26/10/2012

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:00:39. > :00:42.Afternoon, folks, welcome to the Daily Politics. On the show today:

:00:42. > :00:45.Fancy being a teacher? The Government's about to make it that

:00:45. > :00:52.little bit harder by demanding aspiring teachers take a test in

:00:52. > :00:55.maths and English before they start training.

:00:55. > :00:58.After the good economic news yesterday, Tory MPs are warning of

:00:58. > :01:00.a backlash against cuts to child benefit due in January. We'll talk

:01:00. > :01:03.to one of them. Should the European Parliament stop

:01:03. > :01:08.its monthly trek from Brussels to Strasbourg? We'll report on the

:01:08. > :01:11.latest campaign by MEPs to keep the Parliament in one place.

:01:11. > :01:17.And it's the great Government sell- off, as Francis Maude announced the

:01:17. > :01:27.sale of Admiralty Arch in central London for �60 million. But what

:01:27. > :01:32.

:01:32. > :01:35.will become of it? We'll reveal all All that in the next hour, and with

:01:35. > :01:42.me for the first half hour today, we've got some top talent from

:01:42. > :01:46.Fleet Street. They're the new Sonny and Cher of daytime TV - it's Anne

:01:46. > :01:51.McElvoy of the Economist and Philip Collins of the Times. Don't worry,

:01:51. > :01:54.you won't have to sing. Let's start with the news this

:01:54. > :01:56.morning that people who want to become teachers will face tougher

:01:56. > :02:02.tests in English, maths and reasoning before they start their

:02:02. > :02:06.training. The Government says it wants tests to be more rigorous to

:02:06. > :02:16.raise the quality and standing of teaching. Charlie Taylor is the

:02:16. > :02:17.

:02:17. > :02:21.chief executive of the Teaching When you look at the most

:02:22. > :02:25.successful education systems across the world, Finland, South Korea,

:02:25. > :02:30.Singapore, they set the bar very high in terms of the people they

:02:30. > :02:35.allow into teaching and teaching is a high-status job. What these tests

:02:35. > :02:38.do is to say, we want to get the very best people into teaching.

:02:38. > :02:42.And we've been joined by Alice Robinson from the Association of

:02:42. > :02:47.Teachers and Lecturers. You must welcome this? I think all teachers

:02:47. > :02:51.will welcome anything that will help raise standards. I'm not sure

:02:51. > :02:58.tests of these nature will achieve that. Because they will be too

:02:58. > :03:05.simple? No. There are a huge range of issues over becoming a graduate,

:03:05. > :03:08.people have demonstrated that they have GCSEs, they've then completed

:03:08. > :03:12.their degree. I think the Government, one of the things they

:03:12. > :03:17.said they would do was reduce bureaucracy. They've now introduced

:03:17. > :03:22.another level of assessment. They have demonstrated they don't trust

:03:22. > :03:26.the GCSE results, they don't trust A-level results, and now they are

:03:26. > :03:31.saying they don't trust the universities. You have to make sure

:03:31. > :03:36.they can read and count. I'm fairly certain the universities would have

:03:36. > :03:40.insisted on that before they granted firsts, honours degrees and

:03:40. > :03:45.so on. You can get that in Latin but you don't have to be able to

:03:45. > :03:49.read English. These are exams where there's a 98% pass rate. If someone

:03:49. > :03:55.can't pass an exam with 90% of the rest of people, they don't deserve

:03:55. > :04:00.to be a teacher. You have to ask the question, why do you need this?

:04:00. > :04:04.Why don't we have a tougher exams on maths, the basics of maths and

:04:04. > :04:10.English and reasoning on top of the degree before you get into

:04:10. > :04:15.teaching? The reason why places like Taiwan and Finland have such

:04:15. > :04:20.strong education systems is because they pick the best and brightest.

:04:20. > :04:26.That is not completely the case. is in Finland. In Finland, they

:04:26. > :04:31.give teachers a huge amount of autonomy, significant pay...

:04:31. > :04:37.honours graduates. They don't have to do an additional test. I think

:04:37. > :04:42.people will be amazed, every reform Labour or Conservative governments

:04:42. > :04:47.try to make, the teaching unions always oppose it. This is simply an

:04:47. > :04:51.attempt to make sure... I can insure -- a sure you, we employ

:04:51. > :04:56.them. People come out of university and they don't know good spelling

:04:56. > :05:04.or gram and they don't write very well. Why should we not ensure that

:05:05. > :05:08.teachers have that ability? Right. If that is the case, why has

:05:08. > :05:13.Michael Gove said that teachers in academies and free schools don't

:05:13. > :05:18.have to have Q T S? One of our issues is around there's not any

:05:18. > :05:23.consistency. You're against it because everybody is doing it.

:05:23. > :05:26.Would you be in favour of it if he said everybody had to do it. Her I

:05:26. > :05:34.would have welcomed consultation. You would still be in favour?

:05:34. > :05:38.not true. The union I represent... If the Government have based this

:05:39. > :05:44.evidence on a report produced by head teachers. I represent head

:05:44. > :05:49.teachers. I am an assistant head. Actually, the people who do the

:05:49. > :05:55.monitoring, the people who do the mentoring of student teachers, our

:05:55. > :05:58.classroom teachers who do pick up on things. In a small number of

:05:58. > :06:03.cases where people are not as numerate or literate as they should

:06:03. > :06:09.be, they are picked up on and told it is not good enough. There are

:06:09. > :06:15.issues around that. There are a huge number of entry pathways into

:06:15. > :06:23.teaching now, teach first, P G C, a graduate training programme. There

:06:24. > :06:28.is a myriad of entry... slightly flabbergasted by this. I

:06:28. > :06:34.can't see what is wrong with saying to people who are going to educate

:06:34. > :06:38.our children, in primary school or for sophisticated skills, that you

:06:38. > :06:41.must have as half -- high-standard of rudimentary maths and English. I

:06:41. > :06:46.have seen reports where I've wanted to put a red pencil around the

:06:46. > :06:51.grammar of the teachers. This happens because we let it go. As a

:06:51. > :06:55.system we let it go. Not only the teaching unions are responsible,

:06:55. > :06:59.but they are to some extent. Successive governments didn't pick

:06:59. > :07:04.it up. We are now right on it and Charlie Taylor is right to be

:07:04. > :07:08.saying lots of other countries... I do a lot of comparative work about

:07:08. > :07:14.education systems. In most countries this would not be in

:07:14. > :07:21.issue. I agreed with that. We will get on better than Sonny and Cher!

:07:21. > :07:26.In the air years. Thirtysomething else. The best systems also have a

:07:26. > :07:33.very rigorous -- rigorous aptitude test for teaching, which is a skill

:07:33. > :07:38.in itself. The best systems make it very hard to get into teaching, but

:07:38. > :07:42.quite easy to get out. If you've got a teaching certificate in some

:07:42. > :07:46.countries, that is sort of -- thought of as a very distinguished

:07:46. > :07:50.thing to have. If it doesn't work out for you, people going to very

:07:50. > :07:55.good professions because that is a badge of honour. Anything that can

:07:55. > :07:59.help us move towards that has to be a good thing. I entirely agree with

:07:59. > :08:02.what you've just said about attitude and that is one of the

:08:02. > :08:10.issues around a lack of consultation on this very basic

:08:10. > :08:13.test. Being a good teacher is around having a passion, a real

:08:13. > :08:17.understanding and an ability to communicate verbally with your

:08:17. > :08:24.students on a level they can understand. It is around aptitude.

:08:24. > :08:28.We would welcome somebody sitting down and saying, let's look at how

:08:28. > :08:33.we can best screen students, graduates, going into teaching, to

:08:33. > :08:37.demonstrate a wide range of skills, not just picking on one thing.

:08:37. > :08:42.Probably ban the phrase around aptitude to start with. It is

:08:43. > :08:47.slightly baggy language which goes around process and structures. That

:08:47. > :08:51.language hides what is going on and a lot of the education debate is

:08:51. > :08:55.affected by it. We have to raise the level of what we do in

:08:55. > :08:58.education and anything that gets under way... They are supposed to

:08:58. > :09:03.have great degrees, but there's a big problem about what universities

:09:03. > :09:07.are doing in education. There are too many pathways, we don't know

:09:07. > :09:11.what is good, bad and indifferent, and the elite universities are too

:09:12. > :09:19.far away from training teachers. You have a status problem. You will

:09:19. > :09:26.be allowed to fail these exams three times and still be a teacher.

:09:26. > :09:31.Coney 98% of those who apply, not everybody. -- Only. So Statistics!

:09:31. > :09:35.If there's a 98% pass rate on GCSEs on the ones they are trying to do

:09:35. > :09:39.to the level that is required, and even if somebody wants to be a

:09:39. > :09:43.teacher who fails to reach his pass rate the first time, as part of the

:09:43. > :09:47.to do so that did not get it, they can sit it again and again. Most

:09:47. > :09:55.people would say actually, to become a teacher, the tests should

:09:55. > :09:59.be tougher. We want a proper consultation about the whole range

:09:59. > :10:04.of how students are selected to become teachers. You love

:10:04. > :10:09.consultation in these unions rather than a system that will give kids

:10:09. > :10:14.the best possible chances. Her that is what teachers want. Really?

:10:14. > :10:18.Certainly. I was an assisted head and what I wanted in my school was

:10:18. > :10:22.to employ the best possible teachers. In it would surely

:10:22. > :10:27.increase the status of teachers if you had a really tough test that

:10:27. > :10:32.had a high barrier. That would be good for teaching. Not want that is

:10:32. > :10:36.just introduced on a very narrow set of issues. The Government

:10:36. > :10:39.proposes a lot of things that never see the light of day!

:10:40. > :10:44.Now it's time for our daily quiz. Nick Clegg met the President of the

:10:44. > :10:54.European Council, Herman van Rompuy, yesterday. But what language did

:10:54. > :10:57.

:10:57. > :11:00.And we'll give you the answer a little later in the show.

:11:00. > :11:03.After yesterday's good news on the economy, there's going to be some

:11:03. > :11:08.less welcome news for thousands of families next week as the

:11:08. > :11:11.Government prepares the ground for another cut to benefits. If you are

:11:11. > :11:14.lucky enough to earn more than �50,000 a year and have children,

:11:14. > :11:17.you'll get a letter from the taxman you'll get a letter from the taxman

:11:17. > :11:20.next week along with 1.3 million others. But it might not make happy

:11:20. > :11:24.reading. It will tell you that you have a choice either to surrender

:11:24. > :11:27.your child benefit altogether or that you will have to repay part of

:11:27. > :11:31.the benefit, or all of it if you earn over �60,000, when you fill in

:11:31. > :11:38.your end of year tax return. The Treasury thinks that the change

:11:39. > :11:46.will save them around �2.5 billion a year. But it will also mean an

:11:46. > :11:48.extra 500,000 people filing self- assessment tax returns. And a

:11:48. > :11:57.number of Conservative MPs have expressed their concerns, warning

:11:57. > :12:00.that the system will be "fiendishly complicated". But the Government

:12:00. > :12:05.claims that taking benefits from the rich as well as the poor will

:12:05. > :12:08.show that "we're all in this together". Well, this policy was

:12:08. > :12:10.first announced at the Conservative conference way back in 2010. Let's

:12:10. > :12:20.remind ourselves how George Osborne remind ourselves how George Osborne

:12:20. > :12:21.

:12:21. > :12:26.tried to sell the idea to his party. A system that taxes working people

:12:26. > :12:31.at high rates only to give it back in child benefit is very difficult

:12:31. > :12:35.to justify at a time like this. It is very difficult to justify taxing

:12:35. > :12:40.people on low incomes to pay for the child benefit of those earning

:12:40. > :12:44.so much more than them. These days we've really got to focus the

:12:44. > :12:50.resources on where they are most needed. We've got to be tough, but

:12:50. > :12:55.fair. That is why we will withdraw child benefit from households with

:12:55. > :12:58.a higher rate taxpayer. When the debts left by Labour threaten our

:12:58. > :13:07.economy, when our welfare costs are out of control, this measure makes

:13:07. > :13:12.sense. APPLAUSE that was the Chancellor in 2010.

:13:12. > :13:15.There was a bit of a backbench -- backlash even at the conference.

:13:15. > :13:25.With us now is the Conservative backbencher Mark Field. Welcome

:13:25. > :13:26.

:13:26. > :13:30.back to the Daily Politics. MP for Westminster. I am indeed. You've

:13:30. > :13:35.got a mixed constituency. You've got a lot of people on average

:13:35. > :13:40.incomes, and a lot of well-off people. Is there ahead of her steam

:13:40. > :13:45.building? There is, partly because there's some have confusion because

:13:45. > :13:48.the policy has changed. I believe in getting the deficit down. As a

:13:48. > :13:53.moral case as well as any economic case and I have always supported

:13:54. > :13:58.any measures that we have that will reduce public spending. We need to

:13:58. > :14:03.be wise before the event. We know there are some big institutional

:14:03. > :14:08.problems with this policy. Looking at the practicalities, the Way We

:14:08. > :14:12.Live Now is very different. People have consultancy incomes. They

:14:12. > :14:16.don't know what they're going to earn during the year. This policy

:14:16. > :14:21.will mean that anyone in a household where you earn �50,000 a

:14:21. > :14:27.more will see a tapering away off that child benefit. If they earn

:14:27. > :14:31.�60,000, they will have nothing. You'll have perverse invoices --

:14:31. > :14:35.incentives to put invoices in later. You have divorcing couples.

:14:35. > :14:40.Wouldn't it be easier to say if you on the 40% tax band you don't get

:14:40. > :14:45.child benefit? One of the easy things might have been to say you

:14:45. > :14:51.will only get child benefit for a certain number of children. But you

:14:51. > :14:55.couldn't do that with those on existing child benefit. Iain Duncan

:14:55. > :15:02.Smith was saying we would like this to be the case for future parents

:15:02. > :15:06.of families, not for two. He is. That will not save much. I would

:15:06. > :15:10.not be too surprised if these policies were co-ordinated in some

:15:10. > :15:14.way. The worry with this policy, we've talked about raising �2.5

:15:14. > :15:18.billion, a huge amount of money will go into administering this

:15:18. > :15:23.system for up to you don't think the saving will be 2.5 billion? You

:15:23. > :15:28.will have to write off a lot for the reasons I've set out. It is

:15:28. > :15:33.almost a tax on aspiration. If you are on �40,000 a year, you aspire

:15:33. > :15:37.to earn �50,000, and you might lose something. If you have three

:15:37. > :15:42.children and you earn between �50,000.60 �1,000, for the tax

:15:43. > :15:46.could be 65%. The Government says we are all in this together. It has

:15:46. > :15:50.cat housing benefit for those on the low end of the income scale. It

:15:50. > :15:56.is making it harder for people on welfare benefits, forcing them to

:15:56. > :16:01.look for work. They are making it tougher. They are also looking for

:16:01. > :16:05.another 10 billion of cuts in welfare. Surely your traditional

:16:05. > :16:15.supporters, who are probably in these income groups, they will take

:16:15. > :16:18.

:16:18. > :16:24.some of the pain. Some title lead I think there is a very strong case,

:16:24. > :16:28.and I totally agree with George Osborne, trying to get this deficit

:16:28. > :16:33.down at for moral reasons... understand that. You're not

:16:33. > :16:37.prepared to go along with it, the saving, because nobody is going to

:16:37. > :16:43.start as a result of this change, nobody is going to be homeless.

:16:43. > :16:47.don't think it will be two-and-a- half billion. We also see the other

:16:47. > :16:55.concern, problem, which is stay at home mothers are being distance and

:16:55. > :17:01.devised in the sense that if one person is being earning 60,000,...

:17:01. > :17:06.That was the original complaint. have more sympathy with a laugh

:17:06. > :17:10.complaint which is terrible. It sends a terrible signal to women

:17:10. > :17:15.from the party. I can't see a reason why this benefit exists for

:17:15. > :17:20.people earning quite well. Although it's very complicated, to get rid

:17:21. > :17:25.of an entitlement, but I thought we were trying to change the way we

:17:25. > :17:30.look at the welfare state. I can't really see the principle. I'm

:17:30. > :17:34.surprised to see that you don't see it actually not a good idea to have

:17:34. > :17:39.this idea of benefits as pocket money given to certain groups,

:17:39. > :17:42.unless they are in need. You need to bite the bullet on that. There

:17:43. > :17:46.is not well between two different ideals and the welfare state. The

:17:46. > :17:51.last word you'd used was need. The welfare state has become the

:17:51. > :17:55.welfare state of need. Contribution, as you contribute, you should get

:17:56. > :17:59.something out. It's absurd at a time when we haven't got any money

:18:00. > :18:06.as a country, we are transferring money to the state to people who do

:18:06. > :18:13.not need it. That's bizarre. If we save 2.5 billion, as its measured,

:18:13. > :18:21.there we go. It is future entitlement as well. You don't want

:18:21. > :18:25.to take the pain it now. I have got 16 and a half more years with my

:18:25. > :18:32.young daughter. The other issue is this. 40 years ago, when this

:18:32. > :18:40.benefit came in, it used to be a tax allowance, the state making a

:18:40. > :18:46.stall -- small statement saying its good for children to be invested in.

:18:46. > :18:50.The money was going to be in hands of mothers exclusively. I want to

:18:50. > :18:55.get the deficit down. There's been a lot of controversy about this and

:18:55. > :18:59.I think it will raise far less money than we think. Wouldn't a

:18:59. > :19:03.radical conservative government raised the threshold where the 40%

:19:03. > :19:08.clicks and, because, in real terms, it was meant for very well-off

:19:08. > :19:14.people, now average middle-class people, raise it and say, you are

:19:14. > :19:18.going to keep more of what you earn, if you are aspiring, but the child

:19:18. > :19:26.benefit has gone? You could do this. The argument about earning at a

:19:26. > :19:31.particular level were applied and part of the difficulty is that, in

:19:31. > :19:37.trying to raise money, it's all very well the rich having to pay,

:19:37. > :19:43.but there are very much more middle earners. Is it going to happen?

:19:43. > :19:49.sense is it might be delayed. The sensible thing would to started in

:19:49. > :19:55.at the next tax year. He needs the money. Come back if it is delayed

:19:55. > :20:03.and talk to us. Thank you. He has got his daughter outside now,

:20:03. > :20:09.putting a child benefit in a top pocket. How old is she? Six months

:20:09. > :20:12.old. She's already spending the money! Get your bookings in early.

:20:12. > :20:15.The iconic Admiralty Arch, it's at the end of the Mall leading to

:20:15. > :20:19.Trafalgar Square, is being turned into a hotel after the government

:20:19. > :20:23.flogged it off for �60 million. There it is. It was billed only 100

:20:23. > :20:26.years ago. No, it's not part of a government policy to make sure

:20:26. > :20:29.super-rich tourists have enough places to lay their heads. But part

:20:29. > :20:33.of a reorganisation of property that's paid for by the tax payer.

:20:33. > :20:37.Here's our Adam, who's hoping for a job as a chambermaid.

:20:37. > :20:42.Who would live in a house like this? Admiralty Arch was built 100

:20:42. > :20:45.years ago in honour of Queen Victoria and has been a crucial

:20:45. > :20:50.prop in that state occasions ever since. It's also been a home for

:20:50. > :20:55.Sea Lords, and a prime ministerial strategy unit, but no longer, as a

:20:55. > :21:00.news conference, the buildings 99 year lease has been sold for �60

:21:00. > :21:09.million to a property company who will turn it into a hotel. It's

:21:10. > :21:15.about the restoration, bring it back to life, the genius design the

:21:15. > :21:19.original architect built exactly 100 years ago. The idea is to bring

:21:19. > :21:24.up to life. We were given a rare access. Obviously it offers amazing

:21:24. > :21:30.views, when you can see them with Buckingham Palace on one side and a

:21:30. > :21:34.Trafalgar Square on the other. But inside, it's a Hamas to civil

:21:34. > :21:37.service drabness. With a dash of glamour and the odd mist. Political

:21:37. > :21:40.obsesses me want to think twice before they book a room here

:21:40. > :21:45.because you can't stay in the flat where John Prescott used to live

:21:45. > :21:48.where he used to serve shepherd's pie to Tony and Gordon to make them

:21:48. > :21:52.see eye-to-eye, because that's a completely different building and a

:21:52. > :21:56.corner. The sale is part of a big reorganisation of government

:21:56. > :22:02.property. We are getting out of quite a lot of properties. We have

:22:02. > :22:07.raised about �640 million in total so far by selling buildings, but

:22:07. > :22:12.our main business is just to get out of under-used property. In

:22:12. > :22:21.Bristol, for example, central government occupies one and and 15

:22:21. > :22:26.different buildings which is insane. It's expensive. -- 115.

:22:26. > :22:33.aircraft carrier Ark Royal was sold for scrap for �3 million. A bid to

:22:33. > :22:35.turn it into a casino was turned down. This betting organisation was

:22:35. > :22:39.sold for �265 million though the Government had to share that with a

:22:39. > :22:44.horse racing industry. And what about this for a big price tag? A

:22:44. > :22:47.Channel Tunnel rail link was sold for more than �2 billion. But the

:22:47. > :22:52.buyers of his British icon still have to get planning permission so

:22:52. > :22:57.they can't give a date for when the first guests will be checking in.

:22:57. > :23:01.Adam Fleming reporting. Looks pretty imposing. And we've been

:23:01. > :23:06.joined by the Cabinet Office Minister Chloe Smith. It says

:23:06. > :23:13.welcome back to the Daily Politics. Have you been with us before?

:23:14. > :23:19.recently, no. Not in the past 100 years, in other words. It's going

:23:19. > :23:23.to become a hotel, right? You have sold it on a lease. We have sold

:23:24. > :23:29.and 99 year lease hold for �60 million, which means it's a

:23:29. > :23:34.particularly good deal for the taxpayer because not only do we get

:23:34. > :23:39.that peace in the meantime, but in due course it reverts to the public.

:23:39. > :23:43.This is part of a process also I'm told you want to raise �6 billion

:23:43. > :23:47.doing this. What is next? The decisions are being taken across

:23:47. > :23:50.the Government property portfolio, that's for sure. This is one

:23:51. > :23:55.particularly good example and represents a really cracking deal

:23:55. > :23:58.for the taxpayer, in fact, but we are taking those decisions across

:23:58. > :24:02.property with a view to getting good value for money and a view to

:24:02. > :24:05.using space sensibly. Do we know what could be the next iconic

:24:05. > :24:10.building that could be on the block? I don't think there is a

:24:10. > :24:18.shopping list. You have got a lot to go because the barely raised 600

:24:18. > :24:25.million so far. The 640 million saved, according to the Government.

:24:25. > :24:29.10 times that to go. Will a lot to be sold? It's not only a question

:24:30. > :24:34.of selling, it's important to note, there's a number of things you can

:24:34. > :24:39.do with property. You can make sure space is used sensibly. This

:24:39. > :24:45.building was used for office space for a short while and it's not

:24:45. > :24:50.really meant for that. It has been empty recently. What do you say to

:24:50. > :24:53.people who say this is an iconic building at the heart of the couple,

:24:53. > :24:59.the gateway between Buckingham Palace at the end of The Mall into

:24:59. > :25:06.Trafalgar Square, and there should be a national monument? A National

:25:06. > :25:09.Building, a museum, an art gallery? Why wouldn't you do that? Do the

:25:09. > :25:17.key point is, the public can get into it for the first time ever.

:25:17. > :25:24.Think about we are going from a set of shabby office space in disrepair

:25:24. > :25:28.which costs �900,000 a year running costs, while stenting, to something

:25:28. > :25:31.the public can access. I think that's part of it being a good deal.

:25:32. > :25:37.As long as you can afford 20 quid for a cup of tea because it will be

:25:37. > :25:42.a posh hotel, won't it? There will be bars and cafes in it and

:25:42. > :25:47.interestingly, it will be won a best viewpoints in London. It's a

:25:47. > :25:52.great asset open to the public. What else can you see? Buckingham

:25:52. > :25:56.Palace, that would get a ton of money, wouldn't it? The Queen

:25:56. > :26:03.doesn't own it. I'm sure the Queen that would have something to say

:26:03. > :26:09.about that. The but she doesn't own that. Lease it back to them for 99.

:26:09. > :26:15.Andrew, perhaps you would like to put that forward. I just have.

:26:15. > :26:20.you talk to the Queen about it? official response. You did a famous

:26:20. > :26:27.interview on Newsnight with Jeremy Paxman. How do you feel about that

:26:27. > :26:31.now? Well, all I can say is, Andrew, you're far more pleasant person to

:26:31. > :26:37.sit opposite, and I'm sure the BBC prides itself on the quality of its

:26:37. > :26:45.presenters. Do you think you've had the last laugh on Newsnight?

:26:45. > :26:49.continue in my life having a good laugh,. You must have a quiet

:26:49. > :26:53.chuckle at what's happened to the programme since then? It a good

:26:53. > :26:56.moment for the BBC to reflect. The Jimmy Savile allegations are

:26:57. > :27:01.shocking, and I don't think too many people are laughing about

:27:01. > :27:08.those on the whole. Will you come back and see us? I would be

:27:08. > :27:13.delighted. Perhaps we can have a cup of tea. Maybe in the new hotel?

:27:13. > :27:17.Are you all right with this? Yes, I am all right with it. There are so

:27:17. > :27:22.many dead buildings. Somerset House, the revenues Santon there for so

:27:22. > :27:26.long. There is more access to the public. Michael Portillo said he

:27:26. > :27:29.couldn't even remember he owned it when he was a minister. William

:27:29. > :27:32.Morris wrote a book where he suggest the House of Commons be

:27:32. > :27:39.sold off and turned into a storehouse for manure. That might

:27:39. > :27:42.be the next one. No change there. Thank you for joining us. Thank

:27:42. > :27:45.goodness it's Friday. Always the end of a long political week.

:27:45. > :27:48.Perhaps the perfect day for a ministerial resignation. And why

:27:48. > :27:52.would you want to fall on your sword at the beginning of a crisis

:27:52. > :27:55.when you can stick it out to see whether your fate improves? I'm not

:27:55. > :27:58.suggesting Andrew Mitchell clung on his handle bars until the bitter

:27:58. > :28:02.end just a week ago. But ministers sometimes do. Indeed, as followers

:28:02. > :28:04.of The Thick Of It will know, it is hard for our our top dogs to know

:28:04. > :28:09.whether or not resignation is the honourable thing to do.

:28:09. > :28:18.This is going to be about the inquiry. I'm thinking I should

:28:18. > :28:22.resign now. No one shaves your lion's mane of. I am not a lion. A

:28:22. > :28:27.man died because of a policy I signed upon. I should take the

:28:27. > :28:34.dignified way out. No, you have missed the dignified exit,

:28:34. > :28:38.straightaway, basically. Sometimes it's a documentary. It's

:28:38. > :28:40.not comedy or fiction. And we've been joined by the Independent

:28:40. > :28:48.newspaper's parliamentary sketchwriter, and former

:28:48. > :28:53.Conservative MP, Michael Brown. Former. Are you so ashamed of it?

:28:53. > :28:56.Welcome back. I've not seen you for ages. Two ministers resigned too

:28:56. > :29:01.much or too little these days? think there's too much of it,

:29:01. > :29:06.frankly. When you look back at the Thatcher resignation, I looked at a

:29:06. > :29:10.list today, Lord Carrington, Michael Heseltine, Nigel Lawson,

:29:10. > :29:15.Geoffrey Howe, all on matters of principle, Nicholas Ridley had to

:29:15. > :29:21.resign, because of the Germans. I just read his article today. How

:29:22. > :29:25.right he was. They were resignations on the real issues. He

:29:25. > :29:30.was right about the Germans also I think he had to resign. Edwina

:29:30. > :29:35.Currie resigned and was unfairly treated. Everything she said turned

:29:35. > :29:39.out to be true. These days, we are resigning over bits of trivia. I

:29:39. > :29:45.mean, David Laws, it's arguable whether he needed to resign a

:29:45. > :29:49.couple of years ago. On my Twitter account, they all hate him. The in

:29:49. > :29:52.the end, it doesn't come down to the issue but whether the public

:29:52. > :29:59.perception, and short backbench colleagues, most of them are

:29:59. > :30:05.usually driven out. I have another list here. Tim Smith. Oh no! Neil

:30:05. > :30:08.Hamilton, Jonathan Aitken. didn't have much support on the

:30:08. > :30:12.back bench, did they? Up exactly, what tells at the end of the day is

:30:12. > :30:18.when you have support on the backbenches. I resigned as a

:30:18. > :30:22.government whip over a sex scandal in 1994. But the thing is, they you

:30:22. > :30:29.are, most of them are easily forgettable. Ian Gow resigned as a

:30:29. > :30:33.minister. Keith Speed? I don't even know who he is? Secretary of State

:30:33. > :30:43.for Scotland? How dare you! He was the parliamentary private secretary

:30:43. > :30:47.

:30:47. > :30:52.to Margaret Thatcher who was $:/STARTFEED. Andrew Mitchell's

:30:52. > :30:57.resignation has already been forgotten. Ary Nieve was the other

:30:57. > :31:03.Conservative close to Mrs Thatcher who was also assassinated. Just

:31:03. > :31:07.after the election, I remember that one. Two terrible days. Do you have

:31:07. > :31:11.a list of those who should have resigned and didn't? Right at the

:31:11. > :31:16.top of my list is Jeremy Hunt. I think Jeremy Hunt should have

:31:16. > :31:21.resigned a few weeks ago. It is arguable whether Grant Shapps

:31:21. > :31:25.should really be in post. Really? After what the Guardian has

:31:25. > :31:30.suggested. You can't pretend to be somebody else all the time. That

:31:30. > :31:35.wouldn't be like being a politician at all! I would say immediately

:31:35. > :31:39.there are far more questions about those two staying. But they are so

:31:39. > :31:47.close to the Prime Minister that there resignation affects him.

:31:47. > :31:52.we too keen on the media to form a lynch mob? Are you going to resign,

:31:52. > :32:00.minister? When are you going to resign? A notice that this week,

:32:00. > :32:04.the BBC reporter was chasing after the Eid Director General of the BBC.

:32:04. > :32:08.Some day it must happen, a victim must be found. We go down the list

:32:08. > :32:14.as soon as somebody gets into trouble. I do think we should

:32:14. > :32:19.sometimes stand back. You have to allow operators is to find out --

:32:19. > :32:23.play out. You rarely find out what was going on. Liam Fox was a

:32:23. > :32:28.classic, embarrassment about his relationship with his aide and it

:32:28. > :32:34.got out of the way. I would rather find out what happened and come to

:32:34. > :32:39.review. We don't have any criteria for resignation. Key if you look at

:32:39. > :32:43.the textbooks, there are long disquisitions about the principles

:32:43. > :32:46.for resignation and they have gone. The lynch mob howls and howls and

:32:46. > :32:51.keeps on howling until you get to the point where the backbenchers

:32:51. > :32:57.say we have lost confidence in you. That becomes the pretext for the

:32:57. > :33:01.resignation. We've forgotten what the pretext was. We have data from

:33:01. > :33:09.the LSE that shows that of the 12 resignations that have taken place

:33:09. > :33:14.as a result of sex scandals from 1906-2006, 11 were Conservatives.

:33:14. > :33:19.Any theory of that? It always used to be said that if it was money, it

:33:20. > :33:24.was Labour MPs, if it was sex, it was Tory MPs. Cut it is the thing

:33:24. > :33:28.they can't get otherwise. It's Cecil Parkinson came back from a

:33:28. > :33:38.sex scandal. Tim Yeo came back from a sex scandal. A long list, thank

:33:38. > :33:45.you. Earlier we set the guests a little quiz. What language did Nick

:33:45. > :33:53.Clegg and Herman Van Rompuy his speech yesterday when they met?

:33:53. > :34:02.What is the correct answer? Dutch. German. The correct answer is Dutch.

:34:02. > :34:06.A huge glass of champagne waiting? He speaks about five languages.

:34:06. > :34:09.It's just gone 12.30, and it's time to say goodbye to my two guests of

:34:09. > :34:11.the day, Phil Collins and Anne McElvoy. And don't forget, if you

:34:11. > :34:15.can't survive the weekend without your regular politics hit, do join

:34:15. > :34:22.me for the Sunday Politics on BBC One at noon, when I'll be

:34:23. > :34:29.interviewing the Chief Secretary to the Treasury, Danny Alexander. --

:34:29. > :34:32.it's at 11 o'clock! You get an extra hour's sleep before you have

:34:32. > :34:34.to watch us! This week, Members of the European

:34:34. > :34:37.Parliament have been meeting in Strasbourg for their regular

:34:38. > :34:47.plenary session. So what have they been getting up to? Here's Susana

:34:48. > :34:49.

:34:49. > :34:56.with our guide to latest from The scene is set for a showdown

:34:56. > :35:02.after MEPs rejected a position of all 27 National MEPs voted for a

:35:02. > :35:06.rise of 6.8%, the governments want to limit any increase to 2.8%, but

:35:06. > :35:10.the commissioner for budgets said they were ignoring reality.

:35:11. > :35:15.can't endorse the councillors decision to cut by more than 5

:35:15. > :35:19.billion our proposal. Her three appointments have a Luxembourg

:35:19. > :35:22.central banker to the all-male board has angered those who want to

:35:23. > :35:27.see more female candidates for the job. Ever struggled to get

:35:27. > :35:30.compensation for a delayed flight or lost luggage? MEPs agree with

:35:30. > :35:37.you and they have adopted a resolution, calling a passenger

:35:37. > :35:41.rights to be endorsed across the UK. The BC has backed a commission on

:35:41. > :35:46.the Robin Hood tax. The you couldn't get all 27 members to

:35:46. > :35:55.agree, but the 10, including France and Germany, want to carry on

:35:55. > :35:58.And with us for the next 30 minutes, I've been joined by Fiona Hall MEP.

:35:58. > :36:02.She's the Lib Dem leader in the European Parliament. And Paul

:36:02. > :36:05.Nuttal MEP - he's the deputy leader of UKIP. Let's take a look at one

:36:05. > :36:14.of those stories in more detail. The European Parliament vote

:36:14. > :36:17.against the appointment of a man to the ECB executive board. This is a

:36:17. > :36:23.complaint which Europe has been talking a lot about, there are so

:36:23. > :36:29.few women on top boards. Where do you stand on this? I think we did

:36:29. > :36:33.the right thing on the vote on the ECB. It has been established that

:36:33. > :36:39.companies are much better, that they perform much better, if they

:36:39. > :36:46.don't just have men on the board. Duvet? What is the evidence? There

:36:46. > :36:51.was a survey done recently. In the UK, over the last year we have

:36:51. > :36:56.voluntary measures on getting women on to boards since the Davies

:36:56. > :37:00.report and there's been spectacular progress. The ECB is overwhelmingly

:37:00. > :37:04.male. It is largely made up of the existing central bankers and they

:37:04. > :37:09.are probably all male. Is there a female central banker in the

:37:09. > :37:15.eurozone? Originally there was one and she left. Germany is on record

:37:15. > :37:18.as saying it was always understood that they should be won. But our

:37:18. > :37:23.objection in Parliament was not that the new appointee Wasserman,

:37:23. > :37:29.but simply that there wasn't even a woman on the shortlist. We thought

:37:29. > :37:32.that was taking it too far. We are you on this? I believe in a

:37:32. > :37:37.meritocracy. If you are good enough, it doesn't matter if you are a man

:37:37. > :37:42.or woman. What is interesting is that Angela Merkel has swung behind

:37:43. > :37:47.this man to get a job. The last time I looked, she was a woman.

:37:47. > :37:51.Sarkozy didn't always think that. If you are saying it is a

:37:51. > :37:56.meritocracy, it therefore follows, given that the boards on the ECB

:37:56. > :38:00.are dominated by men, it follows from your argument, logically, in a

:38:00. > :38:04.meritocracy, that it is all men because the women are too thick. I

:38:04. > :38:10.don't think many people would accept that. Is that right? Across

:38:10. > :38:14.the world, women are in leading positions. The head of the IMF is a

:38:14. > :38:18.woman. The Chancellor of Germany is a woman, Hillary Clinton, Margaret

:38:18. > :38:23.Thatcher. Why no woman in the seedy? The women were not as

:38:23. > :38:27.qualified as the men. It shouldn't matter what sex you are, at the

:38:27. > :38:31.best person should get the job. clearly does matter because they

:38:31. > :38:35.are all men. Half the population is women, there are more women

:38:35. > :38:41.graduates than men and there's something that is a barrier at the

:38:41. > :38:45.moment. The ECB takes decisions that have effects on household

:38:45. > :38:51.budgets and living conditions which often women bear the brunt of.

:38:51. > :38:55.Exactly. You can get a very narrow view of the world. That is why

:38:55. > :39:00.there take women on board find that they prosper more, they share price

:39:00. > :39:04.goes up, they perform better. Surely it is demeaning to women.

:39:04. > :39:09.You wouldn't want to be the token woman on the board thinking you

:39:09. > :39:16.were only there because you are a placement. UKIP is the party that

:39:16. > :39:20.believes women should be cleaning... Nonsense. They may have moved out.

:39:20. > :39:23.-- moved on. So the stage is set for more

:39:23. > :39:26.fireworks over the EU's budget and there's lots at stake. First - this

:39:26. > :39:29.week, the EU Commission asked member states to stump up another

:39:29. > :39:32.�6 billion to help fill a �9 billion gap in the EU's finances up

:39:32. > :39:34.billion gap in the EU's finances up to the end of the year. Next, the

:39:34. > :39:37.European Parliament voted for a 6.8% increase in the budget for

:39:37. > :39:43.2013, rejecting a lower budget increase put forward by member

:39:43. > :39:47.states. MEPs and the Council of Ministers now have three weeks to

:39:47. > :39:57.try to reach a compromise. And finally, there's the arguments over

:39:57. > :40:05.

:40:05. > :40:09.the total budget for 2014-2020, the so-called "multi-annual framework".

:40:09. > :40:12.It is how much they will spend between now and 2020. MEPs and the

:40:12. > :40:16.European Commission are gunning for a big budget increase to the MFF,

:40:16. > :40:24.which would mean total spending up to 2020 would add up to over 1,000

:40:24. > :40:27.billion euros. But member states have a veto over this, and David

:40:27. > :40:33.Cameron has said he will use his to block any real-terms rise in the

:40:33. > :40:36.overall budget. European leaders are due to meet in late November to

:40:36. > :40:39.agree a plan, but the German Chancellor, Angela Merkel, has said

:40:39. > :40:48.the summit should be scrapped if Mr Cameron doesn't withdraw this

:40:48. > :40:56.Let's talk now to the Spanish MEP Salvador Garriga Polledo, who sits

:40:56. > :41:01.on the European Parliament budgets committee.

:41:01. > :41:06.It looks like you have a lot to resolve for this year, next year

:41:06. > :41:15.and the next six years. Will you get a settlement on all of this, do

:41:15. > :41:20.you think? It is going to be difficult. We started today with 20

:41:20. > :41:26.12th's remaining budget and we have two weeks to come to an agreement

:41:26. > :41:32.on 2013. At the same time, we are still awaiting developments for the

:41:32. > :41:38.coming negotiations. It is going to be a very busy three months.

:41:38. > :41:43.think a lot of people watching will wonder why the European Union

:41:43. > :41:46.should be getting any increase when their governments are they live

:41:46. > :41:51.under are having to slash their spending like mad. It is happening

:41:51. > :41:56.in Britain, it has happened in France, even with President

:41:56. > :42:01.Hollande and his austere budget, it is happening in your own country.

:42:01. > :42:09.National governments are having to cut so why should the European

:42:09. > :42:19.government, if I can call it that, get an increase? It depends on the

:42:19. > :42:22.

:42:22. > :42:25.idea about Europe, that different politicians have. The idea that

:42:25. > :42:35.even though they are slashing budgets, we concede that the

:42:35. > :42:44.European budget should incorporate the European added value. Money is

:42:44. > :42:49.spent in 27 member-states. think the money spent more

:42:49. > :42:54.effectively at a European level than a national level? The EU's

:42:54. > :42:57.accounts have not been approved for about 13 years now. How can it be

:42:57. > :43:07.more effective in spending than the Madrid, Paris or London

:43:07. > :43:14.governments? We truly believe that, and expenditure will be more

:43:14. > :43:24.effective, especially because we are dealing with coalition policy,

:43:24. > :43:26.

:43:26. > :43:32.innovation, development, European Social Fund. Many things are spread

:43:32. > :43:38.between 27 member states. It will produce a better effect. I'm asked

:43:38. > :43:42.say that the European budget is neutral. -- I must say. We don't

:43:42. > :43:52.want the member states to spend more money. We want to transfer

:43:52. > :43:53.

:43:53. > :43:59.some kind of spending to the European budget. Thank you. What

:43:59. > :44:05.should the British Government's strategy... What should they be in

:44:05. > :44:10.this European budget formation? think it is a mistake to say at the

:44:11. > :44:15.beginning that we might walk out. There are a lot of negotiations

:44:15. > :44:20.ahead and that is not the way you normally go into negotiations. I

:44:20. > :44:25.agree that in this time of austerity, we shouldn't be looking

:44:25. > :44:29.at a budget rise. But we also need to be looking at other aspects of

:44:29. > :44:33.the Budget. We need to make sure there's a review, because we know

:44:33. > :44:37.we are beginning to come out of recession and in a couple of years,

:44:37. > :44:41.that will be the moment to invest. We also have to make sure that the

:44:41. > :44:49.money we've got is spent more efficiently. At the moment you are

:44:49. > :44:56.not allowed to swap money between different... That is stupid.

:44:56. > :45:02.agree that the Budget should be frozen in real terms, if not for

:45:02. > :45:07.all of the 2014-2020 period, or maybe for 14, 15 and all 16?

:45:07. > :45:12.part of a package where we look at these other aspects and make sure

:45:12. > :45:19.we get a proper efficient use art of the money we have. If I could

:45:19. > :45:24.just say... Briefly. The accounts being signed off. The countries of

:45:24. > :45:26.Europe, countries like the UK who are responsible for that, it is the

:45:26. > :45:36.Department of Work and Pensions who have never had their accounts

:45:36. > :45:39.

:45:39. > :45:45.People do have doubts that money is being spent wisely at European

:45:45. > :45:48.level, let alone British level. This is completely indefensible

:45:48. > :45:52.when we have cuts in our own country and are living in times of

:45:52. > :45:56.austerity. The European Parliament has voted to increase our

:45:56. > :46:00.contributions by �2 billion a year, something we can't afford, and

:46:00. > :46:05.something the people of this country would not like. What should

:46:05. > :46:09.they do? Rejected completely. I would like to see the Budget

:46:09. > :46:14.reduced significantly. I think Cameron will go into negotiations.

:46:14. > :46:18.He got on the train a few years ago at St Pancras and said, "I'm going

:46:19. > :46:25.to Brussels and I will be the hard man." By the time he got there, he

:46:25. > :46:31.would he accept the 2.5%. If there is no deal because they want to

:46:31. > :46:36.avoid a British veto, as Angela Merkel is suggesting, this year's

:46:36. > :46:41.budget is automatically rolled over with a 2% increase, is an there is

:46:41. > :46:47.no veto on that. Would that be a sensible strategy? Cameron has got

:46:47. > :46:51.to play hardball, and if he has to walk out, I believe he should. The

:46:51. > :46:57.budget will go forward anyway. At the European Parliament wanted to

:46:57. > :47:03.be 6.8% increase which would take a contributions to over 16 billion.

:47:03. > :47:08.didn't get an answer. You have got to play hardball otherwise it won't

:47:08. > :47:12.play in this country at all, but if you play to add, you get rises you

:47:12. > :47:15.didn't want in the first place. are hugely benefiting from this

:47:15. > :47:23.particularly when you look at research programmes. Newcastle

:47:23. > :47:31.University has got 116 at research programmes at the moment. We are

:47:31. > :47:35.net contributors. No, we are not, on research. I understand point. I

:47:35. > :47:40.don't quite understand the point of the argument because, if we didn't

:47:40. > :47:45.make a contribution at all, and decided as a democracy not to, we

:47:45. > :47:52.could give that money to Newcastle University anyway. We wouldn't be

:47:52. > :47:59.in the single market if we did that. The average tax payer pays 8p a day.

:47:59. > :48:04.Poor Norwegian tax payer, he pays almost as much for the privilege.

:48:04. > :48:09.In the end, although it sounds like big money, when you driller down,

:48:09. > :48:14.per capita, it's peanuts. Actually, the contribution is quite

:48:14. > :48:22.significant but, beyond that, the money it takes to comply with EU

:48:22. > :48:25.directives. We give �16.3 billion a year to the European Union and get

:48:25. > :48:29.under half of Babak and then they will tell us how to spend our own

:48:29. > :48:35.money and that is not acceptable and it is wrong. A we have to move

:48:35. > :48:40.on. Plenty of time between now and Christmas to discuss it. Endless

:48:40. > :48:43.summer it's coming up now. David Cameron's air miles will be quite

:48:43. > :48:47.amazing if he carries on like this. Now, how many homes do you think

:48:47. > :48:50.the European Parliament has? I'm sure you know. Well, you might be

:48:50. > :48:53.surprised to find out that it actually has two. One in Brussels

:48:53. > :48:55.and another in Strasbourg. The moving between the two has been

:48:55. > :48:58.dubbed the travelling circus. And in these austere times, many are

:48:58. > :49:07.questioning if it's sensible or affordable? Jo Coburn packed her

:49:07. > :49:10.bag and set off to investigate. Brussels may be more famous for its

:49:10. > :49:19.chocolate and a beer, but it's also home to the European Parliament.

:49:19. > :49:23.Most of the time, anyway. Once a month, 754 MEPs and 3,000 staff

:49:23. > :49:30.trek to London 20 miles to their other home in Strasbourg. The

:49:30. > :49:34.official seat of the European Parliament. This tale of two cities

:49:34. > :49:38.is often referred to as the gravy train, and it could be about to hit

:49:38. > :49:42.the buffers. At the time of crisis, the campaign for a single seed for

:49:42. > :49:48.the European Parliament has been gathering speed. Its supporters

:49:48. > :49:53.claim the monthly shuttle costs 180 million euros a year. A round trip

:49:53. > :50:01.by car and train can take up to eight hours, and it produces 19,000

:50:01. > :50:08.tonnes of carbon dioxide emissions each year. The public see this

:50:08. > :50:13.travelling circus as an example of the EU waste and incompetence. The

:50:13. > :50:17.members themselves want change. We recognise what the public feel. We

:50:17. > :50:24.are responding to that by saying, come on, governments, stop forcing

:50:24. > :50:28.us to meet in Strasbourg. He British MEP Edward McMillan-Scott

:50:28. > :50:38.is leading the fight for a single seed based in Russells and support

:50:38. > :50:38.

:50:38. > :50:45.is growing. 74% of MEPs backed the call for change it -- Brussels. But

:50:45. > :50:48.the decision as a huge historical significance. The city is on the

:50:48. > :50:57.border with Germany. And, for many, it represents the close links

:50:57. > :51:05.between the two countries after two world wars. For us, Strasbourg is a

:51:05. > :51:15.symbol of peace and reconciliation with Germany and France, so it's

:51:15. > :51:15.

:51:15. > :51:19.very strong for us and for Germany or so. -- also. The view of the

:51:19. > :51:23.French is backed up by European law, which states that the parliament

:51:23. > :51:28.meets in Strasbourg 12 times a year. Changing where European

:51:28. > :51:31.institutions are based requires treaty change, agreed by all 27

:51:31. > :51:38.member states. History has proved how difficult that can be to

:51:38. > :51:42.achieve. Then the question is, how do you deal with, as it were,

:51:42. > :51:47.buying off the French? You have to give them something to compensate.

:51:47. > :51:52.You have to work out ways of using the historic value of Strasbourg in

:51:52. > :51:57.different ways. Making Brussels the only destination for Europe's MPs

:51:57. > :52:02.could be many years away. For now, I'd better book my ticket to come

:52:02. > :52:06.back to Strasbourg next month. Jo Coburn reporting. She actually

:52:07. > :52:12.got the train to the south of France! Are you against the

:52:12. > :52:17.situation? It indeed. It's crazy. It's the thing most people regard

:52:17. > :52:24.as the example of what is not efficient. We need to change it. It

:52:24. > :52:28.doesn't make sense from a money point of view. Your carbon

:52:28. > :52:32.footprint is enormous. Terrible. It made sense after the Second World

:52:32. > :52:38.War. This is the 21st century and we have got to make the EU work for

:52:38. > :52:44.the 21st century. Even if the whole parliament was United 100%, putting

:52:44. > :52:48.aside the Strasbourg MEP, who wouldn't be, it won't happen.

:52:48. > :52:52.quite simply, it shows you how powerless MPs are in this issue

:52:52. > :52:58.because we will basically be told it is written into the treaties and

:52:58. > :53:01.can't happen. There is a parliament was mothballed in Luxembourg which

:53:01. > :53:05.has two debating chambers which have never been used and the

:53:05. > :53:12.offices were done up at �800 million and there are 300 staff

:53:12. > :53:18.there. I was interested to learn of the French don't have another

:53:18. > :53:23.major... On French soil, they don't have another major European

:53:23. > :53:28.institution. If it was to stay in Brussels, wardens of Brussels have

:53:28. > :53:32.to sense something big down to Strasbourg to fill the gap? They

:53:32. > :53:42.had been at many good ideas which it used to be put to a building, a

:53:42. > :53:47.technology institute. A hotel like a naughty arch? Even though its

:53:47. > :53:50.right that MEPs can't do anything about it, it's in the coalition

:53:50. > :53:58.agreement with the support of both government parties. -- Admiralty

:53:58. > :54:01.We need to put it on a table. both have been in favour of

:54:01. > :54:07.reforming the Common Agricultural Policy together, too. Watch this

:54:07. > :54:09.space. I will, but I won't hold my breath! Now it might look like

:54:09. > :54:12.David Cameron and his ministers are endlessly shuttling between London

:54:12. > :54:18.and Brussels for make-or-break meetings with their EU counterparts.

:54:18. > :54:22.I know it certainly does to them! It's tough for us just to watch it

:54:22. > :54:24.and cover. But lots of the groundwork is done in advance by

:54:24. > :54:31.civil servants who are based in what's effectively Britain's

:54:31. > :54:41.embassy to the EU. Adam's been to see them in action for the latest

:54:41. > :54:49.

:54:49. > :54:55.in our series, the A-Z of Europe. In amongst the grandeur of the

:54:55. > :55:00.capital of Europe, where can you find our man in Brussels? Well,

:55:00. > :55:06.here in between a bar and a pharmacy. This is home up to the UK

:55:06. > :55:10.Permanent representation to the EU, known as UKREP. And the man in the

:55:10. > :55:15.middle with the blue folder full of secrets is power UKREP, our

:55:15. > :55:20.ambassador to the EU, John Cunliffe, the 10th person to have the job. We

:55:20. > :55:26.caught up with him prowling the corridors and lifts of power with

:55:26. > :55:28.his French opposite number. He grunted as a rare interview. We are

:55:29. > :55:32.responsible for all that associations which take place

:55:32. > :55:39.within the EU. When you think of it, we deal with a whole range of

:55:39. > :55:43.issues. I start the morning meeting the French ambassador and we

:55:43. > :55:46.discuss the agenda, where we are on particular positions, and then I

:55:47. > :55:53.think I'm meeting another couple of ambassadors this evening. My job is

:55:53. > :55:58.to make sure the UK's voice is heard and interests are promoted

:55:58. > :56:03.and are protected. And then he was off to the meeting of ambassadors

:56:03. > :56:08.from the other 26 member states. Here they do much of the EU's day-

:56:08. > :56:14.to-day work. On the agenda, next year's budget, Syria, Iran and

:56:14. > :56:18.immigration. UKREP is a team of people, 150 civil servants from

:56:18. > :56:22.across Whitehall, who spend between two and four years here at the time

:56:22. > :56:27.and do the really did tell me decisions. They also help out

:56:27. > :56:32.British guests when they pop over to Brussels. Here, guiding the

:56:32. > :56:36.minister through the complex world of the European Parliament. Critics

:56:36. > :56:40.of this place say it is full bureaucrats who are enthralled to

:56:40. > :56:44.Brussels. The kind of people who will do any deal rather than the

:56:44. > :56:49.real deal Number Ten would like to see. While they say they simply

:56:49. > :56:54.negotiate within limits, set by London. And there is some glamour

:56:54. > :56:59.to UKREP after all. It turns out our man in Basil gets a residence

:57:00. > :57:08.here on ambassador's role. I suppose he needs somewhere grand

:57:08. > :57:12.for his dinner parties. How does he know that? Adam Fleming

:57:12. > :57:16.reporting. Fiona Hall and Paul Nuttall are still with me. Does

:57:16. > :57:22.UKREP to a good job representing Britain in Brussels? I don't agree

:57:22. > :57:27.with what they do. Britain represents 12% of the population of

:57:27. > :57:31.the EU but only 4% of the staff within the EU are British. They are

:57:31. > :57:34.meant to go sit on our behalf. I'm not going to criticise the civil

:57:34. > :57:37.servants but they are taking their lead from the Foreign Office and

:57:37. > :57:43.quite frankly the Foreign Office has sold us down the river over the

:57:43. > :57:47.year. They report to the foreign office. What is the important thing

:57:47. > :57:54.they do for the UK? They don't just report to the Foreign Office but

:57:54. > :57:58.across the board to departments. Detailed piece of legislation. I

:57:58. > :58:03.think they do a good job and I work closely with them. High quality

:58:03. > :58:07.people? Yes, we had a gap when we stopped fast-tracking people but we

:58:07. > :58:10.are doing so again and that's very important. Are they work on the

:58:10. > :58:17.detail and have their hands tied behind their back because they

:58:17. > :58:23.don't get the full support of UK MEPs because some of them pocket

:58:23. > :58:26.their salary and don't actually do their detailed work. Names? Paul

:58:26. > :58:34.Nuttall has only once been in the environment committee in the last

:58:34. > :58:41.two years. I don't want to go down that road. We, even if you got your

:58:41. > :58:47.way, we still need a UKREP for the EU? If it still existed after we

:58:47. > :58:50.left, of course. I just up answer this question by not turning up. I

:58:50. > :58:55.would rather have a MEP like myself who votes in favour of Britain and

:58:55. > :58:59.against any sort of legislation but transfers power from the UK to

:58:59. > :59:02.Brussels. That's what I do and why I am good value for money. You have