0:00:00 > 0:00:02Mark Urban looks now at the legacy of the man known
0:00:02 > 0:00:03as the 'Butcher of Bosnia'.
0:00:03 > 0:00:11A warning that some viewers may find parts of this programme upsetting.
0:00:11 > 0:00:16In the 1990s, terrible things happened here. And even now,
0:00:16 > 0:00:25Bosnia's earth guards its secrets. GUNFIRE.
0:00:41 > 0:00:45But in order to escape its past, this country was confronted again
0:00:45 > 0:00:50with the imminent verdict on general Ratko Mladic, whose list of war
0:00:50 > 0:01:01crimes led him to be dull but be Butcher of Bosnia. -- dubbed the
0:01:01 > 0:01:03Butcher of Bosnia.
0:01:39 > 0:01:44In an old factory in central Bosnia, the human cost of the war is still
0:01:44 > 0:01:49being measured. For it is here that unidentified corpses from mass
0:01:49 > 0:01:55graves are being delivered even today. And the families of 30,000
0:01:55 > 0:02:03still missing search for answers. This is, um... Overwhelming, in a
0:02:03 > 0:02:09certain way. There are pictures of the missing. There are human remains
0:02:09 > 0:02:16pretty much everywhere here, by the hundreds. And then, at the end
0:02:16 > 0:02:19there, there are scraps of clothing and other things that have been
0:02:19 > 0:02:26recovered with them. And this place is the main hope that a lot of the
0:02:26 > 0:02:30families of those missing have for discovering what on earth happened
0:02:30 > 0:02:39to a loved one who just disappeared all those years ago. Having covered
0:02:39 > 0:02:46the war 25 years ago, I've come back to explore the impact is that one
0:02:46 > 0:02:51particularly malign man had on the lives of thousands.
0:02:56 > 0:03:04Ratko Mladic commanded Serb forces in the Bosnian war. He is now facing
0:03:04 > 0:03:10a verdict on an enormous catalogue of war crimes, including genocide.
0:03:10 > 0:03:16It has taken six years to try.Four days ago marked two decades and is
0:03:16 > 0:03:25Ratko Mladic became the commander of the main staff of the army of
0:03:25 > 0:03:30Republika Serbska. On that day he assumed the mantle of realising,
0:03:30 > 0:03:34through military might, the criminal goals of ethnically cleansing much
0:03:34 > 0:03:50of Bosnia.This woman was a judge herself in the north-western town of
0:03:50 > 0:03:57pre- adore when Serbian troops took it over in May of 1992. She was
0:03:57 > 0:04:01fired and became one of thousands of Muslims sent to a nine or planned
0:04:01 > 0:04:05that would come in from this is a camp where, in a few months, 700
0:04:05 > 0:04:13inmates died. -- sent to an iron ore plant.
0:04:37 > 0:04:42She was the product of what was called ethnic cleansing, driving
0:04:42 > 0:04:49non-Serbs out of much of Bosnia. 37 women were used to serve in the
0:04:49 > 0:04:54camps dining hall. During the day they could hear torture going on in
0:04:54 > 0:04:59their nearby dormitories. Night brought its own anguish.
0:05:53 > 0:06:01I have to admit, somewhat ashamed to admit it, but I was a little
0:06:01 > 0:06:05sceptical of some of the reports that initially emerged in 1992 about
0:06:05 > 0:06:10what was happening to people in these camps. But pretty quickly, it
0:06:10 > 0:06:17did become clear that terrible things were happening. And actually,
0:06:17 > 0:06:21it was the human suffering caused in that initial phase of the neck
0:06:21 > 0:06:26cleansing and murder and rape that went on in the north-west of Bosnia
0:06:26 > 0:06:31here that caused the International Criminal Court of also be formed and
0:06:31 > 0:06:37set in train the whole process of international justice that will
0:06:37 > 0:06:42culminate in the sentencing of general Ratko Mladic. -- ethnic
0:06:42 > 0:06:46cleansing and murder. Our filming was stopped by security guards.
0:06:46 > 0:06:51What's the problem?He is saying that we are not allowed to film the
0:06:51 > 0:06:57factory.The iron plant is now in action again under a foreign firm.
0:06:57 > 0:07:00But it is a measure of the sensitivities that Omarska still
0:07:00 > 0:07:04generates.
0:07:34 > 0:07:42Please rise.Early on, the Hague tribunal tried several of the
0:07:42 > 0:07:49Omarska guards. One of those trials featured Miroslav. A policeman at
0:07:49 > 0:07:53the start of the war, he was described in court as the deputy
0:07:53 > 0:07:58commander of the camp. Then, as now, he portrays himself as someone who
0:07:58 > 0:08:04saved his Muslim wife's relatives from the horror of the camp.
0:08:23 > 0:08:27Because of the isolated acts of kindness to some prisoners, do not
0:08:27 > 0:08:31absolve any individual crimes which may have been committed.The court
0:08:31 > 0:08:34said he was culpable of joint enterprise. He knew what was going
0:08:34 > 0:08:41on.The chamber finds you guilty of the crime against humanity,
0:08:41 > 0:08:53persecution, and the war crimes murder and torture.In the war, we
0:08:53 > 0:08:59used to travel into Surrey are though via this mountain. --
0:08:59 > 0:09:06Sarajevo. We are here again. This place, reminiscent of the Winter
0:09:06 > 0:09:09Olympics, became a battleground as the focus of the war shifted from
0:09:09 > 0:09:17the area around Prejidor to Bosnia's capital. And in that long fight, a
0:09:17 > 0:09:28whole new chapter of war crimes began. Very quickly after the war
0:09:28 > 0:09:32started, the Bosnian Serbs were driven out of most of Surrey are
0:09:32 > 0:09:37though. -- Sarajevo. They held a couple of suburbs on that flank.
0:09:37 > 0:09:40Other than that, they were in the surrounding hills, pouring down
0:09:40 > 0:09:44Sniper Fire and artillery fire on the people below. Ratko Mladic began
0:09:44 > 0:09:48a siege which was to last more than three years. And of course, those
0:09:48 > 0:09:56events now form a central part of the indictments against him. From
0:09:56 > 0:10:01the beginning of the conflict, Ratko Mladic brought to bear the Serb
0:10:01 > 0:10:06army's superiority in artillery. And as this intercepted conversation
0:10:06 > 0:10:10showed, used it against the population of Sarajevo.
0:10:24 > 0:10:34So, you would come out of the flats that morning? Mia was a
0:10:34 > 0:10:40seven-year-old living on the street. How did the vibe change in the war?
0:10:40 > 0:10:46It must have been a big, big change? It was a shock.The siege had just
0:10:46 > 0:10:53started and she was brought out by a rumour of ice cream.We are heard
0:10:53 > 0:10:58this extremely loud or whistle, and suddenly, the earth began to shake.
0:10:58 > 0:11:05I went flying up in there. -- in the air. And another few seconds, all
0:11:05 > 0:11:09hell broke loose.
0:11:12 > 0:11:18SCREAMING.I could see everybody lying on the street, people in
0:11:18 > 0:11:29pieces, a lot of light. -- Bullard. -- blood.In those dreadful moments
0:11:29 > 0:11:34in which 20 people died, a cameraman captured this fleeting image of Mia
0:11:34 > 0:11:39being carried. She survived shrapnel wounds. Her mother lost a leg in the
0:11:39 > 0:11:44blast. Together, the family and neighbours in view of the following
0:11:44 > 0:11:48three years, during which at times, 1000 shells a day would fall on the
0:11:48 > 0:12:00city.We were submitted to shelling, and Sniper rifles, no water, no
0:12:00 > 0:12:06electricity, no food. So we were like mice in a cage, pretty much.
0:12:10 > 0:12:16While the world awaits the Ratko Mladic verdict, it has gone on so
0:12:16 > 0:12:19long some convicts have done their time in prison and could choose
0:12:19 > 0:12:28where to be released. A few years ago, jubilant crowds turned out to
0:12:28 > 0:12:39meet him as he returned. He was the speaker of the Serb parliament. He
0:12:39 > 0:12:49accepts people on his side were guilty of war crimes as well.
0:12:54 > 0:13:01For much of the war, the Bosnian - Serb leadership successfully kept
0:13:01 > 0:13:07the outside world that day, sometimes intimidating UN troops, at
0:13:07 > 0:13:13others, firing on or even taking them hostage. But across in the east
0:13:13 > 0:13:17of the country, events reached a tipping point in the final year of
0:13:17 > 0:13:26the war. The genocide indictment against Ratko Mladic divides his
0:13:26 > 0:13:31crimes into various phases. The early part of the war around
0:13:31 > 0:13:38north-west Bosnia and then the siege of Sarajevo at the centre. And then
0:13:38 > 0:13:43finally the enormous catalogue of crimes that took place in this place
0:13:43 > 0:14:02in 1995, Srebrenica. The UN declared the enclave to be a safe area. But
0:14:02 > 0:14:06as the capture was planned, the Dutch troops had been abandoned by
0:14:06 > 0:14:16their commanders. Ratko Mladic savoured his triumph, and recalled
0:14:16 > 0:14:24past defeats of the Serbs by the Ottoman Turks.
0:14:32 > 0:14:38Srebrenica was overrun, and more than 20,000 frightened Muslim women
0:14:38 > 0:14:48and children crammed into the Dutch base. Rob was one of the soldiers
0:14:48 > 0:14:56there.Still, any time I walk in this door, a split second, a split
0:14:56 > 0:15:06second, I smell and see the people. Dead people, Davies, everything
0:15:06 > 0:15:14together. Thousands of people. -- babies. You cannot imagine it.As
0:15:14 > 0:15:22Srebrenica fell, one woman gave him her woman to look after.How
0:15:22 > 0:15:29desperate do you have to be, a baby, just born, you must be so proud of
0:15:29 > 0:15:36it, to give him to someone because at that moment it was the best
0:15:36 > 0:15:46thinking for her to give the best for her baby.He passed the child on
0:15:46 > 0:15:52to medics and it survived. Ratko Mladic guaranteed the women and
0:15:52 > 0:15:57children safe passage. But meanwhile, his troops hunted the man
0:15:57 > 0:16:05of Srebrenica. -- men. When captured, they were taken to places
0:16:05 > 0:16:12like this school. Soon after the war, we visited it, checking reports
0:16:12 > 0:16:19that men had been held here in shots fired to keep them under control. --
0:16:19 > 0:16:22here and shots.
0:16:27 > 0:16:33Our information came from this man who went back to the school with us
0:16:33 > 0:16:45for only the second time. There, he had seen Ratko Mladic personally
0:16:45 > 0:16:49supervising what was to happen next.
0:18:01 > 0:18:04The men, already terrified, were packed into trucks and taken to a
0:18:04 > 0:18:12nearby field where mass murder began.
0:18:57 > 0:19:04He is survived by playing dead among the corpses. And then at night, he
0:19:04 > 0:19:08escaped over the mountains to government territory.
0:19:20 > 0:19:26When we came here in 1996, the main mosque had actually been blown up
0:19:26 > 0:19:31and the minaret was lying in the streets. It has been restored. And
0:19:31 > 0:19:36over the years, a good many people have come back. Muslim people, not
0:19:36 > 0:19:44as many as were here before, but a kind of Muslim Bosnia Clive has been
0:19:44 > 0:19:54reconstructed in this town. He is haunted by the loss of his father,
0:19:54 > 0:19:57brother, and numerous cousins, and also by the fact he still recognised
0:19:57 > 0:20:06as Serbs around here from those killing fields.
0:20:45 > 0:20:50In the place he returned after the war, there are also reminders
0:20:50 > 0:20:58everywhere. Some men who were never convicted, others who have served
0:20:58 > 0:21:26their sentences, who she now encounters on the streets. Taking
0:21:26 > 0:21:31labouring jobs ends his return, he is unable to leave the past behind
0:21:31 > 0:21:34or get over what he regards as an injustice.
0:21:53 > 0:22:00It is pointless quibbling for him with a sentence he has already
0:22:00 > 0:22:03served. He is done with raging against The Hague.He believes that
0:22:03 > 0:22:17politics as to leave its sectarian bickering behind.
0:22:35 > 0:22:41This remains a divided country in which sectarian politicians play on
0:22:41 > 0:22:47national fears. And for that reason, as the trials and in The Hague, the
0:22:47 > 0:23:14pursuit of war crimes will go on in Bosnia itself.