:00:37. > :00:38.Hello and welcome to the Daily Politics.
:00:39. > :00:42.David Cameron's leaving Parliament, and he may not be the only one.
:00:43. > :00:47.Plans to redraw constituencies across the UK and cut the number
:00:48. > :00:49.of MPs means high profile figures - including Jeremy Corbyn
:00:50. > :00:51.and George Osborne - could face a battle to find
:00:52. > :00:57.Nicky Morgan is still an MP but she wasn't asked to stay
:00:58. > :01:00.on as Education Secretary - we'll be asking her if Theresa May's
:01:01. > :01:05.plans for new grammar schools make the grade.
:01:06. > :01:08.Brexit Secretary David Davis is back in Government and he says it's
:01:09. > :01:11.the sexiest part of politics - but is he planning on telling
:01:12. > :01:22.The bar is low, I suppose! Will MPs see the appeal?
:01:23. > :01:24.And after David Cameron resigns after 15 years as an MP,
:01:25. > :01:29.we'll look at his first new job outside Parliament.
:01:30. > :01:32.All that in the next hour and with us for the whole
:01:33. > :01:35.of the programme today is the Conservative MP Nicky Morgan.
:01:36. > :01:37.She was Education Secretary until Theresa May formed her
:01:38. > :01:42.She's now returned to the backbenches, and she may
:01:43. > :01:45.have lost the big office and the ministerial car, but she's
:01:46. > :01:48.free to give her own opinion again and even appear on shows
:01:49. > :01:55.Welcome to the show, Nicky.
:01:56. > :01:59.Let's begin today by talking about David Cameron.
:02:00. > :02:01.You might remember him - he led Britain's first
:02:02. > :02:03.coalition government since the Second World War,
:02:04. > :02:05.and just last May he secured the first overall Conservative
:02:06. > :02:10.But politics can be a cruel business, and he left Downing Street
:02:11. > :02:14.in July after losing the EU referendum, something which may come
:02:15. > :02:20.Despite saying that he would continue as the MP for Witney
:02:21. > :02:23.in Oxfordshire after resigning from Number ten, yesterday he said
:02:24. > :02:28.With modern politics, with the circumstances
:02:29. > :02:31.of my resignation, it isn't really possible to be a proper backbench MP
:02:32. > :02:38.I think everything you do will become a big distraction
:02:39. > :02:40.and a big diversion from what the Government needs to do
:02:41. > :02:46.And I support Theresa May, I think she's got off to a great start,
:02:47. > :02:48.I think she can be a strong Prime Minister for our
:02:49. > :02:50.country, and I don't want to be that distraction.
:02:51. > :02:54.I want Witney to have a new MP who can play a full part
:02:55. > :03:01.in Parliamentary and political life without being a distraction.
:03:02. > :03:10.So he doesn't want to be a destruction. Are you sad to see him
:03:11. > :03:13.go? Very sad. I think he has been a great leader of the Conservative
:03:14. > :03:18.Party, he got us back into power, won the first majority fell over 20
:03:19. > :03:22.years just last year. I think it is very sad, but I also understand why
:03:23. > :03:27.he has made this decision at this time. As you said, he won that
:03:28. > :03:38.overall majority, but Ken Clarke said yesterday that he will be
:03:39. > :03:40.remembered as the Prime Minister but accidentally, in his words, took the
:03:41. > :03:43.UK out of the EU. That will overshadow everything else. I hope
:03:44. > :03:45.not. I know that is what we are talking about, and we will be
:03:46. > :03:47.talking about it later in the context the new Government, but I
:03:48. > :03:51.think David Cameron achieve more than that. He is the only person I
:03:52. > :03:54.could have kept the coalition government on the road, working with
:03:55. > :03:59.the Lib Dems for the crucial five years to rebuild the economy. Things
:04:00. > :04:03.like education and welfare reforms, which he has championed, history is
:04:04. > :04:09.often kinder to former party leader 's son years after they leave
:04:10. > :04:13.office, rather immediately. His difficulty really arose when leading
:04:14. > :04:19.a Tory majority government. He said he wanted to stay on as an MP until
:04:20. > :04:23.2020, was it just too difficult for him watching Theresa May excel his
:04:24. > :04:30.supporters, like yourself, from Cabinet, then changing key policies
:04:31. > :04:34.like reversing the ban on grammar schools and changing the decision on
:04:35. > :04:39.Hinkley Point? It was such a strange period in July, it was so difficult
:04:40. > :04:42.to make decisions about any of our futures. I suspect that coming back
:04:43. > :04:47.last week, being back in the House of Commons and realising that
:04:48. > :04:50.everything he said would be pored over, every nuance, did he agree
:04:51. > :04:55.with the new Prime Minister, was there a split? That is a huge
:04:56. > :04:59.pressure for somebody who was only 49, wants to get on with their life,
:05:00. > :05:04.wants to be able to say what they think. I suspect that the
:05:05. > :05:08.realisation dawned, actually, I will have to make a different decision.
:05:09. > :05:15.And the key thing being that he wants to say his own decision, --
:05:16. > :05:20.and opinion, and he does not agree with these two key policies from
:05:21. > :05:24.Theresa May? I'd have not spoken to him on these issues, but no doubt it
:05:25. > :05:28.is a change from the party as he was leading it. I know he feels
:05:29. > :05:33.passionately about the free schools movement. His last visit as Prime
:05:34. > :05:37.Minister in July was to a free school set up in his time as brain
:05:38. > :05:41.minister. He wants to speak up about free schools. Were you surprised
:05:42. > :05:46.when he announced he would suddenly stand down? I think we were all
:05:47. > :05:50.taken by surprise yesterday, that it happened yesterday. I don't think we
:05:51. > :05:54.would have been surprised if it was in July, or perhaps in a couple of
:05:55. > :05:59.months' time, but it coming back last week, for a lot of buzz, it was
:06:00. > :06:10.the realisation that things would be really different. -- coming back
:06:11. > :06:13.last week, for a lot of us. Gordon Brown did not really say
:06:14. > :06:15.anything at all but he was therefore a number of years and had that
:06:16. > :06:18.period of grace before leaving, shouldn't David Cameron have done
:06:19. > :06:20.the same? People will decide based on personal circumstance and what
:06:21. > :06:25.they feel. People have different ways. Ted Heath stayed and stayed
:06:26. > :06:29.and stayed and probably slightly outstayed his welcome, Gordon Brown
:06:30. > :06:34.did it a different way, John Major, Tony Blair did his last PMQs and
:06:35. > :06:38.left Parliament. Everybody had to find their own way of doing these
:06:39. > :06:41.things. David Cameron will have thought very long and hard and
:06:42. > :06:45.clearly took the summer to think about what his next steps would be.
:06:46. > :06:49.Time for him to write his memoirs! Now let's stick with David Cameron
:06:50. > :06:52.for a moment, because he's also He'd no sooner stepped down as an MP
:06:53. > :06:57.yesterday than it was announced B, new panellist on This
:06:58. > :07:03.Week with Andrew Neil? Or D, Bailiff of the
:07:04. > :07:08.Manor of Northstead? At the end of the show Nicky
:07:09. > :07:14.will give us the correct answer. MPs and staff were pictured
:07:15. > :07:16.queuing up in the Houses But they weren't all waiting to sign
:07:17. > :07:20.David Cameron's leaving card - no, they were hoping to find out
:07:21. > :07:24.details of a plan to redraw the boundaries of parliamentary
:07:25. > :07:26.constituencies in England and Wales. It's all part of a Government plan
:07:27. > :07:29.to equalise the number of people in each constituency,
:07:30. > :07:31.and to cut the overall Constituency boundaries are reviewed
:07:32. > :07:36.periodically to ensure every MP represents roughly
:07:37. > :07:42.the same number of people. Legislation passed in 2011 means
:07:43. > :07:52.that the number of MPs must be With a few exceptions
:07:53. > :07:55.like the Isle of Wight, every seat will now have to have
:07:56. > :07:57.around 74,000 voters. The independent Boundary Commissions
:07:58. > :08:01.- one for each part of the UK - Their draft plans will see 32
:08:02. > :08:07.fewer constituencies Northern Ireland is
:08:08. > :08:13.already due to lose one. Scotland is expected
:08:14. > :08:16.to lose six constituencies. But redrawing the political map
:08:17. > :08:21.is always controversial. According to one estimate,
:08:22. > :08:24.if the 2015 votes had been cast under the proposed boundaries,
:08:25. > :08:26.Labour would lose around 25 seats And the changes could see the seats
:08:27. > :08:33.of some high profile MPs broken up and divided between
:08:34. > :08:38.neighbouring constituencies. Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn,
:08:39. > :08:41.former Chancellor George Osborne and Brexit Secretary David Davis
:08:42. > :08:44.could all join MPs in a scramble They can argue their case
:08:45. > :08:52.in the consultation that's now underway, with the final proposals
:08:53. > :08:57.due in September 2018.The Government says this is a matter of fairness -
:08:58. > :09:00.here's the Cabinet Office Minister The review being introduced
:09:01. > :09:07.was voted on by the previous parliament and enacts for the first
:09:08. > :09:10.time the historic principle of having equal sized
:09:11. > :09:13.constituencies, which is a principle first called for by the chartists
:09:14. > :09:15.in 1833, it's called for by the Standards and Committee
:09:16. > :09:19.on Public Life. As I said, it was legislated before
:09:20. > :09:22.by the previous parliament. It comes to determine that every
:09:23. > :09:24.seat should be equal. Currently, we have seats
:09:25. > :09:26.which are three times the size of another,
:09:27. > :09:29.which means that one elector's vote is worth three times
:09:30. > :09:30.that of another. That's simply not fair,
:09:31. > :09:33.which is why we are determined to ensure we have equal
:09:34. > :09:34.size constituencies, which is why this
:09:35. > :09:38.review's been enacted. We're joined now by Sam Hartley,
:09:39. > :09:50.he's secretary to the Boundary Welcome to the programme. It's
:09:51. > :09:55.clearly a complex process, so how do you actually go about doing it? It
:09:56. > :09:59.is very complex, we don't hide or shirk from that. Today we launch our
:10:00. > :10:03.initial proposals, it is the first time the public can see what the new
:10:04. > :10:10.map of parliamentary constituencies might look like. As you have
:10:11. > :10:14.outlined, to eat -- we have to reduce the number of constituencies
:10:15. > :10:19.across the country as a whole, I am in the English commission, we had to
:10:20. > :10:24.reduce from 533 to 501. We have to make the number of electors more
:10:25. > :10:29.equal. We do that with the help of the public. We look at data, we have
:10:30. > :10:33.three rounds of consultation. Today is the first day of the first round
:10:34. > :10:41.of consultation. We want people to look at the proposal on the website
:10:42. > :10:44.and tell us what they think. Do you think you will get a big response? I
:10:45. > :10:48.am very confident that we will. Looking at the last review that the
:10:49. > :10:52.Boundary Commission conducted, we got over 50,000 public comments. We
:10:53. > :11:01.know it means a lot to people. We have made it easier than ever to
:11:02. > :11:06.comment, the address is bce2018.org.uk. It is easy to look
:11:07. > :11:11.at the proposals and give us feedback. You will get thousands
:11:12. > :11:15.more now you had said that! It stands now to impossible that you
:11:16. > :11:20.cannot take politics into consideration when you are redrawing
:11:21. > :11:25.constituencies. Many people, not least Labour politicians who stand
:11:26. > :11:29.to lose most, argue it is unfair and undemocratic. It is our job to make
:11:30. > :11:34.independent recommendations to Parliament, which is what we will
:11:35. > :11:38.do. We really rely on public comments for this process. We want
:11:39. > :11:41.people to tell us about their communities, whether the boundaries
:11:42. > :11:48.really reflect them or not. Bearing in mind the tough constraints we
:11:49. > :11:51.have about the introduction and equalisation. We are trying to take
:11:52. > :11:55.politics out of it, we leave that to the politicians. Why is it not based
:11:56. > :11:58.on the most recent poll, the EU referendum, where 2 million people
:11:59. > :12:05.signed up to take part in that? They will not be part of this. The law
:12:06. > :12:09.tells us to take account of the December 2015 electoral register, it
:12:10. > :12:14.would be wrong others to do anything different. Why does the law do that?
:12:15. > :12:19.If 2 million more people could be part of this, it sounds unfair not
:12:20. > :12:23.to include them? That is a question for Parliament or the Government to
:12:24. > :12:28.take. The existing elections on the current constituency boundaries are
:12:29. > :12:31.based on a lecture at from the year 2000, this is already a significant
:12:32. > :12:38.improvement on the current state of affairs. The question about when the
:12:39. > :12:40.snapshot is, that is one for Parliament and the Government to
:12:41. > :12:46.take, not the Boundary Commissions. You accept it is out of date, even
:12:47. > :12:50.though it is much more up to date than 2000? I accept that there has
:12:51. > :12:56.to be a point in time where we take baseline data, that is December
:12:57. > :13:01.2015, it would be wrong to take any other information. Let's take
:13:02. > :13:04.12-macro of the quirks in the proposal, Slough town hall would no
:13:05. > :13:13.longer be in the slow constituency, which might strike people in Slough
:13:14. > :13:16.as slightly odd. Is that the type of thing you would change? That is the
:13:17. > :13:20.sort of evidence we require at the type of thing we would change. It is
:13:21. > :13:24.a tough job, difficult for us to get constituencies that reflect people
:13:25. > :13:28.on the first go. We are very open to hear what people say, using that
:13:29. > :13:32.sort of evidence. Nearly two thirds of our initial proposals last time
:13:33. > :13:37.changed before we got to a revised hearing. We are very open to
:13:38. > :13:40.people's comments and we want people to use the website to do that.
:13:41. > :13:42.As we said earlier, not everyone's happy about these plans -
:13:43. > :13:46.not least Labour, which is expected to be hardest hit by the changes.
:13:47. > :13:48.We're joined now by the Shadow Minister Without Portfolio Jonathan
:13:49. > :13:50.Ashworth, he's at the TUC conference in Brighton.
:13:51. > :13:55.-- he is in the studio. Do you accept that Parliamentary
:13:56. > :14:02.constituencies should rapidly the same size? Of course I do. Isn't
:14:03. > :14:07.that what this is about? No, it is reducing MPs from 650 to 600, there
:14:08. > :14:11.is the strong suspicion that 50 MPs have been taken out because that
:14:12. > :14:16.will head the Labour Party most, once you go beyond 50 you tend to
:14:17. > :14:19.bite further into Conservative MPs. There are 2 million people missing
:14:20. > :14:29.from this register, that is the other issue, fair. It is a fairly
:14:30. > :14:31.powerful all humans to say that it is in the law. Because the
:14:32. > :14:34.conservative coalition government at the time had the votes to pass that.
:14:35. > :14:41.We always said that to use the register based on a different way of
:14:42. > :14:44.getting on the register, you might remember the arguments about
:14:45. > :14:48.individual voter registration, where getting on the register became more
:14:49. > :14:52.burdensome, we always said don't go for the register in November or
:14:53. > :14:56.December, wait longer, we all advise the Government to look at the
:14:57. > :15:01.register this year, they have ignored that. Do you accept that
:15:02. > :15:06.Labour under the current drawing of the boundaries has an unfair
:15:07. > :15:11.advantage? No, they don't. This is a Tory argument about how the votes is
:15:12. > :15:19.distributed across the country. In a lot of safe Conservative seats, lots
:15:20. > :15:22.of Tory votes pile-up, the Labour voter tends to be more evenly
:15:23. > :15:26.distributed across the country. You are stealing this process, the
:15:27. > :15:32.Labour Party will be the biggest loser? No. It has to happen. The
:15:33. > :15:36.figures currently used 16 years out of date, an awful lot has changed in
:15:37. > :15:40.terms of house-building, people moving and everything. It is not a
:15:41. > :15:46.political process. It needs to be done. It is right to reduce the
:15:47. > :15:50.numbers of MPs. Partly it is about saving money in terms of the cost of
:15:51. > :15:55.politics. We are the largest legislature in the Western world.
:15:56. > :16:00.What about the House of Lords? That is also on the Government agenda. We
:16:01. > :16:04.have the ability for peers to resign, we have 50 fewer peers than
:16:05. > :16:08.before. Two wrongs don't make a right. The house of Lords is stuffed
:16:09. > :16:12.to the gills and has been stuffed even more by David Cameron in recent
:16:13. > :16:14.months. Surely the unelected House of Lords would be a better place to
:16:15. > :16:22.start? I think you need to do both. It must
:16:23. > :16:26.be right that MPs are representing roughly the same number of people.
:16:27. > :16:32.We get the same resource, the same demands. Jeremy Corbyn seems to be
:16:33. > :16:37.saying if you were in an urban area you should represent fewer people.
:16:38. > :16:41.That doesn't work or stack up. The Labour Party has always complained
:16:42. > :16:45.about this. The 1970 general election was fought on 1953 data.
:16:46. > :16:54.The Labour Party have history on this. It is time the register was
:16:55. > :17:00.updated. I wasn't born in 1970, so I don't know. But there are 260 extra
:17:01. > :17:06.unelected peers in the House of Lords under this Government costing
:17:07. > :17:13.?32 million a year. We will lose our MEPs. So we as MPs will have a
:17:14. > :17:18.greater legislative responsibility. Why cut down to 600? Why not do it
:17:19. > :17:23.at 650, but equalise the constituencies. Parliament have
:17:24. > :17:29.voted to cut the number of MPs. It is right. We are the largest
:17:30. > :17:33.legislature in the western world. It doesn't make sense any more and I
:17:34. > :17:39.think we should look at the number of peers. Peers have been created
:17:40. > :17:43.from all parties. We now have the thing where peers can retire at a
:17:44. > :17:49.certain age and 50 have taken advantage of that. Why is it fair a
:17:50. > :17:55.Labour seat has around 5,000 fewer voters in it and therefore you have
:17:56. > :18:01.an unfair advantage in terms of being elected than Conservative
:18:02. > :18:06.seats with around 71,000 voters. My seat has about 73,000. But broadly
:18:07. > :18:11.and you accept that there are Labour seats that are elected on fewer
:18:12. > :18:13.votes? That is why we have said the principle of equalising the
:18:14. > :18:17.constituencies is the correct approach. What we have now is a very
:18:18. > :18:22.tight numerical number that the commission have to work to, with
:18:23. > :18:28.limited flexibility. There used to be more flexibility and you could
:18:29. > :18:33.make more allowance for local factors like there is a seat with a
:18:34. > :18:39.mountain range through them and it has been suggested on them. That is
:18:40. > :18:45.why we are looking at the proposals and members of public and we can
:18:46. > :18:49.sends in revisions to point out practical things. We have another
:18:50. > :18:55.two years before this is finally voted on and accepted. But you have
:18:56. > :19:02.got to hit 75,000 with 5% either way. That is a tighter range than
:19:03. > :19:07.was the previous. If you accepted the principle of equalisation, that
:19:08. > :19:13.is what it means, having a number and flexibility. You're keen to
:19:14. > :19:17.produce the cost of politics so why not reduce the number of ministers.
:19:18. > :19:23.That is something to be looked at... Will you support 2345. We will talk
:19:24. > :19:27.about Brexit and this will be a busy Government doing more legislation
:19:28. > :19:31.and not leaving things to the EU. I don't think I would support, having
:19:32. > :19:35.been a minister and seeing how hard they work. Although you have asked
:19:36. > :19:39.for the House of Lords to be looked at, I won't be looked at at the
:19:40. > :19:45.moment and there is no sign of the cost there being reduced or reduce
:19:46. > :19:50.the number of ministers, you're keen on reducing MPs, people may say it
:19:51. > :19:56.is because of party political reasons. People would be wrong.
:19:57. > :20:02.People will say it is party political if they don't like it.
:20:03. > :20:10.Others say it is fairer. The point is it is over due and now we are
:20:11. > :20:18.working on figures from 16 years ago. In my area there has been a
:20:19. > :20:24.massive amount of house building and we get the same resources as MPs,
:20:25. > :20:31.the amount we get for staff doesn't reflect the members we have. The
:20:32. > :20:36.Government are not going to reduce the size of the ministerial payroll
:20:37. > :20:41.and they will be a bigger part of chamber. There is an issue about
:20:42. > :20:46.holding ministers to account. There will be less backbenchers to hold
:20:47. > :20:50.them to account. Hang on, if you were serious about holding ministers
:20:51. > :20:55.to account, you would get yourself sort and be an effective opposition.
:20:56. > :21:00.You can't make that point. So aren't the changes going to Triggs --
:21:01. > :21:06.trigger another power struggle in the Labour Party. A number of your
:21:07. > :21:10.colleagues, people who have been critical of Jeremy Corbyn in the
:21:11. > :21:16.past, well, their seats could be up for grabs and there could be fights
:21:17. > :21:22.and they may well be reselected or deselected. There is no question it
:21:23. > :21:27.will be an uncertain time for colleagues, the same with the
:21:28. > :21:34.Tories. 17 Tory MPs will lose their seats. The same size as their
:21:35. > :21:37.majority. They're not in the midst of a civil war. There is
:21:38. > :21:43.unhappiness. Do you think your colleagues will be safe? No I think
:21:44. > :21:46.Labour Party MPs will have to convince members in an area that
:21:47. > :21:51.they're the right person. What Jeremy Corbyn's seat is disappearing
:21:52. > :21:55.and he is letting it be known. If the arrangements go ahead he will be
:21:56. > :22:01.fighting the new Finsbury Park seat. What do you say to Darren Williams
:22:02. > :22:08.who joined the Labour ruling Executive and said the process of
:22:09. > :22:13.choosing candidates would provide an opportunity to select vipds in tune
:22:14. > :22:18.with -- individuals in tune with party members. I sit on the
:22:19. > :22:23.Executive. Just about. I have been there for three years. But I sit on
:22:24. > :22:28.that Executive and I don't think Darren's comments will have found
:22:29. > :22:33.much favour among Jeremy Corbyn. He has done him a disservice in making
:22:34. > :22:36.those comments. He shouldn't be embarrassing Jeremy Corbyn. That is
:22:37. > :22:41.not what Jeremy Corbyn wants to do. You don't think Jeremy Corbyn
:22:42. > :22:45.peoples that if he is re-elected as leader that, there should be MPs who
:22:46. > :22:50.are nor in tune with him and party members? Jeremy Corbyn has asked
:22:51. > :22:54.Rosie Winston to lead on the boundary change processes. We have a
:22:55. > :23:01.standard procedure that is used in the last round of boundary changes
:23:02. > :23:04.in 2010 and MPs with fight or put themselves forward for a seat if
:23:05. > :23:09.they have a proportion of the seat in the new constituency. So Jeremy
:23:10. > :23:18.Corbyn has got something like 50% going into the new Finsbury Park
:23:19. > :23:25.seat, he can hut himself forward. It would be an opportunity to deselect
:23:26. > :23:32.MPs that members don't like. Any MP have to go through reselection. Our
:23:33. > :23:36.bravenlgs meet -- branches meet to decide that. The good members of
:23:37. > :23:41.Leicester South reselected me and I'm hoping they do it again in this
:23:42. > :23:46.Parliament. That is not new. Do you think they will reselect people like
:23:47. > :23:53.Tristram Hunt and Yvette Cooper? I hope so. They're excellent MPs and
:23:54. > :23:56.work hard for their constituencies and they're always taking up issues
:23:57. > :24:00.for them. I expect them to be reselected. Thank you.
:24:01. > :24:02.Education Secretary Justine Greening was at the despatch box yesterday
:24:03. > :24:04.outlining the Government's plans to extend grammar
:24:05. > :24:10.She said the proposals would create a truly meritocratic system.
:24:11. > :24:13.But it's a subject that gets plenty of people hot under the collar,
:24:14. > :24:15.and the minister faced criticism from the opposition
:24:16. > :24:26.We need to radically expand the number of good school places
:24:27. > :24:28.available to all families, not just those who can afford
:24:29. > :24:32.to move into the catchment areas of the best state schools or those
:24:33. > :24:35.who can afford to pay for private education, or those
:24:36. > :24:43.We need to give all schools with a strong track record -
:24:44. > :24:46.with the experience and the valuable expertise - the incentives
:24:47. > :24:51.to expand their offer to enable even more pupils to go there,
:24:52. > :24:53.driving up standards, giving parents greater
:24:54. > :25:01.Mr Speaker, if I may, I'd like to start by offering some
:25:02. > :25:16.Well, Mr Speaker, that reaction is very interesting.
:25:17. > :25:21.Because that wasn't my advice, it was the advice of the last
:25:22. > :25:25.Prime Minister who is still in post, as I think, today, as I believe.
:25:26. > :25:28.The right honourable member, currently, for Witney.
:25:29. > :25:33.When asked about Tory MPs wanting to return to grammar schools,
:25:34. > :25:36.he went on to say, "I think it is delusional to think that
:25:37. > :25:41.a policy of expanding a number of grammar schools is either a good
:25:42. > :25:48.idea, a sellable idea or even the right idea."
:25:49. > :25:51.Is it not the case that the example of the Harris Westminster Free
:25:52. > :25:54.School, supported by a great independent school,
:25:55. > :25:57.and King's Maths School, supported by a great university,
:25:58. > :26:01.shows that you can of institutions that select at the age of 16 that
:26:02. > :26:04.can ensure that children from disadvantaged backgrounds do
:26:05. > :26:07.more, and will she reassure this House that in the face
:26:08. > :26:12.of the opposition to all reform and all debate from the dogmatists
:26:13. > :26:15.on the left side of the House, she will be driven entirely
:26:16. > :26:17.by data and what works, and that she will press ahead
:26:18. > :26:25.She is right to say that we have great schools and great teachers,
:26:26. > :26:28.So could she explain now, or perhaps in the course
:26:29. > :26:30.of the consultation, how the green paper proposals
:26:31. > :26:33.on selective education will benefit those pupils in areas
:26:34. > :26:38.where expectations are still too low, where results are too poor,
:26:39. > :26:41.and can she tell us when she's going to announce the first
:26:42. > :26:54.And Nicky Morgan, who you saw there, is of course still with us.
:26:55. > :27:02.You said yesterday that the new policy is a strange first battle for
:27:03. > :27:06.team radio to have picked -- Theresa May to have picked. Do you accept
:27:07. > :27:11.there is public support for the policy? I accept that there is
:27:12. > :27:16.public support in areas where there is selective education. But I have
:27:17. > :27:22.had e-mails and calls from people who are not supporters. It is mixed.
:27:23. > :27:26.Everybody wants all children to get the best possible education, to do
:27:27. > :27:31.well for the able to be stretched. But when you think about it, the
:27:32. > :27:38.worry is well what happens to those who don't? We heard yesterday tales
:27:39. > :27:44.from MPs who said I didn't pass the 11-plus. But my concern is about the
:27:45. > :27:49.parts of the country where educational performance is too low
:27:50. > :27:55.and children aren't achieving the results and the focus needs to be
:27:56. > :27:59.making sure that the reforms bed in in all schools across the country.
:28:00. > :28:04.Rather than having another battle front opened up. What is driving
:28:05. > :28:08.this for Theresa May? I don't know. Because I haven't spoken to her
:28:09. > :28:14.about it. But you're in Government with her. You must know her a bit.
:28:15. > :28:18.She has her own constituency experiences and her personal
:28:19. > :28:22.experiences of being at grammar school when she was at school. But
:28:23. > :28:26.also I think it is something she feels strongly about. There are
:28:27. > :28:31.people of course in my party who feel very strongly and have wanted a
:28:32. > :28:36.return too grammar schools, who will be supportive of this. But they're
:28:37. > :28:40.wrong in your view? I think that having spent 24 months as Education
:28:41. > :28:45.Secretary, it became clear to me and we captured this in the White Paper
:28:46. > :28:49.there are parts of country where performance is not good enough and I
:28:50. > :28:53.don't see how selection will help those parts improve. I don't see
:28:54. > :28:59.those are areas where they will invite in selective schools to open
:29:00. > :29:05.or to expands into the areas. Why did you allow an existing grammar
:29:06. > :29:14.school in Sevenoaks to expand? We have the -- We have the view we want
:29:15. > :29:21.good schools to expands. But it is miles from the existing site. We
:29:22. > :29:28.were clear. As a former solicitor, I was clear on the legal ramifications
:29:29. > :29:32.that it the was an integrated way. But you're not against grammar
:29:33. > :29:37.schools per se, you were proud you allowed to it expand. Why such
:29:38. > :29:44.opposition to parts that would like to open new ones? As I say, in the
:29:45. > :29:49.green paper, it talks about the impact of having a selective school
:29:50. > :29:54.on those non-selective schools locally. The challenge we face in
:29:55. > :30:00.education at the moment is that patchiness and that we have great
:30:01. > :30:06.schools and teacherses but we don't have them every where. While one
:30:07. > :30:15.expansion is one thing, inviting this... It is a distraction from the
:30:16. > :30:20.reforms that are working. The Chief Inspector of schools, who is not
:30:21. > :30:24.afraid of challenges he couldn't be clearer, that the system is getting
:30:25. > :30:30.better and it is not something that is needed now.
:30:31. > :30:36.What do you say to your former colleague, the Schools Minister Nick
:30:37. > :30:40.Gibb, who said that an increase in selective places would, by
:30:41. > :30:44.definition, allow more children from poorer backgrounds to get an
:30:45. > :30:48.outstanding education? He is right in the sense that obviously... That
:30:49. > :30:53.is one of the things they will have to look at, how do you ensure that
:30:54. > :30:56.children from more disadvantaged backgrounds get the new places
:30:57. > :31:05.created in selective schools? There is a need for more school places, no
:31:06. > :31:08.question, because there are more pupils in Nick would understand that
:31:09. > :31:11.the need to build a strong education system across the country, one of
:31:12. > :31:14.the questions asked yesterday is how this would work with the academies
:31:15. > :31:20.and free schools programme, all of those things still to be answered?
:31:21. > :31:24.Quite a few of you was cut -- your colleagues voiced concerns, around
:31:25. > :31:30.50%. How big could be the rebellion be if there is one? I think we are
:31:31. > :31:34.way off any kind of vote or anything like that, but I thought it was
:31:35. > :31:40.interesting that there were a number of colleagues, some of whom I would
:31:41. > :31:48.not have expected, voicing concerns. Like? People like Keith Simpson, Ken
:31:49. > :31:52.Clarke, Michelle Donlon, Ken Clarke raised concerns about the fate
:31:53. > :31:56.schools aspect. Clearly there is a lot more explanation and debate to
:31:57. > :32:01.be had. Were you surprised about Michael Gove sounding like he could
:32:02. > :32:05.support this policy? I think Michael started off, and the clip did not
:32:06. > :32:10.show this, talking about the clear moral purpose. Anybody who has been
:32:11. > :32:14.Education Secretary, you are driven, in the end, by wanting the best for
:32:15. > :32:26.the children in the system. Michael talked about being led by the data,
:32:27. > :32:29.that is one of the things raised both in the statement yesterday and
:32:30. > :32:31.also outside, what is the data that shows that more selection builds a
:32:32. > :32:33.strong school system that works for everybody? You were disappointed to
:32:34. > :32:37.lose a job that you loved, what would you say was your biggest
:32:38. > :32:44.achievement? Putting things like this focus on areas of the country,
:32:45. > :32:47.that is what is in the White Paper. But it free schools didn't really do
:32:48. > :32:52.that either, they were not opening in parts of the country that needed
:32:53. > :32:57.them, like the one near me they were often opening in quite affluent
:32:58. > :33:01.areas. You are right. Obviously in parts of the country that our
:33:02. > :33:06.existing schools or existing groups of parents to open it, but we were
:33:07. > :33:12.moving to a place where the area approach of looking at the areas of
:33:13. > :33:17.the corrupt -- country where the results were poor, that is what I
:33:18. > :33:21.was talking about in achieving excellence areas. My other passion
:33:22. > :33:25.with mental health and character education, I put that on the map of
:33:26. > :33:30.the department, I am glad that it will continue. What about your
:33:31. > :33:37.biggest setback? Obviously the whole issue around the academisation and
:33:38. > :33:42.the fact that... Again, as a minister you have the opportunity to
:33:43. > :33:45.visit schools every week, see what is working, the transformation
:33:46. > :33:49.across the country, but communicating that is quite hard to
:33:50. > :33:54.people who are either perhaps looking at their own constituencies,
:33:55. > :33:59.their own areas, or only have experience of certain types of
:34:00. > :34:04.schools. I think that was obviously... Forced academisation.
:34:05. > :34:09.In the last six months of being Education Secretary, it was taken up
:34:10. > :34:15.with the EU vote, so many things were being made to wait until after
:34:16. > :34:19.the 23rd of June. Many of your conservative colleagues
:34:20. > :34:23.saw it as forced academisation. As we went through Brexit and there was
:34:24. > :34:27.referendum, were you surprised that you did not continue as Education
:34:28. > :34:31.Secretary? Know, with everything that unfolded in the weeks after the
:34:32. > :34:41.Brexit votes, the Prime Minister will want her own team around her.
:34:42. > :34:49.You were Remainers. My face did not fit. They were two jobs either
:34:50. > :34:55.doing, but I was not surprised. I think Justine will be a very good
:34:56. > :35:00.Education Secretary, she always talked very passionately about
:35:01. > :35:03.social mobility, she did a lot of that as International Development
:35:04. > :35:08.Secretary. Will it be difficult for her as a state school pupils from
:35:09. > :35:12.Rotherham trying to push through selective education? She will work
:35:13. > :35:17.with the Prime Minister on this. We will have to see. I think she has
:35:18. > :35:22.lots of other things to announce, one of the other things is the fair
:35:23. > :35:28.funding formula. And it was about your support, and I'm talking about
:35:29. > :35:34.losing your job, of Michael Gove's leadership campaign, that pushed you
:35:35. > :35:38.out? I suspect it did not win me any favours. Michael is a great social
:35:39. > :35:43.reformer. The referendum results demonstrated that. We will be
:35:44. > :35:47.talking about Brexit for months, if not years, but I think there are
:35:48. > :35:52.deep divisions in this country and parts of the public services that
:35:53. > :35:55.still need reform, prisons, welfare, education. Michael and I are on
:35:56. > :36:00.different sides of the EU debate, but he is a great social reformer
:36:01. > :36:04.who would have led that. But did not happen, we have a new Prime Minister
:36:05. > :36:10.and we have to see how things unfold. Do you regret backing him? A
:36:11. > :36:13.life or anything else, looking backwards is not worth it. I don't
:36:14. > :36:18.think there is any point in having regrets. I will take this
:36:19. > :36:22.opportunity now, being on the backbenches, the first time in thaw
:36:23. > :36:29.years I have the opportunity to say what I think, still my diary with
:36:30. > :36:35.meetings that I want to go to and explore other areas. In the Times
:36:36. > :36:39.today it was said that Michael Gove's campaign was a terrible car
:36:40. > :36:45.crash in which he was a leading passenger. By definition it was not,
:36:46. > :36:50.ultimately, successful, and I was a lead person in that. At the end of
:36:51. > :36:56.the day... It was an extraordinary period where decisions were made
:36:57. > :37:00.very quickly and it was an exciting period to be involved in. But now I
:37:01. > :37:02.have the opportunity to do other things. Nicky Morgan, thank you. But
:37:03. > :37:03.you are staying. Now, when Britain leaves the EU,
:37:04. > :37:06.one of the biggest challenges facing the Government will be how
:37:07. > :37:09.to untangle more than 40 years' worth of entwined
:37:10. > :37:11.British and European law. Sorting it all into the desirable
:37:12. > :37:15.and the undesirable could take Well, some MPs have proposed
:37:16. > :37:19.speeding the process up by accepting all EU laws now before sorting
:37:20. > :37:22.through them all later on. Ever wondered what 64,000 individual
:37:23. > :37:30.Acts of Parliament look like? Pretty much all of the UK's laws,
:37:31. > :37:34.written down on sheep or goat skin and stored
:37:35. > :37:39.here in the archive in Parliament. The biggest scrolls, I'm told,
:37:40. > :37:45.relate to issues of taxation. Aha, this is arguably the most
:37:46. > :37:48.important thing in here, the European Communities Act
:37:49. > :37:52.of 1972. Essentially it enshrines a principle
:37:53. > :37:54.that British law had It's like this is the boss
:37:55. > :38:00.of everything else in here. Of course, all that's
:38:01. > :38:03.about to change. Brexit means British law
:38:04. > :38:06.will once again be supreme. There's just the little issue
:38:07. > :38:11.of working out how. When you leave the European Union,
:38:12. > :38:17.you repeal the European Communities Act, but you also bring
:38:18. > :38:21.all the European law Then you change it after you've
:38:22. > :38:29.left if you want to, You don't have to change
:38:30. > :38:33.anything as you are leaving. There are two types of EU law,
:38:34. > :38:36.regulations which apply automatically in all member states
:38:37. > :38:40.and EU directives, which set out aims that parliaments
:38:41. > :38:43.must then legislate for, Acts of Parliament like these
:38:44. > :38:45.and statutory instruments Yeah, and that's why this
:38:46. > :38:51.constitutional expert says it's a job that could take up
:38:52. > :38:54.to a decade to sort out. The law, after all, is constantly
:38:55. > :38:56.evolving and tested You can't simply cut and paste
:38:57. > :39:05.without an awful lot of care. One example of what happened
:39:06. > :39:07.when the Supreme Court was created was I think the
:39:08. > :39:10.Government thought... Tony Blair thought, "Tremendously
:39:11. > :39:13.easy, we'll just repeal the office We now have a Lord
:39:14. > :39:16.Chancellor. When you looked at the thousands of
:39:17. > :39:21.Acts of Parliament with references to the Lord Chancellor,
:39:22. > :39:24.he couldn't get rid of it. And there will be an awful lot
:39:25. > :39:26.of that kind of difficulty when you try to get
:39:27. > :39:29.rid of some EU law. Because of the way that laws
:39:30. > :39:32.are recommended, it's really hard to nail down the scale of just how
:39:33. > :39:35.far EU law is entrenched -- the way that laws are
:39:36. > :39:40.implemented. During the referendum campaign,
:39:41. > :39:43.estimates varied from 16% to 13%. And there's no doubt we'd
:39:44. > :39:45.like to keep some of them. Over the years, we've come to accept
:39:46. > :39:49.quite a lot of the EU employment rights, the equality laws,
:39:50. > :39:50.the things like that. Equal pay for men and women,
:39:51. > :39:54.non-discrimination. But some of the more ridiculous
:39:55. > :40:01.regulations in agriculture, for example, or in regulating
:40:02. > :40:06.competition, for example, No one seems to be disputing
:40:07. > :40:15.that this legal separation can be But whatever happens,
:40:16. > :40:20.as soon as Britain leaves, the Communities Act will be
:40:21. > :40:23.effectively ripped up. And, no, of course
:40:24. > :40:33.that's not the real one! Yes, there was a slight gasp in the
:40:34. > :40:35.studio! We're joined now by the Ukip
:40:36. > :40:44.MP Douglas Carswell. Welcome. Clear this up, what
:40:45. > :40:50.proportion of EU law is statute, ie made by Parliament, and what
:40:51. > :40:54.proportion as common law? About 60% of law made last year originated
:40:55. > :41:00.from the EU. There is a huge amount of regulation, statute and law that
:41:01. > :41:04.emanates and was created under the auspices of the European Communities
:41:05. > :41:10.Act. When we leave, we would vote to make all of that law, all of that
:41:11. > :41:13.regulation, British law. It can subsequently be amended or not
:41:14. > :41:17.amended, but the act of converting it into British law and leaving its
:41:18. > :41:22.router be straightforward. But we have just heard the exact opposite,
:41:23. > :41:27.you can't just take everything that was EU law, or originated in the EU
:41:28. > :41:33.Parliament, and put it... I am only taking it from him, that you can't
:41:34. > :41:38.cut and paste. You can't just say, I will rub out EU law and write a
:41:39. > :41:43.British court. When Britain and other countries to colonise to in
:41:44. > :41:46.the 40s, 50s and 60 's, the pattern was that law that had supposedly
:41:47. > :41:50.been imposed by Britain on those countries became domestic law of
:41:51. > :41:57.those countries until subsequently amended. The process of them
:41:58. > :42:00.changing will be unending, because self-governing democracy, every new
:42:01. > :42:04.Government will want to modify and change the law. The process of
:42:05. > :42:08.making every piece of legislation brought in under the auspices of the
:42:09. > :42:13.European Communities Act British law is relatively straightforward. How
:42:14. > :42:17.many laws will we need to repatriate? The entire body of
:42:18. > :42:22.legislation brought in under the European Communities Act 1972 will
:42:23. > :42:28.become British law. How many laws are they, how many numbers?
:42:29. > :42:35.Hundreds, thousands? Tens of thousands, and since we joined the
:42:36. > :42:37.European Communities Act there has been exponential growth in so-called
:42:38. > :42:42.statutory legislation, because the European Communities Act allows
:42:43. > :42:47.technocrats to create law without our consent. Does it sound simple to
:42:48. > :42:51.you? Know, and it was warned about before the vote on the 23rd of June,
:42:52. > :42:56.it would take an inordinate amount of time. Some people just think he
:42:57. > :43:02.will repeal the European Communities Act 1972 and that is it. It will
:43:03. > :43:06.take a lot longer. Another point is the legislations, which have direct
:43:07. > :43:11.effect. We need to decide which of those we want or don't want. The
:43:12. > :43:17.other thing is that the rulings of the European port -- European Court
:43:18. > :43:21.of Justice in terms of precedent, because lawyers in court will often
:43:22. > :43:26.argue about precedent and look at what was meant when a statute or
:43:27. > :43:31.directive was introduced. That will still apply for some years to come
:43:32. > :43:36.until we have our own. It will be British court adjudicating after we
:43:37. > :43:41.have left. But will it be? The lawyer said that
:43:42. > :43:46.if you get rid of the certain number of laws, employment and workers'
:43:47. > :43:52.writes, it takes time to incorporate or rewrite them into British law,
:43:53. > :43:56.then the workers will not be protected? All existing laws and
:43:57. > :44:02.rights would remain and be brought in as British law. Except he says
:44:03. > :44:06.you can't do that as simply as cutting and pasting. There are about
:44:07. > :44:11.200 countries around the world, they are almost all self-governing.
:44:12. > :44:15.Self-government is not such a ridiculously complex process that we
:44:16. > :44:20.can't manage it, we can manage it in a straightforward way. You think the
:44:21. > :44:25.lawyer is wrong? It is generous of him to concede that self-government
:44:26. > :44:30.as possible! But the transition will take a long time. The amount of
:44:31. > :44:35.Government, civil service and Parliamentary time... Parliament
:44:36. > :44:40.making public policy, there's a thought! It will keep us busy. A
:44:41. > :44:44.good democratic principle would be that until the general election,
:44:45. > :44:49.when Parliament published manifestos specifying what they want to change,
:44:50. > :44:54.the default should be not to change. Jeremy Corbyn can by all means
:44:55. > :44:58.nationalise the railways, currently illegal in the EU, but we should not
:44:59. > :45:02.change these laws until we have an election and there is a mandate in
:45:03. > :45:09.the manifested to change existing rules. So you accept it will tie up
:45:10. > :45:13.the UK Parliament for years, maybe a decade? Self-government is quite a
:45:14. > :45:17.busy process. We have been doing it for several centuries and it takes
:45:18. > :45:21.up the time. You have always liked smaller government, fewer ministers,
:45:22. > :45:27.less time spent on these things, now you advocate the opposite? Being in
:45:28. > :45:31.the EU has meant an explosion in regulations and rules. If Parliament
:45:32. > :45:37.has to take responsibility, I think we would get fewer laws, better
:45:38. > :45:40.framed. And the people that the laws most impact would have recourse to
:45:41. > :45:44.change them if they did not like it. You think Parliament will be best
:45:45. > :45:50.served recreating 40 years worth of EU laws, however long it takes? As I
:45:51. > :45:53.tried to explain, we do not need to recreate things, all existing laws
:45:54. > :45:57.will be transposed and become UK law. You will have to recreate some
:45:58. > :45:59.of them, some of them must have originated from the EU, and then
:46:00. > :46:10.decide which to get rid of. Businesses who are going to work
:46:11. > :46:14.with and EU member states, they benefit from those mutual
:46:15. > :46:22.regulations. If we want to carry on with the relationships we have to
:46:23. > :46:25.think it is not just about us. Mutual recognition is compatible
:46:26. > :46:32.within the EU. By being outside the EU it would be easier to have this
:46:33. > :46:39.than in the single market, which imposes a single standard on
:46:40. > :46:46.everyone. Things like passports... That makes passporting in the City
:46:47. > :46:51.redundant. You need the arrangement that Switzerland has. If you want to
:46:52. > :46:55.refight the referendum, making these arguments too late. The realisation
:46:56. > :47:01.is that this is going to be complicated and take a lot of civil
:47:02. > :47:05.service time and cost. And it is not just Parliament, it affects
:47:06. > :47:09.businesses, people in the country and public services, the NHS.
:47:10. > :47:13.Self-Government does take up the time of politicians. It is what
:47:14. > :47:19.people wanted. They wanted to take back control of laws and in a way
:47:20. > :47:24.Parliament has to do this. They did want to take back control. But
:47:25. > :47:29.people, I have had e-mails from people saying it is simple. That is
:47:30. > :47:35.just the starting point. That won't happen... Maybe your party and my
:47:36. > :47:41.party could publish a manifesto with chapters saying what we intend to
:47:42. > :47:46.change. I would like higher animal standards and we can do that and not
:47:47. > :47:51.blame Brussels. It will be good for democracy. You have thought a lot
:47:52. > :48:00.about this over the years, what role doo you see yourself playing? I hope
:48:01. > :48:05.I play a constructive role. I think David Davis is off to a flying
:48:06. > :48:10.start. There is a commission to shadow the Brexit department, I
:48:11. > :48:15.would love to play a part and ensure we leave the EU but co-operate with
:48:16. > :48:23.our friends as neighbours. Wouldn't you rather be on the government
:48:24. > :48:24.bench? Good heavens no, I have never been comfortable being part of
:48:25. > :48:46.Government ever! David Davis has been the busy man.
:48:47. > :48:53.-- has been a busy man. It will take many months to see the effects of
:48:54. > :48:57.several options and the analysis on the negotiating balance, where our
:48:58. > :49:01.allies might be and where they might not be. This is likely to be the
:49:02. > :49:05.most complicated negotiation of modern times and maybe the most
:49:06. > :49:10.complicated of all time. Even with and you mention this inure report as
:49:11. > :49:14.well -- in your report, with private hearings, I have to say I may not be
:49:15. > :49:19.able to tell you everything even in private hearings. Because this is
:49:20. > :49:26.really the sexiest area of politics at the moment. Everybody writes to
:49:27. > :49:32.us and we get vast amounts. My department is tiny. If it is
:49:33. > :49:35.quadrupled in one month, it is eight weeks, but everybody around here
:49:36. > :49:39.know what is Whitehall and Brussels are like in August.
:49:40. > :49:42.Mr Davis is a busy man, because this afternoon he's also due
:49:43. > :49:44.to appear in front of MPs on the Foreign Affairs Committee.
:49:45. > :49:47.Nadhim Zahawi will be one of those putting the questions,
:49:48. > :49:59.Is this the sexiest place to be in Whitehall? I think it is the most
:50:00. > :50:04.exciting place to be if you're in Whitehall in terms of being able to
:50:05. > :50:13.work out what are position is going to be. So that when we do trigger
:50:14. > :50:16.article 50 we are able to once we know what that position is
:50:17. > :50:21.articulate it and negotiate a settlement. That works for the
:50:22. > :50:26.United Kingdom as Theresa May has said, she wants it to work for
:50:27. > :50:30.business, so business can continue to trade with Europe. As well as
:50:31. > :50:37.taking control of our borders. What are you going to ask him. I won't
:50:38. > :50:42.pre-empt that, my colleagues would be upset. You have got them written
:50:43. > :50:49.down. I have many written down, some will come through the interrogation
:50:50. > :50:53.or the... Ability to enquire of our new Secretary of State. We want to
:50:54. > :50:58.look at the structure of his department. To look at how he
:50:59. > :51:04.intends to report back to Parliament. He rightly said, look,
:51:05. > :51:07.we can't give a running commentary. Theresa May repeated that in the
:51:08. > :51:12.chamber. I think it would be wrong of the Government to give a running
:51:13. > :51:19.commentary as to what their thinking is and the position papers, but once
:51:20. > :51:24.those position papers have become more solid, he would have to have
:51:25. > :51:30.scrutiny of a select committee. It sounds fascinating this thing this
:51:31. > :51:34.afternoon. It is. Is it. He is not going to tell you anything. He said
:51:35. > :51:42.in this committee, we will have to keep a lot of negotiations secret
:51:43. > :51:46.and we won't brief Parliamentarians, the rung commentary you -- running
:51:47. > :51:51.commentary, you are not going to learn anything? Our job is to push
:51:52. > :51:55.government. That is what committees do and why they have worked so well,
:51:56. > :52:01.because now we have chairmen elected by the House and Thierry Henry have
:52:02. > :52:04.the -- and therefore have the accountability of House and they
:52:05. > :52:09.have the structure of departments and budget and the direction of
:52:10. > :52:15.travel. You have got to be realistic. You can't have the detail
:52:16. > :52:19.before the Government has had the negotiation. But then we want to
:52:20. > :52:24.make sure there are commitments that they will come and in the spirit of
:52:25. > :52:28.transparency be able to come before the committee and deliver that to
:52:29. > :52:33.the House. Do you have sympathy with David Davis being asked questions he
:52:34. > :52:37.can't answer? I think we have all been through it as ministers. I
:52:38. > :52:43.think it is, we are all finding our way. This will be complicated. We
:52:44. > :52:47.have heard how complex the legal changes. Not according to Douglas
:52:48. > :52:53.Carswell. But I think they will be. I have to say I think, David Davis
:52:54. > :52:57.said last week that he would keep Parliament informed and engaged.
:52:58. > :53:02.There is a point, a balance between no running commentary and nothing at
:53:03. > :53:06.all. And I think we are two months after the vote we need a plan as to
:53:07. > :53:11.when we are going to start the negotiations and I would like to is
:53:12. > :53:16.no what -- know where the Government would like to end up. Things like
:53:17. > :53:21.free movement and single market and it is important I think, because
:53:22. > :53:24.otherwise other people will put in their view and this is for the
:53:25. > :53:31.government. Whether it is today or between now and the end of the term,
:53:32. > :53:36.we need more detail. I think the principle, the guiding principle is
:53:37. > :53:41.what the Prime Minister said, what she will want is a deal that works
:53:42. > :53:46.for British business to export with Europe and control our borders. She
:53:47. > :53:51.is the boss. She is the Prime Minister. Before you interrupted me,
:53:52. > :53:55.free trade for businesses across Europe and controlling our
:53:56. > :53:59.borderses. That were her guiding principles. You have to take the
:54:00. > :54:03.guide from the DNA from any organisation comes from the top and
:54:04. > :54:10.from Theresa May. Reaching a settlement was still possible said
:54:11. > :54:13.David Davis within goo years, but -- two years but will be difficult. Do
:54:14. > :54:21.you think it will slip? We will have to see. Our job on the committee is
:54:22. > :54:24.to question the government as to what their targets are, what
:54:25. > :54:27.structures they're putting in place, the resources they have available,
:54:28. > :54:34.to meet the targets. You have to take them at their word. We have got
:54:35. > :54:39.to take that at face value. But we make sure that that target is real
:54:40. > :54:43.is tick and can be met. Ewith ill be watching. Thank you.
:54:44. > :54:46.Time now to find out the answer to our quiz.
:54:47. > :54:47.The question was about David Cameron.
:54:48. > :54:49.He'd no sooner stepped down as an MP yesterday
:54:50. > :54:56.B, new panellist on This Week with Andrew Neil?
:54:57. > :54:59.Or D, Bailiff of the Manor of Northstead?
:55:00. > :55:04.So, Nicky, what's the correct answer?
:55:05. > :55:09.It is bailiff of the manor of Northstead. Do you know anything
:55:10. > :55:16.about it? No. Yes, the correct answer is that
:55:17. > :55:19.David Cameron has been appointed to be Crown Steward and Bailiff
:55:20. > :55:21.of the Manor of Northstead, That's one of the ancient ceremonial
:55:22. > :55:26.titles that's been kept to allow MPs And that means the previous Steward
:55:27. > :55:30.and Bailiff of the Manor of Northstead is out
:55:31. > :55:32.of a ceremonial job. And we're joined by him now,
:55:33. > :55:35.he's the former Labour MP Huw Irranca-Davies and he stood down
:55:36. > :55:52.as an MP earlier this year in order It is a non-job isn't it? Yes, it is
:55:53. > :55:58.a bit of fun and the only stewardship I have ever had. It is
:55:59. > :56:03.supposed to be a paid office, but I didn't receive anything. Have you
:56:04. > :56:12.written to the Chancellor? I think I should to say, where is my pay. But
:56:13. > :56:19.it is strange. It is apt here in the Senedd, the first person to use the
:56:20. > :56:30.device in 1742, was a Watkins Williams Wyn, who who inherited a
:56:31. > :56:37.paid position and was forced to resign. You could not be a place man
:56:38. > :56:41.and scrutinyise the king. You haven't a manor that you're handing
:56:42. > :56:48.to David Cameron. No, I don't. I did have a bit of a look to see what the
:56:49. > :56:55.manor looked like. Even when it was used in the fashion, it was a
:56:56. > :56:59.derelict, run down building. Now, I understand it is under an industrial
:57:00. > :57:06.estate. Sorry, David, there is not much to look at with this new role.
:57:07. > :57:13.We have got a slight sound problem, but we will continue. There is no
:57:14. > :57:21.process is there for actually standing down as an MP. Hence this
:57:22. > :57:25.strange mechanism. Yes, we should be able to look this and there have
:57:26. > :57:31.been suggestions to allow a MP either thus ill health or -- through
:57:32. > :57:36.ill health, or like me I decided to do something, to put in a letter of
:57:37. > :57:40.resignation. But I have to write, or David Cameron will have writen to
:57:41. > :57:47.the Chancellor to get their permission to take on one of these
:57:48. > :57:52.crown stewardships and that would disbar them from being an MP. So
:57:53. > :57:56.they can't resign, but they're disqualified by having a paid
:57:57. > :58:05.position under the crown. It is bizarre and it is a bit of fun, it
:58:06. > :58:13.is nice to be one on a list that I notice includes people such as Enoch
:58:14. > :58:21.Powell and Boris Johnson, Gerry Adams. And now David Cameron. I hope
:58:22. > :58:31.he looks after it and doesn't upset the neighbours. You haven't upset
:58:32. > :58:35.anyone. No there is a Twitter feed from the manor and they have sent me
:58:36. > :58:39.good wishes for leaving it in good shape and invited me back. You look
:58:40. > :58:43.as if you have enjoyed it. Thank you. You're a free man now. I am
:58:44. > :58:46.free. Enjoy it. The One O'Clock News is starting
:58:47. > :58:51.over on BBC One now. I'll be back at 11:30am tomorrow
:58:52. > :58:54.with Andrew for live coverage