:00:39. > :00:40.Hello and welcome to the Daily Politics.
:00:41. > :00:43.NATO leaders continue their summit in Wales, with Iraq
:00:44. > :00:49.David Cameron says Britain is ready to commit 3,500 troops to
:00:50. > :00:56.David Cameron prepares the ground for British airstrikes
:00:57. > :00:59.against Islamic State fighters in Northern Iraq - but all the signs
:01:00. > :01:07.Nationalise the railways! Raise the minimum wage!
:01:08. > :01:10.No, not the cry of the unions - but the latest policy pledges from the
:01:11. > :01:14.Their leader joins us live at the start
:01:15. > :01:18.And Meet the Neighbours - in the first of a new series profiling
:01:19. > :01:21.the members of the European Union, Adam has been finding out what
:01:22. > :01:33.With us for the first half hour of today's programme is the LBC
:01:34. > :01:41.Let's start with the latest from Calais in northern France, where
:01:42. > :01:43.there's an increased police presence after scores of migrants tried to
:01:44. > :01:51.The local mayor says over 1,000 migrants are camped in the town and
:01:52. > :01:56.And she's threatened to call on local residents to blockade the port
:01:57. > :02:08.Is it the British government's response ability to stop these
:02:09. > :02:12.migrants crossing the Channel? Partly. I speak to people night
:02:13. > :02:16.after night on my late night show and immigration and asylum seekers
:02:17. > :02:21.is always a hot issue, as you would expect. It is easy to say this is
:02:22. > :02:25.France's problem, Calle' problem, get on with it but in this country,
:02:26. > :02:34.there's a real about people coming in, in some cases illegally. What do
:02:35. > :02:37.you do about it? You have had the authorities in Calais asking for
:02:38. > :02:41.more cash to help them. I think that's right. It poses a massive
:02:42. > :02:45.problem for David Cameron because as we go into 2015, and immigration is
:02:46. > :02:51.a political issue, certainly with the Ukip threat, if he cannot be
:02:52. > :02:55.seen to be sorting out Calais, 30-40 miles across the water, where is the
:02:56. > :02:59.credibility in saying he can be tough on immigration, illegal or
:03:00. > :03:03.otherwise? Those are striking pictures, watching people trying to
:03:04. > :03:09.get onto lorries, here, trying to climb over extremely high wire
:03:10. > :03:13.fences. But the mayor of Calais is calling for a blockade. Is that an
:03:14. > :03:17.overreaction? You have to spend some time there. I have been watching
:03:18. > :03:22.reports and listening to people. You had a near riot in the week, where
:03:23. > :03:25.the guys on the ferry had to people. You had a near riot in the week,
:03:26. > :03:31.where the guys on the ferry had staff. It is political pressure. --
:03:32. > :03:36.they had to turn the fire hoses on to stop people getting on board.
:03:37. > :03:41.People that ring into my show ask why people want to come to Britain,
:03:42. > :03:45.and why they -- ask why they don't stay in France. There have been
:03:46. > :03:49.stories of asylum offer is being given to people but they say they
:03:50. > :03:53.want to come for Britain. They could have many reasons for that. English
:03:54. > :03:59.is a language well spoken. And jobs, not benefits necessarily. They
:04:00. > :04:03.have family as well. You can understand it but you get into this
:04:04. > :04:06.whole area, how do you tell the difference between a genuine asylum
:04:07. > :04:07.seeker and someone who quite understandably just wants to go to a
:04:08. > :04:11.country to better their lives? The question for today is -
:04:12. > :04:16.in a speech last night, which city did Boris Johnson say was
:04:17. > :04:18.the best in the world? Was it a) Paris in the 19th century,
:04:19. > :04:22.b) Athens in the 5th century BC c) New York in the 20th century
:04:23. > :04:27.or d) London in the 21st century? And in half an hour's time Duncan
:04:28. > :04:29.will - we hope - We are
:04:30. > :04:41."surrounded by an arc of crisis" according to the Secretary-General
:04:42. > :04:46.of NATO, Anders Fogh Rasmussen. But has the NATO conference in Wales
:04:47. > :04:49.been a talking shop? Or have member countries actually
:04:50. > :04:51.managed to agree any concrete action on the two big issues of the day,
:04:52. > :04:54.Ukraine and the threat from Let's hear what the Prime Minister,
:04:55. > :04:57.David Cameron, has had to stay at the conference
:04:58. > :05:05.this morning, on Ukraine. As Russia tramples illegally over
:05:06. > :05:10.Ukraine, we must reassure our Eastern European members that we
:05:11. > :05:14.will always uphold our Article five commitments to collective
:05:15. > :05:22.self-defence. We must be able to act more swiftly. In 2002, NATO stood
:05:23. > :05:27.down its high readiness force. I hope that today, we can agree a
:05:28. > :05:32.multinational spearhead force, which can be deployed anywhere in the
:05:33. > :05:36.world in just 2-5 days. This would be part of a reformed NATO response
:05:37. > :05:42.Force, with headquarters in Poland, forward units in the Eastern allies,
:05:43. > :05:44.and equipment and infrastructure positioned to allow more exercises
:05:45. > :05:45.and if necessary, rapid reinforcement.
:05:46. > :05:50.The Prime Minister there, announcing a UK commitment of 3,500 personnel
:05:51. > :05:52.The Prime Minister there, announcing a UK commitment of 1,000 personnel
:05:53. > :05:56.We'll discuss what that means in a moment.
:05:57. > :06:00.First, let's take a look at the other developments.
:06:01. > :06:05.More than 60 presidents and prime ministers have gathered for the
:06:06. > :06:09.final day of the NATO summit in Newport. Despite talk of an imminent
:06:10. > :06:12.cease-fire in Ukraine, an announcement of further sanctions
:06:13. > :06:16.against Russia is still expected. These include further travel bans,
:06:17. > :06:20.more financial restrictions on banks, and increased curbs on
:06:21. > :06:23.defence exports. Discussion of action against Islamic State
:06:24. > :06:28.extremists in Iraq and Syria has also dominated the conference. David
:06:29. > :06:33.Cameron has said military action is an option. He believes there are no
:06:34. > :06:38.legal barriers in the UK to air strikes. He added, "we have to use
:06:39. > :06:41.everything in our armoury to wipe out Islamists terrorists". This
:06:42. > :06:45.morning, NATO defence ministers have met to discuss initial -- additional
:06:46. > :06:49.help to train Iraqi and Kurdish forces.
:06:50. > :06:51.Let's get the latest from the NATO summit
:06:52. > :06:55.and speak to the BBC's assistant political editor, Norman Smith.
:06:56. > :07:02.We had from the Prime Minister, 3500 troops being committed to the rapid
:07:03. > :07:08.reaction force but it is now 1000. What was the confusion? The 3500
:07:09. > :07:12.troops will go towards exercises in Eastern Europe in the next two
:07:13. > :07:15.years. They are military training exercises. There will still be the
:07:16. > :07:21.formation of a rapid reaction force, 4000 strong, with 1000
:07:22. > :07:24.British troops, led by a British general but based in Eastern Europe
:07:25. > :07:28.with headquarters in Poland. The clear message is meant to be
:07:29. > :07:32.directed at President Putin, in other words, back off, NATO is
:07:33. > :07:37.getting serious about organising along your borders. That coincides
:07:38. > :07:41.with what is in effect a rebuff to President Putin's offer of a
:07:42. > :07:45.cease-fire. If you speak to senior figures here, it has been dismissed
:07:46. > :07:48.out of hand. They simply don't believe President Putin is serious.
:07:49. > :07:53.For that reason, they are going ahead with a new raft of sanctions,
:07:54. > :07:58.regardless of the cease-fire. What we are seeing is a definite
:07:59. > :08:02.hardening in attitude of Western leaders towards President Putin. The
:08:03. > :08:07.view is, unless the West stand up, President Putin will keep demanding
:08:08. > :08:10.more, and pushing further. David Cameron seems to be preparing the
:08:11. > :08:15.ground, if those conditions are met, for UK involvement in air
:08:16. > :08:22.strikes on ISIS targets in Iraq and possibly Syria. I think that is
:08:23. > :08:27.true. I do think we are at the point of action but I think we are now in
:08:28. > :08:33.a waiting game, waiting firstly to see whether a genuinely inclusive
:08:34. > :08:35.government is formed in Baghdad, and secondly, whether other neighbouring
:08:36. > :08:43.countries in the region get their acts together and actually start to
:08:44. > :08:46.put together forces and resources to confront Islamic State. Thirdly,
:08:47. > :08:50.crucially, we're waiting for President Obama. Everything is
:08:51. > :08:53.predicated on his decision to go for air strikes in Syria. But if you
:08:54. > :08:57.speak to the Prime Minister and Foreign Secretary, it is clear in my
:08:58. > :09:00.mind that they are up for air. Thank you for joining us.
:09:01. > :09:05.And we've been joined by former British
:09:06. > :09:08.ambassador to the US, Sir Christopher Meyer.
:09:09. > :09:09.Labour's shadow defence secretary, Vernon Coaker
:09:10. > :09:14.joins us from our studios in Westminster.
:09:15. > :09:19.David Cameron has said that he won't rule out UK participation in air
:09:20. > :09:24.strikes. Waiting for President Obama, what sign is there that he is
:09:25. > :09:28.actually going to call in Britain to make a contribution? We have not
:09:29. > :09:32.seen a public sign yet but I would be most surprised if President Obama
:09:33. > :09:36.decided he did not want British help in any air strikes or anything else
:09:37. > :09:39.we might do in the region, and not just British. It could be that Obama
:09:40. > :09:45.is looking for a coalition of the willing inside the NATO membership.
:09:46. > :09:50.All this will unravel over the next few days and weeks. The most
:09:51. > :09:53.important thing I heard said by David Cameron, and I am sure the
:09:54. > :09:59.president subscribes to this, is that we do actually have the outline
:10:00. > :10:03.of a strategy, a three pronged strategy. It has changed from
:10:04. > :10:07.President Obama's initial pronouncement that he did not really
:10:08. > :10:12.have a strategy? Taylor he has been given a lot of stick for that and I
:10:13. > :10:17.think very unfairly. He is right, as the Prime Minister is, to be careful
:10:18. > :10:21.about the next steps in Iraq. I think he will be able to come out of
:10:22. > :10:25.the NATO summit saying that they have something like a strategy. It
:10:26. > :10:29.is military, political, they are waiting for a new Baghdad government
:10:30. > :10:33.next week and it is diplomatic, in other words, trying to bring in the
:10:34. > :10:37.big regional powers. Like the Gulf States and Iran although that could
:10:38. > :10:44.be a problem. It could be but it is not impossible. Vernon Coaker, will
:10:45. > :10:50.Labour support UK air strikes on ISIS targets in Iraq? As it stands,
:10:51. > :10:53.we have had no request from the British government, and no
:10:54. > :10:57.discussions with the government about that. We have shown in the
:10:58. > :11:01.past that we supported it where we felt it was appropriate in Libya. We
:11:02. > :11:04.were not prepared to support it in Syria. If the government comes
:11:05. > :11:09.forward with proposals, we will consider them on the basis of the
:11:10. > :11:12.purpose of the air strikes, and what support there is in the region and
:11:13. > :11:16.some other things. But the government needs to be clear to us
:11:17. > :11:21.about what they are proposing to do and why. I think the discussion is
:11:22. > :11:25.being framed along those lines. I put you the scenario which would
:11:26. > :11:28.proceed air strikes. President Obama calls on the UK Government to join
:11:29. > :11:32.air strikes, on the basis that there is some kind of government in
:11:33. > :11:39.Baghdad, and there are players involved. Will Labour, at that
:11:40. > :11:43.point, get behind it? As I say, we need to consider the proposals. If
:11:44. > :11:48.those were the proposals, would you be happy to be there? You cannot say
:11:49. > :11:52.that without knowing the actual proposals. What does it mean to say
:11:53. > :11:58.there is a regional alliance? We need to be clear about the purpose
:11:59. > :12:01.of the air strikes. What are you... Frightened is not the right word but
:12:02. > :12:05.what are you worried about when you say you need to know the nature of
:12:06. > :12:08.it? Those are the conditions as I understand them. They may change but
:12:09. > :12:13.if those conditions were still put to you, what would worry you about
:12:14. > :12:17.it? You would want to know exactly, in clear terms, the purpose of the
:12:18. > :12:22.air strikes and their outcome. You would want to know who among the
:12:23. > :12:27.regional countries were supporting what you are doing. In other words,
:12:28. > :12:32.you have to have some clarity about this. It is not an objection one way
:12:33. > :12:35.or the other. It is not to say we are in favour or against what we
:12:36. > :12:39.need clarity from the government about what they are proposing and
:12:40. > :12:43.then we could look at the proposals, discuss them and decide on that
:12:44. > :12:47.basis whether we would support them or not. That is Iraq and I cannot
:12:48. > :12:52.get you to commit one way or the other, maybe Ferran. What about air
:12:53. > :12:55.strikes in Syria? Many voices say you would have 2 attack ISIS in
:12:56. > :13:00.Syria as well to make it effective if you are going to defeat the
:13:01. > :13:04.enemy. -- have 2 attack. Would air strikes without President Assad's
:13:05. > :13:12.permission be illegal? Again, you would need to know the legal base.
:13:13. > :13:15.It is difficult. You would need to know, and any action against ISIS
:13:16. > :13:21.need a legal basis. That is what we said about Iraq. A legal basis is
:13:22. > :13:25.absolutely vital to proceed. Taking up that point, it is true, bearing
:13:26. > :13:30.in mind the kind of problems we have had in the past over things like the
:13:31. > :13:34.invasion of Iraq and the legality of war, as Vernon Coaker got a point
:13:35. > :13:39.about making sure it was legally tight before air strikes in Syria
:13:40. > :13:43.took place? I am not a lawyer and I don't know but I do know that it
:13:44. > :13:49.makes no sense to confine attacks on ISIS within Iraq alone. What they
:13:50. > :13:53.have introduced into the equation is something quite new, a terrorist
:13:54. > :13:58.organisation which elides frontiers, namely that between Syria and Iraq.
:13:59. > :14:02.If you are going to do something against them which is going to be
:14:03. > :14:06.militarily, politically and diplomatically effective, you have
:14:07. > :14:10.to take them as a whole, not in an Iraqi chunk and then a Syrian chunk
:14:11. > :14:14.to be left hanging around. I don't know the legal imprecations, but the
:14:15. > :14:19.other reasons are very compelling, for going into Syria. --
:14:20. > :14:24.implications. Just for one moment, putting legal issues aside, because
:14:25. > :14:28.we will discuss them separately, but do you agree that any strategy of
:14:29. > :14:33.air strikes has to be one that includes both Iraqi targets and
:14:34. > :14:37.Syrian targets? All I would do is point to the evidence we have so
:14:38. > :14:39.far. We supported American air strikes in support of the
:14:40. > :14:45.humanitarian mission and what they were doing. Those air strikes in
:14:46. > :14:52.Iraq were successful in holding the advance of the ISIS forces. But not
:14:53. > :14:55.defeating them which is what the Prime Minister set and Ed Miliband
:14:56. > :15:02.says he supported mum that. Clearly in terms of Iraq, we have 40 of the
:15:03. > :15:05.advance -- vaulted the advance which has allowed the Kurds to regroup and
:15:06. > :15:09.now the Iraqi government has space to produce the type of inclusive
:15:10. > :15:14.government we want to see there. Do you regret in any way Labour's
:15:15. > :15:19.refusal to support earlier this year David Cameron's attempt to get some
:15:20. > :15:24.kind of mandate for air strikes against President Assad? No, I
:15:25. > :15:28.don't. What you have to do is look at the issues as they arise, the
:15:29. > :15:34.context in which you are asked to make decisions. That was the right
:15:35. > :15:37.decision about Syria. As I said, we are not a party that opposes
:15:38. > :15:42.intervention per se, as we showed with respect to the support we gave
:15:43. > :15:46.air strikes in Libya. But let's look at the context within which we are
:15:47. > :15:50.asked to make these decisions, see what the purpose and outcome is and
:15:51. > :15:55.when we get the request, we will look at it. What do you say about
:15:56. > :15:59.going ahead with air strikes without a Parliamentary mandate? It is
:16:00. > :16:02.dangerous. Going back to the conversation we had earlier, the
:16:03. > :16:07.countdown to next year's general election, political capital powered
:16:08. > :16:10.be lost. The one thing that has not been considered is the support of
:16:11. > :16:14.the British people. It is all well and good politicians debating this,
:16:15. > :16:18.and it is right and proper, but in a survey this week, 50% of people
:16:19. > :16:21.surveyed by the Independent newspaper were against air strikes
:16:22. > :16:25.and there was more opposition to boots on the ground. There's a real
:16:26. > :16:28.responsibility to bring the British people onside. I think it has
:16:29. > :16:36.changed in the last few days, particularly with the second video
:16:37. > :16:38.being released and a third, British captive. I think a poll now would
:16:39. > :16:43.show more support but the British people need to be behind this. Is
:16:44. > :16:49.that do with the Labour's reticence? Possibly.
:16:50. > :16:56.Do you think we will be bombing those targets in Iraqi in a few
:16:57. > :17:00.weeks? It is possible because it is possible to demonstrate that bombing
:17:01. > :17:04.in Iraq and in Syria is quite a different case from that made last
:17:05. > :17:07.year to intervene in the Syrian civil war. Those who support
:17:08. > :17:11.intervention now have to show that it is different to the situation
:17:12. > :17:16.last year, and I think that can be very easily done. Vernon Coaker,
:17:17. > :17:21.briefly, before we turn to Ukraine, have you and other shadow ministers
:17:22. > :17:25.been talking to Labour MPs about whether they support air strikes?
:17:26. > :17:30.Obviously not in a formal way that the Conservatives are doing, asking
:17:31. > :17:34.MPs if they support air strikes. What are you doing? You informally
:17:35. > :17:44.meet with members of your own party and there are discussions going on.
:17:45. > :17:47.And what is the reaction? Labour MPs go back to the point I was making,
:17:48. > :17:55.what is the context and the purpose and the outcome? Thank you. We have
:17:56. > :17:59.heard that 1000 UK troops will be committed to the rapid reaction
:18:00. > :18:03.force. Will that frighten President Putin? It will make him anxious.
:18:04. > :18:08.NATO has always been the bogeyman for the Soviet Union and now for the
:18:09. > :18:12.new state of Russia under Putin, and he needs to congratulate himself, I
:18:13. > :18:16.think, in having revived single-handedly a NATO alliance that
:18:17. > :18:21.was moribund and lacking in papers until he went into Crimea and then
:18:22. > :18:32.Ukraine. This is one of the unintended consequences of his
:18:33. > :18:35.invasion. The message to Putin, and whether it will worry him or not I
:18:36. > :18:38.don't know, but he needs to listen carefully, is that it is not about
:18:39. > :18:41.Ukraine. Ukraine is not likely to be a member of NATO in the near future.
:18:42. > :18:45.The Prime Minister referred specifically to Article five,
:18:46. > :18:49.obligations of the NATO treaty. That refers to current members of NATO
:18:50. > :18:54.and the message to Putin is don't you dare mess with the Baltic
:18:55. > :18:59.states, with Poland, the Czech Republic, Romania, in the way that
:19:00. > :19:04.you have done with Ukraine. Because if you do that, we invoke the
:19:05. > :19:10.article and we are on the edge of war, you see. And that is if you
:19:11. > :19:15.attack one NATO nation then you attack them all. Do you support
:19:16. > :19:18.tougher sanctions? We certainly support the toughening of sanctions
:19:19. > :19:21.with respect to Ukraine and as far as NATO is concerned, the
:19:22. > :19:27.announcement today about the spearhead to the Iraqi reaction
:19:28. > :19:33.force -- rapid reaction force, I think that is also good and
:19:34. > :19:37.reassuring. Will it work? I think it will. On it though it is not
:19:38. > :19:45.sufficient but alongside other policy proposals being made. -- on
:19:46. > :19:49.its own. If you look at NATO allies in Poland and the Baltic states,
:19:50. > :19:54.they are anxious to be reassured. It is ironic that is happening on a day
:19:55. > :19:58.when the Government is having trouble recruiting reserves. But
:19:59. > :20:02.this specific point about the spearhead is a good thing. You would
:20:03. > :20:06.support more defence spending, would you? I would certainly support
:20:07. > :20:09.ensuring that the defence capabilities that we have got are
:20:10. > :20:13.matched by the policies the Government pursue, and with respect
:20:14. > :20:20.to reserves they are failing on that. Would Labour commit more
:20:21. > :20:27.resources and money to the armed forces? We support the Government up
:20:28. > :20:28.until 2015 and after that it will be a question of the next spending
:20:29. > :20:35.review. Thank you very much. A rally demonstrating against
:20:36. > :20:37.the Government's health reforms is It's the culmination
:20:38. > :20:40.of a month-long march that began in Jarrow and followed the route of
:20:41. > :20:43.the original 1936 Jarrow Crusade. Named 999 Call For The NHS,
:20:44. > :20:46.the group is protesting against what they believe is the increasing
:20:47. > :20:49.privatisation of the health service. Adam Fleming joined them for part
:20:50. > :21:01.of the walk. I got up with the Jarrow marchers
:21:02. > :21:05.bright and early at a community centre in Luton where they had spent
:21:06. > :21:11.the night kipping on the floor. They were getting ready to March 11 miles
:21:12. > :21:17.to St Albans. Such a long way but such a small breakfast. It has been
:21:18. > :21:20.hard to deal with people's generosity on the march. People have
:21:21. > :21:25.been so kind, and we have been offered so much food and cake and
:21:26. > :21:28.hospitality. People have baked for the march and the NHS continually
:21:29. > :21:32.and it has been wonderful that people have put time and effort and
:21:33. > :21:37.care into it. We have been finding it hard to beat all the cake. A core
:21:38. > :21:47.group of 20 started off in Jarrow in mid-August and when they reach
:21:48. > :21:50.London on Saturday, they will have marched 280 miles. It is a mixture
:21:51. > :21:55.of trade unionists and lefties and those that say they including a
:21:56. > :21:57.nurse and psychiatrist. They have been joined by all sorts of people
:21:58. > :22:06.along the way. It was the brainchild
:22:07. > :22:08.of some campaigners from Darlington, You have to make sure everyone gets
:22:09. > :22:14.up on time and their luggage gets on the buses and that everyone is
:22:15. > :22:17.ready to go, fighting fit. The reason why they are is
:22:18. > :22:20.the amount of people that have just come out
:22:21. > :22:24.and joined us for the march, shared They are following the footsteps of
:22:25. > :22:29.the original Jarrow March of 1936. They were highlighting a lack
:22:30. > :22:33.of jobs in the North. What motivates the modern-day
:22:34. > :22:36.marchers is the health service, which they fear is being flogged
:22:37. > :22:41.off without the public noticing. That is denied by the Department of
:22:42. > :22:46.Health, who told us 6% of the NHS budget goes to the private sector,
:22:47. > :22:49.and that number has hardly changed But these people feel
:22:50. > :22:54.so passionate about the National Health Service, they really
:22:55. > :23:03.are prepared to go the distance. We've been joined by
:23:04. > :23:05.Dr Louise Irvine from the National Health Action Party which supports
:23:06. > :23:08.the march, and by Julia Manning from the 2020 health group which supports
:23:09. > :23:23.the Government's NHS reforms. Can I start with you? The NHS is
:23:24. > :23:26.still free at the point of use. Do you think the public cares who
:23:27. > :23:32.provides the health care as long as they are not paying for it directly?
:23:33. > :23:36.Well, for the public it is very important that health remain free at
:23:37. > :23:40.the point of use, but how it is organised and delivered is also
:23:41. > :23:46.important and I think if the public knew the amount of wasted that there
:23:47. > :23:49.is in the privatised system, and the risks of destabilising NHS care, but
:23:50. > :23:54.also the risks of poor quality care, they would care very much about who
:23:55. > :24:00.provide the care. What examples have you got poor quality care being
:24:01. > :24:04.provided by private providers? Well, Circle took over the provision
:24:05. > :24:11.of out of hours services in Cornwall, and have lost the contract
:24:12. > :24:16.because of the poor quality. They were putting in misleading reports
:24:17. > :24:18.and results. There have also been two cases recently of cataract
:24:19. > :24:26.operations which were being done by private providers. They have been
:24:27. > :24:30.pulled because of poor results. What do you say to that? There may be an
:24:31. > :24:34.argument that some of the public cares about what happens in the NHS
:24:35. > :24:38.but many will want a decent quality of care provided by whomever, so
:24:39. > :24:44.long as it is free at the point of use but not if the care is
:24:45. > :24:48.substandard and dangerous. I think this march is a fantastic display of
:24:49. > :24:53.public support and commitment to the NHS, which we absolutely agree with,
:24:54. > :24:57.and we want to see the NHS fit for the future and the 21st century. In
:24:58. > :25:02.terms of the concerns around privatisation, the reality is that
:25:03. > :25:07.the NHS is a partnership between independent providers and public
:25:08. > :25:10.sector providers. The amount of money the NHS budget spent in the
:25:11. > :25:18.independent sector, so IT support, GPs, drugs, the whole thing, it is
:25:19. > :25:22.actually 28% already. It is a partnership and without each other
:25:23. > :25:27.the system would fall down. People are worried that private sector
:25:28. > :25:31.provision will begin to engulf parts of what they feel is a health
:25:32. > :25:35.service that will lose its identity. I don't think it will lose its
:25:36. > :25:38.identity. I think everybody is committed to the same core
:25:39. > :25:42.principles and what is really important is that we recognise
:25:43. > :25:51.fantastic independent providers. Nobody wants to get rid of Macmillan
:25:52. > :25:54.nurses and nobody wants to stop the provision of wheelchairs for
:25:55. > :25:58.children. It is a great partnership and we should celebrate it. Isn't it
:25:59. > :26:01.true that the NHS has always been a mixture of public and private
:26:02. > :26:06.providers and what is being said is emotional but in reality has always
:26:07. > :26:12.existed? This is a way of misleading the public, talking about Macmillan
:26:13. > :26:17.nurses, the charity, and GPs who are independent contractors but very
:26:18. > :26:22.much part of the NHS. We do not have shareholders, we do not draw profit
:26:23. > :26:26.into the pockets of shareholders. The problem is the company is taking
:26:27. > :26:30.these contracts are big private equity funds, hedge funds, out to
:26:31. > :26:35.make major profit from the NHS. That is a real risk. The number of
:26:36. > :26:39.contracts that has gone out to the private sector has increased three
:26:40. > :26:44.times in the last year. It is only last year that the regulations came
:26:45. > :26:49.out. The provision percentage has not increased. The health and social
:26:50. > :26:53.care act was fermented two years ago and the regulations that enforce it
:26:54. > :27:00.would just one year ago. -- was implemented. And we have seen
:27:01. > :27:06.contracts going out to the private sector since. We used to have a cap
:27:07. > :27:10.on profits and we should have that. You admit it is a dangerous
:27:11. > :27:15.precedent to allow companies to focus on profit rather than care? I
:27:16. > :27:18.think any company that does not focus on the care they are providing
:27:19. > :27:23.should not be providing services to the NHS. But how on earth do you
:27:24. > :27:28.stop that? It is quite difficult to unravel what is going on in the
:27:29. > :27:33.NHS. The public may be very worried about what they see happening. Yes.
:27:34. > :27:38.There is a responsibility on both your parts and language is so
:27:39. > :27:44.important. When you use the P word, toxic privatisation, people pony up
:27:45. > :27:50.on the radio and think that you can only have treatment if you get your
:27:51. > :27:54.credit card out. You have to be very clear about what your concerns are.
:27:55. > :27:58.The word privatisation can be misused and abused. I think there is
:27:59. > :28:02.a point here that the majority of patients, and this is the battle you
:28:03. > :28:10.have, don't really care whether care comes from, so long as it is first
:28:11. > :28:14.class. -- where the care comes from. By the definition of the World
:28:15. > :28:18.Health Organisation and Oliver Letwin, who wrote about privatising
:28:19. > :28:22.the world, where public sector services are put over to the private
:28:23. > :28:25.sector to provide, that is privatisation. The Government does
:28:26. > :28:29.not want to use that word because it knows it is toxic and the public
:28:30. > :28:34.does not want it. The debate needs to be about how we find the NHS in
:28:35. > :28:39.the future, what services are provided by the NHS because it can't
:28:40. > :28:42.do everything. It raises our expectations about what is possible.
:28:43. > :28:46.We need that public debate and it needs to be about the inequity that
:28:47. > :28:50.is increasing as well. You can have one treatment in one place and not
:28:51. > :28:51.in another and that is what we need to be debating. I will leave it
:28:52. > :28:55.there. Thank you very much. What do you do if you're
:28:56. > :28:58.a left wing voter disillusioned with Well, the Green Party of England
:28:59. > :29:02.and Wales hopes you'll join them and they reckon they might just have
:29:03. > :29:05.the policies to entice the left The party is meeting
:29:06. > :29:08.for their annual conference in Birmingham as they look to add
:29:09. > :29:12.to their one MP gained in 2010. They want to renationalise
:29:13. > :29:16.the railways, something they say is They also want to introduce
:29:17. > :29:21.a wealth tax on the super rich with The party would also legislate
:29:22. > :29:26.for a living wage which will rise to ?10 an hour
:29:27. > :29:30.by the end of the next Parliament. To discuss
:29:31. > :29:32.their prospects we're been joined from Birmingham by the leader of
:29:33. > :29:43.the Green Party, Natalie Bennett. Welcome back to the daily politics.
:29:44. > :29:52.Let's pick up on that last policy proposal about a living wage rising
:29:53. > :29:56.to ?10. Have you got businesses on side? I think very much though.
:29:57. > :29:59.Businesses recognise that the low pay economy is doing them out of
:30:00. > :30:04.customers and opportunities to provide the services and goods that
:30:05. > :30:09.people need. Have you got any names about who has signed up? No, I am
:30:10. > :30:14.not going to give you any names. What I am going to talk about is how
:30:15. > :30:17.we are saying today that we need to make the minimum wage a living wage.
:30:18. > :30:24.If you work full time, you should earn enough to live on, and a survey
:30:25. > :30:27.has shown 76% of the public agree with that statement. The living wage
:30:28. > :30:32.is a basic principle. We have to offer people hope for the future as
:30:33. > :30:41.well. So many people are struggling to pay bills, facing payday loans
:30:42. > :30:44.and credit card bills, and we need to offer hope that things will get
:30:45. > :30:46.better in the future. We also want to... That is what the offer of ?10
:30:47. > :30:55.an hour for everybody by 2020 offers. You are criticising the
:30:56. > :30:58.Labour Party for signing up to the same spending limits as the
:30:59. > :31:03.government, especially initially, but what limit on public services
:31:04. > :31:07.are you add a catering? We need to restore the pay of public sector
:31:08. > :31:12.workers and we also need to restore the level of services. The fact is,
:31:13. > :31:15.we are cutting back so much on youth clubs, social care, there are so
:31:16. > :31:22.many areas, like social care workers... How much would you spend?
:31:23. > :31:26.In terms of the 2015 general election, we will have a fully
:31:27. > :31:30.costed manifesto, as we did in 2010, setting out the full details. But we
:31:31. > :31:34.want to start the election campaign here. We want a sales Territories
:31:35. > :31:38.are failed model. We have a situation where the economy at the
:31:39. > :31:41.moment, rich individuals and multinational companies are not
:31:42. > :31:47.making a fair contribution in tax or in wages. The 99% of us simply are
:31:48. > :31:51.not getting a fair share of Britain's wealth. We are, after
:31:52. > :31:56.all, the world's sixth richest economy. Some of the policies you
:31:57. > :31:58.advocate, you share with the Labour Party. Are you in danger of not
:31:59. > :32:02.achieving your policies, for instance the increased minimum wage,
:32:03. > :32:07.the mansion tax you have talked about, on a higher top rate of tax,
:32:08. > :32:12.all of which the Labour Party is proposing? Will you split the vote
:32:13. > :32:15.and not get anywhere near any of the proposals? If we look at the detail,
:32:16. > :32:20.the Labour Party is making noises about lots of these things. Henri
:32:21. > :32:23.nationalising the railways, Caroline Lucas has a Private members Bill
:32:24. > :32:28.before Parliament that says we should simply, as the train
:32:29. > :32:32.operating companies' contract slats, allow them to come back into public
:32:33. > :32:36.hands and run them as a public institution. Labour say they will
:32:37. > :32:39.create a public company, which bids into this failed, fragmented
:32:40. > :32:45.privatised system we have now. That is not renationalisation. It is
:32:46. > :32:49.supporting the model we have a ready got. If you look at the living wage,
:32:50. > :32:52.I believe Labour's position if they want to ask companies nicely and
:32:53. > :32:56.offer them tax breaks for the living wage. We are saying that white to
:32:57. > :33:01.become if you work full time, you should have enough money to live on.
:33:02. > :33:04.Do you think Natalie Bennett is making an offer, and her party is
:33:05. > :33:09.making an offer, which will have a broader appeal than they have had in
:33:10. > :33:12.the past? Two I think it is. I spoke to Natalie last night about one of
:33:13. > :33:16.the policies and they are broadening their range of policies, broadening
:33:17. > :33:19.from just being about the idea of the environment which is a
:33:20. > :33:22.perception a lot of people have. Where it goes is interesting because
:33:23. > :33:28.it may well take votes from Labour and the Lib Dems. It may well spin
:33:29. > :33:32.to the slightly centre-left chunk of the electorate. -- splinter. I think
:33:33. > :33:36.that might be a good thing but whether or not it will translate
:33:37. > :33:39.into MPs in 2015, no one knows. I also think, about fracking, the
:33:40. > :33:42.Green party will pick up votes from people who don't want it in their
:33:43. > :33:44.back garden. Thank you for joining us.
:33:45. > :33:47.Before we say goodbye to Duncan, let's see if he worked out
:33:48. > :33:51.The question was which city did Boris Johnson say last night was
:33:52. > :33:58.Was it a) Paris in the 19th century b) Athens in the 5th century BC,
:33:59. > :34:01.c) New York in the 20th century or d) London in the 21st century?
:34:02. > :34:06.So Duncan, what's the correct answer?
:34:07. > :34:15.My get out of jail card was I was working last night so I did not see
:34:16. > :34:18.it. I would like to think it is London but he's besotted with our
:34:19. > :34:23.things and was also born in New York. I'm going with Athens. I have
:34:24. > :34:24.to be honest, I'm not sure whether the right answer was Athens or
:34:25. > :34:27.London. But you're right! In a moment, we'll be turning
:34:28. > :34:30.our attention to the latest But for now, it's time to say
:34:31. > :34:35.goodbye to my guest Duncan Barkes. So for the next half an hour we're
:34:36. > :34:41.going to be focusing on Europe. We'll be discussing Europe's
:34:42. > :34:43.approach to the crisis in Ukraine, the line-up of
:34:44. > :34:45.Jean-Claude Juncker's new Commission, and Adam reports from
:34:46. > :34:47.Croatia - the EU's newest member. First though,
:34:48. > :34:49.here's our guide to the latest Germany breaks its post-war policy
:34:50. > :34:58.of not sending arms to conflict zones and authorises the arming
:34:59. > :35:02.of a 4000 strong battalion of Kurdish fighters to battle
:35:03. > :35:06.Islamic State in northern Iraq. The newly designated EU foreign
:35:07. > :35:11.affairs chief, Federica Mogherini says NATO
:35:12. > :35:15.countries bordering Russia need more than a paper pledge that NATO will
:35:16. > :35:19.step in if it comes to fight. You lost
:35:20. > :35:21.your independence once before. With NATO,
:35:22. > :35:23.you will never lose it again. Strong words from the president
:35:24. > :35:27.as 60 world leaders meet in Wales for the latest NATO summit,
:35:28. > :35:29.with security issues A potential Merkel headache with
:35:30. > :35:34.a victory for the For the first time,
:35:35. > :35:40.a party against the euro won seats New rules banning the manufacture or
:35:41. > :35:51.import of over 1600 watt vacuum cleaners led to a huge rush on
:35:52. > :36:00.the things before the ban came in. And with us for the next 30 minutes,
:36:01. > :36:03.I've been joined by Ukip's Jane Collins, and Catherine
:36:04. > :36:07.Stihler for the Labour party. Let's take a look at one
:36:08. > :36:10.of those stories in more detail - the EU's response to the
:36:11. > :36:26.Islamic State militants in Iraq. Jane, should ransoms be paid to
:36:27. > :36:31.ISIS, to release hostages? It is a very emotive question. I think once
:36:32. > :36:36.you start doing that, you are going down a one-way street and you can't
:36:37. > :36:38.come back. So, no. So your position is never to pay ransoms to
:36:39. > :36:44.terrorists, to have a British hostage release? Once you have done
:36:45. > :36:49.it, as I say, you open the door to the one-way street and there's no
:36:50. > :36:51.turning back. Do you agree, and with the Prime Minister being, as was
:36:52. > :36:56.said in some of the papers, quite hawkish on this? I agree. There are
:36:57. > :37:02.other ways to deal with the situation. None of us want to be --
:37:03. > :37:06.this to be the way it is but we have to use other means than paying
:37:07. > :37:10.ransoms. The German parliament is arming a battalion of Kurds, to some
:37:11. > :37:14.extent, changing a decades-old commitment not to get involved,
:37:15. > :37:17.certainly militarily, in international conflicts, and
:37:18. > :37:21.therefore, a minister has recently given a speech advocating more
:37:22. > :37:25.masculine German policy. Do you think that it would be a good idea
:37:26. > :37:32.for a concerted EU effort to do things like arming the Kurds? In
:37:33. > :37:36.Iraq at this moment in time, and remember, we are virtually guilty of
:37:37. > :37:41.causing the situation with this illegal war and we have got the two
:37:42. > :37:46.sides now that we are struggling to get some kind of stability and it is
:37:47. > :37:49.looking impossible, but I think with the Islamic terrorist groups and
:37:50. > :37:56.everything, there has never been a better case for armed intervention
:37:57. > :38:02.in Iraq. So you are saying that we caused it in 2003? We went into an
:38:03. > :38:08.illegal war, led by Tony Blair. Do you think that has led to the rise
:38:09. > :38:11.of ISIS? They have taken advantage of a destabilised country. What
:38:12. > :38:18.about the situation in Syria? Should the UK Government have led air
:38:19. > :38:22.strikes in Syria earlier this year? The thing is, Ukip disagreed with
:38:23. > :38:27.arming the rebels. The very same people now are using the arms
:38:28. > :38:31.against us. They would say they are not the same people. They were the
:38:32. > :38:35.moderate resistance. Do you think that Ed Miliband should firmly stand
:38:36. > :38:39.and support air strikes if America calls on Britain? I think we have to
:38:40. > :38:44.work together to find solutions to the ISIS threat which is why we are
:38:45. > :38:47.working in NATO. I think at the moment, we have to look at all the
:38:48. > :38:52.options. However, at this moment, we had to negotiate a make sure we are
:38:53. > :38:59.working together. Who are we negotiating with? With our
:39:00. > :39:03.colleagues and alliances. I don't think that we can rush into things.
:39:04. > :39:09.It is such a serious situation, we have to make sure the humanitarian
:39:10. > :39:12.situation, looking at what is happening with the Christians and
:39:13. > :39:16.other religious minorities in Iraq, we have had a humanitarian effort
:39:17. > :39:20.and obviously, that cooperation which is essential. But now we have
:39:21. > :39:26.to work together with NATO and across the EU to tackle this serious
:39:27. > :39:28.and poisonous threat. I agree it is a terribly poisonous threat but you
:39:29. > :39:34.can't negotiate with terrorists and that is the main problem. I was not
:39:35. > :39:41.say negotiate with terrorists. We have to work together. With other
:39:42. > :39:44.regional powers? Or within the EU? That is something the Europeans...
:39:45. > :39:47.Isn't this the time we need EU allies more than ever rather than
:39:48. > :39:53.being isolated and out of Europe, it is what Ukip once? I totally
:39:54. > :39:56.disagree. I think we can have our input in these situations quite
:39:57. > :40:04.positively, without having to be part of the EU. I think we have to
:40:05. > :40:12.work together. North and south Iraq really need to split. I completely
:40:13. > :40:15.disagree with that. It is so destabilised, and we can move some
:40:16. > :40:22.of the Christian populations through to the Nineveh plane for safety. We
:40:23. > :40:24.should be helping the Iraqi government, recognising the Sunni
:40:25. > :40:28.minority to make sure their voices are heard. This has been the big
:40:29. > :40:32.problem with Iraqi democracy, the minorities have not been heard. We
:40:33. > :40:36.have to work hard to make sure it happens. You want to see the
:40:37. > :40:40.break-up of Iraq because you don't think the different tribal groups...
:40:41. > :40:41.It is just not working and until it stabilises, it won't.
:40:42. > :40:44.The EU is piling more pressure on Russia over the crisis
:40:45. > :40:46.in Ukraine, with deeper economic sanctions targeting state-controlled
:40:47. > :40:49.banking, energy and defence sectors under discussion.
:40:50. > :40:52.France has already halted the delivery of a warship to Russia
:40:53. > :40:55.this week, one of two that were on order before the existing
:40:56. > :41:00.Now more of President Putin's inner circle,
:41:01. > :41:05.dubbed "Putin's Cronies" could have travel bans imposed on them.
:41:06. > :41:08.And if that doesn't persuade Putin, there are suggestions that the EU
:41:09. > :41:11.could recommend that Russia be banned from participating
:41:12. > :41:14.in sporting events, including stripping them of the 2018 World Cup
:41:15. > :41:26.Jane Collins, what do you think about 1000 troops being committed to
:41:27. > :41:30.a rapid reaction NATO force? Can I just address the fact we have 30
:41:31. > :41:38.soldiers already on exercises in Iraq? Sorry, in Ukraine!
:41:39. > :41:48.Ukraine is not part of NATO. We have no benefit in actually interfering
:41:49. > :41:53.in this situation. Really? We have had America and the EU
:41:54. > :41:59.pushing/insurance, and interference. Don't get me wrong, we don't condone
:42:00. > :42:04.President Putin's annexation and acts of aggression. Do you think he
:42:05. > :42:08.has a right to do it? No, we are saying we don't condone the
:42:09. > :42:15.annexation of Crimea and eastern Ukraine. So you approve of what he
:42:16. > :42:18.is doing? I have just said we don't. But you don't think it's worth
:42:19. > :42:22.trying to stop him? We are saying that what he's doing is wrong. We
:42:23. > :42:28.don't think it is right but what we are saying is, there is no benefit
:42:29. > :42:34.for the sanctions, going in hard, like they are doing, to the UK. What
:42:35. > :42:38.do you say to that? Sanctions have to be a measure. I disagree
:42:39. > :42:42.completely, we have to work together in the European Union. This is a
:42:43. > :42:45.near neighbour, a foreign power has invaded the eastern part of a
:42:46. > :42:52.sovereign country. This is the most serious crisis in Europe since NATO
:42:53. > :42:55.went into Serbia. This is something that is really critical. I think at
:42:56. > :42:58.the moment, when you look at what is happening in a sovereign state,
:42:59. > :43:03.where a foreign power has invaded, and also, the fact that many of our
:43:04. > :43:07.Eastern European neighbours, who are now full members of the EU, their
:43:08. > :43:13.viewpoint of Russia and Russian power, don't forget, is Dhoni had a
:43:14. > :43:17.cyber attack. And countries like Poland. The fact is, countries like
:43:18. > :43:24.the EU and America encouraged a clue to depose an elected president. -- a
:43:25. > :43:30.coop. But what about the people living there. And look as what -- at
:43:31. > :43:34.what has happened with MH17, not being able to get to the crash
:43:35. > :43:37.site. President Putin plays it both ways, one minute saying he has
:43:38. > :43:42.nothing to do with the people creating havoc in eastern Ukraine,
:43:43. > :43:47.but on the other, trying to organise a cease-fire. I am pleased with what
:43:48. > :43:52.is happening with Belarus today. What about the Prime Minister today?
:43:53. > :44:00.I'm not sure if it was today, but on Ukraine, dismissing President
:44:01. > :44:04.Putin's 7-point plan. President Poroshenko, talking about the
:44:05. > :44:07.cease-fire. Belarus are coming together to talk, as far as I
:44:08. > :44:11.understand, and that might be happening as we speak, maybe later
:44:12. > :44:14.but it is important we recognise that is happening. We welcome that
:44:15. > :44:18.because we need to make sure there's a cease-fire. Are you not worried
:44:19. > :44:20.about what is going on in eastern Ukraine in terms of how it could
:44:21. > :44:26.affect other Eastern European countries and the rest of Europe? Of
:44:27. > :44:32.course it is worrying but we see any benefit in putting armed troops on
:44:33. > :44:37.the ground. -- we cannot see. But sanctions is what we are doing. But
:44:38. > :44:39.they are not touching gas and oil, so they are completely toothless. We
:44:40. > :44:42.are going to leave it there. The buzz
:44:43. > :44:44.in Brussels this week has been all about who Jean-Claude Juncker will
:44:45. > :44:47.choose to be his new commissioners, when he takes over from Jose Manuel
:44:48. > :44:49.Barroso as President of the Will he have enough
:44:50. > :44:52.women candidates? Will he rearrange the Commission?
:44:53. > :45:11.And who will get the best jobs? two months left of weekly meetings
:45:12. > :45:14.before their replacements take-over. Appointments to these jobs are
:45:15. > :45:17.closely scrutinised. They are powerful positions because the
:45:18. > :45:25.Commission is the only part of the EU that can propose new laws. It is
:45:26. > :45:30.up on the 13th floor office building, the home of the European
:45:31. > :45:36.Commission, that you will find the President, soon-to-be Jean-Claude
:45:37. > :45:40.Juncker, and his 27 commissioners. There is one commissioner from each
:45:41. > :45:44.member state and each looks after a different policy area. It is the
:45:45. > :45:49.President who decides which portfolio each member state gets, so
:45:50. > :45:52.will this week he has been interviewing the candidates.
:45:53. > :45:58.Surprisingly he seems to think I might have a chance. What job are
:45:59. > :46:06.you going to give the UK candidate? Are you a candidate? Sadly, I am
:46:07. > :46:09.not. The Denmark representative has been head of the climate Commission
:46:10. > :46:14.for five years and knows all about the gruelling process of getting the
:46:15. > :46:17.job. You come from your national Government normally and you know
:46:18. > :46:23.about politics but this is a different kind of world. You have a
:46:24. > :46:27.certain humility in your approach, but you also know for instance that
:46:28. > :46:29.that first meeting with the President-elect is extremely
:46:30. > :46:34.important because that is where it is to find what you are going to do.
:46:35. > :46:40.What is your true portfolio for the next five years? Lauderdale, what
:46:41. > :46:45.position are you getting? How did the interview go? Very positive,
:46:46. > :46:59.thank you. A positive candidate! The new portfolio is already taken. All
:47:00. > :47:03.the other jobs are still up for grabs, which means journalists still
:47:04. > :47:08.have plenty to gossip about. The most sought-after jobs are generally
:47:09. > :47:11.speaking economic ones. Save economic affairs, trade, the
:47:12. > :47:18.internal market, competition, those areas. Britain has said that is what
:47:19. > :47:22.he wants, a top economic job. But if he gets energy and to change, you
:47:23. > :47:28.can argue that energy is crucial to the economy, so whatever he gets as
:47:29. > :47:34.long as it is in economic area, he will be able to sell. Ultimately
:47:35. > :47:37.decisions will be taken in the European Parliament when MPs will
:47:38. > :47:40.vote on the package of commissioners and their portfolios. Vivian Reding
:47:41. > :47:46.used to be the Vice President of the Commission. She is also from
:47:47. > :47:51.Luxembourg and says the number of women candidates is an issue. Women
:47:52. > :47:54.are half of the talent, half of the knowledge, half of the
:47:55. > :48:00.responsibility, so let's also carry half of the doing, what we are
:48:01. > :48:03.standing for. I have the impression that in some member states
:48:04. > :48:08.unfortunately, this is not taken seriously. If everything goes to
:48:09. > :48:14.plan, new commissioners will be in these suits by early November but it
:48:15. > :48:17.is an incredibly complicated process. Even after Jean-Claude
:48:18. > :48:25.Juncker has made up his mind, it is still not a done deal. Jane and
:48:26. > :48:30.Catherine are still with me and we have been joined by Syed Kamall from
:48:31. > :48:36.the Conservatives. It does not look like Lord hill will get one of the
:48:37. > :48:40.top economic jobs. We don't know. We have just seen the draft Commission
:48:41. > :48:45.plan but if it is true that he might get the energy portfolio, that is
:48:46. > :48:49.crucial. Look at what David Cameron and Obama are talking about at the
:48:50. > :48:54.moment, reducing reliance on energy from Russia. You can't have a modern
:48:55. > :48:57.digital economy if you can't switch on the lights. One of the
:48:58. > :49:01.commentators in that film said that the Government will argue any job is
:49:02. > :49:05.crucial to the economy because everything is crucial to the
:49:06. > :49:09.economy, and it is not the same as getting one of the top economic
:49:10. > :49:12.portfolios. Jean-Claude Juncker has made it clear that he is going to
:49:13. > :49:17.change all the portfolios so it will not be exactly the same. If someone
:49:18. > :49:21.had asked me what we would like a few weeks ago, energy would have
:49:22. > :49:28.been one of the top ones. Sounds like he will get that then! Is that
:49:29. > :49:35.what you know? I don't know. Tell us on Daily Politics! If he gets it,
:49:36. > :49:44.great. Which other top economic portfolio would you have liked for
:49:45. > :49:47.Lord Hill? I like to see things like international trade. We are very
:49:48. > :49:51.interested in monetary affairs and that is a crucial industry for
:49:52. > :49:56.Britain. Whatever happens, British MEPs will continue standing up for
:49:57. > :50:01.that crucial industry. Do you accept that without occupying one of the
:50:02. > :50:05.top economic portfolios, Britain's influence in the discussions between
:50:06. > :50:09.austerity and spending, now rife in the European Union again, will be
:50:10. > :50:13.diminished? Not at all. Commissioners all discuss the issues
:50:14. > :50:18.and commissioners often bring up issues not strictly related to their
:50:19. > :50:22.portfolio. It is interesting that it is not just energy but climate
:50:23. > :50:29.change. Paris conference next year, it is a very important issue to deal
:50:30. > :50:33.with. Of course. Wouldn't it be better if the UK was occupying one
:50:34. > :50:38.of the top your league economic roles? Of course. Everything is
:50:39. > :50:43.based on the economy. It is a Mickey Mouse appointment, really. Climate
:50:44. > :50:47.change is not Mickey Mouse! It is for him because he will be made very
:50:48. > :50:51.unpopular at home because energy bills will go up. He is going to
:50:52. > :50:58.push through European legislation, which will increase wind farms and
:50:59. > :51:02.it is going to... All right. It will. It is pensioners and young
:51:03. > :51:10.families and their bills will go up and he will not be popular. Jane is
:51:11. > :51:14.talking about the portfolio. Is it because Lord Hill was not well known
:51:15. > :51:18.to anyone, particularly Jean-Claude Juncker, that actually his chances
:51:19. > :51:22.of getting a key role were also reduced? If you look at most of the
:51:23. > :51:29.commissioners, most people do not know many of them. Not outside the
:51:30. > :51:35.Brussels Circle. But everyone I have met across the political spectrum,
:51:36. > :51:39.they have all said they have been impressed with Lord Hill. How many
:51:40. > :51:43.former Prime Ministers will be chosen as commissioners? Some
:51:44. > :51:48.clearly have been. Former Prime Ministers are much more important.
:51:49. > :51:51.But just because you are former Prime Minister does not mean you are
:51:52. > :51:56.an effective commissioner. I accept that but it is all about profile. It
:51:57. > :52:02.is not, actually, it is about being well respected in British
:52:03. > :52:10.institutions. Jean-Claude Juncker had to Google Hill! It is the job
:52:11. > :52:18.you do in Brussels that is crucial. But Britain is not well respected in
:52:19. > :52:22.Europe. Is that UKIP's fault? But the single market is not there any
:52:23. > :52:28.more. Consumer rights is not there any more. Those are the things that
:52:29. > :52:35.I wonder about. There is better regulation. The German has got the
:52:36. > :52:39.trade portfolio and the French have got competition. These rumours and
:52:40. > :52:43.we will find out next week. But we have to look at this. These people
:52:44. > :52:47.have to go through a hearing process that is very tough, and then they
:52:48. > :52:51.have to be voted into Parliament, so there is some time to go before we
:52:52. > :52:56.see these commissioners approved. I am pleased to see that there are now
:52:57. > :53:00.nine female candidates. I welcome that. I would rather see no
:53:01. > :53:08.commissioners. We don't have a British Commissioner. Are EU
:53:09. > :53:11.commissioners. Right, but they are working on behalf of the UK as well.
:53:12. > :53:16.You would not think so if you saw what was happening. Should the
:53:17. > :53:22.public know more about what the commissioners do and who they are?
:53:23. > :53:25.Yes, I think that is important. I spoke to the committee at the House
:53:26. > :53:29.of Commons this week, and I made the point that whatever you think of the
:53:30. > :53:33.EU, we are members, and legislation that is created in Brussels
:53:34. > :53:40.eventually becomes law in Britain, and we have to recognise that. What
:53:41. > :53:44.reaction did you get? Very positive. People want to know who these people
:53:45. > :53:48.are. People are recognising how many laws are made in Brussels. Do you
:53:49. > :53:53.think there would have been more chance of getting a top job if David
:53:54. > :53:59.Cameron has nominated a woman? You are saying that Hill's job is not a
:54:00. > :54:03.top job. I am not saying that but it is how it is regarded in
:54:04. > :54:05.Conservative circles. If you look at the crucial issues, energy is one of
:54:06. > :54:11.the top issues. Now, hold onto your hats, we've got
:54:12. > :54:14.something very exciting in store. Yes, it's the first in a new series
:54:15. > :54:18.of films called Meet The Neighbours. Adam's going to profile
:54:19. > :54:20.the EU's 28 member countries. He started off in Croatia,
:54:21. > :54:23.the EU's newest member, where he got Can I start with you? The NHS is
:54:24. > :54:34.still free at the point of use. Do -- where he got into a bit of a
:54:35. > :54:43.fight. I am finding out about life
:54:44. > :54:47.as a gladiator in a town Yes, another empire was
:54:48. > :54:58.here long before the EU. Would you rather be a subject of
:54:59. > :55:01.the Roman Empire or the EU empire? OK, Roman empire was
:55:02. > :55:04.definitely more cruel. This is a country which is used
:55:05. > :55:07.to joining and leaving things. I was born in Yugoslavia
:55:08. > :55:16.and my kids in Croatia, Yes, listen, some countries will
:55:17. > :55:24.never go through what we have gone through in the 20th century
:55:25. > :55:29.for another thousand years. Nowadays,
:55:30. > :55:35.Croatia is famous for tourism. But a big industry here is
:55:36. > :55:37.shipbuilding, so big that you need Right, over there are two ferries
:55:38. > :55:44.going to Turkmenistan, a massive fishing boat going to Russia, and
:55:45. > :55:48.this monster is an oil tanker that The country's shipyards were state
:55:49. > :55:59.run, but they had to be sold off, Brussels also insisted
:56:00. > :56:13.the country bring lots of sectors up to European standards, from
:56:14. > :56:16.the police to the sewage system. Now let's get a taste of
:56:17. > :56:18.the politics. This restaurant's name translates
:56:19. > :56:27.as cock-a-doodle-doo. The left-wing parties that form
:56:28. > :56:29.the Croatian government signed their power-sharing deal here,
:56:30. > :56:33.so they are known There were many courses,
:56:34. > :56:41.and they were all different, It was good food and good wine,
:56:42. > :56:46.so with that came good ideas. Another regular diner was
:56:47. > :56:48.the former Prime Minister, Ivo Sanader, who was jailed earlier
:56:49. > :56:51.this year for corruption on a massive scale, something that
:56:52. > :56:56.is often on the menu in Croatia. But here is one customer
:56:57. > :56:59.who is squeaky-clean. Marina is part of a brand-new Green
:57:00. > :57:01.party The general impression is that
:57:02. > :57:12.our politics is all about obtaining positions of power and privileges,
:57:13. > :57:15.well-paid positions, for those who And then not caring
:57:16. > :57:21.about the rest of the world. But the problem people worry
:57:22. > :57:24.about most here is the state Croatia has been battling
:57:25. > :57:30.a fierce recession for six years. Not everyone is convinced that
:57:31. > :57:53.joining the EU will shield them Not a resounding success for Croatia
:57:54. > :57:56.then, since it has joined the EU? Talking to Croatian colleagues, I
:57:57. > :58:01.think Croatia has welcomed being a member of the European Union and
:58:02. > :58:06.access to the single market. The fact that 4.4 million people across
:58:07. > :58:11.Croatia are now European citizens. So why is the economy not doing
:58:12. > :58:14.better? We would all agree that across the European Union our
:58:15. > :58:23.economies have been hard-hit by the financial crisis are improving and
:58:24. > :58:29.progressing. The only member state, when I wrote to every EU country,
:58:30. > :58:36.who said there had been no short cuts. 18 billion spent on them in
:58:37. > :58:41.2013. Tourism has not taken off as they hoped. 20% unemployment. I
:58:42. > :58:46.don't see where there benefits. Nothing evident that it has been
:58:47. > :58:51.beneficial joining the EU. That is it for today. Thanks to my. Goodbye.