:00:36. > :00:38.Hello and welcome to the Daily Politics.
:00:39. > :00:42.MPs are about to begin two days of debate over the bill that
:00:43. > :00:44.will give the Government the authority to get the formal
:00:45. > :00:49.So will it get through Parliament without any hiccups?
:00:50. > :00:53.We speak to MPs from across the political spectrum.
:00:54. > :00:54.Protestors gather outside Downing Street last night
:00:55. > :00:59.to voice their anger at Donald Trump's immigration ban.
:01:00. > :01:00.Overnight the President sacked his acting Attorney General
:01:01. > :01:09.Unlike the eventual trains, the High Speed Two Bill has been
:01:10. > :01:15.But it could soon get to its desired destination.
:01:16. > :01:22.Conservative grandee Nicholas Soames is forced to apologise for making
:01:23. > :01:27.what he calls a "friendly canine salute" to a fellow MP.
:01:28. > :01:42.All that in the next hour and with us for the whole
:01:43. > :01:44.of the programme today is Angela Smith, Labour's leader
:01:45. > :01:53.So, in just over half an hour MPs will finally start debating
:01:54. > :01:55.the Government's Article 50 Bill, with Labour warning of civil
:01:56. > :01:58.disturbances and people taking to the streets if Parliament votes
:01:59. > :02:00.against triggering the Brexit process.
:02:01. > :02:14.If it is approved it will give the Government the authority to trigger
:02:15. > :02:16.leaving that you use. -- leaving the EU. What lies ahead?
:02:17. > :02:19.MPs will begin five days of debate on the European Union Notification
:02:20. > :02:21.of Withdrawal Bill, which has its second reading today
:02:22. > :02:23.and tomorrow before coming back before MPs next Monday
:02:24. > :02:27.Despite being only 133 words long, MPs are queuing up
:02:28. > :02:29.to modify the Bill - with Labour, the SNP,
:02:30. > :02:31.the Liberal Democrats and the Green Party all looking
:02:32. > :02:40.The SNP have promised to put down 50 amendments but so far have
:02:41. > :02:44.only published four, including a reset clause that
:02:45. > :02:48.would keep the UK in the EU if an exit deal can't be reached
:02:49. > :02:55.Both the SNP and Labour will look to put down amendments calling
:02:56. > :02:58.for EU nationals resident in the UK to be given a guarantee
:02:59. > :03:08.Labour plan on putting down a further series of amendments,
:03:09. > :03:10.including forcing the Government to protect workers' rights
:03:11. > :03:13.The Liberal Democrats want to put down three amendments including
:03:14. > :03:16.on having a second referendum where the options will be to accept
:03:17. > :03:24.While the Green Party are going for an even more
:03:25. > :03:25.extreme alternative - a so-called reasoned amendment that
:03:26. > :03:33.would see the whole Article 50 process killed stone dead.
:03:34. > :03:36.Few, if any, amendments are likely to pass in the Commons given Labour
:03:37. > :03:38.support for the Bill - but opponents could have more
:03:39. > :03:40.success in the Lords, which will begin its debate
:03:41. > :03:48.Lords were told last night Ministers want them to have passed
:03:49. > :03:51.the Bill by March 7th - in time for Theresa May to go
:03:52. > :03:54.to the EU summit that weekend to trigger Article 50 and begin
:03:55. > :04:00.As always at times like this, our political correspondent
:04:01. > :04:02.Norman Smith is in the thick of things - he joins us
:04:03. > :04:15.You can never criticise us for not being consistent! Norman, how big a
:04:16. > :04:18.moment is this today? A big moment because it is something Theresa May
:04:19. > :04:23.desperately wanted to avoid. She would not be here worried about the
:04:24. > :04:28.Supreme Court saying you absolutely have to pass legislation -- were it
:04:29. > :04:32.not for the Supreme Court saying. Hundreds amendments have been
:04:33. > :04:37.tabled, there will be a bust up over the pace at which legislation is
:04:38. > :04:42.being pushed. Maastricht was on the floor of the house for weeks, so
:04:43. > :04:47.there will be an argument over why the Government still has not publish
:04:48. > :04:51.this paper it first promised back in December. Still we have not got it.
:04:52. > :04:56.There would be plenty of argy-bargy and aggro, but at the end of the day
:04:57. > :05:01.the one thing pretty much everyone seems to agree on is that Theresa
:05:02. > :05:05.May will in all probability ghetto legislation and in the time frame
:05:06. > :05:10.she wants, namely by the end of March -- will in all probably get
:05:11. > :05:16.her legislation. Her opponents are divided, Tory rebels believe now is
:05:17. > :05:21.not the time to stand up to Mrs May, three, the House of Lords, partly
:05:22. > :05:27.through self preservation do not want to stand up against the
:05:28. > :05:31.referendum and for the most importantly, Jeremy Corbyn has
:05:32. > :05:36.ordered his MPs to back the bill. At the end of the day, Labour MPs will
:05:37. > :05:41.be expected to back the measure even though some will defy him and some
:05:42. > :05:46.will provide -- resign from the backbench in order to not do that --
:05:47. > :05:50.will resign from the front bench. As you repeated, the list of amendments
:05:51. > :05:57.is long. Would it be whittled down to one of two macro by the end? It
:05:58. > :06:04.will be hacked back to three or four. The key amendment as far as I
:06:05. > :06:09.can see it suggests there should be a meaningful vote before Theresa May
:06:10. > :06:15.strikes a deal on Brexit. She has promised a vote after she has done a
:06:16. > :06:18.deal. I do not expect that amendment will be passed in the immediate
:06:19. > :06:25.weeks in which MPs and peers debate this bill, but there is a body of
:06:26. > :06:30.opinion that wants to see down the line, maybe as part of the Great
:06:31. > :06:34.Repeal Bill or other Parliamentary vehicles, whether there can be a
:06:35. > :06:40.mechanism whereby MPs are guaranteed a vote before Mrs May takes us out
:06:41. > :06:43.of the EU. We don't get that clash, but I expect that in time those
:06:44. > :06:45.opposed to Brexit will make their stand there. Thank you very much,
:06:46. > :06:47.Norman Smith. I'm joined now by Conservative MP
:06:48. > :06:49.and former minister John Penrose and the Liberal Democrat
:06:50. > :06:51.former cabinet minister Alistair Carmichael who now sits
:06:52. > :06:59.on the Brexit select committee. Welcome to you both. Alistair
:07:00. > :07:02.Carmichael, as you will probably expect, Brexit Secretary David Davis
:07:03. > :07:08.would accuse you today of abusing the trust of the British people, it
:07:09. > :07:13.is hard to argue with that logic. I will not start losing sleep about
:07:14. > :07:18.accusations from David Davies, it is pretty predictable. The argument
:07:19. > :07:21.about trust from the referendum is important. I know lots of people
:07:22. > :07:25.were told things would be possible in the event that they voted to
:07:26. > :07:29.Leave, we're now told that these things will not happen and we hear
:07:30. > :07:33.from Government ministers, Philip Hammond in particular, that they now
:07:34. > :07:38.want to take the Government in a very particular direction. A small
:07:39. > :07:42.Government, low regulation, low tax economy. That runs directly in the
:07:43. > :07:48.opposite direction from the promises made up having extra money to spend
:07:49. > :07:54.on public service. Remember the famous ?350 million a week? Where is
:07:55. > :08:00.the respect for the result of the referendum? It all just shows how
:08:01. > :08:03.you need to be careful when you come to bouncing around these
:08:04. > :08:08.accusations, let's take it step-by-step and try to have the
:08:09. > :08:12.most mature debate. Is that what the Government is doing, taking Britain
:08:13. > :08:17.in the direction of a low tax, to use Jeremy Corbyn's phrase, bargain
:08:18. > :08:20.basement economy? A bloke I think that is a fallback if it all goes
:08:21. > :08:25.horribly wrong but I don't think that is what we are aiming for.
:08:26. > :08:29.There has been cross-party agreement and trying to preserve workers'
:08:30. > :08:34.rights and so on. It is only if the EUG feels they have is over a barrel
:08:35. > :08:38.and can push us towards a dreadful deal, it is to make sure people
:08:39. > :08:43.understand that a bad deal is worse than no deal, as the Prime Minister
:08:44. > :08:47.rightly said. That is further down the line, let's concentrate on the
:08:48. > :08:52.debate today and tomorrow, Alistair Carmichael, you will not be putting
:08:53. > :08:55.down in till the committee stage next week, so is it not incumbent on
:08:56. > :09:01.you and your colleagues to at least vote through the bill on its second
:09:02. > :09:05.reading? We have tabled the reasoned amendment today, which makes it
:09:06. > :09:09.clear that we decline to give the bill a second reading because it
:09:10. > :09:13.makes no provision for a referendum, because, as you said in your
:09:14. > :09:18.introduction, the White Paper we have been promised has not yet been
:09:19. > :09:23.published. And because the Government has used Parliamentary
:09:24. > :09:27.procedure to avoid giving things like what are known as money
:09:28. > :09:30.resolution some sort. The Government is still trying to do what the
:09:31. > :09:34.Supreme Court has said they are not allowed to do by law, which is to
:09:35. > :09:39.sideline parliament and keep control. How was Parliament is being
:09:40. > :09:42.sidelined? The Government has only brought forward the bill, not the
:09:43. > :09:48.other ancillary measures that normally go with it. That is why we
:09:49. > :09:51.are putting down the amendment. There have been 69 Parliamentary
:09:52. > :09:56.debates on the outcome of the EU referendum since the 23rd of June.
:09:57. > :09:59.If anybody can really, hand on heart, say there has not been a
:10:00. > :10:05.chance for Parliament to scrutinise this decision then, really, you are
:10:06. > :10:10.being facetious. As you well know there is a world of difference
:10:11. > :10:14.between Parliament having general debates that don't have votes, and
:10:15. > :10:19.then a meaningful debate of the sort we have today which is a second
:10:20. > :10:23.reading of a bill, that is... John Penrose, where is this white paper?
:10:24. > :10:27.We were promised it, David Davis said it would not happen, Theresa
:10:28. > :10:31.May pulled the rabbit out of the hat at PMQs and said it would happen,
:10:32. > :10:34.you were a Remainer, presumably you would like to see what is being set
:10:35. > :10:46.out by the Government when you said that you like the single market, you
:10:47. > :10:48.said that on the eve of the referendum, it means jobs when local
:10:49. > :10:51.firms export to Europe so relieving would cost jobs. You would like to
:10:52. > :10:54.see a White Paper? Yes, I was delighted when it was announced. I
:10:55. > :10:58.want to see before the start of the negotiations. Not before the
:10:59. > :11:02.triggering of Article 50? Above that would mean it has to be out before
:11:03. > :11:06.Article 50 is triggered, before the end of March or whatever.
:11:07. > :11:10.On the basis of your support for the single market she would support a
:11:11. > :11:17.Lib Dem amendment to keep us in the single market? No, I am a Remainer
:11:18. > :11:21.but I was a Democrat first. We have taken a collective decision in the
:11:22. > :11:25.referendum, I was on the losing side but I respect that, because we have
:11:26. > :11:29.taken that decision it is up to is to deliver it in the best way
:11:30. > :11:33.possible, I think most of the Labour Party is on the same page. Would you
:11:34. > :11:39.put down an amendment on the lines of staying in the single market? We
:11:40. > :11:43.would like to see a degree of Parliamentary scrutiny. Why you have
:11:44. > :11:47.such a short time for debate is that the Government spent three months
:11:48. > :11:49.fighting the courts not to come to Parliament, which is really
:11:50. > :11:55.outrageous. Parliament should decide this. I don't believe whether
:11:56. > :11:58.people's views were Remain or Leave that there is a single member of
:11:59. > :12:03.Parliament or the House of Lords who does not want the best deal for the
:12:04. > :12:07.UK. That means different things were different people, do you support a
:12:08. > :12:13.second referendum? , It was for the people to decide. The Lib Dems lost
:12:14. > :12:17.the referendum on voting systems, on the EU and now it is calling for
:12:18. > :12:25.another one, ludicrous. The key thing is that must be Parliamentary
:12:26. > :12:28.scrutiny. All these debates we have had have been about trying to get
:12:29. > :12:33.information from the Government which never had a plan, has no
:12:34. > :12:37.information. There needs to be built into this legislation reporting back
:12:38. > :12:41.to Parliament and working and engaging with Parliament, that is
:12:42. > :12:45.missing and is serious. I think it is a false choice to
:12:46. > :12:50.start saying that some Parliamentary debates are more equal than others.
:12:51. > :12:54.Oh, come on extra measure not of course they are wrecks formation not
:12:55. > :12:59.there may be votes on bills and other measures, but nope Prime
:13:00. > :13:06.Minister weathered salt will ignore a sizeable vote, however it is
:13:07. > :13:11.framed. Even on the single market? These things matter because it tells
:13:12. > :13:15.us how Parliament will.... That is ridiculous, all the debates and
:13:16. > :13:19.questions have been trying to get information from the Government.
:13:20. > :13:22.This Government agreed to put the referendum... David Cameron said I
:13:23. > :13:28.will stay on and sing it through, disappeared, it is a Government
:13:29. > :13:35.without a plan. -- stay on and see it through. Will labour Lords vote
:13:36. > :13:41.to trigger Article 50? We will not block or delay the bill? Article 50
:13:42. > :13:47.will be triggered. But this is not a blank check that the Government to
:13:48. > :13:53.do what it wants. Woman Mark Roe -- Theresa May wants to invoke article
:13:54. > :13:58.50. You say you will not block the bill and you know that timing is
:13:59. > :14:02.crucial, you say you have legitimate concerns on a blank cheque, what
:14:03. > :14:06.does that mean practice? We will listen to what happens in the House
:14:07. > :14:10.of Commons, I would be optimistic that the House of Commons in its
:14:11. > :14:16.wisdom would have an amendment that brings through Parliamentary
:14:17. > :14:21.scrutiny chewing the process. -- during the process. To answer more
:14:22. > :14:25.fully, if that does not happen, the only thing open to the House of
:14:26. > :14:30.Lords is to as the House of Commons to look at it again. This is not
:14:31. > :14:33.blocking or delaying, but say to the House of Commons, think about this
:14:34. > :14:37.and have another look. I don't think that would be unreasonable if we get
:14:38. > :14:42.about, but if the House of Commons is to say that it wants that
:14:43. > :14:45.scrutiny, we would support them. So the Lords could bat it back to
:14:46. > :14:47.the Commons and they think again before triggering Article 50, what
:14:48. > :15:04.would that do to the timetable? Within the British people would be
:15:05. > :15:11.enthusiastic about. If it is within the timetable... What we will no
:15:12. > :15:16.doubt see is hysteria from some who think any questioning of the
:15:17. > :15:18.Government is a constitutional outrage. It would be a
:15:19. > :15:24.constitutional outrage not have questioning.
:15:25. > :15:33.The timetable is entirely of Theresa May's on making. She chose to waste
:15:34. > :15:40.month in the courts. Deed think it was a waste of time, John Penrose?
:15:41. > :15:49.No, it was not. It was perfectly arguable. Particularly and
:15:50. > :16:00.constitutionally it was a disgrace to try and sideline parliament. But
:16:01. > :16:05.in the end the Supreme court... They have said the Labour Party will not
:16:06. > :16:11.block the attempt but they are split. Jeremy Corbyn says there will
:16:12. > :16:19.be a whip for MPs. What was the mood last night like at the PLP? There
:16:20. > :16:24.was great support for Keir Starmer and the amendments he has put
:16:25. > :16:29.through. The main focus of last night's meeting was the amendments
:16:30. > :16:33.we are putting down which unites the Parliamentary Labour Party. But you
:16:34. > :16:38.have 50 or 60 MPs who will defy the party? When we get into committee
:16:39. > :16:43.and we are discussing the amendments, there is a really broad,
:16:44. > :16:47.strong agreement around the amendments needing parliamentary
:16:48. > :16:52.scrutiny. It is about trying to get Parliament to have a say. But there
:16:53. > :16:57.is a split in the Labour Party. But the main issue is the amendments.
:16:58. > :17:08.There are split in the Liberal Democrats. How many will vote? I'm
:17:09. > :17:16.delighted to say you are not the Chief Whip. You have Norman Lamb
:17:17. > :17:25.talking about voting against articles 50. Other MPs are thinking
:17:26. > :17:30.about their constituencies. There are there are divisions in the
:17:31. > :17:35.Liberal Democrats. There are divisions in all parties.
:17:36. > :17:39.Incidentally, it is so important that we don't just say that the
:17:40. > :17:43.referendum on the 23rd of June was the last word on this, it was the
:17:44. > :17:46.start of a process, it is an evolving process and at the end of
:17:47. > :17:51.it, the people having started the process, it should be the people
:17:52. > :17:54.through a referendum that should be allowed to give their judgment and
:17:55. > :17:58.end it. Why is the government so frightened of amendments being put
:17:59. > :18:02.to the House and being voted through? There is nothing wrong with
:18:03. > :18:12.them being put to the House. But not voted through! As long as we talk
:18:13. > :18:15.about it! The question is, are they good amendments and is this the
:18:16. > :18:19.right bill for them as well? This is a very simple bill saying began to
:18:20. > :18:24.press the button to start the process. There is an enormous amount
:18:25. > :18:30.of further detail as the deal is negotiated, as the details come out.
:18:31. > :18:36.But this is the key point. We have to make sure that Parliament is kept
:18:37. > :18:40.informed as things come out. All of which is why we should have had the
:18:41. > :18:44.white Paper before the bill. That is how it works. You do your
:18:45. > :18:48.consultation first. When you have heard the views of people, you come
:18:49. > :18:55.forward with legislation. Gentlemen, thank you very much.
:18:56. > :19:00.The question for today is what did a member of the Treasury's Wellbeing
:19:01. > :19:02.work stream suggest could be a hazard to their colleagues' health?
:19:03. > :19:04.Was it: The Chancellor's fiscal statements?
:19:05. > :19:10.At the end of the show Baroness Smith will give us
:19:11. > :19:21.Now, to events on the other side of the Atlantic.
:19:22. > :19:23.And overnight Donald Trump fired his acting Attorney General
:19:24. > :19:33.after she questioned the legality of his immigration measures.
:19:34. > :19:36.Yesterday Ms Yates ordered justice department lawyers not to enforce
:19:37. > :19:48.Sally Yates was appointed by Barack Obama only 11 days ago
:19:49. > :19:50.on the day of Donald Trump's inauguration.
:19:51. > :19:53.She was an acting Attorney General and was due to be replaced
:19:54. > :19:55.by Donald Trump's choice for the role, Jeff Sessions,
:19:56. > :19:57.who was awaiting approval from the US Senate.
:19:58. > :19:59.Yesterday Ms Yates ordered justice department lawyers not to enforce
:20:00. > :20:03.In a letter, she said: "As long as I am the acting attorney general,
:20:04. > :20:06.the department of justice will not present arguments in defence
:20:07. > :20:12.Well, that act of defiance meant she didn't remain in the job very
:20:13. > :20:15.long: within hours the White House said she had been "relieved
:20:16. > :20:18.of her duties" and said she had "betrayed the department of justice
:20:19. > :20:21.by refusing to enforce a legal order designed to protect the citizens
:20:22. > :20:28.On this side of the Atlantic, President Trump's executive order
:20:29. > :20:31.has been causing some embarrassment for the British government which has
:20:32. > :20:33.since said it does not agree with the policy.
:20:34. > :20:36.Yesterday the Foreign Secretary, Boris Johnson, was summoned
:20:37. > :20:39.to the Commons to respond to questions from MPs.
:20:40. > :20:50.Let me begin by saying that this is not UK policy,
:20:51. > :20:53.it is not our policy, nor is it a measure that this
:20:54. > :21:00.I've already made clear our anxiety about measures that discriminate
:21:01. > :21:06.on grounds of nationality in ways that are divisive and wrong.
:21:07. > :21:09.All he can say is that, well, it would not be our policy.
:21:10. > :21:19.Has he urged the US administration to lift this order, to help refugees
:21:20. > :21:28.This order was signed on Holocaust Memorial Day.
:21:29. > :21:29.For the sake of history, for heaven's sake,
:21:30. > :21:34.I have made my views absolutely clear.
:21:35. > :21:37.I've said that it's divisive, I said that it's wrong and I've said
:21:38. > :21:42.that it stigmatises people on grounds of their nationality.
:21:43. > :21:45.But what I will not do, what I will not do,
:21:46. > :21:48.which is what I think the party opposite would do, is disengage
:21:49. > :21:54.from conversations with our American friends and partners in such a way
:21:55. > :21:59.as to do material damage to the interests of UK citizens.
:22:00. > :22:03.And would my right honourable friend agree in paraphrasing
:22:04. > :22:07.a far wiser president, John F Kennedy, that those
:22:08. > :22:12.that ride on the back of a tiger end up inside it?
:22:13. > :22:15.Does my right honourable friend accept there is a universal threat
:22:16. > :22:19.from jihadists and that Europol itself, as an example,
:22:20. > :22:22.have estimated there are upto 5000 jihadists that have come over
:22:23. > :22:26.from several of these countries about on the furthermore,
:22:27. > :22:31.we should also remember the victims of 9/11 in New York,
:22:32. > :22:36.7/7 in London, Paris, Brussels and Berlin,
:22:37. > :22:44.Try to recall, along with me, as I hid underneath the stairs
:22:45. > :22:49.when two fascist dictators, Mussolini and Hitler,
:22:50. > :22:54.were raining bombs on towns and cities in Britain.
:22:55. > :23:01.Now this Government's hand-in-hand with another fascist Trump,
:23:02. > :23:04.and what I say to him, do the decent thing
:23:05. > :23:14.This man is not fit to walk in the footsteps of Nelson Mandela.
:23:15. > :23:16.Well, I hesitate to say that the honourable gentleman's
:23:17. > :23:18.memory must be at fault if he thinks Mussolini rained bombs
:23:19. > :23:31.I'm joined now from Brussels by the Conservative MEP Daniel Hannan.
:23:32. > :23:38.Welcome to the Daily Politics. First of all, an Sally Yates, the former
:23:39. > :23:41.acting Attorney General, was she right when she said she was not
:23:42. > :23:45.convinced that the executive order was legal, and if she was right,
:23:46. > :23:52.wasn't she also crept when she said they should not follow the executive
:23:53. > :23:58.order through -- was she also correct? My own view is the
:23:59. > :24:01.executive order was an abuse of power. I think decisions of this
:24:02. > :24:05.kind should be referred to the legislature and I don't see any
:24:06. > :24:09.reasons why Donald Trump could not have presented his proposals to the
:24:10. > :24:14.two chambers. So in that view she is right. It is worth pointing out as
:24:15. > :24:18.Trump advocates are doing, that are very different standard was applied
:24:19. > :24:22.when Barack Obama used executive orders to change policy, but the
:24:23. > :24:28.fact that it has been abused before does not make it correct now. When
:24:29. > :24:33.you say it is an abuse of power, the fact that Donald Trump got rid of
:24:34. > :24:40.her and also his acting immigration chief, does that not smack of an
:24:41. > :24:42.autocrat? Yes, I would not have voted for Donald Trump precisely
:24:43. > :24:48.because I thought he had his character flaws and so far I have
:24:49. > :24:52.been vindicated. And so people are totally justified to protest what
:24:53. > :24:56.they see as a dangerous road towards autocracy and they hope that
:24:57. > :25:00.pressure in the States and here will lead to him changing his executive
:25:01. > :25:06.order or sending it or relaxing it in some way in terms of the ban
:25:07. > :25:10.which you say is an abuse of power. And if that is effective, you need
:25:11. > :25:18.to have a laser light concentration on what is actually wrong. This was
:25:19. > :25:25.a hasty ban which through the immigration immigration service into
:25:26. > :25:32.chaos. No US national has been killed on US soil by a national of
:25:33. > :25:36.any of those country since people started looking at this in 1975, and
:25:37. > :25:41.a measure of this kind should not be taken by executive order. An abuse
:25:42. > :25:46.of power does not make it any better when it happens this time. If people
:25:47. > :25:53.had restricted their concerns to those lines, rather than just
:25:54. > :25:56.shouting fascist Nazi, they would be more effective at uniting a broad
:25:57. > :26:02.coalition against him but of course people like to indulge themselves by
:26:03. > :26:05.shouting racist, fascist Nazi and that is what floats their boat. Is
:26:06. > :26:12.that the problem that you are in danger of losing the debate of
:26:13. > :26:18.criticising Donald Trump that if you resort to lazy analogies, the Nazis,
:26:19. > :26:21.the Holocaust, Donald Trump being compared to those dictators? I think
:26:22. > :26:25.there are very clear reasons why this should worry us. It gives an
:26:26. > :26:32.indication of the presidency of Donald Trump. It is spontaneous like
:26:33. > :26:38.the demonstrations planned last night, they were not organised or
:26:39. > :26:41.planned. People want to make a spontaneous protest, we have to
:26:42. > :26:47.understand that, but what we saw yesterday was a decision that was
:26:48. > :26:51.not evidence -based. It was made hastily without legal back-up. It
:26:52. > :26:55.was random in its application. We don't know why some countries and
:26:56. > :26:59.not others. There is no evidence base for it. And there was not a
:27:00. > :27:03.debate or discussion which could have gone through Congress, and that
:27:04. > :27:08.is what worries me. We need to have a presidency that is rooted in fact,
:27:09. > :27:14.rooted in reason and it worries me also our relationship with Donald
:27:15. > :27:19.Trump and the presidency of the USA. What did Theresa May no following
:27:20. > :27:23.the meeting? They walked out hand-in-hand like two good friends
:27:24. > :27:28.on their first date, almost. Then this very serious issue emerged that
:27:29. > :27:35.British citizens were being affected and we took so long to respond to
:27:36. > :27:39.it. Let's put that to Daniel. Was she to slow, Theresa May, about what
:27:40. > :27:44.she might have known about what he would sign off in his executive
:27:45. > :27:48.order. Was she to slow to react to criticise which in the end hampered
:27:49. > :27:55.the chances of British citizens to clarify what their situation would
:27:56. > :27:57.be? And think it is really important to distinguish between disapproving
:27:58. > :28:03.of Donald Trump's actions and wanting good relations between the
:28:04. > :28:07.US and United Kingdom. In almost every country in the world we will
:28:08. > :28:11.find something to objective. I did not particularly agree with France's
:28:12. > :28:15.burqa band that I would never suggest for a moment we should stop
:28:16. > :28:20.the French leader from coming here or Angela Merkel having a federal
:28:21. > :28:24.Europe. I should not suggest not having close relations with Germany.
:28:25. > :28:28.I don't think anyone is suggesting that. There are two things. One is
:28:29. > :28:33.that of course Theresa May will meet with Donald Trump and will meet with
:28:34. > :28:37.other leaders across the world. I think the concern is that just a few
:28:38. > :28:41.days into his presidency, when we have not got the measure or
:28:42. > :28:45.understood what that President will be like, a state visit is being
:28:46. > :28:52.arranged, and I think it is a bit unseemly to draw the Queen into this
:28:53. > :28:54.kind of controversy when it took two years for Barack Obama, three years
:28:55. > :28:58.for George W Bush. I think the Prime Minister is in danger of falling
:28:59. > :29:05.into the David Cameron mould of government way you look at quick
:29:06. > :29:08.decisions, and don't deal with the consequences in the long term.
:29:09. > :29:15.Daniel Hannan what is your view of that we did not have to use this
:29:16. > :29:20.state visit type of diplomacy? My guess is that they are deciding
:29:21. > :29:23.right from the beginning they want to emphasise the closeness of the
:29:24. > :29:26.relationship between us and the world's largest economy and chief
:29:27. > :29:31.military power which is no bad thing. The US alliance has been the
:29:32. > :29:35.cornerstone of our foreign policy since at least 1942. The US is the
:29:36. > :29:39.biggest investor in Britain, we are the biggest investor in the US. A
:29:40. > :29:44.million Americans turn up to work for British companies and a million
:29:45. > :29:46.Brits turn up to work for American companies. This is an
:29:47. > :29:51.extraordinarily important relationship and it goes beyond
:29:52. > :29:55.anyone mad or any president. Can I say to Angela Smith, the key is he
:29:56. > :29:58.was elected and he did promise to do these things. He did say he would
:29:59. > :30:07.have a complete and utter shutdown in terms of Muslims coming into the
:30:08. > :30:09.country. I know they have since denied this is a ban on a particular
:30:10. > :30:14.religion, he is enacting what he said he would do.
:30:15. > :30:20.Nobody should be surprised that he has acted in this way, which is more
:30:21. > :30:24.surprising that Theresa May did not raise these issues in the meeting.
:30:25. > :30:27.When he said to her there would be some sort of plan a refugee she did
:30:28. > :30:32.not probe further to ensure it would not impact UK citizens, which it
:30:33. > :30:34.did. On the subject of Britain 's nation Chibok Donald Trump, what to
:30:35. > :30:40.the great British public thing? -- Well, on the subject
:30:41. > :30:41.of Britain's relationship with Donald Trump, what do
:30:42. > :30:44.the Great British public think? Our Ellie has been out
:30:45. > :30:49.with the mighty moodbox. Welcome to wonderful Watford. Lovers
:30:50. > :30:53.in the. Special relationships are a question for today, what should the
:30:54. > :31:00.relationship be with Donald Trump, keep close all keep our distance?
:31:01. > :31:15.# Why do birds suddenly appear every time you are near?
:31:16. > :31:21.# Just like birds... Me, they long to be, close to you.
:31:22. > :31:26.I would like a close relationship, but not with Trump. We get close to
:31:27. > :31:31.him politically as much as we can, it would be good for the UK.
:31:32. > :31:37.Distance relationship. Why? I think he is an idiot. Distant, to
:31:38. > :31:42.be quite honest. All the laws he is trying to bring in and the human
:31:43. > :31:55.rights, we are human beings at the end of the day. Who are you speaking
:31:56. > :31:57.to? My mum, what do you think about Donald Trump, mum? I don't think we
:31:58. > :32:05.have ever done this by telephone before! Hard to say. She can stay on
:32:06. > :32:10.the phone. It is a bit of a thing and Watford. We should have a close
:32:11. > :32:15.relationship, keep an eye on what he is doing. Keep your friends close
:32:16. > :32:22.that your enemies closer, right? Do I detect an accent? West Brom?
:32:23. > :32:29.Watford. I don't think Theresa May knows what she is getting involved
:32:30. > :32:34.with, he is not right. We have to accent for people vote four, Trump
:32:35. > :32:39.was voted in. I think a lot of what he wants to do is for the good of
:32:40. > :32:43.the people. I don't think he is a good man for
:32:44. > :32:49.the world. Don't we need him for trade deals and stuff? No. We love
:32:50. > :32:54.him. Why do you love him? This was a mood
:32:55. > :32:58.box about the special relationship, although some want a close
:32:59. > :33:05.relationship, the overwhelming majority favour distance. Would be
:33:06. > :33:09.needing this, then! -- we won't be needing this.
:33:10. > :33:16.Obviously that is totally unscientific, as wonderful as it is.
:33:17. > :33:20.To go back to the discussion we had before, he won on a very clear
:33:21. > :33:23.campaign when it came to immigration, Angela, according to
:33:24. > :33:30.some polls, more Americans support the ban on refugees, Syrian
:33:31. > :33:34.refugees, and a ban on people coming from this designated countries. He
:33:35. > :33:38.is entitled to do what he has done. Yes, but he has to understand there
:33:39. > :33:43.will be criticism. Part of the problem is process as well as the
:33:44. > :33:47.decision. To say no refugees, to make people think he is somehow
:33:48. > :33:52.making them safer when there is no evidence, it is conning the public
:33:53. > :33:59.in the US. There was huge outpouring in the US as well. This is a sign of
:34:00. > :34:04.the presidency he will have, our relationship with Donald Trump, and
:34:05. > :34:07.I do not suggest that we do not have one, state visits are formal and
:34:08. > :34:10.very special and I am not sure he has earned the right yet. We had to
:34:11. > :34:14.look out for British interests and Theresa May fail to do that in their
:34:15. > :34:19.meeting last week. I would like to know more about what was discussed,
:34:20. > :34:25.and at all time she has to maintain British interests and maintain
:34:26. > :34:29.British values in meetings with him. Dan Hannan, did she hugged him to
:34:30. > :34:41.close? I think she got it right, it was not just a meeting with him, she
:34:42. > :34:43.established relationships with Mitch McConnell, Paul Aiton, other
:34:44. > :34:45.Republican leaders, the US has a divided and balanced constitution
:34:46. > :34:48.not just about one man. She was focused on British interests, she
:34:49. > :34:54.steered him in a direction much closer to what we wanted on torture,
:34:55. > :34:58.Nato, sanctions against Putin. It was not subordinate, it was an
:34:59. > :35:02.alliance between two old, serious democracies. She put her stamp on
:35:03. > :35:07.what the relationship should be. Her job is not to be a finger wagging
:35:08. > :35:11.nanny, it is to look after our interests and by implication the
:35:12. > :35:15.wider Western alliance, she has done that to the latter. That is about
:35:16. > :35:23.holding your enemies even closer, she was the first in the queue, the
:35:24. > :35:26.state visit might have been a weapon of diplomacy, she can to ferret, a
:35:27. > :35:30.date has not been put on it. It is not like the Queen has not
:35:31. > :35:35.entertained other controversial figures in the past. Theresa May
:35:36. > :35:39.went over there, it was a bit of a coup being first but I am not sure
:35:40. > :35:44.there was much of the queue with the European leaders. The relationship
:35:45. > :35:47.with Trump will be delicate. He is rather McCue real, not likely to
:35:48. > :35:54.stick to things he says one day and then changes the next. Did you want
:35:55. > :35:58.to criticise openly at the press conference? Before she had even
:35:59. > :36:04.landed in the UK he was taking decisions affecting UK national
:36:05. > :36:08.switch he had to clarify and change. Based in law it seems to be dubious,
:36:09. > :36:12.she did not say anything for too long. Being in the special
:36:13. > :36:15.relationship means being a critical friend, she has shied away from
:36:16. > :36:16.taking the action we would expect a British prime ministers to take.
:36:17. > :36:19.Thank you, Dan Hannan. Now, plans for the first phase
:36:20. > :36:22.of HS2, a new high speed rail line linking London and the north
:36:23. > :36:25.of England, are almost at the point After three years of shuttling
:36:26. > :36:29.between the Lords and the Commons, yesterday the High Speed Rail Bill
:36:30. > :36:37.survived a final It faces its third reading in the
:36:38. > :36:37.Lords today and could receive Royal assent later this month.
:36:38. > :36:40.The bill authorises the construction of the first section of track
:36:41. > :36:42.between London and Birmingham and sets certain precedents for how
:36:43. > :36:48.The first section is due to be completed in 2026.
:36:49. > :36:50.However, building the next section of the line will
:36:51. > :36:58.Critics call it a white elephant, saying the money could be better
:36:59. > :37:00.spent elsewhere and the project is already over-time
:37:01. > :37:03.But the Government maintains the scheme will provide vital
:37:04. > :37:11.capacity on already congested trains.
:37:12. > :37:15.I'm joined now by Antoinette Sandbach,
:37:16. > :37:18.the Conservative MP for Eddisbury - a constituency where part
:37:19. > :37:21.of the new high speed line will be built, and the Labour peer
:37:22. > :37:23.Andrew Adonis, a former Transport Secretary and one
:37:24. > :37:30.He now sits on the board. Welcome to you both. We are in the final phase
:37:31. > :37:35.of three and a half years of pretty painstaking Parliamentary work, the
:37:36. > :37:41.end for this first section of track is in sight, did you expect it to
:37:42. > :37:44.take this long? In terms of massive infrastructure, this is the largest
:37:45. > :37:48.infrastructure project in your, it has not taken that long. It was hard
:37:49. > :37:51.to get planning decisions through in less than three years. Looking at
:37:52. > :37:56.international high-speed rail schemes, only the Chinese have moved
:37:57. > :38:00.faster on a scheme of this scale, which is not necessarily a good
:38:01. > :38:03.president. It has been a very thorough Parliamentary process, all
:38:04. > :38:08.of those affected have put their case to the House of Commons and
:38:09. > :38:11.House of Lords, but it has moved with deliberate speed. If you look
:38:12. > :38:19.at other decisions like Heathrow, which we spent 40 years now, this is
:38:20. > :38:23.just a piece of tarmac, building another runway, high speed to... Not
:38:24. > :38:27.everybody would agree with that analysis. Berigaud high-speed two
:38:28. > :38:31.was 100 miles in the first phase and then another 200... People would say
:38:32. > :38:38.it is a long time for 100 miles of railway which will not be completed
:38:39. > :38:40.until 2026. This covers phase one between London and Birmingham, your
:38:41. > :38:45.constituency will not be affected by phase one but would be by the light
:38:46. > :38:50.extending north of that. What are your objections? They have not
:38:51. > :38:54.learned the lessons from phase one, they are making decisions without
:38:55. > :38:57.looking at the actual ground conditions that apply, and an
:38:58. > :39:03.independent expert report has indicated that there will be
:39:04. > :39:08.additional ?750 million worth of cost just in relation to 22
:39:09. > :39:16.plummeted as of track near my constituency. Because? -- 22
:39:17. > :39:23.kilometres of track. It is in an area at high risk of subs --
:39:24. > :39:28.subsidence. Has this been looked into, that the truck could think
:39:29. > :39:33.about point? I am not an engineer, this is a debate that needs to
:39:34. > :39:43.continue. Even just getting the first phase of HS2 up to Birmingham,
:39:44. > :39:49.it will be more years before it goes further north. It is about early
:39:50. > :39:53.engagement. HS2 were aware of the problems and heard from geologists
:39:54. > :39:57.early on and did not listen. This decision has taken over two years,
:39:58. > :40:01.and for a relatively small amount of money they could have used up to
:40:02. > :40:05.date data to look at subsidence issues, they could have had the
:40:06. > :40:10.information before making a decision. What is the point now,
:40:11. > :40:16.what is your campaign doing now? We are almost at the end of discussion
:40:17. > :40:20.on phase one. My campaign is to say that there is an alternative route
:40:21. > :40:25.Ludger Beerbaum shorter, it could be cheaper and has less construction
:40:26. > :40:28.issues. It is about HS2 listening and learning lessons that they did
:40:29. > :40:33.not learn on phase one which has led to the ballooning cost in this
:40:34. > :40:40.project we have gone from ?30 billion to estimates of over 55, on
:40:41. > :40:45.a conservative estimate, some estimating 82. So are you not
:40:46. > :40:50.listening to concerns? There is engagement on the issues to do with
:40:51. > :40:56.the detailed geological conditions. Would it be worth having a shorter
:40:57. > :41:00.route? The decision to change the route on the eastern lines was
:41:01. > :41:03.partly because it would lead to significant savings, these
:41:04. > :41:06.discussions need to continue. It is three years until beef than
:41:07. > :41:09.decisions are taken on the route north of Birmingham when legislation
:41:10. > :41:14.is produced, these are precisely the issues that need to be gone through.
:41:15. > :41:18.Issues like tenants who are not being compensated, there are real
:41:19. > :41:25.issues in relation to phase one of the route which will affect those on
:41:26. > :41:29.phase two. It is very important that those lessons are learned, that does
:41:30. > :41:36.not seem to be the case, which is white residents' Commissioner has
:41:37. > :41:40.been appointed. -- which is why a residence' commissioner. Residents
:41:41. > :41:46.in my area were not notified of local engagement. That has been
:41:47. > :41:50.rectified but it is a simple error. On geological conditions, my
:41:51. > :41:54.understanding is that HS2 is looking at these and there is time to get
:41:55. > :41:58.this right. It sounds like some concerns have been met and
:41:59. > :42:01.rectified, the Conservative MP Graham Evans in one constituency may
:42:02. > :42:05.bring yours has said it is worrying when a very small group of people
:42:06. > :42:09.from the tiniest sliver of one of the wealthiest areas in the country
:42:10. > :42:14.seek to threaten an infrastructure project which would benefit many in
:42:15. > :42:18.the country, that is your position? This is an independent risk --
:42:19. > :42:22.independent report which says there are geological issues which will
:42:23. > :42:28.affect it. Should you hold the whole project on the basis of that? I
:42:29. > :42:32.suggest that HS2 needs to go back to the original Wright assessment and
:42:33. > :42:37.look back at those original decisions in relation to the cost
:42:38. > :42:41.information that they now have. This is exactly the discussion which
:42:42. > :42:45.should take place at the moment. They have not been taking place.
:42:46. > :42:51.They are and they need to continue. In terms of the robustness, when
:42:52. > :42:56.people say we can't build big infrastructure and it is always
:42:57. > :43:02.mired in controversy and endless planning, the first phase of HS2
:43:03. > :43:06.shows that is not the case. Where there is a resolve to act and it is
:43:07. > :43:12.possible to get cross-party consensus when I launched it in the
:43:13. > :43:19.last Labour Government to the Royal assent, you can move. At what cost.
:43:20. > :43:25.Big adjustments have been made. What is the cost running to? The
:43:26. > :43:30.Institute of Economic Affairs estimate it at over 100 billion, the
:43:31. > :43:39.Department for Transport themselves estimate it at 55 billion. I should
:43:40. > :43:46.say that IEA is not an independent observer. A big issue we need to
:43:47. > :43:51.look at is the Treasury, when these projects come to fruition, puts in a
:43:52. > :43:54.very big buffer for what they call contingency, which pushes up the
:43:55. > :43:58.cost by more than a third from the original costs through to the end
:43:59. > :44:02.costs. My own view is that putting in such big allowances for
:44:03. > :44:10.contingency simply encourages inflation. We should not ignore the
:44:11. > :44:13.fact that the biggest infrastructure project in Europe is on track, about
:44:14. > :44:18.to become more and there will be diggers on the ground next year.
:44:19. > :44:23.You heard it here first, are you a fan? It was a Labour project in the
:44:24. > :44:26.first place, I am very enthusiastic, and it disappoints me that a
:44:27. > :44:31.Conservative peer was trying to stop it added very last hurdle, which is
:44:32. > :44:39.ironic given from what we heard from the Conservative Party. Are
:44:40. > :44:42.different subject. The Parliamentary processes have gone through on the
:44:43. > :44:46.engagement of this bill for three years, it is a huge bill. I
:44:47. > :44:51.understand there are constituency issues, the engagement we have next,
:44:52. > :44:55.that process continues, if we sat back all the time we would never get
:44:56. > :44:58.these things done at all and I pay enormous tribute to Andrew, who from
:44:59. > :45:03.the very beginning has wanted this project and been involved.
:45:04. > :45:09.Antoinette, as the plan stand would you vote against the Government when
:45:10. > :45:14.a bill for phase two comes to Parliament? As they stand, yes. The
:45:15. > :45:17.Public Accounts Committee, the National Audit Office, they have all
:45:18. > :45:21.questioned the delivery of this project, it is marked at Amber to
:45:22. > :45:26.read in terms of its benefit delivery, I don't understand why the
:45:27. > :45:29.Labour Party as an opposition party are not doing much deeper drilling
:45:30. > :45:33.down into the cost overruns that there clearly are and looking at
:45:34. > :45:40.whether or not this can deliver value for money. This is approved by
:45:41. > :45:44.the Conservative Party in opposition Government thank you.
:45:45. > :45:47.As we heard earlier, it's not just Labour
:45:48. > :45:49.and the Liberal Democrats looking to put down amendments
:45:50. > :45:53.With the five days of debate just beginning in the chamber,
:45:54. > :45:55.what about the other parties looking to get involved?
:45:56. > :45:57.And will they stand any more chance of success?
:45:58. > :46:01.We're joined now from Central Lobby by Tasmina Ahmed-Sheikh,
:46:02. > :46:03.the SNP's trade spokesperson in Westminster, and
:46:04. > :46:19.Welcome to both of you. The SNP are putting down 50 amendments to this
:46:20. > :46:24.bill. There are only 50 SNP MPs. Is this a publicity stunt? How many of
:46:25. > :46:33.these amendments have been written? All of these have been written and
:46:34. > :46:40.not as a publicity stunt. The Scottish Parliament are the first to
:46:41. > :46:44.publish a plan for Theresa May. This is a very serious set of
:46:45. > :46:47.circumstances and we are going into this debate with the full name and
:46:48. > :46:51.ambition to get the best deal for Scotland and the whole of the United
:46:52. > :46:55.Kingdom, because it would appear to us and everybody watching, that the
:46:56. > :46:59.Prime Minister wants to escape any opportunity to debate these
:47:00. > :47:03.important issues. Is she running scared in your mind as well, Douglas
:47:04. > :47:10.Carswell, of these amendments which the Tories do not want to discuss?
:47:11. > :47:14.It is 4032 days since I was elected by my constituents on a promise of
:47:15. > :47:20.getting us out of the European Union and that process begins today. I
:47:21. > :47:23.believe we should get on with it. There is plenty of opportunity for
:47:24. > :47:28.us to debate the deal and have a vote on the deal. Today is not for
:47:29. > :47:36.us to frustrate the will of the people. I respect that Tasmina and
:47:37. > :47:39.others are against the verdict of the voters, but really, they should
:47:40. > :47:44.come clean and say that. They should not trying to hide behind
:47:45. > :47:49.parliamentary procedures. Douglas, we are not voting on a deal. We do
:47:50. > :47:53.not have a deal. We are voting on whether to invoke Article 50 in the
:47:54. > :48:02.absence of a deal. Because there is no white paper of course everyone
:48:03. > :48:04.has found reason to table a multitude of and amendments for
:48:05. > :48:08.questions which remain unanswered. Today is not the day for detail
:48:09. > :48:14.about the deal which may or may may not be negotiated. Today is about
:48:15. > :48:18.who we begin the process, do we honour and respect the verdict of
:48:19. > :48:22.the voters? To pretend that somehow there is an opportunity to discuss
:48:23. > :48:25.some of the wider issues, I would personally like to see a liberal
:48:26. > :48:29.Brexit and I have plenty to say on that, but I do think now we need to
:48:30. > :48:36.get on with it and begin that process in triggering Article 50 and
:48:37. > :48:39.making good on the referendum outcome. Let's have a look at one of
:48:40. > :48:44.the amendments with the SNP. One is that if no deal can be reached then
:48:45. > :48:50.the EU should stay -- the UK should stay in the EU on the same terms,
:48:51. > :48:53.that is hardly what was voted on? The Prime Minister said parliament
:48:54. > :48:57.can vote at the end of the process on the final deal. But what if we
:48:58. > :49:01.don't agree the final deal, then what happens? We are still going to
:49:02. > :49:05.have to come out of the EU because the two-year process will be at an
:49:06. > :49:08.end so effectively it is a fate company. What we are saying is we
:49:09. > :49:21.want agreement from the European Union should
:49:22. > :49:25.we not reach an agreement, at the very least we should be able to get
:49:26. > :49:27.back to where we were at the start? Is that realistic that that would
:49:28. > :49:30.happen, Douglas Carswell? It is probably not a great strategy to say
:49:31. > :49:33.if you don't offer us better terms we will take the terms that we have
:49:34. > :49:36.got. The SNP said they would publish its 50 amendments before the bill
:49:37. > :49:39.had been published. I suspect it sounded like a good idea when they
:49:40. > :49:41.decided what to do about this but ultimately, the majority of people,
:49:42. > :49:46.just as the majority of people in Scotland voted to remain, though
:49:47. > :49:52.majority of people in the UK voted to leave the EU and I don't think
:49:53. > :49:54.politicians should frustrate that. Guy Verhofstadt, the chief
:49:55. > :49:59.negotiator on behalf of the European Parliament said he wants the UK to
:50:00. > :50:04.remain in the single market and that is the SNP and liberal policy as
:50:05. > :50:07.well, but if this bill is passed and Theresa May Texas out of the single
:50:08. > :50:16.market, when will your second independence referendum be?
:50:17. > :50:20.Regarding Theresa May's single market statement, it took six months
:50:21. > :50:25.to reach that position so I think is fair to say she was not sure if that
:50:26. > :50:30.was the best position for the whole of the UK. Nicola Sturgeon and the
:50:31. > :50:33.Scottish Government have presented a compromise position, which is the
:50:34. > :50:37.whole of the UK does not remain in the single market, then at the very
:50:38. > :50:41.least Scotland should be able to do so. We wait to hear from Theresa May
:50:42. > :50:44.about whether she is prepared to take that deal to the table and
:50:45. > :50:52.whether she wants to be Prime Minister for the whole of the United
:50:53. > :50:58.Kingdom. But it remains in Nicola Sturgeon's remit to decide whether
:50:59. > :51:02.the next stage is for Scotland have an independence referendum and that
:51:03. > :51:09.has been at the forefront since the day the European Union result was
:51:10. > :51:12.declared. She is the First Minister of Scotland and it is her duty to
:51:13. > :51:18.make sure what the people of Scotland said and make it a reality.
:51:19. > :51:22.Theresa May has been clear that we would come out of the single market.
:51:23. > :51:30.She has said she would listen to the voices of the other devolved
:51:31. > :51:36.parliaments but even after said they would not allow Scotland to remain
:51:37. > :51:43.unless it was an independent country. There are many people who
:51:44. > :51:47.have made comments but negotiations have not begun. I think it is fair
:51:48. > :51:49.to say at the very least the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom
:51:50. > :51:54.should give the Scottish Government and the other devolved parliaments
:51:55. > :52:00.and tell them this is what she is going to do. Douglas Carswell, have
:52:01. > :52:04.you got any amendments you would like to put down? No, I think we
:52:05. > :52:06.should just get on with it. There are lots of things we need to
:52:07. > :52:11.oversee and scrutinised but we can do that when we have more detail.
:52:12. > :52:15.The truth is, we will not see a lot of detail until after the German
:52:16. > :52:22.elections. Then we have a ten month window that we can scrutinise. I
:52:23. > :52:25.want us to have a liberal Brexit and have a good relationship with the
:52:26. > :52:30.EU. I think we can do that and Parliament can scrutinise that.
:52:31. > :52:34.Today is not the data do that. You are hardly holding the government to
:52:35. > :52:41.as Ukip are supposed to be doing, you sound like you are the totally
:52:42. > :52:46.signed up to Theresa May and what she's doing? I think I helped write
:52:47. > :52:49.her script so I will make sure she reads it faithfully and accurately.
:52:50. > :52:54.This is what people voted for. I think I was on your show in the
:52:55. > :52:57.run-up to the referendum and either you or Andrew Neil asked if this
:52:58. > :53:02.meant coming out of the single market and I said it did. Again and
:53:03. > :53:06.again and again we are seeing politicians trying to use procedure
:53:07. > :53:12.to frustrate the will of the people. That has been no consistency over
:53:13. > :53:17.the single market argument at all. We are heading for a hard Brexit.
:53:18. > :53:21.That is not what the whole of the UK voted for. That is a direction that
:53:22. > :53:25.Theresa May will take us fast and furious, and we will make sure we
:53:26. > :53:31.get the best deal for the whole of the UK. Tasmina you are going to
:53:32. > :53:37.stay with us. Douglas Carswell, I am slightly worried that you cannot
:53:38. > :53:44.tell the difference between me and Andrew Neil! Was that Douglas
:53:45. > :53:45.Carswell wanting to join the Conservative Party? We will leave
:53:46. > :53:49.that there. Now, MPs are often accused
:53:50. > :53:51.of being a rowdy lot, with the Speaker urging members
:53:52. > :53:54.to calm themselves so the person But yesterday - in the midst
:53:55. > :53:58.of a heated debate on new US immigration rules -
:53:59. > :54:00.the noises were more bizarre than usual, and a point
:54:01. > :54:02.of order was raised. Let's have a listen
:54:03. > :54:04.to what was said. I find myself in the unfortunate
:54:05. > :54:09.position of having to make this point of order,
:54:10. > :54:12.to which I've given you prior notice and, indeed, I've given the right
:54:13. > :54:14.honourable member from Mid Sussex During my response from the SNP
:54:15. > :54:18.benches to the Foreign Secretary's statement, I understand
:54:19. > :54:20.that the right honourable member from Mid Sussex,
:54:21. > :54:22.who has always afforded me courtesy and respect, was making
:54:23. > :54:24."woof-woof" sounding noises to what I was saying,
:54:25. > :54:26.which I find, of course, This is an opportunity, Mr Speaker,
:54:27. > :54:29.for yourself as chair, if that's not the case,
:54:30. > :54:32.for the right honourable member And if it is, in fact, the case,
:54:33. > :54:36.perhaps for you, Mr Speaker, to rule whether that is,
:54:37. > :54:38.indeed, in order. I thank the honourable lady
:54:39. > :54:41.for her point of order and for giving me the courtesy
:54:42. > :54:44.advance notice of it. The right honourable gentleman
:54:45. > :54:46.is in his place and, of course, I would want to hear
:54:47. > :54:49.from the right honourable gentleman. Mr Speaker, I, like you,
:54:50. > :54:51.thank the honourable lady for her kindness in warning
:54:52. > :54:53.that she was going I thought that in her question
:54:54. > :54:58.to the Foreign Secretary she snapped at him a bit at the end,
:54:59. > :55:01.so I offered her a friendly No offence was intended,
:55:02. > :55:07.and I apologise to the honourable And Tasmina Ahmed-Sheikh
:55:08. > :55:22.is still with us. We asked Nicholas Soames for an
:55:23. > :55:27.interview that he was unavailable. Probably not a surprise. I suppose,
:55:28. > :55:31.Tasmina, in the House as you know, when it does get heated, there is a
:55:32. > :55:36.lot of noise and sometimes abusive comments and rude remarks were
:55:37. > :55:40.thrown around. Was this worse than you had experienced before? This is
:55:41. > :55:44.our place of work. I am a woman MP and it is not acceptable but abusive
:55:45. > :55:47.remarks are thrown around the chamber. We should be able to
:55:48. > :55:52.represent our constituents without having to face this. This has been
:55:53. > :56:01.going on for too long and last night was the last straw. It is disgusting
:56:02. > :56:06.for someone to make woof-woof noises and quite frankly I have had enough
:56:07. > :56:14.of it. Were you pleased that the speaker took it up and it was
:56:15. > :56:18.discussed in the House. First of all Nicholas Soames said if I was
:56:19. > :56:22.offended, of course I was offended! I wish the speaker had gone further
:56:23. > :56:26.and reminded the House and that how people are expected to behave and we
:56:27. > :56:29.should afford courtesy. We have many young people who come and visit the
:56:30. > :56:34.house of parliament. What on earth must they think about the kind of
:56:35. > :56:37.place this is if they think it is possible and people can conduct
:56:38. > :56:40.themselves in such a way? Women always find themselves at the
:56:41. > :56:44.receiving end of increased noise when they are speaking. It is about
:56:45. > :56:49.time people have listened to what we have to say and give us the respect
:56:50. > :56:52.we give others. That has been a lot of criticism about the unruly
:56:53. > :56:57.behaviour and the rudeness and particularly some of the remarks
:56:58. > :57:01.that are directed at women MPs. There was one such remark from Alex
:57:02. > :57:07.Salmond, your close colleague. He is obviously the former leader of the
:57:08. > :57:12.SNP who told Anna Soubry, a Tory MP to behave, woman, when she was in a
:57:13. > :57:16.debate. Is that also acceptable? It is fair to say in that respect that
:57:17. > :57:23.was a friendly exchange. Alex Salmond is 100% feminist. But is it
:57:24. > :57:28.right to talk in what could be seen as a condescending way. He said it
:57:29. > :57:34.couple of times, behave woman, and she took offence at the time. In
:57:35. > :57:38.general terms we should all conduct ourselves properly in the chamber
:57:39. > :57:41.and there is no cause for remarks which make that work place an
:57:42. > :57:45.uncomfortable place to be. We are talking specifically about an issue
:57:46. > :57:48.yesterday which is really the icing on the cake of so many things that
:57:49. > :57:55.women MPs have to face and quite frankly, it has to come to an end.
:57:56. > :57:58.Tasmina, thank you for joining us today.
:57:59. > :58:01.There's just time before we go to find out the answer to our quiz.
:58:02. > :58:04.The question was what did a member of the Treasury's wellbeing work
:58:05. > :58:07.stream think could be a hazard to their colleagues health?
:58:08. > :58:08.Was it the Chancellor's fiscal statements?
:58:09. > :58:20.I personally think the first one is the most dangerous one, the
:58:21. > :58:27.Chancellor's Autumn Statement, but I think it is cake. It is! We have
:58:28. > :58:32.decided to break with any edict to ban cake and have our own well-being
:58:33. > :58:36.work stream for the Daily Politics. I will offer you a piece in a
:58:37. > :58:43.moment. I am not even trusted with a proper knife! I only have this
:58:44. > :58:47.problem on. I am very partial to cake. We make them in our office and
:58:48. > :58:53.share them around. Thank you for being the guest of the day. I will
:58:54. > :58:56.be back tomorrow at 11:30am with Andrew when there will be no cake
:58:57. > :59:02.left but we will cover prime ministers questions. Bye-bye.
:59:03. > :59:05.To be in the Lords, you have to be punctual...
:59:06. > :59:09.Sometimes you really do literally have to slam the door