16/10/2013

:00:37. > :00:40.Good morning and welcome to The Daily Politics.

:00:41. > :00:43.It's politicians versus the police, as chief constables refuse to

:00:44. > :00:49.discipline officers after the independent watchdog questions their

:00:50. > :00:53.honesty and integrity. House prices may be bouyant, but

:00:54. > :00:57.house building isn't. But who has the remedy, the government or

:00:58. > :01:01.Labour? Nick Clegg says it's time to think

:01:02. > :01:05.more imaginatively on drugs. Does that mean contemplating

:01:06. > :01:10.decriminalising some of the them? And the excitement builds. MPs are

:01:11. > :01:14.voting now for a new deputy speaker, with the result expected within

:01:15. > :01:28.hours. If you still fancy a flutter, we'll bring you the odds on the

:01:29. > :01:36.runners and riders. Are you excited? Kind you feel it? Have you put any

:01:37. > :01:39.money on it? All my savings! No, I haven't but a penny.

:01:40. > :01:42.And joining us for the duration today, the newly appointed shadow

:01:43. > :01:45.housing minister Emma Reynolds, and a man who stubbornly refuses to be

:01:46. > :01:59.reshuffled - Pensions Minister Steve Webb. Welcome to the programme.

:02:00. > :02:03.Now, if this is how the police treat a cabinet minister, what chance is

:02:04. > :02:08.there for an ordinary member of the public? That was how to reason may

:02:09. > :02:13.reflected on the behaviour of police officers whose honesty and integrity

:02:14. > :02:18.is questioned in a report from the IPCC. Deborah Glass, deputy

:02:19. > :02:22.chairwoman of the IPCC, said officers from the West Midlands,

:02:23. > :02:26.West Mercia and Warwickshire forces had acted in pursuit of a political

:02:27. > :02:29.agenda when they organised a meeting with former Chief Whip Andrew

:02:30. > :02:34.Mitchell, who was trying to clear his name after being accused of

:02:35. > :02:40.calling police at the Downing Street gates plebs, an accusation he has

:02:41. > :02:43.always denied. This morning, the president of the Association of

:02:44. > :02:48.Chief Police Officers insisted most police officers are doing a good

:02:49. > :02:53.job. These events do damage confidence in policing, but I am

:02:54. > :02:57.sure that thousands of officers day in day out are giving a good

:02:58. > :03:07.service. They will be just as troubled by this. Joining me now,

:03:08. > :03:11.begin server to MP David Davis, former Shadow Home Secretary and a

:03:12. > :03:15.friend of Andrew Mitchell. And from Birmingham, we're joined by Ron Ball

:03:16. > :03:21.who is the Police and Crime Commissioner for Warwickshire.

:03:22. > :03:27.The Home Secretary said yesterday that if this is how a politician is

:03:28. > :03:32.treated, what hope does a member of the public have? Issue right? I

:03:33. > :03:38.think the problem is the other way round. Because it is an ex-cabinet

:03:39. > :03:44.member, I think the police officer would not be treated the same way.

:03:45. > :03:46.These police officers totally misrepresented what happened at

:03:47. > :03:51.their meeting and we would not have known that unless Mr Mr -- Mr

:03:52. > :03:58.Mitchell taped the meeting. They were out to get him from the start.

:03:59. > :04:06.There was a thorough investigation supervised by the IPCC which was

:04:07. > :04:09.then put to three senior officers in three senior -- in three different

:04:10. > :04:18.forces who came to a conclusion on the facts. That is a fair and open

:04:19. > :04:23.process. At any time, the IPCC could've taken over. They decided

:04:24. > :04:27.not to. They washed their hands of it and then made an inflammatory

:04:28. > :04:32.statement. Well, the police investigated themselves as they

:04:33. > :04:37.usually do. The IPCC looked at this and said, in the end, they had not

:04:38. > :04:41.shown honesty or integrity. What is wrong with that conclusion? I don't

:04:42. > :04:50.see where they have the evidence for that position. They were the

:04:51. > :04:56.findings of three senior officers. So where is the evidence and the

:04:57. > :05:02.legal action? The police came out of that meeting with Mr Mitchell and

:05:03. > :05:07.said that they were -- said he wouldn't tell them the words he'd

:05:08. > :05:11.actually used with police at the Downing Street gates. We now know

:05:12. > :05:15.from a transcript of a recording exactly what Mr Mitchell had told

:05:16. > :05:24.them. They totally misrepresented what Mr Mitchell had said. Well,

:05:25. > :05:33.I've looked at the transcript and I cannot see where that misleading has

:05:34. > :05:38.actually taken place. And that was what the investigation by the IPCC

:05:39. > :05:43.bank. Those officers are now in a difficult position. The outcome of

:05:44. > :05:49.the investigation is that no action will be taken. Now they are being

:05:50. > :05:53.put on trial by the IPCC in the media and have basically been found

:05:54. > :05:58.guilty and have no opportunity to clear their names. Some will think

:05:59. > :06:02.they are lucky to have their jobs, since they are in positions of

:06:03. > :06:10.public trust and they clearly abused that trust. Would you not elected to

:06:11. > :06:19.represent as, the people? Isn't that your job? You are speaking out for

:06:20. > :06:25.the Chief constables, you are representing them, not the people

:06:26. > :06:28.who elected you. I think I'm very much representing the people who

:06:29. > :06:39.elected me who want to see fairness and justice. We sacked three police

:06:40. > :06:43.officers in the last month, mainly through the proactive work of our

:06:44. > :06:51.anti-corruption teams. We take a hard line in the integrity, but it

:06:52. > :06:56.is also about fairness. So these officers have not been treated with

:06:57. > :06:59.fairness. Rubbish. It is unusual, because we actually have hard

:07:00. > :07:08.evidence of what was said in the meeting and outside the meeting. We

:07:09. > :07:11.also have the documents published by the Federation saying what they

:07:12. > :07:19.intended to do, and they were setting out to bring down Andrew

:07:20. > :07:22.Mitchell. So I'm afraid Mr Jones describes the process as their - it

:07:23. > :07:29.was not fair, it wasn't intelligent, it wasn't justice. And

:07:30. > :07:40.as a result, Deborah Glass was entirely right to criticise them.

:07:41. > :07:48.What do you say to that, Mr Jones? I wish to point out yet again the

:07:49. > :07:54.incompetence of the IPCC. I was only complaining about another incident

:07:55. > :08:00.today about the way the IPCC operated. Clearly, we are seeing an

:08:01. > :08:05.abuse of process by the deputy chair of the IPCC. Having supervised it,

:08:06. > :08:09.let somebody else make the decision - if she'd have made the decision

:08:10. > :08:13.she would've had the same facts and the same legal advice and would not

:08:14. > :08:17.have been able to make a different decision. She is letting somebody

:08:18. > :08:24.else carry the can for making the decision, and then giving her own

:08:25. > :08:29.opinion, is grossly unfair. The IPCC should've taken a song from the

:08:30. > :08:33.start, shouldn't it? Well, they have very few staff. There are three

:08:34. > :08:37.types of investigation. One is a supervised one, which is what we

:08:38. > :08:41.have here, where the IPCC keeps an eye on it but the police carry it

:08:42. > :08:46.out. Implicitly, it trusts the police to do it properly. Then there

:08:47. > :08:49.is a managed one, with more involvement. Then there is an

:08:50. > :08:56.independent one, which they do themselves. Here, the IPCC trusted

:08:57. > :09:00.the police, as the public do, and this demonstrates that unfortunately

:09:01. > :09:04.the police cannot be trusted to investigate themselves. Senior

:09:05. > :09:13.officers are trying to protect their own forces from embarrassment. It's

:09:14. > :09:16.a disgrace. When you listen to Mr Jones, do you think your party's

:09:17. > :09:22.plan for elected police commissioners is working? Well, I'm

:09:23. > :09:27.afraid your implicit comment that he's been captured by the people he

:09:28. > :09:38.is supposed to be keeping an eye on is absolutely right. Mr Jones, let

:09:39. > :09:48.me come back to you. I sense this is the crux of this. At this meeting,

:09:49. > :09:52.the police representatives there said, well, what did you say to the

:09:53. > :09:58.police at Downing Street? And Mr Mitch still -- Mr Mitchell said he

:09:59. > :10:12.had said something he should not have said, but I did not use the

:10:13. > :10:17.word plan. -- the word "pleb". That is on record. Then they come out of

:10:18. > :10:24.the meeting and said, he would not tell us what he said. They lied to

:10:25. > :10:30.us. Correct? That was fully investigated and looked at in great

:10:31. > :10:34.detail. Three senior police officers came to the view that there was

:10:35. > :10:42.insufficient evidence to levy any charges. That was the process. I

:10:43. > :10:47.have not looked at it myself. There is series of ways of interpreting

:10:48. > :10:51.the comments that were made. Personally, in terms of the officer

:10:52. > :10:56.of the West Midlands, I have not seen anything that would suggest he

:10:57. > :11:04.misled in any comment here is made subsequent to the interview. This is

:11:05. > :11:09.almost a unique circumflex stands where we have the exact facts on

:11:10. > :11:14.video tape. There is a clear line here, it is also clearly

:11:15. > :11:20.premeditated. And they did not know had -- they did not know the meeting

:11:21. > :11:24.had been recorded. What you've got here is a real problem, because what

:11:25. > :11:30.is the standard of probity we are applying? All three officers are

:11:31. > :11:35.people who are trusted. They can arrest you, they can charge you.

:11:36. > :11:41.They probably will after this! I drive very carefully bees days! They

:11:42. > :11:45.go into court and give evidence against you. You require these

:11:46. > :11:50.people to be intrinsically honest. You do not want them to be willing

:11:51. > :11:53.to go out and mislead the public because it serves their political

:11:54. > :11:58.interests in an explicit campaign to bring down an elected cabinet

:11:59. > :12:05.minister. That makes this a very high profile issue. What terrifies

:12:06. > :12:09.me is, what chance does a young 16-year-old who bases this on the

:12:10. > :12:18.street on a Saturday evening have to get back? Bob Jones, thank you for

:12:19. > :12:22.joining us. Emma, who do you think has been

:12:23. > :12:26.treated unfairly year? I think Andrew Mitchell has had to wait too

:12:27. > :12:32.long for the investigation. I think it is extremely worrying that the

:12:33. > :12:38.IPCC has then said the investigation did not draw the proper conclusions.

:12:39. > :12:41.I do think questions need to be asked about police investigating the

:12:42. > :12:46.police. In this situation, that does not seem to have been affected. Last

:12:47. > :12:51.October, Yvette Cooper called the Andrew Mitchell to be fined for the

:12:52. > :12:55.incident. Was she wrong to do so? Well, there were things that we

:12:56. > :12:59.bought at the time and we now think differently. Having seen the

:13:00. > :13:05.transcript of what happened, it does change our understanding of the

:13:06. > :13:10.event. I would say we have a different position in terms of what

:13:11. > :13:15.we think happened. We haven't quite got to the bottom of everything. To

:13:16. > :13:21.be fair, when the facts change, we change our mind. That is the

:13:22. > :13:34.question, did you believe that he had used the word pleb? Do you think

:13:35. > :13:40.they would try to fit a narrative? We thought he had sworn at a police

:13:41. > :13:48.officer, and it appears that is the case. He did not swear at, you swore

:13:49. > :13:59.in front of the police officer. -- he swore. The reason Andrew Mitchell

:14:00. > :14:04.resigned - this is my understanding of what happened at the time - he

:14:05. > :14:10.said at the time that he felt he lost the support of the Conservative

:14:11. > :14:16.Party and that is why he resigned. Do you think they should apologise,

:14:17. > :14:18.those police officers? I think they should seriously consider

:14:19. > :14:24.apologising. I think the transcript is pretty clear about what was said

:14:25. > :14:30.in the meeting. Bob Jones is wrong? This does demonstrate again that the

:14:31. > :14:35.police should not be investigating the police. There is too much of a

:14:36. > :14:41.conflict of interest there. What do you think of Bob Jones defending? He

:14:42. > :14:45.says he has read the transcript and he has a different interpretation of

:14:46. > :14:48.that meeting, despite the fact the officers we discussed said Andrew

:14:49. > :14:54.Mitchell refused to say anything about what he said in the

:14:55. > :15:00.altercation. What do you think? He has his position on this issue. I

:15:01. > :15:04.think there are serious questions bees police officers now need to and

:15:05. > :15:08.said, and I think, above all of this, the IPCC has to be the

:15:09. > :15:16.superior body. That is what they are there for. What I worry about with

:15:17. > :15:20.all of this is, not only have there been very serious allegations of

:15:21. > :15:26.malpractice, but this is now a big argument, and what does the public

:15:27. > :15:31.think? This is a labour Police Commissioner. I know Bob Jones

:15:32. > :15:35.extremely well and I think he is doing very well across the West

:15:36. > :15:40.Midlands on all sorts of issues. But on this? I'm not comfortable with

:15:41. > :15:46.the position that the three police forces are taken.

:15:47. > :15:53.Would you like to see Andrew Mitchell back in government? He is a

:15:54. > :15:58.very good minister that he has lost his career. He has apologised for

:15:59. > :16:02.the swearing and what happened and rightly so but it is a quarter of a

:16:03. > :16:09.million quid we have spent and we are still going on about it. It

:16:10. > :16:13.needs a line drawing under it. There are hundreds of officers. What you

:16:14. > :16:24.think should happen to the officers involved? If they have misled... The

:16:25. > :16:27.vast majority of officers are reliable and confident. Sometimes a

:16:28. > :16:35.small number of people drag the whole thing down this is what seems

:16:36. > :16:38.to be happening in this. Thank you. The average house price in the

:16:39. > :16:44.United Kingdom is a culture of ?1 million. It is a new record. There

:16:45. > :16:48.is a 3.8% increase over the year with huge regional variations. The

:16:49. > :16:51.supply of new houses is still sluggish and it is taking young

:16:52. > :16:59.people longer to get their own home. The opposition are battling it out

:17:00. > :17:00.for the best policies to alleviate housing shortage.

:17:01. > :17:05.Housing is becoming a political battlefield. What has been going on?

:17:06. > :17:09.In the last full financial year, fewer than 108 thousand new homes

:17:10. > :17:16.were completed in England. That is the lowest on record. The picture

:17:17. > :17:20.has started to improve in recent months. House-building starts are up

:17:21. > :17:25.7% compared with the year before but still well below pre-economic crisis

:17:26. > :17:28.levels. Labour leader Ed Miliband presented his plans to deal with the

:17:29. > :17:34.housing problems at the party conference last month. He promised

:17:35. > :17:38.the Labour government would build 200,000 new homes a year by 2020.

:17:39. > :17:43.And to achieve that he said developers would have to build on

:17:44. > :17:48.any land they own with planning permission or risk having it

:17:49. > :17:51.confiscated. The government hopes its help to buy scheme will

:17:52. > :17:54.stimulate the housing market but Labour have criticised the policy

:17:55. > :18:01.saying the government backed mortgages risk creating a bubble.

:18:02. > :18:06.Andrew. Thank you. Mr Webb, when the

:18:07. > :18:15.coalition came to power in the first financial year, 2010-11, there were

:18:16. > :18:21.111 thousand housing starts in England. How many have there been in

:18:22. > :18:26.the last financial year? You have just seen Jo has given you the

:18:27. > :18:31.figures. There has been a decline and now the economy is picking up. A

:18:32. > :18:35.year ago we had unemployed builders, we had land with planning

:18:36. > :18:38.permission that builders were not willing to build on and we had

:18:39. > :18:42.people who were desperate to buy houses. What we have done now is

:18:43. > :18:50.made sure the developers have already got planning permission are

:18:51. > :18:55.building. People are now starting to buy for the first time so we have

:18:56. > :18:59.turned a corner but this is coming after decades of insufficient

:19:00. > :19:04.house-building. The latest figures we have are up to June this year.

:19:05. > :19:19.How many houses were started in the year to June? You tell me. 111,000,

:19:20. > :19:23.110 to March. This is the latest official figures we have. Can you

:19:24. > :19:31.remind viewers how may houses were started in your first year? What is

:19:32. > :19:34.happening now is acceleration. The house-building industry is

:19:35. > :19:39.accelerating. That is why the economic growth figures are picking

:19:40. > :19:44.up. You need to define the word accelerate for me. In the first

:19:45. > :19:52.financial year 111,000 houses were started. In the year up to June

:19:53. > :19:58.2013, the latest figures we have, 111,000 houses were started. It is

:19:59. > :20:01.the same number. Explain the definition of acceleration. There

:20:02. > :20:09.was a dip and now it is starting to recover. What we need to see is

:20:10. > :20:13.people able to buy new houses. The government's Help to Buy scheme is

:20:14. > :20:17.in two bits. The first is to aim people to buy newly constructed

:20:18. > :20:22.houses. Whereas across the country as a whole house prices in many

:20:23. > :20:28.places are not rising very fast, London and the south-east are rising

:20:29. > :20:35.fast. But there is not this great housing bubble going on. We are now

:20:36. > :20:42.in the financial year 2013-14, what would be a healthy figure four

:20:43. > :20:48.housing starts this year? It will be well up on 110,000. Pick a figure

:20:49. > :20:52.out of the air. We are seeing not only first-time buyers getting into

:20:53. > :20:55.the market but one of the other barriers was people wanting to sell

:20:56. > :21:03.the house and buy a new house and they could not do so because people

:21:04. > :21:10.could not get a deposit together. In 1997, 98, there were 156,000 starts.

:21:11. > :21:17.Ten years later, before the financial crash, how many did Labour

:21:18. > :21:23.start? I do not know the answer. It was 170,000. So after ten years of

:21:24. > :21:27.boom you managed to increase the number of starts by 14,000, ten

:21:28. > :21:33.years of economic growth and you only added to it. One of the reasons

:21:34. > :21:38.why there is a huge housing shortage in this country is because of all

:21:39. > :21:43.the years in power you never built anything like the right number of

:21:44. > :21:48.houses. I would have our record over their record any day. We built 2

:21:49. > :21:57.million houses. What needs to be done now is over 200,000 houses a

:21:58. > :22:04.year should be built. You never heard that figure? That is right, we

:22:05. > :22:10.should have built more. You had 13 years to do it. Firstly, we have put

:22:11. > :22:14.this centre stage of our agenda for the next Parliament. Maybe we did

:22:15. > :22:21.not give it the priority it deserved. Secondly, we have outlined

:22:22. > :22:24.ambitious plans in order to put pressure on developers who are

:22:25. > :22:32.sitting on land with planning permission. Where is the evidence

:22:33. > :22:37.for that bit people have land but not developing? You say it is the

:22:38. > :22:41.case, where is the evidence? It is clear that there are developers

:22:42. > :22:42.sitting on land with planning permission in different local

:22:43. > :22:50.authorities and they are not building. You asserting it does not

:22:51. > :22:56.make it to be so. What you want, a piece of paper? Yes, I want an

:22:57. > :23:01.investigation. The OFT investigated and could not find evidence. Kate

:23:02. > :23:06.Barker had a major investigation and concluded the industry did not have

:23:07. > :23:11.overly large land banks. The home builders Federation pointed out the

:23:12. > :23:23.local latest -- latest local government report on this. There are

:23:24. > :23:26.three, the OFT, Barker report and Local Government Association who all

:23:27. > :23:32.say they have no evidence for what you claim. I would ask you to give

:23:33. > :23:35.me some evidence. We are working very closely with local authorities

:23:36. > :23:39.and there are local authorities in different parts of the country who

:23:40. > :23:43.are telling us this is a problem. I am sure there are individual

:23:44. > :23:47.examples but I cannot find evidence that this is the case. Since you are

:23:48. > :23:53.making it a key part of your claim, can you give me any? It is clear

:23:54. > :23:58.that the market is not working and there are not enough houses being

:23:59. > :24:02.built. We are working closely with local authorities who tell us this

:24:03. > :24:06.is a problem. This is not the only part of the solution that we are

:24:07. > :24:09.suggesting. We have set up a commission chaired by Sir Michael

:24:10. > :24:13.Lyons who has great experience in these matters. He used to be the

:24:14. > :24:17.chief executive of Wolverhampton City Council in the 80s. He is

:24:18. > :24:22.looking at how we can develop further these plans. We think we

:24:23. > :24:27.need to be much more ambitious than this government. This government has

:24:28. > :24:32.presided over slumping housing completions, the lowest since the

:24:33. > :24:40.1920s in peace time. You need to kick-start the building of housing.

:24:41. > :24:43.You can trade statistics till the cows come home. The key thing is

:24:44. > :24:48.helping people to get their foot on the housing ladder which too many

:24:49. > :24:51.have been unable to do. Also freeing up land where builders have got

:24:52. > :24:56.permission and it has not started yet and what the government has

:24:57. > :24:59.managed to do is to unlock a dozen house-building sites which is why we

:25:00. > :25:03.are seeing construction on the up now. We will keep an eye on these

:25:04. > :25:10.figures. Now, the Conservative party has a

:25:11. > :25:16.policy, believe me! Just the one! They promise to raise the personal

:25:17. > :25:19.tax allowance to ?12,500. Sound familiar, Steve Webb? The Liberal

:25:20. > :25:25.Democrats have accused their coalition partners of stealing their

:25:26. > :25:30.policy. How dare they? We know how you feel about good ideas being

:25:31. > :25:34.stolen. It has been brought to our attention that other television

:25:35. > :25:39.programmes may have mimicked our entirely original idea of having a

:25:40. > :25:49.mark with the programme's name on it. ITV's Loose Women, sky News Adam

:25:50. > :25:57.Boulton and our colleagues at BBC Breakfast macro. He does not look a

:25:58. > :26:02.day older than he was when I gave him his job at Sky News. But we

:26:03. > :26:07.still have our unique selling point because we are giving hours away. We

:26:08. > :26:15.will remind you how to enter in a minute but see if you can remember

:26:16. > :26:19.when this happened. Mystical Sun, did you have any regrets? --

:26:20. > :27:33.mystical Sun. To be in with a chance of winning a

:27:34. > :27:40.Daily Politics mug, send your answer to our special quiz e-mail address.

:27:41. > :27:41.You can see the full terms and conditions for best year on our

:27:42. > :27:56.website. It is coming up to midday here. It

:27:57. > :28:03.is Wednesday, it is noon, it means Prime Minister 's questions -- Prime

:28:04. > :28:10.Ministers' Questions. And Nick Robinson is here. You have got the

:28:11. > :28:16.dreaded party conference lurgy, also known as drinking too much! An

:28:17. > :28:22.interesting set of statistics today, a big fall in employment by the

:28:23. > :28:26.job-seeker's allowance cut and average earnings, which we thought

:28:27. > :28:31.would show some signs of life are still flat. That is the intriguing

:28:32. > :28:36.thing. The battle we saw played out in the party conferences, Labour say

:28:37. > :28:41.it is all about the cost of living, the Tory party state is about the

:28:42. > :28:44.economy. I guess this will be played out in Prime Ministers' Questions.

:28:45. > :28:50.The Prime Minister will say employment is at a record high. He

:28:51. > :28:54.will say you did not see that coming and the truth is no one thought

:28:55. > :28:57.unemployment would be as low as it is now. On the other hand, the

:28:58. > :29:03.Labour leader will say not only has the rate of increase of earnings has

:29:04. > :29:09.gone down, not only is it lagging inflation for 39 months in a row out

:29:10. > :29:14.of 40, but there is also the fact in the public sector there has been an

:29:15. > :29:19.actual fall in people's earnings. It is not less than inflation it has

:29:20. > :29:26.gone down by not .5%. That is the first time ever in the statistics --

:29:27. > :29:34.0.5%. It is a striking statistic about the extent of the squeeze on

:29:35. > :29:39.people's earnings. It is the economy again for Prime Ministers'

:29:40. > :29:44.Questions? That is my guess. And Ed Miliband was criticised by his own

:29:45. > :29:49.people for changing the subject. The message he has got is once you say

:29:50. > :29:53.something, you have to say it again and again until people aboard in the

:29:54. > :30:02.hope that the public will notice. The comparison with the standard of

:30:03. > :30:05.living, the real picture is the household disposable income. I

:30:06. > :30:09.suspect the Prime Minister is not always across his statistics and

:30:10. > :30:12.will not know that. There was a debate a few months ago about the

:30:13. > :30:16.figures on the household income whether they were going up or not.

:30:17. > :30:20.The Treasury said they were going up. There was a question about

:30:21. > :30:25.whether they were going overall up across the economy. Or were they not

:30:26. > :30:30.going up her head. You get a detailed breakdown. That will not

:30:31. > :30:35.happen! Crudely speaking, the Prime Minister cannot deny there is the

:30:36. > :30:40.squeeze on people's earnings. The question that hangs over both their

:30:41. > :30:44.assertions is whether the government of either party will make a

:30:45. > :30:49.difference to those statistics. It is interesting that this business of

:30:50. > :30:52.recovery and living standards dominates the political agenda. I

:30:53. > :30:56.remember talking to Labour ministers when the crash began and they were

:30:57. > :30:58.terrified about a rise in unemployment. Now it is like an

:30:59. > :31:30.implement is fine. Let's go to the I had meetings with ministerial

:31:31. > :31:41.colleagues and others and I will have further such meetings later

:31:42. > :31:52.today. I'm only hoping that Sheffield United will follow their

:31:53. > :31:57.lead. Mr Speaker, we will all have heard from constituents who, while

:31:58. > :32:01.struggling to make ends meet, have taken out payday loans and then

:32:02. > :32:05.found themselves trapped in spiralling debt with excessive

:32:06. > :32:11.charges and escalating interest. Yesterday, all the major national

:32:12. > :32:14.consumer and debt advice organisations came together in

:32:15. > :32:24.Parliament to launch a charter calling for the top regulation of

:32:25. > :32:27.payday lenders. The charter is backed by members representing every

:32:28. > :32:33.party in this House. Will the Prime Minister added his support? Can I

:32:34. > :32:37.commend the Honourable Gentleman for the honourable work he does on

:32:38. > :32:43.payday loans and tough regulation? It is absolutely right we get things

:32:44. > :32:46.right in this area. This month, the Government published reports showing

:32:47. > :32:52.that the problems in this market persist. That is why the Financial

:32:53. > :32:56.Conduct Authority has made a series of proposals using powers to ban

:32:57. > :33:00.loans and adverts it does not approve of, limiting the number of

:33:01. > :33:06.attempts payday lender can take money out of, and all other

:33:07. > :33:10.proposals. We continue to look at the issue of a cap but we do have to

:33:11. > :33:14.bear in mind what has been found out in other countries and through our

:33:15. > :33:22.own research about whether a cap would prove effective. But it is

:33:23. > :33:26.right that we regulate this area. Can we have a full and transparent

:33:27. > :33:29.assessment about whether the Guardian's involvement in the

:33:30. > :33:33.Snowdon affair has damaged Britain's national security? Does my

:33:34. > :33:40.right honourable friend agree that it is bizarre that for some, the

:33:41. > :33:45.hacking of a celebrity phone demands a prosecution, but leaving the

:33:46. > :33:49.country vulnerable is opening a debate? I commend my honourable

:33:50. > :33:53.friend for raising this issue. The plain fact is that what has happened

:33:54. > :34:01.has damaged national security, and in many ways, the Guardian admitted

:34:02. > :34:07.that when they agreed to destroy the files they had. So they know what

:34:08. > :34:10.they are dealing with is dangerous for national security. It is up to

:34:11. > :34:18.select committees in this House if they want to examine this issue and

:34:19. > :34:21.make further recommendations. I join the Prime Minister in sending

:34:22. > :34:23.warmest congratulations to the England team on their victory last

:34:24. > :34:29.night and getting to the World Cup finals. My commiserations to Wales,

:34:30. > :34:35.Scotland and Northern Ireland. Today's economic figures show a

:34:36. > :34:40.welcome fall in unemployment. They also show that prices have risen

:34:41. > :34:44.faster than wages, and that is 39 out of 40 months that living

:34:45. > :34:47.standards have fallen since he became Prime Minister. We'll

:34:48. > :34:53.reconfirm what everybody knows, that there is a cost of living crisis in

:34:54. > :34:56.this country? Let me welcome his welcome for the unemployment

:34:57. > :35:02.figures. Not everyone in the House would have been able to study them,

:35:03. > :35:08.but it is good news. Numbers in work are up 155,000. Unemployment is down

:35:09. > :35:12.18,000. Women's unemployment and youth unemployment is down. And

:35:13. > :35:18.vacancies are up. And, crucially, the ball in the claimant count is

:35:19. > :35:22.41,000 this month alone. That is the fastest ball in the number of people

:35:23. > :35:28.claiming employment benefit since February 1997. Of course, we all

:35:29. > :35:32.want to see living standards improve, and last year disposable

:35:33. > :35:36.income increased, but the way to deliver on living standards is to

:35:37. > :35:45.grow the economy, keep producing jobs and cut people 's taxes. There

:35:46. > :35:49.are almost 1 million young people still out of work and yak -- and

:35:50. > :35:54.record numbers of people working part time you cannot find full-time

:35:55. > :35:59.work. That is no cause for complacency. The British people will

:36:00. > :36:02.be surprised to hear the Prime Minister telling them their living

:36:03. > :36:05.standards are rising when they know the truth: Under them, living

:36:06. > :36:11.standards are falling month upon month upon month. One of the reasons

:36:12. > :36:17.is rising energy bills, which one leading charity reports today is one

:36:18. > :36:22.of the things driving people to food banks. In light of that, does the

:36:23. > :36:34.Prime Minister think the energy company as if each's decision to

:36:35. > :36:43.raise bills by 8.2% is justified? -- the company SSE. There is absolutely

:36:44. > :36:48.no complacency, we need more young people in work, we need more jobs.

:36:49. > :36:52.But one remarkable thing about these figures is they show for the first

:36:53. > :36:57.time thereof 1 million more people in work than there were when this

:36:58. > :37:00.Government came to office. And let me remind the right Honourable

:37:01. > :37:11.Gentleman of something he predicted in October 2010. He said the

:37:12. > :37:15.Government have a programme which will clearly lead to the

:37:16. > :37:20.disappearance of 1 million jobs. That was his prediction, he was 100%

:37:21. > :37:27.wrong and he should apologise to this House of Commons. Of course, we

:37:28. > :37:32.all want to see energy prices come down. That's why we're putting

:37:33. > :37:35.people on the lowest tariff. The one thing that will not work is a price

:37:36. > :37:41.column, and that is what he is recommending. The person who should

:37:42. > :37:45.be apologising is this Prime Minister for the cost of living

:37:46. > :37:52.crisis facing millions of families. Let's talk about SSE. On their

:37:53. > :37:56.website they say they have one strategic priority, and they call it

:37:57. > :38:01.a dividend of session. It is not to get bills down, not to be on the

:38:02. > :38:09.side of the consumer. So it is make up your mind time for the Prime

:38:10. > :38:17.Minister. He sided see on? -- whose side is he on? We are on the side of

:38:18. > :38:21.the people. That is why we have frozen council tax and lifted 2

:38:22. > :38:24.million people out of tax. Let me make this point about living

:38:25. > :38:30.standards. If you want to help with living standards, the best way to do

:38:31. > :38:37.that is to cut taxes. You can only cut taxes if you can cut spending.

:38:38. > :38:41.He has opposed every single spending cut we are proposed. Even now comedy

:38:42. > :38:48.wants to spend more money. More spending, more borrowing, more debt.

:38:49. > :38:52.It is the same old Labour. Isn't it striking that the one thing the

:38:53. > :38:56.Prime Minister doesn't want to talk about is energy prices? He can't

:38:57. > :39:00.talk about it, because he has no answer. Let's have an answer on the

:39:01. > :39:05.energy price freeze. Can you confirm that opposing the freeze, he has on

:39:06. > :39:08.his side the big six energy companies, and supporting the

:39:09. > :39:17.freeze, we have consumer bodies and small energy producers and the vast

:39:18. > :39:20.majority of the British people? Is an energy price freeze was such a

:39:21. > :39:27.great idea, why didn't he introduced that when he stood at this precise

:39:28. > :39:32.spot as energy secretary? It is not a price freeze, it is a price con.

:39:33. > :39:36.He is not in control of worldwide gas prices, which is why he had to

:39:37. > :39:41.admit the next day he could not keep his promise. That is the truth. The

:39:42. > :39:44.reason he does not want to talk about the economy is because he

:39:45. > :39:52.hasn't got a credible economic policy. He can't explain why did up

:39:53. > :39:57.as falling, the economy is growing, unemployment is going down. I have

:39:58. > :40:01.to say to him, given his problem is no credible economic policy, he

:40:02. > :40:08.doesn't help them sell by having a totally incredible energy policy. I

:40:09. > :40:13.thought you might get to the record of the last Government. They've been

:40:14. > :40:20.floundering and beds blame the last Government and green levies. Let's

:40:21. > :40:30.talk about them. Who was it you said, go blue, boat Green. There was

:40:31. > :40:36.it who said, I think green taxes as a whole need to go up. It was him as

:40:37. > :40:40.leader of the opposition. He's been talking about my record as energy

:40:41. > :40:47.secretary. So I look back at the record on the energy bill of 2010.

:40:48. > :40:56.Did he oppose the energy bill of 2010? No, you supported the energy

:40:57. > :41:03.bill. You could say, Mr Speaker, two parties working together in the

:41:04. > :41:07.national interest. Does he not feel faintly embarrassed that in five

:41:08. > :41:18.short years he's gone from hug a husky to gas a badger? The only

:41:19. > :41:24.embarrassing thing is this tortured performance. He wants to talk about

:41:25. > :41:32.the record of the last Labour Government. Let me remind him, they

:41:33. > :41:36.doubled the council tax, they put up electricity bills by half, they put

:41:37. > :41:43.up petrol tax 12 times and they increased the basic state pension by

:41:44. > :41:49.a measly 75p. When it came to the low paid, they got rid of the 10p

:41:50. > :41:52.income tax ban altogether. They absolutely no economic policy and

:41:53. > :41:58.that is why the former economic Chancellor said this. I'm waiting to

:41:59. > :42:04.hear what we've got to say on the economy. Well, I think we should

:42:05. > :42:10.give up waiting because they are a hopeless opposition. He talks about

:42:11. > :42:25.the last Labour Government. I will tell him what happened. Living

:42:26. > :42:29.standards up ?3700 over the last years of the Labour Government.

:42:30. > :42:37.Living standards down ?1500 under him. This is the reality of Britain

:42:38. > :42:41.under this Prime Minister booed by -- under this Prime Minister. Even

:42:42. > :42:48.if you are in work, you are worse off. He is in total denial about the

:42:49. > :42:53.cost of living crisis. If he wants to debate the last Labour

:42:54. > :42:57.Government, I say, bring it on. They crashed the economy, they bust the

:42:58. > :43:02.banks, they doubled the national debt, and I have to say to him,

:43:03. > :43:07.today, on the day we can see their 1 million more people in work in their

:43:08. > :43:11.country, that is 1 million people -- reasons to stick to the plan that we

:43:12. > :43:19.have, 1 million reasons to keep reducing the deficit, and 1 million

:43:20. > :43:33.reasons to say, more borrowing, more spending, more debt - that is the

:43:34. > :43:40.same old Labour. Never again! Mr Stephen Gilbert. Thank you. Last

:43:41. > :43:45.night, you presented an award to the nieces of Alan Shearing, their World

:43:46. > :43:48.War II code breaker who helped this country win World War II. The

:43:49. > :43:58.Government indicated in July it would move to bring a pardon to his

:43:59. > :44:03.infection -- to his conviction. Can my right Honourable Gentleman tell

:44:04. > :44:08.me when this pardon will be granted? Firstly, let me pay tribute to what

:44:09. > :44:12.he did for this country. It was remarkable and crucial to winning

:44:13. > :44:16.the war. What happened to him was completely wrong, and looking back,

:44:17. > :44:23.everybody knows that. The specific of the pardon I'm happy to look at,

:44:24. > :44:34.but above all we should praise him and the people who worked for him.

:44:35. > :44:39.The Prime Minister embraced the need to cut pseudo- green biofuel

:44:40. > :44:50.mandates which effectively hijacked food conductivity -- productivity.

:44:51. > :44:55.Today, a 7% cap is being proposed as opposed to the 5%. That difference

:44:56. > :44:59.could feed 68 million people a year. What ever it is he making to

:45:00. > :45:06.actively avert this compromise against the fight against world

:45:07. > :45:13.hunger? Let me pay tribute to the honourable member for the work he

:45:14. > :45:17.has done on this issue. Biofuels should not undermine food

:45:18. > :45:22.production. A 5% cap on fuels was one of the key components of this

:45:23. > :45:24.campaign, which I support. That is what we are pushing for and I hope

:45:25. > :45:46.we will be successful. Mr Speaker, the use of contaminated

:45:47. > :45:50.blood products by the NHS in the 1980s, exposed 5000 people to

:45:51. > :45:57.hepatitis C and some 1200 others included in that number to HIV as

:45:58. > :46:03.well. Of those 1200, just over 300 are still alive. There has never

:46:04. > :46:07.been an apology or a public enquiry. Would my right honourable friend,

:46:08. > :46:11.who has an outstanding record in seeking to close historic wrongs of

:46:12. > :46:17.the past, meet with me and one of my affected constituents, and look

:46:18. > :46:21.again at the issue of a public commitment that this is the last

:46:22. > :46:24.historic scandal and ensure that these people are treated fairly by a

:46:25. > :46:29.state which wronged them in the first place? Can I thank my right

:46:30. > :46:34.honourable friend for raising this issue in the way that he has. I also

:46:35. > :46:38.have constituents who have been affected by this appalling thing

:46:39. > :46:43.which happened in our country. In 2011 in January, we announced a

:46:44. > :46:47.package of measures to provide support for those affected. Not

:46:48. > :46:54.least because there have been change in the outcomes for those with a try

:46:55. > :47:03.the -- those with HIV and hepatitis C. I hope there is more we can do to

:47:04. > :47:06.bring this sad chapter to a close. The Prime Minister will know of the

:47:07. > :47:16.many injustices which have been meted out by ATOS in the last two

:47:17. > :47:24.years. The latest victim was a farmer and a butcher in Bolsover who

:47:25. > :47:30.went to ATOS in December 2012 and was stripped of his benefit. For 11

:47:31. > :47:37.months he waited for an appeal. And then his aggressive cancer took his

:47:38. > :47:46.site, took his hearing and then last Friday took his life. Isn't it time

:47:47. > :47:52.that we put an end to this system where people who are really

:47:53. > :48:01.suffering should not be allowed an appeal, having to live on ?70 a

:48:02. > :48:07.week, him and his widow. Two things the Prime Minister should do, one,

:48:08. > :48:13.with immediate effect make an ex-Gracia payment to his widow to

:48:14. > :48:18.cover the suffering, the pain and the loss of income. And secondly,

:48:19. > :48:27.abolish this cruel, heartless monster called ATOS. Get rid of it!

:48:28. > :48:31.The honourable gentleman quite rightly raises a desperately sad

:48:32. > :48:36.case and I am happy to look at it and look at the specifics of the

:48:37. > :48:40.case he raises. I think everyone who has constituency surgeries knows

:48:41. > :48:43.that and we have to improve the quality of decision-making about

:48:44. > :48:48.this issue. Where I would take issue with him, I think it is important

:48:49. > :48:51.that we carry out proper assessments and whether people are qualified for

:48:52. > :48:55.benefits or not qualified for benefits. That is why before members

:48:56. > :49:01.opposite shout out about this, that is why they started to look at work

:49:02. > :49:04.capability. The question was heard and heard I think with great

:49:05. > :49:09.courtesy and the answer must be heard. The Prime Minister. That is

:49:10. > :49:14.why when they were in government the last government did look at work

:49:15. > :49:19.capability assessments and judge the proper way that people should be

:49:20. > :49:26.receiving benefits. There are appeals to the system but I am happy

:49:27. > :49:31.to look at the individual case. The Arctic 13 comprises of six dish

:49:32. > :49:37.citizens including Alexander Harris, the friend of my daughter. I am

:49:38. > :49:43.really concerned that their ecological protest about grey Wales

:49:44. > :49:48.is being misinterpreted as piracy because no one wants the scrutiny of

:49:49. > :49:55.the environmental work they are doing. I think we need to follow

:49:56. > :49:59.this case extremely closely. The Foreign Office Minister had a

:50:00. > :50:03.meeting which I'm sure she attended and we are daily seeking updates

:50:04. > :50:10.from the Russian government about how these people are being treated.

:50:11. > :50:13.Last week, in answer to question on his marriage tax policy the Prime

:50:14. > :50:18.Minister answered that all married couples paying basic rate tax would

:50:19. > :50:23.benefit from this move, this was not correct, was it, Prime Minister?

:50:24. > :50:29.What I said was he married couples allowance tax is available to all

:50:30. > :50:33.who are on basic rate tax. Anyone who has a unused tax allowance is

:50:34. > :50:39.able to transfer it between a husband or the wife. It comes back

:50:40. > :50:42.to a very simple principle which is we want to back marriage in the tax

:50:43. > :50:46.system and not just of the party opposite did, back tax in the

:50:47. > :50:50.inheritance tax system, we want to back marriage for less well off

:50:51. > :50:53.couples. If the shadow chancellor wants to raise another point of

:50:54. > :51:02.order, I am very happy to stick around and hear it out!

:51:03. > :51:06.I had originally intended to raise the issue of the a 14 with my right

:51:07. > :51:10.honourable friend but an important announcement was made today by the

:51:11. > :51:14.Supreme Court, who unanimously turned down the appeal for

:51:15. > :51:18.prisoners' rights. Also importantly, reasserted that it is the role for

:51:19. > :51:22.this Parliament to make the decision. Can my right honourable

:51:23. > :51:28.friend ensure that we will not be voting for prisoners' rights in this

:51:29. > :51:37.Parliament? Can I think my honourable friend for forsaking the

:51:38. > :51:43.issue of the A14. The Attorney General fought this case if front of

:51:44. > :51:46.the supreme court. He made a compelling and forceful argument and

:51:47. > :51:49.this is a victory for common sense. My views on this issue are

:51:50. > :51:53.well-known. I do not believe that prisoners should have the vote and I

:51:54. > :52:01.believe it is a matter for this House of Commons. The Supreme Court

:52:02. > :52:03.has stood up for common sense and Chrissy. This issue has nothing to

:52:04. > :52:11.do with the European Union and we can already rise that this result.

:52:12. > :52:15.The number of people helped by food banks in 2012-13 was tripled

:52:16. > :52:20.compared with the previous year. Is the Prime Minister proud of this

:52:21. > :52:26.achievement? Well food bank usage went up ten times in the last Labour

:52:27. > :52:30.government. What I want to see is helping all families with their

:52:31. > :52:34.living standards. That is why we should recognise the fact we are

:52:35. > :52:38.getting more people into work. We are growing our economy. We are

:52:39. > :52:42.keeping interest rates down and crucially, we are cutting taxes,

:52:43. > :52:49.four things which are vital for living standards and you would never

:52:50. > :52:53.get from a Labour government. In September, solid hull's ambulance

:52:54. > :52:59.service moved to a make ready system and today there are no two man and

:53:00. > :53:03.didn't is based in the borough. Several of my constituents have been

:53:04. > :53:07.left for totally unacceptably long periods waiting for an ambulance to

:53:08. > :53:12.take them to hospital. Talking to ambulance chiefs is like a dialogue

:53:13. > :53:16.of the death. Will the Prime Minister agreed to meet with me to

:53:17. > :53:22.see what can be done before a constituent dies waiting for an

:53:23. > :53:27.ambulance to come? I share my honourable friend's concern about

:53:28. > :53:32.response times for ambulances. We have to task the NHS with how they

:53:33. > :53:36.best meet those targets. What matters most is swift attendance to

:53:37. > :53:41.people who need it. I am happy to arrange a meeting with her and

:53:42. > :53:43.health ministers. I know the West Midlands ambulance service is

:53:44. > :53:49.looking at ways to improve the ambulance service.

:53:50. > :53:51.The Prime Minister will know that yesterday the Independent Police

:53:52. > :53:57.Complaints Commission published a damning report into events which

:53:58. > :54:01.occurred involving the former government chief whip. This report

:54:02. > :54:05.goes to the heart of the issue of integrity is and ethics of the

:54:06. > :54:08.police. Does he agree with the Home Secretary, who in her evidence to

:54:09. > :54:12.the Home Affairs Select Committee yesterday, said it was right that

:54:13. > :54:18.the relevant Chief Constable should apologise to the right honourable

:54:19. > :54:24.member for Sutton Coldfield and wrong if the relevant officers did

:54:25. > :54:27.not face disciplinary proceedings? I agree 100% with what the Home

:54:28. > :54:32.Secretary said yesterday and I think we should be clear about what we are

:54:33. > :54:37.discussing here. Whole case of what happened outside Number Ten Downing

:54:38. > :54:42.St is with the CPS. What is being discussed here is the fact that the

:54:43. > :54:47.former chief whip had a meeting with Police Federation offices in his

:54:48. > :54:50.constituency where he gave a full account about what happened. He left

:54:51. > :54:54.that meeting and they claimed he gave no account at all.

:54:55. > :54:57.Unfortunately, this meeting was recorded so he has been able to

:54:58. > :55:01.prove what he said was true and what the police officers said was

:55:02. > :55:05.untrue. That is why the right honourable gentleman was absolutely

:55:06. > :55:09.right. He is owed an apology. Conduct of the officers was not

:55:10. > :55:13.acceptable. These things should be properly investigated. Crucially, it

:55:14. > :55:17.is absolutely right for his committee to discuss this with the

:55:18. > :55:23.Chief Constable is concerned and try to get to the bottom of why better

:55:24. > :55:26.redress has not been given. Can I congratulate the Prime

:55:27. > :55:35.Minister on taking 2 million out of income tax but note the 1.3 million

:55:36. > :55:49.earning -- who have been sucked into the higher rate. Can I urge him to

:55:50. > :55:56.Matt Crown can I urge him to deliver it and ease the squeeze on the

:55:57. > :56:01.middle classes? We have taken 2.7 million people out of income tax

:56:02. > :56:05.altogether because we have lifted the first ?10,000 of what you can

:56:06. > :56:11.earn before you start paying taxes. This means some on the minimum wage

:56:12. > :56:15.working full-time, someone on the minimum wage has seen their tax bill

:56:16. > :56:21.come down by something like two thirds. I want to see taxes cut for

:56:22. > :56:26.all, but the only way we can continue to do that is to get the

:56:27. > :56:30.deficit down not listen to the party opposite who even today are making

:56:31. > :56:34.massive commitments to more welfare spending and public spending which

:56:35. > :56:39.would mean more taxes, higher borrowing and more of the old

:56:40. > :56:45.Labour. Does the Prime Minister consider it

:56:46. > :56:50.is a source of shame that on his watch the Red Cross has announced

:56:51. > :56:56.that it will be distributing food to British families for the first time

:56:57. > :57:02.in 70 years? What the Red Cross are choosing to do, and it is their

:57:03. > :57:07.choice, is to work with Fare Share, which is an excellent charity which

:57:08. > :57:11.makes sure supermarkets do not waste food and make it available to people

:57:12. > :57:15.who need it. That is worthwhile. We need to see a raising living

:57:16. > :57:20.standards which we will get if we keep growing the economy, getting

:57:21. > :57:24.more jobs, cutting people's taxes and we keep interest rates and

:57:25. > :57:27.mortgage rates low. Those are the four things this government is

:57:28. > :57:34.delivering which we would never have delivered if we had listened to a

:57:35. > :57:43.word on the front bench opposite. Yesterday I presented a petition to

:57:44. > :57:46.the Department of Health calling for ?420 million hospital redevelopment

:57:47. > :57:50.in Brighton Kemp Town. Does the Prime Minister agree with me that

:57:51. > :57:54.this money would make a real difference to patients across Sussex

:57:55. > :58:01.and the hard-working staff at my local hospital? I understand the

:58:02. > :58:08.business case for the redevelopment for the Centre for teaching trauma

:58:09. > :58:11.and tertiary care at the Royal Hospital of Sussex is being

:58:12. > :58:17.considered. This government decided not to cut the NHS but to put extra

:58:18. > :58:21.resources into the NHS and I am sure when it is considered an

:58:22. > :58:29.announcement will be made. Tax cuts for millionaires. Tax cuts

:58:30. > :58:34.for the wealthiest companies in this country. A bonus bonanza in the

:58:35. > :58:38.city, at the same time as millions are denied the right to work and

:58:39. > :58:44.those people who are hard-working in work have had their pay cut by

:58:45. > :58:51.?1500. When is this government made up of privileged privately educated

:58:52. > :58:56.millionaire ministers going to do something and get in the real world

:58:57. > :59:04.instead of being the political front of the hedge fund is of the bankers

:59:05. > :59:10.in the city? We all know who gave the most bonuses to the bankers, it

:59:11. > :59:15.was the people who allowed the banks to go bust in the first place. This

:59:16. > :59:18.government is taking 2.7 million people out of tax, compared with the

:59:19. > :59:28.disgrace of the government he was in which scrapped the 10p income tax.

:59:29. > :59:31.We all appreciate that government requires hard choices about

:59:32. > :59:36.priorities. Does the Prime Minister agree with me that a generous basic

:59:37. > :59:42.state pension based on a triple lock should have greater priority and

:59:43. > :59:45.more generous benefit payments? I think my honourable friend makes an

:59:46. > :59:51.important point and I am proud of the fact that last year the basic

:59:52. > :59:55.state pension went up by ?5 30 a week. We have the inflation figures

:59:56. > :00:01.for September. We can say that the basic state pension will go up by

:00:02. > :00:06.the rate of inflation next year. The party opposite committed to an

:00:07. > :00:10.earnings increase in the basic state pension would not see anything like

:00:11. > :00:16.that. They are choosing to operate welfare by 2.7% where we think it

:00:17. > :00:19.should be what I 1%. We have the priority is to stand up to people

:00:20. > :00:24.who have worked hard, done the right thing, who have saved during their

:00:25. > :00:31.lives, who deserve dignity in retirement. We will never let our

:00:32. > :00:35.pensioners down. This week, the Office for National Statistics

:00:36. > :00:45.reported that house price inflation in London was running at 8.7%. Does

:00:46. > :00:48.the Prime Minister agree that it is inevitable that the mortgage

:00:49. > :00:58.guarantee scheme will feed the property price bubble? I do not

:00:59. > :01:05.accept that for a moment we want to help people get on housing ladder.

:01:06. > :01:10.The Labour Party is standing against those people. I have to say to the

:01:11. > :01:17.honourable lady that if you look at house price increases outside London

:01:18. > :01:22.and the south-east, it is a 0.8% increase. We want to help people get

:01:23. > :01:26.on the housing ladder and achieve their dream of home ownership.

:01:27. > :01:31.Clearly the party opposite do not care for them.

:01:32. > :01:35.The Prime Minister will know in my constituency, some businesses are

:01:36. > :01:39.almost paying enough in business rates as they are paying in red.

:01:40. > :01:43.What steps will they take to persuade local councils to use the

:01:44. > :01:50.powers this government have given them to reduce those rates and make

:01:51. > :01:55.the right choices to support hard working people? I know he is a real

:01:56. > :01:59.champion for small business on this issue. The first thing we need to do

:02:00. > :02:03.is get the bill passed through the House of Commons. That will cut the

:02:04. > :02:05.national insurance bill of every business in the country,

:02:06. > :02:11.particularly helping small businesses. It means single traders

:02:12. > :02:14.need to take on three people without paying any national insurance at

:02:15. > :02:18.all. That is the most important thing. We will continue to look at

:02:19. > :02:22.the business rate system, encourage councils to make sure they do

:02:23. > :02:26.everything they can to apply the discounts where they are verbal and

:02:27. > :02:40.work on this issue. Under this government Wales -- wages have

:02:41. > :02:43.fallen. When is the Prime Minister going to take personal

:02:44. > :02:48.responsibility for this? What the honourable gentleman has to do is

:02:49. > :02:57.look at disposable income as well as wages. Because this government has

:02:58. > :03:07.cut taxes before they pay taxes, disposable income is rising. If you

:03:08. > :03:11.go on attacking spending cuts and you go on asking for more and more

:03:12. > :03:15.spending, everyone will know, with Labour you have more borrowing, more

:03:16. > :03:42.spending, more taxes, it is the same old Labour. I am very happy to look

:03:43. > :03:47.at what my right honourable friend says. I am a champion for the low

:03:48. > :03:50.paid for people who want to work hard and improve their

:03:51. > :03:56.circumstances. We should look at national insurance. The priorities

:03:57. > :04:02.for small businesses to take people on. There are a million extra people

:04:03. > :04:08.in work. If two or three quarters of those jobs are full-time jobs. The

:04:09. > :04:11.economy is getting stronger, more people are getting into work and we

:04:12. > :04:22.need to encourage that rather than set it back.

:04:23. > :04:31.So, that was dominated by the argument the living standards, which

:04:32. > :04:35.is becoming a common theme. Mr Miliband was talking several times

:04:36. > :04:41.about a crisis of living standards in the country, Mr Cameron arguing

:04:42. > :04:45.that the recovery is now underway. Mr Miliband then brought in energy

:04:46. > :04:52.prices and his plan for a freeze which is part of the argument on

:04:53. > :04:55.living standards. Mr Cameron did not quite over Mr Miliband on the green

:04:56. > :05:00.levies that were introduced when Labour was in power, because Mr

:05:01. > :05:07.Cameron had voted the most of them at that time. I think we had a taste

:05:08. > :05:10.of the argument between now and the general election on this issue, this

:05:11. > :05:17.is what will dominate the discourse between the major parties. Let's

:05:18. > :05:22.hear what you had to say. Reviewers e-mails were all about the cost of

:05:23. > :05:27.living issue. It seems Ed Miliband has really grasped the agenda with

:05:28. > :05:33.his target on the cost of living. Once again, he batted David Cameron.

:05:34. > :05:38.This was from Colin: Ed Miliband may have some valid points to make, but

:05:39. > :05:45.he continually fails to deliver them in a coherent manner. Damian says:

:05:46. > :05:48.Why has Ed Miliband harped on about youth unemployment again? Didn't it

:05:49. > :05:55.soar under Labour and food banks began? This was from Ian Whiteley:

:05:56. > :06:00.Ed Miliband knows he is on a winner his energy price free is, going on

:06:01. > :06:07.it for a second week. He wiped the floor with David Cameron. We now

:06:08. > :06:12.find out they've voted for green taxes. And finally: Raising the tax

:06:13. > :06:16.threshold does not automatically help people out of poverty because

:06:17. > :06:30.people who are really poor were already below the tax threshold.

:06:31. > :06:34.Only 19 more months of this! Ed Miliband has been told to bang on

:06:35. > :06:39.until people listen, and they did bang on. The same phrases, the same

:06:40. > :06:43.quotes, from both parties. We knew there would be the trading of stats,

:06:44. > :06:50.unemployment down and living standards. But there was also the

:06:51. > :06:57.battle of two quotes. From David Cameron, he was able to remind Ed

:06:58. > :07:01.Miliband that he predicted the disappearance of 1 million private

:07:02. > :07:07.and public sector jobs. Today's statistic shows that has not been a

:07:08. > :07:13.disappearance, there has been the creation of an extra 1 million jobs.

:07:14. > :07:19.On the other hand, Ed Miliband was able to remind the Conservatives,

:07:20. > :07:24.Paul Lamy blame green levies and the former energy secretary, he was able

:07:25. > :07:28.to quote that David Cameron and George Osborne said at the time they

:07:29. > :07:34.wanted to see more green taxes, not fewer. So in a sense you are seeing

:07:35. > :07:41.their positioning through statistics". The coalition, if it is

:07:42. > :07:49.to have a hope of doing well at the next election, you're going to have

:07:50. > :07:55.two be able to a rise back to point to a rise in living standards. It is

:07:56. > :08:04.about what people are left with after tax. The threshold used to be

:08:05. > :08:08.6500 and they want to move it up to 10,000. The reviewer who said that

:08:09. > :08:12.poor people don't pay tax, a full-time job on the minimum wage is

:08:13. > :08:17.still on income tax, so that is why the Lib Dems are keen to see if we

:08:18. > :08:23.can go further. So not taxing people on the minimum wage has to be an

:08:24. > :08:26.important part of it. To win the election, given the kind of

:08:27. > :08:31.constituencies both you and the Conservatives tend to win, people in

:08:32. > :08:38.the middle part - in but just around the average - they are going to have

:08:39. > :08:43.to feel that, after the pain they've been through of this belt

:08:44. > :08:46.tightening, by 2015 or even next year, they're going to have to feel

:08:47. > :08:53.that things are getting better, aren't they? I think the fact that

:08:54. > :08:57.wage growth has been so low is historically very and usual. As the

:08:58. > :09:00.economy starts to pick up I think wages will start to pick up. If we

:09:01. > :09:10.can combine out with record low interest rates, we have to keep the

:09:11. > :09:15.mortgage rates low. Cutting the income tax bill, job security, that

:09:16. > :09:24.could be the sign of a strong economy. If you step back from the

:09:25. > :09:27.party politics, the unemployment figures look better than many

:09:28. > :09:31.predicted. Not just Labour, but many thought they would be higher. I

:09:32. > :09:37.think the government itself feared it would be higher. But average

:09:38. > :09:42.earnings are not growing by much. Isn't it honest to say that both are

:09:43. > :09:46.connected? What employers have basically said is, I'm not going to

:09:47. > :09:52.fire you, although there is not a lot of work around, but I'm not

:09:53. > :09:58.going to increase your pay either. We welcome any improvement in the

:09:59. > :10:04.employment figures, but the truth is, many of these new jobs were

:10:05. > :10:07.hearing about our part-time jobs. A minority of them, actually. Well, a

:10:08. > :10:11.lot of people who are working part-time want to be working

:10:12. > :10:16.full-time. With respect, that wasn't what I was asking. I was trying to

:10:17. > :10:19.get you away from the party line. It is penetrated off in this country

:10:20. > :10:25.which we've never had in a recession before, that - and it may be a

:10:26. > :10:31.result of the more liberal, Labour markets which started under the

:10:32. > :10:36.Tories - as a nation, we decided, win not going to have the big rise

:10:37. > :10:38.in unemployment we would normally expect when there is then no

:10:39. > :10:48.economic growth, but only because we're not going to let people's

:10:49. > :10:52.wages rise in terms with prices. I agree and I think it has been

:10:53. > :10:59.different to previous recessions. One reason it has been battered

:11:00. > :11:05.during the recession we just come out of if industrial relations. --

:11:06. > :11:09.one reason it has been better. There was an agreement between trade

:11:10. > :11:12.unions and their employers that in order to keep people in work, in

:11:13. > :11:18.some cases they were working much shorter hours. That was difficult

:11:19. > :11:24.for them, but they preferred to do that and come out the other end.

:11:25. > :11:31.Now, with the recovery happening, that is not yet feeding through into

:11:32. > :11:35.people's pockets. Soaring energy prices but also prices rising faster

:11:36. > :11:39.than wages. If they have hopes of doing well at the election at all,

:11:40. > :11:43.people have to feel better. The interesting thing is the cost of

:11:44. > :11:47.living squeezed it not begin during the recession. It started before the

:11:48. > :11:52.recession. If you look at the figures between 2003 and 2008,

:11:53. > :11:55.people do not have a fall in living standards, but they started to

:11:56. > :12:00.become on hitched from the rate of growth in the economy. Living

:12:01. > :12:04.standards were rising about half the rate of the growth in the economy,

:12:05. > :12:12.so something was already happening. Was it due to globalisation? The

:12:13. > :12:17.cost of living crisis has been a subject in American politics for now

:12:18. > :12:21.much longer than a decade. So this is not just a recession issue, not

:12:22. > :12:31.just a how do you get out of the recession? Now, the police are in

:12:32. > :12:35.real trouble, aren't they? It was quite striking that the Home

:12:36. > :12:39.Secretary, a woman who is herself naturally cautious in a job where

:12:40. > :12:41.the office holder is usually very careful not to enter disputes

:12:42. > :12:49.between police services and a member of the public, did enter that, and

:12:50. > :12:53.now David Cameron has gone further. He has said to serving chief

:12:54. > :12:56.constables that they owe Andrew Mitchell an apology and they

:12:57. > :13:00.should've disciplined their staff. It is a confrontation the like of

:13:01. > :13:06.which I cannot recall between the top of government and the chief

:13:07. > :13:09.constables, and not one, but three, major police forces. They will give

:13:10. > :13:14.evidence next week in the House of Commons. We get a sense of what

:13:15. > :13:18.their defence is now. It is not that their officers didn't do anything

:13:19. > :13:22.wrong, they are basically saying they did do something wrong, but it

:13:23. > :13:29.wasn't enough for is to be able to discipline them. I think the view

:13:30. > :13:34.from Westminster on all sides is that they are backing Andrew

:13:35. > :13:39.Mitchell. They are saying it is not good enough. So the Prime Minister

:13:40. > :13:42.wants the police to apologise to Mr Mitchell. How long before somebody

:13:43. > :13:48.calls on the Prime Minister to apologise to Mr Mitchell? There is

:13:49. > :13:52.of course a gap. He has very carefully I thought in his answer

:13:53. > :13:57.explained that gap. What he said is, we still don't know what happened on

:13:58. > :13:59.the gates of Downing Street. That is the subject of a separate

:14:00. > :14:06.investigation which has not yet reported back. So that day may come.

:14:07. > :14:13.If the Crown Prosecution Service decide to prosecute officers who

:14:14. > :14:21.were at the gates then the Prime Minister may very well find that he

:14:22. > :14:27.is under pressure to apologise. It's not looking good for the police. No,

:14:28. > :14:33.but if you are following the details, it is quite possible that

:14:34. > :14:37.police officers lied, as the police watchdog claimed, about what Andrew

:14:38. > :14:46.Mitchell told them in a meeting. It is quite possible, given the

:14:47. > :14:50.evidence we've seen, that there was a conspiracy to bring Andrew

:14:51. > :14:55.Mitchell down. It is quite possible those things are true, but that the

:14:56. > :15:01.police officer at the centre of this allegation still insists that they

:15:02. > :15:14.heard him say plebs. And that Mehmet -- that may never be resolved. It

:15:15. > :15:17.may not be provable. Now, Nick Clegg has said he's

:15:18. > :15:21."frustrated" with the Conservatives' failure to look at drugs policy in a

:15:22. > :15:24.more open and imaginative way. And Mike Barton, Chief Constable of

:15:25. > :15:27.Durham Constabulary, is the latest police chief to call for the

:15:28. > :15:30.decriminalisation of drugs. So what should we do? Baroness Meacher is

:15:31. > :15:34.the chair of the All Party Group on Drug Policy Reform. In her soapbox,

:15:35. > :15:53.she argues that the existing laws aren't working. Drugs are

:15:54. > :16:00.everywhere. People have always used drugs to change the state of their

:16:01. > :16:05.mind but since our drugs laws were introduced in 90s and one, we have

:16:06. > :16:15.had an explosion of drugs used in this country -- 1971. This suggests

:16:16. > :16:21.to me the drugs law is not working. Today, young people are shifting

:16:22. > :16:25.from traditional drugs to synthetic copies of these, so-called legal

:16:26. > :16:28.highs although many are in fact banned. New legal highs are

:16:29. > :16:34.appearing on the market in the UK every week. The 1971 misuse of drugs

:16:35. > :16:39.act cannot cope with our modern poly- drugs use culture and our

:16:40. > :16:45.web-based drugs market. We are now out of step with the rest of the

:16:46. > :16:49.Western world. 20 US states have legalised cannabis for medical use

:16:50. > :16:54.and two have legalised it altogether. In Europe, Portugal and

:16:55. > :16:58.the Czech Republic decriminalised possession and misuse of drugs more

:16:59. > :17:04.than ten years ago and many European countries have softer drugs laws

:17:05. > :17:09.than we do. 77% of our members of Parliament now agreed on the need

:17:10. > :17:13.for reform. Mike Barton, Chief Constable of Durham Constabulary is

:17:14. > :17:16.the latest top police officer to come out in favour of

:17:17. > :17:22.decriminalisation on the possession and use of all drugs. Nick Clegg

:17:23. > :17:26.supported the Home Affairs Select Committee's call for royal committee

:17:27. > :17:30.on drugs policy. I do not think we are winning the drugs war. We are

:17:31. > :17:36.banging our heads against a brick wall. I find it frustrating that

:17:37. > :17:45.coalition partners are not looking at openly imaginative policies. I

:17:46. > :17:50.would like to see the decriminalisation and possession of

:17:51. > :17:56.all drugs. Secondly, we should not regulate herbal cannabis. Keep it

:17:57. > :18:01.separate from the dangerous stuff. This would keep our young people

:18:02. > :18:06.much safer. And Molly Meacher joins us now. It

:18:07. > :18:10.has been suggested before there has been decades of discussion about it,

:18:11. > :18:14.why do you think now litter clique, you cited some strong support from

:18:15. > :18:19.the leg and the chief police officer in Durham, do you think that will

:18:20. > :18:31.change anything -- some strong support from Nick Clegg. We have had

:18:32. > :18:35.some is strong drugs policy and even Ban Ki-Moon has called on all states

:18:36. > :18:42.to look at drugs policy. In this country we have very tough drugs

:18:43. > :18:45.policies. They do not work. They are dangerous. They drive young people

:18:46. > :18:54.into the hands of illegal drug dealers. They cut the drugs and sell

:18:55. > :18:57.the toughest things they can find. But decriminalisation seems

:18:58. > :19:05.politically unpalatable. Before run election it is tricky. I have great

:19:06. > :19:08.respect for political parties. It is something all parties should be

:19:09. > :19:16.thinking about and I believe they all are thinking about it. You

:19:17. > :19:23.mentioned Portugal and 20 states in the US. What is the experience in

:19:24. > :19:29.Portugal? Has it been a success? In my view it certainly has. How are

:19:30. > :19:33.you measuring that? The numbers of young people using drugs are lower

:19:34. > :19:37.in Portugal whereas nearby in Italy the numbers have gone up. You have

:19:38. > :19:44.to think about an upward trend in drug use across Europe in 50 years.

:19:45. > :19:48.Portugal have bucked the trend. Now all political parties in Portugal

:19:49. > :19:52.support the decriminalisation policy. They certainly did not in

:19:53. > :19:59.the beginning. Hasn't general drug use gone down here as well? That has

:20:00. > :20:04.been recently a small drop in cannabis use. Why? Because young

:20:05. > :20:09.people are shifting in droves to so-called legal highs, very

:20:10. > :20:13.dangerous substances. We have a very bad dangerous situation in this

:20:14. > :20:18.country and we have got to change. The problem is imagining the

:20:19. > :20:22.culture. People often refer to Holland and Amsterdam and imagine

:20:23. > :20:25.people smoking pot, cannabis, walking up and down the street.

:20:26. > :20:32.Would the whole culture which surrounds strokes then be even more

:20:33. > :20:36.rows than it is now? Definitely not. The interesting thing about the

:20:37. > :20:42.Netherlands is the use of heroin has almost disappeared in the

:20:43. > :20:47.Netherlands. We have 0.8% of people using heroin and they have 0.1%.

:20:48. > :20:52.That is important because heroin is dangerous. Will Nick Clegg support

:20:53. > :20:58.decriminalisation and try and get this on the agenda by the next

:20:59. > :21:02.election? We should be looking at what other countries are doing and

:21:03. > :21:07.with Liberal Democrat influencing the Home Office, that is what we are

:21:08. > :21:12.doing, looking at other countries and having evidence -based policy.

:21:13. > :21:17.The current policy is not working so we should look at other countries

:21:18. > :21:21.are doing. What are you hoping that Norman Baker will achieve? Is this

:21:22. > :21:27.an issue he will come to blows with Theresa May over? It is clear that

:21:28. > :21:31.the current policy is causing harm and we have to find an evidence

:21:32. > :21:35.-based way of moving forward. We have to take it away from the

:21:36. > :21:41.political knock-about to see what damage is doing and try and do it

:21:42. > :21:47.better. Will Labour put their money where their mouth is on this issue?

:21:48. > :21:50.We are not in favour of decriminalisation. I think it would

:21:51. > :21:55.send out a bad signal to young people to say, these drugs, it is OK

:21:56. > :22:07.if you take them. One thing I agree with is there is a real problem

:22:08. > :22:10.around legal highs and some of these substances are much more dangerous

:22:11. > :22:12.than cannabis and other lower grade drugs. We do not have an effective

:22:13. > :22:15.policy to deal with those legal highs. I am not blaming the current

:22:16. > :22:17.government. It is a sophisticated develop man in drugs unfortunately.

:22:18. > :22:26.Lots of young people are dying from legal highs. Are the drug laws

:22:27. > :22:32.working? The war against drugs, will it ever be one? We have had the same

:22:33. > :22:38.approach since 1971. If you are saying it cannot be won, should we

:22:39. > :22:42.change the law? Should we change the approach? I am not sure that

:22:43. > :22:47.overhauling the entire system is the right answer but I agree it is not

:22:48. > :22:51.working properly. I was interested in your report that you talk about

:22:52. > :22:57.the legalisation in 20 states in the United States with regard to

:22:58. > :23:01.medicinal use of cannabis. There are lots of people who are suffering

:23:02. > :23:06.from debilitating diseases whose lives could be made much better if

:23:07. > :23:10.that were to happen in the UK. That is not official Labour Party policy

:23:11. > :23:24.but I am very sympathetic to that suggestion. Do you think it will

:23:25. > :23:29.change? This government has have considered this issue of

:23:30. > :23:38.decriminalisation for a year. Europe is moving. The UK is moving

:23:39. > :23:43.carefully. Thank you. Does watching the daily politics

:23:44. > :23:53.constitute a legal high? A high, but it like that! I guess that is a no.

:23:54. > :24:05.15 Tories hope to be on the short list for the canvases and -- candid

:24:06. > :24:08.date of Croydon South. You might get these stockings and the breaches

:24:09. > :24:13.although you do not get them any more but there is a rather nice

:24:14. > :24:19.black silk gown for a vital role at the heart of government. MPs will

:24:20. > :24:32.vote on a new deputy speaker of the House of Commons. Will it be Brian,

:24:33. > :24:34.Simon, Nadine Gary? We will check that the bookies' thoughts but first

:24:35. > :24:36.he is how they performed under some stringent questions.

:24:37. > :24:43.Which language can also be used in some formalities of the parliament?

:24:44. > :24:56.French. Ancient Norman French. Norman French is the word. Who is

:24:57. > :25:01.the MP for Ashton under Lyne? Ashton underlying? Indeed. You can say you

:25:02. > :25:10.don't know. It is David Hayes Labour MP. How did short money get its

:25:11. > :25:19.name? I think after a former Labour minister will stop would you care to

:25:20. > :25:26.have a guess which one? Lend short? Edward Short came up with the idea.

:25:27. > :25:30.What is a money bill? It is when we passed a measure to spend money.

:25:31. > :25:36.That may not be right but it is the best thing I can come up with? Who

:25:37. > :25:44.is the captain of gentlemen of arms? That is not your question. Answer

:25:45. > :25:52.it, Henry. The gentleman Usher of the court. The government Chief

:25:53. > :25:57.Whip. There was one last one. What is the procedure on a member asking

:25:58. > :26:05.the chair whether they can undertake a bush tucker challenge? You do not

:26:06. > :26:13.know that? I do not know either! This is my favourite question. Simon

:26:14. > :26:18.Burns, which member stupid, sanctimonious dwarf? That is cruel

:26:19. > :26:23.and you know it! There you have it, the runners and

:26:24. > :26:29.riders. Alex Donohue is here from Ladbrokes with the full SP, that is

:26:30. > :26:38.starting price for you and me. Eleanor Laing is the favourite at

:26:39. > :26:45.five quarters. We have Gary Streeter...

:26:46. > :26:53.Nadine Dorries is the rank outsider. It is a certainty she will lose but

:26:54. > :27:06.not a certainty that Eleanor Laing will win? We have had one yet Nadine

:27:07. > :27:10.Dorries, 50p is the only stake. Eleanor Laing was odds-on. There

:27:11. > :27:17.were a few big debts which came on for her when we mentioned her. A

:27:18. > :27:23.massive gamble came in on Henry Bellingham after the hustings. We

:27:24. > :27:29.think it is a two horse race between the two at the top. So Henry

:27:30. > :27:36.Bellingham is the one to watch. Absolutely. That is interesting. Is

:27:37. > :27:39.it an important post? It is important because the Deputy Speaker

:27:40. > :27:47.does preside over the business of the Commons for quite a lot of time.

:27:48. > :27:50.How have you voted? I have not voted yet because I came to this

:27:51. > :27:57.programme. I will vote for Eleanor Laing. She has a great, quiet

:27:58. > :28:04.authority. She looks the part and she is quite moderate and I like her

:28:05. > :28:12.style. I will vote for Gary Streeter but I think Eleanor has done very

:28:13. > :28:15.well. No Lib Dems? No, they said Lib Dems will vote for the first time

:28:16. > :28:24.and have seven Conservatives on the ballot paper! It is interesting that

:28:25. > :28:28.it is held under PR. It is time to put you out of your misery and give

:28:29. > :28:38.you the answer for Guess the Year. It was 2011. Press that red button,

:28:39. > :28:45.Emma and we will see who has won. Well done, Andrew, a nice name you

:28:46. > :28:49.have there. That is it for today. Thank you to our guests for being

:28:50. > :28:58.good sports. The one o'clock News is starting on BBC One and we will be

:28:59. > :29:01.back tomorrow at noon. You will be back. I do not get everything right.