0:00:00 > 0:00:00- Subtitles
0:00:00 > 0:00:02- Subtitles- - Subtitles
0:00:07 > 0:00:09- MELANCHOLIC MUSIC
0:00:21 > 0:00:23- ROTOR BLADES WHIR
0:00:29 > 0:00:31- NOISE BUILDS
0:00:33 > 0:00:35- SILENCE
0:00:39 > 0:00:43- There's a silent epidemic on - the increase across the world.
0:00:44 > 0:00:48- In Wales, it kills somebody - almost every day...
0:00:48 > 0:00:51- ..but we don't talk about that.
0:00:54 > 0:00:58- It's the primary cause of death - among men under the age of 50.
0:00:58 > 0:01:03- It kills more people than cancer, - heart disease and road accidents...
0:01:03 > 0:01:06- ..but we don't talk about that.
0:01:07 > 0:01:12- For some reason, - it affects more men than women...
0:01:12 > 0:01:15- ..but we don't talk about that.
0:01:16 > 0:01:18- I'm Stephen Hughes.
0:01:18 > 0:01:21- I'm on my way to my family home...
0:01:21 > 0:01:25- ..to discuss something - I never thought would affect us...
0:01:25 > 0:01:28- ..and I need to talk about that.
0:01:32 > 0:01:34- This is Elfed Hughes.
0:01:34 > 0:01:37- Some call him Elfed Bwchanan.
0:01:38 > 0:01:40- But I call him Dad.
0:01:48 > 0:01:50- On September the 18th, 2015...
0:01:50 > 0:01:54- ..following a spell at - the Hergest Mental Health Unit...
0:01:54 > 0:01:56- ..Dad died.
0:02:00 > 0:02:04- Aged 56, he hanged himself - on the farm.
0:02:04 > 0:02:06- At home.
0:02:11 > 0:02:14- 'Losing Dad'
0:02:15 > 0:02:19- 'Talking about THAT'
0:02:29 > 0:02:34- I now live in Cardiff - but Bwchanan is home.
0:02:42 > 0:02:46- It's almost two years - since that happened...
0:02:47 > 0:02:49- ..leaving a huge void in our lives.
0:02:52 > 0:02:56- At this time, lambing season, - Dad would be in his element.
0:02:56 > 0:03:01- Full of life, barking orders, - and having fun.
0:03:04 > 0:03:06- He loved the busy life of the farm.
0:03:07 > 0:03:11- He'd be the last person - you'd expect to kill himself.
0:03:13 > 0:03:16- I'm the eldest of three brothers.
0:03:16 > 0:03:20- Sion's a local carpenter - and helps on the farm.
0:03:21 > 0:03:24- But Geraint, my youngest brother...
0:03:24 > 0:03:27- ..has had to take the reins - since Dad died.
0:03:29 > 0:03:33- Mam has always been - a farmer's wife.
0:03:36 > 0:03:40- After Dad died, - I had professional counselling.
0:03:40 > 0:03:44- I've learned how important it is - to talk about your feelings.
0:03:45 > 0:03:49- Mam, Sion and Geraint - are very private people...
0:03:49 > 0:03:52- ..and talking about that - is too difficult...
0:03:52 > 0:03:57- ..so I'm going to talk to the other - people who were close to Dad.
0:03:57 > 0:04:00- His friends and family - who loved him.
0:04:02 > 0:04:07- I want to understand why we find it - so difficult to talk about suicide.
0:04:10 > 0:04:14- I feel quite nervous - about what I'm doing.
0:04:14 > 0:04:16- Erm, I...
0:04:18 > 0:04:22- I sometimes think I'm making people - or asking people to do something...
0:04:22 > 0:04:24- ..they don't want to.
0:04:24 > 0:04:26- I'm asking them to talk about - the fact...
0:04:26 > 0:04:30- ..they don't like talking - about something, which is odd.
0:04:30 > 0:04:33- Erm, it's also a very emotional - experience.
0:04:33 > 0:04:35- I'm aware that...
0:04:36 > 0:04:40- Yes, it hurts me - that we have to do this.
0:04:41 > 0:04:46- It's opening an old wound - for friends and family, but...
0:04:47 > 0:04:50- ..I know that what I'm doing - is right.
0:04:50 > 0:04:53- Because if it prevents - just one family...
0:04:53 > 0:04:56- ..having to face - what we're facing...
0:04:56 > 0:04:59- ..I think it's worth doing.
0:04:59 > 0:05:02- It's important - and so it's worth doing.
0:05:02 > 0:05:04- It's going to be difficult...
0:05:04 > 0:05:08- ..and I sometimes wonder whether - this is the best way to do things.
0:05:09 > 0:05:13- Hopefully, if people see this - and think...
0:05:17 > 0:05:22- ..I'll talk about how I feel - rather than hide it...
0:05:22 > 0:05:26- ..and they understand what - the consequences can be...
0:05:26 > 0:05:28- ..or the consequences...
0:05:29 > 0:05:31- ..of killing yourself.
0:05:40 > 0:05:43- 'Colleague.'
0:05:43 > 0:05:46- 'Friend.'
0:05:48 > 0:05:52- I never thought he would - take his own life.
0:05:52 > 0:05:53- No.
0:05:53 > 0:05:57- I was hoping he would get better.
0:05:57 > 0:05:59- And he didn't.
0:06:03 > 0:06:07- Ger Twm was at our sides - throughout the illness...
0:06:07 > 0:06:10- ..including the dark day - when we took Dad...
0:06:10 > 0:06:13- ..to Hergest Mental Health Unit.
0:06:14 > 0:06:18- They've both been friends - as long as I can remember.
0:06:19 > 0:06:22- I was with him every Saturday - for 23 years.
0:06:22 > 0:06:23- Every Saturday?
0:06:23 > 0:06:26- Every Saturday?- - Every Saturday and every holiday.
0:06:26 > 0:06:29- There were no holidays, - were there?
0:06:29 > 0:06:31- That's the way it was.
0:06:31 > 0:06:32- That's the way it was.- - But...
0:06:32 > 0:06:34- ..something went wrong.
0:06:34 > 0:06:38- Yes, something went wrong, Stephen. - What it was, I don't know.
0:06:39 > 0:06:43- If your father could suffer, - anyone can.
0:06:43 > 0:06:45- Isn't it?
0:06:45 > 0:06:47- That's what I think.
0:06:47 > 0:06:49- It's a very thin line, isn't it?
0:06:49 > 0:06:51- Very thin.
0:06:51 > 0:06:53- And we saw that.
0:06:53 > 0:06:54- And we saw that.- - We saw that.
0:06:54 > 0:06:57- And the line broke, didn't it?
0:06:58 > 0:06:59- He was angry with me.
0:06:59 > 0:07:01- He was angry with me.- - I know.
0:07:01 > 0:07:06- I remember taking him and he said, - "You shouldn't have brought me."
0:07:06 > 0:07:08- To Hergest.
0:07:08 > 0:07:11- Yes, Hergest. He hated the place, - didn't he?
0:07:11 > 0:07:13- Yes.
0:07:13 > 0:07:16- I saw Dad with an obsession - about the shame.
0:07:16 > 0:07:20- Yes. With mental health, - there's a stigma, isn't there?
0:07:21 > 0:07:23- Yes, but...
0:07:23 > 0:07:25- You know, we...
0:07:25 > 0:07:29- He was a man, for one thing, - and a man...
0:07:29 > 0:07:31- ..a proud and respectable man.
0:07:31 > 0:07:35- I'm sure a person like him - with a mental illness...
0:07:35 > 0:07:38- ..didn't belong in a place - like that.
0:07:38 > 0:07:40- No, he didn't think so.
0:07:40 > 0:07:42- He didn't, did he?
0:07:42 > 0:07:43- He didn't, did he?- - But...
0:07:43 > 0:07:45- I sometimes think...
0:07:45 > 0:07:49- ..and I haven't discussed this - with lots of people...
0:07:49 > 0:07:51- ..but the fact that he felt - so ashamed...
0:07:51 > 0:07:54- ..was one of the reasons - he killed himself.
0:07:54 > 0:07:58- I'm sure he'd reached the end - of his tether...
0:07:58 > 0:08:01- ..and he couldn't see himself - getting better, in a way.
0:08:01 > 0:08:03- That's what it was.
0:08:04 > 0:08:05- Yeah.
0:08:05 > 0:08:07- I don't know, Stephen.
0:08:07 > 0:08:09- It's...
0:08:09 > 0:08:13- There are questions that we - can't answer, aren't there?
0:08:13 > 0:08:14- Yes.
0:08:14 > 0:08:17- No, it's a real pity.
0:08:38 > 0:08:41- One of the questions I had - for someone like Geraint...
0:08:41 > 0:08:44- ..from the same generation as Dad, - a good friend...
0:08:44 > 0:08:47- ..born and raised in this area...
0:08:47 > 0:08:50- ..why do some people - find it difficult...
0:08:50 > 0:08:53- ..to talk about the way they feel?
0:08:54 > 0:08:58- And he made me realize, - from Dad's perspective...
0:08:58 > 0:09:03- ..that he felt ashamed and found - it difficult to admit he was ill.
0:09:03 > 0:09:06- I hadn't thought about that before.
0:09:07 > 0:09:09- And maybe I can be too critical.
0:09:09 > 0:09:13- When Dad was ill, I'd say, "I don't - understand why you feel ashamed...
0:09:13 > 0:09:16- .."I don't understand that."
0:09:16 > 0:09:20- Maybe I was at fault for not trying - to be a bit more understanding.
0:09:20 > 0:09:25- I was aware that he felt ashamed - and that he felt the stigma...
0:09:25 > 0:09:28- ..but I couldn't understand why...
0:09:28 > 0:09:31- ..because I don't see it myself.
0:09:31 > 0:09:34- But as Geraint said...
0:09:34 > 0:09:38- ..I wouldn't feel ashamed - going to Hergest now...
0:09:38 > 0:09:43- ..but I don't know how I'd feel - if I was suffering like Dad...
0:09:43 > 0:09:45- ..because he was suffering.
0:09:45 > 0:09:48- I never want to suffer like that.
0:09:49 > 0:09:52- And because we haven't - suffered ourselves...
0:09:52 > 0:09:56- ..maybe it's difficult to imagine - what Dad was going through.
0:09:57 > 0:10:00- So, I have benefited, and...
0:10:00 > 0:10:04- ..moving forward, I hope I benefit - from talking to other people too.
0:10:09 > 0:10:10- .
0:10:12 > 0:10:12- Subtitles
0:10:12 > 0:10:14- Subtitles- - Subtitles
0:10:16 > 0:10:18- MELANCHOLIC MUSIC
0:10:34 > 0:10:37- Dad was a very amiable man.
0:10:37 > 0:10:40- I can't think of anyone nicer.
0:10:41 > 0:10:44- He enjoyed life, - he enjoyed laughing.
0:10:44 > 0:10:47- He could talk to anyone.
0:10:47 > 0:10:52- Erm, if you were in - a sociable group of people...
0:10:53 > 0:10:57- ..he would be leading the fun - and laughter.
0:11:10 > 0:11:14- He had his own chair - that he liked to sit in.
0:11:15 > 0:11:20- He didn't like it if someone - sat in his seat.
0:11:20 > 0:11:23- That would irritate him.
0:11:25 > 0:11:28- And, strangely, - the night of his funeral...
0:11:28 > 0:11:31- ..his friends came here - to celebrate his life...
0:11:31 > 0:11:35- ..and to remember him and they - put a glass of whisky...
0:11:35 > 0:11:39- ..on the table where Dad used - to sit and a 'Reserved' sign.
0:11:40 > 0:11:44- Erm, I think that was a wonderful - tribute to him.
0:11:45 > 0:11:49- He would have loved to have walked - in and drunk the whisky that night.
0:11:51 > 0:11:54- And just to see what people - thought of him.
0:11:55 > 0:11:59- The irony, of course, - is that Dad loved coming here.
0:11:59 > 0:12:02- But when he became ill, - he didn't want to come here.
0:12:04 > 0:12:07- That's ironic, considering - how much he enjoyed coming here.
0:12:08 > 0:12:12- But he felt ashamed, he didn't want - to show people that he was ill...
0:12:12 > 0:12:16- ..he didn't want his friends - to see him in that state.
0:12:16 > 0:12:18- And after years of having fun...
0:12:18 > 0:12:21- ..sometimes it was hard to - get him out of here...
0:12:21 > 0:12:25- ..and then it was hard to make him - come here, and that was strange.
0:12:47 > 0:12:52- Dad was a successful farmer - and left a number of farms.
0:12:54 > 0:12:58- It's lambing season at the moment - and everyone's shattered.
0:12:59 > 0:13:02- But Geraint shoulders - the biggest burden.
0:13:04 > 0:13:08- Around six months after Dad died, - Ger's best friend...
0:13:08 > 0:13:13- ..who supported him after we - lost Dad, also killed himself.
0:13:15 > 0:13:18- He's another of many - in this small community...
0:13:18 > 0:13:21- ..who have killed themselves - over the last few years.
0:13:22 > 0:13:26- Suicide is rife in communities - across the country...
0:13:27 > 0:13:30- ..and we find it so difficult - to talk about that.
0:13:42 > 0:13:44- 'Nephew.'
0:13:45 > 0:13:47- 'Shepherd.'
0:13:48 > 0:13:52- 'Friend.'
0:13:54 > 0:13:58- I remember getting a phone call - on the day...
0:13:58 > 0:14:03- ..saying there was an air ambulance - and an ambulance outside Bwchanan.
0:14:03 > 0:14:07- Erm, alarm bells started ringing - straight away.
0:14:07 > 0:14:09- I knew Elfed wasn't well.
0:14:10 > 0:14:16- And she phoned back to say that - Elfed had tried to kill himself.
0:14:18 > 0:14:21- And that the paramedics were - working on him at the time.
0:14:22 > 0:14:23- She didn't know any more.
0:14:24 > 0:14:26- But... I knew.
0:14:35 > 0:14:37- Sorry.
0:14:51 > 0:14:56- Before a lambing night shift, - which he'd do with Dad...
0:14:56 > 0:14:59- ..Richard and I have a chat - about that.
0:15:01 > 0:15:04- We're sitting in the caravan - tonight...
0:15:04 > 0:15:07- ..this is what Dad loved to do, - isn't it?
0:15:07 > 0:15:09- Yes.
0:15:09 > 0:15:11- This is where he'd sit, - in this corner.
0:15:12 > 0:15:15- He asked me to pass him everything - to avoid getting up.
0:15:16 > 0:15:20- Yes, he sat in the corner knowing - people would have to move for him.
0:15:21 > 0:15:23- You had to move - to allow him to move.
0:15:24 > 0:15:26- "Don't be long."
0:15:26 > 0:15:28- "Don't be long."
0:15:29 > 0:15:33- I have days when I do struggle and - then the next day's OK and then...
0:15:34 > 0:15:35- Yeah, yeah.
0:15:35 > 0:15:37- You're not the only one.
0:15:39 > 0:15:40- How do you...
0:15:43 > 0:15:48- How do you even try to, - not just understand, but...
0:15:48 > 0:15:52- ..because of what he did, it's - impossible to accept, isn't it?
0:15:53 > 0:15:55- Yes. Erm, if someone...
0:15:55 > 0:15:59- ..had called to say Elfed had died - of a heart attack or something...
0:15:59 > 0:16:01- ..I'd understand.
0:16:01 > 0:16:04- I would have understood that. - Working so hard.
0:16:04 > 0:16:06- Working so hard.
0:16:06 > 0:16:10- But the phone call - saying what had happened...
0:16:11 > 0:16:13- ..I don't know, it's...
0:16:14 > 0:16:16- ..hard to accept.
0:16:18 > 0:16:21- I remember the day after he died, - I was on the farm...
0:16:21 > 0:16:25- ..and there must have been - around 60 people here...
0:16:25 > 0:16:29- ..and I remember thinking, wow, - you won't get this anywhere else.
0:16:29 > 0:16:31- It shows how popular he was.
0:16:32 > 0:16:34- Yes. And then the day - of his funeral.
0:16:35 > 0:16:37- How many were there? About 800?
0:16:37 > 0:16:39- I think so. Think about that.
0:16:40 > 0:16:41- Yes.
0:16:41 > 0:16:43- Incredible.
0:16:44 > 0:16:47- We were in The Ring earlier. - Dad loved going there.
0:16:47 > 0:16:49- That was the highlight of his day.
0:16:50 > 0:16:51- It was.
0:16:52 > 0:16:55- The Ring is a welcoming place. - Everyone is so...
0:16:55 > 0:16:58- Goodness, yes, - Everyone knows each other.
0:16:58 > 0:17:00- They look after each other.
0:17:00 > 0:17:05- And yet farming is such - a lonely way of life.
0:17:05 > 0:17:09- They go there to discuss - the things they've done...
0:17:09 > 0:17:12- ..but men don't discuss - their feelings.
0:17:12 > 0:17:14- I don't think that's the case.
0:17:15 > 0:17:17- You go to The Ring to switch off.
0:17:18 > 0:17:22- You didn't talk about work - or the farm in The Ring.
0:17:22 > 0:17:25- It was just lots of laughter - and leg pulling.
0:17:25 > 0:17:28- That's what I always thought.
0:17:28 > 0:17:31- I've never thought about it - like that.
0:17:31 > 0:17:35- When I go to the pub I talk about, - I don't know...
0:17:35 > 0:17:37- ..my next holiday...
0:17:37 > 0:17:38- ..my next holiday...- - Yes.
0:17:39 > 0:17:40- ..or the Six Nations.
0:17:40 > 0:17:42- ..or the Six Nations.- - Yes, it's completely different.
0:17:43 > 0:17:46- The Ring was the same. - You went to switch off.
0:17:46 > 0:17:48- And lots of laughter.
0:17:48 > 0:17:49- Yeah.
0:17:51 > 0:17:52- And leg pulling.
0:17:52 > 0:17:55- No-one enjoyed that more than him.
0:17:55 > 0:17:56- No-one enjoyed that more than him.- - No.
0:17:58 > 0:18:00- Blimey.
0:18:01 > 0:18:04- I'll tell you one thing, - it's very strange without him.
0:18:05 > 0:18:08- Mm. And sitting in this caravan - is strange too.
0:18:08 > 0:18:10- We had chips on weekends.
0:18:13 > 0:18:14- It's just not the same.
0:18:26 > 0:18:28- Are you alright?
0:18:28 > 0:18:29- Are you alright?- - Yes.
0:18:44 > 0:18:47- Do you know what though, Steve...
0:18:47 > 0:18:49- ..he made me laugh.
0:18:52 > 0:18:56- There was a time - I never thought I'd cry.
0:19:00 > 0:19:02- No, but he wouldn't want that.
0:19:04 > 0:19:06- He'd be angry with you now.
0:19:08 > 0:19:10- "Get on with it."
0:19:10 > 0:19:13- "Get up. - Those sheep need tending to."
0:19:13 > 0:19:15- "Strap a pair on."
0:19:16 > 0:19:18- Yeah. Yeah.
0:19:18 > 0:19:20- Goodness me.
0:19:20 > 0:19:23- Do you know what, - I've never seen so many men cry.
0:19:24 > 0:19:25- I think...
0:19:26 > 0:19:29- ..although it's tragic and sad, - it's a good thing.
0:19:31 > 0:19:34- Yes, I'm sure a lot more have - than you think.
0:19:34 > 0:19:35- Mm.
0:19:36 > 0:19:38- That might be it.
0:19:38 > 0:19:41- People just don't want to show it.
0:19:41 > 0:19:42- They don't.
0:19:43 > 0:19:46- And yet I think I like to show - my emotions...
0:19:47 > 0:19:50- ..but I don't like crying - in front of other people.
0:19:50 > 0:19:52- I'll cry in front of Mam or...
0:19:52 > 0:19:56- Yes, and we're all the same. - We just don't do it...
0:19:56 > 0:19:59- Because maybe showing too much - emotion, or you think...
0:20:00 > 0:20:03- ..showing too much emotion - makes you weak but it doesn't.
0:20:03 > 0:20:05- It shows that you're...
0:20:06 > 0:20:08- That you're human.
0:20:11 > 0:20:13- Goodness me.
0:20:14 > 0:20:16- MELANCHOLIC MUSIC
0:20:30 > 0:20:33- What Richard said about people - not going to the pub...
0:20:33 > 0:20:37- ..to talk about their problems - or their work...
0:20:38 > 0:20:40- ..they just go to have fun, - I thought, yes.
0:20:41 > 0:20:43- When I go to the pub - with my friends...
0:20:44 > 0:20:46- ..or go for a coffee - with a friend...
0:20:46 > 0:20:50- ..I don't go to discuss - the problems of this world...
0:20:50 > 0:20:53- ..or work - or how I feel emotionally...
0:20:54 > 0:20:56- ..I go to socialize.
0:20:56 > 0:20:58- Are rural communities...
0:20:59 > 0:21:02- ..despite being - such tight-knit communities...
0:21:02 > 0:21:05- ..and how valuable they are...
0:21:05 > 0:21:10- ..are communities like that - less prepared to talk openly...
0:21:10 > 0:21:12- ..about their feelings?
0:21:13 > 0:21:16- My brother Sion - has been pretty adamant...
0:21:16 > 0:21:18- ..that he didn't want to - take part...
0:21:19 > 0:21:20- ..which is fair enough.
0:21:21 > 0:21:25- I've accepted that because he - finds it very hard to discuss.
0:21:25 > 0:21:30- But he decided... he suggested - tonight that he's been thinking...
0:21:31 > 0:21:35- ..about what he'd like to say - about what happened and that...
0:21:36 > 0:21:38- ..it surprised me in a good way.
0:21:39 > 0:21:40- Erm...
0:21:40 > 0:21:45- ..maybe we see that there's - something positive...
0:21:45 > 0:21:47- ..and a good reason for doing it.
0:21:53 > 0:21:54- .
0:21:56 > 0:21:56- Subtitles
0:21:56 > 0:21:58- Subtitles- - Subtitles
0:22:00 > 0:22:02- MELANCHOLIC MUSIC
0:22:17 > 0:22:19- 90% of the people - who kill themselves...
0:22:20 > 0:22:23- ..suffer from a mental health - problem of some kind.
0:22:23 > 0:22:27- It doesn't care about age, race - or background.
0:22:27 > 0:22:30- It can affect anybody - in any situation.
0:22:33 > 0:22:36- But the figures show that - there's a higher risk of suicide...
0:22:37 > 0:22:38- ..in rural areas.
0:22:52 > 0:22:54- 'Niece.'
0:22:55 > 0:22:59- 'Friend.'
0:23:01 > 0:23:04- I remember walking through - the door of the bungalow.
0:23:04 > 0:23:06- Mam was looking out of the window.
0:23:07 > 0:23:10- She turned around and said - that Elfed had killed himself.
0:23:10 > 0:23:13- It was just shock. - I remember saying, "Is he dead?"
0:23:13 > 0:23:15- What a silly question.
0:23:15 > 0:23:19- I just couldn't believe it - and it was surreal, to be honest.
0:23:19 > 0:23:22- I never thought he would do that.
0:23:22 > 0:23:27- Although the signs were there, - I never thought he would.
0:23:27 > 0:23:30- I couldn't believe that he'd gone.
0:23:34 > 0:23:37- A farm girl - and now a farmer's wife...
0:23:37 > 0:23:40- ..no-one knows this community - better than Ann.
0:23:44 > 0:23:46- You knew Dad.
0:23:46 > 0:23:49- Oh, gosh, yes. - We were really good mates.
0:23:50 > 0:23:52- He was a strong character, - wasn't he?
0:23:52 > 0:23:55- Enthusiastic, full of confidence.
0:23:55 > 0:23:59- I think he saw what was happening - to him as a sign of weakness.
0:24:00 > 0:24:03- I remember coming to Bwchanan. - Mam said Elfed wasn't well.
0:24:03 > 0:24:06- I'd been to an appointment - and stopped at Bwchanan...
0:24:07 > 0:24:09- ..and spoke to your mother.
0:24:09 > 0:24:11- He came to the house - and it frightened me.
0:24:12 > 0:24:15- He was turning in circles - around the working tops.
0:24:15 > 0:24:19- He didn't know what to do - and he couldn't make decisions.
0:24:19 > 0:24:22- Everything was wrong. - Everything was against him.
0:24:22 > 0:24:25- He was a shadow of the character - he used to be.
0:24:25 > 0:24:28- He looked at me... - I was welling up.
0:24:28 > 0:24:32- He said, "You want to cry, - don't you?" I said, "Yes."
0:24:32 > 0:24:35- He apologized and thanked us - for being so nice to him.
0:24:35 > 0:24:38- "You're nice to me. - Why are you so nice to me?"
0:24:39 > 0:24:40- He couldn't understand.
0:24:41 > 0:24:45- He put his hand on my shoulder and - said, "We were mates, weren't we?"
0:24:45 > 0:24:48- You know, in the past tense, - "We were mates."
0:24:48 > 0:24:51- "We are mates. You'll get better."
0:24:51 > 0:24:54- And we pleaded with him - to go to Bangor.
0:24:55 > 0:24:58- And we promised him, "They'll help - you. They'll make you better."
0:24:59 > 0:25:00- You know...
0:25:00 > 0:25:05- You feel that guilt, don't you, - that you pleaded and promised...
0:25:06 > 0:25:09- ..and then... - you know what happened.
0:25:11 > 0:25:13- We tried hard, didn't we?
0:25:13 > 0:25:16- You did everything you could, - didn't you?
0:25:16 > 0:25:18- That's the thing.
0:25:18 > 0:25:23- And, you know, the way he was at - home, it was affecting everyone.
0:25:23 > 0:25:25- Yes. We'd reached a point where...
0:25:27 > 0:25:30- We didn't make the decision to - take him to Bangor lightly.
0:25:30 > 0:25:32- It was the right thing to do.
0:25:32 > 0:25:34- It was the right thing to do.- - Definitely. It was.
0:25:34 > 0:25:37- But it was such a big deal - for us all.
0:25:38 > 0:25:39- Goodness, yes.
0:25:40 > 0:25:41- Because...
0:25:41 > 0:25:45- I remember the first time - we took him, the doctor said...
0:25:45 > 0:25:49- ..we had to leave him there and Mam - and I said, no, we'd take him home.
0:25:49 > 0:25:52- But we knew he really - needed to be there.
0:25:52 > 0:25:55- We still brought him home - because we also knew...
0:25:55 > 0:25:58- I'm part of the stigma, aren't I?
0:25:58 > 0:26:00- I played my part in it.
0:26:01 > 0:26:05- The thing I regret about Hergest - is that we didn't take him sooner.
0:26:05 > 0:26:07- We held back so much.
0:26:07 > 0:26:09- You wanted to help him.
0:26:09 > 0:26:14- But we didn't understand it. That's - the thing. A lack of awareness.
0:26:14 > 0:26:17- And it's a big step - to take someone to Hergest.
0:26:17 > 0:26:19- You're afraid, I think.
0:26:20 > 0:26:23- You don't know what to expect - the first time...
0:26:23 > 0:26:27- ..and you are afraid because you - don't know what you'll face.
0:26:28 > 0:26:31- You could see him looking, - thinking, "Am I like that?"
0:26:31 > 0:26:33- Yeah.
0:26:33 > 0:26:37- That was quite tragic to watch, - wasn't it?
0:26:39 > 0:26:42- What sort of community - do you think this is?
0:26:43 > 0:26:45- I see a close-knit community...
0:26:46 > 0:26:49- ..but when it comes to talking - about issues...
0:26:49 > 0:26:50- Like this.
0:26:51 > 0:26:54- ..they'd tell each other - to pull themselves together.
0:26:54 > 0:26:58- Men who are farmers don't usually - talk about their feelings.
0:26:58 > 0:27:02- They don't talk at all, do they? - Not about their feelings.
0:27:02 > 0:27:05- Sion and Ger don't know whether - they'll be able to...
0:27:06 > 0:27:07- ..do anything with me.
0:27:08 > 0:27:10- I respect that. I understand.
0:27:10 > 0:27:12- You know, it's difficult.
0:27:13 > 0:27:15- I find it difficult.
0:27:15 > 0:27:18- If you address the issue - with any farmer...
0:27:18 > 0:27:21- ..you'd see the fear in their eyes - having to talk about it.
0:27:22 > 0:27:23- Again, like Dad.
0:27:25 > 0:27:27- Which is sad, isn't it?
0:27:28 > 0:27:30- You're not weak if you feel low.
0:27:30 > 0:27:32- You're just ill.
0:27:32 > 0:27:35- Yes, that's the perception, - that you're weak.
0:27:36 > 0:27:38- But it's not weakness, is it?
0:27:39 > 0:27:40- It's an illness.
0:27:54 > 0:27:57- We might have held on too long - with Dad...
0:27:57 > 0:28:01- ..because of the stigma - of going to get help.
0:28:01 > 0:28:03- Erm...
0:28:03 > 0:28:06- ..that was a huge mistake - on our part.
0:28:08 > 0:28:12- We didn't know what to do, - how to deal with it...
0:28:12 > 0:28:15- ..what to do with him, - how to deal with him.
0:28:15 > 0:28:18- There are specialists who do know - what to do.
0:28:19 > 0:28:21- They can try to help.
0:28:30 > 0:28:32- 'The GP.'
0:28:33 > 0:28:35- 'Friend.'
0:28:38 > 0:28:42- Dad's illness came from nowhere, - changing his behaviour completely.
0:28:43 > 0:28:46- But mental health is different - for everyone...
0:28:46 > 0:28:49- ..and too often people are afraid - to ask for help...
0:28:49 > 0:28:51- ..until it's too late.
0:28:53 > 0:28:56- 75% of people who have - killed themselves...
0:28:56 > 0:29:00- ..they don't see a doctor during - the year leading up to it.
0:29:00 > 0:29:04- They think one of the reasons for - that is that they have a stigma...
0:29:04 > 0:29:08- ..against their own illness, - if you understand what I'm saying.
0:29:08 > 0:29:12- You're looking at the high-risk - groups like middle-aged men...
0:29:13 > 0:29:17- ..older men, one of the reasons - suicide is far higher among them...
0:29:17 > 0:29:21- ..is that they feel too ashamed to - see a doctor or tell their family.
0:29:22 > 0:29:26- And if someone can tell these - people, tell your partner...
0:29:27 > 0:29:31- ..tell your friend, come and see - your GP, because there is support.
0:29:32 > 0:29:37- It's odd because if you had cancer - or some sort of visible illness...
0:29:37 > 0:29:41- ..you wouldn't think twice - before trying to seek treatment.
0:29:42 > 0:29:45- I say this almost every day - to a patient with depression.
0:29:45 > 0:29:48- They say, "I don't want it - on my doctor's papers.
0:29:49 > 0:29:53- "I don't want tablets in case the - pharmacist sees I have depression."
0:29:54 > 0:29:57- I say, "If you had asthma, - would you feel ashamed?
0:29:57 > 0:30:00- "If you had diabetes, - would you feel ashamed?"
0:30:00 > 0:30:03- Mental health is like - every other illness.
0:30:03 > 0:30:06- There's a chemical change - in the brain...
0:30:06 > 0:30:09- ..just like a chemical change - in the lungs for asthma...
0:30:09 > 0:30:13- ..or the pancreas for diabetes. - There's no difference.
0:30:13 > 0:30:16- That's the important thing. - There is help out there.
0:30:17 > 0:30:20- Things are never as bleak - as they seem.
0:30:21 > 0:30:22- Erm...
0:30:23 > 0:30:27- ..but you can't help anyone unless - they come and ask for that help.
0:30:29 > 0:30:31- And it's so simple, in a way, - to talk about it.
0:30:32 > 0:30:33- Talk.
0:30:33 > 0:30:38- A problem seems so extreme - at two o'clock in the morning...
0:30:39 > 0:30:40- ..when you can't sleep.
0:30:41 > 0:30:43- But if you discuss it - with a professional...
0:30:44 > 0:30:47- ..and go through things, - it might not be a problem.
0:30:47 > 0:30:51- It's the way you look at - the problem that's damaging.
0:30:51 > 0:30:54- The problem itself - can be relatively small.
0:30:55 > 0:30:59- But without the support, without - opening up, we won't get anywhere.
0:31:32 > 0:31:33- Market day.
0:31:34 > 0:31:38- This is a rare opportunity - for farmers to socialize...
0:31:38 > 0:31:43- ..to have a quick chat, - during their busy lives.
0:31:44 > 0:31:45- And...
0:31:45 > 0:31:49- ..this is the community that Dad, - these are the people that Dad...
0:31:50 > 0:31:52- ..this is the kind of person - Dad was.
0:31:57 > 0:32:01- A lot of them knew about someone - who was suffering, had suffered...
0:32:01 > 0:32:06- ..and a lot of them knew someone - who had killed themselves.
0:32:06 > 0:32:10- Farmers, some of the them - were young like Dad.
0:32:11 > 0:32:13- And they all asked why.
0:32:17 > 0:32:19- Hello. How are you?
0:32:20 > 0:32:22- What are you doing?
0:32:22 > 0:32:24- A programme about losing Dad...
0:32:25 > 0:32:28- ..and asking why there's a stigma - around mental health...
0:32:29 > 0:32:31- ..and a sense of shame about it.
0:32:31 > 0:32:34- That's what we're doing. - Are you keeping well?
0:32:34 > 0:32:36- Yes, very well, thank you.
0:32:36 > 0:32:38- We're trying to break the stigma...
0:32:40 > 0:32:43- ..and why Dad felt ashamed - about it.
0:32:43 > 0:32:45- This is a chance for people - to talk.
0:32:46 > 0:32:49- You don't see anyone all week. - You get to socialize and talk.
0:32:50 > 0:32:51- It's important.
0:32:51 > 0:32:55- It is important. You go home - and don't see anyone all day.
0:32:56 > 0:32:58- Or tomorrow or the day after.
0:32:58 > 0:33:01- That's the problem with this - industry. It's a lonely life.
0:33:02 > 0:33:03- It is.
0:33:17 > 0:33:18- Why are men...
0:33:20 > 0:33:22- ..of a certain age...
0:33:22 > 0:33:25- ..increasingly bringing - their lives to an end?
0:33:25 > 0:33:28- It kills more people than cancer.
0:33:28 > 0:33:31- It kills more people - than road accidents.
0:33:31 > 0:33:37- And the only thing I can think of - is that men in general...
0:33:37 > 0:33:40- ..are less likely to talk - about their feelings.
0:33:40 > 0:33:43- Is talking about your feelings - less macho...
0:33:44 > 0:33:45- ..to some people?
0:33:46 > 0:33:48- They obviously think that's true.
0:33:53 > 0:33:56- A group of farmers today - discussed mental health.
0:33:56 > 0:34:02- They touched on the subject - but I know mental health...
0:34:02 > 0:34:06- ..would not have been discussed - if I wasn't here.
0:34:06 > 0:34:11- Everyone I spoke to was prepared - to talk about it...
0:34:11 > 0:34:14- ..and that has to be - something positive.
0:34:26 > 0:34:27- .
0:34:29 > 0:34:29- Subtitles
0:34:29 > 0:34:31- Subtitles- - Subtitles
0:34:33 > 0:34:35- MELANCHOLIC MUSIC
0:34:51 > 0:34:54- I'm feeling quite emotional - this morning.
0:35:11 > 0:35:12- We have...
0:35:13 > 0:35:15- ..days which are more difficult - than others...
0:35:16 > 0:35:18- ..and today, for some reason, - feels hard.
0:35:25 > 0:35:27- He loved life...
0:35:27 > 0:35:31- ..he loved the community, - he loved his family.
0:35:35 > 0:35:39- That he then decided, - as a result of his illness...
0:35:39 > 0:35:42- ..his illness forced him - to end it all...
0:35:46 > 0:35:49- ..is something that we find - very difficult to accept...
0:35:49 > 0:35:51- ..and to deal with.
0:35:53 > 0:35:56- This is where we were raised...
0:35:57 > 0:36:00- ..this is where Dad worked...
0:36:00 > 0:36:02- ..and yet this is where Dad died...
0:36:02 > 0:36:06- ..in the most terrible way possible - for us.
0:36:07 > 0:36:09- And...
0:36:09 > 0:36:11- ..that's...
0:36:11 > 0:36:14- We have to face that every day - as well.
0:36:23 > 0:36:25- Tomorrow, I'll escape - back to Cardiff.
0:36:27 > 0:36:31- Somehow, all the talk about - talking over the last few days...
0:36:31 > 0:36:33- ..has influenced my brothers.
0:36:33 > 0:36:37- Sion and Geraint have agreed - to talk with me later tonight...
0:36:37 > 0:36:39- ..about Dad's suicide.
0:37:08 > 0:37:11- I've never been - a very religious person...
0:37:11 > 0:37:14- ..but what's happened has made me - question even more...
0:37:15 > 0:37:17- ..whether such a thing exists.
0:37:17 > 0:37:21- Maybe that's an inappropriate thing - to say within chapel walls...
0:37:21 > 0:37:26- ..or in a cemetery, but this is - where Dad is now, unfortunately.
0:37:27 > 0:37:29- I...
0:37:29 > 0:37:33- I have to come here because - there is a strong connection...
0:37:34 > 0:37:37- ..and this is where other members - of the family are buried.
0:37:37 > 0:37:41- This was Dad's family chapel. - This is where Dad was a member...
0:37:41 > 0:37:44- ..and although he, perhaps, - wasn't an ardent member...
0:37:45 > 0:37:48- ..it's an important place - in the family's history.
0:38:22 > 0:38:24- ROAR OF FIGHTER JET
0:38:38 > 0:38:43- Sometimes I want to tell Dad - how angry I am...
0:38:44 > 0:38:47- ..sometimes, about what he did.
0:38:48 > 0:38:52- And then, of course, - I forget about that.
0:38:52 > 0:38:56- I'm only angry for short periods, - thank goodness.
0:38:58 > 0:39:00- MELANCHOLIC MUSIC
0:39:29 > 0:39:33- My intention is to try and prevent - this from happening.
0:39:33 > 0:39:36- We obviously won't stop it - completely...
0:39:36 > 0:39:39- ..but we can reduce - the number of cases.
0:39:39 > 0:39:44- To think that, on average, someone - does what Dad did every day.
0:39:45 > 0:39:49- The result of that for the family - is having to cope with it...
0:39:49 > 0:39:51- ..just like we've had to.
0:39:52 > 0:39:54- We've had to live with it.
0:39:54 > 0:39:57- You have to change the way - you live.
0:39:57 > 0:39:59- Family life is just shattered.
0:40:01 > 0:40:02- That...
0:40:04 > 0:40:06- ..isn't right, that isn't right...
0:40:06 > 0:40:10- ..that a family goes through this - every day in Wales.
0:40:10 > 0:40:14- That just can't be right.
0:40:23 > 0:40:25- 'Sons.'
0:40:26 > 0:40:29- 'Friends.'
0:40:32 > 0:40:33- It was a job today.
0:40:33 > 0:40:35- It was a job today.- - It's turned colder today.
0:40:37 > 0:40:38- Erm...
0:40:42 > 0:40:44- I don't know where to start, - really.
0:40:49 > 0:40:50- I know...
0:40:50 > 0:40:52- This is hard.
0:40:52 > 0:40:54- Erm...
0:40:58 > 0:41:02- I never thought you'd talk about - it, to be honest, because...
0:41:02 > 0:41:05- I still can't look at a photo - of him or anything.
0:41:06 > 0:41:08- We all deal with it differently, - don't we?
0:41:08 > 0:41:11- I think it's positive that - you're willing to do this.
0:41:12 > 0:41:15- I also appreciate it, - and you, Ger.
0:41:15 > 0:41:20- I was very aware that what I wanted - people to do was a big ask.
0:41:20 > 0:41:24- It was surprising that people - were willing to do it.
0:41:24 > 0:41:27- What also surprised me was...
0:41:27 > 0:41:31- ..that everyone said, I hope this - is true, they benefitted from it.
0:41:31 > 0:41:34- They felt it made a difference - to them.
0:41:34 > 0:41:38- I think the reason why people - have opened up is that someone...
0:41:39 > 0:41:42- ..of Dad's stamp, in a way...
0:41:42 > 0:41:45- ..a man who'd worked hard...
0:41:45 > 0:41:49- ..a man who'd done everything, and - he had suffered from this illness.
0:41:51 > 0:41:54- Maybe that shocked people - more than anything...
0:41:54 > 0:41:57- ..and that's why they wanted to...
0:41:59 > 0:42:03- The stigma of mental health - is old fashioned nowadays.
0:42:03 > 0:42:06- Maybe if you suffered with mental - health issues 50 years ago...
0:42:07 > 0:42:10- ..it was something to be - ashamed of to some extent.
0:42:10 > 0:42:14- I always used to connect - mental health problems...
0:42:14 > 0:42:16- ..either they were an alcoholic...
0:42:16 > 0:42:19- ..or they'd come from - a rough family from...
0:42:20 > 0:42:21- ..from somewhere.
0:42:22 > 0:42:25- But for it to happen to an ordinary - man from an ordinary family...
0:42:26 > 0:42:27- ..just a farmer...
0:42:27 > 0:42:29- ..just a farmer...- - Who'd worked hard.
0:42:29 > 0:42:31- Who'd worked hard - and just lost his mind.
0:42:32 > 0:42:36- I thought there was an underlying - issue with everyone at Hergest...
0:42:36 > 0:42:37- There isn't.
0:42:37 > 0:42:39- There isn't.- - No.
0:42:39 > 0:42:44- But we now know that there - isn't any reason for it.
0:42:44 > 0:42:46- There's no specific reason.
0:42:46 > 0:42:50- What would you tell someone, - a 50-year-old man, a farmer...
0:42:50 > 0:42:54- ..from Machynlleth suffering - with mental health issues?
0:42:54 > 0:42:57- What would you tell him? - Someone similar to Dad.
0:42:59 > 0:43:02- A man who isn't likely to talk - to his wife or children.
0:43:02 > 0:43:05- What would you tell him today?
0:43:05 > 0:43:07- There's no shame in it.
0:43:12 > 0:43:16- One thing that sums up - how ill Dad was...
0:43:17 > 0:43:19- ..you know he'd do anything...
0:43:19 > 0:43:22- ..for his sheep, his cattle, - his land...
0:43:23 > 0:43:26- ..and to just leave all that.
0:43:26 > 0:43:30- Just to leave it to me - to make a mess of it.
0:43:30 > 0:43:33- He must have been so... - I don't know how to say it.
0:43:33 > 0:43:37- He was willing to give it all up, - wasn't he?
0:43:37 > 0:43:38- Yes.
0:43:38 > 0:43:43- I feel the same. A man who enjoyed - life, who enjoyed working...
0:43:43 > 0:43:46- ..enjoyed everything, and he...
0:43:47 > 0:43:49- Yes, he...
0:43:49 > 0:43:52- He decided to, - this is an odd term...
0:43:54 > 0:43:56- ..to give up on everything.
0:43:56 > 0:43:58- That shows what this illness - is like...
0:43:59 > 0:44:01- ..and the desperation of it all.
0:44:01 > 0:44:04- The agricultural industry - is a lonely one.
0:44:06 > 0:44:09- I didn't realize and I didn't - appreciate until Dad died...
0:44:10 > 0:44:12- ..how much work there is.
0:44:12 > 0:44:15- Farming is much more than - just the farming.
0:44:16 > 0:44:18- You've got to run a business.
0:44:19 > 0:44:23- You're almost the MD of a company - on your own and it's a lot of work.
0:44:23 > 0:44:25- It puts people under pressure.
0:44:28 > 0:44:29- Yeah...
0:44:30 > 0:44:33- I was 25.... - I was 25 when we lost Dad.
0:44:36 > 0:44:39- I had a 600-acre farm - on my hands.
0:44:39 > 0:44:43- I often didn't know how much feed - to give the sheep and cows...
0:44:43 > 0:44:46- ..and how many sheep - should graze per acre.
0:44:46 > 0:44:48- He was the one who knew.
0:44:48 > 0:44:51- I didn't have a clue what to do, - to some degree.
0:44:51 > 0:44:54- I knew how to drive a tractor - and a motorbike.
0:44:57 > 0:44:58- It's a tough job.
0:45:12 > 0:45:14- I can escape this place.
0:45:14 > 0:45:16- You have to do this every day.
0:45:18 > 0:45:20- It's not easy, is it?
0:45:20 > 0:45:22- No, it isn't.
0:45:22 > 0:45:24- But...
0:45:24 > 0:45:27- ..I think you're doing great work.
0:45:27 > 0:45:29- I think you're successful.
0:45:29 > 0:45:31- I know Dad would be angry - about this.
0:45:32 > 0:45:33- What do you think?
0:45:34 > 0:45:36- About this? He'd be furious.
0:45:36 > 0:45:39- He'd hit the roof - that we're wasting time talking.
0:45:40 > 0:45:45- He'd be furious that we're talking - about him and his illness.
0:45:45 > 0:45:48- It's because he didn't understand - the illness.
0:45:48 > 0:45:52- He couldn't even accept it - let alone understand it.
0:45:52 > 0:45:55- He was ashamed... - he was ashamed of it.
0:45:57 > 0:46:00- But there's no need to be ashamed.
0:46:00 > 0:46:04- And that's why, even though I know - Dad would be angry about this...
0:46:04 > 0:46:06- ..that's how I know...
0:46:06 > 0:46:09- Dad was angry when we took him - to the doctor...
0:46:09 > 0:46:13- ..when we took him to Hergest, - but it was the right things to do.
0:46:13 > 0:46:17- Even though I know Dad would be - angry, it doesn't worry me...
0:46:17 > 0:46:20- ..because sometimes you have to - do things people don't like...
0:46:21 > 0:46:22- ..for their own good.
0:46:23 > 0:46:25- And this is for a greater good.
0:46:27 > 0:46:31- I hope that he'd be proud, - in an odd way...
0:46:32 > 0:46:35- ..that we're trying to help - other people.
0:46:59 > 0:47:02- I think in Dad's case, - no doubt about it...
0:47:02 > 0:47:04- ..stigma killed Dad.
0:47:04 > 0:47:06- And...
0:47:08 > 0:47:12- ..his illness to a large degree - allowed him to do what he did.
0:47:13 > 0:47:15- But the stigma killed him.
0:47:15 > 0:47:18- I find myself being part - of that stigma.
0:47:19 > 0:47:22- I don't say that Dad - committed suicide.
0:47:24 > 0:47:27- I always say that Dad has died...
0:47:27 > 0:47:29- ..or Dad's gone...
0:47:29 > 0:47:32- ..or when what happened, happened.
0:47:34 > 0:47:35- It's "that".
0:47:36 > 0:47:38- It's the thing we never mention.
0:47:38 > 0:47:40- Dad killed himself.
0:47:40 > 0:47:45- When Dad committed suicide, when - Elfed decided to commit suicide.
0:47:46 > 0:47:48- We don't... I don't say it.
0:47:48 > 0:47:53- I'm an inadvertent part - of the stigma around it.
0:47:53 > 0:47:58- And, like I said, I know it played - a part in Dad's death...
0:47:58 > 0:48:02- ..and the hope is, as we raise - awareness of the matter...
0:48:02 > 0:48:06- ..it will remove the stigma - and we don't talk about "that"...
0:48:06 > 0:48:09- ..but we talk about the problem - of suicides in Wales...
0:48:10 > 0:48:12- ..in Britain and around the world.
0:48:12 > 0:48:14- It kills too many people.
0:48:14 > 0:48:17- Too many families have to face - what I'm going through...
0:48:17 > 0:48:21- ..what Mam's going through, what - my brothers go through every day.
0:48:21 > 0:48:23- It's not right.
0:48:23 > 0:48:26- An expert on suicide told me...
0:48:28 > 0:48:30- ..that suicide is preventable.
0:48:33 > 0:48:36- So why aren't we preventing it?
0:48:54 > 0:48:56- In memory of Elfed.
0:48:56 > 0:49:02- "The smile that never fades, - the flame that never dims."
0:49:23 > 0:49:26- S4C subtitles by Ericsson
0:49:26 > 0:49:27- .