0:00:00 > 0:00:02Rhys and I made the agreement
0:00:02 > 0:00:0714 years ago, should I ever get a book published about myself
0:00:07 > 0:00:13and should he ever become an actor, should they ever make a film about the book, could he play me?
0:00:13 > 0:00:14And I said yes.
0:00:14 > 0:00:16This programme contains very strong language.
0:00:19 > 0:00:22# Bad, bad, bad, bad behaviour
0:00:22 > 0:00:25# Bad, bad, bad, bad, behaviour
0:00:25 > 0:00:29# Bad, bad, bad, bad behaviour
0:00:29 > 0:00:32# Bad, bad, bad, bad behaviour
0:00:32 > 0:00:35# Bad behaviour
0:00:35 > 0:00:38# Was my saviour
0:00:38 > 0:00:41# Making mischief
0:00:41 > 0:00:45# Used to make my day
0:00:45 > 0:00:48# Subsequently
0:00:48 > 0:00:51# Accidentally
0:00:51 > 0:00:55# I put my fist
0:00:55 > 0:00:58# Through a window pane... #
0:01:02 > 0:01:04When he was released from prison,
0:01:04 > 0:01:08I met him at a Super Furry Animals gig in Pontypridd.
0:01:09 > 0:01:11Howard left prison in '95
0:01:11 > 0:01:14and hit the Cwl Cymru phenomenon bang on.
0:01:17 > 0:01:20When I first met the Super Furry Animals,
0:01:20 > 0:01:23they were bringing out their first album
0:01:23 > 0:01:28and had used pictures of my false passport as their album cover.
0:01:28 > 0:01:32So their record company, Creation, had to get my permission.
0:01:32 > 0:01:37So I listened to the album and liked it and particularly loved the track they wrote about me
0:01:37 > 0:01:41and I went to see them play in Pontypridd
0:01:41 > 0:01:44and they brought along a friend of theirs called Rhys.
0:01:47 > 0:01:51- Remember the first time I met you? - You were just out of nick.
0:01:51 > 0:01:54- Yeah, a matter of months.- Yeah.
0:01:54 > 0:01:58I forget which one of them introduced me to you. Probably Daf.
0:01:58 > 0:02:01You come up with a packet of fag papers.
0:02:02 > 0:02:06I had a packet of Rizlas on me and I asked him to sign a Rizla.
0:02:07 > 0:02:11I was like, "Yeah, sure," picked it up and signed it
0:02:11 > 0:02:14and gave it back to him. He said, "No, I meant every one."
0:02:14 > 0:02:19At that moment I thought, "I'm going to get on with this guy."
0:02:19 > 0:02:22You could totally see where the bond would come from
0:02:22 > 0:02:26cos they're very similar people, separated by a generation.
0:02:26 > 0:02:30I hadn't published... My book hadn't been published.
0:02:30 > 0:02:35- You hadn't done very much... - Anything!- ..known acting.
0:02:35 > 0:02:40And at some point, "All right, if the book does come out
0:02:40 > 0:02:44"and if I do become an actor and they do make a film about it,
0:02:44 > 0:02:48- "is it all right I play you?" We shook hands.- Yeah.
0:02:49 > 0:02:54- And, Rhys, today is the fulfilment. - Yeah.- This is why we did it!
0:02:54 > 0:02:57I fucking love a full circle, don't you?
0:02:59 > 0:03:01It is extraordinary, what happened.
0:03:03 > 0:03:04Hit it.
0:03:05 > 0:03:07Set, action.
0:03:07 > 0:03:09Action, action!
0:03:13 > 0:03:17In Howard Marks, we have a kind of anti-hero, a loveable rogue,
0:03:17 > 0:03:21an incredibly intelligent cerebral character as well.
0:03:21 > 0:03:23And yet, someone who was very naughty.
0:03:35 > 0:03:40'This was the house I was born in, in a place called Kenfig Hill.'
0:03:40 > 0:03:42I spent all my life here till I was 19.
0:03:43 > 0:03:45'All I knew was this small village.'
0:03:48 > 0:03:51Occasionally took jaunts to Cardiff, or Swansea, or Bridgend,
0:03:51 > 0:03:57Port Talbot, but most of my time was spent in the village,
0:03:57 > 0:04:00sitting around, reading encyclopaedias.
0:04:01 > 0:04:07'What brought us as a family to Kenfig Hill were the coal mines.'
0:04:08 > 0:04:13All my family, except my father, every male was a coal miner.
0:04:13 > 0:04:16But then the mines started closing down
0:04:16 > 0:04:21and the steelworks sort of replaced the mines
0:04:21 > 0:04:26as the main local employer in this part of the world.
0:04:27 > 0:04:31So it's the beginning, I suppose, of the steelworks.
0:04:32 > 0:04:34My father worked here
0:04:34 > 0:04:39and his job was to supervise the big ships bringing in,
0:04:40 > 0:04:43usually, iron ore from foreign countries
0:04:43 > 0:04:47to put in those blast furnaces you can just see there.
0:04:47 > 0:04:52That was his position after he left the sea, he was a captain,
0:04:52 > 0:04:57this was his shore job that he took for the rest of his working life.
0:05:00 > 0:05:06My mother, in particular, was a frustrated academic.
0:05:06 > 0:05:12She did well at school but there simply wasn't the money to afford her to go to university.
0:05:12 > 0:05:15She was qualified to. And she became a teacher.
0:05:15 > 0:05:18And always was an avid reader.
0:05:18 > 0:05:22And always encouraged me to read and study.
0:05:22 > 0:05:27My father was away a lot in my early life. He was still at sea.
0:05:27 > 0:05:32And when he came back, he sort of reinforced that encouragement.
0:05:32 > 0:05:37He read a lot too, so it was a pretty bookish house.
0:05:39 > 0:05:44You know, I was embarrassed to do well in examinations, kind of thing.
0:05:45 > 0:05:49I was in danger of being labelled a swot and things.
0:05:49 > 0:05:53I compensated for that by being extremely mischievous.
0:05:54 > 0:05:58With my mother, particularly, there was a lot of, erm...
0:05:58 > 0:06:03persuasion, I suppose, and influence to read Welsh writers
0:06:03 > 0:06:05or ones who were thought highly of within Wales.
0:06:05 > 0:06:12But Dylan Thomas... He was almost too much of a rebel to be part of literature then.
0:06:12 > 0:06:16I mean, he drunk and he smoked and everything.
0:06:16 > 0:06:20And there was this belief that writers didn't do that around here.
0:06:20 > 0:06:26I started reading things like On The Road by Kerouac.
0:06:26 > 0:06:29I started reading those sorts of things as a teenager.
0:06:29 > 0:06:35But as a child, I read quite a lot of Welsh writers.
0:06:39 > 0:06:42We are quite an uptight nation.
0:06:42 > 0:06:45We come from generations of chapel-goers
0:06:45 > 0:06:50and we're fairly forelock tugging, mind the neighbours, that sort of thing,
0:06:50 > 0:06:55and yet, we do throw out occasionally real rebels,
0:06:55 > 0:06:58people who we can live vicariously through.
0:07:01 > 0:07:04We've got Dylan Thomas and the 18 straight whiskies,
0:07:04 > 0:07:07we've got Burton and his legendary capacity for alcohol.
0:07:07 > 0:07:09Naughty, lovable rogues.
0:07:09 > 0:07:14I witnessed Burton's rendition of Thomas's poetry
0:07:14 > 0:07:18and particularly his Under Milk Wood.
0:07:18 > 0:07:22Definitely brought Thomas to a wider audience.
0:07:22 > 0:07:28His interpretation of Thomas was a very important thing in getting Dylan Thomas known,
0:07:28 > 0:07:32as was the respect accorded him by the early Beat poets,
0:07:32 > 0:07:37like Ginsberg, Ferlinghetti, that lot.
0:07:37 > 0:07:42Thomas very soon became a hero, so that eventually filtered down into here.
0:07:44 > 0:07:47It made Welsh people think they were part of it, at least,
0:07:47 > 0:07:52that one of their homeboys, if you like, had become such a hero
0:07:52 > 0:07:57to those who really were, I suppose, pioneering an alternative culture,
0:07:59 > 0:08:04you know, so much as early hippy days could be sort of...
0:08:04 > 0:08:07placed as having its origins there, really.
0:08:07 > 0:08:11I think as far as the rebel personality heavy drinking,
0:08:11 > 0:08:17heavy smoking lifestyle is concerned, that certainly seems to have carried on!
0:08:17 > 0:08:21He's part of this lineage of hellraisers,
0:08:21 > 0:08:25people who've lived hard, played hard, captured our imaginations,
0:08:25 > 0:08:28very seductive characters, very charming characters,
0:08:28 > 0:08:31and people that we're slightly obsessed with.
0:08:59 > 0:09:04I remember the sort of letter coming that stated that I'd been admitted to Oxford.
0:09:04 > 0:09:06I remember that moment very well.
0:09:06 > 0:09:09I'd never expected to get in.
0:09:09 > 0:09:13It wasn't my reality. It was just one more hurdle and I'd be there.
0:09:13 > 0:09:16I just thought it was completely impossible.
0:09:16 > 0:09:22So it was a massive surprise and the rest of the village, I suppose, were proud
0:09:22 > 0:09:24that someone had got in to Oxford.
0:09:24 > 0:09:29It was almost as if I'd scored a try for Wales, or something like that.
0:09:29 > 0:09:32It was this sort of heroic status.
0:09:32 > 0:09:36He was a working class kid from the Welsh Valleys
0:09:36 > 0:09:39in the sort of heart of the British establishment.
0:09:43 > 0:09:44You're in Room 111.
0:09:46 > 0:09:48Close the door.
0:09:48 > 0:09:51I hated the place. No-one could understand me,
0:09:51 > 0:09:54my accent was completely incomprehensible.
0:09:54 > 0:09:57I assumed none of the birds would fancy me.
0:09:57 > 0:10:02I didn't like the boozers. I... I was most unhappy and homesick here.
0:10:03 > 0:10:08I'd put it as my most difficult challenge in life, socially,
0:10:08 > 0:10:10to get on with people here
0:10:10 > 0:10:15and the first place I took drugs.
0:10:16 > 0:10:18Now, that memory is a fond one!
0:10:18 > 0:10:21It changed my life completely.
0:10:22 > 0:10:27It changed him from being an outsider to being at the centre of the party.
0:10:27 > 0:10:31Because I took drugs here
0:10:31 > 0:10:35and was very enthusiastic about taking more,
0:10:35 > 0:10:40I made my room available to anyone who had drugs, basically,
0:10:40 > 0:10:43because I didn't have any myself and didn't have any money.
0:10:43 > 0:10:47So my room became a scene, if you like,
0:10:47 > 0:10:51the place where everyone could go and there'd be drugs and women there.
0:10:51 > 0:10:56But the motivations were simply to get drugs!
0:10:59 > 0:11:03The moment when it exploded in the late '60s
0:11:03 > 0:11:06and it felt like it was part of cultural revolution.
0:11:06 > 0:11:10He realised, because he was a very intelligent guy,
0:11:10 > 0:11:13there was an enormous untapped market here.
0:11:14 > 0:11:19- Very impressive!- I wish I had more to sell. I got rid of it all in days.
0:11:19 > 0:11:24I don't think Howard ever cared about changing the world. He saw it as a business opportunity.
0:11:24 > 0:11:26He wanted the excitement.
0:11:26 > 0:11:29In the papers, they call people who sell drugs 'pushers',
0:11:29 > 0:11:32like you've got to try really hard to get rid of it!
0:11:32 > 0:11:35It doesn't really work like that.
0:11:35 > 0:11:41This is a guy who, from a pretty ordinary background, went to Balliol College, a really cerebral figure,
0:11:41 > 0:11:48great intellectual gifts, and in many ways poured all that talent into the wrong avenue.
0:11:49 > 0:11:54There are a few, you know, who thoroughly disapprove of my CV,
0:11:54 > 0:12:01but most of them sort of think. "Well, you know, at least he put the place on the map."
0:12:11 > 0:12:15'I never realised I had any sort of talent whatsoever to write prose.'
0:12:16 > 0:12:21So I didn't have any early ambitions to be a writer whatsoever.
0:12:21 > 0:12:27When I got out of prison, my release was accompanied by a lot of publicity.
0:12:29 > 0:12:34And a lot of literary agents and publishers were keen to contact me
0:12:34 > 0:12:40and they had the idea, so I just went for the one who offered the most money.
0:12:41 > 0:12:44I thought of using a ghost-writer
0:12:44 > 0:12:49because of the idea of lying back, smoking joints, talking about things
0:12:49 > 0:12:52while someone else wrote it was quite appealing,
0:12:52 > 0:12:55but I felt he wouldn't get it right
0:12:55 > 0:13:00and he would have cost 40% of it, so that's half the money blown there!
0:13:01 > 0:13:07So I wrote a sample chapter which the publishers were happy with and wrote it all myself.
0:13:08 > 0:13:11Research, if you're doing an autobiography, is fairly...
0:13:11 > 0:13:15It's much easier than researching someone else's life.
0:13:15 > 0:13:21There's no attempt to make a plot or anything like that,
0:13:21 > 0:13:24the whole things is sort of sketched out for you.
0:13:24 > 0:13:28In my case, there was an awful lot of material available, press cuttings
0:13:28 > 0:13:32and law enforcement reports, you know.
0:13:32 > 0:13:38Boxes and boxes full of where I have to be at a certain date and time.
0:13:38 > 0:13:41I couldn't remember, but they saw me there.
0:13:43 > 0:13:47It was a best-selling hardback and that surprised me.
0:13:47 > 0:13:51It sort of became a huge seller once it got into paperback,
0:13:51 > 0:13:53that certainly astonished me.
0:13:53 > 0:13:58My friend Luke Roeg got interested in it and said he would pay for a screenplay.
0:13:58 > 0:14:02I met with Howard and, you know, discussions began.
0:14:03 > 0:14:07He had written an extensive and interesting treatment for the film
0:14:07 > 0:14:11and at that point, it had reached a stage where it was going no further.
0:14:11 > 0:14:16That introduced me to the book, which I read and thought, "This is fantastic"
0:14:16 > 0:14:20and beyond that, you get into the culture that is Howard marks.
0:14:22 > 0:14:26The whole casting thing is funny. When I was initially involved,
0:14:26 > 0:14:31there were some quite well-known movie stars who'd expressed interest in playing this part.
0:14:31 > 0:14:37When the conversation, you know, got round to the various star castings
0:14:37 > 0:14:42being bandied about, I said, "What about Rhys?"
0:14:44 > 0:14:49He seemed so obvious to me that he should play him.
0:14:49 > 0:14:53I had no idea that Rhys and Howard had this history that they have.
0:14:55 > 0:15:02So when I first met Howard, I said, "There's only one person who can play this and that's Rhys Ifans."
0:15:02 > 0:15:04I think you should be played by a Welshman.
0:15:04 > 0:15:09I've always thought Rhys Ifans was born completely out of time.
0:15:09 > 0:15:15He would have been brilliant hanging out with Richard Harris, Richard Burton, Peter O'Toole.
0:15:15 > 0:15:19In Howard Marks, he's obviously found his spiritual father.
0:15:19 > 0:15:23Absolutely the perfect person to play Howard Marks.
0:15:23 > 0:15:27There was never anybody else even vaguely approached.
0:15:27 > 0:15:32Given his passion for the role and the character, what was there to doubt?
0:15:32 > 0:15:38I asked Rhys if he wanted to do it before I wrote the screenplay so I kind of wrote it for him.
0:15:38 > 0:15:41It was never shown to anybody else.
0:15:51 > 0:15:53Thank you.
0:15:55 > 0:15:59As soon as I opened my mouth and did Howard there,
0:15:59 > 0:16:03that was the flag, you know, in the moon.
0:16:03 > 0:16:09"This is it now. I'm going to be this guy for the next ten weeks."
0:16:09 > 0:16:14Like I said, are there any plain clothed policemen in here tonight?
0:16:14 > 0:16:17It was very strange in a good way.
0:16:17 > 0:16:22Howard was there, Howard did his show, and then we did a Q&A after.
0:16:22 > 0:16:25Rhys, are you coming on?
0:16:25 > 0:16:27APPLAUSE
0:16:38 > 0:16:42I kind of needed permission from Howard to continue
0:16:42 > 0:16:45and he gave me permission that night.
0:16:47 > 0:16:49We didn't have to discuss it.
0:16:49 > 0:16:54He knows me so well that he's very familiar with the way I walk through the world.
0:16:54 > 0:16:57He didn't need to study me at all.
0:16:57 > 0:17:00Of course, he did read the book over again
0:17:00 > 0:17:04and watched DVDs, for example, of my performances,
0:17:04 > 0:17:07but he didn't really need to study me as a character.
0:17:07 > 0:17:09It wasn't a challenge.
0:17:09 > 0:17:14It wasn't a pressure of having to study Howard or observe Howard,
0:17:14 > 0:17:16I just know Howard.
0:17:19 > 0:17:21And I adore him.
0:17:21 > 0:17:26I've known Howard long enough for the process of osmosis
0:17:26 > 0:17:30to take its milky, kindly toll.
0:17:31 > 0:17:37We've been faithful to the book so there's nothing we're doing to his work, life or character
0:17:37 > 0:17:40that he's not endorsed in one way or another.
0:17:41 > 0:17:45There are really two themes in the film that run in parallel.
0:17:45 > 0:17:48One is the history of recreational drugs
0:17:48 > 0:17:52and the second story, which runs in parallel,
0:17:52 > 0:17:55is a history of addiction, really.
0:17:55 > 0:18:02The affects that taking a lot of drugs have on Howard and the people immediately around him.
0:18:02 > 0:18:06"In Britain, the US, Spain and other countries spanning three continents,
0:18:06 > 0:18:10"the men who wage war against the drug traffickers
0:18:10 > 0:18:13"have been celebrating the success of Operation Lynx.
0:18:13 > 0:18:18"After more than two years, it's culminated in a series of arrests
0:18:18 > 0:18:22"and the smashing of one of the world's biggest drugs rings.
0:18:22 > 0:18:26"A ring allegedly masterminded by a Briton. Dennis Marks, aged 43.
0:18:26 > 0:18:32"This afternoon he, his wife and another British citizen appeared in court in Palma, Majorca."
0:18:32 > 0:18:36I wonder about his attitude to the consequences to his actions.
0:18:36 > 0:18:42There are parts of his life story where he describes what he's done
0:18:42 > 0:18:44but he doesn't really analyse it.
0:18:44 > 0:18:48You're left to think, actually, there is collateral damage.
0:18:48 > 0:18:52I think Howard was and is an adrenaline junkie.
0:18:52 > 0:18:55It becomes the high.
0:18:55 > 0:18:57The question for me was, why didn't he stop?
0:18:57 > 0:19:00- Howard, why don't you stop? - Stop what?- Just stop.
0:19:00 > 0:19:03I'm feeding my family.
0:19:03 > 0:19:05I'm scared they're going to bust you.
0:19:05 > 0:19:09I realise why he didn't stop. Because it was exciting.
0:19:09 > 0:19:12They're not going to bust me. They're not.
0:19:12 > 0:19:14Don't be scared.
0:19:14 > 0:19:17He had opportunities to stop and he didn't.
0:19:17 > 0:19:21The consequences were disastrous for him and his family.
0:19:21 > 0:19:27Judy was so young and she got wrapped up in the lifestyle and glamour of it
0:19:27 > 0:19:32and her sister and brother and family members were involved with him
0:19:32 > 0:19:34and went to prison for it.
0:19:34 > 0:19:37Everybody in her family was affected by it.
0:19:37 > 0:19:43The impact on his family must have been huge. Does he really face up to the consequences of his actions?
0:19:43 > 0:19:47Does he really know what the impact of his actions are?
0:19:47 > 0:19:52One of my favourite scenes is the courtroom at the end, the final courtroom.
0:19:52 > 0:19:55I impose the following sentence.
0:19:55 > 0:19:58The contrast between the British and American courtroom.
0:19:58 > 0:20:02In a British courtroom, Howard is doing his theatre
0:20:02 > 0:20:06and making these strange people in wigs dance to his tune.
0:20:06 > 0:20:10Your Honour, there's something I can't reveal in open court.
0:20:10 > 0:20:16He gets to the American courtroom and he comes up with this bullshit and they just say, "We don't care."
0:20:16 > 0:20:20As to count one of the indictment, for a term of ten years.
0:20:20 > 0:20:27As to count two of the indictment, a term of 15 years.
0:20:27 > 0:20:34I think it's a really unpleasant moment that happens where reality suddenly seeps in.
0:20:34 > 0:20:37Sentences to run consecutively
0:20:37 > 0:20:41for a total of 25 years.
0:20:41 > 0:20:43Case is dismissed.
0:20:44 > 0:20:48One thing that comes across in the book is his belief
0:20:48 > 0:20:54that there aren't any victims to the crimes he commits and that he's not a violent man
0:20:54 > 0:20:58and yet he is fraternising with somebody from the IRA.
0:20:58 > 0:21:02The boys have put a bomb on the next flight to Shannon.
0:21:02 > 0:21:04You have twenty minutes.
0:21:04 > 0:21:10My favourite bit in the film is the whole thing with the walkie-talkies.
0:21:10 > 0:21:12I just love that bit.
0:21:12 > 0:21:18- The Keystone Cops of drug dealing. - Yes!- They're my favourite bits too.
0:21:20 > 0:21:23Oi!
0:21:24 > 0:21:26Pull up the aerial, you prick!
0:21:27 > 0:21:29Hello?
0:21:29 > 0:21:32What are you fucking doing? Come here!
0:21:32 > 0:21:36- Press the button.- Jim? Jim?
0:21:36 > 0:21:39I've got an order.
0:21:39 > 0:21:41I've got...
0:21:41 > 0:21:43Come in. Jim?
0:21:43 > 0:21:48It was hard to say to what extent Rhys is like me, but he's doing that very well.
0:21:48 > 0:21:52- I can hear you the other end of the field.- You fucking idiot!
0:21:52 > 0:21:56David Thewlis does a fantastic job of playing McCann.
0:21:56 > 0:22:00- Piece of fucking shite! - It's not even on, Jim.
0:22:00 > 0:22:04So it's just these two characters, one of which is me,
0:22:04 > 0:22:09and the other, who's probably the strongest character I've met,
0:22:09 > 0:22:15doing completely insane activities in our beloved Ireland.
0:22:15 > 0:22:18Jim McCann is very prominent in the book Mr Nice.
0:22:18 > 0:22:22He's Howard Marks' IRA contact.
0:22:22 > 0:22:27Well, what I was looking for, or like-minded friends of mine were looking for,
0:22:27 > 0:22:32was an entry port into Britain.
0:22:32 > 0:22:37I can get any amount of merchandise into the air from Karachi Airport.
0:22:37 > 0:22:41The problem is how to get it onto the ground.
0:22:41 > 0:22:48He used Jim McCann to bring in hashish from Afghanistan into Ireland
0:22:48 > 0:22:53under the pretext of bringing arms so that McCann could tell the people at the airports
0:22:53 > 0:22:57that they were bringing in arms for the cause, for the IRA.
0:22:57 > 0:23:03We had connections out east to send it so we needed connections...
0:23:03 > 0:23:07in an airport somewhere, in Britain we thought at first,
0:23:07 > 0:23:10to bring dope into the country.
0:23:10 > 0:23:15We couldn't, but we became aware, er...
0:23:15 > 0:23:19that the IRA could bring guns into the country.
0:23:19 > 0:23:23So, in a bit of stoned hippy thinking,
0:23:23 > 0:23:28we thought it might be better all round if we brought in dope.
0:23:28 > 0:23:32- How soon can you send the nordle? - What the fuck's nordle?
0:23:32 > 0:23:36Wise up. You have to use codes. Codes and false names.
0:23:36 > 0:23:39- Nordle is hashish.- Nordle.
0:23:40 > 0:23:42Right.
0:23:42 > 0:23:47They first meet in Ireland, through a mutual contact,
0:23:47 > 0:23:53um, they're introduced. Howard doesn't know who he's going to meet
0:23:53 > 0:23:59and meets a far more volatile character than he was expecting, than anyone he's dealt with before
0:23:59 > 0:24:03and who really endangers him through his volatililty.
0:24:03 > 0:24:06Gus. This is Howard.
0:24:06 > 0:24:10- Hello, Gus.- Aye.
0:24:13 > 0:24:17That was Gus. He's a member of the Belfast Brigade's assassination squad.
0:24:17 > 0:24:22I wanted him to know your face, so no fucking games. You understand me?
0:24:22 > 0:24:27Jim McCann did what he was doing in this film. It's a true story.
0:24:27 > 0:24:30It's a brilliant plan, Jim. When can we start?
0:24:30 > 0:24:35Now. Got it all together, bring in as much as you want.
0:24:35 > 0:24:39There is almost a sense of the innocent abroad, who's drinking in all these experiences.
0:24:39 > 0:24:43And yet you get to the stage where he is this incredible drug baron,
0:24:43 > 0:24:50you think, this stage, "For all your kind of cuteness and charm and sweetness and humour,
0:24:50 > 0:24:54"you must be pretty ruthless to do all this on such a scale."
0:24:54 > 0:24:59And that, for me, is the great paradox of Howard Marks
0:24:59 > 0:25:06because you just think, he is this incredible character, he is so seductive...
0:25:06 > 0:25:11and yet when you analyse what he's actually done... how can those two personas meet?
0:25:13 > 0:25:15< What's your biggest regret?
0:25:17 > 0:25:19AUDIENCE LAUGHS
0:25:23 > 0:25:25Um...
0:25:25 > 0:25:30I don't think I'm going to regret doing this film cos, um...
0:25:30 > 0:25:33you know, I'm playing a living legend.
0:25:33 > 0:25:39He's more than just imitating me, he's putting the whole of himself into the whole of me.
0:25:39 > 0:25:44What comes out is him playing me, not him trying to imitate me.
0:25:44 > 0:25:50You can sustain an imitation for five minutes and it may be convincing,
0:25:50 > 0:25:52but I had to...
0:25:52 > 0:25:57put myself in the situations he was in
0:25:57 > 0:26:00and respond accordingly.
0:26:00 > 0:26:04He came on set quite a bit and when he was sitting there,
0:26:04 > 0:26:09I'd go up to him and say, "How does it look to you? Is it anything like it was?"
0:26:09 > 0:26:15And Howard would always say, "Oh, yes, it's exactly how it was. Exactly."
0:26:15 > 0:26:19And this happened a few times and, after a while, I realised and said,
0:26:19 > 0:26:24"Howard, you just don't remember any of it, do you?" And he went, "No, no. Not a thing."
0:26:24 > 0:26:30It's a bit like dreaming. Sort of when you wake up, how things have flashed in front of you.
0:26:30 > 0:26:34It's a bit like that all the time. It's extraordinary.
0:26:36 > 0:26:40When we first saw each other on set and I was Howard,
0:26:40 > 0:26:44his reaction was, er...hysteria.
0:26:44 > 0:26:50He just pissed himself laughing and just found the whole thing amusing.
0:26:50 > 0:26:54- Trying to take the piss?- No, I've a huge respect for Customs' officers.
0:26:54 > 0:27:01I always knew Howard as the fun guy and the brave man
0:27:01 > 0:27:07who left prison with humility and not a lot of apparent anger.
0:27:07 > 0:27:08Daddy!
0:27:10 > 0:27:16I wanted to hug him after the film. Hold him tight and...look after him.
0:27:16 > 0:27:22We'd become very close before but, as a family now, I feel very close to them all.
0:27:22 > 0:27:24'It's very strange.'
0:27:24 > 0:27:25Thank you very, very much.
0:27:25 > 0:27:29AUDIENCE CHEERS AND APPLAUDS
0:27:29 > 0:27:34'I know him better now, having played him, I think,
0:27:34 > 0:27:37and, um, I like him even more.
0:27:53 > 0:27:58Howard is nice. He's Mr Nice. He's not a difficult person to have around ever.
0:27:58 > 0:28:04That's absolutely the quintessence of his charm,
0:28:04 > 0:28:07that he's comfortable wherever you put him.
0:28:07 > 0:28:12For those God-fearing, law-abiding, slightly repressed Welsh people...
0:28:12 > 0:28:18Howard Marks is just... so off the beaten track,
0:28:18 > 0:28:20just so...different.
0:28:22 > 0:28:27He's a bit of danger in all our lives that we can taste vicariously.
0:28:27 > 0:28:30But wouldn't want to be him.