0:00:11 > 0:00:16APPLAUSE
0:00:16 > 0:00:19Thank you. Welcome to My Life In Books,
0:00:19 > 0:00:22a chance for my guests to share their favourite reads.
0:00:22 > 0:00:24With me tonight, actor Larry Lamb,
0:00:24 > 0:00:28the famously put-upon Mick Shipman in Gavin And Stacey,
0:00:28 > 0:00:31but probably best known as Archie Mitchell in EastEnders,
0:00:31 > 0:00:34for which the Soap Awards named him Villain of the Year.
0:00:34 > 0:00:37Alongside him, stand-up comedian Sarah Millican.
0:00:37 > 0:00:41A couple of years ago, she won Best Newcomer Award
0:00:41 > 0:00:46at the Edinburgh Fringe for her show Sarah Millican's Not Nice.
0:00:46 > 0:00:50And we'll make it clear that you are nice, you're not a villain.
0:00:50 > 0:00:53And even I'm nice when I'm not doing The Weakest Link.
0:00:53 > 0:00:55Thank you, both, for joining me.
0:00:55 > 0:00:57APPLAUSE
0:00:57 > 0:01:00Sarah, did you read a lot as a child?
0:01:00 > 0:01:03Whenever my mam, if she went shopping and she couldn't find us,
0:01:03 > 0:01:07I would always be in a corner reading a book in like Smith's or whatever,
0:01:07 > 0:01:12just be cross-legged in a corner, just working my way into something.
0:01:12 > 0:01:16I remember going to the library and I was only allowed four books and I had
0:01:16 > 0:01:20to borrow my sister's library card because I used to want more books.
0:01:20 > 0:01:23I remember getting reprimanded in the library because I was trying
0:01:23 > 0:01:27to take something back that I'd got out earlier that day cos I'd read it through the day.
0:01:27 > 0:01:30They said, "You're not allowed to do that." Banished...
0:01:30 > 0:01:33- from the library! - For reading too fast.
0:01:33 > 0:01:35- Were you reading from childhood? - Yeah.
0:01:35 > 0:01:38- As a teenager were you reading? - Yeah, yeah.
0:01:38 > 0:01:42My mum got me into reading very early, so I was a bright boy when
0:01:42 > 0:01:46I was a youngster, so I was always ahead of the game with reading.
0:01:46 > 0:01:49They used to give me extraordinary books.
0:01:49 > 0:01:54My grandmother and grandfather on my mother's side were very sort
0:01:54 > 0:02:00of proper working-class, educated socialists with an eye to the
0:02:00 > 0:02:04future for the young, so they gave me books. Definitely.
0:02:04 > 0:02:10Let's start with childhood reads. Larry, you were eight, I understand.
0:02:10 > 0:02:13- Daniel Defoe's Robinson Crusoe.- Yup.
0:02:13 > 0:02:18A lifesaver at that time for me. Everything was in meltdown at home.
0:02:18 > 0:02:20Why?
0:02:20 > 0:02:24Well, my parents were a mismatch and by that stage,
0:02:24 > 0:02:26it was almost about to explode completely.
0:02:26 > 0:02:29Would you escape to your bedroom and read
0:02:29 > 0:02:32- while all war was breaking out below?- It's very interesting.
0:02:32 > 0:02:35I know I used to spend a lot of time listening to see
0:02:35 > 0:02:37if they were going to fight
0:02:37 > 0:02:39and trying to rush down there and stop them.
0:02:39 > 0:02:42- How did you do that? - Get in between them.- Yeah.
0:02:42 > 0:02:45- You were only eight, nine?- I know. It's amazing what you can do.
0:02:45 > 0:02:48Yeah. Tell me about Robinson Crusoe's story.
0:02:48 > 0:02:53That story was something for me to...
0:02:53 > 0:02:56It just pointed out the chance that there was sort of hope
0:02:56 > 0:02:58on the horizon.
0:02:58 > 0:03:02And his story, a young man who sets off on a business trip,
0:03:02 > 0:03:06effectively, in the 17th century, he decides to be a merchant, much
0:03:06 > 0:03:10against his father's advice, and was trying to make trades in the
0:03:10 > 0:03:14islands and finished up shipwrecked on what we now know as Trinidad.
0:03:14 > 0:03:19It's the story of him using everything that came ashore
0:03:19 > 0:03:22when the ship was wrecked to build a life there.
0:03:22 > 0:03:25He creates his own little world on that island,
0:03:25 > 0:03:27but he never gives up hope.
0:03:27 > 0:03:30And I think that was it, it was an inspiration for me.
0:03:30 > 0:03:33- It was about survival and you were trying to survive.- Absolutely.
0:03:33 > 0:03:36Trying to survive the tempers that I was living in,
0:03:36 > 0:03:40the tempers that constantly reared up again.
0:03:40 > 0:03:42- And your mother eventually left. - Yeah, she did.
0:03:42 > 0:03:45She ran for the desert island! But, yeah...
0:03:45 > 0:03:49- And you were left with your father. - Yeah, I got left with him.
0:03:49 > 0:03:51Thanks a lot, Mum(!)
0:03:51 > 0:03:54Did you think you were like Robinson Crusoe?
0:03:54 > 0:03:56Did you build yourself into the character?
0:03:56 > 0:03:59No, but the funny thing about my father is,
0:03:59 > 0:04:02we used to make bows and arrows and catapults and camps in the woods,
0:04:02 > 0:04:07so there was that element of adventure in our life anyway.
0:04:07 > 0:04:13- Something that had come to him... God!- Quite a cheeky little chap.
0:04:13 > 0:04:15Yeah, cheeky little chappy.
0:04:15 > 0:04:19- Quite chubby.- By the time I was 12, I was a real porker.
0:04:19 > 0:04:21A real porker, yeah.
0:04:21 > 0:04:25- That was my one claim...- Reading and snacking at the same time?
0:04:25 > 0:04:26Snacking like Billy-o, I tell you!
0:04:26 > 0:04:29Did you see your mother after she left?
0:04:29 > 0:04:33We used to see her, sort of, at the bus stop every weekend.
0:04:33 > 0:04:38- That's a very sad story.- I know. It is, yeah. But that's the way it was.
0:04:38 > 0:04:42There was no reconciliation possible between them.
0:04:42 > 0:04:46And eventually when you'd grown up, did you make contact properly with your mother?
0:04:46 > 0:04:49Yeah, absolutely. In the end, I lost it with my father
0:04:49 > 0:04:52and have a wonderful relationship with my mum.
0:04:52 > 0:04:56Sarah, your first choice, Daphne's Book by Mary Downing Hahn.
0:04:56 > 0:04:58Tell us about this.
0:04:58 > 0:05:02It's not anywhere near as dramatic as your story. I feel like I should've gone first!
0:05:02 > 0:05:04LAUGHTER
0:05:04 > 0:05:08It's about a little girl in glasses who has trouble making friends.
0:05:08 > 0:05:09There's... Strange(!)
0:05:09 > 0:05:12LAUGHTER
0:05:12 > 0:05:15It's only when I was asked to pick my five books that
0:05:15 > 0:05:18I realised how incredibly autobiographical it was.
0:05:18 > 0:05:21Yeah, it's a little girl who struggles to make friends
0:05:21 > 0:05:25cos she's quite bookish and she's forced to make friends with another girl
0:05:25 > 0:05:28when they do a school project and the other girl's quite popular
0:05:28 > 0:05:31and they both sort of learn things about each other.
0:05:31 > 0:05:34- It wasn't quite like your own childhood.- It almost looks like me!
0:05:34 > 0:05:38- That's terrifying!- But they were in America, you were in Newcastle.
0:05:38 > 0:05:41Yeah, but nerds look like nerds across the world.
0:05:41 > 0:05:43LAUGHTER
0:05:43 > 0:05:46- We've got a picture of you at that time.- See?
0:05:46 > 0:05:48You look much better than her.
0:05:48 > 0:05:52There was a noise there that was "Oh..." in the audience.
0:05:52 > 0:05:55You can pity me, but don't be physically sick!
0:05:55 > 0:05:58You look quite a redhead there, or is that just the light?
0:05:58 > 0:06:01No, it's just old-fashioned photography, I think.
0:06:01 > 0:06:04It was a perm though, cos my mam was a hairdresser and she used to keep
0:06:04 > 0:06:08us off PE cos she didn't think it was important and perm me hair!
0:06:08 > 0:06:12- And was school difficult then, that you felt such a loner?- Well, yeah.
0:06:12 > 0:06:15It's not dramatic, it's not... Nobody was punching us.
0:06:15 > 0:06:20They were just ignoring us, which was quite hard. And I was quite quiet. To be honest, I probably didn't...
0:06:20 > 0:06:24If I'd spoken up, maybe I would've had a few more friends.
0:06:24 > 0:06:25Sounds terribly tragic!
0:06:25 > 0:06:29But you're so much more upbeat about your horrific childhood.
0:06:29 > 0:06:33- And I'm like, "Nobody was my friend! Boo-hoo!"- I've had a lot longer to get over it.
0:06:33 > 0:06:38- Bless you!- Did your father read to you?- My father was a reader, very definitely.
0:06:38 > 0:06:40And my father put me onto a lot of books.
0:06:40 > 0:06:44- He was a psycho, but he was a very intelligent psycho. - LAUGHTER
0:06:44 > 0:06:48It's a bit of an irony that you then played Archie Mitchell,
0:06:48 > 0:06:52- who could've been a prototype for your father.- Yeah, he was the prototype for my father.
0:06:52 > 0:06:54But I had an uncle as well that was similar
0:06:54 > 0:06:57and I looked much more like my uncle, so between the two...
0:06:57 > 0:07:02He was a very tough man and so the strange...
0:07:02 > 0:07:06The weirdness of my father coupled with the strength of my uncle,
0:07:06 > 0:07:09the two came together. It was like an amalgam, really.
0:07:09 > 0:07:12Let's remind everybody of you.
0:07:12 > 0:07:15The girl is dead! Dead and buried! Rotting in the ground!
0:07:15 > 0:07:17And it's down to you!
0:07:17 > 0:07:19Yeah... Ha-ha!
0:07:19 > 0:07:22This is life paying you back...
0:07:22 > 0:07:26for your neglect. Your vicious, selfish neglect.
0:07:26 > 0:07:30Neglect of her, neglect of me, your father.
0:07:32 > 0:07:34Is that the best you can do?
0:07:34 > 0:07:36Horrible, isn't he?
0:07:36 > 0:07:40Yeah, but with that sense of righteousness.
0:07:40 > 0:07:45It's absolutely the rectitude.... "This is no lie."
0:07:45 > 0:07:48Absolutely convinced of what he's doing.
0:07:48 > 0:07:52I mean, a real... Ooh, a performance.
0:07:52 > 0:07:55And I had that in my face all the time.
0:07:55 > 0:08:00- All the time.- The next book you've chosen is La Terre, Emile Zola,
0:08:00 > 0:08:03because it reminds you of living in France.
0:08:03 > 0:08:07Yeah, I'd bought an old house with my then partner, back in 1988,
0:08:07 > 0:08:10and found myself living in a rural community,
0:08:10 > 0:08:12deep in the heart of Normandy.
0:08:12 > 0:08:17I happened on one of Zola's books, it was about a commune in Paris, and
0:08:17 > 0:08:22then that sort of got me on to this whole series of books that he wrote.
0:08:22 > 0:08:23Give us a quick sketch.
0:08:23 > 0:08:26It's about the nature of Norman peasant people.
0:08:26 > 0:08:31That's what it's about. People who live on the land in Normandy.
0:08:31 > 0:08:34And it's about the way they are with money, with land,
0:08:34 > 0:08:36with possessions, with relationships,
0:08:36 > 0:08:40with inter-familial relationships, in a small community.
0:08:40 > 0:08:44Can you read us your favourite passage, or a passage from that?
0:08:44 > 0:08:47Yeah, there's a little passage here that...
0:08:47 > 0:08:49It's about the wine harvest, chapter four.
0:08:49 > 0:08:52"It was early October and the wine harvest was about to begin.
0:08:52 > 0:08:56"A splendid week of feasting when quarrelsome families usually
0:08:56 > 0:08:58"become reconciled over jugs of new wine.
0:08:58 > 0:09:01"For a whole week, Rognes would reek of grapes.
0:09:01 > 0:09:04"People ate so many that women lifted their skirts
0:09:04 > 0:09:08"and men dropped their trousers under every hedge, and lovers,
0:09:08 > 0:09:12"stained with grape juice, greedily exchanged kisses among the vines.
0:09:12 > 0:09:15"In the end, there were lots of drunken men and pregnant girls."
0:09:15 > 0:09:18Is that what it's like in Normandy where you were?
0:09:18 > 0:09:22Certainly not like where I was, I'm here to tell you! They didn't have a wine harvest there.
0:09:22 > 0:09:24I'd have been in real trouble if they did!
0:09:24 > 0:09:29Did you actually read it in French or did you read it as The Earth?
0:09:29 > 0:09:33No, it's quite archaic classical French of the 19th century
0:09:33 > 0:09:37and although it's beautifully written, at that time,
0:09:37 > 0:09:40it would've been a hack to get through it.
0:09:40 > 0:09:45Sarah, your next choice is The Vagina Monologues by Eve Ensler.
0:09:45 > 0:09:48How did you find out about the book?
0:09:48 > 0:09:50Well, I used to want to write for the theatre
0:09:50 > 0:09:54and I used to absorb as many plays as I could and then try
0:09:54 > 0:09:59and write plays and send them in to the local theatres and sometimes they'd put them on as readings.
0:09:59 > 0:10:02It was recommended by somebody at the theatre.
0:10:02 > 0:10:06I started reading it and it was only then... I was 19 or 20. It was only then that I realised
0:10:06 > 0:10:11how formidable women can be and the complexities of being a woman
0:10:11 > 0:10:15and accepting parts of yourself, so to speak.
0:10:15 > 0:10:18It's women's stories about their vaginas.
0:10:18 > 0:10:20And about what can happen to them.
0:10:20 > 0:10:22I should say as well that the show that you mentioned,
0:10:22 > 0:10:27Sarah Millican's Not Nice, was my first show and the reason it was called that was partly
0:10:27 > 0:10:31because I was a bit of a cow, and also because that's what
0:10:31 > 0:10:35we use to call our lady parts when we were kids, me and my sister.
0:10:35 > 0:10:39We used to call it your "not nice". LAUGHTER
0:10:39 > 0:10:42So there's a story behind that, clearly!
0:10:42 > 0:10:46- So, yeah. That's what we used to call ours.- Read us a bit from it.- OK.
0:10:46 > 0:10:49- A nice bit.- A nice bit! Oh! Are you going to blush?
0:10:49 > 0:10:52Oh! You wouldn't believe!
0:10:52 > 0:10:57This is a monologue by a woman who is very sort of introverted
0:10:57 > 0:11:01and is wanting to have a one-night stand, but didn't want to...
0:11:01 > 0:11:04Wasn't comfortable with her sort of nakedness, I suppose.
0:11:04 > 0:11:06That's probably the best way of putting it.
0:11:06 > 0:11:10"I didn't particularly like Bob. I would've missed him altogether
0:11:10 > 0:11:13"if he hadn't picked up my change that I dropped on the deli floor.
0:11:13 > 0:11:16"Then he handed me back my quarters and pennies
0:11:16 > 0:11:19"and his hand accidentally touched mine. Something happened.
0:11:19 > 0:11:23"I went to bed with him. That's when the miracle occurred."
0:11:23 > 0:11:26And the miracle that occurred was the fact that he wanted to look at her
0:11:26 > 0:11:30and she said, "But I'm here. "Look at me now."
0:11:30 > 0:11:32And he said, "No, I want to look at all of you."
0:11:32 > 0:11:36And she was mortified cos she wanted to sort of...in a bed, lying down, in the dark.
0:11:36 > 0:11:40And he just wanted to look at her. And I think it's such a lovely moment that she's realised
0:11:40 > 0:11:44that she is beautiful and she hadn't previously thought that
0:11:44 > 0:11:48anybody would want to sort of drink her in with their eyes.
0:11:48 > 0:11:50Did it move you to be a feminist?
0:11:50 > 0:11:54I think I probably already was, but it certainly brought it out in me.
0:11:54 > 0:11:59I've always wanted to be a strong woman and whenever I do anything, I always try and be a strong woman.
0:11:59 > 0:12:03And this just really opened my eyes to different voices.
0:12:03 > 0:12:09Larry, your next book was published in 2003.
0:12:09 > 0:12:12It's A Million Little Pieces by James Frey.
0:12:12 > 0:12:14Can you give us a brief outline?
0:12:14 > 0:12:20It was given to me as a good book and it sort of took me
0:12:20 > 0:12:24on a journey inside the mind of somebody who was absolutely
0:12:24 > 0:12:27hooked on drugs and alcohol since childhood.
0:12:27 > 0:12:32He managed to grab me right from the opening moment of that book.
0:12:32 > 0:12:36- Shall I read a little bit? - Yeah, cos this is what caught you. - It's the opening sequence of this.
0:12:36 > 0:12:41"I wake to the drone of an airplane engine and the feeling of something warm dripping down my chin.
0:12:41 > 0:12:44"I lift my hand to feel my face. My front four teeth are gone.
0:12:44 > 0:12:49"I have a hole in my cheek, my nose is broken and my eyes are swollen nearly shut.
0:12:49 > 0:12:53"I open them and I look around and I'm in the back of a plane and there's no-one near me.
0:12:53 > 0:12:56"I look at my clothes and my clothes are covered with a colourful
0:12:56 > 0:13:00"mixture of spit, snot, urine, vomit and blood.
0:13:00 > 0:13:03"I reach for the call button and I find it and I push it
0:13:03 > 0:13:06"and I wait, and 30 seconds later an attendant arrives.
0:13:06 > 0:13:10"'How can I help you?' 'Where am I going?' 'You don't know?' 'No.'"
0:13:10 > 0:13:14- Cos he's been in a blackout.- Total blackout.- Has it happened to you?
0:13:14 > 0:13:17No, no, no. I'm far too much of a control freak.
0:13:17 > 0:13:21I drank like a fish as a teenager and then into my 20s and 30s.
0:13:21 > 0:13:26But there's no way I could get completely taken up with that
0:13:26 > 0:13:29- sort of situation at all. - It had mixed reviews
0:13:29 > 0:13:34because reviewers would say that it was annoying, he was en egotist,
0:13:34 > 0:13:38he was bombastic, but actually the writing shone through on this book.
0:13:38 > 0:13:42Yeah, the writing is extraordinary. Even in the negative reviews,
0:13:42 > 0:13:45the one thing they can't deny is the fact that the guy can write.
0:13:45 > 0:13:50- It's brilliantly written.- Sarah, you've moved on to a self-help book.
0:13:50 > 0:13:54Because your husband has quite unexpectedly left you.
0:13:54 > 0:13:58Yeah, leaving is always how they describe it in newspapers and things.
0:13:58 > 0:14:01Really, we just sold the flat and then walked out of the door
0:14:01 > 0:14:06and literally went in different directions. It's very "soap".
0:14:06 > 0:14:08Yes, and it was just unexpected.
0:14:08 > 0:14:11I thought we were happy and it came as quite a shock.
0:14:11 > 0:14:15And I moved back in with my parents and my sister for
0:14:15 > 0:14:19two and a half years at the age of 29, went back in my old bedroom.
0:14:19 > 0:14:23And my dad even said, bless him, "Do you still want your old posters?
0:14:23 > 0:14:27"I can get your old posters out, if you like." My posters of Philip Schofield, bless him!
0:14:27 > 0:14:32- LAUGHTER - The book's called It's Your Life, What Are You Going to Do with It?
0:14:32 > 0:14:36It says, "Coach yourself, make real changes in your life."
0:14:36 > 0:14:40Anthony Grant and Jane Greene.
0:14:40 > 0:14:43Unashamedly self-help, heroically self-help.
0:14:43 > 0:14:47Quite aggressive as well. I think that's why it caught my eye.
0:14:47 > 0:14:53It wasn't namby-pamby. I think I was probably looking for inspiration, just wandering round in a bookshop.
0:14:53 > 0:14:57Sometimes when you don't go in for anything specific, you just browse.
0:14:57 > 0:15:01- Where are we at this point? - In Newcastle.- OK.
0:15:01 > 0:15:05And it caught my eye and I think if you finish a self-help book,
0:15:05 > 0:15:09then it hasn't done its job. I don't think you should, cos some people read them
0:15:09 > 0:15:12almost as a hobby and almost as a lifeline and don't actually
0:15:12 > 0:15:16do the next stage of changing your life and it was only
0:15:16 > 0:15:19when I found it...brought it out of my bookshelf,
0:15:19 > 0:15:25- and it's got a little post-it note from where I stopped reading it. - What page was that?- Page 18.
0:15:25 > 0:15:29I'm quite inspired. I'm going to get you to read from page 87.
0:15:29 > 0:15:33Thank you. I did flick through cos these are the bits I used to like.
0:15:33 > 0:15:36Rather than the exercises, I like the inspirational stories.
0:15:36 > 0:15:39What are the exercises? These sort of exercises?
0:15:39 > 0:15:42- Yeah, that's exactly what they are(!) - Yeah.
0:15:42 > 0:15:45Does it look like I do any of those ever? No!
0:15:45 > 0:15:48LAUGHTER Don't laugh at that.
0:15:48 > 0:15:51"Angela became a professional actress at the age of 50.
0:15:51 > 0:15:54"She managed to break into an overcrowded, insecure,
0:15:54 > 0:15:58"uncertain profession long after most people would have even thought of it.
0:15:58 > 0:16:01"At 49, she auditioned for the Royal Academy of Dramatic Art
0:16:01 > 0:16:05"and with a little help from friends and acquaintances, she had her first professional job at 50.
0:16:05 > 0:16:09"She went on to have a successful career on stage and television,
0:16:09 > 0:16:12"appearing in London's West End with Alan Alda."
0:16:12 > 0:16:15Yes. I know you probably need a heart of stone like mine,
0:16:15 > 0:16:19- but it is a bit impossible to believe, don't you think?- Ugh.
0:16:19 > 0:16:22It means I can become a neurosurgeon any day now.
0:16:22 > 0:16:25It depends on whether you see it as "inspirational" and whether you're
0:16:25 > 0:16:29glass half-empty or glass half-full, which I suspect you're the former.
0:16:29 > 0:16:31This is about fulfilling dreams.
0:16:31 > 0:16:35Yeah, it's about realising that you can do anything.
0:16:35 > 0:16:38I did have those days when I got divorced of days when I felt like I could do nothing
0:16:38 > 0:16:43and then I had days when I felt like I could do anything and I used to call those my She-Ra moments.
0:16:43 > 0:16:45When I felt like if somebody said, "Climb that mountain,"
0:16:45 > 0:16:49I'd think, "I need a bit of training and I need the right shoes, but I'm sure I can manage it."
0:16:49 > 0:16:53And it was on one of those days that I decided to start doing stand-up.
0:16:53 > 0:16:55Let's have a look at the star.
0:16:55 > 0:17:00I bought a woman's magazine recently cos on the cover it said that some female celebrities had put weight on
0:17:00 > 0:17:05and that they were now curvaceous. I thought, "Good. I'll have a look and see just how curvaceous they are."
0:17:05 > 0:17:10And I flicked through and the fattest woman in there, it said that she had "ballooned"...
0:17:10 > 0:17:12I repeat, she had...
0:17:13 > 0:17:16.."ballooned" to a size 12.
0:17:16 > 0:17:18LAUGHTER
0:17:18 > 0:17:23I'd give my right arm to be a size 12. My right arm might be a size 12!
0:17:23 > 0:17:27LAUGHTER AND APPLAUSE
0:17:27 > 0:17:32- Were you always funny as a child? - I was quite "performy" as a child.
0:17:32 > 0:17:36While I was quiet at school, I was always sort of... When I got new shoes,
0:17:36 > 0:17:39I used to tap-dance around the boiler cos there were tiles around the boiler at home
0:17:39 > 0:17:42and I used to have to have a little go with new shoes on.
0:17:42 > 0:17:45And I used to read poetry to my mam that I'd written but I was
0:17:45 > 0:17:49so nervous of performing that I used to read from behind a curtain.
0:17:49 > 0:17:53- Yeah.- They say that comedians can often be sad clowns.
0:17:53 > 0:17:56Do you think there is a kind of contradiction
0:17:56 > 0:17:58between one side of them and the other?
0:17:58 > 0:18:02I don't know. I think generally comedians are outsiders.
0:18:02 > 0:18:05I think they've always been observing life going on,
0:18:05 > 0:18:07as opposed to being part of it.
0:18:07 > 0:18:10Somebody said to me, once I started having a nicer life and I'd found
0:18:10 > 0:18:13a nice man and my life was sort of on more of an even keel,
0:18:13 > 0:18:17that I wouldn't be funny because I was only funny when I was miserable.
0:18:17 > 0:18:22Thanks(!) But I think that's rubbish. I think it just depends on the kind of comedy that you do,
0:18:22 > 0:18:26but I think there is a little bit of a sadness in a lot comics, but I don't think it's obligatory.
0:18:26 > 0:18:32Larry, your next book, by the President of the US, no less, Audacity Of Hope.
0:18:32 > 0:18:37- When did you first notice him? - I noticed him quite early on.
0:18:37 > 0:18:40I think it was 2004 or thereabouts.
0:18:40 > 0:18:45- And he'd written this book by then. - That was the second book.
0:18:45 > 0:18:49- I read them in order. I read the first book...- Dreams From My Father.
0:18:49 > 0:18:55Yeah, I read them back-to-back. Dreams From My Father, which takes you back into his past,
0:18:55 > 0:18:59his rather sort of interesting, chequered past in Indonesia and in Kenya.
0:18:59 > 0:19:02And his family, tracking down his family,
0:19:02 > 0:19:06and going back into his life, which I found fascinating.
0:19:06 > 0:19:09But so truthful, so candid, so honest.
0:19:09 > 0:19:12And then eventually, he takes you on into his political career
0:19:12 > 0:19:15and how it progressed and working in the public sphere,
0:19:15 > 0:19:20working for people as a sort of an organiser, organising people
0:19:20 > 0:19:24to better their situation in poorer areas of Chicago.
0:19:24 > 0:19:27And his gradual rise.
0:19:27 > 0:19:31But the thing is, he doesn't pretend that he's a perfect soul
0:19:31 > 0:19:33the way so many of these politicians do.
0:19:33 > 0:19:37They paint themselves as being...close enough to the
0:19:37 > 0:19:41Messiah, you know? Cos we all know they're not. And he doesn't.
0:19:41 > 0:19:43He goes as close as he can, and you know,
0:19:43 > 0:19:46to being totally truthful about himself.
0:19:46 > 0:19:50And then he takes you inside his relationship with his wife,
0:19:50 > 0:19:54who I just feel instinctively is the power behind the throne.
0:19:54 > 0:19:58She is fantastic, and quite different from any other president's
0:19:58 > 0:20:01wife, in that she's incredibly clever.
0:20:01 > 0:20:05She looks a million dollars, but she's quite happy to do
0:20:05 > 0:20:08traditional things as the president's wife.
0:20:08 > 0:20:10Well...
0:20:10 > 0:20:15She's a real blue collar American girl that's made it herself and
0:20:15 > 0:20:20then she runs into a guy who's going to become the president of the US.
0:20:20 > 0:20:23She's a real success story, that woman.
0:20:23 > 0:20:26But the lovely thing is that what you love is
0:20:26 > 0:20:29the romanticism of their marriage.
0:20:29 > 0:20:33What I love is the truth. The fact that he admits to it
0:20:33 > 0:20:38and he makes you party to it, while guarding the privacy, as it were.
0:20:38 > 0:20:42He's a very... Whatever else, he's some politician,
0:20:42 > 0:20:45but he is an extraordinary writer.
0:20:45 > 0:20:49Have you listened to this book on CD?
0:20:49 > 0:20:53- He reads them himself, the books. - No, but I certainly shall.
0:20:53 > 0:20:57- Would you like to hear?- I'd love to, yeah. He has a wonderful voice.
0:20:57 > 0:21:00OK, he's now trying to date Michelle.
0:21:00 > 0:21:04"After a firm picnic, she drove me back to my apartment.
0:21:04 > 0:21:08"I offered to buy her an ice cream cone at the Baskin Robbins across the street.
0:21:08 > 0:21:12"We sat on the kerb and ate our cones in the sticky afternoon heat.
0:21:12 > 0:21:15"And I told her about working at Baskin Robbins when I was a teenager.
0:21:15 > 0:21:19"And how it was hard to look cool with a brown apron and cap.
0:21:19 > 0:21:22"She told me that for a span of two or three years as a child,
0:21:22 > 0:21:25"she'd refused to eat anything except peanut butter and jelly.
0:21:25 > 0:21:28"I said that I'd like to meet her family.
0:21:28 > 0:21:31"She said that she would like that.
0:21:31 > 0:21:33"I asked her if I could kiss her.
0:21:33 > 0:21:36"It tasted of chocolate."
0:21:36 > 0:21:39- Oh, wow!- Lovely.- Oh, wow!
0:21:39 > 0:21:43Sarah, you actually spent some time producing audio books like that.
0:21:43 > 0:21:46Yes, I worked in the studio for a couple of years
0:21:46 > 0:21:51and it was like being five years old cos you just got read to every day. It was wonderful.
0:21:51 > 0:21:54And I read a lot of Mills and Boon, which wasn't always good.
0:21:54 > 0:21:56LAUGHTER
0:21:56 > 0:22:00- Yeah.- Does the trick.- Well, yeah, but they look really romantic.
0:22:00 > 0:22:03My favourite title ever was Once Upon A Mattress.
0:22:03 > 0:22:07It sounded like it was going to be really romantic and then just turned into pure filth.
0:22:07 > 0:22:10But, yes, it was a great job. I really enjoyed the job.
0:22:10 > 0:22:13And it's prompted your next choice, which is
0:22:13 > 0:22:15The Weeping Tree by Audrey Reimann.
0:22:15 > 0:22:21It's described as a heart-warming Scottish saga. Is this a deep book?
0:22:21 > 0:22:23Er...
0:22:23 > 0:22:26You're so judgemental, Anne. It's a lovely book.
0:22:26 > 0:22:29We did a lot of pot-boilers in the studio.
0:22:29 > 0:22:33It was your Catherine Cookson, that type of thing. And this was one of them.
0:22:33 > 0:22:36This was the only book, I worked there for two years, and the only
0:22:36 > 0:22:40book that I asked at the end of the recording if I could keep the book
0:22:40 > 0:22:43- because I loved it so much. - The story was...?
0:22:43 > 0:22:46It's just a very simple story of a couple who fall in love
0:22:46 > 0:22:50and consummate their relationship underneath a weeping willow and he goes off to war.
0:22:50 > 0:22:54And the whole story is what happens to her, what happens to him and whether he'll come back.
0:22:54 > 0:22:58And the fact that she's actually given birth to his child while he's away.
0:22:58 > 0:23:03- Are they married?- Er...no. - Oh. They had...- Ooh, judgey!
0:23:03 > 0:23:06LAUGHTER There was a point in the recording
0:23:06 > 0:23:10when the actress couldn't continue because her eyes just welled up.
0:23:10 > 0:23:14We got really quite emotional, the two of us, and we had to stop recording for about half an hour.
0:23:14 > 0:23:18We were both in such a state. I love being sucked in by a book like that.
0:23:18 > 0:23:22Could you read a little without crying? Actually, you could cry if you wanted to.
0:23:22 > 0:23:25- That'd be better for the telly programme for you.- Yeah, yeah.
0:23:25 > 0:23:29Let's see if I can work up some tears for you, pet.
0:23:29 > 0:23:32"The sky above him was cobalt blue now
0:23:32 > 0:23:36"and he saw through his teary, misty eyes the clouds ablaze, copper
0:23:36 > 0:23:40"and bronze and flaming red behind the distant dusky hills of Fife.
0:23:40 > 0:23:43"And as a great lump came into his throat,
0:23:43 > 0:23:45"his feelings turned from humility to desperation.
0:23:45 > 0:23:48"He would not rest until he discovered the truth of what had
0:23:48 > 0:23:52"gone on at Ingerlsey in 1940. He would not rest until he saw
0:23:52 > 0:23:57"and touched his own child who was conceived under the weeping tree."
0:23:57 > 0:24:00"He would not rest..." I'm fine! I'm fine!
0:24:00 > 0:24:03I think it's lovely. It's the same as being made to laugh.
0:24:03 > 0:24:07Anything that... Words that somebody's just put on a bit of paper
0:24:07 > 0:24:10can bring out these emotions. I think it's wonderful.
0:24:10 > 0:24:12OK, we've had childhood books,
0:24:12 > 0:24:15we've had ones you've enjoyed as adults and ones that have
0:24:15 > 0:24:18influenced your life. Let's end with a guilty pleasure.
0:24:18 > 0:24:22This is the airport buy, the beach read. Sarah, what is it for you?
0:24:22 > 0:24:26It's not so much a beach read, it's just something that I read as an adult that
0:24:26 > 0:24:30- I should've read as a child. Judy Blume's Forever. - Yes, it's a teenage book.
0:24:30 > 0:24:33It is a teenage book and it's known as "the rude one".
0:24:33 > 0:24:36I read all of Judy Blume's other books and loved them,
0:24:36 > 0:24:39and then I'd heard about Forever and hadn't read it but my mam had
0:24:39 > 0:24:42heard that it was rude, so she banned me from having it - rightly so.
0:24:42 > 0:24:44So I never got to read it.
0:24:44 > 0:24:49And then I was having a chat with my friend when I was sort of late 20s
0:24:49 > 0:24:53and she hadn't been allowed to read it either, so for our
0:24:53 > 0:24:5730th birthdays, I bought us both a copy of Judy Blume's Forever.
0:24:57 > 0:25:00- It's not really that bad. I was quite disappointed.- What's it about?
0:25:00 > 0:25:04It's just about a young couple, teenagers falling in love.
0:25:04 > 0:25:08- But there are, you know, some rude bits in it.- What kind of rude bits?
0:25:08 > 0:25:10Ooh...
0:25:10 > 0:25:14Er, he does refer to his member as Ralf, which seemed an odd name
0:25:14 > 0:25:17to me, cos Ralf, it certainly doesn't make me all hot and bothered.
0:25:17 > 0:25:19LAUGHTER
0:25:19 > 0:25:22Apologies to any Ralfs in the audience.
0:25:22 > 0:25:27She has the distinction of being a bestselling writer
0:25:27 > 0:25:31and plus being one that's banned in parts of America as well.
0:25:31 > 0:25:34It is a book about birth control as well.
0:25:34 > 0:25:39Yes, I did pick up on those things. It wasn't just cos I didn't read the book.
0:25:39 > 0:25:43It didn't mean I didn't know about any of those things until I was 30.
0:25:43 > 0:25:44Whatever you say, Sarah.
0:25:44 > 0:25:46SHE LAUGHS
0:25:46 > 0:25:49Your guilty pleasure, Larry, is...
0:25:49 > 0:25:54The Times Reference Atlas Of The World.
0:25:54 > 0:25:58- Yeah.- You're such a boy!- That's almost travelable, that thing.
0:25:58 > 0:26:00Mine's enormous! It's like this.
0:26:00 > 0:26:02It weighs about, I don't know, probably 15 pounds.
0:26:02 > 0:26:05Just show us, Larry...
0:26:05 > 0:26:08- You read...- Read from it a bit!
0:26:08 > 0:26:13You just open something, and here we are - we're in Thailand.
0:26:13 > 0:26:16- Yes.- I've never been to Thailand.
0:26:16 > 0:26:19I'm sussing out the shape of Thailand, where it runs
0:26:19 > 0:26:22and how long it goes down towards... And there we are, it borders
0:26:22 > 0:26:25with Malaysia and now we're running down the coast...
0:26:25 > 0:26:29- ANNE LAUGHS - ..of all these wonderful places.
0:26:29 > 0:26:32And whole areas where there are no roads.
0:26:32 > 0:26:34There's a whole section here,
0:26:34 > 0:26:39the whole side of this peninsula that's actually Burma.
0:26:39 > 0:26:42And I thought Burma was basically one big lump.
0:26:42 > 0:26:47And there's a huge long strip of it runs down the side of Thailand.
0:26:47 > 0:26:50- So you haven't got to that page yet? - I...
0:26:50 > 0:26:51SARAH LAUGHS
0:26:51 > 0:26:54This is what it is, it's like...
0:26:54 > 0:26:57I've worked in almost every...
0:26:57 > 0:27:00In every continent. I've worked in every country in Europe,
0:27:00 > 0:27:02I've worked in Asia, America.
0:27:02 > 0:27:05Do you share this guilty pleasure with anyone?
0:27:05 > 0:27:07A lot of people are hooked on maps.
0:27:07 > 0:27:11- Are they?- Yeah. Yeah, a lot of people are hooked on maps.
0:27:11 > 0:27:13What would you say, Sarah, now that
0:27:13 > 0:27:17we've seen your choice of books? What do they say about you?
0:27:17 > 0:27:22I think I'm driven by emotion cos yours read sort of like...
0:27:22 > 0:27:25Almost like a university reading list.
0:27:25 > 0:27:28It's very impressive. Mine are...
0:27:28 > 0:27:31There's self-help and children's books and books that I've cried at.
0:27:31 > 0:27:34I think I am driven incredibly by emotion, so if anything has
0:27:34 > 0:27:38made me cry or made me laugh, that's what's going to stick in my brain.
0:27:38 > 0:27:41What do you think your choice of books says about you, Larry?
0:27:41 > 0:27:44I think you've hit it right on the nail. It's an education.
0:27:44 > 0:27:47What I've read is what's educated me.
0:27:47 > 0:27:51And if you had to choose one book to recommend of the five
0:27:51 > 0:27:55- you've chosen, Sarah, what would yours be?- Um...
0:27:55 > 0:27:58I think it would probably be the self-help book, which
0:27:58 > 0:28:02sounds really cheesy, but I think I really like being inspired.
0:28:02 > 0:28:07And even though I changed my life and now I've got a really nice life,
0:28:07 > 0:28:09I think you can always make it a little bit better.
0:28:09 > 0:28:12Larry? What would you recommend of your choices?
0:28:12 > 0:28:17- I think I would recommend Barack Obama's books...- Yeah.
0:28:17 > 0:28:21..because they are just an indication that there's at least
0:28:21 > 0:28:24one person out there that wants to get everything put right.
0:28:24 > 0:28:28Whether he gets the chance to do it is another kettle of fish.
0:28:28 > 0:28:30Larry Lamb, Sarah Millican,
0:28:30 > 0:28:34thank you for joining me for My Life In Books.
0:28:34 > 0:28:35And just to remind you,
0:28:35 > 0:28:40there's more about the books programme on the website:
0:28:40 > 0:28:44And please join me again tomorrow, same time, same place,
0:28:44 > 0:28:48for more stories of lives and books.
0:28:48 > 0:28:52APPLAUSE
0:28:52 > 0:28:55Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd