0:00:04 > 0:00:06Morning. How are you?
0:00:06 > 0:00:11Science and wildlife presenter Liz Bonnin was born in France.
0:00:11 > 0:00:13Thanks a million.
0:00:13 > 0:00:15She spent much of her childhood in Ireland,
0:00:15 > 0:00:18but her family are from the Caribbean.
0:00:18 > 0:00:20Morning. How's it all going?
0:00:20 > 0:00:22When people ask me what I am ethnically,
0:00:22 > 0:00:24I just say I'm a mongrel.
0:00:24 > 0:00:27You know those forms you have to fill out for visas or whatever?
0:00:27 > 0:00:29There actually isn't a box for me.
0:00:29 > 0:00:32My mum is from Trinidad,
0:00:32 > 0:00:36and she is an Indian-Portuguese mix.
0:00:36 > 0:00:38On the other side of my family,
0:00:38 > 0:00:41my dad's family, I know that he is French-Martinican,
0:00:41 > 0:00:45and maybe other things that I don't know.
0:00:45 > 0:00:47I'm a big mishmash of different cultures.
0:00:47 > 0:00:48Can you hear me?
0:00:48 > 0:00:53And that's bound to reveal some unknowns into the lives
0:00:53 > 0:00:55of these zebra.
0:00:55 > 0:00:58But Socks, the four-year-old female that Max spotted in the forest
0:00:58 > 0:01:01is pushing ahead of Winnie, Janet and the rest.
0:01:01 > 0:01:03Super.
0:01:03 > 0:01:06I hope there's nothing too hideous.
0:01:06 > 0:01:08I do wonder about slave ownership,
0:01:08 > 0:01:11and whether that was part of my family's history.
0:01:11 > 0:01:14'It's sort of, it's something in the back of my head.
0:01:14 > 0:01:18'I kind of think that it's probably quite likely, yeah.
0:01:18 > 0:01:20'I want to find out when'
0:01:20 > 0:01:25each arm, sort of, arrived in the Caribbean, and why.
0:01:25 > 0:01:27And what the story is.
0:01:27 > 0:01:30OK, let's go from 31 or 32 and lose "northern".
0:01:31 > 0:01:33I want to know everything.
0:01:33 > 0:01:34Everything.
0:02:14 > 0:02:16Liz is beginning her journey in Trinidad.
0:02:17 > 0:02:19So I was born in Paris,
0:02:19 > 0:02:22and I grew up in the south of France until I was ten.
0:02:22 > 0:02:24But my mum is from Trinidad.
0:02:26 > 0:02:29Trinidad is one of the most ethnically diverse islands
0:02:29 > 0:02:30in the Caribbean.
0:02:32 > 0:02:36Liz wants to track down the roots of her maternal grandfather's family,
0:02:36 > 0:02:38who she knows originally came from India.
0:02:41 > 0:02:44I film in India a lot, and I feel a connection to India.
0:02:44 > 0:02:49So I'd love to know when my Indian family came to Trinidad.
0:02:49 > 0:02:54Which ancestors moved over, from where in India,
0:02:54 > 0:02:56what caste they were...
0:02:56 > 0:03:01So I'm on my way to meet my cousin Andrew. He's like a brother to me.
0:03:01 > 0:03:04I spent so many holidays here in Trinidad.
0:03:04 > 0:03:05I virtually grew up with him.
0:03:09 > 0:03:13Liz's cousin has arranged to meet her at an art supplies shop
0:03:13 > 0:03:16in the Trinidadian capital Port of Spain.
0:03:16 > 0:03:20This business was once owned by Liz's family.
0:03:21 > 0:03:24- Hello.- Hello!
0:03:24 > 0:03:26- How are you?- I'm really good.
0:03:26 > 0:03:28- Good to see you. You OK? - I'm really good, how are you?
0:03:28 > 0:03:31- It's been a while. - I know.- Yeah.
0:03:31 > 0:03:34Liz never knew her mother's father, her grandfather.
0:03:34 > 0:03:39But she did know his sisters, her great aunts.
0:03:39 > 0:03:40So we'll do these one at a time.
0:03:42 > 0:03:44- The aunties! - Now, who do you know here?
0:03:44 > 0:03:46- OK, so that's Orris.- Yes.
0:03:46 > 0:03:49That's Sybil, and that's Avril.
0:03:49 > 0:03:51Look at them!
0:03:51 > 0:03:53And, sort of, where they are.
0:03:53 > 0:03:55Well, they're in the art shop, I guess.
0:03:55 > 0:03:57That's the original place.
0:03:57 > 0:03:59My God, this is taking me back, you know.
0:04:00 > 0:04:01So...
0:04:03 > 0:04:051956. But do we know when...?
0:04:05 > 0:04:08Who set up the company? When did it start?
0:04:08 > 0:04:13Auntie Sybil took the business over from May Agnes, her mother,
0:04:13 > 0:04:16- our great-grandmother. - May Agnes.- Yes.
0:04:18 > 0:04:20- Is that her?- Yeah, it is. - Oh, my gosh.
0:04:21 > 0:04:24- So that's our great-grandfather. - George, yes.- George?
0:04:24 > 0:04:27- George was his name.- So handsome.
0:04:27 > 0:04:29I can see Mum in May's face.
0:04:29 > 0:04:31- Very much.- So, who's this?
0:04:31 > 0:04:34Ah, that is Auntie Sybil.
0:04:34 > 0:04:36Look at her!
0:04:37 > 0:04:39So, OK, this is May,
0:04:39 > 0:04:45this is the first time I've seen a picture of my great-grandfather.
0:04:45 > 0:04:47So the next one I've got is an odd one.
0:04:51 > 0:04:53- Well, there's George. - It is. I'm not sure what...
0:04:53 > 0:04:56Surrounded by clerics?
0:04:56 > 0:04:57As in people of the church.
0:04:57 > 0:05:00- That's a good point, yes. - They are well-dressed.
0:05:00 > 0:05:03Very colonial, very...
0:05:03 > 0:05:05All look like they're from the Caribbean
0:05:05 > 0:05:08with Indian or African heritage.
0:05:08 > 0:05:11When the Indians first came to Trinidad to work the farms
0:05:11 > 0:05:13they probably didn't have two pennies to rub together.
0:05:13 > 0:05:17- Probably not.- So all of these did pretty well for themselves.
0:05:17 > 0:05:19Yeah.
0:05:19 > 0:05:21Managed to find one, sort of,
0:05:21 > 0:05:24document that is actually really interesting.
0:05:24 > 0:05:29It's Auntie Sybil's obituary.
0:05:29 > 0:05:32"Sybil Gwendolyn Rawle died peacefully last October
0:05:32 > 0:05:35"in the Mary Jenny Poole Home
0:05:35 > 0:05:39"after a lingering illness, at the age of 89.
0:05:39 > 0:05:41"She was one of the leaders who established,
0:05:41 > 0:05:45"who assisted in establishing the Susama...char..."
0:05:45 > 0:05:47- Susamachar.- "..Susamachar Church,
0:05:47 > 0:05:49"where she served with great distinction..."
0:05:49 > 0:05:53Hang on. "She was one of the leaders who assisted in establishing
0:05:53 > 0:05:54"the Susamachar church..." She set up...?
0:05:56 > 0:06:00- Sybil Rawle?- Mmm. - ..set up a church?
0:06:00 > 0:06:02"..where she served with great distinction,
0:06:02 > 0:06:05"eventually being elevated to the status of an ordained elder."
0:06:05 > 0:06:06Stop it!
0:06:06 > 0:06:09- Did you know this? - Not until I read that.
0:06:09 > 0:06:12When did this all happen? And how did we not know about this?
0:06:12 > 0:06:15What is the Susamachar Church? What kind of order is it?
0:06:15 > 0:06:17Presbyterian, which is then odd,
0:06:17 > 0:06:19because your mum and my mum were then brought up very Catholic.
0:06:19 > 0:06:25- So...- Indeed.- The other odd thing is the church was in San Fernando,
0:06:25 > 0:06:29in the south of Trinidad, rather than in Port of Spain.
0:06:29 > 0:06:30South Trinidad.
0:06:30 > 0:06:32I don't think I've ever been to South Trinidad.
0:06:32 > 0:06:36I think it makes sense to me to go to San Fernando and find out more
0:06:36 > 0:06:39about where George and May came from.
0:06:43 > 0:06:47Indians came to Trinidad to work on the sugar plantations
0:06:47 > 0:06:49after the abolition of slavery.
0:06:52 > 0:06:58Almost 150,000 made the journey between 1845 and 1917.
0:06:59 > 0:07:03Today, their descendants are the largest ethnic group in Trinidad.
0:07:06 > 0:07:10Liz wants to know more about her Indian great-grandparents,
0:07:10 > 0:07:13George Albert and May Agnes Rawle.
0:07:13 > 0:07:15The only clues she has are
0:07:15 > 0:07:18the obituary of her Great Aunt Sybil
0:07:18 > 0:07:20revealing she was a Presbyterian
0:07:20 > 0:07:21from the south of Trinidad,
0:07:21 > 0:07:23and an intriguing photograph.
0:07:25 > 0:07:27I'm fascinated by this picture
0:07:27 > 0:07:30of my great-grandfather, George Albert.
0:07:30 > 0:07:33I can't really make head or tail of it, because, I don't know,
0:07:33 > 0:07:37I think I would have presumed that my Indian family would have
0:07:37 > 0:07:40been Hindus. So I'm on my way to meet the archivist
0:07:40 > 0:07:43of the Presbyterian Church in San Fernando.
0:07:43 > 0:07:45I'm going to show him this picture,
0:07:45 > 0:07:47and hopefully he can shed some light.
0:08:03 > 0:08:06Good morning. Reverend Kalloo?
0:08:06 > 0:08:08- Hello.- I'm Liz.
0:08:08 > 0:08:09- Liz.- Very nice to meet you.
0:08:09 > 0:08:13Welcome to Paradise Hill, San Fernando.
0:08:13 > 0:08:16- This is where we are going. - Fantastic.- Come this way.
0:08:16 > 0:08:18This is really what I wanted to ask you about,
0:08:18 > 0:08:22because I can't really make sense of this photograph.
0:08:22 > 0:08:25This is a gathering of Presbyterian men, as you see,
0:08:25 > 0:08:28there are two clergymen at least.
0:08:28 > 0:08:30So what does this mean about George Albert?
0:08:30 > 0:08:31What was he?
0:08:31 > 0:08:36He was certainly a member of the Presbyterian Church.
0:08:36 > 0:08:42Here is a certificate of marriage of...
0:08:42 > 0:08:45May Agnes Sirju and George Albert Rawle.
0:08:45 > 0:08:49Performed at Susamachar Presbyterian Church.
0:08:49 > 0:08:53Got married in 1907, on the 10th of January.
0:08:54 > 0:08:58That's the first time I've seen what her maiden name is.
0:08:58 > 0:09:00Do we know anything about Sirjus?
0:09:00 > 0:09:06Her father would be a gentleman by the name of Timothy Sirju.
0:09:07 > 0:09:12Kenneth J Grant, who performed the wedding, he wrote this book.
0:09:12 > 0:09:14My Missionary Memories.
0:09:14 > 0:09:17Yes. See. And he mentions Timothy Sirju.
0:09:17 > 0:09:19There he is.
0:09:19 > 0:09:20Timothy Sirju.
0:09:20 > 0:09:23Secretary of the Board of Managers.
0:09:23 > 0:09:27So he was a prominent person in the church, he was an elder.
0:09:27 > 0:09:34So how does a man of Indian heritage become a Presbyterian?
0:09:34 > 0:09:38What happened to my great-great-grandfather,
0:09:38 > 0:09:42or his family, that led him to go down the Presbyterian path?
0:09:42 > 0:09:46The first thing that I would have to note is the educational opportunity.
0:09:46 > 0:09:51And because of having an education, of course, upward social mobility,
0:09:51 > 0:09:53climbing the social ladder.
0:09:53 > 0:09:57Westernisation went with Christianisation.
0:09:57 > 0:10:01Simply being associated with white missionaries
0:10:01 > 0:10:05made a great deal of difference. He is also here.
0:10:05 > 0:10:08Timothy Sirju - court interpreter.
0:10:08 > 0:10:11- What's a court interpreter? - Aha, he was...
0:10:13 > 0:10:15..assigned to the courts of the land,
0:10:15 > 0:10:17where there were cases being tried,
0:10:17 > 0:10:19- especially when Indians are involved.- OK, right.
0:10:19 > 0:10:22And he was the Hindustani English expert.
0:10:22 > 0:10:25So he'd already learned English, he was then hired,
0:10:25 > 0:10:27- he was given a good job.- Yeah.
0:10:27 > 0:10:30Interesting.
0:10:30 > 0:10:33'Weirdly, I feel a little bit torn about what I found out.
0:10:33 > 0:10:35'I feel a bit sad,
0:10:35 > 0:10:38'and I think it's because it's that loss of'
0:10:38 > 0:10:41the Hindu culture.
0:10:41 > 0:10:46A loss of all the traditions and the religious beliefs
0:10:46 > 0:10:49and culture that I love when I go to India.
0:10:50 > 0:10:55And when I see pictures of my Indian family all dressed up in
0:10:55 > 0:10:58this constrictive British garb,
0:10:58 > 0:11:00in the West Indies...
0:11:02 > 0:11:05..I just feel a little bit sad that all of that was lost.
0:11:11 > 0:11:12Liz has discovered that
0:11:12 > 0:11:14her great-great-grandfather,
0:11:14 > 0:11:15Timothy Sirju,
0:11:15 > 0:11:17was a pillar of the local community.
0:11:18 > 0:11:22She is visiting the Susamachar Church, where he worshipped,
0:11:22 > 0:11:26to meet local historian Angelo Bissessarsingh.
0:11:26 > 0:11:31So, Angelo, I found out about my great-great-grandfather
0:11:31 > 0:11:32Timothy Sirju,
0:11:32 > 0:11:37he had quite an important role in the Presbyterian Church,
0:11:37 > 0:11:42but he was also quite an influential person outside of the church?
0:11:42 > 0:11:46Well, we could start with some documentation, Liz.
0:11:46 > 0:11:50Here we have his obituary.
0:11:50 > 0:11:53OK. I find it hard to read ancestors' obituaries.
0:11:53 > 0:11:55That's quite surprising.
0:11:55 > 0:11:58I'm getting emotional just thinking about a man I've never met.
0:11:58 > 0:11:59- You're connected to him.- Yeah.
0:11:59 > 0:12:02OK, so... "Mr Timothy Sirju of San Fernando,
0:12:02 > 0:12:08"died at his residence at La Pique on Wednesday evening, the 17th,
0:12:08 > 0:12:09"after a fortnight's illness.
0:12:09 > 0:12:12"He succumbed to typhoid.
0:12:12 > 0:12:19"The deceased will leave an aged mother, widow and 12 children.
0:12:19 > 0:12:22"Head of the mercantile house known as the Star."
0:12:22 > 0:12:25And the mercantile house? What is a mercantile house?
0:12:25 > 0:12:28Well, San Fernando was a market town,
0:12:28 > 0:12:33so its high street was lined on both sides with shops.
0:12:33 > 0:12:36The Star was one of those establishments.
0:12:37 > 0:12:41Here, this building was the Star.
0:12:42 > 0:12:45This is my great-great-grandfather's store.
0:12:45 > 0:12:48He was a very wealthy man indeed.
0:12:48 > 0:12:51This is a probate of his will.
0:12:51 > 0:12:56"Real estate, cocoa and sugar plantation known as Nelson."
0:12:56 > 0:12:57Indeed.
0:12:57 > 0:13:00- 130 quarries?- Quarries.
0:13:00 > 0:13:04So you're looking at an approximate of over 400 acres of land.
0:13:04 > 0:13:08A man who owns 400 acres on a small island like ours was a man of
0:13:08 > 0:13:14significant and very, very extensive consequence in society.
0:13:14 > 0:13:16There is still that thing in my head,
0:13:16 > 0:13:18and I don't know why it still lingers,
0:13:18 > 0:13:21of "Who are you as a person?
0:13:21 > 0:13:24"And how much do you value your heritage, your culture,
0:13:24 > 0:13:26"your religion, everything about Hinduism?"
0:13:26 > 0:13:28You'd have to understand,
0:13:28 > 0:13:32colonial British society in the West Indies was heavily stratified
0:13:32 > 0:13:36along the lines of colour, race, religion.
0:13:36 > 0:13:41So to break the chains of any of those class structures
0:13:41 > 0:13:44it would have been almost mandatory to convert to Christianity
0:13:44 > 0:13:47some way, somehow. You don't live for yourself.
0:13:47 > 0:13:49You live for your children, you live for the future.
0:13:49 > 0:13:53In the hope that they have a better life than you.
0:13:53 > 0:13:58I'm beginning to understand what kind of man Timothy Sirju was.
0:13:58 > 0:14:01- He must have been a pretty tough man.- Yeah.- Yeah.
0:14:05 > 0:14:09Liz wants to find out if Timothy Sirju was born in Trinidad,
0:14:09 > 0:14:12or if he was the ancestor who came over from India.
0:14:16 > 0:14:18She's meeting up again with her cousin Andrew,
0:14:18 > 0:14:20he's been doing more digging,
0:14:20 > 0:14:23and has some information from cousins in Canada.
0:14:25 > 0:14:27- Hello.- Hello!
0:14:27 > 0:14:28- How are you?- Good.
0:14:30 > 0:14:32- Is it going well? - It's going really well.
0:14:32 > 0:14:35I've got something here that's arrived from Canada.
0:14:35 > 0:14:38Maybe it will make a bit more sense to you.
0:14:38 > 0:14:40Let's do this.
0:14:40 > 0:14:42One at a time.
0:14:42 > 0:14:44These are very old.
0:14:45 > 0:14:46OK.
0:14:47 > 0:14:50- Can I look at the back?- Yeah. - Oh, my gosh.- Have a look.
0:14:50 > 0:14:51SHE GASPS
0:14:51 > 0:14:55"Timothy Sirju with his two brothers beside him,
0:14:55 > 0:15:00"and staff of his store at High Street, now Imperial Stores,
0:15:00 > 0:15:01"San Fernando."
0:15:01 > 0:15:06So Timothy Sirju is May Agnes' father.
0:15:06 > 0:15:08Oh, right.
0:15:08 > 0:15:11And he had a general store on the high street of San Fernando.
0:15:11 > 0:15:15He was a very wealthy, very successful man.
0:15:15 > 0:15:18- Right.- I can't believe I'm seeing what he looks like.
0:15:18 > 0:15:20Look at him!
0:15:20 > 0:15:22They're very handsome men, the three brothers.
0:15:22 > 0:15:25Aren't they? Look at him!
0:15:25 > 0:15:27And the second one, I guess,
0:15:27 > 0:15:31just helps a bit more with placing people.
0:15:31 > 0:15:32- GASPING:- That is the mother.
0:15:32 > 0:15:35- It goes even further, yes. - And she's in a sari.- Yeah.
0:15:38 > 0:15:40Wow, wow, wow!
0:15:40 > 0:15:44So Geo Adhar, perhaps George Adhar,
0:15:44 > 0:15:46another son, Samuel Bunsie,
0:15:46 > 0:15:48another son, Jas Mungal.
0:15:49 > 0:15:54So Sirju is not necessarily the surname as we'd imagined it.
0:15:54 > 0:15:57With Indian names, I'm not quite sure how it works.
0:15:57 > 0:15:59What was her name, I wonder?
0:15:59 > 0:16:01Look at her.
0:16:01 > 0:16:05So that's our great-great-great grandmother.
0:16:05 > 0:16:06Yes. That would be right.
0:16:06 > 0:16:09- Look at her, she's incredible-looking.- Yes.
0:16:14 > 0:16:19Even though I learned so much about Timothy Sirju's life as an adult,
0:16:19 > 0:16:22we still know nothing about him as a child,
0:16:22 > 0:16:26whether he was born in Trinidad, or whether he did come on the ships.
0:16:26 > 0:16:31It's hard to know whether this was all, sort of, acquired prosperity,
0:16:31 > 0:16:33or whether they already had some wealth.
0:16:33 > 0:16:35- Shamshu?- Yes.
0:16:35 > 0:16:37- Hi, Liz Bonnin.- Nice to meet you.
0:16:37 > 0:16:41Liz is meeting expert genealogist Shamshu Deen.
0:16:41 > 0:16:44- Welcome to the National Archives. - Thank you for having me here.
0:16:45 > 0:16:48Shamshu, I wanted to show you this photograph of
0:16:48 > 0:16:53my great-great-grandfather Timothy Sirju,
0:16:53 > 0:16:56his brothers and their mother.
0:16:56 > 0:16:58And I was wondering, basically,
0:16:58 > 0:17:00if you had as much information about this family as possible.
0:17:00 > 0:17:02I'd be eternally grateful.
0:17:02 > 0:17:05Yes, well, it's quite an interesting photograph.
0:17:05 > 0:17:07I have here his death certificate.
0:17:07 > 0:17:09OK.
0:17:09 > 0:17:12"Timothy Sirju, age 42.
0:17:12 > 0:17:14"Hindustani interpreter.
0:17:14 > 0:17:16"Country of birth - India."
0:17:18 > 0:17:20I'm going to cry. Oh, dearie me.
0:17:20 > 0:17:22What am I like?
0:17:22 > 0:17:25"La Pique Road, cause of death, typhoid."
0:17:26 > 0:17:28Oh, I don't know why I got all emotional there.
0:17:28 > 0:17:31I presume, because of the dates and everything,
0:17:31 > 0:17:35and with the immigration of Indians to Trinidad,
0:17:35 > 0:17:39that he potentially was one of those individuals that came on the boats?
0:17:39 > 0:17:42But it's really lovely to know for sure that, you know,
0:17:42 > 0:17:45I knew I had Indian roots, but it's so real now.
0:17:45 > 0:17:49And the fact that we have the names of brothers, that's interesting,
0:17:49 > 0:17:52because when people came to Trinidad from wherever they came,
0:17:52 > 0:17:55many of them had one name only.
0:17:55 > 0:17:59And that name, eventually, could have become a surname.
0:17:59 > 0:18:02So that could have been his first name.
0:18:02 > 0:18:04His first, and sometimes only name.
0:18:04 > 0:18:08Because I was wondering how his brothers all had different surnames.
0:18:08 > 0:18:12So to find out which ship he was on, what year he came,
0:18:12 > 0:18:16it helps to know that he was in a family group with Bunsie, Mungal,
0:18:16 > 0:18:19Adhar, and a mother whose name we don't know.
0:18:19 > 0:18:23So we will look to a document which might assist us in this way.
0:18:23 > 0:18:26But before we do that, we need to put the gloves on.
0:18:26 > 0:18:29- OK.- Because we are looking at original documents.
0:18:29 > 0:18:31I'm so excited right now.
0:18:31 > 0:18:33I've got butterflies in my stomach.
0:18:33 > 0:18:39I have here one of the sections of a ship register,
0:18:39 > 0:18:43and each page represents a person who comes from India.
0:18:43 > 0:18:44(Open the book, open the book!)
0:18:44 > 0:18:46This here is the register,
0:18:46 > 0:18:47or part of the register,
0:18:47 > 0:18:51of the Indus ship that came to Trinidad in 1872.
0:18:51 > 0:18:53So I want you to take a look at this page
0:18:53 > 0:18:55and see if you have any questions.
0:18:55 > 0:18:58- Oh... The writing is so beautiful. - First of all,
0:18:58 > 0:19:00- I want you to concentrate on the name of the person.- Sorry.
0:19:00 > 0:19:02Can you read that name for us?
0:19:04 > 0:19:09Surjoudin? Surjodin. Surjoodin.
0:19:09 > 0:19:13So you see a bit of a name similar to Sirju.
0:19:13 > 0:19:16- Yes.- So bearing that in mind,
0:19:16 > 0:19:20we would like to see if any others from that picture
0:19:20 > 0:19:22might have been here. OK?
0:19:22 > 0:19:26We know that there is a Mungal there.
0:19:26 > 0:19:29- So we will change...- Oh, Mungal. - Mm-hmm.
0:19:30 > 0:19:32And we also know
0:19:32 > 0:19:34that this one here...
0:19:36 > 0:19:39U-D-H-A-R.
0:19:39 > 0:19:40Udhar.
0:19:40 > 0:19:42- Adhar.- Yes. Did you see this one?
0:19:42 > 0:19:44This is in Bunsee. B-U-N-S-E-E.
0:19:44 > 0:19:48As opposed to B-U-N-S-I-E.
0:19:48 > 0:19:49- And...- So that's the four brothers?
0:19:49 > 0:19:51Yes. We can see that.
0:19:51 > 0:19:56And we also wanted to take a look here at the age of Sirju.
0:19:56 > 0:19:58So we go to Sirju.
0:19:58 > 0:20:00And we see his age is what?
0:20:00 > 0:20:02- Eight.- Eight.
0:20:02 > 0:20:05And when we look at this death certificate, what are we seeing?
0:20:05 > 0:20:08We're seeing that he dies in 1906, at the age...
0:20:08 > 0:20:1042, so... It adds up.
0:20:10 > 0:20:12It adds up. This is him.
0:20:12 > 0:20:15So when you use all the different bits of information
0:20:15 > 0:20:17- you can confirm.- Yes.
0:20:17 > 0:20:20What about the mum?
0:20:20 > 0:20:23- This is the mum. - I can't read that beautiful...
0:20:23 > 0:20:24Her name is Sudhanee.
0:20:24 > 0:20:26Sudhanee.
0:20:26 > 0:20:29S-U-D-H-A-N-E-E.
0:20:29 > 0:20:32- Sudhanee.- Yes.- 30 years of age.
0:20:32 > 0:20:35My great-great-great grandmother.
0:20:36 > 0:20:39Did you know that the father had also come?
0:20:39 > 0:20:42- Hang on.- The husband is here.
0:20:42 > 0:20:45- Aunondee.- Aunondee, yeah.
0:20:48 > 0:20:53Liz now has the names of her Indian great-great-great grandparents.
0:20:53 > 0:20:56Aunondee and Sudhanee.
0:20:56 > 0:20:58She wants to know where they were
0:20:58 > 0:20:59in India's caste system.
0:21:01 > 0:21:03What is the caste?
0:21:03 > 0:21:06- I can't...- The caste is called Koree, it's right here.
0:21:06 > 0:21:11This is an agricultural caste, they were involved in agriculture.
0:21:11 > 0:21:13It was not a very high caste.
0:21:13 > 0:21:17That tells me so much more, again,
0:21:17 > 0:21:20about what he achieved in his life.
0:21:20 > 0:21:25If he came from an agricultural background, a low caste.
0:21:25 > 0:21:28- What does zillah mean? - Zillah is the district.
0:21:28 > 0:21:29In this case, it's in Uttar Pradesh.
0:21:29 > 0:21:32They don't put Uttar Pradesh, but we know this...
0:21:32 > 0:21:35- Uttar Pradesh is... - It's a state in Northern India.
0:21:35 > 0:21:37- Northern India. - It's the largest state.
0:21:37 > 0:21:39- But we even have it up to the... - Village.- ..village level.
0:21:39 > 0:21:43- Oh, good grief...- Luchmanpore.
0:21:43 > 0:21:45So they came from the village of Luchmanpore?
0:21:45 > 0:21:50- Yes.- I now finally know where my Indian heritage comes from.
0:21:50 > 0:21:53Luchmanpore. In Uttar Pradesh.
0:21:53 > 0:21:54Yes.
0:21:57 > 0:22:01Indians coming to Trinidad faced a gruelling three-month voyage
0:22:01 > 0:22:03around the Cape of Good Hope.
0:22:06 > 0:22:08Their passage was paid for them.
0:22:10 > 0:22:13In return, once they got to Trinidad,
0:22:13 > 0:22:16they were bound to work for a plantation owner
0:22:16 > 0:22:18for a period of five years.
0:22:18 > 0:22:21A system that was known as indentureship.
0:22:24 > 0:22:30So each of these pages, which were on the ship record, is a contract?
0:22:30 > 0:22:32- The indentureship? - Yes. A contract, yes.
0:22:32 > 0:22:36"Certified that I have examined and passed the above named
0:22:36 > 0:22:40"as a fit subject for emigration,
0:22:40 > 0:22:44"and that he is free from all bodily and mental disease
0:22:44 > 0:22:46"having been vaccinated."
0:22:46 > 0:22:49It sounds a bit...
0:22:49 > 0:22:53close to the slavery aspect, doesn't it?
0:22:53 > 0:22:55It's like, "This individual is fit...
0:22:55 > 0:22:58"You know, I've checked him out, I've checked his teeth."
0:22:58 > 0:23:02Do we have any idea of what happened to them
0:23:02 > 0:23:04the minute they got off that boat in 1872?
0:23:04 > 0:23:09Yes, they were assigned to various plantations or estates.
0:23:09 > 0:23:13That estate was called, it's right at the top up here.
0:23:15 > 0:23:17Palmist?
0:23:17 > 0:23:19- Palmiste?- Palmiste, correct.
0:23:19 > 0:23:22- Right.- Palmiste? Where's Palmiste?
0:23:22 > 0:23:23Does it still exist?
0:23:23 > 0:23:25It doesn't exist as an estate any more,
0:23:25 > 0:23:27but it is in South Trinidad.
0:23:27 > 0:23:30It was in South Trinidad, not too far from San Fernando.
0:23:31 > 0:23:35It's really, really hard to put into words how I'm feeling right now.
0:23:35 > 0:23:39I can't help but think about Sudhanee and Aunondee,
0:23:39 > 0:23:42my great-great-great grandparents.
0:23:42 > 0:23:45And Sudhanee certainly has a name and a face now,
0:23:45 > 0:23:47with this really young family,
0:23:47 > 0:23:50my great-great-grandfather, just eight years old,
0:23:50 > 0:23:55an eight-year-old boy leaving his home.
0:23:55 > 0:23:59I want to know how on earth this petrified little fellow,
0:23:59 > 0:24:05dragged to this plantation to work, how he went from that to this
0:24:05 > 0:24:10successful, confident family man
0:24:10 > 0:24:14who owned estates, and a shop, and a plantation.
0:24:15 > 0:24:19I'd love to understand more about how he made himself such a success
0:24:19 > 0:24:22in the face of so many obstacles, so many challenges.
0:24:25 > 0:24:29Today, Trinidad's sugar industry is almost closed down.
0:24:31 > 0:24:36Liz is meeting historian Radica Mahase at an old disused sugar mill.
0:24:37 > 0:24:40I wanted to know what life was like for my family.
0:24:40 > 0:24:42Cos they got off the ship
0:24:42 > 0:24:44and were assigned their estate and went to work.
0:24:44 > 0:24:46What was it like?
0:24:46 > 0:24:48Normally the contract stated that they had to work from
0:24:48 > 0:24:50six in the morning until six in the evening.
0:24:50 > 0:24:53But during crop time, when they were reaping, harvesting cane,
0:24:53 > 0:24:56they would probably work till nine, ten in the night.
0:24:56 > 0:24:59So they were extremely long days for the labourers.
0:24:59 > 0:25:03And how much different was it to the conditions
0:25:03 > 0:25:05that the slaves had worked in?
0:25:05 > 0:25:09It was a system of paid labour, as opposed to African enslavement.
0:25:09 > 0:25:11There was the option to return to India,
0:25:11 > 0:25:12whereas with slavery
0:25:12 > 0:25:16you didn't have an option to return to Africa at any point.
0:25:16 > 0:25:19The mere fact that the indentured labourers lived on the same barracks
0:25:19 > 0:25:22that the enslaved Africans lived in before says something.
0:25:22 > 0:25:24So it would have been the same plantations,
0:25:24 > 0:25:26the same living conditions.
0:25:26 > 0:25:30I'm thinking about my great-great-grandfather,
0:25:30 > 0:25:31eight years of age.
0:25:31 > 0:25:34What would life have been like for him?
0:25:34 > 0:25:36Children were allowed to work on the estates.
0:25:36 > 0:25:38- Even at eight years old? - Even at eight years old.
0:25:38 > 0:25:41They'd be given lighter tasks, and they'd be given smaller wages.
0:25:41 > 0:25:44But there were some estates with the planters were opposed to
0:25:44 > 0:25:47the children working and they preferred to encourage the parents
0:25:47 > 0:25:49to send the children to school.
0:25:49 > 0:25:53So he may have worked, he may have been sent to school?
0:25:53 > 0:25:54Yes.
0:25:56 > 0:25:58To explain more about the Palmiste estate
0:25:58 > 0:26:01where Timothy Sirju's family went,
0:26:01 > 0:26:04Radica's taking Liz to a nearby plantation house
0:26:04 > 0:26:07which has been turned into a museum.
0:26:07 > 0:26:11The Palmiste estate was one of the more liberal estates in Trinidad.
0:26:11 > 0:26:14One of the better states to be an indentured labourer.
0:26:14 > 0:26:17- Really?- Yeah. It was owned by the Lamont family,
0:26:17 > 0:26:20and they were Scottish Presbyterians.
0:26:20 > 0:26:22So the children on the Palmiste estate,
0:26:22 > 0:26:24the children of the indentured labourers,
0:26:24 > 0:26:27they would have probably been encouraged to attend schools.
0:26:27 > 0:26:30So in a sense, you know, I've got the Lamont family to thank
0:26:30 > 0:26:34because they could have been sent to a less liberal plantation.
0:26:34 > 0:26:38And do we have information about my family at this plantation?
0:26:38 > 0:26:45We have a birth certificate of Timothy Sirju's eldest son.
0:26:45 > 0:26:48LIZ GASPS
0:26:48 > 0:26:51And this birth certificate clearly shows that
0:26:51 > 0:26:53Timothy Sirju was a schoolmaster.
0:26:53 > 0:26:56This is 1882. What?
0:26:57 > 0:26:59Oh, so at 18 years of age.
0:26:59 > 0:27:03- Yes.- He would have been already a schoolmaster.
0:27:03 > 0:27:07- This guy! Wow!- most probably he would have been allowed to attend
0:27:07 > 0:27:10school as a little boy on the plantation,
0:27:10 > 0:27:12maybe as soon as he arrived in Trinidad,
0:27:12 > 0:27:13or right after.
0:27:13 > 0:27:17So, if Timothy Sirju had probably stayed in India,
0:27:17 > 0:27:19he would probably not have been able to have any kind of
0:27:19 > 0:27:22upward caste mobility.
0:27:22 > 0:27:26Because there were such severe caste restrictions in India.
0:27:26 > 0:27:30So as my heart was breaking for these poor indentured labourers,
0:27:30 > 0:27:33and, I mean, that's not to say their life wasn't difficult,
0:27:33 > 0:27:36Timothy got opportunities that he, you know, arguably,
0:27:36 > 0:27:39he would never have gotten in India.
0:27:39 > 0:27:41It's amazing.
0:27:53 > 0:28:00When I think about Timothy Sirju first setting eyes on Trinidad,
0:28:00 > 0:28:02at the age of eight, you know,
0:28:02 > 0:28:05I can't help but want to give that little boy a hug.
0:28:05 > 0:28:07It must have been so difficult.
0:28:08 > 0:28:12I still feel a little bit sad that he had to lose some of his identity,
0:28:12 > 0:28:15his culture, his homeland, but that's probably really unfair of me.
0:28:15 > 0:28:18I wasn't born in a lower caste in India,
0:28:18 > 0:28:22with very little options to better myself.
0:28:22 > 0:28:27So it's a great feeling to think that despite where he came from,
0:28:27 > 0:28:29he made so much of himself.
0:28:29 > 0:28:33I am incredibly proud to think that he is my ancestor.
0:28:44 > 0:28:48Liz now wants to explore the other side of her family - her father's.
0:28:48 > 0:28:50It means island hopping.
0:28:52 > 0:28:56Liz's father was born in the nearby Caribbean island of Martinique,
0:28:56 > 0:28:58which used to be a French colony.
0:29:10 > 0:29:13Martinique's history, like Trinidad's,
0:29:13 > 0:29:15is dominated by sugar and slavery.
0:29:15 > 0:29:18I used to come to Martinique every holiday.
0:29:18 > 0:29:22I remember coming for Christmas, for Easter, for summer...
0:29:23 > 0:29:25..to visit this amazing woman.
0:29:25 > 0:29:28This is my dad's mum.
0:29:28 > 0:29:31We all called her Granny. Her name is Julie.
0:29:31 > 0:29:35She kind of brought us up, in a way, because we spent so much time here.
0:29:35 > 0:29:37She passed away 13 years ago,
0:29:37 > 0:29:40and I'm tearing up just thinking about her,
0:29:40 > 0:29:42because I loved her so much. I was so close to her.
0:29:42 > 0:29:47And this is my first time back in Martinique since she passed away.
0:29:47 > 0:29:51So everywhere is just bringing back incredible memories,
0:29:51 > 0:29:55and it's a bittersweet visit. For sure.
0:30:00 > 0:30:03Liz is meeting up with her aunt, Marie Christine,
0:30:03 > 0:30:04who is also her godmother.
0:30:08 > 0:30:10Marie Christine!
0:30:10 > 0:30:11Darling, Lizzie.
0:30:11 > 0:30:14IN FRENCH:
0:30:14 > 0:30:16- How have you been?- I'm great.
0:30:20 > 0:30:22- It's so good to see you. - It's been too long.
0:30:22 > 0:30:24Thank you so much for meeting me.
0:30:24 > 0:30:26They've come to Granny Julie's old house,
0:30:26 > 0:30:30which she moved out of more than 30 years ago.
0:30:30 > 0:30:31It no longer belongs to the family,
0:30:31 > 0:30:34but the owners have allowed them to take a look around.
0:30:36 > 0:30:38- Oh, look at that.- Oh, my God. - The terrace.
0:30:40 > 0:30:42Oh-la-la-la. OK.
0:30:42 > 0:30:45- The terrace has the same tiles. - Yes, it's the same tiles.
0:30:45 > 0:30:47And the same dining room.
0:30:47 > 0:30:50Do you know what memory I have, coming through those doors?
0:30:50 > 0:30:52Myself, my sister and my cousin,
0:30:52 > 0:30:57Karine, it's raining tropical rain, and we all run out here,
0:30:57 > 0:30:59and we wash our hair in the rain.
0:31:02 > 0:31:06I love that it's the same doors and the same floors.
0:31:08 > 0:31:10Let's go out on the terrace.
0:31:11 > 0:31:15Same doors. Same doors that Granny used to shut during storms,
0:31:15 > 0:31:19and at night we'd all help shut everything up.
0:31:21 > 0:31:23It's funny, it seems so much smaller now.
0:31:26 > 0:31:28Maybe you've seen this...
0:31:28 > 0:31:30Oh!
0:31:30 > 0:31:33Oh, Marie Christine, I love it.
0:31:33 > 0:31:37- Look at the state of me!- Look at the baby!- Could I be any chubbier?
0:31:37 > 0:31:41So this is when you were named my godmother.
0:31:41 > 0:31:43- Absolutely.- At my christening.
0:31:43 > 0:31:45It was a special day.
0:31:45 > 0:31:47Look at you.
0:31:48 > 0:31:51Look at that. I remember this photograph.
0:31:51 > 0:31:54The year we visited Granny just before her death,
0:31:54 > 0:31:58we did start looking at some of the old cupboards where she
0:31:58 > 0:32:00had photographs, and I remember seeing this.
0:32:00 > 0:32:04- You saw this one?- This is Granny, in the middle.- Yes.
0:32:04 > 0:32:06So they are all, they are all in mourning.
0:32:06 > 0:32:10You see, they all wear black, and the baby wears white.
0:32:11 > 0:32:13Their mother just died.
0:32:13 > 0:32:15Good grief!
0:32:15 > 0:32:18- So Granny's mum died when she was... - She was a baby.
0:32:18 > 0:32:19Yeah.
0:32:19 > 0:32:22I didn't realise that she lost her mum so young.
0:32:22 > 0:32:24Their father was still alive?
0:32:24 > 0:32:26No, the father died a few months before.
0:32:27 > 0:32:30Wow, Marie Christine, I didn't know that.
0:32:30 > 0:32:35This is him. Everybody called him Achille, which was his second name.
0:32:36 > 0:32:38Granny's father.
0:32:38 > 0:32:41- Achille Gros Desormeaux.- Oui.
0:32:41 > 0:32:45- Gros Desormeaux. - Gros Desormeaux is a strange name.
0:32:45 > 0:32:47What do we know about the Gros Desormeaux,
0:32:47 > 0:32:51- what did your mum tell you? - It's a huge family.
0:32:51 > 0:32:53- Yeah?- Um...
0:32:53 > 0:32:54She wouldn't tell me much.
0:32:56 > 0:32:59Such a mix, and it's so complicated.
0:32:59 > 0:33:00- Is it?- Yes.
0:33:00 > 0:33:07I was wondering, in fact, I was presuming, that if we were French,
0:33:07 > 0:33:10at some point we owned slaves.
0:33:10 > 0:33:12Do you know anything about that?
0:33:12 > 0:33:18Well, I think they owned a plantation, or several plantations.
0:33:18 > 0:33:21I don't know with certainty,
0:33:21 > 0:33:24but I was told, my mother told me that
0:33:24 > 0:33:28at some point, there were slaves on the plantations.
0:33:28 > 0:33:30And when slavery was abolished...
0:33:33 > 0:33:36..a few of them stayed with the family.
0:33:36 > 0:33:38They wouldn't leave.
0:33:39 > 0:33:41OK.
0:33:41 > 0:33:43They felt at home.
0:33:43 > 0:33:48I hope so, I hope that, aside from the fact that now we recognise it as
0:33:48 > 0:33:52a hideous period in our history, that perhaps our family, at least,
0:33:52 > 0:33:55treated them well. To make them want to stay,
0:33:55 > 0:33:57or perhaps, they had nowhere else to go.
0:33:57 > 0:33:59Didn't know what else to do, and they stayed anyway.
0:33:59 > 0:34:02But, yeah, I want to find out more about that.
0:34:10 > 0:34:13I'm heading south to meet up with a researcher who's been digging into
0:34:13 > 0:34:15my grandmother's family tree.
0:34:15 > 0:34:19To my absolutely favourite beach in the whole of Martinique,
0:34:19 > 0:34:22it's a place I used to go to with Granny all the time.
0:34:31 > 0:34:33- Romain?- C'est moi.
0:34:33 > 0:34:35Very nice to meet you.
0:34:35 > 0:34:36- How are you?- Nice to meet you.
0:34:36 > 0:34:40THEY CONVERSE IN FRENCH
0:34:40 > 0:34:42I wanted to show you this.
0:34:42 > 0:34:48This is Achille Gros Desormeaux, he's my great-grandfather.
0:34:48 > 0:34:51He's my grandmother Julie's father.
0:34:51 > 0:34:56And I would love to know whether the stories of
0:34:56 > 0:34:59my family owning slaves is true.
0:34:59 > 0:35:01OK.
0:35:01 > 0:35:04In Martinique, slavery was abolished in 1848.
0:35:04 > 0:35:06So if, at some point,
0:35:06 > 0:35:10your family was involved in slavery, it was before that.
0:35:11 > 0:35:14I can show you a document I have here with me.
0:35:15 > 0:35:18- "Mariage."- Yes.
0:35:18 > 0:35:23Oh, my gosh, so the marriage between Achille and Charlotte.
0:35:23 > 0:35:26- Charlotte Savane.- Charlotte Savane.
0:35:26 > 0:35:30So 1907, the 29th of August, at 9.00 in the morning.
0:35:31 > 0:35:37Achille was born on the 5th of October, 1883.
0:35:37 > 0:35:42"Legitimate son of Louis Marie Gros Desormeaux."
0:35:42 > 0:35:47OK, so his father was 79 years old.
0:35:48 > 0:35:51- "Proprietaires." - So he was a landowner.
0:35:51 > 0:35:52A landowner.
0:35:53 > 0:35:5879 in...1907.
0:35:58 > 0:36:02Then he would have been born in 1830...
0:36:02 > 0:36:04- 1828.- Exactly.
0:36:04 > 0:36:06So that would mean that
0:36:06 > 0:36:09at the time of the abolition of slavery he was...
0:36:09 > 0:36:131848... 20 years old.
0:36:13 > 0:36:19So it is very unlikely he was himself a slave owner.
0:36:19 > 0:36:21So, in order to get to the next generation,
0:36:21 > 0:36:23I brought another document for you.
0:36:26 > 0:36:30So this is my great-great-grandfather's death certificate.
0:36:30 > 0:36:32- Louis Marie.- Yes, it is.
0:36:32 > 0:36:34In 1911.
0:36:35 > 0:36:40"Aged 83, landowner.
0:36:40 > 0:36:41"The legitimate son..."
0:36:41 > 0:36:42So here we go.
0:36:42 > 0:36:46"..of Francois Alexandre Gros Desormeaux.
0:36:46 > 0:36:49OK, so we've got your great-great-great-grandfather.
0:36:49 > 0:36:51Great-great-great already.
0:36:51 > 0:36:53Good Lord. I mean, I wanted to go as far back as possible,
0:36:53 > 0:36:55but this is amazing.
0:36:56 > 0:37:00So what we know from Francois Alexandre Gros Desormeaux is that
0:37:00 > 0:37:05he was a well-known landowner in the south-east of the island
0:37:05 > 0:37:07of Martinique at that time.
0:37:07 > 0:37:09And I found something for you.
0:37:09 > 0:37:13I found out that one of his properties is still standing.
0:37:13 > 0:37:15Would you like to see it?
0:37:17 > 0:37:20- Well, let's go.- Wow!
0:37:20 > 0:37:23- Seriously?- Yes, seriously.
0:37:23 > 0:37:25Wow! Yes, let's go.
0:37:25 > 0:37:26Let's go.
0:37:29 > 0:37:31Liz has traced her family back to
0:37:31 > 0:37:34her great, great-great-grandfather,
0:37:34 > 0:37:37Francois Alexandre Gros Desormeaux,
0:37:37 > 0:37:39who was a landowner in Martinique
0:37:39 > 0:37:40during the era of slavery.
0:37:49 > 0:37:52Oh, that is a view and a half!
0:37:55 > 0:37:57- Just...- Amazing.- ..incredible.
0:38:00 > 0:38:04And so, Francois Alexandre owned the land?
0:38:04 > 0:38:08- Yes. He did.- And this was, sort of, the main plantation house?
0:38:08 > 0:38:10Yes, it was. You can see on top of the hill,
0:38:10 > 0:38:12so they could see all the land around.
0:38:14 > 0:38:18So Francois Alexandre was a plantation owner?
0:38:18 > 0:38:21- Yes, he was.- Did he own slaves?
0:38:21 > 0:38:23Well...
0:38:23 > 0:38:25I have a document here I would like to show you.
0:38:25 > 0:38:32It's an inventory that was drawn up in 1838 of his possessions.
0:38:34 > 0:38:35OK...
0:38:35 > 0:38:41"Monsieur Francois Alexandre Gros Desormeaux, aged 43."
0:38:41 > 0:38:44So my great-great-great-grandfather
0:38:44 > 0:38:46was born in the 18th century.
0:38:48 > 0:38:52OK, so a portion of land, 6.75 hectares.
0:38:52 > 0:38:53OK, so it states...
0:38:53 > 0:38:57That's incredible, from 1838, so it states who he is,
0:38:57 > 0:38:58and the land that he...
0:39:00 > 0:39:02Yeah. I just... Hmm.
0:39:08 > 0:39:10Actually, can you just stop filming?
0:39:13 > 0:39:16The 1838 inventory contains a list of slaves
0:39:16 > 0:39:19owned by Liz's great-great-great-grandfather.
0:39:27 > 0:39:29Sorry about that, Romain.
0:39:29 > 0:39:33I got a shock. It's something I expected,
0:39:33 > 0:39:37and it's when I saw people's names and the price...
0:39:39 > 0:39:40These are people.
0:39:40 > 0:39:43These are human beings who were treated as commodities.
0:39:43 > 0:39:48And we know this, but I just got a shock, just seeing it on paper.
0:39:50 > 0:39:51So...
0:39:51 > 0:39:56Francois Alexandre, for this plantation, owned...one, two, three,
0:39:56 > 0:40:01four, five, six, seven slaves.
0:40:01 > 0:40:04So, yeah. There's Louison.
0:40:04 > 0:40:08- Quarante-sept ans. - 47 years old.
0:40:08 > 0:40:13An estimated price, 1,111 francs.
0:40:13 > 0:40:17"Bernadine, la fille," so the daughter of Louison.
0:40:17 > 0:40:2018 years old.
0:40:20 > 0:40:221,200 francs.
0:40:24 > 0:40:28Louise, also the daughter, 13 years old.
0:40:28 > 0:40:29900 francs.
0:40:31 > 0:40:33I have to take a minute after every one.
0:40:36 > 0:40:39- I can't read any more.- OK.
0:40:41 > 0:40:43It's really strange.
0:40:43 > 0:40:48I was pretty sure there was slave ownership in my family.
0:40:48 > 0:40:52I mean, the whole of Martinique involved slave ownership, you know,
0:40:52 > 0:40:56with the sugar cane industry. And many of the other islands.
0:40:56 > 0:40:58And much of America. I mean, it's something I was thinking of
0:40:58 > 0:41:00before I even left the UK,
0:41:00 > 0:41:05and I thought I was more or less prepared for it.
0:41:05 > 0:41:07And my reaction shocked me.
0:41:07 > 0:41:10Now I look around and I think,
0:41:10 > 0:41:13"This was a place that was filled with slaves
0:41:13 > 0:41:15"working the sugar cane fields."
0:41:16 > 0:41:20It's a lot to take in, even though I was preparing myself,
0:41:20 > 0:41:24the reality of it in my family, it's a tough thing.
0:41:24 > 0:41:25It's a tough thing. Yeah.
0:41:33 > 0:41:36Martinique's economy depended on slavery.
0:41:36 > 0:41:40In the 1830s, there were more than 70,000 slaves in the colony.
0:41:42 > 0:41:45Ruled over by about 10,000 whites.
0:41:51 > 0:41:53Liz is heading to Martinique's archives,
0:41:53 > 0:41:56where records from the era of slavery are held.
0:41:58 > 0:41:59Dominique? Liz. Bonjour.
0:41:59 > 0:42:01IN FRENCH:
0:42:05 > 0:42:09She's meeting historian Dominique Roger, an expert on the period.
0:42:11 > 0:42:15So, Dominique, yesterday for me was a very hard day.
0:42:15 > 0:42:18It was quite overwhelming,
0:42:18 > 0:42:21and I found proof that my great-great-great-grandfather,
0:42:21 > 0:42:25Francois Alexandre, was a plantation owner, and he owned slaves.
0:42:27 > 0:42:31I'm curious to find out if there's anything in the archives that might
0:42:31 > 0:42:36help me to understand what he was like as a plantation owner.
0:42:36 > 0:42:39Well, we found a few documents.
0:42:39 > 0:42:42- OK.- Are you prepared? - Yes, I'm prepared.
0:42:45 > 0:42:48Mariage de...
0:42:49 > 0:42:50- Francois.- Voila!
0:42:50 > 0:42:56OK, so marriage of Francois Alexandre Gros Desormeaux
0:42:56 > 0:43:01and of Mademoiselle Marie Joseph.
0:43:01 > 0:43:05That's my great-great-great-grandmother.
0:43:06 > 0:43:08Wow!
0:43:08 > 0:43:11The year, 1835.
0:43:11 > 0:43:14The 22nd of June.
0:43:15 > 0:43:17With eight children.
0:43:17 > 0:43:20They had eight children. But this...
0:43:20 > 0:43:23Hang on. Is this not a marriage certificate?
0:43:23 > 0:43:26- Yes, indeed.- So they had eight children before they got married?
0:43:26 > 0:43:27Yes.
0:43:29 > 0:43:31If they had illegitimate children,
0:43:31 > 0:43:35was there something about their relationship
0:43:35 > 0:43:38that wasn't acceptable at the time?
0:43:38 > 0:43:40Was one or the other
0:43:40 > 0:43:45slightly not of the same class...
0:43:45 > 0:43:47I think we are going to have a second document.
0:43:50 > 0:43:52This is 1831.
0:43:52 > 0:43:54Four years before.
0:43:54 > 0:43:57Four years before. In July. "Le mois de juillet."
0:43:57 > 0:43:59At 11 in the morning...
0:43:59 > 0:44:03SHE READS IN FRENCH
0:44:03 > 0:44:06SHE GASPS
0:44:06 > 0:44:07Oh, my gosh.
0:44:07 > 0:44:09OK, hang on! Wah!
0:44:10 > 0:44:15So... "On the 25th of June 1831, in the name of the King...
0:44:16 > 0:44:20"..we, the governors of Martinique,
0:44:20 > 0:44:27"declare Marie Joseph, aged 40 years, and her six children...
0:44:29 > 0:44:32"..liberated of all servitude...
0:44:34 > 0:44:36"..and free to enjoy..."
0:44:36 > 0:44:39Oh, my gosh! "..free to enjoy the remaining days of their lives
0:44:39 > 0:44:41"in the manner that they choose."
0:44:44 > 0:44:47So my great-great-great-grandmother,
0:44:47 > 0:44:50- Marie Joseph, was a slave?- Yes.
0:44:52 > 0:44:55And her son, my great-great-grandfather,
0:44:55 > 0:44:59Louis Marie, was born in 1828,
0:44:59 > 0:45:01as a slave.
0:45:01 > 0:45:02That's mad!
0:45:04 > 0:45:07I have never felt like this in my entire life.
0:45:07 > 0:45:11I can't even put into words how I'm feeling right now.
0:45:11 > 0:45:14I need to know more about who these people were.
0:45:22 > 0:45:25That was a pretty extraordinary revelation.
0:45:27 > 0:45:29At a time when sexual exploitation
0:45:29 > 0:45:32pretty much went hand-in-hand with slave ownership,
0:45:32 > 0:45:36apparently, my great-great-great-grandfather
0:45:36 > 0:45:41had what seems to be a very real romance with this slave.
0:45:41 > 0:45:45He married her, he legitimised all his children.
0:45:45 > 0:45:48And I'm trying not to romanticise the whole thing too much,
0:45:48 > 0:45:50but it sounds like Francois Alexandre...
0:45:52 > 0:45:55..had the capacity to be a better human being than I potentially
0:45:55 > 0:45:57thought he was the beginning
0:45:57 > 0:45:59when I first found out he was a slave owner.
0:46:04 > 0:46:09Francois Alexandre and the freed slave Marie Joseph,
0:46:09 > 0:46:12Liz's great-great-great-grandparents,
0:46:12 > 0:46:15were married in 1835.
0:46:15 > 0:46:18Liz knows from their wedding certificate that his father was also
0:46:18 > 0:46:20called Francois Alexandre.
0:46:20 > 0:46:22And that his mother
0:46:22 > 0:46:24was called Pauline Zoe.
0:46:24 > 0:46:25Liz now wants to
0:46:25 > 0:46:27find out about them,
0:46:27 > 0:46:31and their attitude to their son's extraordinary marriage to a slave.
0:46:36 > 0:46:41She's meeting local historian Vincent Huyghues-Belrose.
0:46:41 > 0:46:43IN FRENCH:
0:46:50 > 0:46:54Vincent has documents about the next generation of Liz's family.
0:47:58 > 0:48:05So this 1804 document proves that Francois Alexandre Sr
0:48:05 > 0:48:09had children with Pauline Zoe,
0:48:09 > 0:48:14who was a slave at the time when they had two children.
0:48:14 > 0:48:16Francois Alexandre Jr,
0:48:16 > 0:48:20my great-great-great-grandfather and Marc Antoine.
0:48:21 > 0:48:26So that means Francois Alexandre Jr was mixed race.
0:48:27 > 0:48:29It's just...
0:48:30 > 0:48:33..extraordinary and overwhelming
0:48:33 > 0:48:36and I am flabbergasted at this story.
0:48:36 > 0:48:40Vincent collaborated with a distant relative of Liz's
0:48:40 > 0:48:44who wrote a history of the Gros Desormeaux family.
0:48:44 > 0:48:46IN FRENCH:
0:49:09 > 0:49:12The book reveals that Francois Alexandre Sr,
0:49:12 > 0:49:16a white plantation owner whose father was born in France,
0:49:16 > 0:49:19publicly acknowledged Pauline Zoe as his partner.
0:49:19 > 0:49:22Although there were not formally married,
0:49:22 > 0:49:26this was extremely unusual in Martinique at that time.
0:49:53 > 0:49:55Wow!
0:50:05 > 0:50:10I am superbly proud of Francois Alexandre Sr,
0:50:10 > 0:50:15and I absolutely adore this sentence that speaks of how he created
0:50:15 > 0:50:19his own little world, his own haven that suited him,
0:50:19 > 0:50:24and he succeeded in protecting his descendants against the hostility
0:50:24 > 0:50:27of the law, and the animosity of man.
0:50:29 > 0:50:31And now, of course,
0:50:31 > 0:50:35I can't rest until I set eyes on where this place was.
0:50:35 > 0:50:38Where he just lived the way he wanted to live,
0:50:38 > 0:50:40with the people that he loved.
0:50:41 > 0:50:45Liz is meeting up again with historian Dominique Roger
0:50:45 > 0:50:49to see if they can find the fiefdom Francois Alexandre Sr created
0:50:49 > 0:50:51in the hills of Martinique.
0:50:55 > 0:50:59Dominique knows that the location of one of his plantations is now
0:50:59 > 0:51:02a small hamlet called Desormeaux.
0:51:05 > 0:51:09- Pardon, monsieur. Bonjour. - Bonjour.
0:51:09 > 0:51:11IN FRENCH:
0:52:29 > 0:52:31Wow.
0:52:32 > 0:52:37So this spot is where the known plantation house was.
0:52:37 > 0:52:41And it certainly dates to before the late 1800s,
0:52:41 > 0:52:44according to my cousins.
0:52:44 > 0:52:47So, who knows? This could very well be the place where it all started.
0:52:47 > 0:52:52Where Francois Alexandre set up the beginning of his stronghold,
0:52:52 > 0:52:54the beginning of his little world.
0:52:54 > 0:52:58And then expanded his property.
0:53:07 > 0:53:11Dominique has two final documents to show Liz.
0:53:11 > 0:53:14They shed light on the relationship between
0:53:14 > 0:53:18Liz's great-great-great- great-grandparents,
0:53:18 > 0:53:20Francois Alexandre Sr,
0:53:20 > 0:53:22and the freed slave, Pauline Zoe.
0:53:24 > 0:53:27"The last will and testament of
0:53:27 > 0:53:30"Francois Alexandre Gros Desormeaux Sr, 1831.
0:53:32 > 0:53:38"I recognise voluntarily and freely for my natural children,
0:53:38 > 0:53:42"all the rights that natural children are entitled to.
0:53:42 > 0:53:45"And also legally recognised as such.
0:53:45 > 0:53:50"So I leave to the demoiselles Pauline Zoe all of my possessions,
0:53:50 > 0:53:53"and the buildings that I own."
0:53:53 > 0:53:57This will is a very important part of the story,
0:53:57 > 0:53:59it's quite fascinating, in fact.
0:53:59 > 0:54:02It was done just after
0:54:02 > 0:54:06the law of 1831, which, for the first time,
0:54:06 > 0:54:11allows a white man to give money to his family,
0:54:11 > 0:54:14or any free person of colour.
0:54:14 > 0:54:16So the changing of the law meant
0:54:16 > 0:54:19that now he could acknowledge his children,
0:54:19 > 0:54:23and now he could acknowledge the woman that he loved.
0:54:23 > 0:54:25And leave her all of his possessions?
0:54:26 > 0:54:30And he was 95 years old.
0:54:30 > 0:54:37So it's a very lucky state of affairs that he lived to that age,
0:54:37 > 0:54:39to be able to do this for his family.
0:54:40 > 0:54:46So he wrote the will in September 1831, and when did he pass away?
0:54:46 > 0:54:48- The year after.- 1832, right.
0:54:48 > 0:54:51And what happened to Pauline Zoe after that?
0:54:51 > 0:54:54That is the second document.
0:54:54 > 0:54:58Dominique has a list of slave owners who received compensation from
0:54:58 > 0:55:02the French government when slavery was abolished in 1848.
0:55:04 > 0:55:09This is the compensation to slave owners for slaves.
0:55:11 > 0:55:13Hang on a second!
0:55:13 > 0:55:15SHE received the compensation...
0:55:16 > 0:55:20..for the liberation of the slaves that her partner owned,
0:55:20 > 0:55:26and that she, in effect, owned. Because she inherited the estates.
0:55:26 > 0:55:27That makes my head race.
0:55:29 > 0:55:32You know, here is this woman who was a slave to Francois Alexandre,
0:55:32 > 0:55:36they fell in love, they had children, who, at the time,
0:55:36 > 0:55:40were slaves. My great-great- great-grandfather was a slave.
0:55:40 > 0:55:43And then Francois Alexandre Sr passes away,
0:55:43 > 0:55:46and Pauline Zoe becomes slave owner, I mean, that's just...
0:55:49 > 0:55:54How common would it have been at that time for a freed female slave
0:55:54 > 0:55:57to become the owner of a plantation,
0:55:57 > 0:55:59or several plantations, and many slaves?
0:55:59 > 0:56:01It would be exceptional.
0:56:01 > 0:56:03Very rare.
0:56:20 > 0:56:24Before going home, Liz is visiting her granny's grave.
0:56:26 > 0:56:28I love this story.
0:56:28 > 0:56:34It makes me incredibly happy to have made this journey.
0:56:34 > 0:56:38Pauline Zoe must have been quite a tremendous woman
0:56:38 > 0:56:43to survive that roller coaster that must have been her life.
0:56:45 > 0:56:50To be a slave, to be freed, to bear children that were slaves,
0:56:50 > 0:56:53and then to become the owner of what she used to be.
0:56:53 > 0:56:55That must have been tough.
0:56:56 > 0:56:59I guess I won't really ever know
0:56:59 > 0:57:05what Francois Alexandre I's exact motivations were,
0:57:05 > 0:57:07but he loved who he wanted to love.
0:57:07 > 0:57:09And he lived the way he wanted to live.
0:57:09 > 0:57:12I don't think he seemed to care what anybody else thought.
0:57:12 > 0:57:16And I hope that some of that character has trickled down
0:57:16 > 0:57:18through the generations.