0:00:02 > 0:00:04When I heard the name Black Is The New Black, it made me smile.
0:00:04 > 0:00:06'I think we're on the edge of a revolution.'
0:00:06 > 0:00:07Boom!
0:00:07 > 0:00:12We have our own thing. And it's really...rich.
0:00:13 > 0:00:15We're the influencers, the taste makers.
0:00:15 > 0:00:18Remember when we invented jazz, and you didn't know what it was?
0:00:18 > 0:00:20Well, now we're going to do something else.
0:00:21 > 0:00:25I've never really seen myself as an immigrant. I see myself as a person.
0:00:28 > 0:00:32I'm proud to be black. I've never cared to be any other way.
0:00:32 > 0:00:33Everybody wants to be us -
0:00:33 > 0:00:36but they only want the good parts of being us.
0:00:36 > 0:00:37HE SUCKS HIS TEETH
0:00:37 > 0:00:40They want our physicality. They want our musicality.
0:00:40 > 0:00:44Selling our culture, it's like one big hustle.
0:00:44 > 0:00:46They want our talent, they want our dancing skills,
0:00:46 > 0:00:48they want our singing skills.
0:00:48 > 0:00:49Music hasn't got no colour.
0:00:49 > 0:00:52The oppressed always find a way to celebrate, right?
0:00:54 > 0:00:55It was a great feeling.
0:00:55 > 0:00:56We are people of talent,
0:00:56 > 0:00:59people of vision.
0:00:59 > 0:01:00People of passion.
0:01:02 > 0:01:05There's a great seam of British success.
0:01:07 > 0:01:11And when it stands out, it is dazzling.
0:01:11 > 0:01:13And we should celebrate it.
0:01:14 > 0:01:16We should celebrate it.
0:01:30 > 0:01:33INTERVIEWER: Can I ask
0:01:33 > 0:01:35why you agreed to take part in this show?
0:01:35 > 0:01:36I have a story to tell.
0:01:36 > 0:01:39I think it's important that
0:01:39 > 0:01:43not just black people but people in general see the journeys.
0:01:43 > 0:01:46When I heard that something like this was happening I thought,
0:01:46 > 0:01:48"I should do this, it's really important."
0:01:48 > 0:01:51Anything that documents our existence is important.
0:01:51 > 0:01:54I heard the concept, and as a black woman being born in this country,
0:01:54 > 0:01:56I said, "I definitely want to be part of that."
0:01:56 > 0:01:59I'm glad that a show like this is happening.
0:01:59 > 0:02:00Voices need to be heard.
0:02:00 > 0:02:02People don't hear us talking like this.
0:02:02 > 0:02:05My listeners don't hear me talking like this.
0:02:05 > 0:02:07And I look at a lot of
0:02:07 > 0:02:10very famous black achievers,
0:02:10 > 0:02:13and I always wonder, did THEY go through the same thing?
0:02:13 > 0:02:15In life, there's a time for things,
0:02:15 > 0:02:19and I think it was just time for a piece like this to be made.
0:02:19 > 0:02:23We need to see black icons talking in an honest fashion about
0:02:23 > 0:02:25how they came up, where they came from,
0:02:25 > 0:02:28what it's about, and actually seeing the real person rather than
0:02:28 > 0:02:30what you've read about in the newspapers.
0:02:30 > 0:02:32I also hope it will help
0:02:32 > 0:02:36Britain's own self-understanding.
0:02:38 > 0:02:40I can't lie,
0:02:40 > 0:02:45it gives me a little bit of a thrill to know how much that statement,
0:02:45 > 0:02:50me saying, "Made in England," gets under the skin of a few people
0:02:50 > 0:02:52who certainly do not see me
0:02:52 > 0:02:54as being English.
0:02:54 > 0:02:59But sorry, I was born here, I was raised here, and this is what I am.
0:02:59 > 0:03:01I feel fantastic being black and British.
0:03:01 > 0:03:03I'm serious. I am British.
0:03:03 > 0:03:04Can't you tell?
0:03:11 > 0:03:15For me, Britain's important because I was raised and born here.
0:03:15 > 0:03:19Everything that I've done has been spawned from being in Britain.
0:03:19 > 0:03:23So I'm very proud of my blackness and my British heritance.
0:03:23 > 0:03:26This is the flag that I would always fly.
0:03:26 > 0:03:29I was brought up in London,
0:03:29 > 0:03:31and I'm as British as it gets.
0:03:31 > 0:03:34What can I say? I'm proud to be British.
0:03:34 > 0:03:36I just think we're very blessed to live in this country.
0:03:36 > 0:03:40I've served in the British Army, in the British Parliament,
0:03:40 > 0:03:43member of the Court of the Bank of England, the judiciary,
0:03:43 > 0:03:45the English and Wales Cricket Board.
0:03:45 > 0:03:46I can't be any more British,
0:03:46 > 0:03:49there aren't many British institutions
0:03:49 > 0:03:50that haven't touched my life!
0:03:50 > 0:03:54I more think, "Are you losing your Jamaican?"
0:03:54 > 0:03:56That's my question!
0:03:57 > 0:03:59I would describe myself always as West Indian.
0:03:59 > 0:04:02On my passport it says, "British."
0:04:02 > 0:04:05But the passport I had in the West Indies also said "British."
0:04:05 > 0:04:08Am I proud to be British...?
0:04:08 > 0:04:10Er...!
0:04:10 > 0:04:13For many years, when I was growing up,
0:04:13 > 0:04:17the society that you were in
0:04:17 > 0:04:19said very clearly, "If you are black,
0:04:19 > 0:04:24"you are not British."
0:04:24 > 0:04:27I didn't feel really British
0:04:27 > 0:04:29until in my 30s.
0:04:29 > 0:04:31I've never really felt British.
0:04:34 > 0:04:35Is the truthful answer.
0:04:35 > 0:04:37When a group of friends go to a friend's house and
0:04:37 > 0:04:40their dad doesn't let you in because your skin's a different colour,
0:04:40 > 0:04:42you don't FEEL like you belong.
0:04:42 > 0:04:44People were always asking you,
0:04:44 > 0:04:46"No, no, but where do you REALLY come from?"
0:04:50 > 0:04:54Some people think in this country I'm American, which bugs me.
0:04:54 > 0:04:56I've often felt
0:04:56 > 0:04:58I've had to prove myself more in my own country than anywhere else.
0:04:58 > 0:05:00I still feel that way.
0:05:02 > 0:05:05What IS Britain? How do you define a British person?
0:05:06 > 0:05:09Britishness isn't about singularity -
0:05:09 > 0:05:12Britain is actually about difference.
0:05:12 > 0:05:15It's like a microcosm of the globe,
0:05:15 > 0:05:17situated here in the UK.
0:05:17 > 0:05:19I think it's complicated today
0:05:19 > 0:05:23to be British, full stop.
0:05:23 > 0:05:26To be black British is like...
0:05:26 > 0:05:29There's a gazillion question marks over that.
0:05:29 > 0:05:32This British accent has got me out of a lot of trouble.
0:05:32 > 0:05:34Being stopped by a police officer in America,
0:05:34 > 0:05:36then I start speaking and he's like, "Oh, my God -
0:05:36 > 0:05:38"I'm sorry, I thought you were black."
0:05:43 > 0:05:46The first time I really started thinking, "Man...
0:05:48 > 0:05:50"..I'm British," was the Olympics.
0:05:50 > 0:05:52It's one of those rare
0:05:52 > 0:05:55British events where I recognise myself.
0:05:55 > 0:05:59Oh... There was Dizzee Rascal, the representation of Britain.
0:05:59 > 0:06:01For the first time in my life, on television,
0:06:01 > 0:06:04I felt that I was being represented,
0:06:04 > 0:06:06as a British person.
0:06:06 > 0:06:08'It was a real high point.'
0:06:08 > 0:06:10The first time on a global stage
0:06:10 > 0:06:13where the black British experience
0:06:13 > 0:06:18was expressed as a vital part of British identity.
0:06:20 > 0:06:24This is a picture of me in full flight
0:06:24 > 0:06:25singing the closing song
0:06:25 > 0:06:27of the Paralympic opening ceremony.
0:06:27 > 0:06:30And at that precise moment
0:06:30 > 0:06:33and for the ten minutes that I was on that stage,
0:06:33 > 0:06:39I became the symbol of what modern Britain is.
0:06:39 > 0:06:42Me. Just me.
0:06:42 > 0:06:47Black athletes wrapping themselves in the Union Jack...
0:06:47 > 0:06:49And I see them people cheering for Mo Farah
0:06:49 > 0:06:51and it didn't matter where he was from -
0:06:51 > 0:06:53and I was like, "Man...
0:06:53 > 0:06:55"This is what I'm talking about."
0:06:55 > 0:06:58It has left a real good feel factor around us at the moment, you know,
0:06:58 > 0:07:00and that's great, and that does in itself bring community,
0:07:00 > 0:07:03but we need it on a wider scale.
0:07:03 > 0:07:04Can't just be sport.
0:07:06 > 0:07:09I always used to say to myself, "I don't have any heroes,
0:07:09 > 0:07:12"I don't have this one person that I look to."
0:07:12 > 0:07:15Actually, when I reflect on it further, in fact I have MANY people.
0:07:15 > 0:07:18I think the figures that have been most inspirational to me
0:07:18 > 0:07:20are the ones who are most fully
0:07:20 > 0:07:22themselves. Because in the end,
0:07:22 > 0:07:26that's what I think anyone can aspire to be.
0:07:26 > 0:07:29And there's a wonderful African saying again -
0:07:29 > 0:07:32"The person who stands out in a crowd,
0:07:32 > 0:07:33"they're doing so
0:07:33 > 0:07:35"because they're being carried
0:07:35 > 0:07:37"on the shoulders of others."
0:07:40 > 0:07:44When Obama was thinking of standing for President, Michelle said to him,
0:07:44 > 0:07:46cos she wasn't keen, "What will you achieve?"
0:07:46 > 0:07:49And he said, "At least they will look at us differently."
0:07:49 > 0:07:55I sat up all night watching Obama's election. Sat up all night.
0:07:55 > 0:07:57It was one of those moments, I think, when
0:07:57 > 0:07:59you sit up and you watch history.
0:07:59 > 0:08:02I think everyone's aspiration levels went higher, basically.
0:08:02 > 0:08:06Everyone around the world - even in the depths of Africa -
0:08:06 > 0:08:09I think people were like, "Damn, if Obama can be President,
0:08:09 > 0:08:11"I can at least do something."
0:08:11 > 0:08:15I remember sitting my son down when Obama was inaugurated.
0:08:15 > 0:08:17And I sat there, tears streaming down my eyes, I said,
0:08:17 > 0:08:20"Miles, you've got to look at this, you've got to look at this."
0:08:20 > 0:08:22He didn't really feel the significance.
0:08:22 > 0:08:23Because as far as he's concerned,
0:08:23 > 0:08:26the number-one tennis players in the world were black,
0:08:26 > 0:08:28there's a black racing driver...
0:08:28 > 0:08:30"What are you talking about? It's a different world," that kind of vibe.
0:08:30 > 0:08:33And I'm like, "No, this is seismic, this is a huge moment,
0:08:33 > 0:08:38"you don't understand. In my life, I never thought I'd see this."
0:08:39 > 0:08:40- HIS VOICE CRACKS - Do you know what I mean?
0:08:43 > 0:08:45I cried.
0:08:45 > 0:08:46I cried.
0:08:46 > 0:08:49Because it gave
0:08:49 > 0:08:51me hope
0:08:51 > 0:08:54that the world is...is changing.
0:08:55 > 0:08:57That black people are moving forward.
0:08:58 > 0:09:00And upwards.
0:09:00 > 0:09:03I believe we live in a day and an age now where
0:09:03 > 0:09:05anything can happen.
0:09:05 > 0:09:09There was a massive thing around Barack Obama becoming President.
0:09:09 > 0:09:13So I don't see why there couldn't be a black Prime Minister.
0:09:13 > 0:09:15I don't see why not.
0:09:15 > 0:09:19It wasn't just Obama - it was the black family.
0:09:20 > 0:09:24It was thousands of people cheering the black family.
0:09:24 > 0:09:26That's what really...
0:09:27 > 0:09:28..just blew me away.
0:09:28 > 0:09:30The confidence they had.
0:09:31 > 0:09:34And that people were cheering them, celebrating them.
0:09:34 > 0:09:36It's wonderful to see.
0:09:36 > 0:09:37Inspirational.
0:09:41 > 0:09:43So now we've had the black President -
0:09:43 > 0:09:46albeit at the time when everything's falling apart.
0:09:46 > 0:09:49What's he going to do? Use gaffer tape and stick it all together?
0:09:49 > 0:09:53People thought that when Obama became President, it's...
0:09:53 > 0:09:56"Yay, racism's going to end." And stupid people,
0:09:56 > 0:09:59they're like, "How can there still be racism?
0:09:59 > 0:10:01"We have a black President."
0:10:01 > 0:10:04It's actually got worse. Because the racists got angrier.
0:10:04 > 0:10:07They were furious, and they're still furious.
0:10:07 > 0:10:09And it hasn't helped us at all, unfortunately.
0:10:09 > 0:10:11It's amazing for kids coming up -
0:10:11 > 0:10:13they'll never know of a life
0:10:13 > 0:10:14where you couldn't be a President
0:10:14 > 0:10:17as a black man, which is a beautiful thing.
0:10:20 > 0:10:22When I became a professional footballer,
0:10:22 > 0:10:24I thought the highest accolade I could get
0:10:24 > 0:10:26was to represent my country.
0:10:26 > 0:10:29I always remember my dad telling me a story about one of his friends
0:10:29 > 0:10:32going to a pub, and me scoring for England.
0:10:32 > 0:10:36And there was a group of guys who didn't celebrate.
0:10:36 > 0:10:39And he asked them why.
0:10:39 > 0:10:41He said, "He's just scored, why aren't you celebrating?"
0:10:41 > 0:10:42"He's black.
0:10:44 > 0:10:47"We don't celebrate when black people score for England."
0:10:47 > 0:10:50Well... That's hard to take. Erm...
0:10:50 > 0:10:52Cos here you are,
0:10:52 > 0:10:54representing the country that you feel that you...
0:10:54 > 0:10:57Well, I was born here,
0:10:57 > 0:10:59I'm British,
0:10:59 > 0:11:03but still you're not accepted by some.
0:11:03 > 0:11:07And from one level I'm thinking, I'm at the pinnacle here,
0:11:07 > 0:11:10but then I've just been shot right back down here again.
0:11:10 > 0:11:13And almost, like, put back into...into my place.
0:11:17 > 0:11:20My wife was a secretary
0:11:20 > 0:11:21for the Church of England Vicars.
0:11:21 > 0:11:23And she's forgotten some material
0:11:23 > 0:11:24so I actually drove from Stepney
0:11:24 > 0:11:26to Woking, to deliver it.
0:11:26 > 0:11:29So it meant I'm coming back slightly late,
0:11:29 > 0:11:31at about nine o'clock, nine, ten o'clock.
0:11:32 > 0:11:36Then I'm stopped by a City of London Police officer.
0:11:36 > 0:11:37Tells me to get out of the car.
0:11:39 > 0:11:41It was raining, and he searched me.
0:11:41 > 0:11:44And then he said, "Open the boot."
0:11:44 > 0:11:47I opened the boot - there was just nothing in the boot.
0:11:47 > 0:11:50And he looks at me, asks me, "What's your name?" I said, "Sentamu."
0:11:50 > 0:11:52What do you do?
0:11:52 > 0:11:54By that time, he's seen my collar -
0:11:54 > 0:11:57I used to wear a dog collar which I cut off because of Mugabe now,
0:11:57 > 0:12:00but anyway, he saw my collar.
0:12:00 > 0:12:03He says, "Oops." Realises what he's just done.
0:12:03 > 0:12:05And I said, "Officer, any reason
0:12:05 > 0:12:08"why you stopped me,
0:12:08 > 0:12:10"and why you searched me?"
0:12:10 > 0:12:12How did I feel
0:12:12 > 0:12:13when he said, "Oops"...?
0:12:13 > 0:12:15And it's raining...
0:12:15 > 0:12:17You say to yourself,
0:12:17 > 0:12:19we had finished the Stephen Lawrence inquiry,
0:12:19 > 0:12:21our recommendations had been made clear.
0:12:21 > 0:12:24It is as if somebody hadn't noticed.
0:12:25 > 0:12:28I am a bishop, I have a bit of education,
0:12:28 > 0:12:32I can defend my case -
0:12:32 > 0:12:35what happens to an ordinary black guy?
0:12:35 > 0:12:37That worried me.
0:12:37 > 0:12:39It still worries me.
0:12:41 > 0:12:43I've been shocked by
0:12:43 > 0:12:48the xenophobia recently around Brexit.
0:12:48 > 0:12:52I used to be really proud of Britain when I travelled in Europe
0:12:52 > 0:12:57and I heard and saw levels of discrimination over there,
0:12:57 > 0:13:00and I used to be really proud and I used to say,
0:13:00 > 0:13:01"That would never happen in Britain,
0:13:01 > 0:13:04"that would never be condoned in Britain."
0:13:04 > 0:13:06Most people who voted to leave the European Union,
0:13:06 > 0:13:08they were voting on immigration.
0:13:08 > 0:13:13So there's this whole atmosphere of xenophobia and racism.
0:13:13 > 0:13:16I've been racially abused at least three times on the street now,
0:13:16 > 0:13:18in south London. It's extraordinary.
0:13:18 > 0:13:21So we are at a pivotal time now.
0:13:21 > 0:13:25As long as we are in denial, we'll never progress.
0:13:25 > 0:13:27I think it's sad that
0:13:27 > 0:13:31I can read books from James Baldwin,
0:13:31 > 0:13:33and literally make direct links
0:13:33 > 0:13:36to the things he was talking about in the '50s and '60s
0:13:36 > 0:13:38to 2016.
0:13:39 > 0:13:41In black Britain.
0:13:49 > 0:13:51Every country is based on flows of people,
0:13:51 > 0:13:54every country is based on cultural shifts.
0:13:54 > 0:13:58And, you know, the reason I've lived in Britain all my life
0:13:58 > 0:13:59is actually because it's been more
0:13:59 > 0:14:03open to that than many other countries -
0:14:03 > 0:14:06I think Britain's in fact an incredible place because,
0:14:06 > 0:14:08short of the Brexit vote,
0:14:08 > 0:14:11our entire trajectory in post-war times
0:14:11 > 0:14:15has been towards an embrace of difference and diversity.
0:14:17 > 0:14:20I think immigration,
0:14:20 > 0:14:23different sets of people coming together and living together -
0:14:23 > 0:14:25not always happily -
0:14:25 > 0:14:28has made Britain all the stronger,
0:14:28 > 0:14:30all the better, all the more exciting,
0:14:30 > 0:14:34all the more significant internationally as a place to live.
0:14:34 > 0:14:36Because we have this conversation
0:14:36 > 0:14:38that takes place all the time
0:14:38 > 0:14:40about who we are.
0:14:40 > 0:14:44There are lots of white people
0:14:44 > 0:14:48with whom I have more in common than lots of black people.
0:14:48 > 0:14:50To be working class and white in Britain
0:14:50 > 0:14:52and to feel that
0:14:52 > 0:14:55you've been overlooked...
0:14:56 > 0:14:59..undermined,
0:14:59 > 0:15:01forgotten, disparaged...
0:15:01 > 0:15:03And they're angry.
0:15:03 > 0:15:05They're angry that they haven't got jobs,
0:15:05 > 0:15:07they're angry that their industries have gone.
0:15:07 > 0:15:09They're angry that their politicians don't stand up for them.
0:15:09 > 0:15:13I actually have some sympathy for that.
0:15:13 > 0:15:16The place where I depart is, well, who's to blame for that?
0:15:16 > 0:15:20And of course, there are some people who will blame the visible other or
0:15:20 > 0:15:24the audible other, someone they can hear speaking a different language,
0:15:24 > 0:15:27someone who's wearing a hijab or a niqab...
0:15:27 > 0:15:29I'm pretty sure
0:15:29 > 0:15:33that those Roma children or that Muslim woman
0:15:33 > 0:15:35did not trade in credit default swaps,
0:15:35 > 0:15:37that crashed the economy
0:15:37 > 0:15:39and drew all the money
0:15:39 > 0:15:41out of the local council,
0:15:41 > 0:15:42that means you're no longer getting
0:15:42 > 0:15:45the disability services that you require,
0:15:45 > 0:15:46I'm sure it wasn't her.
0:15:46 > 0:15:48I think in that dialogue,
0:15:48 > 0:15:53the issues of specifics relating to black Britons
0:15:53 > 0:15:54perhaps has been a bit lost.
0:15:54 > 0:15:59We always used to be part of the working class, and Labour.
0:15:59 > 0:16:01I think those boundaries have gone now.
0:16:01 > 0:16:03And perhaps
0:16:03 > 0:16:06many of us are now maybe more aspirational,
0:16:06 > 0:16:08maybe identify with
0:16:08 > 0:16:09just a different
0:16:09 > 0:16:11political idea.
0:16:16 > 0:16:19You often get, as somebody of mixed-race background,
0:16:19 > 0:16:24people trying to get you to choose between your different heritages.
0:16:24 > 0:16:26"Are you black or are you white?"
0:16:26 > 0:16:27I am black, but I also have
0:16:27 > 0:16:29a European background too.
0:16:29 > 0:16:30How can you be both?
0:16:30 > 0:16:33I always remember Tiger Woods making the statement, "I'm not black."
0:16:33 > 0:16:35And it was on the front page
0:16:35 > 0:16:39of Britain's biggest-selling black weekly, The Voice.
0:16:39 > 0:16:40Tiger Woods says, "I'm not black."
0:16:40 > 0:16:43I respect where he's coming from,
0:16:43 > 0:16:47but the problem I felt for him, and he's also of a mixed heritage,
0:16:47 > 0:16:48is that he allowed himself
0:16:48 > 0:16:51to be dictated by others in terms of who he defined himself by.
0:16:51 > 0:16:54And the only mistake he made there
0:16:54 > 0:16:55was in saying "I am not" -
0:16:55 > 0:16:57whereas you need to assert who you ARE.
0:16:59 > 0:17:02If I'm not white, I'm black.
0:17:02 > 0:17:04That's what I've found in my life, you know?
0:17:04 > 0:17:05No-one ever refers to me as mixed race.
0:17:05 > 0:17:07It took years and years
0:17:07 > 0:17:10to even have on a form anything other,
0:17:10 > 0:17:14it was like, "White", then it was "Black", and then there was "Other".
0:17:14 > 0:17:15And I remember so clearly
0:17:15 > 0:17:18my mum taking a form back to a counter and saying,
0:17:18 > 0:17:20"If you think I'm going to tick 'Other' for my children,
0:17:20 > 0:17:22"you've another thing coming."
0:17:22 > 0:17:25My wife is white,
0:17:25 > 0:17:28my children are of mixed heritage.
0:17:28 > 0:17:30When I look at them,
0:17:30 > 0:17:33I see another stage in a journey,
0:17:33 > 0:17:35that starts with my parents
0:17:35 > 0:17:38and continues with my marriage, continues with them.
0:17:38 > 0:17:41What I'm sceptical about in that
0:17:41 > 0:17:43is that this is a journey to a kind of
0:17:43 > 0:17:46utopian state where because they're kind of mixed heritage,
0:17:46 > 0:17:47that's the best of all worlds.
0:17:47 > 0:17:50That's not what I say to them.
0:17:50 > 0:17:53I try and give them
0:17:53 > 0:17:55an understanding that the world is a complicated place.
0:17:55 > 0:17:58That the world isn't a harmonious place.
0:17:58 > 0:18:00That the world doesn't actually have to be a SCARY place,
0:18:00 > 0:18:03but that the world is defined by difference.
0:18:03 > 0:18:05We all have to grapple
0:18:05 > 0:18:07with this understanding that the world isn't a place of purities.
0:18:07 > 0:18:11I was the only
0:18:11 > 0:18:14non-white person in the senior school at that time.
0:18:14 > 0:18:18I really wanted to get my hair in canerows, and
0:18:18 > 0:18:21I went into school the first day,
0:18:21 > 0:18:24and that was it, there was a call home.
0:18:24 > 0:18:27I think I had to leave school that day as well.
0:18:27 > 0:18:29And it was a really big deal.
0:18:29 > 0:18:32Bearing in mind that I couldn't just put gel in my hair,
0:18:32 > 0:18:34I couldn't just have a comb-over -
0:18:34 > 0:18:38I either had it as an Afro, or it was braided.
0:18:38 > 0:18:40The best comment that was ever said to me was,
0:18:40 > 0:18:43"We understand that you want to be like David Beckham."
0:18:46 > 0:18:48And still to this moment,
0:18:48 > 0:18:52that comment just sits with me
0:18:52 > 0:18:55and it just shows me such a severe lack of understanding.
0:18:55 > 0:18:57And it was my mum,
0:18:57 > 0:19:01who is my white parent, who went into the school and said
0:19:01 > 0:19:06you're actually victimising him for the hair type he's got.
0:19:06 > 0:19:09You know, his racial identity. You can't do that.
0:19:11 > 0:19:15The Kardashians are celebrated for putting their hair in canerows,
0:19:15 > 0:19:18and you've got schoolgirls in the South West
0:19:18 > 0:19:19that have been sent home from school
0:19:19 > 0:19:22for having their hair braided.
0:19:22 > 0:19:25When nonsense like that stops,
0:19:25 > 0:19:26then we know that we're equal.
0:19:30 > 0:19:32As early adapters and
0:19:32 > 0:19:37early creators, early inventors,
0:19:37 > 0:19:38early messers-abouters,
0:19:38 > 0:19:41black artists rarely get the credit they deserve.
0:19:41 > 0:19:44When it comes to the word "appropriation",
0:19:44 > 0:19:47you have to look at individual cases.
0:19:47 > 0:19:51When it comes to APPRECIATION - that is obviously a lot wider.
0:19:51 > 0:19:53Yeah. I call it stealing.
0:19:53 > 0:19:55I don't call it appropriation.
0:19:55 > 0:19:58It IS appropriation, but it's stealing, it's theft.
0:19:58 > 0:20:00Cos they're taking it, they're using it,
0:20:00 > 0:20:02but they're not acknowledging where it's come from.
0:20:03 > 0:20:05It's theft!
0:20:05 > 0:20:07I agree.
0:20:07 > 0:20:08I do.
0:20:09 > 0:20:12I think there's a thin line between appropriation and appreciation.
0:20:12 > 0:20:16When you get someone like a Taylor Swift for instance,
0:20:16 > 0:20:19lampooning culture, that's when I have a problem with it.
0:20:19 > 0:20:22But when you have someone who appreciates it and
0:20:22 > 0:20:24puts it on a pedestal and says,
0:20:24 > 0:20:25"I appreciate what it is you do so much,
0:20:25 > 0:20:28"I am going to try it myself," that's when I think that
0:20:28 > 0:20:33that person shouldn't be chastised for it.
0:20:33 > 0:20:34It's a problem.
0:20:34 > 0:20:36It's really important that we
0:20:36 > 0:20:39know where our
0:20:39 > 0:20:42inspiration is coming from.
0:20:42 > 0:20:46And if we're going to take... let's give it back.
0:20:46 > 0:20:48And it's fine, you know, to appropriate black culture,
0:20:48 > 0:20:52cos we've appropriated WHITE culture.
0:20:52 > 0:20:53In a lot of ways.
0:20:53 > 0:20:57And that's why, with that fusion of those things,
0:20:57 > 0:21:00we tend to walk tall.
0:21:03 > 0:21:05Black culture for me in Britain,
0:21:05 > 0:21:10I find it's the...the roots, like, of everything.
0:21:10 > 0:21:13It starts in the streets and it makes its way up to the top.
0:21:13 > 0:21:15You put that weed, as you call it,
0:21:15 > 0:21:18the bad seed -
0:21:18 > 0:21:19put it in the ground,
0:21:19 > 0:21:22put the concrete over it, let's just cover that right up there.
0:21:22 > 0:21:24"It's going to come through, man, it's going to come through.
0:21:24 > 0:21:27"It's going to come through, it's going to weave its way through."
0:21:27 > 0:21:30And you've got black people as a whole, were there
0:21:30 > 0:21:33against all odds,
0:21:33 > 0:21:35reinventing. And coming back through.
0:21:35 > 0:21:37I think we came into Britain
0:21:37 > 0:21:39not so much like a wrecking ball,
0:21:39 > 0:21:43but like a tidal wave.
0:21:43 > 0:21:46Consumed everything that was there, kind of culturally,
0:21:46 > 0:21:48threw it up in the air,
0:21:48 > 0:21:51and when it landed, Britain was never the same again.
0:21:51 > 0:21:54And it could be you know, Chris Ofili getting elephant shit
0:21:54 > 0:21:58and putting it on a painting or Basquiat doing hip-hop art
0:21:58 > 0:22:00and elevating it to fine art.
0:22:00 > 0:22:03Ozwald Boateng putting his flavour into clothing.
0:22:03 > 0:22:07Marianne Jean-Baptiste being her own bad self at the Oscars. You know?
0:22:07 > 0:22:10Michaela Coel being so poised and so cool
0:22:10 > 0:22:11and so elegantly styled
0:22:11 > 0:22:14when she picks up her Royal Television Society award,
0:22:14 > 0:22:16and saying just the right thing.
0:22:16 > 0:22:18Because actually,
0:22:18 > 0:22:20this creativity is worth something.
0:22:20 > 0:22:22And what's interesting is
0:22:22 > 0:22:25that we know what that is from the get-go,
0:22:25 > 0:22:27and it takes a while for other people to catch on.
0:22:27 > 0:22:29We go, "Yeah, that's something I was doing two years ago.
0:22:29 > 0:22:31"Now we're doing bebop.
0:22:31 > 0:22:34"Yeah, yeah, OK, that's cool - but now we're doing RE-bop."
0:22:34 > 0:22:39Black culture should be celebrated, and it shouldn't be watered down.
0:22:39 > 0:22:42I have a very, very strong influence from
0:22:42 > 0:22:44the Jamaican side of me,
0:22:44 > 0:22:47and I want that to come across as well.
0:22:47 > 0:22:50And I would love to just see black British culture
0:22:50 > 0:22:54put on a mainstream platform in the UK,
0:22:54 > 0:22:57because I think there's a need and a hunger for it.
0:22:57 > 0:23:01And I think for OUR sanity we need it, because it's part of who we are.
0:23:01 > 0:23:03I tell you who's going to change all of this.
0:23:03 > 0:23:04John Boyega will change it all.
0:23:04 > 0:23:07John Boyega is a brilliant, brilliant young man.
0:23:07 > 0:23:08He's a mainstream name,
0:23:08 > 0:23:10so now he can sell a film in China because it doesn't matter
0:23:10 > 0:23:14that he's a black actor - he's John Boyega. He was in Star Wars.
0:23:14 > 0:23:17I'd just say that this is the time of change in general.
0:23:17 > 0:23:19So, you have transgender people
0:23:19 > 0:23:22who are changing things and are monarchs of change.
0:23:22 > 0:23:25Feminists - big up Emma Watson, by the way -
0:23:25 > 0:23:29who are these advocates of change and empowering females.
0:23:29 > 0:23:31There's gay people who are coming and changing things,
0:23:31 > 0:23:33and it's great.
0:23:33 > 0:23:37So you have to let the black guy change something, man, you have to.
0:23:38 > 0:23:41I think we have huge advantages.
0:23:41 > 0:23:44We are interconnected with the rest of the world due to our families
0:23:44 > 0:23:47in a way that many other Britons aren't.
0:23:47 > 0:23:51And we've got links to all of those countries.
0:23:51 > 0:23:54And Britain can harness the links that we have
0:23:54 > 0:23:56to bring opportunity not just
0:23:56 > 0:23:59for our own community, but all of Britain.
0:23:59 > 0:24:01I think we've got a very, very important role to play
0:24:01 > 0:24:03going forward.
0:24:03 > 0:24:07We're now waking up to this role that we have.
0:24:07 > 0:24:10Or more so,
0:24:10 > 0:24:12this identity
0:24:12 > 0:24:14that had been lost somewhere.
0:24:15 > 0:24:17"Oh, we're supposed to be American."
0:24:17 > 0:24:20No, we have our own thing.
0:24:21 > 0:24:24Hey, we not only
0:24:24 > 0:24:27have a right to BE here, but
0:24:27 > 0:24:29we can fly, by the way.
0:24:29 > 0:24:31That's like, fact.
0:24:31 > 0:24:34I think we are on the edge of a...
0:24:34 > 0:24:35a sort of a revolution.
0:24:35 > 0:24:38It's on a really...
0:24:38 > 0:24:40an awesome level,
0:24:40 > 0:24:42people...
0:24:42 > 0:24:44want to hear from us.
0:24:46 > 0:24:50INTERVIEWER: Could you raise the picture up just slightly, please...?
0:24:51 > 0:24:54Maybe it's one of the proudest moments of my life,
0:24:54 > 0:24:56other than having my children.
0:24:56 > 0:24:59It's a real thick gauge...
0:24:59 > 0:25:01I wouldn't actually call it a sculpture.
0:25:01 > 0:25:04It sits right plum in the area that I used to hang out.
0:25:04 > 0:25:08The only shame is the fact that my parents didn't really get to see it,
0:25:08 > 0:25:11but at least the grandchildren get to see that.
0:25:12 > 0:25:14I figured that being in the melting pot,
0:25:14 > 0:25:17somebody sometime will ask a question, "Who's that geezer?
0:25:17 > 0:25:19"What's all that about?"
0:25:19 > 0:25:22And they will go on and talk about the Funky Dread.
0:25:24 > 0:25:27My message to
0:25:27 > 0:25:29everybody in the future, including my grandchildren,
0:25:29 > 0:25:34would be to have a happy face, listen to a thumping bass,
0:25:34 > 0:25:36so we all have a loving race.
0:25:39 > 0:25:41There was a reason why my parents came here,
0:25:41 > 0:25:44there was a reason why they thought their lives
0:25:44 > 0:25:47could be bettered by being here.
0:25:47 > 0:25:49And despite,
0:25:49 > 0:25:53you know, the racism and the prejudice that they experienced,
0:25:53 > 0:25:56they still were able to have that opportunity,
0:25:56 > 0:25:57it wasn't taken away from them.
0:25:57 > 0:26:00As hard as it was, they were able to rise up the ranks.
0:26:01 > 0:26:03With both my parents actually,
0:26:03 > 0:26:05I feel like I'm continuing their journey,
0:26:05 > 0:26:07which I think is what we are all doing.
0:26:07 > 0:26:10I was talking to my dad, and he was like,
0:26:10 > 0:26:13"This is when everything has started to make sense, with my children -
0:26:13 > 0:26:17"this is now, when it has made sense."
0:26:17 > 0:26:18We're in an interesting time right now.
0:26:18 > 0:26:22This attitude towards blackness I think has shifted,
0:26:22 > 0:26:24and there is now a level of pride and
0:26:24 > 0:26:26you're allowed to talk about
0:26:26 > 0:26:29your culture, your blackness, your history,
0:26:29 > 0:26:30without feeling that, you know,
0:26:30 > 0:26:32you're throwing up a fist for Black Power.
0:26:32 > 0:26:36Maybe this generation, if they could just put the phone down,
0:26:36 > 0:26:37stop texting,
0:26:37 > 0:26:39stop doing the swipe to the left or the right...
0:26:39 > 0:26:43Maybe it's the generation AFTER these guys who actually go,
0:26:43 > 0:26:45"Yeah, all right, we've got this."
0:26:45 > 0:26:48"You old people stand to one side, we've got this!"
0:26:48 > 0:26:51We need THOSE guys. When's that happening?
0:26:51 > 0:26:53There's a quote that I've put on my Twitter -
0:26:53 > 0:26:57"There are those who think of the way things are and ask why.
0:26:57 > 0:27:00"But I say dream of things that never were and ask why not?"
0:27:00 > 0:27:03Being British to us is about
0:27:03 > 0:27:06all these diverse and complex
0:27:06 > 0:27:08influences coming together.
0:27:08 > 0:27:11And it creates a raw energy because it's always evolving,
0:27:11 > 0:27:14it's malleable. And I think it can be you want it to be.
0:27:14 > 0:27:17And I think that's really exciting because there's a kind of...
0:27:17 > 0:27:19a fire there,
0:27:19 > 0:27:21that is burning, and it really excites me.
0:27:21 > 0:27:25I think it's brilliant that we've got potentially a generation
0:27:25 > 0:27:28- underneath- us, - who haven't got those same barriers
0:27:28 > 0:27:29or the same baggage that we had.
0:27:29 > 0:27:33They don't see the barriers of colour.
0:27:33 > 0:27:36They've grown up in a post-modern world, and they want to access it.
0:27:38 > 0:27:40And they're bold,
0:27:40 > 0:27:42and they're brave.
0:27:42 > 0:27:44And they're courageous.
0:27:44 > 0:27:47Black Britain isn't just black any more.
0:27:47 > 0:27:49Black Britain is my complexion,
0:27:49 > 0:27:52Black Britain is Mariah Carey's complexion.
0:27:52 > 0:27:56Black Britain is Thandie Newton, is Mo Farah, it's Jessica Ennis.
0:27:57 > 0:28:01Black Britain is eternally different to what it was 25 years ago.
0:28:01 > 0:28:05Not only are people increasingly accepting their blackness
0:28:05 > 0:28:09and proud of it, but they're also proud of their Britishness.
0:28:09 > 0:28:12And for the white mother that's raising
0:28:12 > 0:28:16the mixed-race son that the world sees as a black boy,
0:28:16 > 0:28:18she understands that
0:28:18 > 0:28:20things are going to be different for him
0:28:20 > 0:28:21than they were for her.
0:28:22 > 0:28:25And she is a part of Black Britain.
0:28:26 > 0:28:29Even though her life
0:28:29 > 0:28:31wasn't even remotely connected to it when she was growing up.