0:00:02 > 0:00:06This programme contains some strong language
0:00:06 > 0:00:09I want to show you what it's really like to be a young woman
0:00:09 > 0:00:11in the music industry. How do I know?
0:00:11 > 0:00:14Well, I'm a singer, I'm 23 and I write songs for other artists too.
0:00:17 > 0:00:20Girls are ruling the charts like never before,
0:00:20 > 0:00:23so it feels like a great time to be a woman in pop.
0:00:26 > 0:00:28The F word - that's feminism - is everywhere.
0:00:28 > 0:00:33Young kids are being blasted with what feminism is
0:00:33 > 0:00:35because Beyonce's standing in front of a massive screen
0:00:35 > 0:00:39that says "Feminism" on it, and that's great.
0:00:39 > 0:00:43But is the male-dominated music industry really changing?
0:00:43 > 0:00:49When I am assertive, I'm a bitch.
0:00:49 > 0:00:52When a man is assertive, he's a boss.
0:00:52 > 0:00:55And why are our bodies under more scrutiny than ever before?
0:00:55 > 0:00:59I literally grew up embarrassed of the fact I would grow vagina hair.
0:01:03 > 0:01:05I'm spending the next couple of months out on the road
0:01:05 > 0:01:09and I want to use that time to find out what feminism really means,
0:01:09 > 0:01:13and to see if girls are finally ruling the world.
0:01:21 > 0:01:24My first stop this summer is Glastonbury.
0:01:24 > 0:01:26I've been on the road now for 18 months
0:01:26 > 0:01:28touring my latest album, Sucker,
0:01:28 > 0:01:32so life on the tour bus is getting pretty familiar.
0:01:32 > 0:01:33It's quite busy today.
0:01:33 > 0:01:35I feel like I just woke up, so...
0:01:35 > 0:01:39I think it's busy and then the show is going to be really good.
0:01:39 > 0:01:42My dad's coming. I don't know if he's going to get in.
0:01:42 > 0:01:46He was like, "I'll meet you at the door."
0:01:46 > 0:01:48"OK, well, we'll see!"
0:01:50 > 0:01:53My show isn't until five o'clock but the rest of my day is going
0:01:53 > 0:01:56to be taken up with photo shoots and interviews.
0:01:56 > 0:01:58Am I faking it, then?
0:01:58 > 0:02:00But hey, festivals are for having fun,
0:02:00 > 0:02:03so I doubt the questions will be too difficult.
0:02:03 > 0:02:06What would you bring to a festival? What would be your essential items?
0:02:06 > 0:02:08It would just be vodka.
0:02:08 > 0:02:09Have you remembered your bra this time?
0:02:09 > 0:02:11Yep, you did hear that right.
0:02:11 > 0:02:14I'm currently not wearing one but will be wearing one later.
0:02:14 > 0:02:16I'm maintaining eye contact at this moment.
0:02:16 > 0:02:18OK. Good, very professional of you. Thank you.
0:02:18 > 0:02:21# Let's keep doing it like we're doing it
0:02:21 > 0:02:24# Doing it like we're doing it now
0:02:27 > 0:02:29# Baby. #
0:02:32 > 0:02:36- Yeah! So good!- Thank you.
0:02:36 > 0:02:40Have you got your amazing all-female band with you at Glastonbury?
0:02:40 > 0:02:43They've been here for, like, three days.
0:02:44 > 0:02:47My all-girl band always gets a mention and that's probably
0:02:47 > 0:02:51because female musicians are still in the minority.
0:02:51 > 0:02:54I think it's important to stand up and be counted,
0:02:54 > 0:02:57and there are plenty of other women here who feel the same way.
0:02:57 > 0:03:00Think different, think feminist.
0:03:05 > 0:03:07But what does feminism mean to them?
0:03:07 > 0:03:08Feminism, I don't know.
0:03:08 > 0:03:11I guess it's like being yourself, being comfortable in your own skin.
0:03:11 > 0:03:14I'm just about empowering women and people in general.
0:03:14 > 0:03:17I don't want to get too specific just because I'm a woman,
0:03:17 > 0:03:19I think everybody is equal. I think that's the point.
0:03:19 > 0:03:23There's so many juxtapositions on what a feminist should be
0:03:23 > 0:03:28and therefore what you should think, that it took me a while to think,
0:03:28 > 0:03:29none of that matters, actually.
0:03:29 > 0:03:32They all basically believe in equality for women,
0:03:32 > 0:03:35it's just you have different beliefs within that.
0:03:35 > 0:03:41I think feminism is asking yourself questions in every single decision
0:03:41 > 0:03:43- you are making.- If it's you, do it,
0:03:43 > 0:03:47- but don't do it... - Because they tell you to do it.
0:03:47 > 0:03:49If you don't know yourself, people are going to put you in boxes,
0:03:49 > 0:03:53but if you know yourself and what you want, you can say, "This is what I want."
0:03:53 > 0:03:55People like Charli are an incredible ambassador for that,
0:03:55 > 0:03:58that she is just literally breaking all of the rules
0:03:58 > 0:04:01and doing whatever she wants, and that kind of shows
0:04:01 > 0:04:04these young kids that you can do that as well,
0:04:04 > 0:04:06and it's totally fine to be who you are
0:04:06 > 0:04:09and not who you think you should be.
0:04:09 > 0:04:11I'd love a double vodka-Red Bull, and a water.
0:04:11 > 0:04:14You can't always do whatever you want,
0:04:14 > 0:04:17especially when you're playing a tea-time gig,
0:04:17 > 0:04:20never mind one that's being televised live to millions of people.
0:04:20 > 0:04:25You can swear as much as you want in Sucker, but then if you can try...
0:04:25 > 0:04:27Not swear.
0:04:27 > 0:04:31- ..in songs, you will get more air time.- Guys, how long do we have?
0:04:31 > 0:04:3320 minutes before you should be ready.
0:04:33 > 0:04:36Let me just get outfits out. Wear these socks.
0:04:36 > 0:04:38This.
0:04:38 > 0:04:41One, two, three, got four shirts. Yes.
0:04:41 > 0:04:43I actually brought my old school uniform.
0:04:43 > 0:04:46I think I'm going to wear a shorter skirt. It's a miniskirt.
0:04:46 > 0:04:48Cos sex sells! I'm kidding.
0:04:59 > 0:05:01Na na-na na na, yeah.
0:05:01 > 0:05:05I feel like for any artist Glastonbury is a huge deal,
0:05:05 > 0:05:08and there's a lot of pressure to put on a great show.
0:05:14 > 0:05:17This is how we do it. Go hard or go home.
0:05:33 > 0:05:37MUSIC: Sucker by Charli XCX
0:05:48 > 0:05:50What's up, Glastonbury!
0:05:50 > 0:05:53CHEERING
0:05:55 > 0:05:58# You said you wanna bang
0:05:58 > 0:06:00# Well
0:06:00 > 0:06:02# Fuck you
0:06:02 > 0:06:03# Sucker! #
0:06:03 > 0:06:07Put your fucking middle fingers up, Glastonbury!
0:06:07 > 0:06:09You fucking ready?
0:06:10 > 0:06:12# I don't care
0:06:12 > 0:06:14# I love it
0:06:14 > 0:06:16# I don't care. #
0:06:16 > 0:06:20# I think we better do it like we're doing it now. #
0:06:20 > 0:06:22# Going to the discotheque
0:06:22 > 0:06:24# Getting high and getting wrecked
0:06:24 > 0:06:26# I don't wanna go to school
0:06:26 > 0:06:28# I just wanna break the rules. #
0:06:28 > 0:06:30# So outrageous
0:06:30 > 0:06:32# Just like we're famous. #
0:06:32 > 0:06:34# I'm so fancy
0:06:34 > 0:06:37# You already know
0:06:37 > 0:06:39# I'm in the fast lane
0:06:39 > 0:06:42# From LA to Tokyo. #
0:06:42 > 0:06:44CHEERING
0:06:44 > 0:06:46Thank you, Glastonbury!
0:06:46 > 0:06:49I'm Charli XCX. Peace out!
0:06:51 > 0:06:53Charli XCX, straight off the John Peel Stage.
0:06:53 > 0:06:55That has got to feel good, surely?
0:06:55 > 0:06:58Yes! I had such a good time and the crowd were really good,
0:06:58 > 0:07:00so many cute kids.
0:07:00 > 0:07:03I felt bad because I flashed my pants!
0:07:03 > 0:07:05I don't know, it was fun, I had fun, though. It was really good.
0:07:05 > 0:07:08These things happen, it's Glastonbury,
0:07:08 > 0:07:09it's totally legitimate.
0:07:09 > 0:07:11Flashing may be a festival staple
0:07:11 > 0:07:15but I know exactly how the tabloid press are going to react to my set.
0:07:15 > 0:07:17Every photograph they decide to use
0:07:17 > 0:07:21is me with my vagina out or whatever, a crotch shot.
0:07:21 > 0:07:29And there are people who are really mad at that, "How dare you do this!
0:07:29 > 0:07:36"You are untalented and no surprise, another woman! That woman!"
0:07:36 > 0:07:40It's always like that, "That woman doing that thing!"
0:07:40 > 0:07:45But then it's like, I'll wear something totally different
0:07:45 > 0:07:47or I'm covered completely.
0:07:47 > 0:07:54They'll be like, "What a hipster! Covering up like a boring woman!"
0:07:54 > 0:08:00You know? So it's kind of like whatever, it's funny.
0:08:00 > 0:08:04Female pop stars are under constant press scrutiny.
0:08:04 > 0:08:08Fashion, relationships, body size, it all goes under the microscope.
0:08:10 > 0:08:14The media may be resorting to the same old sex sells rubbish
0:08:14 > 0:08:17but behind the scenes, I think the industry is changing.
0:08:17 > 0:08:20I think when you're looking at the music industry in isolation,
0:08:20 > 0:08:21especially pop music,
0:08:21 > 0:08:26women being really vocal about being in control of what they do
0:08:26 > 0:08:30and actually that being the case is kind of a new thing.
0:08:30 > 0:08:35I think that people just don't want to ask questions about that
0:08:35 > 0:08:39and sometimes are afraid of that and I think it's great.
0:08:39 > 0:08:46I think people sometimes should be afraid and should be intimidated,
0:08:46 > 0:08:53because I think a woman with power is an incredible thing, you know?
0:08:53 > 0:08:54# I rule the world
0:08:54 > 0:08:56# I-I rule the world... #
0:08:56 > 0:08:58Fierce women may be all over the charts
0:08:58 > 0:09:02but behind the scenes it can still be a bit of a boys' club.
0:09:03 > 0:09:07My friend Liz knows how important it is to stay in control of your image.
0:09:07 > 0:09:11# When I rule the world then I'm gonna make you sweat
0:09:11 > 0:09:12# Dog collar round your neck
0:09:12 > 0:09:15# On your knees and scrub the deck... #
0:09:16 > 0:09:19I started out in the industry when I was 12 years old.
0:09:19 > 0:09:23It's predominately run by middle-aged men,
0:09:23 > 0:09:29so it's quite funny when you try to explain what you want
0:09:29 > 0:09:33to do in your style, and a lot of men just don't get it,
0:09:33 > 0:09:36but the girls love it, so they should just listen to us,
0:09:36 > 0:09:37because we know.
0:09:41 > 0:09:45When I shot my video, my choreographer was like, "Just think of Justin Bieber."
0:09:45 > 0:09:46I was like, "All right."
0:09:52 > 0:09:54I feel like my decisions that I'm making are working,
0:09:54 > 0:10:00so it's kind of like with everything that you achieve,
0:10:00 > 0:10:02you kind of prove people...
0:10:02 > 0:10:04Not prove them wrong, but prove that you're right
0:10:04 > 0:10:07and that you know what's best for you.
0:10:07 > 0:10:10# When I rule the world then I'm gonna make you work
0:10:10 > 0:10:13# Ring! ring! Stay alert, keep on pushing till it hurts... #
0:10:13 > 0:10:18It's so important to build a strong team around you
0:10:18 > 0:10:20and knowing when to bring in help.
0:10:20 > 0:10:23I'm definitely not the kind of person that says,
0:10:23 > 0:10:25"Oh, I can do everything on my own,"
0:10:25 > 0:10:27because that's just impossible. I know I can't.
0:10:27 > 0:10:30I have to reach out to the right people
0:10:30 > 0:10:32and bring in the right mix and that creates the magic.
0:10:32 > 0:10:35A better way to do that when I'm with girls.
0:10:35 > 0:10:38# Till I tell you to, till I tell you to
0:10:38 > 0:10:40# Till I tell you to stop. #
0:10:40 > 0:10:43Exactly. I always wanted to be in Josie and the Pussycats
0:10:43 > 0:10:46so having three amazing girls in my band is a dream.
0:10:53 > 0:10:56This is basically what it's like every gig.
0:10:58 > 0:11:00The boys are pretty used to it.
0:11:00 > 0:11:03Anyway, time to head back out on the road.
0:11:03 > 0:11:05Yes! No!
0:11:05 > 0:11:08Or we would do if we could get back on the tour bus.
0:11:08 > 0:11:12Where have you been? Young lady!
0:11:12 > 0:11:15Shooting a Scottish Widows advert.
0:11:15 > 0:11:17I used to tour with two guys.
0:11:17 > 0:11:19Wilkie, my tour manager, used to be my drummer.
0:11:19 > 0:11:21Don't get me wrong, it was really nice
0:11:21 > 0:11:25but I think touring with girls, it's like a big oestrogen fest.
0:11:25 > 0:11:28It's always really nice to embarrass the boys you're with.
0:11:28 > 0:11:31Be like, "Oh, my God, I'm on my period!"
0:11:31 > 0:11:33They get....
0:11:33 > 0:11:36It can quite often be a boys' club, can't it?
0:11:36 > 0:11:40- Music in general.- It's still the first thing that's mentioned.
0:11:40 > 0:11:42It's like, "Charli and her all-girl band,"
0:11:42 > 0:11:45- rather than "Charli and her band." - That's the thing, that's the point.
0:11:45 > 0:11:48Nobody would ever say that, Lianne La Havas and her all-male band,
0:11:48 > 0:11:49people don't say that.
0:11:49 > 0:11:51It's my favourite thing about a show,
0:11:51 > 0:11:55when we come on stage and someone will come over and be like,
0:11:55 > 0:11:58"Oh, my God, I really want to be a drummer now!"
0:11:58 > 0:12:02Or "My daughter's really into drums, she's 12, and it was really cool
0:12:02 > 0:12:04"for her to see someone else doing it."
0:12:04 > 0:12:06That's one of my favourite things.
0:12:06 > 0:12:11But then you've had a couple of weird experiences. It was in college.
0:12:11 > 0:12:13Oh, my God, that was so funny!
0:12:13 > 0:12:16We played this show and the support band, the drummer,
0:12:16 > 0:12:19was sitting outside and he had his practice pad out
0:12:19 > 0:12:22so I thought I'd join him, and I got my practice pad out
0:12:22 > 0:12:25and we were running the same rudiments, and he was like,
0:12:25 > 0:12:28"Oh, so are you with Charli's crew?" "No."
0:12:28 > 0:12:30"Are you her PA?" "No."
0:12:30 > 0:12:33"Are you dating someone in the band?" "No."
0:12:33 > 0:12:36He literally ran through about 10 things before he whittled it down.
0:12:36 > 0:12:39Make up? So he was like, "So what do you do?"
0:12:39 > 0:12:40"I'm in the band." "Oh, OK."
0:12:40 > 0:12:43Whilst you're drumming.
0:12:43 > 0:12:46Whilst I'm doing the same thing that he's doing.
0:12:46 > 0:12:48He just couldn't comprehend it.
0:12:48 > 0:12:52It sadly still is a thing, but it does feel really empowering.
0:12:52 > 0:12:55Which is why it's so good to be up there
0:12:55 > 0:12:58and showing other girls that it's completely normal and fine.
0:12:58 > 0:13:00Debate!
0:13:00 > 0:13:04Young kids now are being blasted with what feminism is
0:13:04 > 0:13:07because Beyonce is standing in front of a massive screen
0:13:07 > 0:13:11that says feminism on it, and that's great,
0:13:11 > 0:13:14because when I was younger I wasn't conscious of that at all.
0:13:14 > 0:13:16I was just like, "Yeah, Britney!"
0:13:24 > 0:13:29I think Baby One More Time was the first-ever music video I watched.
0:13:31 > 0:13:35MUSIC: Baby One More Time by Britney Spears
0:13:35 > 0:13:38Britney kind of invented the super pop star.
0:13:38 > 0:13:42She was cute but she also had sex appeal and she knew it.
0:13:42 > 0:13:43# Oh, baby, baby
0:13:43 > 0:13:49# How was I supposed to know? #
0:13:49 > 0:13:52I wanted to dress like Britney Spears when I was younger.
0:13:52 > 0:13:58I wanted to have those sparkly pink hair ties for the school uniform
0:13:58 > 0:14:02and everything. I just thought she was like the best-dressed kid ever.
0:14:02 > 0:14:06# Tell me, baby, cos I need to know... #
0:14:06 > 0:14:08She's so young as well.
0:14:08 > 0:14:12# My loneliness is killing me... #
0:14:12 > 0:14:14My love for Britney Spears
0:14:14 > 0:14:18and '90s pop as a whole is definitely not ironic.
0:14:18 > 0:14:20I was super into the Spice Girls
0:14:20 > 0:14:26and I think girl power was my generation's introduction to feminism.
0:14:26 > 0:14:31It's like an easy message and I suppose for Spice Girls fans
0:14:31 > 0:14:35in the '90s, it's like, get along, be friends.
0:14:35 > 0:14:39Friendship is important and that's like a cool thing.
0:14:39 > 0:14:43It's basic but I don't care.
0:14:43 > 0:14:47Like, it made me feel special when I was younger
0:14:47 > 0:14:50and I'm sure it made a lot of other people feel special too.
0:14:50 > 0:14:54The idea of overanalysing the Spice Girls is such a sad thing for me
0:14:54 > 0:14:57because they were so celebrated and joyous.
0:14:57 > 0:15:01MUSIC: Say You'll Be There by Spice Girls
0:15:01 > 0:15:05What's really funny about this video is that in the main set-up,
0:15:05 > 0:15:08they're all just dancing completely on their own,
0:15:08 > 0:15:11completely out of time, but it's so good,
0:15:11 > 0:15:14and I love the styling on this video. Everyone looks great.
0:15:14 > 0:15:18I went through many different phases when it came to my favourite
0:15:18 > 0:15:24Spice Girl, apart from Posh, but now I think Posh is my favourite.
0:15:24 > 0:15:26I feel like Posh would rock a beret.
0:15:26 > 0:15:28That would be like a classic Posh move.
0:15:30 > 0:15:32The Spice Girls had a message
0:15:32 > 0:15:35but in some ways they were still reduced to stereotypes.
0:15:35 > 0:15:39Female pop stars don't want to fit into neat little boxes any more,
0:15:39 > 0:15:41or caravans, for that matter.
0:15:41 > 0:15:44I'm sorry, I'm so worried you're going to get a vagina shot.
0:15:44 > 0:15:46Feminism!
0:15:46 > 0:15:48Marina and the Diamonds, hello.
0:15:48 > 0:15:53I wanted to talk to you about whether you think the question,
0:15:53 > 0:15:56what's it like to be a woman in the music industry,
0:15:56 > 0:15:59- is a really annoying question. - For me, it's not annoying.
0:15:59 > 0:16:01I do still think it's relevant.
0:16:01 > 0:16:07Actually asking the question has made the topic very popular.
0:16:07 > 0:16:09For me personally,
0:16:09 > 0:16:12there are a lot of things that I think still have to happen
0:16:12 > 0:16:14for women in music.
0:16:14 > 0:16:17MUSIC: Froot by Marina and the Diamonds
0:16:17 > 0:16:20Marina's latest album Froot was a worldwide success
0:16:20 > 0:16:24and it's the first album where she has taken complete creative control.
0:16:26 > 0:16:29When it came to the Froot album campaign,
0:16:29 > 0:16:31from an outsider's perspective,
0:16:31 > 0:16:34that seemed like something very much driven by you.
0:16:34 > 0:16:40Was that easy for you to do or was that something that you had to...
0:16:40 > 0:16:44Fight is such a strong work, but fight your label?
0:16:44 > 0:16:45You're absolutely right,
0:16:45 > 0:16:48and actually I've never said this before,
0:16:48 > 0:16:53but it took so much fighting for the album to come out,
0:16:53 > 0:16:55but I think you just have to explain to people who you are
0:16:55 > 0:16:58and sometimes that's hard, especially when you're starting out.
0:16:58 > 0:17:01You have all these other things to think about.
0:17:01 > 0:17:06It's only on this third record that I have been able to do that
0:17:06 > 0:17:09and feel very calm and confident about it.
0:17:09 > 0:17:10# Primadonna girl
0:17:10 > 0:17:13# Would you do anything for me?
0:17:13 > 0:17:16# Buy a big diamond ring for me? #
0:17:16 > 0:17:20Changing your image or sound can be a risky business for a pop star.
0:17:20 > 0:17:24# Pop that pretty question right now, baby... #
0:17:24 > 0:17:26When you put out Primadonna Girl,
0:17:26 > 0:17:30and people began to criticise you and saying you sold out,
0:17:30 > 0:17:33do you think that was more amplified because you're a woman?
0:17:33 > 0:17:35I am not sure,
0:17:35 > 0:17:39but if it happened to a male artist, I think
0:17:39 > 0:17:43people would probably just say, "Oh, you're shit now."
0:17:43 > 0:17:48- "You're shit, mate."- As opposed to lots of grim trolls online.
0:17:48 > 0:17:50Everyone was calling me a sell-out,
0:17:50 > 0:17:54that I'd lost everything that was original about me.
0:17:54 > 0:17:57I feel like I'm going through that right now with this album.
0:17:57 > 0:18:02I did like an insight meeting, stats, and it was very interesting.
0:18:02 > 0:18:05I found that I think a lot of people find me very intimidating.
0:18:05 > 0:18:07- Really?- Yeah!
0:18:07 > 0:18:10I'm like, "Oh, God!"
0:18:10 > 0:18:15- How do they find that out? - They did market research where...
0:18:17 > 0:18:22Honestly, it's really soul destroying, actually. It really is.
0:18:22 > 0:18:25Do you ever think about your output online
0:18:25 > 0:18:28and do you ever think about your audience,
0:18:28 > 0:18:31which is a lot of young girls and gay guys?
0:18:31 > 0:18:34I think you have a responsibility as a human being,
0:18:34 > 0:18:37whether your fan base is young or not,
0:18:37 > 0:18:39but only to a certain extent.
0:18:39 > 0:18:44You are human and are going to do stuff that not everyone agrees with.
0:18:44 > 0:18:49You're always going to, sadly, sometimes leave a small portion
0:18:49 > 0:18:52of fans behind, but I think with my fan base
0:18:52 > 0:18:54and perhaps with yours as well,
0:18:54 > 0:18:57I feel like it's less about the genre of music you make.
0:18:57 > 0:19:00It's more about you as a person, and being honest
0:19:00 > 0:19:04and being able to have that relationship with your fans.
0:19:06 > 0:19:11I know that when you become a pop star or a musician,
0:19:11 > 0:19:14there is always this element of responsibility,
0:19:14 > 0:19:18and I'm aware of that but it's not something I particularly care about,
0:19:18 > 0:19:23which might be something I regret saying, but right now it's not.
0:19:23 > 0:19:27It freaks me out, if I'm honest, because I know I make
0:19:27 > 0:19:30loads of mistakes and I always will, but I think the way
0:19:30 > 0:19:32the music industry is now,
0:19:32 > 0:19:35it's so much about what's going on on the internet
0:19:35 > 0:19:37and I think if you're wise,
0:19:37 > 0:19:41you have to learn to just really take all of that with a pinch of salt.
0:19:41 > 0:19:44When I was younger, I was really worried about it
0:19:44 > 0:19:48because I wanted to please everyone, but that's such an unrealistic thing.
0:19:51 > 0:19:53Oh, my God, I look so friendly!
0:19:53 > 0:19:56I don't like everybody and I know everybody doesn't like me
0:19:56 > 0:19:58and I'm very much at peace with that.
0:19:58 > 0:20:00That's healthy.
0:20:02 > 0:20:03Hey!
0:20:03 > 0:20:05No matter how honest and direct
0:20:05 > 0:20:07your relationship with your fans may be,
0:20:07 > 0:20:10you do still have to think about your image.
0:20:11 > 0:20:15And often it's what pop stars wear that gets the feminist debate raging.
0:20:20 > 0:20:24- How are you? - Nice to meet you finally.
0:20:24 > 0:20:26So these three are yours.
0:20:26 > 0:20:28I love the lining as well.
0:20:28 > 0:20:30Oh, my God.
0:20:30 > 0:20:32XCX.
0:20:32 > 0:20:33Wow.
0:20:37 > 0:20:39- I love this.- You love it, yeah?
0:20:39 > 0:20:42It's so awesome. Do you think the skirt should sit more...?
0:20:42 > 0:20:45Coming in a little bit, there.
0:20:45 > 0:20:49I don't really care about people who ask me
0:20:49 > 0:20:54what type of feminist I am, or if I think it's valid for me
0:20:54 > 0:20:58to be a feminist because I wear a short skirt.
0:20:58 > 0:21:00I think it's just stupid.
0:21:00 > 0:21:05Stupid, stupid conversation that's like...
0:21:05 > 0:21:07pointless.
0:21:08 > 0:21:12And I'm not the only one whose feminist credentials are being questioned.
0:21:12 > 0:21:18When people ask the way Rihanna dresses or Miley Cyrus dresses,
0:21:18 > 0:21:23that's a bad example for girls, and that makes her a bad feminist,
0:21:23 > 0:21:28it's that whole argument of that's... absolute bullshit, basically.
0:21:28 > 0:21:34I think both of those artists are really empowering and artistic
0:21:34 > 0:21:38and daring women.
0:21:38 > 0:21:43I think they're projecting a different way to be sexy
0:21:43 > 0:21:45and a different way to be feminine,
0:21:45 > 0:21:49which I think is really important for young girls.
0:21:49 > 0:21:53I don't know if you saw the new Rihanna video but I love it.
0:21:53 > 0:21:55# Yayo, yayo
0:21:55 > 0:21:58# Moo-la-lah
0:21:58 > 0:22:00# Yayo
0:22:00 > 0:22:03# Bitch better have my money! #
0:22:03 > 0:22:06OK, I know lots of people have had a big problem with this video
0:22:06 > 0:22:11and the use of violence against women in pop promos can feel really
0:22:11 > 0:22:16disturbing, but I think this film speaks to a bigger story.
0:22:16 > 0:22:21Rihanna is dismantling society's idea of what a pop star should be,
0:22:21 > 0:22:25ie perfect, polished and usually white.
0:22:25 > 0:22:29She plays a Tarantinoesque hitwoman with her very own girl gang.
0:22:29 > 0:22:33It's a revenge fantasy, it's a beautiful piece of art,
0:22:33 > 0:22:36but it's also a powerful statement of intent.
0:22:36 > 0:22:40You can't push me around and you can't make me be what I'm not.
0:22:40 > 0:22:44And I also just kind of like that Rihanna's just a bad bitch,
0:22:44 > 0:22:48and I think that's also a good enough reason.
0:22:48 > 0:22:51I don't know why I'm carrying a razor around in my bag.
0:22:51 > 0:22:55It's not real life to be perfect.
0:22:55 > 0:22:58That's not real.
0:22:58 > 0:23:04I like pop stars who fuck up and make mistakes, you know?
0:23:04 > 0:23:10It's just cooler, rather than robots.
0:23:10 > 0:23:14- And completely airbrushed. - Yeah, totally.
0:23:14 > 0:23:16- OK, you're happy with this one? - I love it.
0:23:16 > 0:23:19I'm so excited to perform in this.
0:23:19 > 0:23:22- It was so nice to meet you! - I'm such a fan
0:23:22 > 0:23:25and thank you so much for making this stuff for me.
0:23:25 > 0:23:28I'll send you pictures as soon as we're on tour.
0:23:28 > 0:23:31Yes, please. You look incredible in it. So exciting.
0:23:31 > 0:23:34Bye-bye, everybody. Bye, upstairs!
0:23:46 > 0:23:50It's August and I'm finally in the US for my tour.
0:23:50 > 0:23:53America is the birthplace of manufactured pop,
0:23:53 > 0:23:57but even here, the tide is starting to turn,
0:23:57 > 0:24:00with more and more female artists breaking the mould.
0:24:00 > 0:24:05OK, cool, so Lollapalooza with Ryn Weaver right now.
0:24:05 > 0:24:07- Hi!- Hi.- How's it going?
0:24:07 > 0:24:08Pretty good.
0:24:08 > 0:24:12I was on your Twitter and was reading some tweets
0:24:12 > 0:24:16that you'd written about armpit hair. Like, I find it
0:24:16 > 0:24:19crazy that people get so mad!
0:24:19 > 0:24:22And like lifting bros on Twitter that, like, their photo
0:24:22 > 0:24:25is them taking a selfie in the mirror, and they're like,
0:24:25 > 0:24:28"You're a disgrace to nature!" And I'm like, "I am nature."
0:24:28 > 0:24:30This is nature, what are you doing?
0:24:30 > 0:24:32I think it's funny.
0:24:32 > 0:24:34That's the thing, for me, it's almost entertaining,
0:24:34 > 0:24:37but I don't know. I just don't really care.
0:24:37 > 0:24:39That's what it is, and if I wake up in the morning and I feel
0:24:39 > 0:24:42- like shaving my armpits, I'll do it. - You feel sexy as well.
0:24:42 > 0:24:45I feel sexy, and that's the thing. I feel sexy being natural
0:24:45 > 0:24:49and I feel sexy having dudes, girls, whoever the fuck,
0:24:49 > 0:24:52- think that is dope.- I'm happy that you've got great armpit hair.
0:24:52 > 0:24:55- Thank you. I love my armpit hair. - I think it's great,
0:24:55 > 0:25:01but do you think that's liberating and inspiring young girls,
0:25:01 > 0:25:03cos I definitely see that.
0:25:03 > 0:25:04Like, I think you...
0:25:04 > 0:25:08like, Miley is also someone who doesn't shave her armpits.
0:25:08 > 0:25:09Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
0:25:09 > 0:25:10And I think it's really...
0:25:10 > 0:25:14For young girls who especially grow up with, like,
0:25:14 > 0:25:16People magazine and OK.
0:25:16 > 0:25:19- And porn.- And porn.
0:25:19 > 0:25:20And I think it's really amazing.
0:25:20 > 0:25:23This is the way you're meant to look to be sexy.
0:25:23 > 0:25:27I think it's amazing that people like you guys are really...
0:25:27 > 0:25:30Well, you just get to do whatever the hell you want to do with your
0:25:30 > 0:25:34own body, because it's your body and it's not property of public domain.
0:25:34 > 0:25:36And it's your right
0:25:36 > 0:25:39and it's your choice to do whatever you want with it.
0:25:39 > 0:25:43And I just hope that little girls that see me, or see this,
0:25:43 > 0:25:46or see that, or see a girl who's got a little happy trail
0:25:46 > 0:25:50or see, anything, it's just makes you more human and it makes them
0:25:50 > 0:25:51feel more human.
0:25:51 > 0:25:55It makes them feel like, "I'm allowed to be normal."
0:25:55 > 0:25:58I literally grew up embarrassed of the fact that
0:25:58 > 0:25:59I would grow vagina her.
0:25:59 > 0:26:02Because I was like, "Oh, these girls are so pretty."
0:26:02 > 0:26:04And do you remember when you started shaving?
0:26:04 > 0:26:07- And you were like, "Is that how it's supposed to look?" - Yeah, it was a mess!
0:26:07 > 0:26:10- There's so much self-consciousness around who you were.- Yeah.
0:26:10 > 0:26:12And then always wanting to hide
0:26:12 > 0:26:17and so afraid of this thing that is literally like the centre of...
0:26:17 > 0:26:20Of femininity. And in other ways. I mean, if you're trans, and you're...
0:26:20 > 0:26:22You know. There's all sorts of things.
0:26:22 > 0:26:25But to me, this guy makes me feel...
0:26:25 > 0:26:28Pretty good. And I don't want to be ashamed of anything on my body.
0:26:28 > 0:26:29Amen.
0:26:31 > 0:26:32CHEERING
0:26:34 > 0:26:36You feeling bad?
0:26:36 > 0:26:38'Oh, I almost forgot I was at work.
0:26:38 > 0:26:39'Back to it.
0:26:39 > 0:26:41'Photos, signings, gigs.'
0:26:41 > 0:26:42Get up, get up!
0:26:42 > 0:26:43'You know the drill.'
0:26:43 > 0:26:45# Electric lights. # Come on!
0:26:46 > 0:26:48# Blow my mind. # Get up, get up!
0:26:50 > 0:26:53# I feel all right. # Get up!
0:26:53 > 0:26:55# And never stop, it's how we ride
0:26:55 > 0:26:58# Coming up until we die
0:26:58 > 0:27:00# You catch my eye. #
0:27:00 > 0:27:02- Thanks for taking the time to do this.- No worries.
0:27:02 > 0:27:05# Bitch, you want to fly
0:27:05 > 0:27:09# I'm so alive. # Hey!
0:27:09 > 0:27:10# Never stop, it's how we ride. #
0:27:10 > 0:27:13I'm sure people ask you all the time, but will you marry me?
0:27:13 > 0:27:14# I don't wanna go to school
0:27:14 > 0:27:16# I just wanna break the rules
0:27:16 > 0:27:18# Boys and girls across the world
0:27:18 > 0:27:20# Putting on our dancing shoes
0:27:20 > 0:27:22# Going to the discotheque
0:27:22 > 0:27:24# Getting high and getting wrecked
0:27:24 > 0:27:26# I don't wanna go to school
0:27:26 > 0:27:28# I just wanna break the rules. # My flies keep coming undone!
0:27:28 > 0:27:30# I don't wanna go to school
0:27:30 > 0:27:32# I just wanna break the rules. #
0:27:32 > 0:27:35Because I, like... I'm on your Twitter all the time.
0:27:35 > 0:27:38# Going to the discotheque
0:27:38 > 0:27:40# Getting high and getting wrecked
0:27:40 > 0:27:42# I don't want to go to what?
0:27:42 > 0:27:44- # I just want to break the rules. # - Do it!
0:27:44 > 0:27:47MUSIC: Break The Rules by Charli XCX
0:27:47 > 0:27:49Get up!
0:27:50 > 0:27:52SHE SCREAMS
0:27:54 > 0:27:55Come on, come on!
0:27:58 > 0:27:59That's right!
0:27:59 > 0:28:01CHEERING
0:28:03 > 0:28:05# Get my guitar
0:28:07 > 0:28:09# Sunglasses on
0:28:11 > 0:28:14# So light it up. # Come on!
0:28:14 > 0:28:16# And never stop, it's how we ride
0:28:16 > 0:28:18# Coming up until we die
0:28:18 > 0:28:20# I don't wanna go to school
0:28:20 > 0:28:22# I just wanna break the rules
0:28:22 > 0:28:24# Boys and girls across the world
0:28:24 > 0:28:26# Putting on our dancing shoes
0:28:26 > 0:28:28# Going to the discotheque
0:28:28 > 0:28:30# Getting high and getting wrecked
0:28:30 > 0:28:32# I don't wanna go to what?
0:28:32 > 0:28:34# I just want to break the rules! #
0:28:34 > 0:28:37SHE SCREAMS
0:28:37 > 0:28:39CROWD CHEER
0:28:39 > 0:28:41Put your fucking hands up!
0:28:42 > 0:28:45# Na-na-na-na na-na na-na na-na-na-na! #
0:28:48 > 0:28:50At the back, at the back! Come on!
0:28:50 > 0:28:54# Na-na-na-na na-na na-na na-na-na-na!
0:28:57 > 0:28:59Hey!
0:29:08 > 0:29:10'Oh, my God, that was so hot.'
0:29:10 > 0:29:11Bit warm!
0:29:13 > 0:29:15I'm exhausted.
0:29:17 > 0:29:19I feel like I'm starting to get a really good picture
0:29:19 > 0:29:22of how the industry is changing for female artists.
0:29:22 > 0:29:25But I want to find out what it's like for women behind the scenes.
0:29:25 > 0:29:30I'm off to meet Lizzy Plapinger, my label exec in the US.
0:29:30 > 0:29:34Lizzy runs Neon Gold Records with her business partner, Derek Davies.
0:29:34 > 0:29:39And manages to have time to make music as one half of Ms Mr as well.
0:29:39 > 0:29:42# Came to make a connection
0:29:42 > 0:29:44# Force myself in a dimension. #
0:29:44 > 0:29:49When you think of music industry, record label person,
0:29:49 > 0:29:52you don't think of...
0:29:52 > 0:29:54Like, awesome killer gold dress,
0:29:54 > 0:29:58bright red hair, like, bad-ass bitch.
0:29:58 > 0:30:06Do you ever feel like you ever had to face any kind of shit
0:30:06 > 0:30:10because of who you were and because you're a woman?
0:30:10 > 0:30:13I remember the first couple of meetings we took.
0:30:13 > 0:30:15After we'd been running Neon Gold for two years
0:30:15 > 0:30:18and we started to get major label offers to do subsidiaries
0:30:18 > 0:30:20or joint ventures,
0:30:20 > 0:30:23and it was SO interesting and eye-opening
0:30:23 > 0:30:25for the first time to be taking meetings
0:30:25 > 0:30:29and to be with old, white men who had been in the industry
0:30:29 > 0:30:30for years and years and years,
0:30:30 > 0:30:34who it felt like didn't have a sense of what was happening on the ground,
0:30:34 > 0:30:37and so many meetings people just wouldn't even look me in the eye.
0:30:37 > 0:30:39They would literally only talk to Derek the whole time.
0:30:39 > 0:30:42- That's crazy.- It was SO offensive.
0:30:42 > 0:30:46Did you feel like they were like,
0:30:46 > 0:30:49"Oh, this man is the guy who's running the show
0:30:49 > 0:30:52- "and this is his girlfriend or something"?- Totally.
0:30:52 > 0:30:56I think people didn't understand what my role in the company was
0:30:56 > 0:30:58and so it was directed at Derek and that was...
0:30:58 > 0:31:01It fucking pissed me off. It was really, really upsetting.
0:31:01 > 0:31:04We'd leave meetings and he would completely acknowledge what just went down.
0:31:04 > 0:31:06He'd be like, "We're not fucking working with them.
0:31:06 > 0:31:10"If they're not going to acknowledge we're a team, they're not worth our time."
0:31:10 > 0:31:13That was a very easy way to cut the list in half.
0:31:13 > 0:31:15# Nights like this
0:31:15 > 0:31:17# I become afraid
0:31:17 > 0:31:20# Of the darkness in my mind
0:31:20 > 0:31:22# Hurricane. #
0:31:23 > 0:31:26I feel like I was one of very few women when we first started
0:31:26 > 0:31:29and I'm struggling to think of other women who were at our position,
0:31:29 > 0:31:32and I do think that's a hard conversation to have too,
0:31:32 > 0:31:34to be like, "Yes, there are more women in the industry
0:31:34 > 0:31:38"but they get to a certain level and then there's a barrier to entry."
0:31:38 > 0:31:41Why is it so much harder to get to a certain point in your career
0:31:41 > 0:31:46and then not take that next step to that top, top executive level?
0:31:46 > 0:31:48And I'm not totally sure why that is
0:31:48 > 0:31:50and I hope that that continues to change in the coming years.
0:31:50 > 0:31:53It feels like there has to be some sort of epic change
0:31:53 > 0:31:56and I don't know if that's specifically tied
0:31:56 > 0:31:58to a woman being in power or not but
0:31:58 > 0:32:00I just feel like that's representative
0:32:00 > 0:32:04of this need for whatever's in place right now to sort of shift.
0:32:04 > 0:32:05Yep.
0:32:15 > 0:32:18Somewhere between Chicago and Minneapolis,
0:32:18 > 0:32:21it was my birthday and I hope I'm a bit wiser,
0:32:21 > 0:32:24but maybe I shouldn't have partied QUITE so hard last night.
0:32:37 > 0:32:39# Right away from Holloway
0:32:39 > 0:32:42# I said, Mum, this isn't a holiday
0:32:42 > 0:32:44# Listen up I ain't coming back
0:32:44 > 0:32:48# Till I can fill the shack up with all gold plaques... #
0:32:48 > 0:32:50When you're talking about feminism and pop,
0:32:50 > 0:32:54I think it's just as important to speak to the men in the industry,
0:32:54 > 0:32:56so it's lucky I'm on tour with some.
0:32:56 > 0:32:58No, not that one.
0:32:58 > 0:33:01Jack Antonoff and his band, Bleachers. Awesome.
0:33:02 > 0:33:05Like me, Jack writes with lots of female artists
0:33:05 > 0:33:08and he knows how hard this industry can be on women.
0:33:09 > 0:33:11High five!
0:33:11 > 0:33:15Jack Antonoff, we're on tour together. Do you like that?
0:33:15 > 0:33:17- I love it.- Great. I like it too.
0:33:17 > 0:33:22You've worked with some incredibly talented, powerful females
0:33:22 > 0:33:25- from Taylor Swift... - I love Taylor.
0:33:25 > 0:33:28I've been very vocal about that. She's just...
0:33:28 > 0:33:30I do think that working with her
0:33:30 > 0:33:33and experiencing the way that people digest her has given me a lot
0:33:33 > 0:33:38of insight to the differences of being a woman or a man in music.
0:33:38 > 0:33:41- How come?- No-one wants to believe that she writes the songs.- Yeah.
0:33:41 > 0:33:44And that's such crap.
0:33:44 > 0:33:49I feel like... Kanye makes a record or something, it's just like,
0:33:49 > 0:33:50"You're Kanye. You're a genius,"
0:33:50 > 0:33:54and then Taylor does and I've done so many interviews where people
0:33:54 > 0:33:57are like, "Is she really as good a writer as everyone says?", and I'm like, "Yeah!"
0:33:57 > 0:34:00If I worked with Kanye, no-one would be like, "Is he really as genius
0:34:00 > 0:34:02- "as people say?"- Yeah. - It's just a known thing
0:34:02 > 0:34:07and I think that you can really see how the world sees women artists
0:34:07 > 0:34:10by the questions you get asked in the press, more than anything.
0:34:10 > 0:34:14And very often it can be something offensive that two days later you're like,
0:34:14 > 0:34:17- "Oh, that was actually kind of fucked up, now that I think about it."- Yeah.
0:34:17 > 0:34:19Did you ever see that Nicki Minaj video?
0:34:19 > 0:34:23- Oh, the bitch versus the boss? - Yeah.- I loved that!
0:34:23 > 0:34:26But when I have an ego, I'm a bitch!
0:34:26 > 0:34:28So I'll be that.
0:34:28 > 0:34:31You're ... walking round the ... game with the biggest ... ego
0:34:31 > 0:34:33you can't tell ...
0:34:33 > 0:34:35But when I stand up for myself?
0:34:35 > 0:34:38No. No. No way.
0:34:38 > 0:34:44When I am assertive, I'm a bitch.
0:34:44 > 0:34:46When a man is assertive, he's a boss.
0:34:46 > 0:34:49- He bossed up.- He bossed up! - Yeah, he bossed up.
0:34:49 > 0:34:52No negative connotation behind "bossed up",
0:34:52 > 0:34:56but lots of negative connotation behind being a bitch.
0:34:56 > 0:35:00Do guys in the music industry get a bad reputation?
0:35:00 > 0:35:03No, I feel like...
0:35:03 > 0:35:07I think in history men have done a lot of crappy things, you know?
0:35:07 > 0:35:11- Yeah.- And I think that...
0:35:11 > 0:35:13I try to see it way more just on an individual level.
0:35:13 > 0:35:15I don't think there's a stereotypical man in music
0:35:15 > 0:35:17or woman in music.
0:35:17 > 0:35:19I just know who I feel more comfortable with.
0:35:19 > 0:35:21I just get on better with women.
0:35:21 > 0:35:23The last thing I want to ask you,
0:35:23 > 0:35:26obviously there are now so many amazing women
0:35:26 > 0:35:28at the forefront of the music industry.
0:35:28 > 0:35:30Do you feel like this is a step forward?
0:35:30 > 0:35:34I think the amount of women is a great thing just because
0:35:34 > 0:35:36- it means there's all the different kinds.- Yeah.
0:35:36 > 0:35:38When you have more of something you have more variety.
0:35:38 > 0:35:41So, I think growing up in the '90s,
0:35:41 > 0:35:43I think that it was a lot more rigid.
0:35:43 > 0:35:46A female pop star had to look a certain way and act a certain way
0:35:46 > 0:35:51and had to be very sweet and very attractive and like girl-next-door.
0:35:51 > 0:35:54Now you or Beyonce or Taylor,
0:35:54 > 0:35:58these are all just such different kinds of artists and performers.
0:35:58 > 0:36:01Some of them are super in-your-face and super intense.
0:36:01 > 0:36:04Some of them are really quiet and just making their art,
0:36:04 > 0:36:07and it's just... I think it's wonderful
0:36:07 > 0:36:09because what it says to young people growing up is,
0:36:09 > 0:36:11"You could do anything."
0:36:11 > 0:36:14Because when there's lots of different things happening
0:36:14 > 0:36:17in popular music, it speaks more to the people
0:36:17 > 0:36:22because people are different. People have different colours of skin
0:36:22 > 0:36:25and different haircuts and different attitudes and beliefs
0:36:25 > 0:36:29and all these things, so the more diversity and variety there is,
0:36:29 > 0:36:32the more a young kid in Arkansas or Manchester or whatever
0:36:32 > 0:36:35is going to say to themselves, "Oh, I can do whatever I want."
0:36:37 > 0:36:40Hear, hear, sister! Cool.
0:36:40 > 0:36:42- I feel sick.- Oh, babes.
0:36:42 > 0:36:44# Vicky's so ill.
0:36:46 > 0:36:48# And she's going to throw up. #
0:36:52 > 0:36:53Is Vicky all right?
0:36:57 > 0:36:59- LAUGHING:- Is that my sick bag?
0:37:00 > 0:37:02Is this where I come to be sick?
0:37:02 > 0:37:04You'll be all right.
0:37:04 > 0:37:06CHEERING
0:37:13 > 0:37:15Minneapolis was good.
0:37:15 > 0:37:16CHEERING
0:37:16 > 0:37:22I think I'm still feeling my post-birthday partying.
0:37:25 > 0:37:29My voice is a little husky, a little sexy.
0:37:31 > 0:37:34Vicky nearly passed out. Gingie nearly passed out.
0:37:34 > 0:37:36Debbie nearly passed out.
0:37:43 > 0:37:45You looked like you were going to die tonight.
0:37:48 > 0:37:49SHE SIGHS
0:37:54 > 0:37:59You're traditionally supposed to be just happy all the time
0:37:59 > 0:38:02and OK with it all the time and not complain,
0:38:02 > 0:38:05being a musician or in the limelight,
0:38:05 > 0:38:10but I just can't really do that.
0:38:10 > 0:38:13I can't fake it very well.
0:38:13 > 0:38:21It takes such a talent and such skill to be able to befriend everybody
0:38:21 > 0:38:26and become this memorable, happy person.
0:38:26 > 0:38:28Cos it always affects me.
0:38:28 > 0:38:32If I'm feeling down, it will affect my show.
0:38:32 > 0:38:35I perform differently.
0:38:35 > 0:38:40I'm way ruder. I'm way more rude on stage. I'm like a brat.
0:38:40 > 0:38:44And I don't want to get to the point where I hate it for ever,
0:38:44 > 0:38:48so I just really have to take a break,
0:38:48 > 0:38:50so I cancelled the second leg,
0:38:50 > 0:38:54which was definitely a very selfish decision for me to do
0:38:54 > 0:38:58because obviously I know there are a lot of fans who bought tickets
0:38:58 > 0:39:00and were really looking forward to it,
0:39:00 > 0:39:02and also it was a co-headline tour with Jack as well,
0:39:02 > 0:39:07so it's difficult for him and for his band and all of the crew,
0:39:07 > 0:39:10but I spoke with Jack about it and he was very understanding.
0:39:10 > 0:39:12He knew where I was coming from.
0:39:12 > 0:39:17Obviously I can only apologise to the people that I let down cos it sucks.
0:39:17 > 0:39:19When you like...
0:39:20 > 0:39:22I remember when I was going to see the Spice Girls
0:39:22 > 0:39:24and then Geri left the day before.
0:39:24 > 0:39:27I was like, "Ugh. Come on."
0:39:27 > 0:39:31So, yeah. It wasn't easy. I felt bad.
0:39:34 > 0:39:38And the thing is, I make my own decisions, good and bad.
0:39:40 > 0:39:43To me, that's what feminism is all about.
0:39:43 > 0:39:46The past few months have been a bit of a rollercoaster
0:39:46 > 0:39:51but I'm starting to see why it's so important to keep asking questions,
0:39:51 > 0:39:54even if there aren't any easy answers.
0:39:54 > 0:40:00Being a woman and talking about being a woman in this specific industry
0:40:00 > 0:40:04is such a confusing and layered subject
0:40:04 > 0:40:08and even just when we talk about the most simple questions ever,
0:40:08 > 0:40:12sometimes I just find myself going so deep down this tunnel
0:40:12 > 0:40:14and I'm not even sure if I'm answering the right questions
0:40:14 > 0:40:18any more because there's so much to say.
0:40:18 > 0:40:24But I just hope that this documentary
0:40:24 > 0:40:29makes a lot of people see how much women do behind the scenes
0:40:29 > 0:40:33with their own careers and how much we're aware
0:40:33 > 0:40:36of everything that's going on in the industry,
0:40:36 > 0:40:41and really how these women who stand on stage singing songs
0:40:41 > 0:40:46aren't just puppets but are businesswomen, as well.
0:40:46 > 0:40:51I think everybody is aware that this question of,
0:40:51 > 0:40:54"What is it like to be a woman in the music industry?"
0:40:54 > 0:40:58is important, but everybody is also kind of sick of it
0:40:58 > 0:41:02and I think that maybe the better question is,
0:41:02 > 0:41:04"What's it like to be an artist?"