20/04/2016

:00:37. > :00:39.Hello and welcome to the Daily Politics.

:00:40. > :00:42.Another day on the EU referendum campaign trail, another letter

:00:43. > :00:45.urging voters to back one side or another.

:00:46. > :00:51.Today, we've heard from a group of former White House advisers.

:00:52. > :00:53.But this week's also seen some big numbers and big arguments deployed

:00:54. > :00:56.by the heavy hitters on each side of the referendum debate.

:00:57. > :00:59.We'll be looking at what's fact and what's not.

:01:00. > :01:02.This time next week, junior doctors in England will be

:01:03. > :01:05.staging the first all-out strike in the history of the NHS.

:01:06. > :01:10.Will doctors or the Government pull back?

:01:11. > :01:13.From the doctors' strike to the steel crisis to the first

:01:14. > :01:15.rise in unemployment since last summer -

:01:16. > :01:17.what will Jeremy Corbyn choose to ask David Cameron

:01:18. > :01:23.We'll bring you all the action live at midday.

:01:24. > :01:27.And the public has spoken - in a story that's gone around

:01:28. > :01:30.the world, an online vote decides that the UK's new polar

:01:31. > :01:34.research vessel should be called Boaty McBoatface.

:01:35. > :01:44.But are ministers preparing to overrule the will of the people?

:01:45. > :01:54.Surely not. I like the name. Is it a boat or a ship? A line that

:01:55. > :01:55.is where the debate is going to centre.

:01:56. > :01:58.All that in the next hour and with us for the whole

:01:59. > :02:00.of the programme today, two MPs who would never dismiss

:02:01. > :02:03.the views of the general public in so cynical a fashion.

:02:04. > :02:05.At least not in an election year, anyway.

:02:06. > :02:07.It's the Culture and Digital Economy Minister Ed Vaizey

:02:08. > :02:09.and the former Labour minister and Leave campaigner Kate Hoey.

:02:10. > :02:14.First today - what else but the EU referendum?

:02:15. > :02:20.And it's clearly a week for American interventions in the debate,

:02:21. > :02:22.because ahead of President Obama's visit, eight former

:02:23. > :02:24.US Treasury Secretaries have written to the Times saying voting to leave

:02:25. > :02:30.the European Union on June 23rd would be a "risky bet" for the UK.

:02:31. > :02:34.David Cameron says it's an "important letter",

:02:35. > :02:38.of "belittling Britain's place in the world".

:02:39. > :02:42.You can expect to hear a lot more of this type of thing.

:02:43. > :02:45.But away from those day-to-day skirmishes, this week has at last

:02:46. > :02:48.seen the big hitters from each side of the debate answer the public's

:02:49. > :02:50.demand for facts with some real substance -

:02:51. > :02:56.JoCo's been keeping an eye on the field of play.

:02:57. > :03:01.Yes, we've seen some star strikers take to the pitch this week.

:03:02. > :03:05.Chancellor George Osborne was first, and he kicked off on Monday

:03:06. > :03:11.with Treasury forecasts that the UK economy would be 6% poorer by 2030

:03:12. > :03:17.a figure the Treasury says equates to ?4,300 per household.

:03:18. > :03:20.Leave campaigners were quick to put the boot into that figure,

:03:21. > :03:27.They also pointed out that the Treasury forecast assumed

:03:28. > :03:29.that net migration over the same 14-year period would reach

:03:30. > :03:37.That's 185,000 a year from 2021 - much higher than the Government's

:03:38. > :03:41.target of "tens of thousands" For the Leave Campaign,

:03:42. > :03:46.Michael Gove went on the attack with his own figure,

:03:47. > :03:49.repeating the central claim that the ?350 million spent

:03:50. > :03:54.on the European Union each week could be redirected into the NHS.

:03:55. > :03:58.But their figures have also been tackled by their opponents,

:03:59. > :04:01.who point out that number does not take into account Britain's rebate

:04:02. > :04:04.on the membership cost and other grants Brussels spends in the UK,

:04:05. > :04:12.And just to remind you that if you're hungry for more facts

:04:13. > :04:14.about the debate, you can find out more on

:04:15. > :04:26.Andrew, we are glued to them. We are indeed. Ed Vaizey, can we

:04:27. > :04:32.start with something, is the Government claiming that if we leave

:04:33. > :04:38.the EU, by 2030, each household will be ?4300 worse off? The Government

:04:39. > :04:43.is saying that the growth of the UK economy would be lower if we let the

:04:44. > :04:49.European Union, lullaby some 6% and that equates to around ?4000 per

:04:50. > :04:53.household -- lower by some 6%. If you take it and divided by the

:04:54. > :05:00.current household in the UK and I know you have an issue with that,

:05:01. > :05:08.and indeed, the BBC Reality Check does, which is a very good thing,

:05:09. > :05:14.but... But are you claiming that households will be ?4300 worse off?

:05:15. > :05:20.I couldn't be clearer in saying that we save the economy will contract by

:05:21. > :05:26.around 6%, around ?36 billion that we will not grow and that equates to

:05:27. > :05:31.?4300 per household, it can be loss of income, loss of jobs... You are

:05:32. > :05:36.not measuring household income in this equation, you are measuring GDP

:05:37. > :05:43.per household. It is clear in the document that Kate has brought with

:05:44. > :05:51.her that it is clear to -- equal to ?4300. I have listened to the great

:05:52. > :05:57.BBC business editor explaining it using the word... But two things are

:05:58. > :06:01.not the same. 27 million households, GDP is 1.8 trillion. If I do the

:06:02. > :06:09.same calculation as the Treasury, that gives me a household per GDP,

:06:10. > :06:14.the income, of 60 7,000. Average household incomes, which measure

:06:15. > :06:19.people's living standards, ?44,000, they are entirely different. There

:06:20. > :06:23.are lots of figures that may be confusing the issue. The key point

:06:24. > :06:27.is that on any scenario you take our position outside of the European

:06:28. > :06:35.Union, Britain will grow less slowly and be poorer. It is not just of the

:06:36. > :06:39.Treasury saying that. An independent survey of likely growth scenarios

:06:40. > :06:44.for the UK economy shows we will be poorer if we left the European

:06:45. > :06:49.Union. Hold on, hold on, I am not going to let you try and talk your

:06:50. > :06:53.way out or something. I am going to try! If you wanted to measure

:06:54. > :06:56.whether households would be worse or better off, you should use average

:06:57. > :07:04.household income and you didn't. Why not? Because we talked about GDP and

:07:05. > :07:09.the Treasury is making an estimate across three scenarios. There is

:07:10. > :07:13.actually a worst-case scenario. I understand that but why didn't you

:07:14. > :07:19.use the proper measure, which is household income? Well, that is your

:07:20. > :07:26.assertion. Well can you tell me any other... Hold on. Can you tell me

:07:27. > :07:31.other project on the Treasury red paper where they use this metric of

:07:32. > :07:35.GDP per household? The LSE independent report came out in March

:07:36. > :07:46.which had the same criticism of the BBC Reality Check, which uses... Has

:07:47. > :07:51.the Treasury used this before? It said the GDP will contract by X,

:07:52. > :07:58.that is per household... What does this relate to? It may well have

:07:59. > :08:03.been used in the red book, it may well have been used during Treasury

:08:04. > :08:08.analysis in the Scottish referendum or looking at other policies, but

:08:09. > :08:13.the point is, it is very clear what that document says, which is why

:08:14. > :08:17.Kate has it in front of her. I am trying to work out... Let me ask you

:08:18. > :08:22.this question. No, I am asking the questions, I am not letting you

:08:23. > :08:29.answer your own questions. I want you to answer this. If you think

:08:30. > :08:34.about GDP per household is such an important measure, why did you take

:08:35. > :08:40.the projected GDP in 2030 and divided by the number of households

:08:41. > :08:46.today, not the number of households projected for 2030. Because we are

:08:47. > :08:50.saying it is equivalent to the households today, it is a figure

:08:51. > :08:55.that brings it in line. You asked me to look at different surveys and how

:08:56. > :08:59.they are calculated, can you point to any survey, any economic

:09:00. > :09:02.analysis, independent economic analysis, that says the UK would be

:09:03. > :09:08.better off if we let the European Union? My fundamental point is that

:09:09. > :09:11.on a range of measures, and the Treasury has taken a mid-range

:09:12. > :09:16.measure of a mid-range scenario. If it really wanted to frighten the

:09:17. > :09:23.horses, it could have taken the WTO scenario. Can we come back and get

:09:24. > :09:29.some clarity on this? If you are trying to measure GDP per household

:09:30. > :09:35.in 2030, which, is, as I suggested is a dubious metric in the first

:09:36. > :09:41.place, why did you use the number of households now, which is 27 million,

:09:42. > :09:46.not the official projection of households of 31 million? That is a

:09:47. > :09:50.question you can put the Treasury people who put together but the

:09:51. > :09:56.point I am trying to make is that every analysis of our position,

:09:57. > :09:59.whether leave the EU, is that it will grow less quickly than if we

:10:00. > :10:06.stay. It will cost us, as citizens of the UK, cost us as households.

:10:07. > :10:11.But when it gets to the detail, it is quite difficult. Let me ask you

:10:12. > :10:18.one final thing. You use the number of households now, 27 million, but

:10:19. > :10:24.to get to the GDP for 2030, you assume a huge rise in immigration,

:10:25. > :10:28.which must mean there will be a lot more households. Why do you assume

:10:29. > :10:33.that you will break your immigration target in every year for the next 15

:10:34. > :10:40.years? Well, immigration is one of the key issues that we debate

:10:41. > :10:44.constantly, but... So why do you break it? There will be a lot of

:10:45. > :10:50.people coming to live in this country and a lot of Brits moving

:10:51. > :10:54.out, there are more than a million Britons now living in the European

:10:55. > :11:03.Union. But you have an immigration target of 100,000, your Government's

:11:04. > :11:08.target is to get net migration down to 100000 and your projections

:11:09. > :11:14.assume it rises by at least 150,000, 185,000, every year up to 2030, why?

:11:15. > :11:18.We have set ourselves stretching targets but this is an economic

:11:19. > :11:25.analysis based on the current scenarios. So you are going to break

:11:26. > :11:31.your immigration targets? We haven't succeeded in meeting our immigration

:11:32. > :11:35.targets. But by having a tough immigration target, we have reduced

:11:36. > :11:38.the amount of net migration and as you know, a lot of people who come

:11:39. > :11:44.to this country are students that come to study at our world-class

:11:45. > :11:47.universities. That is not the argument, you have included them in

:11:48. > :11:51.your 100,000. Kate Hoey, can you name an independent study that says

:11:52. > :11:59.we are better off if we leave? Probably not better off. Even one

:12:00. > :12:02.that says we will be the same? I think we are discussing this, with

:12:03. > :12:06.the greatest respect, in the wrong way. With the greatest respect, I

:12:07. > :12:09.think our viewers would like an answer to the question, can you name

:12:10. > :12:17.any reputable study that will show us better off or even just the same

:12:18. > :12:20.if we leave? I can't produce a study that says that because what I am

:12:21. > :12:23.interested in in terms of leaving the EU is the Democratic argument,

:12:24. > :12:28.and the argument that we will then control the money we are currently

:12:29. > :12:33.bringing in and I don't feel that all of these different economists...

:12:34. > :12:36.Look, they can bring out paper after paper and they will all have

:12:37. > :12:41.disagreements about the long-term effects. So even if we were worse

:12:42. > :12:46.off, you would want to leave? I don't think we will be because all

:12:47. > :12:50.of the evidence shows that, as a proud country that is economically

:12:51. > :12:54.sound, we would be able to trade with the rest of the world and do

:12:55. > :13:00.equally well. I just don't accept the underlying assumptions... Banks

:13:01. > :13:04.are a key figure in your side of the campaign. He says that even if the

:13:05. > :13:13.Treasury figures right and I think, as we have demonstrated, there is a

:13:14. > :13:20.lot of doubt about it, banks says that ?4300 is a price worth paying.

:13:21. > :13:28.That is nonsense, I don't know when he said it but... He made a press

:13:29. > :13:33.conference for the league campaign. Nobody would think everybody being

:13:34. > :13:39.worse off by 2030 is right. Let's look at the reputable bodies. The

:13:40. > :13:43.IMF, the IFS, the World Bank, the OECD, the White House, major

:13:44. > :13:47.financial institutions, they all think it would be bad for us to

:13:48. > :13:52.leave. Can you name any global institution that thinks it would be

:13:53. > :13:56.good for us to leave? I'm not sure that any global institution or

:13:57. > :14:01.certainly any other country... They are all part of this kind of idea

:14:02. > :14:06.that somehow, it is important to them. America wants, for example, us

:14:07. > :14:10.to stay in the EU because it suits them. I am interested in what is it

:14:11. > :14:15.our interests as a country and I'm not going to change my views that we

:14:16. > :14:21.are better off leaving by discussing what another country thinks. So the

:14:22. > :14:25.answer is not a single ally that we have, not a single friend of this

:14:26. > :14:32.country, not a single global institution, favours us leaving the

:14:33. > :14:35.EU? I'm not surprised that that, because the European Union is an

:14:36. > :14:39.institution that is fundamentally about supporting and wanting the

:14:40. > :14:43.global corporations and the big business to do very well indeed, but

:14:44. > :14:46.I can think of one person who was the ex-Prime Minister of Australia

:14:47. > :14:56.who very clearly thinks we should leave. Tony Abbott? I am not sure

:14:57. > :15:00.that is true. He was coming around to the idea that we should stay.

:15:01. > :15:06.This decision and the boats are not by Tony Abbott. You raised Tony

:15:07. > :15:09.Abbott? They are not by anybody outside of this country, the British

:15:10. > :15:15.people will decide and not just look at the detail of this gobbledygook,

:15:16. > :15:21.an econometric model that is not going to be read in my constituency

:15:22. > :15:27.or in the housing estates... So your site will not produce an equivalent

:15:28. > :15:32.scenario? I doubt very much that we want to. To give us an idea of

:15:33. > :15:36.whether we might be better off? It is not just about economics. That is

:15:37. > :15:42.what we are talking about because the Treasury report came out.

:15:43. > :15:49.I think it is John Howard, the ex-Australian Prime Minister who

:15:50. > :15:56.said we should leave. Thank you. One final question. You are not going to

:15:57. > :16:04.ask me about gravity modelling Ayew? No, we're not going to look at that.

:16:05. > :16:08.Last year, the Treasury, at this time, couldn't even tell us

:16:09. > :16:14.accurately what the GDP for 2015 would be. Why would we give any

:16:15. > :16:18.credence to what it thinks the GDP for 2030 would be? We live in a free

:16:19. > :16:23.country, so you can dismiss that document. I put off watching some

:16:24. > :16:28.excellent BBC programmes last night to read through it. Did you read the

:16:29. > :16:32.model? It would be important for your viewers, because very few of

:16:33. > :16:39.your viewers will have seen this. Look at this gobbledygook. This is

:16:40. > :16:44.meant to be a serious document. Just because you don't understand it,

:16:45. > :16:48.doesn't make it gobbledygook. Andrew, I know you are one of the

:16:49. > :16:54.few people who doesn't understand it. I am not an economist. We are

:16:55. > :16:59.not a free country at the moment because our laws can be overruled by

:17:00. > :17:04.the Court of Justice and we are subject to majority voting. These

:17:05. > :17:08.are the issues that matter. When you talk to people, this might have been

:17:09. > :17:13.done by the Treasury and they spent lots of money and it, but this will

:17:14. > :17:18.not decide the vote. We will have to leave it there. I think we have got

:17:19. > :17:24.as far as we are going to get today, which wasn't very far!

:17:25. > :17:28.But there is time. We can come back tomorrow. With another document?

:17:29. > :17:31.This time next week, junior doctors in England will be

:17:32. > :17:34.staging the first all-out strike in the history of the NHS as part

:17:35. > :17:37.of their dispute over a new contract being introduced by the Government.

:17:38. > :17:39.Medics will walk out of Accident Emergency,

:17:40. > :17:41.intensive care and maternity units for the first time -

:17:42. > :17:44.although consultants, nurses and midwives will still be working.

:17:45. > :17:47.Well, yesterday, the profession's regulator the General Medical

:17:48. > :17:50.Council said that some hospitals may struggle to cope and striking

:17:51. > :17:53.may not be the "right option" in some places.

:17:54. > :17:56.Let's talk now to Labour's Shadow Health Minister Justin Madders,

:17:57. > :18:04.he's in the central lobby of the Houses of Parliament.

:18:05. > :18:12.Jeremy Hunt says an all-out strike which withdraws life-saving care

:18:13. > :18:16.over a dispute on Saturday pay rates is disproportionate. Do you agree or

:18:17. > :18:20.disagree? What Jeremy Hunt has got to do is give straight answers as to

:18:21. > :18:25.whether he has the legal power to impose these contracts or not. In

:18:26. > :18:31.the Commons on Monday, he was asked five times what is legal powers were

:18:32. > :18:34.to impose contracts and he refused to answer. His lawyers are using

:18:35. > :18:37.different words to the one he used the Bisley and he spent thousands of

:18:38. > :18:44.pounds on another case arguing individual trusts and he is not the

:18:45. > :18:47.appropriate employer. He is trying to impose something, which

:18:48. > :18:53.apparently he doesn't have the legal power to. It is within his hands to

:18:54. > :18:59.end this. Do you agree or disagree, but this all out strike for the

:19:00. > :19:02.first time in the history of the NHS is a proportionate response to this

:19:03. > :19:07.dispute? Junior doctors don't want to go on strike, they made an offer

:19:08. > :19:13.yesterday to get round the negotiating table if he dropped the

:19:14. > :19:18.threat of imposition. Given he probably doesn't have the legal

:19:19. > :19:22.powers to impose that contract, I don't know what is stopping him

:19:23. > :19:25.getting around the table. This name-calling is not doing to reduce

:19:26. > :19:30.the temperature or resolve the dispute. Will you be showing

:19:31. > :19:33.solidarity and standing on the picket line with junior doctors

:19:34. > :19:40.because I'm assuming you think it is a proportionate response? My

:19:41. > :19:43.presence wouldn't make any difference, there is nobody other

:19:44. > :19:52.than Jeremy Hunt who can bring this to a conclusion. Is that yes no, you

:19:53. > :19:56.will be joining them on the picket line? People can make their own

:19:57. > :20:00.decisions. I will see what I'm next week. We need to see what the

:20:01. > :20:08.government are doing to resolve the situation. Given we know it seems

:20:09. > :20:12.unlikely the government can impose the contracts, what have they got to

:20:13. > :20:16.lose by getting round the table and talking and stopping the strikes in

:20:17. > :20:20.the first place. You backed the strikes, so why wouldn't you be

:20:21. > :20:25.joining junior doctors? I am hoping we don't have a strike, I am hoping

:20:26. > :20:30.there is time to resolve this. There are six days to go, you should be

:20:31. > :20:36.asking the government what they will do to avert the strikes. They have

:20:37. > :20:41.sat on their hands for six weeks. I will ask a minister in a minute, but

:20:42. > :20:45.a former health minister says an all-out strike would do lasting and

:20:46. > :20:50.irreparable harm to the profession. He said maybe junior doctors will

:20:51. > :20:53.deeply regret this. Do you think junior doctors should listen to him?

:20:54. > :21:00.They have two make-up their own minds. What the damage to the NHS is

:21:01. > :21:08.being done by this current health trust. Worst records for A

:21:09. > :21:13.attendances. He should be trying to improve the services, rather than

:21:14. > :21:15.dividing them. In terms of Labour's position on strike action, Heidi

:21:16. > :21:22.Alexander said she didn't want to see any member of the Shadow Cabinet

:21:23. > :21:26.on the picket line. But you said individual Labour MPs are making

:21:27. > :21:34.their own minds up, John McDonnell was on the picket line. John is a

:21:35. > :21:39.supporter of the trade union, so there is no surprise. Does it help

:21:40. > :21:43.the Labour Party's position? If there are deaths blamed on the

:21:44. > :21:46.strike, that could see public support for junior doctors fall off

:21:47. > :21:53.a cliff and that will drag your party in also? It is more important

:21:54. > :21:58.what our party is saying. It is critical we try to get a resolution.

:21:59. > :22:01.That is why I am saying we need to be putting pressure on the

:22:02. > :22:05.government and Jeremy Hunt to show a bit of humility and get background

:22:06. > :22:08.the negotiating table. Whether we take an individual position or not

:22:09. > :22:13.is not helping to resolve the matter. The pressure has to be put

:22:14. > :22:17.on Jeremy Hunt to come up with some concrete proposals to resolve the

:22:18. > :22:21.issue. He has done nothing since he announced imposition in February. Ed

:22:22. > :22:27.Vaizey, if this all out strike goes ahead, as it will be the first time

:22:28. > :22:31.ever in the history of the NHS, do you think Jeremy Hunt of the BMA

:22:32. > :22:34.will blink first to prevent it happening? Obviously I hope the

:22:35. > :22:39.strike doesn't go ahead. We'll Jeremy Hunt be the one who blinks

:22:40. > :22:42.first? His position is a respectable position. We had in our manifesto we

:22:43. > :22:48.wanted to introduce seven-day working. There have been lengthy

:22:49. > :22:56.negotiations with the BMA. We agreed 90, 90 5% of the contract. In terms

:22:57. > :23:00.of what Jeremy is saying, three quarters of junior doctors will see

:23:01. > :23:04.their pay increase, no want will see their pay decrease. We have had all

:23:05. > :23:08.these negotiations but we are in a position where Jeremy Hunt has not

:23:09. > :23:13.been able to resolve this. There is no whether Jeremy to go. It is a

:23:14. > :23:18.matter that the junior doctors. I am not sure why they feel the need to

:23:19. > :23:22.go for an all-out strike. Can you deny a staffing crisis would be

:23:23. > :23:26.worse in the week with more medics shifted to weekends without any

:23:27. > :23:30.additional resources. It is clear, if you put more medical resources

:23:31. > :23:33.and shift them through the weekend but don't add any extra investment,

:23:34. > :23:38.it will struggle in the week and that is why they are on strike. It

:23:39. > :23:42.is about reforming the contracts, which Labour have agreed that the

:23:43. > :23:47.contracts need reforming, they cannot stay the way they were. It is

:23:48. > :23:52.incorporating weekend working, a seven-day NHS. With no extra

:23:53. > :23:57.resources. We shouldn't get different care and staff at the

:23:58. > :24:02.weekend and you get in the week. No one is going to lose money from this

:24:03. > :24:06.contract. Ed Vaizey, you deflect the core question at the centre of this

:24:07. > :24:12.dispute. If you have seven days and you shift some of the resources from

:24:13. > :24:16.the week to the weekend, then you do not make up the shortfall in

:24:17. > :24:20.resources, there will then be uneven share, doctors are not prepared to

:24:21. > :24:27.do that. I do not see where this call for extra resources comes from.

:24:28. > :24:29.From junior doctors. It is simply a renegotiation of the contract to

:24:30. > :24:36.ensure Saturday and Sunday is treated the same as a weekday. It is

:24:37. > :24:42.perfectly right. Given the contract was 95% agreed with the BMA, given

:24:43. > :24:50.junior doctors are not going to lose money, I genuinely, I genuinely

:24:51. > :24:54.cannot see why in all -- an all-out strike is needed. I worked with

:24:55. > :24:58.Jeremy Hunt when he was Culture Secretary. I know what he does has

:24:59. > :25:01.Health Secretary. We couldn't have anyone more committed with the time

:25:02. > :25:07.he spends in hospitals and talking to people on the front line. Simon

:25:08. > :25:11.Stephens, a former Labour adviser now chief of the NHS, has worked in

:25:12. > :25:15.the health arena all his working life. We couldn't have two more

:25:16. > :25:19.committed people. But it hasn't worked. Are you comfortable with the

:25:20. > :25:22.idea that some of your labour colleagues are out on the picket

:25:23. > :25:28.line or supporting the strike in the way they are? I have Saint Thomas 's

:25:29. > :25:32.hospital just across the road and I talked to my doctors and work with

:25:33. > :25:35.them. If they are out on strike and will go and talk to them. The

:25:36. > :25:38.problem is now, we have got to a stage where the Prime Minister,

:25:39. > :25:42.instead of floating off round the country doing this EU stuff, he

:25:43. > :25:47.should realise there is a crisis looming next week. He should be

:25:48. > :25:50.getting involved. I think Jeremy Hunt has lost the confidence of

:25:51. > :25:55.people. Whether right or wrong, he has lost the confidence of the trade

:25:56. > :25:59.union and lost the confidence of the ordinary doctors. Therefore the

:26:00. > :26:03.Prime Minister needs to step in. He should be stepping in now and

:26:04. > :26:08.saying, this isn't working. Not necessarily sacking Jeremy Hunt, but

:26:09. > :26:14.him calling it in, having tea and biscuits or what ever they used to

:26:15. > :26:20.do. Sorry Justin, we haven't got time to come back to you.

:26:21. > :26:23.Now, minister and Leave campaigner, Michael Gove, is fond of quoting

:26:24. > :26:26.Robert Burns who once wrote "But facts are chiels that winna

:26:27. > :26:32.In modern English that means something like "facts are fellows

:26:33. > :26:34.who will not be shaken, and cannot be disputed."

:26:35. > :26:36.Whether this week's referendum facts winna ding, we'll

:26:37. > :26:40.But there is one thing that downa be disputed,

:26:41. > :26:43.and that's the value of a Daily Politics mug,

:26:44. > :26:48.which will be just as desirable in or out of the EU.

:26:49. > :26:51.And just like the Treasury we've even come up with our own

:26:52. > :26:59.complicated equation to show you how to win one.

:27:00. > :27:08.Proof if you needed it that our producers are

:27:09. > :27:14.And if that wasn't entirely clear, to be in with a chance of winning

:27:15. > :27:17.this week's mug all you need to do is see if you can remember

:27:18. > :27:29.# This town, is coming like a ghost town #.

:27:30. > :27:32.I grew up in the 30s with an unemployed father.

:27:33. > :27:34.He didn't riot, he got on his bike and looked for

:27:35. > :27:39.work and he kept looking till he found it.

:27:40. > :27:41.# And soon you will find that there comes a time...

:27:42. > :28:04.MUSIC: "Souvenir" by Orchestral Manoeuvres in the Dark.

:28:05. > :28:10.Here is the stuff of which fairy tales are made.

:28:11. > :28:30.To be in with a chance of winning a Daily Politics mug,

:28:31. > :28:35.send your answer to our special quiz email address:

:28:36. > :28:38.Entries must arrive by 12:30pm today, and you can see the full

:28:39. > :28:44.terms and conditions for Guess The Year on our website:

:28:45. > :28:47.It's coming up to midday here, just take a look at Big Ben.

:28:48. > :28:50.And that means we're just moments away from Prime

:28:51. > :29:09.Lovely spring day year in London. It is cold. Moan, moan, moan. It is

:29:10. > :29:11.a beautiful day. And that also means we're joined

:29:12. > :29:24.by the BBC's political I am very happy with the weather.

:29:25. > :29:31.What do we think Jeremy Corbyn will go on? I think he will go on

:29:32. > :29:35.education. Not sure, but a few hints and whispers have reached my ears.

:29:36. > :29:38.What is going on right now, on the Tory benches, which is one of the

:29:39. > :29:42.reasons he might raise it is nervousness by the government's

:29:43. > :29:47.plans to force all schools in England to be academies. Including

:29:48. > :29:50.primary schools. Another controversial part, which lots of

:29:51. > :29:55.conservatives are worried about, including powerful bonuses in local

:29:56. > :30:01.government. If you have a good school that is not a academy, if it

:30:02. > :30:05.isn't broke, why try to fix it. Why put schools through this upheaval

:30:06. > :30:10.and reorganisation? Lots of concerns on the Labour benches, the Shadow

:30:11. > :30:14.Education Secretary has been talking about it. I wouldn't be surprised if

:30:15. > :30:19.Jeremy Corbyn will talk about that. One of the reasons he may do that is

:30:20. > :30:22.there is growing concern of the Conservative back benches. A lot of

:30:23. > :30:28.chatter about a tweak to these plans, if not for U turn. Can they

:30:29. > :30:34.do a U-turn, wouldn't that look ridiculous? It's not like they

:30:35. > :30:37.haven't done it before. It is one of the patterns we have seen in this

:30:38. > :30:43.government, put forward by the government and then dropped. They

:30:44. > :30:48.don't just tweak, it is gone. The government is not listening, would

:30:49. > :30:55.change its mind. The government does a U-turn, the government has changed

:30:56. > :31:00.its mind. Can they introduce some phasing in? It is mainly

:31:01. > :31:05.Conservative MPs concerned about this because smaller primary

:31:06. > :31:08.schools, it is ridiculous. They are probably reasonably happy with their

:31:09. > :31:13.primary schools. Yes, they are working all right. There may be

:31:14. > :31:21.Conservative ministers. Let's go over to the Commons.

:31:22. > :31:28.Mr Speaker, this morning, I had meetings with ministerial colleagues

:31:29. > :31:35.and in addition to my duties today, I shall have further such meetings

:31:36. > :31:41.this morning. -- today. On her 21st birthday in 1947, a young woman

:31:42. > :31:46.declared her whole life, whether long or short, would be dedicated to

:31:47. > :31:50.the service of our nation. Nobody, Mr Speaker, could possibly argue

:31:51. > :31:54.that Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II has done anything other than fulfil

:31:55. > :32:02.her promise to the nation with dignity and grace. People across the

:32:03. > :32:05.country will be marking the Queen's 90th birthday tomorrow in many

:32:06. > :32:11.different ways, many honourable and right Honourable members will have

:32:12. > :32:15.joined the WRI in the four the Queen initiative, tidying the

:32:16. > :32:20.neighbourhoods, some will be raising a small glass and many will be

:32:21. > :32:24.having a proper knees up. So when the Prime Minister next has an

:32:25. > :32:36.audience with the Queen, will he pass on my best wishes and those...

:32:37. > :32:43.And those of the whole house. To our remarkable monitor, and long may she

:32:44. > :32:48.rain. CHEERING.

:32:49. > :32:53.I'm very glad my honourable friend has raised this, I will certainly

:32:54. > :32:57.pass on his best wishes and best wishes from right across Yorkshire.

:32:58. > :33:00.Tomorrow is an important landmark, not only for Her Majesty the Queen

:33:01. > :33:04.but also for the country and Commonwealth as a whole. She has

:33:05. > :33:09.served our nation with such dignity, with such ability for so many years,

:33:10. > :33:13.64 years on the throne and I think it is right we will have the

:33:14. > :33:17.opportunity in the House tomorrow to pay tribute to what she has done and

:33:18. > :33:25.I know the whole country and the whole house will want to join me in

:33:26. > :33:29.saying, long may she reign over us. Thank you, Mr Speaker. Thank you

:33:30. > :33:35.very much, Mr Speaker. I am also looking forward to wishing her a

:33:36. > :33:43.happy birthday tomorrow. But until then, Mr Speaker, until then, could

:33:44. > :33:48.the Prime Minister explain why he is intent on forcing good and

:33:49. > :33:53.outstanding schools to become academies against the wishes of

:33:54. > :33:58.teachers are parents, school governors and local councils? The

:33:59. > :34:03.short answer is because we want schools to be run by head teachers

:34:04. > :34:08.and teachers and not by bureaucrats, that is why we support the policy.

:34:09. > :34:13.But we also support it because of the clear evidence of academies. If

:34:14. > :34:18.you look at converter academies, 88% of them are either good or

:34:19. > :34:22.outstanding and you look at schools started by academies, they see a 10%

:34:23. > :34:27.improvement on average over the first two years. The results are

:34:28. > :34:33.better, education is improving, I say let's complete the work. Mr

:34:34. > :34:37.Speaker, he hasn't managed to convince the former chair of the

:34:38. > :34:40.Education Select Committee, his friend the Member for Beverly Ann

:34:41. > :34:47.Holderness, who said, "Current evidence does not approve that

:34:48. > :34:51.academies raise standards overall or for disadvantaged children." Why is

:34:52. > :34:57.the Prime Minister ignoring evidence of select committee chairs and so

:34:58. > :35:01.many others on this issue? The results speak for themselves. Under

:35:02. > :35:07.this Government, there are 1.4 million more pupils in good or

:35:08. > :35:12.outstanding schools, but let me take him to a school near where he lives.

:35:13. > :35:16.Let's try the downhills primary school not far from his

:35:17. > :35:20.constituency. It was in special measures, taken over by an academy

:35:21. > :35:24.and two years later, it was a good school, so the question I would put

:35:25. > :35:29.to the Leader of the Opposition and indeed so many other MPs opposite,

:35:30. > :35:40.why do you want to stand on a picket line under a banner saying "Save our

:35:41. > :35:44.failing schools"? Mr Speaker, as he well knows, every teacher, parent,

:35:45. > :35:49.pupil wants the best they can get for their schools and they want a

:35:50. > :35:54.good education system. What many are concerned about is this top-down

:35:55. > :35:58.reorganisation. If he won't listen to the former chair of the Education

:35:59. > :36:03.Select Committee, will he listened to his friend the Member for

:36:04. > :36:07.Colchester, who said this, "If a school is well governed, well-run

:36:08. > :36:12.and performing well, it should be left alone and allowed to do its

:36:13. > :36:18.job." Can the Prime Minister explain why good school leaders should focus

:36:19. > :36:24.their time and resources not on educating children but on arbitrary

:36:25. > :36:28.changes imposed from above? Let me make two points on the specific

:36:29. > :36:33.issue he raises. I would say to outstanding or to good schools, they

:36:34. > :36:38.have nothing to fear from becoming academies, but a huge amount to

:36:39. > :36:42.gain. The truth is, even about outstanding or good schools, we want

:36:43. > :36:45.them to be even better and the truth is academies and greater

:36:46. > :36:50.independence, letting headteachers run their schools, has been hugely

:36:51. > :36:54.effective and actually, this is something started by the Labour

:36:55. > :36:57.Government, given rocket boosters under this Government. We have seen

:36:58. > :37:01.massive improvements in our schools because of academies and we say

:37:02. > :37:09.let's get on with it, finished the job and give all of our children are

:37:10. > :37:12.great opportunity. Mr Speaker, I'm sure the Prime Minister is aware of

:37:13. > :37:16.the views of people in Oxfordshire on this issue. Councillor Tilly, the

:37:17. > :37:29.Conservative Cabinet member for education in his own county, said,

:37:30. > :37:34."I am fed up with the from above", "Saying you will do this and you

:37:35. > :37:38.won't do that." He claims to be an advocate of devolution so is he not

:37:39. > :37:40.concerned about criticisms from the Member for altering the sale West

:37:41. > :37:44.who says there is little accountability or parental

:37:45. > :37:49.involvement. Can't the Prime Minister understand the anger so

:37:50. > :37:53.many people feel just being imposed on them, a system they don't want on

:37:54. > :37:59.what of often already very good or outstanding schools? It is always

:38:00. > :38:03.good to get a lecture McDevitt lecture on diktats from somebody

:38:04. > :38:11.who's press secretary is an avowed Stalinist. The truth is, creating

:38:12. > :38:14.academies is true devolution because you are putting the power in the

:38:15. > :38:20.hands of the headteachers and the teachers. And of course you will

:38:21. > :38:25.find people in local Government who want to keep things exactly as they

:38:26. > :38:29.are, but the truth is, one of the reasons I so strongly supported

:38:30. > :38:34.academies is that when they fail, they are intervened on so much

:38:35. > :38:40.faster. Local authority schools are often left to fail, year after year

:38:41. > :38:44.after year. I think one year of a failing school is one year to many,

:38:45. > :38:47.so let's encourage academies, let's build a great education system and

:38:48. > :38:55.let's have opportunity for all our children. Mr Speaker, last week, I

:38:56. > :39:02.spent a very interesting afternoon at a local school in my

:39:03. > :39:06.constituency. I visited Duncan primary school and it is a good to

:39:07. > :39:13.outstanding school and I had a long discussion with the headteacher,

:39:14. > :39:19.parents, parent - governors and year six pupils. The year six pupils were

:39:20. > :39:25.very interesting, asking me to say this to the Prime Minister, "Why are

:39:26. > :39:29.you doing this?" They love their school. They like it the way it is,

:39:30. > :39:34.they don't want any top-down reorganisation and he hasn't even

:39:35. > :39:38.convinced the former Education Secretary Kenneth Baker, who says I

:39:39. > :39:45.don't quite know why the Government is doing this. What is his answer to

:39:46. > :39:49.those very smart pupils in year six? My answer to those pupils in year

:39:50. > :39:53.six is very much the answer that he gave, because I was following his

:39:54. > :39:57.tour of the school and this is what the Right Honourable gentleman said.

:39:58. > :40:05."I Want to see a family of schools and I want to see them properly

:40:06. > :40:10.funded. " with our reform to the formula, there will be fair funding

:40:11. > :40:13.across the country and with our plans for academies, there will be

:40:14. > :40:16.genuine families of schools, families that choose to group

:40:17. > :40:21.together and here is the point about outstanding schools, not only will

:40:22. > :40:26.they be able to get better but in groups of academies, they will be

:40:27. > :40:30.able to help others schools to improve, so a game, that is why we

:40:31. > :40:33.need this reform, to make outstanding and good schools even

:40:34. > :40:39.better and to help raise the aspiration of all. That is what it

:40:40. > :40:45.is all about. Mr Speaker, we appear to be heading into some kind of

:40:46. > :40:54.fantasyland here. The Institute for fiscal is to -- fiscal studies state

:40:55. > :40:59.that school spending is expected to fall by at least 7% in real terms in

:41:00. > :41:04.the next four years. It is the biggest cup since the 1970s. So why

:41:05. > :41:12.on earth is the Prime Minister proposing to spend ?1.3 billion on a

:41:13. > :41:15.top-down reorganisation that wasn't in his manifesto, teachers don't

:41:16. > :41:20.want it, parents don't want it, governors don't want it,

:41:21. > :41:25.headteachers don't want it, even his own MPs and councillors don't want

:41:26. > :41:31.it. Can't he just think again and support schools and education, not

:41:32. > :41:35.force this on them? Let me answer his question very directly about

:41:36. > :41:39.spending, because we have protected spending per pupil all the way

:41:40. > :41:44.through the last Parliament and all the way through this Parliament and

:41:45. > :41:48.we are spending ?7 billion on more school places to make up for the

:41:49. > :41:53.woeful lack of action under the last Labour Government. That is the truth

:41:54. > :41:57.on spending. Now, he talks about fantasyland. I think it is the

:41:58. > :42:00.Labour Party that this week entered fantasyland, where they are now

:42:01. > :42:05.abandoning trident in Scotland, they have selected someone who sits on

:42:06. > :42:10.platforms with extremists in London and they have now decided that when

:42:11. > :42:14.I read they were going to ban McDonnell from the Party Conference,

:42:15. > :42:18.I thought it was the first sensible decision they have made, but it

:42:19. > :42:23.turns out it wasn't the job destroyer they wanted to keep away

:42:24. > :42:27.from their conference, it was one of Britain's biggest destroyers. No

:42:28. > :42:44.wonder Labour MPs are in despair. Frankly, I'm loving it.

:42:45. > :42:50.Thank you, Mr Speaker. Can I ask my right honourable friend whether he

:42:51. > :42:55.agrees with the Treasury forecast issued on Monday, which warns that

:42:56. > :43:03.if we stay in the European Union, there will be 3 million more

:43:04. > :43:07.migrants by the year 2030? Last year, my right honourable friend and

:43:08. > :43:11.I were elected on a clear manifesto pledge to reduce net migration to

:43:12. > :43:14.the tens of thousands. How are we going to be able to deliver on that

:43:15. > :43:21.pledge unless we leave the European Union? The point about the Treasury

:43:22. > :43:24.forecast is it takes the Office of National Statistics' figures and the

:43:25. > :43:29.OBR figures and it doesn't alter them, but it is trying to make a

:43:30. > :43:32.very clear and pure argument, backed by the governor of the Bank of

:43:33. > :43:36.England, that shows what would happen if Britain leads the EU.

:43:37. > :43:39.There is a demand out there for independent and clear statistics and

:43:40. > :43:50.that is exactly what the Treasury provided.

:43:51. > :43:53.It is believed that the recent murder of Glasgow shopkeeper Asad

:43:54. > :44:01.Shah was religiously motivated and this week, faith leaders launched a

:44:02. > :44:04.campaign across Scotland entitled United Against Extremism. Will the

:44:05. > :44:09.Prime Minister join me and colleagues of all parties in

:44:10. > :44:14.supporting the aims of this campaign to support and foster understanding

:44:15. > :44:17.and to stand up to extremism? I will certainly join The Right Honourable

:44:18. > :44:21.gentleman. This was an absolutely shocking murder and I think what it

:44:22. > :44:25.demonstrates again and what his question hints that is we need not

:44:26. > :44:29.only to stand up against violence and acts of appalling violence like

:44:30. > :44:33.this, but we also need to stand up against the extremist mindset that

:44:34. > :44:40.sometimes tries to justify events like this or other such outrages.

:44:41. > :44:45.Total agreement with the Prime Minister and the murder of Asad Shah

:44:46. > :44:52.is just the most recent of sectarian extremism targeting the community in

:44:53. > :44:58.the UK. This is reports, dear being refused employment, businesses being

:44:59. > :45:01.boycotted, children being shunned and people working to bring faith

:45:02. > :45:05.leaders together facing death threats. Does the Prime Minister

:45:06. > :45:09.agree this is totally unacceptable in a country where we believe in

:45:10. > :45:12.free speech and religious tolerance and the time has come for all

:45:13. > :45:14.community and all faith leaders of all religions to stand up against

:45:15. > :45:23.extremism? I agree Faith leaders can play a

:45:24. > :45:31.huge role in standing up against extremism, and I welcome what they

:45:32. > :45:34.do. But the attack on Muslims by other Muslims demonstrates once

:45:35. > :45:39.again that what we face is not some clash of civilisations between Islam

:45:40. > :45:46.and Christianity, or Islam and Buddhism. What we are seeing is a

:45:47. > :45:51.small minority in a great religion in our world, is lamb, believing

:45:52. > :45:57.there is only one way, our violence, extremist way of professing their

:45:58. > :46:05.faith. This is a battle in Islam and we have to be on the side of the

:46:06. > :46:09.moderate and help them win it, otherwise we take the wrong path.

:46:10. > :46:13.The future of services provided by Paignton hospital has been thrown

:46:14. > :46:17.into doubt by news that the CCG and local trust are about to launch a

:46:18. > :46:17.consultation which could see it close with no replacement.

:46:18. > :46:22.Does the Prime Minister share my concerns and agree it is vital

:46:23. > :46:31.services are placed and the trust and the CCG are unsupported actions.

:46:32. > :46:38.I understand no decision has been made. These bodies are clinically

:46:39. > :46:42.led and I think it is important. Decisions about what services are

:46:43. > :46:46.required will be taken by that group. If there are significant

:46:47. > :46:49.changes, they have to meet key tests. Support from clinical

:46:50. > :46:53.commissioners, public engagements and clarity on the clinical evidence

:46:54. > :47:02.base and support, all those things have to be satisfied. Mr Speaker,

:47:03. > :47:11.the air in our cities is both toxic and illegal with diesel fumes

:47:12. > :47:17.contributing to 800 deaths a week. 40,000 a year. So why is the Prime

:47:18. > :47:22.Minister, instead of removing the most heavily polluting diesel

:47:23. > :47:26.vehicles from our streets, lobbying the EU in Brussels with the Mayor of

:47:27. > :47:34.London, to weaken plans to improve our air quality and save lives? We

:47:35. > :47:39.are investing in better air quality. Since 2011 we have committed ?2

:47:40. > :47:43.billion to help us operators upgrade their feet. We have seen her quality

:47:44. > :47:49.improved in terms of emissions of nitrous oxide is coming down by 17%.

:47:50. > :47:54.When it comes to these standards we all have to meet, we are working

:47:55. > :47:58.with our car industry. I want a car industry in Britain. I am proud of

:47:59. > :48:02.the fact it has recovered so strongly. In the north-east of

:48:03. > :48:07.England we now make more cars than the whole of Italy. We are going to

:48:08. > :48:15.make sure they have the resources they need to meet the high standards

:48:16. > :48:19.that are set out. It is a truth universally acknowledged, that fish

:48:20. > :48:23.and chips taste test on the beaches of Skegness and that is why 4

:48:24. > :48:28.million people visit every year. Does the Prime Minister agree with

:48:29. > :48:31.me, that we should work with the Environment Agency, the local

:48:32. > :48:36.enterprise partnership, the local councils and builds on the work of

:48:37. > :48:39.this government that has brought jobs and growth, extend the tourist

:48:40. > :48:45.season and build ?1 billion coastal economy by the end of this decade?

:48:46. > :48:49.By honourable friend is right, that is why I announced the 5-point plan

:48:50. > :48:52.for tourism last year, to encourage people to visit UK resorts, both

:48:53. > :48:57.from overseas and British people as well. That is what is happening. In

:48:58. > :49:05.the week where we are supporting fish and chips on this side of the

:49:06. > :49:09.House, they are banning McDonald's. Mr Speaker, more than 2000 people

:49:10. > :49:15.have signed a petition started by Alison's chemist in Cockermouth in

:49:16. > :49:18.my constituency, calling on the government not to cut the funding

:49:19. > :49:23.for community pharmacists. Given the major reports last week from Bootsy

:49:24. > :49:27.face investigation by the regulator, isn't it time the Prime Minister and

:49:28. > :49:31.his government supported independent pharmacies which are vital lifeline

:49:32. > :49:37.for our community and help to keep the high streets alive? We are

:49:38. > :49:42.supporting the pharmacies. There is a specific scheme to help will stop

:49:43. > :49:46.if we look at the massive fire -- last five year there was a massive

:49:47. > :49:51.increase in pharmacy spending and we have to make sure as much of the NHS

:49:52. > :49:55.resources go to the front line, nurses, doctors and the operations

:49:56. > :50:00.and the A we want to see carried out. We have to make sure we are

:50:01. > :50:04.getting value for money in pharmacies but also protecting the

:50:05. > :50:08.pharmacies she talks about. Mr Speaker, given his earlier important

:50:09. > :50:14.comments, does my right honourable friend agree, it is the duty of all

:50:15. > :50:18.members of this House to condemn, without caveat, all extremism and

:50:19. > :50:24.never, never to share a platform with any extremist? I think my

:50:25. > :50:33.honourable friend is absolutely right. If we are going to condemn,

:50:34. > :50:36.not just by Liz and -- violent extremism, but extremism that

:50:37. > :50:39.justifies violence in anyway, we cannot back these people and appear

:50:40. > :50:45.on platforms with them. I am concerned about Labour's candidate

:50:46. > :50:53.as Mayor of London who has appeared again, and again... The leader of

:50:54. > :51:00.the Labour Party is saying it is disgraceful. Let me tell him...

:51:01. > :51:04.Solomon Ghani, the honourable member for tooting has appeared on a

:51:05. > :51:14.platform with him nine times. This man support IS. Mr Speaker, they are

:51:15. > :51:21.shouting down this point because they don't want to hear the truth.

:51:22. > :51:27.Anyone can make a mistake about who they appear on a platform with. We

:51:28. > :51:30.are not always responsible for what our political opponents say. But if

:51:31. > :51:36.you do it time at the time, time after time, it is right to question

:51:37. > :51:45.your judgment. Mr Speaker, news overnight of a management and worker

:51:46. > :51:51.buyout at Tata will bring hope the families. It is important UK

:51:52. > :51:55.Government provides all the supporter can. Will the Prime

:51:56. > :52:01.Minister become the company's head of sales and meet with Port Talbot's

:52:02. > :52:06.biggest customers to make sure no orders for Welsh steel are lost? We

:52:07. > :52:09.will do everything we can to help this company and help it with its

:52:10. > :52:15.customers during this difficult time. Right now we are talking with

:52:16. > :52:20.the board of Tata to make sure the questions they need answered, are

:52:21. > :52:23.answered by us. We want to have a proper sales process with proper

:52:24. > :52:27.buyers coming forward and we want to be cleared the government is

:52:28. > :52:34.prepared to support that process and support the outcome. That is exactly

:52:35. > :52:38.what we will do. The EU security is only as strong as its weakest

:52:39. > :52:45.border. Does the Prime Minister share my concerns, not only over

:52:46. > :52:55.Angela Merkel's legitimate and -- legitimisation over the Turkish

:52:56. > :53:03.leaders speech. Is he concerned currently Angela Merkel seems to be

:53:04. > :53:09.outstripping everyone in making the case that Brexit. If you are in the

:53:10. > :53:13.Schengen zone you are only as strong as your weakest border. But we're

:53:14. > :53:20.not in the Schengen zone. The second point, the Schengen zone has decided

:53:21. > :53:24.to offer visas to Turkish nationals. We have not made that decision and

:53:25. > :53:32.we will not be making that decision. At Visa is not a right to go and

:53:33. > :53:36.live and work reside. The Visa is a right to visit. So let's be clear

:53:37. > :53:38.also, those Turks with their visas are visiting Schengen countries,

:53:39. > :53:42.don't have those rights and they don't have the right to come to

:53:43. > :53:46.Britain automatically either. Important to get back clear. In the

:53:47. > :53:52.last hour we have had the devastating news that reduce gas

:53:53. > :53:57.proposed to close a site with the loss of 700 jobs. Will the Prime

:53:58. > :54:02.Minister in strip his ministers to contact the company and the unions,

:54:03. > :54:05.and arrange urgent meetings, preferably to save these jobs. If

:54:06. > :54:10.that proves impossible, to establish a task force to create alternative

:54:11. > :54:12.opportunities for this loyal and hard-working workforce? I can give

:54:13. > :54:19.the honourable gentleman that assurance. I heard is new shortly

:54:20. > :54:24.before PMQs. We will make sure a task force of ministers available to

:54:25. > :54:26.talk to the company, the local community to provide assistance in

:54:27. > :54:34.terms of retraining and other things to be done to help. Mr Speaker, Mrs

:54:35. > :54:39.Thatcher used to organise seminars for ministers and senior academics

:54:40. > :54:47.for colleagues like myself whose knowledge of modern science she

:54:48. > :54:50.thought needed to be improved. Would he contemplate similar seminars for

:54:51. > :54:55.some of his senior and very respect did Cabinet colleagues with

:54:56. > :55:01.businessmen, on the nature of international trade in today's

:55:02. > :55:05.world? Because some of their respective figures believe you

:55:06. > :55:11.simply turn up and sell goods and services that comply with British

:55:12. > :55:15.made rules, but don't have to comply with any rules agreed with the

:55:16. > :55:21.country to which you are selling. And would he also include some of

:55:22. > :55:28.the many businessmen who are cutting investment decisions on hold now,

:55:29. > :55:38.because of the uncertainty about Brexit after June the 23rd will stop

:55:39. > :55:42.if we made our whole future trading arrangements with the outside world

:55:43. > :55:48.as uncertain as some people are trying to do. I always listen very

:55:49. > :55:53.careful to my right honourable friend and will consider such

:55:54. > :55:57.seminars. I hope they will never be as frightening as seminars sometimes

:55:58. > :56:03.used to be under Mrs Thatcher. One of the first times I met her, I was

:56:04. > :56:09.responsible for trade and industry research. She asked me what today's

:56:10. > :56:13.figures were, I didn't know. I wanted the floor to open up and

:56:14. > :56:17.swallow me at that moment. Just because you have friendly relations

:56:18. > :56:22.with the country, doesn't mean you get automatically good trade

:56:23. > :56:27.relations. We are very pleased President Obama is coming on Friday,

:56:28. > :56:31.but it is worth noting, even though we have a friendly relationship with

:56:32. > :56:35.America, we cannot sell beef or lamb to the United States of America. The

:56:36. > :56:44.point is, you don't need good relations, you need nailed down

:56:45. > :56:47.trade relations. Mr Speaker, at the budget the Chancellor announced the

:56:48. > :56:51.creation of a northern school strategy, which I broadly welcome.

:56:52. > :56:57.But I am concerned that the progress it could make would be reversed by

:56:58. > :57:02.the government's forced a cad plans. Why is the government pushing these

:57:03. > :57:07.plans, which parents in my constituency don't want and plans,

:57:08. > :57:14.which even a former Tory Education Secretary, describes as a plain daft

:57:15. > :57:17.and unnecessary? What I said to the honourable gentleman, wake of the

:57:18. > :57:23.outcome of this review, which the Chancellor sets up. The point is,

:57:24. > :57:26.some schools that have been failing for year after year have been left

:57:27. > :57:32.by local authorities in that state. We have found the way to help

:57:33. > :57:36.succeed schools to fly and for failing schools to improve is to

:57:37. > :57:42.have academies. The evidence is in front of us and that is why we are

:57:43. > :57:47.so keen in progressing this. One of the reasons my right honourable

:57:48. > :57:50.friend led his party to victory at last year's general election, was

:57:51. > :58:01.the pledge to reduce immigration to the tens of thousands. Can he tell

:58:02. > :58:06.us why the OBR project immigration to be above 200,000 a year for the

:58:07. > :58:11.rest of this decade? By what assumptions do they reach this

:58:12. > :58:15.figure? Can he give some details? The OBR don't take into account the

:58:16. > :58:18.agreements we have just reach with the European Union over welfare and

:58:19. > :58:24.other immigration restrictions. The Treasury document is very clear

:58:25. > :58:28.about not trying to make all sorts of different assumptions by

:58:29. > :58:33.variables, but to take a very clear set of statistics, established by

:58:34. > :58:36.the OBR. That is why it was interesting when the governor of the

:58:37. > :58:40.Bank of England came out and said it wasn't analytically robust process.

:58:41. > :58:49.It doesn't take into account the agreement we reached in Europe. In

:58:50. > :58:54.2009, Michelle was brutally raped and murdered in Walthamstow. Since

:58:55. > :59:01.2011, a man wanted in connection with this crime and seven other

:59:02. > :59:06.counts of sexual violence in my constituency, has been evading

:59:07. > :59:09.extradition from India. Over 30 court appearances and another one

:59:10. > :59:14.planned tomorrow. Yet, despite the severity of this crime and the delay

:59:15. > :59:19.in these proceedings, there is no record of any ministerial or

:59:20. > :59:24.diplomatic representations from either the Foreign Office or the

:59:25. > :59:28.Home Office. Will the Prime Minister today, personally committed to put

:59:29. > :59:33.this right and directly raised this matter with his counterpart, so we

:59:34. > :59:40.can finally seek justice for Michelle? I am happy to give the

:59:41. > :59:43.honourable lady that assurance. The British government is always raises

:59:44. > :59:49.all these individual cases, if that is what the victims want us to do.

:59:50. > :59:53.We always raise them, just as we raise a series of cases where there

:59:54. > :59:57.are British people stuck in the Indian justice system. I wasn't

:59:58. > :00:03.aware of this specific case, if she gives me the details I will raise it

:00:04. > :00:08.appropriately. With the president of the United States visiting the UK

:00:09. > :00:13.later this week, can I ask my right honourable friend to raise the issue

:00:14. > :00:18.of the islanders. The government concluded in a report last year that

:00:19. > :00:25.they have a right of resettlement and with the US military presence,

:00:26. > :00:30.will he raise the case of US assistance for the right of return

:00:31. > :00:34.to the British Indian Ocean Territory? I certainly will be

:00:35. > :00:39.discussing this issue. I know it is right right honourable friend raises

:00:40. > :00:45.it. There are many chip Austrians who live in Crawley. What he said is

:00:46. > :00:48.not entirely correct. What the National Security Council and the

:00:49. > :00:51.Cabinet have been doing is looking at the situation of the islanders

:00:52. > :00:56.and reviewing all of the options for how we can help with their future.

:00:57. > :01:02.Those discussions have taken place and we need to come to a conclusion

:01:03. > :01:09.about the best way forward. Some people think the worst case that has

:01:10. > :01:13.been made so far to vote to leave the EU is the claim that England is

:01:14. > :01:22.an island. Could the Prime Minister tell the House what the worst

:01:23. > :01:27.argument he's heard from Brexit is? I think probably the one we would

:01:28. > :01:31.get out of the Eurovision Song contest. Not only would that be

:01:32. > :01:37.incredibly sad, but given Israel and Azerbaijan and anyone near Europe

:01:38. > :01:51.seems to enter, I think we are pretty safe from that one. Would my

:01:52. > :01:58.right honourable friend point out to President Obama, in a series of

:01:59. > :02:05.European court judgments, such as Davis and Shrems using fundamental

:02:06. > :02:07.rights, the EU has established its jurisdiction over our intelligence

:02:08. > :02:11.data and sought to prevent our intelligence sharing with the United

:02:12. > :02:17.States. Will he therefore warned the president, if we vote Remain, far

:02:18. > :02:21.from the US gaining influence in the EU, the United States is losing

:02:22. > :02:29.control and influence over her closest ally. I am sure the

:02:30. > :02:34.president will take all of these calculations into account before

:02:35. > :02:39.saying anything. Let me make two points. First of all, this decision

:02:40. > :02:43.is a decision for the British people and the British people alone. We are

:02:44. > :02:46.sovereign in making this decision. Personally, I believe we should

:02:47. > :02:50.listen to advice from friends and other countries. I struggle to find

:02:51. > :02:55.the leader of any friendly country who thinks we should leave. When it

:02:56. > :03:00.comes the United States, it is worth looking at what so many Treasury

:03:01. > :03:04.secretaries have said, going back over a Republican or Democrat

:03:05. > :03:07.administrations. It may not be the determining factor for many people,

:03:08. > :03:13.but listening to what our friends say in the world, is not a bad idea.

:03:14. > :03:23.The average property price in Hackney is ?682,000. The medium rent

:03:24. > :03:27.for a two-bedroom flat for month is 1500 pounds and overcrowding and

:03:28. > :03:33.demand for social housing is the highest I have seen in 20 years. Can

:03:34. > :03:36.the Prime Minister tell my constituents how the housing bill

:03:37. > :03:40.will help them? It is going to help them because we are building starter

:03:41. > :03:44.homes for the first time that people come by. We are extending the right

:03:45. > :03:53.to buy two housing association tenants, so they can buy homes. I

:03:54. > :03:58.noticed the lady giving us the benefit of her wisdom. Many people

:03:59. > :04:02.in her constituency would love to buy a council House or a housing

:04:03. > :04:07.association House. We have the Help to Buy scheme which is helping many

:04:08. > :04:11.people get on the housing ladder. And with shared ownership, all of

:04:12. > :04:17.those things will help. Since 2010, 101,000 homes have been built in

:04:18. > :04:24.London, including 670,000 affordable homes. We need to build many more.

:04:25. > :04:38.We need to do the right thing and that his side we are on. Prime

:04:39. > :04:41.Minister, woodland is much valued, not least the recycling much of our

:04:42. > :04:48.hot air, but especially ancient woodland. There is only 2% of the

:04:49. > :04:52.remaining. It is as precious as the rainforest and its biodiversity

:04:53. > :04:56.cannot be replaced. Would the Prime Minister agree this precious habitat

:04:57. > :05:00.and the Prime Minister has 331 ancient and veteran trees in his

:05:01. > :05:02.constituency, would he agree it ought to be protected in line with

:05:03. > :05:11.Heritage sites and national monuments? I am lucky to have an

:05:12. > :05:14.ancient forest in my constituency, containing many of the trees she

:05:15. > :05:20.mentions. I will look carefully at what she says. The most important

:05:21. > :05:25.thing we can do is make sure we are planting more forests, more trees

:05:26. > :05:29.and woodland, which this government has a very good record on. The

:05:30. > :05:32.Secretary of State for Northern Ireland said recently, politics in

:05:33. > :05:37.Northern Ireland was on a more stable footing than it has been for

:05:38. > :05:41.some time. We will continue to offer strong leadership for a better

:05:42. > :05:44.future in Northern Ireland. The people in Northern Ireland are

:05:45. > :05:50.concerned about a two sided approach to the past to investigate a police

:05:51. > :05:55.officer who bravely stopped an IRA bomber trying to kill police

:05:56. > :05:59.officers 25 years ago at a police station. Will the Prime Minister

:06:00. > :06:02.agree with me, we have to get behind our security forces, praise them for

:06:03. > :06:08.the work they did in Northern Ireland and not persecute them going

:06:09. > :06:12.forward? Let me be tribute to the right honourable gentleman and his

:06:13. > :06:16.Members of Parliament and members of the assembly. It is right to say

:06:17. > :06:22.politics in Northern Ireland is more stable and is more given our ban has

:06:23. > :06:30.been for many years. Obviously, issues around the acts of the past

:06:31. > :06:34.cause pain and difficulty on both sides of the debate. But we have an

:06:35. > :06:46.independent and impartial justice system. Order.

:06:47. > :06:54.And as Laura correctly predicted, the Leader of the Opposition went on

:06:55. > :06:59.academies and education, and all primary schools being made to become

:07:00. > :07:03.academies. Plenty have chosen to do so but it seems the Government would

:07:04. > :07:09.like every state school in the country to become academies. All six

:07:10. > :07:14.questions went on that. He implied there were many education experts,

:07:15. > :07:18.former Conservative ministers, against the idea and he asked the

:07:19. > :07:21.Prime Minister to step down on this idea. I think he has asked him to

:07:22. > :07:29.step down on something else, but not today! But the day is early, he may

:07:30. > :07:33.well before it is out! And the Prime Minister was robust and his defence

:07:34. > :07:36.over academies, which will be interesting if, in the end, they do

:07:37. > :07:42.decide to change their policy on academies. Let's first hear what you

:07:43. > :07:47.made of PMQs. They responded to the debate around

:07:48. > :07:51.the academisation of schools in England. J in Milton Keynes says,

:07:52. > :07:56.just my imagination perhaps but the Tory benches appeared to be

:07:57. > :07:59.unusually quiet during David Cameron's and sewers regarding

:08:00. > :08:03.academisation. From York, I want schools to be run

:08:04. > :08:13.by teachers, not bureaucrats. This was a bit rich for a man campaigning

:08:14. > :08:16.to allow unelected Eurocrats to run British lives.

:08:17. > :08:20.In Norwich, Mr Cameron continues to rule over the dispatch box and Mr

:08:21. > :08:24.Corbyn again goes on the wrong subject. Education, however

:08:25. > :08:30.important, is not the issue of the day. How about the junior doctors'

:08:31. > :08:35.strike? And Chris says the knock-about between Corbyn and

:08:36. > :08:38.Cameron is becoming ever more boring and pointless, the backbencher

:08:39. > :08:40.questions are often more interesting and challenging and I think we

:08:41. > :08:46.should give more time to backbenchers. John Burke gives more

:08:47. > :08:52.time then there has been in the past, but point taken -- John

:08:53. > :08:56.Bercow. It is almost 20 to one, so he has

:08:57. > :09:00.allowed it to go over, but the long business about the Queen at the

:09:01. > :09:03.beginning. I don't think she is watching today, she is out at

:09:04. > :09:11.Winsley. She normally watches but she is out today -- at Windsor. Do

:09:12. > :09:20.they not get television in winds are? She is out and about, you are

:09:21. > :09:26.meant to know that. The Counselor mentioned by Jeremy Corbyn watches.

:09:27. > :09:33.The issue of academies is a very important issue and Mr Corbyn had

:09:34. > :09:37.six questions about it. Simply in terms of the process, or in terms of

:09:38. > :09:40.media management, is there a difficulty when you go with

:09:41. > :09:47.something that is important but is not on today's agenda or this week

:09:48. > :09:52.agenda -- this we's agenda Chris Watt doesn't it then struggle to

:09:53. > :09:55.make the news? It can be a problem and we have seen it with Jeremy

:09:56. > :09:59.Corbyn before, on days when he has gone on housing, an issue he really

:10:00. > :10:03.cares about, but it dominates the session and then doesn't go anywhere

:10:04. > :10:07.else. That could happen with this debate, it is a wider danger, but

:10:08. > :10:10.what I thought was interesting was that in a funny way, David Cameron

:10:11. > :10:14.was sending more robust on these plans than Nicky Morgan, the

:10:15. > :10:18.Education Secretary, has. What Jeremy called and didn't raise the

:10:19. > :10:24.comments Nicky Morgan made yesterday in an interview to the BBC that

:10:25. > :10:29.critics have raised important issues, it is legitimate to raise

:10:30. > :10:33.questions and question the policy. If that doesn't end there will be

:10:34. > :10:38.changes, I am not sure what is, I don't know if Jeremy Corbyn hadn't

:10:39. > :10:41.seen the comments and he didn't as perhaps the most pertinent question,

:10:42. > :10:45.can the Prime Minister guarantee right now there will not be any

:10:46. > :10:50.changes to this plan at all? I don't think David Cameron would have been

:10:51. > :10:53.able to. The Government has long been in favour of academies and it

:10:54. > :10:59.picked up the idea of academies from the last Labour Government and it

:11:00. > :11:02.puts rocket boosters under it, and they have been expanding at quite a

:11:03. > :11:08.fast rate, particularly in the second there is for you, but where

:11:09. > :11:12.did the pressure come from to make all schools academies? It is a good

:11:13. > :11:18.question, I don't know. I don't know whose idea it was. I think what they

:11:19. > :11:21.have done is, it is important to put it into context, when they say they

:11:22. > :11:28.are making all schools academies, it is going to be spread over six

:11:29. > :11:34.years, and I think the impetus, I don't know which individuals have

:11:35. > :11:37.pushed it, but as more schools become self-governing academies and

:11:38. > :11:40.fewer schools are under local authority control, you get a

:11:41. > :11:50.mismatch where a lot of money is spent on bureaucracy managing fewer

:11:51. > :11:52.schools and academies have made a material difference to school

:11:53. > :12:00.standards and therefore a decision will be made, if you have a halfway

:12:01. > :12:04.house, to go full house. Are you concerned about the way of support

:12:05. > :12:09.against this idea on the Tory benches? I represent a rule

:12:10. > :12:16.constituency and all secondary schools are academies and I have

:12:17. > :12:24.primary schools that are small -- eight to community. If they may go

:12:25. > :12:29.to MPs and say they are nervous about this but it does not mean MPs

:12:30. > :12:32.say it must not happen but in terms of what Nicky Morgan was saying,

:12:33. > :12:37.they will say I have small primary schools that are nervous, they don't

:12:38. > :12:42.have the necessary resources to handle academisation, can we discuss

:12:43. > :12:48.the best way? In my constituency, a lot of my schools are becoming

:12:49. > :12:53.academy trusts and I think it is working very well and I think having

:12:54. > :12:57.all schools academies will work very well but I noticed my constituents

:12:58. > :13:05.and dear colleague, Melinda Tilly, was mentioned by Jeremy Corbyn and

:13:06. > :13:09.she will be furious about that. Even Michael Gove, who was the Radzi

:13:10. > :13:18.Education Secretary, didn't go for this one size fits all, he was keen

:13:19. > :13:21.to have a variety of size of schools if the school was delivering and

:13:22. > :13:26.doing well and the key to all of this is the head and how the school

:13:27. > :13:29.is run and I can just see that where a school is being run well and there

:13:30. > :13:33.is a good head that now hanging over them, and I know you say it is going

:13:34. > :13:37.to take a lot of time, but that is going to weigh down on them and the

:13:38. > :13:43.rest of the staff and it just doesn't seem necessary. Yes, we all

:13:44. > :13:47.want to tackle schools that are failing, but to kind of have this

:13:48. > :13:50.top down... I have had lots of problems with my local authority

:13:51. > :13:55.but, you know, there are some really, really good schools and you

:13:56. > :13:59.don't want it all to be the same. Do you have academies in your

:14:00. > :14:03.constituency and local authority? Yes. Those schools that come under

:14:04. > :14:09.the local authority, do they really run them now? Ultimately, they still

:14:10. > :14:12.have control over various aspects, in terms of they make them all come

:14:13. > :14:17.to various meetings where their heads have to go off and talk about

:14:18. > :14:22.how they can share things across the authority, that is very good, but it

:14:23. > :14:25.is not how it used to be. The head has not got the power to make

:14:26. > :14:30.decisions about how they make changes to their own school. Laura,

:14:31. > :14:33.do you think they will keep their requirement for parent governors in

:14:34. > :14:39.school? That was one of the things that also was angering Tory MPs.

:14:40. > :14:42.There has already been a bit of mood music around that softening up

:14:43. > :14:46.because the idea of chucking of parents who have been involved in

:14:47. > :14:50.their children's schools successfully be years seemed to many

:14:51. > :14:53.people to be going too far, so that may have already been tweaked and

:14:54. > :14:57.they may have acknowledged they are not going to throw people off, as it

:14:58. > :15:01.were. But I do think that on this whole issue, there is a bit of a

:15:02. > :15:05.misunderstanding from a lot of people about how the local authority

:15:06. > :15:09.role has already changed to become a lot more supervisory. Lots of people

:15:10. > :15:14.believe in the ideas of academies very passionately, the evidence is

:15:15. > :15:18.disputed, it is mixed in some places but not in others, but in terms of

:15:19. > :15:23.the genesis of this, fascinating that Ed Vaizey said he didn't know

:15:24. > :15:26.where the impetus to force academisation came from. There was a

:15:27. > :15:32.suspicion when this was announced, just on the eve of the budget, by

:15:33. > :15:35.the Chancellor, not the Education Secretary, that it was in part to

:15:36. > :15:40.try to show the Conservatives went all about the economy, not all about

:15:41. > :15:44.the deficit, they still wanted to have the social reforms, they still

:15:45. > :15:52.had ideas. And George Osborne wished to be associated with that. For his

:15:53. > :15:55.leadership bid. Exactly. There is an expectation around some education

:15:56. > :15:59.experts that this policy would inevitably come in, it has been the

:16:00. > :16:03.direction of travel for some time but the political timing of when it

:16:04. > :16:07.actually emerged is significant, so if we review this reform in that

:16:08. > :16:12.context, if I have to back down, it is a bit of a failure of that

:16:13. > :16:15.political strategy. Your councillor Tilly, "If it's not broke, don't fix

:16:16. > :16:20.it. I don't think schools should be force. We have been supportive of

:16:21. > :16:23.the Government's agenda, we have been helping schools to convert

:16:24. > :16:26.wherever they could and now all of a sudden they are going to force the

:16:27. > :16:31.rest of them. It makes my blood boil. I am put in a position where I

:16:32. > :16:43.can't protect schools. One size does not fit all." Absolutely. Has she

:16:44. > :16:48.been text in you? Is it a tweet? That is classic Melinda, "Making my

:16:49. > :16:52.blood boil". She is a very strong minded and highly successful member

:16:53. > :16:55.of the Oxfordshire County Council Cabinet responsible for education.

:16:56. > :17:02.She has strong views and has never hidden her strong views on a range

:17:03. > :17:05.of Government policies. You have quite a few Tories... In what we

:17:06. > :17:10.could call the rebel quarter on this issue. Tim Loughton, former

:17:11. > :17:15.education minister. Graham Stewart, Jason McCartney, Will Quinn, James

:17:16. > :17:21.cartridge, Edward Leigh, Stuart Jackson, Richard Drax, Lucy Allen,

:17:22. > :17:26.Richard Benyon, Caroline Noakes, quite a lot. And you only have a

:17:27. > :17:30.majority of 12. More than 12 officially in terms of

:17:31. > :17:33.the rebellion. It is always interesting with these debates

:17:34. > :17:37.because on the one hand, people say the Government doesn't listen and it

:17:38. > :17:42.is a terrible thing and then if the Government does listen and amends

:17:43. > :17:46.any policy, it is seen as a U-turn. Shouldn't you listen before the

:17:47. > :17:54.announcement? According to you, a lot of MPs have raised issues. It is

:17:55. > :17:57.not to say they are opposing academisation and spreading it over

:17:58. > :18:00.six years, but it is perfectly right that we have a dialogue with any MPs

:18:01. > :18:06.that raise concerns and they will be reflecting the concerns... Very few

:18:07. > :18:13.people on many sides oppose academies as such. Mr Corbyn does.

:18:14. > :18:16.If he had a good one in his constituency, maybe he wouldn't,

:18:17. > :18:21.London has had fewer than the rest of the country. It is the top down

:18:22. > :18:26.making it happen, the one size fits all, as Melinda has said. I would

:18:27. > :18:29.turn it around and say it is bottom-up and academisation is

:18:30. > :18:32.precisely the opposite of one size fits all because it gives

:18:33. > :18:38.headteachers the freedoms to drive their schools. We will come back to

:18:39. > :18:42.this, it is an important issue and only refers, of course, to England,

:18:43. > :18:46.but that means a lot of schools. I want to quickly say, I think Melinda

:18:47. > :18:52.Tilly has to come on the Daily Politics after all this. With Ed

:18:53. > :18:56.Vaizey. I don't think I would survive. It is bad enough, being

:18:57. > :19:01.destroyed by Melinda would be too much. I think you could cope.

:19:02. > :19:03.Now, a Conservative MP is warning the Government could face defeat

:19:04. > :19:06.in the Commons unless it gives way and offers sanctuary in Britain

:19:07. > :19:09.to thousands of unaccompanied child regugees stranded alone in Europe.

:19:10. > :19:11.Heidi Allen claims another 30 Tory MPs are "waiting

:19:12. > :19:13.to be convinced" ahead of a vote next week.

:19:14. > :19:16.The government's position has so far been that it's better to help

:19:17. > :19:20.vulnerable people from camps in the affected regions and avoid

:19:21. > :19:24.providing incentives for migrants to attempt the journey to Europe.

:19:25. > :19:31.And Heidi Allen joins us now from Central Lobby.

:19:32. > :19:38.Heidi Allen, is there any indication that the Government is going to

:19:39. > :19:42.shift ground on this? Well, I am hoping so, yes. We had a Westminster

:19:43. > :19:45.Hall debate yesterday morning and James Brogan shar spoke very

:19:46. > :19:50.positively that an announcement would be coming in the coming days

:19:51. > :19:53.but we are desperate to hear the content, because so far we have

:19:54. > :19:56.seen, from our point of view, not as much assistance to children in

:19:57. > :20:01.Europe already as we would like, so we are waiting to hear what he will

:20:02. > :20:04.say. He has, as immigration minister, said the Government will

:20:05. > :20:07.be looking to do more but it is the central issue of whether the

:20:08. > :20:11.Government would actually change its mind in terms of helping

:20:12. > :20:15.unaccompanied children that already are in Europe, when it has

:20:16. > :20:18.repeatedly said no, we will focus effort and perhaps more effort on

:20:19. > :20:19.dealing with children and families in refugee camps in countries like

:20:20. > :20:33.Jordan. That is right. It still remains the

:20:34. > :20:38.right thing to do. That way I look at it is, nobody would argue leaders

:20:39. > :20:42.across the world were slow to react to this. It is a great plan, educate

:20:43. > :20:48.the region, but the plan came after so many people made the journey

:20:49. > :20:52.already. I saw the boats for myself in Lesbos, you don't want anybody

:20:53. > :20:57.getting into those. But the fact remains, some of them are here.

:20:58. > :21:02.Three weeks ago I was in Calais. There are children who are totally

:21:03. > :21:08.vulnerable. No safe guarding. Are we going to look at ourselves in the

:21:09. > :21:13.mirror and say, they can stay there. It is not good enough. What about

:21:14. > :21:16.incentives? They are here already, what the government keeps stating

:21:17. > :21:18.that by taking and agreeing to take a certain number of those

:21:19. > :21:24.unaccompanied children in Europe, it will only tempt more people to make

:21:25. > :21:28.the journey? But there are so many of them who have a genuine right to

:21:29. > :21:34.claim asylum here. When I came back from Calais three weeks ago, the

:21:35. > :21:40.first Syrian refugee boys who had made it through the process, they

:21:41. > :21:45.were with us. But there was no room for the fourth one in the car and he

:21:46. > :21:47.was sent back to the jungle to wait for another month. So it is the

:21:48. > :21:54.processing and the mechanics, there are children out there already with

:21:55. > :21:58.family in the UK and Europe and we have the ability to facilitate that

:21:59. > :22:05.more quickly. I don't agree with the arbiter in number of 3000. But if we

:22:06. > :22:09.can say if we don't have processes in place at the right locations to

:22:10. > :22:14.identify these children at risk, the number becomes arbitrate. But we

:22:15. > :22:20.need to see action on the ground. Ed Vaizey, should we move on this? I

:22:21. > :22:26.cannot say if the government is going to move. The minister is

:22:27. > :22:31.giving evidence to the home affairs select committee. He has indicated

:22:32. > :22:36.he is taking this seriously. I would echo what Heidi said, on the one

:22:37. > :22:41.hand we have a robust policy, which is to help people in the region, to

:22:42. > :22:48.take specific people we can into the UK, but not to help the human

:22:49. > :22:51.traffickers, as it were. You know we have an outstanding record in terms

:22:52. > :22:58.of the financial support as well, both to the Mediterranean rescue

:22:59. > :23:02.operation and Syria. But people feel strongly about this. It is a

:23:03. > :23:07.horrible thing to have to talk about, but all factor. But that has

:23:08. > :23:11.to be a potential factor because a lot of people are coming here via

:23:12. > :23:17.criminal gangs and it is important there is a clear policy. Heidi, in

:23:18. > :23:23.terms of support, are there enough Tory MPs to defeat this? Why all

:23:24. > :23:27.these things, it hinges on the announcement James is able to make.

:23:28. > :23:32.He talks to me and colleagues on a regular basis. It is within his

:23:33. > :23:38.power, it depends on what he's going to announce. Something else perhaps

:23:39. > :23:45.we don't think about, the other all factor is a nasty one and that is

:23:46. > :23:47.the pull factor of abuse and trafficking of children being put

:23:48. > :23:55.into prostitution. Because they are left there? Yes, it happens, I talk

:23:56. > :24:00.to the doctors at Medecins Sans Frontieres, the injuries they

:24:01. > :24:06.sustained, it is awful. Heidi Allen, thank you very much.

:24:07. > :24:08.Now let's talk about one of the biggest democratic

:24:09. > :24:15.Or indeed the results of our Guess the Year comeptition.

:24:16. > :24:18.No I speak of course of the online poll held to choose a name

:24:19. > :24:23.for the UK's new ?200 million polar research vessel.

:24:24. > :24:32.More than 120,000 people wanted it to be Boaty McBoatface. But it looks

:24:33. > :24:38.like the government might step in to thwart their democratic will.

:24:39. > :24:44.It's the ship that launched a thousand smiles.

:24:45. > :24:48.The Royal research ship, due to be built by 2019,

:24:49. > :24:50.will be used to study the Polar regions.

:24:51. > :24:54.They asked Britain what we should call it and Britain spoke.

:24:55. > :24:58.Yes, the minister in charge didn't like that idea.

:24:59. > :25:07.It's not a duck and it doesn't have a daft name,

:25:08. > :25:11.We have a link of Shakespeare and heroines.

:25:12. > :25:17.We ask our staff first for a short list.

:25:18. > :25:19.And then we iron out any embarrassing situations.

:25:20. > :25:26.She drowned, so that wouldn't be good.

:25:27. > :25:28.Boaty McBoatface, that is a lesser-known Shakespearean

:25:29. > :25:30.character from the Scottish play, I believe.

:25:31. > :25:37.But I think it would fall beautifully within

:25:38. > :25:47.But back to the Polar explorer, a case of a rose by any other name?

:25:48. > :25:52.Let's name this boat Boaty McBoatface and let's see it

:25:53. > :25:55.as a monument to minister or folly, and a lesson

:25:56. > :26:03.to all those in positions of authority in ministries.

:26:04. > :26:06.For goodness sake, if you're going to try a bit of Aye democracy,

:26:07. > :26:11.The man who used to be in charge of the British Navy sort of disagrees.

:26:12. > :26:13.I think Her Majesty, although inwardly, she will be

:26:14. > :26:15.amused at the whimsy of the British nation,

:26:16. > :26:16.it will be difficult to say the words.

:26:17. > :26:19."I name you Boaty McBoatface, God bless you and all

:26:20. > :26:28.The Queen may also have trouble with the other

:26:29. > :26:30.suggestions like 'Usain Boat', 'Boatimus Prime' and 'What Iceberg'.

:26:31. > :26:33.The moral of this story - if you're asking the public,

:26:34. > :26:48.There we go. Should it be called Boaty McBoatface? Whatever happens,

:26:49. > :26:54.it will be called that by the public. Maybe 20, 30 years' time,

:26:55. > :27:01.people will have no idea why it is called that. I agree, one you start

:27:02. > :27:08.this, democracy is all right, but once you start asking... Be careful

:27:09. > :27:15.what you say, Kate. Some suggest as it is a polar ship it should be

:27:16. > :27:22.called What Iceberg. What is your view on this, Ed Vaizey. Trust in

:27:23. > :27:27.politics is going down, we should go with the will of the people. Joe

:27:28. > :27:33.Johnson said it was stupid to call it that. As we get more involved in

:27:34. > :27:36.the European Union, eventually the Brussels bureaucrats will abolish

:27:37. > :27:44.the British sense of humour. This will be a great memorial. You have

:27:45. > :27:49.just handed Kate right line. In that one sentence you have annoyed Joe

:27:50. > :28:07.Johnson and annoyed the Chancellor, joining sides with Kate Hoey. What

:28:08. > :28:18.about Ice, Baby Ice. Ice, Ice Baby. On that shock moves, they are split

:28:19. > :28:27.on the issue of Boaty McBoatface. Let's give put you out of your

:28:28. > :28:36.misery and give you the answer to Guessed The Year. It was 1981. Well

:28:37. > :28:40.done Kenny McGrath. The royal wedding was the giveaway. The one

:28:41. > :28:45.o'clock News is starting on BBC One. We will be here at noon tomorrow

:28:46. > :28:49.with another edition of your favourite Daily Politics. We hope

:28:50. > :28:50.Her Majesty will be back from her parameter elation is. Until then,

:28:51. > :28:53.goodbye.