:00:01. > :00:11.has said it will lock out its employees until they agreed to a
:00:11. > :00:29.
:00:29. > :00:39.deal. Welcome to date line -- Dateline
:00:39. > :00:41.
:00:41. > :00:51.London. Kings and queens - women's rights in the British royal
:00:51. > :00:52.
:00:52. > :00:57.family.... Good to see you all. One trillion euro, plans for closer
:00:57. > :01:02.eurozone unions, has this summit in Brussels saved the eurozone? Is the
:01:02. > :01:10.worst over? Where does this leave Britain? Has encouraged the
:01:10. > :01:13.markets? Briefly. It hasn't resolve the central contradiction which is
:01:13. > :01:17.that it is perfectly appropriate for a democratically elected
:01:17. > :01:20.governments to put their own electorates first. The political
:01:20. > :01:25.imperatives for Germany, Greece and all the other countries that are in
:01:25. > :01:29.trouble in the European Union is to put the political considerations,
:01:29. > :01:33.being loyal to their own constituents' interests first. That
:01:33. > :01:37.is not consistent with the kind of coercion and the policing of
:01:37. > :01:41.budgets. We have lost the basic democratic principle here, which a
:01:41. > :01:45.lot of people seem not to have noticed. A budget of individual
:01:45. > :01:48.European countries will have to be submissive to the European Union
:01:48. > :01:52.before they are submitted to parliament for policing and
:01:52. > :01:57.inspection. That means that, as a voter, you do not have direct
:01:57. > :02:00.control over your Parliament's budget. You could also say that it
:02:00. > :02:10.exposes all of the philosophical divides between the French and the
:02:10. > :02:17.
:02:17. > :02:23.Germans.... Germany has a very strong historical prohibition on
:02:23. > :02:26.printing money. They have memories of the Weimar Republic. Quantative
:02:26. > :02:34.easing from Germany would be a temporary solution to the bail-out
:02:34. > :02:37.problem. Instead, we are going to the Chinese. A totalitarian country
:02:37. > :02:42.will be funding the democracies of Europe, which have sold out on
:02:42. > :02:47.their basic principles. If you are not voting on fiscal policy in your
:02:47. > :02:51.own government, what are you voting for? You could also say that the
:02:51. > :02:53.Chinese are backing an American democracy in a different way.
:02:53. > :02:57.Before we get into the philosophical connotations of what
:02:57. > :03:07.is going on, I think, fundamentally, the markets did not rally for that
:03:07. > :03:18.
:03:18. > :03:22.long. It was very short-term. The Italian debt bonds... As somebody
:03:22. > :03:26.who works in financial markets, it was incredible to see how short
:03:26. > :03:35.lived the euphoria was. There tends to be some momentum with good
:03:35. > :03:45.feeling and confidence in the market. I suppose there was some
:03:45. > :03:47.
:03:47. > :03:51.some immediate relief. The moment the cold light of day struck...
:03:51. > :03:54.Berlusconi is still the leader of Italy. Yes.
:03:54. > :04:00.(LAUGHTER). It hasn't filled people with
:04:00. > :04:07.confidence. Greece has defaulted on half of its debt. The markets took
:04:07. > :04:15.a good look at that and thought - now, wait a minute. There is a
:04:15. > :04:20.degree of economic reality. There is a degree of economic reality.
:04:20. > :04:28.Part of that economic reality is that the other formative experience
:04:28. > :04:33.of Germany. What happens if there is no union? This is what
:04:33. > :04:39.Chancellor Angela Merkel was alluding to. I'm sure it reads more
:04:39. > :04:44.forceful than she is capable of delivering. She said - do not
:04:44. > :04:48.presume to think they will be another 50 years of peace in Europe
:04:48. > :04:56.at this whole thing falls apart. That is something that they worry
:04:56. > :04:59.about. And they are right. There are two things about the whole
:04:59. > :05:05.situation. There is a Government's problem in Italy, which is one of
:05:05. > :05:15.the reasons that I know the market rally was short lived. --
:05:15. > :05:18.
:05:18. > :05:22.governance. This is the way the EU works. There is a real crisis of
:05:22. > :05:32.government in the country that is poised to bring the whole thing
:05:32. > :05:37.down - that is Italy. Silvio Berlusconi is reported as saying he
:05:37. > :05:47.will resign in January. Who will replace him? This is a frying-pan
:05:47. > :05:51.and fire dilemma. I rely very heavily on reporting over the last
:05:51. > :05:55.month - a report that came out over the summer, what with the cost of
:05:55. > :06:01.dismantling the Euro be? It is even more dangerous to contemplate
:06:01. > :06:09.blowing the thing apart than it is... It has to be a managed
:06:09. > :06:18.disassembly. Not blowing it apart. Would you volunteer to be on the
:06:18. > :06:27.disassembly committee? There is no good news. We have bought six
:06:27. > :06:35.months at best. The whole deal is dependent on a lot of conditions
:06:35. > :06:43.that need to be met. The bail-out fund - there is no money there yet.
:06:43. > :06:49.Going to China and India... What will be the consequences? Then
:06:49. > :06:56.there is the economic policy - will austerity deliver economic growth
:06:56. > :07:00.on which the success of the euro depends? The opposite is true.
:07:00. > :07:06.Austerity is leading to recession. The budget deficits are getting
:07:06. > :07:15.bigger. That is the situation in Greece and the United Kingdom.
:07:15. > :07:25.There is no growth pushing the eurozone... Let me find one or two
:07:25. > :07:32.
:07:32. > :07:40.and -- one or two bits of good news. Why should the Spanish and the
:07:40. > :07:46.Portuguese be entitled to have their debt written off? Angela
:07:46. > :07:55.Merkel's warning - there is just as much danger of creating
:07:55. > :07:59.international hostility in Europe by closing people into closer and
:07:59. > :08:04.closer will fiscal union - I have never heard more anti-German
:08:04. > :08:07.feeling, even among moderate Greek politicians. The hostility that is
:08:07. > :08:10.developing. When people discover that their own democratic
:08:10. > :08:14.institutions have been rendered irrelevant, they take to the
:08:14. > :08:18.streets. You saw in the modern state of Yugoslavia when you come
:08:18. > :08:23.worse individual nations into a federation they are not comfortable
:08:23. > :08:32.with. It can end in wa end in waif there is protection and every
:08:32. > :08:37.nation can protect itself... That is not the only alternative. I am
:08:37. > :08:41.not saying it is. There is potential for even more conflict if
:08:41. > :08:44.the European Union is dismantled. There is always potential for
:08:44. > :08:47.conflict, but there is no reason why they couldn't be a free trade
:08:47. > :08:52.area without fiscal and political unions, which is what a lot of us
:08:52. > :08:57.wanted in the first place. That brings us back onto where Britain
:08:57. > :09:03.stands on this, if Britain stands anywhere. We are all affected by it.
:09:03. > :09:11.There is also the debate within the Conservative Party as to whether
:09:11. > :09:21.they should be a referendum. would have thought, tactically,
:09:21. > :09:23.
:09:23. > :09:33.that they might have waited and enjoyed the sensation of sour
:09:33. > :09:36.
:09:36. > :09:42.grapes - it is a very logical position... The first time you hit
:09:42. > :09:51.a trough, there will be problems. That is what has happened. I think
:09:51. > :10:01.this is so localised within the Conservative Party. I barely
:10:01. > :10:08.
:10:08. > :10:15.reported on it because it didn't seem to... 70% of people say they
:10:15. > :10:24.want a referendum! And 90% of people want to bring back hanging.
:10:24. > :10:27.(LAUGHTER). It is mainstream. You work in the
:10:27. > :10:31.media and you know that if it was for real, if there was a real
:10:31. > :10:37.referendum being held and a real question that had been properly put
:10:37. > :10:41.together, put to the people, it would not quite be the same numbers.
:10:41. > :10:47.There were three options - one of them was renegotiating our position.
:10:47. > :10:57.That is what most people would vote for. This is the reality, you are
:10:57. > :10:57.
:10:57. > :11:01.either in or out. Britain will be losing out. This is what every
:11:01. > :11:07.Euro-sceptic and MP and politician knows. This is what David Cameron
:11:07. > :11:17.knows. The British economy will suffer, Britain will suffer. This
:11:17. > :11:19.
:11:19. > :11:29.is what they all know. They know that Britain can't move away.
:11:29. > :11:33.
:11:33. > :11:37.not sure how much of a voting issue this is. I think the timing was off
:11:37. > :11:41.and I thought David Cameron looked pa pa be honest, and a bit
:11:41. > :11:51.hoisted by his own petard, because he has been cosying up to the Euro-
:11:51. > :11:55.
:11:55. > :12:05.sceptics. Now it has all come back home to roost. He has got the Lib
:12:05. > :12:05.
:12:05. > :12:11.Dems, the most pro-euro party in the UK, then he has Nick Clegg who
:12:11. > :12:21.referred to them as a group of NT's the mites, nutters, climate change
:12:21. > :12:32.
:12:32. > :12:35.semi its and home of are. I don't think this will filter down.
:12:35. > :12:41.think the fact that it will not filter down to the voting public is
:12:41. > :12:45.the essence of the problem. There this relentless progression towards
:12:46. > :12:50.ever-closer union. That is what people are so angry about. I am
:12:50. > :12:55.so som the odd one out here, but the Euro-sceptics have won back
:12:55. > :13:05.his argument. Every prediction they have made abve made ab 10 ability
:13:05. > :13:10.
:13:10. > :13:14.of this position have come true. -- instability of this position. The
:13:14. > :13:19.mechanics of parliamentary life - it is not always possible to time
:13:19. > :13:26.your intervention to win it would be optimal. The point is that they
:13:26. > :13:30.knew it was a purely rhetorical registering of their argument. My
:13:30. > :13:33.goodness, it had resonance with the public. It got enormous amounts of
:13:33. > :13:43.public attention and forced to this debate about Britain's role in
:13:43. > :13:49.
:13:49. > :13:53.Europe. -- forced this. David Cameron looks undermined. Britain
:13:53. > :14:01.does not want to fully participate in the European project, but it
:14:01. > :14:09.also wants to lead. Well, you can't have your cake and eat it.
:14:09. > :14:13.Newspapers are full of articles - David Cameron was having dinner
:14:13. > :14:16.with the Polish, the Swedish, Danish, while the Italians, the
:14:16. > :14:26.German and the French were somewhere else. The big guys were
:14:26. > :14:27.
:14:27. > :14:37.in another room and David Cameron was with the little ones. Why would
:14:37. > :14:46.
:14:46. > :14:55.They met at 4pm, at 4:30pm the meeting started. It was quite
:14:55. > :15:01.prompt by EU standards. The real deals were made among the 17. Fate
:15:01. > :15:07.might have an impact on David Cameron's political position. -- it
:15:07. > :15:13.might. What I'm talking about, being in the room when the real
:15:13. > :15:22.decisions were made. It is entirely possible that one year from now,
:15:22. > :15:26.two years from now, there will be a two track Europe. That is possible.
:15:26. > :15:33.Being in the room is the last place you want to be in, especially that
:15:33. > :15:38.room. Tunisia, the Arab Spring began, this week they went to the
:15:38. > :15:44.polls to vote for a new government. Are there lessons for other Arab
:15:44. > :15:50.countries? Absolutely. It has been incredibly inspiring to watch
:15:50. > :15:58.Tunisia over the past 12 months. Over the past two weeks it has been
:15:58. > :16:03.really moving for Arabs to watch. 90% turnout of registered voters.
:16:03. > :16:08.The second thing is, the number of women on the ballot box. Women
:16:08. > :16:13.voting and women up for re-election. Remarkably, even though this has
:16:13. > :16:23.been a police state for the better part of three decades, very little
:16:23. > :16:25.
:16:25. > :16:35.disturbance. There was the Sevens in one town. -- disturbance. Yes,
:16:35. > :16:53.
:16:53. > :17:02.in one town where Mahmood -- Mohamed Bouazizi. The martyr of
:17:02. > :17:12.that town. We have an Islamic party in charge of the state. They have
:17:12. > :17:17.
:17:17. > :17:25.managed to negotiate and keep secular laws that were negotiated
:17:25. > :17:31.before the election. Fingers crossed? Absolutely. This is a
:17:31. > :17:36.perfect demonstration of why it was necessary for Western countries to
:17:36. > :17:40.be on the right side of history. The countries entering the modern
:17:40. > :17:50.world. It would have been outrageous for Western countries to
:17:50. > :17:54.appeared ambivalent about these revolutions. It is understandable
:17:54. > :18:04.why they -- there should be fears about security of Israel and
:18:04. > :18:04.
:18:04. > :18:11.Western interests. But democracy has to be the answer to that.
:18:11. > :18:14.Democratic freedoms have to be the answers to those problems. It has
:18:15. > :18:20.been a good week for the Arab world, therefore it has been a good week
:18:20. > :18:28.for the rest of the world. Absolutely. Very inspiring. Not
:18:28. > :18:32.only did the elections go very well, they had an election on the
:18:32. > :18:41.constitution, there will be new elections. Everything is going in a
:18:41. > :18:51.very thoughtful way. If we can extrapolate from the situation in
:18:51. > :18:56.Tunisia to Libya, or Syria. I think it is asking a bit too much. We are
:18:56. > :19:04.talking about very different countries. Libya will might have to
:19:04. > :19:10.renegotiate with the old guard. We hear very worrying noises in Libya
:19:10. > :19:14.that the leader of the transitional council would like to re-establish
:19:14. > :19:21.Sharia law and polygamy. These are very worrying signs coming from
:19:21. > :19:30.Libya. In Egypt there are going to be elections later in November. In
:19:30. > :19:33.the past months the news has been very dire. The military is
:19:33. > :19:40.controlling all of the opposition parties. There is no guarantee it
:19:40. > :19:47.is going to be a real democracy. The nature of this whole year has
:19:47. > :19:57.been to show that the theory of an Arabist and has been a bit of a
:19:57. > :20:01.
:20:01. > :20:08.sham. -- Pan-Arabism. We have to be a little worried about each
:20:08. > :20:16.individual country as they progress. What I was thinking about, I
:20:16. > :20:22.thought we were going to talk about, what I hope for the West, the
:20:22. > :20:31.election of an Islamist government in Tunisia opens up a sense of
:20:31. > :20:36.dialogue of what we mean by... It gets thrown around a lot.
:20:36. > :20:41.Particularly among policy makers on the right in Washington. You have
:20:41. > :20:51.an Islamist government here, this is something we have to be careful.
:20:51. > :20:52.
:20:52. > :21:02.There I Islamists and there are Islamist. None is almost means
:21:02. > :21:07.
:21:07. > :21:17.Western friendly. -- non-Islamist. There is a lot of hypocrisy in the
:21:17. > :21:19.
:21:19. > :21:28.West. There is good Islamist and bad Islamist. That is not how I
:21:28. > :21:35.would describe Recep Tayyip Erdogan. A future monarch cannot marry
:21:35. > :21:42.Catholics and there will be equal rights for women in the monarchy. -
:21:42. > :21:47.- can marry. I think the idea that David Cameron is trying to appeal
:21:47. > :21:52.to the women vote, not many women are going to be terribly excited
:21:52. > :21:56.about this. They would prefer to see a reduction in the electricity
:21:56. > :22:05.bill. I cannot believe that in this day and age we are having this
:22:05. > :22:11.conversation. It is not a good look. This is not a good look for the
:22:11. > :22:21.British Government. This is an important issue for ordinary people
:22:21. > :22:27.in the 17th century. I agree. What is interesting about this, finally
:22:27. > :22:37.this prescription on a Catholic taking the throne, it is consigned
:22:37. > :22:38.
:22:38. > :22:48.to the dustbin of history. You can marry a Catholic... It does not
:22:48. > :22:58.quite say, as far as I am concerned, because they at the head of the
:22:58. > :23:00.
:23:00. > :23:06.Church of England... This is a barbaric tradition. We see this
:23:06. > :23:16.next week with a guy Fawkes night. I am not a Catholic, I am a non-
:23:16. > :23:26.believer. I find it strange that a country like Britain will burn
:23:26. > :23:30.
:23:30. > :23:40.effigies of the Pope. I am not sure. There is certainly a connection.
:23:40. > :23:43.
:23:43. > :23:50.goes back to the terror... So many centuries. The fact that anyone is
:23:50. > :23:55.getting exciting -- a Saturday about this is really pathetic. --
:23:55. > :24:03.excited about this. Kate Middleton's daughter is going to be
:24:03. > :24:13.Queen, this is a little bit worrying. What about establishing a
:24:13. > :24:14.
:24:15. > :24:23.republic in Britain? The idea that the monarchy is modernising itself.
:24:23. > :24:33.What is the point? It is an ancient tradition. It is a bit strange.
:24:33. > :24:36.
:24:36. > :24:44.the end of this century... They change in a traditional way. That