0:00:34 > 0:00:40The nature of selling clothes that look like they were ruins and rags
0:00:40 > 0:00:46appealed with a certain fetishistic aspect to them,
0:00:46 > 0:00:50created a new kind of subversive clothing.
0:00:53 > 0:00:56The new fashion became known as punk,
0:00:56 > 0:01:01and the slogan Clothes For Heroes appeared on the shop door.
0:01:01 > 0:01:05Their most iconic creation were the bondage trousers,
0:01:05 > 0:01:08an item that took heroic nerve to wear.
0:01:10 > 0:01:14You've gotta have a trouser that first of all
0:01:14 > 0:01:18must appear as if you can't walk in them,
0:01:18 > 0:01:22and I realised that we needed to create a strap between the legs,
0:01:22 > 0:01:24but a strap that could move.
0:01:25 > 0:01:31And I decided I wanted a zip that would do something more obnoxious.
0:01:31 > 0:01:35If you could have a zip that went around the crotch
0:01:35 > 0:01:39and half way up the arse, that was more exciting.
0:01:39 > 0:01:42So you'd open up this zip and all your goolies would fall out
0:01:42 > 0:01:45and you could do the most obnoxious things in the street.
0:01:45 > 0:01:48And this was just an ode to Tarzan funnily enough.
0:01:48 > 0:01:54Actually it was a piece of towelling, and I just had this idea of something primitive,
0:01:54 > 0:01:57so it's half of the Tarzan loin cloth is what,
0:01:57 > 0:02:01in my wildest imagination, that was to represent.
0:02:01 > 0:02:06The bondage trousers took Westwood and McLaren's punk look nationwide.
0:02:06 > 0:02:11Their provocative ideas appealed to a generation of young fashion rebels,
0:02:11 > 0:02:14stimulating them to create their own DIY punk style.
0:02:14 > 0:02:20The whole ethos of punk was the do-it-yourself idea behind it,
0:02:20 > 0:02:23and I would buy shirts from Oxfam and then cut them up
0:02:23 > 0:02:25and reassemble them, and put plastic on them
0:02:25 > 0:02:29and obscene messages that my mother was very upset by,
0:02:29 > 0:02:32but it was great, I mean, it was a really exciting time
0:02:32 > 0:02:39and it was about doing things that were new and that appeared, I suppose, shocking at the time.
0:02:39 > 0:02:43They had achieved their goal - spreading anarchic style across Britain.
0:02:43 > 0:02:47A key element in this success was McLaren's decision
0:02:47 > 0:02:51to form a band who could model and soundtrack their punk designs.
0:02:53 > 0:02:59It was natural that a band wearing those clothes was going to be
0:02:59 > 0:03:04the sound of that fashion, so I created a look for the music.
0:03:04 > 0:03:06What was the music?
0:03:06 > 0:03:11Well, I felt the music should be as wrong as the clothes,
0:03:11 > 0:03:15so my idea was I actually thought if they sound bad,
0:03:15 > 0:03:17they're gonna be good.
0:03:17 > 0:03:22You could send the cultural terrorists out into the hinterland
0:03:22 > 0:03:24and have them pollute England.
0:03:24 > 0:03:28It was again this wish to provoke,
0:03:28 > 0:03:31which is crucial to the whole story of punk
0:03:31 > 0:03:34and of that period in McLaren and Westwood's clothing,
0:03:34 > 0:03:40which saw the most incredible outpouring of creativity.
0:03:42 > 0:03:45It was once really possible to shock,
0:03:45 > 0:03:48and to shock people to the core.
0:03:48 > 0:03:50# I'm pretty vacant... #
0:03:50 > 0:03:54Once punk had happened, it was no turning back.
0:03:54 > 0:03:56You can't put your genie back in the bottle.
0:03:56 > 0:03:59They were the ones that said you can do it,
0:03:59 > 0:04:01you don't have to be a professional,
0:04:01 > 0:04:06and let's mix it all together and make it fun.
0:04:06 > 0:04:11Well, yes, that's what's going on today and that is what I think Britain has given the world -
0:04:11 > 0:04:14this idea that everywhere you can do it,
0:04:14 > 0:04:19mix it all up, we're gonna do it our way.
0:04:32 > 0:04:38We started working with designers back in the '90s, first of all to allow our customers to be able to
0:04:38 > 0:04:42buy designer collections they wouldn't have been able to buy
0:04:42 > 0:04:44because they couldn't afford them.
0:04:44 > 0:04:49So it was a way of allowing our customers a glimpse, if you like,
0:04:49 > 0:04:51at a different aesthetic, a different style.
0:04:51 > 0:04:57As collaborations with designers became more natural, High Street chains like Top Shop,
0:04:57 > 0:04:59were able to attract the best new talent,
0:04:59 > 0:05:01such as Jonathan Saunders,
0:05:01 > 0:05:04seen here showing at New York Fashion Week.
0:05:04 > 0:05:09We picked up on Jonathan Saunders about two years after he left St Martin's.
0:05:09 > 0:05:13He was picked for the New Generation sponsorship.
0:05:13 > 0:05:17One of his first collections had the most incredible graphic prints
0:05:17 > 0:05:21that really stood out, and all the fashion press picked up on it
0:05:21 > 0:05:24and said, this guy is going to be really something.
0:05:27 > 0:05:30There is a whole other element of fantasy, which fashion is,
0:05:30 > 0:05:33which I love to do, especially this collection.
0:05:33 > 0:05:37It's more about detail and more structured than I've done before.
0:05:37 > 0:05:42Usually I reference Corbusier or the Bauhaus or something like that,
0:05:42 > 0:05:46and I think about how I can translate that into a print.
0:05:46 > 0:05:50Saunders' catwalk collections may excite the fashion press
0:05:50 > 0:05:54but it's his work for the High Street that will reach a wider group of admirers.
0:05:54 > 0:06:00You know, there's a very youthful spirit about Jonathan and you could argue that it's best appreciated
0:06:00 > 0:06:05by the young, and they can't afford the designer prices,
0:06:05 > 0:06:09but they can buy into Jonathan Saunders at Top Shop.
0:06:09 > 0:06:16In East London, Jonathan Saunders and his team are preparing a new Diffusion line for Top Shop,
0:06:16 > 0:06:20where his high-end designs will be reinterpreted for the High Street.
0:06:22 > 0:06:29Top Shop head buyer Karen Downy has come to discuss the look and the cost implications.
0:06:29 > 0:06:33We don't want it to be overly constructed and overly worked.
0:06:33 > 0:06:38The aesthetic of what I do usually is quite pared down and simple anyway.
0:06:38 > 0:06:43- Yeah, but we have to think a little bit about the construction for a High Street store...- Exactly.
0:06:43 > 0:06:46- ..compared to your collection. - How we translate it.
0:06:46 > 0:06:52So I've brought out a couple of quite simple pieces here, which could translate quite easily,
0:06:52 > 0:06:58you know, because it's expensive fabrics that have been used but you can work on that anyway.
0:06:59 > 0:07:03If you imagine this dress with the body in black,
0:07:03 > 0:07:06- then a strong blue on the shoulders. - Yeah.- Keep the black stripe.
0:07:06 > 0:07:10But also that they can recognise it as definitely one of yours.
0:07:10 > 0:07:13Yeah. Would you still line the dress?
0:07:13 > 0:07:17- Maybe not?- I think we'd look at what it's like unlined first.
0:07:17 > 0:07:20- To keep the price down.- Yeah.
0:07:20 > 0:07:26You're putting your product out there to a wider audience so you need to kind of please more people in a way.
0:07:26 > 0:07:29You have to take that with a pinch of salt, though,
0:07:29 > 0:07:32because if it does affect your design process too much,
0:07:32 > 0:07:36you end up oversimplifying or the dumbing down
0:07:36 > 0:07:39of what you're all about, and you've got to be brave as well.
0:07:39 > 0:07:43Obviously the finishing is really fine on these
0:07:43 > 0:07:48and there's been a lot of work going into finishing this in that way.
0:07:48 > 0:07:53- We probably wouldn't finish it in the same way.- Right. But we can get close to it.- Yeah.
0:07:53 > 0:07:55Something near to it.
0:07:55 > 0:08:00I think it's a two-edged sword in that it's supporting the design process, it's appreciating
0:08:00 > 0:08:02young British talent,
0:08:02 > 0:08:06but it's also bringing to the forefront
0:08:06 > 0:08:10how you can gain those pieces for a low price.
0:08:10 > 0:08:16So all of those things made it really good on a long-term basis.
0:08:31 > 0:08:35The flickering animations in this video of Kate Moss and Primal Scream
0:08:35 > 0:08:38are the work of fashion designer Julie Verhoevan.
0:08:38 > 0:08:41First and foremost, she's an artist who loves to draw,
0:08:41 > 0:08:46what she draws, and for whatever reason comes second.
0:08:46 > 0:08:52A lot of her filigree, yet curiously savage work is loosely called fashion illustration.
0:08:56 > 0:09:00The process she follows to design a collection starts with research,
0:09:00 > 0:09:05developing a general theme, looking at pictures and seeing what takes her fancy.
0:09:06 > 0:09:09This phase could take...
0:09:09 > 0:09:13I'll probably do about three to four
0:09:13 > 0:09:18intensive days of purely photocopying,
0:09:18 > 0:09:21and then I'll start the collection
0:09:21 > 0:09:26and then I'll just sort of revert back to it later on
0:09:26 > 0:09:30in the season when I need to revise my thoughts.
0:09:32 > 0:09:37I'm just looking at random to start with, I don't know quite what I was looking for,
0:09:37 > 0:09:41then I found the good luck charms, which I really like,
0:09:41 > 0:09:43so I just went in that direction,
0:09:43 > 0:09:47and then the sinister undertones are just something I can't get away from.
0:09:47 > 0:09:51There's a sort of mood to the collection...
0:09:51 > 0:09:53so let's lift up your skirt and fly,
0:09:53 > 0:09:59which feels very optimistic but with this sort of sinister undertone.
0:09:59 > 0:10:05It's all based on good luck charms and omens and the supernatural.
0:10:06 > 0:10:13After weeks of accumulating a mass of visual stimuli, she puts all her ideas together as drawings.
0:10:13 > 0:10:16She barely takes the pen off the page because, she says,
0:10:16 > 0:10:20she doesn't want to break the line of her thought.
0:10:20 > 0:10:24It's a good example of how I begin to start sketching.
0:10:24 > 0:10:29I'll begin with a seductive face that is on the face of it quite a pretty...
0:10:33 > 0:10:36And as I work down the body I tend to react to that character
0:10:36 > 0:10:39and give it a little bit of a twist in some way or another.
0:10:41 > 0:10:46I tend to alternate between pen and pencil, and crayon,
0:10:46 > 0:10:50just in the hope that I make another mark that might provoke
0:10:50 > 0:10:54another reaction and suggest another fabric or applique
0:10:54 > 0:10:57or some special treatment. So it's a purposeful thing
0:10:57 > 0:11:00that I just hope again for a happy accident.
0:11:21 > 0:11:27So this is the dress that I'd like you to work on and it's going to be in this Pandora print.
0:11:27 > 0:11:30- OK.- And it's basically coming from
0:11:30 > 0:11:32- the four-leaf clover idea.- Right.
0:11:32 > 0:11:36Very randomly placed, and, um...
0:11:36 > 0:11:39er...no finishing,
0:11:39 > 0:11:43- to feel as unstructured as possible. - Right.
0:11:43 > 0:11:47And kind of 1920s flapper-type feeling,
0:11:47 > 0:11:50sort of Peter Pan in panto.
0:11:53 > 0:11:58Working from Julie's sketches, he comes up with a basic paper pattern.
0:11:58 > 0:12:01Then he cuts a dress from a simple fabric,
0:12:01 > 0:12:03which they fit on a mannequin.
0:12:03 > 0:12:08He'd drawing too, but with a pair of scissors as well as a pen.
0:12:31 > 0:12:36With constant reference back to the original designs, the dress gradually takes shape.
0:12:48 > 0:12:51At this point, a model, Katya, arrives
0:12:51 > 0:12:55and Julie can see how the dress hangs and moves for real.
0:13:16 > 0:13:20For me, looking at her final catwalk show
0:13:20 > 0:13:23is seeing Julie's drawings walk, live and breathe.
0:13:24 > 0:13:32Her drawing, with its swirls and colours, really is at the heart of what she does.
0:13:36 > 0:13:42Fashion designers like her are the exception to the new 21st-century design tradition
0:13:42 > 0:13:44in not using a computer at any stage of the process,
0:13:44 > 0:13:47and although that's proof that computers aren't essential
0:13:47 > 0:13:54to successful modern design, they're the biggest difference between the Renaissance and today.
0:14:06 > 0:14:10Type is saying things to us all the time.
0:14:10 > 0:14:13Typefaces express a mood, an atmosphere.
0:14:13 > 0:14:17They give words a certain colouring.
0:14:17 > 0:14:21Everywhere you look, you see typefaces,
0:14:21 > 0:14:25but one you see more than any other is Helvetica. There it is
0:14:25 > 0:14:27and it seems to come from nowhere. It seems like air,
0:14:27 > 0:14:30it seems like gravity.
0:14:30 > 0:14:35Graphic design is the communication framework
0:14:35 > 0:14:39through which these messages about what the world is now
0:14:39 > 0:14:42and what we should aspire to, it's the way they reach us.
0:14:42 > 0:14:46The designer has an enormous responsibility.
0:14:46 > 0:14:50Those are the people putting their wires into our heads.
0:14:53 > 0:14:56It's always changing, time is changing.
0:14:56 > 0:15:00The appreciation of typefaces is changing very much.
0:15:00 > 0:15:04Why you grab a certain typeface for a certain job
0:15:04 > 0:15:07has a different meaning
0:15:07 > 0:15:10than we grabbed a typeface in the '50s for a certain job.
0:15:10 > 0:15:14It's... You are always a child of your time,
0:15:14 > 0:15:17and you cannot step out of that.
0:15:22 > 0:15:25What we have is a climate now
0:15:25 > 0:15:30in which the very idea of visual communication and graphic design,
0:15:30 > 0:15:34if we still want to call it that, is accepted by many more people.
0:15:34 > 0:15:37They get it, they understand it.
0:15:37 > 0:15:41They're starting to see graphic communication
0:15:41 > 0:15:44as an expression of their own identity.
0:15:44 > 0:15:49The classic case of this is the social networking programmes
0:15:49 > 0:15:55such as MySpace, where you can customise your profile,
0:15:55 > 0:16:01you can change the background, you can put pictures in, you can change the typeface to anything you want,
0:16:01 > 0:16:05and those choices, those decisions you make,
0:16:05 > 0:16:07become expressions of who you are.
0:16:07 > 0:16:13You start to care about it in the way that you care about the clothing you're wearing
0:16:13 > 0:16:17as an expression of who you are, or your haircut or whatever,
0:16:17 > 0:16:21or how you decorate your apartment, all of those things, you know.
0:16:21 > 0:16:24We accept the idea of identity being expressed in that way
0:16:24 > 0:16:27through these consumer choices.
0:16:27 > 0:16:31Well, now it's happening in the sphere of visual communication.
0:16:31 > 0:16:36And there's no reason, as the tools become ever more sophisticated,
0:16:36 > 0:16:40why this just won't go on developing and developing and developing.
0:17:04 > 0:17:09This is the tale of 2 - of the BBC2 identification logo.
0:17:09 > 0:17:14It's not so long ago that BBC2 was presented like this...
0:17:16 > 0:17:18Or this...
0:17:20 > 0:17:23Or until 1991 like this.
0:17:23 > 0:17:27So how was TWO elbowed aside by the wonderful 2?
0:17:29 > 0:17:30I realised there was a problem
0:17:30 > 0:17:32as soon as I took over the channel.
0:17:32 > 0:17:35It was obvious the logo made absolutely no impact.
0:17:35 > 0:17:38In fact it was something anyone could have told you.
0:17:38 > 0:17:42It was singularly unmemorable and told you nothing about the personality of the channel.
0:17:42 > 0:17:48So we decided to commission a corporate design company to do some research.
0:17:49 > 0:17:54When the research came back we were surprised because what it told us
0:17:54 > 0:17:57was that the audience thought BBC2 was "dull and worthy",
0:17:57 > 0:18:01which was a bit of a shock to everybody involved.
0:18:01 > 0:18:06So how did they set about changing people's perceptions? They invented an entirely new 2,
0:18:06 > 0:18:08more in step with the programmes
0:18:08 > 0:18:11and with a personality all its own, hopefully witty, decidedly unusual.
0:18:11 > 0:18:16We took this 2 actually. You think, there's nothing special about this.
0:18:16 > 0:18:20Well, there IS something special about this - it's a distinctive 2,
0:18:20 > 0:18:23it has sharp bits on it and it's rather nice and fat.
0:18:27 > 0:18:30The reason we wanted that particular 2
0:18:30 > 0:18:32is because we wanted to do things with it,
0:18:32 > 0:18:35so you need lots of 2, lots of body on the 2,
0:18:35 > 0:18:37in order to achieve that.
0:18:37 > 0:18:41The familiar greeny-blue colour was featured in the first batch of 2s
0:18:41 > 0:18:43and became a standard component
0:18:43 > 0:18:46in subsequent designs to aid identification.
0:18:48 > 0:18:51But never mind the colour, how did they do this?
0:18:51 > 0:18:54Well, they turned the camera and the model 2 on their sides,
0:18:54 > 0:18:57then filmed paint dropping from a height
0:18:57 > 0:18:59so that when the film was played the right way up,
0:18:59 > 0:19:02it appeared to hurtle in from the side.
0:19:02 > 0:19:07Simple when you know how, but the latest episode in the Tale of 2
0:19:07 > 0:19:11needed a more complicated set-up to produce a steaming 2.
0:19:12 > 0:19:14As well as the idea
0:19:14 > 0:19:17of the surprise of the water turning into steam
0:19:17 > 0:19:19on an object which didn't look hot,
0:19:19 > 0:19:22we also wanted to have the water coming from every angle.
0:19:23 > 0:19:26That was the main problem, really,
0:19:26 > 0:19:30getting some kind of a rig which allowed us to release water on cue,
0:19:30 > 0:19:34and we've come up with quite an amazing Heath Robinson device, I think.
0:19:34 > 0:19:37The drops of water are controlled by opening and closing
0:19:37 > 0:19:41a system of valves so that they splash down on cue. The camera lens
0:19:41 > 0:19:46is in the centre of the action, but it's shielded from the water and this is what it sees.
0:19:51 > 0:19:55Another new ident hot off the press is called Diary.
0:19:55 > 0:19:58The final piece may be on screen for only a few seconds,
0:19:58 > 0:20:00but it took days to produce.
0:20:06 > 0:20:10Basically we have a piece of fish wire, which is attached to the 2,
0:20:10 > 0:20:15with an undercurrent of air, so when we pull it, the actual 2 will come forward on a jet of air.
0:20:15 > 0:20:19The original aim was to pull ten 2s off in rapid succession,
0:20:19 > 0:20:21but things got in a bit of a tangle.
0:20:21 > 0:20:24We ended up with a lot of crossed wires even doing it this way,
0:20:24 > 0:20:27but with ten, it was like down at the lake on Sunday,
0:20:27 > 0:20:31with everyone's rods going in. It was impossible to coordinate.
0:20:31 > 0:20:36So they cheated, they repeated the original shot over and over again.
0:20:38 > 0:20:41But how the 2s were filmed is not the whole story.
0:20:41 > 0:20:45Every 2 has sound effects or specially composed music behind it.
0:20:45 > 0:20:46How are these created?
0:20:46 > 0:20:49Perhaps not exactly how you'd expect.
0:20:49 > 0:20:55The music for each 2 was inspired by a particular theme.
0:20:55 > 0:20:59We came up with a fantasy for silk, which was a seascape,
0:20:59 > 0:21:02and the silk became billowing waves
0:21:02 > 0:21:09and the 2 became a sunken ship complete with piping aboard.
0:21:09 > 0:21:12And the ship's bell way underneath the ocean.
0:21:12 > 0:21:15And ghostly feelings, like whales in the water.
0:21:15 > 0:21:19HIGH-PITCHED PIPING
0:21:32 > 0:21:34So how successful has the new look been?
0:21:34 > 0:21:38Six months after the first research, they tested the audience reaction.
0:21:38 > 0:21:44The results were phenomenal because all the negatives that came out in the first lot of research -
0:21:44 > 0:21:47"dull and worthy" - had disappeared entirely
0:21:47 > 0:21:50and it was all "sophisticated and witty, and amusing"
0:21:50 > 0:21:52and all these words started coming out.
0:21:52 > 0:21:56Back at the Beeb, how do they feel about the 2 they've unleashed?
0:21:56 > 0:22:01We feel it's taken on quite a character of its own. It's started to come alive.
0:22:01 > 0:22:03We see it as the hero of the piece,
0:22:03 > 0:22:06and it's definitely got its own little character.
0:22:18 > 0:22:23Our lives are dominated by objects, disposable, practical, aspirational,
0:22:23 > 0:22:27all designed for a specific purpose,
0:22:27 > 0:22:33but the design icons of today have at their heart the principles of one revolutionary designer.
0:22:33 > 0:22:38You might not know his name, but you can be sure that his work will look very familiar.
0:22:38 > 0:22:42Dieter Rams designed products for Braun for 40 years
0:22:42 > 0:22:45and his rigorous approach of less but better
0:22:45 > 0:22:48paved the way for the designers of today.
0:22:48 > 0:22:53When Dieter Rams joined Braun, they were a small electronics company making radios and shavers.
0:22:53 > 0:22:57Within one year, he had revolutionised their products
0:22:57 > 0:23:03and his epoch-defining 10 principles of good design were already taking shape.
0:23:07 > 0:23:11What is the Dieter Rams' idea about what makes a good design?
0:23:11 > 0:23:14It is when it is believable,
0:23:14 > 0:23:16Glaubhaft in Deutsch,
0:23:16 > 0:23:20yeah, and it should be not lying.
0:23:22 > 0:23:27And I was always saying you can tell
0:23:27 > 0:23:32the companies taking design really honest
0:23:32 > 0:23:34on your ten fingers.
0:23:34 > 0:23:40No change today, it's still only few companies.
0:23:40 > 0:23:42Apple is one,
0:23:42 > 0:23:45a lot of junk between.
0:23:50 > 0:23:53Rams' principle of honesty in design
0:23:53 > 0:23:56means a product doing exactly what it says on the tin,
0:23:56 > 0:23:58something that's been embraced by Apple Mac.
0:23:58 > 0:24:01Jonathan Ive, Apple's head designer, is one of
0:24:01 > 0:24:06Rams' most ardent admirers, and even used the classic Braun calculator
0:24:06 > 0:24:08as the template for the iPhone app.
0:24:08 > 0:24:11One of the first time we had push buttons
0:24:11 > 0:24:15which are electronic push buttons.
0:24:15 > 0:24:21I hate all the words ending with -isms, functionalism...
0:24:23 > 0:24:25It's terrible.
0:24:25 > 0:24:30Nationalism is terrible, a lot of words ending -ism.
0:24:30 > 0:24:34But functionality, it's important.
0:24:34 > 0:24:38And if you compare it today to an Apple iPhone,
0:24:38 > 0:24:41- they've taken your design.- Yeah.
0:24:41 > 0:24:44- They've stolen your design.- No. No, it's a compliment.
0:24:52 > 0:24:55Rams' designs stretch beyond the world of consumer electronics.
0:24:55 > 0:25:00In 1960 he designed the revered 606 shelving system for Vitsoe.
0:25:00 > 0:25:03which has been in continuous production ever since.
0:25:07 > 0:25:13Its modular system allowed for endless variations and could be expanded to fit anywhere.
0:25:13 > 0:25:16I even have a 606 at home.
0:25:16 > 0:25:21The story starts, then I become more and more books
0:25:21 > 0:25:25so I add something in this direction.
0:25:25 > 0:25:30And later on I add this whole.
0:25:30 > 0:25:33The idea of it to be a piece of furniture you keep for life
0:25:33 > 0:25:38instead of just going to IKEA and buying something you'll throw away five years later.
0:25:38 > 0:25:45You should design furniture not only for two or one or three years,
0:25:45 > 0:25:51you should design that for your whole life.
0:25:51 > 0:25:54The Atelier system expanded on this innovation.
0:25:54 > 0:25:58The first hi-fi to offer its components in modular form,
0:25:58 > 0:26:01it allowed you to create bespoke systems to fit your home.
0:26:01 > 0:26:04And so when was this designed?
0:26:04 > 0:26:06In '62,
0:26:06 > 0:26:10and the first one in components
0:26:10 > 0:26:15that you also could arrange horizontal
0:26:15 > 0:26:18or mount it on a wall.
0:26:18 > 0:26:22And what was the thinking behind making it modular, breaking it up?
0:26:22 > 0:26:27First, to make it modular was people could buy
0:26:27 > 0:26:30only components what they want.
0:26:30 > 0:26:36Maybe they don't want a tape recorder, they only want the amplifier or the tuner.
0:26:36 > 0:26:38And the mesh, I love the mesh.
0:26:38 > 0:26:40And the mesh also.
0:26:40 > 0:26:43- Was that difficult?- Of course.
0:26:43 > 0:26:51The technicians was very proud that they had the solution because it's better...
0:26:51 > 0:26:53Loudspeaker quality comes out.
0:26:53 > 0:26:56Before, it was covered with some carpet,
0:26:56 > 0:26:59a kind of carpet, you know, very...
0:27:00 > 0:27:03The tone quality...
0:27:03 > 0:27:05- was damp.- Hm.
0:27:10 > 0:27:16Rams applied his ten principles of good design to every one of his designs for Braun.
0:27:16 > 0:27:19By 1995, when Rams retired from the company,
0:27:19 > 0:27:24millions of homes worldwide contained a little piece of his design ideal.
0:27:24 > 0:27:28I can't believe it, I had one of these and I never knew it was yours.
0:27:28 > 0:27:32- And the toothbrushes for OralB. - All your work.
0:27:36 > 0:27:40If you look into the future, where do you see product design going?
0:27:40 > 0:27:43The main thing is the people,
0:27:43 > 0:27:46not the things which people use.
0:27:47 > 0:27:52We have to look more on our natural resources...
0:27:54 > 0:27:58More deeply our resources,
0:27:58 > 0:28:01and we should more think what we use,
0:28:01 > 0:28:03how we use things,
0:28:03 > 0:28:07and how many things we use.
0:28:09 > 0:28:13That is important in the future.
0:28:14 > 0:28:17Wise words from a very wise man.
0:28:17 > 0:28:20Despite living in a world of throwaway consumer excess,
0:28:20 > 0:28:25Dieter Rams' ideals live on in all the best examples of product design.
0:28:25 > 0:28:29If we make things functional and beautiful, they'll be treasured forever.
0:28:41 > 0:28:45Reinvention doesn't have to be edgy to breathe new life into a classic.
0:28:45 > 0:28:50The most recent phenomenon that rivals Laura Ashley for bringing
0:28:50 > 0:28:55nostalgia-inspired country style to the High Street is Cath Kidston.
0:28:55 > 0:29:01Businesses that are based on taking tradition and reworking it have always appealed to me.
0:29:01 > 0:29:04In print, florals are classic, aren't they?
0:29:04 > 0:29:05They're the kind of cream of print,
0:29:05 > 0:29:08and I guess it enables one to work with
0:29:08 > 0:29:10lots of colour combinations, shapes,
0:29:10 > 0:29:16patterns. I have a very strange memory, I can hardly remember my own telephone number
0:29:16 > 0:29:19but I can remember print and colour for some reason.
0:29:19 > 0:29:22I've got a photographic memory for that kind of thing.
0:29:25 > 0:29:30Cath Kidston has built her empire on reworking vintage finds.
0:29:30 > 0:29:36Her team of designers regularly visit antique fairs looking for inspiration.
0:29:36 > 0:29:38It's really fun, isn't it?
0:29:40 > 0:29:44It's really important for me, working with vintage stuff,
0:29:44 > 0:29:47that it doesn't look old in the sense of dowdy.
0:29:47 > 0:29:49It's got to look fresh and cheerful to appeal to me.
0:29:49 > 0:29:52This is cool, the planes.
0:29:53 > 0:29:56What excites me is taking something like
0:29:56 > 0:29:58an old small child's dress print,
0:29:58 > 0:30:02taking the character of it and maybe redoing the colours,
0:30:02 > 0:30:06and then perhaps having it plastic coated so it has a shiny finish.
0:30:06 > 0:30:10But it's just that thing of how can one take tradition and rework it.
0:30:10 > 0:30:15The only thing with a print like that, that's really kind of so pretty and all the rest of it,
0:30:15 > 0:30:17it needs something to brighten it up.
0:30:17 > 0:30:20I think it's a bit too sugary.
0:30:20 > 0:30:23The only thing is we could make it more sugary
0:30:23 > 0:30:26and really shocking pink, quite bright
0:30:26 > 0:30:28and then it's quite interesting.
0:30:28 > 0:30:32The product is very friendly, it is the sort of feel-good factor somehow.
0:30:32 > 0:30:35There's a sort of humour and a slightly sort of
0:30:35 > 0:30:38it fits in with Carry On films, all those kind of things,
0:30:38 > 0:30:43and a cheekiness that I really like, which I have to say is totally British, isn't it?
0:30:48 > 0:30:50What she's totally tapped into, though,
0:30:50 > 0:30:54is the safety of the nursery, a nursery most people never had.
0:30:54 > 0:30:58That interest and fondness for the state of childhood
0:30:58 > 0:31:01is something that's quite a big factor in British style.
0:31:01 > 0:31:06Romanticising the past has always been a big thing with the British,
0:31:06 > 0:31:09this longing for when things were simpler.
0:31:09 > 0:31:14They probably never were, but looking back it seems that they were.
0:31:14 > 0:31:18Harking back to the past as a refuge from the realities of the present
0:31:18 > 0:31:23is part of the British psyche, it's part of our fashion story too.
0:31:23 > 0:31:29Classic country style is reassuring, comforting, and protective when ill winds blow.
0:31:29 > 0:31:34Is it any coincidence that it's being rediscovered as global recession looms?
0:31:34 > 0:31:37Times are hard, so people search
0:31:37 > 0:31:41for comfort in looks and ideas
0:31:41 > 0:31:44and people that are reassuring.
0:31:44 > 0:31:47People are coming back to that quintessential British style
0:31:47 > 0:31:51of things that are made to last, and especially in times of trouble,
0:31:51 > 0:31:54I think people turn to that, people turn to things
0:31:54 > 0:31:57that are comforting and that are lasting
0:31:57 > 0:31:59and that won't go away.
0:32:13 > 0:32:1555 Broadway was Charles Holden's vision,
0:32:15 > 0:32:19but it was the brainchild of Frank Pick,
0:32:19 > 0:32:22the managing director of the new Underground group.
0:32:22 > 0:32:24These two men, Holden and Pick,
0:32:24 > 0:32:27were pivotal in the development of London's transport network.
0:32:27 > 0:32:32Together they undertook a massive modernisation of all its assets
0:32:32 > 0:32:34to make them fit for the 20th century.
0:32:36 > 0:32:40Frank Pick crucially understood the value of good design
0:32:40 > 0:32:44and that the look of London Transport is its personality.
0:32:44 > 0:32:47He had begun his modernisation programme
0:32:47 > 0:32:50by commissioning posters that would persuade commuters
0:32:50 > 0:32:52to use the trains in their leisure time.
0:32:54 > 0:32:58In the 1920s, bright, colourful Art Deco designs
0:32:58 > 0:33:00produced by the best artists of the day
0:33:00 > 0:33:03were always given pride of place in the Tube stations.
0:33:03 > 0:33:07Frank Pick understood just how effective they could be
0:33:07 > 0:33:13in persuading the public that this was a modern, forward-looking transport system.
0:33:19 > 0:33:23The posters commissioned from Pick's office at 55 Broadway were pivotal
0:33:23 > 0:33:27in the development of the organisation.
0:33:27 > 0:33:30So what were the purpose of these particular posters?
0:33:30 > 0:33:34This was an example of promoting off-peak travel, essentially.
0:33:34 > 0:33:38This, you can see, is particularly directed at women, promoting
0:33:38 > 0:33:42the idea of going out in the day when the services were underused.
0:33:42 > 0:33:44So where would these have gone, where were they exhibited?
0:33:44 > 0:33:49This would have been inside the station, so it would have been
0:33:49 > 0:33:52perhaps as you were leaving, it would prompt an idea of what you might do
0:33:52 > 0:33:57at the weekend, because it was essentially about promoting leisure travel, this kind of poster.
0:33:57 > 0:34:00And I suppose people would have known this was a fashionable image -
0:34:00 > 0:34:02that would have been seen as the latest thing.
0:34:02 > 0:34:05Yeah, and I think to some people it would have done, but I think
0:34:05 > 0:34:11to other people it was the first sort of experience a lot of people would have had of these styles.
0:34:11 > 0:34:13So it's their first kind of touch of Art Deco really?
0:34:13 > 0:34:15Definitely, without necessarily even knowing that it was happening.
0:34:15 > 0:34:17They're wonderful.
0:34:17 > 0:34:20The posters were the starting point for one of the most
0:34:20 > 0:34:26radical redesign programmes ever undertaken by a single company.
0:34:26 > 0:34:31Pick and Holden were able to do this because Art Deco was a total style,
0:34:31 > 0:34:37a style which was appropriate for all the company's assets from its headquarters building at 55 Broadway
0:34:37 > 0:34:41to the smallest fitting on the station platforms, and so too,
0:34:41 > 0:34:44the trains which ran on its tracks.
0:34:44 > 0:34:49Do you know, this is just as I remember these trains.
0:34:49 > 0:34:53When I was kid, I loved to go on the Underground train, it was so different
0:34:53 > 0:34:57from where I grew up, and they are exactly, exactly as I remember them.
0:34:57 > 0:35:00Well, although these trains stayed in service until the late 1980s,
0:35:00 > 0:35:02they were originally introduced
0:35:02 > 0:35:06during the 1930s, and this is called the 1938 stock, and it was
0:35:06 > 0:35:08a revolutionary train at the time.
0:35:08 > 0:35:12It was the first train that had all of its running gear underneath.
0:35:12 > 0:35:14It was styled in a very Art Deco way
0:35:14 > 0:35:19and had a lot of very nice features that we can still see on it today.
0:35:19 > 0:35:22You have these sort of Art Deco lampshades, which are called
0:35:22 > 0:35:25shovel shades by people who work for London Transport.
0:35:25 > 0:35:29And also in the seating fabric, and the technical name for this sort of
0:35:29 > 0:35:32fabric is moquette, and Frank Pick employed some
0:35:32 > 0:35:36of the leading textile designers of the day, people like Marion Dorn
0:35:36 > 0:35:39and Enid Marx, to produce this.
0:35:39 > 0:35:44So the overall effect is a very comfortable and spacious environment for passengers to use.
0:35:44 > 0:35:48This is so obviously Art Deco with this ribbed, sort of go-faster
0:35:48 > 0:35:52stripe thing, and these very Bauhaus geometric patterns.
0:35:52 > 0:35:58If it were treated separately, I'd see it as design, but as a whole I just think, yeah, it's a Tube train.
0:35:58 > 0:36:03It's part of the whole fitness for purpose that Frank Pick was trying to achieve with the trains.
0:36:03 > 0:36:06They're very modern. From a technical point of view they're a great improvement
0:36:06 > 0:36:12on the trains that went before but they're also very attractive spaces for passengers to use.
0:36:12 > 0:36:16The seats are pretty amazingly comfortable, you know.
0:36:16 > 0:36:18Yeah, they're nice, aren't they?
0:36:18 > 0:36:22Pick took a personal interest in the designers that were chosen
0:36:22 > 0:36:26and the samples, and we know that from the posters he commissioned
0:36:26 > 0:36:31but also from the moquette samples, he would personally sign these off.
0:36:31 > 0:36:33Even though as managing director and later vice-chairman,
0:36:33 > 0:36:40he was extraordinarily busy, he still put aside an afternoon a week to do that sort of commissioning.
0:36:40 > 0:36:45- Do you think that kind of total control helped the system?- It did.
0:36:45 > 0:36:49Pick brought order to what was a very disparate system
0:36:49 > 0:36:53in the 1920s and '30s, and this sort of thing
0:36:53 > 0:36:57reassured the passengers that they were getting a consistent service.
0:37:10 > 0:37:15Everything that we see around us has been designed.
0:37:15 > 0:37:19Design is about fitting the object to the human being.
0:37:19 > 0:37:22The challenge for me as a designer
0:37:22 > 0:37:27is to create beautiful and appropriate tools for living.
0:37:30 > 0:37:35Out here in nature, this great expanse, I'm deeply inspired,
0:37:35 > 0:37:38but this is what nature's about.
0:37:38 > 0:37:42Nature can create forms which are beyond man's imagination,
0:37:42 > 0:37:48Look at this one, for example, that's only old stone off the beach
0:37:48 > 0:37:51but look at the way if fits the thumb.
0:37:51 > 0:37:53It could be...
0:37:53 > 0:37:56a remote control -
0:37:56 > 0:37:59it could be a cigarette lighter.
0:37:59 > 0:38:03Look around, look at the forms, everywhere you look
0:38:04 > 0:38:07and that could be a telephone...
0:38:07 > 0:38:09Hello, Mum.
0:38:09 > 0:38:13It's nature which provides the most direct influence on his work,
0:38:13 > 0:38:16in structure as well as form.
0:38:17 > 0:38:21They discovered that the undulating texture
0:38:21 > 0:38:25on a shark's skin contributed to its hydrodynamic performance,
0:38:25 > 0:38:30and they've related that to the wing of an aeroplane now.
0:38:32 > 0:38:37You look at the honeycomb of a beehive, and it's spectacular.
0:38:37 > 0:38:40When we were looking at plastics, the high-impact polystyrenes,
0:38:40 > 0:38:44we thought, how do we create the stiffest structure we can
0:38:44 > 0:38:48and the lightest - well, we take away the material.
0:38:48 > 0:38:53Environmental impact is a central issue in organic design.
0:38:53 > 0:38:57This office system with its ingenious raised floor for communications and power cables
0:38:57 > 0:39:02combines three essential qualities - it's durable, has recyclable components,
0:39:02 > 0:39:04but most impressively, it's totally modular,
0:39:04 > 0:39:10so it won't be discarded each time the office needs a new layout.
0:39:28 > 0:39:33Every aspect of a product's lifecycle, the complete lifecycle
0:39:33 > 0:39:36from selection of the raw materials
0:39:36 > 0:39:40to use and final disposal, everything in between, all the processing
0:39:40 > 0:39:45and all the energy used, all the waste that's potentially created,
0:39:45 > 0:39:48is minimised so that you can create
0:39:48 > 0:39:52products that are as environmentally efficient as possible.
0:39:52 > 0:39:55There's an amazing value in this profession
0:39:55 > 0:39:59and there's a sense of responsibility
0:39:59 > 0:40:04because we're taking these precious resources that exist on the planet,
0:40:04 > 0:40:07a clay, an aluminium, a plastic,
0:40:07 > 0:40:10and we're turning them into objects.
0:40:10 > 0:40:14If, as a designer, you can trim off
0:40:14 > 0:40:18the fat on a product, you're delivering something of value.
0:40:21 > 0:40:24This Bent chair by Ross
0:40:24 > 0:40:28is an example of how he's able
0:40:28 > 0:40:33to provide the most with the least.
0:40:33 > 0:40:40He's handled the material in a minimal way and has removed anything
0:40:40 > 0:40:43that's extraneous to the function.
0:40:43 > 0:40:48For instance, he's obviously made this large cutout here at the back,
0:40:48 > 0:40:52which is unnecessary for full support, he's removed material
0:40:52 > 0:40:55here and achieved this wonderful sweeping curve,
0:40:55 > 0:40:59which kind of echoes this cut-out at the back.
0:40:59 > 0:41:05The top of the back, which is fitted to the seat,
0:41:05 > 0:41:10pan with these wonderfully resolved snap fittings, is transparent,
0:41:10 > 0:41:14which adds to this minimalist aesthetic.
0:41:14 > 0:41:17If you can make a product with less material but
0:41:17 > 0:41:20enable it to retain its...
0:41:20 > 0:41:25physical values, then for every 100 cameras you make,
0:41:25 > 0:41:30you might make another one for free just by being quite frugal with the use of materials.
0:41:30 > 0:41:32There's a lean and efficient
0:41:32 > 0:41:37relationship there with products, and everybody benefits.
0:41:37 > 0:41:42Lovegrove's economy of form is a definite advantage to manufacturers,
0:41:42 > 0:41:45who appreciate the cost-saving implications.
0:41:45 > 0:41:50What Enrico likes about this is that this surface
0:41:50 > 0:41:52is usable, OK?
0:41:52 > 0:41:56Did Enrico appreciate the idea of the liquid, of the juices?
0:41:56 > 0:42:02Ah yes, actually he found very practical the handles.
0:42:02 > 0:42:05Tri Arde, the avant-garde Italian design company,
0:42:05 > 0:42:08have commissioned a range of tableware whose ergonomic lines
0:42:08 > 0:42:13demonstrate Lovegrove's ability to tailor objects to the human form.
0:42:24 > 0:42:27If we look at the cutlery for a moment,
0:42:27 > 0:42:32take the spoon, what interests me is just the way you eat with a spoon.
0:42:32 > 0:42:37You don't eat with a spoon like this, you eat like this.
0:42:37 > 0:42:42So really what I've done is I've placed this element here to create a
0:42:42 > 0:42:45direct relationship with the body, the human body.
0:42:45 > 0:42:47In many ways I design for myself,
0:42:47 > 0:42:51and I hope that the qualities that I imbue my designs with,
0:42:51 > 0:42:55the sort of love and emotion and tactility and usefulness,
0:42:55 > 0:42:59is something that people appreciate, and when they pick up
0:42:59 > 0:43:03this object and use it in their life, that they think
0:43:03 > 0:43:06whoever designed it, regardless of the name,
0:43:06 > 0:43:10really cared about me and really thought about the human being.
0:43:20 > 0:43:26The mass reproduction of art is now big business and one of the biggest players in town is the Art Group,
0:43:26 > 0:43:32which supplies art galleries, shops, and superstores around the world from its factory in Northampton.
0:43:36 > 0:43:40The Art Group started off with just a single stall on Camden Market
0:43:40 > 0:43:4425 years ago - its slogan was "Art for All".
0:43:44 > 0:43:49Now it runs a 24-hour production line and is a multi-million pound business employing 300 people.
0:43:49 > 0:43:52When people think of art they think
0:43:52 > 0:43:58of these perfect white spaces, silent, contemplative,
0:43:58 > 0:44:01and here you've got the thunder of machinery, a warehouse...
0:44:01 > 0:44:03That's absolutely...
0:44:03 > 0:44:06- I like it actually.- This is art on a big scale,
0:44:06 > 0:44:11it doesn't matter if you make 10 a day or 10,000 a week, it still has to be perfect.
0:44:11 > 0:44:15Maybe how recognisable all these images are, I don't have any, I don't own any,
0:44:15 > 0:44:21but they've sort of seeped into my consciousness from trips to IKEA or Habitat or Argos, or wherever.
0:44:21 > 0:44:27So what's the effect of the price of this sort of art coming down?
0:44:27 > 0:44:31The real effect is that it's now in more reach of everyone.
0:44:31 > 0:44:38People now afford this and it becomes disposable artwork. People tend
0:44:38 > 0:44:45to decorate and change art more frequently, which is great for us.
0:44:45 > 0:44:50Because they can. I can see Klimt hanging on the walls, is Klimt a big guy for you?
0:44:50 > 0:44:54Yeah, he's a very successful artist, very well known, a good seller.
0:44:54 > 0:44:57Do you think Klimt would ever have thought as he anguished over that
0:44:57 > 0:45:02picture, that years later people in a factory nailgunning it to a piece of MDF?
0:45:02 > 0:45:05It's art as lifestyle, I guess.
0:45:05 > 0:45:09But it's not Klimt or Matisse or Picasso who top the bestseller lists,
0:45:09 > 0:45:14it's lesser-known artists whose work really makes it into the big galleries.
0:45:14 > 0:45:18One of the top five is Brighton-based artist Sam Toft.
0:45:31 > 0:45:37Sam's whimsical characters, such as Mr Mustard, are drawn from real people she sees on the seafront,
0:45:37 > 0:45:40and they are popular all over the world.
0:45:40 > 0:45:44Sam turned to art when she was in her 30s and has only been working
0:45:44 > 0:45:47full-time as an artist for the past 12 years.
0:45:47 > 0:45:53I like to really pare things down into quite simple shapes, I like triangles, squares, circles.
0:45:53 > 0:45:59This is what I'm doing all the time, I'm trying to put the figure in an interesting place.
0:45:59 > 0:46:02This is like the golden section here,
0:46:02 > 0:46:09so the interesting bit is always in the place that the eye would automatically be drawn to.
0:46:09 > 0:46:15You find it in all the great painters, they put the important thing in the golden section.
0:46:15 > 0:46:22Those trees will be here, which is a nice golden proportion, and you also have the golden spiral,
0:46:22 > 0:46:24I'll attempt to draw on here,
0:46:24 > 0:46:26that's the golden spiral.
0:46:28 > 0:46:32Around 2 million Sam Toft prints and cards have been
0:46:32 > 0:46:37sold in the UK alone - originals go for up to £6,000.
0:46:37 > 0:46:41Sam creates her pictures using several layers of oil pastels and coloured inks,
0:46:41 > 0:46:44and uses a scratching technique as well as fingers and thumbs.
0:46:44 > 0:46:48To make a really good Sam Toft, I'd say it took
0:46:48 > 0:46:51about 45 years and half an hour.
0:46:56 > 0:47:02I love watching people on the benches looking out to sea. Mr Mustard does that a lot.
0:47:02 > 0:47:07- So, even though it's the same walk, it's constantly regenerating in your imagination?- Oh, yeah.
0:47:07 > 0:47:12Oh, definitely, definitely, and when I get back to the studio, I kind of almost feel, er...
0:47:12 > 0:47:16so enthusiastic about trying to capture the colours I've just seen.
0:47:16 > 0:47:18It's so hard. I mean, what colour's that sea?
0:47:18 > 0:47:22- The colour of your eyes, Sue. - That's very sweet. If only!
0:47:22 > 0:47:26I always think it's like milk and I try and get that look in my seas.
0:47:26 > 0:47:30I don't know, I love things to be the same again and again. I love habit.
0:47:30 > 0:47:34I'm comforted by the same thing happening over and over again, but something a little bit different.
0:47:34 > 0:47:39Do you think that's why people are comforted by your work, though, because they sort of know...
0:47:39 > 0:47:46they love what you love and you're giving them a slice of the familiar?
0:47:46 > 0:47:49Yes, well, I hope it's kind of old fashioned,
0:47:49 > 0:47:52it's, er... there's nothing spectacular,
0:47:52 > 0:47:55it's just like you wake up every day, you take your dogs for a walk,
0:47:55 > 0:47:59- have your Cornish pasty, go to bed type of thing.- That's my life.- Yes!
0:47:59 > 0:48:00THEY LAUGH
0:48:00 > 0:48:03'But the Art Group doesn't just publish Sam's work,
0:48:03 > 0:48:08'it also commissions it and tries to broaden its appeal and take it into new markets.
0:48:08 > 0:48:12'Commissioner Katy Elliot works in close collaboration with Sam.'
0:48:12 > 0:48:15This is the book I took to Africa and I was, um...
0:48:15 > 0:48:19drawing when I was on the bus, so there's quite a few nice little characters.
0:48:19 > 0:48:22This is really nice, because you've got
0:48:22 > 0:48:25the long thin panel there, which is a really nice format anyway.
0:48:25 > 0:48:27In the home, it can go
0:48:27 > 0:48:32over the settee, it can go over any nice bits of furniture, whatever.
0:48:32 > 0:48:38We work with a vast spectrum of different artists, from illustrators, graduates,
0:48:38 > 0:48:46people that do it for hobbies, to leading photographers, artists, painters, you name it basically.
0:48:46 > 0:48:51'Working in collaboration with an art publisher has helped Sam's career go global.'
0:48:51 > 0:48:55How many copies of your work have been sold to the Art Group, do you know?
0:48:55 > 0:49:01Oh, I wouldn't know, just kind of loads, just kind of loads, yeah.
0:49:01 > 0:49:03It must be a lot, cos you don't know the figures any more.
0:49:15 > 0:49:19Kitsch is extremely difficult to define.
0:49:19 > 0:49:25It's a word that gets bandied about a lot, but what does it really mean?
0:49:25 > 0:49:29This is my favourite hotel in Venice - the Danieli -
0:49:29 > 0:49:32just a few hundred yards from the Doge's Palace.
0:49:32 > 0:49:35If I save up for a few decades,
0:49:35 > 0:49:38I could just about afford to stay here,
0:49:38 > 0:49:41and this would be the room I'd choose,
0:49:41 > 0:49:46because I'm particularly fascinated by that chandelier.
0:49:50 > 0:49:52I suppose it is over the top.
0:49:52 > 0:49:56That's what you get with Venetian chandeliers.
0:49:56 > 0:49:59Its colours are a touch sickly and sweet,
0:49:59 > 0:50:03and some people will certainly dismiss it as a piece of kitsch.
0:50:05 > 0:50:09But I like it. And I like it in a way that seems
0:50:09 > 0:50:16to have quotation marks around it, as if I like it despite what it is.
0:50:19 > 0:50:24I'm struggling with all this, it's not my natural territory,
0:50:24 > 0:50:27but the struggle is important...
0:50:31 > 0:50:37..because kitsch is a quality that modern art goes looking for deliberately.
0:50:37 > 0:50:42It pushes it in our faces, puts it up on a pedestal
0:50:42 > 0:50:49and confronts us with the vulgarity and tawdriness of our own tastes.
0:50:52 > 0:50:59No-one more so than this intriguing aesthetic troublemaker - Jeff Koons.
0:50:59 > 0:51:04He's just about the most notorious artist at work in the world right now
0:51:04 > 0:51:08and his art certainly divides people.
0:51:08 > 0:51:12But it seems to me that any attempt to understand the art of today
0:51:12 > 0:51:17needs to deal with the allure of kitsch
0:51:17 > 0:51:21and needs to deal with the allure of Jeff Koons.
0:51:30 > 0:51:33You know, I really don't like the word kitsch,
0:51:33 > 0:51:36because, for me, it's really a judgmental word,
0:51:36 > 0:51:38it's creating like a hierarchy of things.
0:51:38 > 0:51:42I believe in acceptance, and the highest state,
0:51:42 > 0:51:47the highest realm that art can take you, is to acceptance of everything.
0:51:47 > 0:51:53So kitsch is really, it's a way of segregation, it's a way of belittling something.
0:51:53 > 0:51:56It's much better in life to be open to everything.
0:51:59 > 0:52:03You sound like someone who's thought about this in personal terms.
0:52:03 > 0:52:09Are you a sort of shy guy who ended up having to make your way in the world?
0:52:09 > 0:52:13I think of myself as somebody that had no idea of the power of art
0:52:13 > 0:52:19or what art was, and that I was able to, over a period of time,
0:52:19 > 0:52:24start to get an understanding of its ability for empowerment.
0:52:24 > 0:52:27And I like to think of myself as kind of generous
0:52:27 > 0:52:31and I'm trying to make work that really can empower other people.
0:52:31 > 0:52:36Art is something that can disempower, it can make people feel insecure
0:52:36 > 0:52:39about their own history, about their own being,
0:52:39 > 0:52:43or it's something which can give them confidence, can let them know they're perfect.
0:52:43 > 0:52:48Everything about them to that moment is absolutely perfect,
0:52:48 > 0:52:52and, from that moment forward, they can just have expansion.
0:52:52 > 0:52:56So I hope people interact with these things and the art happens within them,
0:52:56 > 0:52:59that whatever their curiosities are in life,
0:52:59 > 0:53:03whatever their desire for expansion is, occurs within them.
0:53:07 > 0:53:11Talking to Jeff Koons is a tricky business.
0:53:11 > 0:53:16Everything he says seems to slip through your fingers like sand.
0:53:16 > 0:53:19His art looks dumb, but it isn't.
0:53:19 > 0:53:24It looks cheap, but there's so much modern culture invested in it.
0:53:24 > 0:53:29Koons has identified something in us all which he exploits ruthlessly,
0:53:29 > 0:53:35and that thing he's exploiting is our deep appetite for shallow things.
0:53:54 > 0:53:58Turner Prize winner, Grayson Perry, is everyone's favourite transvestite potter.
0:54:01 > 0:54:07He creates his work with fairly traditional values - craft and ideas of beauty.
0:54:11 > 0:54:17Why is it that your pots are art rather than craft?
0:54:17 > 0:54:21They're art, because I'm an artist and I show them in art galleries
0:54:21 > 0:54:23and they're bought by art collectors,
0:54:23 > 0:54:27and I don't just make pots, I think that is actually quite important.
0:54:35 > 0:54:39You can learn craft. I could teach someone to make my pots as well as I could,
0:54:39 > 0:54:43but whether I could teach them what to put on them is another matter.
0:54:43 > 0:54:48- Do you worry about that, that people might...?- Isn't painting a craft?
0:54:48 > 0:54:52- Well...- It's more of a craft than pottery now, practically. Christ almighty.- Possibly.
0:54:52 > 0:54:56I think it's more painters who are actually craftsmen.
0:54:56 > 0:54:58No, but you do have it, though, don't you?
0:54:58 > 0:55:03Because what I was saying was I'm just wondering whether people try to perhaps pigeonhole you.
0:55:03 > 0:55:08I always say I'm a conceptual artist masquerading as a craftsman.
0:55:08 > 0:55:12I'm interested in the content, I'm interested in the images that are on them and in them.
0:55:12 > 0:55:18I want to use the cultural baggage that comes with the tradition.
0:55:18 > 0:55:22When I'm making something, I'm thinking always
0:55:22 > 0:55:25about tiny micro-decisions that are about art,
0:55:25 > 0:55:29about the finished art content of the piece.
0:55:29 > 0:55:33That's where an artist is, I think, they make their own tradition.
0:55:33 > 0:55:36Jackson Pollock became very good at dripping,
0:55:36 > 0:55:40you know, whereas in the tradition of painting, he was rubbish.
0:55:40 > 0:55:43LAUGHTER
0:55:46 > 0:55:48This is the big pot for my next show, though.
0:55:48 > 0:55:53The working title is Jane Austen in E17,
0:55:53 > 0:55:56because it's about the background. All this green part here is
0:55:56 > 0:56:01all going to be completely covered in photographs and imagery mainly from Walthamstow.
0:56:03 > 0:56:08This is a tapestry he's made for his new show. It shows his ability
0:56:08 > 0:56:11to combine references from high and low culture.
0:56:11 > 0:56:16He didn't weave it himself, but he agonised about every single detail.
0:56:18 > 0:56:25It looks like the Bayeux Tapestry, in the same way it deals with issues of cultural identity in crisis.
0:56:25 > 0:56:31But rather than being overrun by foreign armies, we're being overcome by consumer culture.
0:56:31 > 0:56:37Reading it from left to right, it contains an epic story of birth through to death
0:56:37 > 0:56:41via the perils and preoccupations of modern life,
0:56:42 > 0:56:46Starbucks, IKEA, even the BBC.
0:56:47 > 0:56:50It's called the Walthamstow Tapestry,
0:56:50 > 0:56:54a reference to William Morris, who lived there
0:56:54 > 0:56:59and was also interested in the relationship between artists and craftsmen.
0:56:59 > 0:57:02You could write essays about this if you wanted to,
0:57:02 > 0:57:07but on another level, it's just beautiful, it seduces you.
0:57:07 > 0:57:12I think there's a real nobility to do something that is truly beautifully decorative.
0:57:12 > 0:57:17I want to get visual pleasure, visceral visual pleasure.
0:57:17 > 0:57:21I want to walk into some Moorish palace or gothic cathedral.
0:57:21 > 0:57:24I want to titillate my neurones, you know.
0:57:37 > 0:57:42It's almost an intuition that something in art is...
0:57:42 > 0:57:46is transferable without a lot of learning, that there is something...
0:57:46 > 0:57:49It's because we undervalue the visual, that's why.
0:57:49 > 0:57:54It's because it's very difficult to learn a language or a musical instrument, and so people...
0:57:54 > 0:57:58It takes many thousands of hours, so they think that somehow...
0:57:58 > 0:58:02Whereas looking is easy. Look, I'm doing it now, look, I'm looking!
0:58:02 > 0:58:06That's easy, but really kind of, I think to actually have...
0:58:06 > 0:58:10you know, to be soaked in art takes a long time.
0:58:10 > 0:58:13But when was it better and what did that look like?
0:58:13 > 0:58:17People who were interested in art and had a kind of more...
0:58:17 > 0:58:23reflective, aesthetic, continuous appreciation of art.
0:58:23 > 0:58:28It wasn't this sort of hop in and see the freak show, hop out again thing.
0:58:28 > 0:58:34It was something about a relationship that I think was deeper with it.
0:58:34 > 0:58:39And I think that there's this idea in art that, if you understand it, you've appreciated it.
0:58:49 > 0:58:52Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd
0:58:52 > 0:58:54E-mail: subtitling@bbc.co.uk