0:00:05 > 0:00:09A normal Saturday in the English Football League,
0:00:09 > 0:00:11and Leeds are preparing to welcome Brighton
0:00:11 > 0:00:14from Britain's so-called gay capital.
0:00:20 > 0:00:24The world's most famous gay sportsman, Gareth "Alfie" Thomas,
0:00:24 > 0:00:27is on the way to the ground with Brighton fans.
0:00:27 > 0:00:28Well, wherever we go, really,
0:00:28 > 0:00:32we tend to get chants of, "Does your boyfriend know you're here?"
0:00:32 > 0:00:34Or, "We can see you holding hands."
0:00:34 > 0:00:35You guys don't react?
0:00:35 > 0:00:38- Oh, no.- Well, we do react, I mean, we start singing things to them -
0:00:38 > 0:00:41"You're too ugly to be gay." Or when we are beating them
0:00:41 > 0:00:43we start singing, "1-0 to the nancy boys."
0:00:43 > 0:00:45- Right, so make a joke about it? - Yeah.
0:00:45 > 0:00:48It's kind of...you don't really notice it any more.
0:00:48 > 0:00:51CHANTING BLEEPING
0:00:51 > 0:00:54Probably the most surprising of everything
0:00:54 > 0:00:56is the acceptance of the level
0:00:56 > 0:01:01of abuse, the normality that abuse has been given.
0:01:01 > 0:01:05I find that unacceptable.
0:01:10 > 0:01:13If I was a player in this environment, I would be so afraid.
0:01:13 > 0:01:15So afraid, because you give them an inch and they're going to take
0:01:15 > 0:01:18a mile, because they're just looking for that one crack.
0:01:18 > 0:01:19They're trying to break each other.
0:01:27 > 0:01:32It is a human right that we are allowed to be who we want to be,
0:01:32 > 0:01:36yet football, for some reason, feels like,
0:01:36 > 0:01:39yeah, you can be who you want to be, but within this game,
0:01:39 > 0:01:42if you're not a stereotypical male or female we expect you to be, then,
0:01:42 > 0:01:45you know what, we are allowed to abuse you for 90 minutes.
0:01:45 > 0:01:47That, in my book, ain't right.
0:01:50 > 0:01:54There are 5,000 male professional footballers in the UK.
0:01:55 > 0:01:57Not one is openly gay.
0:01:59 > 0:02:03Does fear rule, or are there just no gay players?
0:02:04 > 0:02:07Do you personally know of any footballers
0:02:07 > 0:02:08who are hiding their sexuality
0:02:08 > 0:02:10within the Football League right now?
0:02:10 > 0:02:16Yes, I do. And I know the lies that they are living and I know the fear
0:02:16 > 0:02:17that they have.
0:02:17 > 0:02:19It's lovely! Robbie Rogers!
0:02:19 > 0:02:22One player reveals the homophobia that stopped him coming out
0:02:22 > 0:02:24when he was playing in the UK.
0:02:24 > 0:02:28I heard it from, you know, coaches, from fans, from players,
0:02:28 > 0:02:31but definitely it was within the changing room
0:02:31 > 0:02:32that affected me the most.
0:02:34 > 0:02:38And politicians have started asking why football seems to be
0:02:38 > 0:02:40the last refuge of extreme homophobia.
0:02:41 > 0:02:46What is it about football that makes it lag
0:02:46 > 0:02:49so far behind civilised society?
0:02:53 > 0:02:57So, 50 years after the legalisation of homosexuality,
0:02:57 > 0:03:01Alfie asks, is football finally ready to kick its homophobic habit?
0:03:02 > 0:03:06I think everybody has something to say about the issue,
0:03:06 > 0:03:09but nobody does anything about the issue,
0:03:09 > 0:03:12and I'd like to find out why that is.
0:03:12 > 0:03:15# You're queer and you know you are
0:03:15 > 0:03:17# You're queer and you know you are
0:03:17 > 0:03:20# You're queer and you know you are. #
0:03:20 > 0:03:22CHANTING ECHOES AND FADES
0:03:34 > 0:03:37This is the cliffs I would come to once a week,
0:03:37 > 0:03:39for maybe a three-month period.
0:03:41 > 0:03:44And I'd always go through this process of standing at the top
0:03:44 > 0:03:46of the cliff, taking off my shoes, putting my shoes tidy,
0:03:46 > 0:03:49putting my socks in my shoes, folding my clothes.
0:03:52 > 0:03:55So, every day I'd come, I'd go like a step closer to the edge and then
0:03:55 > 0:03:57a step closer to the edge, going closer and closer and closer.
0:03:59 > 0:04:01It's a strange, strange thing of wanting to die,
0:04:01 > 0:04:04but I didn't want to die - I just didn't want to open my eyes again.
0:04:05 > 0:04:09Cos the world that I saw in front of me was something that I was
0:04:09 > 0:04:10really, really scared of.
0:04:13 > 0:04:16Ten years ago, Gareth Thomas was a sporting icon.
0:04:18 > 0:04:20Captain of Wales with 100 caps.
0:04:22 > 0:04:24Hard man. Enforcer.
0:04:25 > 0:04:29But the adulation of millions could not help him deal with a secret.
0:04:31 > 0:04:34I wasn't the person that I was portraying myself to be,
0:04:34 > 0:04:38and it makes you feel ugly, it makes you feel shameful,
0:04:38 > 0:04:42and it really does, it makes you feel like you want to die.
0:04:42 > 0:04:44I was afraid of being judged
0:04:44 > 0:04:48for something as normal, as I see it now, as my sexuality.
0:04:49 > 0:04:53The fear of people looking at me differently or talking about me.
0:04:54 > 0:04:57Everything that I had worked my whole life for being taken away,
0:04:57 > 0:05:00and left with nothing to live for.
0:05:00 > 0:05:03But I still want to be able to hear my mother talk.
0:05:03 > 0:05:06I still want to be able to hear my father laugh.
0:05:06 > 0:05:09And it's like THEY are the people that would be affected by this.
0:05:11 > 0:05:13That, I think, was the one thing that was stopping me
0:05:13 > 0:05:15from jumping off the edge.
0:05:15 > 0:05:22So, the last time I came here, I solemnly said to myself,
0:05:22 > 0:05:24"I'm never coming back, because I'm choosing to live,
0:05:24 > 0:05:25"I'm not choosing to die."
0:05:28 > 0:05:31Having first admitted his true sexuality
0:05:31 > 0:05:33to his family and team-mates,
0:05:33 > 0:05:37Alfie then came out to the world on the pages of the Daily Mail -
0:05:37 > 0:05:39the paper his father read.
0:05:39 > 0:05:42Years of torment for me
0:05:42 > 0:05:45took my team-mates, took my friends,
0:05:45 > 0:05:48took my family probably 30 seconds of contemplation
0:05:48 > 0:05:52to be able to deliver the words like, "It doesn't matter,"
0:05:52 > 0:05:55and to me, all of a sudden, life was completely different.
0:05:55 > 0:05:59Honesty was something that gave me a sense of freedom to be able to walk
0:05:59 > 0:06:03down the street a little bit prouder, a little bit happier,
0:06:03 > 0:06:09look people in the eye, and be proud of who I am, where I've come from,
0:06:09 > 0:06:10um, and what I represent.
0:06:12 > 0:06:15It's ten years since Alfie came out,
0:06:15 > 0:06:19and he's now a celebrated gay icon the world over.
0:06:20 > 0:06:21Fashanu.
0:06:21 > 0:06:22Oh, oh, what a goal!
0:06:22 > 0:06:25Oh, that's a magnificent goal!
0:06:25 > 0:06:29The only top-flight male footballer to come out whilst playing in the UK
0:06:29 > 0:06:31was Justin Fashanu.
0:06:31 > 0:06:34His story is very different to that of Alfie Thomas.
0:06:36 > 0:06:38When he came out in 1990,
0:06:38 > 0:06:42he was subject to vile abuse on the terraces, in the press,
0:06:42 > 0:06:44and on the streets.
0:06:46 > 0:06:50In 1998, having been accused of sexual assault,
0:06:50 > 0:06:52Fashanu hanged himself.
0:06:58 > 0:07:00So, I'm on my way now to see Amal Fashanu,
0:07:00 > 0:07:02who is the niece of Justin Fashanu.
0:07:02 > 0:07:05And I just want to chat to her, cos I want to know her experiences,
0:07:05 > 0:07:07cos she's done a similar project to this.
0:07:11 > 0:07:13- Hello, my lovely. - Hi, how are you?
0:07:13 > 0:07:16Five years ago, Amal Fashanu made her own documentary
0:07:16 > 0:07:20about the world of football and the homophobia her uncle suffered.
0:07:20 > 0:07:24You know when you went to the governing bodies about Justin,
0:07:24 > 0:07:28did they take any kind of, any blame, or give you kind of,
0:07:28 > 0:07:33I suppose, any empathy towards what happened with him?
0:07:33 > 0:07:34I think definitely empathy,
0:07:34 > 0:07:39because that's a very diplomatic and very good way of describing,
0:07:39 > 0:07:42you know. I think because Justin passed away,
0:07:42 > 0:07:45there is a certain sense of,
0:07:45 > 0:07:46kind of diplomacy, in a way.
0:07:46 > 0:07:49You're not going to obviously offend to that extreme.
0:07:49 > 0:07:51I'm quite hard-core when it comes to that,
0:07:51 > 0:07:53cos I was really wanting to defend Justin,
0:07:53 > 0:07:57because what I did realise was that football in general,
0:07:57 > 0:08:00it's a very particular sport, you know.
0:08:00 > 0:08:03It's not like rugby, it's not like cricket.
0:08:03 > 0:08:06Within football, I feel like there is a special type of community.
0:08:06 > 0:08:08I don't know whether you can call it
0:08:08 > 0:08:13a macho kind of society environment, which is very closed, you know?
0:08:13 > 0:08:17I think that there is a lot of money involved in it
0:08:17 > 0:08:20and it is very hard to actually get the truth
0:08:20 > 0:08:23and actually understand what's going on.
0:08:23 > 0:08:25I mean, for me, what was most shocking about my documentary
0:08:25 > 0:08:28was the fact that, you know, the FA could say
0:08:28 > 0:08:30that the reason why there is nothing
0:08:30 > 0:08:32really in place for a gay footballer
0:08:32 > 0:08:34would be because there are no gay footballers.
0:08:34 > 0:08:36You know...!
0:08:36 > 0:08:39- Yeah...- I have friends who are gay footballers.
0:08:39 > 0:08:42I would never say their name, I would never say anything,
0:08:42 > 0:08:44but what can they do?
0:08:44 > 0:08:47Yeah. Do you think that now,
0:08:47 > 0:08:51potentially, it could be an environment that is ready
0:08:51 > 0:08:52for a player to come out?
0:08:52 > 0:08:54I would love, love, love to say yes.
0:08:56 > 0:08:59But really, you know, within football,
0:08:59 > 0:09:02have attitudes really changed,
0:09:02 > 0:09:06you know? Are the people, you know, at the boards level kind of thing,
0:09:06 > 0:09:08are they really changing their attitude?
0:09:08 > 0:09:10Will it ever change?
0:09:10 > 0:09:14Maybe when I have children, you know, at that point, I think yes.
0:09:14 > 0:09:17Within rugby, I think even cricket, they're sports which,
0:09:17 > 0:09:20it is bad for me to say, but they're more elegant,
0:09:20 > 0:09:22they seem like the fans are more intelligent.
0:09:22 > 0:09:26With football, I really don't see anything changing
0:09:26 > 0:09:28for the next five years. I just feel like
0:09:28 > 0:09:33until a big footballer currently playing decides to be brave,
0:09:33 > 0:09:37to say and be who they are, I think we're going to be waiting.
0:09:37 > 0:09:39You think that will be the flip,
0:09:39 > 0:09:41- when a footballer comes out? - Definitely.
0:09:41 > 0:09:44Fashanu came in!
0:09:44 > 0:09:48It's almost 20 years since Justin Fashanu died,
0:09:48 > 0:09:51but abuse on the terraces is still rife.
0:09:51 > 0:09:53And now there is a whole new world of abuse online.
0:09:56 > 0:10:00A personal message to Pogba, who is a Manchester United footballer.
0:10:00 > 0:10:02"Pogba, a faggot."
0:10:02 > 0:10:05And then they've got, "Fellaini, burn this faggot."
0:10:05 > 0:10:07Just streams of it.
0:10:07 > 0:10:13- "All Arsenal fans are- BLEEP- faggots, ass bitches, and suck- BLEEP...
0:10:13 > 0:10:19All these people who are writing this, being gay is the lowest form
0:10:19 > 0:10:22of...life on this Earth.
0:10:22 > 0:10:25But nobody's stopping it.
0:10:25 > 0:10:28Like, say you replace any of these words with a racist comment,
0:10:28 > 0:10:30people would comment on it
0:10:30 > 0:10:32and people would be negative towards them.
0:10:32 > 0:10:33God, "Messi is a faggot."
0:10:33 > 0:10:35- "Suck a- BLEEP,- faggot.
0:10:35 > 0:10:38"No-one gives a shit about what you think.
0:10:38 > 0:10:41"Get off the crack, you faggot abortion survivor,
0:10:41 > 0:10:44"14-year-old runt rent boy."
0:10:44 > 0:10:47It's mad, that, like, you read these and you think,
0:10:47 > 0:10:51if there was a guy hiding his sexuality
0:10:51 > 0:10:55and wanting to potentially come out,
0:10:55 > 0:10:57but afraid of what he's going to go into,
0:10:57 > 0:11:03there are people with these views in the stands, week in, week out.
0:11:03 > 0:11:06If they think like that and act like that,
0:11:06 > 0:11:09what kind of environment within a football ground
0:11:09 > 0:11:10is that going to create?
0:11:15 > 0:11:16Earlier this year,
0:11:16 > 0:11:21a House of Commons committee reported on homophobia in sport.
0:11:24 > 0:11:28It discovered that in 2017,
0:11:28 > 0:11:32we have more openly gay sports professionals than ever before.
0:11:33 > 0:11:35Tom Daley in diving.
0:11:37 > 0:11:40Hockey stars Kate and Helen Richardson-Walsh -
0:11:40 > 0:11:43the first same-sex married couple to win Olympic golds.
0:11:43 > 0:11:46And rugby ref Nigel Owens.
0:11:46 > 0:11:47Stay, stay.
0:11:50 > 0:11:53What's your view of the underlying culture and attitudes within rugby,
0:11:53 > 0:11:55and do you have any causes for concern?
0:11:55 > 0:11:58If somebody was to ask me, is rugby a homophobic sport,
0:11:58 > 0:12:00then my answer would be no,
0:12:00 > 0:12:05because I couldn't be who I am today and referee at the level I am today
0:12:05 > 0:12:06if rugby was that case.
0:12:07 > 0:12:11After spending several months questioning people in sport,
0:12:11 > 0:12:17the MPs welcomed the steps taken by the industry to address LGBT issues.
0:12:19 > 0:12:23However, the report was universally scathing
0:12:23 > 0:12:25about homophobia in football.
0:12:25 > 0:12:31What is it about football that makes it lag so far behind
0:12:31 > 0:12:33civilised society?
0:12:33 > 0:12:36The two leading football bodies -
0:12:36 > 0:12:38the Premier League and the Football Association -
0:12:38 > 0:12:41were asked to give evidence, and it was Greg Clarke,
0:12:41 > 0:12:44the chairman of the FA, who caused the biggest stir.
0:12:46 > 0:12:50What do you think would happen to a gay player who came out today?
0:12:50 > 0:12:53I think there would be significant abuse.
0:12:53 > 0:12:55- Do you?- I do.
0:12:55 > 0:13:00If I was a gay man, why would I expose myself to that?
0:13:03 > 0:13:06Alfie's arranged to meet MP Damian Collins...
0:13:06 > 0:13:09- Hello, Damian.- ..chair of the parliamentary committee.
0:13:09 > 0:13:12There is a problem with homophobia in football.
0:13:12 > 0:13:14There is a problem with the way fans behave in stadia.
0:13:14 > 0:13:17There is clearly a problem, I think, within the culture of the sport,
0:13:17 > 0:13:19that no footballer feels comfortable about coming out.
0:13:19 > 0:13:23It's not only that there are no current players playing throughout.
0:13:23 > 0:13:26There are no gay young players in academies.
0:13:26 > 0:13:28- You know, there are no... - Managers, coaches.
0:13:28 > 0:13:32..coaches, nothing, you know, so it is all through the game.
0:13:32 > 0:13:35Do you also feel then that because there are no openly gay players,
0:13:35 > 0:13:38they almost feel that there is no problem and we have nothing to do,
0:13:38 > 0:13:40because we have no gay players
0:13:40 > 0:13:43which, to me, is a raging sign of warning,
0:13:43 > 0:13:44because there are no gay players.
0:13:44 > 0:13:46I think the FA know
0:13:46 > 0:13:50that there must be gay footballers.
0:13:50 > 0:13:52There must be a considerable number of gay footballers.
0:13:52 > 0:13:54And I think what the FA want to see
0:13:54 > 0:13:56is a change within their sport
0:13:56 > 0:13:59so that those footballers feel comfortable being out.
0:13:59 > 0:14:03What I don't think the FA know is how to achieve that.
0:14:03 > 0:14:06And I think, as well, it is, whilst we can look at the abuse
0:14:06 > 0:14:09within the stadia and say that's something, you know, we can hear it,
0:14:09 > 0:14:11we can see it, we know who is doing it.
0:14:11 > 0:14:13And say, "There are some idiots doing that,
0:14:13 > 0:14:14"let's stop them doing it,"
0:14:14 > 0:14:17but is that all that's holding people back,
0:14:17 > 0:14:20or is it actually something cultural within the sport itself, you know,
0:14:20 > 0:14:22within that team environment within the clubs,
0:14:22 > 0:14:24and actually the clubs and the football authorities
0:14:24 > 0:14:27are not doing enough to really look inside the sport
0:14:27 > 0:14:30and look at how... the way the sport is run
0:14:30 > 0:14:33may be putting some players off coming out?
0:14:33 > 0:14:37My gut feeling is that actually they are glad that there is nobody out,
0:14:37 > 0:14:40because they will not know how to deal with it.
0:14:40 > 0:14:42A player could pick up a phone and make a phone call tomorrow,
0:14:42 > 0:14:45and decide that he has to come out because, you know what,
0:14:45 > 0:14:46he can't live his life as a liar.
0:14:46 > 0:14:48My fear is, you know,
0:14:48 > 0:14:52what the hell has any of the governing bodies
0:14:52 > 0:14:55got in their armoury to protect them or to support them?
0:14:58 > 0:15:02So, what are Greg Clarke and the FA doing about it?
0:15:02 > 0:15:05I'm just cautious of encouraging people to come out
0:15:05 > 0:15:07until we've done our part of the bargain
0:15:07 > 0:15:11and stamped out that abuse so they can enjoy the football.
0:15:11 > 0:15:12RINGING TONE
0:15:14 > 0:15:18After a number of unanswered phone messages and one e-mail,
0:15:18 > 0:15:20Alfie's still trying to find out.
0:15:21 > 0:15:25We tried to contact you and you did respond to one of our e-mails,
0:15:25 > 0:15:28but since then we have had no contact with you,
0:15:28 > 0:15:31so I hope to chat to you hopefully next week.
0:15:31 > 0:15:33If not, we will call you back,
0:15:33 > 0:15:34but thank you for your time.
0:15:34 > 0:15:36Take care, buddy, bye.
0:15:36 > 0:15:39The thing is, I understand that they are running big organisations,
0:15:39 > 0:15:43but also the responsibility that comes with running a big
0:15:43 > 0:15:49organisation is staying in touch with not only the grassroots,
0:15:49 > 0:15:53but also people who want to kind of make a difference and make a change,
0:15:53 > 0:15:58so it is extremely difficult, but, you know,
0:15:58 > 0:16:02I didn't get to where I did in my rugby career by giving up,
0:16:02 > 0:16:03by falling at the first hurdle.
0:16:09 > 0:16:1118 months ago,
0:16:11 > 0:16:14the British tabloid claimed two players were poised to come out.
0:16:14 > 0:16:17But no-one did and the story disappeared.
0:16:23 > 0:16:26Alfie's agent is Emanuele Palladino.
0:16:26 > 0:16:28He also represents several footballers.
0:16:30 > 0:16:32So, without naming any names,
0:16:32 > 0:16:34do you personally know of any footballers
0:16:34 > 0:16:36who are hiding their sexuality
0:16:36 > 0:16:38within the Football League right now?
0:16:38 > 0:16:40- Yes, I do.- Yeah?
0:16:40 > 0:16:41And I think it is really difficult.
0:16:41 > 0:16:45And I know the lies that they are living,
0:16:45 > 0:16:51and I know the fear that they have, and I know they are not happy.
0:16:51 > 0:16:53And yet they feel they have got no option.
0:16:53 > 0:16:55And I think that is really,
0:16:55 > 0:16:59really sad in today's world, that you have to live a lie like that.
0:16:59 > 0:17:02How do you feel agents and representatives
0:17:02 > 0:17:05of football...footballers,
0:17:05 > 0:17:08what do you feel their view is towards footballers coming out?
0:17:08 > 0:17:11I think the default reaction is don't come out,
0:17:11 > 0:17:15that football's not ready for you, which I think is a shame.
0:17:15 > 0:17:17I think it is very difficult to come out.
0:17:17 > 0:17:19You know, they said that a footballer
0:17:19 > 0:17:22was going to be coming out, and as a result of that article,
0:17:22 > 0:17:24loads of footballers were being tweeted saying,
0:17:24 > 0:17:27"Tell me you are not gay, tell me it is not you."
0:17:27 > 0:17:28Now, if you are that gay footballer,
0:17:28 > 0:17:31you're going to be looking at every single thing online and you're going
0:17:31 > 0:17:35to be reading those homophobic tweets and going, "Actually, do you know what? I can't do this."
0:17:35 > 0:17:37So, if you had the power to do something within football right now
0:17:37 > 0:17:41to create a better environment for an LGBT player to come out,
0:17:41 > 0:17:44what is the one thing you would do to change football now?
0:17:44 > 0:17:46The million-dollar question!
0:17:47 > 0:17:49It's two things. One is,
0:17:49 > 0:17:56can the governing body be more vocal in trying to stamp out homophobia?
0:17:56 > 0:17:59And two is, can a footballer come out?
0:17:59 > 0:18:00Because if a footballer CAN come out,
0:18:00 > 0:18:03he can help that campaign by being him.
0:18:03 > 0:18:04And it comes back to you.
0:18:04 > 0:18:07When you came out, I always said Gareth Thomas is new territory.
0:18:07 > 0:18:11Gareth Thomas is blazing a new trail that no-one has done,
0:18:11 > 0:18:15and you changed people's minds and perceptions by being you.
0:18:15 > 0:18:18But that is not easy. And, you know, there is no magic wand,
0:18:18 > 0:18:21but that would be it - governing bodies to improve more,
0:18:21 > 0:18:23and a footballer to find the courage.
0:18:23 > 0:18:26But, you know, that may never happen.
0:18:28 > 0:18:30Oh, it's lovely! Robbie Rogers!
0:18:30 > 0:18:32Oh, yes!
0:18:32 > 0:18:34On the entire planet,
0:18:34 > 0:18:37there is currently just one openly gay male footballer
0:18:37 > 0:18:39playing at the top level.
0:18:41 > 0:18:45And Alfie has travelled halfway around the world to Los Angeles
0:18:45 > 0:18:47to meet him.
0:18:47 > 0:18:49- What's going on?- Hello, bud, how are you doing, all right?- Good.
0:18:51 > 0:18:53Come on in, guys.
0:18:53 > 0:18:56- Nice humble house! - HE CHUCKLES
0:18:56 > 0:19:00LA Galaxy star Robbie Rogers is not only a US international,
0:19:00 > 0:19:03he also has experience of playing in the UK.
0:19:04 > 0:19:07Before coming out in 2013,
0:19:07 > 0:19:10he fulfilled a childhood dream of playing in England,
0:19:10 > 0:19:12signing for Leeds United.
0:19:14 > 0:19:18He was soon taken aback by the levels of abuse in the British game.
0:19:18 > 0:19:21A few people start shouting something that other people feel
0:19:21 > 0:19:23it's OK to be, like, shouting something, and it's like
0:19:23 > 0:19:26this pack mentality where they all start going. And there's
0:19:26 > 0:19:29the adrenaline and the aggression, which is so weird to watch sometimes.
0:19:29 > 0:19:32I remember being in England and watching young kids feeding off the
0:19:32 > 0:19:33aggression of their parents,
0:19:33 > 0:19:36which is actually really sad and disgusting to me.
0:19:38 > 0:19:42They don't realise how that's affecting someone's life,
0:19:42 > 0:19:46over their whole life and their emotional state and their happiness.
0:19:46 > 0:19:47You know, they think that they are
0:19:47 > 0:19:49hopefully just affecting a game for 90 minutes.
0:19:51 > 0:19:54Coping with crowds was tough.
0:19:54 > 0:19:58Coping with people on his own side was tougher.
0:19:58 > 0:20:00I mean, I remember a coach saying, like,
0:20:00 > 0:20:02"Don't pass the ball like a faggot."
0:20:02 > 0:20:04That was just so ridiculous that he would be dumb enough to say
0:20:04 > 0:20:07- something like this.- Yeah.- There was discussion is that I heard,
0:20:07 > 0:20:10where guys would be next to me on a bike, riding a bike after a game,
0:20:10 > 0:20:14just doing a cool down, and they would be, like,
0:20:14 > 0:20:17"How disgusting is it that..." "You know, how disgusting, how can a man
0:20:17 > 0:20:19"even go through the act of loving another man?"
0:20:19 > 0:20:20Like, how disgusting that would be.
0:20:20 > 0:20:25And they would be talking about that and I would be there on my bike, like, "Shit. I'm never coming out."
0:20:25 > 0:20:28I would get almost like a cramp, like it was almost hard for me
0:20:28 > 0:20:30to breathe when someone said something like that
0:20:30 > 0:20:32in the locker room because I was so afraid of being,
0:20:32 > 0:20:34like, ostracised from the group of guys.
0:20:34 > 0:20:37So someone would say something and I'd go out to do a training session,
0:20:37 > 0:20:40and I'd just moved to England and I was trying to compete
0:20:40 > 0:20:43with these guys who were great footballers and I was, like,
0:20:43 > 0:20:46still dealing with that pain in my body from someone saying words.
0:20:46 > 0:20:50You don't realise that someone with their words can be so damaging
0:20:50 > 0:20:52to your confidence and your soul.
0:20:53 > 0:20:57Despairing, and no longer prepared to live a lie,
0:20:57 > 0:21:00Robbie quit Britain and turned his back on football.
0:21:01 > 0:21:04He returned to the US and came out to his family and friends.
0:21:06 > 0:21:07Being honest to myself,
0:21:07 > 0:21:09being honest to my family especially was important.
0:21:09 > 0:21:13You know, eventually coming out in a more public way
0:21:13 > 0:21:15because I still felt like I was still closeted.
0:21:15 > 0:21:19Even though at first I was like, "I don't owe anyone anything,"
0:21:19 > 0:21:20but I still felt a little bit...
0:21:20 > 0:21:22I didn't expect that feeling.
0:21:22 > 0:21:25I thought, after I came out to my family and friends,
0:21:25 > 0:21:28that I would be kind of free from that, but...
0:21:28 > 0:21:32I didn't expect to feel like I still needed to just, like,
0:21:32 > 0:21:35write something and post it or wherever.
0:21:35 > 0:21:36- Yeah.- Which then...
0:21:36 > 0:21:39After I did that, I was like, I felt, like, so free.
0:21:40 > 0:21:42Finally out publicly,
0:21:42 > 0:21:46a relieved and liberated Robbie resumed his football career
0:21:46 > 0:21:48- with LA Galaxy.- Another run there!
0:21:48 > 0:21:53And there's the tie goal! It was Robbie Rogers coming through. 1-1.
0:21:53 > 0:21:58One unexpected plus was that, as the only gay top-flight footballer,
0:21:58 > 0:22:02he was suddenly a magnet to sponsors.
0:22:02 > 0:22:06The honesty is something any brand wants to be connected to.
0:22:06 > 0:22:11Yes, I think the younger generation now especially loves connecting
0:22:11 > 0:22:15to...honesty, people that are different, that are creative,
0:22:15 > 0:22:17that are willing to, you know, stand out.
0:22:17 > 0:22:20I think brands are smart and they are starting to, you know,
0:22:20 > 0:22:24latch onto that. So I don't think any athletes,
0:22:24 > 0:22:26male or female, in any sport,
0:22:26 > 0:22:29I don't think they have to fear that, because I think really
0:22:29 > 0:22:32there's a lot of brands out there that want to work with athletes,
0:22:32 > 0:22:35- and especially ones that stand out in a positive way.- Yeah.
0:22:37 > 0:22:41That's America, but in Britain things are very different.
0:22:45 > 0:22:49Alfie heads to the headquarters of the players union, the PFA.
0:22:50 > 0:22:53Gordon Taylor is the Chief Executive,
0:22:53 > 0:22:56and Simone Pound, the head of equalities.
0:22:56 > 0:22:59As a body that is there to protect the players,
0:22:59 > 0:23:03do you feel that if a professional footballer came out within England
0:23:03 > 0:23:07and Wales, that the PFA would have a procedure and a policy there
0:23:07 > 0:23:09to protect him?
0:23:09 > 0:23:12Well, I hope so, and
0:23:12 > 0:23:16football being a team game, it is about offering support
0:23:16 > 0:23:18in whatever area.
0:23:18 > 0:23:24We talked about other areas that we deal with, with depression, and...
0:23:26 > 0:23:31..issues with regard to anti-racism, anti-Semitism,
0:23:31 > 0:23:34and we look after the women in the game.
0:23:34 > 0:23:38Quite a number of our older players with suffering, need new hips,
0:23:38 > 0:23:42or arthritis, so to get back straightaway,
0:23:42 > 0:23:45where it is something that we are very much aware of
0:23:45 > 0:23:48and the players who have come out are normally players
0:23:48 > 0:23:50who have come out once they've retired from the game.
0:23:50 > 0:23:52I think Robbie Rogers is still playing.
0:23:52 > 0:23:56- Yeah, he is.- I think... how he felt so much better,
0:23:56 > 0:23:58so obviously when you look,
0:23:58 > 0:24:03we are to some extent looking at the anniversary of 50 years ago and
0:24:03 > 0:24:07legislation, and when you think some of the actual heroes of this country,
0:24:07 > 0:24:10Second World War, you know,
0:24:10 > 0:24:14different individuals who were gay, and yet,
0:24:14 > 0:24:17you know, were vilified, and you think, "What is that about?"
0:24:17 > 0:24:19You know, "How could they have to cope with that?"
0:24:19 > 0:24:21And so you do feel that sympathy.
0:24:23 > 0:24:24It is a good question,
0:24:24 > 0:24:29but in answering it I would love the environment to be comfortable enough
0:24:29 > 0:24:31so that that would happen.
0:24:31 > 0:24:33Do you feel you can create that?
0:24:33 > 0:24:35Only because I just feel personally,
0:24:35 > 0:24:37from my own story, when I came out...
0:24:39 > 0:24:41..as being gay and carried on playing,
0:24:41 > 0:24:45there was nothing in place, and that was what really, really scared me.
0:24:45 > 0:24:49And for me, I just think if there is something open, a policy open.
0:24:49 > 0:24:54You were a pathfinder, and that's what I said, we have looked at how
0:24:54 > 0:24:57to judge what happened with regard to yourself,
0:24:57 > 0:25:00and in cricket and in other sports,
0:25:00 > 0:25:02and tried to take out what has worked.
0:25:02 > 0:25:05But, again, what kind of interests me is you are saying
0:25:05 > 0:25:08you are learning lessons from other people.
0:25:08 > 0:25:11I'm still not really understanding, to be honest, what did you learn?
0:25:11 > 0:25:15Just, really, what we learnt from your story, Gareth,
0:25:15 > 0:25:18and what you were saying about where we have come from as a game.
0:25:19 > 0:25:23And obviously we have worked on this area for a number of years now,
0:25:23 > 0:25:27I have been in post for nearly 17 years now,
0:25:27 > 0:25:31and can see I think we have actually made huge strides as a game,
0:25:31 > 0:25:35with regards to LGBT inclusion and homophobia in particular.
0:25:35 > 0:25:38Obviously as the players' union,
0:25:38 > 0:25:43it is something that we've really pushed for, in terms of a protocol,
0:25:43 > 0:25:49in terms of procedures in and around the game, and obviously your story.
0:25:49 > 0:25:50And just really...
0:25:52 > 0:25:54..like you did, spoke to the coach,
0:25:54 > 0:25:58made sure that your team-mates were supportive, and the...
0:26:00 > 0:26:04..rugby associations came out and kind of supported and endorsed their
0:26:04 > 0:26:07belief in you as a person, and I think that is really,
0:26:07 > 0:26:09you know, best practice,
0:26:09 > 0:26:12all that anyone would do, and what we will do as a game.
0:26:14 > 0:26:17I don't know whether to laugh or cry.
0:26:19 > 0:26:22I am literally dumbfounded, like, I am literally dumbfounded,
0:26:22 > 0:26:24because personally if I had been doing a job for 17 years
0:26:24 > 0:26:28on controlling the diversity and welfare of players,
0:26:28 > 0:26:32then I am sure as hell, if I was asked a question...
0:26:32 > 0:26:35which is such a current topic at the moment,
0:26:35 > 0:26:37about a potential footballer coming out to be gay,
0:26:37 > 0:26:40I would be on it. I would have every point,
0:26:40 > 0:26:42I would answer every question,
0:26:42 > 0:26:44because I would have been prepared for it.
0:26:46 > 0:26:49And there is a good old saying in sport,
0:26:49 > 0:26:52is failure to prepare is preparing to fail.
0:26:53 > 0:26:55And this, to me, is an absolute failure.
0:26:57 > 0:27:02Alfie tries again to speak to Greg Clarke, chairman of the FA.
0:27:02 > 0:27:06I am personally ashamed that they don't feel safe to come out.
0:27:08 > 0:27:09Answering machine.
0:27:13 > 0:27:15I tell you what, I wouldn't want
0:27:15 > 0:27:18to be like a multi-million pound business
0:27:18 > 0:27:21trying to get hold of them to do some sponsorship deal or something,
0:27:21 > 0:27:24because...very difficult to get hold of, or maybe it's just me!
0:27:27 > 0:27:29Everything I went through out there...
0:27:31 > 0:27:34..was nothing compared to the demons inside.
0:27:34 > 0:27:38Alfie starred in a high-profile ad campaign about his coming out.
0:27:38 > 0:27:39I turned to my team-mates.
0:27:41 > 0:27:45Telling them I was gay was the toughest thing I've ever done.
0:27:47 > 0:27:49But when I needed them the most,
0:27:49 > 0:27:50they were there for me.
0:27:57 > 0:28:02For me, it was such an honour to have my story associated with it,
0:28:02 > 0:28:05but I suppose as a brand, as a company,
0:28:05 > 0:28:08did you feel it might kind of weaken your stance in any way?
0:28:08 > 0:28:10No, we didn't. And I'll tell you why,
0:28:10 > 0:28:13because we look for stories that are about strength of character
0:28:13 > 0:28:16and about bonds of friendship
0:28:16 > 0:28:21that ultimately have a kind of positive effect on the world.
0:28:21 > 0:28:24- Right.- That's what we found so inspiring about YOUR story.
0:28:24 > 0:28:27Did you feel, as a company, it was a positive?
0:28:27 > 0:28:30Absolutely. Your film scored better, like,
0:28:30 > 0:28:34significantly better than our average Guinness performance,
0:28:34 > 0:28:36and so that is comparing to some pretty successful,
0:28:36 > 0:28:37very famous Guinness advertising.
0:28:37 > 0:28:39- Right.- And this scored higher than it.
0:28:39 > 0:28:43And I think it's because people were attracted to your human story.
0:28:43 > 0:28:47Obviously what I'm doing at the moment is, I'm kind of in this world
0:28:47 > 0:28:51of football, which is a very new world to me,
0:28:51 > 0:28:56and is probably more focused on sponsorship,
0:28:56 > 0:28:58on advertising than any other sport.
0:28:58 > 0:29:01And I think there is a lot of fear for people wanting to be themselves
0:29:01 > 0:29:04within sport, because advertising...
0:29:05 > 0:29:09..is such a big part of it and they don't want to lose their attachment
0:29:09 > 0:29:12to their brands. Now, if a footballer was to come out
0:29:12 > 0:29:13within that game,
0:29:13 > 0:29:17do you feel like they would be more of an attractive proposition?
0:29:17 > 0:29:20I think there would be brands that would be knocking down the door
0:29:20 > 0:29:23to want to work with the first person that did that,
0:29:23 > 0:29:27because, the same reasons that we wanted to work with you,
0:29:27 > 0:29:30because you were the first, you were a role model.
0:29:30 > 0:29:34- Yeah.- And it made for an unbelievable personal story
0:29:34 > 0:29:37as a result of doing that, because of the burden of being first
0:29:37 > 0:29:39- as well.- Yeah, yeah.
0:29:44 > 0:29:50Last year, a survey found that 72% of fans had heard homophobic abuse
0:29:50 > 0:29:51on the terraces.
0:29:53 > 0:29:56All of the football authorities
0:29:56 > 0:29:59have financed campaign group Kick It Out to create a free app
0:29:59 > 0:30:01for reporting abuse.
0:30:03 > 0:30:08Yet across the whole of last season, the app was used just 19 times.
0:30:12 > 0:30:16Kick It Out's chief executive officer is Roisin Wood.
0:30:16 > 0:30:19Now, I can look after myself, but I was at a football match
0:30:19 > 0:30:21and I thought, do you know what,
0:30:21 > 0:30:26there's homophobic abuse going on here and I would find that extremely
0:30:26 > 0:30:31difficult and extremely intimidating to do anything about it.
0:30:31 > 0:30:35It's like, you know, it just seemed like a really scary environment.
0:30:35 > 0:30:36It is very, very intimidating to go,
0:30:36 > 0:30:40"Hi, there is a big guy over there, and he's shouting homophobic abuse.
0:30:40 > 0:30:43- "Can you do something about it?" - Or if there's 100 little guys,
0:30:43 > 0:30:45- it's scary. - Exactly. Of course it is.
0:30:45 > 0:30:48You would be naive not to recognise that.
0:30:48 > 0:30:52So, do you feel the campaigns that you've set up,
0:30:52 > 0:30:56do you feel that's creating a better environment, at this moment,
0:30:56 > 0:30:58for football grounds?
0:30:58 > 0:31:00To me, could we do more?
0:31:00 > 0:31:02Yes, of course we can do more.
0:31:02 > 0:31:05We could do more, the football bodies can do more,
0:31:05 > 0:31:06the clubs can do more.
0:31:06 > 0:31:08So, why isn't it happening?
0:31:08 > 0:31:11- That's the thing, though. - I think it's happening.
0:31:11 > 0:31:12It's like everything, there's 92 clubs.
0:31:12 > 0:31:14I think some clubs are brilliant at it.
0:31:14 > 0:31:18- Yeah, OK.- I think some clubs are not that good at it and there's ones in
0:31:18 > 0:31:20the middle that are OK at it.
0:31:20 > 0:31:24Sometimes clubs, I think, are a bit afraid about doing the wrong thing.
0:31:24 > 0:31:27So rather than do the wrong thing, they'll do nothing.
0:31:28 > 0:31:31To me, the only way this will ever,
0:31:31 > 0:31:34ever be treated is to have a whole-game approach because one,
0:31:34 > 0:31:37people can't do on their own. Certainly Kick It Out can't do it
0:31:37 > 0:31:41- on its own.- OK.- We're the campaigning body but it needs the buy-in from the clubs.
0:31:41 > 0:31:43It needs the buy-in from everybody.
0:31:43 > 0:31:49And they need all...not to tick the box, and that's what makes me crazy.
0:31:49 > 0:31:50They need to take it seriously.
0:31:52 > 0:31:54And I think that's the problem.
0:31:54 > 0:31:56INDISTINCT SINGING
0:32:03 > 0:32:07Keen to see how individual clubs control homophobia,
0:32:07 > 0:32:11Alfie has been invited to Cardiff City for an end-of-season clash with
0:32:11 > 0:32:12Newcastle United.
0:32:14 > 0:32:17Toon! Toon!
0:32:19 > 0:32:22City have their own alternative to the Kick It Out app -
0:32:22 > 0:32:26a live reporting system advertised throughout the stadium.
0:32:27 > 0:32:30Anybody, anywhere in the ground can see the signs.
0:32:30 > 0:32:32They can send a text, they can make a call.
0:32:32 > 0:32:35The call is then - or text - is answered in the control room.
0:32:35 > 0:32:37If they want to keep it anonymous, they can.
0:32:37 > 0:32:39We can then act on the information we get,
0:32:39 > 0:32:41look at the system. So we've got access to the ticketing system,
0:32:41 > 0:32:43see which area of the ground they are in,
0:32:43 > 0:32:45and take appropriate action from there.
0:32:45 > 0:32:48And it is hot, so we get it there and then and we can try to act on it
0:32:48 > 0:32:50during the game, if something is happening.
0:32:50 > 0:32:54Is this, do you feel, more of a relevance than the Kick It Out app?
0:32:54 > 0:32:58We've got the option to act on the information we get on match day,
0:32:58 > 0:33:00whereas most of the time with something reported
0:33:00 > 0:33:02via the Kick It Out app,
0:33:02 > 0:33:05you get afterwards and then you've got to try and identify where the
0:33:05 > 0:33:08people were sat, who the people they were complaining against are.
0:33:08 > 0:33:11We've got more of an opportunity to try and stop things happening
0:33:11 > 0:33:14- further down the line, and there and then.- Yeah.
0:33:19 > 0:33:23Match-day security is down to stadium manager Wayne Nash.
0:33:23 > 0:33:26- How are you doing.- How are you?
0:33:26 > 0:33:28- Yeah, good, man.- Good stuff. Busy here, boss?
0:33:30 > 0:33:33Wayne coordinates the police and stewards
0:33:33 > 0:33:34from the event control room.
0:33:34 > 0:33:37So this is a multi-agency control room.
0:33:37 > 0:33:40Multiple CCTV cameras monitor all points,
0:33:40 > 0:33:43both inside and outside the ground.
0:33:43 > 0:33:47If you look up and see a camera, it will make you feel a bit safer.
0:33:47 > 0:33:49Especially when there is an incident,
0:33:49 > 0:33:50you look how tight we can zoom in.
0:33:50 > 0:33:53You can see the motif on people's shirts.
0:33:53 > 0:33:56We have had some cracking stories where people are misbehaving,
0:33:56 > 0:34:00we can go on the system, find out the person's seat number,
0:34:00 > 0:34:04add them in, he will bring up his ticketing details
0:34:04 > 0:34:06and I can ring his mobile.
0:34:06 > 0:34:08And this guy is picking up his mobile up and I'm saying,
0:34:08 > 0:34:10"Do us a favour. Your behaviour is out of order.
0:34:10 > 0:34:15- "Give it a rest."- Whilst physical abuse can be monitored remotely,
0:34:15 > 0:34:19verbal abuse requires direct intervention.
0:34:21 > 0:34:26And this is where the stewards step in and handle any abuse they hear.
0:34:26 > 0:34:30# ..going down and the Mags are going up... #
0:34:30 > 0:34:35Tonight, they will be dealing with 23,000 fans.
0:34:35 > 0:34:38The point I thought about is when they walk through the turnstiles,
0:34:38 > 0:34:42everybody is getting searched for kind of weapons or, you know,
0:34:42 > 0:34:45something that could cause damage.
0:34:45 > 0:34:48And the reality is, there's things that can cause damage that you can't
0:34:48 > 0:34:50find on them, there's words they can use that come out of their mouth,
0:34:50 > 0:34:54and that is something that is uncontrollable,
0:34:54 > 0:34:56really, until people get in there.
0:34:56 > 0:34:59Because they can sneak
0:34:59 > 0:35:01their voices and their opinions in,
0:35:01 > 0:35:03and then it's how it is controlled when they are within the ground.
0:35:09 > 0:35:12The chief steward is Mark Jenkins.
0:35:15 > 0:35:18Within ten minutes of kick-off, there is an incident.
0:35:20 > 0:35:24We've got one racist comment which was made to one of our players.
0:35:24 > 0:35:27It was witnessed by a supervisor of ours.
0:35:27 > 0:35:29They are actually talking to the gentleman now.
0:35:29 > 0:35:31I spoke to the police to warn them.
0:35:31 > 0:35:35Debbie, you will have to get a witness statement for that one.
0:35:35 > 0:35:37- No problem.- And it was against Harris?
0:35:37 > 0:35:40- Kadeem Harris. - So it was against a player?
0:35:40 > 0:35:41It was against a player, yeah.
0:35:41 > 0:35:43Called him a black...
0:35:43 > 0:35:44Right, OK.
0:35:46 > 0:35:49The offender is escorted from the stadium
0:35:49 > 0:35:51and it is now a police matter.
0:35:51 > 0:35:53If he goes to court with that, he will be banned from football.
0:35:53 > 0:35:57Newcastle should ban him anyway. We'll inform Newcastle.
0:35:57 > 0:36:00- Right.- And they will ban him next, you know,
0:36:00 > 0:36:02he will be gutted now for next year, won't he?
0:36:02 > 0:36:03- Yeah.- But that's great.
0:36:03 > 0:36:06Let me ask you an honest question, then.
0:36:06 > 0:36:08You know he got banned for making a racist comment
0:36:08 > 0:36:10because there is no racism in football.
0:36:10 > 0:36:13- Yeah.- Do you think, like, in there...
0:36:14 > 0:36:17..not you, maybe one of the other stewards,
0:36:17 > 0:36:19would they treat this in the exact same way
0:36:19 > 0:36:20if it was a homophobic comment?
0:36:23 > 0:36:26If I'm truthful, I would like to think that...
0:36:26 > 0:36:28But the reality is...
0:36:28 > 0:36:30I would like to think 100% they would.
0:36:30 > 0:36:31- Yeah.- All of them.
0:36:31 > 0:36:33Yeah.
0:36:33 > 0:36:36If I'm truthful, you may not get that.
0:36:36 > 0:36:38But we're not all perfect.
0:36:38 > 0:36:39Listen, no, mate.
0:36:39 > 0:36:44But I would like to think that everyone would.
0:36:44 > 0:36:45Yeah, yeah, yeah.
0:36:49 > 0:36:52I think Mark is probably the first real,
0:36:52 > 0:36:55honest person to say how the reality
0:36:55 > 0:37:00of trying to police homophobic abuse is, and where on the radar it is,
0:37:00 > 0:37:05in the fact that somebody was kicked out of the ground for racism,
0:37:05 > 0:37:08for racist abuse. And the reality would have been if that was
0:37:08 > 0:37:11homophobic abuse, it probably wouldn't have happened.
0:37:11 > 0:37:16So he's the first person to give us a real answer of what's going on -
0:37:16 > 0:37:19not seeing a TV camera in front of him and thinking,
0:37:19 > 0:37:21"This is what I should say, so this is what I will say."
0:37:21 > 0:37:25He said, "This is what I think it is, and that's the reality of it."
0:37:29 > 0:37:32But what I WILL say, and what I appreciate now,
0:37:32 > 0:37:33it is definitely a minority.
0:37:33 > 0:37:35Which to me, should make it easier to stamp it out.
0:37:35 > 0:37:38Lose this minority from the game -
0:37:38 > 0:37:41nobody really loses, everybody wins.
0:37:41 > 0:37:45So I'm not understanding how this minority is still able
0:37:45 > 0:37:47to create just such chaos.
0:37:54 > 0:37:58There are, though, some grassroots initiatives to improve the game.
0:38:06 > 0:38:08Football V Homophobia -
0:38:08 > 0:38:12a pressure group that organises an annual month of action,
0:38:12 > 0:38:14highlighting issues across the game.
0:38:18 > 0:38:20Its impact is growing.
0:38:20 > 0:38:24But currently only a third of all professional clubs support it.
0:38:27 > 0:38:31Probably the most famous campaign is Rainbow Laces -
0:38:31 > 0:38:34originated by gay rights charity Stonewall,
0:38:34 > 0:38:37and this year sponsored by the Premier League.
0:38:38 > 0:38:42It encourages the UK's 5,000 professional footballers
0:38:42 > 0:38:47to wear rainbow laces on one Saturday of each season.
0:38:47 > 0:38:50It is up to the individual whether they take part.
0:38:50 > 0:38:53The majority choose not to.
0:38:56 > 0:38:59What about the LGBT awareness campaigns
0:38:59 > 0:39:01run by gay fans themselves?
0:39:01 > 0:39:03Since 2013,
0:39:03 > 0:39:0812 of the Premier League teams have had LGBT fan groups officially
0:39:08 > 0:39:10recognised by their clubs.
0:39:10 > 0:39:13Some clubs allow banners.
0:39:13 > 0:39:15But that's no guarantee against abuse.
0:39:15 > 0:39:19This week I was with a female partner
0:39:19 > 0:39:20and we were walking over the bridge,
0:39:20 > 0:39:23to the match. And she kissed me goodbye, really briefly,
0:39:23 > 0:39:25not like a make-out session or anything like that.
0:39:25 > 0:39:27It was a real brief peck.
0:39:27 > 0:39:30And instantly there were some lads walking past and we got,
0:39:30 > 0:39:34"Oh, what is that? That is disgusting. Did they just ... kiss?"
0:39:34 > 0:39:37I'm still very uneasy about holding hands or anything like that.
0:39:37 > 0:39:40Because having been attacked a couple of times,
0:39:40 > 0:39:43- for me, it's too dangerous.- Yeah.
0:39:43 > 0:39:47What worries me and what concerns me is that everyone, like,
0:39:47 > 0:39:51has their own agenda, so everyone pulls in their own direction.
0:39:51 > 0:39:53And they are all doing good things, but them things are not spread
0:39:53 > 0:39:56across football, they are just individual for that ground.
0:39:56 > 0:39:58And then you go to another ground, and there might be nothing.
0:39:58 > 0:40:01Or you go to another ground and there might be something
0:40:01 > 0:40:04completely different. You know, what I feel should happen
0:40:04 > 0:40:05is an umbrella law,
0:40:05 > 0:40:09which basically, I feel, the people have the power to do that, the FA,
0:40:09 > 0:40:13the Premier League, they have the power to say to all clubs,
0:40:13 > 0:40:15all players,
0:40:15 > 0:40:18all stewards, "This is what you should do.
0:40:18 > 0:40:21"Or this is what has to be done in every ground."
0:40:21 > 0:40:24These are thoughts that Alfie would like to share with Greg Clarke,
0:40:24 > 0:40:25chairman of the FA.
0:40:25 > 0:40:27We may not have figured out how to crack it yet,
0:40:27 > 0:40:30but there's a deep loathing of that sort of behaviour
0:40:30 > 0:40:31throughout football.
0:40:31 > 0:40:33If only they could compare notes.
0:40:34 > 0:40:36RINGING TONE
0:40:37 > 0:40:40- ANSWER PHONE MESSAGE:- Hello. I'm sorry, but about the person
0:40:40 > 0:40:41you've called is not available.
0:40:41 > 0:40:43Please leave your message after the tone.
0:40:43 > 0:40:46- BEEP - It's Gareth Thomas here.
0:40:46 > 0:40:48A call-back would be much appreciated, mate.
0:40:48 > 0:40:51If not, I'll try you again. Take care, buddy. Bye.
0:40:55 > 0:40:57I feel like I'm working in a call centre,
0:40:57 > 0:41:00trying to sell somebody something that they really don't want.
0:41:02 > 0:41:06But, you know what, it takes five seconds for me to pick up a phone
0:41:06 > 0:41:09and keep calling. And if I take five seconds out of my day
0:41:09 > 0:41:10every now and again, then so be it.
0:41:10 > 0:41:12I pick the phone up and I keep calling them.
0:41:12 > 0:41:15Until one of them has the balls to either say, "Yeah, do you know,
0:41:15 > 0:41:16"we'll meet you."
0:41:16 > 0:41:19Or say, "Do you know what? No, it doesn't interest us."
0:41:19 > 0:41:21Either way, it's a definitive answer.
0:41:23 > 0:41:27Until then, Alfie is taking matters into his own hands.
0:41:29 > 0:41:33It just seems to me that people who are at the top of the game are not
0:41:33 > 0:41:35interested. And if I was a player,
0:41:35 > 0:41:39and as we know for a fact that there are Premier League footballers
0:41:39 > 0:41:42who are gay and closeted, then, to me,
0:41:42 > 0:41:46this just shows a sign that the top of the game doesn't really care.
0:41:46 > 0:41:49It doesn't want to make a change,
0:41:49 > 0:41:51it doesn't want to actually stamp down and do something,
0:41:51 > 0:41:54because as far as they're concerned,
0:41:54 > 0:41:56it's a very minimal problem
0:41:56 > 0:41:58and they've got a bigger issue to deal with -
0:41:58 > 0:42:02and that's keeping the game of football, probably making money.
0:42:02 > 0:42:05So rather than just talk about it now, I feel it is time,
0:42:05 > 0:42:07from what I've learned, to do something about it.
0:42:07 > 0:42:10So we're going to see lawyers to try and get some kind of charter
0:42:10 > 0:42:13drawn up. Take this charter to the likes of the FA,
0:42:13 > 0:42:16the Premier League, to the clubs, to the owners,
0:42:16 > 0:42:18to say, within our ground...
0:42:20 > 0:42:25..this form of abuse is not tolerated and will be punished.
0:42:26 > 0:42:29To see if they will sign it, because to me
0:42:29 > 0:42:32there is no reason why they shouldn't sign it.
0:42:36 > 0:42:40The charter Alfie has in mind is a code of practice against homophobia,
0:42:40 > 0:42:43as already used in other European leagues.
0:42:43 > 0:42:47- Hello, bud. How are you doing? - Not bad. You?
0:42:47 > 0:42:49Yeah, good. Good to see you.
0:42:49 > 0:42:53He has chosen international lawyer Gabriele Giambrone to help.
0:42:53 > 0:42:57I think we need to change the culture completely from the top.
0:42:57 > 0:43:01I mean, you heard an interview by the FA chairman this year.
0:43:01 > 0:43:04He is the one who said this is not the right time
0:43:04 > 0:43:06for a gay footballer to come out.
0:43:06 > 0:43:08And this is coming from the top of the FA.
0:43:08 > 0:43:13If the chairman of Microsoft or Facebook would say,
0:43:13 > 0:43:17it's not the right time for one of my employees
0:43:17 > 0:43:18to come out as being gay,
0:43:18 > 0:43:22he would be sued for thousands and thousands of pounds.
0:43:22 > 0:43:26So, it feels like football is in a galaxy
0:43:26 > 0:43:29miles away, with its own rules, which it's not.
0:43:29 > 0:43:31Do you have some kind of policy or code of conduct
0:43:31 > 0:43:34within other countries, and the UK is way behind
0:43:34 > 0:43:36and it doesn't even know it?
0:43:36 > 0:43:40The UK is maybe behind and maybe doesn't even know it.
0:43:40 > 0:43:43There are countries, for example, like Spain or Italy,
0:43:43 > 0:43:45that have stricter rules,
0:43:45 > 0:43:49because there is a code, and the code applies to everybody.
0:43:49 > 0:43:51I would say that for sure
0:43:51 > 0:43:56the Italian, for example, system or the Spanish system have
0:43:56 > 0:43:57stricter rules.
0:43:57 > 0:43:59Whether the rules
0:43:59 > 0:44:02are followed or not, that's another issue.
0:44:02 > 0:44:03But at least the rules are there.
0:44:03 > 0:44:05Even though it might sound complicated,
0:44:05 > 0:44:06it's actually really simple.
0:44:06 > 0:44:11You're just giving people a human right to be able to be themselves
0:44:11 > 0:44:14and not be discriminated against for it.
0:44:14 > 0:44:16And if you are, then you break the law.
0:44:16 > 0:44:20Right, Gareth. I think that there are two issues here.
0:44:20 > 0:44:22The code of practice in itself
0:44:22 > 0:44:27is a self-regulating code that clubs may or may not adopt.
0:44:27 > 0:44:31But the issue is that unless there is serious legal consequences of
0:44:31 > 0:44:32breaching those rules,
0:44:32 > 0:44:36they would just simply not be implemented by the clubs.
0:44:36 > 0:44:38So my suggestion would be, for example,
0:44:38 > 0:44:42just to change the Football Offences Act 1991.
0:44:42 > 0:44:46I mean, this act is about 27 years old now.
0:44:46 > 0:44:50If you are chanting racial abuse at the moment,
0:44:50 > 0:44:53under the 1991 act, that is an offence.
0:44:53 > 0:44:56If you say anything homophobic, under the act -
0:44:56 > 0:45:00so we're referring to the 1991 act - that is NOT an offence.
0:45:00 > 0:45:03- Right.- So it is probably just about time we can revisit it.
0:45:03 > 0:45:05Parliament can revisit it
0:45:05 > 0:45:08and introduce homophobia as well as racism as one of the issues
0:45:08 > 0:45:11that could lead to the committal of an offence.
0:45:12 > 0:45:15While changing the law may even take Alfie a while,
0:45:15 > 0:45:19he believes that a code of practice is achievable in the short term.
0:45:22 > 0:45:24Really happy. I think a fantastic meeting.
0:45:24 > 0:45:26It's great to have something to focus on.
0:45:26 > 0:45:28But also this thing we've got to focus on
0:45:28 > 0:45:30has a possible outcome as well.
0:45:31 > 0:45:34So it's great, it's given a whole...
0:45:34 > 0:45:37It's given me a whole new energy.
0:45:37 > 0:45:39I've really found something to fight for.
0:45:43 > 0:45:45It's the end of the football season,
0:45:45 > 0:45:48and Brighton have been promoted to the Premier League.
0:45:48 > 0:45:51Some supporters of their arch-rivals, Crystal Palace,
0:45:51 > 0:45:53have gone online...
0:45:53 > 0:45:54to congratulate them.
0:45:56 > 0:46:00One I've just got up here is two Brighton players,
0:46:00 > 0:46:03one is giving the other one a kiss on the cheek.
0:46:03 > 0:46:06And the guy has wrote, "Typical of this club."
0:46:08 > 0:46:11So the other one I have gone to is again from a Crystal Palace fan,
0:46:11 > 0:46:13which starts off with saying...
0:46:13 > 0:46:18"Glenn trying his hardest not to get bummed by the bender brigade."
0:46:18 > 0:46:20And when I play that...
0:46:21 > 0:46:23'Oh! Oh, help me.
0:46:23 > 0:46:27'Let me get out. Oh, Christ! No! Stay away!
0:46:27 > 0:46:29'Don't touch me.'
0:46:29 > 0:46:36You wouldn't even expect that from children in a playground in 2017.
0:46:36 > 0:46:38It is being retweeted.
0:46:38 > 0:46:40It's been liked.
0:46:40 > 0:46:42So in response,
0:46:42 > 0:46:47the LGBT group of Crystal Palace fans, called Proud And Palace,
0:46:47 > 0:46:52have felt that they have to make a response for this, and it reads...
0:46:52 > 0:46:54"It isn't just banter, it's offensive.
0:46:54 > 0:46:56"We won't accept it. We won't tolerate it
0:46:56 > 0:46:58"and we will actively support the club in addressing it."
0:46:59 > 0:47:05So, in response to the statement made by the LGBT group...
0:47:05 > 0:47:09which says, "It was only a matter of time before this got out of hand and
0:47:09 > 0:47:12"people were banging the gay PC drum.
0:47:12 > 0:47:14"I don't think many people who join in
0:47:14 > 0:47:17"the 'Brighton take it up the bum' chants
0:47:17 > 0:47:19"have any real malicious intent."
0:47:21 > 0:47:25And then underneath, "The fact that Brighton find
0:47:25 > 0:47:29"being called gay insulting, makes THEM the homophobic ones!"
0:47:29 > 0:47:31Wow! Wow!
0:47:31 > 0:47:35Imagine climbing inside his head for ten minutes.
0:47:35 > 0:47:38I would love... I would give my right arm, right,
0:47:38 > 0:47:41to sit down in a room with some of these people,
0:47:41 > 0:47:44just to, like, understand their views.
0:47:44 > 0:47:45Or even just to see them.
0:47:45 > 0:47:49"Hello, everyone. My name is Gareth Thomas,
0:47:49 > 0:47:51"and I'm a former rugby player."
0:47:51 > 0:47:54So Alfie adds his own post to the forum.
0:47:54 > 0:47:56"I believe everyone is entitled to their opinion,
0:47:56 > 0:47:59"but should also be brave enough to defend their opinions
0:47:59 > 0:48:00"when challenged.
0:48:00 > 0:48:04"On that note, I would really like to invite some of you to meet and
0:48:04 > 0:48:06"exchange opinions on this subject."
0:48:06 > 0:48:08And I will sign in as my name
0:48:08 > 0:48:11because I am brave enough to stand for my opinions
0:48:11 > 0:48:13and put my name to my opinions.
0:48:13 > 0:48:16I have thought about putting a kiss,
0:48:16 > 0:48:18but I wouldn't...cos it's football.
0:48:18 > 0:48:22So here goes, I'm about to post it into the unknown.
0:48:24 > 0:48:25Back of the net!
0:48:34 > 0:48:38After 16 weeks of calls, e-mails and texts,
0:48:38 > 0:48:39the FA is still avoiding his request
0:48:39 > 0:48:42for an interview with chairman Greg Clarke.
0:48:46 > 0:48:49I have a strong connection to this, and it is something
0:48:49 > 0:48:52that I passionately, I passionately care about.
0:48:54 > 0:48:55And that's why, you know,
0:48:55 > 0:48:57I want to speak to people
0:48:57 > 0:49:01who have the power to be able to make a bit of change, maybe.
0:49:01 > 0:49:03But the Premier League -
0:49:03 > 0:49:06the richest league in the world - have offered a meeting.
0:49:08 > 0:49:10Thanks, mate. Cheers, man. Cheers, buddy. Bye-bye.
0:49:15 > 0:49:18Alfie sets out with a list of questions -
0:49:18 > 0:49:22top of which is, will the Premier League sign up
0:49:22 > 0:49:23to his code of conduct?
0:49:25 > 0:49:30Chief Executive Bill Bush has laid down one condition for the meeting -
0:49:30 > 0:49:31no cameras allowed.
0:49:32 > 0:49:35Which makes me very dubious and sceptical.
0:49:35 > 0:49:38And I hope he can understand, er, you know, why I feel that way.
0:49:38 > 0:49:40So I'm going to push him on some questions,
0:49:40 > 0:49:44as to their responsibility for players, and what are they doing
0:49:44 > 0:49:47to hold that responsibility to players.
0:49:47 > 0:49:51But, also, it seems to me like a bit of a copout because I think maybe
0:49:51 > 0:49:54he understands I know more about this subject than he does,
0:49:54 > 0:49:58so he thinks when I talk to the camera about my interview about him,
0:49:58 > 0:50:01I could probably put it in a better way than he potentially could.
0:50:01 > 0:50:05So that is one thing. That is one of my theories, but it is definitely
0:50:05 > 0:50:09interesting to me and very much seems like a copout
0:50:09 > 0:50:11as to why he wouldn't talk on camera.
0:50:13 > 0:50:15- INTERCOM:- Premier League. - Hello. It's Gareth Thomas,
0:50:15 > 0:50:17I have a meeting with Bill Bush.
0:50:18 > 0:50:20- BUZZER - Thank you.
0:50:20 > 0:50:24Alfie goes in, the camera remains outside.
0:50:32 > 0:50:34The meeting lasted over 40 minutes.
0:50:38 > 0:50:44The standard answer is, you know, "We're in line with Stonewall.
0:50:44 > 0:50:45"We're in line with Kick it Out...
0:50:47 > 0:50:50"Football Against Homophobia."
0:50:50 > 0:50:52Now, all of these are kind of campaigns...
0:50:54 > 0:50:56..that show awareness.
0:50:56 > 0:51:00They are not campaigns that are really going forward and actually
0:51:00 > 0:51:04stopping homophobic abuse going on.
0:51:04 > 0:51:07I would like to know why this is all being allowed,
0:51:07 > 0:51:10why this is all being tolerated
0:51:10 > 0:51:14and why this all seems to be OK and nothing is being done about it.
0:51:14 > 0:51:17Those ultimately are the answers that I was looking for.
0:51:17 > 0:51:21And being told that, you know, you're in line with an organisation,
0:51:21 > 0:51:25or they have passed this on to a campaign
0:51:25 > 0:51:28is not the answer I was looking for
0:51:28 > 0:51:32from people with ridiculous amounts of power within the game.
0:51:42 > 0:51:46Alfie's had some responses from the Palace fans.
0:51:47 > 0:51:50"Some mincers just don't know when to stop.
0:51:50 > 0:51:52"There's only one Gareth Thomas, one Gareth Thomas.
0:51:52 > 0:51:56"He used to be straight until he shagged his team-mate
0:51:56 > 0:51:59"Now living in a felcher's fairyland."
0:51:59 > 0:52:02Um... It's just rubbish, it's just absolutely pathetic.
0:52:02 > 0:52:04This one now has got
0:52:04 > 0:52:08quite a long one. It says, "Make no mistake and be warned,
0:52:08 > 0:52:14"the BBC and Gareth are out to do a hit-piece on EPL football fans
0:52:14 > 0:52:16"to further their aggressive gay agenda.
0:52:16 > 0:52:19"These people
0:52:19 > 0:52:21"are agenda-driven political activists
0:52:21 > 0:52:24"and they already know exactly what their documentary is
0:52:24 > 0:52:27"going to say. I am calling YOU out, Gareth.
0:52:27 > 0:52:30"Fuck off, away from our beloved football where, everyone,
0:52:30 > 0:52:32"including gays, are welcome to scream and shout
0:52:32 > 0:52:34"and unload their weekly stress without
0:52:34 > 0:52:37"fear of you bullying them with your PC propaganda."
0:52:39 > 0:52:41It's not about, you know,
0:52:41 > 0:52:45I've come on behalf of, like, the LGBT community.
0:52:45 > 0:52:48I've come on behalf of somebody who knows what it's like to be in
0:52:48 > 0:52:51a sporting environment and have to lie to everybody,
0:52:51 > 0:52:54and the fear of potentially telling the truth.
0:52:54 > 0:52:56"I personally think the BBC should do a bit of research
0:52:56 > 0:52:59"on how many paedophiles are gay.
0:53:00 > 0:53:04"It's probably why Brighton are considering erecting a massive fence
0:53:04 > 0:53:07"around their family section."
0:53:07 > 0:53:08Like, that is just...
0:53:08 > 0:53:12The fact that I have even read that actually...
0:53:12 > 0:53:14like, makes me feel sick.
0:53:14 > 0:53:16And, again, you can imagine what kind of chant
0:53:16 > 0:53:17that could turn into it.
0:53:17 > 0:53:20We've got another one here that says,
0:53:20 > 0:53:22"Amazed how juvenile and pathetic people are on here.
0:53:22 > 0:53:23"Grow up.
0:53:23 > 0:53:26"These school yard taunts are ridiculous.
0:53:26 > 0:53:28"I am assuming some of you have kids.
0:53:28 > 0:53:31"What on earth would your response be if they turned out to be gay?"
0:53:31 > 0:53:36Again, she or he has summed it up perfectly there.
0:53:36 > 0:53:38And the reality is that, do you know what,
0:53:38 > 0:53:40this is not just me saying this any more.
0:53:40 > 0:53:43This is like other fans of yours.
0:53:43 > 0:53:45Because if you take these opinions into the football ground,
0:53:45 > 0:53:48do you think that is OK?
0:53:48 > 0:53:49Do you think that is fine?
0:53:51 > 0:53:53So I'm kind of still at the place where I was at the start.
0:53:53 > 0:53:55I'd like to meet them, I'd like to chat with them,
0:53:55 > 0:53:57I'd like to discuss that with them.
0:53:57 > 0:54:01Because if they assume that this documentary is already, you know,
0:54:01 > 0:54:04already decided and already made up,
0:54:04 > 0:54:07then come and chat with me and change my mind.
0:54:08 > 0:54:12Alfie posts an invite, naming a time and a place.
0:54:12 > 0:54:15So I am going to be at Graces Bar & Grill in Beckenham
0:54:15 > 0:54:17on Wednesday 21st of June at 7pm.
0:54:17 > 0:54:19So hopefully see you there.
0:54:29 > 0:54:30So, the table is now set.
0:54:32 > 0:54:33And I sit...
0:54:36 > 0:54:37..and I wait.
0:54:45 > 0:54:48You know, you want someone like David Beckham to stand up and say,
0:54:48 > 0:54:50"Look, it's all right to be gay.
0:54:50 > 0:54:53"Who cares?" You want someone like Messi to say it.
0:54:53 > 0:54:57And then I feel that would make, like, young people be like,
0:54:57 > 0:55:00"Well, maybe it's all right to be gay in football."
0:55:05 > 0:55:07We need the governing bodies
0:55:07 > 0:55:09to just increase their awareness and
0:55:09 > 0:55:11visibility and their fight against it.
0:55:11 > 0:55:13Because that could be the difference.
0:55:13 > 0:55:15That could be the 1% that tips a footballer from saying,
0:55:15 > 0:55:18"Do you know what, I've got everything and now I'm going to go."
0:55:18 > 0:55:20And it's never going to be a perfect environment.
0:55:20 > 0:55:22He is never going to feel ready, but he is going to think,
0:55:22 > 0:55:25"There's enough in place that the risks are as low as they could be,
0:55:25 > 0:55:27"let's go for it."
0:55:29 > 0:55:31After an hour, it's clear
0:55:31 > 0:55:35Alfie won't be exchanging views with his online abusers.
0:55:35 > 0:55:38At this point, I can actually say
0:55:38 > 0:55:41that whoever they are behind the messages are cowards.
0:55:41 > 0:55:45They've called me a hell of a lot worse names.
0:55:45 > 0:55:48And I have accepted it, and I've said, "Do you know what, that's OK.
0:55:48 > 0:55:51"If that's your opinion, fine. But discuss your opinion with me."
0:55:51 > 0:55:54So, empty chairs...
0:55:54 > 0:55:55not filled by cowards.
0:55:59 > 0:56:03He never heard back from FA chairman Greg Clarke, either.
0:56:06 > 0:56:09But Alfie HAS heard from his lawyers.
0:56:09 > 0:56:12They've drawn up and sent him the code of practice.
0:56:12 > 0:56:14There are 17 points for the code
0:56:14 > 0:56:17but, for me, the most important points are these.
0:56:17 > 0:56:19"All match-day materials, programmes,
0:56:19 > 0:56:21"tickets and season tickets
0:56:21 > 0:56:23"to highlight the zero tolerance of homophobia
0:56:23 > 0:56:26"and how to report abuse if observed.
0:56:26 > 0:56:29"A pre-match video to be played at every football ground prior to the
0:56:29 > 0:56:33"match, stating the zero tolerance of the homophobia charter.
0:56:33 > 0:56:37"A minimum three-year ban for any fan found guilty
0:56:37 > 0:56:38"of homophobic abuse."
0:56:38 > 0:56:41So I am going to send this to Bill Bush of the Premier League
0:56:41 > 0:56:45and Greg Clarke of the FA. I'm going to send it to the Football League,
0:56:45 > 0:56:48the PFA and all 92 clubs within England and Wales.
0:56:48 > 0:56:49So...
0:56:50 > 0:56:53All I know is, we've tried our hardest, we've tried our best.
0:56:53 > 0:56:54This is what we have come up with.
0:56:54 > 0:56:57Hopefully it will have been worthwhile.
0:56:58 > 0:57:01Gareth "Alfie" Thomas asked many questions
0:57:01 > 0:57:04over the course of his investigation.
0:57:04 > 0:57:07There is one final one he's asking himself.
0:57:08 > 0:57:10If he were a gay footballer today...
0:57:12 > 0:57:14..would he come out?
0:57:14 > 0:57:17I would love to come out
0:57:17 > 0:57:19because I would challenge every dickhead who sits behind a desk
0:57:19 > 0:57:22with a shirt and tie to say, "Right, mate.
0:57:22 > 0:57:24"Right, OK, now will you support me?
0:57:24 > 0:57:26"Here I am. NOW support me.
0:57:26 > 0:57:28"Now show me what you've learned."
0:57:28 > 0:57:30And I would boot the door open to the PFA
0:57:30 > 0:57:32and boot the door open to the Premier League and I would say,
0:57:32 > 0:57:35"I am standing in front of you now, bud.
0:57:35 > 0:57:37"Now what are you going to do about it?"