:00:39. > :00:40.Hello and welcome to the Daily Politics.
:00:41. > :00:44.More than 180,000 people have signed up to Labour in just two days,
:00:45. > :00:46.but how many of them have joined to support Jeremy Corbyn,
:00:47. > :00:54.Mr Corbyn has this morning launched his campaign
:00:55. > :00:58.to remain as Labour leader, with a promise to crackdown on firms
:00:59. > :01:02.His challenger Owen Smith appears to have a mountain to climb.
:01:03. > :01:07.Theresa May begun talks with European leaders
:01:08. > :01:11.about the terms of Britain's exit from the EU - yesterday she was in
:01:12. > :01:14.Berlin with Angela Merkel, will she have a trickier time
:01:15. > :01:20.One month on from the referendum result which stunned the world,
:01:21. > :01:23.we'll hear from a Vote Leave campaign insider about
:01:24. > :01:30.And as MPs pack up and leave Westminster until September,
:01:31. > :01:33.what books will they take with them to the beach?
:01:34. > :01:39.We'll bring you their definitive summer reading list.
:01:40. > :01:42.All that in the next hour and with us for the whole
:01:43. > :01:45.of the programme today two journalists who may look
:01:46. > :01:50.like a highbrow pair, but really they're just
:01:51. > :01:52.as accessible and ready for the beach as any
:01:53. > :02:00.Think of them as the Dan Brown and James Patterson
:02:01. > :02:01.of political journalism - only without the sales figures.
:02:02. > :02:04.It's Steve Richards and Fraser Nelson.
:02:05. > :02:08.So, Parliament rises for its annual summer recess today,
:02:09. > :02:11.many MPs have already left Westminster for their constituencies
:02:12. > :02:14.and plenty of them will be breathing a sigh of relief after a period
:02:15. > :02:18.in politics which has been more turbulent than any in recent memory.
:02:19. > :02:21.But while some of them will be getting a holiday, for others it's
:02:22. > :02:24.going to be a long hot summer with plenty of hard work
:02:25. > :02:29.For Labour members it will be an unsettled few months,
:02:30. > :02:33.as Storm Owen Smith takes on Cyclone Jeremy Corbyn.
:02:34. > :02:36.The two will be travelling the country, as ballot papers sweep
:02:37. > :02:41.And the results will be announced at a special conference
:02:42. > :02:50.Two other parties will also have leadership contests over the summer.
:02:51. > :02:54.On the first weekend of September we will find out which
:02:55. > :02:58.Green Party hopeful will have their time in the sun.
:02:59. > :03:05.And next week we get the final list of Ukip leadership hopefuls,
:03:06. > :03:07.who come mid-September, will replace the El Nino of UK
:03:08. > :03:11.The Conservatives are experiencing a calmer front now their leadership
:03:12. > :03:13.question is settled, or at least as calm as it gets
:03:14. > :03:15.in the post-referendum world of politics.
:03:16. > :03:21.Theresa May will be hoping the Trade Winds are favourable
:03:22. > :03:24.as she grapples with preparations for the Brexit negotiations -
:03:25. > :03:31.having committed to triggering Article 50 by the end of the year.
:03:32. > :03:34.And she'll be hoping to avert predictions of gathering
:03:35. > :03:36.economic grey clouds, as yesterday the Bank of England
:03:37. > :03:39.reported many companies were adopting a "business
:03:40. > :03:41.as usual" approach after last month's referendum result.
:03:42. > :03:44.Well, the Prime Minister has been visiting European leaders
:03:45. > :03:47.to discuss her approach to leaving the EU.
:03:48. > :03:49.Today she's due to meet with President Hollande
:03:50. > :03:53.That follows her meeting yesterday with German Chancellor,
:03:54. > :03:57.Mrs Merkel agreed with Mrs May that the UK shouldn't
:03:58. > :04:00.rush for the exit door, but should take its time
:04:01. > :04:13.I want to work with Chancellor Merkel and my colleagues around
:04:14. > :04:15.the European Council in a constructive spirit,
:04:16. > :04:17.to make this a sensible and orderly departure.
:04:18. > :04:20.All of us will need time to prepare for these negotiations
:04:21. > :04:22.and the United Kingdom will not invoke Article 50
:04:23. > :04:26.That is why I have said already this will not happen before
:04:27. > :04:30.I understand this timescale will not please everyone but I think
:04:31. > :04:32.it is important to provide clarity on that now.
:04:33. > :04:34.We should strive for a solution which respects the decision
:04:35. > :04:37.of British voters, but also respects the interests of our
:04:38. > :04:42.Together we should maximise the opportunities for
:04:43. > :04:49.We're joined now by the Conservative MP Mark Field.
:04:50. > :04:55.Welcome to the Daily Politics. The last one before the recess. First
:04:56. > :04:58.meetings, you could say always contain warm words and it seemed to
:04:59. > :05:02.go well. But that doesn't necessarily mean it will be easy
:05:03. > :05:06.from now on Think everyone knows it is going to be tough. In the
:05:07. > :05:09.Conservative Party we know that and I think that Angela Merkel's team
:05:10. > :05:13.out in Germany are well awhich are there will be difficulties as we try
:05:14. > :05:16.to extricate ourselves from the European Union. It was a positive
:05:17. > :05:18.first meeting and it has been remarked by a number of political
:05:19. > :05:21.commentator that is there are profound similarities in the
:05:22. > :05:26.political stale of the two ladies, and I think it'll go well. It is
:05:27. > :05:29.quite amazing, I suppose, to see two women together at the top of
:05:30. > :05:34.politics, it isn't often that you see that. I think we will see more
:05:35. > :05:38.of it in the months and years to come. It is a good thing, isn't it?
:05:39. > :05:42.Well, any Scot will be well-used to seeing women at the top of the
:05:43. > :05:50.#35r789. Full of them. Can't move without them? In Scotland, it is
:05:51. > :05:53.leading world politics, in having women, as presiding officers and
:05:54. > :05:58.leading parties. It may be unusual here but in Holyrood people have
:05:59. > :06:02.been used to it for sometime. It could be perhaps, Hillary Clinton in
:06:03. > :06:05.and perhaps, a female President of France. Well, before that happens,
:06:06. > :06:11.Francois Hollande is still there in France. How tricky is that meeting
:06:12. > :06:21.going to be? He is going to be frosier, isn't he? I think it will
:06:22. > :06:25.be fine. Theresa May is an emollient politician. In contrast to Gordon
:06:26. > :06:29.Brown, nine years ago, he was almost bereft of ideas and a spent force.
:06:30. > :06:34.What has surprised everyone with Theresa May, she is full of ideas,
:06:35. > :06:37.firm ideas, on what she hopes to do, for example, to encourage social
:06:38. > :06:42.mobility which seems to have gone downhill. She's not enthralled by
:06:43. > :06:46.the way, Blair, Brown and Cameron and Osborne were with the City and
:06:47. > :06:50.metropolitan values. There is a real sense of mission there. But she
:06:51. > :06:54.doesn't know what she is going to do with Brexit and that at the moment
:06:55. > :06:58.will be the defining issue. I think you are right about that in one
:06:59. > :07:02.sense, however it is all the more reason why she has a domestic agenda
:07:03. > :07:06.she is also looking to put together. We don't know how long the Brexit
:07:07. > :07:11.issue will take. Don't get me wrong, I'm in the unreal it be, it is going
:07:12. > :07:15.to be a dark cloud with difficulties for the political class. It is all
:07:16. > :07:21.the more reason why what has been interesting, is she hasn't defined
:07:22. > :07:26.the early days of her Prime Ministerier by Brexit. We know by
:07:27. > :07:33.Mrs America Mark, she said to her own Parliament, that the UK can't
:07:34. > :07:38.cherry pick. - Mrs Merkel. And that will be the potential pit
:07:39. > :07:41.fall. I think it will be unrealistic to think that we can cherry pick on
:07:42. > :07:45.single market and passporting without having to give some leeway
:07:46. > :07:49.as far as free movement is concerned. However, I think you also
:07:50. > :07:51.have to remember there is a lot of volitility throughout Europe. We
:07:52. > :07:55.have elections in France and Germany. The Italian banks are in
:07:56. > :07:58.deep trouble. Actually, we have to remember we are going to be having
:07:59. > :08:02.this negotiation over the next two or three years once Article 50 is
:08:03. > :08:06.triggered but that's not going to be taking place in a vacuum, it will be
:08:07. > :08:11.being taking place in a volatile situation in the rest of Europe,
:08:12. > :08:17.there are tremendous opportunities, pro-I had vooing we diplomatically
:08:18. > :08:21.we grasp them. How do you assess her chances of getting a deal to sell to
:08:22. > :08:27.the British people With great difficulty. This early period
:08:28. > :08:31.reminds me of when John Major took over, it felt like a new Government
:08:32. > :08:34.after a traumatic period for the Conservative Party. He moved away
:08:35. > :08:38.from the past, abolishing things like the poll tax, which was
:08:39. > :08:42.associated with the Thatcherite passed and the way that Theresa May
:08:43. > :08:47.has moved away from the Cameroons now. But Europe hovered for John
:08:48. > :08:53.Major in the form of the Maastricht Treaty. And Brexit hovers for
:08:54. > :08:58.Theresa May and it is bigger and more problematic than max trict even
:08:59. > :09:04.though it was a nightmare for John Major. Although it feels fresh and
:09:05. > :09:09.new and she has moved into the job with poise. This is the honeymoon
:09:10. > :09:12.period and Brexit does pose many, many nightmarish problems for her.
:09:13. > :09:16.Immigration will be one of them. She restated about the commitment to
:09:17. > :09:20.bring net migration down to tens of thousands. She said it would take
:09:21. > :09:24.sometime. A realisation that perhaps it just isn't achievable. Well, not
:09:25. > :09:29.for the next ten years, anyway. If you look at the projections, nobody
:09:30. > :09:31.envisaging that happening. But interestingly she says will will
:09:32. > :09:39.control free movement rather than abolish it. This relishes the
:09:40. > :09:43.prospect... Of of a deal being done. Jiem' snot as gloomy as stee. There
:09:44. > :09:48.are many ways of leaving the EU. Britain voted for a way. I don't
:09:49. > :09:52.think there are many rocks ahead of her. But you have to satisfy many of
:09:53. > :09:59.the people who voted for Brexit and who wouldn't control of movement.
:10:00. > :10:03.But people voted for a different range of reasons. I think the schism
:10:04. > :10:10.could be the eurozone verses the EU I think there is an opportunity if
:10:11. > :10:13.we go down an down the Norwegian route, the EU-light approach, we
:10:14. > :10:17.would have a situation like the Czechs and Swedes, over the next few
:10:18. > :10:21.years. If it is achievable, of course. Let's look at the banking
:10:22. > :10:25.industry. There are companies like that sector that have been able to
:10:26. > :10:30.operate across the EU as long as they have a base in the UK called
:10:31. > :10:33.passporting that. Will not continue until a new deal is arranged for
:10:34. > :10:37.them as well? It'll continue until we know what will happen. Truth of
:10:38. > :10:41.the matter is obviously that will be something that will have to be
:10:42. > :10:45.negotiated to a certain extent. I think it is true to say... Are you
:10:46. > :10:50.worried about it? Think it is true to say that the City of Europe will
:10:51. > :10:54.lose some of that bishops it would be naive to think some won't go to
:10:55. > :10:57.Dublin, Frankfurt or Paris. How big a hit will it be? There are
:10:58. > :11:01.opportunities that also arise. One of the things about the City of
:11:02. > :11:06.London and I was saying this before the referendum it is not an Joan
:11:07. > :11:08.shore centre for Europe it is an off-shore centre for around the
:11:09. > :11:12.world that brings problems as well but tlurnts as a global financial
:11:13. > :11:15.centre. You have talked about them, but we don't know how they are going
:11:16. > :11:19.to form, fair enough. In the meantime you would expect other EU
:11:20. > :11:23.countries to jump in there. We have heard the French Prime Minister say
:11:24. > :11:26.- we want it build the financial capital, you remember Boris Johnson
:11:27. > :11:31.saying to the French businesses come to London, now they will do that in
:11:32. > :11:37.reverse. The same arguments were put is a years ago when we didn't join
:11:38. > :11:42.the euro. And the critical mass of London is stronger against Paris or
:11:43. > :11:47.Frankfurt since that time. I'm in the naive thinking there will not be
:11:48. > :11:51.difficulties but I don't think it is all doom and gloom and it won't be
:11:52. > :11:59.easy for par toys reinvent itself as a financial global cap. A how much
:12:00. > :12:03.goodwill is there across the EU to what Britain is trying to do? I
:12:04. > :12:09.think it is wrong to look at it with good L I agree with Mark. It'll be
:12:10. > :12:12.fine with France tonight, in tonal atmospherics, here is a new Prime
:12:13. > :12:17.Minister. But they will have to calculate what is in their own
:12:18. > :12:21.self-interest, so for example, the French presidential election will
:12:22. > :12:25.play a bigger calculation in how France plays this over the next 12
:12:26. > :12:28.months rather than goodwill on either side. Similarly the next
:12:29. > :12:32.German election which will be uppermost in Merkel's mind. This is
:12:33. > :12:36.where the game of chess gets so complicated. They will have to
:12:37. > :12:43.calculate what their electorates are thinking... Are prepared to...
:12:44. > :12:48.Prepared to accept. On the whole issue of free, movement, for
:12:49. > :12:52.example, the rise of Le Pen in France, may well mean the French are
:12:53. > :12:58.happy to row in behind some sort of hybrid deal we could be talking
:12:59. > :13:00.about come the early part of 2017. So there are opportunities, the
:13:01. > :13:04.diplomacy element and one thing I would say which has been evident, so
:13:05. > :13:07.many European reads such perfect English and read our primary
:13:08. > :13:11.sources. The one thing many of our ministers have to do is not spend
:13:12. > :13:16.their time with a mega phone saying what they are going to end up doing.
:13:17. > :13:22.The difficulty is so many people now read the Times and Telegraph on a
:13:23. > :13:27.daily basis... And all publications. The The contrast we have, we pick up
:13:28. > :13:30.once a month what is happening in the economist from Swedish politics
:13:31. > :13:34.and you what is happening in Italy cops from a diplomat. I think we
:13:35. > :13:38.need to, as I say we have a stronger hand that we might think and need to
:13:39. > :13:40.play the diplomatic cards carefully. Well, thank you very much.
:13:41. > :13:43.Now it's time for our daily quiz, and it's all about former
:13:44. > :13:46.It's been reported this morning that before last year's general election
:13:47. > :13:49.Mr Clegg spent two days and close to ?8,000 doing something
:13:50. > :13:51.that the party hoped would show he could be "fun".
:13:52. > :13:56.Did he, A) Go to a theme park in a baseball cap?
:13:57. > :14:01.C) Film his own version of a pop video?
:14:02. > :14:09.Or D) Erect a 'Cleggstone' in his back garden?
:14:10. > :14:13.At the end of the show Steve and Fraser
:14:14. > :14:20.The Labour Party is gearing up to spend a second consecutive summer
:14:21. > :14:23.While last year's was all about Jeremy Corbyn's surge
:14:24. > :14:26.from nowhere to beat his more established rivals, this year's
:14:27. > :14:29.looks like being a hard-fought and bitterly divisive contest
:14:30. > :14:31.between Mr Corbyn and his challenger Owen Smith, who is backed
:14:32. > :14:39.The election, which ends in September, is being fought
:14:40. > :14:42.on a one-member-one-vote basis, and there's been a scramble to sign
:14:43. > :14:49.In the past 48 hours, an extra 183,000 people have paid
:14:50. > :14:54.?25 to become registered supporters and vote in the ballot.
:14:55. > :14:59.That means a total of more than ?4.5 million for the party coffers.
:15:00. > :15:05.It's not clear how many people were signing up to vote
:15:06. > :15:08.for or against Mr Corbyn, but a spokesman for Mr Corbyn has
:15:09. > :15:10.said it is "reasonable to assume" that the majority
:15:11. > :15:12.of the new registrations come from supporters of the
:15:13. > :15:16.Well, Owen Smith is holding a rally in Birmingham later today,
:15:17. > :15:19.and this morning he was asked whether he was worried
:15:20. > :15:23.about lots of the new registrations being from Corbyn supporters.
:15:24. > :15:27.Well, they might be, but we don't know, do we?
:15:28. > :15:30.Let's be blunt, we don't know how those people have joined.
:15:31. > :15:33.I've got friends who have joined, one or two, because they want
:15:34. > :15:37.I'm sure a couple of Jeremy's friends have joined, as well.
:15:38. > :15:42.If they do end up being on that side, it looks pretty difficult
:15:43. > :15:45.for you, would that end up in a split of the party?
:15:46. > :15:47.The reason I'm running is very simply because I think the party
:15:48. > :15:51.is in danger of splitting and if we do split the Labour Party
:15:52. > :15:54.So that was Owen Smith, let's listen now to Jeremy Corbyn
:15:55. > :15:57.launching his re-election campaign in London just a short while ago.
:15:58. > :16:05.I wish they were all on board and I wish they would play a full part in
:16:06. > :16:15.the economic debate yesterday when euro John McDonnell -- when John
:16:16. > :16:22.McDonnell was really putting this to the government. We have a government
:16:23. > :16:25.creating worse divisions in our country, and it is their job to get
:16:26. > :16:30.behind the campaign against this government. This party is going
:16:31. > :16:34.places, it is strong and capable of winning a general election, and if
:16:35. > :16:38.I'm leader of the party I will be that Prime Minister.
:16:39. > :16:40.We're joined now by the Labour MP Kerry McCarthy, she's supporting
:16:41. > :16:43.Owen Smith for leader, and Barbara Ntumy from Momentum
:16:44. > :16:48.which is an organisation supporting Jeremy Corbyn.
:16:49. > :17:00.Barbara, what is the evidence that the majority of new registrations
:17:01. > :17:04.are Jeremy Corbyn supporters? Momentum had a lot of people engaged
:17:05. > :17:10.and we did a lot of recruiting of getting people to sign up for just
:17:11. > :17:13.?25 and we are very confident, even though we don't know the numbers,
:17:14. > :17:18.but we are confident people have joined to support Jeremy. There was
:17:19. > :17:22.also the saving Labour campaign, people were urging people to come
:17:23. > :17:27.together to save the Labour Party because this is absolute crisis
:17:28. > :17:30.point as Owen said, and there were people who signed up through that,
:17:31. > :17:34.you can't assume that the people that voted for Jeremy last time are
:17:35. > :17:38.going to vote for him this time. I've spoken to people in my
:17:39. > :17:45.constituency who say they realised they did the wrong thing. It is
:17:46. > :17:54.interesting. Just one example, one of the lobby correspondents said the
:17:55. > :17:59.latest sampling of 183,000 new registrations are 60-40 in favour of
:18:00. > :18:03.Owen Smith. That is a surprise, but there are many people already
:18:04. > :18:10.members, Jeremy Hunt the support of many of the members, not just the ?3
:18:11. > :18:14.voters, and in the next week we will have Jeremy and Owen putting their
:18:15. > :18:19.manifesto forward, and I'm slightly worried that Owen is pitching to the
:18:20. > :18:22.left, because Jeremy has changed the debate, so people know they have got
:18:23. > :18:29.to say the things that people can hold onto. You say you are worried,
:18:30. > :18:35.surely that would fill you with confidence? I'm worried he is
:18:36. > :18:37.pitching to the left even though he is not that left, his record does
:18:38. > :18:42.not show that he has been campaigning on these issues, he
:18:43. > :18:44.abstained on the welfare debate, you can't abstain on very crucial things
:18:45. > :18:50.which will affect millions of people. As Secretary of State for
:18:51. > :18:56.Work and Pensions Owen led the charge against tax credits where we
:18:57. > :19:01.got the government to do a U-turn, the government MPs voted against it.
:19:02. > :19:04.This is a nonsense line which is being peddled, in the same way they
:19:05. > :19:09.tried to cast aspersions on commitment to the NHS which is free
:19:10. > :19:14.at the point of delivery, we have got to get away from that. We need a
:19:15. > :19:17.genuine and honest debate about these candidates and what they stand
:19:18. > :19:22.for and what they can do and what their abilities are. It is not just
:19:23. > :19:26.what you say, it is what you do as a politician and whether you have a
:19:27. > :19:31.strategy for dealing with the crisis the country finds itself in. I
:19:32. > :19:35.agree, is what you do. I find it hard to believe that loads of people
:19:36. > :19:39.that resign from the Shadow Cabinet are now saying they tried their best
:19:40. > :19:43.to work with him, if you look at what has unfolded, it seems half the
:19:44. > :19:47.effort was put in and the other half was thinking of a way to get rid of
:19:48. > :19:51.him. It was not a spontaneous thing, it was very organised. You can't
:19:52. > :19:54.spend time saying you are trying to work hard with someone, and then
:19:55. > :20:00.throw that away at the drop of a hat. 80% of the Parliamentary Labour
:20:01. > :20:02.Party, that spans all the politics which exists within the
:20:03. > :20:07.Parliamentary Labour Party, certainly. I did not think he was
:20:08. > :20:12.doing a great job as leader and I did not support him to become leader
:20:13. > :20:16.but I recognised he had a mandate. In my case I was disappointed with
:20:17. > :20:27.his lack of leadership, and it was obvious he was not fully on board
:20:28. > :20:34.with the Remain campaign. There seemed a complete lack of concern,
:20:35. > :20:37.used the phrase, we campaigned around the country but we were
:20:38. > :20:41.ultimately unsuccessful, and that is all he said, but everyone else said
:20:42. > :20:46.it was devastating, so many issues we need to be addressing. We are
:20:47. > :20:50.looking to the leader to set out what happens next. We had a PLP
:20:51. > :20:55.hustings on Monday and Jeremy said we have two years to trigger article
:20:56. > :21:00.50 and that brings it home. That is not even true. He does not
:21:01. > :21:05.understand... He does not understand anything about Brexit. Labour
:21:06. > :21:12.supporters of voted to stay, it was Ukip and the Conservative supporters
:21:13. > :21:18.who voted to leave, you cannot blame Brexit on Jeremy Corbyn. Don't talk
:21:19. > :21:22.over each other. I'm not blaming Jeremy Corbyn for the referendum
:21:23. > :21:26.result, but I do think he was very lacklustre during the campaign. What
:21:27. > :21:30.I was looking for after the referendum result, a sign that he
:21:31. > :21:34.was bothered about it, and he did not seem bothered at all, but also
:21:35. > :21:39.that he had a sense of where we were going to go next. He called for
:21:40. > :21:42.article 50, only him and Nigel Farage called for it to be triggered
:21:43. > :21:48.immediately, and that shows he did not understand what the situation
:21:49. > :21:52.was and the importance of triggering Article 50 and at the PLP hustings
:21:53. > :21:56.on Monday he said we have two years to trigger article 50 which is not
:21:57. > :22:02.the case. He doesn't understand and he doesn't really care about it. To
:22:03. > :22:06.the nature of the campaign. Jeremy Corbyn says he doesn't want the
:22:07. > :22:10.contest to end up in the gutter. We are going to put up a poster, pitch
:22:11. > :22:14.of Jeremy Corbyn and Owen Smith, in a moment, does this represent not
:22:15. > :22:29.going to the gutter? -- a picture. Owen Smith says he was invited to a
:22:30. > :22:34.defence event because it was a significant employer in his
:22:35. > :22:45.constituency, but he didn't go. Is that post-affair? I did not make the
:22:46. > :22:50.poster. -- poster fair? Jeremy Corbyn supporters have done it.
:22:51. > :22:54.Should it be called out? Definitely, it is not accept of all, but none of
:22:55. > :22:59.this started with Jeremy and it will not end with Jeremy. People have
:23:00. > :23:03.gone out of their way. It is never as nasty as this. Women are attacked
:23:04. > :23:10.on Twitter for having certain politics. You don't think that the
:23:11. > :23:13.intimidation of women MPs that has been cited by those women
:23:14. > :23:20.themselves, you don't think that is exaggerated? Not saying it is worse,
:23:21. > :23:23.it is something that has always existed and we should continue to
:23:24. > :23:26.say it is an acceptable, but I'm very concerned when the narrative is
:23:27. > :23:30.given that this is only happening because of Jeremy and he is
:23:31. > :23:34.instigating it when that is not necessarily true. Is that really
:23:35. > :23:38.fair? I've been a member of the Labour Party 25 years and all of my
:23:39. > :23:46.colleagues that have been involved, they say it has never been as nasty
:23:47. > :23:50.as this now. Social media exaggerates it because it is easier
:23:51. > :23:53.to attack people and you have anonymous trolls, but it feels far
:23:54. > :23:58.more on present than anything I can remember and I feel it is stoked up,
:23:59. > :24:02.the narrative of betrayal. Everyone who doesn't support Jeremy is a
:24:03. > :24:07.traitor, unprincipled, has no socialist values and no place in the
:24:08. > :24:11.Labour Party. He has encouraged it. He says he would like to reach out
:24:12. > :24:16.to Labour MPs and he would like them to come back into the Labour fold
:24:17. > :24:21.which is growing under him because of the increasing party membership.
:24:22. > :24:26.He said that again this morning. He also said he doesn't expect this
:24:27. > :24:31.loyalty from MPs if he wins again and there is a threat there that
:24:32. > :24:34.there would be increasing cause for the selection of MPs that don't
:24:35. > :24:43.support him. Should that happen? -- calls. They need to decide how to
:24:44. > :24:47.hold the representative to account. It feels like people are not willing
:24:48. > :24:51.to put differences aside to try and work together as much as possible,
:24:52. > :24:57.and constituencies should hold the elected representative to account.
:24:58. > :25:02.Jeremy voted against the Labour whip over 500 times, he called for John
:25:03. > :25:08.Smith to have a leadership challenge two months after he was elected,
:25:09. > :25:13.with 91% of the vote. Those were the things he did then. Five days after
:25:14. > :25:20.Black Wednesday and we were ahead in the polls. It seems to be one rule
:25:21. > :25:29.for Jeremy and one for everyone else. What will happen in the
:25:30. > :25:33.contest? I've just read the polls. Actually, Paul has which those
:25:34. > :25:37.figures around, it is 60-40 in favour of Jeremy Corbyn. A
:25:38. > :25:43.significant turnaround and that confirms a poll in the times on
:25:44. > :25:48.their front page, yesterday. We must assume at this stage Jeremy Corbyn
:25:49. > :25:53.starts miles ahead and they are highly effective at organising these
:25:54. > :25:58.kind of events as we know from last summer. If that proves to be the
:25:59. > :26:04.case it raises a number of questions about what the Labour MPs are trying
:26:05. > :26:08.to achieve through this. I've been doing a 3-part series on Corbyn's
:26:09. > :26:14.first year and the last goes out on Monday on Radio 4 and it is clear
:26:15. > :26:20.that there was very little coordination amongst the dissenters
:26:21. > :26:25.after the referendum. Margaret Hodge did one thing. Hilary Benn did
:26:26. > :26:31.something else. The Shadow Cabinet did something else. When John
:26:32. > :26:35.McDonnell said at a rally the other day, I won't repeat it exactly, but
:26:36. > :26:40.he said they are not very good at organising. Use the supporters, yes.
:26:41. > :26:47.That is proving to be the case so far. -- useless. It Jeremy Corbyn
:26:48. > :26:50.wants this as a long-term project he needs a different parliamentary
:26:51. > :26:56.party and the Parliamentary party needs a different leader, that much
:26:57. > :26:59.is clear. In terms of the party, the figures are astounding, in terms of
:27:00. > :27:02.new membership, the money that will be rolling into the Labour Party for
:27:03. > :27:07.the first time in many years, that is also pretty astounding. There's
:27:08. > :27:11.also the massive disconnect the mechanic a movement in the way that
:27:12. > :27:17.Jeremy Corbyn and the grassroots supporters think without the
:27:18. > :27:25.Parliamentary party? -- massive disconnect, but can it be a
:27:26. > :27:29.movement. Yes, it can be, the people who have just signed up, that is
:27:30. > :27:35.more than the Tory party membership, so it is a movement. Can it be a
:27:36. > :27:40.government? That is not the aim of Jeremy Corbyn, his aim is to capture
:27:41. > :27:55.the Labour Party with his hard left views. It is not hard left. The
:27:56. > :27:59.thing is, we want to form a government and Jeremy has been very
:28:00. > :28:02.effective in opposing the Tories and their cuts and he has been very
:28:03. > :28:07.effective on issues of social justice. Actually fund education.
:28:08. > :28:13.Many older people have the chance to go to education for free, the cost
:28:14. > :28:18.of rising is -- the cost of living is rising. It is enough. Things can
:28:19. > :28:21.be better and we want things to be better and we understand you need to
:28:22. > :28:25.be in government to do that and that is what we are doing. We will knock
:28:26. > :28:28.on the doors, we went out on our hundreds to knock on the doors for
:28:29. > :28:35.Sadiq Khan to be the Mayor of London, we need to stop distort the
:28:36. > :28:38.facts, we want Jeremy Corbyn to be Prime Minister and we want the
:28:39. > :28:43.country to be better for everyone and not just a few people. That is
:28:44. > :28:47.the passion of view, Jeremy Corbyn can lead a Labour government into
:28:48. > :28:52.the government. He's not electable, he's not a future Prime Minister,
:28:53. > :28:56.and when I go... On the Bristol MP, there are parts of Bristol where he
:28:57. > :29:02.goes down very well, amongst the former Green voters, people who are
:29:03. > :29:09.in organisations, but if I go out to be more traditional Labour voters,
:29:10. > :29:15.it is hard to convince them that he could be a Prime Minister. He wants
:29:16. > :29:22.to speak to those people, the evidence is that Ed Miliband has
:29:23. > :29:28.lost Labour loads of support, but Jeremy said... You said it would be
:29:29. > :29:34.a disaster when he came, but he has not lost any by-elections. Can I ask
:29:35. > :29:41.one question regarding the rules, is it right that the Jeremy Corbyn
:29:42. > :29:45.supporters have offered to pay ?25 for anyone to back their leader? Is
:29:46. > :30:01.that right? It was heartbreaking when I heard that the NEC had
:30:02. > :30:06.decided... Shore. -- that is fine. The problem is, wider working class
:30:07. > :30:10.people have to pay so much -- wider working class people have to pay so
:30:11. > :30:16.much to be a member of the party? Thanks for joining us.
:30:17. > :30:19.Today marks one month since Britain voted to leave the EU -
:30:20. > :30:22.A result that surprised the pollsters, the pundits
:30:23. > :30:27.Recently on the show we had an 'in' campaigner
:30:28. > :30:30.reflecting on what went wrong, and today we're going to hear
:30:31. > :30:32.from a central figure in the Leave campaign
:30:33. > :30:35.Here's Vote Leave's chief executive, Matthew Elliott, with his account
:30:36. > :30:47.So, Big Ben has struck 10.00pm, and we can now start
:30:48. > :30:50.trying to discover which side thinks it's carried the day.
:30:51. > :30:52.At 10.00pm on 23rd June, the consensus was that Vote
:30:53. > :30:57.A contact of mine at Number 10 texted me to say,
:30:58. > :31:01.And even Nigel Farage was predicting a Remain victory.
:31:02. > :31:03.But after our final conference call with Boris Johnson, Michael Gove,
:31:04. > :31:05.and Dominic Cummings, our campaign director,
:31:06. > :31:09.Gisela Stuart and I were still upbeat.
:31:10. > :31:21.People were talking that we'd lost, the evidence wasn't there.
:31:22. > :31:24.And, of course, as the evening went by, it became clearer and clearer
:31:25. > :31:27.that we were winning but I did not accept it until David Dimbleby said,
:31:28. > :31:30."We can now officially declare that Vote Leave has won."
:31:31. > :31:43.I kept saying, "We need two speeches."
:31:44. > :31:49.The UK has voted to leave the European Union.
:31:50. > :31:51.I kept saying, "We need two speeches."
:31:52. > :31:53.But this was not really reciprocated.
:31:54. > :31:56.The mood was - we only need a speech to concede defeat gracefully,
:31:57. > :31:58.but you and I didn't quite see it that way.
:31:59. > :32:03.Getting to that point was a long road.
:32:04. > :32:07.Five years ago I ran the "No to AV" referendum campaign.
:32:08. > :32:10.I took on this challenge, the test run for a possible EU referendum.
:32:11. > :32:12.We manageded to turn public opinion from being 2-1 in favour
:32:13. > :32:16.of electoral reform, to being 2-1 against.
:32:17. > :32:18.Alongside me at No to AV was Peter Crudder.
:32:19. > :32:27.When I joined No to AV it was a bit political.
:32:28. > :32:29.It needed that injection of business knowledge.
:32:30. > :32:31.I think the same applied to Vote Leave.
:32:32. > :32:36.What I brought was this business acumen.
:32:37. > :32:38.Having the funding and the right campaign team in place
:32:39. > :32:40.for Vote Leave was essential but we had three big
:32:41. > :32:52.We were taking on the establishment, we were fighting Ukip.
:32:53. > :32:54.And we had to overcome the natural bias in a referendum
:32:55. > :33:00.To take on the establishment, we needed to recruit big
:33:01. > :33:04.We needed to show swing voters that serious people from politics,
:33:05. > :33:12.business and other walks of life, backed voting Leave.
:33:13. > :33:16.If you look back to 1975, one of the reasons why the Leave
:33:17. > :33:18.campaign then was so unsuccessful was because leading political
:33:19. > :33:25.figures were seen as very much outliers, in some cases extremists.
:33:26. > :33:28.So to demonstrate there were senior, centrist, moderate figures
:33:29. > :33:30.campaigning to leave the European Union, I hope
:33:31. > :33:34.made a real contribution to the result of the referendum.
:33:35. > :33:37.But at the same time as taking on the establishment,
:33:38. > :33:43.we were also fighting Ukip and Nigel Farage.
:33:44. > :33:46.We knew that swing voters didn't want to feel they were voting
:33:47. > :33:50.Resisting the overtures from Ukip, to create a properly
:33:51. > :33:52.cross-party campaign, was probably the toughest
:33:53. > :34:15.aspect of the referendum for the campaign team.
:34:16. > :34:17.But at one point, the group closest to Ukip - Leave.EU -
:34:18. > :34:20.sent out a statement to MPs and the media, saying that
:34:21. > :34:23.Dominic Cummings and I couldn't run a sweet shop and Nigel Farage
:34:24. > :34:26.appeared on the Daily Politics saying both of us should be sacked.
:34:27. > :34:28.This was a massively stressful period and the pressure
:34:29. > :34:34.A week before the referendum, we were riding high.
:34:35. > :34:38.Vote Leave had punctured a hole in project fear by organising 60 MPs
:34:39. > :34:40.to say they would vote against George Osborne's Brexit
:34:41. > :34:43.budget and we had the wind in our sails but then Nigel Farage
:34:44. > :34:45.unveiled the most controversial poster of the referendum.
:34:46. > :34:47.The Breaking Point image was damaging enough
:34:48. > :34:49.but in the context of Jo Cox's murder, it threatened
:34:50. > :34:53.Thankfully it was clear to voters that Ukip was not
:34:54. > :34:56.The final challenge we faced was to overcome the natural
:34:57. > :35:02.status quo bias of any referendum campaign.
:35:03. > :35:04.As was the case with the Alternative Vote,
:35:05. > :35:08.or Scottish independence, the change side often loses
:35:09. > :35:10.because people's natural caution kicks in.
:35:11. > :35:13.We had to show how there was no status quo.
:35:14. > :35:16.We highlighted the risk of Remain and we showed how Leave
:35:17. > :35:26.Getting to what people feel, rather than what they say,
:35:27. > :35:29.is where the future of research is and this is what we did
:35:30. > :35:31.and the one key thing that emerged on this was the strength
:35:32. > :35:36.of emotional connectivity with that "take control" argument.
:35:37. > :35:40.So that single message was actually a decision of genius, in many ways,
:35:41. > :35:43.because it was exactly what people could understand.
:35:44. > :35:47.It was something that people just got.
:35:48. > :35:52.It cut through straightaway to so many people.
:35:53. > :35:56.At Vote Leave we were challenged for telling voters that the UK
:35:57. > :36:03.is billed ?350 million each week for our membership of the EU.
:36:04. > :36:06.It is a legitimate figure, it is entirely right.
:36:07. > :36:09.We emblazoned this figure on our bus and on our literature and our
:36:10. > :36:14.spokespeople repeated it again and again.
:36:15. > :36:28.In direct comparison to the arguments for Remain,
:36:29. > :36:31.around the perceived impact on the economy in a head-to-head
:36:32. > :36:33.question, if you like, the ?350 million question won every
:36:34. > :36:41.At heart, I'm a policy wonk before I'm a referendum campaigner.
:36:42. > :36:47.At Vote Leave we probably achieved the biggest policy change, ever,
:36:48. > :36:52.A month on, the repercussions from Vote leave victories have
:36:53. > :36:58.The economic scares that people predicted haven't materialised.
:36:59. > :37:00.British politics has been turned upside down.
:37:01. > :37:06.And even the European Union is showing signs of reform.
:37:07. > :37:09.As Liam Fox wrote on Vote Leave's white board on referendum night,
:37:10. > :37:28.Is it true there was only one speech written for night? I was with Gisela
:37:29. > :37:32.Stuart had seemed astounded by the are you, delighted but astounded and
:37:33. > :37:37.the only speech that had been written was the one to condition
:37:38. > :37:43.seed defeat. I think the most difficult speech to make was to
:37:44. > :37:50.concede defeat. A victory speech was easier. Was there only one? There
:37:51. > :37:54.was one but about midnight she started skripling away on her
:37:55. > :37:58.victory acceptance speech. You say you were always confident but not
:37:59. > :38:03.everyone in Vote Leave was so sure? From February, once we saw the deal
:38:04. > :38:06.and terrain, we felt sure if it got to the final stage of the
:38:07. > :38:11.referendum, it was still 50-50, still in contention, then we could
:38:12. > :38:15.get across the line and win. We knew we had - our voters were more
:38:16. > :38:20.enthusiastic and we felt our ground game was better. On the ground game.
:38:21. > :38:23.Let's talk about a that ?350 #34i8 yob fichlingt you say you make no
:38:24. > :38:26.aapproximately joy for t but you promised something you couldn't
:38:27. > :38:30.deliver and you knew you couldn't deliver ?350 million being spent on
:38:31. > :38:34.the NHS. So you lied, effectively. I disagree. A referendum campaign is
:38:35. > :38:38.very different to an election, in the sense that... You don't have to
:38:39. > :38:42.at the time truth... We are a campaign team, we are campaigning
:38:43. > :38:46.for a certain result and we hoped that the Government would use that
:38:47. > :38:52.money for the NHS. You didn't say, that you said "Lets avenue give our
:38:53. > :38:58.NHS the ?350 million the EU takes every week." That was disputed that
:38:59. > :39:02.?3 #r50 million was sent to the EU, in fact it was disproved but then to
:39:03. > :39:04.promise that amount, which people distanced themselves from
:39:05. > :39:08.immediately afterwards s dishonest. The key point was, it could have
:39:09. > :39:12.been delivered by the Government, we would have liked it could have been
:39:13. > :39:14.delivered by the Government but Vote leave didn't become the Government
:39:15. > :39:18.afterwards. What about the in-fighting? You talked about that
:39:19. > :39:22.and said it was difficult to deal with. Was it something that really
:39:23. > :39:28.undermined the Vote Leave campaign? The key point was, we had the vision
:39:29. > :39:31.of a cross-party business-led campaign involving senior people
:39:32. > :39:35.from business, politics, the military other walks of life. It was
:39:36. > :39:40.the best way of conadvicing swing voters it was a moderate, sensible,
:39:41. > :39:43.mainstream thing to do, to vote Leave. It was why it was important
:39:44. > :39:47.that we weren't dominated by Ukip and had a separate independent
:39:48. > :39:51.campaign. You were on the Leave side, Fraser, were you surprised?
:39:52. > :39:56.Yes, really surprised. I don't know any journalist o actually who
:39:57. > :40:00.predicted that Leave would win. The polls repeatedly told us otherwise,
:40:01. > :40:04.we knew not to trust them from last time around but you would think they
:40:05. > :40:08.would have their house in order. The momentum seemed to be going with the
:40:09. > :40:12.Government's side. Pretty much every single member of the establishment,
:40:13. > :40:17.on behalf of the status quoe, the Government, blink and all economists
:40:18. > :40:22.and you had a rag tag bag of insurgents on the other side. So, I
:40:23. > :40:25.didn't know anybody who predicted a Brexit strike but one arrived in
:40:26. > :40:28.what was certainly the most extraordinary political victory in
:40:29. > :40:33.our living memory. It feels like a lifetime now since the vote, or it
:40:34. > :40:36.does to us anyway. Boris Johnson and Michael Gove, key personalities in
:40:37. > :40:41.that Leave campaign. They won the war, if you like, but they haven't
:40:42. > :40:49.been anywhere in the piece? Well, Boris is Foreign Secretary. But one
:40:50. > :40:54.of the extraordinary things about politics is what follow a tumultuous
:40:55. > :40:58.event, like you have just brilliantly described, is never
:40:59. > :41:02.logical. So you have a Remain Prime Minister in place, albeit one that
:41:03. > :41:05.kept a very low-profile during the referendum. Michael Gove, nowhere to
:41:06. > :41:10.be seen. If you like, Boris Johnson, it was a surprise even to him, I
:41:11. > :41:15.think in the end. What, becoming Foreign Secretary? He had two
:41:16. > :41:17.surprises, Michael Gove suddenly standing, an extraordinary
:41:18. > :41:21.Shakespearean drama and then returning when many people were
:41:22. > :41:25.saying, well he is going back to writing books. That was a major
:41:26. > :41:29.weakness, I think in the campaign, that was there no follow-through.
:41:30. > :41:33.The lack of organisation was jaw-dropping, staggering and I
:41:34. > :41:37.think, indefensible. On that, looking ahead, what about a group
:41:38. > :41:43.being formed to hold the Brexit department to account? To watch for
:41:44. > :41:48.any, as you would no doubt see t backsliding? I think there is a need
:41:49. > :41:53.for a group to work with the Government. You have groups like the
:41:54. > :41:56.Centre for Social Justice who work closely with Iain Duncan Smith or
:41:57. > :42:00.the networks that worked with Michael Gove when he was at the
:42:01. > :42:04.Department for Education so there might be a need for a group to
:42:05. > :42:09.expand on the idea. Do you think there should be one? I think so.
:42:10. > :42:13.Would you be part of that? We will have to wait and see. This is what
:42:14. > :42:15.is being talked about now, is holding Government it account.
:42:16. > :42:18.Absolutely, the important thing to my mind, state of the EU immigrants,
:42:19. > :42:26.throughout the campaign, everybody said there should be no question
:42:27. > :42:29.that EU immigrants should stay here, no question of repatriation,
:42:30. > :42:34.everyone said that, and Theresa May has put the skids under three
:42:35. > :42:39.million nationals living in Britain. They are being sent letters up in
:42:40. > :42:44.Scotland saying, you are OK for now. The lack of precision in the
:42:45. > :42:49.immediate aftermath. I don't blame the Brexiteers, they had to win a
:42:50. > :42:53.campaign and they won T I don't blame what you did in the NHS. All
:42:54. > :42:57.is fair in a xavenlt I blame David Cameron for offering this in the
:42:58. > :43:02.first place, as a binary referendum, on in or out, where no-ones with a
:43:03. > :43:06.under any pressure to explain what out would mean in any great deat the
:43:07. > :43:09.same time. You had a campaign to win, but that's a different
:43:10. > :43:12.objective, which you did brilliantly and that is the problem with
:43:13. > :43:18.referendums. I understand why he felt he had to call t but they are
:43:19. > :43:23.dangerous devices because you then, once it is called, you just focus on
:43:24. > :43:27.how you win it. And the threshold... And now face the consequences and
:43:28. > :43:33.no-one is entirely sure what it is going to mean. Did you enjoy it? I
:43:34. > :43:39.loved T However difficult it was. Would you have said that if you had
:43:40. > :43:43.lost? Of it a tough year, it was a really tough year, but it feels a
:43:44. > :43:47.great sense of achievement. Yes, because you won. I think it would
:43:48. > :43:50.have been much tougher if we had lost. Well, you didn't so thank you
:43:51. > :43:52.very much. Now, let's turn to the situation, in
:43:53. > :43:57.Turkey. Following last Friday's failed army
:43:58. > :44:00.coup, President Erdogan has declared a state of emergency in the country
:44:01. > :44:03.for three months, giving him More than 50,000 state employees
:44:04. > :44:06.have been rounded up, sacked or suspended in recent days,
:44:07. > :44:08.as the government says it is attempting to root out
:44:09. > :44:12.the "virus" behind the coup. Well let's speak now
:44:13. > :44:23.to our correspondent Nick, have there been any further
:44:24. > :44:27.developments? Well, the people are really trying to digest, now, the
:44:28. > :44:31.news of this state of emergency. The President announced it late last
:44:32. > :44:35.night, just before midnight. We know it'll last for three months. Under
:44:36. > :44:38.the constitution it could have lasted significance months and some
:44:39. > :44:42.of his critics are clutching at straws really, saying perhaps this
:44:43. > :44:46.is not as bad as it could have been. Anyway, Turkey, since the coup, only
:44:47. > :44:50.five or six days ago, has been living under a kind of de facto
:44:51. > :44:53.state of emergency anyway, so some people, even critics of the
:44:54. > :44:59.government are saying - better to know where we stand than to be in
:45:00. > :45:02.this sort of legal quagmire. People, however, are also concerned, what
:45:03. > :45:06.will happen now? The huge numbers you referred to, more than 50,000
:45:07. > :45:10.people suspended from their jobs. Teachers called back from their
:45:11. > :45:15.summer holidays to be told they are now under investigation. More than
:45:16. > :45:20.6,000 arrests in the army, 100 top generals, more than one in four of
:45:21. > :45:23.the top brass of the military here all under arrest. So a lot of
:45:24. > :45:31.concern in society. A lot of worry but also a sense that this Turkey
:45:32. > :45:35.just survived a coup. A military attacks on Parliament and police
:45:36. > :45:37.headquarters, so there is also some understanding that clear, firm
:45:38. > :45:41.measures are needed at a time like this. Thank you very much.
:45:42. > :45:43.We're joined now by the Liberal Democrat peer Meral Hussein -
:45:44. > :45:46.she sits on the all-party parliamentary group for Turkey.
:45:47. > :45:52.It sounds devastating in terms of the scale of the state of emergency.
:45:53. > :45:58.The state of emergency was five days late. As the president said last
:45:59. > :46:04.night, Francis had a state of emergency since last November. --
:46:05. > :46:08.France has had. People are still reeling from the repercussions of
:46:09. > :46:17.the attempted coup and people in Turkey have memories of the last
:46:18. > :46:22.four attempted coups and so they feel very much in favour of the
:46:23. > :46:33.president, and the majority, that includes Kurds and secular wrists.
:46:34. > :46:36.Looking at it very simply, it is the Muslims are more in favour of what
:46:37. > :46:41.the President is saying, it has been said. People are coming together to
:46:42. > :46:47.give support to the button which is unprecedented. Amnesty International
:46:48. > :46:51.says there's a crackdown of exceptional proportions, do you
:46:52. > :47:01.think they are wrong? It is exceptional, but we don't know... Is
:47:02. > :47:06.it justified? We don't know. The people feel there is a conspiracy,
:47:07. > :47:14.people in all sections of public life embedded who are sympathisers
:47:15. > :47:18.who have had a hand in this coup, and the president has said he's
:47:19. > :47:22.going to this out. The majority of people think this is a good thing
:47:23. > :47:29.but it seems he is going way too far and we don't know what is going to
:47:30. > :47:34.come out the other end, what kind of society is going to emerge. The
:47:35. > :47:41.question is, has he always wanted to do this? We know from following his
:47:42. > :47:45.government in Turkey, there have already been moves to clamp down on
:47:46. > :47:52.certain freedoms in the press, for example. He's now doing what he
:47:53. > :47:56.wants. He is, it is true that he was clamping down on freedom of the
:47:57. > :48:00.media and journalists, but there was a strong indication that he was
:48:01. > :48:06.moving against certain sections of the military and the other
:48:07. > :48:11.establishment before the coup and people in Turkey I've spoken to have
:48:12. > :48:16.said to me this coup was pre-empting what they thought he might have
:48:17. > :48:22.done. Is this the beginning of the end of democratic rule in Turkey? It
:48:23. > :48:28.looks as if he is taking this opportunity to clamp-down on away
:48:29. > :48:36.which is staggering in scale -- a way. He's really going for the
:48:37. > :48:43.academic and universities, teachers, everybody. An extraordinary
:48:44. > :48:47.reaction. You are better placed to make judgments on internal targets
:48:48. > :48:52.politics, but it seems the assessment early on was it was a
:48:53. > :48:55.clumsy ill judged coup but it has been treated as if it was the most
:48:56. > :49:03.extraordinary threat to this government. Clearly by implication,
:49:04. > :49:08.people were involved in every walk of Turkish society, if he is going
:49:09. > :49:13.to justify this level of clamp-down, but I think he's using it as a
:49:14. > :49:19.excuse to seize control of every element of Turkish society. These
:49:20. > :49:26.people involved in the coup, beyond the military, what should the EU do
:49:27. > :49:28.question up we are doing this deal which has been successful in terms
:49:29. > :49:36.of stemming the flow of migrants through grace -- what should the EU
:49:37. > :49:43.do? We have given them billions in aid, to Turkey. The EU was pretty
:49:44. > :49:52.useless before and it will be so now. Right now Germany, Italy, they
:49:53. > :49:59.are terrified, so they are in a weak position if Erdogan loses, I cannot
:50:00. > :50:04.see any punishment working at the moment. That is the problem with the
:50:05. > :50:08.EU, it is great as a free-trade bloc, but as a political entity,
:50:09. > :50:15.useless. What do you think is going to happen? I think it will go
:50:16. > :50:21.further and I agree with Steve, he's Bubba be taking this as an
:50:22. > :50:26.opportunity to get firmer control -- he's probably taking this as an
:50:27. > :50:33.opportunity. The EU have lost any influence they have had, and the
:50:34. > :50:36.fact the United Kingdom, after what happened in the Brexit campaign, in
:50:37. > :50:45.which Turkey was the fight, because of the poster and all the rest of it
:50:46. > :50:49.-- in which Turkey was vilified. I was talking to friends last night,
:50:50. > :50:53.they say the majority of the Turkish public and they think the UK and the
:50:54. > :50:56.United States are involved in a conspiracy to shut down their
:50:57. > :51:01.democracy, they really believe this. They were slow to condemn the coup
:51:02. > :51:05.and they don't seem to be taking it as serious way in terms of the
:51:06. > :51:11.United States wanting a next edition, so there are many aspects
:51:12. > :51:13.to this, layer upon layer. -- wanting an extradition. Thanks for
:51:14. > :51:16.joining us. With Parliament rising MPs are
:51:17. > :51:18.leaving Westminster until September. They'll be able to concentrate
:51:19. > :51:20.on work in their constituencies, fight the odd leadership battle,
:51:21. > :51:23.and in some cases even manage So what will they be reading
:51:24. > :51:27.if they do make it as a far Come aboard London's floating book
:51:28. > :51:38.shop for a selection from the MPs' Want to know more
:51:39. > :51:43.about the Labour leader? How about Comrade Corbyn by former
:51:44. > :51:46.lobby journalist Rosa Prince. Everyone is desperate for insight
:51:47. > :51:48.into the new Prime Minister. Our Joe is a biography of the former
:51:49. > :51:59.Conservative mayor of Birmingham in the 19th century,
:52:00. > :52:01.Joseph Chamberlain. Written by Theresa May's chief
:52:02. > :52:04.of staff Nick Timothy. We've recently increased our stock
:52:05. > :52:08.of ex-prime ministers by one and here's a trio of prime
:52:09. > :52:11.ministerial biographies. First of all this one of Tony Blair
:52:12. > :52:13.by the investigative journalist Tom Bower,
:52:14. > :52:16.called Broken Vows. And then there is this book
:52:17. > :52:21.about Harold Wilson called What a nice way to celebrate 100
:52:22. > :52:27.years since he was born. And finally this book about Disraeli
:52:28. > :52:30.called The Novel Politician. If you want the insider account
:52:31. > :52:52.of the last government, how about Coalition by the former
:52:53. > :52:54.Liberal Democrat If you want to get really insidery,
:52:55. > :53:01.how about the Black Door? It is all about how prime ministers
:53:02. > :53:03.have interacted with 100 years since the Easter
:53:04. > :53:22.uprising in Ireland. If you want to know about that,
:53:23. > :53:25.Fearghal McGarry has drawn on 1700 If you want to visit the battlefield
:53:26. > :53:43.of the Somme, Major and Mrs Holt have written
:53:44. > :53:45.the definitive guide of where to go. If you fancy something
:53:46. > :53:47.historical but a bit lighter, All about the epic task of keeping
:53:48. > :53:52.Britain fed in the Second World War. I love visiting friends
:53:53. > :53:54.in their posh mansions, and now you can read about it
:53:55. > :53:57.in a book called The Long weekend: Life in the English Country
:53:58. > :53:59.House Between The Wars. And if you can't bear the idea
:54:00. > :54:02.of being away from Westminster, don't worry, you could always
:54:03. > :54:05.read Mr Barry's War, all about rebuilding parliament
:54:06. > :54:11.after it burnt down in 1834, or my colleague Ben Wright's book
:54:12. > :54:14.about politics and alcohol. And Keith Simpson joins
:54:15. > :54:35.us now to tell us more He's moved a branch of Waterstones
:54:36. > :54:45.into the studio, have you read all of them? No, but a fair number. What
:54:46. > :54:54.recommendations? I would start, not necessarily on the beach, but Nick
:54:55. > :54:56.Timothy's Our Joe, Joseph Chamberlain's Conservative legacy,
:54:57. > :54:59.Nick Timothy wrote this for the Conservative history group and he is
:55:00. > :55:06.now the joint Chief of staff with Theresa May. You can see parts of
:55:07. > :55:09.this went into her speech at Birmingham and then her speech
:55:10. > :55:16.outside number ten. You will see a template for government under
:55:17. > :55:22.Theresa May? I think you will. It is about what Joseph chamber and was
:55:23. > :55:27.doing in Birmingham, to alleviate the lot of the people at the bottom
:55:28. > :55:33.of the social ladder -- Joseph Chamberlain was doing in Birmingham.
:55:34. > :55:37.You can see this has influenced her. It is also short, it would be a good
:55:38. > :55:45.one to start with. There are some pictures. At the lighter end, a
:55:46. > :55:55.wonderful book called the long weekend, life in the end this
:55:56. > :55:58.country house between the wars and he combines the stories of amazingly
:55:59. > :56:04.eccentric people. One of these country houses, they needed to put
:56:05. > :56:07.wiring and the owner refused to have the floor pulled up, and they got
:56:08. > :56:14.round it by putting a dead rabbit at one end and a ferret and they tied
:56:15. > :56:18.to the ferret a string and the wire, and I'm not making that up. I
:56:19. > :56:26.imagine that was very smelly. Looking at the list, as I did. It is
:56:27. > :56:32.quite heavy. Even by your standards, quite a heavy list of books in terms
:56:33. > :56:39.of content. It is serious, part and parcel of the time we are living in,
:56:40. > :56:43.we are in a serious mood and Theresa May is a very serious politician and
:56:44. > :56:47.Jeremy Corbyn is, as well. If someone else would like to produce
:56:48. > :56:53.another list. The Lady Whipp said she was going to be choose a list of
:56:54. > :56:59.chick lit but she has not got round to it. No one is going to compete
:57:00. > :57:13.against you. What Angel fancy? The Nick Timothy Burke. -- what takes
:57:14. > :57:15.your fancy? There are very few speeches from sick terry macro, but
:57:16. > :57:21.we know Nick Timothy is probably more influential than any adviser in
:57:22. > :57:24.the direction of government because she trusts so few people -- there
:57:25. > :57:34.are very few speeches from Theresa May. What about for you Steve? The
:57:35. > :57:40.Joe Chamberlain one and maybe the Harold Wilson won, because Harold
:57:41. > :57:44.Wilson won a referendum on Europe in 1975 and he knew how to win. Maybe
:57:45. > :57:49.you should have read that before the referendum. Maybe David Cameron
:57:50. > :58:01.should. He knew how to win elections and keep his party at gully -- keep
:58:02. > :58:11.his party united, skills which Theresa May and whoever leads Labour
:58:12. > :58:17.will require. Any laughs? Yes, this one. I have stolen a review copy
:58:18. > :58:21.from the Spectator. If you are a Scottish right-winger like me, this
:58:22. > :58:29.is wonderful. That might be a niche market. There are a few others. All
:58:30. > :58:37.reading this on the beach in the summer. It was funny comedy, sage
:58:38. > :58:42.and with Ken Clarke. -- it was funny, the conversation with Ken
:58:43. > :58:48.Clarke. I have put some books on the list, including Ken Clarke's memoirs
:58:49. > :58:54.which is coming out in time for the party conference, and Denis
:58:55. > :58:59.Healey's, he has a broad hinterland, you have him coming out, Ed Balls's
:59:00. > :59:04.memoir and a view of politics, just in time for the Labour Party. The
:59:05. > :59:11.title of his book? Putting the boot in. LAUGHTER
:59:12. > :59:17.Actually, I can't remember. If I was a Labour member, there is a
:59:18. > :59:18.biography of Clement Attlee coming out in time for the Labour Party
:59:19. > :59:23.conference. There's just time before we go
:59:24. > :59:27.to find out the answer to our quiz. The question was what did Nick Clegg
:59:28. > :59:30.spend two says and nearly ?8,000 doing to show that he could be fun
:59:31. > :59:33.during the last election campaign? A) Go to a theme park
:59:34. > :59:36.in a baseball cap C) Film his own version
:59:37. > :59:39.of a pop video Or D) Erect a 'Cleggstone'
:59:40. > :59:47.in his back garden. It has got to be the pop video. It
:59:48. > :59:48.is. But we have not seen it, of course.
:59:49. > :59:51.That's all for today, and that's all from the Daily
:59:52. > :59:55.We'll be back when Parliament returns on Monday 5th September -