:00:36. > :00:43.Morning, folks. Sorry seems to be the hardest word for Harriet Harman.
:00:44. > :00:46.But should she be uttering it at all? She certainly doesn't think so
:00:47. > :00:50.even though the Daily Mail is saying she should have done more to sever
:00:51. > :00:54.links between a civil rights lobby she worked for in the 1970s and a
:00:55. > :01:01.paedophile rights group. Everyone wants lower energy Bills, including
:01:02. > :01:04.British industry. The former Chief Executive at Grangemouth will be
:01:05. > :01:10.here with a possible solution. Will this German Chancellor manage to
:01:11. > :01:13.appease Conservative Euro-sceptics? Angela Merkel's in town this week
:01:14. > :01:17.and "Call me Dave" certainly hopes so. And it's PMQs at midday. But do
:01:18. > :01:20.you love it? Or loathe it? We've carried out the most extensive
:01:21. > :01:37.scientific research known to mankind. I love it! Why? No blows on
:01:38. > :01:45.both side of the House. Mr Speaker! Mr Speaker! A man of taste and
:01:46. > :01:49.distinction. Yes, all that and more coming up in the next 90 minutes of
:01:50. > :01:52.public service broadcasting at its cheapest. And with me for the
:01:53. > :01:55.duration, because I'm all on my lonesome today, we've hired for a
:01:56. > :01:58.pittance, in fact for absolutely nothing at all, the Justice
:01:59. > :02:05.Secretary, Chris Grayling and the Shadow Scottish Secretary, Margaret
:02:06. > :02:13.Curran. They're worth every penny. Every penny we have not paid!
:02:14. > :02:16.Charming! Welcome. Now, first today let's talk about two stories that
:02:17. > :02:19.have dominated today's front pages. In a moment we'll be talking about
:02:20. > :02:26.John Downey, a former IRA member who walked free from court yesterday. He
:02:27. > :02:29.was a prime suspect for the murder of four soldiers by the IRA in 1982,
:02:30. > :02:32.but was effectively given immunity from prosecution by police and
:02:33. > :02:37.officials as part of the peace process. But first on the front page
:02:38. > :02:47.of the Mail today - the death of 40-year-old Andrew Young, who was
:02:48. > :02:50.punched in the street and died. His killer, yesterday, pleaded guilty to
:02:51. > :02:58.manslaughter and was sentenced to four years in prison. Chris
:02:59. > :03:01.Grayling, is that a fair sentence? This is a repugnant crime, a
:03:02. > :03:08.horrible situation, and my heart goes out to the family of Mr Young.
:03:09. > :03:13.Most of the public will feel that justice has not been done. I always
:03:14. > :03:17.ask people to be careful because none of us have sat through the
:03:18. > :03:25.court hearing and heard the circumstances. It is quite a simple
:03:26. > :03:32.case. This man sees a cyclist on the pavement. We are talking about
:03:33. > :03:37.Bournemouth, not Glasgow! He says to this man, it is a bit dangerous to
:03:38. > :03:45.ride your bike. A friend of the cyclist comes from nowhere and
:03:46. > :03:51.punches him, he falls, he dies, and the man gets four years. You have to
:03:52. > :03:57.be careful about forming a view of a case that we have not sat through.
:03:58. > :04:02.In this particular case, I think it is right that the Attorney General
:04:03. > :04:09.considers whether this sentence is too lenient. Let me clarify that.
:04:10. > :04:15.The Attorney General is determining whether this case is too lenient?
:04:16. > :04:23.Yes, that is correct. He is considering whether to launch a --
:04:24. > :04:27.an appeal. He can go back to the courts and appeal against the
:04:28. > :04:35.sentence and seek a longer sentence. That was the case with Stewart Paul
:04:36. > :04:40.-- Stewart Paul. He may choose to do that in this case. I cannot say what
:04:41. > :04:48.he will do but I think it is right and proper that consideration is
:04:49. > :04:53.given. You promised that, quote, under this government, offenders are
:04:54. > :05:04.likely to go to jail for even longer. That is the case. Not here
:05:05. > :05:09.it is not. If you can punch someone in the street so hard that you can
:05:10. > :05:15.kill them and then end up, in effect, serving two years, I am
:05:16. > :05:22.afraid that the quote does not stack up. What do you say to the mother of
:05:23. > :05:29.Mr Young? She calls the sentence a joke. One of your backbenchers calls
:05:30. > :05:33.it outrageously lean. Under this government, more people are going to
:05:34. > :05:38.prison and going for longer. What I would say to his mother, apart from
:05:39. > :05:43.how desperately sorry I am for the situation... She does not want your
:05:44. > :05:53.pity or sorrow, she once justice. She does not think this is enough.
:05:54. > :06:00.You have also said that, quote, we are all angered by dangerous
:06:01. > :06:09.criminals. This man will be released halfway through his jail sentence.
:06:10. > :06:13.Is that right? He falls under the legislation we have before
:06:14. > :06:20.Parliament at the moment. We are legislating at the moment and my
:06:21. > :06:24.natural instincts tell me that ten years should mean ten years. I
:06:25. > :06:29.cannot move to that in one go and I do not want a situation where people
:06:30. > :06:32.who are a danger to the public are released automatically halfway
:06:33. > :06:37.through their sentence. We are currently legislating so people
:06:38. > :06:42.cannot be released before the end of their sentence. That is unless the
:06:43. > :06:49.parole board judges they are not a threat to the public. I'm aware of
:06:50. > :06:56.the difficulties but I would suggest to you that this is where the
:06:57. > :07:03.Westminster elite disconnects with ordinary people. I cannot speak for
:07:04. > :07:11.Chris Grayling but this situation is astonishing. It is astonishing that
:07:12. > :07:17.it could happen in our community. As I understand it there may be a
:07:18. > :07:26.mental health situation in all of this. The mental health situation is
:07:27. > :07:31.on the side of the... Victim. We do not understand societies sometimes.
:07:32. > :07:36.It shows you that we have do understand public opinion and the
:07:37. > :07:41.outrage that people will feel over this, and the huge injustice. That
:07:42. > :08:04.should be the imperative thing. Chris Grayling, egg give me a brief
:08:05. > :08:14.reaction to the John Downey case. -- can you give me a brief reaction?
:08:15. > :08:20.Something has gone badly wrong. The family is furious and do not think
:08:21. > :08:26.that the justice system works in their favour. What happened was
:08:27. > :08:31.horrible and terrible, but Northern Ireland, thanks to the efforts of
:08:32. > :08:38.politicians over the last 20 years, is a much better place. We have
:08:39. > :08:43.achieved a degree of stability in Northern Ireland. It is a better
:08:44. > :08:47.place than it was. Now to Harriet Harman who's been having a bit of a
:08:48. > :08:50.rough ride this week. She, her husband jack Dromey, and former
:08:51. > :08:53.Labour Minister, Patricia Hewitt have been, at least they would
:08:54. > :08:56.argue, the victim of a smear campaign by the Daily Mail. The
:08:57. > :08:59.paper says all three of them should have done more to sever the
:09:00. > :09:03.affiliation between the National Council of Civil Liberties - which
:09:04. > :09:08.they all worked for - and the Paedophile Information Exchange.
:09:09. > :09:16.Harriet Harman had this to say yesterday. Nothing I have done in
:09:17. > :09:20.secret, there is nothing hidden to be discovered about me. I have been
:09:21. > :09:24.in public life for more than 30 years and all of those years have
:09:25. > :09:29.been about protecting the vulnerable, protecting women and
:09:30. > :09:34.children, and that is why I find it unfair and offensive that the Daily
:09:35. > :09:39.Mail should put smear and innuendo on me, as it somehow I have
:09:40. > :09:42.supported those people that I have fought against. I think they are
:09:43. > :09:49.wrong to be doing that and that is why I am speaking out. Please do not
:09:50. > :09:54.keep asking me to apologise. I stand by it and fought to protect the
:09:55. > :09:57.vulnerable. It was a vile organisation and regret the fact
:09:58. > :10:02.that it ever existed. I supported laws to protect children and stand
:10:03. > :10:08.by what I have done. And we're joined now by the Daily Mail's
:10:09. > :10:15.Andrew Pierce. What has she done wrong? She said that the Paedophile
:10:16. > :10:19.Information Exchange was swept away and was not influential with the
:10:20. > :10:29.National Council of Civil Liberties. That is not the case. In 1979, a
:10:30. > :10:31.year after Harriet joined, the chairman of the Paedophile
:10:32. > :10:34.Information Exchange was serving as a councillor on National Council of
:10:35. > :10:42.Civil Liberties. What has she done wrong? She was the legal adviser at
:10:43. > :10:48.the time. She never made any attempt to sever the links between that body
:10:49. > :10:54.and an organisation that was seeking to abolish the age of consent
:10:55. > :11:01.altogether. I think it is extraordinary that she cannot admit
:11:02. > :11:03.that it is wrong. I think she should apologise for it. She should feel
:11:04. > :11:10.profoundly guilty that she was associated with it. They were taking
:11:11. > :11:15.money from an organisation that was advocating sex with four-year-olds.
:11:16. > :11:25.Are you saying that she should apologise for giving succour to
:11:26. > :11:32.paedophiles? I am saying that the Paedophile Information Exchange, by
:11:33. > :11:37.being affiliated to a respectable campaign organisation, helped to
:11:38. > :11:46.promote a climate where paedophiles could flourish. Did she ever defend
:11:47. > :11:52.it? I do not know. What she has ever done -- never done is called for the
:11:53. > :11:58.links to be severed. Is there any evidence that the organisation
:11:59. > :12:06.influenced what she stood for? Did she trials through -- did she try to
:12:07. > :12:14.water down child pornography laws? I do not know. Everybody on the left
:12:15. > :12:19.was looking for a more relaxed approach to pornography in the
:12:20. > :12:22.1970s. Many people were. I am not sure that that meant that they
:12:23. > :12:27.wanted a more relaxed approach to child pornography. Do you have any
:12:28. > :12:36.evidence that Harriet Harman wanted a more relaxed approach to this? She
:12:37. > :12:44.signed a document in 1970 which said there should be no prosecution
:12:45. > :12:53.unless the child had been damaged. Is not every child damaged this?
:12:54. > :13:01.This is... Look, the National Council of Civil Liberties, in
:13:02. > :13:04.retrospect, she did not run its, and clearly, being associated with the
:13:05. > :13:10.Paedophile Information Exchange was a stupid thing, but I am not sure
:13:11. > :13:16.where Harriet Harman has do carry the blame for this. This is, surely,
:13:17. > :13:28.just a tenuous smear campaign. We have asked Patricia Hewitt about
:13:29. > :13:36.this. The police returned to Paedophile Information Exchange...
:13:37. > :13:41.Who was the MP who were calling for the BBC to be more open question
:13:42. > :13:51.what Harriet Harman. Sorry, I am desperate to get in. Can I say one
:13:52. > :13:54.other thing? She now runs Liberty which succeeded National Council of
:13:55. > :13:58.Civil Liberties. She said she was ashamed and disgusted by what the
:13:59. > :14:04.National Council of Civil Liberties bid by being affiliated to a
:14:05. > :14:08.paedophile organisation. I think what the Daily Mail has done is
:14:09. > :14:15.outrageous. Harriet Harman has an outstanding record of 30 years'
:14:16. > :14:26.work. Every member of the public would say that Harriet Harman stands
:14:27. > :14:32.up women's' right. There is not a shred of evidence. Why did she not,
:14:33. > :14:36.in her interview, simply say that it was clearly a mistake for Paedophile
:14:37. > :14:45.Information Exchange to be allowed to affiliate with the National
:14:46. > :14:53.Council of Civil Liberties? She was given so many chances and
:14:54. > :14:57.opportunities to do so. At the time, Paedophile Information
:14:58. > :15:08.Exchange were associated on the extreme margins... They had people
:15:09. > :15:10.on the committees! There was a debate in the National Council of
:15:11. > :15:15.Civil Liberties about freedom of speech. You can argue the mechanics
:15:16. > :15:22.of that organisation, but they are saying, in them Mail, that there is
:15:23. > :15:31.a link between Harriet Harman and the Paedophile Information Exchange.
:15:32. > :15:35.you are saying that because of the mechanics of the structure of that
:15:36. > :15:45.organisation there is complicity on Harriet Harman's Park. Are you
:15:46. > :15:52.saying she was in any way complicit with PIE? I am saying that by not
:15:53. > :15:59.disaffiliated from that organisation, they got rid of PIE a
:16:00. > :16:06.year after Harriet Harman left, she showed as a campaigner for women's
:16:07. > :16:11.rights... Let's accept they should never have let PIE affiliate in the
:16:12. > :16:17.first place, let's accept they were too slow to get rid of them, but do
:16:18. > :16:23.you have any evidence that she was complicit with anything that PIE
:16:24. > :16:31.stood for? We have never suggested Harriet Harman supports paedophilia.
:16:32. > :16:38.In any way complicit is the key question. Has she been in any way
:16:39. > :16:42.complicit? Do you have any evidence? Anyone who was running the
:16:43. > :16:48.organisation at the time in a sense was complicit for not disassociating
:16:49. > :16:53.with that group which supports paedophilia. That could be regarded
:16:54. > :16:59.as an error of judgement, but it does not mean complicity. For which
:17:00. > :17:06.I think they should all apologise. For what? For an error of judgement.
:17:07. > :17:12.It is an error of judgement to sit on a committee with a man who was
:17:13. > :17:16.locked up for paedophilia. A year after she joined the organisation
:17:17. > :17:23.the chairman of the Paedophile Information Exchange was locked up.
:17:24. > :17:26.It is like saying you should not be with the BBC because Jimmy Savile
:17:27. > :17:36.was at his most rampart when he was in the BBC. You should not be with
:17:37. > :17:41.the Daily Mail because that supports Hitler. You have made the
:17:42. > :17:44.charge that Harriet Harman is complicit by some degree with
:17:45. > :17:56.paedophilia because she was part of an organisation, that some extreme,
:17:57. > :17:59.vile, terrible people have said... I have never suggested that Harriet
:18:00. > :18:08.Harman in any way supported paedophilia. I think you should
:18:09. > :18:16.apologise for that. You talk about the sexual exploitation of children.
:18:17. > :18:23.It is a photograph. I will take no lessons from you on moral outrage.
:18:24. > :18:27.Harriet Harman has clearly got issues to address. I do not think it
:18:28. > :18:36.is right for me to get into those. Quite clearly back at that time the
:18:37. > :18:40.National Council for Civil Liberties was infiltrated and influenced by
:18:41. > :18:44.somebody with views most of us would find utterly repugnant. There is a
:18:45. > :18:48.real danger in this country in a world where there is a bit of a
:18:49. > :18:53.pressure culture where it becomes easy for groups to be hijacked with
:18:54. > :18:57.people with their own agendas. Politicians and the media should be
:18:58. > :19:02.much more scrutinising about who these groups are, and what the
:19:03. > :19:09.agendas of individuals in them are. These are not people who are whiter
:19:10. > :19:17.than white. We have put in it there. Where is your editor? Why are you
:19:18. > :19:20.doing these interviews? He is busy editing the newspaper. I always
:19:21. > :19:30.appeared to defend what I put on the front page. I will tell him you
:19:31. > :19:34.missed him. Now, how do you like your PMQs? Sombre and serious? In
:19:35. > :19:38.bed with a cup of cocoa? Feisty, fun and ferocious at midday on the Daily
:19:39. > :19:41.Politics? Perhaps with a pina colada and a sardine sandwich? Well, the
:19:42. > :19:44.event of the Parliamentary week has been getting a lot of stick lately
:19:45. > :19:48.and last week the speaker himself wrote to Messers Cameron, Clegg and
:19:49. > :19:52.Milliband urging them to clamp down on "yobbery and public school
:19:53. > :19:56.twittishness". Mr Bercow said the tone of debate was putting the
:19:57. > :20:07.public off. So does he have a point? Who better to find out than Giles
:20:08. > :20:13.with his balls. So, we have brought the mood box to East London where it
:20:14. > :20:18.borders two constituencies, one Lib Dem and one Labour to find out if
:20:19. > :20:24.they like PMQs and all that argy-bargy. Do they like it or
:20:25. > :20:31.loathe it? You don't mind the shouting? It is not hurting anybody.
:20:32. > :20:43.Shall I put a bowl in Love it? Love it. They are not talking about the
:20:44. > :20:49.British people are tall. It is a nuisance. Are you put off because
:20:50. > :20:58.they shout at each other? Not really, no. They can have a good
:20:59. > :21:05.debate, but not on camera. Do you never watch it? It is a load of
:21:06. > :21:14.rubbish. The same as him, a load of rubbish. Who does she mean? If it
:21:15. > :21:20.gets to the point, it is fine, but if not, they are being pompous. How
:21:21. > :21:27.often do they get to the point? Not very often. The sun is not shining
:21:28. > :21:37.on Parliament or me today, it is raining on our parade. I love it,
:21:38. > :21:43.but I hate it as well. Prime Minister's Questions, do you watch
:21:44. > :21:50.it and like it or loathe it? I watch it every now and then, but it is all
:21:51. > :21:55.about personalities so I loathe it. It is about even Stevens and the
:21:56. > :22:03.rain is coming in. It is rubbish. They are rubbish. Do they just shout
:22:04. > :22:11.at each other? Exactly and they do nothing. I love it, trading blows on
:22:12. > :22:19.both sides of the house, Mr Speaker, Mr Speaker. And the backbenchers.
:22:20. > :22:28.You do not want it to be polite? No, just as it is, just as it is. I love
:22:29. > :22:35.the headgear. Sometimes you have to listen to other people. That is the
:22:36. > :22:41.verdict from the market. When it comes to PMQs more of them love it
:22:42. > :22:49.and loathe it and the San Francisco out as well. And Nick Robinson has
:22:50. > :22:57.come to the party early. Why has the Speaker decided to make this
:22:58. > :23:02.intervention? I think he genuinely feels that PMQs has got out of
:23:03. > :23:06.control. One day I ended up in my old seat sitting above the House of
:23:07. > :23:11.Commons in the press gallery and even I was shocked. I could not
:23:12. > :23:18.hear. Occasionally you will see members of Parliament leaning back.
:23:19. > :23:22.In the press gallery you have to lean forward and I had to do this to
:23:23. > :23:29.hear what people were saying because it was that noisy. There was a sense
:23:30. > :23:34.before Christmas that it was out of control. This is not new territory
:23:35. > :23:39.for John Bercow. He made the comparison with the Bighorn that
:23:40. > :23:43.used to play in the World Cup and he said it was as loud as that. Plenty
:23:44. > :23:48.of people in the House of Commons think it is his fault, that he does
:23:49. > :23:52.not have the respect of people on both sides of the house, so people
:23:53. > :23:59.do not respect him when he stands up to tell them to shut up. Does he
:24:00. > :24:05.have support among backbenchers? Or do they like PMQs the way it is?
:24:06. > :24:09.There have always been two different cultures. There are some people who
:24:10. > :24:14.believe the bearpit atmosphere is something that other countries envy.
:24:15. > :24:19.As you travel the world with any prime minister the people around
:24:20. > :24:25.them often say, we never a got our guys to say what your guys have
:24:26. > :24:29.said. I have heard it in France and Germany. Leaders around the world do
:24:30. > :24:33.not get scrutinised. On the other hand, there are other members of
:24:34. > :24:39.Parliament who will say it looks like a rowdy, boys' club and it is
:24:40. > :24:43.off-putting to people who do not have the self-confidence to take
:24:44. > :24:49.part. It is off-putting to women who are there and they are shouted at in
:24:50. > :24:55.the way that is not a part of normal dialogue. Women can do a lot of
:24:56. > :25:00.shouting as well. Every leader says they will change it. David Cameron
:25:01. > :25:05.talk about a Punch and Judy show and he discovered if he did not play
:25:06. > :25:08.Punch and Judy, his backbenchers felt let down and people in
:25:09. > :25:14.television would often not put him on the TV. There is an awful lot of
:25:15. > :25:20.the processes at Westminster which are measured, sensible, intelligent
:25:21. > :25:25.debate the kind people would want to see happen in Parliament and it gets
:25:26. > :25:32.zero coverage. The only time the cameras turn up is at PMQs. I will
:25:33. > :25:36.challenge you on that and this is an John Bercow's favour. Because he has
:25:37. > :25:41.dragged ministers into the house to do urgent questions, when the news
:25:42. > :25:45.comes up he says they have to explain what goes on, we are putting
:25:46. > :25:54.more of that sober stuff on television. The select committees
:25:55. > :26:00.are alive now. I accept some of the criticism from Chris, but when and
:26:01. > :26:05.if the House of Commons is discussing what the country is
:26:06. > :26:08.talking about, it gets on the television. There is a growing
:26:09. > :26:15.distinction between the natural kind of debate and the pressure debate at
:26:16. > :26:21.PMQs and the organised operation that sometimes they have too much
:26:22. > :26:27.shouting down. I think that is different. There is a bit where it
:26:28. > :26:31.is high octane and people are under pressure and everybody likes that
:26:32. > :26:34.excitement, but there is a difference when you get to the
:26:35. > :26:41.orchestrated shouting down and you do not get to the debate and there
:26:42. > :26:49.is a shift towards that. It is Wednesday and it is nearly 12
:26:50. > :26:57.o'clock and it is PMQs! No, it is Crackerjack. Crackerjack! Mr
:26:58. > :27:01.Speaker, what on earth are you up to?
:27:02. > :27:05.They have got some broomstick handles and they have got to get the
:27:06. > :27:11.rings onto the handle, as many as possible at one time and put them on
:27:12. > :27:20.the post at the end. There is John, Philip, Nicholas and Christian.
:27:21. > :27:27.Ready, steady, go. Oh, you must work in a curtain shop. Look at him, that
:27:28. > :27:36.is the quickest ever done. He has done it. There is a prize for you,
:27:37. > :27:47.and for you and your prize is a Crackerjack pencil! Crackerjack! No
:27:48. > :27:52.Crackerjack pencils. He was the small lad who we first saw on the
:27:53. > :27:58.camera. He looked kind of cute. But if you want a Daily Politics mug,
:27:59. > :28:13.you have to be in it to win it. Let's see if you can remember when
:28:14. > :28:22.this happened. # Baby, give it up... You realise you are breaking
:28:23. > :28:35.the law? Yes, I do, I better put it on. # Daddy is going to buy you a
:28:36. > :28:57.dream to cling to... Modernise, work. # You were a war baby. This
:28:58. > :29:14.means war, baby. You are watching the first edition of BBC
:29:15. > :29:22.television's breakfast time. # I thought I heard your words... To be
:29:23. > :29:29.in with a chance of winning, you can send your answers to our quiz e-mail
:29:30. > :29:43.address. You can see the full terms and conditions on our website. It is
:29:44. > :29:49.coming up to midday, there is Big Ben. It can only mean one thing,
:29:50. > :29:57.Prime Minister's Questions is on its way. Would I be right in saying a
:29:58. > :30:01.lot of people have turned anti-coalition this week? It is very
:30:02. > :30:09.fashionable. The Daily Telegraph had a story that David Cameron might
:30:10. > :30:19.rule out another coalition. But David Finkelstein said it was
:30:20. > :30:25.lunacy. The story or the idea? But Ed McCluskey said Ed Miliband should
:30:26. > :30:35.do the same. But it is not actually up to politicians what the election
:30:36. > :30:42.result is. Should he ruled out a coalition? Our sole interest is on
:30:43. > :30:49.winning an election and right. But should he rule it out? I do not
:30:50. > :30:53.think that story is true. The only way this country gets what it once
:30:54. > :30:59.is to win the election. You will not get from David Cameron or anyone
:31:00. > :31:06.else except determination to win and you are not going to see a start a
:31:07. > :31:11.debate about coalition. If you rule out coalition it is saying what you
:31:12. > :31:15.have done for the last four years is the wrong thing. It is possible one
:31:16. > :31:20.of these parties could come close and need the support of the
:31:21. > :31:24.Democratic Unionists. There are all sorts of complicated setups that may
:31:25. > :31:30.happen after an uncertain general election result. If you write down
:31:31. > :31:37.no, never, will not do it, you are making life difficult. If Labour was
:31:38. > :31:41.the largest party and a couple of votes shy of an overall majority
:31:42. > :31:47.they would rather stick as a minority Government in the hope that
:31:48. > :31:55.all the other smaller parties would rarely ganged up against a Labour
:31:56. > :32:02.Government. I am fairly confident we will get a majority. What we will
:32:03. > :32:11.not get is a German style grand coalition. Let's go over to PMQs.
:32:12. > :32:18.I had meetings with colleagues and in addition to my duties in the
:32:19. > :32:25.House, I will have further duties today. I rang the Prime Minister for
:32:26. > :32:29.his answer but we should congratulate Team GB on their
:32:30. > :32:38.success in the Winter Olympics. HSBC have announced that bonuses of ?2.3
:32:39. > :32:43.billion will be paid to the Chief Executive. When ordinary British
:32:44. > :32:47.families face a cost of living crisis, is it not time for this
:32:48. > :32:55.government to listen to Labour and tax bonuses to get the young people
:32:56. > :33:00.back to work? Let me join the honourable gentleman in
:33:01. > :33:05.congratulating Team GB for their best medal performance since 1924 at
:33:06. > :33:10.a Winter Olympics. It was a huge honour to welcome them to Downing
:33:11. > :33:17.Street to have an explanation of how skeleton and curling works. On the
:33:18. > :33:21.issue of bank bonuses, they are well down from the appalling situation
:33:22. > :33:26.that was left by the last Labour government. What we need to see is
:33:27. > :33:31.the proper control of all form of pay. What I do not want to see and
:33:32. > :33:41.what I think we will get from the party opposite is focusing only on
:33:42. > :33:49.bonuses. You can claw-back bonuses but you cannot claw back pay. Does
:33:50. > :33:53.the Prime Minister recognise that it is part of the job of church leaders
:33:54. > :34:05.to challenge government about policy. Will he discuss with them
:34:06. > :34:13.measures to get out of poverty? There is nothing particularly moral
:34:14. > :34:22.about pouring borrowed money into systems that can trap people in
:34:23. > :34:26.poverty. I think my right honourable friend, who was a church man
:34:27. > :34:31.himself, talks perfect sense. There is nothing immoral about running up
:34:32. > :34:35.deficits, out-of-control welfare Bills, and if we do not deal with
:34:36. > :34:39.the problems, the whole country will be poorer. We should listen to the
:34:40. > :34:46.former Archbishop of Canterbury, George Carey, who said that the
:34:47. > :34:54.church should be wary of the dangers. I think serious politicians
:34:55. > :35:02.have to engage in this and this should go for everybody. Mr Speaker,
:35:03. > :35:04.I joined my honourable friend and the Prime Minister in congratulating
:35:05. > :35:11.Team GB on their brilliant performance. As the threat of floods
:35:12. > :35:15.passes, there are still thousands out of their homes, the Somerset
:35:16. > :35:23.Levels are underwater, and farms are struggling to recover. The committee
:35:24. > :35:26.on climate change has said that the government investment in flood
:35:27. > :35:32.defences has fallen. In light of this, does the Prime Minister think
:35:33. > :35:36.it is right to revisit the plans for investment in flood defences? We
:35:37. > :35:42.will look carefully at this. We set out spending figures all the way out
:35:43. > :35:49.to 2020, which are major investments in flood defences. As the waters
:35:50. > :35:53.reside, and as the Environment Agency look at what happened, we can
:35:54. > :35:58.review it and see what new measures are necessary. Let me repeat the
:35:59. > :36:14.point. In this four-year period, overall float spending has gone up.
:36:15. > :36:18.-- flood spending. This is what the UK Statistics Authority has said:
:36:19. > :36:24.Government funding for flood defences was lower in real terms
:36:25. > :36:30.during the current spending period than the last. The only way you
:36:31. > :36:33.claim otherwise is by ignoring inflation and by claiming credit for
:36:34. > :36:40.the money that other organisations spend. Why does the Prime Minister
:36:41. > :36:46.not admit it? They have cut flood spending and he has been caught out!
:36:47. > :36:52.If you take the period 2010 to 2014, the spending has been 2.4 billion
:36:53. > :37:02.more than the 2.2 billion in the previous four years. If you take the
:37:03. > :37:06.five-year period of this Parliament that the spending has been higher
:37:07. > :37:11.than the previous five years. I think having this debate is slightly
:37:12. > :37:15.pointless. The whole country should be coming together to deal with
:37:16. > :37:19.flood defences. The fact is that from the moment he turned up in a
:37:20. > :37:24.flooded village with a Labour candidate beside him, he has missed
:37:25. > :37:37.judged the mood of the country. -- misjudged. First of all, if it is a
:37:38. > :37:44.simple choice between the UK Statistics Authority, people will
:37:45. > :37:48.believe the Statistics Authority. The question of how much to invest
:37:49. > :37:52.in flood defence depends on the assessment of risks posed by
:37:53. > :37:59.man-made climate change. He said this: It is easy to do the softer
:38:00. > :38:04.things like riding your bike, visiting glaciers, and rebuilding
:38:05. > :38:08.your House to make it green. It is only clear you mean it when you do
:38:09. > :38:12.the tough things as well, like telling the truth about climate
:38:13. > :38:19.change. What is the truth about climate change? The truth is that
:38:20. > :38:23.this government has eight programme to reduce carbon right across the
:38:24. > :38:32.economy. -- a programme to reduce carbon. We have started! Compared to
:38:33. > :38:38.the government he left, the carbon emissions are down 14%. Let me
:38:39. > :38:42.return to this issue of floods defence spending. The people of this
:38:43. > :39:00.country will want to know this. He is committed to a 0% Spending
:39:01. > :39:14.Review. That means a a 0% well not match the spending in 2016, 2017 or
:39:15. > :39:23.all the way to 2018! What total nonsense and he knows it! It is very
:39:24. > :39:27.interesting because someone who is in opposition wanted to talk as much
:39:28. > :39:34.as he could about climate change is now wanting to get off the subject!
:39:35. > :39:40.Will he just set out, for his party and the country, his views about
:39:41. > :39:44.man-made climate change? I believe man-made climate change is one of
:39:45. > :39:50.the most serious threats that this country and the world faces. That is
:39:51. > :39:55.why we have the world's first green investment bank here in Britain.
:39:56. > :39:59.That is why we are building the first nuclear power station for 30
:40:00. > :40:05.years in this country. That is why we have cut carbon emissions by 40%
:40:06. > :40:10.since we came to office. That is why we set out carbon budgets in this
:40:11. > :40:16.country. They talk a good game about it, but it takes people to come in,
:40:17. > :40:21.govern effectively and deal with it! Excellent. We are getting somewhere.
:40:22. > :40:28.I agree with what he's said about the importance of climate change.
:40:29. > :40:30.The reason this matters is because there are people in the most
:40:31. > :40:36.important positions in his government, going around,
:40:37. > :40:40.questioning climate change. This is what the Environment Secretary said:
:40:41. > :40:44.People get very emotional about this. People should accept that the
:40:45. > :40:51.climate has been changing for centuries. The energy minister, when
:40:52. > :40:57.asked about climate change, said this: You are not going to draw me
:40:58. > :41:02.on that. I have not had time to get into the climate change debate. He
:41:03. > :41:08.is the energy minister, Mr Speaker! Will the Prime Minister clarify, is
:41:09. > :41:15.he happy to have climate change deniers in his government? You come
:41:16. > :41:23.to the House of Commons and praise the Prime Minister for his
:41:24. > :41:28.commitment to climate change! I like the new style. This is refreshing.
:41:29. > :41:34.This government has a solid track record of cutting carbon, investing
:41:35. > :41:38.in nuclear, having the biggest renewable energy programme in this
:41:39. > :41:49.country, and for the first time in a long time we are on track to meet
:41:50. > :41:54.our renewable targets. The whole country will have heard that he
:41:55. > :42:00.cannot answer the question about whether you need to believe in
:42:01. > :42:07.man-made climate change to be part of his government. He has gone from
:42:08. > :42:12.thinking it is a basic part of his policy to a matter of individual
:42:13. > :42:21.conscience. He would say it was his passion above all else. Order! The
:42:22. > :42:26.questions and the answers will be heard however long it takes. Those
:42:27. > :42:35.who are exercising their vocal chords should calm down. There was a
:42:36. > :42:39.long way to go. If we are going to protect the people against the
:42:40. > :42:46.dangers they face, we cannot have doubt and confusion in his
:42:47. > :42:52.government. They need to rediscover their past convictions and get real
:42:53. > :42:58.on climate change! You can measure the courage of convictions by the
:42:59. > :43:01.act in government. There is the investment in renewables, there is
:43:02. > :43:05.the investment in nuclear. He talks a good game but did not achieve
:43:06. > :43:19.anything when he was in office. Mr Speaker, the most serious form of
:43:20. > :43:24.denial, is the denial of renewables. What is the plan for long-term
:43:25. > :43:30.investment? That is the requirement for climate change. Nuclear power.
:43:31. > :43:34.Long-term investment like fixing our economy. That is what this
:43:35. > :43:42.government is doing. All he does is get up and deliver a lot of hot air.
:43:43. > :43:48.Can I ask my right honourable friend 's if he can return to public
:43:49. > :43:56.concern at work? Can he get advice on the whistle-blowing report, and
:43:57. > :44:00.see whether he can bring people together in government and look at
:44:01. > :44:12.their recommendations and stop people being persecuted before the
:44:13. > :44:16.Baby P case? The public interest the closure act 1988 protects most
:44:17. > :44:23.workers from being unfairly dismissed when they report a matter
:44:24. > :44:27.of concern. We have strengthened this in 2013 and we will always
:44:28. > :44:31.backed whistle-blowers when reporting poor standards in large
:44:32. > :44:35.organisations. We are happy to make sure that he discusses with the
:44:36. > :44:42.relevant ministers any further step we need to take in this direction.
:44:43. > :44:48.Does the Prime Minister understand the depth of the hurt among Vic
:44:49. > :44:51.Tims' families and the deep sense of public outrage across the country as
:44:52. > :44:59.a result of the outcome of the John Downey case? He needs to understand
:45:00. > :45:09.that for a official letter to trump shoe protest process is deeply
:45:10. > :45:14.offensive to the public in this country. Willy now scrap these get
:45:15. > :45:17.out of jail free letters immediately, and will he do
:45:18. > :45:22.everything in his power to reverse the despicable decision in the John
:45:23. > :45:35.Downey case so that justice can be done for the family of the breed? --
:45:36. > :45:41.First of all, I understand the deep feelings of the families feel and
:45:42. > :45:47.the fact that the person responsible is not going to be tried. Our first
:45:48. > :45:51.thought should be with those 11 soldiers and their families and
:45:52. > :45:56.friends. It may have happened 32 years ago, but anyone who has lost
:45:57. > :46:02.someone in a situation like that will mourn them today as they did
:46:03. > :46:08.all those years ago. It was a dreadful mistake and a mistake we
:46:09. > :46:12.need to have a review of to make sure this cannot happen again.
:46:13. > :46:15.Whatever happens, we have to stick to the principle that we are a
:46:16. > :46:24.country and a Government under the rule of law. My right honourable
:46:25. > :46:28.friend has taken swift action to help communities and I welcome the
:46:29. > :46:36.?10 million flood relief fund for farmers. But some are at risk from
:46:37. > :46:42.Environment Agency scaremongering to reduce land drainage and reduce
:46:43. > :46:48.pumping stations. Can my right honourable friend ensure it the
:46:49. > :46:54.growers in my constituency that the necessary protections will be given
:46:55. > :46:58.to their land and in order to react properly, this Government is
:46:59. > :47:03.planning for the long-term security of this industry. I am glad she is
:47:04. > :47:08.advertising to have farm is the availability of the ?10 million fund
:47:09. > :47:12.that will be available to those who have lost the use of productive
:47:13. > :47:18.land. The point about farmers and landowners being nervous about
:47:19. > :47:23.dredging their land because of rules is a good one. The pendulum swung
:47:24. > :47:27.too far against dredging and that will change. It is not the whole
:47:28. > :47:32.answer to the problems she discusses, but it has a proper part
:47:33. > :47:40.in properly managing the landscape. Mr Speaker, the tragic death on a
:47:41. > :47:44.Birmingham Street of Sarah Childs devastated her family and shocked
:47:45. > :47:50.the community, a much loved sister and daughter. She was killed and her
:47:51. > :47:55.sister Claire, who was pregnant, was severely injured by a speeding
:47:56. > :48:00.driver doing 64 miles an hour who got four years in prison. Does the
:48:01. > :48:06.Prime Minister agreed the time has come to look again at the sentencing
:48:07. > :48:12.of those who kill with a car? First of all, my heart goes out to his
:48:13. > :48:16.constituents and the family of the constituent who was tragically
:48:17. > :48:21.killed. I think it is right to look again at motoring offences and the
:48:22. > :48:25.penalties that are given. I have discussed with the Secretary of
:48:26. > :48:31.State and I am sure he will be listening carefully to what the
:48:32. > :48:43.honourable gentleman has said. The response of NHS Wales to Sir Bruce
:48:44. > :48:48.Keogh's e-mail about a video response. Is the Prime Minister is
:48:49. > :48:53.astounded as I am that NHS Wales thinks the cheap medical director of
:48:54. > :48:57.England and the Royal College of surgeons' views are not legitimate?
:48:58. > :49:03.Will he worked with the leader of the opposition to try to get his
:49:04. > :49:08.party in Wales to reverse this decision? It could save lives. The
:49:09. > :49:13.honourable lady makes a very important point. Sir Bruce Keogh's
:49:14. > :49:19.views should be respected and listened to by the NHS in Wales. The
:49:20. > :49:23.Royal College of surgeons are saying there are people on NHS waiting
:49:24. > :49:28.lists who are dying in Wales because the waiting lists are too long
:49:29. > :49:32.because the NHS is not being properly managed and funded and
:49:33. > :49:41.reformed in Wales. That is a matter for the Welsh assembly Government.
:49:42. > :49:48.Will the Prime Minister accept the overwhelming humanitarian case for
:49:49. > :49:52.guaranteeing long-term support to victims and survivors of terrorism?
:49:53. > :50:00.If so, will he agreed to meet with me, Colin Parry and survivors of the
:50:01. > :50:08.7/7 London bombings who have benefited from the services of
:50:09. > :50:14.survivors for peace programme which is now faced with imminent closure?
:50:15. > :50:52.In doing so, will he remember his pledge that survivors of I am very
:50:53. > :51:00.It is a unique charity and it does an extraordinary job. We want to
:51:01. > :51:02.make sure that all these institutions can continue their
:51:03. > :51:08.excellent work and I am happy to hold this discussion with her. We
:51:09. > :51:14.all want to see a more balanced economy. Does the Prime Minister
:51:15. > :51:19.agree that today's stonking upward rise in business investment, over
:51:20. > :51:26.9%, shows that British entrepreneurs are rising to this challenge? My
:51:27. > :51:31.honourable friend makes an important point. Right across this house, and
:51:32. > :51:37.many experts have been saying what we need is a balanced recovery, one
:51:38. > :51:41.that sees increases in exports as well as consumption, one that sees
:51:42. > :51:46.increases in investment from business and the upgrading of the
:51:47. > :51:50.GDP figures showing an increase in exports and a very large increase in
:51:51. > :51:58.business investment is hugely welcome for our country. Given
:51:59. > :52:02.yesterday's court revelations of a secret scheme, does the Prime
:52:03. > :52:09.Minister believed that as well as the parties in Northern Ireland
:52:10. > :52:14.progressing the elements following the hardest talks that there is a
:52:15. > :52:20.need for transparency regarding the confused and shabby ways that the
:52:21. > :52:27.past was dealt with, and remembering that Downing Street was involved in
:52:28. > :52:32.this matter. The talks made good progress and they were trying to
:52:33. > :52:34.deal with difficult issues in Northern Ireland in terms of flags
:52:35. > :52:43.and parades and the most difficult issue of all, the past. She wanted
:52:44. > :52:47.to point the finger apparently at Downing Street. I would argue that
:52:48. > :52:51.when it comes to dealing with things like the bloody Sunday inquiry, that
:52:52. > :52:56.Downing Street is very happy to play its role in helping to bring parties
:52:57. > :53:01.together and make sure that we continue with peace in Northern
:53:02. > :53:05.Ireland. Given what the Prime Minister has called the leader of
:53:06. > :53:08.the opposition's new approach and Chancellor Angela Merkel's visit
:53:09. > :53:12.tomorrow, does he think there is something we can learn from her
:53:13. > :53:19.about an even broader base approach to coalition that would unite the
:53:20. > :53:23.whole country? In circumstances he would have to give red meat to them
:53:24. > :53:33.and read meat to us, it would mean we could leave the Liberal Democrats
:53:34. > :53:38.where they belong. My admiration for Angela Merkel is enormous. There are
:53:39. > :53:44.many things she has achieved that I would like to copy, not getting
:53:45. > :53:49.re-elected. But the one thing I do not want to copy is I think the idea
:53:50. > :53:56.of a grand coalition is a bit too much for me. What steps will the
:53:57. > :54:11.Prime Minister and Government take to insist the National Crime Agency
:54:12. > :54:15.assist the people trafficking police? The National Crime Agency do
:54:16. > :54:21.not have free rein in Northern Ireland. The honourable gentleman
:54:22. > :54:26.makes an important point. I have been impressed by the work the
:54:27. > :54:31.National Crime Agency is doing. It has got real strength and numbers in
:54:32. > :54:35.terms of being able to tackle organised crime. It is bad for
:54:36. > :54:40.Northern Ireland that it is not able to properly operate there. I hope
:54:41. > :54:44.that over time it will be possible to make progress and it would be
:54:45. > :54:50.good for Northern Ireland and good for our fight against organised
:54:51. > :54:56.crime. May I take this opportunity to congratulate you on your new role
:54:57. > :55:06.as Chancellor of Bedford University? In the last three
:55:07. > :55:11.years... In the last three years, 99 brave soldiers have given their life
:55:12. > :55:18.for this country in Afghanistan. In the same period of time 264 British
:55:19. > :55:22.women have been murdered at the hands of men and over three quarters
:55:23. > :55:27.of those women were stalked before they were murdered. Will the Prime
:55:28. > :55:30.Minister give a guaranteed that this Government will introduce
:55:31. > :55:34.legislation to protect women from that fate in the future,
:55:35. > :55:39.particularly given the ease that stock was have to begin their
:55:40. > :55:45.stopping activity by social media and the Internet? I am grateful for
:55:46. > :55:48.what might honourable friend says. Stocking is an appalling crime and
:55:49. > :55:53.it can destroy lives and we have to crack down on it. We have introduced
:55:54. > :55:59.a new offence to make absolutely clear the view we take of it. The
:56:00. > :56:02.new laws are equally applicable to online cyber stalking and
:56:03. > :56:09.harassment. And the CPS has published guidelines regarding
:56:10. > :56:13.information sent by social media. I am happy to write to her with the
:56:14. > :56:18.detail of all the things we are doing and to see if there are
:56:19. > :56:22.further steps we can take. When the Prime Minister was asked about the
:56:23. > :56:27.bedroom tax last March he said, what we have done is to exempt disabled
:56:28. > :56:31.people who need an extra room. Now that we know that people with
:56:32. > :56:35.terminal illness who cannot share a room, those who have to store
:56:36. > :56:38.equipment, such as dialysis machines, and families with severely
:56:39. > :56:44.disabled children who need occasional respite are all subject
:56:45. > :56:48.to this pernicious tax, would he like to revise that answer and to
:56:49. > :56:55.apologise to the disabled people to whom he gave false hope? This is a
:56:56. > :56:58.basic issue of fairness, that people who are renting in the private
:56:59. > :57:04.sector do not get additional money for rooms they do not use, so it is
:57:05. > :57:09.not fair to have a different set of rules in the social sector. But we
:57:10. > :57:17.have a large discretionary payment system in order to help families
:57:18. > :57:21.like the ones she mentions. Does the Prime Minister agree with me that
:57:22. > :57:27.the increase in jobs, or stopping increase in jobs, in the private
:57:28. > :57:33.sector is leading the UK's economic recovery and helped by the range of
:57:34. > :57:35.engineers, manufacturers and retailers who are employing people
:57:36. > :57:43.and sending their exports around the world? My honourable friend is
:57:44. > :57:48.absolutely right. We have now got 1.6 million new private sector jobs
:57:49. > :57:54.and there are 1.34 million people employed in our country. We have
:57:55. > :58:00.seen a growth in employment in every region in the country. Some are
:58:01. > :58:03.growing faster than others. But one of the indicators of economic
:58:04. > :58:09.success is weak in, week out, the leader of the Labour Party comes to
:58:10. > :58:13.the House of Commons and cannot talk about the economy or jobs and
:58:14. > :58:20.investment and growth, because all the things he said would never
:58:21. > :58:27.happen are happening in our economy. Could the Prime Minister focus on
:58:28. > :58:32.the fact that the company doing the work capability test was to give up
:58:33. > :58:36.and could it not be changed back to the medical evidence of the
:58:37. > :58:48.consultants of those who are applying? It costs money for
:58:49. > :58:53.appeals. The contract was awarded by the last Labour Government. Of
:58:54. > :58:58.course we are now discussing and debating with the company had this
:58:59. > :59:03.should be taken forward. But we need in this country a way of determining
:59:04. > :59:08.whether people are fit for work or not. When it comes to the issue of
:59:09. > :59:13.sanctions in our benefit system, it is right people who are offered a
:59:14. > :59:19.job and do not take a job face a sanction. That will be the toys at
:59:20. > :59:23.the next election. One party in favour of hard working people and
:59:24. > :59:29.another party obsessed by bigger and bigger benefits. Britain's Armed
:59:30. > :59:36.Forces are the best and as we are witnessing taking essential action
:59:37. > :59:41.in flooded areas. Prime Minister, please recognised the folly of
:59:42. > :59:46.reducing the size of the Armed Forces and stop sucking full-time
:59:47. > :59:49.service men and women. This gives me the opportunity of praising the
:59:50. > :59:55.extraordinary role that armed services personnel have played
:59:56. > :00:00.during the floods in our country over the last week. What we have
:00:01. > :00:06.done is removed the ?38 billion black hole that we were left. That
:00:07. > :00:13.meant taking difficult decisions over the size of the Army, navy and
:00:14. > :00:16.air force. We now have a top-flight defence budget in terms of spending
:00:17. > :00:21.anywhere in the world and we are coming to the end of all the
:00:22. > :00:25.redundancy schemes so we can point loudly to the extraordinary
:00:26. > :00:30.investment we can be making a new aircraft carriers, in hunter killer
:00:31. > :00:37.submarines, in aircraft, in the best equipment that any Armed Forces
:00:38. > :00:44.could have anywhere in the world. I met a man called really, who is 24
:00:45. > :00:49.years old. He lost his job a year ago and had to resort to going
:00:50. > :00:59.through supermarket skips to find out of date food so he could eat. --
:01:00. > :01:04.belief. -- belief. Why will the government not offer him a job? What
:01:05. > :01:12.we are doing for Billy and thousands like him is offering jobs and hope.
:01:13. > :01:17.Honourable members opposite come here week after week to try and say
:01:18. > :01:20.that this country is poorer or worse off under this government. Let me
:01:21. > :01:26.remind hope what it was like in 2009. There were a million more
:01:27. > :01:33.people in poverty, 500,000 more children in poverty, 150,000 more
:01:34. > :01:39.unemployed people, and 750,000 more people claiming benefits. Yes, there
:01:40. > :01:54.is more to do but we have a proud record of giving people jobs and
:01:55. > :02:02.hope. Just over a week ago, I joined school pupils and asked them what
:02:03. > :02:06.they would like to ask the Prime Minister, and one of them wanted to
:02:07. > :02:14.know why the government keeps on making so many new laws. Could the
:02:15. > :02:21.Prime Minister tell my young constituent what he is doing to
:02:22. > :02:24.reduce the burden of legislation? I think he has a promising future in
:02:25. > :02:30.this place, that is the attitude we need. This is going to be the first
:02:31. > :02:35.government since the war that leaves office, at the end of its term, with
:02:36. > :02:39.fewer regulations in place than at the beginning. That is because of
:02:40. > :02:46.the excellent work by the business department who has done a brilliant
:02:47. > :02:54.job of taking legislation of business. There has not been an oral
:02:55. > :02:58.statement to the House about the future of Stafford Hospital, given
:02:59. > :03:01.that it is expected that the University Hospital of North
:03:02. > :03:10.Staffordshire will take on the running of the site. Will he accept
:03:11. > :03:16.that there was a funding gap of ?39 million capital costs, ?4 million
:03:17. > :03:20.revenue cost, and make sure that there will be the opportunity to
:03:21. > :03:24.question the government and that these changes will not go through at
:03:25. > :03:28.the expense of the health of the people of North Staffordshire? A
:03:29. > :03:33.statement is being made today about the future of the hospital. It has
:03:34. > :03:38.been a difficult issue to deal with, the appalling situation that we were
:03:39. > :03:41.left with. I am sure there will be opportunities to debate within the
:03:42. > :03:47.House, but I think she will see that there are good steps being made, and
:03:48. > :03:54.hard work will be put into make sure it is possible to continue with
:03:55. > :03:57.consultant led maternity services so people can have their babies
:03:58. > :04:02.delivered in Stafford Hospital. That is what I want to see and the Health
:04:03. > :04:09.Secretary will set out the proposals later. There will be opportunities
:04:10. > :04:15.to debate this and the failures of Stapp -- Stafford Hospital. Millions
:04:16. > :04:19.of Londoners were inconvenienced earlier this month by the
:04:20. > :04:23.underground strike which was only supported by 30% of the union
:04:24. > :04:29.members. Will my right honourable friend agreed to conduct a review to
:04:30. > :04:35.increase the threshold so pointless strikes are outlawed? My honourable
:04:36. > :04:40.friend makes a good point. When you see how many people rely on these
:04:41. > :04:45.essential services, the time has come to look at what changes we can
:04:46. > :04:57.make. One of the problems we have seen is that despite requests, the
:04:58. > :05:03.party opposite have not condemned the strike. We were told, Mr
:05:04. > :05:10.Speaker, that they were heading for divorce, but I think they are going
:05:11. > :05:15.to renew their vows! That brings us to the end of Prime Minister's
:05:16. > :05:22.Questions. While it was taking place, we have learned that the
:05:23. > :05:29.president of the Russian Federation has put his forces on alert. He did
:05:30. > :05:34.this act 2pm Russian time. That is according to the Russian defence
:05:35. > :05:42.minister. We understand that Vladimir Putin has ensured the
:05:43. > :05:48.combat readiness of his forces in Russia. This is different to the
:05:49. > :05:57.full-scale mobilisation that it could lead to that. -- but it could
:05:58. > :06:04.lead to that. This is obviously due to events in Ukraine. Nick, I want
:06:05. > :06:14.to come back to why this was not raised in PMQs, but what do you know
:06:15. > :06:21.is happening in Russia? This announcement was made by the defence
:06:22. > :06:25.Minister. According to Reuters, it is not the first time this has
:06:26. > :06:30.happened. There have been a number of these. When you hear it
:06:31. > :06:31.initially, people think, my goodness, but it could be sabre
:06:32. > :06:51.rattling. The Government's National Security
:06:52. > :06:55.Council met and was discussing the issue of Ukraine. On the one hand
:06:56. > :06:59.you have got the European countries worry about funding for example and
:07:00. > :07:07.have to try and get the democratic process back on step, led largely by
:07:08. > :07:12.the Germans. On the other hand, I am told, the Government ministers were
:07:13. > :07:16.at that stage discussing Russia's options. One option they discussed
:07:17. > :07:24.was the possibility Russia would send in troops to protect Russian
:07:25. > :07:32.speakers. There are a large number of Russian speakers in the Crimea.
:07:33. > :07:38.He also has a port there. Also they could pull the plug on the financing
:07:39. > :07:51.of the Ukraine. They have frozen the 15 billion. Does it not strike you
:07:52. > :07:57.that it is a parochial nature that Ukraine was not raised once during
:07:58. > :08:03.Prime Minister's Questions? I appreciate that this news broke
:08:04. > :08:09.while it was going on, but we are taking a major forum policy
:08:10. > :08:15.position, and we are being asked to step up to the plate and provide a
:08:16. > :08:20.lot of money. -- foreign policy. Why would not a single MP raise this as
:08:21. > :08:27.an issue in Parliament? It goes back to the discussion we were having
:08:28. > :08:30.about the nature of PMQs. It is increasingly backbenchers playing a
:08:31. > :08:36.party game so that everybody things they are on the side of their party
:08:37. > :08:41.leader to try and get over that day's partisan points. People stop
:08:42. > :08:45.thinking for themselves. There was, to be fair, a big statement by the
:08:46. > :08:59.Foreign Secretary on Ukraine. This is PMQs, live on network
:09:00. > :09:04.television. That is right. Surely on that, the first thing to say is that
:09:05. > :09:08.we had a long statement on Monday in front of a full House. You are
:09:09. > :09:14.talking about serious issues. The Leader of the Opposition, the man
:09:15. > :09:19.who wants to be Prime Minister, surely the question to be asked is
:09:20. > :09:24.why was he having a bizarre conversation about climate change
:09:25. > :09:30.when, actually, there are bigger issues to discuss? There was a major
:09:31. > :09:37.international issue that confronts Europe and it is an issue that
:09:38. > :09:41.involves our foreign policy, the European foreign policy, and because
:09:42. > :09:46.we contribute to the IMF and the EU, which is money is being asked for
:09:47. > :09:55.through these institutions. That is right. Just because it was not
:09:56. > :10:01.raised at PMQs, I do not think people do not understand the gravity
:10:02. > :10:06.of the situation. Flooding should dominate PMQs as well. We can say
:10:07. > :10:15.for sure that flooding has been pretty well covered. This is not an
:10:16. > :10:19.either or argument. No, I do not want to do that. I am sure they will
:10:20. > :10:27.come back to it in another statement. I do think that the UK
:10:28. > :10:35.Parliament has looked at the issue and will continue to do so. I think
:10:36. > :10:44.we need to be careful. Do we have a view? Do the MPs have of view? Do we
:10:45. > :10:48.have a view under what conditions we should lend Ukraine money and what
:10:49. > :11:03.assets we should demand as security? They are talking about 30
:11:04. > :11:10.billion or so. I would not read into the fact that it did not come up
:11:11. > :11:17.today. There was some discussion around George Osborne's
:11:18. > :11:24.discussions. The economic interest of Ukraine, we must intervene in
:11:25. > :11:28.that to protect the interests of the country and look at the geopolitical
:11:29. > :11:33.balance that is now emerging as one of the big issues. Events are moving
:11:34. > :11:39.so we have to be temperate in how we deal with matters. You agree with
:11:40. > :11:46.the Prime Minister? Climate change is one of the most serious threats
:11:47. > :11:50.facing mankind. The truth is that what Ed Miliband was trying to do
:11:51. > :11:55.today was drive wedges between those who believe strongly in climate
:11:56. > :12:00.change and those who are unsure. I asked you if you are in agreement
:12:01. > :12:06.with the Prime Minister that climate change is one of the most serious
:12:07. > :12:12.threats? It is clearly an issue for us. Is it one of the most serious
:12:13. > :12:18.rates for mankind? Around the world, it is having a major impact on
:12:19. > :12:23.different societies, and therefore, investment on things like flood
:12:24. > :12:33.defences... But do you believe that man-made climate change is one of
:12:34. > :12:42.the most serious threats facing mankind? It is an issue. The price
:12:43. > :13:01.of bread is an issue! Why does he think that anybody cares outside the
:13:02. > :13:11.Westminster Circle? John Hayes. He uses these toxic phrases like,
:13:12. > :13:15.denier. What is a denier? Somebody that does not recognise that climate
:13:16. > :13:19.change is one of the most significant challenges we face as a
:13:20. > :13:31.country, and that governments have to take action now to protect us. If
:13:32. > :13:36.the government was to say that there is no question that the climate is
:13:37. > :13:45.changing and man is contributing to that change, would that be a denial?
:13:46. > :13:51.Somebody who denies that it is a global challenge... That is not what
:13:52. > :13:55.I said but would it be a denial but Mark if you are sceptical about
:13:56. > :14:10.man's involvement in this, is that a denial? Yes, that is a denial. If
:14:11. > :14:17.you say, I am in no doubt that the Prime Minister is warming -- on the
:14:18. > :14:21.planet is warming up, that I am not sure by how much it is warming up,
:14:22. > :14:29.and the predictions may be alarmist, is that a denial? Yes. The key point
:14:30. > :14:34.that Ed Miliband was making and one that is relevant is the fact that
:14:35. > :14:37.the environment will not take a briefing on climate change experts
:14:38. > :14:50.in his own department. He will not receive official briefing. We know
:14:51. > :14:57.already that there is no scientific do not think that the scientific
:14:58. > :15:03.Minister... Do not think he should take a meeting from his officials? I
:15:04. > :15:11.think it is relevant. Your final thought? One thing that is important
:15:12. > :15:16.is the court case that the Prime Minister was asked about to do with
:15:17. > :15:21.the bombing. The two representatives of the Democratic party said there
:15:22. > :15:25.should be no more of these. He did say he understood their anger and
:15:26. > :15:28.thought it was a mistake but when he was asked to say that they should
:15:29. > :15:37.not happen in the future, he clearly did not say it. He took a tougher
:15:38. > :15:42.line on strikes and implied there may be a change in the law on the
:15:43. > :15:47.number of people who vote in essential services. The cost of gas
:15:48. > :15:49.and electricity has been a big political issue ever since Ed
:15:50. > :15:54.Miliband said he would help consumers with their bills by
:15:55. > :16:00.capping prices. But it is also a problem for industry, particularly
:16:01. > :16:08.energy heavily intensive industry. Tom Crotty from INEOS, which owns
:16:09. > :16:19.Grangemouth, says the high prices are damaging the industrial sector.
:16:20. > :16:24.This is his soapbox. Welcome to Grangemouth, one of the biggest
:16:25. > :16:28.industrial sites in the UK. The plant uses more energy than
:16:29. > :16:39.Edinburgh, Glasgow and Aberdeen combined. This piece of kit, the
:16:40. > :16:44.cracker, is at the heart of the site and it produces basic raw
:16:45. > :16:48.materials. These chemicals are the basic building blocks of everyday
:16:49. > :17:00.products. But industry like this is threatened. The UK has some of the
:17:01. > :17:05.most expensive energy in the world, not helped by Government taxes. It
:17:06. > :17:09.is making Grangemouth uncompetitive. Heavy industry in the
:17:10. > :17:17.UK spends much more on energy costs and our counterparts in Europe.
:17:18. > :17:22.Paying more for our energy than our rivals is simply not sustainable
:17:23. > :17:27.long term. In Germany, industrial energy costs are capped. 20 years
:17:28. > :17:33.ago in the UK and Germany, manufacturing accounted for 23% of
:17:34. > :17:40.GDP. In Germany it is the same, but in the UK it has fallen to 11% and
:17:41. > :17:44.much of this is accounted for by our uncompetitive energy costs. There is
:17:45. > :17:50.one other possibility for lower energy prices in the UK and that is
:17:51. > :17:54.shale gas. It is cheaper than other energy sources and it is driving a
:17:55. > :18:00.manufacturing boom in the United States. There are over 1 million
:18:01. > :18:07.Shell gas wells and the USA will be self-sufficient in energy by 2020.
:18:08. > :18:12.The UK has got to embrace shale gas. We at INEOS will be the first
:18:13. > :18:20.company to import shale gas from the United States and this area will be
:18:21. > :18:25.filled with shale gas from the US. But it is not enough. We need to be
:18:26. > :18:30.able to produce shale gas and we have huge reserves of it. If we do
:18:31. > :18:38.not address the heavy costs for industry, we will not have industry.
:18:39. > :18:44.Tom Crotty is with us. Let me put your point to these politicians. You
:18:45. > :18:50.are always talking, both of you, all parties, we need to rebalance the
:18:51. > :18:56.economy and go back to manufacturing and look after heavy industry. What
:18:57. > :19:02.do you say? That was an interesting film, but in principle we need to be
:19:03. > :19:08.careful about shale gas. I would not rule it out. We need to look at the
:19:09. > :19:14.regulation of it. He is making the general point that because of
:19:15. > :19:19.policies both of your parties have pursued, including the Lib Dems,
:19:20. > :19:25.which have forced energy prices up ever since the 2008 climate change
:19:26. > :19:31.act, you are making life difficult for heavy industry that employs over
:19:32. > :19:37.800,000 people in this country. I could provide a list of the savings
:19:38. > :19:44.that could be given to Scottish and British business as a result of the
:19:45. > :19:50.energy freeze. Give as an example? I have not got that in my hand, I do
:19:51. > :19:59.not have that recall, but they would save as much energy as household
:20:00. > :20:06.would. He is just freezing it. If the costs increase, he will save
:20:07. > :20:10.something. What do you say? Wii I am a strong supporter of lower tax, and
:20:11. > :20:13.I want to see tax cuts for businesses. He will know the scale
:20:14. > :20:26.of the challenge we are dealing with. The solution to this is what
:20:27. > :20:31.he has described. I want us to move ahead with shale gas. It has
:20:32. > :20:37.transformed the situation in the United States. We have got huge
:20:38. > :20:40.reserves, it is inexpensive for industry and the public and it will
:20:41. > :20:45.take pressure of businesses and pensioners struggling with their gas
:20:46. > :20:52.bills. What do you say to them about the existing tax and the Green taxes
:20:53. > :20:59.and the extra costs, the closing down of cheap coal stations, what do
:21:00. > :21:04.you say to them? Where we are is as a result of a lack of industrial and
:21:05. > :21:11.energy policy over a long period of time. In Germany they had through
:21:12. > :21:17.the last 25-30 years that it would protect its heavy industry come what
:21:18. > :21:21.may. But at the cost of households. The cost of electricity is going
:21:22. > :21:27.through the roof, Germans say it is a luxury good. They know how
:21:28. > :21:33.important heavy industry is, but ordinary Germans are paying through
:21:34. > :21:38.the nose. During winter 300,000 of them get cut off. There are
:21:39. > :21:42.undoubtedly trade office. Germany has chosen to say what we need is an
:21:43. > :21:45.industry that supports our economy and through that we can support our
:21:46. > :21:52.people and those people can afford to live. Do you think Shell gas
:21:53. > :21:59.avoids that trade-off? Let's come to shale gas. It can give you a
:22:00. > :22:04.security of supply because it is under our own ground, but unlike
:22:05. > :22:09.America where the gas market is a separate, hermetically sealed market
:22:10. > :22:15.where they can set their own prices, we are part of a world
:22:16. > :22:22.market and our gas would be at world prices, it would not be cheaper. I
:22:23. > :22:27.agree entirely. This is not about suddenly we get cheap gas. This is
:22:28. > :22:32.about having abundant supplies. We cannot get the gas we need today.
:22:33. > :22:37.The North Sea does not have the right sort of gas we need to make
:22:38. > :22:43.chemicals. For the chemical industry this is transformational. The US
:22:44. > :22:47.industry is currently investing $71 billion in new plant and that is the
:22:48. > :22:53.sort of transformation it could bring about. You have got to have
:22:54. > :22:58.chemicals and steel and aluminium. Thank you for that. They are rolling
:22:59. > :23:01.out the red carpet for Angela Merkel tomorrow. She is going to address
:23:02. > :23:09.both Houses of Parliament and have tea with the Queen. That will
:23:10. > :23:12.probably be in German as well. Compare that to the pie and a pint
:23:13. > :23:16.given to the French president Francois Hollande last month. We
:23:17. > :23:20.have seen the difference. Chancellor Merkel is being treated as a VIP
:23:21. > :23:26.because David Cameron sees her as his best chance to renegotiate the
:23:27. > :23:29.European Union treaty. Mrs Merkel does want reform although in part
:23:30. > :23:35.she wants closer integration to protect the euro zone from any
:23:36. > :23:38.future financial crisis. It has been reported, however, that she is
:23:39. > :23:41.willing to give Mr Cameron some concessions. There could be limited
:23:42. > :23:44.opt outs on certain EU regulations like the Working Time Directive and
:23:45. > :23:48.the treaty could be revised to ensure those countries like Britain
:23:49. > :23:53.who do not have the euro are protected in the single market.
:23:54. > :23:56.Finally, EU regulations could be implemented in a less prescriptive
:23:57. > :24:03.and intrusive way, although that all may not be enough for some. Earlier
:24:04. > :24:06.this week Mrs Merkel's chief spokesman was quoted as saying, "The
:24:07. > :24:17.expectations in the press are clearly too high." And he meant the
:24:18. > :24:22.British press. With me now is John Jungclaussen from the German
:24:23. > :24:29.newspaper Die Zeit. That quote is right, isn't it? She may want to
:24:30. > :24:35.help Mr Cameron, but she can fulfil the Eurosceptic expectations? That
:24:36. > :24:41.is absolutely true. The problem one -- is one of timing and diplomacy.
:24:42. > :24:47.Remember when Gordon Brown arrived late for the signing of the Lisbon
:24:48. > :24:52.Treaty... Intentionally. Intentionally. Now the Brits cannot
:24:53. > :24:56.get out of the treaty quick enough. For someone in the club who wants to
:24:57. > :25:01.rewrite the rules, they may have support, but to do it within a time
:25:02. > :25:10.frame they have set that is unlike any time frame the EU would ever
:25:11. > :25:23.met... 1917, sorry 2017, 1917 was a while ago! 2017 is the problem. It
:25:24. > :25:28.cannot be done in that time. The last thing Mr Cameron wants is
:25:29. > :25:34.another referendum in the same year as an election. The other problem is
:25:35. > :25:41.her new Foreign Secretary, who, when he saw William Hague, made it very
:25:42. > :25:43.clear he was essentially a more committed European than Angela
:25:44. > :25:50.Merkel and less likely to pave the way for an agreement. Having a grand
:25:51. > :25:57.coalition with the social Democrats is a constraint on Mrs Merkel as
:25:58. > :26:01.well. Absolutely. But Angela Merkel has some challenges in the old
:26:02. > :26:05.Franco German alliance which was at the core of Europe since the Treaty
:26:06. > :26:11.of Rome is fraying at the edges. There is a big question over whether
:26:12. > :26:17.the French economy stays with Northern Europe or drifts of and
:26:18. > :26:23.becomes a Club Med economy leaving Mrs Merkel with Northern Europe. She
:26:24. > :26:30.would like Britain to be there. Absolutely. Increasing
:26:31. > :26:35.competitiveness, essentially German and Britain followed the same model
:26:36. > :26:40.and Britain is recognised as an important partner. But if you
:26:41. > :26:45.approach the table and sit down in a grumpy mood and say, we have to
:26:46. > :26:51.change now and very quickly, then that is not seen as being very
:26:52. > :26:58.helpful. We are being told the First Minister of Northern Ireland, Peter
:26:59. > :27:04.Robinson, will resign because of the judicial review case over the IRA
:27:05. > :27:09.bomber. Francois Hollande does not want to give you anything and Mrs
:27:10. > :27:14.Merkel will not be able to give you as much as she would like because
:27:15. > :27:20.she is in coalition with the German Labour Party. This is the start of a
:27:21. > :27:24.process. The reality is the European Union is changing. As a result of
:27:25. > :27:28.the Europe presses, the European states are going to have to take
:27:29. > :27:32.significant steps toward integration in order to deal with the crisis.
:27:33. > :27:41.Britain is not part of that and we are not part of that process, but we
:27:42. > :27:46.are in the EU. But it cannot all be done by 2017. If we are in power
:27:47. > :27:51.there will be a referendum in 2017 and if we have not got to a position
:27:52. > :27:56.where there is a new relationship, the British public will have the
:27:57. > :28:00.freedom to vote to leave. The choice will be for our European partners
:28:01. > :28:04.who they want to accept the nature of the changes that are taking place
:28:05. > :28:10.and find a way for Britain to coexist with a euro zone area that
:28:11. > :28:14.is becoming more integrated? Or do they want to leave it to our
:28:15. > :28:20.electorate to decide? I am confident we have to win the election first
:28:21. > :28:24.and we then can make good progress. We have made progress because we
:28:25. > :28:32.have run out of time. I had so much to say. Time to put you out of your
:28:33. > :28:37.misery for Guess The Year. It was 1983, the year of the election.
:28:38. > :28:52.Margaret, you get to press the button. The winner: Thank you for
:28:53. > :28:59.joining us. Thank you to our guests. The one o'clock News is on BBC One
:29:00. > :29:01.and we will be back tomorrow night and tomorrow also with the Daily
:29:02. > :29:05.Politics. Goodbye.