no idea what she's like out of work, so it's time to move on.
0:42:03 > 0:42:06Move on. You can do better than that.
0:42:07 > 0:42:10So I poured the wine away
0:42:10 > 0:42:13and put a video on and watched that.
0:42:14 > 0:42:16I WILL get over it.
0:42:16 > 0:42:18I will get over it.
0:42:25 > 0:42:29And I don't think I'm such a bad person.
0:42:29 > 0:42:34Although I'm frustrated with the situation I'm in, being single,
0:42:34 > 0:42:36I don't feel it's my fault.
0:42:38 > 0:42:40If that makes any sense.
0:42:43 > 0:42:50It strikes me that pouring that wine reminds me of when you were sitting on that park bench
0:42:50 > 0:42:52- with all those tablets.- Yeah.
0:42:52 > 0:42:56It must have taken a lot of, I don't know, courage to...?
0:42:56 > 0:43:01- Yes, it was.- ..pour the wine away. - I've never gone that far before.
0:43:01 > 0:43:06I'm wondering whether you're someone that's quite good on your own.
0:43:06 > 0:43:12And when you seek back-up from other people, whether maybe it changes things.
0:43:12 > 0:43:17Maybe it's something you'd like to do in the future, but at the moment
0:43:17 > 0:43:21- I'm wondering if you're resourceful when it's just you...- Yeah.
0:43:21 > 0:43:25I feel stronger when I'm on my own. Yeah.
0:43:25 > 0:43:28Thinking about this woman at work.
0:43:28 > 0:43:35- If she hadn't been there, you would not have discovered that you could say no to those bottles.- Yeah.
0:43:35 > 0:43:40- Maybe in some funny way she's helped.- Yeah. Possibly, yeah.
0:43:40 > 0:43:43Maybe you even need to have a rerun.
0:43:43 > 0:43:47Go to work. Get as depressed as possible.
0:43:47 > 0:43:51Buy some bottles of wine. Go back home. Get the CDs out.
0:43:51 > 0:43:55- Then ask yourself, "Can I do this still?"- Yeah.
0:43:55 > 0:44:00I've been very struck by your talking, through our sessions,
0:44:00 > 0:44:02of these voices.
0:44:02 > 0:44:05This darker influence,
0:44:05 > 0:44:10which has seen you go into some pretty hellish places.
0:44:10 > 0:44:12Then there's this lighter influence.
0:44:12 > 0:44:16It's shown you that you've got courage, wisdom.
0:44:16 > 0:44:21That you can pour glasses of wine down the drain, or whatever.
0:44:21 > 0:44:22Yeah.
0:44:22 > 0:44:26And I've got a letter, as if written by you,
0:44:26 > 0:44:29to the darker influence.
0:44:29 > 0:44:34And it's about renegotiating your relationship with it.
0:44:34 > 0:44:36"Dear darker influence.
0:44:36 > 0:44:43"Re: Thank you for services supplied and a respectful ending now of our relationship.
0:44:43 > 0:44:49"Since I was born, you have protected me from adult couple relationships
0:44:49 > 0:44:52"by ensuring I never became committed before I was ready.
0:44:52 > 0:44:54"During our time together,
0:44:54 > 0:44:58"you showed me how much I appreciate my life.
0:44:58 > 0:45:02"You did this by pushing me to even consider suicide.
0:45:02 > 0:45:07"That you engaged in this high-risk strategy with someone you loved
0:45:07 > 0:45:12"was testament to how much you believed I did value my life
0:45:12 > 0:45:16"and, when ready, would make the changes I dreamed of.
0:45:16 > 0:45:18"Now, with your help,
0:45:18 > 0:45:22"I feel ready to engage in a meaningful couple relationship.
0:45:22 > 0:45:28"Hence, this letter is to tell you I now no longer need your services.
0:45:28 > 0:45:31"With much love, affection and thanks, goodbye."
0:45:31 > 0:45:36There's a place for a signature and a date, and your name.
0:45:38 > 0:45:40That's brilliant.
0:45:43 > 0:45:46That's great. That's really good.
0:45:46 > 0:45:50The fact is that I'm reading it in black and white.
0:45:50 > 0:45:52So it makes it all the more real.
0:45:53 > 0:45:56You've got no idea how...
0:45:58 > 0:46:01..that could, er...
0:46:01 > 0:46:04Oh! Straight up. That's great.
0:46:04 > 0:46:08When do you think you'll be ready to sign it?
0:46:09 > 0:46:12- Got a pen?- Go for it.
0:46:12 > 0:46:15LAUGHS That's brilliant.
0:46:21 > 0:46:26That's fantastic. Thank you ever so much.
0:46:26 > 0:46:28You did this.
0:46:28 > 0:46:30SNIFFS
0:46:48 > 0:46:50CLOCK TICKS
0:46:55 > 0:46:58- I'm going right, aren't I?- Left.
0:46:58 > 0:47:01- Left? Are you sure?- Think so. Yeah.
0:47:01 > 0:47:05We're so used to these ups and downs.
0:47:05 > 0:47:08Ultimately, I think they'll be together for ever.
0:47:08 > 0:47:13I agree, but it's not going to be happily ever after.
0:47:13 > 0:47:16The pub I'm thinking of is in a field.
0:47:16 > 0:47:21Perhaps you can sort of direct me in the appropriate...
0:47:21 > 0:47:25I think they are much more affectionate towards each other.
0:47:25 > 0:47:29They have the odd hug or they'll hold hands or...
0:47:29 > 0:47:32- A bit too much, really. - ..touch!
0:47:32 > 0:47:36- Now where do I go? - I don't bloody know.
0:47:37 > 0:47:42It's nowhere near. We're bloody miles away.
0:47:42 > 0:47:45- I'm not going to drive around... - No, no!
0:47:45 > 0:47:47We all want them to just be happy.
0:47:47 > 0:47:49Separate or together.
0:47:49 > 0:47:54In my view, I don't think they could possibly be happy
0:47:54 > 0:47:59without each other in some form or in some manner, you know.
0:47:59 > 0:48:02- We'll just have to go here. - It's got a garden.
0:48:02 > 0:48:06- It is foul, isn't it?- Jesus Christ! - Where's the garden, then?
0:48:06 > 0:48:09Round the back.
0:48:09 > 0:48:11- Look, garden.- Yeah, great(!)
0:48:50 > 0:48:53Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd
0:48:53 > 0:48:56E-mail subtitling@bbc.co.uk