0:00:19 > 0:00:22Hello and welcome to My Life In Books,
0:00:22 > 0:00:25a chance for guests to chat about their favourite books
0:00:25 > 0:00:26and what they mean to them.
0:00:26 > 0:00:30Joining me tonight is Robert Peston, the BBC's business editor,
0:00:30 > 0:00:33famous for his hard-hitting journalism,
0:00:33 > 0:00:37also, and this has me very overexcited, he's actually been voted
0:00:37 > 0:00:40one of the 20 sexiest brains in Britain.
0:00:40 > 0:00:45I'm hoping he'll be able to explain what a sexy brain looks like.
0:00:45 > 0:00:50Alongside him, Sharon Gless, a long-time heroine to so many of us
0:00:50 > 0:00:55since her days as the tough, hard-drinking cop Cagney.
0:00:55 > 0:00:59She's just finished a West End run in A Round-Heeled Woman.
0:00:59 > 0:01:04A woman who sets out to have as many sexual adventures as possible within a year.
0:01:04 > 0:01:07And hopefully, that's already exciting Robert, is it?
0:01:07 > 0:01:09- It certainly is.- Welcome to you both.
0:01:14 > 0:01:16I'm just going to remind you that this series is,
0:01:16 > 0:01:20of course, part of the BBC's Celebration World Book Day.
0:01:20 > 0:01:24Robert, I'm going to start with your first choice of book,
0:01:24 > 0:01:27which is incredibly traditional.
0:01:27 > 0:01:28Winnie-the-Pooh.
0:01:28 > 0:01:32You were brought up in North London in a bookish household?
0:01:32 > 0:01:33There were books everywhere.
0:01:33 > 0:01:36My dad was an economics professor
0:01:36 > 0:01:44and you couldn't move in any of the rooms of the house without sort of falling over books.
0:01:44 > 0:01:46I just have an extraordinary,
0:01:46 > 0:01:48powerful memory of reading Winnie-the-Pooh
0:01:48 > 0:01:53as a very young... I must've been four or five,
0:01:53 > 0:01:55something like that,
0:01:55 > 0:01:58and just finding it incredibly funny,
0:01:58 > 0:02:02but also very comforting.
0:02:02 > 0:02:05Was it your father or mother who was reading it to you?
0:02:05 > 0:02:07I've spoken to them about this.
0:02:07 > 0:02:11They don't remember reading it to me, but they must have done, because
0:02:11 > 0:02:16when I think of my childhood, I do think of Winnie-the-Pooh.
0:02:16 > 0:02:21It just, for me, captures the great puzzlement that all young children have.
0:02:21 > 0:02:26I remember reading Winnie-the-Pooh to my boy, Maximilian,
0:02:26 > 0:02:33who's now almost 15, but going on 35, he's so sophisticated these days.
0:02:34 > 0:02:37Again, I'm afraid, it probably gave me more pleasure
0:02:37 > 0:02:40reading it to him than he got.
0:02:40 > 0:02:45He preferred Spiderman, I'm afraid, when he was even two or three.
0:02:45 > 0:02:49But it is just one of those books.
0:02:49 > 0:02:53Almost all the books I really love transport you into another world.
0:02:53 > 0:02:55Shall we listen to it? This is an interesting recording,
0:02:55 > 0:02:58because it's actually A A Milne reading it.
0:02:58 > 0:03:02'One fine winter's day, when Piglet was brushing away the snow in front of his house,
0:03:02 > 0:03:06'he happened to look up, and there was Winnie-the-Pooh.
0:03:06 > 0:03:09'Pooh was walking round and round in a circle,
0:03:09 > 0:03:11'thinking of something else.
0:03:11 > 0:03:15'And when Piglet called to him, he just went on walking.
0:03:15 > 0:03:18'"Hello," said Piglet, "what are you doing?"
0:03:18 > 0:03:20'"Hunting," said Pooh.
0:03:20 > 0:03:23'"Hunting what?" "Tracking something," said Pooh.
0:03:24 > 0:03:27'"Tracking what?" said Piglet, coming closer.
0:03:27 > 0:03:31'"That's just what I ask myself, I ask myself, what?"
0:03:32 > 0:03:36Sharon, that's no great actor reading that,
0:03:36 > 0:03:38it's very much a dad reading it.
0:03:38 > 0:03:41I think it's fabulous to hear the actual author.
0:03:41 > 0:03:44I'm so amused watching you when you're describing it,
0:03:44 > 0:03:45you become like a child.
0:03:45 > 0:03:48No, it's wonderful to see your excitement.
0:03:48 > 0:03:53- But it is the great thing about all brilliant children's literature...- Right.
0:03:53 > 0:03:55..it does transport you back.
0:03:55 > 0:03:59- You always described your upbringing as culturally Jewish.- Yeah.
0:03:59 > 0:04:03- And yours, conversely, was very much a Catholic upbringing, wasn't it? - Very.
0:04:03 > 0:04:07- But a very affluent one too.- Yes, we lived in my grandparents' home.
0:04:07 > 0:04:12In Hancock Park, which, in LA, is huge, huge houses.
0:04:12 > 0:04:15- Posh, I guess is the word they use now.- An in-and-out drive.
0:04:15 > 0:04:19Right, yes, and very Catholic.
0:04:19 > 0:04:22- We've actually got a picture of little Sharon.- We do?- We do.
0:04:22 > 0:04:26- Looking very...- Oh, my God!
0:04:26 > 0:04:30You look like Shirley Temple, or did everyone look like Shirley Temple?
0:04:30 > 0:04:33We probably all did at that age, but Shirley had a lot more curls.
0:04:33 > 0:04:34Were there books in the house?
0:04:34 > 0:04:36I'm embarrassed to say,
0:04:36 > 0:04:38I believe there were books in the house...
0:04:38 > 0:04:42This is out of Auntie Mame, the line I'm about to say,
0:04:42 > 0:04:45'Books are so decorative, I think.'
0:04:48 > 0:04:53I'm ashamed to say, I don't think I came from a big reading family.
0:04:53 > 0:04:58I mean, I had my books, but I don't remember...
0:04:58 > 0:05:00Certainly not your background.
0:05:00 > 0:05:04But, in fact, your grandfather was also in show business,
0:05:04 > 0:05:07but at the other end of show business.
0:05:07 > 0:05:10He was a very big lawyer.
0:05:10 > 0:05:12He was Howard Hughes and Cecil B DeMille's
0:05:12 > 0:05:15and Louis B Meyer's lawyer, and Cary Grant's.
0:05:15 > 0:05:18And your first book is The Little Engine That Could, by Watty Piper.
0:05:18 > 0:05:21I remember this book very, very, very well.
0:05:21 > 0:05:25It's not complicated, but it's a very, very encouraging,
0:05:25 > 0:05:28inspiring book for a child.
0:05:28 > 0:05:31It's about this toy, this train, that carried toys and food
0:05:31 > 0:05:34for children in a village,
0:05:34 > 0:05:39and the little red engine that was pulling it died.
0:05:39 > 0:05:42And they kept stopping all these big fancy engines saying,
0:05:42 > 0:05:44"Please help us, please help us."
0:05:44 > 0:05:47They were turned down because it was a little toy train and nobody cared.
0:05:47 > 0:05:51Finally, this little blue engine comes along
0:05:51 > 0:05:56and is asked, "Can you help us?"
0:05:56 > 0:06:00This engine said, "I don't know, I'm too small.
0:06:00 > 0:06:04"I don't think I'm going to be able to do it." But she hooks herself onto it
0:06:04 > 0:06:07and as she's going up the hill, pulling all these children's toys,
0:06:07 > 0:06:10she keeps saying, "I think I can, I think I can,
0:06:10 > 0:06:14"I think I can, I think I can, I think I can, I think I can, I think I can."
0:06:14 > 0:06:16The sound of a train.
0:06:16 > 0:06:20It was her determination to get over that hill
0:06:20 > 0:06:23with those toys for the children.
0:06:23 > 0:06:27Everybody was celebrating and it was exciting
0:06:27 > 0:06:31because she did it, and then as she's driving away, all by herself,
0:06:31 > 0:06:32she says, "I thought I could,
0:06:32 > 0:06:35"I thought I could, I thought I could, I thought I could."
0:06:36 > 0:06:40And I always remember that ability,
0:06:40 > 0:06:45that it is possible to do anything, if you believe.
0:06:46 > 0:06:51You were very much I think I can, weren't you, Robert?
0:06:51 > 0:06:53I think I'm sort of classic eldest boy.
0:06:53 > 0:06:56I was sort of left to get on with things
0:06:56 > 0:07:00and I decided, at far too early an age,
0:07:00 > 0:07:02that I knew everything.
0:07:02 > 0:07:04I went to the local comprehensive school,
0:07:04 > 0:07:07my parents were great believers in comprehensives.
0:07:07 > 0:07:09My family were Jewish,
0:07:09 > 0:07:16came over in that late 19th-century, early 20th century way from Eastern Europe.
0:07:16 > 0:07:20My dad, for example, grew up the East End, relatively humble circumstances,
0:07:20 > 0:07:23but at the time when you had this extraordinary social mobility,
0:07:23 > 0:07:28went to the London School Of Economics, went to Princeton, became a professor.
0:07:28 > 0:07:35We were sort of rising rapidly through Britain's class structure.
0:07:35 > 0:07:39I suppose my parents' generation, or rather grandparents' generation,
0:07:39 > 0:07:41would, I suppose, have been described as working-class,
0:07:41 > 0:07:46but by the time I'm growing up in the '60s, we are very middle-class,
0:07:46 > 0:07:49but my parents were very committed to comprehensives and state schools,
0:07:49 > 0:07:54go to the local comprehensive, and had a wonderful time.
0:07:54 > 0:07:58Because, in fact, Robert, it was at a time when the subject for the Labour Party
0:07:58 > 0:08:04was a very fierce battle about educating your children in the state system.
0:08:04 > 0:08:08Your father is now in the House of Lords, a Labour peer.
0:08:08 > 0:08:10He was a passionate believer in comprehensives.
0:08:10 > 0:08:12My parents ran something called The Campaign For Comprehensive Education.
0:08:12 > 0:08:17I have to say, I remain a passionate believer in comprehensive education,
0:08:17 > 0:08:21because it was the one, you know, it got me into Oxford.
0:08:21 > 0:08:25So it did nothing but good for me educationally, but also it is the one bit of your life,
0:08:25 > 0:08:28at school, where you can mix with a great variety of different people,
0:08:28 > 0:08:31from different backgrounds, if you go to a comprehensive.
0:08:31 > 0:08:35But, of course, Sharon, yours was completely different, because you went off to boarding school.
0:08:35 > 0:08:38I went to a Catholic school when I was little.
0:08:38 > 0:08:41Then I went to my mother's all-girls' school for two years,
0:08:41 > 0:08:44and before they asked me to leave, I was shipped off to a boarding school.
0:08:44 > 0:08:48But I thought I had a good education.
0:08:48 > 0:08:51I went on to a Jesuit University, out of which I was thrown,
0:08:51 > 0:08:55but my English is impeccable.
0:08:55 > 0:08:57You notice I didn't end the sentence with a preposition?
0:08:57 > 0:09:04Yes, so I think the world of academia escaped me.
0:09:04 > 0:09:06What were you doing that people didn't like,
0:09:06 > 0:09:09that it threw you out of school so often?
0:09:09 > 0:09:11I just used to sign out to somebody's house,
0:09:11 > 0:09:14then we'd just go to a motel and stay and play.
0:09:14 > 0:09:17Nobody was screwing around in those days.
0:09:17 > 0:09:21You saved yourself for your husband, it was that era.
0:09:21 > 0:09:24But a lot of the guys in the graduate school would come
0:09:24 > 0:09:27and they would bring kegs of beer and we would just party all night.
0:09:27 > 0:09:29So when I got back to school that Sunday,
0:09:29 > 0:09:33I was asked to come back next September and take my finals.
0:09:33 > 0:09:37My grandmother said, "I might as well have thrown that money down the toilet."
0:09:37 > 0:09:38And my education stopped there.
0:09:38 > 0:09:41Were you a good boy at school?
0:09:41 > 0:09:45Well, I was good, I suppose, in the sense that I did my homework.
0:09:47 > 0:09:52I mean, it was a fairly free and easy time, the '70s,
0:09:52 > 0:09:54which is when I was a teenager.
0:09:54 > 0:09:57In those days, for example,
0:09:57 > 0:10:00we went to the pub ludicrously young.
0:10:00 > 0:10:02Your voice hadn't really broken and you would say,
0:10:02 > 0:10:04"Two pints of bitter, please."
0:10:04 > 0:10:06He would say, "Are you 18?" I'd say, "Yes."
0:10:06 > 0:10:11Robert, your second choice of book is quite an interesting one.
0:10:11 > 0:10:13- Bel-Ami.- Bel-Ami, yes.
0:10:13 > 0:10:14This is the actual battered copy
0:10:14 > 0:10:16that I read when I was about 17.
0:10:16 > 0:10:18I love that.
0:10:18 > 0:10:19It's a book by Guy de Maupassant,
0:10:19 > 0:10:25a great French writer. It's about a decommissioned soldier,
0:10:25 > 0:10:29in late 19th-century Paris, who's down on his luck
0:10:29 > 0:10:35and he bumps into an old army pal who works for a newspaper.
0:10:35 > 0:10:40Broadly, it's a story about how Bel-Ami, who's this very glamorous,
0:10:40 > 0:10:45handsome young man, sleeps his way to the top of French society.
0:10:45 > 0:10:49It's all about the corruption of politics, the corruption of the media,
0:10:49 > 0:10:56and I remember at the time thinking it was extraordinarily glamorous.
0:10:56 > 0:11:00And it may, for all I know, have contributed to my decision to become a journalist
0:11:00 > 0:11:02in some sort of subconscious way.
0:11:02 > 0:11:04Having re-read it,
0:11:04 > 0:11:08I now cannot believe how much I sort of loved... It's a brilliant book,
0:11:08 > 0:11:12I would certainly recommend it, it's a fantastic read,
0:11:12 > 0:11:19but this chap, Bel-Ami, Monsieur Duroy, barely has a redeeming feature at all.
0:11:19 > 0:11:23I mean, you know, he's sort of cynical, he exploits all these rich women.
0:11:23 > 0:11:26He gets involved in insider trading,
0:11:26 > 0:11:29he helps dodgy politicians,
0:11:29 > 0:11:34very much like journalists today, of course.
0:11:34 > 0:11:39It is, I say, I think, in a way, quite a sort of modern book
0:11:39 > 0:11:42because lots of the themes of the book do seem still relevant today,
0:11:42 > 0:11:46but almost every character in it is appalling.
0:11:46 > 0:11:52It's funny that I didn't sort of notice that at the time!
0:11:52 > 0:11:58Also, Robert, that you didn't go into journalism as a first choice of career,
0:11:58 > 0:12:01so it must have been unconscious.
0:12:01 > 0:12:07I think it was. I was one of those people who really didn't know what they wanted to do in life.
0:12:07 > 0:12:13I was a slightly strange teenager because I did know I wanted to go to Oxford.
0:12:13 > 0:12:17Not only did I know I wanted to go to Oxford, I was absolutely clear, from the age of 13 or so,
0:12:17 > 0:12:18that I wanted to go to Balliol.
0:12:18 > 0:12:21I think the reason for that was because I loved history
0:12:21 > 0:12:24and the master of Balliol was Christopher Hill, who was a great historian.
0:12:24 > 0:12:27And I achieved that ambition, but having achieved that particular ambition,
0:12:27 > 0:12:30I sort of got there and thought, well, that's all very nice,
0:12:30 > 0:12:33but what next? I haven't the faintest idea.
0:12:33 > 0:12:36I tried a few things. I actually worked in the City for a bit,
0:12:36 > 0:12:38which turned out to be quite useful because I did find out,
0:12:38 > 0:12:41when working in the City, there are quite a lot of crooks there,
0:12:41 > 0:12:44which, as a journalist, that was quite a useful lesson.
0:12:44 > 0:12:47But I didn't really enjoy the City terribly much.
0:12:47 > 0:12:51I was lucky enough to have a mate on a magazine who said there were jobs going.
0:12:51 > 0:12:56I managed to bluff my way into that job by pretending I knew something about finance,
0:12:56 > 0:13:01and miraculously discovered that journalism is absolutely a vocation.
0:13:01 > 0:13:06I mean, I now cannot think of doing anything else because I'm so passionate about it.
0:13:06 > 0:13:08But it was trial and error that got me into it.
0:13:08 > 0:13:12Meanwhile, Sharon, you were determined to be an actress.
0:13:12 > 0:13:15There was a boy in my class, Billy Chapin was his name,
0:13:15 > 0:13:16and he was a child star.
0:13:16 > 0:13:20I went to the movies one day, I was in the second grade,
0:13:20 > 0:13:22and I saw Billy on the screen.
0:13:22 > 0:13:26I was so excited seeing somebody I knew up on the screen
0:13:26 > 0:13:30and how much fun I had watching it that I thought, it's possible,
0:13:30 > 0:13:35if you know somebody who did it and they got away with it.
0:13:35 > 0:13:38Billy goes to school with me and he's just a normal person.
0:13:38 > 0:13:42I thought, "That's not so scary. I want to do that."
0:13:42 > 0:13:46My grandfather did say, "It's a filthy business, stay out of it."
0:13:46 > 0:13:47I was too polite to say,
0:13:47 > 0:13:50"But, Grandpa, that's how you made all your money."
0:13:50 > 0:13:51So I just...
0:13:51 > 0:13:55But it wasn't until I was 26 years old, it was very old,
0:13:55 > 0:13:58especially for a woman to start in my business,
0:13:58 > 0:14:03and by 27, I was under contract to the biggest studio in the world, Universal Studios.
0:14:03 > 0:14:06- For the next decade. - For the next ten years.
0:14:06 > 0:14:10And after ten years, I was the last contract player in the history of Hollywood.
0:14:10 > 0:14:12I was the last one to walk off the lot.
0:14:12 > 0:14:15And I walked into Cagney and Lacey.
0:14:15 > 0:14:17When you were offered Cagney and Lacey...
0:14:17 > 0:14:18Because it was groundbreaking,
0:14:18 > 0:14:21- it was the start of the '80s... - Right.
0:14:21 > 0:14:24- ..and you were a hard-drinking, tough cop.- Yes, I was.
0:14:24 > 0:14:27Did it seem unusual, when you were reading the script?
0:14:27 > 0:14:33Well, I was very taken with it because it was about two women,
0:14:33 > 0:14:37but I don't think I had a clue what that show was going to become.
0:14:39 > 0:14:43But I was taken with Cagney because she was quite flawed,
0:14:43 > 0:14:47and they didn't usually have heroes -
0:14:47 > 0:14:49I use the term loosely -
0:14:49 > 0:14:53heroes of series that are flawed like she was.
0:14:53 > 0:14:56She had a terrible attitude, terribly ambitious,
0:14:56 > 0:14:58and I thought she was funny.
0:14:58 > 0:15:01But you did turn it down twice, didn't you?
0:15:01 > 0:15:04Yes, I had just done a pilot at Universal
0:15:04 > 0:15:08where I did play a cop, with a male partner, and it didn't sell,
0:15:08 > 0:15:12but my manager talked me into it and I went and met with the producer,
0:15:12 > 0:15:14had a meeting with six people.
0:15:14 > 0:15:17When I came out, she said, "What do you think?"
0:15:17 > 0:15:19I said, "I don't want to do it." She said, "Why not?"
0:15:19 > 0:15:21I said, "I don't like the guy with the beard."
0:15:21 > 0:15:25That was Barney Rosenzweig, whom I married ten years later.
0:15:26 > 0:15:32And it is very significant, the importance, because your next book is indeed
0:15:32 > 0:15:34titled Cagney And Lacey...And Me.
0:15:36 > 0:15:37- And me.- And the "me" is Barney.
0:15:37 > 0:15:39Barney. He created the show.
0:15:39 > 0:15:44It tells... It took him seven years carrying that script,
0:15:44 > 0:15:48like a cliche, carried the script for seven years, could not sell it.
0:15:48 > 0:15:52The networks were run by men. Finally, he did.
0:15:52 > 0:15:55He's the first feminist I ever met, Barney,
0:15:55 > 0:15:58which is difficult sometimes because he says things like,
0:15:58 > 0:16:00"You wanted equality, open your own door."
0:16:00 > 0:16:02Uniquely to this series,
0:16:02 > 0:16:04you've chosen a book you haven't read there.
0:16:04 > 0:16:07Oh, I do have to admit to that,
0:16:07 > 0:16:10but it's gotten amazing reviews.
0:16:10 > 0:16:14- Why haven't you read it? - And lots of nice things on the back.
0:16:14 > 0:16:17I deliberately have not read this book
0:16:17 > 0:16:21because I want to stay married to him.
0:16:21 > 0:16:24And I understand he tells all.
0:16:24 > 0:16:28In his experience. He said, "It's my story, it's my memory."
0:16:28 > 0:16:29Well, that's a very loyal wife.
0:16:29 > 0:16:32Well, I just don't want
0:16:32 > 0:16:37- any trouble.- That's true of all of us, isn't it?- Yeah.
0:16:37 > 0:16:39We've got a very loyal husband here.
0:16:39 > 0:16:40Well, I...
0:16:40 > 0:16:43Your next choice of book.
0:16:43 > 0:16:46I'm more a fan, I think, than loyal, aren't I?
0:16:46 > 0:16:49This is a book by my wife, Sian Busby.
0:16:49 > 0:16:51It is an incredibly,
0:16:51 > 0:16:54I think, impressive novel,
0:16:54 > 0:16:56set in the 19th century
0:16:56 > 0:16:58and written in a style of a 19th-century book.
0:16:58 > 0:17:01And funnily enough, in some ways, it's got things in common with Bel-Ami,
0:17:01 > 0:17:03because it's all about political intrigue.
0:17:03 > 0:17:07It's about the assassination of the Prime Minister's private secretary,
0:17:07 > 0:17:09a chap called Drummond.
0:17:09 > 0:17:12This is Peel's private secretary.
0:17:12 > 0:17:14And there was. It's a real story, the basis of the...
0:17:14 > 0:17:18Let's tell everybody, it's called McNaughton, who is the crazy assassin.
0:17:18 > 0:17:20Who is the allegedly crazy assassin.
0:17:20 > 0:17:23And my wife is
0:17:23 > 0:17:25desperately interested in madness -
0:17:25 > 0:17:27maybe that's why she married me -
0:17:27 > 0:17:30and all her books are about madness in different ways.
0:17:30 > 0:17:36The M'Naghten rules are actually the rules that are still used in courts today
0:17:36 > 0:17:42to decide whether somebody is of diminished responsibility when they commit a crime.
0:17:42 > 0:17:46The M'Naghten rules stem from this incident,
0:17:46 > 0:17:49this attempted assassination.
0:17:49 > 0:17:52The chap did die, there is an issue about whether or not
0:17:52 > 0:17:56he was killed by his doctors or by the man who pulled the trigger.
0:17:56 > 0:18:00But the main thing about it is it just creates, again,
0:18:00 > 0:18:04you might have noticed all my books allow one to escape,
0:18:04 > 0:18:10and it just creates an entire believable world in which you can completely immerse yourself.
0:18:10 > 0:18:14But again, very modern themes, Britain in 1842 to '43,
0:18:14 > 0:18:16in the grips of terrible economic conditions.
0:18:16 > 0:18:21People are starving, there are lots of protesters out there.
0:18:21 > 0:18:26A sort of slightly more extreme version of the St Paul's encampment,
0:18:26 > 0:18:28for example, the anti-banker encampment.
0:18:28 > 0:18:35So it feels, again, in some ways, very resonant and very modern.
0:18:35 > 0:18:38So although I will be accused, I'm sure, of nepotism in choosing it,
0:18:38 > 0:18:42I have no shame about it because it is an absolutely outstanding book.
0:18:42 > 0:18:47What's lovely about your wife is she's so loyal to you in interviews.
0:18:47 > 0:18:52She talks about not everyone being drawn to your presenting style.
0:18:54 > 0:18:58My presenting style has been described in lots of unflattering ways by lots of people.
0:18:58 > 0:19:03But it is that thing of a newspaper journalist transferring to television.
0:19:03 > 0:19:06Some very great newspaper journalists failed to make the transfer
0:19:06 > 0:19:09simply because they can't do television,
0:19:09 > 0:19:13but we're just going to embarrass you one bit more, because it's such fun.
0:19:13 > 0:19:16This is one of your very early attempts at television.
0:19:16 > 0:19:20Marks & Spencer's rivals are telling me
0:19:20 > 0:19:21that the real problem on the High Street at the moment...
0:19:21 > 0:19:23- < Stand still, start again. - Sorry.
0:19:23 > 0:19:25Sorry.
0:19:25 > 0:19:27The bosses of M&S's rivals tell me that... Oh, sorry.
0:19:27 > 0:19:31Phew... Did I ever say to you I thought it was going to be easy?
0:19:31 > 0:19:33APPLAUSE
0:19:36 > 0:19:41Actually, I should tell you, that was my audition tape and they still gave me the job.
0:19:41 > 0:19:45It's extraordinary, isn't it? Heads should roll at the BBC.
0:19:45 > 0:19:47It takes time, doesn't it, Sharon, to perfect?
0:19:47 > 0:19:50Yes, I've been doing it for 40 years now.
0:19:50 > 0:19:54I used to be taken into a big screening room alone with a projectionist
0:19:54 > 0:19:56and the Head of Talent, and she would look at things.
0:19:56 > 0:20:00"See that look on your face?" "Yes." "Don't do that again."
0:20:01 > 0:20:05Your third choice is wonderful, actually.
0:20:05 > 0:20:10It's a book of poetry, and one particular poem by Edna St Vincent Millay.
0:20:10 > 0:20:15- Yes.- An American poet from the turn-of-the-century.
0:20:15 > 0:20:17How did you come across this?
0:20:17 > 0:20:21Well, again, Barney, my husband,
0:20:21 > 0:20:25is very romantic and he gave me,
0:20:25 > 0:20:28when we were first dating,
0:20:28 > 0:20:33he gave me Edna St Vincent Millay's Book Of Poetry first edition.
0:20:34 > 0:20:40Very, very beautiful copy, which he then destroyed by signing it to me.
0:20:40 > 0:20:42You're not supposed to touch a first edition,
0:20:42 > 0:20:44but it will always be with me and my family.
0:20:44 > 0:20:48There was a favourite poem that he used to read to me that I loved.
0:20:48 > 0:20:50It's called Love Is Not All.
0:20:51 > 0:20:52"Love is not all
0:20:52 > 0:20:55"It is not meat nor drink
0:20:55 > 0:20:56"Nor slumber
0:20:56 > 0:20:59"Nor a roof against the rain
0:20:59 > 0:21:02"Nor yet a floating spar to men that sink
0:21:02 > 0:21:05"And rise and sink and rise and sink again
0:21:06 > 0:21:10"Love cannot fill the thickened lung with breath
0:21:10 > 0:21:12"Nor clean the blood
0:21:12 > 0:21:14"Nor set the fractured bone
0:21:14 > 0:21:17"Yet many a man is making friends with death
0:21:17 > 0:21:19"Even as I speak
0:21:19 > 0:21:20"For lack of love alone
0:21:22 > 0:21:25"It well may be that in a difficult hour
0:21:25 > 0:21:28"Pinned down by pain and moaning for release
0:21:28 > 0:21:32"Or nagged by want past resolution's power
0:21:32 > 0:21:36"I may be driven to sell your love for peace
0:21:36 > 0:21:40"Or trade the memory of this night for food
0:21:40 > 0:21:44"It well may be. I do not think I would."
0:21:44 > 0:21:46- That was lovely. - APPLAUSE
0:21:53 > 0:21:56She was quite ahead of her time, rather like Cagney, wasn't she?
0:21:57 > 0:22:01Cagney should write this well!
0:22:01 > 0:22:05Yes, she was a feminist...
0:22:06 > 0:22:10..politically very controversial,
0:22:10 > 0:22:14and just was an amazing writer.
0:22:14 > 0:22:18I don't know if she even became famous in her time.
0:22:18 > 0:22:21- Do you know?- Well, I confess to not having known about her.
0:22:21 > 0:22:23- What about you, Robert? - She's American.
0:22:23 > 0:22:28I've only read it in the last few days because I knew that Sharon was going to choose her.
0:22:28 > 0:22:31I have to say...wonderful.
0:22:31 > 0:22:33I've read a whole load over the last couple of days
0:22:33 > 0:22:36and she's the most wonderful poet.
0:22:36 > 0:22:38I think she is.
0:22:38 > 0:22:43Poetry, I'm not always drawn to, I'd rather read a story,
0:22:43 > 0:22:47but I do get caught up in her poems.
0:22:47 > 0:22:51Some don't sing to me as well as others.
0:22:51 > 0:22:55This one, I think, will be my favourite for all time.
0:22:55 > 0:23:00In complete contrast, you go back to being a real boy with your final choice.
0:23:00 > 0:23:06Yes, you thought this was one of my choices from childhood, but it's not.
0:23:06 > 0:23:07This is John Buchan.
0:23:07 > 0:23:13It is hilariously gripping, adventurous stuff.
0:23:13 > 0:23:17In some ways, I should probably hate it.
0:23:17 > 0:23:21I have mentioned, you know, Jewish background,
0:23:21 > 0:23:24there's lots of casual anti-Semitism in John Buchan.
0:23:24 > 0:23:27It's a different sort of anti-Semitism though.
0:23:27 > 0:23:32Oh, yes, it's not sort of nasty, political, you know, round up the Jews ghastliness,
0:23:32 > 0:23:35it's just people...
0:23:35 > 0:23:38Actually, the same is true of the Maupassant,
0:23:38 > 0:23:40you know, you can say
0:23:40 > 0:23:43the Jew somebody or other in a sort of descriptive way.
0:23:43 > 0:23:44In a way that these days,
0:23:44 > 0:23:47we would find completely shocking.
0:23:47 > 0:23:51So long as you know that's how people thought at the time, you just screen that out
0:23:51 > 0:23:54and you get involved in the story,
0:23:54 > 0:23:57and the story is terrific.
0:23:57 > 0:23:58Britain's at war with Germany.
0:23:58 > 0:24:02They've got a scrap of intelligence
0:24:02 > 0:24:06that the Germans are somehow uniting various Islamic peoples
0:24:06 > 0:24:12and the Islamic peoples are then going to launch this Jihad against England and France.
0:24:12 > 0:24:15There's no way, obviously, we would win in those circumstances.
0:24:15 > 0:24:20Richard Hannay is sent off to defuse this threat and, of course,
0:24:20 > 0:24:23he chooses the second son of a baron,
0:24:23 > 0:24:30Sandy Arbuthnot, his great army buddy from Eton and New College.
0:24:30 > 0:24:33Sandy has this capacity
0:24:33 > 0:24:39to take on the identity of all sorts of exotic characters.
0:24:39 > 0:24:43At one point, he turns up as the leader of a gang of whirling dervishes.
0:24:43 > 0:24:47And, of course, all the whirling dervishes believe he's a whirling dervish.
0:24:47 > 0:24:52But if you like easy, adventurous reading
0:24:52 > 0:24:56and you can get over - which I easily can, obviously -
0:24:56 > 0:24:58the sort of attitudes of the time, it's fantastic stuff.
0:24:58 > 0:25:02And it's written beautifully, he's a beautiful writer.
0:25:02 > 0:25:04The thing which amazed me is that it's never been made into a film,
0:25:04 > 0:25:06because it would make the most amazing film.
0:25:06 > 0:25:08Sharon, your final choice?
0:25:08 > 0:25:10Well, my final choice is
0:25:10 > 0:25:14a book called A Round-Heeled Woman.
0:25:14 > 0:25:17I fell in love with this ten years ago.
0:25:17 > 0:25:18I purchased the option
0:25:18 > 0:25:20to perform in it,
0:25:20 > 0:25:23and it's this play that I just finished in the West End.
0:25:23 > 0:25:25It's written by a woman named Jane Juska.
0:25:25 > 0:25:30A woman of round heels is a woman who is sexually promiscuous.
0:25:30 > 0:25:32In America, it's used,
0:25:32 > 0:25:37"Her heels are so round, all you have to do is touch her and she's on her back."
0:25:37 > 0:25:40But apparently, the original round-heeled woman expression
0:25:40 > 0:25:43came from Victorian England,
0:25:43 > 0:25:47when the prostitutes would walk the cobbled streets
0:25:47 > 0:25:50and their heels would get worn down,
0:25:50 > 0:25:53and they became called round-heeled women.
0:25:53 > 0:25:57Jane Juska, who wrote this book, chose to call herself that.
0:25:58 > 0:26:01And let me read the ad that she took out. She's a real...
0:26:01 > 0:26:04she teaches English to English teachers in Berkeley.
0:26:04 > 0:26:07"Before I turn 67, next March,
0:26:07 > 0:26:12"I would like to have a lot of sex with a man I like.
0:26:12 > 0:26:16"If you want to talk first, Trollope works for me.'
0:26:18 > 0:26:22In America, where this was printed, she had 63 responses
0:26:22 > 0:26:26and a couple of them misunderstood the word Trollope,
0:26:26 > 0:26:28which is amusing, we do that in our play.
0:26:28 > 0:26:30But it is the most courageous book.
0:26:30 > 0:26:34It's very, very funny, very true, very sad,
0:26:34 > 0:26:36a touch naive,
0:26:36 > 0:26:38but she's a beautiful, beautiful writer.
0:26:38 > 0:26:42Could we have a little extract from it, please, Sharon?
0:26:42 > 0:26:44This is towards the end.
0:26:44 > 0:26:48"She said, I'm not tired, hardly at all,
0:26:48 > 0:26:51"so I take pleasure in the memory of lying next to a man
0:26:51 > 0:26:53"who knew what to do with me.
0:26:53 > 0:26:55"I recall with equal pleasure
0:26:55 > 0:26:57"the conversations with intelligent men who were lively
0:26:57 > 0:27:01"and curious and thoughtful and who liked to talk with me.
0:27:01 > 0:27:03"That was a surprise.
0:27:03 > 0:27:07"I never thought we would actually, as my ad offered, talk first,
0:27:07 > 0:27:12"but we did, first and last and sometimes in the middle.
0:27:12 > 0:27:16"All my parts have been fed by these men, they have made me a rich woman,
0:27:16 > 0:27:19"but rich doesn't mean full,
0:27:19 > 0:27:23"and rich as I am, I am not full.
0:27:23 > 0:27:27"The thing is, once you have a lot of sex with a man you like,
0:27:27 > 0:27:29"how do you stop wanting him?"
0:27:29 > 0:27:31Very good.
0:27:31 > 0:27:34APPLAUSE
0:27:35 > 0:27:39Jane Juska is now 78 and still going strong.
0:27:39 > 0:27:41Winky, winky!
0:27:42 > 0:27:46She has a libido the likes of which I hope to have in my next life.
0:27:50 > 0:27:52On that note, I want to thank you both very much,
0:27:52 > 0:27:55Sharon Gless and Robert Peston.
0:27:55 > 0:27:57APPLAUSE
0:28:03 > 0:28:07To remind you, details for this series are on the BBC website.
0:28:12 > 0:28:14There is also more there about
0:28:14 > 0:28:16my guests and their book choices,
0:28:16 > 0:28:18and you can even hear them
0:28:18 > 0:28:19read a passage from
0:28:19 > 0:28:21their favourite children's book.
0:28:21 > 0:28:23Meanwhile, please join me again tomorrow night. Good night.
0:28:40 > 0:28:44Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd