:00:05. > :00:14.Now it is time for HARDtalk. Stephen Sackur talks to Robin Gibb.
:00:14. > :00:18.This programme was recorded in January last year.
:00:18. > :00:23.Last week saw the death of a musician who did much to define the
:00:23. > :00:27.pop music of the 70s and 80s. Robin Gibb of the Bee Gees. They wrote
:00:27. > :00:33.the soundtrack for the disco era, perhaps captured in the film
:00:33. > :00:37.Saturday Night Fever. 18 months ago, he joining me in the HARDtalk
:00:37. > :00:43.studio to talk about his music and the pressures of pop stardom. Today,
:00:43. > :00:53.they look back at the HARDtalk interview with Robin Gibb. -- a
:00:53. > :01:18.
:01:18. > :01:21.look back. Welcome to HARDtalk. Imagine for a
:01:22. > :01:25.second that the Bee Gees were setting out to make a career in the
:01:25. > :01:35.music business today. What would they make of the pop industry right
:01:35. > :01:38.now? I am actually saddened by it. It is karaoke. It is elevator music.
:01:38. > :01:47.People are posing, not being artists. We are composers, first
:01:47. > :01:51.and foremost. We have one of the biggest catalogues in the world. In
:01:51. > :02:00.fact, the biggest, alongside John Lennon and Paul McCartney. We have
:02:00. > :02:04.written for other artists as well. A whole host of songs. Beyonce's
:02:04. > :02:11.Emotion, Dionne Warwick. We have a two-tier career. A lot of artists
:02:11. > :02:14.today are just single artists. They are chosen for reality shows. They
:02:14. > :02:18.probably never had a history of actually paying their dues and
:02:18. > :02:21.working their way up the industry. When you see a show like the X
:02:21. > :02:25.Factor in the UK, which has an enormous influence on the charts,
:02:25. > :02:33.and which Simon Cowell produces, and he owns the rights to the acts
:02:33. > :02:43.who are successful, do you burn with resentment? No because I see
:02:43. > :02:44.
:02:44. > :02:48.the shows as television shows, rather than discovery of talent. In
:02:48. > :02:51.essence, when the shows go off the air, the people are on their own.
:02:51. > :02:57.They have to prove themselves. Sting said the danger is that it is
:02:57. > :03:06.putting popular music back decades. Is that really true? When we
:03:06. > :03:11.started out, people said it was had to be able to sing and sing
:03:11. > :03:15.live. Record companies would be evaluating you on that. For
:03:15. > :03:18.promotion reasons, they wouldn't sign you. It was much harder to get
:03:18. > :03:23.records on the radio. The standard was higher. British music dominated
:03:23. > :03:32.the American charts. It doesn't today. Today, they have something
:03:32. > :03:36.called autotune. If you look great, even if you cannot sing in tune, it
:03:36. > :03:40.doesn't matter. Would the Bee Gees have used that? Absolutely not. We
:03:40. > :03:45.started writing songs when we were eight-years-old. We started
:03:45. > :03:50.harmonies. Nobody taught us. We did it out of fun. We started in
:03:50. > :03:55.Manchester, copying what we heard on the radio. As young as eight or
:03:55. > :04:02.nine, we were composing music. there a danger of thinking that the
:04:02. > :04:07.good old days were always better? Natural is better. If something is
:04:07. > :04:11.real, that is always better. How often have you seen a reality TV
:04:11. > :04:18.show have a band that have got back together, c together, co
:04:18. > :04:21.their own songs, and harmonies, and not many people can do that. I was
:04:21. > :04:25.struck by something you said the other day about the X Factor
:04:25. > :04:35.phenomenon. You describe the successful ones on the show as
:04:35. > :04:45.
:04:45. > :04:49.overstocked puppets. -- overstyled. Simply a product. I would put it to
:04:49. > :04:56.you, in the end, Berry Gordy was treating the musicians as a product,
:04:56. > :05:01.a commodity to sell. It has always happened in the industry. With
:05:01. > :05:04.Motown, there was a host of that. I think that is there. In our case,
:05:04. > :05:09.we have always composed our own music. We have been our own masters.
:05:09. > :05:13.We never relied on other people to write our own songs. We have never
:05:13. > :05:20.been taught anything about music. It is fascinating how you came to
:05:20. > :05:30.be so good at music so young. Your dad pushed you very hard. He didn't
:05:30. > :05:34.really. He never knew exactly what we were doing. He never knew
:05:34. > :05:37.because we did it on our own. It was much later that he discovered,
:05:37. > :05:43.because we were very young, it was not like Los Angeles where you were
:05:43. > :05:50.groomed. There is a concern about the pushing of child stars. Justin
:05:50. > :05:54.Bieber, he is still a teenager, Britney Spears. We never had that.
:05:54. > :05:59.But it sort of happened to you. Weren't you pushed into talent
:05:59. > :06:09.shows of the time yourself? Only by enthusiasm. Because that is
:06:09. > :06:11.
:06:11. > :06:15.something that we wanted to do. A radio station in Brisbane or Bill
:06:15. > :06:19.Gates wanted us to play in drive- time shows. -- primetime. We loved
:06:19. > :06:28.that. You were in your early teens. No, eight or nine. So you were one
:06:28. > :06:37.of these child stars who was pushed onto the stage. Isn't there
:06:37. > :06:39.something dangerous about that? Working in the outback of
:06:39. > :06:43.Queensland, we were doing these things like speedway. Like,
:06:43. > :06:48.reckless speed work. He did not know anything about it. We were
:06:48. > :06:51.miners. -- minors. You develop quickly. As part of
:06:51. > :06:55.your development, you came back from Australia to the UK. I want to
:06:55. > :07:05.remind people what the early Bee Gees, with your first number one
:07:05. > :07:23.
:07:23. > :07:33.MUSIC PLAYS. # I'm going back to Massechusetts. # Something's
:07:33. > :07:35.
:07:35. > :07:39.telling me I must go home. # Our life is down in Massechusetts. #
:07:39. > :07:45.The day I left, standing on the road. There you are, Robin Gibb,
:07:45. > :07:51.singing Massachusetts. You must have been 17 when you sang that. It
:07:51. > :07:56.is a very hippy sort of sound. lot of the songs in the catalogue
:07:56. > :08:02.are still in the radio. I can turn the radio on, including the BBC,
:08:02. > :08:06.and hear five of our songs a day, in America as well at the same time.
:08:06. > :08:11.Because of all the other artists we have written for, as well as
:08:11. > :08:17.ourselves. But I am tempted to ask what happened to your sound?
:08:17. > :08:27.Because it changed radically in quite a few years. It did. Because
:08:27. > :08:28.
:08:28. > :08:30.we are composers. We felt we had licence to go into other areas
:08:30. > :08:35.where people would fear to go, especially older artists, because
:08:35. > :08:40.we were so young. Were you just casting about to find the most
:08:40. > :08:50.commercially successful sound? were having fun. Islands in the
:08:50. > :08:55.Stream is the most successful country song. We haven't lived in
:08:55. > :09:01.Nashville or Memphis. We are not country artists but we have wrote
:09:01. > :09:05.that. We have always liked R&B and even soul. For a while, after
:09:05. > :09:14.Massachusetts, a few other hits which were a bit more hippy, you
:09:14. > :09:24.and soul thing. You were called the blue-eyed soul boys. You left the
:09:24. > :09:25.
:09:25. > :09:29.UK to develop that sound. We have to. We wanted to explore what we
:09:29. > :09:32.were doing. We wanted a transition. We wanted to explore American music,
:09:32. > :09:42.black music particularly, because that is where we felt the future
:09:42. > :09:49.
:09:49. > :09:53.was going to be. But the producer, he wanted you to forget that you
:09:53. > :10:00.were three white boys from Manchester? The fact of the matter
:10:00. > :10:08.is, he loved the harmonies and the writing. He saw us as composers and
:10:08. > :10:11.recording artists. We never worried about image. We lived and breathed
:10:11. > :10:18.the recording studio. Although he was a great producer, we did all
:10:18. > :10:21.the work. The thing was, we did live and breathe it. If something
:10:21. > :10:24.sounded good to him, you do it today. Nothing waited. You are
:10:24. > :10:28.playing around with different styles and you have the ability to
:10:28. > :10:35.catch different moods. How did you get to the sound that is always
:10:35. > :10:45.associated with you, which is the falsetto? It has been always used.
:10:45. > :10:48.It was licence. The Four Seasons, Jersey Boys. And of course people
:10:48. > :10:52.like The Rolling Stones have used falsetto as well, and Prince, with
:10:52. > :11:01.The Most Beautiful Girl in the World. But why are you and the Bee
:11:01. > :11:04.Gees always stuck with that particular style of singing?
:11:04. > :11:14.Because that particular piece of music, it was the biggest selling
:11:14. > :11:15.
:11:15. > :11:18.soundtrack album of all time. It still is. It's like walking on the
:11:18. > :11:28.moon. At this point we had to remind people of that particular
:11:28. > :11:28.
:11:28. > :12:12.Apology for the loss of subtitles for 43 seconds
:12:12. > :12:17.sound. This is Stayin' Alive from That was a massive success. It
:12:17. > :12:23.almost defined an era for many people. It created an era. It did
:12:23. > :12:29.not exist before all of that. It created its own climate. In those
:12:29. > :12:39.days, you could not hide anything. It was purely organic. Unlike today,
:12:39. > :12:39.
:12:39. > :12:45.where everything is hype. But your own brother later said it became an
:12:45. > :12:49.albatross. Do you still feel that? Do you feel it would have been
:12:49. > :12:55.better if it was not like that and if you were not so defined by that?
:12:55. > :13:02.John Lennon said he wished he had a Saturday night fever in his career
:13:02. > :13:07.because he loved singles. I love them too. He always saw that as an
:13:07. > :13:12.albatross and came to love it. I am very proud of it now because I do
:13:12. > :13:17.not think... Many people would like to have a single like that. You
:13:17. > :13:26.cannot plan it. Did it to annoy you that it became something that
:13:26. > :13:33.others in the business poked fun at? You had satirical bans.
:13:33. > :13:40.there are also many tribute bands as well. All around the world. Not
:13:40. > :13:43.many people have tribute bands. The fact is, it had an impact on the
:13:43. > :13:53.culture. There are people who have hit records and there are those
:13:53. > :13:58.that have impacts on the culture. There are expressions around the
:13:58. > :14:08.song. No doubt, it is part of the music culture. You mentioned John
:14:08. > :14:18.Lennon. There is something about the Beatles and other huge bands
:14:18. > :14:18.
:14:18. > :14:22.Bringing it up to date, it with Oasis it was 0 and Liam. In the
:14:22. > :14:27.Stones it was Keith and Mick. You were a family band, a band of
:14:27. > :14:31.brothers. There is always going to be Dynamics in any group whether
:14:31. > :14:37.you were brothers or not. People say you have been together so long
:14:37. > :14:41.because you are brothers. Brothers may stay together because they are
:14:41. > :14:51.brothers. You try to quit when... Was that because there were power
:14:51. > :14:54.
:14:54. > :14:58.relationships that you could not cope with? It happened with Oasis
:14:58. > :15:02.it is called first success, and it does happen when you feel you want
:15:02. > :15:06.to spread your wings on your own. I don't think we split up as such but
:15:06. > :15:09.I showed up on my own. We were still learning the ropes, still
:15:10. > :15:17.developing and when you have success very young it goes to a
:15:17. > :15:20.head very quickly. You had problems at the time. I know you had some
:15:20. > :15:25.drugs problems with amphetamines and I think your brothers and your
:15:25. > :15:29.father were extraordinarily worried about you. Yes but everybody in
:15:29. > :15:33.those days was like that, in the late 60s. That was the hardest
:15:33. > :15:42.thing I have ever done. I never really took anything harder than
:15:42. > :15:49.that. I never took a hard drugs at all. Never took LSD, heroin, crack.
:15:49. > :15:59.Never? Never. And that was to stay up all night working in the studio
:15:59. > :16:00.
:16:00. > :16:04.which we did. The tragedy of the brothers Gibb is the one brother
:16:04. > :16:09.Andy, who was not part of the BG's, but you were very close to, he fell
:16:09. > :16:12.foul of drugs in a much more terrible way. He did but that is
:16:12. > :16:16.not how he died. He died from myocarditis on his 30th birthday.
:16:16. > :16:20.He had a problem years earlier with drugs but by the time he died he
:16:20. > :16:24.was clean. He did have a virus in the heart which was not bacterial,
:16:24. > :16:29.anyone can tell you myocarditis is for life but if you are run-down it
:16:29. > :16:32.or claimed you. In retrospect do you think it was good for the
:16:32. > :16:40.family dynamic, all of your relationships, that the BG's had
:16:40. > :16:45.such remarkable success and became such a success? I do. It is what
:16:45. > :16:49.you dream about. I don't know anything else. I don't think I
:16:49. > :16:59.would do anything any different. I love music and I'm working with the
:16:59. > :17:01.
:17:01. > :17:05.Royal Philharmonic on the Titanic wreck cream for 2012. -- requiem. I
:17:05. > :17:09.will be working with my brother next year on some very big thing as
:17:09. > :17:13.a caring. I have to stop you because you could not have said
:17:13. > :17:16.that a few years ago that there would be things happening because
:17:16. > :17:21.after the tragic death of Morris, your twin brother, within a week or
:17:21. > :17:31.so you did say that the BG's as a unit will never be created without
:17:31. > :17:33.
:17:33. > :17:36.Morris. -- Maurice. He were talking about the group. It is projects
:17:36. > :17:39.that are related to the catalogue we have written and what is going
:17:39. > :17:43.to happen with back-catalogue in terms of major players in the
:17:43. > :17:46.United States which will affect the whole world. In the States, the
:17:47. > :17:53.Beatles had 26 Number ones, we have written and recorded 22 US Number
:17:53. > :18:02.ones which is more than any other British act apart from the be tools.
:18:02. > :18:06.You and Barry to go on stage together no together noWhen
:18:06. > :18:10.you do that do you feel you're doing it as Bee Gees or something
:18:10. > :18:15.different? It is a creation. In a way it is almost abstract because
:18:15. > :18:18.it is just a name. We also see ourselves as the creators of, the
:18:18. > :18:23.chief composers, even though you don't engineer it is something that
:18:23. > :18:33.happens. We are the creators and in a sense weather the band or the
:18:33. > :18:40.
:18:40. > :18:44.Gibb brothers, whatever we are. are still doing it. We cherry-pick
:18:44. > :18:49.the things that we do, the live shows but the catalogue is so big
:18:49. > :18:58.it is the movies all the time, it is on the radio, it is a living
:18:58. > :19:02.catalogue that we are very proud of. And people all over the world know
:19:02. > :19:07.your music. You did say once and this is quite a reflective comment,
:19:07. > :19:12.you have been through tough times in your life. I have been in train
:19:12. > :19:15.crashes as well, when I was 17. Nearly 80 people were killed.
:19:15. > :19:19.seems to me as an interesting juxtaposition with a lot of your
:19:19. > :19:24.up-tempo music, you said an artist is an artist because he is not
:19:24. > :19:28.happy with the world so as a result he creates his own existence.
:19:28. > :19:32.Charles Dickens said the same thing, it is an extension of yourself
:19:32. > :19:36.because no matter how much you use your art to fill the void with the
:19:36. > :19:42.new it is a never ending void because you'll never be satisfied.
:19:42. > :19:52.Is it? The void that drives your creativity it is as much better day
:19:52. > :19:54.
:19:54. > :19:58.as it ever was? Yes. You can't can say I will retire at a certain
:19:58. > :20:01.point, it is just something you have to do until you drop. If you
:20:01. > :20:05.were too happy in your material world would you not be able to
:20:05. > :20:08.write music any more? I don't think there is any such thing as actual
:20:08. > :20:18.happiness but there is contentment. Contentment for me it is writing
:20:18. > :20:19.
:20:19. > :20:23.Contentment for me it is writing I don't think, as Churchill said,
:20:23. > :20:26.at rest is frost. I don't like to stand still and back at the sunset.
:20:26. > :20:29.You rather neatly linked into another interest. You mention
:20:29. > :20:32.Churchill. You have become preoccupied with a campaign to get
:20:32. > :20:35.more recognition, a massive new monument, for the young men who
:20:35. > :20:43.gave their lives for Britain in Bomber Command, those who flew the
:20:43. > :20:53.bombers. 55,000 of them who have never been recognised for 70 years
:20:53. > :20:53.
:20:53. > :20:57.between the end just of 22, it for the Nazis. You were born after the
:20:57. > :21:00.end of the Second World War and you have lived this international live,
:21:00. > :21:03.a home in Florida, some time in Australia, you are an international
:21:03. > :21:13.person, why have you developed this particular obsession, a very
:21:13. > :21:14.
:21:14. > :21:17.British obsession? They are always seen as heroes in Australia and
:21:18. > :21:25.America, they admire what these guys did because they ended the war
:21:25. > :21:30.and brought peace and freedom to Europe which affected the world.
:21:30. > :21:34.Yes. You have just come back from Germany and you know better than I
:21:34. > :21:39.do that some Germans because of the scale of the monument you want to
:21:39. > :21:43.put up they have real problems. I am thinking of the mayor of Dresden
:21:43. > :21:45.who has said that she thinks what you are proposing for London, this
:21:45. > :21:55.big monument, is contrary to Dresden's notion of what
:21:55. > :21:59.remembrances all about. From the point of view, I have the backing
:21:59. > :22:07.of Boris Johnson and the Prime Minister and Nick Clegg. It has
:22:07. > :22:11.been passed by Westminster Council and is going ahead. Of course they
:22:11. > :22:14.are going to be bitter but this is an anti- war memorial, showing
:22:14. > :22:19.young people back peace and democracy and justice are not given
:22:19. > :22:22.things and not be taken for granted. These guys never got to see it the
:22:22. > :22:27.freedom they created, not just for the German people but the whole
:22:27. > :22:31.world. They did it with no reservations at all. Are you doing
:22:31. > :22:37.this partly because maybe you feel your life has been too easy in a
:22:37. > :22:45.way? Is that why you are so interested in these young men?
:22:45. > :22:54.have not been recognised of all the armed divisions. Why a pop-star,
:22:54. > :23:02.with all the millions who have made,... Popular music. Why it's
:23:02. > :23:08.has developed this particular interest? Why not? It has certainly
:23:08. > :23:11.had an effect. The fact that the matter is these guys are heroes,
:23:11. > :23:14.they should be honoured and it is something the whole country has
:23:14. > :23:22.supported, including newspapers, and it is up to the point where it