:00:39. > :00:43.Hello, and welcome to the Daily Politics.
:00:44. > :00:46.Economic growth returns to the UK, with figures out this morning
:00:47. > :00:51.showing Britain's economy growing at the fastest rate since 2007. But
:00:52. > :00:57.Vince Cable is still gloomy, warning the recovery could be short-lived.
:00:58. > :01:00.The Royal Household is criticised by MPs for not doing enough to save
:01:01. > :01:03.taxpayers' money. The Public Accounts Committee wants Buckingham
:01:04. > :01:07.Palace to be opened to more paying visitors, to fund improvements to
:01:08. > :01:11.the royal estate. How much energy could we produce
:01:12. > :01:15.from renewable sources? The leader of the Green Party, Natalie Bennett,
:01:16. > :01:18.joins us live. And, what's the best way for MPs to
:01:19. > :01:20.connect with voters? We'll debate whether TV appearances or
:01:21. > :01:22.old-fashioned door-knocking are better for getting in touch with the
:01:23. > :01:33.electorate. All that in the next hour.
:01:34. > :01:35.And, with us for the whole programme today is the Conservative
:01:36. > :01:40.backbencher Nadine Dorries. Welcome to the Daily Politics.
:01:41. > :01:44.First, it seems that no-one in the country is safe from a ticking off
:01:45. > :01:47.from the Labour MP Margaret Hodge, not even Her Majesty. The chair of
:01:48. > :01:50.the Public Accounts Committee has criticised Buckingham Palace for not
:01:51. > :02:06.managing its finances properly, after overspending the Sovereign
:02:07. > :02:11.Grant by almost ?2.5 million. The balance is at an all-time low of
:02:12. > :02:15.?1 million. At the same time they are spending more than they are
:02:16. > :02:20.getting, the condition of many of the royal buildings means you have
:02:21. > :02:25.got to invest. The boilers in Buckingham Palace are 60 years old
:02:26. > :02:32.which means bills are very high. You look at the Victoria and Albert
:02:33. > :02:34.mausoleum, we have known for 18 years that structure needs
:02:35. > :02:39.investment yet they have done nothing. The bathrooms in Windsor
:02:40. > :02:45.Castle, the rain coming through in the art gallery in Buckingham
:02:46. > :02:50.Palace. All of these are serious issues which need to be addressed.
:02:51. > :02:53.We've been joined by Graham Smith from the pressure group Republic,
:02:54. > :02:57.which campaigns for an end to the monarchy. Welcome to the Daily
:02:58. > :03:02.Politics. Spending above their means, not
:03:03. > :03:08.making the necessary savings, it is the Royal Household worth it?
:03:09. > :03:12.I felt embarrassed listening to this list of repairs to Royal buildings
:03:13. > :03:18.that we have not funded as a country. What the Royal family does
:03:19. > :03:23.for us is beyond explanation. They bring in investment, tourism, they
:03:24. > :03:28.put this little island of England on the world map. They are something we
:03:29. > :03:33.should be proud of. I love the Royal family. I am embarrassed that a
:03:34. > :03:38.60-year-old boiler exists in Buckingham Palace which has not been
:03:39. > :03:41.repaired and they have huge heating bills.
:03:42. > :04:01.Do they not take responsibility for that themselves?
:04:02. > :04:03.If they decided to undertake that schedule of repairs, people on this
:04:04. > :04:06.programme and the media would be in Opera at the expenditure. We have to
:04:07. > :04:09.take it on the chin. Lots of people in this country think they are worth
:04:10. > :04:11.it and have no objection with the investment we need to put in.
:04:12. > :04:13.We need to separate two issues, the historic Royal buildings which
:04:14. > :04:16.belong to the British people, we have a responsibility to maintain
:04:17. > :04:18.them. Clearly the Royal Household isn't up to that job, it is time for
:04:19. > :04:25.the government to take them off their hands. To make them revenue
:04:26. > :04:31.neutral at the Tower of London is so the taxpayer doesn't need to stump
:04:32. > :04:37.up more cash. The other costs. The cost every year of the monarchy is
:04:38. > :04:40.well over ?200 million. You include things like the income from the
:04:41. > :04:45.duchies of Cornwall and Lancaster which belong to the nation but given
:04:46. > :04:53.to the Royal family, security costs, the cost of police forces, taxes
:04:54. > :04:57.unpaid. A large amount of money. Equivalent to thousands of nurses or
:04:58. > :05:05.doctors. Nadine says they are worth it, because of the attractiveness.
:05:06. > :05:11.It is beyond explanation, because it is not true. There is no evidence.
:05:12. > :05:15.If we get rid of the monarchy, is there any evidence tourism would go
:05:16. > :05:21.down? It is not a little family put on the map by the Royal family. This
:05:22. > :05:27.is a big, exciting country which we have put on the map ourselves. Where
:05:28. > :05:31.we promote tourism and businesses. This has nothing to do with the
:05:32. > :05:36.people who live in Buckingham Palace. Is your evidence is
:05:37. > :05:43.anecdotal? Look at our movie industry alone. The number of
:05:44. > :05:49.visitors to Buckingham Palace, Windsor. They go there because of
:05:50. > :05:54.the history associated with them. We have thousands of years of royal
:05:55. > :05:59.history that other countries have abandoned. They don't have it. We
:06:00. > :06:04.can get rid of the Royal family which is what many families have
:06:05. > :06:12.done. Do they have the amount of tourism and interest? France has a
:06:13. > :06:17.huge tourism industry. Not based around their Royal Family. This
:06:18. > :06:28.isn't actually about politics and power, it is an institution part of
:06:29. > :06:39.our political system. Powers are invested in the Royals. These issues
:06:40. > :06:43.of power and politics, it makes the tourism argument vacuous. There is
:06:44. > :06:47.no evidence we would lose tourism revenue if the Royals did not live
:06:48. > :06:50.in those houses. The history would still be there. The crowds would
:06:51. > :06:54.still be there. We're not going to get a Republic
:06:55. > :06:59.any time soon. Because the British people don't want it. So you say. If
:07:00. > :07:05.we look at the Royal Household, Nadine, you said, to posh boys who
:07:06. > :07:13.didn't know the price of milk. Shouldn't they cut their crop -- cut
:07:14. > :07:15.their cloth in the same way others have.
:07:16. > :07:21.They have been come every time there has been a report or analysis of
:07:22. > :07:26.their budget, they make savings. In terms of their costs, they are going
:07:27. > :07:31.up. The cost of keeping the Royal family secure and protected, I have
:07:32. > :07:43.no complaint with that. I am sure there are many millions of British
:07:44. > :07:49.people have no complaint. These figures are hugely inflated because
:07:50. > :07:54.there are costs for people we do not know of, like Princess Alexandra.
:07:55. > :08:01.The PAC has said there had been savings but not enough. The
:08:02. > :08:06.Sovereign Grant will always go up because it is paid to property
:08:07. > :08:09.values. If you look at Prince Charles who spent ?30,000 of public
:08:10. > :08:15.money on a four-day private holiday to Scotland, that is the waste, if
:08:16. > :08:19.an MP did that, they would be in jail. Why do we challenge them in
:08:20. > :08:24.the same way? What about opening up Buckingham Palace more, one
:08:25. > :08:29.suggestion. You mentioned the Tower of London which is open most of the
:08:30. > :08:35.year. Couldn't the palace be opened significantly more to raise
:08:36. > :08:40.much-needed funds to repair it? I have no issue with that. That is a
:08:41. > :08:46.discussion based around practicalities, security when the
:08:47. > :08:50.Royal Family are in residence. Something for those... So you say
:08:51. > :08:58.they could generate more money. But I am against again -- this attack
:08:59. > :09:05.against the Royal Family. Look at the wedding. Nine years ago, MPs
:09:06. > :09:11.said they wanted the palace to be open all year round, and they said
:09:12. > :09:15.no. But it is their home. It is ridiculous. It is the headquarters,
:09:16. > :09:19.in the same way as the Vatican is the headquarters of the Pope. Those
:09:20. > :09:23.buildings are open all year round to tourists. We could have millions
:09:24. > :09:28.paying for the upkeep through ticket sales. How much do you think Britain
:09:29. > :09:36.benefited from the Jubilee, the royal wedding? How many people do
:09:37. > :09:43.think indirectly benefited? The CBI said an extra public holiday wipes
:09:44. > :09:49.off billions of pounds from the Jewish economy. So there is no
:09:50. > :09:52.evidence. Tourism figures on an annual basis. I think... Hang on, we
:09:53. > :09:59.have to leave it there. It's time for our daily quiz. The
:10:00. > :10:02.question for today is: What has been spotted in the tea room in the House
:10:03. > :10:06.of Commons? Was it: A cockroach. A snake.
:10:07. > :10:11.A mouse. A tarantula?
:10:12. > :10:16.At the end of the show, Nadine will give us the correct answer.
:10:17. > :10:21.The growth figures are out, and are being pored over by politicians and
:10:22. > :10:25.economists up and down the country. Napoleon said we were a nation of
:10:26. > :10:30.shopkeepers, so how is UK Ltd doing? David Cameron and George Osborne can
:10:31. > :10:34.point to some pretty good figures. In the last quarter of 2013,
:10:35. > :10:43.Britain's economy grew by 0.7%. That compares with 0.8% from the previous
:10:44. > :10:46.quarter. And it will mean in total the economy grew by 1.9% in 2013,
:10:47. > :10:50.the best annual performance since 2007. However, there's still a lot
:10:51. > :10:56.more work to do for the managers of UK Ltd. The economy is still 1.3%
:10:57. > :10:59.smaller than in the beginning of 2008 when the economic crisis began.
:11:00. > :11:07.What's more, some commentators are raising concerns that the recovery
:11:08. > :11:10.is too concentrated in London. A report published yesterday by the
:11:11. > :11:13.Centre For Cities think tank found that 79% of private sector jobs were
:11:14. > :11:17.created in London, nearly ten times more than the next best area. There
:11:18. > :11:23.are also fears it's the wrong kind of growth. Whilst the service sector
:11:24. > :11:27.is doing well, manufacturing is still 8.2% lower than it was before
:11:28. > :11:34.recession hit. Then, there are fears of a housing bubble.
:11:35. > :11:37.Speaking to the BBC last night, the Business Secretary Vince Cable said
:11:38. > :11:43.that, whilst we're on the right track, he does have concerns.
:11:44. > :11:49.It hasn't yet got the shape of recovery that we want. We are
:11:50. > :11:55.beginning to see a real revival, and that is really positive, good news.
:11:56. > :11:59.I don't want to minimise that in any way. To be sustainable and last in
:12:00. > :12:03.the long term, we need strong, consistent growth of exports, we
:12:04. > :12:08.haven't got that. Businesses investing in large amounts of money
:12:09. > :12:15.in the long term. At the moment, a lot are discouraged by over the
:12:16. > :12:18.European Union and what the Labour Party is saying about stifling
:12:19. > :12:23.energy investment. We need investment confidence. And to stop a
:12:24. > :12:26.repetition of the property boom and bust of the past.
:12:27. > :12:28.With us now is the economist and financial journalist Liam Halligan.
:12:29. > :12:35.And, joining us from Merseyside is Joe Anderson, the Mayor of
:12:36. > :12:39.Liverpool. Nadine, it is the government, within
:12:40. > :12:43.government, Vince Cable, already warning despite great figures, we
:12:44. > :12:49.could be running into the same problems and conditions that got us
:12:50. > :12:56.into this mess. I don't know what it will take to make Vince Cable smile.
:12:57. > :13:02.It is good news, it is growing faster than we thought. Unemployment
:13:03. > :13:07.is down at an all-time low, down to 2.3 million. More people in work
:13:08. > :13:13.today than we have ever had in work in the UK ever. It is a good news
:13:14. > :13:20.story and a developing story. The economy has grown the fastest since
:13:21. > :13:26.2007 in terms of GDP. It is part of the developing good news story.
:13:27. > :13:31.Are you feeling it in Merseyside? It would be easy for me to dismiss
:13:32. > :13:34.those figures and talk about part-time work, zero hour contracts
:13:35. > :13:41.within the city. We are a city that is growing, we
:13:42. > :13:44.are doing a great deal to make that happen, creating conditions,
:13:45. > :13:50.confidence. My argument is, this is a government that came to power,
:13:51. > :13:56.promising it would devolve powers and more resources, and
:13:57. > :14:03.decentralised, create localism, and it is not. For me, I want our city
:14:04. > :14:07.to be able to have more of its own resources to spend, in a way that
:14:08. > :14:12.creates the regeneration, infrastructure, the right conditions
:14:13. > :14:17.for growth for businesses to come. I guess, it is both parties, not just
:14:18. > :14:21.the Conservatives who are in control, but labour previously have
:14:22. > :14:28.not accepted that cities in themselves have a right to grow and
:14:29. > :14:33.are part equally with the capital. Like a car with a pristine engine
:14:34. > :14:41.but flat tyres. Liverpool can actually play a better role -- role
:14:42. > :14:46.in helping the UK grow. The Chancellor always talks about
:14:47. > :14:50.trickle-down economics. If London is booming in the south-east, it will
:14:51. > :14:55.be a driver for the rest of the country. But there are problems,
:14:56. > :15:00.Vince Cable talks about the economy remaining 1.3% smaller than the
:15:01. > :15:07.prerecession peak in 2008. Various parts of the coming are not faring
:15:08. > :15:13.well. Relying on the service sector, not manufacturing.
:15:14. > :15:19.There's a lot in that. We've had the best performance for six years.
:15:20. > :15:24.Let's see it within ourselves to celebrate that. But any objective
:15:25. > :15:28.observer has to say that the eat -- the economic recovery has been
:15:29. > :15:31.rather in balanced. The manufacturing sector remains almost
:15:32. > :15:35.7% lower than it was at its pre-crisis peaked. The construction
:15:36. > :15:37.sector is over 11% below where it was in balanced. The manufacturing
:15:38. > :15:39.sector remains almost 7% lower than it was at its precrisis peak. The
:15:40. > :15:42.construction sector is over 11% below where it was and it precrisis
:15:43. > :15:44.peak. A lot of this growth we are seeing as financial services, which
:15:45. > :15:48.is generally a London centric activity. There are some pretty big
:15:49. > :15:54.blots on the landscape. The latest trade figures have a big loud. They
:15:55. > :15:57.show September to November, our trade deficit widening. It strikes
:15:58. > :16:03.me also that bank lending, and I think this is really where Vince
:16:04. > :16:07.Cable is probing, it has continued to contract. Yes, mortgage lending
:16:08. > :16:17.has been higher, driven by Funding for Lending and so on, but housing
:16:18. > :16:23.demand... Housing supply has been stagnant and even contracting. It is
:16:24. > :16:27.a rather in balanced recovery, despite these good headline numbers.
:16:28. > :16:30.It is imbalanced, there are weaknesses, it's not the economy
:16:31. > :16:34.that the Government promised. What we have is the risk of an
:16:35. > :16:38.overheating housing market concentrated again in London and the
:16:39. > :16:43.south-east, and the risk of it not being sustainable. We promised a
:16:44. > :16:47.rebalanced economy by 2018. We've only been in power for almost four
:16:48. > :16:52.years. That's because George Osborne failed on every single measure that
:16:53. > :16:56.he put in place in his emergency budget in 2010. You may say that the
:16:57. > :17:00.things are doing much better now. You are right about the banks and
:17:01. > :17:03.lending. One of the problems is we've seen many more small and
:17:04. > :17:07.medium businesses growing and creating more jobs. If we could get
:17:08. > :17:11.the part blow to those businesses from the banks, one of the problems
:17:12. > :17:15.is the banks are still reticent to lend to business. That's almost like
:17:16. > :17:18.a cork in the bottle that has to go, to get even more growth coming
:17:19. > :17:23.through the other end. It is a good news story, we mustn't talk down.
:17:24. > :17:27.Are better now than they have been for a long time. And they are
:17:28. > :17:33.especially better in Liverpool. Liverpool is the most fantastic city
:17:34. > :17:38.on the planet. But your city is growing, you have a massive Hummer
:17:39. > :17:46.flagship store that has taken on almost 1000 people there. What about
:17:47. > :17:50.making some things we can export? If you visited Liverpool ten years
:17:51. > :17:56.ago, I remember growing up in Liverpool, the difference to what it
:17:57. > :18:00.is today. Your city is rocking. Isn't it all about our resumption of
:18:01. > :18:04.consumer spending? That's all that's happening, and they are adding to
:18:05. > :18:09.their own private debt. Wii absolutely, that's the point. When
:18:10. > :18:14.Nadine talks about promising it in 2018, everyone can see it's a
:18:15. > :18:19.trajectory. Wii it will continue to fail. If you look at Liverpool and
:18:20. > :18:23.the regeneration that has taken place in Liverpool, it's as a result
:18:24. > :18:31.of my investment, as a result of the city's investment. . We have a
:18:32. > :18:35.fantastic dock. We have an arena and Convention Centre. We are borrowing
:18:36. > :18:41.?40 million and investing it in a new exhibition Centre. It is
:18:42. > :18:45.bringing in a 4-star hotel. They are creating 300 jobs. We are doing that
:18:46. > :18:48.in other parts of the city. What my argument is that if government
:18:49. > :18:55.allows cities to do more themselves, I know better than Whitehall
:18:56. > :18:58.ministers what is best for my city and where the growth is. The
:18:59. > :19:01.government thinks that councils like yours need to be cut back, they need
:19:02. > :19:06.to spend less, they need to be able to do these things with less money
:19:07. > :19:11.because there is too much waste. . We are both on the same page in
:19:12. > :19:17.terms of councils and cities becoming more sustainable. I accept
:19:18. > :19:22.that. What my point is if they want that, and I want that, then they've
:19:23. > :19:26.got to allow us to achieve that. The way to do that is by allowing us to
:19:27. > :19:32.spend the money and taxes. The government take probably a 78% of
:19:33. > :19:35.the funding, the taxes, all of the taxes we generate in Liverpool away
:19:36. > :19:39.from us and then deposit back. We want to be able to control a lot
:19:40. > :19:42.more of that, so we can create the economic conditions for growth and
:19:43. > :19:48.getting new businesses into our city. We are doing that, but we can
:19:49. > :19:52.do much, much more. Is it true to say that this recovery, if it
:19:53. > :19:56.continues, is only benefiting one area of the country, and that cities
:19:57. > :20:04.like Liverpool, although they are doing better, are not going to be
:20:05. > :20:07.able to reach their full potential on the basis of the policies that
:20:08. > :20:10.are in place at the moment? I think that is fair. I was up in the
:20:11. > :20:12.north-east at the end of last year and I met some of the most
:20:13. > :20:16.impressive entrepreneurs I've ever met anywhere in the world. And yet
:20:17. > :20:20.it's very difficult for them to raise capital because banks don't
:20:21. > :20:24.want to lend, and a lot of long-term capital in this country is rather
:20:25. > :20:28.unimaginative. Here are some numbers that aren't in the ONS press
:20:29. > :20:31.release, these are from the World Bank database. Gross investment in
:20:32. > :20:41.advanced countries around the world between 2009 to 2000 ten. Spain and
:20:42. > :20:47.France up. Autonomy is we deride, Germany 18%. The UK, 13%. Our
:20:48. > :20:54.investment in this country is at the lowest as it's been as a share of
:20:55. > :20:58.GDP since 1952. Wide? Because the banking sector continues to be
:20:59. > :21:02.broken. RBS have made a provision of biblical proportions last night. I'm
:21:03. > :21:09.sorry, Nadine, it's great to have you on the show, Rocard fuelling the
:21:10. > :21:11.economy, good for you, but I don't think our political leaders are
:21:12. > :21:15.getting in there and getting stuck in and really fixing our banking
:21:16. > :21:19.sector. Its casting an enormous Powell across the British economy
:21:20. > :21:23.and the eurozone economy. Our biggest export destination is the
:21:24. > :21:26.eurozone. It is tremendously difficult to get investment going in
:21:27. > :21:29.the eurozone because they've got these huge banking stress tests
:21:30. > :21:35.coming down the track this coming autumn. Until that happens, and the
:21:36. > :21:39.danger of systemic spasms is over, people won't invest. In the
:21:40. > :21:43.meantime, Labour is gaining credit for cost of living crisis that they
:21:44. > :21:50.are putting to the Government. I don't think they are gaining credit
:21:51. > :21:52.for it. They certainly have taken that agenda forward because the
:21:53. > :21:58.Government has been accused of following it. Any political argument
:21:59. > :22:07.which lands on the kitchen table of any home in Britain has resonance.
:22:08. > :22:13.George Osborne has frozen fuel tax, so by 2015, people will be ?11
:22:14. > :22:18.better off every time they develop their tanks with fuel. That
:22:19. > :22:22.resonance. That is a policy where you can see the cash in your hand
:22:23. > :22:25.that you are saving, from policies that are happening now from a
:22:26. > :22:29.government that promises for the future. But be no real wages have
:22:30. > :22:33.fallen and are continuing to fall, despite these patents that the
:22:34. > :22:37.Government are putting forward, which are all out of borrowed money.
:22:38. > :22:42.They are predicting it will come up in terms of wages versus prices. As
:22:43. > :22:48.long as we can keep the lid on inflation. Inflation is at 2%. You
:22:49. > :22:52.are quite right over the banks. I get it in the neck for highlighting
:22:53. > :22:58.it constantly but I'm not going to stop. We will be talking to Chris
:22:59. > :23:05.Leslie a little later in the programme. Now for today's big
:23:06. > :23:08.political news. Yes, it's the Lib Dem deputy leadership election, with
:23:09. > :23:12.Lib Dem MPs voting for someone to replace Simon Hughes as the party's
:23:13. > :23:19.number two. Vicky Young is outside Parliament and can tell us more. Is
:23:20. > :23:23.everyone on the edge of their seats at Westminster? They are talking of
:23:24. > :23:28.little else. This election going on today, very small but select band of
:23:29. > :23:34.electorate, just the 56 Lib Dem MPs get to vote on all of this. It is
:23:35. > :23:38.single transferable vote, you wouldn't expect any less from the
:23:39. > :23:41.Liberal Democrats. There are some art can bruise, and MP for more than
:23:42. > :23:46.30 years, although he is standing down at the next election. He is
:23:47. > :23:49.also the chair of the International development committee. Gordon
:23:50. > :23:57.Birtwistle, he is the MP for Burnley. But the bookies'
:23:58. > :24:03.favourite, Lori Birt. She is the front runner. The eagle eyed amongst
:24:04. > :24:08.you will notice she is a woman. She has said that the Lib Dems very much
:24:09. > :24:12.need a woman in a top team. Some will say she's perfectly qualified.
:24:13. > :24:16.Her first job was as assistant governor at Holloway prison. She's
:24:17. > :24:20.also got a degree in economics. She's got an award-winning training
:24:21. > :24:26.company and is used to fighting hard against the Tories. The majority in
:24:27. > :24:32.her seat of Solihull is just 175 votes. So she is a tough fighter.
:24:33. > :24:35.The serious point is as deputy leader of the Liberal Democrats,
:24:36. > :24:39.they would have quite a high profile, being in the media a lot
:24:40. > :24:43.more. The Lib Dems very much under the cosh about not having much
:24:44. > :24:47.diversity in their party, certainly not many female MPs, only seven, and
:24:48. > :24:54.none of them really in high profile positions. The result is due at 6pm.
:24:55. > :24:58.They might put a press release out. So you can't even go to the grand
:24:59. > :25:01.unveiling. What is the mood like amongst Lib Dem MPs at the moment,
:25:02. > :25:07.bearing in mind it has been difficult for the party in recent
:25:08. > :25:10.times? They have been criticised for the way they have reacted to those
:25:11. > :25:14.accusations against Chris Rennard and Mike Hancock, both of whom
:25:15. > :25:18.denied the allegations against them. I think it is a bit of a
:25:19. > :25:23.symptom of the party, the way it works. They have this democratic
:25:24. > :25:27.process. Very much that people on councils make their own decisions,
:25:28. > :25:31.and that has made it difficult for Nick Clegg to be seen to get a grip
:25:32. > :25:33.of this. They are facing a very difficult time come the next
:25:34. > :25:38.election. But they very much be all they do have to get more women in
:25:39. > :25:41.winnable seats, if there are many of those left for the Lib Dems.
:25:42. > :25:44.Certainly they feel it would help to have a high profile woman on that
:25:45. > :25:50.leadership team, which they just don't have. It looks very white and
:25:51. > :25:53.very male at the moment. How much of our electricity could come from
:25:54. > :25:56.renewable sources? Today a new offshore wind farm in the Irish Sea
:25:57. > :26:00.will start generating electricity for the first time. When it reaches
:26:01. > :26:03.full-strength, the wind farm, eight miles off the Cumbrian coast, will
:26:04. > :26:04.have more than 100 turbines and generate enough electricity for
:26:05. > :26:13.almost 300,000 homes. Britain currently leads the field in
:26:14. > :26:20.offshore wind. Across the UK there are 3,400 turbines in total at 342
:26:21. > :26:25.different sites. Around 700 of the turbines are offshore, like those
:26:26. > :26:29.which have started today. But wind power is not the only source of
:26:30. > :26:34.renewable energy on the up in the UK, there's solar and tidal energy
:26:35. > :26:40.as well. In fact, renewable energy accounted for 11.3% of UK
:26:41. > :26:44.electricity generation in 2012. And it looks set to get bigger. At the
:26:45. > :26:47.end of last year the Scottish government granted permission for
:26:48. > :26:51.work to begin on the largest tidal energy project in Europe. But the
:26:52. > :26:54.renewable energy companies now want to see the Government commit to
:26:55. > :27:01.long-term offshore targets beyond 2030. This, they claim, will provide
:27:02. > :27:07.real cost savings and allow for more investment in new technologies.
:27:08. > :27:15.We're joined now by the Green Party leader, Natalie Bennett. We seem to
:27:16. > :27:19.be making progress with green energy. Some would say that because
:27:20. > :27:24.we've invested a lot of money in it. What price is it for consumers? We
:27:25. > :27:28.are paying subsidies, companies are paying subsidies and people are
:27:29. > :27:32.having their bills increased as a result. We have to remember that
:27:33. > :27:37.this is a tiny percentage of the increase. The hugely -- leap we've
:27:38. > :27:40.seen over the past decade, that is due to the rising price of gas. That
:27:41. > :27:53.is a reflection of the fact we have to move away from fossil fuels. That
:27:54. > :27:56.is the high cost, risky energy option. The thing about renewables
:27:57. > :27:59.is certainly at the moment, per unit it is higher cost. But what we need
:28:00. > :28:01.is a reliable energy source that we know the cost of. The question is
:28:02. > :28:05.reliability. We are paying an average ?112 a year just for green
:28:06. > :28:09.subsidies. Even if the main bit of the cost comes from rising energy
:28:10. > :28:13.prices, you can understand the bitter taste people are left with
:28:14. > :28:19.when that section of ?112 on average a year is just for green subsidies.
:28:20. > :28:22.Green subsidies, about a third of that is for social subsidies, people
:28:23. > :28:38.who are unable to afford their bills, so that help them. About a
:28:39. > :28:40.further third of that is going into insulating our homes. That is the
:28:41. > :28:43.real area of total Government policy failure, in that we are not moving
:28:44. > :28:46.fast enough. By far the cheapest, as well as the greenest energy, is that
:28:47. > :28:49.which you don't use. The green deal has been a disaster. What we need to
:28:50. > :28:51.do to save people 's money and the long runners make sure they've got
:28:52. > :28:53.energy efficient, affordable to heat homes. And that means well
:28:54. > :28:56.insulated, well-prepared homes. We need a decent standard of homes we
:28:57. > :29:01.haven't got at the moment. People have accused the Government of mixed
:29:02. > :29:06.messages on this. Renewables are now providing 11% of our energy, is that
:29:07. > :29:10.good news? The reason why the Government has pulled back on
:29:11. > :29:14.insulating is because most homes are now insulated. The only ones that
:29:15. > :29:20.aren't other difficult to reach and treat homes. Currently about a third
:29:21. > :29:24.of our homes are in GE, H or F energy bands, which means they are
:29:25. > :29:29.basically impossible to heat. A third of our homes are extremely
:29:30. > :29:34.pour. I just know I had a meeting with the minister responsible for
:29:35. > :29:37.this recently with an installation company in my constituency. My
:29:38. > :29:47.insulation company agreed that most homes now insulated, apart from the
:29:48. > :29:51.difficult to treat and reach. I think, on renewable energy, is the
:29:52. > :29:57.reason we are here is because we have a European target that we have
:29:58. > :30:00.to reach by 2020, of having 20% of our energy derived from renewables.
:30:01. > :30:03.I think in 50 years time, generations in the future will look
:30:04. > :30:06.back at pictures of those wind turbines and laugh. They will wonder
:30:07. > :30:12.what on earth we were doing. We should be investing in nuclear power
:30:13. > :30:16.and fusion power. Unfortunately, all our energy and investment is
:30:17. > :30:19.diverted away from that former power because we have to reach this
:30:20. > :30:23.arbitrary target set by the European Union. Do the government never
:30:24. > :30:29.really believed in those targets, did they never really have a green
:30:30. > :30:35.agenda? All of that boat blew, get green, is all a myth? We have to
:30:36. > :30:39.meet the directive which has been set. I very much think we should be
:30:40. > :30:44.channelling our thoughts, energy and investment towards a far cheaper,
:30:45. > :30:48.far cleaner type of energy, which is far more efficient. Every time you
:30:49. > :30:53.talk about fusion power someone tells you it's only four years away.
:30:54. > :30:58.It's about 20 years away, as it has been for the past three or four
:30:59. > :31:05.decades. The problem with renewables is the reliability.
:31:06. > :31:11.The European point is important. We have the climate change bill which
:31:12. > :31:17.demands we reduce our carbon emissions. The three large parties
:31:18. > :31:24.agreed to that, recognising its importance to tackle climate change.
:31:25. > :31:29.That is set in law by the European Union. This is the law agreed by the
:31:30. > :31:36.British Parliament. Running in parallel with the directive, we
:31:37. > :31:42.can't do anything else. If the EU says this, we have to pass a bill.
:31:43. > :31:53.The physics also says we have to do that. The Green Party does state
:31:54. > :31:58.that, but... There are other options now. Looking at shale gas, the
:31:59. > :32:03.nuclear option. You could plug the gap, without investing more, without
:32:04. > :32:09.asking consumers to pay more on their bills for further investment
:32:10. > :32:15.in offshore, onshore wind and other renewables. In terms of wind, the
:32:16. > :32:19.government has agreed a good strike price. Nuclear, there are issues
:32:20. > :32:25.around safety, no plan for dealing with waste. The people of Cumbria
:32:26. > :32:33.had strong words on that. Germany has turned its back. Indeed, as has
:32:34. > :32:44.Japan. I have just been reading about Chernobyl. I am happy to park
:32:45. > :32:49.all of those arguments and simply come to one point. The last two
:32:50. > :32:55.plants have taken on average 14 years to build and 16 years to bring
:32:56. > :33:01.online. Nuclear is way too slow to fill our energy gap now. It doesn't
:33:02. > :33:05.provide any answers. The government prevaricated over its commitment to
:33:06. > :33:11.nuclear, whether there should be a subsidy. Every government has
:33:12. > :33:18.prevaricated. But they won't be online, on time. By the time the
:33:19. > :33:25.nuclear power stations are finished building, we will need renewables,
:33:26. > :33:29.there will be a gap. The only advantage from wind turbines is a
:33:30. > :33:35.small amount of wind energy. Tidal wave power is doing better, I
:33:36. > :33:47.believe, providing energy. What is the percentage from offshore wind?
:33:48. > :33:54.About 5%. Barrow will provide an extra amount. We have rich offshore
:33:55. > :34:02.resources. Look at Germany, China, the US. Racing ahead. They don't
:34:03. > :34:08.have the wonderful wind resources and tidal resources. We are a tiny
:34:09. > :34:16.island. We do not want our skyline blighted by these turbines? 64% of
:34:17. > :34:20.UK adults according to one research, said they wanted
:34:21. > :34:28.renewables installed between now and 2020, clean alternatives. If you
:34:29. > :34:34.have specified, wind turbine? It depends how the question was asked.
:34:35. > :34:39.I have not heard from anybody who lives within sight of a wind turbine
:34:40. > :34:49.who is happy. Our population is growing. We have enough challenges,
:34:50. > :34:59.we have very little... We do not want this blighted -- blighting our
:35:00. > :35:06.views. There is an answer in terms of why we need to change the way we
:35:07. > :35:09.build our renewable resources. The government has introduced a small
:35:10. > :35:16.but good community energy policy this week. We need to recognise that
:35:17. > :35:21.on the continent, communities compete to get wind farms, because
:35:22. > :35:33.they are community owned and they see the benefit. Where people feel a
:35:34. > :35:36.multinational company is imposed on them, they feel different. We will
:35:37. > :35:46.have to leave it there. What would you do if you lived under
:35:47. > :35:49.a repressive and unjust regime? In his new book, the former Labour
:35:50. > :35:53.Cabinet Minister Peter Hain tells the story of his parents who were
:35:54. > :35:56.forced to leave South Africa in the 1960s for their stand against
:35:57. > :36:43.apartheid. In a moment, we'll be talking to Peter.
:36:44. > :36:53.I'm joined now by Labour MP Peter Hain. Welcome.
:36:54. > :36:58.How did your parents become involved in activism in South Africa? They
:36:59. > :37:03.didn't start off political at all, there was nothing in the
:37:04. > :37:07.background. Not members of parties or involved in local politics.
:37:08. > :37:11.Nothing to suggest they would end up notorious and expelled from their
:37:12. > :37:19.country. It was a sense of fairness, due to their upbringing, they
:37:20. > :37:24.treated their fellow black countrymen and women more generously
:37:25. > :37:30.and equally. What did they do? They began by simply joining the Liberal
:37:31. > :37:34.party of South Africa, one of the anti-apartheid organisations. They
:37:35. > :37:39.then leafleted, wrote letters to the newspapers, joined in meetings and
:37:40. > :37:44.organised. We used to have black friends come through the front door
:37:45. > :37:52.of our house. Which was unusual, I presume. Almost unknown, last -- and
:37:53. > :38:00.then it led to their house being raided, they were arrested and
:38:01. > :38:04.jailed being charged. Then, they were banned. My mother was issued
:38:05. > :38:09.with a banning order which meant she couldn't take part in political
:38:10. > :38:13.activity or even a social gathering. When we had diplomats at parties in
:38:14. > :38:17.our house, I used to have to take them one by one into the kitchen.
:38:18. > :38:25.She could only meet one diplomat at a time. The party was going on next
:38:26. > :38:29.door. But she could only see one person at a time. Amazing they
:38:30. > :38:35.allowed the party to take place. That wasn't illegal. Then, they
:38:36. > :38:41.banned my dad. And he couldn't communicate with another band
:38:42. > :38:46.person. When I asked, what did they do, you said they had a sense of
:38:47. > :38:51.fairness, to treat their black staff fairly. I am sure there were quite a
:38:52. > :38:56.lot of people like that. What drove them then to make more of a stand
:38:57. > :39:01.over the issue of fairness and wanting equal rights for blacks? It
:39:02. > :39:08.is a very good question and I don't entirely answered it in the book.
:39:09. > :39:11.They were one of a tiny group of white South Africans, almost alone
:39:12. > :39:16.among their relatives and friends, with the exception of my mother 's
:39:17. > :39:21.younger sister, Joan. A lot of whites would say, we don't really
:39:22. > :39:28.approve of apartheid but we are benefiting from it. We get on with
:39:29. > :39:31.our lives. They took a stand and it led to progressively more
:39:32. > :39:35.intimidation, threats against them, restrictions, and to ultimately they
:39:36. > :39:41.stopped my father working as an architect, there was no income for
:39:42. > :39:46.us and we had to leave in 1966. What was it likely you? It became part of
:39:47. > :39:52.our lives. We had security police officers raiding in the early hours
:39:53. > :39:54.of the morning. My parents subject to restrictions. Security police
:39:55. > :40:01.cars sitting outside the front gates. It became part of the of
:40:02. > :40:06.life. My brother and my two younger sisters were very supportive of my
:40:07. > :40:11.parents, very proud of them. Obviously, we were different from
:40:12. > :40:16.our friends. You had an understanding at an early stage of
:40:17. > :40:20.your life of apartheid and its wrongs is to knock yes. I was
:40:21. > :40:24.brought up to believe regardless of the colour of your skin, faith
:40:25. > :40:29.politics, you should be treated equally. It was part of our DNA.
:40:30. > :40:36.That was not the case for every one of my friends and virtually all our
:40:37. > :40:41.relatives. Nadine, are you surprised there weren't more white activists
:40:42. > :40:45.in South Africa. The books and films do chronicle the stories of people
:40:46. > :40:52.who did fight against apartheid, but there weren't that many, are you
:40:53. > :40:57.surprised? I lived in Central Africa for a while. It was such an
:40:58. > :41:01.oppressive... Your parents were incredibly brave. It was such an
:41:02. > :41:07.oppressive atmosphere from what I have heard. I remember getting my
:41:08. > :41:13.first flat in London, and the couple are shared with had fled South
:41:14. > :41:19.Africa and were of mixed race. Because it was impossible for them
:41:20. > :41:25.to have been together in that country. Probably the white
:41:26. > :41:30.community that... There was also a culture of, a long-term South
:41:31. > :41:34.African white culture, imbued with apartheid. It was the best standard
:41:35. > :41:40.of living in the world for the white community so why would they want to
:41:41. > :41:44.change it? But there is another point. You take great risks when you
:41:45. > :41:50.do this. The most interesting question about my parents is, why
:41:51. > :41:54.they risked everything? Their lives, they had to flee the country of
:41:55. > :42:00.their birth which they loved, risk the future of their family, their
:42:01. > :42:05.jobs. Very few of us would do that to something we believe in. If you
:42:06. > :42:10.look across the world, whether it is resistance to tyranny anywhere, very
:42:11. > :42:14.few people actually take a stand. Even if the majority are suffering
:42:15. > :42:21.from the very same. I am proud of my parents did so. Hence, I have
:42:22. > :42:26.written the book. An ordinary couple who did extraordinary things. And
:42:27. > :42:33.faced a lifetime of consequences. It was their values and sense of duty,
:42:34. > :42:35.not big politics or ideology. That is the point about it. That makes it
:42:36. > :42:44.a poignant story. Let's go back to our top story
:42:45. > :42:48.today. The latest growth figures out this morning show the UK economy
:42:49. > :42:51.grew in the last three months of 2013. In the last hour, the
:42:52. > :42:55.Chancellor has been taking questions in the House of Commons. He was
:42:56. > :42:58.understandably pleased with the figures.
:42:59. > :43:02.These numbers are a boost for the economic security of hard-working
:43:03. > :43:08.people. Growth is broadly based with manufacturing growing fastest of
:43:09. > :43:13.all. It is more evidence that our long-term economic plan is working.
:43:14. > :43:18.But the job is not done. And it is clear the biggest risk... He has
:43:19. > :43:21.finished already! We've been joined by the Shadow
:43:22. > :43:31.Chief Secretary to the Treasury, Chris Leslie.
:43:32. > :43:37.So, difficult for Labour, more good news, continual good economic news.
:43:38. > :43:44.It is good we have 0.7%. The same figure, the level of
:43:45. > :43:48.quarterly growth we had back in the second quarter of 2010 after the
:43:49. > :43:55.general election, when the economy was beginning to recover. We know
:43:56. > :43:59.the story, we had three years of stagnation. Let us hope these
:44:00. > :44:03.statistics translate into real, meaningful improvements in living
:44:04. > :44:08.standards the people. Our worry is, though, that so far the people who
:44:09. > :44:12.are benefiting tend to be those who are the wealthier. Most people
:44:13. > :44:17.watching will be waiting and saying, I am not feeling the
:44:18. > :44:22.benefit. Do you think a 50p top rate of tax will help?
:44:23. > :44:29.Yes. The wealthiest in society should pay a fairer share. To look
:44:30. > :44:33.at some of the reactions from the right-wing press, you'd think this
:44:34. > :44:37.was an astonishing change. But what we are talking about is on those
:44:38. > :44:43.pounds that people learn, if they are lucky enough to earn ?150,000
:44:44. > :44:48.the amounts of money above that, instead of 45 pH should be 50p in
:44:49. > :44:52.the pound, I don't think it's an unreasonable thing to ask, to make
:44:53. > :44:56.sure we have the ability to protect some of those services and the most
:44:57. > :45:01.vulnerable in society. But it's not just the right wing press, its
:45:02. > :45:06.business leaders. Some of your own donors said it was extreme socialist
:45:07. > :45:11.nonsense. Across the board in the city, enemy of business, labour is
:45:12. > :45:14.anti-aspiration, punishing people earning lots of money. Is it your
:45:15. > :45:21.intention to alienate the business community? No, it's not. All of the
:45:22. > :45:26.people criticising tend to be beneficiaries of a tax cut if you
:45:27. > :45:30.are on ?1 million income, for example, you get a tax cut of
:45:31. > :45:34.?40,000. It's a very nice thing of you could have a tax cut of
:45:35. > :45:39.?40,000, I just don't think it's fair at the same time you've got the
:45:40. > :45:45.bedroom tax, cuts to tax credit, the rising VAT, where red is lower and
:45:46. > :45:52.middle income people... George Osborne today wouldn't rule out
:45:53. > :45:59.cutting it even further to 40p. Would you like to see it cut to 40p?
:46:00. > :46:08.Can I just address the hypocrisy? I would like to see it cut. Can I just
:46:09. > :46:13.say, all credit to you, is that New Labour is dead. Labour, when they
:46:14. > :46:18.came in and 97, didn't introduce a 50p tax rate. They didn't do it in
:46:19. > :46:23.2001, they didn't do it in 2005. They did it 100 days before the 2010
:46:24. > :46:27.election to appeal to your core vote. It was political and
:46:28. > :46:31.ideological. For you to sit here now and talk about the 50p tax rate and
:46:32. > :46:37.pulling it back, when you only put it in 100 days before the 2010
:46:38. > :46:41.election is so rich. I know that in the partisan world it is tempting
:46:42. > :46:44.for the government to say that it was spending on schools and
:46:45. > :46:52.hospitals that caused the deficit. The banking crisis came along... It
:46:53. > :46:57.caused a deficit which needed to be repaired. It was only right to ask
:46:58. > :47:03.the very wealthiest in society, the richest 1%. You do agree they should
:47:04. > :47:07.be contributing something? You can understand why your constituents
:47:08. > :47:11.don't want you obsessing about cutting their incomes, the richest
:47:12. > :47:19.people 's tax take even more. Why shouldn't people... Why shouldn't
:47:20. > :47:23.people, in this situation, as the recovery is trying to take hold, why
:47:24. > :47:29.shouldn't people earning more than 150,000, less than 1% of the
:47:30. > :47:32.population, pay more in tax? There's no proof that works. There's no
:47:33. > :47:37.evidence that the Treasury receives any more money by doing that. That
:47:38. > :47:42.comes back to the issue that this is bad economics. The ISS, I know you
:47:43. > :47:47.dispute this, the figure that was raised, but the IDF S, very
:47:48. > :47:53.respected Institute, says it only raised something in the region of
:47:54. > :47:59.100 million a year. There's no proof of that. There is proof of 100
:48:00. > :48:10.million at least. The OBR say 3 million. -- 3 billion. The reason I
:48:11. > :48:13.think it was so low, if George Osborne telegraphed to the
:48:14. > :48:16.millionaires a year or maybe more that he was going to cut that
:48:17. > :48:19.operate, what he has said to them is, if you can avoid paying your
:48:20. > :48:24.bonuses till the day the tax cut comes in, you will do very well.
:48:25. > :48:31.What did the statistics show about bonuses? They went up 82% the month
:48:32. > :48:37.after that top rate came from 50p to 45p. There's a lot of staving off.
:48:38. > :48:41.People avoiding that tax rate. Shouldn't be temporary or permanent?
:48:42. > :48:46.We've said it should be for the lifetime of the next Parliament.
:48:47. > :48:50.This government couldn't eradicate the deficit so we will finish the
:48:51. > :48:54.job. There is a debate, in terms of the money raised, whether you would
:48:55. > :48:57.make a big enough dent in the deficit on that alone. Let me come
:48:58. > :49:02.back to the issue, why is Labour wanted to kill off business
:49:03. > :49:07.investment and job creation at a time when growth has just returned?
:49:08. > :49:14.I don't think that raising the top rate of tax the -- about ?150,000 to
:49:15. > :49:18.50p would have that effect on business investment. For restart,
:49:19. > :49:23.we're not seeing business investment exactly flourishing now. The GDP
:49:24. > :49:25.figures show consumer fuel, not export or business investment
:49:26. > :49:30.driven. If you look at the period, the three years when we did have the
:49:31. > :49:34.50p rate in place, actually, the earnings of those above that
:49:35. > :49:39.?150,000 level were up by 10 billion more than the Treasury expected.
:49:40. > :49:45.Actually, there's no proof that it was that deterrent. Its popular.
:49:46. > :49:48.Topline announcement sounds popular. I have to take issue on the fact
:49:49. > :49:53.that you've said we live in different times and it was a result
:49:54. > :49:57.of the banking crisis. You brought it in 100 days before the 2010
:49:58. > :50:00.election. The banking crisis and problems happened a long time before
:50:01. > :50:03.that. What you did was political. I think what you are doing now was
:50:04. > :50:07.political and I think you will pay for it. The attitude now that your
:50:08. > :50:11.party is embracing as one of the days of Kinnock and extreme
:50:12. > :50:15.left-wing politics. I think you will find you are losing the centre
:50:16. > :50:21.ground, you've lost the New Labour project and you will pay for that in
:50:22. > :50:24.the election. I would strongly advise you to do what George Osborne
:50:25. > :50:29.did today. We didn't want to talk about the 50p rate at all, because
:50:30. > :50:34.he knows the public want, guess, deficit reduction, but fair deficit
:50:35. > :50:40.reduction. Can I ask about an adviser to Labour, Mr Arnie Graf?
:50:41. > :50:44.Priti Patel, a Tory backbencher believes he may be working in the UK
:50:45. > :50:50.illegally. What is the status of this man? I'm not party to his
:50:51. > :50:55.immigration status. I only heard the story in passing on the news today.
:50:56. > :50:59.Will you find out? And more than happy to look at it. The party has
:51:00. > :51:06.already put out statements he has made. There's a bit of mischief
:51:07. > :51:12.going on here by Priti Patel. When Conservative MP is start picking on
:51:13. > :51:16.Labour advisers and so full, you can probably sense there's a little bit
:51:17. > :51:21.of bias in what they are suggesting. Is she wrong to write to the UK
:51:22. > :51:26.Border Agency? That's what Conservative MP 's do about Labour.
:51:27. > :51:32.Labour would do -- never do it, would they? According to this, Mr
:51:33. > :51:37.Graf advises the party on campaigning and visits the UK on a
:51:38. > :51:40.business Visa. Party say they reimburse him for lost earnings and
:51:41. > :51:46.expenses. It sounds like they pay him. Is there something that needs
:51:47. > :51:49.to be investigated? So nobody is allowed to talk to anybody from
:51:50. > :51:55.other countries? Lynton Crosby had quite a number of dealings in
:51:56. > :52:00.Australia. Are we not supposed to have those conversations? I don't
:52:01. > :52:04.think this is going to go very far. We've made them eat bugs, we've seen
:52:05. > :52:07.them pretend to be pussycats - it seems as though some MPs will stop
:52:08. > :52:11.at nothing to make the voters like them. Those, like our guest of the
:52:12. > :52:15.day, Nadine Dorries, say they go on shows like I'm A Celebrity because
:52:16. > :52:17.it helps them get their message across to an increasingly apathetic
:52:18. > :52:22.public. Not all of her colleagues agree, to put it mildly, but where
:52:23. > :52:24.they do concur is on the need for a greater connection between
:52:25. > :52:37.politicians and the people. So what works, and what leaves a nasty taste
:52:38. > :52:41.in the mouth? Here's David. If there's one thing politicians
:52:42. > :52:45.really like, it's connecting with the lovely voters. If they could,
:52:46. > :52:49.they'd shake everyone occupied the hand, preferably while kissing your
:52:50. > :52:53.babies at the same time. The problem is they can't, so they are coming up
:52:54. > :53:01.with ever more inventive ways of reaching out and showing they are
:53:02. > :53:05.just like you and me. No politician worth his or his salt is now without
:53:06. > :53:09.a Twitter account, holding forth on everything from the deficit to
:53:10. > :53:13.Strictly Come Dancing. Talking of reality TV shows, here's an early
:53:14. > :53:17.example of the genre, with Michael Portillo trying life as a single mum
:53:18. > :53:21.in the 90s. Since then, do trips to the Big Brother house or the jungle
:53:22. > :53:26.is all part of the plan to get down with voters. Do they work? Those
:53:27. > :53:31.shows are entertainment based around a concept that you humiliate and
:53:32. > :53:34.embarrass people. Politicians face more humour lesion and embarrass
:53:35. > :53:37.anyway, they don't need more of that. What works well is where
:53:38. > :53:40.politicians are talking about themselves as human beings and the
:53:41. > :53:43.issues they are dealing with as politicians. It doesn't work well
:53:44. > :53:48.when they are doing things like having to eat cockroaches live on
:53:49. > :53:53.TV. Could that be more preferable to taking your chances every week on a
:53:54. > :53:58.live phone in with voters? Do you approve of MPs using 10,000 pounds
:53:59. > :54:02.of taxpayers' money for acting lessons? You Low we've seen how it
:54:03. > :54:05.completely dominates the political news agenda for that morning or
:54:06. > :54:09.sometimes all the way through the day. It allows Nick Clegg to set out
:54:10. > :54:13.his position on issues, in a position where he is not completely
:54:14. > :54:16.in control of the agenda because anyone can ring up and ask him any
:54:17. > :54:22.question. But if there's a message she wants to get out, he can get it
:54:23. > :54:27.out. Daewoo out the old school ways of keeping in touch. I like meeting
:54:28. > :54:31.people in the street, knocking on doors. It humanises you and reminds
:54:32. > :54:35.you where you came from and who you are. Holding an advice bureau, being
:54:36. > :54:39.in the constituency is absolutely crucial to keeping your feet on the
:54:40. > :54:46.ground and illustrating to people locally that you still care and are
:54:47. > :54:51.still there. So what's next? Things like virtual town halls, if you run
:54:52. > :54:54.MP in London representing a constituency many hundreds of miles
:54:55. > :54:58.away, you could be in Parliament voting and debating, then in the
:54:59. > :55:01.evening in the virtual town hall you can engage with your constituents,
:55:02. > :55:06.even though they are at the other end of the country. That technology
:55:07. > :55:11.is the future. It looks like MPs will continue to use methods, old,
:55:12. > :55:17.new and, frankly, bizarre, to connect with you lucky voters,
:55:18. > :55:25.whether you like it or not. And we've been joined by Michael White
:55:26. > :55:31.from the Guardian. He's not wearing a tiger onesie, thank goodness! Do
:55:32. > :55:37.you have any regrets about your time on reality TV? Gosh, no. Penny
:55:38. > :55:45.Mordaunt doing splash recently, I don't think she is an MP in a
:55:46. > :55:49.marginal seat. So it is about self-promotion? Yes, and then
:55:50. > :55:53.looking what you does behind. More people know who she is, will be
:55:54. > :55:57.interested and look at what she's doing as an MP. Therefore she is
:55:58. > :56:00.being able to reach out to many voters. Somebody said on the film
:56:01. > :56:04.just now, you've got to go and knock on the doors. We do that anyway, we
:56:05. > :56:17.kissed the babies, we knock on the doors and talk to people, but we can
:56:18. > :56:20.do other things as well. Because it clearly isn't enough on its own. I
:56:21. > :56:22.agree with Nadine Dorries on most of that. It's not for the
:56:23. > :56:24.faint-hearted, reality TV and live phone-ins. Should politicians be
:56:25. > :56:29.doing it? Why not, if you're an extrovert. Michael Portillo,
:56:30. > :56:34.introverted figure. The difference between Gordon Brown and Tony
:56:35. > :56:39.Blair, won an extrovert... If you can carry it off, I didn't see
:56:40. > :56:51.Nadine on I'm A Celebrity, Get Me Out Of Here... The wonders of
:56:52. > :56:55.YouTube! If you can carry it off and if the voters don't mind, if they
:56:56. > :57:01.think she's doing a good job, they will re-elect her. Did she carry it
:57:02. > :57:05.off? I don't know. The best person to judge that, it's not my kind of
:57:06. > :57:10.show. If she gets re-elected, it's all part of the process, like social
:57:11. > :57:15.media, tweeting, but it's dangerous. If you are not good at it, people
:57:16. > :57:23.won't like it. Being voted off early on... On another programme, voted
:57:24. > :57:28.off air, if you are a politician you will be voted off first. For me,
:57:29. > :57:35.that was taken in to the whole process. Was an Widdicombe voted off
:57:36. > :57:44.first? She stayed on for ages. Would you do another reality TV show? Not
:57:45. > :57:49.while I'm an MP. There are two aspects to this. There is the media
:57:50. > :57:53.and your constituents. All I can say is, if you'd read the media you
:57:54. > :57:57.would have thought my constituents... I don't know the
:57:58. > :58:01.exact figure, but somebody got a nationwide campaign up while I was
:58:02. > :58:07.in the jungle to get me removed as an MP. 65 million people could vote.
:58:08. > :58:11.There are 80,000 people in my constituency. I think they got
:58:12. > :58:15.something like 400 signatures. The people loved it. So you are not
:58:16. > :58:21.against them being on reality TV shows, it's just got to be the right
:58:22. > :58:25.person? It's very risky. It sounds as if she got away with it, but
:58:26. > :58:29.she's not doing it again. There's just time before we go to find out
:58:30. > :58:31.the answer to our quiz. The question was... What has been spotted in the
:58:32. > :58:46.tearoom in the House of Commons? I've seen a mouse on a daily basis.
:58:47. > :58:58.It's so bold, it runs over your feet. You've seen it? I photographed
:58:59. > :59:00.it, I put it on Twitter. I'll be back tomorrow. Goodbye.