:00:02. > :00:07.It is hoped that any bank will be able to survive for one month,
:00:07. > :00:17.without any help from their government. And now it is time for
:00:17. > :00:18.
:00:18. > :00:22.My guest today is global fashion icon and Ozwald Boateng. He was the
:00:22. > :00:27.youngest ever and first black designer Ann Taylor a London's
:00:27. > :00:31.prestigious Savile Row. Born to Ghanaian parents, he said his
:00:31. > :00:36.colour was irrelevant to his success and he put it to one side
:00:36. > :00:41.and got on with his career. Too many Africans, he is a role model.
:00:41. > :00:45.Why is he now making more of his African identity by championing
:00:45. > :00:55.investment in business on the Continent and could he have been
:00:55. > :01:20.
:01:20. > :01:25.Ozwald Boateng, welcome to HARDtalk. Why do you say that je African
:01:25. > :01:31.origin has been a relevant to your success? Mainly because as a
:01:31. > :01:37.designer for my first started, I didn't want my origins to help in
:01:37. > :01:43.any sort of stereotype in terms of my approach to design. What I did
:01:43. > :01:50.was I really focused on the work itself. I took the traditional
:01:50. > :01:54.British sit and I made it modern. That was very unique as a designer.
:01:54. > :01:59.I wanted the focus of that unique design approach to be the focus of
:01:59. > :02:04.the world's attention in terms of design, not me as an individual.
:02:04. > :02:10.What do you mean about not conforming to a stereotype? Do you
:02:10. > :02:18.mean they would have expected bold African patterns? In the design
:02:18. > :02:24.world, as a black man, I was very unique in that way. I didn't want
:02:24. > :02:31.the image of myself to get in front of me as a creator. Did you see
:02:31. > :02:36.your race as a handicap? I would not say a handicap but I was unique
:02:36. > :02:41.within the field. You can be in a field full of men and you can be
:02:41. > :02:46.the first woman. You want the work to speak for you. That is the
:02:46. > :02:50.approach that I took. That is why I always talked about it in that
:02:50. > :02:57.contest. In a recent documentary about due that fall due for a
:02:57. > :03:01.decade or so, a Man's Story, you said you wanted to forget your skin
:03:01. > :03:05.colour and get on with it. You said people did not know what you look
:03:05. > :03:09.like and did not know your name was African. They thought she won a
:03:09. > :03:13.middle-aged white man. Because they thought you were a middle-aged
:03:13. > :03:20.white man, if they had known you were a young black guy, they would
:03:20. > :03:26.have bodgers its. We talk about -- would have bought your suits. When
:03:26. > :03:31.you talk about Savile Row, when I started, I was 18 years old. I was
:03:31. > :03:36.very young. I was working in a very old and established business. I had
:03:36. > :03:40.a very strong point of view and a very unique point of view. I wanted
:03:40. > :03:45.the focus to be about the work itself as opposed to me as an
:03:45. > :03:54.individual. Then people judge you work differently and say "this is
:03:54. > :04:02.not for me." You need to be a different man to earn this. Had you
:04:02. > :04:10.had racist experiences in the past? Savile Row is very much a closed
:04:10. > :04:16.club, it was a bad point. I started by my fabrics at the beginning and
:04:16. > :04:20.a lot of the merchants, they were not easy on me, put it that way. I
:04:20. > :04:27.had to earn my respect with them. Can you think of a specific
:04:27. > :04:33.example? I would not necessarily get good terms in purchasing of my
:04:33. > :04:40.cloth. That made things harder for stub that was consistent. -- I was
:04:40. > :04:45.consistent and I was a respectful of them as merchants. They started
:04:45. > :04:52.to realise that actually I was quite good at what I was doing. I
:04:53. > :04:57.developed a reputation for that from that point. That is why, when
:04:57. > :05:02.you are starting to build the brand, when it opened and Savile Row, I
:05:02. > :05:08.was very clear about me being on the street, one, what I could do
:05:08. > :05:13.for the concept of tailoring globally. I also knew that by just
:05:13. > :05:18.being there and doing a good job, I could maybe affect attitudes around
:05:18. > :05:24.someone like myself being in that field. Can ask you about that?
:05:24. > :05:29.Savile Row, no easy thing to get in that part of London, Piccadilly, it
:05:29. > :05:34.is where the likes of Prince Charles, and fight it think he is
:05:34. > :05:40.one of your clients, Richard Branson, Hollywood stars, they buy
:05:40. > :05:46.assets from you. -- in fact I think he is. Were you not perhaps burying
:05:46. > :05:51.your race and identity deliberately in order to get on fine, arguably,
:05:51. > :05:57.you could have used your success as a vehicle, as a platform to promote
:05:57. > :06:02.better race relations? Promote a different vision of Africa. I think
:06:02. > :06:10.I was doing it anyway. I did not have to announce it. The moment you
:06:10. > :06:16.get into badges as when -- is when you have the opportunity of someone
:06:16. > :06:25.saying, he is a bladder Senna. have the badge of colour anyway.
:06:25. > :06:32.I'd do -- he is a black Taylor. I do. But it was not about that. I
:06:32. > :06:36.did not have that Preston me as an individual. Not only did you not
:06:36. > :06:43.use your success as a base to promote better race relations, you
:06:43. > :06:48.actually actively buried it. some extent. Is that a matter of
:06:48. > :06:56.regret for you? I don't think I buried it. I just did not make the
:06:56. > :07:01..9. I think by not making it a point, -- I just did not make it
:07:01. > :07:07.the point. I think by not making it a point, by just being good at what
:07:07. > :07:12.I do, that helped to shift the perception of someone like myself
:07:12. > :07:21.being within that industry. Working in the way that I do. You were very
:07:21. > :07:27.successful in the late 80s, Ellen intos. -- Early 90s. I started to
:07:27. > :07:34.build a name. To you know what was going on in Africa at the time?
:07:34. > :07:38.There were a lot of Kus. A lot of images of Africans constantly
:07:38. > :07:44.depicted as starving and waiting for an active Western nation to
:07:45. > :07:48.come and help them out. You could have countered that, kind of. You
:07:48. > :07:54.could have been multi-dimensional, here I am an African, Ozwald
:07:54. > :07:59.Boateng, successful. I did not have that influence. As a designer,
:07:59. > :08:04.either they gathered momentum in people
:08:04. > :08:09.people would argue that there was a very Afro-pessimistic view of the
:08:09. > :08:16.Continent. You could have countered that. Not a bad point. You keep
:08:16. > :08:25.saying that. -- not at that point. Not at that point Machen time.
:08:25. > :08:35.There is something about that. I am more active now. I have been active
:08:35. > :08:36.
:08:36. > :08:43.since 2000, 2003/4. To a very effective change or do anything to
:08:43. > :08:50.change that the, I would have had to be in a position where I could
:08:50. > :08:58.have communication all editions. -- to change Africa. And 2001 or 2002,
:08:58. > :09:02.I met the President of Ghana. I had a conversation with him about
:09:02. > :09:07.development. I did not realise I could have a conversation and he
:09:07. > :09:15.would listen to me. You had this influence Budget did not realise?
:09:15. > :09:19.At the time, I didn't. I was developing as a brand. Developing
:09:19. > :09:25.his unknown individual. More often than not, you don't know how well
:09:25. > :09:31.you're doing. Not until you experience it. You said you
:09:31. > :09:37.awakened to you African identity by that. Why is it that in 2013 you
:09:37. > :09:44.are using African influences for the first time. That is not correct.
:09:44. > :09:49.What it is, I don't sue Scholar within my work. Not ride from the
:09:49. > :09:54.beginning because of -- don't use colourful stop this is the first
:09:54. > :10:00.time you are using an overtly African influence. I am using
:10:00. > :10:05.colour and an African context. Rich colours. I always said I used
:10:05. > :10:10.colour as a tool to make something very traditional look very modern.
:10:10. > :10:16.The way I am combining my collars, it has always had a strong African
:10:16. > :10:19.awareness. -- colours. The can compare your word to Vivienne
:10:19. > :10:26.Westwood or Jean-Paul Gaultier. They had been using African
:10:26. > :10:30.influences for years. You have it as a birthright and you chose not
:10:30. > :10:35.to. At the time, I needed to establish myself as a designer. I
:10:35. > :10:40.did not want to be established as an African designer. I think I am
:10:40. > :10:44.established to such an extent now that any embracing African fabrics
:10:44. > :10:49.and using them in an interesting way is it is no longer just badged
:10:49. > :10:54.as an African designer. It is a designer who is understood who has
:10:54. > :11:03.at the kindreds and this is how he wants to work with that. -- who has
:11:03. > :11:09.African roots. It is like Africa. It is badly marketed. It is great
:11:09. > :11:15.now to see the world starting to realise that Africa has a role. It
:11:15. > :11:20.is not just how much you can donate to it in it. You have said it is
:11:20. > :11:27.now added a's time. When you look at relations between Africa and
:11:27. > :11:33.Western nations, do you believe that now you can help to counter
:11:33. > :11:40.the view that consumer goods are only really desirable if they are
:11:40. > :11:49.made in the West and confirm to Western-style the standards? I see
:11:49. > :11:56.it like this, Africa has, bearing in mind it controls 50 % of all
:11:56. > :12:02.known resources, maybe more, now we have an opportunity for Afrikaner
:12:02. > :12:10.to actually have its own identity in terms what products it creates.
:12:10. > :12:16.-- For Africa a to have. My view of Africa, why you see me more
:12:16. > :12:23.naturally engaged, I think now it is working out its language what it
:12:23. > :12:29.is going to say about itself in terms of production. There is a
:12:29. > :12:34.real interest for companies to set up manufacturing bases in Africa up
:12:34. > :12:38.in a with there was not before. The raw materials were taken out and
:12:38. > :12:46.manufactured elsewhere. Everyone is realising that now is the right
:12:46. > :12:51.time to do that. I have definitely been campaigning and China mac
:12:51. > :12:55.changed that view. The image of -- as trying to change our view. The
:12:55. > :13:00.image of the charity work in Africa has been fantastic. People have
:13:00. > :13:06.done great things but, from a marketing perspective, the images
:13:07. > :13:13.the same. It is kids' staffing and flies. The marketing aspect, it
:13:13. > :13:17.does what is desirable, it is something that is Western. A
:13:17. > :13:24.professor at London University who studied clothing market across
:13:24. > :13:30.Africa told altitude that shoppers make choices based on style rather
:13:30. > :13:34.than sustainability and choose Western clothing because it has
:13:34. > :13:37.parallels with Western culture and matches what they see on TV. Do you
:13:37. > :13:47.believe that you need to inject something different into an African
:13:47. > :13:50.
:13:50. > :13:57.market and say, actually, draw on He seemed many Africans wearing
:13:57. > :14:06.amazing presence even though the fabric is made in Holland. -- you
:14:06. > :14:12.see. They do have an identity. It is about confidence. I have been
:14:12. > :14:18.told, when I am in Africa, they CIM successful. I am known for my
:14:18. > :14:24.designs. I am embracing the fabrics. It is reinforcing a confidence in
:14:24. > :14:33.self. But they are still chasing all those products that are made in
:14:33. > :14:43.the West. But it is just timing. There are still trying to figure
:14:43. > :14:43.
:14:43. > :14:50.out and understand what their new identity means. You see more
:14:50. > :14:55.Africans wanting to go back to Africa, now more than ever. The
:14:55. > :15:05.global crisis has been a great thing for Africa, in one way. It
:15:05. > :15:06.
:15:06. > :15:11.made everybody rethink. I am experiencing it with my own parents.
:15:11. > :15:17.They are selling their property here. They are going back. You are
:15:17. > :15:24.one of three children. Your siblings are also heading back. Are
:15:24. > :15:30.you? I am about Emperor should show development. -- infrastructure
:15:30. > :15:37.development. I would love to see shopping centres. A development of
:15:37. > :15:41.new types of cities. With environmental awareness that are
:15:41. > :15:46.very interestingly designed. The landscape of Africa is so under
:15:46. > :15:55.fire. You can really make it something you dream about all read
:15:55. > :16:03.about inbox. It is possible. talked about the clothing industry
:16:03. > :16:07.and about helping bring investment to the Confederate -- confident.
:16:07. > :16:12.You said Africa could be the new hub for the textile industry
:16:12. > :16:17.worldwide. There are voices that say they do not want the sweatshops
:16:17. > :16:22.they have seen in some parts of Asia. Even if we want to come
:16:22. > :16:32.should be, you have to make sure it is done correctly. Yes. That is
:16:32. > :16:37.true. I agree. You have to start. There is a lot of rationale behind
:16:37. > :16:44.doing this and during bad. We need infrastructure. You cannot go to
:16:44. > :16:50.one country from the next because there is no decent road. This basic
:16:50. > :16:56.infrastructure needs to be dealt with. You set this -- set up this
:16:57. > :17:03.organisation, launched in 2009, to bring innovation and investment to
:17:03. > :17:09.Africa. Focusing on infrastructure. Not had much success. The thing is,
:17:10. > :17:15.like I said, there has been such bad PR on Africa. The men Ysaye
:17:15. > :17:20.Africa and Investment, people talk about governance, corruption, all
:17:20. > :17:25.the issues before you can even talk about the opportunities. You cannot
:17:25. > :17:31.blame them. You were quoted in the Guardian in March this year saying:
:17:31. > :17:38.Corruption in Africa, absolutely nonsense. I think corruption is
:17:38. > :17:44.everywhere. We can look at the financial crisis and talk about
:17:44. > :17:48.corruption. I said it was nonsense because there is too much focus on
:17:48. > :17:53.that. If you build the infrastructure so I can take
:17:53. > :18:03.advantage of my wealth, my assets that sit in the ground, then I had
:18:03. > :18:04.
:18:04. > :18:08.the resources to trade with you. Nobody disagrees. To say the
:18:08. > :18:16.government is corrupt is the reason why we cannot do that, or even
:18:16. > :18:22.start, it does not make sense. There are 54 countries. There has
:18:22. > :18:26.to be a few examples of countries their... If you group all the
:18:26. > :18:32.countries in one, there are a couple of problems in three
:18:32. > :18:41.countries. Where did you get that information from? You know the
:18:41. > :18:44.telecom Sudanese billionaire. Latest figures say state except
:18:45. > :18:51.there has been improvement of governments in Africa in the last
:18:52. > :18:57.couple of years. In many countries, they are going backwards. Like
:18:57. > :19:06.Nigeria of Kenya. Governance is a big issue and there are huge
:19:07. > :19:16.negatives. So we do not invest? So we do not China lift people are a
:19:16. > :19:21.poverty? -- we do not lift a people. You do not say governance is
:19:21. > :19:29.irrelevant. I say let's not have it be the first thing you say.
:19:29. > :19:34.need accountability. Make it transparent. I love that. Don't
:19:34. > :19:42.make it a bad excuse and not to invest. You need the accountability.
:19:42. > :19:48.Do you accept that? 100%. How do you bring it about? You are a big
:19:48. > :19:57.backer of these bonds. Members of the African diaspora can invest in
:19:57. > :20:02.bonds that can be used for infrastructure. When this idea was
:20:02. > :20:10.tried a few years ago in Ethiopia, people said if they do not trust
:20:10. > :20:15.the government as a guarantor. is why the African Development Bank
:20:15. > :20:22.is doing. They have a AAA rating rating. They are dealing with
:20:23. > :20:30.member states of the moment. That is great. It is about involvement.
:20:30. > :20:35.The bonds they are planning to do is $22 million. It is fantastic
:20:35. > :20:43.news for Africa. Many African nations do not have that sort of
:20:43. > :20:47.rating. The 54 African countries have their own reserves. They
:20:48. > :20:51.invest that in bronze on the other side of the globe, close to $1
:20:52. > :20:59.trillion. They do not invest in their own continent. That makes no
:20:59. > :21:05.sense. As a leading member of the African diaspora, had you invested?
:21:05. > :21:12.Absolutely. Not in the bronze, but in Africa. The the the the us
:21:12. > :21:22.poorer has a real role to play? Absolutely. -- de think the gifts
:21:22. > :21:28.
:21:28. > :21:36.poorer. -- African DS poorer. There is a real opportunity in Ghana and
:21:36. > :21:39.West Africa. There is no tax on goods coming in from Africa and
:21:39. > :21:45.into the US. There is a real incentive to develop manufacturing
:21:45. > :21:50.there. If you do not have to develop a textile company, because
:21:50. > :21:54.you do not know it -- do not have that know how bad is a problem.
:21:54. > :22:03.having the right tax and legal structures in place are people who
:22:03. > :22:09.invest know their money will be safe. They all say security. I saw
:22:09. > :22:17.a statistic on Russia right now. 45 African countries are better in
:22:17. > :22:21.terms of corruption than Russia is. How does that work? D believe that
:22:21. > :22:29.these kind of investments will filter down to those who are the
:22:29. > :22:39.poorest. If you build error road that connects two cities together,
:22:39. > :22:44.
:22:44. > :22:54.100%. You stand for the elite. Your suits. $30,000. Might average price
:22:54. > :22:56.
:22:56. > :23:00.is $2,000. The top? Top price is about $20,000. When you talk about
:23:00. > :23:06.a huge investment opportunities, there are still huge levels of
:23:06. > :23:14.poverty. Does that not strike you as a lot of money to put on your
:23:14. > :23:19.back? I am designing. That is what I do as a luxury brand. Having the
:23:19. > :23:25.African descent is an important message. It does not mean I do not
:23:25. > :23:31.care because I am in the luxury industry. You can reconcile that?
:23:31. > :23:38.care about one thing. I want to see Africa move forward. I want to be
:23:38. > :23:43.in the position where I can open a shop, many shops. It is a very
:23:43. > :23:49.important point. It does not mean because we are African, we cannot