:00:00. > :00:00.treading the boards again. Her life, however, has been touched by scandal
:00:00. > :00:00.and Hollywood has changed dramatically in the youth she has
:00:07. > :00:21.been involved. Guest today is Debbie Reynolds.
:00:22. > :00:30.Debbie Reynolds, welcome to HARDtalk. What are you still so
:00:31. > :00:34.driven to carry on? If I was and, if I was not having a wonderful time I
:00:35. > :00:39.would be bored to than sitting at home and I would not know what to do
:00:40. > :00:44.it myself. I have always been busy and active and home in the States I
:00:45. > :00:48.travel 42 weeks a year and that is just constant. I never stopped
:00:49. > :00:56.working since I was 16. I am used to it. I get quite nervous if, let's
:00:57. > :01:00.say I had a two week vacation then I am nervous. I must keep busy. When
:01:01. > :01:04.you started at 16 years old, and could you have imagined you would
:01:05. > :01:10.still be doing it at 78 question now, I thought I would of been dead.
:01:11. > :01:14.Is why I named the tour alive. When they called me they said, Debbie,
:01:15. > :01:18.what should be named tour? I told I did not really know some people say
:01:19. > :01:22.Debbie Reynolds, is she still alive? They went with that. OK, we will
:01:23. > :01:29.call the tour alive and they added fabulous. And when people see me
:01:30. > :01:33.they will see I am. You say you are driven but it is more than that,
:01:34. > :01:37.isn't it? You have to do this financially. It has not been an easy
:01:38. > :01:43.life for you financially. When I so driven, it is what you want to do.
:01:44. > :01:47.Do I have to work, or as force that everybody needs to work. I raised
:01:48. > :01:53.five children. They all went to university and they all always had a
:01:54. > :01:56.mother who work. They had the cars, colleges, you know. I think all
:01:57. > :02:04.parents work. Don't they? Especially as they have a divorce. That is the
:02:05. > :02:07.thing. Your third husband left you bankrupt, didn't he? The second one
:02:08. > :02:12.with the bankrupt first stop and the third husband, he just left with all
:02:13. > :02:16.the money. That must be very difficult because as a Hollywood
:02:17. > :02:20.star you had amassed a huge amount of money until your second and third
:02:21. > :02:26.marriages. I know, but husband spent a lot of money. I called shop all
:02:27. > :02:30.day on what they spend. Do you regret that you trusted your husband
:02:31. > :02:34.is so much financially and in the end it just didn't work out that for
:02:35. > :02:38.one reason or another in the case your second husband he gambled a
:02:39. > :02:43.lot, didn't he? In the second husband, the hotel complex it didn't
:02:44. > :02:47.work out? As a woman, I must answer you honestly. When you fall in love
:02:48. > :02:53.you do not really ask the man in love with me? You think that he is.
:02:54. > :03:01.Otherwise you would not get married. You just really do believe. I am
:03:02. > :03:06.rather Victorian and I think of a man says he loves me and he wants to
:03:07. > :03:09.marry me and be with me for the rest of alive, you must believe him walk
:03:10. > :03:13.you wouldn't marry him. I'm not a complete fool until after the fact.
:03:14. > :03:20.Then I was. Yes, I have been married three times. Twice, to settle and
:03:21. > :03:22.went bankrupt and the third one went bankrupt but he didn't get
:03:23. > :03:28.everything. He took all the money and ran but he did not get anything.
:03:29. > :03:33.In a great resilience, you know? They do not tackle me on the way out
:03:34. > :03:38.they just leave me fall in like a good punch. Back in 1988 it look
:03:39. > :03:42.different. You were quoted as saying two more years than you would have
:03:43. > :03:46.enough money to retire. That was prior to the marriage crumbling and
:03:47. > :03:52.leaving you penniless again. I always say you can make it back. I
:03:53. > :03:57.give myself not really a two-year period, a five-year plan. I always
:03:58. > :04:01.say there is a light at end of the tunnel so I can get through because
:04:02. > :04:05.if there is a tunnel there is a light. I can make it. I never give
:04:06. > :04:10.up. What the bankruptcy mean? How did it affect you? The government
:04:11. > :04:16.gets all the money. That is what bankruptcy means to me. It is a big
:04:17. > :04:19.setback but you didn't do it, your husband does it. And in California,
:04:20. > :04:24.California taxes community property so the government steps in and you
:04:25. > :04:29.have to pay it back what your husband I was. Some people wonder
:04:30. > :04:32.how this could happen. We always hear the stories about Hollywood
:04:33. > :04:35.stars with people to protect their business interests. Someone doing
:04:36. > :04:43.everything for them. But clearly there is not? No, there is often
:04:44. > :04:48.someone stupid like me. Did you not get advice? I had great lawyers.
:04:49. > :04:53.That is holed up in bankruptcy court. Somehow there is a different
:04:54. > :05:02.thing with community property. So they win. And you are still working
:05:03. > :05:07.as a result. The good fortune I have was to be in show business. In show
:05:08. > :05:12.business if people care about you and if you have a good show and you
:05:13. > :05:16.work hard your entire life and you have learnt to sing and dance and do
:05:17. > :05:21.mimicry and just be good at your craft, people want to come and see
:05:22. > :05:25.you. Cast your mind back to early days when you were first discovered
:05:26. > :05:30.at the age of 16. What did it feel like to be on the verge of a
:05:31. > :05:39.Hollywood career? Who knew? I was 16 and in school. Aged local beauty
:05:40. > :05:45.contests for fun. This way he did it? Win a free scarf? A silk scarf.
:05:46. > :05:54.I never had a silk scarf. Or a beautiful blouse. Did you want to be
:05:55. > :05:58.an actress? No-one in my family was in acting and I wanted to be a gym
:05:59. > :06:03.teacher. I wanted to go to college and I could go as I went to a
:06:04. > :06:08.scholarship. So I kept my grades up and that is what I wanted to do what
:06:09. > :06:11.I hope to be. But a harbour have a local contest in Burbank and I won
:06:12. > :06:15.the contest. There was a talent scout there and they took me to
:06:16. > :06:19.Warner Brothers and they did a screen test and they asked me why I
:06:20. > :06:24.wanted to be in the movies and I said I don't. That must have shocked
:06:25. > :06:28.them because every young girl in those days wanted to be an actress.
:06:29. > :06:33.Especially in California. I truly had no thought about it. I liked to
:06:34. > :06:38.go to the movies but why would you think you would be in the movies? It
:06:39. > :06:42.is one thing to go and to see movie stars but why would you think you
:06:43. > :06:47.were ever going to be there? If no-one in your family was, if you
:06:48. > :06:53.were not exposed to it, I no dream of that. All of a sudden, I guess,
:06:54. > :06:57.it was crazy but I fit into show business. You have to be able crazy
:06:58. > :07:03.to be in show business. I have decided that. You came from a poor
:07:04. > :07:08.background. My family were poor. We have enough food on the table but my
:07:09. > :07:13.father did not make enough money. He worked for the railroad and there
:07:14. > :07:17.was very little to go around. We didn't have furniture. We have a
:07:18. > :07:21.little home my father built and I can't say that we knew we were poor
:07:22. > :07:27.because everybody else was poor. So there was no-one to guide you to
:07:28. > :07:31.say, do you feel terrible? We did not feel that we were different to
:07:32. > :07:37.anybody else because everybody was poor. You have made some fantastic
:07:38. > :07:41.films including the one that sticks in everybody's mind, Singin' In The
:07:42. > :07:45.Rain with Gene Kelly. A wonderful musical. When you are making it at
:07:46. > :07:49.the time did you think was going to be a great film that people would
:07:50. > :07:53.remember the decades afterwards? I didn't know that because I was only
:07:54. > :07:58.17 and will goal. They put me in the picture and I had never danced and
:07:59. > :08:02.then the head of the studio said Gene Kelly, this is Debbie Reynolds.
:08:03. > :08:07.Mary Francis was my real name. That said this is Debbie. They changed to
:08:08. > :08:13.Debbie. They said she will be your new leading lady. Gene Kelly said it
:08:14. > :08:22.really? Do you dance? I said, well, no. And I'm sure he was aghast. And
:08:23. > :08:25.there are complicated dance scenes, aren't there? Absolutely. As
:08:26. > :08:36.difficult as you could get. How did you tackle it? I could do the basic
:08:37. > :08:44.steps. And then... A maxi forward is a dance step. So then Jean knew that
:08:45. > :08:49.he had to teach me how to dance. So I did and I worked like a dog. I had
:08:50. > :08:53.five different teachers and in six months they prepared me to work and
:08:54. > :08:57.I worked really hard because if the taskmaster and a great dancer and
:08:58. > :09:00.this was his idea. And then Gene Kelly and Fred Astaire and Stanley
:09:01. > :09:05.Donnan, they were the creators. Henri LeConte could dance to drop
:09:06. > :09:09.dead. His family were orphaned soakers. It was great. He could run
:09:10. > :09:13.up the wall around backwards. They say all the taskmaster and some were
:09:14. > :09:18.saying he was tough on you. Not always very nice. Now, he was tough.
:09:19. > :09:26.You have the right idea. Did he shout at you? He had a microphone
:09:27. > :09:31.and he used to yell at you. Gene Kelly? He would tell me smile, the
:09:32. > :09:37.bigger, be louder. He was always coaching. You were his love interest
:09:38. > :09:40.in the movie and you fought off quite another actresses who are in
:09:41. > :09:44.the friend to get the role originally. People like Leslie Caron
:09:45. > :09:49.and Judy Garland and in the end it was the unknown, Debbie Reynolds. It
:09:50. > :09:53.was supposed to be an innocent virginal will goal and I was fat and
:09:54. > :09:57.I think it was a tough deal for porting to be stuck with me who had
:09:58. > :10:01.never danced. It would have been far better for him to have a great
:10:02. > :10:05.dancer and I worked so hard that I think in the end when a look at the
:10:06. > :10:09.performance of our little girl I think I did a good job. It must have
:10:10. > :10:14.been a fantastic time in many ways in the 1950s. You also hanging out
:10:15. > :10:17.with Frank and the rat Pack a great mob and there were you with your
:10:18. > :10:22.innocent will girl image. How did you fit in with the rat Pack was to
:10:23. > :10:27.mark I was not having a wild time when I started. I was just a
:10:28. > :10:32.teenager. But then I did my first nightclub act and I did a movie with
:10:33. > :10:37.ring Sinatra called a tender trap. He adopted me like a little sister
:10:38. > :10:41.and he is the one who advised me to never marry a singer. And you did in
:10:42. > :10:44.the end. Your first husband was Eddie Fisher, one of the best-known
:10:45. > :10:51.singers of that time. A massive star. 20 gold records. Why should I
:10:52. > :10:54.start off right? Why didn't you listen to Frank Sinatra? That
:10:55. > :10:59.marriage ended in disaster after Eddie Fisher and run-off with
:11:00. > :11:02.Elizabeth Taylor. I had to make these mistakes. I did wrong the
:11:03. > :11:09.first time, I did wrong the second time and then the third time. I
:11:10. > :11:12.called myself out. Your daughter said that she thought the courtship
:11:13. > :11:16.between you and Eddie Fisher was a press release. They were riding the
:11:17. > :11:19.wave of being a media couple more than having any real compatibility.
:11:20. > :11:23.She said she probably didn't have much in common with Eddie Fisher.
:11:24. > :11:27.Probably but I did not know that. I was in love, young love. What did I
:11:28. > :11:33.go? I really didn't know anything. I thought it was terrific. He was
:11:34. > :11:39.dialling, he was handsome he was a wonderful looking fellow at the
:11:40. > :11:43.start and here I was a young star and... Quite a scandal when he ran
:11:44. > :11:47.off with one of the world 's best-known actresses, Elizabeth
:11:48. > :11:50.Taylor. We went to school together at the MGM lot. We were good
:11:51. > :11:57.friends. She is the most beautiful woman in the world. I certainly was
:11:58. > :12:01.not. And woman. I certainly was not. You could say we Eddie Fisher wanted
:12:02. > :12:06.her but why would Elizabeth Taylor what Eddie Fisher? What did you mean
:12:07. > :12:12.by that? She wonders to as well. Of course she found that out right
:12:13. > :12:16.afterwards. I told Eddie, I told him that what would happen was that in
:12:17. > :12:19.1.5 years he would realise that she was really nothing and she will
:12:20. > :12:25.throw you out. That's what happened. She met Richard Burton and he was
:12:26. > :12:29.our stop a lot of scrutiny when that story broke. It must have been
:12:30. > :12:34.unbearable. At one stage it said it was an bearable when a man walk out
:12:35. > :12:38.but the fact that the public took it as an affront of was watching, that
:12:39. > :12:42.was unbelievable. It was played out in the public gaze, wasn't it? Isn't
:12:43. > :12:47.everything in pub show business question mark everything in the
:12:48. > :12:50.public. Terry said that mother is like Ratten Angelina and Jennifer
:12:51. > :12:55.Aniston today. You and Eddie and Elisabeth. It was a similar story. I
:12:56. > :13:00.always make a joke of it. I said that Elisabeth went down the Nile.
:13:01. > :13:06.Eddie Fisher has always challenged your version. She knows I didn't
:13:07. > :13:13.leave her for Elisabeth, we were apart long for that. Poor boy. I
:13:14. > :13:20.feel so sorry for him he has to make up some story. He was even less
:13:21. > :13:28.generous about you. He said that you were the next door but only if you
:13:29. > :13:35.lived next door to a self is driven insecure woman. It was good that he
:13:36. > :13:40.could read. Have you forgiven? I cared about but yes I have four
:13:41. > :13:45.given Eddie I have never really understood a man leaving his
:13:46. > :13:50.children. I can understand leaving the woman but he never really came
:13:51. > :13:53.back around to be a very good father. So I don't particularly
:13:54. > :14:00.admire that. I have wonderful children and I am their parents. So
:14:01. > :14:08.if you ask if I have four given him, I say that with a bit of anger
:14:09. > :14:11.because I have a son, his only son and he misses having a good father.
:14:12. > :14:22.So when Eddie left he really left. Keating Collie would has changed a
:14:23. > :14:31.lot? These days, is probably more frenetic. -- do you think Hollywood
:14:32. > :14:39.has changed. The world has changed. When I came into films, the studios
:14:40. > :14:42.owned the films and Congress took it over and they could no longer
:14:43. > :14:49.release the film is so than television entered the scene so that
:14:50. > :14:54.the film industry was cut in half, their power. Television took over
:14:55. > :15:02.and then movies, the Golden era ended, nobody was under contract,
:15:03. > :15:08.they dropped Greta Garbo, all the stars were let go, I was really the
:15:09. > :15:12.only one left under contract was up you spent 17 years under contract.
:15:13. > :15:16.In those days, they told you write, this week you will be in this film,
:15:17. > :15:22.next week that film, it was a controlled life for an actress and
:15:23. > :15:25.it's not the way these days. Now it's much harder. You have to raise
:15:26. > :15:31.the money, buy the book, it's much harder. Were produced. They were
:15:32. > :15:37.finding the movies for you. We were owned, we were under contract. It
:15:38. > :15:41.was a wonderful life, though. We went paid very well, though. Today
:15:42. > :15:46.they get $20 million per picture. What you think about that? I think
:15:47. > :15:56.they should save their money. Some people say that they produced bad
:15:57. > :16:00.movies big so they found bad movies. They are not all good today but I
:16:01. > :16:03.think they made some very good pictures and some good ones today. I
:16:04. > :16:08.think they are very fortunate in the salaries that they make. I wish to
:16:09. > :16:12.all of the stars great success and I hope that they give a lot of their
:16:13. > :16:16.money to charity because they have a great opportunity to help people
:16:17. > :16:21.will stop most of them are doing that. I admire that very much. We
:16:22. > :16:26.made $700 a week in the beginning I made 65 dollars a week or stop them
:16:27. > :16:30.a $20 million. There is a great deal of difference. Other differences,
:16:31. > :16:34.they talk about the Golden age of Hollywood that it was an innocent
:16:35. > :16:37.time in some ways. I think that's why your breakup with Eddie Fisher
:16:38. > :16:41.was such a scandal that played out that the films were more innocent
:16:42. > :16:45.too, when they? Boy meets girl, they fall in love and meet -- live
:16:46. > :16:52.happily ever after. Jono Donna Reed, Andy Griffith, corny pictures. There
:16:53. > :16:56.is too much violence and pornography, really, I call it
:16:57. > :17:01.pornography, today. The innocence is gone. I think a body can look
:17:02. > :17:06.beautiful through a veil, it doesn't have to be boom, I don't really want
:17:07. > :17:11.to see a man's frontal or a woman. It is not appropriate for children.
:17:12. > :17:15.All young people. If it wasn't that type of movie, you could see it but
:17:16. > :17:19.I don't beget should be the general public for every film. You think
:17:20. > :17:26.Hollywood is dictating the product or the audience? Television has gone
:17:27. > :17:31.much too far. Television. I don't think the films necessarily but they
:17:32. > :17:35.have but really, television is pushing it because it's so popular
:17:36. > :17:38.and there is so much cable today. You have hundreds of programmes.
:17:39. > :17:46.Before, we didn't even have television. He had two stations,
:17:47. > :17:50.then for stations and now it's... To fill that, if an octopus. To give
:17:51. > :17:54.the public what they want is very difficult. It's difficult for all
:17:55. > :18:03.the networks, the competitions are real. The paparazzi is only. -- the
:18:04. > :18:10.competition is unreal. The paparazzi is unreal. What about your breakup
:18:11. > :18:15.with Eddie Fisher, it was back then but what if it was today? You
:18:16. > :18:19.watched it with Angelina with Brad, they follow them everywhere. I feel
:18:20. > :18:23.sorry for them but I went through that. I had hundreds of press on my
:18:24. > :18:26.front lawn and the backyard, the swimming pool. All around. It is
:18:27. > :18:31.difficult and it's not something that one likes to have happened. It
:18:32. > :18:36.won't happen to me again. I'm just going to be here and the UK and play
:18:37. > :18:40.at the Apollo Theatre, I'm just going to have a good time and be
:18:41. > :18:44.live on stage and do what I like to do but my life can be easy now
:18:45. > :18:48.because I've been in the business of 63 years and I've had 63 wonderful,
:18:49. > :18:53.glorious years. I'm very happy with my life, I've been through all of it
:18:54. > :18:57.now and I've done all of it and I've had a great life and a great time
:18:58. > :19:01.and I'm still having it, that's what I like. You always make very pithy
:19:02. > :19:07.comments, you are a very direct person that she made pithy comments
:19:08. > :19:12.about why you stopped making films. Maybe it is realism that its artist
:19:13. > :19:17.Bill, I don't like making -- taking my clothes offer supportive think
:19:18. > :19:19.about Hollywood today? I do think it's glamorous, pretty. I think
:19:20. > :19:28.there are ways to make things exciting and and mysterious at the
:19:29. > :19:33.same time, that's no need. I'm a religious person, I don't need to go
:19:34. > :19:37.that way. I don't believe in that example for the young people. You
:19:38. > :19:42.can be a good entertainer and a good actress. If you want to, go ahead
:19:43. > :19:46.but it's not something I ever wanted to do and therefore I never did it.
:19:47. > :19:53.The clock will never be turned back to the innocent age. I think not. I
:19:54. > :19:57.think this is it. We don't have to go... I don't really have a comment
:19:58. > :20:01.about it because we are here and today is today and so we have to
:20:02. > :20:06.face, that we can handle ourselves well. We can handle ourselves with
:20:07. > :20:14.class and dignity. We don't have to fall down amongst the masses, so to
:20:15. > :20:19.speak, meaning, if you want to be trashy, you can be trashy. There is
:20:20. > :20:23.really no need, it is much more fun to have little dignity in life. You
:20:24. > :20:28.have always been open about the mistakes you made in your love life
:20:29. > :20:31.and picking the wrong man. What about the mistakes you made
:20:32. > :20:36.professionally? One time in the late 60s you had a row with NBC over the
:20:37. > :20:40.Debbie Reynolds show because you decided to make a stand over tobacco
:20:41. > :20:44.advertising. What happened then? Everyone could smoke on camera and
:20:45. > :20:47.you could advertise cigarettes. I didn't know Congress would pass a
:20:48. > :20:53.law that you couldn't within six months and I had a new show, the
:20:54. > :20:59.Debbie Reynolds Show and it was out like the Lucille Ball, show. A
:21:00. > :21:03.two-year contract at a lot of money. I was having a great time but then
:21:04. > :21:10.the show came out and they were advertising cigarettes. I got very
:21:11. > :21:14.upset because I said, I'm not advertising cigarettes. You promised
:21:15. > :21:24.me that I wasn't. That was quite a stand to take it that pick --
:21:25. > :21:28.particular period. They work at you don't have to advertise it for the
:21:29. > :21:32.young people and I didn't want to do it. I told them I didn't want to
:21:33. > :21:36.have a cigarette sponsor and they said well, that's too bad, that's
:21:37. > :21:39.what you have. And I told them it wasn't in my contract and they read
:21:40. > :21:45.the contract and that was the truth. Your thinking was ahead of the game.
:21:46. > :21:50.Banning in cigarette advertising in many countries didn't happen until
:21:51. > :21:58.later. I lost millions for that stand but I'm happy I did it but I
:21:59. > :22:02.think it was foolishly it was foolish for me financially but then
:22:03. > :22:06.my husbands would have then had more money to spend. One thing that has
:22:07. > :22:10.always got you through and we have seen it in the past few minutes is
:22:11. > :22:18.your sense of humour. How important is it in show business? Life itself
:22:19. > :22:23.is hard, it is not just show business. Rough and tumble in
:22:24. > :22:29.whatever form. It doesn't matter if you sell bicycles or work in the toy
:22:30. > :22:34.store. Life isn't easy. Life is what we can make of it and with a sense
:22:35. > :22:38.of humour, a faith in whatever faith, it doesn't matter, as long as
:22:39. > :22:42.we are good to other people and we are kind and we look around our
:22:43. > :22:47.lives and we do unto others, I think we will make it through. Debbie
:22:48. > :22:52.Reynolds, thank you so much for appearing on HARDtalk. Good to see
:22:53. > :22:54.you, good to see you, thank you very much.