:00:07. > :00:12.It's 20 years since Bill Clinton immortalised the phrase, "it's the
:00:12. > :00:15.economy, stupid". He was referring then to the crisis hitting the US
:00:15. > :00:21.committee in the 1990s. That phrase works just as well today here in
:00:21. > :00:24.Britain. In particular, in the North West. We're here at the
:00:24. > :00:29.Museum of Science and Industry in Manchester, a shrine to our
:00:29. > :00:33.industrial heritage. What about our industrial future? In a special
:00:33. > :00:43.North West Tonight Debate we're asking, what is being done? What
:00:43. > :01:02.
:01:02. > :01:06.isn't being done? What should be A warm welcome to you at home and
:01:06. > :01:09.to everybody here, our guests at the Museum of Science and Industry.
:01:09. > :01:13.Each one of these people has a vested interest in making sure the
:01:13. > :01:17.North West economy is a huge success in the future. Where do we
:01:17. > :01:22.stand today? In the week when the Budget is to be announced. We have
:01:22. > :01:26.heard, haven't we, the potential that public sector workers may have
:01:26. > :01:30.their pay frozen to bring in line with private sector pay. That will
:01:30. > :01:33.hit workers here in the North West we will talk about that and much
:01:33. > :01:39.more. Before we check on the state of the economy here, let's check
:01:39. > :01:44.what our state of mind is, first of all. A straw poll, who of you here,
:01:44. > :01:51.no matter what is going on, feels optimistic about the North West's
:01:51. > :01:55.economy? Pretty much. Max, you put your hand up. Why? Investment is
:01:55. > :02:00.still going into the North West. Jaguar Land Rover, the new mercy
:02:00. > :02:04.crossing. The Government has to carry on helping us and meet us
:02:04. > :02:11.half way. We need a Government who can help us with growth and we can
:02:11. > :02:14.continue to be optimistic. feels pessimistic? As a recent
:02:14. > :02:18.post-graduate there is little for job opportunities. Whatever
:02:18. > :02:24.investment has come into the region it hasn't filtered to us. When I
:02:24. > :02:28.apply for a job there is 1,000 applying for the job. The prospects
:02:28. > :02:31.for me are limited at the moment. We know that everyone is feeling
:02:31. > :02:40.the pinch in their back pocket, for some people it's harder than most.
:02:40. > :02:46.Here is one story. My name is Tammy, I'm 24, I'm a carer for the elderly.
:02:46. > :02:54.I live in Blackpool. I'm married, for four years. I have two boys.
:02:54. > :02:59.Andrew is age six and Adrian is aged four. I spend money on my
:02:59. > :03:03.council tax, rent, gas, water and electric. I'm cutting back on my
:03:03. > :03:07.food and shopping to save for electric and gas. I feel that we
:03:07. > :03:11.are being punished for working really. When we were on benefits it
:03:11. > :03:14.was easier. I make a budget list every week of what I have to pay
:03:14. > :03:19.out. At the end of it, it seems a small amount what is left. I would
:03:19. > :03:26.like to know when the cost of living is going to come down? We
:03:26. > :03:30.don't have a crystal ball, we do have Professor Alan Harding, an
:03:30. > :03:33.expert in the economy. When is the cost of living going to come down,
:03:33. > :03:37.what is your sense? Don't hold your breath would be my short answer to
:03:37. > :03:40.that question. There are two sides of this, aren't there? The way we
:03:41. > :03:44.experience the cost of living depends on what we earn. Partly on
:03:44. > :03:48.the cost of the stuff that we consume. On the earning side you
:03:48. > :03:53.will talk later on in the programme about the squeeze on earnings in
:03:53. > :03:58.the public and private sectors in recent years. On the other side, we
:03:58. > :04:02.know the cost of certain things. If you bought a computer five years
:04:02. > :04:07.ago you can get get a Bert computer than less than you paid then,
:04:07. > :04:12.energy, housing, food. Three big items in every family's expenditure.
:04:12. > :04:15.It's all going up. You talk about energy. Here is a really
:04:15. > :04:21.interesting statistic. The average debt to gas and electricity
:04:21. > :04:25.companies has more than doubled since 2005. If a person owed �320
:04:25. > :04:32.before they now owe �640. The number of people isn't going up.
:04:32. > :04:35.The poor are getting poorer. Tory MP, what are you doing about it?
:04:35. > :04:39.It's important to note that inflation will be coming down
:04:39. > :04:43.according to forecasts. That is good news. The Government made
:04:43. > :04:49.important steps in reducing what would of been the price of fuel
:04:49. > :04:53.under the previous government by 6p. It's important to keep on tackling
:04:53. > :04:57.the deficit. We will keep interest rates low and mortgage payments low
:04:57. > :05:02.which are important for households who are struggling to pay their
:05:02. > :05:09.mortgage payments. Is it worth the price we are paying? I have a young
:05:09. > :05:14.family of my own as well. You are a single mum. You won Dragon's Den?
:05:14. > :05:20.have a little boy. Similar situation to Tammy. It's hard.
:05:20. > :05:26.People are spending more. It's easy to get things on finance. You see
:05:26. > :05:34.adverts, "borrow money" it's 3,000% APR. So easy to borrow money and
:05:34. > :05:40.get things on finance nowadays. What Tammy said she used to be
:05:40. > :05:45.better on benefits. The changes to tax credits will mean that hard-
:05:45. > :05:49.working families are �65 a week worse off. Unless they get extra
:05:49. > :05:54.hours they will lose the tax credits. They could say to families,
:05:54. > :05:57.we will not penalise because you are prepared to get out of work and
:05:58. > :06:06.look after your family. There are other ways. We will change things
:06:06. > :06:09.with the Work Programme. 1 months. She could lose �65 a week. She
:06:09. > :06:13.can't manage. Let's see what the Chancellor has to say in the Budget.
:06:14. > :06:17.We made significant progress in terms of getting people out of tax.
:06:17. > :06:23.We made significant progress. Let's see what the Chancellor does. That
:06:23. > :06:27.is a real opportunity. You run a hair and beauty salon. What are
:06:27. > :06:32.people telling you about how life is? A lot of my clients have lost
:06:32. > :06:36.their jobs. Some of them have take an cut in their salary. It's had a
:06:36. > :06:43.serious impact on my business. The only way we have been able to
:06:43. > :06:48.combat it really is do special offers and... What - how do you
:06:48. > :06:52.respond to what he is saying about how they are helping the poor not
:06:52. > :06:56.to get poorer? I don't see how it will balance out the way the
:06:56. > :07:02.Government planned to deal with this issue. One of the reasons why
:07:02. > :07:09.is because I have girls who work for me, young girls, with families,
:07:09. > :07:13.similar to your self- -- yourself. They are struggling anyway. I'm the
:07:13. > :07:17.owner of a small business. If I'm expected to give them more hours,
:07:18. > :07:23.then some of them are going to have to go. If you look at what people
:07:23. > :07:26.are saying about the North West economy, we heard about good news
:07:26. > :07:31.and the manpower surveys more businesss are optimistic about
:07:31. > :07:36.taking more people on. We have to create an environment where there
:07:36. > :07:40.are more jobs. Is it really working? It is. You had your hand
:07:40. > :07:45.up there. See something believing. Go around the Trafford Centre and
:07:45. > :07:50.have a look, how many shops are closing down? We had 10,000 square
:07:51. > :07:57.footrest raupbt much we closed it down because of the rent prices. We
:07:57. > :08:02.have a unit down stairs, the rents are going up. The big boys should
:08:02. > :08:05.work... We will talk about the demise of the high street. You
:08:05. > :08:10.travelled from Cumbria Tony to be here. You are interested in how the
:08:10. > :08:13.fuel, you know, the cost of petrol is strangling people's domestic
:08:13. > :08:17.budgets. What do you want the Government to do about it?
:08:17. > :08:23.Certainly, the cost of fuel and energy generally is a major problem,
:08:23. > :08:29.not just for me and for others as individuals, as a small business,
:08:29. > :08:34.the energy costs we pay are crippling. My gas bill typically is
:08:34. > :08:41.about �200 a month. The electricity is not far short. That makes it
:08:41. > :08:45.very hard for any small business to survive. Is it difficult in Cumbria
:08:45. > :08:50.where using your car is the only way of getting about in a lot of
:08:50. > :08:55.cases? Getting around in Cumbria is a maidge o problem for businesses
:08:55. > :09:00.and visitors. You wanted to put your hand up there, Norman? For me,
:09:00. > :09:03.the economy has spent the last four years tightening the budgets,
:09:03. > :09:09.working within tight constraints. We are being told that the future
:09:09. > :09:13.growth of the economy is going to come from the SME market. Small
:09:13. > :09:18.business. There is no long-term strategy or direction to give us
:09:18. > :09:21.that confidence to drive our businesses forward. We are talking
:09:21. > :09:25.about business economy, what about personal economy? I hear what you
:09:25. > :09:28.are saying regarding how you will stimulate growth and jobs. If that
:09:28. > :09:33.is not translating into something real on the ground for people like
:09:33. > :09:37.me, and other people who are highly skilled - Is it the government's
:09:37. > :09:42.responsibility, do you not have to have personal responsibility, we
:09:42. > :09:46.are in difficult times, we are spending on the never ever...
:09:46. > :09:53.applied for 100 jobs and got two interviews that is not filtering
:09:53. > :09:56.through to people like me. We will move on and come back to that. What
:09:56. > :10:02.you were saying about high street and boarded up shops. We are
:10:02. > :10:08.feeling the pinch in our own pockets, we are not buying as much
:10:08. > :10:13.that leads to boarded up shops. Here is one story. I own a men's
:10:13. > :10:18.shop. We found it difficult over the last few years. Last year we
:10:18. > :10:25.thought we were going to go under. It was the worse year I had in
:10:25. > :10:30.retail. There were a lot of empty shopss. Businesses closing down.
:10:30. > :10:34.Woolworths went and other stores went. Half of the town centre was
:10:34. > :10:39.empty. The VAT came as a surprise. That didn't help at all. The
:10:40. > :10:43.business rates have gone up. We never had a decrease. The Trafford
:10:43. > :10:51.Centre around the corn certificate free parking. Here it is difficult
:10:51. > :10:58.to park. How can we get customers back on the high street spending
:10:58. > :11:01.money? Meet Michael Jones, it's a different situation. We imagine
:11:01. > :11:06.chestshire East doesn't have as many problems, what are you doing?
:11:06. > :11:10.We are working with the local businesss to make it work. We
:11:10. > :11:15.published a prospectus saying we are open for business. Come and
:11:15. > :11:19.invest in our high street. You can't rely on big stores coming
:11:19. > :11:24.down. You have to look at boutiques and get the community involved. We
:11:25. > :11:29.are doing that. In maxles field we are doing well with local markets.
:11:29. > :11:34.We haven't had much help in stock Stockport, we have been neglected
:11:34. > :11:40.over the last few years. When the recession hit in, Trafford Centre
:11:40. > :11:46.around the corner, free parking all the empty shopss, businesses are
:11:46. > :11:52.going down. Come to maxles field. We are getting the community who
:11:52. > :11:59.are creating community-led solution including our weekly market. There
:11:59. > :12:05.are community resolutions we can find working in partnership with
:12:05. > :12:10.councils and businesses. We are seeing success. Absolutely. I agree
:12:10. > :12:15.with Michael, I think the community issue is an important issue. Come
:12:16. > :12:19.to Stockport it's divided than Macclesfield. What was your
:12:19. > :12:25.perspective on it? It's important to improve the environment around
:12:25. > :12:28.shops. Where I live in Marple, four miles away, there are street
:12:28. > :12:32.markets regularly. There are food festivals. That comes from the
:12:32. > :12:38.bottom up. That comes from businesses wanting to improve their
:12:38. > :12:42.local district. That made a huge impact. Where do you get the sense
:12:42. > :12:51.of community spirit from. The North West has the highest proportion of
:12:51. > :12:55.vacant shop units of any UK region. 20%. Almost 20%. Hazel, and Anne,
:12:55. > :13:00.at the back When I was in government we set up a project to
:13:00. > :13:04.bring life back to shopping centres. This problem has been around for a
:13:04. > :13:08.long time. That meant local councils giving you relief on your
:13:08. > :13:13.rates, water. The cost that is strangle small businesses. We could
:13:13. > :13:17.do something about the VAT. When the VAT went up, I bet your sales
:13:17. > :13:21.went down? We could have a temporary reduction in VAT. Put
:13:21. > :13:27.money in people's pockets. At the moment, people are not spending
:13:27. > :13:31.because people, like Tammy, have no money to spend. When councils can't
:13:31. > :13:36.raise council tax, business rates are bound to go up, they have to
:13:36. > :13:40.find their revenue from somewhere? We have been lucky. We got the
:13:40. > :13:45.community together. We just outside Stockport, at the bottom of the
:13:45. > :13:50.food chain. We have a fish and chip shop there. We took a leap of faith.
:13:50. > :13:56.Shops were closing down at the rate of one every two months much we
:13:56. > :14:04.decided to open one of the efforty units. The council were supportive.
:14:04. > :14:08.The precinct is on the up. Who can give support and ideas to him, he
:14:08. > :14:13.wants to make a success of business? We need to look at the
:14:13. > :14:19.parking situation. You can't go into Manchester. If you look at
:14:19. > :14:26.House of Fraser, �6 to park. If you have a system where you get the
:14:26. > :14:31.redemption back. Parking is killing. It's a huge issue. I understand
:14:31. > :14:40.that Redcar abolished car parking charges and retail sales went up
:14:40. > :14:44.25% as a consequence. Max, and Michael, max your view? I mean, I
:14:44. > :14:49.think Liverpool is doing well. Actually the whole shopping estate
:14:49. > :14:54.in Liverpool isn't doing well. We had a historical pattern in the
:14:54. > :14:57.north North West that we have to look at again. Not every part of
:14:57. > :15:02.the shopping viability in the North West can provide for the future.
:15:02. > :15:07.People have to change. Do we have to go, the high street is dying, we
:15:08. > :15:14.can't do anything to save it. Is that the future? I think the high
:15:14. > :15:20.street is the future. It will not be normal shops, services, exciting
:15:20. > :15:26.things like farmer's markets. You could do a fashion shop show. In
:15:26. > :15:30.London there are fashion shops. If you have a fashion show you could
:15:30. > :15:35.get more people. You are in a business, what is your suggestion?
:15:35. > :15:38.You have to be pro-active and think of ways to encourage people to use
:15:38. > :15:44.your business. You have to think outside of the box. When business
:15:44. > :15:53.rates are going up, VAT is going up, you are on a down ward spiral, how
:15:53. > :15:57.do you do that? How do councils support businesses? We talk to
:15:57. > :16:03.retailers and the owners of properties like Scottish Widows and
:16:03. > :16:08.talking about how to develop the new future. It's over for the
:16:08. > :16:11.traditional high street. Do we accept that? It is over for the
:16:11. > :16:16.traditional high street it's the community high street. There is an
:16:16. > :16:19.opportunity for everyone. It's about entertainment, eating, night
:16:19. > :16:24.life. It's about providing the offer that brings people out who
:16:24. > :16:32.will spend six or seven hours doing a range of things in which shopping
:16:32. > :16:38.is part of it. Who is spearheading this? Who will do this? Some of the
:16:38. > :16:41.work that happened before with the Mary Portas project which will
:16:41. > :16:48.energise communities and give greater empowerment to them. There
:16:48. > :16:50.is an opportunity to become a Porta pilot. We are doing that in
:16:50. > :16:55.Macclesfield. There will be other communities bidding against us,
:16:55. > :16:58.that is great. There has been a shift in the people's spending
:16:58. > :17:04.habits. Technology allowed people to buy in different ways. It's very,
:17:04. > :17:09.very different now. I have a relative of mine who has a small
:17:09. > :17:12.shop, they do most of their business in dress making over
:17:12. > :17:17.Facebook, by having a virtual shop so they have a presence somewhere
:17:17. > :17:22.else. People are calling and asking for dresses from here and there.
:17:22. > :17:28.it a case of adapt or die? You have to adapt and bring in new ideas and
:17:28. > :17:32.change to give it an increase. hope that you do that. We want you
:17:32. > :17:36.to succeed. Absolutely. That is what is happening on the high
:17:36. > :17:41.street. Let's talk about what is happening in the public sector,
:17:41. > :17:46.shall we now. Huge story there. We have seen cuts to libraries, social
:17:46. > :17:53.services, benefits and, ultimately, for some it means the end of their
:17:53. > :17:56.job. My name is Brian, I have worked here for 33 years. The
:17:56. > :18:04.company was opened after the Second World War. They opened about 17
:18:04. > :18:08.sites at the beginning. We ended up with 90 odd sites. We are now in a
:18:08. > :18:17.place where they want to close everything. They will throw us on
:18:17. > :18:21.the scrap heap. I'm at the end. They have taken my job away, my
:18:21. > :18:28.dignity away. They are taking the reason why I get up in the morning.
:18:29. > :18:34.They are taking my life away. Can you tell me, how is this going to
:18:34. > :18:39.help me as a person, and other disabled people, when you are
:18:39. > :18:45.making us redundant? Very powerful film there from you Brian. Jackie,
:18:45. > :18:50.you work with Breakthrough UK, you help disabled people. You get a
:18:50. > :18:55.sense there that losing your job is not only about losing your job, but
:18:55. > :19:00.also your dignity? You are absolutely. The unemployment rate
:19:00. > :19:04.of disabled people is twice that of non-disabled people. There is some
:19:04. > :19:07.work to do with employers to encourage employers to understand
:19:07. > :19:10.that the barriers that disable people face in the workplace are
:19:11. > :19:15.something they can do something about easily. Brian, presumably,
:19:15. > :19:22.your point is, look, everybody is struggling to get a job, by these
:19:22. > :19:26.cuts you feel more unfairly targeted, do you? Yes. Talk to
:19:26. > :19:32.David. Remploy, you are going to close Remploy down. I don't think
:19:32. > :19:38.you have thought it through at all. You want to put 1,700 people this
:19:38. > :19:44.time on the dole. I know you are going to say you will find...
:19:44. > :19:48.do you work, where? Wigan. I was speaking to a business on Friday
:19:48. > :19:53.who employ, or contract out to Remploy, in Bolton. They were
:19:53. > :19:56.asking me about the situation. What they are keen to do is to seek to
:19:56. > :20:01.reemploy some of the people from Remploy to give them the work. They
:20:01. > :20:06.do a fantastic job. The problem with Remploy. This isn't trying to
:20:06. > :20:09.focus in on making things difficult for disabled people, it's the
:20:09. > :20:14.overheads have been staggering, the cost of trying to provide the jobs.
:20:14. > :20:21.We need to tackle that and make sure we can build on your skills
:20:21. > :20:28.and find you jobs through private - What are the figures? I don't have
:20:28. > :20:33.them. It was �25,000 per head. That is wrong, it's �18,000. That is a
:20:33. > :20:38.high statistic. There are lower cost solutions that will help you
:20:38. > :20:46.use your kills. Let's find a solution to get the skills and keep
:20:46. > :20:50.the people in the jobs. Jackie? There are different solutions.
:20:50. > :20:55.Remploy was set up after the Second World War to get disabled ex-
:20:55. > :20:59.service men and women into work. It's out dated in the way it
:20:59. > :21:05.provides services, in the way in which it provides employment for
:21:05. > :21:08.disabled people, it needs to move on and move on koct constructively.
:21:08. > :21:14.Subsidising people into work isn't the way forward. You can get eight
:21:14. > :21:19.people into work for every one that you subsidise in Remploy. What
:21:19. > :21:23.would you d for Brian, have the cuts been fair? They haven't been
:21:23. > :21:27.fair, no. It's very difficult for people who are losing long-term
:21:27. > :21:31.employment. There should be ways in which that money is spent
:21:31. > :21:35.productively to ensure that more disabled people get employment. One
:21:35. > :21:39.in five disabled people, one in five people are disabled in the
:21:39. > :21:44.North West. That is a huge chunk of the economy, both from spending
:21:44. > :21:51.power and from... If they are not employed a huge waste of energy.
:21:51. > :21:55.You wanted to say something? biggest fear, along with Brian, is
:21:55. > :22:01.knowing there are 2.5 million people unemployed across the
:22:01. > :22:06.country, by now making up to 1,760, which could follow up to nearly
:22:07. > :22:12.3,000 furthermore disabled people, my biggest fear is, what quality of
:22:12. > :22:18.life is a disabled person, am I going to have, knowing I will be
:22:18. > :22:22.made redundant. This government is making me redundant. What quality
:22:22. > :22:27.of life have I? Jackie said there is 100,000 in the North West.
:22:27. > :22:31.Remploy is not just a business, it's a community for them people.
:22:31. > :22:35.understand. What I think we need to do is find other solutions where
:22:35. > :22:39.they are mutual organisations, get people together with the skills you
:22:39. > :22:43.are able to use. Based on my experience there are people out
:22:43. > :22:50.there who want it take you on. Want to employ people who worked at
:22:50. > :22:57.Remploy. Let's find solutions for them. It isn't just about a
:22:57. > :23:03.disabled situation. It's a wider. 23% of people in the North West
:23:03. > :23:09.work in the public sector. We rely on public sector jobs here more
:23:09. > :23:13.anywhere else. Steve Stock from unison, what impact is this
:23:13. > :23:15.potential pay freeze going to have that we heard about just this
:23:15. > :23:21.weekend? Not potential. It's happening. Local government workers
:23:21. > :23:28.have had two years of a pay freeze, in their third year. Will it
:23:28. > :23:34.unfairly impact people up here? pay freezes here and its hitting
:23:34. > :23:42.the pockets of ordinary workers very hard. Very hard indeed. Brian?
:23:42. > :23:48.I am member of the Nation until -- National Museum. At the moment
:23:48. > :23:58.there were so much trimming. You mentioned about public sector and
:23:58. > :24:02.voluntary sector. Year-on-year cuts by DCMS. What is that Department of
:24:02. > :24:08.Culture, Media and Sport. This cutting we had about 18 voluntary
:24:08. > :24:13.retirement from last year. Now we have to face the next cut. It's 150.
:24:13. > :24:20.Where are the jobs going to come from? Who has an answer? It's not
:24:20. > :24:26.about the pay freezes, it's about job losses. 635 public sector
:24:26. > :24:30.workers jobs lost erday since this Government came into power. We are
:24:30. > :24:36.too dependant on the public sector in the North West. Over the ten
:24:36. > :24:41.years before the credit crunch 117,000 public sector jobs, only
:24:41. > :24:48.17,000 in the private sector. wants to take this on. It's easy to
:24:48. > :24:52.use that phrase. What about the nurses, the people who work in the
:24:52. > :24:57.health service, carers, front line staff doing essential jobs. The
:24:57. > :25:06.women in the North West have been hard hit by the public sector cuts,
:25:06. > :25:11.they are low paid, part-time workers. It's easy to use that
:25:11. > :25:15.emotive language, bobbies on the beat and nurses. 23% of the
:25:15. > :25:19.workforce being in the public sector that creates a culture of
:25:19. > :25:23.dependency not one of entrepreneurship and invasion. We
:25:23. > :25:26.need more people like Kirstie, sat next to you. I want my police
:25:26. > :25:32.officers when I'm in trouble. I want them to be there for me.
:25:32. > :25:36.growth has to come from the private sector. The SME's are important to
:25:36. > :25:42.our national and regional economy they are the engine of growth.
:25:42. > :25:47.Banks should not be funding start- ups. Banks need to lend where they
:25:47. > :25:50.will get 99% certainty to get their money back. There is funding
:25:50. > :25:54.available. It's not as easy as walking down to your bank. They
:25:54. > :25:59.need to be informed to understand that. Let's look at one person's
:25:59. > :26:05.story about, who is struggling to find a job and we will carry on
:26:05. > :26:14.this debate. I'm 20 years of age and looking for a job. I went to
:26:15. > :26:19.college and did my Level 1 Child Care. I got a contracted job as a
:26:19. > :26:26.teaching assistant. While I was on the course we learnt job skills,
:26:26. > :26:32.interview techniques, motivation. To get a job I'm looking online, on
:26:32. > :26:39.different websites and in the paper or on the Jobcentre information
:26:39. > :26:43.page. I come back here a lot to use the computers and there are staff
:26:44. > :26:47.around if I need a hand. Not having a job is really hard when you are
:26:47. > :26:53.paying your own bills much you want to support yourself really. I would
:26:53. > :26:58.like to know what is being done to help people like me find work?
:26:59. > :27:06.Coral is here sitting next to Luke. You have a history degree, what are
:27:06. > :27:11.you doing for work? I'm working in a supermarket. What value does your
:27:11. > :27:17.degree hold? In the workplace I have there are four people with
:27:17. > :27:21.degrees and one with a PHD. That is saying something is wrong. It's a
:27:21. > :27:26.job afterall, are you grateful for the job? I am. I took forever,
:27:26. > :27:31.almost it seems like, to get this job. What does that tell us? What
:27:31. > :27:37.does that tell us about where we are? Talk to Luke, what does this
:27:37. > :27:45.tell us where we are in the North West when one with a degree is
:27:45. > :27:50.working in a supermarket and is grateful for it. We have 80% of the
:27:50. > :27:55.Morrison jobs for local people by battling. The issue around
:27:55. > :27:59.graduates, it's heartbreaking when you are worked, seen yourself
:27:59. > :28:03.through college and great ambitions. Some jobs in supermarkets could
:28:03. > :28:06.lead you to the Board. We need investment in this region.
:28:06. > :28:10.Investment in our creative industries. We have great business
:28:10. > :28:15.people in the room. Kevin here, Norman here. Investment in bio
:28:15. > :28:21.sciences in this region could help to drive the economy. Aet's find
:28:21. > :28:26.out. From my experience, we have recruited 15 people last year. I
:28:26. > :28:31.took technical sales graduate on this year. You are quite correct, I
:28:31. > :28:35.had 300 CVs that came through the door for that one position. It's
:28:35. > :28:40.very heartbreaking when you see people who work very hard, spent
:28:40. > :28:46.time getting these degrees. The jobs aren't there. We can create a
:28:46. > :28:50.number of jobs. We can't take this... Make this gap up. It's very
:28:50. > :28:55.difficult. I've children who are going through university right now.
:28:55. > :28:59.They will face the same situation. Let's look at one statistic. North
:28:59. > :29:03.West saw the biggest rise of unemployment in any UK region
:29:03. > :29:06.between November and January, 16,000. Is it a case now of
:29:06. > :29:11.thinking, forget your history degree, it's not a passion, it
:29:11. > :29:16.might not get you a job. Is it apprenticeships? The skills have to
:29:16. > :29:21.be pointing in the right direction in the skills that will grow. If
:29:21. > :29:27.our fund, we have three sector funds. Do we have the skill set in
:29:27. > :29:32.the North West? Are we informing young people enough... We selected
:29:32. > :29:37.those sectors because there is a experience pool in the North West
:29:37. > :29:46.of great facilities, media cities on the creative side. It will take
:29:46. > :29:49.time. We have 500 apprenticeship s. Young people need to know about
:29:49. > :29:53.that. I have a sense that everything has been drawn to London.
:29:53. > :29:59.It's all going down south. We need a champion for the North West who
:29:59. > :30:04.will speak up, be our advocate and get our young people into jobs. Yes
:30:05. > :30:09.it is. It is going down to London now. The Government drivers say to
:30:09. > :30:14.me there are no ministers doing visits in the North West much we
:30:14. > :30:19.need a champ champion up here that will make our case. Norman, you are
:30:19. > :30:22.an employer. What is their future here? I don't think it will be
:30:22. > :30:27.fixed with one simple thing. We have to look at long-term strategy.
:30:27. > :30:33.We have to look at some sensible, short-term solutions which will
:30:33. > :30:39.inspire confidence and give us growth. How will that help Luke and
:30:39. > :30:42.Coral. Coral what, what do you think? I have been on different
:30:42. > :30:46.courses. I have been on the return to work course, I have got the
:30:47. > :30:51.skills. I don't have a degree or nothing like that. What I do have
:30:51. > :30:55.is the experience and stuff. I'm keen to work. I did have a job,
:30:55. > :31:00.which was cut because it was only a contracted job because of funding.
:31:00. > :31:05.I find it really hard there isn't anything there. I agree with the
:31:05. > :31:09.point about long-term strategies. There is no simple answer. We need
:31:09. > :31:13.in the North West the climate for entrepreneurship, the guys on my
:31:13. > :31:19.right had a student loan. Why aren't we lending at young people
:31:19. > :31:23.at 16 or 17 who want to set up their own business? This country
:31:23. > :31:27.50% want to be in business. We need to ask the Government through the
:31:27. > :31:31.Budget to create a climate where young people, who haven't done a
:31:31. > :31:37.history degree, nothing wrong with that, go with their skills and
:31:37. > :31:41.create that entrepreneurship. are from Tranmere University, what
:31:42. > :31:46.do you think? What Hazel was saying before, there isn't enough
:31:46. > :31:51.education given to 16, 17, 18-year- old in terms of where to go to get
:31:51. > :31:57.this help. Luke is saying that he doesn't know these courses and
:31:57. > :32:02.everything that he can to get experience. There is not enough
:32:02. > :32:07.education. In the midst of all this gloom, we are going to talk success
:32:07. > :32:14.and the future and where the answers maybe. Take a look at this.
:32:14. > :32:18.I'm Kevin Bird of EDM Limited we are a specialist training and
:32:18. > :32:23.simulation company providing exports around the world. We
:32:23. > :32:29.manufacturer training and simulation equipment include bg
:32:29. > :32:32.cockpit trainers. Our markets have been Ministry of Defence, but we
:32:32. > :32:35.recognised that we had to move overseas to develop further.
:32:35. > :32:41.Throughout this recession we have grown the business. We have
:32:41. > :32:44.continued to be able to recruit staff and we have focused on
:32:44. > :32:47.creating apprenticeships within the business. China is a developing
:32:47. > :32:52.market in terms of international air traffic. We recognise that
:32:52. > :32:57.training in that sector was going to be a progressive business for us.
:32:57. > :33:00.We need Government to be supportive and strategic for us and for
:33:00. > :33:04.business across this country to export our way out of the trouble
:33:05. > :33:09.that we are currently in. Kevin there, who is here, is the man who
:33:09. > :33:13.could give work to Luke or to Coral or anybody else looking for it. Are
:33:13. > :33:20.you doing enough to support people like Kevin who want to help the
:33:20. > :33:23.North West economy? Absolutely. you Absolutely. The SMEs and the
:33:23. > :33:28.growth SMEs generate are fundamental to our future. Whether
:33:28. > :33:30.it's growth or export markets or getting into a new market on a
:33:30. > :33:35.domestic front if you need investment for that that is what we
:33:35. > :33:39.are here to do and drive employment as part of that. The North West is
:33:39. > :33:43.ranked second in the UK for export- led growth potential. That is what
:33:43. > :33:47.we are told here. Is that where we need to be looking? We used to be,
:33:47. > :33:52.with the Port of Liverpool, we used to look out on the world and the
:33:52. > :33:55.world came to us, is that what we need to do again? We are working
:33:55. > :33:59.within severely constrained times. In terms of lending, you have to
:34:00. > :34:05.have a healthy balance sheet. You have to have a good performing
:34:05. > :34:08.company. How do you get to that point? It's a catch 22. Providing
:34:08. > :34:14.employment is critical to any business moving forward. Have you
:34:14. > :34:17.to think outside the box and stay one to 10 steps ahead of your
:34:17. > :34:20.competition. The future is in the new mind sets coming threw.
:34:20. > :34:26.came from the south and set up business in the North West whasm is
:34:26. > :34:29.unique about where we live? What can we offer? Let's be positive?
:34:29. > :34:33.Have a dynamic environment. It's about people, you are absolutely
:34:33. > :34:38.right. The amount of enthusiasm and commitment and passion in this
:34:38. > :34:41.region is outstanding. I have not experienced it anywhere else.
:34:41. > :34:44.What is happening at the moment is this realisation that there are
:34:44. > :34:48.opportunities in a global economy. No good to just think you can sell
:34:48. > :34:52.to the guy down the road. It's about thinking there are
:34:52. > :34:57.opportunities in India, China and using the opportunities from export
:34:57. > :35:04.licences, from credit support, for businesses like his to go overseas
:35:04. > :35:11.and sell their wares. Kirstie, what is it you do, food? Healthy food
:35:11. > :35:16.brand called Kirsties. I was on Dragon's Den because I could not
:35:16. > :35:20.get money from mi why else. If I go to the bank, if I went to the bank
:35:20. > :35:24.two years ago, with an attempted business plan, I didn't know how to
:35:24. > :35:29.write one. It was a no, no. They say they are lending, they are not.
:35:30. > :35:36.We have to go to other places to get finance. You have to look out
:35:36. > :35:45.for where... The Chinese market, is that where we have to be looking?
:35:45. > :35:50.The growth sector is our students. I was at Manchester University,
:35:50. > :35:59.10,000 Chinese study in the North West from Lancaster, Preston, all
:35:59. > :36:08.over. 10,000, 20,000 fees, plus living, all the industry to
:36:08. > :36:13.everybody. You think the academia. If Tranmere were to open a shop in
:36:13. > :36:18.China, you would make a fortune. Take that back with you. The last
:36:18. > :36:26.bit I want to say. In the North West there is no, in the North West
:36:27. > :36:32.we have something to say. There is a cohesive policy it's
:36:32. > :36:38.disintegrated. We have Cheshire enterprise, who is going to lead
:36:38. > :36:45.intervention? Two comments. One from Max and Alan? You have to be
:36:45. > :36:50.ambitious. We went to Shanghai. We signed over 50 deals ranging from
:36:50. > :36:55.�5,000 to �500,000. The markets are there. They will come to this
:36:55. > :36:59.country and invest. We have to look outwards and that is where our
:36:59. > :37:03.money will come from that is where our economy will come from?
:37:03. > :37:10.Absolutely. Universities are big global businesses in their own
:37:10. > :37:14.right. Who worries me is that the more we go down in concentrating
:37:14. > :37:17.research resources into many few places, they happen to be in the
:37:17. > :37:22.south, Oxford, Cambridge and London, the more we ignore the development
:37:22. > :37:26.of those things we are good at. North West, Kevin, we end with you.
:37:26. > :37:30.The North West, what position are we in from your point of view, is
:37:30. > :37:34.there something we can go away going, yeah, we should be positive,
:37:34. > :37:38.no matter what? We have a great heritage. A will the of businesses
:37:38. > :37:43.started in the north west. If you are pro-active and focused and you
:37:43. > :37:47.can see opportunities, there are, there are success stories out there.
:37:47. > :37:53.Businesses can grow. Businesses can develop. It -- it will have to be
:37:53. > :37:56.exports. That is where we will end it. Brian, Luke, Coral, anybody in
:37:56. > :38:02.our film, thank you very much. Thank you all for coming. Straw
:38:02. > :38:09.poll at the end. How many of you feel more positive? Anybody more
:38:09. > :38:14.optimistic now than they were at the beginning? You are waivering.
:38:14. > :38:18.There are fewer of you optimistic now. Right, OK. Thank you so much
:38:18. > :38:21.for all of you being here. The Budget is this week. We will be
:38:22. > :38:27.waiting with bated breath to see what George Osborne has to deliver.
:38:27. > :38:30.You can follow any of those developments across the BBC on