0:00:05 > 0:00:09For most of us, Dame Judi Dench is M.
0:00:09 > 0:00:11For God's sake!
0:00:11 > 0:00:13Just get out of the way!
0:00:13 > 0:00:16- Don't you recognise the car? - Madam...
0:00:16 > 0:00:17EXPLOSION
0:00:21 > 0:00:23She transformed the role,
0:00:23 > 0:00:26and helped bring James Bond into the 21st century.
0:00:28 > 0:00:34A lifetime of experience allowed her to create a very modern,
0:00:34 > 0:00:36and very human, M.
0:00:36 > 0:00:39Judi has balls, M has balls.
0:00:39 > 0:00:41And she knows how to use them.
0:00:41 > 0:00:43HE LAUGHS
0:00:43 > 0:00:45You connect with her immediately when you see her on screen,
0:00:45 > 0:00:48because there's a sort of joy, and there's this twinkle in her eye,
0:00:48 > 0:00:50which is just sort of magical.
0:00:50 > 0:00:52JUDI LAUGHS
0:00:52 > 0:00:56Judi challenges you in an extraordinary, frightening
0:00:56 > 0:01:02and exhilarating way, to be the very, very, very best that you can.
0:01:02 > 0:01:04You've got to progress.
0:01:04 > 0:01:07You can't ever stand still. You can't go back.
0:01:07 > 0:01:11Besides Bond, Judi's shown the world how it's done
0:01:11 > 0:01:12in independent film...
0:01:12 > 0:01:15Should I smile or shall I be serious?
0:01:15 > 0:01:18..Hollywood film, Shakespeare...
0:01:18 > 0:01:20Drinks all round!
0:01:20 > 0:01:24..modern theatre, TV sitcom,
0:01:24 > 0:01:26musicals...
0:01:26 > 0:01:28and even as a mouse.
0:01:28 > 0:01:31So confusing!
0:01:31 > 0:01:35And then of course, there is her national treasure status.
0:01:35 > 0:01:40She would say she doesn't enjoy being a national treasure,
0:01:40 > 0:01:43which would be an absolute bloody lie.
0:01:43 > 0:01:45She loves it!
0:01:45 > 0:01:48But beyond the Dame Judi we all think we know,
0:01:48 > 0:01:50there is another Judi.
0:01:50 > 0:01:53Private, instinctive, enigmatic.
0:01:53 > 0:01:57I feel more comfortable when I'm dressed up as somebody else,
0:01:57 > 0:01:59being somebody else, and talking.
0:01:59 > 0:02:03I find it difficult to go along as myself.
0:02:03 > 0:02:08I do think she's one of those people who expresses something in her art
0:02:08 > 0:02:10that she cannot express in life.
0:02:10 > 0:02:12She'll enjoy making you laugh.
0:02:12 > 0:02:14AUDIENCE LAUGH
0:02:14 > 0:02:17But equally, she's capable of making you cry,
0:02:17 > 0:02:20and doing that turn on a sixpence.
0:02:20 > 0:02:24And you do feel that at that moment you've seen into the soul -
0:02:24 > 0:02:27the real Judi.
0:02:27 > 0:02:30I think the real Judi dresses in leather
0:02:30 > 0:02:32with metal spikes on it,
0:02:32 > 0:02:35and screams punk rock all night
0:02:35 > 0:02:38and annoys the neighbours, kills cats.
0:02:38 > 0:02:41In order to understand the real Dame Judi Dench,
0:02:41 > 0:02:45we will explore some of the most powerful performances of her career.
0:02:45 > 0:02:48Through them, we will uncover her secrets
0:02:48 > 0:02:50and show why she is regarded
0:02:50 > 0:02:53as one of the most versatile actors in history.
0:03:13 > 0:03:18Over 50 years ago, a young Judi was on her way
0:03:18 > 0:03:21to one of the most memorable auditions of her life.
0:03:21 > 0:03:24Already a success at the Royal Shakespeare Company,
0:03:24 > 0:03:27she had yet to make her mark in film.
0:03:27 > 0:03:30I went up about a film once, before I'd ever made a film,
0:03:30 > 0:03:33and I went into a room and there were five big men there.
0:03:33 > 0:03:35They offered me a seat, and nobody said anything.
0:03:35 > 0:03:38This man looked at me for a long time,
0:03:38 > 0:03:41and then he took a cigar out of his mouth, and he said,
0:03:41 > 0:03:44"Miss Dench, you have every single thing wrong with your face."
0:03:44 > 0:03:46And I got up and I walked out of the room.
0:03:46 > 0:03:49# These boots are made for walking
0:03:49 > 0:03:52# And that's just what they'll do
0:03:52 > 0:03:58# One of these days these boots are gonna walk all over you... #
0:03:58 > 0:04:03Oh, how history has proved that particular director wrong.
0:04:05 > 0:04:06# Start walking... #
0:04:08 > 0:04:1150 years after that audition,
0:04:11 > 0:04:13Dame Judi Dench has become one of the most successful
0:04:13 > 0:04:16and recognised actors in the world.
0:04:16 > 0:04:22This was in no small part due to her role in international espionage.
0:04:24 > 0:04:26Who the hell do they think they are?
0:04:26 > 0:04:27I report to the Prime Minister,
0:04:27 > 0:04:29and even he's smart enough
0:04:29 > 0:04:30not to ask me what we do.
0:04:30 > 0:04:34Have you ever seen such a bunch of self-righteous, arse-covering prigs?
0:04:34 > 0:04:39I didn't for a second ever imagine that I would play M.
0:04:39 > 0:04:42And I was a huge fan of the Bond films.
0:04:42 > 0:04:4417 years, and did seven films,
0:04:44 > 0:04:47and just the most glorious time.
0:04:47 > 0:04:50But Bond is only one part
0:04:50 > 0:04:53of the story. Judi's real break in cinema
0:04:53 > 0:04:56came on a low-budget film made for the BBC.
0:04:56 > 0:04:59Judi was in her 60s.
0:05:06 > 0:05:07She openly confessed that
0:05:07 > 0:05:10she was terrified about doing it,
0:05:10 > 0:05:13and I said, "why?". It seemed...
0:05:13 > 0:05:16improbable, given the breadth
0:05:16 > 0:05:18and depth of experience that she'd had in her career.
0:05:18 > 0:05:23And she said, "Because I don't trust that I'll know what to do."
0:05:23 > 0:05:29My job was initially to try and engender confidence in her
0:05:29 > 0:05:31that she could pull it off.
0:05:31 > 0:05:34The project definitely daunted her.
0:05:36 > 0:05:39It's your first real starring role in a movie, isn't it?
0:05:39 > 0:05:41It is. It is.
0:05:41 > 0:05:43Because you don't like films much, do you?
0:05:43 > 0:05:45I don't know the business of it.
0:05:45 > 0:05:49I really rely very, very, very much on the director.
0:05:49 > 0:05:53I'm very, very unsure of myself in the movies, very.
0:05:53 > 0:05:57But if Judi was nervous, her co-star was terrified.
0:05:57 > 0:06:00Mr Brown, ma'am.
0:06:00 > 0:06:02She frightened the life out of me at first.
0:06:02 > 0:06:05Because, you know, she was such a giant of the business.
0:06:05 > 0:06:06And I said to John Madden,
0:06:06 > 0:06:07"I'll do the part,
0:06:07 > 0:06:09"but I want to meet her first."
0:06:09 > 0:06:12We talked, and we found who we didn't like,
0:06:12 > 0:06:14which I always find endears me to people,
0:06:14 > 0:06:18if we are linked by people we loathe.
0:06:18 > 0:06:19You know?
0:06:22 > 0:06:25Billy Connolly played the part of John Brown,
0:06:25 > 0:06:26who was to console the Queen
0:06:26 > 0:06:30after the death of her husband, Prince Albert.
0:06:32 > 0:06:36Honest to God, I never thought to see you in such a state.
0:06:36 > 0:06:38You must miss him dreadfully.
0:06:39 > 0:06:41You do not...
0:06:42 > 0:06:44He...
0:06:45 > 0:06:48Get him out! Get him out!
0:06:49 > 0:06:52Get him out! Get him out!
0:06:55 > 0:06:56The first scene we did,
0:06:56 > 0:07:00Queen Victoria burst into tears in the middle of it.
0:07:00 > 0:07:03And we did it 12 times, and she did it...
0:07:03 > 0:07:05She burst into tears 12 times
0:07:05 > 0:07:07and it blew me sideways.
0:07:07 > 0:07:11You know? That was the great reality of her.
0:07:11 > 0:07:17'My husband used to say, "You have a huge well of sadness in you.
0:07:17 > 0:07:21' "An incredible kind of deep pit of something."
0:07:21 > 0:07:24'And I suppose out of that pit came any grief
0:07:24 > 0:07:26'that I showed as Queen Victoria.'
0:07:27 > 0:07:29The film told the story of the friendship
0:07:29 > 0:07:31and then deepening affection that developed
0:07:31 > 0:07:34between Queen Victoria and Mr Brown.
0:07:39 > 0:07:42We were doing the Eightsome Reel in a scene in the castle,
0:07:42 > 0:07:44and she was directly opposite me.
0:07:44 > 0:07:46And in the middle of the dance
0:07:46 > 0:07:49I thought, "Oh, my God, she fancies me!"
0:07:49 > 0:07:52"Judi Dench fancies me, what am I going to do?"
0:07:52 > 0:07:55You know? I'm not that good at spotting that in a woman,
0:07:55 > 0:07:58but I spotted it in lumps here.
0:07:58 > 0:08:01I thought, "Oh, Christ, how do I get out of this?"
0:08:03 > 0:08:05And of course, she was acting.
0:08:05 > 0:08:07And she did fancy John Brown,
0:08:07 > 0:08:10and suddenly the penny dropped in my head.
0:08:10 > 0:08:12And I began to act properly.
0:08:12 > 0:08:15It was one of the lessons of my life.
0:08:15 > 0:08:18She just gave it to me for free.
0:08:21 > 0:08:23Mrs Brown surpassed all expectations.
0:08:25 > 0:08:27Judi was nominated for an Oscar...
0:08:29 > 0:08:32..and although she didn't win that time,
0:08:32 > 0:08:35Mrs Brown was the beginning of a new era.
0:08:35 > 0:08:37Judi, the film star.
0:08:37 > 0:08:38REPORTERS CLAMOUR
0:08:44 > 0:08:46My family, my family.
0:08:47 > 0:08:50There was an extraordinary story that she once told me.
0:08:50 > 0:08:52She'd gone to America to do
0:08:52 > 0:08:55the pre-publicity
0:08:55 > 0:08:57for Mrs Brown, in fact it was.
0:08:57 > 0:09:00And she was being interviewed by the American journalists,
0:09:00 > 0:09:03and they said to her, in all seriousness, they said,
0:09:03 > 0:09:07"We all know you from the Bond films. So what did you do before?"
0:09:07 > 0:09:10And that's sort of 40 years of a career.
0:09:10 > 0:09:13But you have to go, "Well, I've done quite a lot of Shakespeare."
0:09:13 > 0:09:15Completely oblivious to the magnificence
0:09:15 > 0:09:18that we've all been watching for as long as I can remember.
0:09:22 > 0:09:26What angel wakes me from my flowery bed?
0:09:28 > 0:09:30For nearly 60 years,
0:09:30 > 0:09:34Judi Dench has been first and foremost a Shakespearean actor.
0:09:34 > 0:09:38'Shakespeare has always been my passion.'
0:09:38 > 0:09:41Therefore the winds, piping to us in vain, as in revenge,
0:09:41 > 0:09:44have sucked up from the sea contagious fogs...
0:09:44 > 0:09:46'They're such wonderful parts.'
0:09:46 > 0:09:49That Herod's head I'll have.
0:09:49 > 0:09:52I am a spirit of no common rate.
0:09:52 > 0:09:55The summer still doth tend upon my state.
0:09:56 > 0:09:58' "The man who pays the rent,"
0:09:58 > 0:10:02'that's what Shakespeare was known as in our house.'
0:10:03 > 0:10:05She does make it look absurdly easy.
0:10:05 > 0:10:08You do think it's just like breathing for her,
0:10:08 > 0:10:09speaking Shakespearean text.
0:10:09 > 0:10:12It just seems like she rolls out of bed and just does it, you know?
0:10:12 > 0:10:16What she is masterful at is hiding how difficult it is.
0:10:16 > 0:10:19What comfortable hour canst thou name,
0:10:19 > 0:10:22that ever graced me with thy company?
0:10:22 > 0:10:25She has immense knowledge, immense technical craft,
0:10:25 > 0:10:28but you are simply unable to see it.
0:10:31 > 0:10:36But hard as it is to believe today, Judi's first role in Shakespeare,
0:10:36 > 0:10:40aged just 18, was a disaster.
0:10:40 > 0:10:44I got cast as Ophelia straight out of drama school.
0:10:44 > 0:10:47Very, very lucky, but quite hard.
0:10:47 > 0:10:49Baptism of fire.
0:10:51 > 0:10:55I tried every way to make her mad when she came to the mad scene.
0:10:55 > 0:10:57Now I know now
0:10:57 > 0:11:01that I need have only chosen one thing
0:11:01 > 0:11:04to convey to the audience her madness,
0:11:04 > 0:11:07and it would have been enough. You know, less is more.
0:11:07 > 0:11:11It's a very, very difficult thing to learn when you're a young actor.
0:11:11 > 0:11:12There's no short cuts.
0:11:12 > 0:11:16And it is something you have to learn by experience.
0:11:19 > 0:11:21And I got terrible notices as Ophelia.
0:11:21 > 0:11:23I had to do an enormous swallow,
0:11:23 > 0:11:27and...I could have been fired, and that would have been it.
0:11:27 > 0:11:30I don't know what would have happened. Anyway, it didn't matter,
0:11:30 > 0:11:33because I played lots and lots and lots of Shakespeare,
0:11:33 > 0:11:35and so I did learn.
0:11:35 > 0:11:38- The elbow.- Oh, je m'en oublie! De elbow.
0:11:42 > 0:11:44When I was a little, little girl,
0:11:44 > 0:11:49I'd seen my brother play Lady Macbeth at school
0:11:49 > 0:11:51and my other brother was playing Duncan.
0:11:51 > 0:11:53I always remember he came in and said, "What bloody man is that?",
0:11:53 > 0:11:55I said, I thought, "Oh!" I was about eight.
0:11:55 > 0:11:57I thought, this is thrilling.
0:11:57 > 0:12:00This isn't just Shakespeare, it's swearing, too.
0:12:00 > 0:12:02So the play must have been one of
0:12:02 > 0:12:04the first Shakespeare plays I'd ever seen.
0:12:08 > 0:12:12In 1976, Judi and fellow actor Ian McKellen asked
0:12:12 > 0:12:16the director Trevor Nunn whether they could play the leading roles
0:12:16 > 0:12:19in Shakespeare's bloody tale
0:12:19 > 0:12:21of obsession and murder.
0:12:21 > 0:12:23I was immediately aware
0:12:23 > 0:12:26that if Judi Dench and Ian McKellen worked on it,
0:12:26 > 0:12:32then there was an extraordinary possibility to re-examine Macbeth.
0:12:32 > 0:12:35And we went ahead
0:12:35 > 0:12:38very much on a tide of
0:12:38 > 0:12:40their joint energy.
0:12:43 > 0:12:48Great Glamis, worthy Cawdor.
0:12:48 > 0:12:52Greater than both, by the all-hail hereafter!
0:12:55 > 0:12:58Ian McKellen had worked with Judi once before.
0:12:58 > 0:13:02She famously arrives at the first rehearsal unprepared.
0:13:02 > 0:13:04But she's a quick study, and suddenly,
0:13:04 > 0:13:08somewhere in the middle of the first week, Judi became the character.
0:13:08 > 0:13:13And she'd learnt the words, and she knew how she wanted to inhabit them.
0:13:13 > 0:13:14And that can be alarming,
0:13:14 > 0:13:16if you're still struggling
0:13:16 > 0:13:17up your own mountain,
0:13:17 > 0:13:19and you look up and there's Judi
0:13:19 > 0:13:21at the top of hers, waving, "Come on up!"
0:13:21 > 0:13:23Hail, king that shalt be.
0:13:25 > 0:13:27Hail, king that shalt be...
0:13:27 > 0:13:30'Nothing happens by chance with Judi, she has worked it out.'
0:13:30 > 0:13:35But when she works it out is a bafflement to me.
0:13:35 > 0:13:37Judi discovered that Lady Macbeth
0:13:37 > 0:13:40was not simply the embodiment of all evil.
0:13:40 > 0:13:43She wasn't simply someone who was off the rails.
0:13:43 > 0:13:46On the contrary, everything that goes wrong with her character
0:13:46 > 0:13:49and her husband is rooted in their love for each other.
0:13:53 > 0:13:55Your face, my thane,
0:13:55 > 0:13:57is as a book,
0:13:57 > 0:14:00where men may read strange matters.
0:14:02 > 0:14:04To beguile the time,
0:14:04 > 0:14:06look like the time.
0:14:06 > 0:14:10Bear welcome in your hand, your eye, your tongue.
0:14:10 > 0:14:14Look like the innocent flower,
0:14:14 > 0:14:17but be the serpent under it.
0:14:17 > 0:14:21'I've just always believed that she was incredibly ambitious,
0:14:21 > 0:14:23'not for herself, but for her husband.
0:14:23 > 0:14:27'So she pushes through the one deed which she thinks is going to be
0:14:27 > 0:14:30'glory for them both for the rest of their lives.'
0:14:30 > 0:14:35Will these hands ne'er be clean?
0:14:37 > 0:14:41You were entirely taken into this woman's world.
0:14:41 > 0:14:48You identified with her needs and her passions and ambition.
0:14:48 > 0:14:50And almost the only time
0:14:50 > 0:14:53I thought, this play is a tragedy,
0:14:53 > 0:14:56because this woman, essentially,
0:14:56 > 0:15:00destroys herself and destroys her husband.
0:15:00 > 0:15:04That's the extent that she transformed the play
0:15:04 > 0:15:07and transformed the part.
0:15:09 > 0:15:11SHE MOANS
0:15:11 > 0:15:15'Gradually the rift gets wider and wider between them.
0:15:15 > 0:15:21'And that is, in a way, what she dies of, I think.
0:15:21 > 0:15:23'There's nothing for her to live for.
0:15:23 > 0:15:25'And that's the tragedy of it.'
0:15:25 > 0:15:27SHE WAILS
0:15:38 > 0:15:42- Do the roles take you over? I mean...- No!
0:15:42 > 0:15:45They don't? I mean, you don't walk around Sainsbury's as Cleopatra?
0:15:45 > 0:15:47No! Tricky, actually.
0:15:47 > 0:15:50Tricky shopping. Tricky shopping when you come to play Lady Macbeth
0:15:50 > 0:15:52- round Sainsbury's!- That keeps the old feet on the ground?
0:15:52 > 0:15:55It certainly does, when you have the shopping list to do.
0:16:01 > 0:16:03Judi continues to play in Shakespeare.
0:16:04 > 0:16:06In early 2016,
0:16:06 > 0:16:10she received a record eighth Olivier Award for her supporting role
0:16:10 > 0:16:14in Sir Kenneth Branagh's The Winter's Tale.
0:16:14 > 0:16:17But the reason she has become one of the most versatile actors
0:16:17 > 0:16:20of her generation is the fact that Shakespeare alone
0:16:20 > 0:16:23was not enough for Judi.
0:16:23 > 0:16:25There was a boredom threshold with Judi.
0:16:25 > 0:16:29She says herself, she can get, "I've done that now,
0:16:29 > 0:16:31"let's get on to something else."
0:16:32 > 0:16:36# Come on, pretty baby Let's move it and groove it... #
0:16:38 > 0:16:40SHE GROANS
0:16:40 > 0:16:41Hey up. Hey!
0:16:41 > 0:16:44In 1963, Judi was given a part in
0:16:44 > 0:16:47an early episode of the BBC's Z Cars,
0:16:47 > 0:16:50one of her first steps into the world of television,
0:16:50 > 0:16:52and a very different medium.
0:16:52 > 0:16:54They go for it, don't they? A bit of a punch-up...
0:16:54 > 0:16:57- What's your name?- Judy Garland!
0:16:57 > 0:17:01Judi had already made her mark in the theatre.
0:17:01 > 0:17:03- SHE SHOUTS - Hey, shut it!
0:17:03 > 0:17:05She was beginning to be
0:17:05 > 0:17:08talked about as potentially
0:17:08 > 0:17:12a great young actor.
0:17:12 > 0:17:16When I first did television, I thought I'd never...
0:17:16 > 0:17:18..come to grips with it at all.
0:17:18 > 0:17:22But John Hopkins wrote this quartet of plays
0:17:22 > 0:17:25called Talking To A Stranger,
0:17:25 > 0:17:28about a family in suburbia.
0:17:29 > 0:17:32And Christopher Morahan was directing it.
0:17:36 > 0:17:40Talking To A Stranger is very bleak indeed.
0:17:40 > 0:17:43I think there are some actors
0:17:43 > 0:17:45who would find it too frightening,
0:17:45 > 0:17:47and wouldn't have been able to do that,
0:17:47 > 0:17:49and that's why they weren't cast.
0:17:50 > 0:17:52But, I mean, Judi was
0:17:52 > 0:17:54the most marvellously rich,
0:17:54 > 0:17:56tough-minded actor.
0:17:58 > 0:18:02'I use the fear, I think, because that creates adrenaline.
0:18:04 > 0:18:07'So you can use all that, because you'll need that anyway.
0:18:07 > 0:18:11'I don't know, I don't know about anything else.
0:18:11 > 0:18:14'Except that, you know, I'm sure that every actor
0:18:14 > 0:18:15'has that kind of fear.
0:18:15 > 0:18:20'And it's not part of the deal to share it.'
0:18:22 > 0:18:24Would you like to hear my life story?
0:18:24 > 0:18:27No, of course you wouldn't. Everyone else has a perfectly good life story
0:18:27 > 0:18:29of their own. Oh, I had such a happy childhood.
0:18:29 > 0:18:31Happy, happy, happy.
0:18:31 > 0:18:33The first time I saw Judi she was playing this very,
0:18:33 > 0:18:35very troubled teenager.
0:18:35 > 0:18:38Now, the conventional view would be that brilliant performance of
0:18:38 > 0:18:42troubled teenager equals...
0:18:42 > 0:18:47very disturbed childhood and teenage years.
0:18:47 > 0:18:49- This is a family?- Isn't it?
0:18:49 > 0:18:51The outward and visible maybe, if you don't look too closely.
0:18:51 > 0:18:55Now, with Judi, the reverse is true.
0:18:55 > 0:19:00Judi had a very happy, settled childhood.
0:19:03 > 0:19:05Your childhood, of course, was in Yorkshire.
0:19:05 > 0:19:07Yes, I love it still.
0:19:09 > 0:19:12What were your early ambitions as a child?
0:19:12 > 0:19:16My first ambition was to be the owner of a fish shop!
0:19:16 > 0:19:18JUDI CHUCKLES
0:19:18 > 0:19:21- Why? I mean...- Well, it's the feel and the look of it.
0:19:21 > 0:19:25And, very early on, I took some kippers from the fish shop.
0:19:25 > 0:19:27- You mean you stole them?- Stole them.
0:19:27 > 0:19:29And my mother found out when we were...
0:19:29 > 0:19:33She said, "You go straight back and take them back!"
0:19:40 > 0:19:44Judi's father, Reginald Arthur Dench, was the local GP.
0:19:46 > 0:19:50But outside of the surgery, he had a variety of other roles.
0:19:50 > 0:19:53Here, he can be seen in a production of Dick Turpin,
0:19:53 > 0:19:57starring alongside his wife and Judi's brother.
0:19:57 > 0:20:02We had a big hamper, and we had all sorts of bits of things,
0:20:02 > 0:20:05and we were always dressed up in costume.
0:20:05 > 0:20:08As a child, Judi was surrounded by theatre.
0:20:08 > 0:20:13Here she is seen playing an angel in the famous York Mystery Plays.
0:20:13 > 0:20:16There was no pressure for her to become an actress.
0:20:16 > 0:20:22There was simply this extraordinary talent that she was nursing.
0:20:23 > 0:20:27Her portrayal of life in a very different family to her own
0:20:27 > 0:20:31would earn her a Bafta in her first major TV role.
0:20:31 > 0:20:32Do you think you're so important?
0:20:32 > 0:20:35I think anyone who needs something, anything, I don't know, God knows.
0:20:35 > 0:20:37Your friends think that's very funny, I suppose?
0:20:37 > 0:20:40Look, once and for all, the friends I've got, I haven't got any.
0:20:40 > 0:20:42You put butter on that piece of bread, eat,
0:20:42 > 0:20:44- and you still wouldn't choke on them.- Terry, be quiet.
0:20:44 > 0:20:45Sweetie, I've only just started.
0:20:45 > 0:20:48'I don't think we, as an audience in Britain,'
0:20:48 > 0:20:53had seen a suburban family dissected,
0:20:53 > 0:20:56and asked to be witnesses,
0:20:56 > 0:20:58'in such a way before.
0:20:58 > 0:21:01'The rawness was palpable.'
0:21:01 > 0:21:03Tonight? No, well, I can't, tonight. I...
0:21:05 > 0:21:07No, I'm not busy, I just don't want to go out with you.
0:21:08 > 0:21:11Not tonight, not tomorrow night, not...
0:21:11 > 0:21:13Well, you know what I mean.
0:21:14 > 0:21:18No, look, Chris, I had a dolly time, you're very sweet and all that,
0:21:18 > 0:21:21and you'll make somebody a very nice...whatever the word is.
0:21:21 > 0:21:24Husband. I know that's not the idea,
0:21:24 > 0:21:26but it's what you're cut out for - ask your wife.
0:21:26 > 0:21:29'It would be very difficult to do a scene like that,
0:21:29 > 0:21:32'the speech on the phone, because it is basically a monologue.'
0:21:32 > 0:21:34Well, it's the only way I know how to talk.
0:21:34 > 0:21:37What do you think, I put it on? Is that what you think?
0:21:37 > 0:21:42To sustain that level of emotional connection,
0:21:42 > 0:21:45'and to vary it all the time.
0:21:45 > 0:21:49'She'll laugh when it's unexpected, she'll be cynical
0:21:49 > 0:21:52'when it's unexpected, and so on.'
0:21:52 > 0:21:55You'll soon find a substitute - I could name a dozen.
0:21:56 > 0:21:58Come the dark, you won't even notice.
0:21:59 > 0:22:06She has an instinctive empathy for more or less everyone she meets.
0:22:06 > 0:22:13And certainly at the heart of her craft is a capacity to empathise
0:22:13 > 0:22:17and fully comprehend the lives of people
0:22:17 > 0:22:20who are quite distinct from her.
0:22:23 > 0:22:26MUSIC: You Were Made For Me by Freddie And The Dreamers
0:22:26 > 0:22:30- # You were made for me - You were made for me
0:22:30 > 0:22:33# Everybody tells me so
0:22:33 > 0:22:36- # You were made for me - You were made for me
0:22:36 > 0:22:39# Don't pretend that you don't know... #
0:22:39 > 0:22:42Judi's work in TV and theatre had brought critical acclaim,
0:22:42 > 0:22:45but it was only after she met and then married
0:22:45 > 0:22:49the actor Michael Williams that she found broad popular appeal.
0:22:53 > 0:22:55It was no surprise to anybody
0:22:55 > 0:22:59that they just absolutely hit it off instantly.
0:22:59 > 0:23:03They were absolutely the right...
0:23:03 > 0:23:06size, the right optimism,
0:23:06 > 0:23:10the right sense of humour for each other.
0:23:10 > 0:23:13And in 1981, Michael and Judi embarked together on a sitcom.
0:23:14 > 0:23:17Let's talk about you.
0:23:17 > 0:23:19Helen said you were a linguist.
0:23:19 > 0:23:21It was to become a classic.
0:23:21 > 0:23:23No, I'm sure it's not.
0:23:23 > 0:23:25I mean, what are you translating at the moment?
0:23:25 > 0:23:28A German textbook on urinary infections.
0:23:28 > 0:23:29LAUGHTER
0:23:32 > 0:23:35It was really good fun for her to be
0:23:35 > 0:23:38able to work on something with Mike.
0:23:38 > 0:23:39She adored him.
0:23:39 > 0:23:42- What about the bank? - I already owe them.
0:23:42 > 0:23:44Well, owe them more.
0:23:44 > 0:23:47And, at the same time, it was financially rewarding.
0:23:49 > 0:23:53I don't know if you have any idea what you get paid as an actor
0:23:53 > 0:23:56at the Royal Shakespeare Company in the National Theatre,
0:23:56 > 0:23:59but it's barely enough to support a family.
0:24:02 > 0:24:07But she also loved the fact that she had an audience exponentially larger
0:24:07 > 0:24:10than anything she'd ever done before.
0:24:12 > 0:24:13Many in the audience believed
0:24:13 > 0:24:16they were getting a glimpse of the real Judi.
0:24:16 > 0:24:19The audience see her first of all as
0:24:19 > 0:24:23someone rather ordinary, and...
0:24:23 > 0:24:28..not unlike their sisters or people they know.
0:24:28 > 0:24:32But suddenly they see some strange depth there, and they want to know,
0:24:32 > 0:24:34- where did that come from?- Look.
0:24:36 > 0:24:38If you can get by without the sheer black nightie,
0:24:38 > 0:24:41I can get by without the words.
0:24:42 > 0:24:44Do people expect you to be like
0:24:44 > 0:24:47the character you play in A Fine Romance?
0:24:47 > 0:24:48They do expect us to be like that
0:24:48 > 0:24:51and they think that our lives at home are exactly like it.
0:24:51 > 0:24:53It's not at all like us.
0:24:53 > 0:24:57But I think that the appeal of it is because it is more like real life,
0:24:57 > 0:25:01in that it's more, life is more like having a dinner with somebody
0:25:01 > 0:25:04and thinking how lovely you are, and you find there's spinach
0:25:04 > 0:25:06on your tooth or egg all down your front.
0:25:06 > 0:25:08LAUGHTER
0:25:09 > 0:25:11Why are you winking?
0:25:11 > 0:25:15Do you know something about the food that I don't?
0:25:15 > 0:25:17I've lost a contact lens.
0:25:17 > 0:25:20- Here?- Well, it must be here, it was in a minute ago.
0:25:20 > 0:25:22Well, where is it?
0:25:22 > 0:25:25Why do people always ask that when you've lost something?
0:25:34 > 0:25:35What's going on?
0:25:36 > 0:25:38They sometimes drop down your front.
0:25:49 > 0:25:52I think what was remarkable is that
0:25:52 > 0:25:59neither Judi or Michael did what I'd describe as sitcom acting.
0:25:59 > 0:26:05Look, if you, if you wiggle about a bit, I'll have a look on the floor.
0:26:05 > 0:26:09Occasionally, there'd be pauses where one or the other
0:26:09 > 0:26:12was just thinking and reacting,
0:26:12 > 0:26:19and in the syntax of sitcom that's very, very bold stuff.
0:26:21 > 0:26:25- Are you ready to order, sir? - No thank you, we're still deciding.
0:26:25 > 0:26:27'Judi would defer to Michael.
0:26:27 > 0:26:30'Michael was a very clever comedy actor.'
0:26:30 > 0:26:31Michael would say, "You should
0:26:31 > 0:26:33"have left a longer pause there
0:26:33 > 0:26:34"before the punch line," and Judi
0:26:34 > 0:26:36would say, "Yes, you're right."
0:26:36 > 0:26:40So there was tremendous respect going between them.
0:26:43 > 0:26:45HE SCREAMS
0:26:47 > 0:26:50You are a distinguished Shakespearean actress,
0:26:50 > 0:26:54yet best known for a somewhat trivial television comedy.
0:26:54 > 0:26:57Yes, and a lot of people say to me, "Is this the first job you've had?"
0:26:57 > 0:26:59So it's very nice to reach an audience
0:26:59 > 0:27:01who don't want to come and see Shakespeare,
0:27:01 > 0:27:03but do want to sit and see you in their sitting-room.
0:27:03 > 0:27:06But you don't feel, "Is this what all my training has been about?"
0:27:06 > 0:27:07No, I don't, I like it a lot.
0:27:07 > 0:27:13Because I like to do something that is the most unexpected thing.
0:27:13 > 0:27:14Quick, hide!
0:27:14 > 0:27:16SHE GASPS
0:27:17 > 0:27:22TV sitcom remained a draw, and in 1992 she starred alongside
0:27:22 > 0:27:26Geoffrey Palmer in the hugely popular As Time Goes By.
0:27:26 > 0:27:29At last, we've got a bit of weekend to ourselves.
0:27:29 > 0:27:30LAUGHTER
0:27:32 > 0:27:34It ran for a decade.
0:27:34 > 0:27:36- Wait!- What?- You've broken an ankle.
0:27:39 > 0:27:41I suppose it's pointless to ask why?
0:27:41 > 0:27:45'Her success in popular shows is part of what makes her accepted
0:27:45 > 0:27:47'as a national treasure.'
0:27:47 > 0:27:50- Just limp!- Which leg? - Well, I don't know, just limp!
0:27:50 > 0:27:52There are many very successful
0:27:52 > 0:27:55sitcom actors of both genders,
0:27:55 > 0:27:57but they haven't also been
0:27:57 > 0:27:58very good as Lady Macbeth...
0:28:00 > 0:28:02..or Sally Bowles in Cabaret.
0:28:02 > 0:28:06# ..a chance
0:28:06 > 0:28:09# Hush up, don't tell Mama
0:28:09 > 0:28:11# Shush up, don't tell Mama
0:28:11 > 0:28:15# Don't tell Mama whatever you do... #
0:28:16 > 0:28:20I do like the challenge of something new.
0:28:20 > 0:28:23I've always wanted to do a musical and everyone kind of says,
0:28:23 > 0:28:25"Oh, get you," when you say musical.
0:28:25 > 0:28:27But I want to have a go
0:28:27 > 0:28:30and I want to have a great big orchestra and everything,
0:28:30 > 0:28:32and a bit of dancing,
0:28:32 > 0:28:34a bit of singing and a bit of acting.
0:28:34 > 0:28:36A chorus and all.
0:28:36 > 0:28:40I long for that, because that's a really different thing.
0:28:41 > 0:28:45In 1968, Judi Dench starred as Sally Bowles in Cabaret -
0:28:45 > 0:28:50a musical based in a seedy nightclub in '30s Berlin.
0:28:50 > 0:28:52..doesn't even have an inkling.
0:28:52 > 0:28:55When she tries, as Sally Bowles, to hit the high note,
0:28:55 > 0:28:59the character doesn't quite achieve it, but the actor does.
0:28:59 > 0:29:04It's a totally successful rendering of Cabaret.
0:29:04 > 0:29:08No-one will ever sing it as well. Couldn't.
0:29:08 > 0:29:10# You can tell my papa that's all right
0:29:10 > 0:29:12# Cos he comes in here every night
0:29:12 > 0:29:17# But don't tell Mama what you saw. #
0:29:17 > 0:29:19- We're in two.- We are in two.
0:29:19 > 0:29:21It would be almost 20 years
0:29:21 > 0:29:24before Judi would return to the musical stage,
0:29:24 > 0:29:29in Stephen Sondheim's powerful love story A Little Night Music.
0:29:29 > 0:29:32What is it that you're trying to prove?
0:29:32 > 0:29:36'I'm trying to prove that I'm worthy of another part
0:29:36 > 0:29:38'coming up after the next one, you know.
0:29:38 > 0:29:40'Because people say all the time, "What are you going to do next?"
0:29:40 > 0:29:42'I have no idea what I'm going to do next.'
0:29:42 > 0:29:44You'll have to get through today.
0:29:44 > 0:29:46Once we get today over, we shan't mind.
0:29:46 > 0:29:47THEY LAUGH
0:29:47 > 0:29:51A Little Night Music centres around an actress, Desiree,
0:29:51 > 0:29:53and I think she's your...
0:29:54 > 0:29:56..absolute creature of the theatre
0:29:56 > 0:29:59and Judi Dench had a very strong connection to that character.
0:29:59 > 0:30:03The play tells of how Desiree's old lover Frederick, now married,
0:30:03 > 0:30:06re-enters her life and how, after many years apart,
0:30:06 > 0:30:09they fall for each other's charms again.
0:30:09 > 0:30:12- I apologise for all the squalor. - On the contrary.
0:30:12 > 0:30:15I've always associated you, very happily, with chaos.
0:30:15 > 0:30:17When you said that time, "I apologise for all the squalor,"
0:30:17 > 0:30:19it was like, shall we now go into...
0:30:19 > 0:30:21- It's going to be worse in there. - Yes.
0:30:21 > 0:30:25'It's hard to specify her techniques.
0:30:25 > 0:30:29'She rehearses in a way that you don't talk about it,'
0:30:29 > 0:30:31you just do it,
0:30:31 > 0:30:33and you do it differently
0:30:33 > 0:30:34all the time.
0:30:34 > 0:30:36Each time we got on our feet,
0:30:36 > 0:30:39we did a different version of things and then, slowly,
0:30:39 > 0:30:44the performance begins to coalesce of its own volition.
0:30:44 > 0:30:47Still hungry as ever after a performance, I see.
0:30:47 > 0:30:49Worse.
0:30:49 > 0:30:51I'm a wolf.
0:30:51 > 0:30:53Still hungry as ever as a performance, I see.
0:30:53 > 0:30:55Worse.
0:30:55 > 0:30:56I'm a wolf.
0:30:58 > 0:31:01Hungry as ever after a performance, I see.
0:31:01 > 0:31:02Worse.
0:31:02 > 0:31:04I'm a wolf.
0:31:04 > 0:31:07'Rehearsals is a time that you're allowed to make mistakes
0:31:07 > 0:31:10'and try and make choices, to move your wings
0:31:10 > 0:31:13'and to fly a little bit in certain directions.'
0:31:13 > 0:31:15I peered and peered and thought, "Is it?
0:31:15 > 0:31:16"Can it be possible...? Is it...?"
0:31:16 > 0:31:19I thought, "Is it? Can it be? Could it...?"
0:31:21 > 0:31:25I've got so much bread, it is terrible.
0:31:25 > 0:31:28- It's terrible.- It's only to substantiate the line,
0:31:28 > 0:31:29"I eat like a wolf."
0:31:30 > 0:31:32'It's a very curious thing sometimes.
0:31:32 > 0:31:34'You know that there is a laugh in a line.
0:31:34 > 0:31:37'Your instinct is entirely what tells you there's a laugh
0:31:37 > 0:31:41'and sometimes you can't get it. In the play and the theatre,
0:31:41 > 0:31:42'you can't get it and can't get it.
0:31:42 > 0:31:44'Quite suddenly, one night, you will get it.'
0:31:46 > 0:31:50- Sandwich?- No. Hungry as ever after a performance, I see.
0:31:50 > 0:31:51Worse.
0:31:51 > 0:31:53I'm a wolf.
0:31:53 > 0:31:55LAUGHTER
0:31:55 > 0:31:57Sit down.
0:32:00 > 0:32:04'So much of being in the theatre is being part of a company.'
0:32:06 > 0:32:10'I wouldn't even know who to rely on if it was on my own.
0:32:10 > 0:32:13'You'd have none of those wonderful larks that go on sometimes
0:32:13 > 0:32:17'in the dressing room. Or in a company of people.'
0:32:17 > 0:32:19Oh, dear.
0:32:19 > 0:32:21Judi likes to work and, actually,
0:32:21 > 0:32:23I would put it more strongly than that.
0:32:23 > 0:32:25She can't bear not to work.
0:32:25 > 0:32:27Her particular demon is to be
0:32:27 > 0:32:30left alone with nothing to do and
0:32:30 > 0:32:32no ability to practise her skills
0:32:32 > 0:32:36and I think she's scared witless by that idea.
0:32:36 > 0:32:38'Well, I don't have much quietness inside me.'
0:32:39 > 0:32:43'I don't find it easy to sit still and do nothing.
0:32:43 > 0:32:45'In fact, I can't do that.
0:32:45 > 0:32:50'I'm not good at being passively quiet.'
0:32:50 > 0:32:54# I thought that you'd want what I want... #
0:32:54 > 0:32:58The emotional climax of the play is when Frederic tells Desiree
0:32:58 > 0:33:00that he will not leave his wife.
0:33:00 > 0:33:04# But where are the clowns?
0:33:05 > 0:33:08# Quick, send in the clowns
0:33:10 > 0:33:16# Don't bother, they're here. #
0:33:16 > 0:33:18I'm an actress who can put over a song.
0:33:18 > 0:33:22I wouldn't say sings but I would say could put over a song,
0:33:22 > 0:33:24because I had to learn that in Cabaret.
0:33:24 > 0:33:27So it's just a matter of acting it.
0:33:28 > 0:33:30Do try to forgive me.
0:33:37 > 0:33:38The opening night,
0:33:38 > 0:33:42I was sitting next to Stephen Sondheim, the composer,
0:33:42 > 0:33:47and Stephen was leaning forward as she was singing,
0:33:47 > 0:33:50and then turned to me and said,
0:33:50 > 0:33:53"Well, that's why I like to write songs."
0:33:55 > 0:33:57And for him, it was sublime.
0:33:57 > 0:33:59It was perfect.
0:33:59 > 0:34:00It was acted.
0:34:00 > 0:34:04# Isn't it rich?
0:34:07 > 0:34:09# Isn't it queer?
0:34:12 > 0:34:16# Losing my timing this late
0:34:16 > 0:34:18# In my career
0:34:22 > 0:34:24# But where are the clowns?
0:34:26 > 0:34:29# There ought to be clowns
0:34:32 > 0:34:36# Well, maybe...
0:34:38 > 0:34:44# ..next year. #
0:34:44 > 0:34:46Her great gift as an actress
0:34:46 > 0:34:50is making everybody feel that she's accessible to them,
0:34:50 > 0:34:53but she's much more private
0:34:53 > 0:34:58and there's a core of her that is hard to know
0:34:58 > 0:35:00and, when you do know it,
0:35:00 > 0:35:03you feel that there is something there
0:35:03 > 0:35:05that is...
0:35:05 > 0:35:10..a soul that is far from untroubled.
0:35:11 > 0:35:13MUSIC PLAYS
0:35:18 > 0:35:20'I love the theatre best.
0:35:20 > 0:35:21'And then I like television.
0:35:21 > 0:35:23'Last, I like the movies.'
0:35:25 > 0:35:27'The theatre, although it's the thing
0:35:27 > 0:35:29'that takes the most energy out of you,
0:35:29 > 0:35:32'it's the thing that gets the greatest rewards. You know?
0:35:32 > 0:35:34'You can hear the audience reactions, you know.
0:35:34 > 0:35:37'You can hear if you need to kind of
0:35:37 > 0:35:40'push the accelerator a bit or pull back the brake.'
0:35:42 > 0:35:44Dominic, you've never seen my mother acting.
0:35:44 > 0:35:45No, it must seem ridiculous.
0:35:45 > 0:35:47I do know how famous you are,
0:35:47 > 0:35:50but, by and large, my generation, we don't go to the theatre.
0:35:50 > 0:35:52To us, it doesn't seem relevant.
0:35:52 > 0:35:54No, well, why should it? I quite understand.
0:35:54 > 0:35:57People say, "Oh, everyone should go to the theatre."
0:35:57 > 0:35:58Why should they?
0:35:58 > 0:36:01Amy's View was the story of Esme, an actress,
0:36:01 > 0:36:03and her daughter Amy.
0:36:03 > 0:36:07It followed their relationship over a quarter of a century.
0:36:07 > 0:36:09Let's play to people who actually like it
0:36:09 > 0:36:12and if there aren't very many, well, so be it.
0:36:12 > 0:36:16But don't come, please, because you've been told to.
0:36:16 > 0:36:18That won't do at all.
0:36:18 > 0:36:20When I wrote Amy's View, then Richard Eyre,
0:36:20 > 0:36:21who was to direct it,
0:36:21 > 0:36:23immediately said, "Well,
0:36:23 > 0:36:25"this is Judi Dench, isn't it?"
0:36:25 > 0:36:26Now, I never write for actors
0:36:26 > 0:36:30so I said, "I hadn't thought that, but, yes, that would be fantastic."
0:36:30 > 0:36:33But when she was given Amy's View, she said,
0:36:33 > 0:36:36"I don't see myself in this at all. Why are you giving this to me?
0:36:36 > 0:36:38"This is not me."
0:36:38 > 0:36:41She resisted the part very strongly.
0:36:41 > 0:36:43Did David Hare write that play about you, really?
0:36:43 > 0:36:45'I don't think he did.
0:36:45 > 0:36:48'But there are lots of things in it that are parallels, I suppose,
0:36:48 > 0:36:51'with my life or that I can understand easily.'
0:36:51 > 0:36:56She, Esme, is really a very vulnerable character, isn't she?
0:36:56 > 0:36:57'Yes, I think she is, very.'
0:36:57 > 0:37:00Do you think you are?
0:37:00 > 0:37:02'Yes, I expect I've got a lot of that in me, too.'
0:37:09 > 0:37:11Mummy's brilliant at playing comedy.
0:37:11 > 0:37:14Well, I'm usually best at playing genteel
0:37:14 > 0:37:17with something interesting happening underneath.
0:37:17 > 0:37:19You know, layers. I play a lot of layers.
0:37:19 > 0:37:22- She plays them wonderfully. - Well, thank you.
0:37:22 > 0:37:25The reason people responded so strongly to the play
0:37:25 > 0:37:28was that it's a mother-daughter play.
0:37:28 > 0:37:31I observed how complex that bond is
0:37:31 > 0:37:34and the play plugs into something pretty primal.
0:37:34 > 0:37:37Oh, you all say it so easily, so glibly.
0:37:37 > 0:37:39"Take control of your lives."
0:37:39 > 0:37:41Who's in control, finally?!
0:37:41 > 0:37:44I ask you. The answer is no-one.
0:37:44 > 0:37:46No-one!
0:37:46 > 0:37:50If you don't know that, you know nothing.
0:37:50 > 0:37:55There is an element of rebuke and competition in that relationship.
0:37:55 > 0:37:57And also, in the mother,
0:37:57 > 0:37:59there's also a regret for the life they never got to live
0:37:59 > 0:38:01and that they feel their daughter is living.
0:38:01 > 0:38:04My God, you live with this man, this child, this figure,
0:38:04 > 0:38:07who you think merits your love.
0:38:07 > 0:38:08And you let him run off with
0:38:08 > 0:38:11a slice of teenage Scandinavian charcuterie
0:38:11 > 0:38:15and, even then, forgive me,
0:38:15 > 0:38:17you don't even leave.
0:38:17 > 0:38:21'There are two kinds of actors - those who'
0:38:21 > 0:38:22reveal themselves when they act
0:38:22 > 0:38:24and those who act...
0:38:24 > 0:38:26..with a series of masks, you know.
0:38:26 > 0:38:29In a sense, one is about stripping away
0:38:29 > 0:38:31the mask that they have in public
0:38:31 > 0:38:33and the other is about adding a mask.
0:38:33 > 0:38:35She reveals herself.
0:38:35 > 0:38:37- Please, stay. - I can't, not tonight.
0:38:37 > 0:38:40- I have to get back to London. - Amy, I beg you, please.
0:38:40 > 0:38:42- I can't.- Just tonight.
0:38:42 > 0:38:45Just stay and comfort me!
0:38:45 > 0:38:46I can't.
0:38:46 > 0:38:50'When mother and daughter finally come to loggerheads,
0:38:50 > 0:38:52'it was immensely challenging.'
0:38:52 > 0:38:55Try and stay steady.
0:38:55 > 0:38:59'And immensely painful to play.'
0:38:59 > 0:39:01Jude would play with
0:39:01 > 0:39:03such searing honesty...
0:39:06 > 0:39:09..that one simply responded.
0:39:10 > 0:39:12I'll see you.
0:39:12 > 0:39:14- Amy!- I'll call you.
0:39:14 > 0:39:16This is the last scene of the play
0:39:16 > 0:39:20before Esme discovers that her daughter Amy has died.
0:39:20 > 0:39:22SOBBING
0:39:25 > 0:39:27As the play transferred to New York,
0:39:27 > 0:39:29Judi received the news
0:39:29 > 0:39:32that her husband Michael had been diagnosed with cancer.
0:39:33 > 0:39:39We were in New York together when Michael first got ill
0:39:39 > 0:39:43and she was absolutely terrified
0:39:43 > 0:39:45and...
0:39:45 > 0:39:49..drawn, and in agony.
0:39:51 > 0:39:53Is it that you just don't dare to
0:39:53 > 0:39:55deal with real experience?
0:39:55 > 0:39:58Or the things that happen in real life,
0:39:58 > 0:40:01like grief and betrayal...
0:40:01 > 0:40:04..and love and unhappiness...
0:40:05 > 0:40:07..and loss?
0:40:07 > 0:40:09The loss of people we love.
0:40:09 > 0:40:12She has the necessary stoicism
0:40:12 > 0:40:15that an actor has to perform,
0:40:15 > 0:40:18even though their heart is breaking.
0:40:21 > 0:40:27Michael died on 11th January, 2001, after an 18-month illness.
0:40:28 > 0:40:31Did you take time away from acting after your husband died?
0:40:31 > 0:40:33'No.
0:40:33 > 0:40:36'I was not in a frightfully wonderful place
0:40:36 > 0:40:40'and then I kind of immersed myself in a lot of work,
0:40:40 > 0:40:42'and I think it was the best thing I could do,
0:40:42 > 0:40:45'and it was also being with incredible people.
0:40:45 > 0:40:48'Richard Eyre and Jim Broadbent, you know.
0:40:48 > 0:40:51'Spread amongst friends - it was good.'
0:40:55 > 0:40:57Wonderful. Well done.
0:40:58 > 0:41:00My mother had had Alzheimer's,
0:41:00 > 0:41:02so I knew a lot about it, and it was uncanny
0:41:02 > 0:41:04that Judi, who hadn't actually
0:41:04 > 0:41:08been through that in any way,
0:41:08 > 0:41:10was incredibly just accurate.
0:41:14 > 0:41:16Even when she was suffering from
0:41:16 > 0:41:20terrible grief over Michael's death,
0:41:20 > 0:41:24she was performing this exquisitely dignified person
0:41:24 > 0:41:28who was dealing with the worst grief of her life.
0:41:32 > 0:41:34'If you are grieving,
0:41:34 > 0:41:40'for anything, grieving creates an incredible energy in you.
0:41:40 > 0:41:44'You can use that, it just is like...
0:41:44 > 0:41:48'It's petrol. It can be used, that energy,
0:41:48 > 0:41:50'in order to tell another story.'
0:41:55 > 0:42:00There's a scene where she is in the advanced stages of dementia
0:42:00 > 0:42:03and her husband, played by Jim Broadbent,
0:42:03 > 0:42:08reads an excerpt from Pride and Prejudice to her.
0:42:08 > 0:42:12And in her close-up,
0:42:12 > 0:42:18you feel that you're watching somebody whose mind is half there.
0:42:19 > 0:42:22Extraordinarily difficult to do.
0:42:22 > 0:42:26"Mr Darcy had at first scarcely allowed her to be pretty."
0:42:26 > 0:42:29I...wrote.
0:42:31 > 0:42:35Yes, my darling clever cat.
0:42:35 > 0:42:37You wrote books.
0:42:37 > 0:42:40Books. I wrote.
0:42:40 > 0:42:43You wrote novels.
0:42:43 > 0:42:45Wonderful novels.
0:42:52 > 0:42:55I think what she covers up, very skilfully,
0:42:55 > 0:42:58is the sheer degree of hard work
0:42:58 > 0:43:02and technical skill that has been required to get her to where she is.
0:43:04 > 0:43:06She has immense knowledge,
0:43:06 > 0:43:11immense technical craft, but you are simply unable to see it.
0:43:11 > 0:43:13It is there so deep for so long,
0:43:13 > 0:43:20and with such a sensitivity and such knowledge, and such perception,
0:43:20 > 0:43:22that it is just invisible.
0:43:25 > 0:43:29'I don't want to be thought of as one kind of actress.
0:43:29 > 0:43:32'You know, if having played Iris Murdoch,
0:43:32 > 0:43:36'another similar kind of part comes up, then I can't do that.
0:43:36 > 0:43:38'Everything in me says no.'
0:43:38 > 0:43:42Dame Judi's range of work was now immense.
0:43:42 > 0:43:45Everything from a disturbed schoolteacher...
0:43:45 > 0:43:47..to a cartoon mouse...
0:43:47 > 0:43:50..to Queen Elizabeth I - a role for which
0:43:50 > 0:43:53she received an Oscar for a performance
0:43:53 > 0:43:55lasting under ten minutes.
0:43:55 > 0:43:56But in those ten minutes,
0:43:56 > 0:43:59Judi delivered one of the great performances of her lifetime.
0:43:59 > 0:44:03It was as if the part was written for her.
0:44:03 > 0:44:06What do you love so much?
0:44:06 > 0:44:09- Your Majesty, I...- Speak up, girl. I know who I am.
0:44:09 > 0:44:12It's one of the thrilling things about Judi's career
0:44:12 > 0:44:16is to have watched someone who has been so glorious, always,
0:44:16 > 0:44:19and then suddenly she has this extraordinary film career
0:44:19 > 0:44:24that kind of started when she was about 65 or 70.
0:44:24 > 0:44:25It fills us all with hope.
0:44:29 > 0:44:35Challenging herself yet again, Judi played the lead in Philomena,
0:44:35 > 0:44:38made by veteran director, Stephen Frears.
0:44:38 > 0:44:40Hello, you must be Philomena. I'm Martin.
0:44:40 > 0:44:43It told the story of an Irish mother
0:44:43 > 0:44:45who was looking for her long-lost son
0:44:45 > 0:44:49with the help of a journalist, Martin Sixsmith,
0:44:49 > 0:44:50played by Steve Coogan.
0:44:50 > 0:44:53I must apologise for the other night, I'm afraid I was a bit...
0:44:53 > 0:44:55Caught me at a bad moment.
0:44:55 > 0:44:56Oh, that's all right.
0:44:56 > 0:44:59'Philomena is about the Irish girl who's had a baby
0:44:59 > 0:45:02'out of wedlock and went into a convent and then,
0:45:02 > 0:45:04'at the age of four, the child was sold to an American.'
0:45:06 > 0:45:08So, Philomena, how are you?
0:45:08 > 0:45:10I'm all right.
0:45:10 > 0:45:11And so the mother
0:45:11 > 0:45:13never saw the child again.
0:45:16 > 0:45:19'I met her before and she made me a cup of tea,
0:45:19 > 0:45:21'and I told her the story of Philomena.'
0:45:21 > 0:45:24- Hello, sorry I'm late. - Hello, Martin.
0:45:24 > 0:45:26First of all, she said,
0:45:26 > 0:45:30"Who do you see as playing Martin Sixsmith?"
0:45:30 > 0:45:33And I said, "Well, we were thinking...
0:45:33 > 0:45:35"..maybe me."
0:45:35 > 0:45:38And she said, "OK,
0:45:38 > 0:45:40"and is that negotiable?"
0:45:40 > 0:45:42And I said, "No."
0:45:42 > 0:45:44And she went, "OK."
0:45:48 > 0:45:51One of the reasons we wanted Judi
0:45:51 > 0:45:55was because we wanted to have the audience
0:45:55 > 0:45:58privy to Philomena's private anguish
0:45:58 > 0:46:02when no other people, within the film, are present.
0:46:02 > 0:46:04Because it makes the moment really intimate.
0:46:04 > 0:46:08There are very few actors who can pull that off.
0:46:08 > 0:46:10In the wrong hands, it can just be...
0:46:10 > 0:46:14Someone can just look vacant, you know, when the camera's on them.
0:46:14 > 0:46:17Of course, the audience really connects with her,
0:46:17 > 0:46:19just being able to look at her face very closely.
0:46:23 > 0:46:26You know that her face is very, very expressive,
0:46:26 > 0:46:29therefore you don't need six lines to say what her face is saying.
0:46:29 > 0:46:34So you can do less, because she's doing it for you.
0:46:36 > 0:46:38So, she's the perfect director...
0:46:38 > 0:46:40The perfect actress for a lazy man.
0:46:41 > 0:46:43Action.
0:46:44 > 0:46:46There wasn't really much direction.
0:46:46 > 0:46:49There wasn't much conversation with Stephen.
0:46:49 > 0:46:52I mean, most of his direction was for me.
0:46:52 > 0:46:54I mean, she didn't really need any.
0:46:54 > 0:46:58As Philomena's relationship with Martin Sixsmith develops,
0:46:58 > 0:47:01she opens up about the father of her lost son.
0:47:01 > 0:47:05What made it so much worse was... that I enjoyed it.
0:47:05 > 0:47:08- What?- The sex.
0:47:08 > 0:47:10SHE SIGHS
0:47:10 > 0:47:13It was just wonderful, Martin. I thought I was floating on air.
0:47:13 > 0:47:15He was so handsome.
0:47:15 > 0:47:17The way he held me in his arms.
0:47:19 > 0:47:23- The thing is, I didn't even know I had a clitoris, Martin.- Right.
0:47:23 > 0:47:25'Judi mainly liked the dirty bits.'
0:47:25 > 0:47:27She did ring me up and say,
0:47:27 > 0:47:29"I've just come across this line about the clitoris.
0:47:29 > 0:47:31"You are going to keep it in, aren't you?"
0:47:31 > 0:47:33I told her she was grubby.
0:47:33 > 0:47:35Underneath it all, she was grubby.
0:47:35 > 0:47:37It seemed to me all the better for it.
0:47:40 > 0:47:42I...
0:47:42 > 0:47:45..knew your son for about ten years.
0:47:45 > 0:47:47The way Judi played Philomena
0:47:47 > 0:47:49was a very careful tightrope to walk
0:47:49 > 0:47:52because if you over-play the comedy,
0:47:52 > 0:47:55then she could become a caricature.
0:47:55 > 0:47:58I don't know if you know, but he was gay.
0:47:58 > 0:48:00'Or it could be seen as cruel.
0:48:00 > 0:48:03'So, it needed to be really well-judged'
0:48:03 > 0:48:06and she managed to get that slight...
0:48:06 > 0:48:10..naivety coupled with a kind of a...
0:48:10 > 0:48:13..sort of a folk wisdom.
0:48:13 > 0:48:16Tell me, did he father any children?
0:48:16 > 0:48:19Philomena, Marcia's just told us that Anthony was gay.
0:48:19 > 0:48:21Yeah, well, I always knew that,
0:48:21 > 0:48:24- but I just wondered if he might be bi-curious.- Bi-curious?
0:48:24 > 0:48:27A lot of the nurses I worked with were gay, but one of them,
0:48:27 > 0:48:29called Brendan, told me was bi-curious.
0:48:29 > 0:48:31I don't think he could make up his mind, Marcia.
0:48:31 > 0:48:36She has enormous empathy, but so do lots of people.
0:48:36 > 0:48:38Sorry, this is my anti-national treasure line.
0:48:38 > 0:48:40So do lots of people.
0:48:40 > 0:48:43But then she's a trained actress, she's good at her job.
0:48:43 > 0:48:46You work with Hollywood actors and they're not trained in that way,
0:48:46 > 0:48:49and then you come across Judi and her gang,
0:48:49 > 0:48:51and they know how to do it.
0:48:51 > 0:48:54They do it basically, in rep, every two weeks.
0:48:54 > 0:48:56That's what they do. They act a part.
0:49:03 > 0:49:07'I think acting is... I think it's always talked about
0:49:07 > 0:49:09'and it shouldn't be talked about, it should be done.
0:49:09 > 0:49:11'It should either be a success or not a success.
0:49:11 > 0:49:13'Just get on, tell the story.'
0:49:14 > 0:49:17Where the hell have you been?
0:49:17 > 0:49:19Enjoying death.
0:49:20 > 0:49:23007, reporting for duty.
0:49:24 > 0:49:28Judi being cast as M was just a piece of inspired casting.
0:49:28 > 0:49:31It allowed a female voice...
0:49:34 > 0:49:36Something that was probably needed
0:49:36 > 0:49:38in a Bond...
0:49:38 > 0:49:40..in the Bond franchise.
0:49:40 > 0:49:43She came in and she took it, and she made it her own.
0:49:46 > 0:49:50Her first outing was back in 1995 with Pierce Brosnan,
0:49:50 > 0:49:52who was also new to the Bond family.
0:49:56 > 0:49:58Would you care for a drink?
0:49:58 > 0:50:02Thank you. Your predecessor kept some cognac in the top...
0:50:02 > 0:50:05- I prefer bourbon. Ice?- Yes.
0:50:05 > 0:50:08I remember Pierce Brosnan's first day with Judi,
0:50:08 > 0:50:09and it transpired
0:50:09 > 0:50:13that he was absolutely terrified.
0:50:13 > 0:50:15We were chatting in the lift
0:50:15 > 0:50:18and he was going, "Well, you've worked with her. What's she like?"
0:50:18 > 0:50:20And I was going, "Well, she's lovely, she's divine."
0:50:20 > 0:50:22He was going, "Yes, but you know, she's...
0:50:22 > 0:50:24"It's Judi Dench!"
0:50:24 > 0:50:29'It's our first time together as James Bond and M.
0:50:29 > 0:50:33'Both of us, I think, are quite anxious and nervous. They wanted her
0:50:33 > 0:50:36to have a cup of tea in her hand
0:50:36 > 0:50:38and she said, "No, that's going to
0:50:38 > 0:50:39"rattle too much."
0:50:39 > 0:50:41She said, "Just give me a Scotch."
0:50:41 > 0:50:44So she sat there with a Scotch in her hand.
0:50:44 > 0:50:48I said to her, "Do you like doing films?" She said, "Oh, no, no.
0:50:48 > 0:50:50"I don't like films at all."
0:50:50 > 0:50:53You don't like me, Bond. You don't like my methods.
0:50:53 > 0:50:55You think I'm an accountant.
0:50:55 > 0:50:58A bean counter, more interested in my numbers than your instincts.
0:50:58 > 0:51:00- The thought had occurred to me. - Good.
0:51:00 > 0:51:03Because I think you're a sexist, misogynist dinosaur.
0:51:03 > 0:51:05A relic of the Cold War.
0:51:05 > 0:51:08That particular scene, and that line,
0:51:08 > 0:51:13really set the benchmark for the rest of her career playing M.
0:51:14 > 0:51:17- Point taken.- Not quite, 007.
0:51:17 > 0:51:20She gave it a context, for the first time,
0:51:20 > 0:51:22rather than us feeling like
0:51:22 > 0:51:24we're in this permanent time warp
0:51:24 > 0:51:27of 1969 or '72,
0:51:27 > 0:51:31the sort of Connery, Roger Moore axis, and basically,
0:51:31 > 0:51:35they were stuck there forever.
0:51:35 > 0:51:38You know. She somehow went, "Actually, no, we can...
0:51:38 > 0:51:39"This is now."
0:51:39 > 0:51:43- AMERICAN REPORTERS:- M, over here, M! - Judi!
0:51:43 > 0:51:45But however much Judi brought to Bond,
0:51:45 > 0:51:48her screen time was still limited -
0:51:48 > 0:51:50until director Sam Mendes took over.
0:51:52 > 0:51:54When I directed Bond, I thought, "Hang on a minute,
0:51:54 > 0:51:57"we haven't exploited the fact we've got a great actor
0:51:57 > 0:51:59"playing M."
0:51:59 > 0:52:01Take the shot.
0:52:01 > 0:52:03- I can't, I'm... - Take the bloody shot.
0:52:03 > 0:52:07So let's try and unlock the potential of the character
0:52:07 > 0:52:10and her genuine interaction with Bond.
0:52:10 > 0:52:15That's something that I felt Judi could bring that nobody else could.
0:52:16 > 0:52:19His name is Thiago Rodriguez.
0:52:19 > 0:52:21He was a brilliant agent.
0:52:21 > 0:52:25But he started operating beyond his brief, hacking the Chinese.
0:52:25 > 0:52:29The handover was coming up and they were onto him, so I gave him up.
0:52:31 > 0:52:34Yeah, she stole every scene she's in.
0:52:34 > 0:52:36But, I mean, what a joy is that, for me as an actor.
0:52:36 > 0:52:40When people like Judi walk on set, I relax.
0:52:40 > 0:52:42With Judi, you're always guaranteed a little magic.
0:52:42 > 0:52:45Who is your favourite Bond?
0:52:45 > 0:52:48Oh, you see, I knew that would come up.
0:52:48 > 0:52:50How can I say that? Now, how can I say that?
0:52:50 > 0:52:52How would Pierce feel?
0:52:52 > 0:52:54Dame Judi might feel differently
0:52:54 > 0:52:57if she knew the role that Craig had played in her demise
0:52:57 > 0:53:00in her last Bond outing, Skyfall.
0:53:00 > 0:53:04I think I actually was the one who came up with the idea.
0:53:04 > 0:53:07You try and think of what's the biggest, best story you can tell.
0:53:07 > 0:53:09And that seemed to me...
0:53:09 > 0:53:14To me and everybody in the room, to be the biggest and most emotionally
0:53:14 > 0:53:17kind of charged story we could tell.
0:53:17 > 0:53:22Then we had to, of course, break the news to Judi, which wasn't so easy.
0:53:24 > 0:53:27'I had 17 years of being M,
0:53:27 > 0:53:30'so I had a full go at it.'
0:53:30 > 0:53:32Christ. 'And I loved it.
0:53:32 > 0:53:33'Just loved it.'
0:53:35 > 0:53:38I think she was drawing on the fact that she had had this long,
0:53:38 > 0:53:40seven-movie relationship with the franchise
0:53:40 > 0:53:42and it felt to her like M's relationship with MI6
0:53:42 > 0:53:44was the equivalent.
0:53:45 > 0:53:49She was grieving it, and it's nice when art and life intersect
0:53:49 > 0:53:53to the degree, when someone who has had a 20-year relationship
0:53:53 > 0:53:56with the role is actually saying goodbye to it.
0:53:56 > 0:54:01In Skyfall, M had become the film's driving force.
0:54:01 > 0:54:03Judi Dench - the ultimate Bond girl.
0:54:03 > 0:54:06I read your obituary of me.
0:54:06 > 0:54:07And?
0:54:07 > 0:54:09Appalling.
0:54:09 > 0:54:11Yeah, I knew you'd hate it.
0:54:13 > 0:54:16I did call you, "an exemplar of British fortitude."
0:54:16 > 0:54:18That bit was all right.
0:54:20 > 0:54:23Judi's days in Bond may be over,
0:54:23 > 0:54:26but since then, she has performed on stage, on television and in film,
0:54:26 > 0:54:31where she reprised her role as Queen Victoria.
0:54:36 > 0:54:40I said, "I'll only make this if Judi does it."
0:54:40 > 0:54:41And I cannot guarantee that she'll
0:54:41 > 0:54:45want to put all those clothes on again.
0:54:45 > 0:54:48But it's a wicked, mischievous part, so...
0:54:48 > 0:54:50I don't think it would have been something
0:54:50 > 0:54:52I would have done by choice but once I got the script
0:54:52 > 0:54:55and I knew Stephen was directing it, I thought
0:54:55 > 0:54:58I would definitely want to do it and I'm very pleased I have.
0:55:02 > 0:55:04Judi co-starred with the actor, Ali Fazal.
0:55:04 > 0:55:06Ali plays the Indian servant, Abdul,
0:55:06 > 0:55:08who becomes Queen Victoria's confidante.
0:55:11 > 0:55:14There are very few people I really admired as a child.
0:55:14 > 0:55:17It was Judi Dench, it was Meryl Streep, Marlon Brando, DeNiro
0:55:17 > 0:55:19and these were actors we would idolise.
0:55:23 > 0:55:26And then to be able to work with her, I mean, it was...
0:55:26 > 0:55:27It was a dream come true.
0:55:28 > 0:55:33My first scene, actually, with her, there was 200 people on set.
0:55:33 > 0:55:36Honestly, I was nervous, it was all there...
0:55:36 > 0:55:38..for you to see.
0:55:38 > 0:55:43Profiteroles have gone. Gentlemen, process, turn, bow, present.
0:55:43 > 0:55:47And absolutely no eye contact whatsoever.
0:55:47 > 0:55:51FANFARE
0:55:51 > 0:55:53One of the film's key scenes is where Abdul has to present
0:55:53 > 0:55:56a ceremonial coin to Queen Victoria but not to catch her eye.
0:56:01 > 0:56:03The subtle interplay between the two co-stars
0:56:03 > 0:56:05hints at the relationship that follows.
0:56:09 > 0:56:14- I remember both of us looked at Stephen.- Eyes!
0:56:14 > 0:56:16And we were like, "Is that OK for you, Stephen?"
0:56:16 > 0:56:18And Stephen just walks up to her and says...
0:56:18 > 0:56:20"Judi, just act better."
0:56:22 > 0:56:29And I thought, that was the best ice breaker, everybody was in splits.
0:56:29 > 0:56:31And action, Ali.
0:56:31 > 0:56:37As the film progresses, Abdul begins to teach Queen Victoria Urdu.
0:56:38 > 0:56:40ABDUL SPEAKS URDU
0:56:40 > 0:56:41"I am the Queen."
0:56:41 > 0:56:44- I see. - Judi Dench was a good student.
0:56:44 > 0:56:47We would sit together and we would do our lines
0:56:47 > 0:56:48and we would do the Urdu.
0:56:50 > 0:56:52Luckily, I knew the Urdu well,
0:56:52 > 0:56:55so, eventually it was me you know, writing it all for her,
0:56:55 > 0:56:58recording the dialogues for her or we would just practice.
0:57:00 > 0:57:03JUDI SPEAKS URDU
0:57:05 > 0:57:08That took me ages but with Ali, you know, it was somebody on hand
0:57:08 > 0:57:10to say, "It's not like that, it's like this."
0:57:14 > 0:57:16She's constantly trying to reinvent herself.
0:57:16 > 0:57:19She's trying to make mistakes, she is making mistakes
0:57:19 > 0:57:21and learning from them.
0:57:21 > 0:57:24At that age, with that experience.
0:57:24 > 0:57:27It gives you so much to work with.
0:57:31 > 0:57:34The lucky ones are people like Judi who find what they're good at
0:57:34 > 0:57:36and are allowed to lead an interesting life.
0:57:44 > 0:57:46Would you ever consider retiring?
0:57:46 > 0:57:48No. No.
0:57:50 > 0:57:52It's a really dirty word.
0:57:52 > 0:57:57Old and retiring, those are really dirty words.
0:57:57 > 0:57:59I think she wants to go on working until she can't do it any
0:57:59 > 0:58:03longer and would love to expire probably, preferably, on stage.
0:58:07 > 0:58:10I don't think it's unusual for somebody to want to work
0:58:10 > 0:58:13when their means of expression artistically is their talent,
0:58:13 > 0:58:17their God-given gift and that's what she has.
0:58:19 > 0:58:21I think she is a figurehead.
0:58:21 > 0:58:23A woman of great integrity, beauty, charm, intellect.
0:58:23 > 0:58:25And, above all, humanity.
0:58:31 > 0:58:32She's not like other people.
0:58:32 > 0:58:34If other people were the same as Judi,
0:58:34 > 0:58:36we wouldn't be talking about her.
0:58:39 > 0:58:40You've got to progress.
0:58:41 > 0:58:43You can't ever stand still.
0:58:43 > 0:58:45You can't go back or at least you hope you won't,
0:58:45 > 0:58:47stand still or go back.
0:58:47 > 0:58:51And also, you're aware of the mistakes that one can make.
0:58:51 > 0:58:53It's like building a house of cards.
0:58:53 > 0:58:57Your hand starts to shake when you get up to the top.