0:00:02 > 0:00:05My name is Jasmine Harman and I know first-hand
0:00:05 > 0:00:08how devastating a compulsive disorder can be.
0:00:08 > 0:00:12All through my life, I felt like my mum's stuff was more
0:00:12 > 0:00:17important than me. It was purely a compulsion that she couldn't control.
0:00:17 > 0:00:21I've helped Mum and people all over the country
0:00:21 > 0:00:23deal with their obsessive behaviour.
0:00:23 > 0:00:25- Get rid.- I'm really proud of you.
0:00:26 > 0:00:30Now I've become interested in another secretive condition.
0:00:30 > 0:00:33So you actually keep your living room locked?
0:00:33 > 0:00:35Compulsive shopping.
0:00:35 > 0:00:37I don't know why, but I can't stop myself.
0:00:37 > 0:00:39We all shop, of course.
0:00:39 > 0:00:42- Bargains!- I won it, yay!
0:00:42 > 0:00:45But some of us shop MUCH more than others.
0:00:45 > 0:00:49I think I've spent about £9,000 just on shoes.
0:00:49 > 0:00:52I will be out and all of a sudden I see a bargain.
0:00:52 > 0:00:55I forget really how much I'm spending.
0:00:55 > 0:00:59He just continues to buy and buy and buy things we don't really need.
0:01:00 > 0:01:04I explore what happens when shopping spirals out of control.
0:01:04 > 0:01:06It's really taken over my life.
0:01:06 > 0:01:08I don't like shopping but shopping likes me.
0:01:08 > 0:01:10I can't even trust myself.
0:01:10 > 0:01:13I discover the roots of the problem run deep.
0:01:13 > 0:01:18I haven't been in there since I put all the girls' clothes in.
0:01:19 > 0:01:22And the impact on shoppers and their families...
0:01:22 > 0:01:25I do feel pushed out, to be honest with you.
0:01:25 > 0:01:28..can be far greater than simply overspending.
0:01:28 > 0:01:31I don't want to have shopping taken away from me,
0:01:31 > 0:01:33that would be like my whole world come to an end.
0:01:41 > 0:01:43It's thought that as many as eight million
0:01:43 > 0:01:46people in the UK have a compulsive buying disorder.
0:01:48 > 0:01:50Shopping is my life, I live to shop.
0:01:53 > 0:01:56I'm not married yet and shopping is like my husband,
0:01:56 > 0:01:57like my companion.
0:01:59 > 0:02:02I've been told about 30-year-old Dipna,
0:02:02 > 0:02:04a self-confessed shopping addict.
0:02:06 > 0:02:07Have a lovely day, bye.
0:02:08 > 0:02:12Capable of spending thousands in a single transaction.
0:02:12 > 0:02:17I do feel as if it's out of my control. I might not want to buy,
0:02:17 > 0:02:18but I just buy it.
0:02:21 > 0:02:25She's filled a wall of wardrobes with designer jewellery,
0:02:25 > 0:02:28shoes, blazers and bags.
0:02:30 > 0:02:38This was 3,000, this was 1,600 and the wallet was about £700.
0:02:38 > 0:02:43I got credit cards, that's probably the worst thing I could have done.
0:02:43 > 0:02:46Despite living at home, earning £500 a week teaching
0:02:46 > 0:02:49and writing about cookery, and co-managing her dad's
0:02:49 > 0:02:53restaurant, Dipna is struggling to fund her habit.
0:02:53 > 0:02:56I'm in about £7,500 debt.
0:02:57 > 0:03:01These earrings are like £200 each, 220, 250.
0:03:01 > 0:03:06When I can't go shopping, it depresses me. I've cancelled
0:03:06 > 0:03:10work just so I can go shopping. I know that's not a good thing.
0:03:10 > 0:03:14I can't imagine there being absolutely no shopping.
0:03:14 > 0:03:17What else would I do if I didn't shop?
0:03:17 > 0:03:20What would I have to look forward to?
0:03:20 > 0:03:22Nothing. There'd be no life without shopping.
0:03:26 > 0:03:29I don't think I've ever met anybody before who sees shopping as
0:03:29 > 0:03:35their best friend or life partner. You can't have a relationship
0:03:35 > 0:03:39with shopping, it sounds silly even to say it out loud.
0:03:41 > 0:03:45But Dipna really feels that is the meaning to her life.
0:03:46 > 0:03:48The trouble is she's getting
0:03:48 > 0:03:51into debt, she feels depressed if she can't go shopping.
0:03:51 > 0:03:53Hi!
0:03:53 > 0:03:57To me, that sounds like quite a serious problem.
0:04:00 > 0:04:04Dipna already has more clothes than she could possibly wear,
0:04:04 > 0:04:06but I see no signs of her slowing down.
0:04:08 > 0:04:12- How much did you spend yesterday? - £1,500.
0:04:13 > 0:04:16I didn't want to, but I'm trying not to think about it.
0:04:19 > 0:04:22- That's quite a shopping spree.- Yeah.
0:04:24 > 0:04:27Most of the things she buys are pushed to the back of her cupboards
0:04:27 > 0:04:29and still have their labels on.
0:04:30 > 0:04:32There's quite a lot there you haven't used.
0:04:32 > 0:04:36Yeah, but when you go to the shop and you see it, it's just that
0:04:36 > 0:04:40moment where you think, "That's really nice, what the hell, just buy it."
0:04:40 > 0:04:41You're not in control,
0:04:41 > 0:04:45you're not really able to say, "No, I'm not buying it."
0:04:47 > 0:04:50No, I'm unable to do that.
0:04:50 > 0:04:51Who's in control?
0:04:52 > 0:04:54The little voice inside of me.
0:04:56 > 0:05:00£600. You look like you don't like them.
0:05:00 > 0:05:03They're not my cup of tea, is the honest truth,
0:05:03 > 0:05:06but then I'm not going to be wearing them.
0:05:06 > 0:05:08- How much?- £485.
0:05:12 > 0:05:14Yesterday I said to Mum, "Right, that's it now,
0:05:14 > 0:05:18"I'm going to start saving up because I want to buy a car."
0:05:18 > 0:05:19Have you already got a car?
0:05:19 > 0:05:23Yeah, but the car I have is the old Mercedes, there's a new one coming
0:05:23 > 0:05:27out in a few months, a new shape. So I've got my heart set on that.
0:05:28 > 0:05:31And it's really important to have the new shape?
0:05:31 > 0:05:35Yeah. I'll take it on lease and then if I'm paying that off every
0:05:35 > 0:05:40month, I know that pressure might stop me from shopping so much.
0:05:40 > 0:05:42Or just might get you in more debt.
0:05:44 > 0:05:48Does that ever cross your mind? You could stick with the old car
0:05:48 > 0:05:52and you could have the extra money every month to pay off your debt?
0:05:52 > 0:05:53But I wouldn't.
0:05:53 > 0:05:54You wouldn't? Why not?
0:05:54 > 0:05:59I'd probably just use that money to either shop more, or
0:05:59 > 0:06:00I'd go and get the car.
0:06:01 > 0:06:06So the way you look at it is that that money, you might as well use
0:06:06 > 0:06:10it on a new car, because otherwise you'll use it on shopping.
0:06:10 > 0:06:14Yeah, which makes sense.
0:06:14 > 0:06:15No, it doesn't!
0:06:16 > 0:06:19I'm looking at all of this. It's actually mind-boggling
0:06:19 > 0:06:23to think how much monies-worth of stuff you've got here.
0:06:25 > 0:06:32It's got to be hundreds of thousands of pounds' worth of stuff.
0:06:32 > 0:06:33Yeah, it's a lot of stuff.
0:06:35 > 0:06:41On first meeting Dipna, you could be forgiven for thinking she is
0:06:41 > 0:06:47spoilt, but actually, the honest truth, I think,
0:06:47 > 0:06:51is that she is not in control.
0:06:51 > 0:06:58I know, from my work with hoarders, that compulsive disorders govern
0:06:58 > 0:07:03the people that have them.
0:07:03 > 0:07:08And I think that Dipna could well be in that category.
0:07:13 > 0:07:17Not all shopping addicts get their fix from high-priced purchases.
0:07:22 > 0:07:25I'm on my way to meet a single mum, Ebony,
0:07:25 > 0:07:28whose eye for a bargain is out of control.
0:07:28 > 0:07:32They've still got their labels on them.
0:07:33 > 0:07:36I don't even remember half the wigs I have got, I have to say.
0:07:38 > 0:07:41Ebony lives in Surrey with her sons River and Chance.
0:07:41 > 0:07:44How comes you've got all that blonde in your hair?
0:07:44 > 0:07:49I dyed it ginger. I think it looks pretty swag, if you ask me.
0:07:49 > 0:07:52Oh, please, spare me! Shut up!
0:07:54 > 0:07:56Their mum doesn't spend a lot of money,
0:07:56 > 0:07:59but, boy, does she buy a lot of things!
0:08:01 > 0:08:06Whoa. Wow. How many pairs of shoes do you think you've got?
0:08:06 > 0:08:09Er...possibly 1,000 now.
0:08:09 > 0:08:121,000 pairs of shoes?!
0:08:12 > 0:08:14But have you worn all of them?
0:08:14 > 0:08:17They will be worn. They will be worn.
0:08:17 > 0:08:20I don't actually go out to buy shoes.
0:08:20 > 0:08:23I will be out and then, all of a sudden, I see a bargain.
0:08:23 > 0:08:27So are you saying that 1,000 pairs of shoes happened by accident?
0:08:27 > 0:08:30Totally. None of these shoes were planned.
0:08:30 > 0:08:32Does it not worry you?
0:08:32 > 0:08:35I don't spend more than £20,
0:08:35 > 0:08:40if anything, on any of these shoes. I'm saving.
0:08:40 > 0:08:43OK. Prime example, these boots down here,
0:08:43 > 0:08:46I got three pairs for a tenner.
0:08:46 > 0:08:49They were such a good bargain.
0:08:49 > 0:08:52I actually bought nine pairs of shoes.
0:08:52 > 0:08:53Nine pairs?
0:08:53 > 0:08:59I did. It was amazing, I can't even express how fantastic it felt
0:08:59 > 0:09:03that day, it's like an escape from your day's work, you know?
0:09:03 > 0:09:06And financially, you're OK with buying all of that stuff?
0:09:06 > 0:09:09Yeah, because eventually I pay off the debt.
0:09:09 > 0:09:11So do you buy on credit cards?
0:09:11 > 0:09:12I do.
0:09:12 > 0:09:14How much debt have you got?
0:09:14 > 0:09:16About six grand.
0:09:16 > 0:09:21- OK.- But if I paid the full price at £1,000,
0:09:21 > 0:09:24that would be ridiculous.
0:09:24 > 0:09:26It would be, but it's already ridiculous.
0:09:26 > 0:09:28As I said, I don't plan to go out shopping.
0:09:28 > 0:09:32- I don't like shopping, but shopping likes me!- I see.
0:09:33 > 0:09:37It says, "Come to me, come to me."
0:09:37 > 0:09:41- Secret storage compartment.- Totally.
0:09:41 > 0:09:45You are kidding me, are you actually joking?
0:09:45 > 0:09:47How do you find anything?
0:09:47 > 0:09:48Da-na!
0:09:49 > 0:09:52Just a couple of scarves and hats.
0:09:52 > 0:09:57It obviously makes you feel good, having all these things,
0:09:57 > 0:09:59to hug in your bed.
0:09:59 > 0:10:03- There you go, there's the missing void.- Yeah?
0:10:03 > 0:10:04They're replacing my man.
0:10:06 > 0:10:09I don't have one and I'm sure these will give me more joy.
0:10:14 > 0:10:18If I'm honest, I find Ebony a bit frustrating.
0:10:18 > 0:10:22It's hard to know when she's being serious or not. She doesn't
0:10:22 > 0:10:24see herself as a shopping addict
0:10:24 > 0:10:28because she doesn't even like shopping - shopping likes her.
0:10:29 > 0:10:31Ebony hides the problem from herself
0:10:31 > 0:10:34by cramming bargains into every nook and cranny,
0:10:34 > 0:10:38including a locked room I'm not yet allowed to look in.
0:10:43 > 0:10:46At least Ebony stops buying when the shops shut.
0:10:47 > 0:10:51Behind closed doors all over Britain, some compulsive
0:10:51 > 0:10:54shoppers feed their habit around the clock online.
0:10:56 > 0:10:59When I wake up in the morning, the first thing I think about
0:10:59 > 0:11:01is what I'm bidding on that day.
0:11:03 > 0:11:0756-year-old Dene is addicted to online auctions, spending more
0:11:07 > 0:11:10time with his computer than with his wife Karen.
0:11:10 > 0:11:13It's almost a full-time job for Dene. It could be eight hours a day.
0:11:13 > 0:11:16If something finishes at four in the morning, he'll stay up
0:11:16 > 0:11:18till four in the morning.
0:11:23 > 0:11:27In one day, I would buy probably 20 items, maybe more.
0:11:27 > 0:11:30Oh, God, there's another two cameras in here!
0:11:30 > 0:11:34It could be a new television, it could be a car.
0:11:34 > 0:11:37- There's another camera here. - Oh, another camera.
0:11:37 > 0:11:42Candyfloss makers, sunglasses, watches.
0:11:42 > 0:11:44- I'd forgotten I had those, Karen. - Did you?
0:11:44 > 0:11:4630, 40 coats.
0:11:46 > 0:11:49- That one? - That's brand-new, that one.
0:11:49 > 0:11:51Does he wear them?
0:11:51 > 0:11:54He does... No, not really.
0:11:54 > 0:11:58Some of these clothes are quite expensive. Goodness knows how
0:11:58 > 0:12:01much money I've spent on them, I wouldn't like to count up really.
0:12:01 > 0:12:06- All with tags on, never even been worn.- Not even been worn.
0:12:06 > 0:12:13I like to buy guitars, equipment, Hawaiian shirts, a caravan.
0:12:13 > 0:12:18In fact, he did bid on a boat, but fortunately we didn't win that,
0:12:18 > 0:12:20because we've nowhere to put it.
0:12:20 > 0:12:22He did have five cars at one time.
0:12:22 > 0:12:27He bought that safe. He didn't realise this was a toy.
0:12:27 > 0:12:32I thought I was buying a metal, big safe for a good price.
0:12:32 > 0:12:34He's not got a clue, have you, love?
0:12:36 > 0:12:41When I bid, I really get excited, it's the thrill of the win,
0:12:41 > 0:12:43it's like gambling in a way, I suppose.
0:12:43 > 0:12:45And if somebody was to outbid him
0:12:45 > 0:12:48by five, ten pounds, he'd be beside himself.
0:12:48 > 0:12:52- We could have bought a small house by now.- Yeah.- Couldn't we?
0:12:52 > 0:12:57It gets quite embarrassing, really. I feel embarrassed about it.
0:13:00 > 0:13:03Dene and Karen have been married for less than two years.
0:13:03 > 0:13:05Karen's under no illusion as to where
0:13:05 > 0:13:08she comes in relation to shopping.
0:13:08 > 0:13:11He spends an awful lot more time now than ever,
0:13:11 > 0:13:14and I do feel pushed out, to be honest with you,
0:13:14 > 0:13:18as if eBay gets more attention than I do.
0:13:19 > 0:13:21So, yeah, it has got out of control.
0:13:22 > 0:13:27I would prefer to shop than go to the pictures, or go to an event,
0:13:27 > 0:13:31it's taken over my life, it's really taken over my life,
0:13:31 > 0:13:33and I just think about it all the time.
0:13:36 > 0:13:39Dene squirrels away a lot of his buying in different storage
0:13:39 > 0:13:41locations across Yorkshire.
0:13:41 > 0:13:45But still, their home has become unbearable for wife Karen,
0:13:45 > 0:13:48prompting a drastic move to a bigger property in the same village.
0:13:51 > 0:13:54As you can see, we've just moved and these are all the boxes.
0:13:54 > 0:13:56I've come to find out more.
0:13:56 > 0:13:59Well, it's got to the stage where we couldn't have anybody over to
0:13:59 > 0:14:03stay, even the grandchildren, because you couldn't get to the bed.
0:14:03 > 0:14:06All the things I'd bought were on top of the bed,
0:14:06 > 0:14:09we had nowhere else to put them. We had to move, really.
0:14:09 > 0:14:13What, you couldn't just maybe get rid of some of the stuff?
0:14:13 > 0:14:18The postman had a satchel, then he went to a little trolley
0:14:18 > 0:14:21and then it got that bad he had a little van.
0:14:21 > 0:14:22Bringing all my parcels!
0:14:22 > 0:14:25Your solution is to keep putting things in storage
0:14:25 > 0:14:30and keep moving into a bigger house and a bigger house.
0:14:30 > 0:14:33Dene's already filled every cupboard in their new house,
0:14:33 > 0:14:36his purchases are spilling into the spare room.
0:14:37 > 0:14:39You've just got a few here.
0:14:39 > 0:14:43Oh! These are just brand-new, unused, never come out of the plastic.
0:14:43 > 0:14:47Never even took them out. Some children's watches.
0:14:47 > 0:14:49We've got an awful lot of sunglasses as well.
0:14:50 > 0:14:53I'm sure we've got a suitcase full of sunglasses.
0:14:53 > 0:14:55A suitcase full of sunglasses?!
0:14:55 > 0:14:57I'd imagine it's that one, I think.
0:14:57 > 0:14:59Dene, when you're buying a watch online,
0:14:59 > 0:15:01what's going through your mind?
0:15:01 > 0:15:02It's just a case of buying them.
0:15:02 > 0:15:05And do you have plans for them?
0:15:05 > 0:15:07To put them in this box.
0:15:07 > 0:15:10What happens is that you'll get things on eBay, so you'll
0:15:10 > 0:15:12leave it on your desk for a while, so I'll put it
0:15:12 > 0:15:15in a box, then he'll forget all about it.
0:15:15 > 0:15:17And that's how it starts to stack.
0:15:17 > 0:15:23I see, so for you, the excitement is actually that moment of purchase?
0:15:23 > 0:15:25- Yes.- Sometimes I see him bidding on something
0:15:25 > 0:15:28and I think, "Oh, God, that's just going to go in the spare room."
0:15:32 > 0:15:36What's inside this house is the tip of the iceberg, because he's
0:15:36 > 0:15:40got storage full of cheap, tacky,
0:15:40 > 0:15:43plastic junk, for want of a better word.
0:15:44 > 0:15:47- Sunglasses? - Oh, I forgot all about those.
0:15:47 > 0:15:48That Dene doesn't care about,
0:15:48 > 0:15:52he doesn't even know what's in those boxes,
0:15:52 > 0:15:56so it seems really pointless,
0:15:56 > 0:15:59but still he can't stop.
0:16:01 > 0:16:05Dene spends eight hours a day glued to online auctions, but I'm not
0:16:05 > 0:16:09sure he really knows how much money, as well as time, he is wasting.
0:16:10 > 0:16:15So show me some of the type of things you are looking at online at the moment.
0:16:15 > 0:16:18Right. At the moment, I've just bid on this one
0:16:18 > 0:16:20and I've won this for the kitchen.
0:16:20 > 0:16:24- There it is, we can look at the pictures now.- £51.
0:16:24 > 0:16:26Which I think I've got a bargain there.
0:16:26 > 0:16:31- So how do you feel, having just won that?- Fantastic.
0:16:31 > 0:16:33It's like scoring a goal at football, I suppose,
0:16:33 > 0:16:39it's that thing you get, that elation of winning the bid.
0:16:39 > 0:16:42How much do you reckon you spend each week?
0:16:42 > 0:16:46It goes in, er... I'm not sure, cos I don't really...
0:16:47 > 0:16:52The fact that you have absolutely no idea how much you've spent -
0:16:52 > 0:16:54not worrying to you at all?
0:16:54 > 0:16:56Um, I have an overdraft at the bank. So...
0:17:01 > 0:17:04Dene's oblivion to his spending is staggering.
0:17:04 > 0:17:07Hopefully, Karen can shed some real light on his finances.
0:17:10 > 0:17:12Do you know if Dene is in debt?
0:17:12 > 0:17:13- Yes.- He is?- Definitely.
0:17:13 > 0:17:16- Do you know how much?- Yes.
0:17:16 > 0:17:18Are you willing to share?
0:17:18 > 0:17:19I think it's 15,000.
0:17:19 > 0:17:23- Really?- Mm-hm.- Right.
0:17:26 > 0:17:29- That makes this situation a lot more serious.- It does.
0:17:33 > 0:17:37I really do worry that if Dene carries on the way he's been
0:17:37 > 0:17:44going, he's going to do irreparable damage to not only his finances,
0:17:44 > 0:17:48but also to his relationship,
0:17:48 > 0:17:52because it must be so hard for Karen to just
0:17:52 > 0:17:57have to put up with it, on a daily basis,
0:17:57 > 0:18:00when it's completely unnecessary.
0:18:04 > 0:18:08I really want to help all three of the compulsive shoppers I've met.
0:18:08 > 0:18:12So I've come to one of the few medical institutions in the UK
0:18:12 > 0:18:15that identifies the damage shopping addiction can cause.
0:18:16 > 0:18:20I'm hoping to find some answers from lead consultant for addiction,
0:18:20 > 0:18:22Dr Niall Campbell.
0:18:23 > 0:18:28I have seen lots of patients who have significant shopping problems
0:18:28 > 0:18:34and it's not recognised by the medical profession as a serious symptom.
0:18:35 > 0:18:38The harm that's done and the consequences are enormous,
0:18:38 > 0:18:41particularly the financial consequences,
0:18:41 > 0:18:44and then the amount of time they spend doing it instead of being
0:18:44 > 0:18:48with their family, interacting with other people, being with friends.
0:18:48 > 0:18:52I think it's a huge issue and we've got our head in the sand about it.
0:18:52 > 0:18:54With the people I've met, a lot of them don't really
0:18:54 > 0:19:00see their shopping as a problem, sometimes defining themselves by it,
0:19:00 > 0:19:03"That's just what I do," and there seems to be an element of denial.
0:19:03 > 0:19:06- Is that quite common? - It's massive.
0:19:06 > 0:19:10The key is recognition, like any other addiction,
0:19:10 > 0:19:12that there's something wrong.
0:19:12 > 0:19:15And if people actually acknowledge the fact,
0:19:15 > 0:19:18then they can reach some sort of solution.
0:19:18 > 0:19:22Could you liken compulsive shopping to drug addiction,
0:19:22 > 0:19:24alcoholism or gambling?
0:19:24 > 0:19:27We see a lot of similarities with those kind of addictions.
0:19:27 > 0:19:31When people buy things, they get a little bit of a rush
0:19:31 > 0:19:37and that's probably a bit of a dopamine rush, like people get when
0:19:37 > 0:19:40they score drugs, or when they put a bet on
0:19:40 > 0:19:42and people say, "Yeah, I felt a bit better,"
0:19:42 > 0:19:45brought it home, but then there's a big downward surge
0:19:45 > 0:19:52when they feel guilty about it, so there's a negative aspect to it.
0:19:52 > 0:19:56Which is why we often think of it as an addictive thing.
0:19:56 > 0:20:00Are there any practical steps or exercises that someone who is
0:20:00 > 0:20:03addicted to shopping can use?
0:20:03 > 0:20:09Well, compulsive shopping we see as a symptom of many conditions,
0:20:09 > 0:20:14so the therapy is aimed at what unhappiness from the past,
0:20:14 > 0:20:18what unhappiness currently about relationships or your situation,
0:20:18 > 0:20:21then trying to change that. It's about what's behind it.
0:20:26 > 0:20:29So this is where the rest of your stuff is hidden, is it?
0:20:29 > 0:20:34Yes, this is our storage space. I don't have enough room downstairs.
0:20:34 > 0:20:37My future husband better have a big house, that's all I'm saying.
0:20:37 > 0:20:40So where did your love of shopping begin?
0:20:40 > 0:20:43- I think I blame my mum and dad.- Why?
0:20:43 > 0:20:47Because as a child, they spoiled me.
0:20:47 > 0:20:50Whenever I used to go out with Mum, she always used to buy us something,
0:20:50 > 0:20:53and when Dad was with us, he'd always take us into the shop
0:20:53 > 0:20:56and say, "Right, guys, get what you want."
0:20:56 > 0:20:59Would you say you're addicted to shopping?
0:20:59 > 0:21:00Yes, for sure.
0:21:00 > 0:21:02What makes it an addiction?
0:21:02 > 0:21:04The fact that I can't stop, and I think
0:21:04 > 0:21:09if I did ever stop, or someone did try and stop me, I don't think
0:21:09 > 0:21:13I would be Dipna and I wouldn't be where I am today if I didn't.
0:21:13 > 0:21:15So you would lose your identity?
0:21:15 > 0:21:16Yeah, I think I would.
0:21:16 > 0:21:19Because there's a lot more to you, Dipna, than just shopping.
0:21:19 > 0:21:20- There is.- I think.
0:21:20 > 0:21:23Me, as a person, I love children and I think,
0:21:23 > 0:21:27if I ever had kids, which I will, I'm sure, in the future,
0:21:27 > 0:21:31I think that will make me forget shopping,
0:21:31 > 0:21:36because my love of kids is even more extreme than my shopping.
0:21:36 > 0:21:40- That makes me feel kind of sad.- Aww.
0:21:41 > 0:21:44I think she's lonely and I think the shopping is almost
0:21:44 > 0:21:50a replacement for having someone in her life to love and to cherish and
0:21:50 > 0:21:54so, instead, she loves and cherishes all these other material things.
0:22:00 > 0:22:03I've decided to pay Dipna's father, Gulu, a visit
0:22:03 > 0:22:07at his restaurant to see what he thinks of his daughter's shopping
0:22:07 > 0:22:09and her views about what might have started it.
0:22:13 > 0:22:17She told me a bit about her upbringing and she had pretty much
0:22:17 > 0:22:24had everything that she wanted. Do you think that has made her worse?
0:22:25 > 0:22:30Er...I would say I am to blame a little. When we got married,
0:22:30 > 0:22:37we were longing for a child, I'd been going to temples, to shrines,
0:22:37 > 0:22:41we waited nearly six years and our prayers were answered.
0:22:41 > 0:22:46That was the proudest moment and I wanted to get her anything
0:22:46 > 0:22:49she said, she was like a little princess, she still is.
0:22:51 > 0:22:56How does it then make you feel that Dipna says shopping is her
0:22:56 > 0:22:59partner and shopping is the biggest thing in her life?
0:22:59 > 0:23:03I think that is not a very serious problem. Drinking is
0:23:03 > 0:23:07a serious problem, or drugs is a serious problem, more than shopping.
0:23:08 > 0:23:13But if Dipna is addicted to shopping,
0:23:13 > 0:23:17could that not be just as dangerous, or as harmful
0:23:17 > 0:23:20and as limiting to her life as drinking or taking drugs?
0:23:21 > 0:23:26No, I don't think so. She's a free person, that's how I can put her...
0:23:26 > 0:23:30But is she, Gulu? Because Dipna has said to me that she
0:23:30 > 0:23:32would love to have children and that
0:23:32 > 0:23:34she thinks if she had children,
0:23:34 > 0:23:37she wouldn't need to be shopping so much because
0:23:37 > 0:23:41she would have something else to fill her time, but by spending
0:23:41 > 0:23:46so much of her time and her energies and her efforts and her money, of
0:23:46 > 0:23:52course, shopping, is she preventing herself from getting to that point?
0:23:52 > 0:23:56She's taking her time to getting the right person
0:23:56 > 0:24:03and, of course, I think once she gets married, she will then realise how
0:24:03 > 0:24:07she's got to maintain her lifestyle, things will change.
0:24:09 > 0:24:17I think, in a way, what she's doing is how she is,
0:24:17 > 0:24:19so I cannot change too much of that.
0:24:22 > 0:24:24Talking to Dipna's dad,
0:24:24 > 0:24:29so many little things kind of fall into place, but I don't think
0:24:29 > 0:24:33he really got the fact that the shopping could be getting
0:24:33 > 0:24:39in the way of Dipna living her life and moving forward with her future.
0:24:42 > 0:24:45It feels to me that because shopping is universal,
0:24:45 > 0:24:48something we all do, it's all too easy for compulsive shoppers
0:24:48 > 0:24:51and their families to bury their heads in the sand.
0:24:54 > 0:24:58I'm going to see Ebony today and I'd like to get to the
0:24:58 > 0:25:04bottom of what is going on, because it's all fun, it's all a game,
0:25:04 > 0:25:08but...I think that's a veneer.
0:25:13 > 0:25:17I'm hoping she'll let me see what she stores in her secret room
0:25:17 > 0:25:19and open up enough for me to understand
0:25:19 > 0:25:21why she's filling her house with so much stuff.
0:25:21 > 0:25:24- Hi.- Hi, how are you?
0:25:24 > 0:25:27I've actually got some really good bargains.
0:25:27 > 0:25:31- Have you?- Definitely. - What kind of things?
0:25:31 > 0:25:32Electric blankets.
0:25:32 > 0:25:35Electric blankets? How many did you get?
0:25:35 > 0:25:40Er, five. And a few other bits and pieces.
0:25:40 > 0:25:42Oh, go on, tell me. What else?
0:25:42 > 0:25:47I got two jackets, three clocks, a pair of shoes, but my feet
0:25:47 > 0:25:49were hurting me, so I had to go and buy a pair.
0:25:49 > 0:25:54I got this really nice bra and knicker set, a CD,
0:25:54 > 0:25:56three of those doughnuts, three croissants.
0:25:56 > 0:26:00Oh, and now I see why. You got three packets of each
0:26:00 > 0:26:01because they were reduced?
0:26:01 > 0:26:08Absolutely, but I only went out for tortillas and mayonnaise!
0:26:08 > 0:26:11What happens then, you go out to buy tortilla
0:26:11 > 0:26:15- and you come back with so much other stuff?- I don't know.
0:26:15 > 0:26:19I didn't even want to stop. But if I don't spoil myself,
0:26:19 > 0:26:22no-one's going to spoil me, so I might as well do it.
0:26:22 > 0:26:27So when you buy things for yourself, what are you doing there?
0:26:27 > 0:26:32Oh, what am I doing? I'm making myself feel happy for a little while.
0:26:32 > 0:26:35Why don't you show me where you're keeping your stuff?
0:26:35 > 0:26:37You seem like you really don't want to go.
0:26:37 > 0:26:40I really don't want to go into this room, because it's a complete mess.
0:26:42 > 0:26:43I really don't want to.
0:26:43 > 0:26:46- So you actually keep your living room locked?- Yeah.
0:26:54 > 0:26:57- OK.- OK, so you store quite a lot of stuff in here.
0:26:57 > 0:26:59I'm supposed to be decorating, or trying
0:26:59 > 0:27:01to find someone to help me decorate.
0:27:02 > 0:27:04You're planning to decorate.
0:27:04 > 0:27:06Well, I bought three sets of wallpaper.
0:27:06 > 0:27:09I'm not quite sure which to put where.
0:27:09 > 0:27:12You just bought three sets of wallpaper without knowing
0:27:12 > 0:27:13where they're going to go?
0:27:13 > 0:27:18- Yeah, but they were only £2.50 each. - OK.
0:27:18 > 0:27:24I just wonder if sometimes you get swept up with an idea
0:27:24 > 0:27:28and you buy all the stuff to go with it, like the wallpaper
0:27:28 > 0:27:31and the paint because it's on discount, and then
0:27:31 > 0:27:34whatever it is you're planning to do with it doesn't materialise.
0:27:34 > 0:27:35It's the wrong way round.
0:27:35 > 0:27:39I'll see the bargains, I'll buy the bargains and when I bring them
0:27:39 > 0:27:43here, I think, "What can I do with it?" Then I do something with it.
0:27:43 > 0:27:45- Right.- It's the other way round.
0:27:45 > 0:27:51- So it's completely driven by you seeing a bargain?- Yup.
0:27:51 > 0:27:54- And you think, "I've bought it now, I need to make use of it."- Yup.
0:27:54 > 0:27:55What about all this lot?
0:27:55 > 0:28:01- Some of my tools. See? Just as good as shoes.- Really?
0:28:01 > 0:28:06- Yeah, absolutely. This is new. - What is it?
0:28:07 > 0:28:09It's an angle grinder.
0:28:09 > 0:28:11Do you have much use for an angle grinder?
0:28:11 > 0:28:16Yup, I will be, be using it very soon.
0:28:16 > 0:28:19- I see more tool boxes.- More tools.
0:28:19 > 0:28:23It's just dawning on me the size of what you're dealing with
0:28:23 > 0:28:26on a day-to-day basis when you're going out and you're
0:28:26 > 0:28:31tempted to buy something, it's not just one type of thing.
0:28:31 > 0:28:33No. There's another toolbox down there.
0:28:33 > 0:28:38And does it matter if you use them or not, or if you need them or not?
0:28:38 > 0:28:41I always use tools, eventually.
0:28:45 > 0:28:48It's a really sad situation, actually. I was totally not
0:28:48 > 0:28:49prepared for that.
0:28:51 > 0:28:56I thought she was a girl who likes shoes, likes jackets, likes clothes,
0:28:56 > 0:29:01straightforward, but she's got these projects on the go,
0:29:01 > 0:29:04but they're not really ever getting started.
0:29:04 > 0:29:06What's in there, then?
0:29:06 > 0:29:08Some more tools.
0:29:10 > 0:29:12And now, seeing everything makes me
0:29:12 > 0:29:18realise this is much bigger than I realised in the beginning and
0:29:18 > 0:29:22definitely a much bigger issue than she realises herself at the moment.
0:29:30 > 0:29:34In Yorkshire, it's Dene's favourite time of the day.
0:29:34 > 0:29:37I've quite a lot coming today and it's big excitement.
0:29:38 > 0:29:43It's a buzz I get every morning, I'm here, I'm waiting for him.
0:29:43 > 0:29:45I never know what's coming.
0:29:46 > 0:29:48Karen sees things differently.
0:29:49 > 0:29:54I'm just thinking, "Oh, my God, how much, what is it, do we need it?"
0:29:54 > 0:29:56It upsets me, really, because it's a waste of money.
0:29:56 > 0:30:00It's money we could be doing something constructive with.
0:30:00 > 0:30:02Hi, there. Thank you.
0:30:06 > 0:30:13One, two, three, four, five, six,
0:30:13 > 0:30:15seven, eight, nine, ten today.
0:30:16 > 0:30:18It's like Christmas.
0:30:23 > 0:30:27It really worries me, to be honest with you. On a daily basis,
0:30:27 > 0:30:30I'm trying to find where to put things.
0:30:30 > 0:30:31It's exciting, isn't it?
0:30:33 > 0:30:35I can't get into this one.
0:30:35 > 0:30:37What's this, Boo, eh?
0:30:40 > 0:30:43- Oh, wow.- I want to see what else I've got, so you can take that.
0:30:43 > 0:30:45Are you bored with this now?
0:30:45 > 0:30:48Just a little bit, we'll see what's in this one now.
0:30:48 > 0:30:50I'll put that over there.
0:30:50 > 0:30:56It's the bidding and the winning and then opening the parcels.
0:30:56 > 0:31:00They are like presents to him, I think, that's how he looks at them.
0:31:00 > 0:31:02But it is just that thrill.
0:31:02 > 0:31:05Hawaiian shirts are something I do buy and I do collect them,
0:31:05 > 0:31:08like my watches and guitars and things.
0:31:08 > 0:31:12That is actually essential, that, because everything has to match.
0:31:15 > 0:31:18I don't think that will even fit Dene.
0:31:18 > 0:31:22That's out of Dene's mind now, today's purchases,
0:31:22 > 0:31:23he's on tomorrow's.
0:31:24 > 0:31:27It's gone up, I've still been outbid.
0:31:27 > 0:31:31So I'm going up to £15.09 now.
0:31:31 > 0:31:35He just continues to just buy and buy and buy and I'd
0:31:35 > 0:31:37say 75% of the items we receive,
0:31:37 > 0:31:41we don't really need, want or require.
0:31:41 > 0:31:44I'm the high bidder. I'm winning the bid, yay!
0:31:47 > 0:31:49Dene's on his fourth marriage.
0:31:51 > 0:31:53I really want him to spend more time with Karen
0:31:53 > 0:31:56and rediscover the world outside of online auctions.
0:31:59 > 0:32:02I'm asking him to try something he has NEVER done before -
0:32:02 > 0:32:05go cold turkey.
0:32:05 > 0:32:07- Delete eBay.- OK.
0:32:07 > 0:32:09Gone. There you go.
0:32:09 > 0:32:13Feels like I've lost my hand. I bet you're surprised I've done that.
0:32:13 > 0:32:17- I'm really surprised you've actually done it.- I bet you are.
0:32:17 > 0:32:20Think of all the time you'll have to yourself now.
0:32:20 > 0:32:22And more time for you as well.
0:32:22 > 0:32:24That'll be nice.
0:32:24 > 0:32:28Dene's agreed to try and stay off the auction site for three weeks.
0:32:28 > 0:32:31I think the hardest part of not going online is
0:32:31 > 0:32:34I do it, it's just automatic for me. We could be sat
0:32:34 > 0:32:39watching TV, but I'm always on there looking at what's happening. That's
0:32:39 > 0:32:41going to be the hardest part, not having it there at the side of me.
0:32:43 > 0:32:47Dene will be starving himself of a habit he's fed eight hours a day,
0:32:47 > 0:32:50day in and day out, for years.
0:32:52 > 0:32:56It's like a little break this, isn't it? Just getting out.
0:32:56 > 0:33:00We need to make more time to do something like this, because
0:33:00 > 0:33:03a cup of coffee and a sandwich is nowhere near as much as you'd
0:33:03 > 0:33:05- spend on the internet.- Yeah.
0:33:07 > 0:33:11To help Dene, I've suggested he uses some of the time freed up from
0:33:11 > 0:33:14shopping to get rid of the stuff he's stored in friend's garages and
0:33:14 > 0:33:19warehouses all over Yorkshire by selling it at a car boot.
0:33:19 > 0:33:23I actually bought this from eBay to try and learn the keyboard.
0:33:23 > 0:33:26It had all the things on there, all the different notes,
0:33:26 > 0:33:31something I bought on a whim really and I think I played it once.
0:33:31 > 0:33:34A lot of it is just a load of rubbish really, isn't it?
0:33:35 > 0:33:38By facing up to the things he's buried in boxes,
0:33:38 > 0:33:42I hope to open Dene's eyes to what's truly important.
0:33:43 > 0:33:45These bring back some memories, look.
0:33:46 > 0:33:49Amongst piles of discarded purchases,
0:33:49 > 0:33:53Dene stores memorabilia from his past life as an '80s pop star.
0:33:55 > 0:33:57That's me with Black Lace, there.
0:33:57 > 0:34:00It just means so much, when you look back on your life,
0:34:00 > 0:34:02what you've achieved and done.
0:34:04 > 0:34:09I'm upset that they've just been put into a box and closed up
0:34:09 > 0:34:11and put away in storage.
0:34:12 > 0:34:15The other things are immaterial really, they mean nothing,
0:34:15 > 0:34:19but when you open that up and you find what used to be...
0:34:19 > 0:34:21Brought a tear to my eye, that did.
0:34:23 > 0:34:25I know you shouldn't always live on your past,
0:34:25 > 0:34:31but it is, it's just lovely memories of my life.
0:34:33 > 0:34:37As Dene's popstar-dom waned, online shopping filled the gap.
0:34:37 > 0:34:41It's seductive stuff and easy to see how without it,
0:34:41 > 0:34:42his life feels empty.
0:34:44 > 0:34:47Another day, this is getting harder and harder not to go on.
0:34:47 > 0:34:50To be honest, I had a sneaky look on yesterday,
0:34:50 > 0:34:54but I did manage not to buy anything.
0:34:59 > 0:35:01In West London, I want to see
0:35:01 > 0:35:04if Dipna might be up for a similar challenge.
0:35:06 > 0:35:09Not just to stop shopping, but to think about why she shops
0:35:09 > 0:35:11and how else she might spend her time.
0:35:13 > 0:35:15Say three weeks?
0:35:15 > 0:35:16Three weeks?
0:35:16 > 0:35:19Yeah, cos I think that will be enough time to, you know, it'd be
0:35:19 > 0:35:23a challenge, but it would be enough time to see how it affects you.
0:35:23 > 0:35:31Three weeks is a very long time, that's...that's unrealistic.
0:35:31 > 0:35:32Two weeks I could still...
0:35:32 > 0:35:35Two weeks, you think you can do?
0:35:35 > 0:35:36Yeah.
0:35:36 > 0:35:40And how will you go about avoiding the temptation to shop?
0:35:40 > 0:35:42I'll have to find something to do.
0:35:42 > 0:35:46Yes! Exactly! That's exactly what you will have to do.
0:35:46 > 0:35:48Go on a couple of dates.
0:35:50 > 0:35:53Hmm, doesn't sound as exciting as shopping,
0:35:53 > 0:35:55but I could always try!
0:35:57 > 0:36:00Dipna may be laughing now, but as I leave her to it,
0:36:00 > 0:36:02I know it's not going to be easy.
0:36:02 > 0:36:05Today, my first proper day,
0:36:05 > 0:36:10I really need to buy something and it's getting me quite down
0:36:10 > 0:36:13and, I don't know, making me a bit depressed I guess.
0:36:13 > 0:36:17Right now it just feels like I haven't been shopping for ages
0:36:17 > 0:36:20and it's actually starting to piss me off.
0:36:23 > 0:36:25It's making me pretty grumpy.
0:36:29 > 0:36:3120 miles away in Weybridge,
0:36:31 > 0:36:35I've suggested a slightly different strategy for Ebony.
0:36:38 > 0:36:42From kitchen blenders, to garden tools,
0:36:42 > 0:36:46Ebony gets her buzz from bargains, going out for one thing
0:36:46 > 0:36:49and returning with multiples of anything on offer.
0:36:49 > 0:36:52I bought three of these teddy bears
0:36:52 > 0:36:55and I bought four of these little mini ones.
0:36:55 > 0:36:59But she's cluttering up her house and her life with stuff
0:36:59 > 0:37:02she doesn't need and can barely afford.
0:37:02 > 0:37:06So I've asked her to write a shopping list and stick to it.
0:37:07 > 0:37:10OK, everything that I need from one shop.
0:37:10 > 0:37:13I have to visualise the shops, so dog food...
0:37:14 > 0:37:16But despite best intentions...
0:37:16 > 0:37:18Right, just one second.
0:37:18 > 0:37:21..it seems she soon falls back into old ways.
0:37:22 > 0:37:25Let me show you what I bought.
0:37:25 > 0:37:27£9 tin
0:37:27 > 0:37:30and what did Ebony find it for?
0:37:30 > 0:37:34Do-do, 50p!
0:37:34 > 0:37:36And yes, I did buy more than one.
0:37:36 > 0:37:39Do-do-do!
0:37:39 > 0:37:4150p!
0:37:41 > 0:37:46I'm sorry but there is just no way I am going to walk past them.
0:37:48 > 0:37:51When I caught up with Ebony two weeks later,
0:37:51 > 0:37:55I quickly realised she'd fallen off the wagon big time.
0:37:55 > 0:37:58- That's new.- Really?- Yeah.
0:37:58 > 0:38:0340 inch flatscreen TVs and tablets don't come cheap.
0:38:03 > 0:38:05I bought a couple of those.
0:38:05 > 0:38:09I urgently needed a filing cabinet.
0:38:09 > 0:38:12- Right, you got two of these? - So I ended up with two of these.
0:38:12 > 0:38:14- And one of these?- Yep.
0:38:14 > 0:38:17- So that's new as well.- This is new.
0:38:20 > 0:38:23I'm not sure the shopping list idea helped at all.
0:38:24 > 0:38:29So, Ebony, given everything you've just shown me,
0:38:29 > 0:38:32all the shopping you have done, have you got a shopping problem?
0:38:33 > 0:38:35Oh, my God, that's a hard question.
0:38:35 > 0:38:37I'm only looking for a one-word answer.
0:38:38 > 0:38:40- I don't think I have.- No.
0:38:40 > 0:38:42And even with all the discussions
0:38:42 > 0:38:45and being aware of everything you're buying,
0:38:45 > 0:38:49all of that hasn't altered the way you look at your shopping?
0:38:50 > 0:38:52Not really.
0:38:52 > 0:38:55No, that's what I'm saying, I'm still doing the same shopping.
0:38:55 > 0:38:57I'm not not doing the shopping,
0:38:57 > 0:38:59it hasn't got me to the stage where I'm so guilty
0:38:59 > 0:39:01that I'm actually stopping.
0:39:01 > 0:39:05The whole point of having a shopping list is not to make you feel guilty
0:39:05 > 0:39:07if you buy something that's off the list,
0:39:07 > 0:39:12it's just to see whether if you yourself can remain focused
0:39:12 > 0:39:16- and aware...- Yeah.- ..of what you are going out to buy
0:39:16 > 0:39:20and how easy it is for you to get led astray
0:39:20 > 0:39:25and come back having spent £200 on a new TV.
0:39:25 > 0:39:28It's not about going and spending, you know, a couple of quid
0:39:28 > 0:39:30on stain remover for the kid's shirts.
0:39:30 > 0:39:32No, you see, I think you are wrong
0:39:32 > 0:39:36because at the end of the day if the whole exercise was that
0:39:36 > 0:39:38I chose to stick to the list
0:39:38 > 0:39:40then it doesn't matter whether it's a spray or a TV.
0:39:40 > 0:39:43No, but you've just proved that you find it really difficult
0:39:43 > 0:39:45to stick to the list,
0:39:45 > 0:39:47whether it's a spray or whether it's a TV or it's whatever.
0:39:47 > 0:39:52No, I've done it, I've gone out with the list. Does it give me a buzz? No.
0:39:52 > 0:39:54Cos I've gone in there, I've got what I have to do
0:39:54 > 0:39:58and then I have to go to work then I have to come back, do all the...
0:39:58 > 0:40:00So there's nothing exciting in my life.
0:40:00 > 0:40:03I'm not going out partying, I haven't got a partner.
0:40:03 > 0:40:06Please tell me, where is my little bit of escape?
0:40:06 > 0:40:11OK, so was that shopping list exercise pointless in your opinion?
0:40:13 > 0:40:15Yeah, a little bit.
0:40:15 > 0:40:18You could say if Ebony doesn't have a problem with her shopping,
0:40:18 > 0:40:20who am I to argue?
0:40:20 > 0:40:24But it's not just Ebony that her compulsive shopping affects.
0:40:24 > 0:40:26- Knock-knock, guys.- You all right?
0:40:26 > 0:40:29- How's it going?- Not too bad, yourself?- Can I sit down?- Yeah.
0:40:29 > 0:40:32So tell me,
0:40:32 > 0:40:34what do you two think about your mum's shopping?
0:40:35 > 0:40:38It's ridiculous. Way too much.
0:40:38 > 0:40:41- She shops so much. - What do you think, River?
0:40:41 > 0:40:44Yeah, it's just like crazy, she always like just goes out
0:40:44 > 0:40:46and buys random stuff that she never uses.
0:40:46 > 0:40:48You just know she doesn't have the money for it
0:40:48 > 0:40:51and if she's not going to use it, what's the point in buying it?
0:40:51 > 0:40:54It's weird not being able to go to certain places in my own house
0:40:54 > 0:40:56because there's too many stuff in there.
0:40:56 > 0:40:58What would change if you were able
0:40:58 > 0:41:03to get the living room sorted and cleared?
0:41:03 > 0:41:05Just the fact that we would have an actual house
0:41:05 > 0:41:08instead of a giant storage facility.
0:41:09 > 0:41:12I'm determined not to give up on Ebony.
0:41:16 > 0:41:19It's three weeks since I asked Dene to go cold turkey
0:41:19 > 0:41:21from his beloved online auctions.
0:41:23 > 0:41:26I've been thinking about Dene quite a lot since I last saw him
0:41:26 > 0:41:31and, you know, it seems really sad,
0:41:31 > 0:41:34that, you know, he did so many things
0:41:34 > 0:41:38and had all this fame and fortune
0:41:38 > 0:41:45and now he's a person who would rather stay in and shop online,
0:41:45 > 0:41:52rather than go out with friends or with his wife and socialise,
0:41:52 > 0:41:58and that sort of turnaround, it really puts things into perspective.
0:42:02 > 0:42:04So how have you been since I last saw you?
0:42:04 > 0:42:06- I've kept my promise.- Have you?
0:42:06 > 0:42:09Yes, I have, although I've had a look,
0:42:09 > 0:42:12had a sneaky look at something,
0:42:12 > 0:42:16- at a Rolls-Royce that I was looking at.- Are you being serious?
0:42:16 > 0:42:19But I didn't get it because Karen said you can't have one
0:42:19 > 0:42:20so I didn't bid or anything.
0:42:20 > 0:42:23But I used to have a Rolls-Royce many years ago
0:42:23 > 0:42:28when I lived in Spain but I can't afford one any more so that's gone.
0:42:28 > 0:42:30It feels like a lot of your shopping
0:42:30 > 0:42:33is because of memories from the past.
0:42:33 > 0:42:35Yeah, how I used to live.
0:42:37 > 0:42:39Dene's made another big step.
0:42:39 > 0:42:42Not only has he not bought anything new,
0:42:42 > 0:42:45he's getting rid of much of the stuff he already has.
0:42:45 > 0:42:47Some clothes there.
0:42:47 > 0:42:51I'm wondering what Karen makes of the new Dene.
0:42:51 > 0:42:53What's he been like the last three weeks
0:42:53 > 0:42:55when he's not going on buying shopping?
0:42:55 > 0:42:59- He's been a little bit like a lost boy.- Really?- Yeah.
0:42:59 > 0:43:03And after you'd been here last time,
0:43:03 > 0:43:07there were still parcels being delivered ten days later.
0:43:07 > 0:43:10And it was things he'd forgotten that he'd ordered.
0:43:10 > 0:43:12But he's lost interest,
0:43:12 > 0:43:15he doesn't even go to the letter box for the letters now.
0:43:15 > 0:43:19We've eaten out a lot, so that's been nice.
0:43:19 > 0:43:20We've had more time.
0:43:20 > 0:43:25I think he's secretly realised that he's got a problem going on here
0:43:25 > 0:43:28and it's opened his eyes quite a lot.
0:43:35 > 0:43:37Oh, wow.
0:43:37 > 0:43:39Gosh, so much, isn't it?
0:43:39 > 0:43:42I'm just sorting everything out, what we're going to keep
0:43:42 > 0:43:44and what we're going to take to the car boot.
0:43:44 > 0:43:47OK, so they're all memories, scrapbooks and things
0:43:47 > 0:43:50so I'll keep those.
0:43:50 > 0:43:53Dene, international cabaret star.
0:43:55 > 0:43:57That's when I used to do the cruise ships.
0:43:57 > 0:44:01So you must miss that life of making records and...
0:44:01 > 0:44:06Yeah, I miss being on there and in the limelight, if you like.
0:44:06 > 0:44:08I think it's one thing to save things
0:44:08 > 0:44:10but it's another thing entirely
0:44:10 > 0:44:14- being dependent on...- Yeah. - ..bidding on something
0:44:14 > 0:44:19and winning it for that little rush of happiness that it gives you and
0:44:19 > 0:44:26when you get huge success or you get recognised in the street
0:44:26 > 0:44:28or you've got fans coming after you,
0:44:28 > 0:44:31- that must give you that same little buzz.- Oh, it does, yeah.
0:44:31 > 0:44:34- But it must be on a much larger scale.- Yeah.
0:44:34 > 0:44:38You know when you win the bid, is it like a round of applause?
0:44:38 > 0:44:42I suppose it is really, it's like getting that round of applause.
0:44:42 > 0:44:44I think that's probably what it is, that little bit of a...
0:44:44 > 0:44:47That might be what it is, why I do that then.
0:44:47 > 0:44:49When you say it in that way, yeah.
0:44:49 > 0:44:51Yeah.
0:44:51 > 0:44:55And what's to stop you going back to this in the future?
0:44:55 > 0:44:57- I don't think I will. - But why don't you think you will?
0:44:57 > 0:45:00- I just don't think I will, do you think I will now?- Yeah.
0:45:00 > 0:45:03Do you, really? I mean...
0:45:03 > 0:45:07I think it'll just slowly get back.
0:45:07 > 0:45:09Well, I don't think so, I think I can do it.
0:45:09 > 0:45:11And I've realised now.
0:45:12 > 0:45:16I really hope Dene can prove Karen wrong for her sake
0:45:16 > 0:45:18just as much as his.
0:45:22 > 0:45:25In West London, after two weeks without shopping,
0:45:25 > 0:45:28Dipna's lost no time returning to old habits.
0:45:28 > 0:45:32Whatever happens with her shopping, no matter how much she shops,
0:45:32 > 0:45:34she's always going to have a roof over her head,
0:45:34 > 0:45:37there'll be food on the table,
0:45:37 > 0:45:39she's going to have a car to drive
0:45:39 > 0:45:43so really she feels there's nothing to lose,
0:45:43 > 0:45:45whereas when I look at it,
0:45:45 > 0:45:51I see that what she's sacrificing for shopping is actually a future.
0:45:52 > 0:45:56It's having the life that she really wants.
0:45:58 > 0:46:01The perfectionist in Dipna rose to the challenge
0:46:01 > 0:46:04but she clearly didn't enjoy it.
0:46:04 > 0:46:08- I was a bit depressed on some days. - Were you?- Yeah, I was a bit down.
0:46:08 > 0:46:12When I was busy, I was still myself and I was still happy.
0:46:12 > 0:46:16There were just times when I was moody and a little bit depressed
0:46:16 > 0:46:20and I think those times especially when I was left alone,
0:46:20 > 0:46:23when I came home from work and no-one was here.
0:46:23 > 0:46:25Think about what you just said.
0:46:25 > 0:46:28It was when you came home, there was nobody here
0:46:28 > 0:46:29and you were on your own.
0:46:29 > 0:46:34Do you not think that maybe that comes from loneliness?
0:46:34 > 0:46:37You know, you're 30 years old and you live at home which is fine
0:46:37 > 0:46:40but you've said that you'd like to get married,
0:46:40 > 0:46:42you'd like to have a home of your own.
0:46:42 > 0:46:45Is the shopping not just standing in the way
0:46:45 > 0:46:48of you doing those things that you want to do?
0:46:48 > 0:46:53No, I don't think so because even tomorrow if I did get married,
0:46:53 > 0:46:57I don't think I would stop shopping completely.
0:46:57 > 0:47:00It would still be a part of me because it's something I love to do
0:47:00 > 0:47:03but I would never let shopping kind of stand in the way.
0:47:06 > 0:47:10When I meet Mum, I realise Dipna's shopping covers up
0:47:10 > 0:47:12a much bigger fear than of being single.
0:47:12 > 0:47:16Do you think, Shushmer, that Dipna will find it hard to adapt
0:47:16 > 0:47:18to not being with you?
0:47:18 > 0:47:20I can say that with hand on my heart
0:47:20 > 0:47:23that she'll find it difficult, more than the shopping...
0:47:23 > 0:47:25- Yeah, for sure.- ..leaving me.
0:47:25 > 0:47:27I mean, leaving the house.
0:47:27 > 0:47:31That's what's stopping her from getting married, I think.
0:47:31 > 0:47:33- Are you OK?- Yeah.
0:47:34 > 0:47:35Does it upset you?
0:47:38 > 0:47:44It's almost nicer to just stay here with Mum and Dad
0:47:44 > 0:47:50and not have to really grow up and pay bills and get married
0:47:50 > 0:47:52and leave the security of home.
0:47:52 > 0:47:54If I could...
0:47:56 > 0:47:58I would give up shopping tomorrow
0:47:58 > 0:48:01so long as I could stay with Mum and Dad forever.
0:48:03 > 0:48:07It's really interesting because it seems like your main problem
0:48:07 > 0:48:11is not shopping, it just comes out in shopping
0:48:11 > 0:48:17but actually the underlying thing that's going on is that
0:48:17 > 0:48:19you don't want to leave home.
0:48:19 > 0:48:24I can't even think about the day when I have to leave home,
0:48:24 > 0:48:27I just can't think of it without getting upset.
0:48:30 > 0:48:33- But she has to go one day. - And it's hard, isn't it?
0:48:37 > 0:48:39It's that lovely safe bubble.
0:48:39 > 0:48:43Yeah, where I feel safest and most secure.
0:48:44 > 0:48:49To begin with, I really thought that her shopping was holding her back
0:48:49 > 0:48:53and preventing her from moving on with her life.
0:48:53 > 0:48:59If the day comes when Dipna feels ready to leave home and get married
0:48:59 > 0:49:02and have a family of her own and at that point,
0:49:02 > 0:49:03maybe her shopping will subside
0:49:03 > 0:49:08because she won't rely on it so much, she won't need it any more.
0:49:08 > 0:49:10But I think until that day comes,
0:49:10 > 0:49:14Dipna will keep shopping because she's clinging on to her childhood.
0:49:20 > 0:49:24While Dipna seems desperate to keep hold of what's familiar,
0:49:24 > 0:49:27Ebony wants nothing more than to escape her everyday life.
0:49:30 > 0:49:35Today, I'm here to help Ebony do some clearing.
0:49:35 > 0:49:38She's overwhelmed by all the different projects that need doing,
0:49:38 > 0:49:43by the decorating, by the clutter, by the garden
0:49:43 > 0:49:47and so she goes out and when she goes out, she ends up shopping
0:49:47 > 0:49:50and bringing more stuff back to the house
0:49:50 > 0:49:53and I think that for a lot of people,
0:49:53 > 0:49:58and Ebony being one of them, the state of your home quite often
0:49:58 > 0:50:02reflects the state of your mind and so I think clearing the decks
0:50:02 > 0:50:08and making some space, will be also really important mentally for her.
0:50:10 > 0:50:14I've persuaded Ebony to recycle some of her clutter,
0:50:14 > 0:50:17including some of the many things she's bought and never used.
0:50:19 > 0:50:23- We've got our work cut out for us today, haven't we?- Yes, we do.
0:50:23 > 0:50:26Are you looking forward to this?
0:50:26 > 0:50:28Yeah, I'm too happy. I'm trying to hold it down!
0:50:28 > 0:50:31Don't hold it down.
0:50:31 > 0:50:32What do you want to start with?
0:50:32 > 0:50:35I don't know, let's just go for it.
0:50:35 > 0:50:37Let's just throw it all away!
0:50:39 > 0:50:42First piece to go, yes!
0:50:46 > 0:50:48- Sorry.- Happy?
0:50:48 > 0:50:51I'm just so happy right now, I can't stop laughing.
0:50:51 > 0:50:54See, boys, doesn't this feel much better?
0:50:54 > 0:50:56Is it nice to have the kids helping?
0:50:56 > 0:51:00Yeah, but you know they're only willing because you're here.
0:51:00 > 0:51:03- Are you serious?- I swear.
0:51:04 > 0:51:07Chance, is it true your mum said that if I wasn't here,
0:51:07 > 0:51:10- you wouldn't be helping?- Yeah.
0:51:11 > 0:51:12Told ya.
0:51:14 > 0:51:16- Why wouldn't you help? - Do I get paid for this, Mum?
0:51:16 > 0:51:18No, you don't get paid for it.
0:51:20 > 0:51:23Wow.
0:51:23 > 0:51:25I think we might need another skip.
0:51:25 > 0:51:27I know and we haven't even gone to the shed yet.
0:51:27 > 0:51:29We haven't even touched the shed,
0:51:29 > 0:51:32we've hardly even scratched the surface of the garden.
0:51:32 > 0:51:36Ebony has put off clearing her shed for several years.
0:51:36 > 0:51:38I know I've got quite a few baby stuff in there.
0:51:38 > 0:51:41How long have they been in there, since they were babies?
0:51:41 > 0:51:45No, it wasn't for them, you know, cos I miscarried a couple of them.
0:51:45 > 0:51:47You know I started getting the stuff,
0:51:47 > 0:51:50cos you get all excited once three months is up.
0:51:50 > 0:51:53This is quite a few years back now, couple of years back
0:51:53 > 0:51:58so I haven't been in there since I put all the girls' clothes in.
0:51:58 > 0:52:00I've just bunged them at the back there.
0:52:00 > 0:52:03I know there's a cot in there and baby walkers
0:52:03 > 0:52:06and so there's a lot of baby stuff in there so...
0:52:06 > 0:52:08It's got to go.
0:52:09 > 0:52:14I didn't realise that Ebony had had a miscarriage
0:52:14 > 0:52:18so going through the shed where she's kept all the baby stuff
0:52:18 > 0:52:20is going to be really hard as well
0:52:20 > 0:52:24and so it's kind of understandable that she's put it off.
0:52:24 > 0:52:28And actually going shopping is one way of filling her time
0:52:28 > 0:52:30and just avoiding doing all these things
0:52:30 > 0:52:32that are a bit overwhelming.
0:52:32 > 0:52:33A, to do it on your own
0:52:33 > 0:52:37and B, to go back and relive those painful memories.
0:52:39 > 0:52:43Right, let's get the cot out. At least let's get the cot out.
0:52:54 > 0:52:59I actually can't get over it that you are able to just carry on.
0:52:59 > 0:53:03- What can I do?- No, I know, it's amazing.
0:53:04 > 0:53:06- OK.- Just carry on.
0:53:08 > 0:53:11- Aw. You still all right?- Yeah.
0:53:13 > 0:53:18I can't do it, I thought I'd be able to just, you know, just...
0:53:18 > 0:53:20But I think I'm going to have to keep that one.
0:53:21 > 0:53:26- You, my darling...- Stop it.- ..you have got an absolute heart of gold
0:53:26 > 0:53:30and you're keeping everything going for everybody else.
0:53:30 > 0:53:32You should be really proud of yourself.
0:53:41 > 0:53:45I hope Ebony can see the positives of what she's achieved today.
0:53:51 > 0:53:53That is nuts, isn't it?
0:53:53 > 0:53:55Oh, my gosh.
0:53:55 > 0:53:58That's like a big brick has been taken off my shoulder.
0:53:58 > 0:54:01- It's really liberating, isn't it? - Yeah, it is.
0:54:01 > 0:54:03Not to have that stuff hanging around your neck.
0:54:03 > 0:54:05Yeah, just throw it.
0:54:05 > 0:54:09But when you look at it, do you also partly think, "What a waste,
0:54:09 > 0:54:11"because that is all stuff that I have bought."
0:54:11 > 0:54:14Yeah, it is a waste but...
0:54:14 > 0:54:17I'm not in a rush to do it again, so...
0:54:17 > 0:54:20- Are you not?- No.- It's been a really good exercise in that way.
0:54:20 > 0:54:23THIS has been a good exercise,
0:54:23 > 0:54:24I don't know about the shopping list
0:54:24 > 0:54:29but this is definitely a good exercise.
0:54:29 > 0:54:35Have you also learnt that there are much greater pleasures in life
0:54:35 > 0:54:37than the buzz of going shopping?
0:54:37 > 0:54:39Of course. Of course there is.
0:54:39 > 0:54:42So today totally beats the buzz of shopping?
0:54:42 > 0:54:44Totally.
0:54:45 > 0:54:47Absolutely 100%.
0:54:50 > 0:54:53One day can't change a lifetime of habits
0:54:53 > 0:54:57but one day can inspire somebody.
0:54:57 > 0:54:58You know for Ebony,
0:54:58 > 0:55:03today, this has been way better than any shopping trip.
0:55:04 > 0:55:06I'm not sure she'll ever resist the lure
0:55:06 > 0:55:10of a spur of the moment bargain altogether,
0:55:10 > 0:55:13but at least she knows there are bigger buzzes out there.
0:55:15 > 0:55:18I'm keen to know if it's the same for Dene in Yorkshire,
0:55:18 > 0:55:20whether four weeks after I last saw him,
0:55:20 > 0:55:23he's been able to confound Karen's doubts
0:55:23 > 0:55:25and stay clear of online auctions.
0:55:26 > 0:55:29I'm very careful what I buy.
0:55:29 > 0:55:33I mean I've not bought anything off, from eBay since we spoke last.
0:55:33 > 0:55:35- That's progress.- Yes, it is, yeah.
0:55:35 > 0:55:38When we first met, you were quite reluctant
0:55:38 > 0:55:40- to even go out and socialise...- I was.
0:55:40 > 0:55:45- ..because you had bids that were finishing...- And I was watching.
0:55:45 > 0:55:51- Yeah.- So how has stopping online shopping changed your life?
0:55:51 > 0:55:54I think it's brought Karen and I closer together,
0:55:54 > 0:55:58- I think we spend a lot more time together.- Time you wouldn't have had.
0:55:58 > 0:56:00- That's right.- If you'd have been shopping.
0:56:00 > 0:56:02- Cos I would have been shopping on there.- What did Karen say?
0:56:02 > 0:56:04She said it's better now,
0:56:04 > 0:56:06your computer and everything else is in there
0:56:06 > 0:56:10and we sit in there without any interruptions,
0:56:10 > 0:56:12that we can communicate more together
0:56:12 > 0:56:17and I can honestly say that I'm not addicted any more, which is great.
0:56:17 > 0:56:22- Amazing.- Yeah, I'm in a different place now.
0:56:22 > 0:56:25I'm really proud of Dene and really happy for Karen.
0:56:28 > 0:56:31I've learnt that for compulsive shoppers,
0:56:31 > 0:56:36a disorder that masquerades as a harmless pastime can, in reality,
0:56:36 > 0:56:38be addictive and dangerous.
0:56:38 > 0:56:41Used to combat underlying unhappiness,
0:56:41 > 0:56:43it ends up contributing to it.
0:56:45 > 0:56:49What I've realised is that when people who shop compulsively
0:56:49 > 0:56:52acknowledge that they've got a problem
0:56:52 > 0:56:57and begin to understand the reasons why they shop,
0:56:57 > 0:56:59then there is hope
0:56:59 > 0:57:02and with the right help, they can reclaim their lives.