:00:37. > :00:38.Hello, and welcome to the Daily Politics.
:00:39. > :00:40.Nearly 24 hours after the Chancellor delivered his budget,
:00:41. > :00:44.and as always the devil's in the detail.
:00:45. > :00:47.Mr Osborne's already under fire over cuts to disability benefits,
:00:48. > :00:50.and the so-called tampon tax, and this morning he's had to reject
:00:51. > :00:52.suggestions that there may have to be more tax rises or spending
:00:53. > :00:56.cuts if he wants to eliminate the deficit by the end of this
:00:57. > :01:06.The Chancellor also announced a sugar tax on fizzy drinks.
:01:07. > :01:08.Our Adam's been out with his bon-bons, to see how well that's
:01:09. > :01:20.What chance EU leaders can stem the flow of migrants from Turkey?
:01:21. > :01:21.They're meeting in Brussels later today.
:01:22. > :01:31.And is this the funniest budget joke ever, ever, ever?
:01:32. > :01:34.Indeed, the former Pensions Minister the Liberal Democrat Steve Webb said
:01:35. > :01:36."I was trying to abolish the lump sum."
:01:37. > :01:39.Instead, we are going to keep the lump sum and abolish the Liberal
:01:40. > :01:51.All that in the next hour, and with us for the duration,
:01:52. > :01:53.the BBC's former economics editor, now JP Morgan's chief market
:01:54. > :01:58.strategist for Europe, Stephanie Flanders.
:01:59. > :02:03.So at just over 9,000 words, and an hour long, George Osborne
:02:04. > :02:11.delivered his eighth budget yesterday.
:02:12. > :02:13.Against a backdrop of deepening Conservative division over Europe,
:02:14. > :02:17.and a gloomy economic outlook, the Chancellor waged war
:02:18. > :02:24.Sugar addicts may be relieved to hear, loop-holes are aplenty.
:02:25. > :02:29.Jammie-dodgers and donuts escaped the Chancellor's ire.
:02:30. > :02:33.As is traditional the morning after, Mr Osborne gave a round of Breakfast
:02:34. > :02:36.interviews - he probably needed an Irn-Bru to get through it all.
:02:37. > :02:42.In Britain we have a growing economy, we have got unemployment
:02:43. > :02:43.coming down, we saw that again today.
:02:44. > :02:47.And what I'm saying in this Budget is we have got to hold to the course
:02:48. > :02:51.we have set out, we have got to take action now on the public
:02:52. > :02:54.finances so we are stable and secure and don't pay later and we have got
:02:55. > :02:56.to back small businesses, the self-employed, working people,
:02:57. > :02:58.by cutting their taxes and helping our
:02:59. > :03:10.We set out the plan to do that in the Budget.
:03:11. > :03:17.When you stand back from all the details, does this budget change the
:03:18. > :03:20.macroeconomic course of this economy? Well it changes the
:03:21. > :03:25.forecast but that is the forecast that he was dealing with from the
:03:26. > :03:30.Office for Budget Responsibility, the backdrop was that the office for
:03:31. > :03:36.national statistic, the cash value of the economy was smaller than
:03:37. > :03:40.think thought, about a month after the Autumn Statement, they decided
:03:41. > :03:44.that, and the Office for Budget Responsibility has decided to be
:03:45. > :03:47.gloomier about our long-term growth prospects and particularly
:03:48. > :03:52.productivity, a growth in out put per head. So he was keel dealing
:03:53. > :03:57.with lower revenue forecast over ?50 billion extra black hole in the
:03:58. > :04:03.public finances. But, and he is partly responded to that, but also
:04:04. > :04:07.used some smoke and mirrors to still beat that, have that surplus at the
:04:08. > :04:11.end of the Parliament. I thought it was kind of impressive with the
:04:12. > :04:17.straight face he can still talk about the long-term plan and holding
:04:18. > :04:21.fast to his pinss. The buzz words Avoiding short-term fixes when this
:04:22. > :04:27.was another big change in forecast for spending, masses of Tyne qlitle
:04:28. > :04:29.gimmicks and -- gimmicks worthy of Gordon Brown. Some worse than things
:04:30. > :04:34.that Gordon Brown would have announced. I thought it was a shame,
:04:35. > :04:41.there was a lot of micro changes but not a clear strategy, not a clear,
:04:42. > :04:45.you know, when you think about long-term tax reform, there wasn't a
:04:46. > :04:51.clear line of thought, you know, he says he is against cop rap-of-rat
:04:52. > :04:56.tax evasion, the old Chancellor Nigel Lawson used to say you get rid
:04:57. > :05:00.of it by narrowing the gap between personal taxes and corporation tax,
:05:01. > :05:05.it has widened again, so I thought it was a bit of as me, but we ended
:05:06. > :05:10.up thinking he is politically shrewd and he is of course. Very well..
:05:11. > :05:15.The question for today is - there's been a bit of a hoo-ha over
:05:16. > :05:18.whether male presenters are always positioned on the left of the screen
:05:19. > :05:22.Some have argued it's sexist that the women in a presenting duo
:05:23. > :05:24.are always positioned to the right of the man.
:05:25. > :05:39.or d) Her Majesty's Daily Politics.
:05:40. > :05:42.At the end of the show Stephanie will give us the correct answer
:05:43. > :05:56.So the Chancellor blamed the economic slowdown
:05:57. > :05:58.on a "dangerous cocktail" of global risks.
:05:59. > :06:03.And he warned that the UK would have to act now or pay later.
:06:04. > :06:06.His promise to return public finances to the black by 2020 looks
:06:07. > :06:11.Yesterday, he revealed he needed to borrow ?56 billion more
:06:12. > :06:14.than expected over the next five years, in stark contrast
:06:15. > :06:17.to an announcement in November, when he said he had an extra
:06:18. > :06:36.The personal tax allowance will rise to ?11, 500 in 2017.
:06:37. > :06:38.And the higher rate tax threshold will increase
:06:39. > :06:45.Corporation tax is to be cut from 20% to 17% by 2020.
:06:46. > :06:51.And the Government plans to raise ?12 billion by 2020 by cracking down
:06:52. > :06:57.Good news for small businesses - they will see a new threshold
:06:58. > :07:01.for their rate relief, rising from ?6,000 up
:07:02. > :07:08.For savers, the ISA limit will be increased to ?20,000 a year
:07:09. > :07:12.for all savers and lifetime ISAs with a 25% bonus will be introduced
:07:13. > :07:25.A new sugar tax - the Chancellor's headline measure-
:07:26. > :07:28.A new sugar tax - the Chancellor's headline measure -
:07:29. > :07:29.will be introduced in two years' time.
:07:30. > :07:32.The levy will be added to sugary drinks raising ?520 million,
:07:33. > :07:34.to be then spent on primary school sport.
:07:35. > :07:40.That's for the sixth year in a row now.
:07:41. > :07:42.And there's a 2% tax increase on cigarettes,
:07:43. > :07:51.but beer, cider and spirit duties will all be frozen.
:07:52. > :07:54.Let's talk now to Sam Coates from the Times, and Isabel Hardman
:07:55. > :07:56.from the Spectator who are on College Green.
:07:57. > :08:01., it has widened again, so I thought it was a bit of as me, but we ended
:08:02. > :08:04.up thinking he is politically shrewd and he is of course. Very well..
:08:05. > :08:07.Welcome to both of you. Sam, the big surprise was the sugar tax, do you
:08:08. > :08:10.think that was done mainly to deflect from the fact he was missing
:08:11. > :08:13.his own fiscal targets? Think some of George Osborne's allies were
:08:14. > :08:19.pretty much saying that yesterday, look, I think this is a fascinating
:08:20. > :08:23.budget. It is a budget of two halve, the tough he wants to do now, many
:08:24. > :08:27.will kick in in the first half of this Parliament. The stuff he thinks
:08:28. > :08:32.the popular, lie the sugar tax, the fuel duty freeze, the Isa for the
:08:33. > :08:37.under 40s, the income tax cuts, they are going to come in pretty soon.
:08:38. > :08:41.What he did with his financial jiggery-pokery and moving the years
:08:42. > :08:45.some of the bad news to the end. He pushed off the difficult stuff to
:08:46. > :08:50.the end of the Parliament. Would be Chancellor if 2019 after they had to
:08:51. > :08:53.find in one year ?30 billion of fiscal consolidation? The political
:08:54. > :08:56.point being we know the answer to that. In 2019 George Osborne is
:08:57. > :09:00.probably not going to be the Chancellor, because whatever else is
:09:01. > :09:02.going to happen, there are a Tory leadership contest and George
:09:03. > :09:07.Osborne at that point will either be up or out of that job. It is all
:09:08. > :09:12.about the politics because we have the backdrop of the EU referendum,
:09:13. > :09:19.his leadership ambitions, but how much trouble is he in in terms of
:09:20. > :09:23.credibility and trust, by not meeting those rules for now? He
:09:24. > :09:27.should be in a lot of trouble by right, what lets him off from having
:09:28. > :09:31.missed his target and being on track to miss a third one, is Labour isn't
:09:32. > :09:35.a credible opposition, Jeremy Corbyn did quite a good job yesterday at
:09:36. > :09:39.the despatch box in the House of Commons but he has very little
:09:40. > :09:43.support from MPs and he has terrible ratings as Labour leader, and this
:09:44. > :09:46.means there is no heat at all on George Osborne when he makes
:09:47. > :09:49.mistakes or misses targets he himself has chosen to set. He can
:09:50. > :09:53.get away with it. He can probably set more he is going to miss for
:09:54. > :09:59.another five years if he wants to. The heat coming from some people on
:10:00. > :10:03.the Tory backbenches, particularly over this issue of cuts as many
:10:04. > :10:08.people see it to disability payment, is that going to cause him trouble
:10:09. > :10:13.that will lead to him U-turning? ? It is fascinating. The big picture
:10:14. > :10:19.policy doesn't seem to be causing too many problems or a few people
:10:20. > :10:22.who whinge about the sur plus, not many people think he should be
:10:23. > :10:27.cutting harder. There are two or three areas where there the start a
:10:28. > :10:31.Tory rebellion, there is an underground one on the PIP, the
:10:32. > :10:35.disability cuts outlined yesterday, Tories trying to negotiate in
:10:36. > :10:38.private with the Chancellor to whittle away at some the worst
:10:39. > :10:45.excesses of what was announced. There is going to be before we get
:10:46. > :10:50.there to really quite big high profile revolt, and this is where
:10:51. > :10:55.the budget bumps up against the referendum. Me Tuesday when the
:10:56. > :10:58.Finance Bill is before Parliament there looks like there will be
:10:59. > :11:09.amendments on whether they should get rid of VAT on women's sanitary
:11:10. > :11:18.products which Brussels says has to be. We are now, standing, four day
:11:19. > :11:22.away from George Osborne potentially losing an amendment to the Finance
:11:23. > :11:28.Bill. That is very serious, that hasn't happened since 1994 when Ken
:11:29. > :11:30.Clarke lost one. And that will be have been embarrassing, the
:11:31. > :11:32.Chancellor's people weren't expecting that to happen. I think
:11:33. > :11:36.that is the first thing we will focus on in terms of political
:11:37. > :11:42.problems on this budget. How will that leave George Osborne, if we
:11:43. > :11:49.take that into account, and if we look at a rebellion or moves to get
:11:50. > :11:56.it to change its mind on disability payment, how is his standing among
:11:57. > :12:00.Tory backbenchers. He went in very cautious, the decision to freeze
:12:01. > :12:07.fuel duty showed he didn't want to upset the backbenches, he will be
:12:08. > :12:11.surprised he ended up but a potential rebellion on his hand. He
:12:12. > :12:16.tried to justify the cuts explicitly when he didn't really spent much of
:12:17. > :12:23.the budget speech talking about cuts at all. Briefly but we have to move
:12:24. > :12:26.on. I don't think this with was a budget for the leadership. It was
:12:27. > :12:29.for now and for him being Chancellor and co-Prime Minister. This isn't
:12:30. > :12:33.for now and for him being Chancellor the budget you would give if you had
:12:34. > :12:38.am bigs for the top job, and this is when the hoary hits.
:12:39. > :12:39.Thank you both. Hello, and welcome
:12:40. > :12:43.to the Daily Politics. Nearly 24 hours after the Chancellor
:12:44. > :12:56.delivered his budget, The Chancellor is blaming global
:12:57. > :13:02.head winds for lower economic growth, more borrow, less tax
:13:03. > :13:06.revenue, more spending cuts, why didn't the Chancellor see these
:13:07. > :13:10.gathering storm clouds in November? He is not clairvoyant. He can only
:13:11. > :13:14.react to evens has the I happen. The growth forecast had only come down
:13:15. > :13:19.by a small amount. It is down every year. It is down a bit. Last year.
:13:20. > :13:24.For five year, Last year we had the highest growth of any G7 country.
:13:25. > :13:29.Over the last five years we did better than any G7 country. I wasn't
:13:30. > :13:34.asking about the past, I was asking about the future. The Chancellor is
:13:35. > :13:37.not clairvoyant, but you don't need to be, because the IMF spelled out
:13:38. > :13:42.what was happening to the global economy at its October meeting in
:13:43. > :13:48.Peru. I reread what it said. I talked about a growing catalogue of
:13:49. > :13:52.problem, Slough Chinese growth, a collapse in commodities hitting the
:13:53. > :13:57.emerging market, deflation still a danger, a banking system still full
:13:58. > :13:59.of bad debt, Italy particular and financial markets tanking, that was
:14:00. > :14:04.in October. Where was the Chancellor? The Chancellor in his
:14:05. > :14:07.November statement relied on the Office for Budget Responsibility,
:14:08. > :14:10.that is the UK's independent forecasting body, and he used their
:14:11. > :14:14.forecast in setting the statement. All those things are true. Why
:14:15. > :14:20.didn't he take that into account in November. Because he was relying, he
:14:21. > :14:24.was relying on the Office for Budget Responsibility forecast. All those
:14:25. > :14:30.things made it clearer why we need to stick to the plan. I tell you
:14:31. > :14:36.where he was, he was in Peru, he heard this himself first hand, and
:14:37. > :14:43.yet a month later, when faced with the OBR saying you have 27 billion
:14:44. > :14:47.more accumulated through to 2020 to spend, what did he do, he spent
:14:48. > :14:52.nearly all of us that was a major mistake. Not really. It is provent
:14:53. > :14:58.people like Gordon Brown fiddling with the figures, They didn't tell
:14:59. > :15:01.him to spend more money. The Chancellor decided to use that to
:15:02. > :15:08.alleviate the effect of cuts which was reasonable. Because he ends up
:15:09. > :15:12.four months later with a ?56 billion shortfall, he had 27 billion to save
:15:13. > :15:17.four months ago, you spent most of it and you end up with a ?56 billion
:15:18. > :15:23.shortfall, that is not managing the economy. The point is when we get to
:15:24. > :15:27.2019/20 we will have thes is plus and finally after 18 long years we
:15:28. > :15:32.can start just repaying our nation's debt. What is the point of finding
:15:33. > :15:36.27 billion down the back of the Treasury sofa, and spending it, and
:15:37. > :15:45.then having to borrow almost 40 billion more over the next three
:15:46. > :15:51.years. What is the point of that What is the point of having an
:15:52. > :15:54.independent forecasting service if you ignore them? Therefore cost was
:15:55. > :16:02.they had found 27 billion more, for a number of technical reasons, they
:16:03. > :16:06.didn't tell you to spend it, that was the Chancellor's decision, and
:16:07. > :16:10.it was wrong. I think he was trying to achieve the government's fiscal
:16:11. > :16:15.targets while minimising the level of spending reductions because they
:16:16. > :16:19.have implications. He tried to make those spending reduction impacts as
:16:20. > :16:23.low as possible is to his credit. You've been in power for six years,
:16:24. > :16:27.is it not a measure of your fiscal failure that you will have two Row
:16:28. > :16:33.30 8 billion more pounds in the next three years then you thought even
:16:34. > :16:38.last November? The fact is we have a hard Labour's deficit. You said you
:16:39. > :16:45.would get rid of it. Now you will have to borrow more. It will take us
:16:46. > :16:50.longer to fix Labour's mess that we had hoped, for reasons due to
:16:51. > :16:54.international financial economic 's but the point is, we are fixing it
:16:55. > :16:58.and we have done half the job already. You say that but given the
:16:59. > :17:09.track record of consistently failed this -- fiscal forecasts, why would
:17:10. > :17:16.we believe that a 21 billion deficit in 2018-19 will magically become a
:17:17. > :17:22.10 billion surplus in 2019-20, in one year, a 30 billion turnaround in
:17:23. > :17:25.the nation's fiscal position. Given your government's track record, why
:17:26. > :17:31.is that in any way credible? Started off with a 150 billion deficit, we
:17:32. > :17:36.have halved that and over the next five years we will do that again.
:17:37. > :17:40.Tell me one year where you have changed the fiscal position by ?30
:17:41. > :17:47.billion. Over the five-year period, the rate of change is the same. No,
:17:48. > :17:54.I'm sorry. This is the following do you to be in surplus and suddenly, a
:17:55. > :17:59.deficit becomes a 10 billion surplus. Given your track record,
:18:00. > :18:04.that is truly incredible. You can ask the OBR, they do the forecasts.
:18:05. > :18:09.On the basis of government policy. As you know, they score the forecast
:18:10. > :18:13.for it is delivered and the numbers you have quoted have been scored by
:18:14. > :18:17.the OBR. How much will you add to the national debt in this
:18:18. > :18:28.Parliament? I'm guessing about 400 billion. No, 150 billion, which will
:18:29. > :18:31.take it to 1.7 4 trillion. 1.7 4 trillion under a government that was
:18:32. > :18:37.meant to get control of the nation's finances. Which is why we need to
:18:38. > :18:41.stick with the plan to cut the deficit down. No one is saying our
:18:42. > :18:45.fiscal position is a good one but we have made a huge amount of progress,
:18:46. > :18:48.we have fixed half the problem that Labour left behind and we have a
:18:49. > :18:53.plan that will see us begin to pay the debt down in Twenty20 host of
:18:54. > :18:57.the size of those figures illustrates why it is important we
:18:58. > :19:01.run a slight surplus. The Labour Party and others say it is
:19:02. > :19:06.irresponsible but even if we run a 1% per year surplus, it will still
:19:07. > :19:10.take as 30 or 40 years to get the debt under control, so there is a
:19:11. > :19:17.huge amount of work to do. Why are you cutting public investment? It
:19:18. > :19:25.isn't being cut. I am sorry, it is being cut. In the last financial
:19:26. > :19:30.year, it is 35 billion, up by 2019-20, it will be 32 billion, by
:19:31. > :19:34.my arithmetic that is a ?3 billion cut, why are you cutting it? Because
:19:35. > :19:42.the books need to be balanced. So you are cutting it. If those numbers
:19:43. > :19:49.are correct. The point is, that is a very small reduction... It's not,
:19:50. > :19:53.it's about 10%. It will be used to deliver things like Crossrail two,
:19:54. > :20:03.high-speed three. Which our country needs. Labour says you will balance
:20:04. > :20:06.current spending, so far all I've seen is they have suggested a number
:20:07. > :20:11.of ways in which you would increase current spending, what would you cut
:20:12. > :20:16.the balance current spending? If you would take one example of where we
:20:17. > :20:20.were definitely look to reduce from waste, one example of where we have
:20:21. > :20:26.seen a cost, that is housing benefit. Set to be 350 million more
:20:27. > :20:29.than forecast last July, and why is that? Because we are not building
:20:30. > :20:35.homes. We have seen home ownership come down. You would cut housing
:20:36. > :20:42.benefit? We would invest to save, that's what you do. Would we have
:20:43. > :20:49.not seen George Osborne do. I want to know where you will cut current
:20:50. > :20:54.spending. This is related. Current spending is about 720 billion. So
:20:55. > :20:57.where are you going to cut? What we have said is there are two ways you
:20:58. > :21:02.can balance the books, one is how you increase revenue, you look at
:21:03. > :21:06.fair taxation, tax avoidance and how you grow the economy. What Chris
:21:07. > :21:14.missed out of his commentary was that the OBR actually have said in
:21:15. > :21:18.their fiscal outlook that it is UK productivity that has been a main
:21:19. > :21:24.contributor to the revised GDP figures. They may be factors but I'm
:21:25. > :21:30.not asking you about UK productivity. Where would you cut
:21:31. > :21:37.current spending to bring it into balance? We have been very clear and
:21:38. > :21:42.you will know. About increasing tax receipts through growth and through
:21:43. > :21:47.their taxation as well as looking at how you would make savings. So show
:21:48. > :21:53.me where you would make the savings. George Osborne talks about asking
:21:54. > :21:58.now... But I am asking about Labour policy, tell me where you would cut
:21:59. > :22:04.current spending. We have been very clear. We would be investing in
:22:05. > :22:07.order to see the economy grow. We would be making sure we have
:22:08. > :22:14.increased productivity, investing in new technology. You are displaying
:22:15. > :22:19.the time here. Let me just get you one more time, where would you cut
:22:20. > :22:24.current spending the balance current spending budget? And I have said
:22:25. > :22:33.this before and I will say it again. We would of course lay out editions
:22:34. > :22:36.nearer the time. But we have a framework and what we are saying is
:22:37. > :22:42.you need to have an approach that looks at both sites. Let me try on
:22:43. > :22:46.capital spending. We would say there is a huge amount to do. I had
:22:47. > :22:53.obviously failed on current spending. You would still borrow to
:22:54. > :22:58.invest, borrow for public investment, how much extra would you
:22:59. > :23:01.borrow to invest? That argument for borrowing to invest has been made by
:23:02. > :23:08.many independent economists and it is the right time... I am asking you
:23:09. > :23:12.how much. But we have said, and I will say this again, is we would
:23:13. > :23:18.want to see our spending on investment and infrastructure to be
:23:19. > :23:27.at the OECD average. Which is about 3%? Is that right? We have said
:23:28. > :23:32.that. But we have challenged, as well, the drop in public sector
:23:33. > :23:41.investment that you also talked about today, coming down... Let me
:23:42. > :23:46.come to the 3%. Because at the moment it's just over 1.5%, is
:23:47. > :23:53.heading to about 32 billion. So you would double that, taking it to 64
:23:54. > :23:58.billion. Let's assume that you do balance current spending although
:23:59. > :24:05.you haven't told me how. You would still borrow 64 billion a year. You
:24:06. > :24:09.know as well as I do that these are in line with what the economy would
:24:10. > :24:14.need to grow. You would borrow that indefinitely? We haven't said that,
:24:15. > :24:18.we have said that you need to look at where the needs of the economy
:24:19. > :24:24.are. How you would invest for a return as well. That could be
:24:25. > :24:30.through RND, through looking for a return for working with industry as
:24:31. > :24:34.well, if you look even in investing in renewables, which is incredibly
:24:35. > :24:39.important... I'm not asking you what you would invest in, I'm trying to
:24:40. > :24:45.get the scale. And you have helped us test Bush the scale. Now it
:24:46. > :24:51.follows, since you are talking about 3% of GDP, that if you balance the
:24:52. > :24:55.budget, but borrow 64 billion between 60 and 70 billion to invest
:24:56. > :25:04.your policy is to run a deficit, the finance that borrowing,
:25:05. > :25:08.indefinitely. We have not said that, you are putting words in my mouth,
:25:09. > :25:12.but we have been clear about the principles of how we would approach
:25:13. > :25:16.tax and spend decisions. We would balance the current budget over the
:25:17. > :25:20.course of the parliament and would want to see... And borrow to invest
:25:21. > :25:24.so you would always be adding to the national debt. We would expect a
:25:25. > :25:30.return to growth and tax receipts but there are many black holes in
:25:31. > :25:35.George Osborne's budget, another 560 million that has been identified...
:25:36. > :25:41.Let me ask you this. You didn't ask Chris this. I don't need you to tell
:25:42. > :25:48.me what questions to ask. Do you agree with raising the threshold of
:25:49. > :25:54.the 40% tax rate? We have said we won't be opposing it, we wouldn't do
:25:55. > :25:58.it at this time, because you are seeing a budget that was supposedly
:25:59. > :26:03.to support the next Generation, at the same time as you see rents
:26:04. > :26:10.increasing, you see reports coming out that say that the UK two thirds
:26:11. > :26:12.of the UK is unaffordable for young people. This is a government that
:26:13. > :26:18.has made life much harder for young people. So why are you agreeing with
:26:19. > :26:22.a costly rise? There are a lot of middle income families who also
:26:23. > :26:30.struggling to make ends meet in the climate that we are in. They are
:26:31. > :26:33.below the ?45,000 threshold. But there are families who will be
:26:34. > :26:37.struggling to make ends meet, we believe that we would not make that
:26:38. > :26:41.decision at this time. But we're not going to oppose it. We have said we
:26:42. > :26:47.will oppose inheritance tax cuts, we will oppose further corporation tax
:26:48. > :26:53.cut and the capital gains tax cuts. Would you make the state of the
:26:54. > :26:57.debate? It's finished in reflection, the budget itself was an interesting
:26:58. > :27:04.reflection of the lack of opposition at this time -- an interesting
:27:05. > :27:07.reflection. It was quite aggressive, the tax changes, the distribution of
:27:08. > :27:12.all these tax giveaways, the personal allowances and others, very
:27:13. > :27:16.much to the upper end of the distributional -- it was quite
:27:17. > :27:21.regressive. At the same time as you have cut heavily onto the bottom
:27:22. > :27:26.half of the income distribution and I've seen analysis that shows the
:27:27. > :27:31.changes the election, the bottom half of the net losers and the top
:27:32. > :27:36.half on it gauges. So it just the fact able to do that and focus on
:27:37. > :27:42.the conservative side of the bench in worrying about the friend and
:27:43. > :27:46.everything else. Despite about public investment, you emphasise the
:27:47. > :27:49.slowdown in the global economy, the OBR made clear that most of the
:27:50. > :27:52.change, they have revised down the growth forecast for the rest of the
:27:53. > :27:55.world of most of it is on productivity and as other countries
:27:56. > :27:59.grappled with this problem, they are seeing central banks trying to as
:28:00. > :28:04.much as they can to support growth but turning increasingly thinking,
:28:05. > :28:08.do we need to do more on public investment? Does there need to be
:28:09. > :28:12.fiscal support for growth as well as central banks? So it adjusting that
:28:13. > :28:17.he didn't give more of play to that debate and felt able to have lower
:28:18. > :28:21.public investment going into the future -- so it's interesting. And
:28:22. > :28:26.low it worth of the public sector at a time others have been talking
:28:27. > :28:28.about increasing that. So slightly against the tide of those debates.
:28:29. > :28:30.Thank you both. Well, the Chancellor faces
:28:31. > :28:32.a rebellion over the so-called tampon tax, a 5% levy
:28:33. > :28:34.on sanitary products, Up in arms, an alliance
:28:35. > :28:38.of feminists and campaigners who would like Britain
:28:39. > :28:40.to leave the EU. Let's talk now to the Conservative
:28:41. > :28:51.MP, Anne-Marie Trevelyan who's Isn't that really the nub of it,
:28:52. > :28:55.it's about the campaign to leave the EU, not really about the VAT on
:28:56. > :28:59.sanitary products? Quite the opposite though they are linked.
:29:00. > :29:05.This is an issue we have been trying to get movement on from the Treasury
:29:06. > :29:10.for months, trying to drive the board, it is the right thing to do.
:29:11. > :29:16.This is a completely wrong VAT tax, we have a VAT directive which means
:29:17. > :29:22.we are not able to determine our VAT rates and have to go again to all 27
:29:23. > :29:27.other states to ask them to allow us to do something. I think that is
:29:28. > :29:30.wrong, and at a practical level we need is the Chancellor, and he
:29:31. > :29:34.committed to doing that back in the autumn, to go and ask for that
:29:35. > :29:39.derogation to get that changed in the short term. How big is this
:29:40. > :29:44.rebellion looking? How many colleagues of yours are signing up
:29:45. > :29:47.to rebel? I haven't spoken to anyone this morning I have been in Select
:29:48. > :29:51.Committee but I know there is great support for it, there was earlier in
:29:52. > :29:55.the parliamentary term and that will continue because it is an important
:29:56. > :30:02.issue for women. While the Chancellor is committed to spending
:30:03. > :30:05.somewhere between 12 and 15 million, the VAT take on sanitary products on
:30:06. > :30:11.domestic violence and other issues for women, it is women who are
:30:12. > :30:14.paying, through their tax, on these things, for women's shelters on
:30:15. > :30:26.issues infected by men. Under EU rules the UK zroent the
:30:27. > :30:31.power to cut that VAT further, so you have asked the Chancellor to go
:30:32. > :30:39.and make a case, but beyond that what can he do? He needs to make the
:30:40. > :30:43.case, if he is to show us there is any authority from the our one of 28
:30:44. > :30:49.states to get through to the others in the EU framework, that this is a
:30:50. > :30:53.very minor change that we are asking for in overall VAT and tax terms but
:30:54. > :30:58.the key point it proves we are not controlling our own tax system. That
:30:59. > :31:02.is democratically wrong, British voters should not have taxes set
:31:03. > :31:05.upon them and controlled by those they don't have a direct voting
:31:06. > :31:09.link, that is wrong at every level, as far as I am concerned if the VAT
:31:10. > :31:12.directive isn't that they put forward as being scrapped when the
:31:13. > :31:16.Chancellor comes back with what he saying will be a deal, voting the
:31:17. > :31:17.leave is the only solution. Thank you.
:31:18. > :31:21.Well, later today, David Cameron hot foots it to Brussels for a meeting
:31:22. > :31:25.On the agenda, details of a proposed deal with Turkey to halt
:31:26. > :31:28.There are signs, though, that the agreement is already
:31:29. > :31:35.Let's talk now to our correspondent, Rob Watson, who's in Brussels.
:31:36. > :31:43.What are the leaders trying to achieve? Put very crudely, Jo, they
:31:44. > :31:47.want to do is deter migrants from coming to Europe. The way they want
:31:48. > :31:52.to do that is say look, if you try to make it to Greece or any other
:31:53. > :31:56.part offure, you will be taken back to Turkey and you will end up at the
:31:57. > :32:03.back of the queue. In order do that they need to sweeten the pill for
:32:04. > :32:05.Turkey, so there are a number of goodies for Ankara including things
:32:06. > :32:10.like speeding up access to membership of the EU and giving
:32:11. > :32:13.tushes a free visa visit to the European Union. That is the nature
:32:14. > :32:18.of the deal. As it looks from your perspective is it going to happen,
:32:19. > :32:23.are they going to sign it? Well, what I will say in many ways these
:32:24. > :32:28.summits are doomed to success, what I mean by that is you don't find
:32:29. > :32:32.leaders saying we did our best, we tried but it ain't going to work, so
:32:33. > :32:36.yes they will come to some kind of agreement, but the question is, will
:32:37. > :32:41.it work? There are all sorts of problems, how exactly is it going to
:32:42. > :32:44.work, taking people by boat from Greece, to Turkey? Will the
:32:45. > :32:49.Europeans deliver on their promise, to the Turks? And I guess the other
:32:50. > :32:52.thing to look at is to say look, there have been EU summits since
:32:53. > :32:54.2001 trying to deal with this problem, there have been previous
:32:55. > :33:01.agreements with Turkey, they haven't worked. It is right to be sceptical.
:33:02. > :33:03.There is a sense that this deal is absolutely far from perfect, but
:33:04. > :33:06.it's the only one out there. Thank you very much.
:33:07. > :33:09.Well, earlier I spoke to David McAllister MEP
:33:10. > :33:12.I began by asking him whether Germany was now
:33:13. > :33:14.going to heed David Cameron's advice not to shut Turkey out
:33:15. > :33:28.Well, I am carefully optimistic we can find a deal at this sum my. Of
:33:29. > :33:34.course there is still hard work in front of us, but we need Turkey to
:33:35. > :33:40.find a solution, for the migration crisis, we have to bring the numbers
:33:41. > :33:46.down of illegal migrant coming from Turkey to grease. How high a price
:33:47. > :33:50.are you prepared to pay? In 2013 you said Turkey wasn't politically or
:33:51. > :33:55.economically fit enough to join the EU. Have you changed your mind? We
:33:56. > :33:58.obviously have to co-operate with Turkey, to solve this crisis, and
:33:59. > :34:03.this is a very important question for Germany. So the one thing is to
:34:04. > :34:08.co-operate with Turkey, on the other hand we have our European value, we
:34:09. > :34:13.have Turkish interests but we have our European values on the other
:34:14. > :34:17.hand, and of course, there won't be any discount for Turkey, we
:34:18. > :34:22.understand their concern, they want more financial assistance, I believe
:34:23. > :34:26.we should be ready to give it. They want to open new chapter, here I
:34:27. > :34:29.would say they have to match the cry Syria, they have to fulfil all
:34:30. > :34:36.conditions like all other countries who are in a membership process, but
:34:37. > :34:40.we also see the situation of the freedom of media, the freedom of
:34:41. > :34:43.expression, human rights and we will have toed a dress the concerns
:34:44. > :34:49.whenever we are together with the Turks. Is the EU ready and are you
:34:50. > :34:56.ready to allow Turkish citizens full access to the Shengen zone by July?
:34:57. > :35:00.Well, the question of viva liberalisation has always been on
:35:01. > :35:03.the agenda for Turkish Government. I remember when the President came and
:35:04. > :35:09.talked to Angela Merkel about that few years ago, I am ready to go a
:35:10. > :35:17.few steps forward. Once again Turkey has to fulfil the necessary criteria
:35:18. > :35:20.so we can have viva liberisation for Turkish citizen, the European
:35:21. > :35:23.council decided this should be achieved by July. This is very
:35:24. > :35:30.ambitious and it is up to Turkey to deliver. We are seeing slum camps on
:35:31. > :35:34.the borders of Macedonian and reG4S -- refugees attempt to settle in
:35:35. > :35:42.Germany. Did you expect the open door policy would have such profound
:35:43. > :35:48.consequences? Angela Merkel is committed to a humanitarian refugee
:35:49. > :35:54.policy, and Germany has shown responsibility in the last 12 months
:35:55. > :35:59.like no other country in the on your union. These pictures are sad
:36:00. > :36:04.pictures, and they are certainly breaching our European values. We
:36:05. > :36:08.need to find a sustainable European solution. This is the good thing
:36:09. > :36:13.about this summit, since ten days for the first time we see the
:36:14. > :36:21.possibility of a European approach to solve-of-crisis, but once again,
:36:22. > :36:25.all 28 member states have to agree, we have got to stop the illegal
:36:26. > :36:30.migration from other parts of the world to Europe, we have got to
:36:31. > :36:34.break the system, we have to break the link between getting on a boat,
:36:35. > :36:38.and then finding resettlement in Europe. That is why this European
:36:39. > :36:44.Turkish deal might be the breakthrough. Angela Merkel, will
:36:45. > :36:47.she survive politically? Sure, she is our Chancellor, our party leader
:36:48. > :36:53.and she has a lot of support in Germany. That is why we will follow
:36:54. > :36:58.her on a refugee policy once again it is Angela Merkel's policy to find
:36:59. > :37:03.an international response to this international crisis, we have to
:37:04. > :37:07.solve the root causes, why these people are coming to Europe. We need
:37:08. > :37:12.more European solidarity, that is why it is so important the 28 member
:37:13. > :37:16.states co-operate, it is better to do this together, than every single
:37:17. > :37:21.nation state in the European Union going it own way. Thank you.
:37:22. > :37:24.And with us now, Chairman of the Foreign Affairs Select
:37:25. > :37:26.Committee, Crispin Blunt, and the Shadow Foreign Secretary,
:37:27. > :37:36.Hilary Benn there is a lot coming out top of European capitals, not
:37:37. > :37:42.happy with this deal that Angela Merkel has in effect done with
:37:43. > :37:45.Turkey, she did it without involving the President or President Hollande.
:37:46. > :37:52.Is it going to get through? It will be a difficult meeting today. I
:37:53. > :37:56.think in the end this is the only potential deal. It is the only show
:37:57. > :38:03.in town. There are a lot of questions about it, which member
:38:04. > :38:07.states will have, what happens in people are detained in Greek
:38:08. > :38:12.territorial waters as opposed to Turkish, views expressed about the
:38:13. > :38:16.legality of this, what is the status of Turkey as a safe place for
:38:17. > :38:19.refugees to be, but I suspect in the end something will go through,
:38:20. > :38:24.because I think both sides need this. Do you think it will go
:38:25. > :38:28.through? I don't know. I don't think it should, where it is making
:38:29. > :38:31.concessions to Turkey about early accession to the European Union, I
:38:32. > :38:34.think the only thing we should be talking to Turkey about is giving
:38:35. > :38:39.them financial support for the problems they face on their border
:38:40. > :38:44.and giving them the proper support as a neighbouring state to the
:38:45. > :38:48.crisis. Is it giving concession to Turkey on early accession? Chapters
:38:49. > :38:53.are being advanced, they are being offered vice have a free access to
:38:54. > :38:59.the Shengen answeria, all of these are -- area. All of these are EU
:39:00. > :39:03.deals with the Turks to make them more accommodating on the issue. It
:39:04. > :39:07.is ignoring the fact Turkey is spiralling down into dictatorship.
:39:08. > :39:10.It is running a disgrace. War against its own people in south-east
:39:11. > :39:15.Turkey which it chose to do as the Government. And we appear to be
:39:16. > :39:18.ignoring the fact Turkey is no longer a country that is led by
:39:19. > :39:22.someone who is fit to be a partner in the European Union. Does this
:39:23. > :39:26.deal involve speeding up Turkey's application process? I don't think
:39:27. > :39:30.so in practise, for the reason, as Crispin has just said, there are a
:39:31. > :39:34.lot of problems in Turkey at the moment and there are conditions you
:39:35. > :39:39.have to meet. I don't think, I think Turkish accession is a long way off.
:39:40. > :39:44.Would you be in favour of it In presence. Certain subject to certain
:39:45. > :39:49.condition, firstly they meet the standards on human right, governance
:39:50. > :39:52.of law, there is the question of Cyprus, the crucial point will be
:39:53. > :39:59.where we end up on free movemenches we would say member states will have
:40:00. > :40:01.to be able to decide for themselves what transitional arrangement and
:40:02. > :40:06.how long they want them to be in place before taking a decision, as
:40:07. > :40:10.you know, every member state has to agree so any one has a veto. It is a
:40:11. > :40:15.long way off. I wouldn't confuse frankly although Turkey may be
:40:16. > :40:19.seeking to bring the two things together, a decision today,
:40:20. > :40:23.hopefully can be reached, I don't know. Twries to deal with the
:40:24. > :40:27.refugee crisis and the question of Turkish membership. The book has
:40:28. > :40:34.been opened on it for coming on for 11 years, So Turkey I can's
:40:35. > :40:42.membership is in the long grass. What signals are we sending, it is
:40:43. > :40:46.under rogue leadership, with internal policies, that are
:40:47. > :40:49.disgraceful, by any standard, and which is placed its domestic
:40:50. > :40:53.politics ahead of the common international interest both in
:40:54. > :40:57.bringing the Syrian civil war to an end, as well as... All that would
:40:58. > :41:01.disical them for membership under current conditions. It would. What
:41:02. > :41:07.is going on here? What is being offered? Is this, why are terms
:41:08. > :41:13.being offered to Turkey round viva free access to the Shengen area, it
:41:14. > :41:18.is in the draft agreement that has been leaked, actually offering
:41:19. > :41:22.accelerated terms under the chapters round the accession negotiations,
:41:23. > :41:27.this is not the time to be making these concessions to Turkey, we
:41:28. > :41:34.should be clear. It is clear, that under Erdogan Turkey wants to join
:41:35. > :41:38.the EU? It is a real question, a reflection of how badly the European
:41:39. > :41:42.Union have damaged their relationship with Turkey and indeed
:41:43. > :41:46.with Ukraine and the other side of Russia. All this focus on the
:41:47. > :41:49.eurozone has distracked from the long-term strategy of securing the
:41:50. > :41:54.neighbouring parts and one of the reflections of that is where the
:41:55. > :41:58.Erdogan Government has gone. I think he has been giving conflicting
:41:59. > :42:02.signals on that I would say it is clear it's a long way off any
:42:03. > :42:07.serious asession. Let me come whack to migrants. Part of the agreement
:42:08. > :42:14.is those that in other circumstances, the Vietnamese for
:42:15. > :42:21.example would be called boat people. They made it to Greece. Part of the
:42:22. > :42:26.deal is they are to be sent back to Turkey, on the Syrian basis one for
:42:27. > :42:30.other other Syrians will be properly processed out of the camps and enter
:42:31. > :42:34.into Greece and I assume the European Union, how do you force
:42:35. > :42:39.them to go back? That is one of the really practical problems with the
:42:40. > :42:45.proposed arrangements in the circumstances. It will come down to
:42:46. > :42:50.what happens when boats are intercepted, at sea and what message
:42:51. > :42:57.it send if it is successful, in returning people to Turkey. I can
:42:58. > :43:01.see an agreement where by if Nato ships or whatever, or European Union
:43:02. > :43:06.frontier boats stop the boat people, the migrants trying to make it, that
:43:07. > :43:09.there is an agreement they take them back from whence they came which
:43:10. > :43:13.would be Turkey, I am talking about the tens of thousands of migrants
:43:14. > :43:19.who have made it on to Greek territory. Hour do you force them to
:43:20. > :43:25.go back? I think that would be very difficult. I would suppose that any
:43:26. > :43:27.agreement that is reached is going to have to look separately at that
:43:28. > :43:34.from anyone who might be coming in the future. As we are seen, in the
:43:35. > :43:38.last few months, people will do desperate things to progress because
:43:39. > :43:43.of the trauma they have suffered in Syria and it is important we try and
:43:44. > :43:47.come to an a rankment which is workable to deal with that, and to
:43:48. > :43:52.separate out economic migrants because that is another part of the
:43:53. > :43:57.flow from those who are fleeing persecution genuinely. That applies
:43:58. > :44:03.to anyone coming out of Syria. As the European Union grapples with the
:44:04. > :44:08.flow of people from Turkey, to Greece, as the spring weather begins
:44:09. > :44:13.to light on the southern Mediterranean, I am seeing reports
:44:14. > :44:19.as the Lampedusa crossing becomes more possible welcome back the
:44:20. > :44:22.weather weather they are up to 500,000 migrants gathered on the
:44:23. > :44:28.coast of Libya. That is not covered by the Turkish agreement. This is a
:44:29. > :44:34.new, a return to a previous way that people were coming in. Strong among
:44:35. > :44:40.the people traffickers there, is Islamic State. And the briefings my
:44:41. > :44:45.committee got, we went to Cairo and Tunis, were some of the routes from
:44:46. > :44:48.central Africa and West Africa are controlled by Islamic State and they
:44:49. > :44:52.are money from people, they are the people taking the money from the
:44:53. > :44:56.people smugglers. I don't know whether 500,000 is the right number,
:44:57. > :45:03.it didn't get any sense from the briefings we received it was of that
:45:04. > :45:11.scale but plainly question is very much back in play. We need to, it is
:45:12. > :45:16.a huge issue we will have to come back to this, we have own out of
:45:17. > :45:21.time. I know you are for Remain, are you maind your mind up? My committee
:45:22. > :45:36.is continuing to take evidence. Your committee? Are they going to tell
:45:37. > :45:40.you how to vote? People are crying out for an unbiased assessment and
:45:41. > :45:44.we need to look at the patience for Britain's future role in the world
:45:45. > :45:49.and we have a committee that is split. I want a unanimous report
:45:50. > :45:55.from Europe files and Eurosceptics, who will then announce a report
:45:56. > :46:01.agreed by everyone. Yes, I will tell you. Because the nation is waiting
:46:02. > :46:11.to hear! But I will wait to hear until the committee has reported...
:46:12. > :46:12.I think he has said yes! I can't imagine anywhere better to announce
:46:13. > :46:16.it in on this programme. Now, back to the budget,
:46:17. > :46:19.the Chancellor was keen to point out that this budget was aimed
:46:20. > :46:21.at the next generation. He mentioned them 18
:46:22. > :46:23.times to be precise. One wonders about family life
:46:24. > :46:26.in the Osborne house. The Chancellor announced
:46:27. > :46:27.crowd-pleasers like longer school hours
:46:28. > :46:29.and that tax on sugar. My mum always said you weren't
:46:30. > :46:36.allowed fizzy drinks before lunchtime but that doesn't mean you
:46:37. > :46:38.can't discuss them before lunchtime. We are asking is this sugar tax
:46:39. > :46:41.a good idea or a bad Have you heard of a man
:46:42. > :46:49.called George Osborne? This is what the government
:46:50. > :46:55.is going to do to stop people drinking too many fizzy drinks,
:46:56. > :46:58.what do you think about that? Should fizzy drinks cost
:46:59. > :47:07.more to stop people Because fizzy drinks doesn't
:47:08. > :47:16.really matter that much. The more they cost,
:47:17. > :47:25.the less you buy. I'm sure it will do,
:47:26. > :48:02.because like the Yesterday they announced
:48:03. > :48:12.another thing that will affect you, making
:48:13. > :48:14.school longer every day, You are a school nurse,
:48:15. > :48:30.you are a medical professional, will this stop kids drinking
:48:31. > :48:32.too many fizzy drinks? Yes, we think it will make a big
:48:33. > :48:35.difference, it's an excellent move If a can was 10p more expensive,
:48:36. > :48:40.would you not buy it? You could adopt the libertarian
:48:41. > :48:56.argument of saying you choose your life and pay
:48:57. > :48:59.accordingly but we don't live in that, we live
:49:00. > :49:01.in a world where our National Health Service
:49:02. > :49:02.is under increasing pressure and the population
:49:03. > :49:06.is ageing and the next problem is obesity so we have to try
:49:07. > :49:09.and do something about it. What are the odds of
:49:10. > :49:12.bumping into a Tory MP who is a GP on the street
:49:13. > :49:14.near the school! The bell has just gone
:49:15. > :49:18.and they are all in their first I think we asked nearly the whole
:49:19. > :49:22.school and I think a big majority And with us now, Kate Andrews from
:49:23. > :49:38.the Institute of Economic Affairs. So it's a good idea? I don't think
:49:39. > :49:42.so, it's incredibly regressive, it will hurt people at the bottom who
:49:43. > :49:46.may not have the disposable income to be able to justify a few pence
:49:47. > :49:48.increase on their drinks, but putting that aside, the most
:49:49. > :49:57.frustrating part of this policy is that the Chancellor is interested in
:49:58. > :50:00.curbing obi city, I would urge to increment a policy where anywhere in
:50:01. > :50:07.the world there was one piece of evidence that you your tax would
:50:08. > :50:14.affect anything. There is no evidence that it has any impact on
:50:15. > :50:19.health outcomes. There is some from Mexico, but we will talk about that.
:50:20. > :50:22.It is arguably regressive in terms of disproportionately hitting the
:50:23. > :50:34.poorest but so is sugar and its impact, and the obesity crisis. Two
:50:35. > :50:37.thirds of adults are obese, it disproportionately affects the
:50:38. > :50:42.poorest, so surely it is a good thing to do to deal with that? You
:50:43. > :50:47.have that into the philosophy of it, and if we think we want to live in a
:50:48. > :50:50.society where somebody is of a lower income is more likely to be
:50:51. > :50:55.overweight, that we can say from the top down, we are going to price you
:50:56. > :50:59.out of this, not allow you to purchase things, I'm deeply
:51:00. > :51:05.uncomfortable with that. It is an issue we should be tackling... It is
:51:06. > :51:08.a crisis. But not by pricing people out of something, people at the top
:51:09. > :51:11.can still have this but we have decided your lifestyle habits are
:51:12. > :51:14.dangerous and we will try and take you out of the equation, that is
:51:15. > :51:19.something all of us are uncomfortable with. On the demand
:51:20. > :51:23.issue, it would reduces the demand for sugary drinks then surely it
:51:24. > :51:30.reduces and decreases the risks of obesity. It would be if we saw a
:51:31. > :51:35.decrease in demand but we can look at Denmark and Mexico... They put a
:51:36. > :51:41.10% tax on the strings in Mexico and we also saw consumption decreased by
:51:42. > :51:46.6%. And now if you look, it is right back up to where it was. There has
:51:47. > :51:51.been no decrease in Mexico. Would it work, would it tackle obesity? It is
:51:52. > :51:56.a good first step, it is ready hard to change people's behaviour, it's a
:51:57. > :52:01.shame that some of the public have budget, some of those programmes,
:52:02. > :52:04.were cut in the last year, but I think the head of the NHS made quite
:52:05. > :52:09.clear that this was an issue that was important to him and I think
:52:10. > :52:13.it's a good first step. It is focused on the volume of sugar, to
:52:14. > :52:16.get into the technicalities, it does make sense, because we think a lot
:52:17. > :52:21.of the worst offenders, it is always to put the price of one in the
:52:22. > :52:26.supermarkets, it tackles that issue as well as starting on the road to
:52:27. > :52:30.higher prices. But when the issue is focused on children, people don't
:52:31. > :52:33.worry quite so much, maybe that's why he's focused on that argument
:52:34. > :52:40.because we don't mind nannying children, it's adults that are a
:52:41. > :52:48.problem. Thank you. You do enough nannying of May! -- of me. Depends
:52:49. > :52:50.where you look. Now, George Osborne,
:52:51. > :52:52.he's not exactly Michael McIntyre or Jimmy Carr, and it's not his job
:52:53. > :52:55.to stand up and make everyone laugh, but the Chancellor does
:52:56. > :52:58.like to pepper his budget script with a few quips.
:52:59. > :53:00.And he's not the only one. Here's our Adam with something
:53:01. > :53:13.completely different. The guide to budget jokes, in fifth
:53:14. > :53:18.press, Norman Lamont takes a dig at the newspapers. Some of these zero
:53:19. > :53:24.rated goods, food and water, are clearly amongst the most basic
:53:25. > :53:30.necessities of life. Others, for example... Sewage and newspapers,
:53:31. > :53:40.perhaps fall into a different category. Me neither. In fourth, Ken
:53:41. > :53:45.Clarke begins his 1996 budget speech. Contrary to public belief, I
:53:46. > :53:50.do always look at the mirror in the morning... On this occasion I am
:53:51. > :53:58.reasonably well prepared for this occasion, about to deliver the real
:53:59. > :54:06.budget statement. At least he's enjoying himself! In third, George
:54:07. > :54:13.Osborne about Ed Miliband and his Shadow Chancellor Ed Balls. He will
:54:14. > :54:17.support our brilliant video games and animation industry too, because
:54:18. > :54:23.it is the determined policy of this government that we keep Wallace and
:54:24. > :54:30.Gromit exactly where they are. Cracking jokes, George! In second,
:54:31. > :54:35.not known for his sense of humour, Gordon Brown. In anticipation of
:54:36. > :54:43.World Cup success this summer, I'm freezing duty on champagne... And on
:54:44. > :54:49.British sparkling wine. Which he followed up with this, and get David
:54:50. > :54:55.Cameron. I hold to our pledge not to extend VAT to a number of items, no
:54:56. > :54:59.VAT on food, books and use papers, public transport fares, and
:55:00. > :55:07.children's clothes, and children's shoes, including flip-flops. Good
:55:08. > :55:12.try, Gordon. In the top spot, George Osborne took the time in this budget
:55:13. > :55:15.to pay tribute to his former coalition partners. The former
:55:16. > :55:20.pensions minister, the Liberal Democrat Steve Webb said, I was
:55:21. > :55:28.trying to abolish the lump sum. Instead we will keep the lump sum
:55:29. > :55:29.and abolish the Liberal Democrats. Tim Farron is laughing on the
:55:30. > :55:33.outside. And with us now, former Conservative
:55:34. > :55:45.MP, Matthew Parris from the Times. I hesitate to say this but Mr
:55:46. > :55:53.Osborne had the best jokes. Yes, he's possibly the best joker...
:55:54. > :55:56.Boom, boom! But generally he carries them off although he had another
:55:57. > :56:02.joke in that budget about the Crossrail to, heading south... For
:56:03. > :56:09.people heading south. I thought that was quite funny, too. That is a very
:56:10. > :56:16.city slicker kind of joke. I don't think a lot of people have got it.
:56:17. > :56:21.Disraeli ruined his first budget as Chancellor with too much scorn, too
:56:22. > :56:25.much derision, too many jokes at the expense of the opposition, enabling
:56:26. > :56:29.Gladstone to get up and be pompous for about five hours, did him a lot
:56:30. > :56:34.of harm. I think you tread carefully if you make jokes as Chancellor. He
:56:35. > :56:42.got away with it, they often don't. Who gives them the jokes? They will
:56:43. > :56:45.have advisers, speech writers, think Danny Finkelstein helps, but some of
:56:46. > :56:50.them they may think of on their own. George Osborne is quite a funny man.
:56:51. > :56:55.I see the danger of overdoing it when you are talking about people's
:56:56. > :56:58.pay, unemployment, standard of living, but a couple of jokes in an
:56:59. > :57:06.hour-long budget speech is not a bad idea. I agree, if you can live in it
:57:07. > :57:08.in some way, it works better if it is a response to somebody else
:57:09. > :57:14.rather than something that has been laboratory worked up. I think it was
:57:15. > :57:17.Jeremy Corbyn the other day who said, I have been talking to a lot
:57:18. > :57:21.of Socialist leaders and they all say somebody shouted, who are you,
:57:22. > :57:29.that worked well because it was spontaneous. Is Mr Osborne funny
:57:30. > :57:33.than previous chancellors? I think he does get away with the delivery,
:57:34. > :57:37.the convoluted jokes are hard to get away with but he has got away with a
:57:38. > :57:42.few, the King John joke around his support for the Magna Carta, at the
:57:43. > :57:45.expense of Ed Miliband, was a terribly clever one but because he
:57:46. > :57:49.is known to be an historian and because he was doing a thing about
:57:50. > :57:54.the Magna Carta, it did actually come off. I don't think Gordon Brown
:57:55. > :58:00.ever pulled them off. The bust until any jokes in that five hours? No,
:58:01. > :58:06.no, Gladstone didn't tell jokes. George Osborne has the be careful
:58:07. > :58:12.not to be accused of devising budget measures so as to come up with
:58:13. > :58:18.jokes. He made a joke about the church roof, the Labour opposition
:58:19. > :58:21.said, that the cost ?100 million. We never do that with our script!
:58:22. > :58:24.There's just time before we go to find out the answer to our quiz.
:58:25. > :58:27.The question was - there's been a bit of a hoo haa over
:58:28. > :58:29.whether male presenters are always positioned
:58:30. > :58:31.on the left of the screen on TV chat shows.
:58:32. > :58:50.You buck the trend in so many ways! You haven't managed to sit on
:58:51. > :58:51.Andrew! Not literally but metaphorically!
:58:52. > :58:53.That's all for today. Thanks to our guests.
:58:54. > :58:56.The One o'Clock news is starting over on BBC One now.
:58:57. > :58:58.And I will be on BBC One tonight talking about Russia
:58:59. > :59:00.and the sex industry with Michael Portillo,
:59:01. > :59:02.Alan Johnson, Stacey Dooley, Anne McElvoy and Tim Marshall
:59:03. > :59:06.I'm 52 years old... HE CLEARS THROAT
:59:07. > :59:09...and I want... HE MAKES CLICKING NOISES, GRUNTS
:59:10. > :59:17.The fact that... HE MAKES HIGH-PITCHED GROAN
:59:18. > :59:20...it's harder for me to find a job...means I want it even more.
:59:21. > :59:24.When you keep getting knocked down and knocked down and knocked down