:00:36. > :00:41.David Cameron's in Iceland making friends with some
:00:42. > :00:57.But the leaders of Estonia and Finland say they've yet to hear
:00:58. > :00:59.from the PM how exactly he wants to renegotiate Britain's membership
:01:00. > :01:02.Mr Cameron insists his reform discussions are "going well".
:01:03. > :01:06.We don't have the report but we do now have a date - ish -
:01:07. > :01:09.for the publication of the Chilcott inquiry into the Iraq war.
:01:10. > :01:16.Every five years in China, man, they have a development plan.
:01:17. > :01:19.So man, China's one child policy has been abandoned.
:01:20. > :01:22.We'll be finding what else is in their latest five year plan.
:01:23. > :01:24.And how about a spot of dog whistle politics?
:01:25. > :01:32.It's the Parliamentary Dog of the Year Awards again.
:01:33. > :01:35.All that in the next hour and with us for the duration, businessman and
:01:36. > :01:43.Now, first today, since we have a Lord in our midst,
:01:44. > :01:45.let's talk about the Upper House and the events of Monday.
:01:46. > :01:48.You voted against George Osborne's plan to reduce tax credits.
:01:49. > :02:00.. I think that what George Osborne did was not thought through. He had
:02:01. > :02:05.openly said in the election that they wanted to cut welfare, which is
:02:06. > :02:08.fine and I do think welfare needs to be cut. I do believe in
:02:09. > :02:08.fine and I do think welfare needs to welfare-to-work and I do think we
:02:09. > :02:13.need to balance reduce our set and our deficit but
:02:14. > :02:16.the way he did this, without taking into
:02:17. > :02:19.the way he did this, without taking cuts on the poorest, was just so bad
:02:20. > :02:23.it was not compassionate and also, putting it through, through a
:02:24. > :02:25.statutory instrument was not the right way to do it. This is a
:02:26. > :02:32.welfare matter but also right way to do it. This is a
:02:33. > :02:34.matter T should have been in the Autumn
:02:35. > :02:35.matter T should have been in the Statement, debated in the House of
:02:36. > :02:39.Commons. If it was a finance Statement, debated in the House of
:02:40. > :02:40.you shouldn't have been touching it at all. Did you have concerns that
:02:41. > :02:44.the Lords was getting at all. Did you have concerns that
:02:45. > :02:48.It was a tricky situation, because we had a constitutional matter.
:02:49. > :02:50.Should we have taken part in this? Because it was a statutory
:02:51. > :02:53.instrument we could. There was no Because it was a statutory
:02:54. > :02:57.question about it. It is rare we voted on statutory instruments. It
:02:58. > :03:03.only happened a handful of times in the last few years, last time was in
:03:04. > :03:08.two 12. I think people felt strongly about it, it hasn't been done the
:03:09. > :03:10.right way. George Osborne is a politically astute. I can't believe
:03:11. > :03:15.he did this, after the budget, there he did this, after the budget, there
:03:16. > :03:18.was no need to do it this way. You are a businessman, you have
:03:19. > :03:21.was no need to do it this way. You tough decisions, not always popular.
:03:22. > :03:23.Isn't that what Chancellors have to do taking decisions is one thing,
:03:24. > :03:28.how you implement them. do taking decisions is one thing,
:03:29. > :03:32.listen to people. Do you do it from an ivory tower or listen to people?
:03:33. > :03:34.Do you take into account effects of your decisions, this could have been
:03:35. > :03:37.phased in be and done your decisions, this could have been
:03:38. > :03:40.that doesn't affect the poorest. the right thing in using its voice
:03:41. > :03:48.and expertise. That's the right thing in using its voice
:03:49. > :03:49.amazing expertise. He the right thing in using its voice
:03:50. > :03:59.away to think the right thing in using its voice
:04:00. > :04:09.we did, that the English came At the end of the show our guest
:04:10. > :04:20.will give us the correct answer. We hope. For a change I know the
:04:21. > :04:24.answer. It's day two of David Cameron's
:04:25. > :04:26.visit to Iceland. He's meant to be making friends with
:04:27. > :04:29.our Northern European neighbours. Our Political Editor,
:04:30. > :04:41.Laura Kuensberg is in Rejkavik. Looks lovely. What is going on?
:04:42. > :04:45.Well, David Cameron has been trying to show in the last couple of days
:04:46. > :04:49.that he is, after trying to stay out of the fray, now really engaging in
:04:50. > :04:52.this whole debate. That is a change of position, no doubt about it.
:04:53. > :04:56.Because in recent months, while the campaign for out and in have been
:04:57. > :05:00.getting busy, number ten have really wanted to hang back but this week
:05:01. > :05:04.that's changed. He is trying to show progress. He has been warning about
:05:05. > :05:08.the idea of having a looser relationship like Iceland and Norway
:05:09. > :05:12.do, with the rest of the EU but I think maybe more than anything else,
:05:13. > :05:15.number ten has been trying to show that he is actually doing something.
:05:16. > :05:19.One of the criticisms that has been made at home is that there is not
:05:20. > :05:23.really anything going on with the renegotiation, it is all a bit of
:05:24. > :05:26.emperor's new clothes at the moment. Downing Street challenge that and
:05:27. > :05:30.insist things are happening. And in fact Europe Minister, David living
:05:31. > :05:33.tonne, said last night, that the technical talks were completely
:05:34. > :05:38.complete: The difficulty with that is - when you talk to European
:05:39. > :05:42.leaders here, the Finnish Prime Minister and the Estonian one, as we
:05:43. > :05:46.have been doing in the last 24 hours, both said to me that they
:05:47. > :05:50.were yet to see any real detail and that there haven't been any concrete
:05:51. > :05:53.proposals put on the table. All of that matters, of course, not just
:05:54. > :05:57.because David Cameron wants to look like he is in the right place, but
:05:58. > :06:00.there is only a few weeks left before he said he'd actually put
:06:01. > :06:03.those proposals into the public domain. Tricky times. Indeed and a
:06:04. > :06:08.first for a British Prime Minister, I understand that there hasn't been
:06:09. > :06:12.a British Prime Minister in recce Vic since Winston Churchill. I
:06:13. > :06:17.presume that was during the war. What is it like there, tell us what
:06:18. > :06:25.it is like? Well 1941 was the year. You are right, Churchill came here
:06:26. > :06:33.during the Second World War. Second world summits, as you well know --
:06:34. > :06:38.summits, as you well know, are odd affairs. And this is in that rather
:06:39. > :06:41.strange tradition, partly because of where the summit is taking place.
:06:42. > :06:45.This is the summit hotel, throughout the last couple of days, there have
:06:46. > :06:55.been bemused glances and bemused exchanges between the tourists who
:06:56. > :07:00.are here for a spot of whale watching or a strip around the
:07:01. > :07:05.harbour, wrapped up, wand around like Michelin men and on the other
:07:06. > :07:09.side you have the security men with earpieces in and leaders going about
:07:10. > :07:14.their business. Compared to a summit in Brussels or the kinds of things
:07:15. > :07:17.that happen in America or at G20 oer a big hardcore meeting like that.
:07:18. > :07:20.This is a pretty relaxed and friendly affair, a bit like the
:07:21. > :07:25.Icelanders themselves. Indeed they are. Don't go whale watching. That
:07:26. > :07:27.seems to be a rather dangerous occupation these days. Try the hot
:07:28. > :07:36.springs, you will enjoy them. With us now, the Conservative peer,
:07:37. > :07:39.Martin Callanan, who used to be a member of the European Parliament,
:07:40. > :07:44.and the UKIP MP, Douglas Carswell. Martin Callanan, how account Prime
:07:45. > :07:50.Minister say the negotiations are going well when the people like the
:07:51. > :07:54.leaders of Estonia and the Finns say they don't know what he wants? I
:07:55. > :07:58.don't know what he wants. We have it in broad terms. But we haven't seen
:07:59. > :08:02.the detail. Why don't we know what he wants? I think it is a good
:08:03. > :08:08.question. And do you have a good answer? I think their view is that
:08:09. > :08:12.they want to try and conclude negotiations in secret and not set
:08:13. > :08:16.out their negotiating position too early but of course, nobody know
:08:17. > :08:20.what is is on the table and we'll all look forward to seeing what it
:08:21. > :08:23.is they are actually asking for when they publish the letter to the
:08:24. > :08:26.European Council in November. You want Britain to leave the European
:08:27. > :08:30.Union. Is this good news or bad news, for you, the way the Prime
:08:31. > :08:34.Minister is going about it? I think it is pretty good news. I think many
:08:35. > :08:38.undecided vote letters realise there is no fundamentally new deal on the
:08:39. > :08:42.table and they are more lined to support leaving. -- voters will. Two
:08:43. > :08:45.years ago when David Cameron announced the in-out referendum he
:08:46. > :08:50.was framing it as a choice between leaving or a fundamentally new deal.
:08:51. > :08:54.I think this week marks the moment at which the Prime Minister starts
:08:55. > :08:59.to campaign for remaining in the EU, on current terms. He is more or less
:09:00. > :09:03.given up on the idea of a new dee. He is using a combination of project
:09:04. > :09:09.fear - saying you will be like Norway, as if it is the worst thing
:09:10. > :09:12.in the world and on the other hand, suggesting we wouldn't have cheap
:09:13. > :09:15.flights if we weren't in the EU. Both are nonsensical positions but
:09:16. > :09:19.this is what the bottom of the barrel looks like in Downing Street
:09:20. > :09:22.if you have no deal. With the Prime Minister deciding to come out
:09:23. > :09:26.against the "Norwegian option" he is taking sides now. He said at one
:09:27. > :09:29.stage he would rule nothing out. He has now ruled out the Norwegian
:09:30. > :09:35.option. Why would you do that? I have no idea. I don't know anybody
:09:36. > :09:40.arguing for the Norwegian option. Norway is the richest country of
:09:41. > :09:44.Europe. It is a much sore semidetached option. It is by no
:09:45. > :09:50.means perfect. They have a lot of problems. Nearly as bad as ours.
:09:51. > :09:54.They have to accept a lot of the single market policies. But they are
:09:55. > :09:57.not part of the Common Agricultural Policy, common farming 308cy, setts.
:09:58. > :10:01.There are problems in the relationship but it doesn't seem to
:10:02. > :10:07.do them harm. 70% of the population of Norway don't want to join as full
:10:08. > :10:12.members T can't be that bad. Would you be happy to have a British
:10:13. > :10:17.version. If we come out we won't copy Norway but it could provide a
:10:18. > :10:21.template. Would you be happy with a British version of the Norwegian
:10:22. > :10:24.relationship? I think it would present problems, particularly in
:10:25. > :10:29.terms of services, financial services in particular and we would
:10:30. > :10:34.need... Norway is covered by service, Switzerland isn't but
:10:35. > :10:37.Norway S. The Norway model is a bad template. Norway is in the position
:10:38. > :10:44.it is n because political elights wanted Norway to join and so as a
:10:45. > :10:47.prelude to membership they went into the so-called waiting room for
:10:48. > :10:51.Brussels membership. The people in Norway had more sense and their
:10:52. > :10:56.politicians said no and they were left in an awkward position. Now if
:10:57. > :11:01.they are in the position where five or six million can get preferential
:11:02. > :11:04.terms. Think what we could do with we left and negotiated for a genuine
:11:05. > :11:07.market accessed based relationship but without the red tape and
:11:08. > :11:13.condition strants that come with being in the EU. What would be wrong
:11:14. > :11:16.with that? I agree with Douglas, if we vote to leave we could probably
:11:17. > :11:20.negotiate ourselves a better deal than Norway or Switzerland have
:11:21. > :11:25.because of our relative size. But the problem s we wouldn't know until
:11:26. > :11:29.we did leave. That's the problem. It depends what sort of goodwill is on
:11:30. > :11:33.the other side, how difficult or awkward they want to be. Would, for
:11:34. > :11:36.instance, the big question is - would access to the single market
:11:37. > :11:39.necessarily result in accepting free movement, which is what many
:11:40. > :11:45.people's problem is with Europe. It is a good point but let's bore in
:11:46. > :11:49.mind last year we bought about #r50 billion pounds more stuff off the
:11:50. > :11:56.Member States than they bought off us. They will not put protection
:11:57. > :12:00.barriers there. They will not do that. Is the Prime Minister really
:12:01. > :12:06.no longer neutral on this? All the signals we see is that he is going
:12:07. > :12:10.to do his utmost to keep Britain in the European Union? I think that has
:12:11. > :12:13.always been clear. I don't think he has made much secret of the fact
:12:14. > :12:19.that fundamentally he wants to keep Britain in. Doesn't that weaken his
:12:20. > :12:23.hand, then? That may be right position for a British Prime
:12:24. > :12:27.Minister to say, that's not for me to decide. But if you are in an
:12:28. > :12:31.negotiation, it is surely a mistake to send out signals to the other
:12:32. > :12:35.side that basically - even if you give us next to nothing, I'm for
:12:36. > :12:40.staying N. You start the negotiation which saying - please can we have
:12:41. > :12:43.the concessions but don't worry we'll stay anyway, doesn't put you
:12:44. > :12:46.in the position. But the trump card is the referendum. David Cameron
:12:47. > :12:53.doesn't get to decide, I don't or Douglas doesn't. You do and everyone
:12:54. > :13:01.else does, too. We have a vote. . . In the Lords. Do you not get a vote?
:13:02. > :13:04.If I may, the two biggest developments that have happened in
:13:05. > :13:08.the European Union over the past years is one the euro has proven to
:13:09. > :13:11.be a disastrous thing t should never happened and slicked the migration
:13:12. > :13:14.crisis is a huge problem. These two developments show that the European
:13:15. > :13:18.Union, one, the free movement of people which I believe n we might
:13:19. > :13:21.need to bring in with the free movement of people, passports check
:13:22. > :13:25.between borders even if you are a European passport holder, you can
:13:26. > :13:30.still have free movement and check passports but where the euro is
:13:31. > :13:33.concerned that has proven the Europe project of an ever-moving forward
:13:34. > :13:37.towards a United States of Europe is not going to happen and if David
:13:38. > :13:40.Cameron can get an assurance, because there are many in Europe
:13:41. > :13:43.right now who want to move towards that United States of Europe. That
:13:44. > :13:47.is something we would never be prepared to go down. . I agree,
:13:48. > :13:52.given immigration will be such an important issue it is worth bearing
:13:53. > :13:55.in mind Iceland has a good situation with immigration. People can go to
:13:56. > :14:05.Iceland for the skills they need. It works for migrants and Iceland. Why
:14:06. > :14:07.don't we do that? It is the perception of outside world. To
:14:08. > :14:11.countries like independentia, the United States, they all think for us
:14:12. > :14:14.to be part of the European Union is important. The perception is very
:14:15. > :14:18.important but on the other hand, I know that we are being hampered by
:14:19. > :14:22.being part of the European Union by not being able to do free trade
:14:23. > :14:27.deals. The EU-India free trade deal has stuck up for years and years, we
:14:28. > :14:30.will never get that. On our own we would get there within months.
:14:31. > :14:33.That's not what the American trade representative said today or
:14:34. > :14:36.yesterday. He said America is moving to a free trade arrangement where
:14:37. > :14:39.where it is doing deals with regional groups. It is just
:14:40. > :14:43.completed one in the Pacific. It hopes to do one in Europe as well.
:14:44. > :14:49.Although it is way behind the Pacific one. They are not so keen
:14:50. > :14:52.any more to do by lateral deals. The State Department and Government
:14:53. > :14:57.officials tend to like the European Union, it is a project created by
:14:58. > :15:01.people like them to run humane economic social affairs Boyer his
:15:02. > :15:06.Lordship makes a powerful point we. Could have a free trade agreement
:15:07. > :15:10.with India. Isn't it absurd that Tata, a big investor in this
:15:11. > :15:15.country, we don't have a free trade agreement with India. We could have
:15:16. > :15:19.them if we leave the European Union. That's true but there are different
:15:20. > :15:25.types. It is easy to have a free trade agreement with third world
:15:26. > :15:27.country, India, China, on certain goods but we want banking services,
:15:28. > :15:39.which is much more difficult to get. A It is surely inconceivable that
:15:40. > :15:47.give the UK was outside the EU that it could not do a trade deal with
:15:48. > :15:57.the USA? Absolutely. I would be interested to see if politicians
:15:58. > :16:07.agree. Where would you rather be, Croydon or recce of it? Croydon but
:16:08. > :16:12.Reykjavik is a wonderful place! If the ideal world would be for David
:16:13. > :16:17.Cameron to go in there and renegotiate to see what the EU is
:16:18. > :16:20.actually about. If he can do that and get an efficient Europe, all the
:16:21. > :16:28.problems that the EU has, that and get an efficient Europe, all the
:16:29. > :16:34.be a good situation. We can end on agreement with that.
:16:35. > :16:36.So, a new timetable's been released for the long-awaited inquiry
:16:37. > :16:39.into the Iraq war - predicting it will be made public
:16:40. > :16:52.We don't have a date but we have a James Landale joins me now.
:16:53. > :17:05.We don't have a date but we have a rough I hear. We could see it in the
:17:06. > :17:12.summer of next year. -- date. There has been delays in the report and it
:17:13. > :17:18.was originally set up when Gordon Brown was Prime Minister in 2009. It
:17:19. > :17:23.heard its last evidence in February 2011 and yet we are still waiting.
:17:24. > :17:27.What we now know is that we have something approaching a timetable,
:17:28. > :17:32.if not a specific date, a letter sent by Sir John Chilcot to the
:17:33. > :17:35.Prime Minister yesterday and published yesterday saying
:17:36. > :17:38.Prime Minister yesterday and be finished by April and it will
:17:39. > :17:42.then go to the security services to check there are no inadvertent
:17:43. > :17:46.breaches of national security in the published document which will run to
:17:47. > :17:52.2 million words and the expectation is that it will be published in June
:17:53. > :17:57.or July next year. I cabinets nine week window when it will be
:17:58. > :17:59.published. A huge amount of frustration expressed in reaction
:18:00. > :18:04.about what many people see as a further delay. I will tell you what
:18:05. > :18:09.the Prime Minister and former Prime Minister, Tony Blair, had to say
:18:10. > :18:15.after we hear from the Speaker of the House of Commons who had this to
:18:16. > :18:24.say in The Chamber. I think it is important on behalf of the House
:18:25. > :18:29.whether it concerns him or not, that Sir John should be aware that there
:18:30. > :18:40.is a very real sense of anger and frustration across the House about
:18:41. > :18:43.the disservice that has been done. That anger reflected by some of the
:18:44. > :18:48.families of the Jewish servicemen who were killed in Iraq, and by the
:18:49. > :18:56.current Prime Minister and Tony Blair. -- British. David Cameron
:18:57. > :19:00.said he is still frustrated that it is on this existing timetable and is
:19:01. > :19:04.willing to provide more support in terms of staff from Whitehall to
:19:05. > :19:08.speed the process up. Tony Blair responded on his website and said
:19:09. > :19:14.that he and other contributors to the enquiry are not to blame for
:19:15. > :19:20.this process where contributors were given draft copies of the report,
:19:21. > :19:25.where they were criticised, offering them the opportunity to respond to
:19:26. > :19:31.that. Tony Blair said it is not right to blame that for the delay.
:19:32. > :19:35.He only found out this year about the contents and would reply by the
:19:36. > :19:43.summer. He said there are other reasons why this took so long and it
:19:44. > :19:59.is not all down to me. Thank you. We are joined by someone from the Daily
:20:00. > :20:04.Mail. I went to the BBC, I said that Sir John Chilcot is clearly five
:20:05. > :20:10.years late, most of the evidence has been made to the public, we can go
:20:11. > :20:15.through the testimony to Chilcot, and we were able to answer the
:20:16. > :20:21.question is very clearly. Do you get the impression that we now know the
:20:22. > :20:27.date? You get the feeling that a gun was put to Chilcot's head,
:20:28. > :20:32.metaphorically. Absolutely. There was a report that it would be
:20:33. > :20:39.delayed until 2017. It was reported in the Sunday Times that the whole
:20:40. > :20:44.thing had errors in the report, they had not understood how the military
:20:45. > :20:48.works, so poor old Sir John Chilcot who is getting on now, well into his
:20:49. > :20:56.70s, one of the panel is guides while... Some of the people whose
:20:57. > :21:02.sons and daughters were lost died in Iraq as well. Hundreds of thousands
:21:03. > :21:11.of deaths in Iraq. Their parents have died and they have been waiting
:21:12. > :21:16.for this bug an important point. It is an outrage. The last British
:21:17. > :21:24.soldier left Basra, left Iraq, in 2007. This report will be nine years
:21:25. > :21:30.late to stop Sir John Chilcot said that it would happen in 2011, six
:21:31. > :21:34.years after he said it would appear. This statement from Tony Blair is
:21:35. > :21:39.amazing. He got the report on him in January and took until the summer.
:21:40. > :21:44.He sat on it for six months, he said there was not a problem. A major
:21:45. > :21:49.problem! Six months he sat on it. Has the problem not been with the
:21:50. > :21:55.Maxwell eyes Asian process? The lawyers who were involved in the
:21:56. > :22:05.original enquiry were not sat next to Tony Blair, lawyers have become
:22:06. > :22:13.involved in this process. -- Maxwellisation. Chilcot should not
:22:14. > :22:20.have allowed that. He knew of the criticisms. Actually, we are going
:22:21. > :22:25.to go ahead anyway. He should not have got involved and before then he
:22:26. > :22:29.got himself distracted by Downing Street with the crucial letters
:22:30. > :22:33.between President Bush and Tony Blair and said we would publish them
:22:34. > :22:39.anyway, any Downing Street wants to censor it, they can do it. He has
:22:40. > :22:46.been dithering, and... John Chilcot? Yes. What he added with
:22:47. > :22:50.debt? Absolutely. Let's look at the people on the panel. John Chilcot is
:22:51. > :23:03.deeply embedded in the establishment. -- Wattie out of his
:23:04. > :23:09.depth? -- was he. You had one person who was completely clueless, way out
:23:10. > :23:17.of her depth. A very experienced person. She was very out of her
:23:18. > :23:22.depth. The 1 person who made some sense was the former British
:23:23. > :23:28.ambassador to Moscow. A low-grade panel. OK but you have always had
:23:29. > :23:35.strong views on the Iraq war, you were opposed to it, you were against
:23:36. > :23:42.it. Is there anything that changes your mind by doing this enquiry?
:23:43. > :23:46.What was extraordinary, going into it, was the weight of the testimony
:23:47. > :23:51.that Tony Blair represented to Parliament. I had a long
:23:52. > :24:01.conversation with Hans Blix in which he said to me that it wasn't just
:24:02. > :24:12.the notorious dossier of December 2002 but also in the famous last
:24:13. > :24:19.speech of Tony Blair to Parliament, he misrepresented what Hans Blix had
:24:20. > :24:21.found, and the weapons inspectors. I then had a conversation with Sir
:24:22. > :24:28.Stephen Wall, the Prime Minister's European private secretary, in which
:24:29. > :24:33.he witnessed Tony Blair and Alistair Campbell telling lies to the Sun
:24:34. > :24:40.newspaper. That was in order to set up President Chirac. What is
:24:41. > :24:43.interesting is how the weight of testimony was knowingly misled by
:24:44. > :24:49.the British Prime Minister of the day, and also that the testimony --
:24:50. > :24:56.that the testimony of the war is illegal. All advisers advised that
:24:57. > :25:00.the war was illegal. I said at the end of my long conversation with
:25:01. > :25:04.Hans Blix, can I just summarise what you said to me? You are saying that
:25:05. > :25:07.the Prime Minister misrepresented the facts about the war to the
:25:08. > :25:14.British people in order to sell an illegal war. Yes, I am a diplomat, I
:25:15. > :25:20.do not use such language but essentially what you are saying is
:25:21. > :25:33.true. But he is not a lawyer. He is very experienced. 27 Foreign Office
:25:34. > :25:42.lawyers... Yes, but... Yes, at 27 -- all 27 Foreign Office lawyers...
:25:43. > :25:47.That is very interesting but opinion is so polarised on the subject of
:25:48. > :25:51.Chilcot, I would suggest that both sides will be trying to reinforce
:25:52. > :25:56.what they already think. It is not the first time a report like this
:25:57. > :25:59.has taken a long time. It is frustrating. For the families it
:26:00. > :26:06.needs to happen quickly. At least we now have a date and it will happen
:26:07. > :26:09.in the summer. Before this, it could have been 2017 but at least it is
:26:10. > :26:14.next year. It is the families who need to know but also everybody
:26:15. > :26:19.needs to learn the lessons. When we debated intervening in Syria when
:26:20. > :26:24.Parliament was recalled, all the debate was about going back to
:26:25. > :26:28.lessons learned in Iraq. If we had the Chilcot report, we would have
:26:29. > :26:36.been better position. We need it now. The lessons needs to be learned
:26:37. > :26:42.quickly. OK. 8pm, BBC Radio four, tonight.
:26:43. > :26:45.Now, just over an hour ago China announced that it was to end
:26:46. > :26:48.Women will now be able to have two children.
:26:49. > :26:51.The decision was all part of China's next Five Year Plan,
:26:52. > :27:07.the country's 13th, and it looks a little different.
:27:08. > :28:12.Hey, have you heard what is going on in China?
:28:13. > :28:17.There you go, the Chinese propaganda department really watching too much
:28:18. > :28:22.Sesame Street the state! Write-down to American accent! -- these days.
:28:23. > :28:25.With us now is the Diane Wei Liang, who's an author and commentator
:28:26. > :28:35.The 1 child policy now being scrapped, that is because China now
:28:36. > :28:39.has a demographic problem, it is running out of people. Not exactly
:28:40. > :28:45.running out of people. It is running out of young people, and China has
:28:46. > :28:50.an inverted pyramid which means you have grandparents and parents who
:28:51. > :28:55.are now living longer and longer but with fewer young people to support
:28:56. > :29:05.them. Exactly. And the endless supplies of Labour has been drying
:29:06. > :29:12.up? Yes. The costs are high now. That is not only part of
:29:13. > :29:21.demographics but the Labour costs have risen. This touchy-feely, nice
:29:22. > :29:27.cartoon that we saw, is part of that not to hide the fact that the real
:29:28. > :29:34.go-go years, of 10% plus growth, they are over now? China will grow
:29:35. > :29:40.strongly as you expect a developing economy to do that no double-digit
:29:41. > :29:46.growth any more. With China's current economic size, you would not
:29:47. > :29:55.expect to grow to double digits. It is a new phase, about 7%. At that
:29:56. > :30:01.growth, we are looking at doubling output in ten years, and there is
:30:02. > :30:08.still a massive output economically at 7%. Today's growth equals 14% in
:30:09. > :30:16.2011, said China is growing very fast. The calculation is I have seen
:30:17. > :30:22.have suggested the growth rate is between four and 5% but the real
:30:23. > :30:28.significance of this five-year plan is that it marks the move of China
:30:29. > :30:33.from being a manufacturing lead smokestack industry economy to a
:30:34. > :30:40.more and more service consumer led economy.
:30:41. > :30:45.That's right and while manufacturing had been flowing and the service
:30:46. > :30:51.injury growing, it was 18% last year, now service industry counts
:30:52. > :30:56.for half of China's GDP. A bigger share of GDP than manufacturing now?
:30:57. > :31:00.It is moving that direction. This new five-year plan in itself is also
:31:01. > :31:04.slightly different. Not only in the way that you see, you know, the
:31:05. > :31:09.little commercial here, it is very Xi. And President Xi is sort of rock
:31:10. > :31:14.'n' roll President in China, believe it or not, he might not appear so
:31:15. > :31:18.when he visited the Queen last week but this plan is a little different
:31:19. > :31:24.from the last one, in that the economic element of it is going to
:31:25. > :31:28.be only 10%. 90% of the plan is going to focus on social reforms,
:31:29. > :31:35.political reforms, environmental issues. And that, again, brings in
:31:36. > :31:40.the One Child Policy, part of the social reform that will be pushed
:31:41. > :31:46.through in this plan. He is not a Liberal is he? He has been tougher
:31:47. > :31:52.since he became President. There has been a tougher crackdown on human
:31:53. > :31:56.rights' issues and dissidents under him than his predecessor? There are
:31:57. > :32:02.two points - Xi is a politically strong man. He is he has incredible
:32:03. > :32:05.power, because of his background and also because of his political
:32:06. > :32:14.astuteness and also he is pro business. He is anti-corruption
:32:15. > :32:17.which has touched on lots of high level politicians, CEOs of
:32:18. > :32:23.state-owned introprizes. By in large it is all private sectors which
:32:24. > :32:29.accounts for 80% of China's output so he is doing this, in one way to
:32:30. > :32:32.clean up the party. Let's remember the Chairman of state-owned
:32:33. > :32:36.introprizes, they are all party members. -- enterprises. At the same
:32:37. > :32:42.time he is trying to drive the business side. If China is moving to
:32:43. > :32:45.more of a consumer-driven, service economy, less of an export-led
:32:46. > :32:51.manufacturing economy, who are the winners and losers? I would suggest
:32:52. > :32:54.the emerging market commodity producers are losers because China
:32:55. > :32:59.won't need as many commodities, they are in trouble. Germany is in a bit
:33:00. > :33:02.of trouble because they are the big exporters of manufactured products
:33:03. > :33:05.and there is a huge opportunity for Britain, because we are world
:33:06. > :33:10.leaders in services and China will need more services? That's
:33:11. > :33:15.absolutely true. When you saw the steel plans, closing in the UK and
:33:16. > :33:20.-- the steel plants closing in the UK and it was the commodity, the
:33:21. > :33:26.demand, re-Will for reduction and steel plants are closing in China
:33:27. > :33:31.but the UK is in the perfect foegs trade with China for the next 20
:33:32. > :33:35.years and that's what China is interested N -- perfect position to
:33:36. > :33:40.trade with China. And what last week was about. Here is the big change.
:33:41. > :33:43.When Mr Cameron became leader of the Tory Party and leader, he talked
:33:44. > :33:47.about the big relationship Britain was going to have with India. That
:33:48. > :33:56.is not happening. The big relationship is with China and how
:33:57. > :34:00.Mr Mhrodi will be treated will be a few carpets left than the Chineseth
:34:01. > :34:04.President. Our Prime Minister sees the future much more with China an
:34:05. > :34:09.India. I don't see that. When we saw the plan, it reminded me of India
:34:10. > :34:12.which has five-year plans, the hangover frot socialist days. But
:34:13. > :34:17.India is exactly the opposite where China is concerned. India's
:34:18. > :34:22.population is increasing. I have always thought the One Child Policy
:34:23. > :34:26.has been, in my view not the right policy, it is inhumane, cause the
:34:27. > :34:34.problems, and it is not right. I'm pleased it it is done away with but
:34:35. > :34:38.in India it'll take over by 2005-30. India has a consumer-driven growth.
:34:39. > :34:42.Independentia, the opposite of China, targeting 25% of the GDPs to
:34:43. > :34:46.be manufacturing and wants to grow manufacturing. I think there is a
:34:47. > :34:50.huge opportunity for Britain with China and India. All I can tell you
:34:51. > :34:55.is dealing with the Foreign Office, all they want to talk about is
:34:56. > :34:59.China. . After Mr Mhodi's visit, that will change.
:35:00. > :35:01.The Office for National Statistics have this morning released new
:35:02. > :35:06.They show Britain to be both growing and ageing.
:35:07. > :35:11.On current trends we are expected to overtake France and become
:35:12. > :35:14.the second largest country in Europe by 2030 and become the largest
:35:15. > :35:29.This is on present trends. That will overtake Germany.
:35:30. > :35:32.The UK's population is projected to increase
:35:33. > :35:35.by 9.7 million over the next 25 years, reaching 70 million by 2027
:35:36. > :35:47.The population of England is projected to increase
:35:48. > :36:00.The vast majority of the increase. #12k3w4r that's less than ten years
:36:01. > :36:04.away. -- that's less than ten years away and will increase by
:36:05. > :36:07.The populations of the other UK countries will grow at
:36:08. > :36:14.51% of the population rise over the next 25 years is expected to be
:36:15. > :36:18.The population is also projected to continue ageing
:36:19. > :36:30.That doesn't seem a will the but means a big difference.
:36:31. > :36:33.And by that time, more than 1 in 12 of the population
:36:34. > :36:38.By 2039 there are projected to be 370 people of pensionable age per
:36:39. > :36:43.1,000 people of working age - up from from 310 in 2014.
:36:44. > :36:50.You see the trend. Growing population but also more pensioners
:36:51. > :37:00.as a percentage of the overall population. With us now, we have a
:37:01. > :37:06.journalist from the Guardian and an Conservative MP. . We have an
:37:07. > :37:10.growing segment of the population. And there are other statistics out
:37:11. > :37:15.in the last 24 hours showing how incomes are rising. We need to in
:37:16. > :37:18.some way pay for all of that. If we didn't have younger people coming
:37:19. > :37:22.into the population then those figures would be completely skewed
:37:23. > :37:26.in another way. Would they be worse in a sense? They would be worse. A
:37:27. > :37:30.higher percentage of pensionable age. Exactly. Good thing? With
:37:31. > :37:34.population comes power, if you handle it right. We will be the
:37:35. > :37:38.biggest country by population in Europe, by the middle of the
:37:39. > :37:43.searching tri? ? This is a very good sign for the future of our country.
:37:44. > :37:47.--. Search tri. I I gree with that point. We are in a strong position
:37:48. > :37:51.and the growing population means we are bringing in more young people,
:37:52. > :37:55.which helps to balance the age of our population which is a good
:37:56. > :37:59.thing. Do you have any concerns and many were expressed to me this
:38:00. > :38:03.morning on Twitter. Let me put it like this - it is all because of
:38:04. > :38:06.immigration. It is not all because of immigration. I understand that
:38:07. > :38:11.but I'm acting as a reporter here. Is this something we should be
:38:12. > :38:14.concerned about, or is it a plus? Well, the question is whether people
:38:15. > :38:19.in this country feel in control of what is happening. And if
:38:20. > :38:25.politicians are promising things like cutting net migration from
:38:26. > :38:31.hundreds of thousands of to tens of thousands which sounds like a 90%
:38:32. > :38:36.cut but at the time the promise was made it would only be a 50% cut and
:38:37. > :38:43.then they failed to achieve that and promised the again, thisp isn't
:38:44. > :38:47.going to make people feel confident in politicians' promises. It isn't
:38:48. > :38:51.always the case. There are many things driving it but there is free
:38:52. > :38:56.movement in the European Union. Whether people like it or not it is
:38:57. > :39:02.now inevitable that the face of this country is going to change. Is
:39:03. > :39:07.rising populations are going to be disproportionately from recent
:39:08. > :39:09.arrivals, from new arrivals, from first, second, third generation,
:39:10. > :39:14.sons and daughters of first, second, third generation,
:39:15. > :39:16.going to be, they are the growing bit of our population? Really
:39:17. > :39:20.going to be, they are the growing moment, the problem is we are not
:39:21. > :39:24.catering for non-retired people, if you want, very well at all. We
:39:25. > :39:28.already know about housing. I mean we have had dozens and dozens of
:39:29. > :39:33.people talk about housing this year I'm sure with you and how much it is
:39:34. > :39:36.an issue. And we have issues with childcare and schooling. We haven't
:39:37. > :39:38.built enough schools. We are not catering for the growing segment of
:39:39. > :39:42.our population. any nacsent economic benefits almost
:39:43. > :39:47.from the very any nacsent economic benefits almost
:39:48. > :39:51.issue. Isn't that an issue which any nacsent economic benefits almost
:39:52. > :39:54.politicians on both sides of the House have let us down, and
:39:55. > :39:55.politicians on both sides of the step up to the crease on, that
:39:56. > :39:58.people can welcome a step up to the crease on, that
:39:59. > :40:00.population, but it means step up to the crease on, that
:40:01. > :40:04.more schools, we need more step up to the crease on, that
:40:05. > :40:10.homes above all - step up to the crease on, that
:40:11. > :40:15.that, have failed news that step up to the crease on, that
:40:16. > :40:21.Failed is a bienry thing. I think there has been some failure. . I
:40:22. > :40:28.think we need to do much better. It needs more investment. As a
:40:29. > :40:31.think we need to do much better. It class. We have to do better. But the
:40:32. > :40:36.Government is pushing the homes class. We have to do better. But the
:40:37. > :40:39.issue now more strongly. What is remarkable under a Conservative
:40:40. > :40:43.Government, you would have thought, horrors of horrors, the level of
:40:44. > :40:49.housing ownership has gone down. Which usually defines a Tory voter.
:40:50. > :40:52.It has gone down from 69% of the population to 64% of the population
:40:53. > :40:57.owning their own homes, it is terrible. There has been
:40:58. > :41:01.owning their own homes, it is in buy-to-let. Should Britain
:41:02. > :41:07.rejoice that its population is growing so quickly? I mean many
:41:08. > :41:09.people - you are too young - but in the '60s and '70, the
:41:10. > :41:14.people - you are too young - but in this nation was of decline. Senior
:41:15. > :41:21.civil servants would talk about the nature of decline, people were
:41:22. > :41:26.queueing to leave. The orderly nature of decline. One used
:41:27. > :41:31.civilised to me. It is a huge change. It is a change, if you look
:41:32. > :41:37.at it positively it is xenlt. What is challenging is the be Bernard's
:41:38. > :41:41.point, the Government setting ridiculous targets for migration. We
:41:42. > :41:43.are three times of it. We need an immigration policy where we are
:41:44. > :41:48.encouraging the skilled people this country needs to support the ageing
:41:49. > :41:50.population. For example, the Indian restaurant industry, the curry
:41:51. > :41:56.restaurant, they cannot bring in the chefs. The tech any, there has been
:41:57. > :42:00.a list signed by the Who's Who saying - please allow us to bring
:42:01. > :42:04.in. I thought you were allowed to bring them in. They are having
:42:05. > :42:12.trouble. It is very discriminatory. With students and academics, 30% of
:42:13. > :42:15.our academicsing are foreign. Theresa May's attitude towards
:42:16. > :42:19.international students have shocking, she wants them to leave
:42:20. > :42:23.the day after they graduate. Where does she say that? Because we are in
:42:24. > :42:29.the European Union we have a discriminatory policy. We let in
:42:30. > :42:33.anybody from within the European Union, even shob has just bought an
:42:34. > :42:38.eastern European passport, even if they are a national of other country
:42:39. > :42:41.they have all the rights of an etch U citizen and we have Draconian
:42:42. > :42:48.controls against people and countries outside the European
:42:49. > :42:52.Union, even if we want their skills. Except that immigration from non-EU
:42:53. > :42:58.countries is also way above 100,000. That's true. With you Bo with you we
:42:59. > :43:01.keep including international students within the immigration
:43:02. > :43:05.figures, which is ridiculous. We have a fairer and more humane
:43:06. > :43:08.immigration policy if we had uniform control over who decides. We need to
:43:09. > :43:12.take back that control. We will be returning to this, to Europe, that
:43:13. > :43:15.is, and to our population. Thank you to both of you coming N
:43:16. > :43:18.Now if you like a good chicken tika masala and a pint,
:43:19. > :43:21.chances are you've tasted the tipple our Guest of the Day invented.
:43:22. > :43:23.Karan Bilimoria founded Cobra beer in 1989.
:43:24. > :43:26.An aspiring entrepreneur, he saw the need for a beer that was less gassy
:43:27. > :43:30.Cobra claims to be as refreshing as the former,
:43:31. > :43:41.And now, the company supplies over 98% of the UK's Indian
:43:42. > :43:49.That's called a monopoly. Get the commission on to him
:43:50. > :43:51.Other beers, I'd like to point out, are available.
:43:52. > :43:54.Our Ellie went to speak to our Guest of the Day in his office.
:43:55. > :44:00.By day, he runs a successful beer company,
:44:01. > :44:08.There is one word that sums up a entrepreneur.
:44:09. > :44:14.You have to have the guts to do it in the first place
:44:15. > :44:17.but also the guts to stay with it when others would give up.
:44:18. > :44:19.I nearly lost my business three times over the
:44:20. > :44:23.years and each time, getting through those crises was a challenge and
:44:24. > :44:27.bouncing back from them and learning from them and continuing to grow.
:44:28. > :44:29.Karan Bilimoria was born in Hyderabad in the '60s.
:44:30. > :44:33.He went to university there at the ender age of 16.
:44:34. > :44:36.He then came over to London to train as an accountant, before graduating
:44:37. > :44:41.It was there he first came up with the idea of Cobra beer.
:44:42. > :44:52.Britain was the sick man of Europe, when entrepreneurship was looked
:44:53. > :44:55.down upon and conjured up images of Delboy second-hand car salesmen.
:44:56. > :44:57.Entrepreneurship now in this country is celebrated.
:44:58. > :44:58.There is huge support for entrepreneurs.
:44:59. > :45:00.There are huge networks of entrepreneurs.
:45:01. > :45:01.There is finance available that I didn't have,
:45:02. > :45:05.There is the internet which didn't exist 25 years ago
:45:06. > :45:10.In many ways, there is no better time to be
:45:11. > :45:18.The England I came to three decades ago, compared to the UK today,
:45:19. > :45:20.this is a country that has improved in leaps
:45:21. > :45:29.Karan Bilimoria, CBE, became Lord Bilimoria in 2006.
:45:30. > :45:31.In Britain we have a lot going for us.
:45:32. > :45:35.We are less than 1% of the world's population but have the
:45:36. > :45:41.And he has strong opinions on how the place he now calls home,
:45:42. > :45:47.We have an immigration policy over the last
:45:48. > :45:52.five years, under a Home Secretary, Theresa May, that I think is
:45:53. > :45:57.damaging our economy, damaging our universities and I say this openly.
:45:58. > :46:04.I find Theresa May's immigration policies economically illiterate.
:46:05. > :46:09.Away from showing his strength in the Lords, he has branched out
:46:10. > :46:12.in the world of tech and launched a new picture-sharing app.
:46:13. > :46:21.A new challenge for someone who likes to win stuff.
:46:22. > :46:23.And we're joined now by another British entrepreneur, Charlie
:46:24. > :46:26.Mullins, who founded Pimlico Plumbers.
:46:27. > :46:35.Is it a good country to do business? Undoubtably, absolutely brilliant.
:46:36. > :46:41.Things are going from stronger to stronger, and the stronger the
:46:42. > :46:47.economy is becoming. Better in your view? Undoubtably. What has changed?
:46:48. > :46:54.The Tories getting youngsters into work. Was it not good doing business
:46:55. > :46:59.under the last Labour government until the great crash? We nearly
:47:00. > :47:04.went bust or we did go bust! That was more to do with sub-prime
:47:05. > :47:09.mortgages in America. It was under Labour's watch. They just happened
:47:10. > :47:14.to be in power. You telling me that there would not have been a crash if
:47:15. > :47:19.the Tories were in power? The death as it may not have been as big but
:47:20. > :47:24.we are onto a winner. Do you agree? Asked macro deficit. The Labour
:47:25. > :47:31.government and publishing government have been pro-enterprise. The
:47:32. > :47:37.networks and finances that exist, the support that exists,
:47:38. > :47:42.entrepreneurialism is great now. Does that mean it is easier than
:47:43. > :47:46.when you started out? When you started out, given the atmosphere
:47:47. > :47:53.and hurdles in your way, you needed gut. Maybe not so much now? If there
:47:54. > :48:02.is one word that defines being an entrepreneur, it it is guts. The
:48:03. > :48:07.guts, you always need them, it is always going to be against all odds.
:48:08. > :48:11.What is greatest technology, communications, travel. You can
:48:12. > :48:19.start and think global from day one. We are thinking global immediately.
:48:20. > :48:23.It may be a good place to do business for businessmen like
:48:24. > :48:29.yourself that is it not a place where there is a low-wage economy?
:48:30. > :48:36.Yes, I agree, I think we should increase wages. What is stopping
:48:37. > :48:42.you? We are paying more than you do, Andrew! That is not a high
:48:43. > :48:53.benchmark! What is the average salary of one of these people who
:48:54. > :49:01.works in your van birthmark plumber? -- 150 grams is the top end,
:49:02. > :49:19.anything from 80 grand. -- 150 grand. I have an apprenticeship? --
:49:20. > :49:22.can I. I mean, I am not against what we are saying about students staying
:49:23. > :49:29.or going, the most important thing is getting them into work and making
:49:30. > :49:37.them pay tax. Did you advertise for French plumbers? ?125,000? Yes. Did
:49:38. > :49:42.you run out of Polish plumbers? They are building London at the moment!
:49:43. > :49:48.We would not have an Olympics without them! The salaries are
:49:49. > :49:53.amazing but they are not the average. The latest figures suggest
:49:54. > :49:58.this may be a good country to do business but there are many people,
:49:59. > :50:02.particularly outside of London, on low wages. That is what the tax
:50:03. > :50:05.credit argument is all about, they are not paid enough to bring up
:50:06. > :50:11.families, they needs to be supplemented by tax. Although we are
:50:12. > :50:16.doing well as an economy and encouraging entrepreneurism, or we
:50:17. > :50:20.are lagging on productivity. The governments over the year not
:50:21. > :50:27.invested enough in education and skills. -- years. The amount we
:50:28. > :50:34.spend on a proportion of GDP is half that of America's. Research and
:50:35. > :50:39.development and innovation, we invest very low compared to the EU.
:50:40. > :50:43.South Korea spends double of what we do on this. We have to do this. That
:50:44. > :50:52.will increase productivity and the wages and makers more popular. --
:50:53. > :51:01.make us. We should be investing more on apprenticeships. Anyhow, you are
:51:02. > :51:08.doing a great job. Oh, you're speaking to him! Thank you.
:51:09. > :51:10.Now, doesn't time fly when you're having fun?
:51:11. > :51:13.The nights are already drawing in, Halloween's just a couple
:51:14. > :51:16.Bonfire night's next week, and there's just 56 days till Christmas.
:51:17. > :51:25.Westminster Dog of the Year has come around AGAIN.
:51:26. > :51:30.Never one to miss a beauty contest, our Giles checked out the runners
:51:31. > :51:53.# Walking the dog. # Guests who is walking the dog?
:51:54. > :51:57.# There comes a time in the Parliamentary year when they put
:51:58. > :52:00.aside tax credit cuts, renewal of Trident is shelved, and
:52:01. > :52:11.representatives of the mother of all parliaments get moments to say, oh,
:52:12. > :52:17.look at that lovely dog! Can I just point out the serious bit? The hosts
:52:18. > :52:26.do this event to celebrate not just all things dog but to promote
:52:27. > :52:29.re-homing and rescuing. He lives on the outskirts of my constituency and
:52:30. > :52:32.comes from a shelter and she is the office dog. She has
:52:33. > :52:41.comes from a shelter and she is the personality which. You need
:52:42. > :52:50.canning, and fashion plays a part. From Tweed to Willie jumpers. This
:52:51. > :52:55.year came Carla. She has done a tour of Afghanistan, she searches for
:52:56. > :53:05.explosives, she can find the parts to trigger explosives, and she is an
:53:06. > :53:08.amazing animal. Her handlers are here today. It takes 16
:53:09. > :53:11.amazing animal. Her handlers are train a dog out, and we are
:53:12. > :53:16.showcasing the work they do. Admirable stuff from the dog, but
:53:17. > :53:20.MPs will go to great lengths to take a lead and lick the opposition. It
:53:21. > :53:23.seems doggy lobbying is a bone of contention. The do not
:53:24. > :53:27.seems doggy lobbying is a bone of e-mail? It is a democracy and we
:53:28. > :53:30.drew attention, and it is amazing the other entrants that followed in
:53:31. > :53:31.drew attention, and it is amazing my wake. Does this kind of thing
:53:32. > :53:41.work, this lobbying? No! All that my wake. Does this kind of thing
:53:42. > :53:50.before someone has made a complete dog's breakfast of the press photo.
:53:51. > :53:53.Once more, just like that! Honestly, it is much
:53:54. > :54:00.Once more, just like that! Honestly, MDs! Dogs like to chase and shoot
:54:01. > :54:13.balls so perhaps it is apt that the new winner belongs to the MP for
:54:14. > :54:48.Morley. She has a very special way of celebrating victory. DOG SINGS.
:54:49. > :54:51.I'm joined now by the Conservative Mps Hugo Swire and Andrea Jenkyns,
:54:52. > :54:53.with their dogs - Rocco, Lady and Godiva.
:54:54. > :54:59.Godiva enjoys singing, it started years ago, and when I was teaching,
:55:00. > :55:07.she joined in with me. Well, congratulations. You wonder the
:55:08. > :55:17.online competition. Yes, the Democratic people's boat! -- vote.
:55:18. > :55:29.It is not a financial instrument. But you can paint quite hard, didn't
:55:30. > :55:34.you? -- campaigned. We were encouraged by the Can CLUB, we had
:55:35. > :55:41.an online thing, and brought it to people's attention. There were 19
:55:42. > :55:44.entrants, 15 were Conservative entrants, the others were Labour. Do
:55:45. > :55:52.Tories have more dogs or do they like showboating their dogs more? We
:55:53. > :55:59.are a nation of animal lovers. Cross-party? Crossbreeding
:56:00. > :56:04.cross-party? It is great fun, I had a look this morning, but there is a
:56:05. > :56:15.serious side because it promotes the Can all Club to promote responsible
:56:16. > :56:22.dog ownership because some dogs are still very badly treated. -- Kennel
:56:23. > :56:31.Club. Are I am on the all Parliamentary group for animal
:56:32. > :56:40.welfare. Now it is time to play... Here we go. Who is this and what is
:56:41. > :56:51.the name of his pooch? It is George Bush, the first it is easy, but what
:56:52. > :56:56.is the dog? Blair? ! No, it is Barney, the Spanish terrier.
:56:57. > :57:02.President Putin said, you call that a dog? He has a Scottish terrier
:57:03. > :57:08.called Miss Beazley. And this? That is Cherie Blair. That is the Downing
:57:09. > :57:18.Street cat of the day called Humphrey. This is trickier. That is
:57:19. > :57:33.Lloyd George. And the dog? The dog... It rhymes with rug. Pug! And
:57:34. > :57:41.that is Gerald Ford, and what is the name of this dog? It is what
:57:42. > :57:53.Americans like to think they always believe in. Land of the... Free. The
:57:54. > :58:01.name of the dog is liberty. President Obama with a cute little
:58:02. > :58:06.dog, what is that? At Oxford and Cambridge you do what? Row. It
:58:07. > :58:15.rhymes with that. It is Bow. There's just time before we go to
:58:16. > :58:18.find out the answer to our quiz. newspaper or magazine has Jeremy
:58:19. > :58:21.Corbyn been pictured carrying? the Sun or Simply Knitting? So
:58:22. > :58:37.what's the correct answer? It is the Sun newspaper. That is the
:58:38. > :58:42.right answer! Anyway, congratulations to the dogs. The
:58:43. > :58:47.news is on BBC One, and I will be here tonight on BBC One.
:58:48. > :58:50.I'll be here joined by Alex Salmond, Margaret Hodge, Julia Hartley
:58:51. > :58:55.Brewer, Michael Portillo, Melvyn Bragg, and Kevin Maguire tonight on