:00:11. > :00:14.Tropical Storm Harvey has brought massive flooding
:00:15. > :00:26.More than 2,000 people have been rescued as the waters
:00:27. > :00:30.President Trump is due to visit Texas on Tuesday.
:00:31. > :00:38.Thousands of Rohingya Muslims are stranded on the Bangladeshi
:00:39. > :00:40.border, after escaping two days of violence in Myanmar's Rakhine
:00:41. > :00:43.It's the latest in a deepening crisis in the region.
:00:44. > :00:45.And this story is trending on bbc.com.
:00:46. > :00:48.There's a heavy security presence in northern India,
:00:49. > :00:50.ahead of the sentencing of a controversial guru
:00:51. > :00:59.38 people died during protests after Gurmeet Ram Rahim Singh
:01:00. > :01:15.Now on BBC News, it's time for HARDtalk.
:01:16. > :01:22.In the late 70s, Roman Polanski admitted to having unlawful sex
:01:23. > :01:29.He spent 42 days in prison, and then fled the US
:01:30. > :01:32.because he feared being given a longer sentence.
:01:33. > :01:35.In the nearly 40 years since, much has been said and written
:01:36. > :01:39.But we have hardly heard anything from the girl herself,
:01:40. > :01:43.I have come to New York to hear her account of what happened,
:01:44. > :02:06.Samantha Geimer, welcome to HARDtalk.
:02:07. > :02:10.You have struggled to protect your privacy for nearly 40 years,
:02:11. > :02:16.so why are you choosing to speak up now?
:02:17. > :02:20.I just wanted to tell the story, the true story, my story,
:02:21. > :02:23.on my own terms rather than as a reaction to whatever might
:02:24. > :02:36.be bringing it up in my life, which happens from time to time.
:02:37. > :02:40.So I thought it was time to, on my own terms, at my own time,
:02:41. > :02:43.tell the truth and say the things I wanted to say.
:02:44. > :02:47.Those who say, this is about making some money out of a story that has
:02:48. > :02:49.gone quiet, what would you say to them?
:02:50. > :02:54.It never goes quiet for very long for me, not that much,
:02:55. > :03:02.You were 13, and the first time you met Roman Polanski,
:03:03. > :03:06.He was looking to take some photographs of young girls.
:03:07. > :03:09.He was looking for a model, and he was a friend
:03:10. > :03:17.He approached you, and you went out with him one evening and he had
:03:18. > :03:21.met your mother, and he took some photographs of you.
:03:22. > :03:24.He came by the house, and met my mother to see
:03:25. > :03:30.We did test shots a couple of weeks later, during the day,
:03:31. > :03:39.What were you hoping would come from it?
:03:40. > :03:42.I was hoping I would be in Vogue Paris, and it
:03:43. > :03:50.would be my big shot at getting some parts and having an acting career.
:03:51. > :03:54.You went out with him, and you write about it in your book.
:03:55. > :03:57.You gradually took your clothes off while he took photos of you up
:03:58. > :04:10.He asked me to change my shirt, and took photos while I was topless.
:04:11. > :04:13.I let him do that, and I didn't tell my mother.
:04:14. > :04:16.Then he gets back in contact, and he wants to take more.
:04:17. > :04:21.I was a little uncomfortable, but I really wanted that opportunity
:04:22. > :04:25.to be in Vogue Paris, so I went ahead with it.
:04:26. > :04:28.You wrote about it, saying, whatever I did on that hill,
:04:29. > :04:42.it might put me on the map, my family would be stoked.
:04:43. > :04:45.So everyone will be happy that you are making it.
:04:46. > :04:50.You went off with a friend as well, but she didn't stay.
:04:51. > :04:55.He said we would be kind of late, and she couldn't stay late.
:04:56. > :05:07.I didn't see it as a big deal or a problem.
:05:08. > :05:10.And he ended up taking you up to Jack Nicholson's house?
:05:11. > :05:17.I thought we would do photos until we lost the light and then
:05:18. > :05:21.From the moment you arrive, he gave you champagne?
:05:22. > :05:23.We had photographs, and there was a housekeeper
:05:24. > :05:26.and they opened some champagne, and I was using it during the photos
:05:27. > :05:54.He offered me that, and I took it, I don't know why.
:05:55. > :05:57.Can you explain why you went along with a lot of the things
:05:58. > :06:06.I thought I was working, it was a modelling job,
:06:07. > :06:10.so I was there to model and do has he said and do it correctly.
:06:11. > :06:13.I thought it was work, most of it was work.
:06:14. > :06:16.The drinking was a lot of fun, since I was 13, almost 14,
:06:17. > :06:26.When you are younger, having a glass of champagne is nice.
:06:27. > :06:29.But I wasn't experienced enough to know that I had maybe
:06:30. > :06:39.He says, he wrote in his autobiography, there is no doubt
:06:40. > :06:41.about her experience and lack of inhibition.
:06:42. > :06:46.I'm sure he would like to remember it that way, so that's OK.
:06:47. > :06:48.I obviously had a lack of inhibition or wouldn't have
:06:49. > :07:03.Was there a question of how much you allowed?
:07:04. > :07:11.I thought I was mature but I was naive.
:07:12. > :07:17.Maybe, I knew it was somehow inappropriate, but I didn't put it
:07:18. > :07:20.together that it might go further, and something that might happen.
:07:21. > :07:28.You have written about it in your book, that it went,
:07:29. > :07:40.Yes, it was modelling, then he wanted to get
:07:41. > :07:45.I realised it was wrong, I had been drinking and I had taken
:07:46. > :07:49.that pill, so I was just confused and after that he was going
:07:50. > :08:04.I was afraid, I was unprepared, I was surprised.
:08:05. > :08:12.And that was because he was nervous about getting you pregnant?
:08:13. > :08:21.That is what everyone seems to think so I will go with that.
:08:22. > :08:32.I was scared and I didn't know how to stop it.
:08:33. > :08:35.I knew what sex was, and I figured, this is what is happening.
:08:36. > :08:39.I didn't know how to get out of it so I figured that
:08:40. > :08:42.since it was going to happen, let's just hope it happens quickly
:08:43. > :08:48.and will be done and I'll go home afterwards.
:08:49. > :08:52.The other question that has been asked again and again
:08:53. > :08:56.Why she couldn't see the warning signs.
:08:57. > :09:10.Who would have thought he would do something so inappropriate?
:09:11. > :09:12.There was nothing to indicate he would do that.
:09:13. > :09:15.He was well-known, and you wouldn't expect that from someone
:09:16. > :09:17.who would suffer those kind of consequences.
:09:18. > :09:19.He was incredibly high-profile, so do you think there
:09:20. > :09:22.was a presumption that somebody so famous wouldn't do
:09:23. > :09:43.Trying to remember the 70s, was it more accepted do you think?
:09:44. > :09:45.The various comments that people have made about the case.
:09:46. > :09:50.Other directors, Howard Koch, for example.
:09:51. > :09:53."It is one of those situations, that he could find himself
:09:54. > :10:13.You make the point that Brooke Shields had just posed nude
:10:14. > :10:17.at age ten, and she had been a child prostitute at the age of ten
:10:18. > :10:27.I was aware of Jodie Foster being in Taxi Driver.
:10:28. > :10:38.It wasn't uncommon for young girls to be in sexualised parts.
:10:39. > :10:40.So, for your mother, she knew you were there,
:10:41. > :10:44.And told her everything was all right?
:10:45. > :10:46.Yes, I thought everything was all right.
:10:47. > :10:53.And in all that time, you have never been angry with her.
:10:54. > :10:57.It seems the only time you angry with her was for letting
:10:58. > :11:10.Yes, I was immature and I was angry that she called the police
:11:11. > :11:12.because that really brought down a lot of difficult,
:11:13. > :11:22.As a younger person I was angry, I wish she hadn't, because then it
:11:23. > :11:27.would have just been over, and instead it went on for year.
:11:28. > :11:30.It went on for a lot longer, didn't it?
:11:31. > :11:34.You said of the subsequent process, if I had to choose between reliving
:11:35. > :11:41.the rape or the Grand Jury testimony, I would choose the rape.
:11:42. > :11:47.The Grand Jury, Everyone was then involved.
:11:48. > :11:54.And that was just one day of weeks that I had to go through.
:11:55. > :12:11.The effect on your family over the years.
:12:12. > :12:15.Yes, I think it affected my family even more than it affected me.
:12:16. > :12:18.It was quiet for quite a long time after that.
:12:19. > :12:21.You did say then that later when you are asked about it,
:12:22. > :12:24.if you had a daughter who was raped at 13,
:12:25. > :12:26.you almost question whether you would call the police.
:12:27. > :12:29.Probably, but I might think about that carefully
:12:30. > :12:44.Because I wouldn't want to make it worse than just being raped.
:12:45. > :12:54.When you look back, you talk about this sense of what people
:12:55. > :13:05.If only he had hurt me worse, in more obvious ways,
:13:06. > :13:09.It was strange and awful in a lot of ways.
:13:10. > :13:11.Police, the hospital, police station.
:13:12. > :13:13.The next day, the district attorney's office.
:13:14. > :13:18.Then the fact that everyone was lying on top of that.
:13:19. > :13:22.Then, trying to prove he did it, it was like, if there was more
:13:23. > :13:25.proof, if I was more damaged, then we could prove I wasn't lying.
:13:26. > :13:40.These were people who were on your side.
:13:41. > :13:47.They are on my side, yet wanting to prove something bad
:13:48. > :14:00.It was really confusing for me, I was only 14, and it was confusing
:14:01. > :14:04.to have to go through all that, to be forced to do so many things.
:14:05. > :14:12.That you were hurt, you just weren't hurt in the right way?
:14:13. > :14:16.I was wondering why everyone was continuing to hurt me as some
:14:17. > :14:19.kind of requirement for what I had already been through.
:14:20. > :14:33.The phone rang off the hook, everyone was calling me a liar,
:14:34. > :14:40.Some of the things that were coming at you, it was presumed that you had
:14:41. > :14:44.It was presumed that I was lying, that I had asked for it,
:14:45. > :14:55.Every awful thing you could presume was presumed about me and my family.
:14:56. > :14:58.The judge said, what have we got here, a mother-daughter hooker team?
:14:59. > :15:05.You also say that you weren't the kind of victim people wanted.
:15:06. > :15:07.You didn't behave in the way people wanted.
:15:08. > :15:20.At the time I was a really angry young girl.
:15:21. > :15:23.I'm sure I wasn't behaving the way people wanted me to then.
:15:24. > :15:25.But later, people want you to be interesting
:15:26. > :15:29.They would like to exaggerate what happened to you to make
:15:30. > :15:34.So, I don't co-operate with that because that is not who I am.
:15:35. > :15:36.It is like a disappointment for everyone that I am fine
:15:37. > :15:48.You have been critical of the victim culture and suggested that it does
:15:49. > :15:53.In recent days, it is like that there is a whole little
:15:54. > :15:57.entertainment industry built up around victims of crime
:15:58. > :16:02.and they are just used for ratings or for selling copies and spit out.
:16:03. > :16:06.I don't think that any of the people doing that really care about them
:16:07. > :16:11.They are just helping themselves at the expense of someone who has
:16:12. > :16:16.The victim themselves should not see it as sympathy.
:16:17. > :16:25.I know from experience that people insisting that you be a victim
:16:26. > :16:29.and put that on display for them and carry it out
:16:30. > :16:37.As a result of your reluctance to continue the trial process,
:16:38. > :16:46.As a result of this, the more serious charges are dropped
:16:47. > :16:53.and he admits to unlawful sexual intercourse with a minor.
:16:54. > :16:57.A deal is reached with the judge on sentencing that you are happy
:16:58. > :17:02.The judge reneged on that deal and that is where the problem
:17:03. > :17:09.The legal problems began with the judge.
:17:10. > :17:13.And continued with the judge and remain the responsibility
:17:14. > :17:21.of the judge because he did not stick to the deal.
:17:22. > :17:24.He wanted to change it every time he thought that he was getting bad
:17:25. > :17:29.press, which is not how our justice system is supposed to work.
:17:30. > :17:32.As a result of his attempts to change it, that is what led
:17:33. > :17:34.to Roman Polanski fleeing the country?
:17:35. > :17:38.He was supposed to have probation and the judge was angry
:17:39. > :17:41.because of a photo of him in Germany was published with a caption saying
:17:42. > :17:48.He made him come back and gave him an illegal sentence of 90 days
:17:49. > :17:57.They then let him out in 42 days and the judge was angry again.
:17:58. > :18:01.The judge put him back in for an indeterminate amount
:18:02. > :18:04.of time which can mean for up to 50 years and said,
:18:05. > :18:08."Come back in a few weeks and I will let you out
:18:09. > :18:17.Which was on the judge's word which was good for nothing.
:18:18. > :18:18.Do you sympathise with Roman Polanski?
:18:19. > :18:21.That is not how you are supposed to be treated in court.
:18:22. > :18:26.I understand and I was kind of glad he did.
:18:27. > :18:35.It was nice that he was gone and it was over for a little while.
:18:36. > :18:38.It was over for a little while and I wonder if you think
:18:39. > :18:41.that it could have been resolved except for the judge?
:18:42. > :18:44.It could have easily been resolved and should have been resolved
:18:45. > :18:47.and the judge just made sure that did not happen
:18:48. > :18:50.because he was concerned about himself and his own image
:18:51. > :18:53.and he was really enjoying the publicity and really
:18:54. > :18:58.I think he was disappointed that they weren't going to put me
:18:59. > :19:04.on the stand at 14 to be cross-examined.
:19:05. > :19:06.Do you now feel angrier with the judge?
:19:07. > :19:12.If I had to pick, yes, I am not still angry
:19:13. > :19:16.but I definitely feel that he bears the responsibility for the way
:19:17. > :19:23.that this has worked out for all of us.
:19:24. > :19:26.You say that you felt relieved when Roman Polanski left.
:19:27. > :19:34.It was only a matter of time because in the years since then,
:19:35. > :19:37.there have been legal manoeuvres from all sides and we have
:19:38. > :19:40.this situation in 2009 when he was arrested in Switzerland.
:19:41. > :19:42.You said that the panic attacks and insomnia you had
:19:43. > :19:44.suffered your entire life returned in full force.
:19:45. > :19:51.They did not tell me that would happen so it was a complete shock.
:19:52. > :19:56.I called home because I was out of town.
:19:57. > :20:00.I called home to tell them to unplug the phone which is a standard
:20:01. > :20:05.Within hours, they called back, saying that there were reporters
:20:06. > :20:07.in the yard and people there with cameras and people
:20:08. > :20:13.They would not leave and I was in Colorado.
:20:14. > :20:17.I did not think it could get as bad as 1977 but it felt like it did.
:20:18. > :20:20.You said when he was released that he was released and put
:20:21. > :20:33.I wake up in the morning and the nightmare is back
:20:34. > :20:36.and he is in his 70s, sitting in a jail somewhere.
:20:37. > :20:41.I don't know who would feel good about that but I didn't.
:20:42. > :20:44.The district attorney said that it was about a 44-year-old
:20:45. > :20:47.defendant who plied a 13-year-old with drugs and then committed sodomy
:20:48. > :20:56.That would be why he pled guilty to unlawful sexual intercourse
:20:57. > :21:01.All that other stuff the district attorney likes to say for shock
:21:02. > :21:04.value, that is not what he pled guilty to.
:21:05. > :21:14.You think the district attorney were setting out to make life
:21:15. > :21:24.There is another argument - that this is in the public interest.
:21:25. > :21:27.That here is somebody who did something and was never fully held
:21:28. > :21:36.He was never supposed to serve any time and he served 42 days.
:21:37. > :21:39.He did everything he was asked until it became so unreasonable that
:21:40. > :21:51.You quote Jaclyn Freeman in your book, who campaigns on this
:21:52. > :21:55.matter and she says that rape is not just a crime against one person
:21:56. > :21:58.but also against the social fabric that binds us altogether.
:21:59. > :22:04.The argument is that you may want it to go away and he may want it to go
:22:05. > :22:09.away but it sends a very important message to somebody to not do this.
:22:10. > :22:16.I don't understand why people think that he should do more than that.
:22:17. > :22:20.We have the situation where this man who you hardly know,
:22:21. > :22:23.you only met three or four times, in one of which he raped you.
:22:24. > :22:26.You are virtual strangers and yet you are campaigning for him?
:22:27. > :22:29.I am not campaigning for him but I will campaign
:22:30. > :22:34.against a corrupt court, all by myself, for anybody.
:22:35. > :22:36.That's just my personal feeling about it.
:22:37. > :22:43.In the process, is it campaigning for justice for the victim as you go
:22:44. > :22:55.Justice should be for the defendant, for the victim.
:22:56. > :23:07.While you are arguing this, this comes back to again in a sense,
:23:08. > :23:10.whether you are the kind of victim that the public likes?
:23:11. > :23:19.Undoubtedly, majority of public opinion was against him.
:23:20. > :23:24.Yes, which is interesting because now it is.
:23:25. > :23:26.But I know that feels like because when this happened,
:23:27. > :23:31.That is the change of culture between 1977 and now.
:23:32. > :23:38.People called my house and asked if we were prostitutes,
:23:39. > :23:55.And now it is reversed, so I know what it is like to be
:23:56. > :24:00.He wrote you a letter of apology in 2009?
:24:01. > :24:05.It helped because it made my mother feel better and that
:24:06. > :24:12.For me, every one of my family is upset and I want them to feel
:24:13. > :24:16.In it, he said he wanted you to know how sorry
:24:17. > :24:19.he was and that they should give your mother a break.
:24:20. > :24:22."The fault was mine, not your mother's." It was obvious.
:24:23. > :24:26.I appreciated it and it made my mother feel better.
:24:27. > :24:28.This strange relationship you have with this man...
:24:29. > :24:31.You have been tied to him all your life?
:24:32. > :24:35.I used to think that it might end but I think now that we have both
:24:36. > :24:47.We have had some limited contact and he sent me that note but nothing
:24:48. > :24:59.I know he has a wife and children so I have some sympathy
:25:00. > :25:02.for the way he gets treated about this because, like I said,
:25:03. > :25:05.I have been on the other end of it as well.
:25:06. > :25:16.About what he is like, about what he would be
:25:17. > :25:28.Samantha Geimer, thank you for coming on HARDtalk Thanks
:25:29. > :26:05.the. Temperatures are coming down a week ahead. Make the most of any
:26:06. > :26:06.warm sunshine you have to on Monday, the bulk