0:00:32 > 0:00:38In November 1989, Julie Hogg disappeared from her home in Billingham on Teesside.
0:00:43 > 0:00:49Almost three months after she went missing, Julie's mother, Ann Ming, returned to her house.
0:00:52 > 0:00:57This is Grange Avenue, Billingham, where our Julie lived.
0:00:57 > 0:00:59I remember it as though it was yesterday.
0:00:59 > 0:01:04I'm stood here now, and it's just as though I'm back all that time ago.
0:01:04 > 0:01:08February 5th, 1990, called to the house with my grandson Kevin.
0:01:12 > 0:01:16Walked into the house, smelled the putrid smell.
0:01:17 > 0:01:23Outwardly, I was like slow-motion. I walked up the stairs into the bathroom,
0:01:23 > 0:01:27and as I leaned over, my knee went against the bath panel
0:01:27 > 0:01:30and the smell came out stronger from under the bath panel.
0:01:30 > 0:01:34With working in an operating theatre for so long, I just knew what the smell was.
0:01:34 > 0:01:37I was praying, "Please, God, don't let it be Julie",
0:01:37 > 0:01:41but knowing in my own mind what it was.
0:01:42 > 0:01:45I just bent down and pulled it open
0:01:45 > 0:01:49and there I found Julie's decomposing body.
0:01:52 > 0:01:55Just absolutely hysterical.
0:01:55 > 0:01:59I ran down the stairs, screaming, "She's under the bath, she's under the bath."
0:01:59 > 0:02:03I was right all along that something had happened to her,
0:02:03 > 0:02:06but I never dreamt something had happened to her in that house.
0:02:06 > 0:02:10And I think wanting to know what had happened to her,
0:02:10 > 0:02:14who'd done this to her, just gave me inner strength.
0:02:21 > 0:02:25A local man, Billy Dunlop, was quickly arrested.
0:02:25 > 0:02:29He knew Julie, and just hours before her disappearance,
0:02:29 > 0:02:32he'd told a neighbour he was going round to see her.
0:02:32 > 0:02:35But the case against him was circumstantial.
0:02:36 > 0:02:39He was tried twice at Newcastle Crown Court,
0:02:39 > 0:02:42but on both occasions, the jury failed to reach a verdict
0:02:42 > 0:02:48and after his second trial, in October 1991, he was formally found not guilty.
0:02:48 > 0:02:53The Double Jeopardy law, which was introduced to protect the innocent,
0:02:53 > 0:02:56meant Dunlop could never be tried again for Julie's murder.
0:03:12 > 0:03:17Ann Ming and her husband Charlie live in Middlesbrough in the north-east of England.
0:03:17 > 0:03:22For 17 years, Ann has campaigned for justice for her murdered daughter.
0:03:22 > 0:03:27It's May 2006 and at a hearing at the Court of Appeal in London,
0:03:27 > 0:03:33five High Court judges will decide if Billy Dunlop can be tried again for killing Julie.
0:03:33 > 0:03:36If they agree, he will become the first man in 800 years
0:03:36 > 0:03:41to face a new trial for an offence he's already been cleared of.
0:03:44 > 0:03:50Ann's fight for justice began with the dreadful discovery of her daughter's body.
0:03:50 > 0:03:53Throughout the days, you know, the not knowing.
0:03:53 > 0:03:57And then when I found her body I thought, "There's nothing else I can do now for her
0:03:57 > 0:04:01"but to see, you know, justice for her."
0:04:01 > 0:04:03And it's just taken just so long.
0:04:06 > 0:04:11Ann has always been convinced that Billy Dunlop killed her daughter.
0:04:11 > 0:04:13In October 1991, on the night of his acquittal,
0:04:13 > 0:04:18Ann had to watch as Billy Dunlop pleaded his innocence on television.
0:04:18 > 0:04:21For 20 months the police have been looking in the wrong direction.
0:04:21 > 0:04:24They've been pointing the finger at me for 20 months
0:04:24 > 0:04:28and they've found now that it was in the wrong direction,
0:04:28 > 0:04:34and I would like them now to reopen this case and start looking in the right direction.
0:04:34 > 0:04:37The night that the trial ended, we had the news on
0:04:37 > 0:04:41and, obviously, it was talking about him being acquitted.
0:04:41 > 0:04:45And then the next thing that came on was an interview that he'd done,
0:04:45 > 0:04:47and it was just like adding insult to injury.
0:04:47 > 0:04:52Are you seeking recompense, compensation?
0:04:52 > 0:04:58Well, I feel that I should be given something for the 20 months of hell.
0:04:58 > 0:05:02You just... It's just sickening, just watching him.
0:05:02 > 0:05:05Just watching him there, you know? Sitting there on television,
0:05:05 > 0:05:09you know, saying he is innocent and he'd been through 20 months of hell!
0:05:09 > 0:05:13We've been through 17 years of hell because of what he did to our daughter.
0:05:17 > 0:05:21Shortly after, Dunlop returned to his home town of Billingham.
0:05:21 > 0:05:23Although he had been found not guilty,
0:05:23 > 0:05:27his reputation for violence had been enhanced by the trial.
0:05:27 > 0:05:30Thinking double jeopardy had put him beyond the law,
0:05:30 > 0:05:36he began openly bragging that he had been responsible for Julie's death.
0:05:36 > 0:05:40To hear people telling us that he was boasting in pubs that he'd killed her,
0:05:40 > 0:05:44you can't imagine what it was like. It was just horrible.
0:05:44 > 0:05:49And he was walking free, getting on with his life and he's bragging he's killed your daughter.
0:05:49 > 0:05:51And an 800-year-old law
0:05:51 > 0:05:55stopped us getting justice for her, that just wasn't right.
0:05:55 > 0:05:58Anybody else who had got off by the skin of their teeth
0:05:58 > 0:06:02when they'd killed somebody, you would lay low and behave yourself,
0:06:02 > 0:06:04but not Dunlop. He got more brave.
0:06:04 > 0:06:09He threatened to kill a woman and he attempted to kill another man and woman,
0:06:09 > 0:06:14and when he gets out after this, if he gets convicted and he gets out, he'll kill again.
0:06:14 > 0:06:19In May 1998 Billy Dunlop attacked a man and an ex-girlfriend
0:06:19 > 0:06:21with a baseball bat and a barbecue fork.
0:06:21 > 0:06:25Shaun Fairweather was left fighting for life and his face
0:06:25 > 0:06:28needed rebuilding with metal plates and wires.
0:06:30 > 0:06:36Dunlop pleaded guilty to grievous bodily harm and received seven years in prison.
0:06:36 > 0:06:40Even then, he thought he was beyond the reach of the law for murdering Julie.
0:06:40 > 0:06:45But a prison officer secretly recorded him admitting to Julie's murder.
0:06:47 > 0:06:49'I can't get caught for this.'
0:06:52 > 0:06:58Cleveland Police began a new investigation, led by Detective Superintendent Dave Duffey.
0:07:00 > 0:07:03We were determined to put him away for as long as possible,
0:07:03 > 0:07:06because we knew once he came out he would commit another offence,
0:07:06 > 0:07:10he would attack someone, and next time, he might kill someone else.
0:07:10 > 0:07:13He was a really violent individual, he just can't help himself.
0:07:13 > 0:07:19In October 1999, Dunlop was interviewed once again by the police.
0:07:19 > 0:07:23The double jeopardy law meant he couldn't be questioned about Julie's murder,
0:07:23 > 0:07:28but he could be interviewed about committing perjury by lying at the earlier trials.
0:07:28 > 0:07:33'Is it right that at both trials you denied killing Julie Hogg?'
0:07:35 > 0:07:37'Were you acquitted of the murder of Julie Hogg?'
0:07:41 > 0:07:44'Did you tell the truth at both your trials?'
0:07:46 > 0:07:49'Did you kill Julie Hogg?'
0:07:51 > 0:07:56He actually looked solemn and slightly beaten during that interview.
0:07:56 > 0:08:00He just sat with his head down, spoke very, very slowly.
0:08:00 > 0:08:02He was very, very calm.
0:08:02 > 0:08:06I wasn't expecting him to admit to the murder during that interview.
0:08:06 > 0:08:09I think he thought all along that if he got sentenced to this,
0:08:09 > 0:08:13he could come back out and he would never, ever be charged with murder.
0:08:44 > 0:08:46He does have a photographic memory,
0:08:46 > 0:08:50remembered the times and dates of his court appearances and what went on.
0:08:50 > 0:08:55He could remember everything about it, and he could remember in detail how he killed her.
0:09:02 > 0:09:07Because of the double jeopardy law, Dunlop still couldn't be tried again for murder.
0:09:07 > 0:09:12But he had lied in court, so he could be charged with two counts of perjury.
0:09:12 > 0:09:15He pleaded guilty and was sentenced to six years.
0:09:15 > 0:09:19He might have been charged with perjury, that was only lying in court.
0:09:19 > 0:09:25That's not a murder conviction. He probably thought to himself, "I'll do that and it will shut her up."
0:09:25 > 0:09:28He was totally wrong. It got me going even more.
0:09:28 > 0:09:31He'll think, "Oh, that bloody woman again", you know?
0:09:31 > 0:09:33"Why doesn't she just shut up?"
0:09:33 > 0:09:35He probably hates me as much as I hate him.
0:09:40 > 0:09:44When I think of it and I hear my daughter's voice
0:09:44 > 0:09:49in the middle of the night and you wake up here and it's...
0:09:49 > 0:09:55Well, it's something he's done that him or me can't replace.
0:09:55 > 0:09:58Life. It's one word, but it's a lot.
0:10:08 > 0:10:11We sat and we thought, "Well, that can't be right, surely?"
0:10:11 > 0:10:17But it was the law, and you didn't think it could ever be changed. That's how you felt at the time.
0:10:17 > 0:10:21I said to Charlie, "There's no guideline, no test case,"
0:10:21 > 0:10:26and that was what made me determined I was gonna set about getting this law changed.
0:10:26 > 0:10:33Ann began to campaign for a change in the law through meetings, in newspapers and on television.
0:10:33 > 0:10:36For every door that's open to us, there's been a door shut.
0:10:36 > 0:10:38You've got people opposing it.
0:10:38 > 0:10:41Seeing a Home Secretary, then going to see the Law Commission,
0:10:41 > 0:10:46then the Law Commission's waiting for their report. That took two years.
0:10:46 > 0:10:48If I think about us, before we lost Julie
0:10:48 > 0:10:52I could never have envisaged myself going meeting people like this,
0:10:52 > 0:10:56but once this happened, I didn't think about Jack Straw being a Home Secretary.
0:10:56 > 0:10:58Jack Straw's a father.
0:11:00 > 0:11:02I am proud of what Ann's done.
0:11:02 > 0:11:06In my opinion, she's done everything possible.
0:11:06 > 0:11:12I thought, in myself, I thought she wouldn't get anywhere, you know?
0:11:12 > 0:11:14But I was wrong.
0:11:14 > 0:11:16Julie was her daughter.
0:11:22 > 0:11:27In April 2005, Ann's campaigning won through.
0:11:27 > 0:11:31The 800-year-old double jeopardy law was changed.
0:11:31 > 0:11:36Now, people previously cleared could be tried again if there was new and compelling evidence.
0:11:36 > 0:11:40Dunlop had admitted killing Julie on tape,
0:11:40 > 0:11:44and his case was listed as the first to be heard under the new rules.
0:11:44 > 0:11:47- I'm cold.- I'm cold.
0:11:47 > 0:11:52I'm cold and I'm nervous and just churned up inside.
0:11:52 > 0:11:57It's May 17th 2006 and the Court of Appeal is holding a unique hearing.
0:11:57 > 0:12:00It must decide if the new evidence against Billy Dunlop
0:12:00 > 0:12:04is strong enough to quash his original not guilty sentence.
0:12:04 > 0:12:07You don't know how stressed I am, honestly you don't.
0:12:07 > 0:12:10I really am this morning, I'm really worried.
0:12:12 > 0:12:15I feel sick when I see him, absolutely sick.
0:12:15 > 0:12:18I wish he'd just blooming confess to it and...
0:12:18 > 0:12:23- It's 9 o'clock now.- I know. We're all right, we have got half an hour. It's only over the road.
0:12:26 > 0:12:32The evidence will be heard by five of the most experienced High Court judges in the country.
0:12:32 > 0:12:34Ann and Charlie will be in the public gallery,
0:12:34 > 0:12:38just feet away from the dock where Billy Dunlop will stand.
0:12:38 > 0:12:40I think he thought he was above the law.
0:12:40 > 0:12:44You see, he thought it could never happen, he'd never be retried again,
0:12:44 > 0:12:46because he knew about the double jeopardy law
0:12:46 > 0:12:51and he thought he was clever, and he could confess and he was one of the untouchables.
0:12:51 > 0:12:53He was using it all along, wasn't he?
0:12:53 > 0:12:59But what he failed to realise was the love that a mother and father feel for their child.
0:12:59 > 0:13:03And that's what's kept us going, given us the strength to fight on.
0:13:03 > 0:13:06They say about his human rights, what about Julie's human rights?
0:13:06 > 0:13:11You know, he took her life. His human rights should be taken from him. A life for a life.
0:13:14 > 0:13:18Ann knows that Dunlop will argue that to try him again
0:13:18 > 0:13:23will breach his human rights, and that the publicity surrounding her campaign
0:13:23 > 0:13:25will mean he won't get a fair trial.
0:13:32 > 0:13:35Two hours later, and the double jeopardy law
0:13:35 > 0:13:39that has stood for 800 years is consigned to history.
0:13:42 > 0:13:44I can't believe what's happened today.
0:13:44 > 0:13:49We've just come out of the court and Billy Dunlop's had his original acquittal quashed,
0:13:49 > 0:13:54so that will lead the way to a retrial and hopefully a conviction for the murder of Julie.
0:13:54 > 0:13:5716 and a half years we've waited for it.
0:13:57 > 0:14:00I just can't believe it's happened now.
0:14:00 > 0:14:03Hopefully, by the 17th anniversary of Julie's death,
0:14:03 > 0:14:07we'll finally have Billy Dunlop convicted of her murder.
0:14:07 > 0:14:09The next time Ann and Charlie come to London
0:14:09 > 0:14:12they will be at the Old Bailey to hear Billy Dunlop
0:14:12 > 0:14:15accused once again of murdering their daughter.
0:14:15 > 0:14:19But they don't know whether he'll finally admit it.
0:14:19 > 0:14:23On her return to the north-east Ann visits Julie's son,
0:14:23 > 0:14:2720-year-old Kevin, who was just a toddler when his mother died.
0:14:27 > 0:14:29Mammy...
0:14:29 > 0:14:33Police, friend, anybody. Just let us know you're alive, Julie. That's all.
0:14:33 > 0:14:36Kevin was three years old when Julie was murdered
0:14:36 > 0:14:40and he wasn't told the truth initially.
0:14:40 > 0:14:43We thought that was for the best, with him being so young.
0:14:43 > 0:14:46But we know now that the truth was always best.
0:14:46 > 0:14:50Trying to explain to a 13-year-old son that his mother
0:14:50 > 0:14:53hadn't slipped and hit her head in the bath, as we told him,
0:14:53 > 0:14:57that she'd actually been murdered, and the man who'd murdered her
0:14:57 > 0:15:01wasn't in prison for killing his mam, it was a really, really difficult time for Kevin.
0:15:01 > 0:15:04Are you all right about next week, are you?
0:15:04 > 0:15:06Getting a bit churned up about it?
0:15:06 > 0:15:08Churned, yeah.
0:15:08 > 0:15:10What do you mean, worry about next week?
0:15:10 > 0:15:13What his plea's gonna be.
0:15:13 > 0:15:20I feel a bit like that, but at least next week we'll know one way or the other.
0:15:20 > 0:15:24At the end of the day, we'll get him convicted for killing your mam, won't we?
0:15:24 > 0:15:28- What memories do have of your mum? - None at all.
0:15:28 > 0:15:31None whatsoever.
0:15:31 > 0:15:34Just memories of, like, what you've told me, isn't it, really?
0:15:36 > 0:15:38Sort of second-hand memories of your mum?
0:15:38 > 0:15:41They're always best-off second-hand, though.
0:15:41 > 0:15:44What do you mean by that?
0:15:44 > 0:15:47The funny stories, like when she was younger.
0:15:47 > 0:15:51It's like, it's nice. We've had some laughs as well, haven't we?
0:15:51 > 0:15:56- Yeah.- It's strange, actually, because two or three years ago
0:15:56 > 0:16:00I went back to the house and the person who lives in it now
0:16:00 > 0:16:04showed us around and, like, memories, you know? Smells.
0:16:11 > 0:16:18It's July 2006, and Ann and Charlie set off to the Old Bailey for Dunlop's new hearing.
0:16:18 > 0:16:20In order to protect innocent people,
0:16:20 > 0:16:24the new law states that defendants can only be re-tried one more time.
0:16:24 > 0:16:28Ann and Charlie know that if Dunlop walks free this time,
0:16:28 > 0:16:30he will never be brought to justice.
0:16:30 > 0:16:35This is our last chance. There's no other chance of a retrial or anything else.
0:16:35 > 0:16:39You know, if we don't succeed with this conviction, that's it.
0:16:39 > 0:16:41We'll never get one.
0:16:41 > 0:16:44So there will be no closure whatsoever.
0:16:44 > 0:16:47I could never, ever, forgive him for what he's done.
0:16:47 > 0:16:51Anybody who's had a child murdered and they say they forgive the killer,
0:16:51 > 0:16:55I just don't understand their logic at all. I just don't.
0:16:55 > 0:16:58I'll never, ever, forgive him for what he's done.
0:17:00 > 0:17:04The hearing is listed for the Old Bailey's Number One Court.
0:17:04 > 0:17:07Ann's fight has brought Billy Dunlop to the same dock
0:17:07 > 0:17:10as the most notorious figures in British criminal history.
0:17:10 > 0:17:14Everything is in place for the case to go ahead, but no-one knows yet
0:17:14 > 0:17:18if Dunlop will deny everything again and force a full retrial.
0:17:18 > 0:17:22He's due to enter his plea at 10.30am.
0:17:22 > 0:17:24I can't believe that.
0:17:24 > 0:17:28We've just found out now that the court case is not going ahead at half past ten.
0:17:28 > 0:17:33it is 4 o'clock now, and it doesn't look as though he's gonna even enter a plea today.
0:17:33 > 0:17:36What is the point of us coming here, getting all stressed out about this
0:17:36 > 0:17:39and it doesn't look as if anything's gonna happen?
0:17:39 > 0:17:42It just doesn't make... It doesn't make blooming sense.
0:17:42 > 0:17:44We might as well pack our bags.
0:17:44 > 0:17:49I just feel like getting a bloody train and going home this morning, really. I'm sick of it. Sick of it.
0:17:49 > 0:17:51Can't even get it right now.
0:17:51 > 0:17:53I mean, what's the damn delay now?
0:17:53 > 0:17:57Why did the barrister last week more or less imply he was gonna enter a plea,
0:17:57 > 0:18:01cos he said he probably would get to know the day before and he'd let us know.
0:18:01 > 0:18:06And I said "No matter what the barristers say about entering a plea, it's up to Dunlop."
0:18:06 > 0:18:10And he's that much of a bastard to put us through all the tosh we've gone through,
0:18:10 > 0:18:14just to plead not guilty and just be blooming awkward.
0:18:14 > 0:18:19Surely somebody must have some bloody idea, apart from damn Dunlop himself.
0:18:19 > 0:18:21I think he's running the show here.
0:18:21 > 0:18:25It just... It just seems like fate. Is something else gonna go wrong now?
0:18:25 > 0:18:28Oh, I'm gonna start crying in a minute because I'm just so fed up.
0:18:30 > 0:18:34Ann and Charlie decide they can't just sit and wait in their hotel room.
0:18:36 > 0:18:41What I've decided to do now is, we're gonna go to the Old Bailey ourselves,
0:18:41 > 0:18:45go and see if we can see the court listings, see what time Dunlop's up,
0:18:45 > 0:18:49see which court and see whether it's a Plea and Directions Hearing,
0:18:49 > 0:18:51as we thought it was gonna be, or what it's gonna be,
0:18:51 > 0:18:54just so that we've seen it in black and white.
0:18:54 > 0:18:58This is not how it's supposed to work, there's supposed to be professional people
0:18:58 > 0:19:01who are supposed to be helping you as victims' families.
0:19:01 > 0:19:06I mean, where's the balance in the scales of justice in favour of the victims' families?
0:19:06 > 0:19:10What's happening? You know, I don't suppose Dunlop's having to try and find out
0:19:10 > 0:19:13which court he's in and...
0:19:13 > 0:19:17We'll be having a stroke before 4 o'clock.
0:19:17 > 0:19:19I hope not.
0:19:21 > 0:19:23All I need now is some snotty blooming clerk on the door
0:19:23 > 0:19:27or security man saying, "You can't come and look at the listings."
0:19:38 > 0:19:41There, Dunlop.
0:19:41 > 0:19:43Defendant to attend.
0:19:43 > 0:19:45Defendant will attend. Plea...
0:19:45 > 0:19:49What is it? Plea and Case Management. Right, just a minute.
0:19:49 > 0:19:53Let me phone the police and I'll tell the police what I've read.
0:19:55 > 0:19:57When it says "plea",
0:19:57 > 0:19:59does that mean he's gonna enter his plea
0:19:59 > 0:20:03or is that different to Plea and Direction, Plea and Case Management?
0:20:03 > 0:20:08I mean, to be quite honest, I could just cry.
0:20:08 > 0:20:11Well, it looks as though he's gonna plead not guilty, doesn't it?
0:20:13 > 0:20:15The hearing is set for 4pm.
0:20:15 > 0:20:21It now looks likely that Dunlop will plead not guilty to the murder charge.
0:20:21 > 0:20:24If this happens, a full re-trial must go ahead.
0:20:31 > 0:20:35I feel like it's the longest walk I've ever had in all my life.
0:20:38 > 0:20:42- We are not going too fast for you, Charles? Are you all right?- Mmm.
0:20:42 > 0:20:46- Are we going in together?- Yeah.
0:20:51 > 0:20:53After you.
0:20:54 > 0:20:58The police interview tape of Dunlop admitting he killed Julie
0:20:58 > 0:21:02will be the main evidence if the Prosecution have to prove their case.
0:21:02 > 0:21:05It means Dunlop's chances of being found not guilty are slim,
0:21:05 > 0:21:12but he also knows that admitting murder will mean it will be years before he gets out of prison.
0:21:12 > 0:21:14After an hour, Ann and Charlie emerge.
0:21:20 > 0:21:22He's pleaded not guilty,
0:21:22 > 0:21:26so now they've set a date for him to come back again
0:21:26 > 0:21:29on the week beginning 11 September.
0:21:29 > 0:21:34I just got really upset just listening to him standing up and saying not guilty.
0:21:34 > 0:21:37You just can't believe this, how he can...
0:21:37 > 0:21:41how he can...plead not guilty when he has already confessed in court,
0:21:41 > 0:21:46the acquittal's been quashed and he's still, STILL playing the system.
0:21:46 > 0:21:50I don't know whether he really believes that he's gonna end up getting off.
0:21:50 > 0:21:54- I don't know what he believes. - There's something radically wrong with him.
0:21:54 > 0:21:55I don't understand it.
0:21:55 > 0:21:59He's admitted it and then there's this.
0:21:59 > 0:22:02It's just like... It's just like a continuation of the nightmare
0:22:02 > 0:22:05that we've had since the day she went missing.
0:22:05 > 0:22:09Dunlop will appear at the Old Bailey again in nine weeks' time.
0:22:09 > 0:22:13His not guilty plea means a full hearing. Fifteen years after the last trial,
0:22:13 > 0:22:15Ann and Charlie will have to sit through
0:22:15 > 0:22:19the horrific details of their daughter's murder all over again.
0:22:22 > 0:22:26What I found difficult - and it's how many would feel - I mean,
0:22:26 > 0:22:30with the very beginning of the first trial and that,
0:22:30 > 0:22:33it wasn't very promising, was it? The results.
0:22:33 > 0:22:37When I think, I think, "Why did he walk out of court?"
0:22:38 > 0:22:40I always said, "It's wrong."
0:22:43 > 0:22:48I mean, maybe I'm awkward, one thing and another, I don't know,
0:22:48 > 0:22:51but I think if they take a life they should give a life.
0:22:51 > 0:22:56What do you want? Can I have a Bounty, please? And a Snickers.
0:23:01 > 0:23:06For the past ten years, Charlie has been a voluntary worker at the local hospital coffee shop.
0:23:08 > 0:23:13Well, I work here because, well, it keeps me sane, to be exact.
0:23:13 > 0:23:17Before that I used to be sat at home starting to think about one thing,
0:23:17 > 0:23:20then another, then another, then going back to the first one.
0:23:20 > 0:23:23It's continual.
0:23:23 > 0:23:24You're forever thinking of it.
0:23:24 > 0:23:27If I'm stood here and a young woman comes in
0:23:27 > 0:23:29and she's similar to my daughter,
0:23:29 > 0:23:33well, then your mind starts, you know?
0:23:33 > 0:23:34All over again.
0:23:37 > 0:23:41I mean, you get to the point, you can't forget it but you've got to live with it.
0:23:50 > 0:23:55There's times I thought "I'm just on the point of giving up, really."
0:23:55 > 0:24:01Ann's campaign has dominated her life from the day in 1991 when she watched Dunlop walk free.
0:24:01 > 0:24:05Her niece Angela has seen at first hand the effect it's had on her.
0:24:05 > 0:24:09'It's been every hour of every day, every week, for Ann.
0:24:09 > 0:24:11'The minute she's woke up,'
0:24:11 > 0:24:13that's all she thinks about.
0:24:13 > 0:24:15How she carries on, I don't know.
0:24:15 > 0:24:17And the same for Charlie.
0:24:17 > 0:24:19It must be so painful for them both.
0:24:19 > 0:24:22With him confessing, though, won't they use that?
0:24:22 > 0:24:25Well, they use that but, I mean,
0:24:25 > 0:24:32he's confessed, but he can still say... He can still plead not guilty. It doesn't make sense.
0:24:32 > 0:24:33'She'll be elated.'
0:24:33 > 0:24:36In the short term,
0:24:36 > 0:24:41she'll be really, you know, she'll feel she's done something, achieved something.
0:24:41 > 0:24:44In the long term, I don't know how it will affect her.
0:24:44 > 0:24:50She hasn't grieved yet - she's had 17 years and she's still been unable to grieve for her daughter -
0:24:50 > 0:24:54so, hopefully, she can start that process of grieving after it's all finished.
0:25:02 > 0:25:07Dunlop will have one more chance at the start of the trial to change his plea to guilty,
0:25:07 > 0:25:11which would save Ann and Charlie from hearing the appalling evidence.
0:25:12 > 0:25:18When Ann and Charlie want to reflect back, they go to the crematorium where Julie's funeral took place.
0:25:21 > 0:25:25It's just a few more days now till we go to the Old Bailey.
0:25:25 > 0:25:27To, hopefully,
0:25:27 > 0:25:32hear Billy Dunlop plead guilty to killing Julie.
0:25:32 > 0:25:36So we just felt it was appropriate to come here today,
0:25:36 > 0:25:40just to reflect back on what's happened.
0:25:40 > 0:25:43And, hopefully, next Monday,
0:25:43 > 0:25:49we'll be able to get some form of closure on the last nearly 17 years.
0:25:49 > 0:25:54And, hopefully, get him convicted for killing Julie.
0:26:01 > 0:26:03'It was April 21st...
0:26:04 > 0:26:06'1990,
0:26:06 > 0:26:09'and the day is a bit of a blur.
0:26:09 > 0:26:13'I remember going to the doctor's the day before.'
0:26:13 > 0:26:17I said to the doctor, "You know that song, Make The World Go Away?"
0:26:17 > 0:26:20"Can you give me some tablets to make tomorrow go away?"
0:26:20 > 0:26:24Because I just didn't want to go to the funeral. Because it's like the final thing.
0:26:24 > 0:26:31I remember getting to the church and they were carrying the coffin. Me and Charlie walking behind the coffin.
0:26:31 > 0:26:33I looked at the coffin and I thought,
0:26:33 > 0:26:38"This is all abnormal, it should be me in the coffin, not Julie." I remember going hysterical.
0:26:38 > 0:26:41Just all of us actually seeing the coffin -
0:26:41 > 0:26:44it brings it all home that she's dead.
0:26:44 > 0:26:47And, no matter what, she's never coming back.
0:26:47 > 0:26:54Never. All her life to look forward to, 22 years old, with a young son of three.
0:26:54 > 0:26:58All gone because of an evil killer.
0:26:58 > 0:27:02If it had been an illness she'd died of, or a traffic accident,
0:27:02 > 0:27:04I think you could accept that more.
0:27:04 > 0:27:09But when it's been somebody that's deliberately taken your child's life,
0:27:09 > 0:27:11you don't want to accept anything about anything.
0:27:11 > 0:27:14I didn't want a headstone, I didn't want anything.
0:27:14 > 0:27:18I just wanted them to scatter her ashes in the garden of remembrance.
0:27:18 > 0:27:20I thought, "I don't need to go
0:27:20 > 0:27:24"to sit at the crematorium to think about her, because she's in my thoughts every day."
0:27:24 > 0:27:30But looking back now, I wish I'd done it differently. I wish I'd had a headstone and done that for her.
0:27:30 > 0:27:35But I didn't. I got the bench, but I didn't really...
0:27:35 > 0:27:38I wasn't really thinking clear to be quite honest.
0:27:38 > 0:27:44I'd rather have a legacy, like I've done with the law change.
0:27:44 > 0:27:49Because changing the law was the only way to get the justice.
0:27:49 > 0:27:52And I feel it's a lasting legacy to Julie.
0:27:52 > 0:27:56Every case that goes through, the double jeopardy changes,
0:27:56 > 0:28:00will be a lasting reminder to what we did for Julie.
0:28:13 > 0:28:14- Hi.- Hi.
0:28:14 > 0:28:17- Can I come in? - Looks like bad news, two of you...
0:28:17 > 0:28:19Oh, no, no, no.
0:28:19 > 0:28:25Detective Chief Superintendent Mark Braithwaite has known Ann since the day Julie's body was discovered.
0:28:25 > 0:28:28Are you the bringer of bad news?
0:28:28 > 0:28:33No, what I wanted to do was just give you an update on what's going to happen on Monday.
0:28:33 > 0:28:38What we're expecting is that he is going to enter a plea on Monday.
0:28:38 > 0:28:41- Right. - But it won't be finalised on Monday.
0:28:41 > 0:28:44It looks like Dunlop might finally plead guilty to murdering Julie.
0:28:44 > 0:28:48But, before sentence, the Prosecution want the court to know
0:28:48 > 0:28:51that he also severely injured her after death,
0:28:51 > 0:28:55and had been violent towards other women. This ought to mean he stays in jail longer.
0:28:55 > 0:28:58It's critical that we get that evidence in.
0:28:58 > 0:29:04In order that the sentencing judge, whoever he or she is, is fully aware of the circumstances
0:29:04 > 0:29:09- of not just this case, but of Dunlop's previous behaviour.- Right.
0:29:09 > 0:29:12That will affect the final sentence that he is sentenced to.
0:29:12 > 0:29:14Does Dunlop know this is going to happen?
0:29:14 > 0:29:16No, he doesn't at this stage.
0:29:16 > 0:29:18- He doesn't know?- He will by Monday.
0:29:18 > 0:29:21But he won't know that till after his plea's been entered
0:29:21 > 0:29:25- and after it's been adjourned, is that right?- That's right.
0:29:25 > 0:29:30So, really, in a way, it's not like Dunlop having a say about adjourning things,
0:29:30 > 0:29:34- it's from the Crown Prosecution and your side?- It is, very much.
0:29:35 > 0:29:38Nine weeks after she last travelled to the Old Bailey,
0:29:38 > 0:29:43and Ann is in London where she hopes to finally see Billy Dunlop admit to the murder of her daughter.
0:29:43 > 0:29:46But two hours before the case is due to begin,
0:29:46 > 0:29:49she hears that it might not be able to go ahead.
0:29:49 > 0:29:51It seems the right judge might not be sitting.
0:29:51 > 0:29:54Now, after we've met with the CPS,
0:29:54 > 0:30:01we are now told that there's less than a 50% chance that Dunlop's going to enter a plea.
0:30:01 > 0:30:05So, I feel as though it's all been a waste of time.
0:30:05 > 0:30:07It's just getting all too much.
0:30:08 > 0:30:11Just wasting your time coming today.
0:30:12 > 0:30:16I feel as though everything's just going downhill again.
0:30:16 > 0:30:22Ann rings the Director of Public Prosecutions office to see why things have apparently changed.
0:30:23 > 0:30:25You see, what I can't understand is,
0:30:25 > 0:30:28they knew that this was coming up.
0:30:28 > 0:30:35It's already been adjourned once and, I mean, you know, we just want to hear him say the words guilty.
0:30:35 > 0:30:41And, I mean, they have got us all down to London, you know, the police and CPS and everybody's come down.
0:30:43 > 0:30:46From what I understand, the judge who was taking the case
0:30:46 > 0:30:49can hear the plea but they said it's unlikely that they will.
0:30:49 > 0:30:55I don't understand why this judge has took the case if they're not prepared to let him enter his plea.
0:30:56 > 0:31:00We just want him to be able to enter his plea.
0:31:00 > 0:31:02It's just so stressful, you know, for us.
0:31:02 > 0:31:04Yeah.
0:31:06 > 0:31:08OK.
0:31:08 > 0:31:11Well, thanks very much. Thank you. Bye.
0:31:11 > 0:31:16Right. They say they're balancing the scales in favour of the victim's family?
0:31:16 > 0:31:21Well, look! Look at the state of us! You know, all this extra stress for what? For nothing.
0:31:21 > 0:31:26To go to the blooming court again, today, to hear it is adjourned again!
0:31:32 > 0:31:35After spending the morning in their room,
0:31:35 > 0:31:37Ann and Charlie head for the Old Bailey.
0:31:37 > 0:31:40It now seems that Dunlop might enter a plea after all.
0:31:56 > 0:32:01We've been in a time warp for nearly 17 years.
0:32:01 > 0:32:04You can't imagine what it was like, it was just horrible.
0:32:04 > 0:32:06And he was walking free, getting on with his life.
0:32:06 > 0:32:09And he's bragging he's killed your daughter?!
0:32:09 > 0:32:12I have gone with it all the way. I've never, ever give up.
0:32:12 > 0:32:15I just want to get him convicted
0:32:15 > 0:32:17for Julie.
0:32:17 > 0:32:20I feel as though, as a mum,
0:32:20 > 0:32:23I've done everything I could possibly do.
0:32:35 > 0:32:39It's taken nearly 17 years,
0:32:39 > 0:32:43but we finally heard Billy Dunlop confess in court he murdered our daughter.
0:32:43 > 0:32:47How did you feel when you finally heard the word "guilty"?
0:32:47 > 0:32:49Just relieved. Just relieved.
0:32:49 > 0:32:52Just so worried it would go wrong.
0:32:52 > 0:32:53Thanks very much, everybody.
0:32:58 > 0:33:01I just feel a bit numb, actually,
0:33:01 > 0:33:05because it just happened all that quick.
0:33:05 > 0:33:08And knowing now that we've...
0:33:08 > 0:33:10we've achieved what we set out to do.
0:33:10 > 0:33:15That was to get Dunlop retried for killing Julie.
0:33:15 > 0:33:19So I just feel a bit numb that it's just happened that quick.
0:33:20 > 0:33:22I thought it would take longer than...
0:33:22 > 0:33:26You know, I thought there would be arguments from the defence.
0:33:26 > 0:33:29But just going in at two and...
0:33:30 > 0:33:3235 minutes later we were out.
0:33:32 > 0:33:34He's entered the plea and...
0:33:34 > 0:33:37just going to be brought back to be sentenced.
0:33:39 > 0:33:41Nearly 17 years...
0:33:41 > 0:33:43after killing Julie.
0:33:55 > 0:33:58Ann is taken to Snow Hill Police Station nearby.
0:34:02 > 0:34:05She's never heard the confession Dunlop made to the police
0:34:05 > 0:34:09and the media are clamouring for it to be released.
0:34:11 > 0:34:13For the first time, she's about to hear the moment
0:34:13 > 0:34:17when the man that killed her daughter finally admitted to the crime.
0:34:17 > 0:34:22- It might upset you, but if you want me to stop it, just let me know.- OK.
0:34:25 > 0:34:28- TAPE RECORDING: - 'Did you kill Julie Hogg?'
0:34:38 > 0:34:43'Did you realise, at that point, that you'd killed her?'
0:35:18 > 0:35:22At least we've heard from his own words now what happened that night.
0:35:22 > 0:35:26And one thing, I suppose, that you can say positive out of it,
0:35:26 > 0:35:29she was definitely dead when he put her behind the bath.
0:35:29 > 0:35:35Cos that was my main worry, that she was still alive and he left her behind the bath to die.
0:35:35 > 0:35:40It hasn't made it any easier but at least I know she was dead.
0:35:40 > 0:35:42Biggest mistake was letting him in.
0:35:44 > 0:35:46Are you OK?
0:35:46 > 0:35:50- I'm fine, yeah, fine. - Charlie, are you all right?
0:35:50 > 0:35:53You don't feel like it's an achievement, you feel as though
0:35:53 > 0:35:57we've done everything we could possibly do to get justice for Julie.
0:35:57 > 0:36:00It's just been a long battle.
0:36:00 > 0:36:06We didn't think... We thought it would change, but we didn't think it would apply to our case.
0:36:06 > 0:36:08There was always that element of doubt.
0:36:13 > 0:36:16Other countries where the double jeopardy law exists,
0:36:16 > 0:36:21like Australia, India and Canada, have been watching the case closely.
0:36:21 > 0:36:28The press conference called for after the hearing, has attracted news crews from all over the world.
0:36:29 > 0:36:33Ann could never have realised the global impact her campaign would have.
0:36:33 > 0:36:38- Thank you very much for coming. - "We knew Dunlop was responsible.
0:36:38 > 0:36:44"It's been a long and difficult journey to see him standing in the dock at court today.
0:36:44 > 0:36:47"He's done everything he could do to avoid justice,
0:36:47 > 0:36:52"but his lying and scheming have eventually all been in vain.
0:36:52 > 0:36:55"We made a promise to ourselves that Julie's killer would be punished
0:36:55 > 0:37:02"and everyone we have approached over the years has helped me in some way to reach that goal.
0:37:02 > 0:37:07"No-one can know what it's like to lose a daughter in such horrific circumstances
0:37:07 > 0:37:10"and our family will live with her death forever.
0:37:10 > 0:37:14"It is a life sentence and a deep sadness that will never go.
0:37:14 > 0:37:17"We would give everything to have her back today.
0:37:17 > 0:37:21"Through our love for Julie we have helped leave a lasting legacy
0:37:21 > 0:37:26"that we hope has paved the way for other families to obtain justice."
0:37:28 > 0:37:29Thank you.
0:37:29 > 0:37:33"I have nothing but praise and admiration for Ann and her husband.
0:37:33 > 0:37:38"Together they have fought and won the campaign to change the double jeopardy law
0:37:38 > 0:37:42"that has been a cornerstone of British justice for 800 years."
0:37:42 > 0:37:46I would like to say to everybody who has helped us, to thank you.
0:37:46 > 0:37:49But if you would just give us time to reflect on what happened today.
0:37:49 > 0:37:53I'm just shaking. I didn't expect all this interest.
0:37:56 > 0:37:59Right. Thanks everybody. Thank you.
0:38:01 > 0:38:03- Shall I take those? - No, I'm all right.
0:38:06 > 0:38:09- Are you all right?- Yeah. Thanks, everybody.
0:38:10 > 0:38:13Billy Dunlop was sentenced to life in prison,
0:38:13 > 0:38:17with a recommendation that he serve at least 17 years.
0:38:19 > 0:38:23The day after the trial, and Ann is back in Middlesbrough.
0:38:25 > 0:38:29This is the Daily Mirror and the headlines, "Mum who wouldn't give up".
0:38:30 > 0:38:34And then the voice of the Mirror -
0:38:34 > 0:38:38"Justice at the double - justice has been done 15 years
0:38:38 > 0:38:42"after evil Billy Dunlop thought he'd got away with murder.
0:38:42 > 0:38:46"Julie's mother Ann deserves credit for never giving up hope
0:38:46 > 0:38:50"and campaigning tirelessly for yesterday's verdict."
0:38:50 > 0:38:54Seeing all these headlines in the paper, I know it's not surreal,
0:38:54 > 0:38:57it's not a dream or nightmare, it's true.
0:38:57 > 0:38:59"Double jeopardy joy".
0:39:01 > 0:39:04Wonderful.
0:39:04 > 0:39:08If there's an afterlife she will be saying to me, "Well done, our mam."
0:39:08 > 0:39:11So... I'm going to get upset now!
0:39:17 > 0:39:20Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd
0:39:20 > 0:39:24E-mail subtitling@bbc.co.uk