0:00:02 > 0:00:04Hello. Let me introduce myself. I am "Nanny Pammy".
0:00:04 > 0:00:07Well, I am to my little grandson, Jacob, here.
0:00:07 > 0:00:10Being a grandparent is absolutely great.
0:00:10 > 0:00:12There are about 14 million of us in the UK.
0:00:12 > 0:00:15For most, it's a really joyful experience,
0:00:15 > 0:00:18sometimes heartbreaking, often a combination of the two.
0:00:18 > 0:00:23But for me, it's been very special, because, when I got married nine years ago,
0:00:23 > 0:00:25I took on six daughters.
0:00:25 > 0:00:28And that made a total of eight children between us.
0:00:28 > 0:00:32I have to say it has been a great blessing.
0:00:32 > 0:00:35Do you know the best thing about being "Nanny Pammy"?
0:00:35 > 0:00:36As much as I love Jacob to bits,
0:00:36 > 0:00:40when he needs changing, here you are, Mum!
0:00:44 > 0:00:48'Tonight, we celebrate grandparents.
0:00:48 > 0:00:51'How for some, they've been an inspiration,
0:00:51 > 0:00:54'and how for others, being a grandparent
0:00:54 > 0:00:57'has changed their lives.'
0:01:05 > 0:01:08There is an old Welsh proverb which says
0:01:08 > 0:01:12that perfect love sometimes doesn't come
0:01:12 > 0:01:14until the first grandchild.
0:01:14 > 0:01:16I think there's something in that.
0:01:16 > 0:01:21When I first became a mother, I thought nothing could beat the experience of being a mum.
0:01:21 > 0:01:24And now, I'm a grandma,
0:01:24 > 0:01:28and that's even nicer. It feels as if I've completed the circle.
0:01:28 > 0:01:29A circle of love.
0:01:29 > 0:01:32Our music today comes from Coventry Cathedral.
0:01:32 > 0:01:34We start with a hymn
0:01:34 > 0:01:37which is a perfect expression of love's power, through God.
0:04:18 > 0:04:20I grew up in a really loving family.
0:04:20 > 0:04:22I had a very, very happy childhood.
0:04:22 > 0:04:25It wasn't until
0:04:25 > 0:04:26I was a teenager that I realised
0:04:26 > 0:04:29my "grandmother" was not my real grandmother,
0:04:29 > 0:04:32but that my mother had been adopted when she was a baby.
0:04:32 > 0:04:39As she grew older, Elizabeth became fascinated to know about her real grandmother.
0:04:39 > 0:04:43With just a name and an old address taken from her mother's adoption certificate,
0:04:43 > 0:04:47she set about searching for any record of her grandmother's death.
0:04:47 > 0:04:52I had to trawl through each of the registry sheets.
0:04:52 > 0:04:56Then I sat down every evening with my laptop on my knee.
0:04:56 > 0:04:59I remember the moment when I found her.
0:04:59 > 0:05:02We were actually watching football on the television.
0:05:02 > 0:05:05And suddenly there it was, Miriam Sabina Garratt.
0:05:05 > 0:05:08And there could be no doubt about it,
0:05:08 > 0:05:10because of that strange middle name.
0:05:10 > 0:05:12And I was trembling, looking at it.
0:05:12 > 0:05:15There she was, real.
0:05:15 > 0:05:20Sadly, Elizabeth's real grandmother had died in 1970,
0:05:20 > 0:05:22aged 71, and unmarried.
0:05:22 > 0:05:25But, for Elizabeth, there was a further lead.
0:05:25 > 0:05:28On the death certificate,
0:05:28 > 0:05:32she was down as a retired chief model maker
0:05:32 > 0:05:36for the City Architects Department in Coventry.
0:05:36 > 0:05:39So I rang the City Library,
0:05:39 > 0:05:41and I got through to somebody, and they said,
0:05:41 > 0:05:45"Oh! That's the lady who wrote the poem, isn't it?"
0:05:45 > 0:05:47And I said, "Poem?!
0:05:47 > 0:05:50"What poem? I don't know anything about her."
0:05:50 > 0:05:53So she said, "Oh, yeah, she wrote a poem about Coventry,
0:05:53 > 0:05:56"and it sold hundreds of copies."
0:05:56 > 0:05:58It's not great poetry,
0:05:58 > 0:06:03but she wrote very feelingly about Coventry during the war.
0:06:03 > 0:06:06And she quoted Jesus' words on the cross.
0:06:06 > 0:06:10"Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do."
0:06:10 > 0:06:13And I read this, and I thought,
0:06:13 > 0:06:14"This is amazing."
0:06:14 > 0:06:17It was like turning a focus on a camera,
0:06:17 > 0:06:22and a face and a personality beginning to come together.
0:06:22 > 0:06:27Over time, Elizabeth discovered more about her grandmother -
0:06:27 > 0:06:29that she'd also been a well-known artist
0:06:29 > 0:06:31in her home town of Coventry.
0:06:33 > 0:06:36It was unexpected
0:06:36 > 0:06:39to find that my grandmother was somebody
0:06:39 > 0:06:41that I could connect with...
0:06:41 > 0:06:43I felt that I could connect with,
0:06:43 > 0:06:45on many levels,
0:06:45 > 0:06:47and on a level of faith, as well.
0:06:47 > 0:06:50And as I've gone on,
0:06:50 > 0:06:54I've been really surprised about how much it's meant to me.
0:06:54 > 0:06:58She was obviously a warm person. She had a faith.
0:06:58 > 0:07:03And she put it all together in this way which really touched people.
0:07:03 > 0:07:06That was so warming, to feel,
0:07:06 > 0:07:08"Yes, this is the grandmother we've been looking for, really."
0:07:08 > 0:07:11She's part of my life now.
0:07:18 > 0:07:24# It is a thing most wonderful
0:07:25 > 0:07:31# Almost too wonderful to be
0:07:32 > 0:07:40# That God's own son should come from heaven
0:07:40 > 0:07:46# And die to save a child
0:07:46 > 0:07:52# Like me
0:07:52 > 0:07:57# And yet I know that it is true
0:07:57 > 0:08:03# He chose a poor and humble lot
0:08:03 > 0:08:07# And wept and toiled
0:08:07 > 0:08:12# And mourned and died
0:08:12 > 0:08:14# For love of those
0:08:14 > 0:08:19# Who loved him not
0:08:24 > 0:08:29# I sometimes think about the cross
0:08:29 > 0:08:35# And shut my eyes and try to see
0:08:35 > 0:08:39# The cruel nails
0:08:39 > 0:08:41# And crown of thorns
0:08:41 > 0:08:47# And Jesus crucified for me
0:08:51 > 0:08:55# But even could I see him die
0:08:55 > 0:09:01# I should but see a little part
0:09:01 > 0:09:08# Of that great love Which like a fire
0:09:08 > 0:09:13# Is always burning in his heart
0:09:26 > 0:09:33# And yet I want to love thee, Lord
0:09:33 > 0:09:37# Oh, light thy flame
0:09:37 > 0:09:41# Within my heart
0:09:41 > 0:09:46# And I will love thee
0:09:46 > 0:09:49# More and more
0:09:53 > 0:09:57# Until I see
0:09:58 > 0:10:00# Thee
0:10:00 > 0:10:08# As thou art. #
0:10:20 > 0:10:23About 20 years ago, we bought this house
0:10:23 > 0:10:25in a lovely rural area.
0:10:25 > 0:10:29It was designed for our retirement, really,
0:10:29 > 0:10:33but of course, it didn't work out that way.
0:10:33 > 0:10:3612 years ago, Tony Gaskell and his wife, Lesley,
0:10:36 > 0:10:41took over the care and upbringing of their daughter's children
0:10:41 > 0:10:44when she could no longer cope.
0:10:44 > 0:10:46'Daniel was five,
0:10:46 > 0:10:49'and Joseph was six.'
0:10:49 > 0:10:53What were your priorities, then, in making sure that they had
0:10:53 > 0:10:55peace of mind as they grew up?
0:10:55 > 0:10:57Telling them how much I loved them,
0:10:57 > 0:10:59that was the main priority.
0:10:59 > 0:11:03Children love to be told how much you love them.
0:11:03 > 0:11:05They love to be loved.
0:11:05 > 0:11:07In those early days, of course,
0:11:07 > 0:11:09it was both you and your wife
0:11:09 > 0:11:12who were coping, but that didn't last for long, did it?
0:11:12 > 0:11:15No, unfortunately Lesley died from lung cancer
0:11:15 > 0:11:17and I was left then on my own
0:11:17 > 0:11:20with the two boys.
0:11:20 > 0:11:24The grief was like a ton weight on my head, for years.
0:11:24 > 0:11:27And you were having to deal
0:11:27 > 0:11:29with that pain of bereavement,
0:11:29 > 0:11:32while two sets of little eyes were looking at you for reassurance
0:11:32 > 0:11:33that they were OK?
0:11:33 > 0:11:34Absolutely.
0:11:34 > 0:11:37When you hear a piece of music,
0:11:37 > 0:11:38something that reminds you,
0:11:38 > 0:11:40you've got to turn your back on them.
0:11:40 > 0:11:44Because you've got to not let my grief
0:11:44 > 0:11:46overflow onto their lives.
0:11:46 > 0:11:48They've got enough to handle,
0:11:48 > 0:11:50with growing up, haven't they?
0:11:50 > 0:11:53And all the time, you were dealing with everything
0:11:53 > 0:11:54on your own?
0:11:54 > 0:11:55Everything, everything.
0:11:55 > 0:11:57I'm a dreadful cook.
0:11:57 > 0:12:00I've even been to lessons to try...
0:12:00 > 0:12:01I still can't do it.
0:12:01 > 0:12:03Still hopeless.
0:12:03 > 0:12:05But you get on with it.
0:12:05 > 0:12:08It just happens.
0:12:08 > 0:12:11I had to go to parents' evenings.
0:12:11 > 0:12:13I found it ultra-hard,
0:12:13 > 0:12:16I really did, and I had to learn how to do it.
0:12:16 > 0:12:19If Joseph says, "What d'you think about this, Grandad?"
0:12:19 > 0:12:21I can't say, "Well, I don't know how to do it,"
0:12:21 > 0:12:25you've got to try and get through it for him,
0:12:25 > 0:12:26as a father would.
0:12:26 > 0:12:30Where do you go when you want to talk things over?
0:12:30 > 0:12:32I belong to my local church.
0:12:32 > 0:12:34It's very peaceful there.
0:12:34 > 0:12:38I think prayer comes in a million different ways.
0:12:38 > 0:12:40I think a prayer can be a thank you
0:12:40 > 0:12:43for something that happens in my day.
0:12:43 > 0:12:45And that's my source of prayer.
0:12:45 > 0:12:47Wouldn't it have been nice if your wife were here
0:12:47 > 0:12:50to share all this with you?
0:12:50 > 0:12:51I talk to my wife.
0:12:51 > 0:12:54I believe she's listening to me and she can hear me.
0:12:54 > 0:12:56D'you know what I would like most of all?
0:12:56 > 0:12:59To hear her opinion
0:12:59 > 0:13:01what she thinks of them now.
0:13:01 > 0:13:04Because they are two fabulous boys.
0:13:04 > 0:13:06They really are. I'm not just saying that, they are.
0:15:22 > 0:15:25She was definitely the ideal grandma.
0:15:25 > 0:15:28We'd play games, and she'd teach us how to bandage up
0:15:28 > 0:15:31our teddy bears properly.
0:15:31 > 0:15:36Then always on a Sunday morning, she'd take us to church.
0:15:36 > 0:15:39When she was in her 20s, she trained as a nurse and a midwife,
0:15:39 > 0:15:41with an order of nuns.
0:15:41 > 0:15:45I remember when my mum told me she was writing a book about it.
0:15:45 > 0:15:48I was about ten, and I really wanted to read it,
0:15:48 > 0:15:51but my mum said it was far too graphic
0:15:51 > 0:15:53and not for a ten-year-old, so I had to wait for a little while.
0:15:53 > 0:15:56That book and its sequels
0:15:56 > 0:15:59are now phenomenal bestsellers.
0:15:59 > 0:16:01And Eleanor's grandma, Jennifer Worth,
0:16:01 > 0:16:03has been immortalised
0:16:03 > 0:16:06in the popular BBC series, Call The Midwife.
0:16:06 > 0:16:10It's been incredible to watch it progress from this
0:16:10 > 0:16:13very privately-published book
0:16:13 > 0:16:16to suddenly this huge piece of writing
0:16:16 > 0:16:18that everyone is wanting to read,
0:16:18 > 0:16:21and whenever you hear people saying, "Oh, did you watch Call The Midwife?",
0:16:21 > 0:16:24I'm like, "Yes! Course I did!"
0:16:24 > 0:16:26I ate at least four slices of that cake,
0:16:26 > 0:16:28and I didn't realise I was coming to a convent.
0:16:28 > 0:16:31'It's been a really nice tribute to her.
0:16:31 > 0:16:34'She died just before they started filming for it.
0:16:34 > 0:16:36'But right up until the end,
0:16:36 > 0:16:39'she was very involved with the casting and scriptwriting and stuff.'
0:16:39 > 0:16:41Do you have a faith, Nurse Lee?
0:16:41 > 0:16:43Not really.
0:16:43 > 0:16:44I'm Church of England.
0:16:44 > 0:16:46We're Anglican, too.
0:16:46 > 0:16:47I think she would have definitely
0:16:47 > 0:16:50been proud of what they've made of it,
0:16:50 > 0:16:51but she was very practical
0:16:51 > 0:16:53and didn't like to make a fuss over anything.
0:16:53 > 0:16:56She probably thought this would have been very over the top
0:16:56 > 0:16:58and very unnecessary, and all of that.
0:16:58 > 0:17:01But I think she would have really appreciated it.
0:17:01 > 0:17:03Your grandma's story
0:17:03 > 0:17:04has made a very big impression on you.
0:17:04 > 0:17:06Definitely.
0:17:06 > 0:17:09I knew I always wanted to go into care work,
0:17:09 > 0:17:11ever since I was little.
0:17:11 > 0:17:14But I've definitely decided I want to do midwifery,
0:17:14 > 0:17:16and I've applied to do midwifery at university.
0:17:16 > 0:17:20I think it's just an amazing thing to do,
0:17:20 > 0:17:24and I'm so jealous of my grandma - that she got to do that for so long,
0:17:24 > 0:17:25and that she loved it so much.
0:17:25 > 0:17:28She was certainly remarkable in life,
0:17:28 > 0:17:31but also remarkable as she faced death.
0:17:31 > 0:17:34When she was diagnosed with cancer,
0:17:34 > 0:17:35it was such a shock.
0:17:35 > 0:17:40I think she was the one that helped us through it the most.
0:17:40 > 0:17:43As she became more ill, it was definitely more apparent
0:17:43 > 0:17:45how important her faith was to her.
0:17:45 > 0:17:49She always had a cross and a Bible next to her bed.
0:17:51 > 0:17:53Right until the very end,
0:17:53 > 0:17:56if we had a big solo or something,
0:17:56 > 0:17:59she'd always come and be in the front pew, watching us.
0:17:59 > 0:18:03Going to church now, it keeps her alive, as well.
0:18:03 > 0:18:09# Rejoice in God, my saviour. #
0:21:42 > 0:21:44I was at work.
0:21:44 > 0:21:46And my son rang me.
0:21:46 > 0:21:48I picked the phone up,
0:21:48 > 0:21:51and there was a crying young man on the other end of the phone,
0:21:51 > 0:21:54saying, "It's a girl, it's a girl!
0:21:54 > 0:21:56"And she's beautiful."
0:21:56 > 0:22:00We had a moment, he and I, on the phone together, I have to say.
0:22:00 > 0:22:03Something quite extraordinary
0:22:03 > 0:22:06when your own children have children themselves.
0:22:09 > 0:22:13Being a grandfather is something that I always imagined
0:22:13 > 0:22:16as suddenly making you very old.
0:22:16 > 0:22:19But it did the opposite - it was a wonderful event.
0:22:19 > 0:22:22We were part of her life for seven years.
0:22:22 > 0:22:25They were wonderful, joyous times.
0:22:25 > 0:22:28Happy times. Lots of laughs, lots of giggling.
0:22:28 > 0:22:33One day, five years ago, Jane and Marc saw their granddaughter
0:22:33 > 0:22:35for the last time.
0:22:35 > 0:22:40Divorce and family breakdown meant a total separation.
0:22:40 > 0:22:43Being a grandparent, you think
0:22:43 > 0:22:46you should be able to put things right.
0:22:46 > 0:22:50You are actually quite ashamed, and you feel ashamed
0:22:50 > 0:22:52that you can't sort it out and put things right.
0:22:52 > 0:22:55Whenever she came here,
0:22:55 > 0:22:58she always enjoyed our summerhouse.
0:22:58 > 0:23:00It was her private place where she could go out and read,
0:23:00 > 0:23:03and she could paint.
0:23:03 > 0:23:05That was her place and it was full of all her things
0:23:05 > 0:23:07when she'd gone.
0:23:09 > 0:23:12Having gone through those quite dark days, some of them,
0:23:12 > 0:23:17I made the conscious decision that I had to make
0:23:17 > 0:23:19a positive out of a negative.
0:23:19 > 0:23:21So, I did a bit of research,
0:23:21 > 0:23:22and found out that actually
0:23:22 > 0:23:25there's over a million children in the United Kingdom
0:23:25 > 0:23:27who are denied contact with their grandparents.
0:23:27 > 0:23:29So I thought I would try and set up
0:23:29 > 0:23:31a support group.
0:23:31 > 0:23:35And, to my astonishment, people turned up.
0:23:35 > 0:23:37What we're doing is,
0:23:37 > 0:23:38we're supporting each other.
0:23:38 > 0:23:40We're all here to listen,
0:23:40 > 0:23:45and I've met some very good friends as a result of a huge negative in my life.
0:23:45 > 0:23:46I don't think I could be doing
0:23:46 > 0:23:48what I'm doing
0:23:48 > 0:23:51unless somebody bigger and better than me, somewhere,
0:23:51 > 0:23:54is steering me along that course.
0:23:54 > 0:23:57I spend hours on the telephone,
0:23:57 > 0:23:59talking to grandparents in huge distress.
0:23:59 > 0:24:01I wouldn't be able to cope with that
0:24:01 > 0:24:03unless there was somebody
0:24:03 > 0:24:06just saying, "Come on, Jane, you can deal with this."
0:24:06 > 0:24:08You have to hope.
0:24:08 > 0:24:12If you don't hope, then the question is, "What's the point?"
0:24:12 > 0:24:15I hope that one day she will find us.
0:24:15 > 0:24:17We're hoping for that knock on the door.
0:24:26 > 0:24:33# The Lord's my shepherd
0:24:33 > 0:24:38# I'll not want
0:24:38 > 0:24:42# He makes me down to lie
0:24:43 > 0:24:46# In pastures green
0:24:46 > 0:24:50# He leadeth me
0:24:50 > 0:24:57# The quiet waters by
0:25:01 > 0:25:04# My soul he doth
0:25:04 > 0:25:08# Restore again
0:25:08 > 0:25:11# And me to walk
0:25:11 > 0:25:14# Doth make
0:25:16 > 0:25:22# Within the paths of righteousness
0:25:22 > 0:25:28# E'en for his own name's sake
0:25:31 > 0:25:40# Yea, though I walk through death's dark vale
0:25:40 > 0:25:47# Yet will I fear not ill
0:25:47 > 0:25:52# For thou art with me
0:25:52 > 0:26:02# And thy rod and staff me comfort still
0:26:03 > 0:26:10# My table thou has furnished
0:26:10 > 0:26:18# In presence of my foes
0:26:18 > 0:26:24# My head thou dost with oil anoint
0:26:24 > 0:26:30# And my cup overflows
0:26:33 > 0:26:37# Goodness and mercy
0:26:37 > 0:26:41# All my life
0:26:41 > 0:26:45# Shall surely follow
0:26:45 > 0:26:48# Follow me
0:26:48 > 0:26:52# And in God's house
0:26:52 > 0:26:59# For evermore
0:26:59 > 0:27:11# My dwelling place shall be
0:27:21 > 0:27:27# Goodness and mercy all my life
0:27:29 > 0:27:35# Shall surely follow me. #
0:27:41 > 0:27:47This is my nan, Lily, and she brought up her children, during the Second World War, in Kent
0:27:47 > 0:27:51with the Battle of Britain raging in the skies overhead.
0:27:51 > 0:27:55What got the family through was that they worked together
0:27:55 > 0:27:56and they made do.
0:27:56 > 0:28:00Well, nowadays, we have so much and want still more,
0:28:00 > 0:28:04so perhaps there is quite a bit that we could learn from my nan's generation.
0:28:09 > 0:28:14My grandfather was a Christian but the main thing was about him
0:28:14 > 0:28:17he lived it out.
0:28:17 > 0:28:19He never ever gave you the feeling that you,
0:28:19 > 0:28:22if you were wrong, you couldn't be forgiven.
0:28:22 > 0:28:25He always had that attitude.
0:28:25 > 0:28:28My grandmother was matriarchal,
0:28:28 > 0:28:30and she was strict.
0:28:30 > 0:28:32But she was also
0:28:32 > 0:28:33very human, as well.
0:28:35 > 0:28:38I used to love standing next to her in the chapel and singing.
0:28:41 > 0:28:43He would just pick me up,
0:28:43 > 0:28:45put me on his lap,
0:28:45 > 0:28:48and cuddle me.
0:28:48 > 0:28:50I could hear his heartbeat
0:28:50 > 0:28:52and I'd go...
0:28:52 > 0:28:55I'd just drop off to sleep.
0:28:55 > 0:28:59And that was a lovely feeling
0:28:59 > 0:29:01and I've never forgotten it.
0:29:02 > 0:29:06She very much showed me what was beautiful around me.
0:29:06 > 0:29:10That feeling that you're always, always a part
0:29:10 > 0:29:13of something so much bigger than yourself,
0:29:13 > 0:29:16and that you matter, no matter what you do.
0:29:17 > 0:29:22I told my grandmother that I'd like to do some family tree research
0:29:22 > 0:29:27and she suddenly produced an old, rather tatty family Bible,
0:29:27 > 0:29:30which she said had some names inside it,
0:29:30 > 0:29:33and I talked about them to her.
0:29:33 > 0:29:40I do wish now that my grandmother was here to see
0:29:40 > 0:29:42what I've found out about the family.
0:29:44 > 0:29:50There are lots of things I'd like to be able to tell my grandparents, or I'd love for them to share now.
0:29:54 > 0:30:01# The Lord bless you and keep you
0:30:01 > 0:30:07# The Lord make his face
0:30:07 > 0:30:12# To shine upon you
0:30:12 > 0:30:20# And be gracious unto you
0:30:20 > 0:30:30# The Lord lift his countenance
0:30:30 > 0:30:38# Upon you
0:30:38 > 0:30:47# And give you
0:30:47 > 0:30:52# Peace. #
0:30:55 > 0:30:57- HE BURPS - Oh!
0:30:57 > 0:31:00There can't be many things
0:31:00 > 0:31:03that are better than having a cuddle
0:31:03 > 0:31:04with your grandchild,
0:31:04 > 0:31:06and there is a really special bond
0:31:06 > 0:31:09that spans the generations.
0:31:09 > 0:31:12So that to have a loving, and a loved, grandparent in your life
0:31:12 > 0:31:14can really shape what you become.
0:31:14 > 0:31:18And, you know, they make us all we could be, too.
0:31:18 > 0:31:22And for Jacob and me, blessings don't come much better than that.
0:33:17 > 0:33:20Next week, Aled meets some famous faces
0:33:20 > 0:33:23who, like him, were once choristers,
0:33:23 > 0:33:28and finds out how that experience as a youngster
0:33:28 > 0:33:31has made a difference to their lives since.
0:33:31 > 0:33:34There'll also be some wonderful hymns sung by choristers
0:33:34 > 0:33:35from all over the country.
0:33:55 > 0:33:58Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd