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0:00:12 > 0:00:15- This white strip - where land meets sea...
0:00:16 > 0:00:21- ..is littered with remarkable - names, tales and characters.
0:00:23 > 0:00:25- This is the Llyn coastline.
0:00:34 > 0:00:37- In this programme, we travel east...
0:00:37 > 0:00:41- ..from the village of Llanbedrog, - passing Pwllheli...
0:00:42 > 0:00:43- ..and on to Criccieth.
0:00:49 > 0:00:52- "An expanse of land - stretching to the horizon."
0:00:52 > 0:00:56- That's John and Alun's description - of this peninsula...
0:00:57 > 0:01:00- ..with its many - different characteristics.
0:01:00 > 0:01:05- Its landscape and history - can often surprise you.
0:01:10 > 0:01:13- Travelling towards Llanbedrog...
0:01:13 > 0:01:16- ..the most notable feature - is Tir y Cwmwd headland...
0:01:17 > 0:01:19- ..and the quarry remains - of Tan y Mynydd...
0:01:19 > 0:01:21- ..Gwaith Canol and Gwaith Trwyn.
0:01:22 > 0:01:25- Nestled in the headland - is Plas Glyn-y-Weddw.
0:01:26 > 0:01:28- Today, it's an art gallery.
0:01:28 > 0:01:30- It represents the roots...
0:01:30 > 0:01:34- ..of a comparatively - modern industry locally.
0:01:36 > 0:01:39- Iwan Hughes spent many years - lobster fishing.
0:01:40 > 0:01:42- He now works in Glyn-y-Weddw.
0:01:49 > 0:01:54- I've travelled a long way - along the peninsula.
0:01:54 > 0:02:00- It's mostly farmland but quarries - are dotted along the way.
0:02:00 > 0:02:05- The remains of the granite - quarries are found on Tir y Cwmwd.
0:02:05 > 0:02:08- There's been a lot of work - in this area.
0:02:08 > 0:02:13- I would say that over a hundred - people would have worked there.
0:02:13 > 0:02:19- Llanbedrog grew considerably in - the second half of the 19th century.
0:02:19 > 0:02:22- The quarries have now closed down.
0:02:22 > 0:02:25- Tourism is a far more important - industry now.
0:02:25 > 0:02:29- The history of the tourism industry - stretches back to the 19th century.
0:02:29 > 0:02:33- Solomon Andrews had great vision - in that respect.
0:02:33 > 0:02:38- He bought Plas Glyn-y-Weddw in 1896.
0:02:39 > 0:02:43- He renovated the house - and the gardens for tourism.
0:02:45 > 0:02:49- A tramway was developed - to bring visitors here.
0:02:49 > 0:02:52- He brought his customers - from Pwllheli.
0:02:52 > 0:02:56- He was a Cardiff businessman - and he saw potential in the area.
0:02:57 > 0:02:59- How did the tram work?
0:02:59 > 0:03:03- It was a horse-drawn tram - - with one horse pulling it.
0:03:03 > 0:03:06- A track tramway - stretched from Pwllheli...
0:03:06 > 0:03:10- ..from the junction - between Ala Road and Cardiff Road.
0:03:10 > 0:03:14- The station was nearby, in front - of the church in Llanbedrog.
0:03:15 > 0:03:17- It was a major attraction - at the time.
0:03:17 > 0:03:20- Its main feature - was its art gallery.
0:03:20 > 0:03:26- Paintings by some prominent artists - of the time were exhibited here.
0:03:26 > 0:03:29- The gardens were open to the public.
0:03:29 > 0:03:35- A network of footpaths led - to the vineyard and nearby forest.
0:03:36 > 0:03:40- The park in front of the house - stretched all the way to the beach.
0:03:42 > 0:03:47- There was a tearoom, - orchestras played in the afternoon.
0:03:47 > 0:03:51- There were also concerts - during the evenings.
0:03:51 > 0:03:53- There was quite a lot going on here.
0:03:53 > 0:03:55- There was quite a lot going on here.- - It's a wonderful location.
0:03:56 > 0:03:59- It's easy to see - how people are attracted to it.
0:03:59 > 0:04:03- Tell me more about the name - - Plas Glyn-y-Weddw.
0:04:03 > 0:04:07- The widow of Sir Love Jones-Parry - built the house in 1857...
0:04:07 > 0:04:11- ..with the intention of moving here - to live when her son married.
0:04:14 > 0:04:17- Her son never married - during her lifetime.
0:04:17 > 0:04:19- She never moved here to live.
0:04:19 > 0:04:21- She would regularly visit...
0:04:21 > 0:04:25- ..and enjoyed staying - at the house and its gardens.
0:04:25 > 0:04:28- She had a collection of art.
0:04:29 > 0:04:33- The architect designed the house - with the intention...
0:04:33 > 0:04:35- ..of exhibiting the artwork.
0:04:36 > 0:04:37- She was the widow.
0:04:37 > 0:04:39- She was the widow.- - Elizabeth Love Jones-Parry.
0:04:39 > 0:04:44- The house was built perfectly - to become an art gallery.
0:04:55 > 0:04:57- Most places on Llyn - are close to the sea.
0:04:57 > 0:05:02- It's no surprise that the area has - produced its fair share of sailors.
0:05:02 > 0:05:05- One of those was Hugh Hughes, - Gellidara, Penrhos...
0:05:05 > 0:05:07- ..captain of the Eagle.
0:05:13 > 0:05:16- Hugh Hughes was a man of religion.
0:05:16 > 0:05:19- He would conduct services - on board the Eagle.
0:05:20 > 0:05:23- One Sunday night in Falmouth, - in 1843...
0:05:23 > 0:05:26- ..his service was heard - by 300 sailors...
0:05:26 > 0:05:30- ..who'd congregated on the Eagle - from 50 nearby Welsh ships.
0:05:35 > 0:05:41- Hugh Hughes would notify other - sailors about his services...
0:05:42 > 0:05:44- ..by flying a very special banner.
0:05:48 > 0:05:50- It was a blue banner - similar to this...
0:05:51 > 0:05:53- ..with the word Bethel - in white on it.
0:05:53 > 0:05:58- A star in one corner and a dove - with an olive branch in its mouth.
0:05:58 > 0:06:01- The meaning of Bethel - is God's house.
0:06:01 > 0:06:04- When Hugh Hughes retired - from the sea in 1847...
0:06:05 > 0:06:08- ..he married the daughter - of Gellidara, Penrhos.
0:06:08 > 0:06:13- When a new chapel was built - in Penrhos in the 1860s...
0:06:13 > 0:06:16- ..Hugh Hughes insisted - it was called Bethel...
0:06:17 > 0:06:20- ..in memory of the time - he conducted services at sea.
0:06:33 > 0:06:36- After a two-minute car journey...
0:06:36 > 0:06:40- ..I arrive at the coastal town - of Pwllheli.
0:06:41 > 0:06:45- Walking the streets, I observe - names connected to the sea...
0:06:45 > 0:06:50- ..even though the seaside is now - relatively far from the town centre.
0:06:59 > 0:07:01- To shed light on this confusion...
0:07:02 > 0:07:05- ..I visit - the Pwllheli lifeboat shed...
0:07:05 > 0:07:09- ..to see Owen Roberts, - a boat engineer for many years.
0:07:16 > 0:07:20- Now, you were born and raised - in Pwllheli.
0:07:20 > 0:07:21- Yes.
0:07:21 > 0:07:29- I was born near a window - that overlooked the harbour.
0:07:30 > 0:07:33- I remember the sailboats...
0:07:33 > 0:07:36- ..and goods ships sailing in.
0:07:36 > 0:07:39- That's where my interest started.
0:07:39 > 0:07:42- You've spent a long time - in this shed.
0:07:42 > 0:07:43- Yes.
0:07:44 > 0:07:47- The shed is evident - in old photographs.
0:07:47 > 0:07:48- Oh, yes.
0:07:49 > 0:07:50- There was nothing around it.
0:07:50 > 0:07:52- There was nothing around it.- - Nothing around it.
0:07:53 > 0:07:56- This huge expanse of rock - behind the shed...
0:07:57 > 0:07:59- ..very little of it remains now.
0:07:59 > 0:08:00- What was it?
0:08:00 > 0:08:03- What was it?- - Carreg Yr Imbill (Gimlet Rock).
0:08:03 > 0:08:06- The rock has almost - all disappeared now.
0:08:06 > 0:08:10- What happened to the material - that was quarried here?
0:08:10 > 0:08:14- It was transported - to the large English cities...
0:08:14 > 0:08:18- ..and to places - such as Hamburg in Germany.
0:08:19 > 0:08:24- People in Hamburg are walking on - sections of Carreg Yr Imbill today.
0:08:24 > 0:08:25- It appears so.
0:08:25 > 0:08:30- I know you contributed maps - for the publication of this book...
0:08:31 > 0:08:35- ..by Dafydd Glyn Lloyd Hughes - on the history of Pwllheli.
0:08:35 > 0:08:39- It shows the remarkable changes - that have been.
0:08:39 > 0:08:42- In truth, on the first map...
0:08:43 > 0:08:46- ..Carreg yr Imbill - is in the middle of the sea!
0:08:46 > 0:08:52- You imagine this was - just a sandbank around the 1280s.
0:08:53 > 0:08:55- Oh, yes.
0:08:55 > 0:09:00- There is an old map - and it shows the rock out at sea...
0:09:00 > 0:09:05- ..beyond Pwllheli, - with no surrounding land.
0:09:05 > 0:09:10- In the second map, - more sand is visible around it.
0:09:10 > 0:09:12- It grew around it.
0:09:12 > 0:09:15- There were many fords to cross.
0:09:16 > 0:09:18- This ford is called Rhydliniog.
0:09:19 > 0:09:21- There's a street - with a similar name.
0:09:22 > 0:09:23- Penrhydliniog.
0:09:23 > 0:09:28- Or 'Pentref' as the people - of Penrhydliniog called it.
0:09:28 > 0:09:31- There were so many small lakes - around there.
0:09:31 > 0:09:33- The street...
0:09:33 > 0:09:38- ..well, it practically follows - the same path as the ford.
0:09:39 > 0:09:42- As you walk through Pwllheli, - you notice instantly...
0:09:43 > 0:09:48- ..the names of streets - such as Y Traeth and Penylan.
0:09:49 > 0:09:51- Such names jump out at you.
0:09:51 > 0:09:54- The sea is relatively far - from the town.
0:09:54 > 0:09:57- I know that your brother - is an artist.
0:09:59 > 0:10:02- This picture was on - the sailing club's calendar.
0:10:02 > 0:10:06- It might show what Pwllheli - was like. Can you tell us more?
0:10:07 > 0:10:10- What draws your attention - is the mount.
0:10:10 > 0:10:15- Behind the mount - is a saltwater lake.
0:10:15 > 0:10:18- The 'pwll heli' (saltwater lake).
0:10:18 > 0:10:23- The tide would come in - and saltwater would fill the lake.
0:10:23 > 0:10:27- When the tide went out, there was - a sandbank where the beach is.
0:10:27 > 0:10:30- The lake was full of saltwater.
0:10:30 > 0:10:34- This picture clearly shows - the existence of a beach.
0:10:34 > 0:10:37- Is this where the street - named Y Traeth is now?
0:10:38 > 0:10:41- Yes, the road that comes in - from Caernarfon.
0:10:41 > 0:10:45- There's a street - called Lon Dywod (Sand Way).
0:10:45 > 0:10:47- This is where the tide came in.
0:10:50 > 0:10:53- This created quite a quandary - at the time...
0:10:53 > 0:10:56- ..because they wanted English names.
0:10:56 > 0:10:59- Y Traeth wasn't considered - a nice name.
0:11:00 > 0:11:02- Sand Street - that was better.
0:11:04 > 0:11:09- Lon Dywod - they didn't have - a name for Lon Dywod.
0:11:09 > 0:11:11- It was renamed New Street.
0:11:12 > 0:11:14- Lon Dywod was New Street...
0:11:14 > 0:11:17- ..and Traeth was Sand Street!
0:11:17 > 0:11:23- There was time in Pwllheli when - everything was being Anglicized.
0:11:24 > 0:11:30- They wanted to change - the name of the town.
0:11:30 > 0:11:32- There were many options.
0:11:33 > 0:11:36- Albertville... all kinds of names.
0:11:36 > 0:11:37- Really?
0:11:37 > 0:11:38- Really?- - Yes.
0:11:39 > 0:11:42- One person suggested Salt Lake City!
0:11:44 > 0:11:52- I think that those kind of jokes - made them give it all up.
0:11:53 > 0:11:55- They kept the name Pwllheli.
0:12:05 > 0:12:05- .
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0:12:15 > 0:12:18- I'm on a journey - across Llyn's coastline...
0:12:19 > 0:12:23- ..searching for the area's - remarkable place names and tales.
0:12:23 > 0:12:26- Near Pwllheli is a village - whose name suggests...
0:12:26 > 0:12:29- ..that the river Erch - should flow to the sea here.
0:12:30 > 0:12:32- But it doesn't.
0:12:38 > 0:12:42- The first thing - that interests me here...
0:12:42 > 0:12:44- ..is seeing the sign - Abererch.
0:12:45 > 0:12:48- You hear some people - pronouncing it as 'Berch'.
0:12:49 > 0:12:51- What should I be saying?
0:12:51 > 0:12:52- Berch!
0:12:53 > 0:12:57- There's an overcompensation - in the pronunciation...
0:12:57 > 0:12:59- ..often in official forms.
0:12:59 > 0:13:02- The University of Wales Press - adopt a caesura...
0:13:02 > 0:13:06- ..to ensure that everyone - pronounces the three syllables.
0:13:07 > 0:13:10- That's a mistake. - The old pronunciation was Abererch.
0:13:11 > 0:13:14- That's been lost - and it's become Berch locally.
0:13:14 > 0:13:19- The same happened with Bermo and - Berffro - Aberffraw became Berffro.
0:13:19 > 0:13:22- The emphasis - is on the penultimate syllable.
0:13:22 > 0:13:27- The name appears as one word - in the Black Book of Carmarthen.
0:13:27 > 0:13:29- "Bedd Rhydderch Hael in Abererch."
0:13:29 > 0:13:34- Abererch is a significant - mispronunciation as it stands now.
0:13:34 > 0:13:37- I'll fit in with the locals - and say Berch.
0:13:37 > 0:13:40- Where's the River Erch from here?
0:13:40 > 0:13:43- The River Erch - flows down from the Eifl...
0:13:43 > 0:13:45- ..and it travels south.
0:13:45 > 0:13:48- It flowed out to sea...
0:13:49 > 0:13:51- ..in Berch, hence the name.
0:13:51 > 0:13:57- It doesn't now and hasn't done since - the Dark Ages or the Middle Ages.
0:13:57 > 0:14:02- It's changed its course - and flows to the sea in Pwllheli.
0:14:02 > 0:14:04- The word 'erch' means grey.
0:14:04 > 0:14:07- It merges with Afon Ddu - (black river) here.
0:14:08 > 0:14:12- The landscape has also changed - through human interference.
0:14:12 > 0:14:14- The main change happened...
0:14:14 > 0:14:18- ..two centuries ago - to the year before last, in 1813.
0:14:18 > 0:14:21- Sea embankments were built - either side of Pwllheli.
0:14:22 > 0:14:26- The embankment on this side - reclaimed a lot of land...
0:14:26 > 0:14:30- ..land that was subsequently sold - to local landowners.
0:14:30 > 0:14:35- That land remains under sea level.
0:14:35 > 0:14:41- There's a high-tide rock in - a field near Yr Odyn in Berch.
0:14:41 > 0:14:43- That had to be submerged...
0:14:43 > 0:14:49- ..to allow enough depth in the sea - for limestone ships to dock.
0:14:50 > 0:14:52- They measured the tide - against the rock.
0:14:52 > 0:14:57- If the rock wasn't submerged, - the water wasn't deep enough.
0:14:58 > 0:15:01- There's a wonderful view - from this highland.
0:15:02 > 0:15:04- I can visualise the whole story.
0:15:04 > 0:15:07- What on earth is this rock - we're stood on?
0:15:07 > 0:15:10- Cadair Cawrdaf Sant - (Cawrdaf's Seat).
0:15:10 > 0:15:13- Cawrdaf is the patron saint - of Berch...
0:15:13 > 0:15:15- ..and Miskin in Mid Glamorgan.
0:15:15 > 0:15:19- I don't know of anywhere else - in North Wales, apart from Berch...
0:15:19 > 0:15:21- ..where he is the patron saint.
0:15:21 > 0:15:26- When people would travel on their - pilgrimages to Bardsey Island...
0:15:26 > 0:15:28- ..they would stop and sit here.
0:15:29 > 0:15:34- The pilgrim's path to Bardsey - was just beyond here...
0:15:34 > 0:15:37- ..just at the bottom of this field.
0:15:37 > 0:15:41- According to legend, the pilgrims - would rest and sit here...
0:15:41 > 0:15:44- ..and receive a blessing - before crossing the sound.
0:15:45 > 0:15:47- I don't know the details - of the blessing...
0:15:47 > 0:15:50- ..but I believe - it helped them cross the sound.
0:15:51 > 0:15:53- It must have. - At least they had great views.
0:15:54 > 0:15:56- They sat because they were tired!
0:16:01 > 0:16:05- After passing Carreg Pen Llanw - (High Tide Rock) in Berch...
0:16:05 > 0:16:07- ..I head back to Pwllheli...
0:16:08 > 0:16:10- ..to launch my boat.
0:16:16 > 0:16:18- This is a very busy harbour.
0:16:19 > 0:16:23- A wide variety of boats - benefit from recent developments.
0:16:24 > 0:16:27- There's some safety here - but it should be remembered...
0:16:28 > 0:16:31- ..that these shores - can be perilous...
0:16:31 > 0:16:33- ..even when it's calm.
0:16:37 > 0:16:39- On July 1, 1899...
0:16:39 > 0:16:44- ..members of the Llanddeiniolen - parish church congregated here...
0:16:44 > 0:16:46- ..for a Sunday school trip.
0:16:46 > 0:16:49- Some ventured out into the bay - in a boat.
0:16:49 > 0:16:52- The boat capsized, 12 drowned...
0:16:52 > 0:16:55- ..and the only one who survived - was the oarsman.
0:17:17 > 0:17:21- As I leave Pwllheli to the backdrop - of Carreg Yr Imbill...
0:17:21 > 0:17:23- ..I head to the ocean.
0:17:23 > 0:17:26- South of Pwllheli is Sarn Badrig...
0:17:27 > 0:17:31- ..an underwater shingle reef - extending across the bay.
0:17:31 > 0:17:35- Some claim the reef is the remains - of Cantre'r Gwaelod...
0:17:35 > 0:17:39- ..the mythological kingdom - buried by the sea.
0:17:40 > 0:17:46- The romanticists among us associate - Pen Ychain with Cantre'r Gwaelod.
0:17:46 > 0:17:50- The prince of Cantre'r Gwaelod - was Gwyddno Garanhir.
0:17:50 > 0:17:56- According to some, his groan when he - realised his kingdom was drowning...
0:17:56 > 0:17:59- ..inspired the name Pen Ochain - (Groaning Head).
0:18:03 > 0:18:10- Whatever the truth, Sarn Badrig - is a perilous stretch for sailors.
0:18:10 > 0:18:16- With the tide out, six ships ran - aground during the last century.
0:18:17 > 0:18:21- Easy does it as you sail - past the Dwyfor estuary...
0:18:21 > 0:18:23- ..and on to Criccieth.
0:18:32 > 0:18:36- Reaching Criccieth from the sea - is an exceptional experience...
0:18:37 > 0:18:40- ..as you become dwarfed - by the castle on the hill.
0:18:40 > 0:18:43- It reminds you of your place - in the world.
0:18:44 > 0:18:46- The safety of being up there...
0:18:46 > 0:18:50- ..and the uncertainty - of being down here, on the sea.
0:18:53 > 0:18:56- We've certainly reached - a historic town.
0:18:58 > 0:19:03- Criccieth's business centre once - stood to the east of the castle.
0:19:03 > 0:19:07- It inspired the name - Abermarchnad (Market Estuary).
0:19:07 > 0:19:12- For years, people congregated here - every Sunday night to sing hymns.
0:19:12 > 0:19:13- It was some chapel.
0:19:23 > 0:19:27- Criccieth Castle has stood - on this rock for almost 800 years.
0:19:27 > 0:19:30- Eight centuries - of guarding Cardigan Bay...
0:19:31 > 0:19:34- ..and reigning over - this corner of Eifionydd.
0:19:34 > 0:19:36- It's still imposing today.
0:19:36 > 0:19:40- Can you imagine standing - on this beach centuries ago...
0:19:40 > 0:19:44- ..and seeing the castle walls - looking down on you.
0:20:02 > 0:20:05- Gwyneth, this castle - is in such a special location.
0:20:06 > 0:20:08- You're used to seeing it every day.
0:20:08 > 0:20:10- I'm here almost every day.
0:20:11 > 0:20:13- My son, Maelgwn, - enjoys playing here.
0:20:13 > 0:20:17- He wears his Owain Glyndwr tabard - and terrorises holidaymakers.
0:20:17 > 0:20:20- Generations of my family - have played here.
0:20:20 > 0:20:24- Mam played cowboys and Indians here - with her friends in the 1950s.
0:20:24 > 0:20:29- Before that, my great uncle Robat, - he hated school.
0:20:29 > 0:20:32- He would escape every day - through the school window...
0:20:32 > 0:20:34- ..and no-one knew where he went.
0:20:34 > 0:20:36- He would hide here.
0:20:36 > 0:20:41- There's no better place. A wonderful - bay and a castle across the water.
0:20:41 > 0:20:43- It's a special location.
0:20:44 > 0:20:49- Ten years ago, Taid, in his 90s - at the time, walked along the prom.
0:20:49 > 0:20:54- An old man came up to him and asked - if he'd lived here all his life.
0:20:54 > 0:20:56- "Yes," replied Taid.
0:20:56 > 0:20:59- He then asked, "Is there - another chateau over here?"
0:21:00 > 0:21:03- Taid pointed through the mist - to Harlech Castle.
0:21:03 > 0:21:05- "Yes indeed."
0:21:06 > 0:21:08- "Ah, then I am in the right place.
0:21:08 > 0:21:12- "During the war, - we were here in a U-boat."
0:21:12 > 0:21:14- Taid said lucky he hadn't landed.
0:21:15 > 0:21:19- The Criccieth Home Guard - wasn't up to much at the time.
0:21:19 > 0:21:21- The history stretches back further.
0:21:21 > 0:21:25- The castle was built by Llywelyn - the Great in the 13th century.
0:21:26 > 0:21:31- His son, Dafydd, imprisoned his - brother Gruffydd ap Llywelyn Fawr.
0:21:31 > 0:21:34- Edward I captured the castle.
0:21:34 > 0:21:37- It became a prison for many years...
0:21:38 > 0:21:43- ..until Owain Glyndwr destroyed - the castle in the 15th century.
0:21:44 > 0:21:48- The use of the castle as a prison - led to the name Criccieth.
0:21:48 > 0:21:53- During the Middle Ages - it was called Treferthyr...
0:21:53 > 0:21:58- ..after St Catherine who was - murdered by a Roman emperor.
0:21:58 > 0:22:03- One explanation suggest its origin - as 'crug' (hill)...
0:22:03 > 0:22:07- ..and 'caeth' (imprisoned) - after the prisoners.
0:22:07 > 0:22:12- Having said that, the common use - of 'caeth' during the Middle Ages...
0:22:12 > 0:22:14- ..was 'taeog' (servile).
0:22:14 > 0:22:16- It could refer to native serfs.
0:22:17 > 0:22:21- There's still a lot of discussion - about doubling the C.
0:22:21 > 0:22:25- Some say it should be double because - of 'crug' and 'caeth' - g and c.
0:22:25 > 0:22:29- Others argue that it doesn't happen - in Welsh grammar.
0:22:29 > 0:22:32- As a local, - where do you stand on it?
0:22:32 > 0:22:35- As an Eifionydd girl, - it should have only one C!
0:22:35 > 0:22:41- What's funny is when someone comes - to Criccieth from Llanystumdwy...
0:22:41 > 0:22:45- ..sometimes there are two Cs - on the official sign...
0:22:45 > 0:22:50- ..and sometimes there's one - after someone painted over it.
0:22:50 > 0:22:55- People will discuss and argue - about it for many years to come.
0:22:55 > 0:22:56- Are you the painter?
0:22:56 > 0:22:58- Are you the painter?- - Not me!
0:23:16 > 0:23:19- One thing the debate - of Criccieth's name shows...
0:23:20 > 0:23:23- ..is that people care - about place names...
0:23:23 > 0:23:26- ..their spelling - and their meanings.
0:23:26 > 0:23:31- This is because everyone feels - an instinctive ownership of them.
0:23:50 > 0:23:52- S4C Subtitles by Adnod Cyf.
0:23:52 > 0:23:52- .