:00:00. > :00:00.The White House hasn't released details but a draft called for a 30
:00:00. > :00:00.day suspension on visas for people from countries including Syria and
:00:07. > :00:16.Iraq has been put in place. In August, 2016, Thae Yong-ho became
:00:17. > :00:21.one of the highest ranking officials ever to defect from North Korea. He
:00:22. > :00:24.had been a diplomat for Tongan in London. He has been speaking to our
:00:25. > :00:33.sole correspondent. I'm Steve Evans and this is Seoul,
:00:34. > :00:39.one of the most prosperous and bustling cities in Asia. It is only
:00:40. > :00:45.100 miles from Pyongyang, but in terms of atmosphere and attitude it
:00:46. > :00:48.is 1 million miles away. This is now the home of Thae Yong-ho, the North
:00:49. > :00:54.Korean diplomat who defected from London. He lives here in secret,
:00:55. > :01:03.accompanied by a body guards, often in disguise. North Korea called him
:01:04. > :01:07.human scum and that's because he was so central to North Korea's
:01:08. > :01:17.diplomatic effort. I will be talking to him in a moment. He lived in
:01:18. > :01:20.London with his family and the families of two other North Korean
:01:21. > :01:25.diplomats in the embassy. Outwardly a bush while suburban house. Thae
:01:26. > :01:35.Yong-ho escorted Kim Jong-un's brother to a rock concert in the
:01:36. > :01:46.Royal Albert Hall. -- outwardly a Rouge was. He summed the praises of
:01:47. > :01:54.socialism. And now in South Korea where I met him. He won't say how he
:01:55. > :02:00.got here. The secret services of the United States or Britain, or South
:02:01. > :02:03.Korea helped? Hao Wei you getting on in Seoul? But he did talk about how
:02:04. > :02:09.his family turned him against the regime in Tom Young. -- how are you
:02:10. > :02:14.getting on. Me and my family, my sons and my wife, did not come to
:02:15. > :02:22.that kind of conclusion just in one day. At the first stage there is a
:02:23. > :02:31.kind of ideological debate inside the family, especially between me
:02:32. > :02:38.and my son is, when my son is entered the UK's university, the
:02:39. > :02:44.education they received was quite different to what they got in North
:02:45. > :02:51.Korea. It was something totally different. So at first they started
:02:52. > :02:59.to ask me questions, why, when they learned history in high school, then
:03:00. > :03:05.my son after school he came to me and asked which is right, about the
:03:06. > :03:11.Second World War, the First World War. So there was quite a different
:03:12. > :03:18.explanation about the same thing in the UK and North Korea. So first of
:03:19. > :03:25.these questions started to come up to me and then these questions
:03:26. > :03:31.pushed me into a very difficult situation, e-commerce as a father I
:03:32. > :03:38.have to tell the truth. -- because as a father. And if I tell the truth
:03:39. > :03:44.then my explanation would be quite different to what the North Korean
:03:45. > :03:51.regime, you know, so far brainwashed. But as a father I can't
:03:52. > :04:03.tell them liars, so I started to tell them the truth. Meanwhile, the
:04:04. > :04:07.environment of my sons was a little bit difficult for my sons to cope
:04:08. > :04:15.with. For instance, when my son had long hair, then his friends may ask
:04:16. > :04:20.questions like, aren't you afraid of being arrested by Kim Jong-un
:04:21. > :04:31.because you have long hair? In North Korea, if anyone has long hair, that
:04:32. > :04:36.is the subject of these kinds of questions. They always make my son
:04:37. > :04:45.is very difficult when they mingle with British friends. And his
:04:46. > :04:52.friends asked my son questions like why there is no internet, why North
:04:53. > :04:57.Korea and are forbidden to access internet. My sons asked me, wiry
:04:58. > :05:05.doesn't the North Korean regime allowed the internet? These very
:05:06. > :05:09.simple questions. I have to tell them the long story wire, why are
:05:10. > :05:20.politically. So these kinds of questions and debate is started
:05:21. > :05:24.inside my family. At that time I thought my sons deserve the truth.
:05:25. > :05:33.But the truth is very dangerous, isn't it? Because if you were then
:05:34. > :05:37.putting the party line out in public, but the truth to your
:05:38. > :05:41.sons... There was a danger that your sons were going to say, my dad
:05:42. > :05:46.doesn't believe all that stuff, and then your life was in danger. That's
:05:47. > :05:52.right. I always have to remind my son that they should keep what I
:05:53. > :06:00.told them in their mind. They should not tell anyone. As a diplomat, I
:06:01. > :06:09.have to pretend to be loyal to the regime. So all these things put me
:06:10. > :06:17.in a very difficult condition inside the family and, meanwhile, I learnt
:06:18. > :06:25.that since my sons knew the truth it would be very difficult for them in
:06:26. > :06:34.their future to survive in North Korea. Was it gradual? It was a very
:06:35. > :06:37.long process. Because a year ago even you are going to public
:06:38. > :06:42.meetings with the Communist Party and singing the praises of Kim
:06:43. > :06:51.Jong-un and socialism. So did you believe it when he said that? No,
:06:52. > :07:00.because actually to be honest my doubt on the North Korean regime and
:07:01. > :07:08.North Korean society started even in the late 1990s. Making the decision
:07:09. > :07:21.was that I was lucky to bring both of my sons to London, because
:07:22. > :07:30.diplomats of North Korea should leave one of his children in
:07:31. > :07:35.Pyongyang, to abuse this to a love between parents and children as a
:07:36. > :07:44.kind of tool to control the diplomats. But I was lucky. You
:07:45. > :07:48.still have family in North Korea. Will you ever see them again, will
:07:49. > :07:56.you ever talk to them again? You have any indication about how they
:07:57. > :08:05.feel? So far now iambic target of the organisation by the North Korean
:08:06. > :08:12.regime. -- now I am the target. I am sure that my relatives, my brother
:08:13. > :08:20.at and sisters, family, by now are all sent to either removed, closed
:08:21. > :08:27.areas or prison camps. So that really breaks my heart. If you could
:08:28. > :08:34.imagine your rather shouting at you, why did you do this to me? --
:08:35. > :08:48.brother. Why did you put me in this place? What would you say? That is
:08:49. > :08:55.really, you know, a question which I do not like to even think about.
:08:56. > :09:02.Yes. But that's why I am very much now determined to do everything
:09:03. > :09:08.possible to pull down the North Korean regime, in order to save not
:09:09. > :09:15.only my family members but the whole North Korean people from slavery.
:09:16. > :09:20.The think you will ever see your brother again? I am absolutely sure
:09:21. > :09:25.and this is my dream, to walk back to my hometown. Lots of people
:09:26. > :09:30.outside say there is a prison camp system in North Korea, Gulag system.
:09:31. > :09:37.The regime in Pyongyang emphatically denies that. What's the truth of it
:09:38. > :09:42.as you see it? All North Korean people know that there is a prison
:09:43. > :09:54.camps. It is common knowledge inside North Korea. And it is the kind
:09:55. > :10:01.of... One part of everyday life in North Korea, that if you commit any
:10:02. > :10:08.crime is which is the threat to the system, then you will be sent to
:10:09. > :10:16.these prison camps. Thousands of families in Pyongyang were all sent
:10:17. > :10:25.to the prison camps. Not one or two, thousands of families were sent to
:10:26. > :10:33.prison camps. There is a new president in Washington with a very
:10:34. > :10:39.different tone and many policy. And your former country is much closer
:10:40. > :10:49.to having nuclear weapons. What do you think should be done? The Trump
:10:50. > :10:54.administration should not acknowledge the status of North
:10:55. > :11:03.Korea as a nuclear power, because Kim Jong-un and the regime want to
:11:04. > :11:11.achieve a kind of compromise between North Korea and America. So the
:11:12. > :11:18.American administration should not fall in this trap. Don't do deals?
:11:19. > :11:29.To do deals, and they should continue to push the sanctions and
:11:30. > :11:33.they should continue the concerted effort to sanction North Korea, the
:11:34. > :11:38.North Korea should give up the nuclear weapons programme itself.
:11:39. > :11:42.If, when, Kim Jong-un gets the bomb properly, and missiles to deliver,
:11:43. > :11:53.is he capable of pressing that Hutton and destroying Los Angeles?
:11:54. > :12:07.Kim Jong-un knows quite well that nuclear weapons are the only
:12:08. > :12:23.guarantee for his rule. Kim Jong-un, I think, will press the button of
:12:24. > :12:34.this dangerous weapon when he thinks that his rule and his dynasty is
:12:35. > :12:37.threatened to collapse. He would destroy Los Angeles, even though the
:12:38. > :12:49.retaliation would kill him? Yes, because he knew that if... He lose
:12:50. > :13:05.the power, then it is his last day. So he may do anything... To attack
:13:06. > :13:14.Los Angeles, because once the people know that in any way he will be
:13:15. > :13:19.killed, then you can do anything. That is the human beings' normal
:13:20. > :13:27.reaction. How do you assess Kim Jong-un? He is sometimes painted
:13:28. > :13:31.outside as a buffoon, as not very bright, and sometimes as well as
:13:32. > :13:42.being very devious. How do you assess him? You know, North Korean
:13:43. > :13:55.society can only be held in place by idolising or raising the leader as a
:13:56. > :14:05.god. So we have to remove the image and the process of idealisation of
:14:06. > :14:13.Kim Jong-un insight North Korean society. He rules by fear, clearly.
:14:14. > :14:18.But also I watched three girls in Pyongyang. They didn't know they
:14:19. > :14:22.were being watched by me. They went up to a statue of his father and
:14:23. > :14:27.grandfather and they came away with moist eyes. So there's more than the
:14:28. > :14:28.going isn't there? Explained this complexity.
:14:29. > :14:44.the children, from the age of three, are brainwashed to bow in front of
:14:45. > :14:51.the statue of the Kim family, and then when they have lunch or dinner
:14:52. > :14:55.in kindergarten, they were taught to thank, for the meal. So North Korean
:14:56. > :15:06.people are growing up in this kind of, you know, idolising process. So
:15:07. > :15:10.I think the tears which you have seen during your stay in Pyonyang
:15:11. > :15:20.may be, might be, the true feeling. But the majority of the ruling class
:15:21. > :15:26.in North Korea, high officials or elites, they now learnt that this
:15:27. > :15:33.kind of a red entry system has nothing to do with the true
:15:34. > :15:40.communism -- hereditary. The Kim family only built North Korea for
:15:41. > :15:47.the Kim family's prosperity alone. And now that people, most of the
:15:48. > :15:55.people, and especially the elite group, learned that the current
:15:56. > :16:01.system is nothing but only serves the Kim family alone. That is the
:16:02. > :16:09.point. So I am sure that one day those elites will turn their back on
:16:10. > :16:15.Kim Jong-un, and they will also rise up, together with a popular
:16:16. > :16:21.uprising, yes. In this country, in South Korea, there is sometimes talk
:16:22. > :16:25.of decapitation. In effect, assassinating Kim Jong-un, if that
:16:26. > :16:33.were possible. What do you think of that? I think that is unlikely.
:16:34. > :16:39.Because, you know, even North Korean people do not know the whereabouts
:16:40. > :16:45.of Kim Jong-un. Myself, I've never seen car, even, in Pyonyang city.
:16:46. > :16:53.Even the high officials in North Korea do not know where is his
:16:54. > :16:58.office, where is his house, no. He is a kind of leader in the air.
:16:59. > :17:04.Whenever he visits some places, or whenever he holds some meetings, it
:17:05. > :17:13.is already, you know, preset. The process, and even myself, and even
:17:14. > :17:21.the high officials don't know where he is. Let me talk about how North
:17:22. > :17:27.Korean diplomats work. What were the kinds of things that you would do to
:17:28. > :17:34.raise money, or just to please the regime? I'm thinking you escorted
:17:35. > :17:39.Kim Jong-un's rather to an Eric Clapton concert. Tell me about that,
:17:40. > :17:45.what happened? Kim Jong-un's brother is a really good musician, at my
:17:46. > :17:53.impression. He plays guitar very well, and he actually... Actually he
:17:54. > :18:00.has met Eric Clapton, you know. He watched Eric Clapton's performance
:18:01. > :18:06.twice in London, and whenever he was at that, you know, in the Albert
:18:07. > :18:13.Hall to watch Eric Clapton, I can see the tears, even, in his eyes.
:18:14. > :18:21.And he is only interested in music, nothing else. I took a good many
:18:22. > :18:29.places, like Parliament Square, you know, Trafalgar Square, and all the
:18:30. > :18:36.nice, you know, top ten sites and places. But he never asked even a
:18:37. > :18:43.single question, you know, about these other places, or even the
:18:44. > :18:51.history, about Britain. He is not interested at all. So I kept on
:18:52. > :18:56.telling him this and that, you know, and I soon learnt that he is not
:18:57. > :19:02.interested in those, you know, sightseeing, or history, or
:19:03. > :19:09.important people. He is only interested in music. Eric Clapton.
:19:10. > :19:14.Eric Lupton. Did you do anything that you are ashamed of, and did you
:19:15. > :19:23.do anything criminal? Did you break the law, British law -- Clapton. As
:19:24. > :19:28.a diplomat of the DPRK? No. I didn't break any law. Not one to do with
:19:29. > :19:31.making money for the regime, or raising money for the regime?
:19:32. > :19:38.Because there are all kinds of stories that DPRK diplomats have to
:19:39. > :19:45.engage in crime to raise money for Pyonyang. Yes, but not all
:19:46. > :19:55.countries, you know, allow that kind of thing. For instance, the North
:19:56. > :19:58.Korean diplomats in Europe, you know, especially like Britain and
:19:59. > :20:05.France where there is a really high level of securities, you know, and
:20:06. > :20:15.also with the intelligence services, it is really dangerous for not only
:20:16. > :20:19.North Korean diplomats, or even the other foreign diplomats as well, to
:20:20. > :20:30.do this kind of illicit activities. In terms of law, we didn't pay, for
:20:31. > :20:36.instance, the condition charges, you know, the parking fees, North Korean
:20:37. > :20:42.members in London. So far I think the outstanding parking
:20:43. > :20:53.accommodation and parking fines are around, to my memory, so around
:20:54. > :20:57.?100,000. What do you miss about Britain? Your life in Britain seemed
:20:58. > :21:02.to me to be very English and lots of ways. You played tennis in a rather
:21:03. > :21:10.nice suburban tennis club. What do you miss about your life that? I
:21:11. > :21:19.really miss that kind of, you know, life, you know, especially in
:21:20. > :21:25.dealing. And even now I am really sorry for not saying goodbye to my
:21:26. > :21:31.tennis club -- Ealing. You know, the members, because they are really
:21:32. > :21:43.nice, and you know, gentle. And so, if possible, I want to say, you
:21:44. > :21:50.know, the official goodbye to my old tennis club members. We have been
:21:51. > :21:56.the member of this club for eight years. My youngest son even joined
:21:57. > :22:04.this club when he was at the age of eight, you know. And we had a
:22:05. > :22:10.really, really wonderful coach that, you know? He was an old man and he
:22:11. > :22:15.thought all members of my family had to play tennis. Me, my kids, my
:22:16. > :22:24.wife. You know, so the whole tennis club members were just one family
:22:25. > :22:27.members. And we had... Really still miss English, the spring, the
:22:28. > :22:33.autumn, where you have this wonderful tennis. So now I really
:22:34. > :22:41.want to say goodbye and thank you to all my club members. Finally, how do
:22:42. > :22:53.you think Kim Jong-un will end his days? Is he going to die peacefully
:22:54. > :23:02.in his own bed? No. Or how? I'm sure that Kim Jong-un regime will one day
:23:03. > :23:03.collapse by people's uprising. Thank you very much. Thank